Bigfoot: Fact Or Fiction?

[Assassin32]

http://www.ruidoso.net/visitors/images/bigfoot.jpg

http://www.bfro.net/


I say.....no.:)

[E. Bison]

http://img21.photobucket.com/albums/v62/Bane_Lily/dialog-vega3.gifI don't know. I guess I'm a bit of a skeptic but I want to believe. Did you know that stories of Big Foot, Sasquatch, Abominable Snowman, and Yeti are thousands of years old. Many Native American legends speak of stories of wild hairy men of the woods. So legends of Big Foot are not new. Something inspired them. Maybe an extinct species of North American ape or something.

[Shifty]

Originally posted by Bloody Mary
i used to have nightmares of me walking through thr woods and bigfoots would be hiding, blending into the bushed and trees, staring at me. then would chase me. it all started after i watched a tv show about them, how they camoflauge so easily no one would know if they were near.

Unsolved Mysteries did an episode, scared the ^_^^_^^_^^_^ out of me. Damn you Robert Stack!! (rip:( )

[Batman2005]

Fact. One of em even shaved down and had a successful action movie career, and became a governer in America.

[Assassin32]

Originally posted by Batman2005
Fact. One of em even shaved down and had a successful action movie career, and became a governer in America.

The Governator pwns you.:mad:

[Shifty]

Sometimes I wonder what my reaction would be if a few aliens (you know the big blackeyed ones) crowded around my bed like they always show on TV. I don't sleep for awhile...

[Majin Boo]

is that chewie?

[Assassin32]

It's Bigfoot!:eek:

[Shifty]

Originally posted by Assassin32
The Governator pwns you.:mad:

http://www.autobahn.mb.ca/~woodduck/images/signs/kokanee_xing.jpg

[Batman2005]

looks like chewie! where's Han? photoshop time!

[E. Bison]

Originally posted by Bloody Mary
i honestly couldnt sleep normally for a month after watching one of those unsolved mysteries about aliens. how they would wake up with an alien in the corner of their room, staring at them.
http://earthops.org/tvalien.jpg

[Assassin32]

:eek:

[E. Bison]

Originally posted by Assassin32
:eek:
http://img21.photobucket.com/albums/v62/Bane_Lily/Bison_shocked.jpg

[Assassin32]

Hey Bison, I saw this teen magazine at the store, and on the cover it had Hilary Duff vs. Lindsay Lohan. So, I looked inside, and it had the hottest picture of Hilary ever.:up:

[E. Bison]

http://img21.photobucket.com/albums/v62/Bane_Lily/dialog-vega3.gifReally? What magazine was it and how did she look?

[Assassin32]

I don't remember which mag, just that it was a teen one. She was wearing all black and was wearing a black hat. Pigtails, too. Or as I like to refer to them.....handle bars.;):up:

[E. Bison]

http://img21.photobucket.com/albums/v62/Bane_Lily/th_vega_5.gifOk? How is that the hottest picture of Hilary Duff ever?

[Assassin32]

You have to see it. Go to the store and look for a Hilary vs. Lindsay magazine. You'll see. Okay, back to Bigfoot.:o

[E. Bison]

http://img21.photobucket.com/albums/v62/Bane_Lily/Vega_10.gifI thought we WERE talking about Big Foot since we were speaking of a hary abominable creature like Lohan?

[Assassin32]

Originally posted by E. Bison
http://img21.photobucket.com/albums/v62/Bane_Lily/Vega_10.gifI thought we WERE talking about Big Foot since we were speaking of a hary abominable creature like Lohan?

She's hot.:)

[lord vegeta]

i believe there's something up north,too many people have said they've seen it to be just a hoax

[lord vegeta]

lohan is hot

[Kent]

Fiction.

[Truthteller]

Its unknown at this point.

There could be an as yet unidentified critter out there. Evidence suggests that there is, but it is as of yet unproven.

Did you know that the Mountain Gorilla of Africa was not identified until the early 1900s? Up till then there were stories about it that most considered myth.

[Kent]

Originally posted by lord vegeta
i believe there's something up north,too many people have said they've seen it to be just a hoax

Then it has to be magic, since it leaves no scat, no bones, no fur, no dead bodies, no nothing. :)

[Kent]

Originally posted by Truthteller
Its unknown at this point.

There could be an as yet unidentified critter out there. Evidence suggests that there is, but it is as of yet unproven.

What evidence would that be?

[solitary_knight]

I side with Kent, it's all bull until it's proven otherwise

[Truthteller]

Bodies of dead bears are not found in the wild either. And if they exist, the Sasquatch is much rarer than bear. ;)

[Truthteller]

Originally posted by Kent
What evidence would that be? The thousands of eye witness accounts is part of it. Many of the witnesses are creadible.

[Kent]

Originally posted by Truthteller
The thousands of eye witness accounts is part of it. Many of the witnesses are creadible.

There are also thousands of eye witness accounts for the Loch Ness monster, poltergeists and little green men.

Maybe we're talking about different sorts of evidence. I'm sure that eye witness accounts are considered evidence in court, but I prefer evidence that is open to thorough examination, as opposed to "he said so".

But still, do you have any examples of these credible witnesses?

[lord vegeta]

Originally posted by Kent
Then it has to be magic, since it leaves no scat, no bones, no fur, no dead bodies, no nothing. :)


its a smart creature..or whatever it is....it doesnt want to be found:)

[Truthteller]

Originally posted by Kent
There are also thousands of eye witness accounts for the Loch Ness monster, poltergeists and little green men.

Maybe we're talking about different sorts of evidence. I'm sure that eye witness accounts are considered evidence in court, but I prefer evidence that is open to thorough examination, as opposed to "he said so".

But still, do you have any examples of these credible witnesses? Yes I do. :) I'll get you some.

And just to be clear, I'm a skeptic. We know there are hoaxes. I'm not talking about just crazy stories. I'm talking about credible witnesses, many who know how to make field identification of wildlife, know what to look for in say a bear (snout, ears). There is also quite a bit of audio evidence. Some scat and hair apparently, and some castings of foot prints and at least one well-known and recent "body" print - the Skookum cast.

