Dream Team League (Discussion)

[Ahura Mazda]

On Corp's request, I am going to submit the point system idea here for it to possibly be discussed.

Maybe we should think about another ranking system that mirrors Heroclix's point system and the way they put together matches, ie, the match is given a point value(lets say 300), and then you can pick as many characters as you want as long as they don't add up to over 300(you can have supes(200) and bats(100) and that's it, or you can have supes(200) and 5 robins(20), etc)

So for us, each character is rated on a 1 to 6 level, and for each match you are allowed a total of 15 points to fill.

so our existing ranking system would be allotted points like this:

Uber - 5 points
Medium - 3 points
Regular - 1 point

So then adding some new ranks to fill in the gaps we would get this:

Super-Uber(maybe King Thor, Dr. Manhattan, BION) - 6 points
Uber(Super-Skrull, Gladiator, Temugin) - 5 points
Super-Medium(maybe Xavier, Saturn Girl or Max Mercury) - 4 points
Medium(Aztek, Blob and Emma Frost) - 3 points
Super-Regular(maybe She-Hulk, Spider-Man or Hank Pym) - 2 points
Regular(Batman, Nightcrawler, etc) - 1 point

The names of these ranks could be anything, or maybe don't name them at all, just let them be numbers(that would make adding up your roster much easier). In addition, we could always rank characters a 7 also, if a character arises.

So possible line-ups for a 15 point match would be:

2 Ubers, 1 Medium, 2 Regulars
3 Ubers
1 Uber, 3 Mediums, 1 Regulars
2 Super-Ubers, 1 Medium
1 Super-Uber and 3 Mediums
1 Uber, 2 Super-Mediums, 1 Super-Regular

So with this, you completely lift the idea of forcing rankings on a teams line-up, along with the 5 character setup, just let them fill up their 15 points however they want to, and have the teams go at it. This would REALLY mix up the battles and introduce some *****en fights. Imagine 15 regulars taking on 3 ubers! :)

This would also open up the possibilty of having specialty matches where point totals are altered, like for All-Star week maybe up the total to 20 points to allow for a larger battle, or if the two combatants one week decide to alter it, they can.

Along with this, we would probably need to allow a roster increase to 15 characters at least, so people would be able to do the many regulars vs a few ubers type battles, and have enough characters to allow it.

You could still enforce the mixture of publisher thing(try to go 50/50) and having at least one female on the team with this also.

I think this is a very good idea but the point system should be raised to at least 18, as it should be based on 3 super ubers rather then 3 ubers. To be honest, I do not really agree with the category of super uber because it leaves too much room for a subjective choice.

[The Leaguer]

I don't like there being a class beyond uber. I think the upper limit established last season would be the best guildline.

[primemover]

I think this is a very good idea but the point system should be raised to at least 18, as it should be based on 3 super ubers rather then 3 ubers. To be honest, I do not really agree with the category of super uber because it leaves too much room for a subjective choice.

The points are based on what is allowed in a match now, that is a good point to start. That said, that number can change pretty easily.

Now the name 'super-uber' is just a label I threw on, in the future, if this system was established, characters would just be given a point value, and that is it. There really is no top level to the point value, for instance if we wanted, we could have a 7 point character, or even an 8, that ceiling would have to be discussed.

So to figure out these point values, somebody would mention a character, then there would be a discussion on what he is worth, then let it go at that. If King Thor is given a 7 point value, then he can be used, but he just takes up alot of points, hopefully that will balance things out.

Beyond the 6+ level characters being allowed via this system, I am more excited about seeing the lower teir ubers getting granted a 4 point value and having them be used more.

As for Leaguers comments about those upper characters, maybe the ceiling should be 6, which would allow for characters like Composite Man and Xav Juggernaut be allowed back in, but still disallow such chars as King Thor and such.

[AnnoyingSilence]

Bwhahha, you ****ing spelt intellect wrong. That hilarious AS, seriously.

For one, you're making judgements call out of nowhere. I can call you a tard because you're simply putting down one of the best movies made in decades. No, you didn't dislike it because of any particuler reason, you just dislike it because of your massive idiocy.

Keep on spelling you u and through thru, you spellbinding cluster****, sad excuse of a human being.Now i remember y i love u sooooo much:daredevil

i don't care how i spell it, as long as you know what is in the meaning. i really only try to correctly(down to the "T") post what i say when its time for battle, or its in some way, shape, or form needed. i could care less anyother time:D

JB, I'm sorry that i posted that. I only meant it to go that far and will not argue with X. I just taken on the policy tick him off when he's being a "Soap Dropper".

Cerebro - Only is as powerful as the person that uses the power. If I pick Avalanche, then I can not use his power beyond what he has done. For instance... I picked up the Regular for of Cable. Now he has telekinesis/pathic powers also, but I can not use them to the full extent that the Uber one does. Even if I use this robot to his full extent(X-men title character, before Zero Tolerence), I never recalled him actually being above Uber rankings. I mean, yea, you can make some pretty nice combonations, but if you drop Cerebro out... Bye bye Amazo, bye bye C-Man, bye bye both Mimic's, bye bye Rogue, etc... You said that Ubers are allowed to dupe once, right theres his made person. Then the rule of changing the rank of your characters ranking. You said that if anyone jumps rank then thats breaking the rules. That week(Me Vs. Elijya) I had Mount Joy jump into QuickSilver and Dreamer. If Mount Joy had stipped into Uber status he would have been out of the fight and it would be against the rules.... So:

1. One of your Ubers is allowed to "dupe" themselves.
and 2. If a Regular or Medium lifts its' rank, then that character is gone from the fight.

These characters are variety characters. If one is gone, then the other also have to go.

[AnnoyingSilence]

D/M SuperUber
D/M Uber
D/M Medium
D Regular
M Regular
1 Female

The SuperUber and Uber have to be from different universes.
make it similar and simple

[Nightwing.]

so are the battle sput off for another week then due to the character changes?

[AnnoyingSilence]

...

[XFanTim]

so are the battle sput off for another week then due to the character changes?
Yeah, JB said everything's put on hold indefinitely until we get all the character stuff sorted out.

[JewishHobbit]

I'm not sure on Magus as of yet. I think he sounds pretty easy to work around but his power is potentially too much. It'd be one of those cases where we'd have to downplay him to make it work. I think before I say yes or no on him I want to see where other characters that we've done that to like Composite Man and Validus go. I think Magus will be in the same ranking as all of them.

[Harlekin]

I'm all for the point system that primemover suggested. It would allow some great mixing up of teams, and also for some hardcore one-man armies to go against teams.

[XFanTim]

Primemover's system is too drastic a change to be made mid-season. Could be considered for next season, but shouldn't be considered as a mid-season change.

Of course, I also think banning dozens of characters is too drastic a change for mid-season and the uber bar should have been left fixed until the season's end.

[Nightwing.]

the point system sounds abit silly.i think we should stick with reg med and uber and just vote on what is too uber and what isnt.but if things are abit dull around here then introduce none DC/Marvel characters.that would be more fun and then people could have predators or aliens and that would be much better

[Nightwing.]

but yeah i agree.all changes should be made at the end of the season

[4StringFox]

Magus sounds all right if he doesn't go around growing larger than planets in space and then sucking whole planets up, Galactus-style.

See the thing is -- he wouldn't do that. If I remember right, the only time we ever see him that size is when Warlock is remembering Magus chasing him through space. The funny thing about Magus is that even though he's an extremely sophistocated computer, he's not really a strategist or a thinker (except that one time when he stalked Warlock for 3 YEARS and popped up out of nowhere while the New Mutants were fighting somebody totally unrelated, and supposedly spent his free time observing Earth -- but I think that can be chalked up to CIS). He's way closer to "Hulk smash" in his mindset. If he has to go into a heavily populated area he might shapeshift so as not to draw attention to himself, but then as soon as he finds whatever he's going to attack he drops the disguise and starts smashing things with abandon. When he attacked the X-Mansion, he could have grown to gigantic size and then just ripped the mansion out of the ground. Instead he stayed fairly small (for him) and just charged it straight ahead. Like I said, the guy doesn't plan, and he wouldn't normally take to someone else's plan.

How massive is this strength we're talking about? Hulk/Jugs class?

Yeah.

[4StringFox]

I agree that the point system shouldn't be brought in right now, although it should be considered for a future season.

[Nightwing.]

i dont think the point system should come into it cos then your just playing a card game in theory.this should be down to research and knowledge and writing and people will try and get 7 pointers and the whole arguements that have span are stating that they are too uber.so if people are wanting to change the system so that super ubers are allowed then people are gonna drop out.just stick with keeping the uber bar at this level and keep things at reg med and uber.

[Tropico]

I have posted this twice now. Please read and respond. I would appreciate it. Thank you. :)
I even copied it over so you wouldn't have to click a link. These are the only two Ubers I have that are under question and once they are reviewed I will shush and get out of the way. Promise.

When I first wanted Magus I had to make a reasoned argument for why he wasn't Too Uber (Tuber? heehee). Here's the reasons that came up:
- Clear and defined weaknesses. Magus is a living being, not a machine, and so couldn't be controlled by the Ex Machina guy or simply captured and rebuilt or anything. However, he is very vulnerable to (1) electricity (2) magnetism and (3) significant losses of mass (ie cutting or blasting off big pieces of him). Those are relatively easy tasks compared to what it would take to bring down most of the guys on the "Possibly Too Uber" list.
- Exploitable personality flaws. He is hugely self-centered, selfish, and megalomaniacal -- the kind of guy who would never go along with someone else's plan unless he saw a flaw to exploit for himself, or unless he could be convinced that he (Magus) actually thought of it himself first.
As the ruler of the Technarchy he is very devoted to its rules, particularly the one where Technarch children have to fight their parent to the death for the right to live. I even wrote this into one fight (vs. Gilrean/Black's Storm) -- he'd expected to kill Odin with TO, but instead Odin came back as TO Odin, so Magus immediately dropped everything to fight Odin, ignoring his surroundings and the rest of his team.
- A Medium and two Regs (Rogue, Colossus, and Nightcrawler) fought him alone and managed to drive him off with the three of them still standing.



