Does Jesus Love You?

[Abaddon]

What do you think?

[Brodie Bruce]

I dunno, His mouth was a bit full so all I heard was mumbling

[Abaddon]

Your sick.

[Dew k. Mosi]

Jeebus is stalking me

[logan_weapon_x]

Jesus. Who cares? I dont live my life so that toher people can love me. Anyway, jesus was just a @@@@ing hippie who got nailed. Do you ask yourself if Tommy Chong loves you? Nope dont think so.

[Abaddon]

Not that I'm some super-religious person,but Jesus died for all of us.That is if he even really existed.

[Hobgoblin]

You dont have a "Hell no" response.

[logan_weapon_x]

Exactly, 'if' he existed. We dont know he did. Plus he didnt die for all of us. He stepped outta line and got what he deserved.

[Abaddon]

Originally posted by Demogoblin
You dont have a "Hell no" response.

Nope sorry."no" will have to do.:(

[twylight]

"Jesus loves me this I know,
for the Bible tells me so..."
:D ;) :)
Mommy told me too :o ;)

[Elijya]

Originally posted by logan_weapon_x
Exactly, 'if' he existed. We dont know he did. Plus he didnt die for all of us. He stepped outta line and got what he deserved.

I'm sorry? please clarify that, cause if he deserved what he got, I'm fairly certain you deserve to be raped by a herd of goats

[logan_weapon_x]

And why is that what i deserve exactly?

[Abaddon]

Originally posted by twylight
"Jesus loves me this I know,
for the Bible tells me so..."
:D ;) :)
Mommy told me too :o ;)

Mommy lied.:mad:

[Themanofbat]

Originally posted by Abaddon
What do you think?

He's dead.

:confused:

[Abaddon]

Originally posted by Themanofbat
He's dead.

:confused:

or is he......?DunDUNDUN!;)

[Spider-Nerd]

I'm pretty sure they can prove he was an actual person....whether he's god or not.....well......

[Themanofbat]

Originally posted by Spider-Nerd
I'm pretty sure they can prove he was an actual person....whether he's god or not.....well......

He was a man, he walked the Earth like you and I.

It was only decided by Constantine at the Council of Niccae around 320 AD to give him god-like powers to make it easier for the sheep to follow the new shephard.

:)

[Abaddon]

Originally posted by Themanofbat
He was a man, he walked the Earth like you and I.

It was only decided by Constantine at the Council of Niccae around 320 AD to give him god-like powers to make it easier for the sheep to follow the new shephard.

:)

Where'd you hear this?:confused:

[Themanofbat]

Originally posted by Abaddon
Where'd you hear this?:confused:

A few old books, the histories of Christianity, biographies on Constantine....

Oh, and it was in 325 AD at the Council of Nicea (I misplelled it earlier).

And the final vote was 218 to 2 to make Jesus a god as opposed to a mortal prophet, where he could have been easily more associated with the Pagan Sun God, Sol Invictus.

:)

[Wams]

He died in our place.
Sounds like LOVE to me.
;)















Jesus lives.

[E. Bison]

http://img21.photobucket.com/albums/v62/Bane_Lily/dialog-vega3.gifJesus doesn't love me, but Hilary Duff does. That's all I need.

[Donnie Darko]

Originally posted by Wams
He died in our place.
Sounds like LOVE to me.
;)



Jesus lives.

I concur.

[E. Bison]

Originally posted by Themanofbat
He was a man, he walked the Earth like you and I.

It was only decided by Constantine at the Council of Niccae around 320 AD to give him god-like powers to make it easier for the sheep to follow the new shephard.

:)
http://img21.photobucket.com/albums/v62/Bane_Lily/dialog-vega1.gif This is actually true. The Council of Nicea only meant to make Jesus equal to God and the same person so it could be easier for the Pagan masses of the time to practice "Christianity" or as we call it Christendom. When Constantine intervened in the debates, it was him who influenced the introduction of the holy spirit as a person so as to make it a triad of gods. This was done because the surrounding pagan religions of the time has Triads of gods and Constatine knew that religious separation was a threat to his empire.

[Abaddon]

Cool.

[jollyjohnny]

I believe Jesus did exist.
Whether he was really the son of god, I'll let you decide...but me, I'm religious, so I'm unreasonable.:p

[Jason Blood]

Jesus loves me, he loves me a bunch, because he always puts skippy in my lunch.

[Abaddon]

Jesus loves Pete Griffin.Its why his show is coming back.

[JcDc]

What about Muhammad?

[E. Bison]

http://img21.photobucket.com/albums/v62/Bane_Lily/th_vega_5.gifMuhammad is a pedophile. His last wife was 9 years old.

[Abaddon]

Originally posted by E. Bison
http://img21.photobucket.com/albums/v62/Bane_Lily/th_vega_5.gifMuhammad is a pedophile. His last wife was 9 years old.

:eek:

Sick bastard.:mad:

[E. Bison]

http://img21.photobucket.com/albums/v62/Bane_Lily/dialog-vega1.gif I know huh? It's ironic how "holy" he is. It's actually legal in Islam to marry a girl very, VERY young as long as the man gets parents permission. In fact, I heard that when a girl is born she is already ready for marriage.

[spiderrasmon]

that's it, I'm leaving....

[Dark Carnage]

Originally posted by BrodieBruce
I dunno, His mouth was a bit full so all I heard was mumbling http://img37.photobucket.com/albums/v113/Vegenom/Smilies/rofl.gif

[redmarvel]

Jesus loves everyone. Even those that do not love Him. That's what being the son of God is all about. "God is Love".

[Jack Rabbit]

Originally posted by BrodieBruce
I dunno, His mouth was a bit full so all I heard was mumbling

HAHAHAHhAHAHAHHAHAHHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAAHA HAHAHAHHAhAHAAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHHAAAHHAHAHAHHAHHHHAHAHAHAH!!!:D :D :D

[Hulkzilla]

Jesus DOES exist
He still lives
and YES
He loves ALL of us!

[Themanofbat]

Originally posted by Hulkzilla
Jesus DOES exist
He still lives
and YES
He loves ALL of us!

He did exist.
He is now dead.
And I'm sure that he was fond of a lot of people back in his day.

:)

[TheSlag]

Yes. Although it's a mystery and a blessing to me. Thank God.

[Backdrifter]

Originally posted by E. Bison
http://img21.photobucket.com/albums/v62/Bane_Lily/dialog-vega1.gif This is actually true. The Council of Nicea only meant to make Jesus equal to God and the same person so it could be easier for the Pagan masses of the time to practice "Christianity" or as we call it Christendom. When Constantine intervened in the debates, it was him who influenced the introduction of the holy spirit as a person so as to make it a triad of gods. This was done because the surrounding pagan religions of the time has Triads of gods and Constatine knew that religious separation was a threat to his empire.


you both are wrong. if your going to try and prove a point about a religon, at least state the truth

the The Council of Nicea was a coucil to discuss the meaning to the trinity and the catholic chruch doctrine. they never gave christ powers. a bunch of theologians meeting to discuss church doctrine.




http://www.christianitytoday.com/ch/51h/51h011.html

[Themanofbat]

Originally posted by Stewie Griffin
you both are wrong. if your going to try and prove a point about a religon, at least state the truth

the The Council of Nicea was a coucil to discuss the meaning to the trinity and the catholic chruch doctrine. the never gave christ powers. a bunch of theologians meeting to discuss church doctrine.

http://www.christianitytoday.com/ch/51h/51h011.html

And I'm supposed to believe the words found on a "christian" web site? :confused:

That's not proof... that's just a one sided (and VERY biased) opinion. If the Church were to acknowledge the truth, it would tear itself up from its very foundations.

As far as what else happened at the Council of Nicea, the dating of Easter was established, rules were framed which defined the authority of bishops, thereby paving the way for a concentration of power in ecclesiastical hands, and the decision to make Jesus a god by vote. These were the main events to come out of the Council of Nicea.

You may choose to believe it or not. But a christian web site certainly isn't proof otherwise, it's mere biased thought.

:)

[Backdrifter]

my problem is, if its not down the middle (which i think think this is) than its just some one twisting events to make it seem like something happened that actually didnt unfold that way... you understand what i mean? i know it can work both ways, but i believe this is an unbiased history.



well call me biased but i believe it. :)

but i guess thats all that matters, to me atleast.








i guess you werent really calling me biased. lol

[Balthus Dire]

i coulda died from alcohol poisoning on friday night of last week.


i didn't.






the man in the sky was with me.