I do a lot of field identification of wildlife, I'm an expert birder (North America) for example, so this is more than just an idle interest for me.

Hang on for some of the better evidence, I'll be posting soon.

[Kent]

Originally posted by Truthteller
Bodies of dead bears are not found in the wild either. And if they exist, the Sasquatch is much rarer than bear. ;)

Since I'm not in the habit of frequenting the habitats of bears I'll have to take your word (although I seriously doubt it is true). I du know people frequently see bear scat in nature though... so... do these bigfeet ever ^_^^_^^_^^_^? ;)

[Truthteller]

Originally posted by Kent
...But still, do you have any examples of these credible witnesses? Here is some recent analysis of the Paterson film compared to a recent attempt by the BBC to replicate the film.

http://www.bfro.net/news/challenge/images/arms_comparison.jpg

By Jeff Meldrum Ph.D.

Associate professor of Anatomy & Anthropology Idaho State University Pocatello, Idaho

It has been obvious to even the casual viewer that the film subject possesses arms that are disproportionately long for its stature.

John Green is a veteran researcher into the question of Sasquatch or Bigfoot. He was among the first to view the film captured by Patterson and Gimlin and has studied it intensely in the intervening years. His recognition of the significance of the unhumanly long arms of the film subject is a point that has not previously been articulated in such a straightforward manner. It is such a fundamental observation that it is considered a breakthrough in assessing the validity of this extraordinary film.

Anthropologists typically express limb proportions as an intermembral index (IM), which is the ratio of combined arm and forearm skeletal length (humerus + radius) to combined thigh and leg skeletal length (femur + tibia) x 100. The human IM averages 72.

The intermembral index is a significant measure of a primate's locomotor adapatation. The forelimb-dominated movements of the chimp and gorilla are reflected in their high IM indices of 106 and 117 respectively.

http://www.bfro.net/news/challenge/images/rearview.jpg

You are invited to make measurements and IM calculations on your own using frame 72, above.

Identifying the positions of the joints on the film subject can only be approximate and the limbs are frequently oriented obliquely to the plane of the film, rendering them foreshortened to varying degrees. However, in some frames the limbs are nearly vertical, hence parallel to the filmplane, and indicate an IM index somewhere between 80 and 90, intermediate between humans and African apes.

In spite of the imprecision of this preliminary estimate, it is well beyond the mean for humans and effectively rules out a man-in-a-suit explanation for the Patterson-Gimlin film without invoking an elaborate, if not inconceivable, prosthetic contrivance to account for the appropriate positions and actions of wrist and elbow and finger flexion visible on the film. This point deserves further examination and may well rule out the probability of hoaxing.

Dr. Meldrum is an expert in primate anatomy and locomotion. He recently coedited, From Biped to Strider: The Emergence of Modern Human Walking, Running, and Resource Transport.

http://www.bfro.net/news/challenge/home.asp

[spiderjaybe143]

Originally posted by Bloody Mary
i used to have nightmares of me walking through thr woods and bigfoots would be hiding, blending into the bushed and trees, staring at me. then would chase me. it all started after i watched a tv show about them, how they camoflauge so easily no one would know if they were near.
dude,I soooooo totally understand that,I remember dreaming something like that,and also a dream in which I sat in a boat in the ocean,and a big shadow dived under me,and I saw the shadow but I couldn't hide anywhere for it...


....pretty scary:(

[Truthteller]

Originally posted by Kent
... But still, do you have any examples of these credible witnesses? More on this Patterson film controversy:

Q: Why can't it be done? Why can't anyone accurately recreate the "costume" used in the Patterson footage?

A: It's not a man in a costume ...

The image on the right is from a scene in an episode of X-Creatures. X-Creatures was a wildlife documentary series made by the BBC's (British Broadcasting Corporation) Natural History Unit. The episode was filmed around 1995 or later.

Frame 72.
The moving footage reveals the movement of massive muscles in the back, and the shoulders and the limbs. These proportions and dynamics, among other things, cannot be simulated by a man in simple padded costume.

In this program the BBC sought to debunk the Patterson footage by recreating the "hoax."

In order to have the most exacting re-enactment possible, the BBC hired the best monster costume designer in Hollywood and even took the costume to the same location where the Patterson incident occurred in Northern California.

How could the BBC have missed the mark so badly with their replica of the Patterson "costume"?

In the Patterson footage, the figure's muscles are flexing noticeably as the figure walks away. To simulate that, the BBC's costume designers in Hollywood had to create a costume that would show the same effect of flexing muscles.

Remote controlled soft-tissue prosthetics were not invented until well after 1967, so they could not be used in an honest replica of a 1967 costume. The costume had to allow the actor's own muscles to flex the outermost surface of the costume.

It was assumed the muscle bulk of the costume could be amplified to match the Patterson creature's muscle bulk, just by fluffing up the fur. There was actually no other choice. There could be no significant padding between the actor's muscles and the fabric to which the fur was attached, without interfering with visibility of the muscles flexing.

Eyewitness sketch of a female sasquatch, showing a musculature and body proportions similar to the Patterson figure. This one was observed for several minutes by hiker William Roe on Mica Mountain in British Columbia, Canada, in 1955. This drawing was made shortly after the 1955 sighting, but was not published until 1968, one year after the Patterson footage was obtained.

The difference of the fur color may not have been so apparent to the designers until they took their costume on location and out into the bright mountain sunlight.

The Patterson figure has a mix of shiny dark fur with reddish auburn undertones. The fur colors and reflectivity change slightly as the fur moves in bright sunlight. The reddish undertones are not very pronounced in the frame 352 image above.

The BBC's costume designers in Hollywood used artificial fur with a reddish tint to simulate the reddish tones seen in the footage. While developing the costume, the chief designer said the Patterson creature's fur looks like "the typical cheap fake fur they used in the '60's." So that's what he used.

The images above show how that "typical fake fur from the 60's" doesn't create the same kind of reflective sheen, or change color much as the fur moves in the sunlight.

The side by side images above reveal striking difference in the muscle proportions of the two figures. The muscles on the Patterson figure are more than twice the size of the human's muscles in many places. These muscles flex as the figure walks, so they are not made of padding.

