View Full Version : Dream Team League (Discussion)
Johnny Blaze
08-08-2007, 01:20 PM
The regular version of Doctor Doom would be... regular, because Reed Richards is a regular and he's a genius and has strechy powers to boot. Dr Doom with Cosmic Power would be an uber.
I have no idea who that other guy is. :)
Dr. Doom would be an Uber. One of the most sofisticated armor systems on the planet, not to mention he's one of the most powerful mystics on Earth as well would make him such.
Harlekin
08-08-2007, 01:22 PM
Exactly. Doom's uber for the same reason Iron Man is.
LadyVader
08-08-2007, 01:23 PM
Sorry. I didn't know his armor was so powerful.
Johnny Blaze
08-08-2007, 01:24 PM
And now you know. And knowing is half the battle... :up:
Lord Doom
08-08-2007, 01:48 PM
And now you know. And knowing is half the battle... :up:
http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o44/helloamy12/GIJoe_Green_Knowing-Tee.jpg
G.I. JOOOOOOOE!!!
TheCorpulent1
08-08-2007, 02:19 PM
If Doom is uber, where does that leave Doom with the Power Cosmic? Is he a tuber now? He's significantly more powerful than regular Doom.
Johnny Blaze
08-08-2007, 05:40 PM
If Doom is uber, where does that leave Doom with the Power Cosmic? Is he a tuber now? He's significantly more powerful than regular Doom.
Hell if I know. That's for Wieg to decide.
And nice avatar, Corp. :up:
wiegeabo
08-08-2007, 06:09 PM
Doom was an uber? I thought he was a middleweight. (And Doom with PC and Doom Sorcerer Supreme was uber)
TheCorpulent1
08-09-2007, 10:07 AM
I think normal Doom would be a really, really good middleweight and a really bad uber. So my vote would be for middleweight status.
AnnoyingSilence
08-09-2007, 10:25 AM
can i get some scans of Dooms armor being so high tech and his magic skills as well... i've yet to hear either of being so in depth
Harlekin
08-09-2007, 11:29 AM
I had a list of magic feats, but he's good enough to beat the Fantastic Four both with tech and with magic, so I'd definitely put him in the upper echelons of middleweights, if not just ubers.
TheCorpulent1
08-09-2007, 12:11 PM
With magic not counting the "Unthinkable" magic boost?
AnnoyingSilence
08-09-2007, 12:31 PM
again. instead of tellin me about it. show me.
Harlekin
08-09-2007, 01:08 PM
With magic not counting the "Unthinkable" magic boost?
The Unthinkable boost seems to have stuck around, as I'm pretty sure we've seen him use magic after that. Before Unthinkable, his magic was potent, but raw. He certainly wasn't anything above average on the magic level.
again. instead of tellin me about it. show me.
Then download or buy them. I'm not going to bother scanning.
TheCorpulent1
08-09-2007, 01:28 PM
I stand by my assessment of Doom as a middleweight. A really good one. He's comparable to Hadrian or a low-level Eternal for me--lots of powers, but he doesn't really stand out in any area.
Red Leader
08-09-2007, 02:53 PM
Wow... Doom's a big issue here, apparently. Anyways, don't know much about the DTL, but what I do know makes me wanna participate. You know, whenever it starts.
AnnoyingSilence
08-14-2007, 02:56 AM
1. doom really isn't that big of a deal
2. its been 5 days since you posted... is there anyone here?
LadyVader
08-14-2007, 06:52 AM
I'm gonna go on holiday for a week. I know that there's little to no chance of anything getting done by then but just in case, don't forget about me. :)
TheCorpulent1
08-14-2007, 07:24 AM
Yeah, how many owners are there at the moment? Maybe we should start working on the pre-season stuff, like getting the draft done. I'm sure there'll be more activity around here if people actually have characters and a roster to obsess over.
wiegeabo
08-14-2007, 10:49 AM
How does everyone want to do the draft. I have two ideas in mind.
The first, everyone makes a list of characters (all three ranks), and I just go straight down the list taking the first unpicked character available. The problem is that making sure characters ranks are mixed up is up to the owner. But that may add more fun and strategy (and can be corrected by roster changes later).
The second, everyone makes up three lists, one for each rank. Then I'll pick the top three unpicked ubers from each uber list, top three middles, and top four regs (or top four of each if we're using 12 characters).
Any other ideas, or are one of these two fine?
Ahura Mazda
08-14-2007, 11:01 AM
I prefer the first option which evens out the chances for everyone.
Ahura Mazda
08-14-2007, 11:01 AM
Is WWH Hulk allowed?
Harlekin
08-14-2007, 11:04 AM
I'm for option 2. Gives you an evened out team right from the get go at least and I don't see any real disadvantages to it.
Johnny Blaze
08-14-2007, 11:37 AM
Option two would be my choice as well.
TheCorpulent1
08-14-2007, 11:39 AM
My vote's for option 2 as well. There's no real strategic way to ensure you get a good number of each class with option one; it's all luck of the draw.
Plus, separate lists will just help me organize my characters better when I pick random, obscure characters. :)
Oh, and I talked to Leaguer; he's been behind on his comics and off on vacation or some junk, which is why he hasn't been around much. We're still co-owning a team for the next season, though.
TheCorpulent1
08-14-2007, 11:43 AM
Is WWH Hulk allowed?
My guess would be no. He hasn't even come close to being stopped so far, and some pretty top-tier ubers have gone up against him.
To clarify: are characters from Marvel and DC imprints still allowed? Vertigo, MAX, Wildstorm, Malibu, etc.?
Johnny Blaze
08-14-2007, 11:56 AM
My guess would be no. He hasn't even come close to being stopped so far, and some pretty top-tier ubers have gone up against him.
To clarify: are characters from Marvel and DC imprints still allowed? Vertigo, MAX, Wildstorm, Malibu, etc.?
Who's he gone up against? I've only read the first few issues online where he beats the crap out of Black Bolt, off panel, and Tony.
Oh, and the other imprints are allowed. :up:
TheCorpulent1
08-14-2007, 12:04 PM
He broke Strange's hands from the astral plane. He's clearly gone beyond just the super-strong Hulk and back into the metaphysically powerful, ghost-sensing, time-punching Hulk again.
Johnny Blaze
08-14-2007, 12:12 PM
He broke Strange's hands from the astral plane. He's clearly gone beyond just the super-strong Hulk and back into the metaphysically powerful, ghost-sensing, time-punching Hulk again.
*sigh* Lame. I never did care for that Hulk. :csad:
TheCorpulent1
08-14-2007, 12:17 PM
I was hoping Pak would stay away from that nonsense, but alas...
Johnny Blaze
08-14-2007, 12:28 PM
I was hoping Pak would stay away from that nonsense, but alas...
Well, maybe he'll lose all the amped up power he's got when it's all over with? It is all from the immense rage over his preg-O wife being blown to hell along with a nice portion of his planet. A little closure might help things out...maybe. :o
TheCorpulent1
08-14-2007, 12:30 PM
He'll probably be back down to his usual power level by the end of the mini-series. I can't see them leaving him at a level where he could hand literally everyone their ass.
AnnoyingSilence
08-14-2007, 12:46 PM
ha. leaguer...
option two
TheCorpulent1
08-14-2007, 01:04 PM
He missed you. :heart:
wiegeabo
08-14-2007, 01:54 PM
My guess would be no. He hasn't even come close to being stopped so far, and some pretty top-tier ubers have gone up against him.
To clarify: are characters from Marvel and DC imprints still allowed? Vertigo, MAX, Wildstorm, Malibu, etc.?
Well, I don't think we can keep Wildstorm out since it's part of the 52 now. And, I guess, to be fair, we should let Malibu in. But do we really also need Vertigo and MAX?
TheCorpulent1
08-14-2007, 01:57 PM
Doesn't matter to me if you take them out. JB might have an issue with it, since I think he wanted Little Boy Blue from Fables again.
Hell, I don't even really need Malibu, either. I doubt anyone's really gonna take anyone from Malibu. I just wanted Wildstorm so I could have Hadrian and Ambrose Chase again.
wiegeabo
08-14-2007, 02:01 PM
I'd rather not have any imprints. But that's just me. We've got so many characters from the main publishers already. And, like I said, Wildstorm's part of DC now, so I can't really keep that out.
TheCorpulent1
08-14-2007, 02:04 PM
Shyeah. You can't. :oldrazz:
Red Leader
08-14-2007, 06:38 PM
Please forgive the stupid question, but I'm new to the theory. What are the ranks, and where would I find a link to tell which character is which rank, if such a link exists?
Thanks in advance.
wiegeabo
08-14-2007, 08:30 PM
Please forgive the stupid question, but I'm new to the theory. What are the ranks, and where would I find a link to tell which character is which rank, if such a link exists?
Thanks in advance.
Last season's Update thread will give you a lot of examples of characters and previous teams.
http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=220202
TheCorpulent1
08-14-2007, 08:38 PM
Middleweight is usually the only class that stumps people. Ubers are Thor, Superman, Black Adam, the Silver Surfer, Thanos, etc. and regulars are Spider-Man, Captain America, Batman, Wolverine, etc.
Middleweights are tricky because a character who's uber-level in one area but lacks any other useful powers will usually be bumped down to middleweight. Perfect examples are Colossus and the Thing--they're strong enough to hold their own against most ubers, but they don't really have anything else going for them and there are always tons of ways to get around their one super-potent power. Additionally, characters who have a bunch of powers but don't really excel in any of them tend to be middleweights as well. Doctor Doom, whom we were just discussing, is a good example--he dabbles in magic and he's got a decent suit of armor, but it's not a super-powerful suit of armor like Iron Man's and he's certainly no Dr. Strange, so he gets to hang out at the middleweight level.
Johnny Blaze
08-14-2007, 09:45 PM
Well, I don't think we can keep Wildstorm out since it's part of the 52 now. And, I guess, to be fair, we should let Malibu in. But do we really also need Vertigo and MAX?
We. Need. Vertigo. :cmad:
Or really just Fables. The rest I can give two ****s about. :o
Ahura Mazda
08-15-2007, 04:57 AM
My guess would be no. He hasn't even come close to being stopped so far, and some pretty top-tier ubers have gone up against him.
Yes but at the same time Strange said he could finish him off just like that if he wanted to. It was only because he let his guard down that he was able to do that. If Strange is allowed there is an argument for Hulk to be allowed.
TheCorpulent1
08-15-2007, 08:27 AM
Eh, I guess the WWH Hulk really just represents what the normal Hulk is capable of when pushed to extremes, like I'm sure people will push him in the DTL anyway. He'd just start off at a higher base strength.
Ahura Mazda
08-15-2007, 10:00 AM
Eh, I guess the WWH Hulk really just represents what the normal Hulk is capable of when pushed to extremes, like I'm sure people will push him in the DTL anyway. He'd just start off at a higher base strength.
That was my thought....
AnnoyingSilence
08-16-2007, 01:31 AM
He missed you. :heart:Everyone did
Nightwing.
08-18-2007, 08:15 AM
Please forgive the stupid question, but I'm new to the theory. What are the ranks, and where would I find a link to tell which character is which rank, if such a link exists?
Thanks in advance.
i tried making a DTL Character Lobby which has a limited selection to choose from....iot might help you atleast get an idea of what characters you can have and ranks.
i will probs add to that this season to be honest.if people think it would help?
TheCorpulent1
08-18-2007, 09:03 AM
If we're getting new people, sure. Most of us who've played in a season before know the broad strokes of the weight classes and have a bunch of characters in mind already.
Nightwing.
08-18-2007, 01:51 PM
yeah....ive just checked my links and the threads been destroyed now i think......either that or moved..........anyway can i ask you lot......do you know what date spring break is in california?ive tried to get a straight forward answer from the community threads and i just got sarcasm and idiots.
wiegeabo
08-18-2007, 02:22 PM
Spring break can vary depending on school (for universities) and school districts (for lower education). Typically it's a week in April. Occasionally the last week in March. I know of one school that took it the first week of May.
In my area I think it's usually the week of, or week after, Easter.
TheCorpulent1
08-19-2007, 02:05 PM
In my area (central Florida), it was usually the middle of March.