[The Lizard]

Originally posted by Themanofbat

As far as what else happened at the Council of Nicea, the dating of Easter was established, rules were framed which defined the authority of bishops, thereby paving the way for a concentration of power in ecclesiastical hands, and the decision to make Jesus a god by vote. These were the main events to come out of the Council of Nicea.


This thread got off to an immature and disrespectful start (Brodie! :mad: ), so I've been avoiding it up until now... however...

TMOB raises some very good points about the Council of Nicea, but there is some clarification that is needed here.

The "vote" in question was in support of a Trinitarian view of Christ, in that Jesus would be considered "one God" with the Father, who existed at the beginning of time.

The main controversy, between Bishop Alexander and Priest Arius, did NOT debate whether or not Christ was the Messiah, was born of a virgin birth, performed miracles, or was resurrected from the dead.

Arius argued that Christ was a creation of the Father, and therefore came from nothing, ex nihilo, like the rest of humanity and creation. The Bishops refused to accept this doctrine, and adopted the concept of the Trinity based on their personal studies and interpretation of scripture.

Constantine definitely put his two cents into the Council, and his adherance to certain Roman polytheistic beliefs until his deathbed is well documented. Although Easter gets its name from the goddess of the dawn, Eostre (Eos in Roman tradition), the fact that the Resurrection does come after Passover in the scriptures shows that it is usually celebrated in the correct basic time period, although the "Spring connection" is what determines the exact Sunday each year it is celebrated, and that is indeed connected to Constantine's polytheism.

Whether Arius, or Alexander, or neither of them (the view of my particular faith) were totally correct in their aguments at the Council of Nicea can still be debated among both Christians and non-Christians.

However, to sum up, the Council of Nicea did cast votes on Christ's divinity as it related to Trinitarian interpretation, but it was not a simple debate of "Is he just a dead man, or a God?"

http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/basis/nicea1.txt
http://www.factmonster.com/ce6/society/A0835563.html
http://www.columbia.edu/cu/augustine/arch/sbrandt/nicea.htm

Not a biased Christian source,

Not a biased anti-Christian source, either. :)

[Backdrifter]

Originally posted by The Lizard
This thread got off to an immature and disrespectful start (Brodie! :mad: ), so I've been avoiding it up until now... however...

TMOB raises some very good points about the Council of Nicea, but there is some clarification that is needed here.

The "vote" in question was in support of a Trinitarian view of Christ, in that Jesus would be considered "one God" with the Father, who existed at the beginning of time.

The main controversy, between Bishop Alexander and Priest Arius, did NOT debate whether or not Christ was the Messiah, was born of a virgin birth, performed miracles, or was resurrected from the dead.

Arius argued that Christ was a creation of the Father, and therefore came from nothing, ex nihilo, like the rest of humanity and creation. The Bishops refused to accept this doctrine, and adopted the concept of the Trinity based on their personal studies and interpretation of scripture.

Constantine definitely put his two cents into the Council, and his adherance to certain Roman polytheistic beliefs until his deathbed is well documented. Although Easter gets its name from the goddess of the dawn, Eostre (Eos in Roman tradition), the fact that the Resurrection does come after Passover in the scriptures shows that it is celebrated in the correct basic time period, although the Spring connection is what determines the exact Sunday each year it is celebrated.

Whether Arius, or Alexander, or neither of them (the view of my particular faith) were totally correct in their aguments at the Council of Nicea can still be debated among both Christians and non-Christians.

However, to sum up, the Council of Nicea did cast votes on Christ's divinity as it related to Trinitarian interpretation, but it was not a simple debate of "Is he just a dead man, or a God?"

http://www.columbia.edu/cu/augustine/arch/sbrandt/nicea.htm

Not a biased Christian source,

Not a biased anti-Christian source, either. :)


thank you!

and the conclusion that was drawn is still opinion. faith is individual and it calls you to drawn individual opinions. as a christian i sometimes try to distance myself and my beliefs from chruch doctrines. but again, in the end all that matters is where stand with God.

[Abaddon]

Originally posted by Themanofbat
He did exist.
He is now dead.
And I'm sure that he was fond of a lot of people back in his day.

:)


:up:

Sounds good to me.:)

[Alf]

Yes, very much...:o:):up:

[Herr Logan]

Originally posted by BrodieBruce
I dunno, His mouth was a bit full so all I heard was mumbling

That makes you my new hero.

I'm in agreement with all the disrespectful, ungrateful heathens who don't appreciate the sacrifice some conceited hippie made 2000 years ago for all of the people who swear obedience to him.

[AC/DC]I'm on the hiiighway to hell...[/AC/DC]

[logansoldcigar]

Originally posted by twylight
"Jesus loves me this I know,
for the Bible tells me so..."
:D ;) :)
Mommy told me too :o ;)

yeah well, my mommy told me i didnt want to spend time time with "the dirty girl" that lived up the road. when i found out why, i also knew my mommy was wrong about that.

[The Lizard]

Originally posted by Herr Logan
That makes you my new hero.


Well, if all it takes to be your hero is for one to make sophomoric, asinine comments about any beliefs one doesn't agree with, then you must have quite a few heroes in the Community forum. :p

[Themanofbat]

Originally posted by The Lizard
Well, if all it takes to be your hero is for one to make sophomoric, asinine comments about any beliefs one doesn't agree with, then you must have quite a few heroes in the Community forum. :p

More members there than the Legion of Super-Heroes... :D :D :D

;)

[X]

Definitly...not. :o

[Herr Logan]

Originally posted by The Lizard
Well, if all it takes to be your hero is for one to make sophomoric, asinine comments about any beliefs one doesn't agree with, then you must have quite a few heroes in the Community forum. :p

Nice try. Not only is the pro-religious argument you're about to make in response to this completely invalid and devoid of evidence, logic, and common sense (yes, I've heard them all, but hey, if you really think you have something new, I've got nothing better to do today either), but you incorrectly described BruceBrodie's comment. He didn't say anything about "beliefs one doesn't agree with." He just made a cryptic comment from which one has to infer information that fits their preconceived notions of what the comment might mean in order to make sense of it. Don't even try to deny that part, because that's a rock-solid argument with no wiggle room for interpretation. All you have is your own version of what he meant, and no proof. Same as I do.

[The Lizard]

Originally posted by Herr Logan
Nice try. Not only is the pro-religious argument you're about to make in response to this completely invalid and devoid of evidence, logic, and common sense (yes, I've heard them all, but hey, if you really think you have something new, I've got nothing better to do today either),

First of all, you have NO concept of any "argument" I'm about to make, O incredibly presumtuous one. I don't argue religion, I merely clarify points (as in my clarifications of what the main debates at Nicea were about). Arguing religion serves no purpose, since it all comes down to an intangible, unprovable concept - faith. Please don't insult both our intelligences by setting up a straw man that doesn't even exist here, 'K?

you incorrectly described BruceBrodie's comment. He didn't say anything about "beliefs one doesn't agree with." He just made a cryptic comment from which one has to infer information that fits their preconceived notions of what the comment might mean in order to make sense of it. Don't even try to deny that part, because that's a rock-solid argument with no wiggle room for interpretation. All you have is your own version of what he meant, and no proof. Same as I do.

I've been around these boards long enough to know what Brodie meant, however veiled you feel his comment may have been. Brodie takes pride in being a gadfly, in fact. So what?

Similarly, I've observed that you seem to enjoy sparking heated debates (hence your oddly out-of-place "rock-solid argument" comment). I however, do not. While I maintain that Brodie's original comment (however cryptic it may seem to an outsider) was motivated by disrespect, note that I did NOT draw conclusions about Brodie's character from it, and my comment about your "heroes" being easy to find in Community was mostly intended in jest, hence the ":p " at the end. Also note that TMOB, the poster whose quote I responded to in the first place, realized that fact.

If you felt personally attacked, then I apologize. However, I feel no need to let offhand comments about something that is meaningful to me go unaddressed -- an attitude with which I'm sure you would agree.

[Abaddon]

Ooh,I love debates.