The Patterson figure's skeletal proportions can now be measured by computer. Positions of the joints can be determined from the rotation of the joints, and then modeled into a moving 3D skeletal frame. Although on the surface the Patterson figure looks more or less human in terms of the skeletal proportions, computer modeling demonstrates that the figure has a non-human frame.

http://www.bfro.net/news/challenge/home.asp

[spiderjaybe143]

Originally posted by spiderjaybe143
dude,I soooooo totally understand that,I remember dreaming something like that,and also a dream in which I sat in a boat in the ocean,and a big shadow dived under me,and I saw the shadow but I couldn't hide anywhere for it...


....pretty scary:(

EDIT: does anybudy know where we can see or download or watch the original footage of bigfooty?

[kbomb106]

Bigfoot exists! I remember all the proof that was all over TV during the 80s.
http://home.att.net/~vintz/BigFoot01.jpg

[Kent]

About the Patterson film, and supposed analysis of said film.

Last time I saw this film I was too young to really give damn, but it seems to me that it would be impossible to make any anatomical analysis of this figure without also knowing the exact angles the film was taken at, and at that... being an expert at how the angle of the shot influences the look of anatomical structure.

I also find it kind of curious that Patterson went out with the express intent of getting a bigfoot on camera, and that Ray Wallace (well known, and self confessed bigfoot hoaxer) was the one to tip Patterson off on where to find the bigfoot is even more curious...

[Dr.Dude]

Fiction. It's more boring that way, but nothing convinces me otherwise. :o ;)

[Shifty]

Didn't they come out recently saying the Patterson film was a hoax? Pretty sure. to lazy to google news it.

[Jason Blood]

who in the blue hell cares about bigfoot?

if he was a wookie...

[choskins]

Originally posted by slinger
Didn't they come out recently saying the Patterson film was a hoax? Pretty sure. to lazy to google news it.

Patterson's family did after he died last year. Showed the footprints they used, costume, etc. It was a hoax. 100%

[choskins]

http://www.katu.com/team2/story.asp?ID=66988

Sorry, it was Wallace, the guy who wore the suit who died last year. Patterson died in 1972

[Orko Is King]

Originally posted by kbomb106
Bigfoot exists! I remember all the proof that was all over TV during the 80s.
http://home.att.net/~vintz/BigFoot01.jpg

Whoever owns that car has a very small penis...maybe a vagina.

[Honey Vibe]

Originally posted by choskins
http://www.katu.com/team2/story.asp?ID=66988

Sorry, it was Wallace, the guy who wore the suit who died last year. Patterson died in 1972 I thought this footage was pulled from the film made in the 1990s?

Does anybody know about the 90s footage?

[Truthteller]

Originally posted by slinger
Didn't they come out recently saying the Patterson film was a hoax? Pretty sure. to lazy to google news it. Originally posted by choskins
Patterson's family did after he died last year. Showed the footprints they used, costume, etc. It was a hoax. 100% Originally posted by choskins
http://www.katu.com/team2/story.asp?ID=66988

Sorry, it was Wallace, the guy who wore the suit who died last year. Patterson died in 1972 Whoa... you jump to conclusions too quickly.

Everybody knows Wallace was a hoaxer. He also liked to claim more that what he was responsible for. The notion that the whole of the complex of sasquatch mythology is all due to Wallace is simply unsustainable. We have accounts that go back thousands of years into native American oral tradition for just one example.

The Wallace story was largely the media once again sensationalizing something to the point where the truth gets glossed over.

Look here:

Tuesday, December 23, 2003
Hoaxes put focus on fantasy, hopes
By Diane Clay
The Oklahoman

Bigfoot

For 44 years, residents in northwestern states reported seeing a dark, hairy man more than 6 feet tall, with feet as long as 17 inches. One rancher, Roger Patterson, even claimed to have captured the creature on film in 1967, cementing the belief that Bigfoot was a real link to our Homo sapiens past.

The legend was dashed last year when the family of California man Ray Wallace released a statement from the dying 84-year-old construction company owner who said he had created the first Bigfoot footprints with carved wooden feet. He had reported the find to a local newspaper, and Bigfoot was born.

In the years following the footprint sighting, Wallace and his wife said they dressed in Bigfoot suits to make their own films and recorded Bigfoot noises. Wallace said for Patterson’s film, he told the filmmaker he thought Bigfoot would be near Bluff Creek, Calif., that day, and Patterson should try to film it. Patterson showed up, and so did Bigfoot.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
BFRO Commentary:
It’s depressing to see sloppy inaccurate reporting such as this continually presented to an unsuspecting public. Almost nothing in this section of the article (which addresses several intentional or unintentional hoaxes) is valid, and it’s obvious the reporter merely recycled tired information without doing an iota of research on her own.

Regarding some of the misstatements in this article:

1. Scientists do not claim the sasquatch is or represents any kind of link in human evolution.

2. Ray Wallace did not release a bigfoot-related deathbed confession.

3. While Ray Wallace did own wooden feet, his carved feet did not match the prints they supposedly created. A simple check of this easily verifiable fact should have laid the whole Wallace controversy to rest. Unfortunately, the mainstream media have proven themselves more interested in sensationalism than truth.

4. Ray Wallace did not go to the press regarding footprint discoveries.

5. Saying “Bigfoot was born” as a result of Ray Wallace’s shenanigans is like saying Nicholas, bishop of Myra, was born with Tim Allen’s “The Santa Clause.” Sasquatch sightings and track finds predated Wallace by many years.

6. Purported connections between Wallace, his wife, and the Patterson/Gimlin film are so utterly fantastic they don’t even merit discussion. The National Enquirer wouldn’t stoop that low.

http://www.bfro.net/GDB/show_article.asp?id=355

[Jack Rabbit]

Originally posted by Truthteller
Here is some recent analysis of the Paterson film compared to a recent attempt by the BBC to replicate the film.

http://www.bfro.net/news/challenge/images/arms_comparison.jpg

By Jeff Meldrum Ph.D.

Associate professor of Anatomy & Anthropology Idaho State University Pocatello, Idaho

It has been obvious to even the casual viewer that the film subject possesses arms that are disproportionately long for its stature.