Nightwing.
08-19-2007, 02:37 PM
central florida aye?????hmmmm interesting...and how wild do the parties get there?
Johnny Blaze
08-19-2007, 02:43 PM
It's Florida. It's warm weather 90% of the year, some of the best beaches in the world, and it's full of bars, pubs, and clubs. There's always parties going on. :up:
Nightwing.
08-19-2007, 04:24 PM
yeah but are we talking your standard friday night style parties.....or MTV style spring break parties with college chicks and shots off their bodies?
Johnny Blaze
08-19-2007, 04:38 PM
yeah but are we talking your standard friday night style parties.....or MTV style spring break parties with college chicks and shots off their bodies?
It's Florida, one of the top destinations for spring breakers. You'll find some wild parties if you know where to look.
Nightwing.
08-19-2007, 04:51 PM
thats the thing....we want to know where the best places are and when to go to em....if you have some tips that would be awesome and would save us a lot of planning time.
TheCorpulent1
08-19-2007, 06:54 PM
I'm not much of a party person, so I won't be much help.
Johnny Blaze
08-19-2007, 07:27 PM
thats the thing....we want to know where the best places are and when to go to em....if you have some tips that would be awesome and would save us a lot of planning time.
Tips for what?
AnnoyingSilence
08-20-2007, 12:11 AM
seriously, blaze? the bucs?
AnnoyingSilence
08-20-2007, 12:16 AM
stick with a winner
http://www.projectmessrocks.com/images/Patriots07.jpg
Johnny Blaze
08-20-2007, 11:53 AM
Sorry, I don't jump on the bandwagon. I stick with my team no matter what. :up:
wiegeabo
08-20-2007, 11:59 AM
Sorry, I don't jump on the bandwagon. I stick with my team no matter what. :up:
Good for you. Go Niner's!!! :woot: :csad:
...Thank god I like Bears too.
Johnny Blaze
08-20-2007, 12:05 PM
Good for you. Go Niner's!!! :woot: :csad:
...Thank god I like Bears too.
**** the Bears. **** them in their stupid asses. :o
wiegeabo
08-20-2007, 12:06 PM
**** the Bears. **** them in their stupid asses. :o
Ooo, looks like I touched a nerve. :ninja:
Johnny Blaze
08-20-2007, 12:28 PM
Not really. I just don't like the Bears is all. Same goes for the rest of the old NFC Central, and the NFC South. They're old rivals and current rivals, respectively. As such I hate them all. :up:
wiegeabo
08-20-2007, 12:48 PM
Not really. I just don't like the Bears is all. Same goes for the rest of the old NFC Central, and the NFC South. They're old rivals and current rivals, respectively. As such I hate them all. :up:
As long as it's a general hatred rather than a specific hatred.
Unlike my hatred for the Packers and Cowboys and Raiders. :cmad:
Johnny Blaze
08-20-2007, 12:59 PM
Well, it is kind of specific. I specifically hate the NFC North and rest of the South. I hate the Eagles (along with all Philly sports teams), hate the Cowboys (thanks to their whiney fans and Michael "Coke Whores" Irvin), hate the Raiders (thanks to Al), hate the Rams (****ing Ricky Proehl :cmad: ), and, finally, I hate the the Patriots (and Red Sox) because of all the New England fans that have popped up after they started winning.
Supposedly they were Pats fans all along, but for some reason they just never showed it until they turned it around. :huh:
TheCorpulent1
08-20-2007, 01:03 PM
Football's totally gay. :o
Johnny Blaze
08-20-2007, 01:11 PM
It really is. I mean, a bunch of sweaty men in tights running around trying to tackle each other? And two of the positions are the Tight End and Wide Receiver.
Totally fruity.
TheCorpulent1
08-20-2007, 01:13 PM
Don't forget about the scrimmage activities. The QB gets to get hunch over and put his hands so close to the snapper's crotch that he can feel the heat radiating off the dude's nuts. Gayalicious. :o
Johnny Blaze
08-20-2007, 01:16 PM
And after the game they all go and take a nice hot shower together.
wiegeabo
08-20-2007, 01:16 PM
Well, it is kind of specific. I specifically hate the NFC North and rest of the South. I hate the Eagles (along with all Philly sports teams), hate the Cowboys (thanks to their whiney fans and Michael "Coke Whores" Irvin), hate the Raiders (thanks to Al), hate the Rams (****ing Ricky Proehl :cmad: ), and, finally, I hate the the Patriots (and Red Sox) because of all the New England fans that have popped up after they started winning.
Supposedly they were Pats fans all along, but for some reason they just never showed it until they turned it around. :huh:
Ah, yes. The Rams. I hate the Rams. But that's mostly because they're my dad's favorite team.
TheCorpulent1
08-20-2007, 01:17 PM
And after the game they all go and take a nice hot shower together.
They probably soap each other down.
wiegeabo
08-20-2007, 01:18 PM
They probably soap each other down.
That's called teamwork. ;)
Johnny Blaze
08-20-2007, 01:28 PM
That's ****in' teamwoooork!
Sorry...I had a D moment there. :o
TheCorpulent1
08-20-2007, 01:29 PM
It happens.
AnnoyingSilence
08-21-2007, 04:23 AM
Well, it is kind of specific. I specifically hate the NFC North and rest of the South. I hate the Eagles (along with all Philly sports teams), hate the Cowboys (thanks to their whiney fans and Michael "Coke Whores" Irvin), hate the Raiders (thanks to Al), hate the Rams (****ing Ricky Proehl :cmad: ), and, finally, I hate the the Patriots (and Red Sox) because of all the New England fans that have popped up after they started winning.
Supposedly they were Pats fans all along, but for some reason they just never showed it until they turned it around. :huh:i started liking the pats in 2000 when i actually started getting into sports(other than playing them myself and knowing the home teams(cin)).
the pats were 5-11 that season.
since i kep up with bengals my whole life, there was no choice., i had to change teams. cuase even now the bengals suck. thats why carson palmer does.
peyton only has one championship. Tom three.
the steelers are "knee leaners"(hope they break a leg)
hate mcnabb, emmit smith and micheal vick
ladanian, and the ravens kick ass
AnnoyingSilence
08-21-2007, 04:24 AM
That's ****in' teamwoooork!
Sorry...I had a D moment there. :odidn't know they still had one
AnnoyingSilence
08-21-2007, 04:30 AM
heres a buccaneer.
http://anthropik.com/wp-uploads/hpyle-buccaneer.jpg
Buccaneers Rock Ass!
used to. :)
AnnoyingSilence
08-21-2007, 04:39 AM
and 4 for the spam
Johnny Blaze
08-21-2007, 04:29 PM
didn't know they still had one
Still had one? They're the greatest rock band of all time! They still have everything.
Nightwing.
08-21-2007, 05:08 PM
Tips for what?
where these best locations are....you said if i knew where to look...im guessing you do know where to look and i was wondering if you could tell me the best places to party in florida were.
TheCorpulent1
08-21-2007, 05:09 PM
Brothels.
Nightwing.
08-21-2007, 05:11 PM
i was thinking more of areas of florida that werent costly or at risk of me contracting virus's
TheCorpulent1
08-21-2007, 05:13 PM
...
High-class brothels?
Nightwing.
08-21-2007, 05:18 PM
not really the direction im wanting......ill explain.....i want to find a beach/or beaches that have a large number of females (and by large i mean so theres a ratio of atleast 20 women to 1 guy) and these women are all gorgeous and are wanting shot drinking off their bodies and are wanting to party with some british guys.
so basically......everything that they show in the MTV spring break things and everything they dont.....
Johnny Blaze
08-21-2007, 05:22 PM
not really the direction im wanting......ill explain.....i want to find a beach/or beaches that have a large number of females (and by large i mean so theres a ratio of atleast 20 women to 1 guy) and these women are all gorgeous and are wanting shot drinking off their bodies and are wanting to party with some british guys.
so basically......everything that they show in the MTV spring break things and everything they dont.....
Ah, there's your problem. You watch MTV and think that's how it is all the time during spring break.
Sure, go to some clubs and you'll get some wild parties.
But the MTV stuff is just dressed up for TV, not to mention in Mexico. You know, a country where cops can be bribed to look the other way. :o
Nightwing.
08-21-2007, 05:23 PM
surely its very similar in florida
Johnny Blaze
08-21-2007, 08:10 PM
surely its very similar in florida
There are wild parties during spring break if you know where to go and which clubs to hit, but it's not to the extent that you see on MTV. That's trussed up to make entertaining television.
Nightwing.
08-22-2007, 03:38 AM
but there are wild parties and clubs?where are these then?
you know i might employ you as a party guide lol
TheCorpulent1
08-22-2007, 07:27 AM
South Beach, dude. All the good clubs are on South Beach. That's why every TV show you've ever seen set in Miami is really mostly set in South Beach. A good number of celebrities go to South Beach a lot, too.
Johnny Blaze
08-22-2007, 03:27 PM
**** Miami. I stay the hell out of that infernal plane as much as humanly possible. :o
TheCorpulent1
08-22-2007, 03:33 PM
Me, too. Growing up there was bad enough.
Johnny Blaze
08-22-2007, 03:43 PM
Not to mention: Foreigners + Miami = Bad times.
Seriously, there's dozens of attacks on out of staters each year in Cuba Jr, let alone the people from other countries. Most tourists don't get harrassed, but if you're out there at clubs and parties all night, you're gonna find trouble.
TheCorpulent1
08-22-2007, 03:53 PM
Yeah, I'm pretty sure that's just Miami's club scene in general, whether you're a foreigner or not. I went to a club in Miami exactly one time and, while I wasn't harassed because I didn't really interact with anyone, I could see how the mixture of liquor, Hispanic tempers, and overwhelming testosterone could easily lead to trouble.
Johnny Blaze
08-22-2007, 07:31 PM
Well, you have to take that into acount whenever you go out drinking.
But yeah, Cuba Jr is a bit more...disturbed than other places. Especially to people who hail from foreign lands that don't start with a "C" and end in a "uba". :o
wiegeabo
08-22-2007, 08:19 PM
Well, you have to take that into acount whenever you go out drinking.
But yeah, Cuba Jr is a bit more...disturbed than other places. Especially to people who hail from foreign lands that don't start with a "C" and end in a "uba". :o
Cubanada? :confused:
Johnny Blaze
08-22-2007, 08:30 PM
Cubanada? :confused:
That's the one. :up:
AnnoyingSilence
08-24-2007, 03:21 AM
side note: i've been foot noting a Cable (Burnt Offering) Vs. Superman battle
hopefully i can get the battle ended and have it up by sat(when no ones on)
wiegeabo
08-24-2007, 10:13 AM
That's the one. :up:
Good. For a second I thought you mean Canaduba. And I hate that place. :mad: :p
TheCorpulent1
08-24-2007, 10:16 AM
Who doesn't?
wiegeabo
08-24-2007, 10:22 AM
Who doesn't?
Communists.
Dirty, stinkin' communists.
And the French. :dry:
TheCorpulent1
08-24-2007, 10:23 AM
French Communists are the worst. They're redder than their delicious, fragrant wine.
AnnoyingSilence
08-24-2007, 01:08 PM
Good. For a second I thought you mean Canaduba. And I hate that place. :mad: :pthats good, kuz i thought yall meant ohio
AnnoyingSilence
08-28-2007, 11:28 PM
ok, so... waiting on an update
AnnoyingSilence
08-28-2007, 11:28 PM
Superman Vs. Cable
Location: Darkside of the Moon
Both Superman and Cable have been given full info on eachother. Cable (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cable_%28comics%29#Savior) Superman (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superman#Powers_and_abilities)
As these two combatants appear...
Cable: I'm very impressed by your file.
Superman: That'll be two of us...
Cable: So..? Ready?-
Superman makes the first move, darting at Cable, bashing is fists against Cable's Telekinetic force field until Cable reacts, knocking Superman to the ground. Using any opprotunity availible, Superman burrows into the moon, reappearing under Cable, grabbing his ankles, throwing him into the moon followed by a fury of punches sending them deeper into the moon...
Pushing Superman to the side, Cable: I hope your not gonna try to win with punches.