[The Lizard]

I don't. :(

[Abaddon]

Originally posted by The Lizard
I don't. :(


I do.:mad:

[The Lizard]

*runs away*



;)

[Abaddon]

Hey wait.Bring your non-confrontational ass back here!:mad:

;)

[Herr Logan]

Originally posted by The Lizard
First of all, you have NO concept of any "argument" I'm about to make, O incredibly presumtuous one. I don't argue religion, I merely clarify points (as in my clarifications of what the main debates at Nicea were about). Arguing religion serves no purpose, since it all comes down to an intangible, unprovable concept - faith. Please don't insult both our intelligences by setting up a straw man that doesn't even exist here, 'K?



I've been around these boards long enough to know what Brodie meant, however veiled you feel his comment may have been. Brodie takes pride in being a gadfly, in fact. So what?

Similarly, I've observed that you seem to enjoy sparking heated debates (hence your oddly out-of-place "rock-solid argument" comment). I however, do not. While I maintain that Brodie's original comment (however cryptic it may seem to an outsider) was motivated by disrespect, note that I did NOT draw conclusions about Brodie's character from it, and my comment about your "heroes" being easy to find in Community was mostly intended in jest, hence the ":p " at the end. Also note that TMOB, the poster whose quote I responded to in the first place, realized that fact.

If you felt personally attacked, then I apologize. However, I feel no need to let offhand comments about something that is meaningful to me go unaddressed -- an attitude with which I'm sure you would agree.

On basic principal, I do indeed agree.

I didn't say you described Brodie's character. I said you incorrectly described his comment. You didn't go into historical context or personal knowledge, you simply described what he said a certain way, and it was inaccurate considering the language you used. I'm not denying it was meant as crude gesture. I simply pointed out that you made an interpretation that went beyond the content of Brodie's post. See, rock-solid argument. I wish you hadn't insulted both of us by misguidedly arguing that point.

[The Lizard]

Originally posted by Herr Logan
On basic principal, I do indeed agree.

I didn't say you described Brodie's character. I said you incorrectly described his comment. You didn't go into historical context or personal knowledge, you simply described what he said a certain way, and it was inaccurate considering the language you used. I'm not denying it was meant as crude gesture. I simply pointed out that you made an interpretation that went beyond the content of Brodie's post. See, rock-solid argument. I wish you hadn't insulted both of us by misguidedly arguing that point.

OK -- it's a deal.
If you don't insult us both by attempting an erroneous prediction of (and premature condecension towards) my next comments, I won't insult us both by denying that my interpretation of other posters intents was a personal one and not based impartially on the evidence at hand.

Heaven knows, we probably have enough people willing to insult us at this point anyway, there's no sense in doing it to ourselves, eh? ;)

[MrJabroni]

Well, I voted yes, since according to Christians, Jesus loves everybody...even Hitler :)

[Abaddon]

I dont think Jesus would have loved Hitler.

[Herr Logan]

Originally posted by The Lizard
OK -- it's a deal.
If you don't insult us both by attempting an erroneous prediction of (and premature condecension towards) my next comments, I won't insult us both by denying that my interpretation of other posters intents was a personal one and not based impartially on the evidence at hand.

Heaven knows, we probably have enough people willing to insult us at this point anyway, there's no sense in doing it to ourselves, eh? ;)

Deal.

I hope you recognize the tactic I used to keep you from presenting a religious argument (predicting it to avoid it) and use it in the future with those you may encounter. It was actually a strategy more than an insult. Learn and conquer.

[The Lizard]

Originally posted by Herr Logan
Deal.

I hope you recognize the tactic I used to keep you from presenting a religious argument (predicting it to avoid it) and use it in the future with those you may encounter. It was actually a strategy more than an insult. Learn and conquer.

Just as well you should recognize the need to take some time to actually know the person you are addressing, as opposed to assuming that you are even capable of predicting or manipulating a particular response. The first exchange was a case in point. Your original statement bore no facts whatsoever to contend with - only your opinion (presented in a humorous manner, I might add) as it related to Brodie's statement. Thus, I would have had no rational reason to give a "religious argument", as you describe it.

Perhaps you assumed that any person with religious convictions would always launch into a zealous scriptural rebuttal to such a simple comment. If so, you might need to re-examine that presumption. In any case, your prediction was erroneous from its inception, but if you wish to refer to it as an effective tactic in retrospect, then feel free to do so.

Education can come from many sources, even those sources we are often quick to dismiss due to preconceived notions.

[Herr Logan]

There is a 50/50 chance that a stranger with religious conviction will either put forth an argument, or won't. If I overshoot the mark by stating I know all the possible arguments (which is the truth) and presume that the stranger will actually put forth those arguments whether or not I know they will, I've reduced the chances that they will put forth the arguments.

It's all motivated by my twisted philosophy and psychological survival strategy. I'm usually right, because I usually expect the worst. If someone disappoints me or something bad happens, then I'm right. If something good happens, I'm wrong, but yay, something good happened. It's not a 50/50 win-win situation, but it's a win to some degree either way.

You did as I privately assumed you would (declined to argue religious validity), thereby making the statements in my post wrong. I was wrong in my statement, but you didn't bore me with useless arguments (whether or not you were actually inclined to do so), and that makes me happy.

Most people shouldn't have to live or think like this, but I do. So don't bother telling me how twisted it is. Just reserve it for when you might need it.

[Themanofbat]

:)

[Honey Vibe]

Originally posted by The Lizard
Just as well you should recognize the need to take some time to actually know the person you are addressing, as opposed to assuming that you are even capable of predicting or manipulating a particular response. The first exchange was a case in point. Your original statement bore no facts whatsoever to contend with - only your opinion (presented in a humorous manner, I might add) as it related to Brodie's statement. Thus, I would have had no rational reason to give a "religious argument", as you describe it.

Perhaps you assumed that any person with religious convictions would always launch into a zealous scriptural rebuttal to such a simple comment. If so, you might need to re-examine that presumption. In any case, your prediction was erroneous from its inception, but if you wish to refer to it as an effective tactic in retrospect, then feel free to do so.

Education can come from many sources, even those sources we are often quick to dismiss due to preconceived notions. Excellent post, Liz.

[TLATOANI]

JESUS LOVE THE ENTIRE WORLD

HE DIE FOR US

[TLATOANI]

THE ONLY PEOPLE WHO SAY THAT JESUS RECEIVED WHAT HE DESERVED ARE THE JUDS

[Zenien]

No that would be the roman empire. Get your facts straight.

[E. Bison]

http://img21.photobucket.com/albums/v62/Bane_Lily/ex3-vega.jpgI think he met "THE JEWS"

[Zenien]

Either way that boy has had too many private sessions with the local priest...

[Pnyryd2k1]

hard to do when he's been dead for quite a while now

[Zenien]

Him to

[E. Bison]

http://img21.photobucket.com/albums/v62/Bane_Lily/Vega_10.gifYou would know love. What would you say if I told you I was the devil?

[E. Bison]

http://img21.photobucket.com/albums/v62/Bane_Lily/dialog-vega3.gifThen why don't you and I go meet at the "Satan" thread I started under this one? You'll definitely enjoy it.

[The Lizard]

Originally posted by Herr Logan
If I overshoot the mark by stating I know all the possible arguments (which is the truth) and presume that the stranger will actually put forth those arguments whether or not I know they will, I've reduced the chances that they will put forth the arguments.

It must be comforting to know ALL possible arguments that can arise in a given situation. Of course "the truth" is subjective, so that bait isn't even worth taking. ;) I will say that I can certainly see how your habitual choice of words and presentation has most likely resulted in a history of emotional responses from those who disagree with you.


It's all motivated by my twisted philosophy and psychological survival strategy. I'm usually right, because I usually expect the worst. If someone disappoints me or something bad happens, then I'm right. If something good happens, I'm wrong, but yay, something good happened. It's not a 50/50 win-win situation, but it's a win to some degree either way.

You did as I privately assumed you would (declined to argue religious validity), thereby making the statements in my post wrong. I was wrong in my statement, but you didn't bore me with useless arguments (whether or not you were actually inclined to do so), and that makes me happy.

Most people shouldn't have to live or think like this, but I do. So don't bother telling me how twisted it is. Just reserve it for when you might need it.

"Twisted" is your word, not mine. If your thought process allows you to "win" (again, a subjective condition) in any scenario as you describe, then why would you characterize it as such?
As you say, the need for survival is a strong motivation. However, we are on a fun, frivolous superhero website (albeit currently in a forum rife with trite, blunt opinions). So if I, a person who holds some spiritual views so easily attacked and vivisected by the forces of Rational Thought And Analysis, can exist at ease, perhaps you can too.

[Abaddon]

This is interesting.