John Green is a veteran researcher into the question of Sasquatch or Bigfoot. He was among the first to view the film captured by Patterson and Gimlin and has studied it intensely in the intervening years. His recognition of the significance of the unhumanly long arms of the film subject is a point that has not previously been articulated in such a straightforward manner. It is such a fundamental observation that it is considered a breakthrough in assessing the validity of this extraordinary film.

Anthropologists typically express limb proportions as an intermembral index (IM), which is the ratio of combined arm and forearm skeletal length (humerus + radius) to combined thigh and leg skeletal length (femur + tibia) x 100. The human IM averages 72.

The intermembral index is a significant measure of a primate's locomotor adapatation. The forelimb-dominated movements of the chimp and gorilla are reflected in their high IM indices of 106 and 117 respectively.

http://www.bfro.net/news/challenge/images/rearview.jpg

You are invited to make measurements and IM calculations on your own using frame 72, above.

Identifying the positions of the joints on the film subject can only be approximate and the limbs are frequently oriented obliquely to the plane of the film, rendering them foreshortened to varying degrees. However, in some frames the limbs are nearly vertical, hence parallel to the filmplane, and indicate an IM index somewhere between 80 and 90, intermediate between humans and African apes.

In spite of the imprecision of this preliminary estimate, it is well beyond the mean for humans and effectively rules out a man-in-a-suit explanation for the Patterson-Gimlin film without invoking an elaborate, if not inconceivable, prosthetic contrivance to account for the appropriate positions and actions of wrist and elbow and finger flexion visible on the film. This point deserves further examination and may well rule out the probability of hoaxing.

Dr. Meldrum is an expert in primate anatomy and locomotion. He recently coedited, From Biped to Strider: The Emergence of Modern Human Walking, Running, and Resource Transport.

http://www.bfro.net/news/challenge/home.asp

TT, the Patterson footage was a hoax.

Didn't he die recently and admit it on his death bed?

I believe I heard that on the news.

[Truthteller]

Originally posted by MidKnight
TT, the Patterson footage was a hoax.

Didn't he die recently and admit it on his death bed?

I believe I heard that on the news. No he didn't. You are giving a good example of what I mean by the media being misleading. Go back and look at the post you just quoted and then look at my previous post.

The bit about Wallace and Patterson making up the whole of the "bigfoot" or better term, sasquatch, complex is false.

[Truthteller]

Wallace Hoax Behind Bigfoot?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Wallace Scam Ensnares Hollywood Producers
BFRO's Quick FAQ on the 'Death of Bigfoot' Story
More Commentary on the 'Death of Bigfoot' Story
Samples of other Wallace Claims
John Green on the 'Birth of Bigfoot' at Bluff Creek.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Wallace Scam Ensnares Hollywood Producers

Some folks in Hollywood apparently didn't get the memo, or didn't get it in time. Months after the Wallace family's bogus story about their deceased, veracity-challenged father, was thoroughly scientifically debunked by Dr. Jeff Meldrum at Idaho State University, and Canadian journalist John Green, a newly formed production company in Hollywood has announced plans to produce a "documentary" based on the discredited Wallace story (see article from the Hollywood Reporter, below).

Someone needs to send another memo to actor Judge Reinhold and producer Eric Geadelmann, before they make fools of themselves:

1) The Wallace story has been debunked, scientifically. It was a lie. The wooden track stompers shown to the media by the Wallace family do not match photos of the 1958 tracks they claim their father made. They are different foot shapes. See for yourself.

2) It is not physically possible to fake tracks with the shape, depth and stride of the Bluff Creek tracks, using any kind of wooden track stompers. Go ahead and try it sometime. Stompers large enough to produce the tracks cast in 1958 act like snowshoes in soft soil. They cannot create the heavy compression seen in the 1958 casts.

3) John Green has offered $100,000 dollars to anyone who can recreate the tracks the Wallaces claim their deceased father created. The Wallace family can't do it. One of the Wallace family members nearly killed himself trying to do it, as he was towed behind a pickup truck while wearing the wooden stompers, in front of media cameras.

4) The Wallace family waited for their father to die before propagating their bogus story, because Wallace himself would have been easily discredited upon cross examination by those who could prove he didn't know the key details about the tracks found by Jerry Crew.

5) Scientific luminaries such as Jane Goodall and George Schaller have recently become vocal advocates for the authenticity of the real evidence indicating the existence of these animals.

6) This is a very serious environmental issue. Television programs and films that mislead the public about it will eventually be viewed as something between distasteful and criminal exploitation of popular misconceptions, as more evidence and scientific support accumulates to show that the species exists, and is likely endangered.

Is this how you'd like to be remembered? If you have any moral fiber at all you'll think about this. Don't cop out by calling it entertainment. The ignorant attitudes you're encouraging will affect public policy in a lot of areas, policies that directly affect the habitats of this rare, important primate species.


---------------------------------------
From the Hollywood Reporter

Reinholds put their Bigfoot forward in venture
By Chris Gardner, Reuters

LOS ANGELES (Hollywood Reporter) - Actor Judge Reinhold and his wife, Amy, have teamed with indie producer Eric Geadelmann to launch a feature film production company.

TLP Prods., which will maintain offices in Los Angeles and Nashville, has acquired two narrative fiction projects and started production on a documentary.

TLP has acquired the rights to the life story of Ray Wallace, a logger in the Pacific Northwest who is credited with creating the myth of Bigfoot by using a pair of 16-foot carved wooden feet and stomping around on the ground. He kept the legend going for more than 40 years by using photos, footprints and fake sightings before his family admitted the long-running hoax shortly after his death in November 2002.

The Reinholds, Geadelmann and manager-producer Gordon Gilbertson will produce the untitled Bigfoot-hoax project, with Judge Reinhold expected to take a supporting role in the film.

"Initially, this was just a funny headline in the New York Times, but the more we learned about Ray and the ingenious ways he captured people's imagination and manipulated mass media, we knew we had to tell his story," Judge Reinhold said. "It's Ray's young son's discovery that his father is Bigfoot, set against the mystery and enchantment of the Northwest woods."