If Dr. Fate goes, then I insist that Merlin, Dr. Strange, and all the other spellcasters on that list have to go too. Merlin never should have been here to start with.

Magus is a megamorph, he can alter his shape into vehicles and weapons just like Warlock. The only person I've seen that has developed an immunity to the TO virus is Rogue. It took a lot out of Nightcrawler after 'porting a piece of him, not everyone has a teleporter on their team to repeat the same stratagem. Yes, he can be hurt but by the same token he can replensih energy by infecting organic matter (trees and plant life count) and absorbing their "life's glow". Potentially, he can take out anyone in the DTL by infecting them and taking their energy.

At the risk of this sounding vindictive: I asked for him near the end of the last season (where a couple of too Ubers squeaked by) and I was denied. That alone is enough for me to say that he shouldn't be allowed. If he was ruled too Uber then, it should hold up again.

[Harlekin]

i dont think the point system should come into it cos then your just playing a card game in theory.this should be down to research and knowledge and writing and people will try and get 7 pointers and the whole arguements that have span are stating that they are too uber.so if people are wanting to change the system so that super ubers are allowed then people are gonna drop out.just stick with keeping the uber bar at this level and keep things at reg med and uber.
I suggest you read over Primemover's suggestion again to get a better grasp of the point system. A card game? WTF?

[Nightwing.]

ok so ive read it again.it still says to me that there would be the inclusion of people like king thor which again makes it hard for people to write a fun but plausible victory over them.and 15 regs against 1 uber.who the f**k wants to write out 15 different peoples actions towards another character.i think this idea sucks.and the reason i say its like a card game is because write ups will become a thing of the past and well be stuck with say a team roster of upto 3 ubers upto 5 mediums and upto 20 regs.people wont have time to research all these characters.the feed back would take ages if they did and in the end people will just put i choose blah blah and blah which equals 15 points its legal who would win? and the answer would be the super ubers.

the point people like my self are trying to get across are NO F***ING SUPER UBERS.JUST STICK WITH WHAT WE HAVE.

stick with JB's ruling about the ubers that arent allowed and leave out the idea of a points system.itll get far too complicated.

[Ahura Mazda]

As I stated elsewhere, and based on how much time I have available to me, if the uber level is lowerred effectively invalidating all of our ubers (Guyverjay's and mine) I will resign.

If guyverjay wishes to continue by himself then he has the team, if he wants to rebuild it and have me join him, I will consider it but otherwise I am out. I just do not have the time to rebuild the whole team and do research on a whole new set of characters.

Nobody seems to care apart from Tim, but changing rules so drastically in the middle of a season does not seem to me to be the best way to manage it.

[Harlekin]

ok so ive read it again.it still says to me that there would be the inclusion of people like king thor which again makes it hard for people to write a fun but plausible victory over them.and 15 regs against 1 uber.who the f**k wants to write out 15 different peoples actions towards another character.i think this idea sucks.and the reason i say its like a card game is because write ups will become a thing of the past and well be stuck with say a team roster of upto 3 ubers upto 5 mediums and upto 20 regs.people wont have time to research all these characters.the feed back would take ages if they did and in the end people will just put i choose blah blah and blah which equals 15 points its legal who would win? and the answer would be the super ubers.

the point people like my self are trying to get across are NO F***ING SUPER UBERS.JUST STICK WITH WHAT WE HAVE.

stick with JB's ruling about the ubers that arent allowed and leave out the idea of a points system.itll get far too complicated.
Because obviously we'll be seeing 20 reg teams like that. Imagine it like it is now, except that in some cases the super uber would replace the team. It in no way resembles a card game... at all.

[The Leaguer]

I agree that the point system shouldn't be brought in right now, although it should be considered for a future season.

Roger that. And I share Nightwing's views: no super-ubers. They are the whole reason behind what's going on right now.

[wiegeabo]

Boy, you leave the boards for a few hours and look what happens.

Ok, my take on this situation. I do think the too uber bar should be lowered, but wait until next season. Just apply the bar to future pick ups for the remainder of season 2. With the lowered bar, if someone has a character that's now considered too uber, too bad. They got their pick in when the character was still legal, so that character should be allowed until the end of the season, at least. Whether I think the characters are too uber or not doesn't matter right now, it's only fair they get to keep the characters that were previously deemed ok.

Making drastic changes right now would only seriously hurt the flow of the season, especially since some of the now banned characters were fine last season (we might have lowered the bar too far, which is another reason we should wait). I also don't think we should change the way teams or lineups are formed. That is an idea worth consideration, but, again, not until the offseason.

Once the season is over, we'll get our typical one/two month offseason to hash out all of these issues and put new rules in place. It'll give everyone time to research if necessary, and get us back on track for this season.

I suggest we take this week off as well so everyone can cool their heels, take a deep breath, and rest up. It'll give us a chance to get back into the spirit of things and get this season moving again with the same spirit the first half had.

[4StringFox]

At the risk of this sounding vindictive: I asked for him near the end of the last season (where a couple of too Ubers squeaked by) and I was denied. That alone is enough for me to say that he shouldn't be allowed. If he was ruled too Uber then, it should hold up again.

I forgot all about that. Ok, if we're resetting everything to last season and he was too uber last season, then I guess he's too uber now.

[4StringFox]

Boy, you leave the boards for a few hours and look what happens.

Yeah, dude, I know. Elijya said almost the exact same thing after he got home from work last night!

I suggest we take this week off as well so everyone can cool their heels, take a deep breath, and rest up. It'll give us a chance to get back into the spirit of things and get this season moving again with the same spirit the first half had.

JB ruled that all matches and trades are suspended until this crap is ironed out.

[primemover]

ok so ive read it again.it still says to me that there would be the inclusion of people like king thor which again makes it hard for people to write a fun but plausible victory over them.and 15 regs against 1 uber.who the f**k wants to write out 15 different peoples actions towards another character.i think this idea sucks.and the reason i say its like a card game is because write ups will become a thing of the past and well be stuck with say a team roster of upto 3 ubers upto 5 mediums and upto 20 regs.people wont have time to research all these characters.the feed back would take ages if they did and in the end people will just put i choose blah blah and blah which equals 15 points its legal who would win? and the answer would be the super ubers.

the point people like my self are trying to get across are NO F***ING SUPER UBERS.JUST STICK WITH WHAT WE HAVE.

stick with JB's ruling about the ubers that arent allowed and leave out the idea of a points system.itll get far too complicated.

Actually it would be 15 regulars to 3 ubers, do the math correctly next time.

Also, that was mentioned tongue in cheek, there would be limits to the amount of characters you can put on the field at once, most likely by the fact that your roster would be limited, it'd be hard to field a 15 regular team from a roster of 10 characters now wouldn't it. Rosters would have to grow, but I would in NO WAY condone a 30 man roster, 15 at maximum, which would give people alot of flexibility in their line-up making.

I would recommend some line-up stipulations that would defend against going with all regulars or all ubers, maybe force a balance of 1-3 and 4-6 ranked characters, etc.

Look at the list of possible line-up examples I gave, I can't imagine you seing a problem with those.

If you really didn't want to field a team of many regulars, you still have the ability to just do the 2u/1m/2r system, it is your choice, and that is what this boils down to, having more of a choice on how you put your team together, in characters and in weekly line-up decisions.

I have no idea what you are talking about with this card game thing, if you are talking about people not doing write-ups and just looking at rosters, I don't know WHY this system would encourage that more or less than the way it is now, maybe you can explain that more.

Unless this season comes to a grinding halt with a major overhaul in sight, I would never recommend we all of a sudden switch to this, it would definately be a 3rd season deal.

[Harlekin]

On one hand I agree with wiegeabo, Ahura and XFanTim that this should kind of wait for next season. On the other hand, it might be better to get this crap out of the way first.

I am leaning to the first solution right now and suggest that we continue this season unhindered, but let this week be the last trade week, stopping anymore endless discussions. One last week for trades, keep it like it is for now, and just plain no more changes to the line-up. Every one makes his/her final team, and that's IT.

[Nightwing.]

Actually it would be 15 regulars to 3 ubers, do the math correctly next time.

Also, that was mentioned tongue in cheek, there would be limits to the amount of characters you can put on the field at once, most likely by the fact that your roster would be limited, it'd be hard to field a 15 regular team from a roster of 10 characters now wouldn't it. Rosters would have to grow, but I would in NO WAY condone a 30 man roster, 15 at maximum, which would give people alot of flexibility in their line-up making.

I would recommend some line-up stipulations that would defend against going with all regulars or all ubers, maybe force a balance of 1-3 and 4-6 ranked characters, etc.

Look at the list of possible line-up examples I gave, I can't imagine you seing a problem with those.

If you really didn't want to field a team of many regulars, you still have the ability to just do the 2u/1m/2r system, it is your choice, and that is what this boils down to, having more of a choice on how you put your team together, in characters and in weekly line-up decisions.

I have no idea what you are talking about with this card game thing, if you are talking about people not doing write-ups and just looking at rosters, I don't know WHY this system would encourage that more or less than the way it is now, maybe you can explain that more.

Unless this season comes to a grinding halt with a major overhaul in sight, I would never recommend we all of a sudden switch to this, it would definately be a 3rd season deal.

its not that i have a problem with the amount of characters.ok it may take time to get used to the number you had to write i just dont want super ubers to be allowed which is what you are sneakily trying to do.whether its deliberate or not its what you are doing.

[Harlekin]

Sneakily trying to shoehorn in super-ubers? I think he's just giving another perspective, and trying to unify all the other perspectives. Don't accuse.

[Nightwing.]

well weve spent along time trying to filter out super ubers and hes craftily trying to bring em back in.now i want to resolve the situation by waiting to the end of season for major uber removal but i think at this point in time Dr.Manhatten and King Thor should be removed indefinatley as they were the cause of this whole fiasco

[The Leaguer]

I like the verb "shoehorn."

[Harlekin]

Just see primemover's post below.