Using his vast telekinetics, Cable super condenses the rocks around Superman as they rise back out of the moon.
Trapped in the ever growing baulder, Superman: Don't worry about me.!
Struggling to free himself by use of eyes beams, super breath and brute strength, Superman instead uses his x-ray vision,takes off with the baulder still around him, circles the moon(grabbing the upper-hand using his speed), Superman collides with Cable knocking him into one of the labs...
Cable: I hope-
Grabbing Cable, Superman bolts into the blackness of space...
Still flying, Superman: You know what I hope? I hope you don't die on the trip back to the moon...
Cable: I can't breath out here!
Superman: Isn't that the point?.
Cable: Since we're resorting to dirty tricks..
Ending the battle, Cable takes over Superman mind, flying them back to the moon and putting him to sleep...
Cable wins
TheCorpulent1
08-28-2007, 11:34 PM
Cable. Superman's been brought low by telepaths before because, frankly, he has no defense against them.
AnnoyingSilence
08-28-2007, 11:39 PM
shhh... you'll ruin it.
besides, how many times have you seen a telepathy/telekinetic use his telepathy to battle...
TheCorpulent1
08-28-2007, 11:40 PM
CABLE!!!
wiegeabo
08-28-2007, 11:44 PM
Since labor day weekend is coming up, and some of us will probably be traveling (or enjoying not having to do a damn thing for three days), lets finalize the teams and how the draft will work by the end of the week. Then we'll have the draft lists due next weekend.
Looking at the calendar, if we have eight teams, and start by the 14th of September, we should finish the second week of December and avoid playing over the holidays.
TheCorpulent1
08-28-2007, 11:53 PM
Shazam, progress! :up:
AnnoyingSilence
08-29-2007, 12:20 AM
best news ever
AnnoyingSilence
08-29-2007, 12:20 AM
well, not ever
LadyVader
08-29-2007, 01:59 AM
Jahwol, mein herr!
AnnoyingSilence
08-30-2007, 04:25 AM
did i get romani-owned again?
TheCorpulent1
08-30-2007, 07:07 AM
No, I think LV just called wieg a Nazi.
LadyVader
08-30-2007, 07:14 AM
http://www.seinfeld-fan.net/pictures/episodes/the_soup_nazi/the_soup_nazi017.jpg
Maybe. :)
TheCorpulent1
08-30-2007, 07:15 AM
Oh, that's okay, then. Soup Nazis are a rare, family-friendly breed of Nazi. :up:
LadyVader
08-30-2007, 07:18 AM
did i get romani-owned again?
Don't think so. I'm pretty straightforward about this kind of stuff. :)
wiegeabo
08-30-2007, 10:16 AM
Hmmm...DTL Nazi. I might have to put that in my avatar.
So here's what I'm thinking for the draft. We'll have 12 characters on our bench now. For the draft we'll each get 4 of each rank (uber, med, reg). So everyone will have to submit three draft lists, one for each rank. Your top four unclaimed picks on each list get on your team. (So, in effect, it's 3 mini-drafts.)
As for how many characters you'll need in the lists. With eight teams of four characters in each rank, a total of 32 characters that will be picked for each rank. So each draft list you submit must have a minimum of 32 characters. By doing so you're guarantying that you won't run out of characters partway through the draft process.
Of course after the draft you can still change characters, and the number of characters you have in each rank if you want. But I think doing it this way will have everyone start out on relatively equal footing.
Nightwing.
08-30-2007, 07:49 PM
what about the teams we already hold?
i mean i have some pretty good characters and it'd be ashame to lose them cos i didnt post them first.....
cant we just use the ten characters we already have and add 2 and just change the ones we dont want?
it took me quite a while to build my team and keep hold of the characters that i have...obviously i want to make a few changes but i certainly dont want to be going through 32 characters for the sake of it and lose the ones i have....
im surely not alone on this....i bet LV doesnt want to lose Deadpool cos someone put him at the top of their list first....and Corp probs doesnt want to lose Little Boy Blue and i think you see where im going with this.....what i suggest (can be scrapped) is people use the teams they already have and add 2 default characters just so we all know that they have a legal squad of 12 then before the matches are decided they use this time to do legal trades and switches from the ownerless teams and the free characters....then if due to commitments someone misses the deadline for trading they atleast have a legal team to create a legal line up....
TheCorpulent1
08-30-2007, 07:53 PM
Alas, this new season is a fresh start. All teams are reset and all characters are freely floating through the unowned ether.
Nightwing.
08-30-2007, 07:54 PM
when do the drafts have to be in?
TheCorpulent1
08-30-2007, 07:55 PM
Wieg is shooting for the end of next week, I believe.
Nightwing.
08-30-2007, 07:59 PM
is that when we start to put them in or the deadline for when they have to be in?can i put mine in now?
TheCorpulent1
08-30-2007, 08:00 PM
I don't know, that's a wieg question.
Nightwing.
08-30-2007, 08:06 PM
fair enough....heres a maths question.....3 ranks....8 characters in each....doesnt that make 24 and not 32?
wiegeabo
08-30-2007, 08:35 PM
We need 32 characters for each rank (a total of 96 characters). And the reason is every team will have 4 ubers. Times 8 teams, that's 32 ubers. The same goes for meds and regs. So, to guarantee not running out, you'd need at least 32 characters in each rank.
Of course, if no one picks the characters you have listed you can get by with a smaller list. But you're taking a chance of running short.
Which begs of what we should do if someone does run short.
TheCorpulent1
08-30-2007, 09:47 PM
Seems like it'll be down to either you throwing characters on their roster or mandating that they have their roster filled by the time their first field roster is due. I'd opt for the latter. The responsibility ultimately rests with the owner to get their team ready.
wiegeabo
08-30-2007, 09:56 PM
Seems like it'll be down to either you throwing characters on their roster or mandating that they have their roster filled by the time their first field roster is due. I'd opt for the latter. The responsibility ultimately rests with the owner to get their team ready.
Maybe I'll threaten to give anyone who runs short characters like Beak and Aunt May, and then lock anyone from making changes the first week. That should get the job done. :ninja:
Actually, that gives me an idea. What if we did lock teams the first week? Everyone would have to use the team they draft for that first match, making good draft lists very very important.
TheCorpulent1
08-30-2007, 10:00 PM
Haha, that would be great.
I don't mind locking the teams for the first week.
LadyVader
08-31-2007, 12:22 AM
Not that I think they're in any danger but i just want you to know. There's no point in me participating if I don't have Deadpool and Wonder Woman. :)
wiegeabo
08-31-2007, 01:09 AM
Not that I think they're in any danger but i just want you to know. There's no point in me participating if I don't have Deadpool and Wonder Woman. :)
You're hoping for another body swap week, aren't you. :ninja:
LadyVader
08-31-2007, 02:18 AM
Hope is all that nourishes me wieg m'dear, but that has nothing to do with it. I'm all for a fresh start, but if I'm not allowed to write Diana and especially Deadpool then it just won't be any more fun for me. And fun is the main reason I'm in cause we all know I ain't no mad genius.
Mad maybe, but genius no. :)
AnnoyingSilence
08-31-2007, 04:26 AM
what if more than one person has deadpool in the number one spot of the reg draft
o. and, it sucks your doin it like that, kuz i just put together my list last night all the wrong way....:(
Ahura Mazda
08-31-2007, 04:57 AM
I have only until nest week to submit my list. That will be tough especially as my partner, Mad Bull, is missing.
Hmm I guess I beter get on it.
Is Dr. Strange/Zom allowed?
TheCorpulent1
08-31-2007, 07:17 AM
I doubt it. By all accounts, he should be able to annihilate even the WWH Hulk with just a fraction of his power. It apparently took the Living Tribunal, Eternity, and a few other cosmic entities to shut Zom down.
Harlekin
08-31-2007, 07:35 AM
what if more than one person has deadpool in the number one spot of the reg draft
o. and, it sucks your doin it like that, kuz i just put together my list last night all the wrong way....:(
That's the whole point of the draft. Only one person can get Deadpool/a character.
TheCorpulent1
08-31-2007, 07:36 AM
There are alternate versions of Deadpool, so two people could actually get him. Or some form of him.
Harlekin
08-31-2007, 08:15 AM
Well, yeah, exempting that of course.
LadyVader
08-31-2007, 09:16 AM
You're all welcomed to Agent X but the original is mine. :D
AnnoyingSilence
08-31-2007, 10:51 PM
ok, now someone answer my question
wiegeabo
08-31-2007, 11:10 PM
what if more than one person has deadpool in the number one spot of the reg draft
The person whose list is first in line gets Deadpool. The other person gets the next available character on their list.
And I think we'll do a snake draft. That means that in the first round owners 1 through 8 get characters in that order, then 8 through 1 in the next round, back to 1 through 8, and on and on...
AnnoyingSilence
09-01-2007, 12:20 AM
like a madden fantasy draft
wiegeabo
09-01-2007, 12:29 AM
like a madden fantasy draft
That's exactly what we're doing. It's no different than a sports draft. Instead of player positions we draft on player ranks.
I guess we are a little different in that we're sort of doing a draft for each rank (position) rather than mixing all the characters in a single draft
Nightwing.
09-01-2007, 03:02 AM
i do see what your doing with this new season fresh start thing but it is abit frustrating considering i had worked very hard to get and keep hold of alot of my characters....most of my characters were selected purely cos i could do them more justice imo thatn i could with other characters...is there no way you could reconsider the whole drafts thing?and have people just add 2 characters to their already nice team?and if anyone does want to start from scratch they just pull together a team of 12....its just a thought
Harlekin
09-01-2007, 05:51 AM
Just hope you get the characters you want.
TheCorpulent1
09-01-2007, 09:49 AM
Yeah, I worked pretty hard on getting all the characters I wanted, too. But since we're getting some new people in this time and the DTL went on hiatus for like 6 months, I think it's only fair that we get a fresh start. It's tough to pull together a team from random characters when we all know that a lot of owners are never going to trade off a lot of the best characters available. As unfair as it is for veterans to have to recreate teams, it's more unfair for newbies to never realistically get a shot at some of the better characters.
Harlekin
09-01-2007, 10:32 AM
Exactly. Especially after membership started dropping, a lot of characters were ripe for the picking. Heck, I was able to have a team with Quasar, Silver Surfer, Flash and Dr. Fate as ubers.
TheCorpulent1
09-01-2007, 10:33 AM
And a bunch of my cast-offs, too. :oldrazz:
Harlekin
09-01-2007, 12:29 PM
Well... yeah. My team's official nickname is basically "Corp's graveyard" :/.
TheCorpulent1
09-01-2007, 12:59 PM
If I were an a-hole, I'd brag to newbs that I've thrown away better characters than their teams will ever have.
Come to think of it, I should tell newbs that...
Johnny Blaze
09-01-2007, 01:16 PM
You should make that your sig. :o
TheCorpulent1
09-01-2007, 03:07 PM
Nah, the sexist stylings of Ari Gold are doing just fine. :oldrazz:
wiegeabo
09-01-2007, 04:11 PM
Well... yeah. My team's official nickname is basically "Corp's graveyard" :/.
Sounds better than "Corp's Sloppy Seconds"
TheCorpulent1
09-01-2007, 04:28 PM
Either way, I likes it.
Nightwing.
09-02-2007, 03:41 PM
so when are the teams announced?and who's participating this season?
who from the old seasons and who are new?
wiegeabo
09-02-2007, 04:14 PM
Well, I'd like to get the draft lists all in by Friday or Saturday. Then I can hopefully have all the teams picked by Sunday or Monday. Then the first round of matches by next Friday.
As for teams:
wiegeabo, nightwing, LV, Corp, AS, Harl, JB, and Ahura.
I think that's right.
Johnny Blaze
09-02-2007, 04:26 PM
Well, I'd like to get the draft lists all in by Friday or Saturday. Then I can hopefully have all the teams picked by Sunday or Monday. Then the first round of matches by next Friday.
As for teams:
wiegeabo, nightwing, LV, Corp, AS, Harl, and Ahura.
I think that's right.
Fixed it. :D
Yeah, I'm not going to be in it I'm afraid. At least not for the start up.
wiegeabo
09-02-2007, 04:35 PM
Fixed it. :D
Yeah, I'm not going to be in it I'm afraid. At least not for the start up.