TLP's other fiction film project is "One Stupid Thing," a black comedy penned by John Lavachielli about a New Jersey man who moves his family to the small town of Nyborg, Wyo., to protect them from impending terrorism. Justine Baddeley is producing in association with TLP. CAA is packaging both projects.

TLP has started production on the feature docu "Ghosts in the Hills" in Arkansas. The film tells the story of a white community at a historic crossroads because of the Ku Klux Klan.

Geadelmann also is a partner in Haynes/Geadelmann Pictures, an independent film production outfit that recently announced a multiple-project deal with Nicolas Cage and his Saturn Films.

Judge Reinhold was last seen on the big screen in last year's "Santa Clause 2." Upcoming film projects for the actor include "The Hollow" and "Crab Orchard."

Reuters/Hollywood Reporter

Much more here: http://www.bfro.net/news/Wallace.asp

[Truthteller]

BFRO's Quick FAQ on the 12/02 'Death of Bigfoot' Story.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
John Green on the 'Birth of Bigfoot' at Bluff Creek.
More Commentary of the 'Death of Bigfoot' Story
Samples of other Wallace Claims
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Question: How many successful bigfoot hoaxes did Ray Wallace perpetrate during his lifetime?

Answer: None. Wallace didn't even claim publicly to have perpetrated any successful bigfoot hoaxes. These assertions were publicized after Wallace's death, by Wallace's heirs, and a freelance publisher/writer on the East Coast. Wallace cannot be given credit for any successful hoaxes because researchers in general were never duped by his fake evidence. Many who knew Wallace said he indeed faked some evidence to sell at his shop. He told lots of people tall-tales about his alleged interactions with sasquatches, but he did all these things while firmly believing sasquatches existed somewhere in the forests of the northwest, according to friends who knew Wallace for years.


Question: Did Wallace ever fake any bigfoot evidence?

Answer: Yes. Over the years Wallace faked perhaps a dozen or so bigfoot track casts, and a smaller number fake bigfoot photos and films. He started faking evidence long after the first "Bigfoot" story hit the media in the late 1950's. For decades he tried to sell crudely faked casts at his roadside tourist shop in southern Washington State. He wasn't interested in perpetrating a major hoax, as much as he was eager to sell fake casts to tourists. He didn't sell much. He was more prolific at telling outrageous stories. His stories and his evidence had been repeatedly examined over the years, by a long list of qualified researchers, all of whom concluded that it had no credibility.


Question: Was Wallace responsible for the various high-profile bigfoot evidence referred to in the 12/02 news stories?

Answer: No. Wallace's material was always clearly identifiable as fake, and thus was disregarded along with many other pieces of fake evidence that various people tried to sell over the years in roadside shops in the northwest. The facts and physical evidence clearly demonstrate that Wallace had nothing to do with the many tracks and casts, and the best footage, found in more remote areas in the northwest, which are thought to be authentic. Wallace never publicly claimed to have faked any of that high-profile, credible evidence, though his heirs are now claiming that he took responsibility for it all shortly before he died.


Question: Why would Wallace's heirs claim he faked all the evidence and started the Bigfoot mystery if he really didn't?

Answer: Many assume it is because his heirs inherited lots of worthless, unsold, fake evidence from his roadside tourist shop. They believe his heirs may be hoping that their stories about Ray, and his personal belongings, will be much more valuable if there is a big sensational story attached to it.


Question: Why did the 'Death of Bigfoot' story become such a big, worldwide news event so quickly, if the physical evidence clearly shows that Wallace was not responsible for the original "Bigfoot" tracks?

Answer: The first story was a long, slanted obituary wherein the family and the freelance publisher made their claims about Ray Wallace. This obituary instantly became a hot item on the AP wire service, and became progressively distorted as it exploded out across other wire services, newspapers, television and radio stations, around the world. This happened over the course of a few days in early December. There was apparently no time for any newspaper (except the Denver Post), to seek out the truth behind the Wallace story. Every other newspaper was eager announce the 'Death of Bigfoot', mainly because other 'confession' stories purporting to debunk major mysteries, such as Loch Ness and crop circles, were always major world headlines when they first appeared. The investigation by the Denver Post is still ongoing.


Question: What is the physical proof demonstrating that Wallace did not create the original "Bigfoot" tracks?

Answer: The fake track stompers said by the Wallace family to be those which created the famous "Bigfoot" tracks, physically do not match the casts of the famous "Bigfoot" tracks. Wallace's fake track stompers are crude, carved representations of some Bluff Creek tracks from that era, based on copies of casts shared among locals years after the fact. The details of Wallace's stompers show they are simply not the molds, so to speak, which created the original tracks found in the ground by Jerry Crew and Bob Titmus in Bluff Creek in the 1950's.


Question: Is it possible that someone else could have faked all the best evidence obtained around Bluff Creek in the 1950's and 1960's?

Answer: As any school child will point out, anything is possible. It is possible that everything in the world which appears to be natural and organic, is actually fabricated by pranksters. By the same token it is possible that all the physical evidence of sasquatches from across the continent is fabricated by pranksters. What is not possible is the idea that the consistent, subtle hallmarks of all the tracks believed to be authentic could have been fabricated without a lot of expensive, high-tech mechanical engineering. Wallace's methods for faking tracks, by contrast, were very crude and produced obviously fake casts. Wallace endeavored for decades to sell every bit of fake bigfoot garbage that he could, but never had anything better than his typical crude casts for sale in his shop. He never displayed any casts in his shop that had these subtle hallmarks of authentic casts. Neither Wallace nor his heirs have ever displayed, or claim to possess, any of the advanced technology or collateral items required to fake the original Bluff Creek tracks. No one else has ever been able to demonstrate the methods or elaborate gear required to fake the authentic casts, and this gear would had to have been in use since the 1940's, when sasquatch tracks first started to be investigated. Because of the time-line of the evidence, one couldn't rely on the most modern technology to fabricate the distinguishing characteristics.


Question: What has been the effect of the 'Death of Bigfoot' story on the researcher efforts into the bigfoot/sasquatch phenomena?