[primemover]

its not that i have a problem with the amount of characters.ok it may take time to get used to the number you had to write i just dont want super ubers to be allowed which is what you are sneakily trying to do.whether its deliberate or not its what you are doing.

Actually, I am FOR lowering the uber bar, that is not a secret.

What I am against is the ditching of characters because of rank and trying to fit them into the ranking system that we have, one thing you forget about the point system is that even though super-ubers might be allowed, they COST more, that is how the balance is forced.

[Nightwing.]

well what ever hes doing.just leave it all until end of season except for the removal of dr.m and king thor.

[Harlekin]

It's just a goddamn theory man.

[primemover]

One last week for trades, keep it like it is for now, and just plain no more changes to the line-up. Every one makes his/her final team, and that's IT.

This would be brutal, but awesome!

[Nightwing.]

Actually, I am FOR lowering the uber bar, that is not a secret.

What I am against is the ditching of characters because of rank and trying to fit them into the ranking system that we have, one thing you forget about the point system is that even though super-ubers might be allowed, they COST more, that is how the balance is forced.

whether they cost more or not is irrelevant.i like your idea but what noone seems to grasp that im saying is this

NOONE WANTS SUPER UBERS AS THEY ARE TOO HARD TO WRITE IN A PLAUSIBLE YET FUN WRITE UP AS NOONE CAN BEAT THEM REALISTICLY.THIS IS ABOUT THE WRITING.NOT THE CHARACTERS

[Harlekin]

It would quite simply be the easiest way to solve all of this, till the next season.

Nightwing: Faced with super-uber means you need to get creative. And that's all about the writing.

[primemover]

whether they cost more or not is irrelevant.i like your idea but what noone seems to grasp that im saying is this

NOONE WANTS SUPER UBERS AS THEY ARE TOO HARD TO WRITE IN A PLAUSIBLE YET FUN WRITE UP AS NOONE CAN BEAT THEM REALISTICLY.THIS IS ABOUT THE WRITING.NOT THE CHARACTERS

This from a person who voted against a team that did a write up and whose opponent didn't, just because of a SINGLE CHARACTER. Here, let me refresh your memory (http://superherohype.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5034782&postcount=18).

Sorry for coming off as vindictive, as it was my team that you voted against, but after this diatribe of yours about the points system, it just plain irritates me to no end.

[Nightwing.]

look youve got your opinion and ive got mine.but the whole thing that was decided and is temporarily in effect is no super ubers.now we are deciding whther it takes effect now or end of season and what i am saying is (my own personal view by the way) is that we should leave all ubers where they are except for dr.m and king thor and resolve the issue end of season.

[Nightwing.]

yeah so what?are we talking about who voted who?or are we settling the problem with drm and king thor.which is what this whole thing started with?

[primemover]

look youve got your opinion and ive got mine.but the whole thing that was decided and is temporarily in effect is no super ubers.now we are deciding whther it takes effect now or end of season and what i am saying is (my own personal view by the way) is that we should leave all ubers where they are except for dr.m and king thor and resolve the issue end of season.

that sounds fine, wait until next season, for now just cull these too-uber characters, let those who lost characters get the previously traded 'legal' characters back regardless of duplication, and lets finish the season.

[Union Jack]

which too uber characters are we on about,just manhatten and king thor?

[TheCorpulent1]

Ok, I agree with all the suggestions that all changes should be left to next season. We could just go back to the way things were before Dr. Manhattan and King Thor entered the picture. I'll ditch Hourman with the worlogog so that pre-cog ubers are totally out of the DTL and people can get along fine. Then we can resume the rest of this season while ironing out where we want the ubers to be for next season, hopefully with reasonable debate and thoughtful points brought up, though I know that may be too much to ask at this point.

Regarding primemover's point system: I didn't realize how complicated it was when I skimmed over it the first time. My thoughts on it are that it should be simplified from a massively variable point deal to a simple either/or system. Either you take one super-uber or you use a regular, 5 person, 2 U, 1 M, 2 R team. Those would be the only options. No 3 ubers vs. 15 regs, just the single choice of one super-uber or the normally laid-out teams we've been using since the beginning of this season. Anything more would create unwarranted complication, which just begs for people to turn around and argue with righteous indignation. I think, more than anything else, this whole deal with the uber bar slowly rising has taught us that simpler = better for the DTL.
which too uber characters are we on about,just manhatten and king thor?
No, this has unfortunately gone way beyond that. There's a list of too uber characters and another list of debatably too uber characters in the Transaction thread.

[Nightwing.]

yes drop dr.m and king thor.everyone else keeps who they got.trades can carry on just no super ubers.if they get deemed too uber dont plead for em.a unanimous vote should tell you you cant have em

[TheCorpulent1]

Nothing in the DTL has ever been unanimous.

[Nightwing.]

yes it has.everyone who said king thor=too uber is a unanymous vote.

[TheCorpulent1]

Not everyone said King Thor was too uber, so it wasn't unanimous. Unanimous would mean that literally everyone in the DTL supported a decision, not just that a bunch of people supported your decision.

[Union Jack]

doesnt have to be unanimous,just a mjority vote.

[Nightwing.]

unanymous means a group on a whole having the same decision it doesnt mean everyone.didnt you go to school?

[Harlekin]

unanymous means a group on a whole having the same decision it doesnt mean everyone.didnt you go to school?
And I suggest you go back. Corp used the correct definition of unanimous.

[Union Jack]

yeah,he did...sorry nightwing.
still surely it does have to be unanimous...just a majority vote.

[XFanTim]

Nightwing, you shouldn't act so cocky unless you're actually correct. Unanimous (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=unanimous) literally means "one mind" -- it describes a state of complete agreement. A simple majority is not the same thing as a unanimous vote.

[TheCorpulent1]

It's a non-issue. I've dropped King Thor and I suspect Tim will probably follow soon with Manhattan because he seems as interested in getting the DTL back on track as I am. I'll reiterate that it makes no sense whatsoever to me how people can see King Thor and the potential power of some other ubers and say the former is greater, but I don't care anymore. You guys win.

[Nightwing.]

no he dident because he thinks unanymous means that everyone should have the same view.it just needs a majority.it could have been unamymous towards his decision.its only unanymous because everyone knows who said what.anonymous means that its nameless.unanymous is just a posh word.

*edit to one of my previous posts. a majority of objections towards a character should state that they are too uber.dont try and chance it with a three page shpiel.accept it and move on.just like a while back i was told steel with aegis armour was too uber.i didnt whinge and whine i just said ok ill use the normal one.....because the majority said he was too uber.its called being mature and accepting stuff

[Nightwing.]

Nightwing, you shouldn't act so cocky unless you're actually correct. Unanimous (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=unanimous) literally means "one mind" -- it describes a state of complete agreement. A simple majority is not the same thing as a unanimous vote.

ok i accept my dumbness.

[Harlekin]

Nightwing, if you are the only one that thinks unaminous means that, and I'm pretty sure Corp is a linguistics (or English, whatever) major/minor, who do you think is wrong? Do you really want me to grab the Oxford dictionary?

[Nightwing.]

actually it says in your link Sharing the same opinions or views.so i was right.its just ai should have added a majority in front of it.

[XFanTim]

Ha ha, it's cool -- we're all dumb sometimes. :)

[TheCorpulent1]

It means everyone's sharing the same opinions or views. If a majority of people share the same views, it's called a majority, not a unanimity. By the way, the definition of unanimity (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=unanimity) is "everyone being of one mind."

[Nightwing.]

does it matter now?youve dropped king thor and im just saying stuff others darednt

[TheCorpulent1]

No, it doesn't matter now. I'm sorry, that last post came off snarkier than I meant it to. This whole business is just pissing me off.

[Harlekin]

Well, now that the season is back on track, we can start having some fun again.

[Guyverjay]

I say bring on the damn KING!!!!!!

I can kick his ass anyway, so why not:up:

Still don't like the Doc though, all his supposed weaknesses are just basic assumption. The guy was supposed to be able to do literally ANYTHING he wanted to. Maybe Tim can post his arguments agasn because I didn't actually read them:p

[X]

Sersei needs to be in the too uber list. She's a female Thanos, literally. She's one punched KO'ed Hercules (The Immortal, actually powerful one) protected The Avenger's when the ****ing universe was blinking out of existence... She's come back in seconds after being atomized by herald level beings. We're talking about telepathy and massive resitance to it, total molculer control, she's just about as strong as she needs to be, massive, massive transmution... A pretty much infinite source of power.

[X]

Oh, lets not forget her casually turning three of Maelstorm's Minions into different animals. Gronk (Who's pretty powerful) Phobius, and somebody else. A pig, a duck, and something else respectivly. :D

[primemover]

yeah so what?are we talking about who voted who?or are we settling the problem with drm and king thor.which is what this whole thing started with?

Just responding to you screaming a hypocritical platitude, that is all :)

[Nightwing.]

that was ages ago.were done beefin.people are dropping out because of it now

[TheCorpulent1]

Yeah, I asked JB about Sersi. I figured that if Firestorm and others of that nature are allowed, she'd be permissable. She's got a lot going for her but she's far from unbeatable. She'll probably be out next season though, which kind of sucks since I've had her since last season, but I'll deal with it.

[DBM]

Yeah, I asked JB about Sersi. I figured that if Firestorm and others of that nature are allowed, she'd be permissable. She's got a lot going for her but she's far from unbeatable. She'll probably be out next season though, which kind of sucks since I've had her since last season, but I'll deal with it.

IIRC, I had Element Lad and Blink go against her and win. I think you even had her then Corp.

[TheCorpulent1]

I believe that was me. I think I'm the only person who's had Sersi for any length of time. I wonder if anyone else even realizes how good she is.

Anyway, in my write-up I had Blink occupied with someone else and Sersi and Element Lad transmutated each other a bit, testing each other out, then Sersi just blasted him with cosmic energy since she figured they could transmute all day. :)

[DBM]

I believe that was me. I think I'm the only person who's had Sersi for any length of time. I wonder if anyone else even realizes how good she is.