Dammit! :mad:
Than means we're one team short. We need eight teams.
Wait...where's X? Is he still playing this season?
The Leaguer
09-02-2007, 08:50 PM
As for teams:
wiegeabo, nightwing, LV, Leag/Corp, AS, Harl, JB, and Ahura.
Notice my name is first.
We also go by Leagulent.
wiegeabo
09-02-2007, 09:01 PM
We also go by Leagulent.
That sounds like a nasty skin disorder.:oldrazz:
The Leaguer
09-02-2007, 09:05 PM
He is annoying like one.
TheCorpulent1
09-03-2007, 10:30 AM
I will punch you with an economy-class airliner.
The Leaguer
09-03-2007, 10:32 AM
I'll shoot you with my helicopter gun.
Ahura Mazda
09-04-2007, 06:19 AM
Guys I apologise but it looks like I will not be able to get my team done before I leave for Los Angeles and I will not get back until the 14th.
I have a team in mind but I have no list done. Maybe I wil be able to create a team with the leftovers if the seléection is done in my absence. Either that or Mad Bull makes an appearance.
wiegeabo
09-04-2007, 10:45 AM
Guys I apologise but it looks like I will not be able to get my team done before I leave for Los Angeles and I will not get back until the 14th.
I have a team in mind but I have no list done. Maybe I wil be able to create a team with the leftovers if the seléection is done in my absence. Either that or Mad Bull makes an appearance.
Well, the timing is flexible. We can always start later (this would only put us a week or two behind). The original schedule was designed so we'd finish right before the holidays. But we could always move the playoffs until after the holidays. I'm just afraid that we might lose participation if we have a big gap.
As for making draft lists, if anyone is having trouble picking enough characters (you should have at least 96), there's a list of 201 characters in last season's Update thread. Just don't pick the tubers. ;)
AnnoyingSilence
09-05-2007, 03:15 AM
I already sent mine... :)
i only put 3 mediums... thats the only ones i want
Nightwing.
09-05-2007, 06:40 AM
ive sent mine too....if it doesnt work out that i get the characters i want then ill just make some edits after the first battle based on the 201 characters in the update thread
Harlekin
09-05-2007, 08:18 AM
When's the draft deadline again?
TheCorpulent1
09-05-2007, 08:25 AM
The end of this week, I believe.
Kaboom
09-05-2007, 09:09 AM
is it too late to sign up for a team?
wiegeabo
09-05-2007, 10:46 AM
is it too late to sign up for a team?
No it's not. :woot: In fact, we need another team to make an even eight.
...An even eight? :confused:
wiegeabo
09-05-2007, 10:48 AM
The end of this week, I believe.
I may put it off until next week because Ahura isn't here. Unless he can get his list in this week.
TheCorpulent1
09-05-2007, 10:55 AM
More time suits me fine.
No it's not. :woot: In fact, we need another team to make an even eight.
...An even eight? :confused:
All eights are even.
wiegeabo
09-05-2007, 11:11 AM
More time suits me fine.
All eights are even.
...yeah, well go with that.:word:
Kaboom
09-05-2007, 11:14 AM
sweet then im in.
how do i prepare my draft list? how deep do i go?
TheCorpulent1
09-05-2007, 11:23 AM
Our esteemed leader answered this a few posts ago:
Well, the timing is flexible. We can always start later (this would only put us a week or two behind). The original schedule was designed so we'd finish right before the holidays. But we could always move the playoffs until after the holidays. I'm just afraid that we might lose participation if we have a big gap.
As for making draft lists, if anyone is having trouble picking enough characters (you should have at least 96), there's a list of 201 characters in last season's Update thread. Just don't pick the tubers. ;)
wiegeabo
09-05-2007, 11:34 AM
sweet then im in.
how do i prepare my draft list? how deep do i go?
To be safe, you'll need at least 32 characters of each rank (uber, middleweight, and regular) for a total of 96. The Update thread will give you a good list of examples (and you don't have to limit yourself to that list. Just put the characters you want the most higher on the list, just like any other draft.
Nightwing.
09-06-2007, 05:21 AM
ok folks this is a random question but whats the nearest airport to this address?
11127 West HWY98
Panama City
FL32407
US
is it miami international?
TheCorpulent1
09-06-2007, 07:33 AM
Panama City International Airport. (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&rls=com.microsoft%3Aen-us&q=panama+city+international+airport)
JewishHobbit
09-06-2007, 06:25 PM
I thought I'd be a mucher and throw a link on here. Feel free to bid on anything you'd like :)
LINK (http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZshadagad)
And I see you're already to the draft portion. I'm eager to see who gets what. Good luck to all :up:
XFanTim
09-06-2007, 07:56 PM
Hey guys,
I'm basically never on this board anymore, and definitely don't have time to participate in the DTL right now, but I figured I'd put in my 2 cents as a former DTL-er. I also don't know whether rules changes for the upcoming season have already been agreed upon . . . anyway, what I'm saying is feel free to ignore everything I have to say. Nevertheless:
If there is one thing I could suggest to improve the DTL, it would be this: Put a limit on the length of writeups. (Limiting the number of words is probably easiest -- since it's not dependent on font size or line spacing like a page limit would be).
It might be surprising that I'm advocating for this, given that I won season three by, essentially, writing more than anyone else. (Well, maybe not more than Corp.) But let me run down the problems with overly-long writeups:
(1) It's too hard to find and maintain DTL participants.
How many people have we seen quit the league because they just didn't have time to write the mini-novels some of us were putting out each week? Or not bother to do anything some weeks, because they knew they didn't have enough time to write a winning writeup? And lets be honest, if you write a page and your oponent writes a book, then unless yours is of drastically higher quality there's no way you're going to win.
(2) We end up with too few voters.
because no one has time to read the insanely long writeups. We've seen too many matches be decided 3-2 or 2-1 because no one else had time to read the whole thing (and who is to say those 5 people really read it all?)
(3) Writeups get finished late
because everyone is writing so much. This results in a smaller window of time between when the writeup is finished and when voting closes, which means people who can't get online in that window either (a) don't vote, or (b) must vote without reading the whole writeup. Neither option is good. Plus, it cuts into time for debate . . . or leaves the participants too exhausted to debate.
(4) Matches end up being decided more on the basis of how much time people put in, rather than how good their team/strategy is.
Some might not consider this a downside, but really, it shouldn't be about who has no life outside of DTL. (Again, I'm saying this as someone who won because I had no life outside of DTL, or rather because I was willing to blow off my real life in order to win the DTL. Seriously, my now-wife is still giving me **** for the fact that I took time out on our first date to reply to a DTL thread. True story.)
I guess someone might say "Look, no one's forcing anyone to do a monster writeup", and in theory no one is voting on length of writeup." But in practice the most successful DTL participants have all tended to write very long writeups. Why? Because it's easier to tell an impressive story if you have more words to work with. But the thing is, the DTL shouldn't be a story-telling competition. As I enumerated above, not enough people have time to participate in one consistently, not enough people have time to read it all and vote, and it takes away from what the DTL should be: a strategy competition, where you win by drafting a well balanced team, crafting a creative strategy each week, and summarizing that stategy coherently and defending it persuasively. Besides, there's already a forum for fan-fiction and this ain't it.
Anyway, for those who absolutely love writing epics, there's always the playoffs, where I would say the fewer teams (and presumably stronger commitment of the remaining players) could justify loosening the length restriction a bit.
Plus, I think that if you could participate each week without essentially sacrificing all your free time, most people would have a lot more fun.
- XFanTim
(By the way, I have some other suggestions which I might post later, but this is the main one and I figured I'd give it its own post.)
JewishHobbit
09-06-2007, 08:09 PM
Man, I haven't seen you around in forever (especially since I left DTL before season 3). Good to see ya.
TheCorpulent1
09-08-2007, 03:13 PM
Seriously. You should hang around a little more, even if you're not going to participate in the League itself, Tim. :up:
Harlekin
09-08-2007, 06:39 PM
Yeah, it's been a while Tim. Good to see you still lurk at least.
So, precise deadline? I know we said this weekend. I need at least another day.
wiegeabo
09-08-2007, 07:07 PM
Yeah, it's been a while Tim. Good to see you still lurk at least.
So, precise deadline? I know we said this weekend. I need at least another day.
I wanted to get them all in by Tomorrow. But this week kicked my ass at work, so I didn't have time to get anything ready. And Ahura is gone until Friday. So I'm going to move the due date for draft lists until next Sunday (the 16th).
That will give me enough time to get everything ready, especially the final season 5 rules (which I want to give everyone a bit of time to discuss).
LadyVader
09-09-2007, 04:02 AM
Great, I had started work on it but I could use the week to fill it up. 32 to characters in each rank is quite a load. Oh, and are we dropping the super-uber rank after all?
TheCorpulent1
09-09-2007, 10:35 AM
Yeah, Leaguer and I started on our lists but got sidetracked with *****ing about how much something or other sucked, and then we just stopped. Kind of like a day on the Hype, really.
LV, nice avatar. That was a hilarious episode. :D
The Leaguer
09-09-2007, 11:04 AM
Corp, get on AIM, you chucklef***.
TheCorpulent1
09-09-2007, 11:17 AM
I am, cockrag.
LadyVader
09-09-2007, 01:18 PM
LV, nice avatar. That was a hilarious episode. :D
Mark Valley is f@#$ing funny when he screams in terror. :)
TheCorpulent1
09-10-2007, 11:04 AM
Mark Valley is always ****ing funny. Did you watch Keen Eddie?
wiegeabo
09-10-2007, 11:17 AM
Mark Valley is always ****ing funny. Did you watch Keen Eddie?
Why did you have to bring up Keen Eddie?
Now I'm sad...:csad:
TheCorpulent1
09-10-2007, 11:21 AM
Because it's awesome. Let us remember it as it was, not as another victim of Fox's retarded "cancel all good shows without letting them find their footing" policy.
LadyVader
09-10-2007, 12:44 PM
Unless I can find episodes of it online, I won't be able to watch it. :(
TheCorpulent1
09-10-2007, 01:03 PM
Well, a bunch of clips are on YouTube. Here's the opening credits:
7KYCClZGMxI
Other than that, there are torrents of it all over.
Nightwing.
09-10-2007, 04:25 PM
has there been any decision as to the voting system this season?
i kinda preferred the win/lose version as opposed to the marks out of 10 voting....just seemed easier and stuff.....
Johnny Blaze
09-10-2007, 04:39 PM
has there been any decision as to the voting system this season?
i kinda preferred the win/lose version as opposed to the marks out of 10 voting....just seemed easier and stuff.....
What the hell? Somebody actually talking about the DTL in a DTL thread!? :wow:
Blasphemy! Let's lynch the bastard! :cmad:
Nightwing.
09-10-2007, 06:37 PM
ah no please i didnt realise......have mercy.........
i got confused.......i didnt realise this was an irony thread.....i thought we discussed DTL.......
*cowers in fear from large mob of lynching erm mobsters*
wiegeabo
09-10-2007, 06:55 PM
I plan to have the full list of rules posted today or tomorrow for discussion.
What the hell? Somebody actually talking about the DTL in a DTL thread!? :wow:
Blasphemy! Let's lynch the bastard! :cmad:
You're the retard who was so keen on RI jokes every time I tried to make discussion in here, you son of a *****.
XFanTim
09-11-2007, 12:28 AM
One other suggestion to add to mine from the last page: I still think some tweaking could be made with regard to the uber bar. In particular, I think it would be better to ditch the "do everything" characters. I feel like that would make more room for people to use some of the more interesting lower-level ubers. E.g., why use Magneto (manipulates metal and electormagnetism) if you can use the Silver Surfer (manipulates all forms of energy, transmutes matter, super fast, super durable, etc., etc., etc.) For that matter, why ever use someone like the Hulk, when the Surfer or Quasar or any other energy manipulator can just suck the gamma-energy right out of him?