Answer: Long-time reseachers are stunned at the lack of integrity and diligence on the part of the wire services and the mainstream media. The media (and even Jay Leno) implied that bigfoot researchers were hoaxed for years by Ray Wallace's efforts. Bigfoot researchers say the AP wire service, etc., were hoaxed by the 'Death of Bigfoot' story. The fact is, Ray Wallace's efforts at fabricating evidence and stories were well known to researchers for decades. Ray Wallace was a fountain of bogus stories, and everyone knew it. He always sought attention for his stories, but never got much. Nor was he the only pathological liar out there spouting ridiculous stories and peddling crudely faked evidence. The only Wallace story that made big news happened after his death -- the 12/02 'Death of Bigfoot' story. Ironically, this bogus story didn't come directly from Wallace, but was attributed to him by members of his family. It was as if someone helped the heirs realize that a "deathbed hoax confession" story was the only story the wire services and mainstream media would circulate without hesitation or any due diligence.

http://www.bfro.net/news/wallace_faq.asp

[spiderjaybe143]

dude,that's interesting.....that's veeeeery interesting:D

[Truthteller]

Footprints in the snow? Yeah, right... Check this out:

Report # 2393 (Class A)
Submitted by witness David K. on Thursday, March 09, 2000.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A group of military police report an encounter while guarding a chopper accident site
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

YEAR: 1985

SEASON: Summer

MONTH: September

STATE: Georgia

COUNTY: Lumpkin County

LOCATION DETAILS: The location was northwest of Dalonega, Ga about 5-6 miles in the Chatahoochee Forest, 4 miles north of Camp Darby [Camp Frank D. Merrill] (US Army Ranger training camp). The main N - S Park access (dirt and gravel) road was about two miles from the location. The Park starts about 1/2 mile north of Camp Darby and the access road is the road from Darby into the Park - follow this road for about 2 miles and take the right (north) fork. About 2-3 miles north of the fork and on the west side of the road is a large mountain (I dont know the name of it, and was probably only known as a number on the military maps, however I do not recall what it is) the incident occured near a ridge, about 1/3 of the way up mountain. If I had a military map of the area I could show you the exact location.


NEAREST TOWN: Dalonega

NEAREST ROAD: state park access road about 2 miles away

OBSERVED: In 1985 I was assigned as a Military Policeman to the US Army Garrison at Fort McPhearson, Ga.(Atlanta). We recieved a alert for my squad to go and secure the crash site of an AH-1 (Cobra) helicopter that belonged to the Texas Army National Guard that crashed in the Chatahoochee Forest, North of the Ranger Camp.

We were helicoptered into the ranger camp with our gear and we boarded a "Duece" (2 1/2 ton truck) for the ride to the crash site.

We made it to within about 1/4 mile of the site and had to carry our gear in.

We relieved the Rangers that were guarding the site (the crash occured about 12 hrs earlier) and set up camp. Our job was to keep people out of the area (curiosity seekers, news people, etc.) until the crash investigation team arrived and took over.

The crash site was small, about 100 feet by 30 feet because the Cobra crashed in one piece and then burned, so the whole area had that fuel smell and that "burned flesh" smell.

The photos below are from the official accident investigation report. It is uncertain whether these photos were taken the day before or the day after the animal encounter.

The accident investigation report was obtained by Larry Lesh, MSgt, USAF (Retired)

http://www.bfro.net/GDB/CNTS/GA/LK/GA_chopper_crash_site_01.jpg

http://www.bfro.net/GDB/CNTS/GA/LK/GA_chopper_crash_site_03.jpg


We set up camp adjacent to the wreckage about 50 feet away and posted our guard shifts. (I will not name complete names here because of 2 reasons, 1. some of the people involved refused to even talk about it afterward. 2. I do not know where they are today.)

My squad consisted of 5 men:

SGT Ken R. - Patrol Supervisor (NCOIC)
SPC Rodney T. - MP
SPC Shaun N. - MP
PFC Tim A. - MP
PFC David K. (Me)-MP

We finally got the camp set around 6:00 pm and the sun was going down. A large fire was built in our perimeter (which was pretty stupid in retrospect due to the large amount of fuel on the ground from the crash) and had set 4 hour shifts. Myself and SPC Shaun N were on the second shift (10:00 pm-2:00 am) we finally racked out about 8:00pm to get some shut-eye.

Around 10:00 pm I woke to the most god awful howl/scream you could imagine and when I looked at SGT Ken R, SPC Rodney T and PFC Tim A, you would have thought that they saw a ghost! All three had their 45's out (we were armed with [45's] with two 6 round magazines) cocked, locked and ready to rock!

All were visibly shaken. Myself and SPC Shaun N got up and asked what the hell was that, the only answer we got was another howl/scream that was about 50 feet to our east (from the direction of the wreckage) at which time SGT Ken R started dousing the fire from a 5 gallon water can and then told us to spread out online. He told us to keep our flashlights off until he told us and then told us to move out to the wreckage keeping online. His words were "If these locals wanna F*** with the Army then lets give em what they want."

At this point as we started to move out I could hear metal being pulled, thrown and moved around at the crash site and I kept looking for a light down there as I was moving. About 30 feet away SGT Ken R turned on his mag-lite and what I saw scared the S*** out of me: 3 creatures were there among the wreckage and they were not bears! the closest one (about 10 feet away) was holding a piece of metal from the heicopter and stood on 2 legs at least 7 1/2 feet tall, covered in hair except for the face, which looked like a chimp, the one behind him(15 feet away) was dragging part of the pilot's body from the wreckage, he (or she) was larger than the first one, however it was stooped while dragging the body. My estimate was over 8 feet tall with the same facial features. I only saw the 3rd one briefly 40 feet away as it was fleeing.

SPC Rodney T. was the first one to fire which sent everyone into "Dodge City" mode (basically shooting everywhere). After SGT Ken R. got everyone to stop shooting and got us calmed down (yea right!) we reloaded a fresh clip and circled the wagons so to speak. This all lasted about 20 min from start (when I heard the scream) to finish(when we stopped firing) however we stayed locked and loaded till sunrise and did not move from our 360 at the wreckage.