[PWN3R]

I'm sorry? please clarify that, cause if he deserved what he got, I'm fairly certain you deserve to be raped by a herd of goats

I second that

[Halcohol]

Jesus said he loved me, but he never called.

[XwolverineX]

NONE OF THOSE OPTIONS, I DON'T BELIEVE IN JESUS... :o

[Halcohol]

NONE OF THOSE OPTIONS, I DON'T BELIEVE IN JESUS... :o
That's option #3, freak show

[Da Docta]

That's option #3, freak show
This is why we need to believe in Jesus

[Halcohol]

Jesus saves.

He passes to Gretzky.

Gretzky shoots.

He scores!

[Neto Magnus]

lol, I like the 4th option :up:

[SpiderHulkThing]

Yes Jesus loves me, cause the bible tells me so.

[deemar325]

Jesus loves all of ya'll.

for real.

[Wilhelm-Scream]

I love ya baby, but if you don't do EXACTLY as I say, I'm gonna set you on fire forever.
mmmm

[Abaddon]

You only get to know God through me,*****.So listen up and do what I ****ing say.

[SpiderHulkThing]

Probably my main reason for believing in God etc is because I saw a ghost when I was a kid. Scared the freakin crap out of me, but at least I knew then that things that can't be explained can happen.

[Alpha and Omega]

I love ya baby, but if you don't do EXACTLY as I say, I'm gonna set you on fire forever.
mmmm

SHC. :o

[Abaddon]

Probably my main reason for believing in God etc is because I saw a ghost when I was a kid. Scared the freakin crap out of me, but at least I knew then that things that can't be explained can happen.


A) You don't know that it was a ghost.
B) The only ghost mentioned in the Bible is the Holy Spirit,so I don't know how youre getting this connection to God.
C)Sometimes things can be explained,we just arent aware of the answers at the time.

[deemar325]

Probably my main reason for believing in God etc is because I saw a ghost when I was a kid. Scared the freakin crap out of me, but at least I knew then that things that can't be explained can happen.


I've had multiple near death experiences, and I still standing that's why I believe.

[Alpha and Omega]

What do you think?

I think you should ask Jesus.:up:

[Abaddon]

I think you should ask Jesus.:up:


I don't talk to dead people who may or may have existed.:up:

[Alpha and Omega]

I don't talk to dead people who may or may have existed.:up:

Isn't that statement a bit of a paradox?

[Calvin]

I dunno, His mouth was a bit full so all I heard was mumbling
Brodie without typos, whoa.

[Abaddon]

Isn't that statement a bit of a paradox?


It is and it isn't.

[deemar325]

Isn't that statement a bit of a paradox?

May or may, I think knows jesus exsists.

[SpiderHulkThing]

A) You don't know that it was a ghost.
B) The only ghost mentioned in the Bible is the Holy Spirit,so I don't know how youre getting this connection to God.
C)Sometimes things can be explained,we just arent aware of the answers at the time.


actually, fallen angels. i thought that they were demons etc. Could have been that. who knows. but the way life is, i'm certain there is a hell. so if there is a hell, then there must be a heaven. good enough for me. it doesnt hurt anyone for me to believe in heaven. if didn't i'd worry about dying all the time. b/c i can't think of anything scarier than imagining being dead and that be the end of it. to not exist is a terrifying thought.

[Alpha and Omega]

It is and it isn't.

Because it does and it doesn't, but did it make you wonder what type of response you would or wouldn't get from someone who did or didn't believe in a man who should or shouldn't love you? . . . period.

May or may, I think knows jesus exsists.
edit - :)

[The Lumberjack]

He doesn't love me. He never spends the night and refuses to cuddle.:(

[KingOfDreams]

Isn't Jesus supposed to love everybody?

[Abaddon]

Because it does and it doesn't, but did it make you wonder what type of response you would or wouldn't get from someone who did or didn't believe in a man who should or shouldn't love you? . . . period.





Only briefly.

[Calendar Man]

In the words of Green Jelly...

"Yeah Jesus Christ...yeah he is nice."

[deemar325]

Isn't Jesus supposed to love everybody?

That's pretty much my point, even use sinners.

[Abaddon]

actually, fallen angels. i thought that they were demons etc. Could have been that. who knows. but the way life is, i'm certain there is a hell. so if there is a hell, then there must be a heaven. good enough for me. it doesnt hurt anyone for me to believe in heaven. if didn't i'd worry about dying all the time.
Sorry but this post did inspire a ":rolleyes:" reaction in me.What exactly makes you think there's a hell?


b/c i can't think of anything scarier than imagining being dead and that be the end of it. to not exist is a terrifying thought.

Try to look at it objectively.

[Abaddon]

That's pretty much my point, even use sinners.


If he died to absolve mankind of guilt,then whats the point of punishing anyone after death?

[Neto Magnus]

well, at least Jesus loves magic...
http://img116.imageshack.us/img116/9673/netochrist5005dp.gif

[deemar325]

^ I'm not a expert I just believe.

[ShadowBoxing]

I am unconvinced of Jesus' existence

[deemar325]

^ Everyone should have the right to practice their faith or not too.

It's all good, as long as it don't effect me.

[Erundur]

I like Jesus :up:

[Mr. Socko]

Yes

[Abaddon]

^ I'm not a expert I just believe.


whats the source of your belief?

[JewishHobbit]

actually, fallen angels. i thought that they were demons etc. Could have been that. who knows. but the way life is, i'm certain there is a hell. so if there is a hell, then there must be a heaven. good enough for me. it doesnt hurt anyone for me to believe in heaven. if didn't i'd worry about dying all the time. b/c i can't think of anything scarier than imagining being dead and that be the end of it. to not exist is a terrifying thought.

I strongly believe that 'ghosts' are demons. My mom's house was haunted; Screams, slamming doors, footsteps, the whole 9 yards every night. It all came from the basement. My mom's friend even saw the ghost, a man ina military uniform. Ironically enough, another lady they work with use to live in our house, and she was showing the pics, and the dead guy in our basement was her grandfather in his military uniform. When my wife and I had to move back in due to my job closing and us being broke, I went down to the basement and felt the ghost/demons (as I've encountered demons on several occations). I prayed to Jesus and claimed the house and all in it in Jesus name, while I was there. We lived in that basement for a year, and no one in the house heard a thing the whole time, or even felt scared. The NIGHT that my wife and I moved out, the 'ghost' returned with a fury, just days before the house was tore down.

My mom was a strong believer in psychics, ghosts, talking to the dead, and all that. When we moved out of the house, she turned on all those ideas. Recently, she's rededicated herself to Christ, much to my joy. She's recently started going back to church and everything. So yeah, I believe ghosts to be demons. I have a more indepth thought of the reasonings why, but I won't bother you with it unless you guys want to hear it.

[JewishHobbit]

Oh, and yes, I believe Jesus loves me :D

[JewishHobbit]

Also, I saw some mentions of the Council of Nicea. Now I haven't really heard anyone talking about this until after the Devinci Code got big, as I've heard it was a point from that book, (I've not read it yet).

But if that is where some of you are getting your information, have you read the book "Breaking the Devinci Code"? I haven't read it either, but it's suppose to show how the auther of the original book either got some things wrong, or told only parts of a larger story, etc. I dont know as I haven't read it either (just heard a program with the guy on the radio the past few days). I thought that book might interest anyone who's searching, trying to figure out this whole Jesus thing and was turned off by the Devinci Code.

[Abaddon]

I strongly believe that 'ghosts' are demons. My mom's house was haunted; Screams, slamming doors, footsteps, the whole 9 yards every night. It all came from the basement. My mom's friend even saw the ghost, a man ina military uniform. Ironically enough, another lady they work with use to live in our house, and she was showing the pics, and the dead guy in our basement was her grandfather in his military uniform. When my wife and I had to move back in due to my job closing and us being broke, I went down to the basement and felt the ghost/demons (as I've encountered demons on several occations). I prayed to Jesus and claimed the house and all in it in Jesus name, while I was there. We lived in that basement for a year, and no one in the house heard a thing the whole time, or even felt scared. The NIGHT that my wife and I moved out, the 'ghost' returned with a fury, just days before the house was tore down.

My mom was a strong believer in psychics, ghosts, talking to the dead, and all that. When we moved out of the house, she turned on all those ideas. Recently, she's rededicated herself to Christ, much to my joy. She's recently started going back to church and everything. So yeah, I believe ghosts to be demons. I have a more indepth thought of the reasonings why, but I won't bother you with it unless you guys want to hear it.