The top-level mages are the worst offenders, because they can literally do just about anything, and their power levels tend to fluctuate severely between appearances. Dr. Strange is the quintessential example -- at times he's destroyed a star, beaten Galactus, stood up to Adam Warlock with the Infinity Gauntlet, etc., and at other times he's been knocked out by a miscellaneous minor demon. I've even seen him KOed by an Asgardian troll. (Technically, I guess the trolls are from Jotunheim, but whatever.) Mages also tend to make for particularly uninteresting strategy -- how often have we just seen two people throw their uber mages against each other and let them at each other?
I might suggest just ditching the uber mages altogether, maybe categorizing the remaining ubers into two levels -- high ubers and low ubers. High ubers would be Silver Surfer, Quasar, maybe the Green Lanterns, etc. Low ubers would be characters that, while still powerful, have a more limited array of abilities, like Magneto, or the Hulk, or even Superman. I'd say if someone wants to use a High uber, then they have to fill their other uber spot with a medium. So for instance one person's uber spots might look like:
Silver Surfer (High Uber)
Vision (Medium)
while the other's might be:
Magneto (Low Uber)
Juggernaut (Low Uber)
The advantages of this are:
(1) You can use a wider range of uber characters and still have decent matchups (i.e., you don't have to just go with the most ridiculously overpowered character that you can find)
(2) You can use more than one medium without getting trounced (since you have the high-uber to make up for it)
I'd say anything that lets you use a wider variety of characters in your lineup while still keeping the matches well-balanced can only make things more varied and more fun.
While I'm suggesting tweaks to the usage of ubers, what about a rule that says your ubers can't attack lower level characters before finishing off the opposing ubers, unless the lower level people attack them first? My reasoning is that there's really no good reason an uber speedster, or telepath, or even energy projector shouldn't just annihilate all the opposing regs in the first five seconds. (Other than B.S. psychic shields and whatnot -- how many times have you actually seen a psi just grant total telepathic immunity to all their teammates? If that actually worked, the X-Men wouldn't have any telepathic enemies.)
By the way, I also think company restrictions should be done away with (or did we do this already?) There's always going to be plenty of characters from both Marvel and DC in the league, since everyone wants to find the best characters. But if someone wants to use an all-Marvel lineup one week, why not let them? I'd say greater lineup flexibility can only lead to more varied matches. Plus it lets people who know one company much better than the other still participate.
TheCorpulent1
09-11-2007, 07:16 AM
While I enjoy mages, I wouldn't mind getting rid of them. They really are the easiest characters in the game to use. Get an uber mage and you've got a guy who can take on any other uber, set up psi-shields, set up various other protections, teleport, etc.
AnnoyingSilence
09-11-2007, 12:42 PM
i wouldn't be broken hearted
Nightwing.
09-11-2007, 12:43 PM
i agree...they have forsight etc to help with preptime,they can move people to locations for their advantage,the list is endless...its best for people to make use of the surroundings and situations their characters are presented with rather than them thinking 'oh i could lose this so ill move them to a place where they are about as harmful as a pile of teddy bears and then kick their arse with the uttering of a word and make it look like i won the battle for all mwah ha ha ha' that was a bit OTT i know but you get the general idea surely
AnnoyingSilence
09-11-2007, 12:47 PM
can i just mind control zatanna and say "cigam erom on"?
wiegeabo
09-11-2007, 01:12 PM
Whoa, two posts by Tim in a week?! :p
We are going to have shorter writeups this season. Owners are allowed to tell stories for prep-time like before. But with the understanding that readers can skip prep-time if needed. As for battles, they need to be kept down in size, focusing more on strategies than storytelling.
As for getting rid of, or splitting off, top-tier ubers, I see the argument. But creating a mid-uber bar (for lack of a better term) will just create another set of arguments over which characters are above and below. Maybe that's good, maybe that's bad.
And getting rid of the uber ubers (uubers?) Something just seems wrong about not being able to play classic characters like the Surfer, or Dr. Fate. Heck, even Flash and Superman probably fall into that category. Well, maybe not Superman, but Hyperion feasibly could.
Johnny Blaze
09-11-2007, 01:42 PM
You're the retard who was so keen on RI jokes every time I tried to make discussion in here, you son of a *****.
****in' A right! Bring back the funny to this thread!
TheCorpulent1
09-11-2007, 02:05 PM
Whoa, two posts by Tim in a week?! :p
We are going to have shorter writeups this season. Owners are allowed to tell stories for prep-time like before. But with the understanding that readers can skip prep-time if needed. As for battles, they need to be kept down in size, focusing more on strategies than storytelling.
As for getting rid of, or splitting off, top-tier ubers, I see the argument. But creating a mid-uber bar (for lack of a better term) will just create another set of arguments over which characters are above and below. Maybe that's good, maybe that's bad.
And getting rid of the uber ubers (uubers?) Something just seems wrong about not being able to play classic characters like the Surfer, or Dr. Fate. Heck, even Flash and Superman probably fall into that category. Well, maybe not Superman, but Hyperion feasibly could.
Whoa, the Flash can't furnish his entire team with psychic protection or override physics on a whim. Well, sometimes the latter, but it takes considerably more effort than it would for a mage. The Surfer's problematic because he basically can do all the things a mage could. I guess if we took out mages, it'd be fair to take him out, too. Same with Thanos. Meh, I'm sure they'll all wind up staying in after all, since people really like a lot of the higher-tier ubers.
wiegeabo
09-11-2007, 02:37 PM
Whoa, the Flash can't furnish his entire team with psychic protection or override physics on a whim. Well, sometimes the latter, but it takes considerably more effort than it would for a mage. The Surfer's problematic because he basically can do all the things a mage could. I guess if we took out mages, it'd be fair to take him out, too. Same with Thanos. Meh, I'm sure they'll all wind up staying in after all, since people really like a lot of the higher-tier ubers.
But the Flash should be able to take out the entire opposing team in the blink of an eye. Literally.
Unless the other side happens to have their own speedster, or powerful mage, or other such protection. Which is where the strategy comes in using characters to counter characters.
It's a tough problem.
TheCorpulent1
09-11-2007, 03:16 PM
Eh, I suppose. I always have magic protection of some form anyway.
As for getting rid of, or splitting off, top-tier ubers, I see the argument. But creating a mid-uber bar (for lack of a better term) will just create another set of arguments over which characters are above and below. Maybe that's good, maybe that's bad.
I think a complete "set" of arguements along with radical changes are the only things that are going to make the DTL viable and keep it alive.
Even if someone's an amazing writer and they come up with some great stretegy, if they're using the Hulk and the Juggernaut vs. Dr. Strange and Dr. Fate (Who didn't get the benefit of a good right up) the brick team is still going to be on some levels sold short simply because of who they are.
Honestly, I think the entire driving point of the DTL should be brains over brawn. We should have to think about these things and come up with interesting solutions to win. This should not be a course in writing novels nor should it be "My ubers more powerful, the end".
I think Tim's ideas are by and far perfect for what we need to do. Half of the ubers shouldn't be at huge disadvantages and basically broken as usable character because they're pure bricks. They have their places too but not in the current climate where it's all power and variety. Green Lantern's and The Martian Manhunter are desirable and there's really no other way about it.
TheCorpulent1
09-11-2007, 04:00 PM
But some characters are just naturally at a disadvantage. A purely strength-driven powerhouse really wouldn't logically be able to do much against a full-on mage like Strange or Fate. The only thing a bruiser could do is punch the mages into submission, and it'd be a massive disservice to the mages if someone allowed that to happen.
Also, seperating ubers into different categories would promote, by and far, healthy discussion if anything. And it really wouldn't be that difficult.
Green Lantern's? Those ring make them high ubers due to their versatility and raw power.
Herald's are Marvel's Green Lantern's in setting and powers, so, once again, high ubers.
Bricks such as the Hulk, The Juggernaut, Drax, The Champion, Hercules... Their power makes them uber BUT their lack of versatility and scope makes them "low" ubers.
Tim's idea of ubers facing ubers is a perfect one too.
How many times do write-up's consist of one teams ubers destroying the others regulars in five seconds flat and then cleaning up the remaining ubers?
That's taking power into account and nothing but, and cheapening the entire game in the process. Not strategy, not cleverness, no regulars getting to shine against other regulars.
We should have a rule pertaining to high end characters fighting one another, while regulars would have the option to attack ubers.
But some characters are just naturally at a disadvantage. A purely strength-driven powerhouse really wouldn't logically be able to do much against a full-on mage like Strange or Fate. The only thing a bruiser could do is punch the mages into submission, and it'd be a massive disservice to the mages if someone allowed that to happen.
And that's why two low ubers would face off against a high end and a medium. You saw Tim's example, correct?
Silver Surfer (High Uber)
Vision (Medium)
while the other's might be:
Magneto (Low Uber)
Juggernaut (Low Uber)
Juggernaut's laid out Strange physically before, as have other bricks. What would stop, say, Magneto from keeping Strange busy while the Juggernaut physically takes Strange out with one or two punches? There are a lot of possibilities there.
It's strategy, no disservice needed.
wiegeabo
09-11-2007, 05:08 PM
Here's a current set of rules and potentials for discussion. I've bolded changes I've decided to include this season. I've tried to include things we already discussed, but there was a lot, and I've missed some. Everything is still up for discussion, but I'd like to have all the rules finalized by this weekend.
Proposed Season 5 rules:
Teams are divided into two conferences; Timely and National. And within each conference are two divisions; Latveria and Wakanda in the Timely Conference, Metropolis and Gotham in the National Conference. This structure can be changed based on the number of teams participating.
Teams can have co-owners. But no more than two owners to a team. And only the owner who writes the battle may debate. If both owners write a battle, they must choose which one will do the debating.
Each team is made up of 12 characters drawn from the Marvel, DC, and Wildstorm universes. No Amaglams. Only 5 characters at a time are in a lineup during any given match. (The other 5 characters are on the bench.) Characters from alternate timelines, different points in time, What-if's, and Elseworlds are also allowed.
Characters are broken up into 3 groups by general power levels: Uber, Middleweight, and Regular. Uber characters include Superman, Apocalypse, Flash, and Thor. Middleweight characters include Captain Britain, Aquaman, Vision, and Sand. Regular characters include Spider-Man, Batman, Captain America, and Plastic Man.
Characters deemed too uber (or tuber) are banned from competition. Character rankings can be argued by owners, but the actual ranking of a character as Tuber, Uber, Middleweight, or Regular is at the sole discretion of the commissioner.
No more than two versions of any character can be used in the league at the same time. Having the same secret identity does not necessarily count as being the same character. Green Lantern (Hal Jordan) and Green Lantern (Alan Scott) do not count as the same character. But Hulk and Maestro would since they are both Bruce Banner at different points in time.
A lineup of 5 characters must have at least two characters from different universes. A lineup can have, at most, two ubers, one middleweight, and two regulars. Characters in a lineup can be downgraded (e.g. a middleweight can be used instead of an uber, a regular can be used instead of a middleweight or an uber).
During the course of the season, an owner must use at least 12 different characters in matches.
A new match will run each week. Final lineups for matches are due by midnight, Wednesday (PST). Lineups can be posted and changed anytime before the deadline. If a lineup is changed at the last minute, the opposing owner will have one chance to change their lineups in response.
Matches will start on Thursday and run until midnight, Sunday (PST). During this time only team owners can post their battles and debates. Battles should be straightforward and condensed descriptions as to what will happen to save reading and writing time. Prep-time can still consist of story type writing since that part of the battle can be skimmed or skipped by voters with little time, with little to no effect on the match.
Voting starts Monday and ends Tuesday at midnight (PST). Voters will vote for the team they think will win the match. The team with the most votes wins.
A match consists of a battle between the two teams in a preselected battleground. All teams are considered to have 24 hours of prep-time before the match starts. Teams can only use resources to which those characters in the lineup would normally have access in order to prepare. No person outside of the lineups (on the team, or otherwise) can be used as a resource. Teams can visit and prepare the battleground ahead of time.
During battle, the goal of the match is to incapacitate the other team. This includes knocking out an opposing character, eliminating them from the match or field of battle, making them unable to fight, or killing them. Characters should not act out of character (heroes generally do not kill). Characters are allowed to remember previous matches, but are not allowed to remember deaths, even their own. This eliminates the tactic of a character 'blowing themselves up' without reason, just to take out the other team because they know they'll come back to life. Characters should react as in-character as possible to their teams, and not necessarily get along just because they are in a tournament. Mortal enemies on the same team will not necessarily work well together. Characters cannot remember previous seasons.