Around 6:00 it started getting light, so we moved out to see if we killed one of the creatures or could at least get a bloodtrail. We found no creature bodies or bloodtrails.

The crash invesigators arrived at 8:00 am and we said nothing to them (upon agreement) and we left and returned to Fort McPhearson.

When I think about that night I really get the "Willies" about what I saw and as I said earlier some of the guys with me absolutely refused to talk about it. I honestly think (looking back on this) that these creatures ment us no harm - they were only scavaging. I think they may have smelled the burned bodies in the same way you can smell someone bar-b-quing, how good it smells? They sensed a free meal - even though we were 50 feet away - and were willing to take the risk.

The howl/scream? one of the creatures calling the others to his find. I have only talked to 2 other people about this and because I am still in the military (though I am no longer an MP) I wish to remain unknown to the public - at least until I retire (in 4 years). As an investigator you are free to contact me any time and I will answer any of your questions that I can.

OTHER WITNESSES: 5 total witnesses involved 2 were sleeping - (myself and SPC Shaun N.) 3 were guarding - (SGT Ken R., SPC Rodney T., PFC Tim A.)

TIME AND CONDITIONS: 10:00-11:00 pm Light Conditions: dark but clear Weather: clear and about 60 degrees


ENVIRONMENT: Geography: mountain terrain (by Georgia standards) with elevations around 3000 feet (highest peak in the area). It has many fast flowing creeks and streams with deep beds. The terrain tends to be very steep in most places with lots of gullies and draws.

Heavily wooded with areas of clearcut. underbrush is thick with lots of deadfalls. Virgin forest and 2nd generation forest about 50 / 50. Mostly Oak and Pine, some Walnut and a few Elm. Blackberries and wild plums abound. Enviorment of Encounter Area: 2nd generation hardwood forest (about 20-30 yrs old) and thick underbrush (oak scrub) about 200 meters (175 yards) from the edge of virgin timber (hardwood)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Follow-up investigation report:

Primary BFRO investigators: Matt M. and Army Ranger Instructor Carl J.

Matt M. has spoken with the witness David K. by phone from Korea. Carl was able to confirm that there was a helicopter crash with fatalities at the described location in 1985.

If you are one of the other witnesses mentioned in the report, please contact Curators@BFRO.net.

Witness David K. and Ranger Instructor Carl J. would both like to speak with you about the incident. This an animal observation case, not a criminal case. You have nothing to worry about by coming forward. No reasonable person is going to suggest that five MP witnesses are all crazy. As the first witness noted, this database puts your encounter in the proper context. You're not the only one who has seen these animals.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Q&A with witness David K.

Q: How did David K.'s group explain the missing ammunition when they returned?

A: To answer the question about the rounds, ask any MP and he will tell you that he carries his own [small arms] rounds. As a matter of fact most Infantry do too! My section had their own rounds and that is what we used. We had planned to do some [target practice] while we were there.

Q: How did they explain to the crash investigation team that the pilot's remains had been removed from the wreckage? The point of that being that the scene was to supposed to be kept undisturbed until the investigators arrived.

A: In the interview David K. mentioned that the only time his unit worried about others learning what happened was the following morning. Soon after the investigators arrived they started shouting and asking how and why the remains were outside the wreckage. David said his unit was very nervous at that moment. They could only shrug it off.

It's important to keep in mind that the MP unit's order were not to keep the site completely undisturbed. Their instructions were to "keep people away from the crash site." They camped at a spot where they would be able to deter people approaching from the nearest road. They didn't need to camp right next to wreckage.

Q: Can David K. explain why none of the three creatures were hit at such close range although many rounds were fired?

A: David never said that none of the creatures were hit. All he knew was that his unit didn't find any dead animals the next morning, nor did they find a blood trail. That does not mean that none were hit. He doesn't know one way or the other on that.

On the phone he explained that as the guys approached the wreckage, they were holding their guns and only one was holding a flashlight -- the sergeant. After the sgt and the rest of the unit got a good look at the animals in the flashlight beam, the sgt dropped the flashlight to go for his gun. So they were all suddenly laying down panicky cover fire blindly in the dark. If the animals were already starting to flee, the MPs could have easily missed them.

As David K. said on the phone, all his guys were trying to do at that moment was stop the animals from dragging away the remains. Their response definitely accomplished that, regardless of the surprise factor.

Q: Was it possible the wreckage was hit? Wouldn't bullet holes have raised questions?

A: Visible bullet holes in the wreckage would probably have raised questions among investigators. I assume David K. would have mentioned it if his unit had been called back and questioned about that later. Considering that he didn't mention that I can assume 1) they weren't called back and questioned about that, and thus 2) there were no bullet holes in the wreckage, and thus 3) they probably weren't firing toward the wreckage.

Other Questions:

Several other questions and comments have been sent in by readers who have doubts about this story. Their questions range the gamut, from "Were there any tracks?" to "What happened to the spent shell casings after the shooting?"

Instead of going back to David K. with every new question and doubt that is sent in about this story, we are going to collect those questions and direct them to the other witnesses when we hear from them. David K. has told us enough. We'd like to seek answers from some of the other witnesses who were there that night.

=============================

This very unusual report has been posted to the BFRO site in order to encourage the other MPs involved to contact us with their version of the events that night, and their descriptions of the animals that were attracted to this crash site.

Various readers have responded to this report with questions and comments. A few people with military knowledge have pointed out some elements they consider to be inconsistent with standard military practice. The recurring elements have been put to some active military personnel. They have said that some things seem unusual, but may be due to slightly different practices and tolerances among different units in 1985. In that time period, we are told, operational procedures in various parts of the armed forces were not as strictly uniform among all units as they eventually became in subsequent years. In other words, some units did things a bit differently depending upon the style of the individual supervisors. This may not be tolerated today, but this incident did occur 15 years ago.

Some points, such as an apparent descrepancy in the asserted capacity of a 45 magazine, were later explained by David K. (and confirmed by other sources) as simply a difference in usage among serviceman at that time. The 45 magazine technically holds 7 rounds, but some servicemen put only 6 rounds in the magazine to prevent jamming -- hence David's reference to a 6 round magazine.