Color me curious.

If the ghost you saw was a person,how is it that he's a demon?

[KingOfDreams]

But if that is where some of you are getting your information, have you read the book "Breaking the Devinci Code"? I haven't read it either, but it's suppose to show how the auther of the original book either got some things wrong, or told only parts of a larger story, etc. I dont know as I haven't read it either (just heard a program with the guy on the radio the past few days). I thought that book might interest anyone who's searching, trying to figure out this whole Jesus thing and was turned off by the Devinci Code.


The Da Vinci Code is fiction. It really pisses me off when people seem to forget that. People shouldn't take it so seriously. Yes, Dan Brown referenced real theories and real organizations but it's still a FICTION book.

[PWN3R]

whats the source of your belief?


Its called faith.

Read Hebrews 11, the whole chapter...:D

[Abaddon]

Also, I saw some mentions of the Council of Nicea. Now I haven't really heard anyone talking about this until after the Devinci Code got big, as I've heard it was a point from that book, (I've not read it yet).

But if that is where some of you are getting your information, have you read the book "Breaking the Devinci Code"? I haven't read it either, but it's suppose to show how the auther of the original book either got some things wrong, or told only parts of a larger story, etc. I dont know as I haven't read it either (just heard a program with the guy on the radio the past few days). I thought that book might interest anyone who's searching, trying to figure out this whole Jesus thing and was turned off by the Devinci Code.


I want to read the Gospel of Barnabus.:confused:

[Abaddon]

Its called faith.

Read Hebrews 11, the whole chapter...:D


I don't feel like it.Give me the short version.

[SpiderHulkThing]

I strongly believe that 'ghosts' are demons. My mom's house was haunted; Screams, slamming doors, footsteps, the whole 9 yards every night. It all came from the basement. My mom's friend even saw the ghost, a man ina military uniform. Ironically enough, another lady they work with use to live in our house, and she was showing the pics, and the dead guy in our basement was her grandfather in his military uniform. When my wife and I had to move back in due to my job closing and us being broke, I went down to the basement and felt the ghost/demons (as I've encountered demons on several occations). I prayed to Jesus and claimed the house and all in it in Jesus name, while I was there. We lived in that basement for a year, and no one in the house heard a thing the whole time, or even felt scared. The NIGHT that my wife and I moved out, the 'ghost' returned with a fury, just days before the house was tore down.

My mom was a strong believer in psychics, ghosts, talking to the dead, and all that. When we moved out of the house, she turned on all those ideas. Recently, she's rededicated herself to Christ, much to my joy. She's recently started going back to church and everything. So yeah, I believe ghosts to be demons. I have a more indepth thought of the reasonings why, but I won't bother you with it unless you guys want to hear it.

Glad we're on the same page :up: I could tell you about the ghost if you wanted me to via PM, just PM me first and I'll send you a description of it. but i think that demons or whatever can make contact with people in whatever form they choose, like a person someone knew that died or some random person for whatever reason. I know what I saw, and it went away as soon as i prayed for it too. I watched it for at least a couple minutes before i did so. Even though it scared me, i'm glad that it happenend b/c whenever i'm having doubts or questioning, i just have to remember that.

A little off topic, but my dad and i got into a discussion last weekend about religion. Of course religion is a sensitive subject for just about everyone. But anyway, he doesnt believe in God and all that and I'm worried about him. He says that people usually pray b/c they want something. I don't ever pray for possesions. I pray for others, family friends, etc. You're welcome to PM me your other stories or more of what you were talking about.

[PWN3R]

edit

[SpiderHulkThing]

Color me curious.

If the ghost you saw was a person,how is it that he's a demon?

the demon can take on whatever form it wants. why not? if their can be demons, then surely it could look like whatever it wanted to look like.

[8Ball2/JanG5]

Jesus loves everyone but then again he also loves crack cocain.

[SpiderHulkThing]

Sorry but this post did inspire a ":rolleyes:" reaction in me.What exactly makes you think there's a hell?

Try to look at it objectively.

Looking around makes me know theres a hell. The things that people do to one another and the things they do to themselves.

[JewishHobbit]

Color me curious.

If the ghost you saw was a person,how is it that he's a demon?

Now for the long version :D

Satan and the demons want to pull people away from God, but they won't always go and just say "Hi, I'm satan, God hates you, follow me," only Wilhelm would actually follow that (just kiding Wilhelm :)). So he's more caniving. It shows in the bible that demons and angels can come in many forms, and I believe that they come in forms to pull people away from God.

If someone seeing a ghost makes them believe in ghosts, then being that the bible discredit's ghosts, it will help make that person doubt the bible. So the demon will come in the form and actions of a ghost to pull that person away from God. They've been here all along, and they know the people whose lived in the past and where they've been. They can take the form of a man who passed away 50 years ago if they choose, and use that to drive a wedge between a person and their belief in God. Satan's a deceiver, and he can pull people away in many form and fashions, most of which aren't even obviously related to spiritual warfare.

I also believe that this is how many false gods come about. If someone sees a glowing thing that claims to be a god of the Sun, or whatever, chances are they'll believe it because they saw it. So Satan or the demons would come to people in various forms and pull people away from the true God, as I believe Him to be, by pretending to be other Gods.

That's a quicker version of why I believe Demons take the forms of Ghosts and other such things. Not to scare or anything, but to use it to drive a wedge between that person and God's teachings.

[SpiderHulkThing]

Now for the long version :D

Satan and the demons want to pull people away from God, but they won't always go and just say "Hi, I'm satan, God hates you, follow me," only Wilhelm would actually follow that (just kiding Wilhelm :)). So he's more caniving. It shows in the bible that demons and angels can come in many forms, and I believe that they come in forms to pull people away from God.

If someone seeing a ghost makes them believe in ghosts, then being that the bible discredit's ghosts, it will help make that person doubt the bible. So the demon will come in the form and actions of a ghost to pull that person away from God. They've been here all along, and they know the people whose lived in the past and where they've been. They can take the form of a man who passed away 50 years ago if they choose, and use that to drive a wedge between a person and their belief in God. Satan's a deceiver, and he can pull people away in many form and fashions, most of which aren't even obviously related to spiritual warfare.

I also believe that this is how many false gods come about. If someone sees a glowing thing that claims to be a god of the Sun, or whatever, chances are they'll believe it because they saw it. So Satan or the demons would come to people in various forms and pull people away from the true God, as I believe Him to be, by pretending to be other Gods.

That's a quicker version of why I believe Demons take the forms of Ghosts and other such things. Not to scare or anything, but to use it to drive a wedge between that person and God's teachings.

good explanation. i concure.

[JewishHobbit]

The Da Vinci Code is fiction. It really pisses me off when people seem to forget that. People shouldn't take it so seriously. Yes, Dan Brown referenced real theories and real organizations but it's still a FICTION book.

Yeah, that gets me too.

[PWN3R]

I don't feel like it.Give me the short version.

First two verses buddy. :up:

Rest of it is good as well...


http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/...011&version=31

[Abaddon]

So basically you guys are following the Elizabethan belief that demons,or the devil himself,can take the form of dead people to lure the living into damnation.Interesting,except that these ghost arent appear as your dead loved ones.And you(Jewishhobbit) seem to think that just seeing it would make people question God.Thats pretty ridiculous considering the amount of people who go to Church and still believe in ghosts.

[Abaddon]

Looking around makes me know theres a hell. The things that people do to one another and the things they do to themselves.



Is that it?I mean,come on.:rolleyes::down

[SpiderHulkThing]

Is that it?I mean,come on.:rolleyes::down

That's cool. The good thing is at least, that if it does exist, at least I won't have to go.

[JewishHobbit]

So basically you guys are following the Elizabethan belief that demons,or the devil himself,can take the form of dead people to lure the living into damnation.Interesting,except that these ghost arent appear as your dead loved ones.And you(Jewishhobbit) seem to think that just seeing it would make people question God.Thats pretty ridiculous considering the amount of people who go to Church and still believe in ghosts.