Anyway, in my write-up I had Blink occupied with someone else and Sersi and Element Lad transmutated each other a bit, testing each other out, then Sersi just blasted him with cosmic energy since she figured they could transmute all day. :)

But my write up was the one that won. :p

So it's the one that counts. :D

[wiegeabo]

If they were fine last season, I don't see why they shouldn't be fine now. That bar seemed to work fairly well.

[Guyverjay]

It was a draw:o

I remember because I did it on purpose taking the win from Corp:D

[TheCorpulent1]

Yes, I remember. You vindictive bastard. :mad:

[DBM]

It was a draw:o

I remember because I did it on purpose taking the win from Corp:D

Is that what it was? It's too long ago for me to remember. I just remember it being a really good match.

[TheCorpulent1]

Thanks, it was good for me too. :cool:

[Johnny Blaze]

Is that what it was? It's too long ago for me to remember. I just remember it being a really good match.
BAM!! (http://superherohype.com/forums/showthread.php?t=124042&page=2&pp=25) :up:

[TheCorpulent1]

BAM!! (http://superherohype.com/forums/showthread.php?t=124042&page=2&pp=25) :up:
Heh, I had Patriarch call Blink a barbarian! I remember that one. :D

I miss Patriarch.

[DBM]

BAM!! (http://superherohype.com/forums/showthread.php?t=124042&page=2&pp=25) :up:

Now I remember it.

GOD DAMMIT!!

If I had been able to vote for myself I would have won.

Oh, well. A tie with Corp is good for me. I wish I had known more about his characters from the start because I would have kicked his ass:p but I don't know **** about DC characters.

Heh, I had Patriarch call Blink a barbarian! I remember that one.

I miss Patriarch.

He was good. I remember picking him up after you dropped him and using him.

[X]

Meh, I had Aza Chorn, who was Patriarch to the nth level. :(

[primemover]

Regarding primemover's point system: I didn't realize how complicated it was when I skimmed over it the first time. My thoughts on it are that it should be simplified from a massively variable point deal to a simple either/or system. Either you take one super-uber or you use a regular, 5 person, 2 U, 1 M, 2 R team. Those would be the only options. No 3 ubers vs. 15 regs, just the single choice of one super-uber or the normally laid-out teams we've been using since the beginning of this season. Anything more would create unwarranted complication, which just begs for people to turn around and argue with righteous indignation. I think, more than anything else, this whole deal with the uber bar slowly rising has taught us that simpler = better for the DTL.

I really don't see how complicated this would be, if you can add, you can set up a team, it really is as simple as that. After all the characters are given points it should be that straightforward. Even as 'simple' as the system is right now, people STILL turn in illegal line-ups, this could recitify that actually.

The only stipulation I would probably add would be that you must have at least one character from the lower ranks, say force at least one character from the 1-3 point range, that would keep people from doing the 3 uber team thing.

Figuring out what point value characters are can be a bit more tricky, but we still rumble over that one, so it would be the same ole, same ole :) I actually think having twice the amount of ranking categories will make alot of these characters easier to rank.

[XFanTim]

Still don't like the Doc though, all his supposed weaknesses are just basic assumption. The guy was supposed to be able to do literally ANYTHING he wanted to. Maybe Tim can post his arguments agasn because I didn't actually read them:p
Well, he was basically able to do anything the story called for, but I'm limiting him to powers he was specifically shown to have, which is:
(1) matter transmutation
(2) extreme precognition (the future is as clear as the present)
(3) teleportation (including interplanetary distances)
(4) ability to alter his body, such as changes his size or appearance, or even reconstructing himself after disintegration
(5) subatomic-level senses (he can see neutrinos)
(6) extremely advanced mind (able to handle multiple complex tasks simultaneously)
(7) the ability to create multiple bodies (I'm not planning to use this one, and anyway I believe DTL rules limit him to one extra body)

Some limitations/weaknesses:

His precognition can be interfered with by tachyon particles. While the other DTL characters won't know he's a precog (unless they have a telepath who can pull the info from Manhattan's mind or the mind of his teammates, or they have a magic user who can just scry for info at the start of the battle), someone as smart as Mr. Fantastic could probably deduce that Dr. Manhattan was anticipating their moves, and figure out a way to muck up his precog on the fly. If written well it would certainly seem plausible.

He has no magical abilities (there was no indication magic even exists in the Watchmen universe), and thus also no immunity to magic. If Dr. Strange hit him with a spell to make him forget how to use his powers, for example, then he'd forget how to use his powers. Someone could also presumably interfere with his precognition by magical means.

He has no telepathy, and there's no evidence that he's resistant to telepathy (because of course there also weren't any telepaths in Watchmen). I'd think with Dr. Manhattan's advanced mind you could argue that he'd be able to at least fight back against a telepath a little, but I still think an uber level telepath could eventually overwhelm him. Not to mention, they could feed him all sorts of false images of the future and totally mess up his pre-cog.

Even though he's basically immune to physical damage (because he can rebuild himself even after disintegration), I would think he must be made of something even if it's just some sort of energy. So a Silver Surfer like being could potentially kill him by disintegrating him and draining all his energy. (Not that the Silver Surfer is likely to kill anyone, but someone like Thanos or Darkseid could presumably destroy him).

Also, Dr. Manhattan has never had to contend with another matter transmuter, so I could see someone like that (or a power copier) being able to take him apart. And there's no indication that he can use his powers while his bodies destroyed (other than for putting himself back together, anyway) -- so at best he might end up in a perpetual stalemate, with him continually trying to rebuild himself while someone else keeps taking him apart. Someone might also be able to accomplish this by trapping him in some continuous disintegration beam that works faster can rebuild himself.

One note about power copiers, though -- if they aren't someone who can copy intelligence, they might be somewhat overwhelmed by suddenly receiving Dr. M's ability to see all of time at once (not to mention seeing matter on a subatomic level).

There's some other things he's never been shown to be able to do, such as time travel or interdimensional teleportation. So someone could use tech or magic to strand him in a different time period or dimensional plane, and there'd be nothing he could do. Of course, to successfully hit him with this (or other attacks) they'd probably have to mess up his pre-cog first, but as I've said, magic users, tech geniuses, and telepaths all have ways they could do that, and almost everyone has at least one of those.

I realize this is all kind of speculative: We don't know Dr. Manhattan can't block magic, because he never met any magic users. We don't know he can't block telepathy, because he never met any telepaths. And so forth. But I think it's a lot more reasonable to assume a character can't do things unless he was actually shown to be able to do them, rather than just assuming he has a whole bunch of powers he never used.

[Guyverjay]

Okay sounds fair enough

[X]

God I want to have that mans children. :up: :(

[Nightwing.]

so does anyone have any info on the weapon x facility?i wanna start my write up.i need to know exactly how much room i got to whoop king thor around:D

[Gilrean]

Make it up, there isn't any real info on it.

[Nightwing.]

so i could base it on the film version?thats all i can really think of.and id love to have use of the dam.

[Harlekin]

I just wanted to restart this particular discussion:
Are female starters all that neccesary? Why are they compulsory?

[Guyverjay]

Because Women need love too, besides it adds some strategy.

[Nightwing.]

i dont think they are necessary.get a vote going.i vote

no to women in teams as a necessity

[Harlekin]

Because Women need love too, besides it adds some strategy.
Strategy in the sense that it forces me to completely change my line-up for a week, because my intended strategy didn't have a female in play.

[Johnny Blaze]

Because Women need love too, besides it adds some strategy.
:D :up:

[Harlekin]

Seriously? That's it?

I think its a pretty crappy rule if you don't mind me saying.

[Johnny Blaze]

That's cool. I don't mind you saying. http://www.honda-acura.net/forums/images/smilies/tongue.gif

It was made back in the DTT days, along with the 2 Ubers and 3 Reg rule, to make people use more strategy when creating their teams. When I started the DTL I carried those rules over.

[TheCorpulent1]

I've come to like the women I'm using a lot. They're all pretty good. Maybe you should just look for better female characters, Harlekin. And I don't mean that to be insulting, even though it kinda sounds that way.

[Harlekin]

Oh, don't get me wrong. I like using characters like Nocturne, its just that sometimes I got this perfect combination in my head, and it gets screwed with by the female rule. I'll live with it though, don't worry. I just like my characters too damn much, I guess. Maybe I'll switch up Optimus Prime sometime soon for a Female Marvel uber. At least gives me a bit more versitality.

It wasn't insulting at all Corp.

[primemover]

I am for dropping that gender line-up stipulation, I would never trade my two females if it were the case, it just ruins a couple of cool character combos! Hell, for the better part of my season I have gone with a 2 female line-up!

Heck, I am also for dropping the publisher stipulation, me crazy! :)

[Union Jack]

folk can still use women for the strategy,just make it not compulsary.
if people want to have a woman in there thats fine but iot seem daft having to have a woman in the team.
it is like (and i certainly don't mean to be offensive)like having to have the black man on the team,this was something the avengers faced not too long ago...
it shouldnt be compulsary,if it adds dynamic to some teams fine,but a male character can do that too.
there would be even more strategy if the line up was totalkly down to your choosing.
i remember when we first started the dtl i thought it a strange rule.
so what about next season(if we have one) we drop the female thing.
not all teams need a woman.
(except if some cleaning needs to be done!! ;) :D)......JOKE!!!!!

[TheCorpulent1]

I don't mind the female thing, but I wouldn't see a problem with dropping it. Maybe that could be another change for next season.

[Harlekin]

Wouldn't mind dropping it here and now though.

[TheCorpulent1]

Me either, I just don't want to kick up any more duststorms over anything. I wonder how many people would ditch their females if they could.

[Union Jack]

i would ditch mine,i am always having trouble bringing union jack into the fray....stupid blinkin women!!!
im not saying the female characters are bad as such,but my team would be stronger without having to have them in there.

[Nightwing.]

id like the option to have a woman in my team just not every single match.

[Harlekin]

I would probably drop Wonder Woman, but keep Nocturne. Would just use her a little less.

[primemover]

Another exploration question along the same lines as the female one.

Lets say, the DTL were to get rid of the equal publisher representation line-up stipulation, how would that effect your personal roster and weekly line-ups, would you favor one universe over another, and by how much. And overall, who do you think the league would favor, if at all?