A bye week will be provided at mid-season and between the regular and post-seasons. No matches take place on a bye week to allow owners time to rest. All non-match activities like roster and lineups changes are still allowed.
At random times during a season, a theme week may be declared. Theme weeks do various things like change rules or alter how battles take place. Based on their nature, some themes will be announced ahead of times. Others will not be announced until the matches are posted. Theme weeks will only appear in 10%-20% of the weeks.
Characters on a team can be changed at any time before lineups are due. Changes made after this time will be reflected on the next week's matches. Swapping a character for another that is unowned is done on a first-come, first-serve basis. The first owner to request a character will get them.
Owners are allowed to trade characters with owners of other teams, but both owners must agree on the trade and post the trade. Owners can also put a character on the trading block if they are willing to trade them away and want to listen to trade offers.
All character changes, trades, and lineup posts should be made in the DTL Transactions thread. All DTL and general discussion should be made in the DTL Discussion thread.
The DTL Update thread will have posts describing the current status of the season including rosters, lineups, matches, and records.
The commissioner may appoint lieutenants to help run the league, make decisions, keep track of changes, and make sure things are updated. But the commissioner's decisions are final.
And I am the commissioner. ;)
Season 5 rule suggestions:
Characters as they appear in currently ongoing storylines (as of the start of season 5) cannot be used. The latest version of a character that can be used is as they were before the ongoing storyline began.
A new category for character between tuber and uber called Super-Uber, or suber. Characters like Thanos and Despero, who would otherwise likely be tubers, would fit in this category. One suber counts as two ubers, so anyone using a suber would only be allowed a 4-man lineup.
Battlefield prep-time where the battlefield can be prepared during this time period, but neither team can interact with the other, nor can they leave the area. Resources are limited to what the characters in the match know, have on them, or can use/build in the battlefield. If the battlefield provides a character a way to access additional resources, that is allowed as long as it would be normally accessible to the character.
A trading deadline, after which no more trading of characters between
teams is allowed.
Some type of minimum appearance rule to establish that a character is fleshed out.
Looks good by and far, but Plastic Man a regular? The Fernus fighting Plastic Man?
He's a high end MW at least.
Anyway, what do you think of the stuff going on in the other DTL thread, Wieg?
And who's going to take care of the update thread as of now?
wiegeabo
09-11-2007, 05:15 PM
And who's going to take care of the update thread as of now?
That reminds me.
They'll be a new update thread. I'm going to create the DTLCommish identity that me and the lieutenants will all be able to use. That way anyone of us can make changes to any part of the update thread at any time.
Tropico
09-11-2007, 06:25 PM
Outsiders can vote. Cool!:woot::up:
That reminds me.
They'll be a new update thread. I'm going to create the DTLCommish identity that me and the lieutenants will all be able to use. That way anyone of us can make changes to any part of the update thread at any time.
Ah, sounds like a plan.
XFanTim
09-11-2007, 10:24 PM
Whoa, two posts by Tim in a week?! :p
Yeah, I'm posting with reckless abandon! :woot:
As for getting rid of, or splitting off, top-tier ubers, I see the argument. But creating a mid-uber bar (for lack of a better term) will just create another set of arguments over which characters are above and below. Maybe that's good, maybe that's bad.I don't think it would be too much trouble. For one thing, a lot of the popular ubers fall readily into categories. So we only have to rank the Flash-type speedsters once, we only have to rank the Superman-type characters once, we only have to rank the GLs once, etc.
And getting rid of the uber ubers (uubers?) Something just seems wrong about not being able to play classic characters like the Surfer, or Dr. Fate. Heck, even Flash and Superman probably fall into that category. Well, maybe not Superman, but Hyperion feasibly could.I think we should mainly judge on range of powers. All ubers are powerful, but while Superman's basic powers are just strength/speed/flight/durability, Surfer has all that plus matter transmutation and energy manipulation. To me, Superman is a clear cut low uber, and Surfer is a clear cut high uber.
But the Flash should be able to take out the entire opposing team in the blink of an eye. Literally. Unless the other side happens to have their own speedster, or powerful mage, or other such protection. Which is where the strategy comes in using characters to counter characters.This is where my other suggestion comes in: not letting ubers attack non-ubers unless (1) They're attacked first, or (2) They've already finished off the opposing ubers. That way, you don't need a mage to "give everyone psi-shields" (which is lame anyway) whenever you face an uber-psi -- you just need to have an uber who can beat that psi. Say, a brick with good psi-defence, like Juggernaut.
I really think this would lead to more interesting matchups and more creative strategies, rather than just the same "My mage makes all my characters immune to your uber's power."
A new category for character between tuber and uber called Super-Uber, or suber. Characters like Thanos and Despero, who would otherwise likely be tubers, would fit in this category. One suber counts as two ubers, so anyone using a suber would only be allowed a 4-man lineup.
I think if someone is so powerful that you have to completely leave off another uber to make it even, then they should just be called too uber. I still like the idea of high uber + medium = low uber + low uber. Plus, I really like the idea of people being able to have two mediums in their lineup without putting themselves at a huge disadvantage. In my opinion, the mediums have some of the most interesting powers, and it's a shame that they're the least represented in the battles.
XFanTim
09-11-2007, 11:16 PM
With regard to the uber mages, I think they're do-everything characters to an even more ridiculous degree than the heralds. Sure, you can find obscure cases where the Surfer has used his powers to do all sorts of things, but most of the time, his powerset is pretty consistent. He's durable, he's fast, he's strong, he flies, he controls his board, he fires energy blasts, he absorbs and transforms energy, he transmutes matter. That's a lot, but you still wouldn't expect him to, say, pull a Galactus-beating power out of his ass like Strange did (he used a spell to make Galactus feel all the pain he'd caused). With the mages, there's really nothing that's out of character. Plus they get used in the lamest ways (I'll give all my characters superspeed, I'll make them all immune to telpathy, etc.) when as I've said above a few simple rules changes would eliminate the need.
Anyway, here are some tentative rankings of most of the ubers into low uber (luber?) and high uber (huber?)
**Mages** (probably tuber)
Dr. Strange
Dr. Fate
Loki
Mordru
The Ancient One
Shanzar
Krugarr
Karnilla
Atlan
Zatanna
[Zatanna maybe could be a huber, if the rule is (1) she must speak to use her power, and (2) she can't "power up" before the fight, e.g. "elbicnivni em ekaM". With those restrictions she'd be vulnerable to a speedster, for instance.]
**Herald-type** [high uber]
Silver Surfer
Morg
Quasar
Green Lantern (any version)
*** Psionics *** [low uber]
Cable (Burn Offering)
Cassandra Nova
Exodus
Stryfe
*** Speedsters *** [low uber]
Flash (any version)
Savitar
Zoom
[The only reason they'd be high uber is if they're allowed to speedblitz the regs. Which they shouldn't be.]
***Bricks*** [low uber]
Hulk
Maestro
Juggernaut
The General
Lobo
***Psi-Bricks*** [high uber]
Despero
Fernus the Burning
Martian Manhunter
Doomsday-Brainiac
Xavier-Juggernaut
(Some, like Despero, might even be tuber, depending on what portrayal we're using. You could make a case for MM as luber, with the fire weakness. Maybe Xavier-Juggernaut too, since he has no superspeed, no flight, etc. He's arguably weaker than MM -- Jugs has comparable psi and more durability, but without shapeshifting, speed, intangibility, flight, etc.)
*** Superman-type *** [low uber]
Superman
Gladiator
Hyperion
Bizarro
Captain Marvel (DC)
Black Adam
Samaritan
Wonder Woman
[Not all of these are [i]exactly Superman-type, but they're all mainly speed/strength/durability/flight characters -- so all are luber. Again, assuming they can't speed-blitz the regs.]
*** Misc. ***
Darkseid [At least huber if he's got the old-school unstoppable omega effect]
Thanos [huber: Thor-level bruiser with beyond Doom-level brains and tech]
Nebulon [A tough match for the Defenders -- he's at least huber]
Captain Marvel (Insane Genis-Vell) [huber]
Black Alice [huber]
Android Hourman [huber]
Adam Warlock [huber -- his attack is too unstoppable]
Warlock (Jaine) [huber]
Paragon [huber -- he has weaknesses, but can go one-on-one with most hubers]
Thor [luber -- assuming no superspeed. I know he has gone toe-to-toe with characters with superspeed, but in the comics a lot of characters stupidly don't use their superspeed all the time -- whereas DTL writers generally push their characters to the max.]
Beta Ray Bill [luber -- same reason]
Nimrod [luber]
Magneto [luber]
Iron Man [luber]
A few others I didn't bother to rank:
Stellaris
Captain Atom
Vartox
High Evolutionary
Protex
Parasite
Dr. Light
Firestorm
Maxima
Malefic
Sersi
Space Phantom
That's basically all the ubers, excepting minor variations for which the ranking is obvious. (E.g., Dr. Doom w/ Power Cosmic is obviously ranked like Silver Surfer. Dr. Doom Sorcerer Supreme is ranked like Dr. Strange. Etc.)
Nightwing.
09-12-2007, 11:07 AM
Outsiders can vote. Cool!:woot::up:
outsiders voting?wouldnt that be unfair?it happened last time and there was uproar if im not mistaken due to the fact that people were rallying around their friends to vote for them...surely it should just stay within the DTL'ers.
LadyVader
09-12-2007, 12:14 PM
Friends? People form friendships on Hype? Since when are we so civil to each other? :)
wiegeabo
09-12-2007, 02:36 PM
Actually, I'm support outside participation. Not only can it lead to more discussion during open debate time, and in this thread, but if anyone needs to leave, we're more likely to have a replacement. It can also help keep participation up during the end of the season/playoffs when votes tend to die down. (Even though pride should be enough to motivate everyone to try and win every game. :mad: :()
Now, any kind of iffy voting or favoritism will bring down my ultimate wrath! :mad:
(yeah, that just means their votes wouldn't count)
Tim's basically nailed everything perfectly.
He should more or less be running this thing. :(
Tropico
09-12-2007, 06:51 PM
Actually, I'm support outside participation. Not only can it lead to more discussion during open debate time, and in this thread, but if anyone needs to leave, we're more likely to have a replacement. It can also help keep participation up during the end of the season/playoffs when votes tend to die down. (Even though pride should be enough to motivate everyone to try and win every game. :mad: :()
Now, any kind of iffy voting or favoritism will bring down my ultimate wrath! :mad:
(yeah, that just means their votes wouldn't count)
Yup, that's how I got into the DTL in the first place. Of course, the "you have to vote in every thread" rule should always be enforced. People really brought in other people just to get votes for themselves? That's pretty pathetic. Anyway, if it's decided that it should be owners only, that's ok, too. I'll probably still look around and read for a bit.
trustyside-kick
09-12-2007, 10:00 PM
I'm curious as to what this DTL stuff is exactly. It kind of confuses me, even though a few times JB and wieg have tried doing so.
wiegeabo
09-12-2007, 10:07 PM
I know it's a bit to read, but see if these rules make sense to you. And let me know what doesn't make sense (because I want to make them as clear as possible.
The gist of the game is that owners put together teams of characters and write about how they would beat the team they are facing that week.
Proposed Season 5 rules:
Teams are divided into two conferences; Timely and National. And within each conference are two divisions; Latveria and Wakanda in the Timely Conference, Metropolis and Gotham in the National Conference. This structure can be changed based on the number of teams participating.
Teams can have co-owners. But no more than two owners to a team. And only the owner who writes the battle may debate. If both owners write a battle, they must choose which one will do the debating.
Each team is made up of 12 characters drawn from the Marvel, DC, and Wildstorm universes. No Amaglams. Only 5 characters at a time are in a lineup during any given match. (The other 5 characters are on the bench.) Characters from alternate timelines, different points in time, What-if's, and Elseworlds are also allowed.