Well, never heard of the "Elizabethan" belief, but alright. And I'm not niave enough to believe that seeing a ghost will make one question his faith, but enough of it added to whatever the devil or just life in general throws at you can add up. I know for fact that it can work as it did with my mother. She use to be a christian in your youth, but turned from the church. She still believed in God, but just didn't really live like it. Then when she started hearing ghosts in one of our old houses, she went to a psychic about it and learned all about "Michael." That really made her question God. Then at the house I was talking about before, she knew both ladies (the one who saw the ghost, and the one who's grandfather "it was"). She saw the picture and was there when the lady flipped out in her basement, they were one in the same, and it was a good 50 or 60 years prior to our even living there when that man died. That time frame made her really doubt God because she really believed in Ghosts, though the bible says they don't exist. She also began to grow mad because it was messing with her kids (as "michael" messed with me in my youth). She didn't know why God would let crap like this happen, and she really began to doubt his authenticity. She did all the things that psychics and other ghost people say to do, but the ghost never went away. Then I came over and "christianized" the house as she put it, and boom, from that day on it was gone. And the day I left it came back. She was made a believer right then and there. When I later explained my opinions she just shook her head, afraid of the thought of a demon in her basement, but she acknowledged that it made sense and worked on her.

[JewishHobbit]

I believe in Hell because I believe in the passages that the bible says about it, though Hell is temparary and the lake of fire is what most people think of hell being (at least that's how I interpret the passages in Revelations)

[Abaddon]

Well,not that I doubt you,but where does the Bible actually say ghost don't exist?

Also,you can't expect your mothers own experience to be the same for everybody.I just can't get my head around why you would believe this.

[Abaddon]

That's cool. The good thing is at least, that if it does exist, at least I won't have to go.


I just don't get how you'd make a connection from the suckitude of the world to hell.:confused:


I'm guessing you grew up in a pretty religious household.

[Abaddon]

First two verses buddy. :up:

Rest of it is good as well...


http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/...011&version=31


Its not working.

[SpiderHulkThing]

So what do you believe in then Abaddon? And please note that I'm not trying to argue with you or anything, i'm just interested and that's the vibe i'm getting from you as well. Also note, I'm really not a bible pusher though I may seem to be coming off as one right now. I do believe in God, but I respect the beliefs of others and dont try to push my views on them. And right now I'm really worried about my dad b/c I do believe in heaven, and i'm afriad he wont be able to go since he doesnt believe in it.

[JewishHobbit]

Because it makes all notions of other religions and ghosts and all things that seem to make the bible iffy, make sense. Add that to the fact that angels and demons and such were shown to take other forms in the bible, and it's not a long stretch in the slightest.

And I don't remember the actual passage, and I'm too tired to look them up, but it's in the places talking about how all men are deemed to die once (taking out the reincarnation idea). Also, the bible says that when we die we go to be judged, heaven, hell, all that. If there were ghosts walking the earth, then that shows that someone didn't go to get judged upon death, and thus, that doesn't make sense with the bible.

As I said before, these are my beliefs on my opinions of what I've seen and encountered, and on how I interpret the bible. I can see how some of it could be confusing, but if you really think about it and look into it, it's not a stretch at all, and it really makes so many things that make people question God make sense.

[SpiderHulkThing]

I just don't get how you'd make a connection from the suckitude of the world to hell.:confused:


I'm guessing you grew up in a pretty religious household.

No, i didnt. My mother was a drug addict, addicted to pain killers. She's also bipolar which gives her the tendency for addiction. My father doesnt beleive in God at all. I have morals that were never instilled in me.

[Cyclops]

Jesus n' me are tight. We hang out on Fridays, go bowling (bastard always wins), cruise around the bars some, and have spirited debates over whether or not Bendis can write superhero books well.

[KingOfDreams]

No, i didnt. My mother was a drug addict, addicted to pain killers. She's also bipolar which gives her the tendency for addiction. My father doesnt beleive in God at all. I have morals that were never instilled in me.

I might be reading too much into your post but are you saying that people who don't believe in god don't have morals?

[JewishHobbit]

No, i didnt. My mother was a drug addict, addicted to pain killers. She's also bipolar which gives her the tendency for addiction. My father doesnt beleive in God at all. I have morals that were never instilled in me.

Nor was I raised in a christian home. My dad left before I was born and my mother married an angry alcoholic. My mom was good to me, but was not a christian, though she believed there was a God somewhere. She asked me when I was about 13 if I knew Jesus' connection to God and I said "Uncle?"

I was smart. I knew a guy was with Mary in the nativity sets, so he must have been the father... so Uncle was the next best choice :)

And Noah's flood was a disney cartoon :)

Not all christians are that way because someone forced their beliefs on them.

[SpiderHulkThing]

I might be reading too much into your post but are you saying that people who don't believe in god don't have morals?

No no. I'm sorry, i didn't mean it come off that way.

[Cyclops]

I think he's saying that the morals he developed weren't ingrained into him on account of his parents. Not that his parents are immoral or amoral.

[JewishHobbit]

I might be reading too much into your post but are you saying that people who don't believe in god don't have morals?

I think he's just saying that some morals he has, he didn't get from his parents. Not that they didn't have any.

[KingOfDreams]

No no. I'm sorry, i didn't mean it come off that way.

It's okay. I don't think you really came off that way. I was just checking.

[SpiderHulkThing]

Nor was I raised in a christian home. My dad left before I was born and my mother married an angry alcoholic. My mom was good to me, but was not a christian, though she believed there was a God somewhere. She asked me when I was about 13 if I knew Jesus' connection to God and I said "Uncle?"

I was smart. I knew a guy was with Mary in the nativity sets, so he must have been the father... so Uncle was the next best choice :)

Not all christians are that way because someone forced their beliefs on them.

Exactly. That's what i was trying to say. Come to think of it, it is weird that i believed in God b/c of all the crap my mother put me through. But i think having faith in something made enough of a difference in my life to make me keep pushing forward and not end up giving into the habits like those of my mother etc.

[Abaddon]

So what do you believe in then Abaddon? And please note that I'm not trying to argue with you or anything, i'm just interested and that's the vibe i'm getting from you as well. Also note, I'm really not a bible pusher though I may seem to be coming off as one right now. I do believe in God, but I respect the beliefs of others and dont try to push my views on them. And right now I'm really worried about my dad b/c I do believe in heaven, and i'm afriad he wont be able to go since he doesnt believe in it.


yeah,I'm hoping you don't think I'm just trying to argue and discredit you.I'm Agnostic,but I keep an open-mind to most things.What I've heard in the last two pages is apparently a much tougher pill to swallow and its mostly because the reasons I'm hearing just don't seem adequate.Not that it should automatically mean I'm right and youre wrong.Neither of us really has the answer.

I used to believe in ghost and some supernatural type stuff when I was young,but in my teen years I became more skeptical of **** like that.:confused:

I believe in God.I don't go to the Church,but I still pray.I accept that my belief in God may be wrong,and it works out because I'm not sure I should.I can't say I have a set position when it comes to the Almighty because I'm constantly reading different perspectives and considering those theories and beliefs,and so my own position seems to be evolving(and sometimes regressing).I flip through the Bible occassionally(usually Revelations since its the most accessible to me) just to get a better understanding.I don't think the Bible is meant to be taken literally,and I prefer to look at it as poetry,instead of prose.Its a very interesting story,and I pretty much see it the same way I see mythology.I'd expand further but I think I've already answered your question.:up:

[SpiderHulkThing]

It's okay. I don't think you really came off that way. I was just checking.

Yeah. My best friend is actually an athesit. We kind of stay off the whole religion topics, but I know that he has high moral fiber. So just b/c someone doesnt believe in God doesnt mean they don't have morals. I was also trying to say that I had faith even though no one really gave me a reason to believe in anything when i was little. No church influences and all that.

[SpiderHulkThing]

yeah,I'm hoping you don't think I'm just trying to argue and discredit you.I'm Agnostic,but I keep an open-mind to most things.What I've heard in the last two pages is apparently a much tougher pill to swallow and its mostly because the reasons I'm hearing just don't seem adequate.Not that it should automatically mean I'm right and youre wrong.Neither of us really has the answer.

I used to believe in ghost and some supernatural type stuff when I was young,but in my teen years I became more skeptical of **** like that.:confused:

I believe in God.I don't go to the Church,but I still pray.I accept that my belief in God may be wrong,and it works out because I'm not sure I should.I can't say I have a set position when it comes to the Almighty because I'm constantly reading different perspectives and considering those theories and beliefs,and so my own position seems to be evolving(and sometimes regressing).I flip through the Bible occassionally(usually Revelations since its the most accessible to me) just to get a better understanding.I don't think the Bible is meant to be taken literally,and I prefer to look at it as poetry,instead of prose.Its a very interesting story,and I pretty much see it the same way I see mythology.I'd expand further but I think I've already answered your question.:up:

Nice answer. Doesnt Agnostic mean that you don't believe in organized religion?