I really have no idea, I am middle of the road as far as this is concerned, it'd truly be a character to character thing, based on their usefulness.

[TheCorpulent1]

I would use Giant-Man a hell of a lot more. I can never justify using him over Proctor right now, but if I could have more than one Marvel reg in a match, he'd be in there just about every time.

I think who favors which publisher would vary from person to person. I know I'd probably veer more towards Marvel since I have more experience with their characters, but I wouldn't totally abandon DC because guys like the Dark Flash are just too awesome to pass up.

[Harlekin]

I'd be veering majorly to the DC side. For some reason, I love using the DC characters in this game, they're so goddamn versatile, and are mostly great characters. Me getting all fired up for DC Countdown, and pretty much anything DC this year helps too.

[Nightwing.]

thats a good question.the thing is i have 2 favourite characters and they are opposite universes they are Gambit and Nightwing.i dont know much about them but i think theyre cool.but id say im more leaning towards DC.they seem to have more power based characters rather than guys with suites and gadgets (mysterio,original chameleon,spiderman's web shooters)the thing i dont like about DC is the follow on characters for eg the flash.the first one got his abilities from a one of accident.the second does exactly the same thing due to experiment and then the third one follows suit.silly.

[XFanTim]

I don't care one way or another about the "must have a woman" rule. But I like the fact that we have to have a mix of the two companies . . . forces people who are more familiar with one company to get some exposure to the other side, which I think is a good thing.

[wiegeabo]

Mixing the companies also has a strategic advantage for teams. A team made up of characters from only one universe wouldn't have any information on opponents from the other team that come from the other universe.

[Harlekin]

I agree that I don't mind the mix of the two companies. It allows for an interesting mixture of tech, and mystical items and the like, not to mention an interesting character dynamic.

[primemover]

All good points, interesting to see the different sides.

If anything, I would like to see the stipulation that you must have one Uber from each publisher, and one Regular from each publisher gone. Just say you need to have at least two characters from each publisher, no matter rank or gender, and let us go from there.

I think that would be neat, and would free things up a bit and not lose the mix.

[Union Jack]

yeah,i'd say keep the two companies thing,but ditch the "got to have a female in your squad" thing.

[Guyverjay]

*yearns for the good old days and then realises it wasn't that long ago*~:(

[primemover]

*yearns for the good old days and then realises it wasn't that long ago*~:(

Why, what happened in the good old days, something important? Nothing comes to mind . .

[TheCorpulent1]

People complained less than Guyver back then. ;)

[The Leaguer]

Yeah, back then, Guyv was the extreme. Now he's the norm.

[TheCorpulent1]

He's practically a kitten.

[The Leaguer]

An orange one, with big eyes.

[JewishHobbit]

Hah,.. that's great.

Personally I like both of them how they are. If the female thing were dropped I'd be okay with it, but I kinda like having both companies, and this from a guy who isn't a big DC fan and knows very little about it. I just like that if you are only familiar with one company there is a 2 in 5 chance that you'll be familiar with at least 1 of your opponants. Now if this were dropped I'd live but I like it how it is.

[JewishHobbit]

An orange one, with big eyes.

In that case Guyver is my old cat Kit-Kat. For now on,... he shall be my Kit-Kat

[The Leaguer]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v327/TheLeaguer/Guyver3.jpg

[primemover]

Looks like GuyverJay circa season 1 is going to eat GuyverJay circa season 2!!

[primemover]

I just like that if you are only familiar with one company there is a 2 in 5 chance that you'll be familiar with at least 1 of your opponants.

Ohh, another question for guys, what do you think if the whole 'only intel about other characters comes from what one of you characters knows in their universe' thing was ditched. I sometimes think it is an unnecessary annoyance and and luckily alot of people don't hold people to it, at least TOO much :)

[TheCorpulent1]

Ohh, another question for guys, what do you think if the whole 'only intel about other characters comes from what one of you characters knows in their universe' thing was ditched. I sometimes think it is an unnecessary annoyance and and luckily alot of people don't hold people to it, at least TOO much :)
I think it should stay. It was a new imposition for this season because people like me would use really cheap tactics to easily learn everything about the opposite team. I think it makes the write-ups more fun too.

[primemover]

Ah, didn't know it was new this season. I can go either way on this one, it just does become a hassle to play the 'who knows what' game.

Makes me think though, it would be interesting to have a completely 'blind' fight, ie nobody knows anything about their opponents, everything would have to be found out ON the battlefield! :)

[The Leaguer]

It's new? I always did it last season, too. Either way, I like it. It increases the strategy.

[wiegeabo]

Makes me think though, it would be interesting to have a completely 'blind' fight, ie nobody knows anything about their opponents, everything would have to be found out ON the battlefield! :)

That's how I do my writeups. I don't like the idea of being able to use a base of operations, so I don't. I always do my prep-time in the location of the battle. My team gets to use what's around them, or what they would have normally, but nothing else. It may be limiting my team, but it makes the writeups more fun and challenging.

[JewishHobbit]

Same here. And as for the knowing your opponants stuff,... I didn't like the change at first because I liked having Cable scan and know all about my foes,.. but now that I'm use to it I kinda like it better.

[The Leaguer]

Oh, okay, Corp meant the ruling on using means to scan your opponents on the battlefield during prep-time. That did affect me, as I would have Fernus scan his opponents, but I didn't have a hard time at all adapting. I find it more fun, actually.

[TheCorpulent1]

Yeah, I meant that limiting characters to only what they would know or be able to pull up through their resources. I was pretty cheap with gathering information myself last season, since I had Dr. Fate whip up a scrying pool that he could focus the Amulet of Anubis through. Absolutely nothing gets past the Amulet of Anubis, so I'd know everything about the characters regardless of whether they tried to hide anything.

[The Leaguer]

Well, technically, it was always limited to what characters knew, in that you couldn't start your write-up with your characters knowing his/hers in intimate detail.

And more like the Amulet of... A-newb-is. :D

I know that was bad, I just couldn't pass it up.

[Tropico]

Gee, Primemover. You developed a point system. Want the rankings increased. Feel that females shouldn't be compulsory. Would prefer that intercompany requirements are a minimum. What if? and Amalgalm characters should be out, but other companies should be included. And that prep-time intel be unlimited.

I know I'm being a jerk, but is there anything about the current DTL that you DO like?

[primemover]

Gee, Primemover. You developed a point system. Want the rankings increased. Feel that females shouldn't be compulsory. Would prefer that intercompany requirements are a minimum. What if? and Amalgalm characters should be out, but other companies should be included. And that prep-time intel be unlimited.

I know I'm being a jerk, but is there anything about the current DTL that you DO like?

This is the DTL discussion forum, and it is exactly what I am doing, if I hated the DTL like it is I would not be here. In fact, I like it so much I would like to see it improved if there are things to improve, as I hope everybody would, and I believe most do.

Most of the things I bring up are just explorations of possible rule changes, brought up FOR discussion, which many have responded by discussing them in kind.

You were one of the people I wanted to hear from, I was just hoping it wasn't in this way. I kind of felt this might happen, JB can always tell me to stick it and keep my stupid ideas to myself whenever he pleases, and I will slither back to wherever I came from. I really hope not, he's done an amazing job with this league and I hope he doesn't see my questions and ideas as a dis.

[The Leaguer]

A lot of changes have been proposed for the DTL, ranging from the point system to the abandonment of team requirements, such as the female and universe req's. I've kept quiet for the most part, but I figure it's time I chimed in.

I'm against all of it. In my opinion, the DTL has not only run perfectly smoothly, but down right great. Things only got jumbled with all the too uber stuff. Although I was mostly quiet about it, I was in the camp that supported lowering of the bar.

After a lot of confusion and debate, the uber ratings are going, for the most part, back to where they were last season. In season one, uber ratings ran great, much better than they were running this season. There was much less bitter, petty squabbling. Now, with uber rating generally returning to their level last season, things should run much smoother.

With the only true problem that arose now dealt with, all these other ideas are not solutions, because there aren't any problems to begin with. I say, to coin the popular cliche, "Don't fix what isn't broken."

Last season, with all these rules in place, things ran great. Everyone had fun (at least, no one said otherwise) and virtually no one complained (I'm not saying that no one should complain, I'm just saying no one found anything to complain about). With policies this season returning to how they were last season, things should logically return to how they were then.

Now, for the ideas themselves. I believe that both the female and unverse-representation requirements add fun challenges to team construction. They add another level of strategy to the game. From what I've seen of the arguments against them, they essentially sum up to "they make the game harder." Well, in my opinion, that's the point. And I welcome it.

I'm also against the proposed point system. I mean no offense to anyone who is advocating it, but in my opinion, it would be an unnecessary complication in a system that has thus far worked just fine. I believe it would also have a negative effect, as debate over character worth would increase exponentially, as owners would argue over point value. This would almost certainly degrade into the petty bickering that has plagued us recently. This system would also reintroduce the top-tier ubers that I believe would not be beneficial to the DTL, as the past few weeks have shown.

That's my two cents.

[Tropico]

This is the DTL discussion forum, and it is exactly what I am doing, if I hated the DTL like it is I would not be here. In fact, I like it so much I would like to see it improved if there are things to improve, as I hope everybody would, and I believe most do.

Most of the things I bring up are just explorations of possible rule changes, brought up FOR discussion, which many have responded by discussing them in kind.

You were one of the people I wanted to hear from, I was just hoping it wasn't in this way. I kind of felt this might happen, JB can always tell me to stick it and keep my stupid ideas to myself whenever he pleases, and I will slither back to wherever I came from. I really hope not, he's done an amazing job with this league and I hope he doesn't see my questions and ideas as a dis.

Thanks for answering my question. I'm glad that you DO like the DTL.

Please tell me where in my post I make mention that you should keep your ideas to yourself. It would be very hypocritical on my part to tell you to shut up when a couple of days ago I spoke up when other posters were saying that people complaining should shut up. I legitimately ask because all of these things you're asking one after the other would change the DTL a LOT and I was curious where you were going with this.