Characters are broken up into 3 groups by general power levels: Uber, Middleweight, and Regular. Uber characters include Superman, Apocalypse, Flash, and Thor. Middleweight characters include Captain Britain, Aquaman, Vision, and Sand. Regular characters include Spider-Man, Batman, Captain America, and Plastic Man.
Characters deemed too uber (or tuber) are banned from competition. Character rankings can be argued by owners, but the actual ranking of a character as Tuber, Uber, Middleweight, or Regular is at the sole discretion of the commissioner.
No more than two versions of any character can be used in the league at the same time. Having the same secret identity does not necessarily count as being the same character. Green Lantern (Hal Jordan) and Green Lantern (Alan Scott) do not count as the same character. But Hulk and Maestro would since they are both Bruce Banner at different points in time.
A lineup of 5 characters must have at least two characters from different universes. A lineup can have, at most, two ubers, one middleweight, and two regulars. Characters in a lineup can be downgraded (e.g. a middleweight can be used instead of an uber, a regular can be used instead of a middleweight or an uber).
During the course of the season, an owner must use at least 12 different characters in matches.
A new match will run each week. Final lineups for matches are due by midnight, Wednesday (PST). Lineups can be posted and changed anytime before the deadline. If a lineup is changed at the last minute, the opposing owner will have one chance to change their lineups in response.
Matches will start on Thursday and run until midnight, Sunday (PST). During this time only team owners can post their battles and debates. Battles should be straightforward and condensed descriptions as to what will happen to save reading and writing time. Prep-time can still consist of story type writing since that part of the battle can be skimmed or skipped by voters with little time, with little to no effect on the match.
Voting starts Monday and ends Tuesday at midnight (PST). Voters will vote for the team they think will win the match. The team with the most votes wins.
A match consists of a battle between the two teams in a preselected battleground. All teams are considered to have 24 hours of prep-time before the match starts. Teams can only use resources to which those characters in the lineup would normally have access in order to prepare. No person outside of the lineups (on the team, or otherwise) can be used as a resource. Teams can visit and prepare the battleground ahead of time.
During battle, the goal of the match is to incapacitate the other team. This includes knocking out an opposing character, eliminating them from the match or field of battle, making them unable to fight, or killing them. Characters should not act out of character (heroes generally do not kill). Characters are allowed to remember previous matches, but are not allowed to remember deaths, even their own. This eliminates the tactic of a character 'blowing themselves up' without reason, just to take out the other team because they know they'll come back to life. Characters should react as in-character as possible to their teams, and not necessarily get along just because they are in a tournament. Mortal enemies on the same team will not necessarily work well together. Characters cannot remember previous seasons.
A bye week will be provided at mid-season and between the regular and post-seasons. No matches take place on a bye week to allow owners time to rest. All non-match activities like roster and lineups changes are still allowed.
At random times during a season, a theme week may be declared. Theme weeks do various things like change rules or alter how battles take place. Based on their nature, some themes will be announced ahead of times. Others will not be announced until the matches are posted. Theme weeks will only appear in 10%-20% of the weeks.
Characters on a team can be changed at any time before lineups are due. Changes made after this time will be reflected on the next week's matches. Swapping a character for another that is unowned is done on a first-come, first-serve basis. The first owner to request a character will get them.
Owners are allowed to trade characters with owners of other teams, but both owners must agree on the trade and post the trade. Owners can also put a character on the trading block if they are willing to trade them away and want to listen to trade offers.
All character changes, trades, and lineup posts should be made in the DTL Transactions thread. All DTL and general discussion should be made in the DTL Discussion thread.
The DTL Update thread will have posts describing the current status of the season including rosters, lineups, matches, and records.
The commissioner may appoint lieutenants to help run the league, make decisions, keep track of changes, and make sure things are updated. But the commissioner's decisions are final.
And I am the commissioner.
Season 5 rule suggestions:
Characters as they appear in currently ongoing storylines (as of the start of season 5) cannot be used. The latest version of a character that can be used is as they were before the ongoing storyline began.
A new category for character between tuber and uber called Super-Uber, or suber. Characters like Thanos and Despero, who would otherwise likely be tubers, would fit in this category. One suber counts as two ubers, so anyone using a suber would only be allowed a 4-man lineup.
Battlefield prep-time where the battlefield can be prepared during this time period, but neither team can interact with the other, nor can they leave the area. Resources are limited to what the characters in the match know, have on them, or can use/build in the battlefield. If the battlefield provides a character a way to access additional resources, that is allowed as long as it would be normally accessible to the character.
A trading deadline, after which no more trading of characters between
teams is allowed.
Some type of minimum appearance rule to establish that a character is fleshed out.
trustyside-kick
09-12-2007, 10:21 PM
But how do you decide who gets to get what characters? Obviously a lot of people may request the same ones pretty often.
wiegeabo
09-12-2007, 10:23 PM
But how do you decide who gets to get what characters? Obviously a lot of people may request the same ones pretty often.
Initially there's going to be a draft (just like a draft in fantasy football) where owners get available characters in the order they listed them as we go down the list of owners.
Aterwards, owners can add and drop characters on a first come, first serve basis. Or they can trade characters they own for characters other owners have.
Once we hit the playoffs, all character changes stop. And owners must use 12 different character during the year (to make sure all characters get used and they're not just hording).
trustyside-kick
09-12-2007, 10:30 PM
wieg, can you get on AIM so it will be easier understanding this? I've never played fantasy football, but I've heard about it; so the references aren't helping.
wiegeabo
09-12-2007, 10:38 PM
I've also been mulling over the idea of splitting up ubers into uber and uber ubers (or uubers or super ubers or subers, or whatever we call them).
I'm just wondering if there's a difference between using a high uber and middle as opposed to the original idea of using one super uber in place of two ubers. I mean, I know there's a difference, but is it significant enough? Or is either idea any better than the other.
I'm not for or against yet, I'd just like to see what some other owners think.
And, I want to be clear to everyone that if you are going to own a team, you have to be willing to commit to staying active and putting out a writeup every week. We have a rule, which it looks like I left out of all the others, about participation.
Basically, missing a week, or maybe even two, because of real life getting in the way is likely going to happen to someone. As the schedule looks now, there's only going to be 10 weeks of matches before playoffs, and missing just two games can cripple your odds of getting into the playoffs (unless you're already dominating the league). So if you miss, say, three weeks during the season, I'll have to make your team available to anyone who wants to take it over, first one who wants it gets is. If you claim your team first, you can have it back. But real life better not get in the way again, or I'll have to give it to someone else for the remainder of the season (because real life should always take precedence).
That's how I'm thinking the rule will go. Now, after week 5, we'll have a bye week. Taking that week off gives everyone a chance to rest a bit and focus on real life again. We'll also have another bye week right before the playoffs (unless it will hinder participation and voting).
wiegeabo
09-12-2007, 10:38 PM
wieg, can you get on AIM so it will be easier understanding this? I've never played fantasy football, but I've heard about it; so the references aren't helping.
No prob. I'll be on in a little while.
trustyside-kick
09-12-2007, 10:55 PM
No prob. I'll be on in a little while.
Actually, no need to anymore.
Been talking to JB and after a while I realized I may not be able to commit. Also, even if I were it would be best to first check it out from the outsider's point of view to learn more through it actually happening.
So I guess I'll just speculate and vote so I understand it more.
wiegeabo
09-12-2007, 11:16 PM
Participation in any form is welcome. Having another voter is always good. And non-owners are allowed to discuss everything in the threads just like anyone else.
Nightwing.
09-13-2007, 01:24 PM
the super ubers thing i think is a bit too much at this point....maybe later in the season the last thing we want is mass conflict and arguements and people walking out before we start.but yeah maybe a suber rank would be good or rather what we could do is for one week each person picks one suber each and its just a one on one of how they would win.no other characters involved....
or what you could do is if a suber rank is made make a rule that they can only take out ubers and subers.....cos otherwise they could plow through 2 regs and a med just like that....which could make a very interesting tactic esp if someone has a suber picked and their opponent has a full team of regs.....that suber would be pretty much unusable but destroyable which would make people really think hard about who they use each week and not expect their suber to automatically win every match up for them.....
does that make sense at all?
I wouldn't see the problem delaying the start of the season a few weeks to figure something out that could very well make the entire league work a lot better.
We'd have our characters, and the game isn't going to go anywhere if we wait a week or two.
I'd rather delay it then halfass anything, anyway.
Anyway, has any thought been given to any of Tim's ideas?
XFanTim
09-13-2007, 07:03 PM
I'm just wondering if there's a difference between using a high uber and middle as opposed to the original idea of using one super uber in place of two ubers. I mean, I know there's a difference, but is it significant enough? Or is either idea any better than the other.
I think it's clear which version I support, but let me try to spell out why I think there's a difference:
In my mind the question is this:
Do we want to include more characters from the top of the uber level, or more from the bottom.
I think the SuperUber = 2 Ubers proposal will lead to more top-level ubers being used (i.e., ones that are near the uber/tuber threshold), whereas the HighUber + Medium = Low Uber + Low Uber proposal will lead to more low-level ubers being used (i.e., ones near the uber/medium threshold).
In Part 1 below, I explain why I believe these two proposals will have such different effects, while in Part 2 I explain why I think one of those effects preferable.
Part 1: Why the two proposals have different effects
Subsection A: The SuperUber = 2 Uber proposal
For starters, we have to draw a line between SuperUber and Uber. Let's say we identify Superman and the Flash as standard ubers. That seems reasonable, right? I mean, they're clearly not as high up the totem pole as, say, Dr. Strange or the Silver Surfer. But then, is Green Lantern a SuperUber? Would you really say Green Lantern vs. Superman and Flash is a fair fight? (Picture Superman with his speed plus everything Flash can lend him, pummeling GL's shields with a billion superstrength-enhanced infinite mass punches before Kyle or whoever can think to mount a defense.) So OK, let's call the Green Lanterns standard ubers too. But that means the SuperUbers have to be able to take on two GLs. Would even a herald like Morg be up to beating Kyle and Hal simultaneously? Or, say, beating a GL and a Flash (Flash stealing his speed while GL pounds the crap out of him?)
My point is, the only way one character can hope to beat two standard uber's is if that character is extremely powerful, at least on the level of Silver Surfer if not higher. So clearly the player using a SuperUber is going to be picking someone incredibly strong. And the player who has to face them is going to need two solid ubers like Flash or Green Lantern. Only a complete idiot would take on the Surfer with a couple low-level ubers like Magneto and Apocalypse.
So clearly Proposal A can lead to more top level ubers in use, but not a lot more low-level ubers in use. Whether this is good or bad I'll adress in Part 2, but first let's turn to Proposal B.
Subsection B: The High Uber + Medium = Low Uber + Low Uber proposal
As I pointed out in the previous section, a SuperUber must be ridiculously powerful to take on two ubers by himself. But a High Uber who gets the help of a Medium won't need to be as powerful in order to take on two ubers. So we can include people like Green Lantern as a High Uber under this proposal, even though he would make a fairly weak SuperUber under the other proposal.
But having weaker characters as High Ubers means more people will feel like they can get away with using lower level ubers. As I said above, you'd be nuts to use, say Magneto (who controls electromagnetic energy) and Apocalypse (who controls his own molecules) against Silver Surfer (who controls all energy and all molecules, not to mention being super strong/fast/durable). But Suppose you had a matchup like this:
Green Lantern
medium
medium
reg
reg
vs.
Apocalypse
Magneto
Medium
Reg
Reg
GL is more beatable than Surfer, because underneath his shields and other powers he's still a human with human vulnerablities. Apocalypse could beat a med. and a reg. by himself (he's beaten multiple X-Men plenty of times, and they have some pretty solid mediums like Storm or Polaris). That means at least one of your regs would be free to help Magneto fight GL. And if that reg is someone like Vertigo or Mastermind, they might be able to disorient GL or confuse him with illusions for a second or two, which is all Magneto would need to form the iron in his blood into a clot. Boom, instant stroke. (Note that this would never work against Surfer or Thanos, because even if a low level character can create an opening, Magneto just doesn't have the firepower to take them down.)