I guess I'll explain some of my beliefs in return. Obviously the Bible is a really big book. A very complex one at that. I believe that if you read the Bible, assuming that God is real, that you'll be able to understand what you're supposed to be able to understand. Some people need more direction in one way than in others for instance. Also, I'm not a regular church goer, b/c I tend to follow my heart and feelings and all that. I won't go to a church if i dont feel comfortable in it and i just get some bad vibes from some churches. As far as talking to God and all that, I believe that our concious is God's way of talking to us. Like i said about my parents, they didnt really teach me right from wrong. I just know when I feel guilty about something or when i am in a position of doing something that i think is right or wrong and i listen to my concious. Either way, i feel that believing in something is better than nothing.

[Abaddon]

Because it makes all notions of other religions and ghosts and all things that seem to make the bible iffy, make sense. Add that to the fact that angels and demons and such were shown to take other forms in the bible, and it's not a long stretch in the slightest.

And I don't remember the actual passage, and I'm too tired to look them up, but it's in the places talking about how all men are deemed to die once (taking out the reincarnation idea). Also, the bible says that when we die we go to be judged, heaven, hell, all that. If there were ghosts walking the earth, then that shows that someone didn't go to get judged upon death, and thus, that doesn't make sense with the bible.

As I said before, these are my beliefs on my opinions of what I've seen and encountered, and on how I interpret the bible. I can see how some of it could be confusing, but if you really think about it and look into it, it's not a stretch at all, and it really makes so many things that make people question God make sense.

Well I'm fairly certain the Bible implies that when a person dies they enter a sort of dreamless sleep,and its only till judgement day that everyone is judged.Of course there might be a contradiction,which is why I don't really approve of people taking the good book literally.


I also want to say that,in spite of the misgivings I and others share over the Bible and religion,it can have a very positive effect on individuals.It can inspire some to be better people,and I'm all for that.However,I still wish people would just take the message and not the story.Its not so much about the denotation but the connotation.

[Abaddon]

Nice answer. Doesnt Agnostic mean that you don't believe in organized religion?

I guess I'll explain some of my beliefs in return. Obviously the Bible is a really big book. A very complex one at that. I believe that if you read the Bible, assuming that God is real, that you'll be able to understand what you're supposed to be able to understand. Some people need more direction in one way than in others for instance. Also, I'm not a regular church goer, b/c I tend to follow my heart and feelings and all that. I won't go to a church if i dont feel comfortable in it and i just get some bad vibes from some churches. As far as talking to God and all that, I believe that our concious is God's way of talking to us. Like i said about my parents, they didnt really teach me right from wrong. I just know when I feel guilty about something or when i am in a position of doing something that i think is right or wrong and i listen to my concious. Either way, i feel that believing in something is better than nothing.


People tend to define Agnosticism differently.Either its seen as a belief in God,with no connection to organized religion,or the belief that the answers regarding God cannot be known.Fortunately I fit into both categories.:up:

Sometimes I think of God as just a part of my conscious,and likely every persons.

[JewishHobbit]

Well guys, I'm off to bed. Kudos for not turning this discussion to a heated argument or anything. I always respect that :up:

[Abaddon]

Well,its really not that big a deal when you think about it.Goodnight.

[SpiderHulkThing]

People tend to define Agnosticism differently.Either its seen as a belief in God,with no connection to organized religion,or the belief that the answers regarding God cannot be known.Fortunately I fit into both categories.:up:

Sometimes I think of God as just a part of my conscious,and likely every persons.

Seems like some of our stuff sounds similar then.

[PWN3R]

Yeah agree about this not being a flame war due to different views. Its nice to see there are posters on here, that can handle themselves in a mature manner.

[Abaddon]

Seems like some of our stuff sounds similar then.


Indeed.



Yeah agree about this not being a flame war due to different views. Its nice to see there are posters on here, that can handle themselves in a mature manner.

Well to be fair,I mightve lost it if Kessel Day stepped into this discussion spouting her fundamentalist beliefs.She's not a bad poster,but I disagree with pretty much everything she says regarding her faith.Plus I'm kinda tired.

[SpiderHulkThing]

Yeah agree about this not being a flame war due to different views. Its nice to see there are posters on here, that can handle themselves in a mature manner.

You called me mature. :O My fiancee would be so proud of me tonight. And also that I was acting in a mature fashion. I guess I'm really growing up.

I'm glad I'm getting to know some of you better.

[SpiderHulkThing]

Indeed.

Well to be fair,I mightve lost it if Kessel Day stepped into this discussion spouting her fundamentalist beliefs.She's not a bad poster,but I disagree with pretty much everything she says regarding her faith.Plus I'm kinda tired.

I'm glad that you and I had our discussion. At first when you asked why i could beleive in hell and some of the other stuff i was wondering if you were trying to start an argument. i'm tired too and could have easily been provoked. but i'm glad that getting to know each other's viewpoints revealed more things in common (or at least a fair amount) then not. there's a lesson in there somewhere, about communication in an orderly fashion and how to stay away from conflicts etc.

[Abaddon]

You called me mature. :O My fiancee would be so proud of me tonight. And also that I was acting in a mature fashion. I guess I'm really growing up.

I'm glad I'm getting to know some of you better.


Is it just me,or was your avatar bigger before?

[PWN3R]

Its true though. We all have different beliefs, but people are going to believe whatever they want.


I have seen so many petty insults on this board, due to the fact that they disagree with the person. Its normal to disagree, but you can disagree without insulting the person.

[The Riddler]

jesus is not real.

[Abaddon]

I'm glad that you and I had our discussion. At first when you asked why i could beleive in hell and some of the other stuff i was wondering if you were trying to start an argument. i'm tired too and could have easily been provoked. but i'm glad that getting to know each other's viewpoints revealed more things in common (or at least a fair amount) then not. there's a lesson in there somewhere, about communication in an orderly fashion and how to stay away from conflicts etc.


I agree,but I'm afraid this is turning into an afterschool special.:o

[PWN3R]

I agree,but I'm afraid this is turning into an afterschool special.:o

Like the special in Spidey where he got molested?? :( :(

http://spideygotmolested.ytmnd.com/

[SpiderHulkThing]

Is it just me,or was your avatar bigger before?

Nope. Doom gave me this avator. He was using it over the summer. I don't have enough posts, so my "boobies" are still small right now. I'll probably see if I can get someone to make me an avy of Spider-man, Hulk, and the Thing flashing to go with my name.

[SpiderHulkThing]

I agree,but I'm afraid this is turning into an afterschool special.:o

Yeah true. Sorry about that. Want me to call you an a$$wipe and call it a night? jk. :)

[SpiderHulkThing]

Like the special in Spidey where he got molested?? :( :(

http://spideygotmolested.ytmnd.com/

Whoa indeed.

[Abaddon]

:eek::confused:

[Arkady Rossovich]

Of course Jesus loves us all,he died for our sins.Many people still know this,and understand this.But there are the souls that are not worthy of this,this is why some people die in "mysterious" ways.They speak against the word of god and are striken down by divine power.

[Abaddon]

No,I think youre mistaken.

[Wilhelm-Scream]

Of course Jesus loves us all,he died for our sins.Many people still know this,and understand this.But there are the souls that are not worthy of this,this is why some people die in "mysterious" ways.They speak against the word of god and are striken down by divine power.Hmmm...I guess Satan had a protective bubble around William S. Burroughs.

[Darthphere]

jesus is not real.


Of course he is, there was a guy named Jesus, now if he was actually the son of God, is another question.

[ShadowBoxing]

jesus is not real.Um excuse me:mad: Jesus does a VERY nice job of mopping the floors at this school, I will not have you talk about him that way:down

[KingOfDreams]

I believe that Jesus was a real person. Don't ask my why, I just do. But I don't believe he was the son of God...because I don't believe in God.

[Abaddon]

Um excuse me:mad: Jesus does a VERY nice job of mopping the floors at this school, I will not have you talk about him that way:down


He's not talking about the guy whose name is pronounced "Hay-zeus".:thing:

[Super Flight]

he loves all of you, just like Gandhi, Martin luther king, and santa clause

[ShadowBoxing]

He's not talking about the guy whose name is pronounced "Hay-zeus".:thing:Well then I have no idea who he could be talking about:o

[Abaddon]

You wouldnt.:rolleyes:

[PWN3R]

Because I love Abaddon...