You want to know what I think? Ok, here you go:

-The point system: I don't see the appeal of it and I don't support it. I think it's more work than the current system. Not only would ALL of the characters AND future characters have to be ranked with a very specific number, the possibilties of continued discussion are larger. Believe it or not, our three (arguably) broad categories allow us to resolve ranking matters pretty quickly. Limitations (very similar to current line-up limitations) would have to be imposed for balance.
-You can see above what i think about an increase in ranking categories. I don't want Too Ubers (or super ubers, like you say) in the DTL; the same goes for super meds or super regs.
-Compulsory females...I'm for it. It adds variety to the line-up. Is it an obstacle sometimes? Yeah, it's happened to me when I'm setting up a line-up. But, I like the challenge. I like that we have to step around this and think a lil' bit more.
-My forté is DC, Marvel is a little more troublesome for me. Again, having that little extra challenge is cool for me. I support the current line-up requirement, I think it's made with balance in mind.
-I support What If?!, Amalgam and other company characters. I have voiced this before. The majority has always spoken and they don't want anything BUT DC & Marvel. As long as there's clear information on the character, preferably with someone else knowing the character also, I would have no problem with it as long as it ranks legal. (BTW, I see Spawn thrown around a lot and he has always been ranked Too Uber.)
-As was already mentioned, the unlimited intel pre-battle was one of the adjustments that were made to this season. We were ALL (or most of us, some would say) being quite cheap with it and it was decided that we should tone it down. Not even Dr. Manhattan can see what's going to happen during prep-time.

IF the DTL seems static or rigid, I will argue against it. You already saw what happened recently and what came out of it with the whole lowering the bar debacle. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. We've already made some modifications from last season and even some on the fly this season. I'm probably being overly cautious in saying that all further changes should be submitted or take effect next season; but that's just me.

[Tropico]

And now I just look like Leaguer's biatch. :( :o I swear I wrote this and Leag hadn't posted yet.

[The Leaguer]

Sure, Trop, we all believe you. :rolleyes: :D

[TheCorpulent1]

Hey, at least Trop didn't try to over-intellectualize a cliche. "Don't fix what isn't broken." Psshh, get over yourself Leaguer, we all know you live in a box. :rolleyes:

Anyway, here's my take on the current crop of proposed changes:

- No point system. I liked primemover's idea of different team possibilities but I don't like how complicated he made the point system. I think there should be precisely two team configurations: one super-uber or a regular team comprised of the classes we've been using since the beginning of the season. I can see where others are coming from in claiming it's an unnecessary overcomplication, but I think a whole team against one colossal uber could be fun, and everything that makes the DTL more fun is a plus for me.
- The female requirement doesn't matter to me. I love my females so I'd still use them, but I guess I can see how other people might have problems with it. I know first-hand how much of a b**** it can be when you've got a perfect team for the situation that happens to be all male and trying to shoehorn a female in. I've spent a lot of time writing around situations like that simply because the female is on my team instead of the male who was better suited, but I don't mind. Having to think around obstacles is fun for me.
- Publisher requirements should stay in place. Beyond just encouraging people to broaden their comic horizons if they're weak on a particular publisher, I think the publisher requirement is beneficial to everyone. You go in with a team of Marvel characters against a team of DC characters and you're basically gonna have no prep time and a whole hell of a lot of crap to work through in the battles themselves.
- Don't much care for the other publishers besides the big 2. I've stated my reasons in each of the threads it's come up in, but basically it boils down to the fact that we just have no standard for other publishers' characters relative to the big 2's. We could argue for pages and pages about whether Spawn's magic is more potent than Dr. Fate's or whether Hellboy is stronger or weaker than Spider-Man, but we'd have no basis for anything. There's also not as much information for a lot of the characters. DC and Marvel characters are pretty easy to compare to each other and it keeps things simple, so I would vote against other publishers.

[The Leaguer]

Hey, all I did was apply proper grammar. ...Poopyhead.

Oh yeah, I'm against the other publishers thing.

And I now count that "shoehorn" has been used as a verb three times in two days, by three different people.

[TheCorpulent1]

But if you apply proper grammar to a cliche, it's not the cliche anymore.

Hey, "shoehorn" is in 2 reputable online dictionaries as a transitive verb, so poo on you. Fluid linguistics, my friend.

[The Leaguer]

Sure it is. Content is what makes a cliche, not the presentation.

[The Leaguer]

And I'm not knocking "shoehorn," I'm just acknowledging that it's a rather rare verb. And I bet a lot of the people who use it don't even know what a shoehorn is.

[TheCorpulent1]

I had a little shoehorn when I was younger. I think I used it twice or three times in my life. :)

[The Leaguer]

Taken out of context by someone who didn't know what a shoehorn was, that statement would be hilarious.

[TheCorpulent1]

Your Tropico-sexuality has made you very dirty. :(

[The Leaguer]

I blame Tropico. He's a bad influence.

[primemover]

For one thing, the only actual proposition I believe I made was for the point system, mainly as a solution for the 'too-uber' debacle, this isn't something I pulled out of my rear, it is based on the Heroclix system and I thought it might help. I am/was pro-lowering the bar on the ubers(with the way the rankings are now), and after seeing the list of characters getting the axe due to the bar being lowered, I thought this system would enable us to include those lost characters.

All of the other things I brought up were ideas that I wanted to get feedback on, I was not asking for things to be changed. I am not commisioner, or any league leader, so all I CAN do is bring up ideas, if this is unwelcome I will stop. I guess I got overzealous with the ideas, people were responding and I wanted to continue exporing.

Trop, in your 'Gee, Primemover' response you came across as a tad snide and I read that as you calling me out that I was anti-DTL, I apologize if I read this wrong. Thank you for your reponses to the ideas I brought up, I wish you would have just done that from the start and not said what you said. :(

As for going back to the rules that were in force last year, and that were working just fine, as far as I know there are characters that were allowed last year that would not be allowed now that the bar is lowered, that tells me there will always be bickering over characters being allowed. I really hope the bickering goes away though, I am not pro-bickering. :)

I will not bore anybody further, even though there are other things brought up by Leaguer Tropico and Corp that I would like to respond to piece by piece, but I will only do that via pm if interested.

[Nightwing.]

id say no to the point system
yes to the female ot being compulsory - it'd be nice to have a choice.
im gonna say yes to the other characters outside DC/Marvel.im already in favour of amalgam and what if...?i just think pushing that boundary alittle more into image and dark horse rather than lifting the uber bar would put a twist on things and still have it as an enjoyable past time.
and the no preptime thing.thats all ive really used anyway.i think that should remain as optional as it already is.putting the female thing in the same boat would make it more fun for people.

[TheCorpulent1]

I will not bore anybody further, even though there are other things brought up by Leaguer Tropico and Corp that I would like to respond to piece by piece, but I will only do that via pm if interested.
If you're boring anyone in here, they're perfectly free to stop reading. If you've got opinions or anything you want to talk about regarding the DTL, go ahead and post them. Don't shy away because your post might be long. Don't let Tropico's one post--which, coincidentally, I don't think he meant to be snide or mean--discourage you from using the Discussion thread is it was intended.

[Tropico]

Thanks, Corp; but I knew that my post had a very high potential in coming off badly. I even mention it in the post that I was being a "jerk". Sometimes that's the only outcome, but good CAN come out of it; like the last few posts.

Prime, like I said before, you have every right to express your opinions. I have yet to see you make truly offensive posts like other posters are known for and that is a very big plus in my book. I have no problems with you responding to our posts in the board, it might clear up things for other people or cement their own ideas.

I can see where a lot of people might think that it would be "easier and more fun" for some ot the restrictions to be removed. The thing is that sometimes things you think would be more fun for you to do turn out to be not as fun when they get done TO you. I think that might have been the biggest factor in restricting the pre-battle intel.

[The Leaguer]

I think that, even if debate carries over into PM's or instant messages, the arguments should be reposted in the threads, because this debate is over something that will affect everyone in the league. Many people choose not to participate in the debate and that shouldn't exclude them from knowing where the debate stands.

[Guyverjay]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v327/TheLeaguer/Guyver3.jpg


Hey thats not true:(

[The Leaguer]

Compared to how everyone else is acting it is. ;)

[AnnoyingSilence]

Hey thats not true:(tis true

[Guyverjay]

Meh I nerver moaned in season 1 (except about Doomsday brainiac), why would I when virtually everything went my way:confused:

[Tropico]

Meh I nerver moaned in season 1 (except about Doomsday brainiac), why would I when virtually everything went my way:confused:

So there was no moaning about Cosmic Spidey?:confused:

[Guyverjay]

No..he'd already been ruled out before I signed up so there was nothing to moan about:o

Of course I wanted him but didn't make a federal case about it at all
Theres not much for me to moan about now. My team rules all sorts of ass:o

[AnnoyingSilence]

well, i hope i don't make UJ quit after i tear his head off this weak

[Guyverjay]

You sure are hyping yourself AS,I hope you live up to it or I'll be disappointed:(

[Union Jack]

yeah,i'm suprised he can walk out the door with that great big noggin on his shoulders!!
he's just trying to psych me out.
emphasis on the trying!!.

[Harlekin]

well, i hope i don't make UJ quit after i tear his head off this weak
Kinda hoping Jack kicks your ass. :D

[Guyverjay]

yeah,i'm suprised he can walk out the door with that great big noggin on his shoulders!!
he's just trying to psych me out.
emphasis on the trying!!.


Having an ego isnt the problem, underestimating an opponent sure is though

[Nightwing.]

hey JB have you decided on the women not compulsory rule yet?if you have any chance it could take effect immediately?

[Nightwing.]

Week 10 line up

Team 1: The Outsiders

Juggernaut (What If…?) (MU)
Martian Manhunter (DU)
Blackfire (DM) (F)
Gambit (MR)
Red Robin (Dick Grayson) (DR)

[Nightwing.]

sorry wrong thread

[primemover]

hey JB have you decided on the women not compulsory rule yet?if you have any chance it could take effect immediately?