So, to summarize: Giving a High Uber a Medium-level partner means that some characters get bumped up to high uber who wouldn't make SuperUber under the other proposal. The weaker high ubers give people more hope to pull off an upset using two low-level ubers, so that means more low-level ubers get used. But let's not forget that the inclusion of a second medium on the high-uber's team means that more top-level mediums are getting used as well.
Additionally, the fact that the high uber gets a medium-level partner means that we probably won't be tempted to allow in any of the too ubers who really are better off staying too uber.
Part 2: OK, so the proposals will have different results. But which is better?
In Part 1, I argued that Proposal A (SuperUber = Uber + Uber) will lead to more characters near the uber/too-uber threshold being used, but not a lot more characters near the medium/uber threshold. Proposal B has the opposite effect, making it feasible to use more mediums and low-level ubers. OK, but which is better?
I guess that depends on what direction we want the DTL to go in. I'd say either of the following would be improvements:
(1) More creative strategies
(2) More variety of characters used
Having a character like Silver Surfer who can basically do anything doesn't encourage creativity. What takes creativity is having a character with clear limitations find ways to work around them. Likewise, it takes creativity to find a way for a weaker character to beat a stronger one. "How do I beat Green Lantern or Superman using Magneto's set of powers?" is an interesting question. "How do I beat Green Lantern or Superman using Silver Surfer's set of powers" is obvious. Clearly, weaker ubers require more creativity.
As for variety, this is also better served by the proposal which favors the use of low-level ubers. When you get towards the top of the uber level, the characters are less distinct (at least in terms of powers), because all of them can do pretty much anything. There's a big difference between what Magneto can do (EM energy manipulation) and what the Hulk can do (strength,regeneration). But one herald isn't much different from another, and the uber mages are virtually interchangeable. (Again, I'm talking powers, not personality, but if we're trying to make the league more about strategy and less about story-telling, the powers are what really matters.)
One of the most frustrating things about the DTL right now is that every week you're having your mage fight someone else's mage or your herald/GL fight someone else's herald/GL. There's enough of them for everyone, and they can handle any situation, so why wouldn't you use them? And here's the thing, Magneto is probably my favorite villain in all of comics, I'd love to use him in a writeup, but if my goal is to win the league I'd never waste a roster slot on him. Why would I, when I can get "Dr. Doom w/ power cosmic" and have an equally ruthless villain who can do everything Magneto does and a whole lot more. But if Magneto gets an uber partner, and Doom w/PC doesn't, suddenly Magneto is a whole lot more tempting. I still wouldn't use Magneto against Doom w/ PC, but I'd be willing to give him a try against someone like Kyle Rayner. The thing that makes Magneto tempting though is that there are ubers who are strong enough that they only deserve a medium-level partner, but still weak enough that they can fall to a low-end uber with a little creativity. Whereas no one who could potentially be beat by a low-end uber should ever be classed as on-par with two ubers all by himself.
Finally, there's the fact that this rule change would mean we'd see lots of lineups which feature two mediums. Mediums are great characters from a creative strategy standpoint -- they have very useful powers, while still having very definite limitations. (As I said above, I think limitations are good for creativity.) And this means all sorts of different options as far as teamwork, since we'd be seeing characters who never got to work together until now (except on the rare occasion when an owner willingly put himself at a disadvantage by using a medium instead of an uber).
The Bottom line: the league would be more fun if more of the diverse high-med to low-uber level characters were used, instead of just mage/herald vs. mage/herald for the umpteenth time. And I think my proposal is the best way to achieve this.
'nuff said.
XFanTim
09-13-2007, 07:39 PM
OK, maybe not quite 'nuff said. As for my other proposal (ditching the mages), I think that should be decided separately than the high/low uber vs. superuber thing, but my argument is similar:
We want more creativity.
We want more variety.
Mages don't produce variety, because there's a ton of them, and they all have basically the same powers (namely, pretty much every power you can think of). So as long as they're allowed it just means every team in the league gets their own do-anything guy.
Mages don't add creativity, because they're too versatile. When you have a character who can do anything you want, you don't need to be creative. Say you're fighting Android Hourman (who may be too uber, but whatever). With a mage, you don't have to think of a creative way around his time manipulation. You just say, "Dr. Strange uses a spell to counter Hourman's time manipulation." Because, truth be told, Dr. Strange probably does have an anti-time-manipulation spell. He's Doctor Freakin' Strange!
In the past, I've tried to defend mages. I even wrote a (ridiculously long) list of "standard mage powers", in part to try to make sure they wouldn't be banned as cheap "do everything" characters. Why? Because I knew that if I had to drop Dr. Strange, I'd need to get an uber telepath to keep my team from being mind-blasted, a Flash to keep my team from being speed-blitzed, a Living Un-Eraser to keep my team from being erased, etc., etc., etc. Whereas with Dr. Strange I could just say "I give my team telepathy shields, alter time to let them keep up with the Flash, and make them all eraser-proof!" Which has to be about the least creative strategy there ever was.
Of course, if we take my other suggestion and just say "ubers can't attack lower-levels until they've beaten the ubers, except when they're attacked first" then this whole justification for allowing mages becomes moot. Anyone who can take out all your mediums and regulars instantly should be uber, and this rule stops them from doing it. Problem solved. And if you want to have one of your ubers fight some medium, you can still do it. If you put your uber in front of an opposing medium, the med. is going to attack, and then it's on. This rule only prevents the "I kill you before you see it coming" strategy.
One more thing. I really do think these rules should be hammered out before the season starts, just because someone shouldn't be told "you can't use the Surfer and GL together anymore" or "you can't use Dr. Strange anymore" when those guys have been on their team for half the season. Better to take the time to settle it in advance. We've had enough seasons already to judge whether these rule changes are a good idea.
Now 'nuff said. :oldrazz:
wiegeabo
09-14-2007, 12:54 AM
First I'll say that I definitely won't start the season until all the big issues are worked out.
Second I'll say that if you can write that much Tim, you should be able to compete this season. :p
But a lot of good points have been brought up, and I'd like to see some others throw their voices in. There's at least a dozen of us involved in some way this season, but only a couple of us have talked this over. Let's here what some other think. I'd love to get a fresh perspective from the rookies since they don't have fours season of history to sway them.
And, along the lines of the idea Tim's thrown out there, here's a couple of others to discuss. What about getting rid of all these high-uber characters, not just the mages. Say, anyone at herald level or above who fall into that 'do everything' category. (Basically, a serious lowering of the uber bar.) The first instinct is probably to say know because some great characters would be lost. But it would force everyone to put more focus on lower ubers and even meds and regs.
Or, what about keeping the uber bar about where it is and changing the lineups so you can only have one uber, 2 meds, and 2 regs (with downgrads, of course)? That would really force owners to mix up their strategies with the lower characters.
wiegeabo
09-14-2007, 01:05 AM
I knew there was a rule I kept forgetting in the list.
Characters cannot be upgraded during the battle to the point where they become a higher class of character. So granting powers to regs if it will bump them up to med or uber, or bumping a med to an uber. The exception is if your lineup can accommodate the bump. If you take 2 ubers and 3 regs into a battle, you can bump 1 reg to middleweight. This includes power copiers and mages giving abilities.
Now maybe we should change this rule so you can't bump a character up a rank.
TheCorpulent1
09-14-2007, 07:36 AM
I don't think leaving the uber bar where it is and changing the line-ups would help. In fact, I think it'd hurt. If one owner puts a mage down as his uber, the other owner pretty much has no recourse except to a) put their own mage up or b) double-team the mage with two or more of their guys. I think you get a greater variety of strategic choices with two ubers than with two middleweights.
Frankly, if it's a real concern to more people, I wouldn't mind lowering the uber bar and losing the likes of Dr. Strange and the Silver Surfer and even Thor. Whatever makes the game more fun.
XFanTim
09-14-2007, 09:41 AM
Keeping things brief so as not to monopolize the discussion:
And, along the lines of the idea Tim's thrown out there, here's a couple of others to discuss. What about getting rid of all these high-uber characters, not just the mages. Say, anyone at herald level or above who fall into that 'do everything' category. (Basically, a serious lowering of the uber bar.) The first instinct is probably to say no because some great characters would be lost. But it would force everyone to put more focus on lower ubers and even meds and regs.If people would go for it, I think that's not a bad idea. I've thought for a while that the highest level characters are the most dull, both because they can do everything and because you end up with too many battles between characters with the same powers (which is less interesting IMO than battles between characters with different powers.) But I assumed that too many people would object to ditching all the top-level guys because it would mean parting with their favorite character (be it Thanos or Silver Surfer or whoever). If not, great.
For what it's worth, I still think Thor might be permissible with a definitive ruling that he doesn't have Superman-level superspeed, and that he can't be pumped up to Superman-level superspeed without becoming too uber. Of course, that only counts as a weakness if we're still including superspeed characters like Superman or Flash -- which means we'd still probably need a strict rule against speedblitzing the mediums and regs. (As well as psi-blitzing, teleporting them into space, etc.)
Under this system I guess Superman and Flash type characters would be top dogs . . . maybe Martian Manhunter with strict enforcement of the fire weakness.
Second I'll say that if you can write that much Tim, you should be able to compete this season. :p
Honestly, if we're serious about voting on strategy rather than who can write the greatest epic story, and if we make it so it's not "Silver Surfer vs. Silver Surfer (Earth-M)" or "Dr. Strange vs. Dr. Strange (Man-Thing)" every single week, I'd be pretty tempted.
Although my wife might kill me, given how much time I've spent on DTL in the past. :)
trustyside-kick
09-14-2007, 09:46 AM
I may not be having a team to participate, but I will be a voter.
Regardless though, I think magic users should not be allowed. There is too much potential; even if you classify them as super or tuber so there cannot be much. Magic is just too fluid to work with. There are no real boundaries ever stated for these kind of characters; say for growing tired of casting too much.
Nightwing.
09-14-2007, 10:12 AM
well i think with the mages thing there should be some boundaries set for the use of power...for instance no having them e put force fields round whole team cos thats just a cheap way out of losing,second no fore sight (which i think was a rule placed last season anyway),no teleporting them to other worlds/areas to help their chances of winning theyre just a few ideas anything else anyone can think of spellswise?
its cool to see the old win/lose voting is in play again this season.just wondering though....how is the 12 character line ups gonna work?is it 4 of each rank in the team?
wiegeabo
09-14-2007, 10:26 AM
well i think with the mages thing there should be some boundaries set for the use of power...for instance no having them e put force fields round whole team cos thats just a cheap way out of losing,second no fore sight (which i think was a rule placed last season anyway),no teleporting them to other worlds/areas to help their chances of winning theyre just a few ideas anything else anyone can think of spellswise?
its cool to see the old win/lose voting is in play again this season.just wondering though....how is the 12 character line ups gonna work?is it 4 of each rank in the team?
For the draft we'll pick four of each rank. But after that, you can set you team up however you want. If you only want 2 ubers, that's fine (although it will be easy for your opponent to figure out who you're going to use ;)).
And I'll bring up once again, because 'Wing just reminded me, but should we lock teams the first week? What I mean is that, for the first week of battles, you have to use whatever team you draft to make your lineup. After the first week, all characters will be open again. But I think this might make the draft a little more important, and force everyone to put a little strategy in how they build their lists. (And, yes, there is some strategy when ordering the characters in a draft list.)
And, along the lines of the idea Tim's thrown out there, here's a couple of others to discuss. What about getting rid of all these high-uber characters, not just the mages. Say, anyone at herald level or above who fall into that 'do everything' category. (Basically, a serious lowering of the uber bar.) The first instinct is probably to say know because some great characters would be lost. But it would force everyone to put more focus on lower ubers and even meds and regs.
Or, what about keeping the uber bar about where it is and changing the lineups so you can only have one uber, 2 meds, and 2 regs (with downgrads, of course)? That would really force owners to mix up their strategies with the lower characters.
Everything you propose involves cutting and trimming away parts of the game. This shouldn't be about pigeon holing people into having to use any range or type of character.
We should be able to use any characters we want within sanity, and we'd be able to use the full range of them if there was a more efficent way to differentiate between characters of different levels.
I see it as a very simple solution that adds more to the game instead of us losing large parts of it. Little bit of extra work and thought and we have just as much if not more than before, instead of losing a chunk of the characters we can use.
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