[The Chairman]

He loves all of us. Even those who don't love him. And why was this thread bumped?

[PWN3R]

Because the community is boring and I'm sure some idiot will come in here and argue with another idiot which in turn will provide an entertaining read.

That and the fact that Abby threads are fun.

[The Chairman]

We already have the Christianity Beliefs thread. That's enough, I would say.

[Kritish]

There's only one Jesus you need...

http://www.screenland.com/BigLebowskiSER1_2.jpg

[bullets]

if jesus loves me i need some reassurance.
a frickin hug would be nice

[Abaddon]

whooaa, huge bump.

[Scar Predator]

Yes indeed. There are few sure things in life but Agape, the love beyond all loves, is one of them.

[Argyle of Sock]

I believe that Jesus was a real person. Don't ask my why, I just do. But I don't believe he was the son of God...because I don't believe in God.

Agreed. I'm 90+ percent convinced that there was a historical Jesus. He was a political revolutionary (for lack of a better phrase), but not the son of any god.

Because I came 2000 years after his time, he never knew me and so (unless he posessed some serious precognitive powers) did not and does not love me.

Santa Clause, on the other hand, loves everyone unconditionally...

[Carcharodon]

He loves me repeatedly, and often. :csad:


I think I'm pregnant now.

[SuperMonkey]

A few old books, the histories of Christianity, biographies on Constantine....

Oh, and it was in 325 AD at the Council of Nicea (I misplelled it earlier).

And the final vote was 218 to 2 to make Jesus a god as opposed to a mortal prophet, where he could have been easily more associated with the Pagan Sun God, Sol Invictus.

:)

Not true, the Council only made it official church doctrine. The majority of Christians before this time had been practicing it anyway. I.E., it was a council to interpret the teachings of the Bible, not change them.

-- FunBob

[C.F. Kane]

I love Jesus, but I'm not 'in love', you know?

[Scar Predator]

Not true, the Council only made it official church doctrine. The majority of Christians before this time had been practicing it anyway. I.E., it was a council to interpret the teachings of the Bible, not change them.

-- FunBob

You are correct, SM. The Council didn't invent any persona for Jesus but rather sought to differentiate basic, orthodox thought from the marginalized schools of thought ( Arianism, Docetism,Montanism etc..) that became heretical. Obviously, Trinitarianism became the official stance on the nature of Jesus.

[Spoarz™]

Yes, I believe he does and that he died for my sins. I also believe that I'm not worthy of his sacrifice. :(

[blind_fury]

If Jesus loves us unconditionally, why do we need religion?

Why does he need recognition from people and society?

It's not like he's the type to throw people into the dungeon pit known as Hell because they didn't recognize his contribution to the world.

[blind_fury]

Why doesn't God have millions of kids with various women?

Low sperm count?

[blind_fury]

It's easy to be a great person when half of your DNA is shared with God.

I mean c'mon.

[blind_fury]

ok last one.

If Jesus' father wasn't judge, jury, and executioner would people really give damn about Jesus and his teachings/sacrifice?

no carrot and stick afterlife = no incentive to care about Jesus

[The Kid]

Either way, people would find his teaching's meaningful since they're good moral values. People naturally gravitate towards that stuff.

[blake]

I dunno, he died before I could meet him...

[blind_fury]

Either way, people would find his teaching's meaningful since they're good moral values. People naturally gravitate towards that stuff.

Yeah but recognizing him wouldn't be considered a moral necessity or a requirement for eternal salvation.

He'd have a few best selling biographies and self-help books just like every other inspirational leader.

[Memphis Slim]

Why do we have this thread?

[blind_fury]

Why not?

If nobody wanted to discuss it, it wouldn't have made it to page 2.

[Super Kal]

yep, I think so

[Wilhelm-Scream]

If my child was being anally raped to death by a hairy freak who crawled into her window, and I walked in, and had a gun, but just stood there watching the rape continue, and then let the freak escape out the window, and then watched my daughter bleed to death from her rectum.........would. you. say. that. I. was. a. "loving". Father?!?!?

'Cause Jesus does that every single day.
The only way you could possibly respect Jesus is if he was just a man who died and wasn't God and had no magical powers, but even then, if he claimed he WAS God, or God's Son, then he was either a con man or insane, so....

[WTFimVENOM]

If my child was being anally raped to death by a hairy freak who crawled into her window, and I walked in, and had a gun, but just stood there watching the rape continue, and then let the freak escape out the window, and then watched my daughter bleed to death from her rectum.........would. you. say. that. I. was. a. "loving". Father?!?!?

'Cause Jesus does that every single day.
The only way you could possibly respect Jesus is if he was just a man who died and wasn't God and had no magical powers, but even then, if he claimed he WAS God, or God's Son, then he was either a con man or insane, so....
Wow, I didn't know you felt so strongly about this Willhelm.... dam
Thats pretty graphic

[Wilhelm-Scream]

Wow, I didn't know you felt so strongly about this Willhelm.... dam
Thats pretty graphicWell, answer the question. Would you call someone who could stand by and let that happen, even though he had the supreme power to stop it, a "loving" person? :huh:

[Carcharodon]

If my child was being anally raped to death by a hairy freak who crawled into her window, and I walked in, and had a gun, but just stood there watching the rape continue, and then let the freak escape out the window, and then watched my daughter bleed to death from her rectum.........would. you. say. that. I. was. a. "loving". Father?!?!?

'Cause Jesus does that every single day.
The only way you could possibly respect Jesus is if he was just a man who died and wasn't God and had no magical powers, but even then, if he claimed he WAS God, or God's Son, then he was either a con man or insane, so....Rectal bleeding FTL. :csad:

[Carcharodon]

No. I'd do everything in my power to stop it and I'd fight until my last breath. Regardless of what the weapon was.Rubber chicken? That's just silly.

[LegendaryCaleb]

If my child was being anally raped to death by a hairy freak who crawled into her window, and I walked in, and had a gun, but just stood there watching the rape continue, and then let the freak escape out the window, and then watched my daughter bleed to death from her rectum.........would. you. say. that. I. was. a. "loving". Father?!?!?

'Cause Jesus does that every single day.
The only way you could possibly respect Jesus is if he was just a man who died and wasn't God and had no magical powers, but even then, if he claimed he WAS God, or God's Son, then he was either a con man or insane, so....
where does this apply?...u get anally raped everyday?

[Wilhelm-Scream]

No. I'd do everything in my power to stop it and I'd fight until my last breath. Regardless of what the weapon was.Yeah. Me too. Even if it wasn't someone I loved.
If it was someone I loved you'd better believe I'd step in and stop it.
God does not.
Jesus does not.
And yet apparently they're supposed to be even more loving, perfect and just than I am. :huh:

[Wilhelm-Scream]

where does this apply?...u get anally raped everyday?No, little girls do. :dry:
I can't see them all and have no power to protect them.
But Jesus supposedly does see them all and does have power to protect them.

[blind_fury]

Jesus and a wrathful God is just another version of good cop/bad cop.

You play this game so people think the good cop is doing them a favor when he really is just the lighter side of a concrete ultimatum.

[WTFimVENOM]

Well, answer the question. Would you call someone who could stand by and let that happen, even though he had the supreme power to stop it, a "loving" person? :huh:
I don't know what to say man, I don't put any stock in Jesus either way,
but I do understand where you are coming from...

[The Kid]

Yeah but recognizing him wouldn't be considered a moral necessity or a requirement for eternal salvation.

He'd have a few best selling biographies and self-help books just like every other inspirational leader.

Nothing wrong with that to be honest.

[The Kid]

Jesus and a wrathful God is just another version of good cop/bad cop.

You play this game so people think the good cop is doing them a favor when he really is just the lighter side of a concrete ultimatum.

You're absolutely right. It's a way of setting people straight by explaining the unexplainable, reasoning the unreasonable, filling in the gaps as we all hurtle towards a sweet dirt nap.

I view it as a way of saying we're still human actually. People forget it's not about vanity, arrogance, it's supposed to be about humility and humbleness before a power we have yet to fully understand and may never will...

Even better, it's more like your own mom and dad, blind. I'm guessing they guided you, influenced you, gave you good examples of what right and wrong is. That's religion in a nutshell. Then of course there's the crazy types too.