As far as I know, this, nor any of the other things I brought up are in motion to be voted on, or to be changed, so don't expect it. They were just brought up for discussion.

[primemover]

Thanks, Corp; but I knew that my post had a very high potential in coming off badly. I even mention it in the post that I was being a "jerk". Sometimes that's the only outcome, but good CAN come out of it; like the last few posts.

Prime, like I said before, you have every right to express your opinions. I have yet to see you make truly offensive posts like other posters are known for and that is a very big plus in my book. I have no problems with you responding to our posts in the board, it might clear up things for other people or cement their own ideas.

I can see where a lot of people might think that it would be "easier and more fun" for some ot the restrictions to be removed. The thing is that sometimes things you think would be more fun for you to do turn out to be not as fun when they get done TO you. I think that might have been the biggest factor in restricting the pre-battle intel.

It's all good, I appreciate your reponse.

Removing restrictions on line-ups does make it easier(whether you think it is good or bad), but it also allows more creativity in line-up creation. A few people have said they have really sweet line-ups that they cannot do due to the female line-up stipulation. This combined with the responses I got that most people would not drop their females if the rule was lifted, leads me to think the rule is more of a hindrance than anything, if it's only existence is to make sure females are fairly represented in the league.

As far as the publisher thing, I am in the middle of the road on it for my personal line-up building, it would not change my line-ups much at all. But I can see it's benefit in the league as a whole, and it's character diversity, so I am FOR it staying.

The only thing I would like to see changed with it is how it recquires us to have 1 uber and 1 regular from each publisher, whereas I think it would be more fun to just recquire at least 2 characters from each publisher and let us figure the rest out. I would LOVE to use Nightcrawler and Shadowcat together in a match, but I can't because they are both regulars. :(

[TheCorpulent1]

While I agree that lifting the female rule now wouldn't bring too much change, I think the DTL would've been much different right now if we hadn't had the female rule in place from the start. My team probably wouldn't have had any females, since my mind for some reason just doesn't go to women when I'm thinking of comic characters.

I think some serious thought should be given to the 1 DU, 1 MU, 1 DR, 1 MR rule. I think we should have the 1 DU, 1 MU rule stay in place, but replace the regular requirement with at least 1 other team member from another company, not specifically a regular. That way we could have 1 DM and 2 MRs or 1 MM and 2 DRs. I think that'd make a lot more sense. Like primemover, I have combinations of same-publisher regs that I'd love to use.

[X]

While I agree that lifting the female rule now wouldn't bring too much change, I think the DTL would've been much different right now if we hadn't had the female rule in place from the start. My team probably wouldn't have had any females, since my mind for some reason just doesn't go to women when I'm thinking of comic characters.

I think some serious thought should be given to the 1 DU, 1 MU, 1 DR, 1 MR rule. I think we should have the 1 DU, 1 MU rule stay in place, but replace the regular requirement with at least 1 other team member from another company, not specifically a regular. That way we could have 1 DM and 2 MRs or 1 MM and 2 DRs. I think that'd make a lot more sense. Like primemover, I have combinations of same-publisher regs that I'd love to use.

:up:

The female thing is still, well, embedded to some degree though. I know I'd prefer keeping The Scarlet Witch, or Fascination... Or Ganymede... Lot of badass female characters.

[TheCorpulent1]

Yeah, there are. I just flipped through Our Worlds at War vol. 2 in a bookstore and found that Strange Visitor is pretty cool. I think she'll be good on my team.

Just making sure of something: the Glimmer is too uber, right?

[X]

Who? :confused:

[primemover]

I think some serious thought should be given to the 1 DU, 1 MU, 1 DR, 1 MR rule. I think we should have the 1 DU, 1 MU rule stay in place, but replace the regular requirement with at least 1 other team member from another company, not specifically a regular. That way we could have 1 DM and 2 MRs or 1 MM and 2 DRs. I think that'd make a lot more sense. Like primemover, I have combinations of same-publisher regs that I'd love to use.

Maybe allowing us to transfer one of the 'regular' publisher recquirements onto the 'medium' spot.

[TheCorpulent1]

Yeah, that's what I was saying. Right now the requirement is that we have to have 1 uber and 1 regular from each publisher, with the final member of the team (the middleweight) being a wild card. I think a better rule would be 1 uber from each publisher and at least 1 of our remaining 3 team members, be they regular or middleweight, from each publisher.
Who? :confused:
The Glimmer. From what I understand of the limited stuff I've read of him, he was basically the Flash of Wonderworld. He's like 50 feet tall, too. This is the only link I could find for him:
http://www.hyperborea.org/flash/appendix-heroes.html#glimmer

[X]

Yeah, I'd say too uber.

[TheCorpulent1]

I thought so, since the Wonderworld protectors seem to be variants on the JLA but taken to the extreme. Just checking. Thanks. :up:

[X]

Hey, I'm not the final word or anything, Blaze'll give you that. :D

I don't even really know what my position is anymore now that I quit, to be honest with you. :o

[primemover]

You're a bottom.

[Tropico]

The only thing I would like to see changed with it is how it recquires us to have 1 uber and 1 regular from each publisher, whereas I think it would be more fun to just recquire at least 2 characters from each publisher and let us figure the rest out. I would LOVE to use Nightcrawler and Shadowcat together in a match, but I can't because they are both regulars. :(

You can always downgrade one of your higher ranked characters to achieve the combos that you want, originally the wildcard Med was a wildcard Reg.

[Johnny Blaze]

hey JB have you decided on the women not compulsory rule yet?if you have any chance it could take effect immediately?
It's not going to change.

I think some serious thought should be given to the 1 DU, 1 MU, 1 DR, 1 MR rule. I think we should have the 1 DU, 1 MU rule stay in place, but replace the regular requirement with at least 1 other team member from another company, not specifically a regular. That way we could have 1 DM and 2 MRs or 1 MM and 2 DRs. I think that'd make a lot more sense. Like primemover, I have combinations of same-publisher regs that I'd love to use. It will probably change to the format you mention here next season.
As for the Glimmer...not sure; I'll have to look over WWIII again either tonight or tomorrow.

I don't even really know what my position is anymore now that I quit, to be honest with you. So, just to make sure before I mark your team as ownerless, you did officially quit the DTL and are now out of the league?

[X]

Well, what's going on with the too uber thing? Are we continuing this season, starting that next... what? confused:

[Johnny Blaze]

I said a few days ago that the lowering of the bar won't happen until next season.

[X]

I'm still out then.

[Johnny Blaze]

Ok, just wanted to be sure before I went and marked the New Defenders ownerless is all.




Well, with all of the people who quit this season and the ones who are talking about leaving when this season is over...I guess there'll be some contraction of the divisions and what not in the off season. :(

[primemover]

You can always downgrade one of your higher ranked characters to achieve the combos that you want, originally the wildcard Med was a wildcard Reg.

Yes that is an option, but losing a medium for a regular really isn't a great option IMHO.

[JewishHobbit]

Ok, just wanted to be sure before I went and marked the New Defenders ownerless is all.




Well, with all of the people who quit this season and the ones who are talking about leaving when this season is over...I guess there'll be some contraction of the divisions and what not in the off season. :(

It was definately easier to vote last season with the fewer teams, that's for sure. I haven't quite desided what I'm going to do next season yet but if I do end up dropping out I know I'll still keep up with conversation and voting and all that. And it's good to hear the contraction bit because frankly with all the quiting I was wondering if there will be a season 3.

[TheCorpulent1]

It will probably change to the format you mention here next season.
Coolness. I think as small a change as that could probably be implemented for the remainder of this season but I don't want to stir up any controversy again.

[primemover]

Coolness. I think as small a change as that could probably be implemented for the remainder of this season but I don't want to stir up any controversy again.

You bastard!

[TheCorpulent1]

Hey man, I'm just trying to preserve the hippie-like state of peace that has descended on the DTL in the wake of the Too Uber Debacle. Yeah, that's right, it gets capital letters now. Wanna make somethin' of it?? :mad:

[LadyVader]

It's a shame really. :(

I'm never leaving.
You're going to have to throw me out. :)

[JewishHobbit]

Hey JBBBBBB,.. LadyVader's daring you to throw her Ooouuuuttttt!!!!

(just call me mr. tattletale)



I'm retarded.

[LadyVader]

No use. I'm a big girl. I doubt any of you little guys could throw me out.
:D

EDIT: You're just special. ;)

[primemover]

Wait, I thought all Romanian women were 3 feet tall 50 pounds, DID THE OLYMPICS LIE TO ME!?!

[JewishHobbit]

I'm pretty weak and out of shape these days so I probably couldn't then (darn wife and kid,... making me lose all the physical goodness I use to have)

[primemover]

Hey man, I'm just trying to preserve the hippie-like state of peace that has descended on the DTL in the wake of the Too Uber Debacle. Yeah, that's right, it gets capital letters now. Wanna make somethin' of it?? :mad:

TUD sucks as an acronym, call it the 'Too Uber Rowdy Debacle' or in short, TURD.

[LadyVader]

Don't go using stereotypes on me dude, or I'll have to ask you about your braces and pencil holders and whatnot.
:)

[primemover]

Nah, I am one of those 'cool' nerds, no braces, taped glasses or pocket protectors here, I was a football playing, bad grades, prom going nerd!

[LadyVader]

Then I'm an over weight, cheetos eating, romanian couch potato!
Cool, huh? :)

Like I said on another thread, I'm flexible, but in the mental sense. :D

[TheCorpulent1]

I'm a living comic nerd stereotype. I went to my prom, but only because it was free and my mom made me. I went with the valedictorian too, although granted, she looked pretty hot to me.

[LadyVader]

Smart chicks are always hot...
Or so we like to think.

:D

[JewishHobbit]

I'm an average joe I think. Nothing great or bad about me. I blend in with a crowd. My wife disagrees with me but she has to so I don't know. We should all post pics :)

[Harlekin]

Meh, I solved the female thing anyway by having my Marvel regular option being female exclusive, giving me complete freedom in my ubers and mediums.

[Tropico]

TUD sucks as an acronym, call it the 'Too Uber Rowdy Debacle' or in short, TURD.

It would be better if it was called the Stupid Too Uber Debacle. Baptized the Tropico-sexual way, S.T.U.D.

[TheCorpulent1]

Smart chicks are always hot...
Or so we like to think.

:D
She's cool. I'm still friends with her, actually. Some of our friends and I got her drunk at a club and she found some Swedish kid to dance with. :)

Frankly, I think I've gotta be one of the least attractive people in the world, barring legitimate deformity. People try to tell me different every now and then, and the one girlfriend I had had a pretty big problem with my thinking that way, but I can't honestly look in a mirror and consider myself attractive. Some people got it and some don't, know what I mean? I definitely don't.

[The Leaguer]

It would be better if it was called the Stupid Too Uber Debacle. Baptized the Tropico-sexual way, S.T.U.D.

Soon, all shall become Tropico-sexual. Resistence is futile.

[primemover]

Frankly, I think I've gotta be one of the least attractive people in the world, barring legitimate deformity. People try to tell me different every now and then, and the one girlfriend I had had a pretty big problem with my thinking that way, but I can't honestly look in a mirror and consider myself attractive. Some people got it and some don't, know what I mean? I definitely don't.

Shoot, I was going to say we should all post pictures of ourselves so we can put faces to names, etc, but after reading this I retract that idea, like other parts of me have retracted, EEYYYEEECHH!

[TheCorpulent1]

It's ok, you're not the first. :cool:

[Nightwing.]

so if x has left can we raid his team?

not being nasty or anything x but needs must and all

[JewishHobbit]

Shoot, I was going to say we should all post pictures of ourselves so we can put faces to names, etc, but after reading this I retract that idea, like other parts of me have retracted, EEYYYEEECHH!

I was thinking it'd be nice too,... oh well.

[XFanTim]

so if x has left can we raid his team?

not being nasty or anything x but needs must and all
If you had acted first and asked questions later, perhaps you would have Composite Man by now. If you want BION, don't delay . . . I may soon decide that having two power copiers is unnecessarily redundant. :D

[XFanTim]

I'm an average joe I think. Nothing great or bad about me. I blend in with a crowd. My wife disagrees with me but she has to so I don't know. We should all post pics :)
Actually Hobbit, I remember you posting a picture of yourself at some point (you with a bunch of family members), and I think you looked fairly handsome. Of course I'm only saying that because you looked a bit like me. ;)

(Although I'm more manly, because I have a beard. ;))

[JewishHobbit]

Yay,.. Men find me Hot!!!!! And I never pictured you with a beard... one day I'll actually be able to grow one. All I can get is the soul patch under my lip thing and if I wanted to an mustache. Everything else is too thin. You'd think at 23 almost 24 I'd be able to. Eh,.. darn family genes.

[XFanTim]

Yeah, my girlfriend's dad can't grow a beard, but on the other hand he's well over 6 feet tall, an army vet, and an avid hunter, so I don't question his manliness. (Not that those things make him more manly, just more likely to shoot/pummel anyone who questions his manliness. And to be honest, when you're dating someone's daughter I figure they're on the verge of shooting/pummeling you pretty much 24/7.)

My beard is neatly trimmed now, but when I was an undergrad I had a big bushy beard, and long hair to match. Looked like a freakin' hippy. :D

[X]

so if x has left can we raid his team?

not being nasty or anything x but needs must and all

Go for it. :up:

[Union Jack]

it is interesting to think what folk look ike on this board,you kinda get a mental image of what you expect them to look like.
also no offence corpulent1 but i kinda always imagined you looked like the comic book guy from the simpsons!!
probably because of you title name!
:)

[TheCorpulent1]

Well, I'm not bald with a ponytail and I don't have a beard... but otherwise I guess that's pretty accurate.

[Union Jack]

reallly...ha ha ha.coooool!
worst.episode.ever.

[Nightwing.]

If you had acted first and asked questions later, perhaps you would have Composite Man by now. If you want BION, don't delay . . . I may soon decide that having two power copiers is unnecessarily redundant. :D

i decided against it after askin as i dont know anything about his team and id end up cocking things up

[XFanTim]

I gotcha. Powerful characters aren't worth that much if you don't know how to use them.

[Nightwing.]

exactly.i just looted MM from canned mojo and Magneto from Consequences so im happy.ive got an alround strong team.ive got psychic long range projectiles strength magic(jugs) hand to hand combat,team leading,female charm(not me..my team)i just got one more character to get and my team will be complete but AS aint droppin him yet.

[Harlekin]

I gotcha. Powerful characters aren't worth that much if you don't know how to use them.
Which stopped me from picking up C-Man and B.I.O.N. just not that familiar with the Legion and all that.

Nightwing: What, you don't want Nightwing no more?

[TheCorpulent1]

He's got Red Robin, who's basically the same thing only older and slower. ;)

[Harlekin]

He's got Red Robin, who's basically the same thing only older and slower. ;)
I know, mostly because I suggested him, since I'm not giving up Nightwing. ;)

[Nightwing.]

yeah i still want him and red robin aint that slow hes different because hes got issues.and issues lead to rage.but yeah i still want nightwing

[gregtestagent]

ok. what if I have technical difficulties or other complications that hinder my ability to play?

[JewishHobbit]

Just let us know about it. We're understanding that life and computer problems get in the way. While the DTL is a bit of a commitment,.. it's also just a game and most of us understand that. (trust me,.. I'm married with a 1 year old daughter, I know how things get in the way).

Do you have any questions on how to play or how the DTL works?

[gregtestagent]

what's his name JohnnyBlaze or something helped me out with that. I'm not sure if I can write debates about characters since I don't read too many comics. I know the basics about a lot of characters and other things but I don't know too many facts or specific instances that could help me prove a point.

[JewishHobbit]

Try not to look at the big picture in that reguards,.. take it a step at a time. Basically when you're up against an opponant, look at that guy's characters and research them only. Figure out how they work and you can do an okay job. Some good ways to research is to first off ask the other guy to explain his characters or give you some links to bios. Or you could go to old matches and look how he/she used them or find links to bios in their write up. Or you can just ask others in the DTL, we're all pretty friendly and helpful here. And when all else fails,.. Google it.

If you focus on a match at a time you'll not only do alright but you'll learn a lot of cool stuff about differant characters.

[Johnny Blaze]

So, have you decided on which team you will be taking over, Greg?

[Tropico]

MAN! Your new avatar is Too Uber cool, JB!! Props to CConn!!:up::D

[gregtestagent]

So, have you decided on which team you will be taking over, Greg?
whoa! whoa! I get to lead a team? I guess I'll helm the um the um...what teams are there? again?

[Tropico]

These are the available teams:

Mondo Funkies (Owner: n/a)
Wonder Woman (Just Imagine…) (DU) (F)
Cosmic Spider-Man (MU)
Indigo (DR) (F)
Captain Marvel (DU)
Wonder Man (MM)
Optimus Prime (w/ Creation Matrix) (MU)
Midnighter (DR)
Jesse Custer (DM)
Desak (MU)
The Answer (MR)

The Consequences (Owner: n/a)
Magus (MU)
Megatron (MU)
Carrion (Miles Warren) (MR)
Dr. Fate (Kent/Inza Nelson) (DU) (F)
Silver Swan II (DR) (F)
Ray II (DR)
Zero (MR)
Clea (MM) (F)
Composite (MU)
Kylun (MR)

Canned Mojo! (Owner: n/a)
Atomic Knight (DR)
Gog (DU)
Hawkeye (MR)
Iron Man (MU)
Android Human Torch (MR)
Medusa (MR) (F)
Absorbing Man (Earth X) (MU)
Swamp Thing (DU)
Kid Flash (Bart Allen) (DM)
Mr. Terrific (Michael Holt) (DR)

The New Defenders (Owner: n/a)
Mimic (Exiles) (MU)
Marvel Boy (Noh-Varr) (MR)
Firestorm (Jason Rusch) (DU)
Animal Man (Pre-Crisis) (DR)
BION (DU)
Karate Kid (DR)
Scarlet Witch (MM) (F)
Dr. Midas (Cosmic Man) (MU)
Grimbor (Pre-Zero Hour) (DR)
Devil Slayer (MR)

You can always check the DTL Update (http://www.superherohype.com/forums/showthread.php?t=125148) thread to see all of the teams and their current standing. You're not limited to the characters on those teams, as long as you don't repeat a character you can use other DC or Marvel characters,

[Nightwing.]

just a test.this is my first effort but how does this look?i think it might be too small to be honest
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v721/Randomtask124124/Pics/Heroes1st.jpg

[Nightwing.]

i cant seem to get rid of the excess white area around it.any tips would be nice

[Nightwing.]

it just isnt workin

[Harlekin]

Its pretty good for a first effort and definitely not too small. I'd fudge around with the lettering a bit, so it can be read on black (maybe just make the lettering white). Experiment.

[Nightwing.]

so how do you get rid of that excess white in the background?

[Harlekin]

What did you use? If you use Paint, just fill it up with Black.

[Nightwing.]

think i got it now

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v721/Randomtask124124/Pics/Heroes2ND.jpg

[Nightwing.]

wohoo i got the ability to make titles.

[Harlekin]

Congrats on your first banner.

[Harlekin]

I just made this one myself:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v124/Daimoah/InitiativeBanner3.png

[Nightwing.]

cool.check this out.ive got loads of premade teams and im making banners for em all.this is what ive made for this weeks team.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v721/Randomtask124124/Pics/theoutsiders.jpg

[Nightwing.]

i wouldnt mind having that software so you can really edit pics like corp and primemover have done.is it called adobe photoshop?

[Harlekin]

I do believe they use adobe photoshop yes.

[Nightwing.]

i like the pics i have of magneto and moonknight.i think theyre well good.do you know what version of adobe photshop they use?

[Harlekin]

I have absolutely no idea.

[TheCorpulent1]

I'm using Adobe Photoshop 7.0. It's a throwback to my days as an art student.

[Jason C C]

I wish to play and I want Mondo Funkies as my team

I asked to play ageessss ago but I haven't been around in a while and told to wait in the queue