This is one example of a circumstantial element and a superficially questionable statement that various folks have focused on. These elements are peripheral, however, to the main question the BFRO is concerned with: What animal species was encountered that night at the crash site?

The BFRO's investigation has conclusively established two important things related to this incident.

1) This helicopter crash happened in the area and time frame described by David K.

2) David K. and at least some of the other MPs mentioned were among the people who guarded the crash site that night.

We're assuming that at least one of the other former MPs is still alive and recalls this assignment. We know some of their full names and can probably locate them, but we would like them to contact us on their own when they desire to discuss the incident. According to David K. they were very reluctant to discuss the matter after it happened, so we want to be sensitive to that. Both David K. and the BFRO are confident that at least one of the other MPs will want to make a statement about the incident at some point. It's much more likely that we'll receive a full and forthcoming account from the other witnesses if they initiate the contact with us, instead of them being contacted out of the blue and questioned about it.

If we are ever contacted by one of those former MPs we are actually expecting to hear a somewhat different version of the story than David K's version.

The key thing that interests the BFRO is the description of the animals that were observed that night, and what those animals were observed doing when confronted by the unit. If other elements of the whole story are disagreed upon between different witnesses, it would not be surprising at all, nor would it be relevant to the key issue of this report.

Different people will tend to have different recollections about peripheral details and sequences of events they experienced together many years before. We are only concerned about the recollections of a specific, 5-10 second observation that occured among this group that night in 1985. If there are discrepancies among versions the story, but a consistency among them as to description of the animals, it would support the credibility of that part of the story.

If David's story is not true, in whole or in part, we assume the other MPs involved won't hesitate to tell us so, but we haven't heard from any of them yet ...

http://www.bfro.net/GDB/show_report.asp?id=2393

[Truthteller]

About 30 feet away SGT Ken R turned on his mag-lite and what I saw scared the S*** out of me: 3 creatures were there among the wreckage and they were not bears! the closest one (about 10 feet away) was holding a piece of metal from the heicopter and stood on 2 legs at least 7 1/2 feet tall, covered in hair except for the face, which looked like a chimp, the one behind him(15 feet away) was dragging part of the pilot's body from the wreckage, he (or she) was larger than the first one, however it was stooped while dragging the body. My estimate was over 8 feet tall with the same facial features. I only saw the 3rd one briefly 40 feet away as it was fleeing.

SPC Rodney T. was the first one to fire which sent everyone into "Dodge City" mode (basically shooting everywhere). After SGT Ken R. got everyone to stop shooting and got us calmed down (yea right!) we reloaded a fresh clip and circled the wagons so to speak. This all lasted about 20 min from start (when I heard the scream) to finish(when we stopped firing) however we stayed locked and loaded till sunrise and did not move from our 360 at the wreckage. HA! "Dodge City Mode" :D

[choskins]

Truthteller, all your alleged neutral fact-based, truth-telling articles come from a website called BFRO. What does BFRO stand for? Yeah, that's what I thought. Not exactly neutral. I put up an article from the actual participants that said it was a load of crap. You put up a rebuttal article from the Bigfoot Researchers Organization. Oh, Ok!

[Capt Throbberson]

CHEWBACCA!!!!
ROOOGGHGHGHGH!!

[Honey Vibe]

I don't think that automatically makes the source sensational, choskins.

[choskins]

But it is not unbiased.

[Quietstorm]

I was watching the Discovery Channel 3 or 4 days ago about a primate who walks upright. I forget his name, but no one knew where he came from (I'm sure some of you guys know what I'm talking about). Supposedly he had 47 chromosomes, but that could have been the error of Japanese scientist who studied him. Some scientist say that maybe he was a creation of a human and a chimp, which I honestly I think is impossible. Therefore, I believe that there are animals out there yet to be discovered. :up:

[Truthteller]

Originally posted by choskins
Truthteller, all your alleged neutral fact-based, truth-telling articles come from a website called BFRO. What does BFRO stand for? Yeah, that's what I thought. Not exactly neutral. I put up an article from the actual participants that said it was a load of crap. You put up a rebuttal article from the Bigfoot Researchers Organization. Oh, Ok! choskins, I am familar with your source. I read it before you posted it. Its a local news station. It is no more unimpeachable than BFRO, in fact I would say less so.

Lets be clear. I am a skeptic. In my mind the question is still open. I know there are plenty of hoaxes. That doesn't mean all accounts are hoaxes though. Some are certainly misidentification. Some are less clear.

You seem to want to take the position that the case is closed. And by case I don't mean just the Patterson film but the whole of the Sasquatch/North American great ape existence question. If you choose to take the position that the case is closed and there is no need to consider evidence then fine. I would say that is both your choice and a premature conclusion.

I am an Anthropologist. I am interested in the issue from both a physical science existence of a previously unknown animal question (plenty of precedent for such an event). As well as from a human folklore or oral history perspective. Both aspects have a wealth of material to study.

Again, my position is that the case is still open, but certainly not yet proven. It looks to me though like there is better evidence than the general public is aware of through media accounts. There is plenty of habitat including food and cover for a population of several thousand of these animals in North America. I approach this like everything else, from a scientific perspective. So it is wrong if you think I have some kind of bias for the existence of the animal. Being an Anthropologist and being one who frequently likes to identify the flora and fauna of the world around me, I simply find it interesting.

[Jatslo]

Anyone who knows me will tell you that I am an avid outdoorsman, and have always been so. In fact, I am happiest when I am prospecting for game fish, game animals, and precious minerals simultaneously. I have seen just about everything that walks and talks in Oregon, but I have never definitively seen, heard, smelled, touched, or tasted a "Bigfoot", nor have I witnessed primary "Bigfoot" evidence.

I have heard the stories, yes.

I would like to either go on an expedition of my own design, and\or sign up for one of those fancy "Bigfoot" vacation packages. I have researched financing a project of my own, and I found a place who will board any horses that I acquire for around $300.00/month. I am thinking I will require two horses, one for my camera person; the other for me. I will also need between two to four pack mules to haul my equipment, food, and water.

I intend to do a little prospecting in the vicinity of remote Southern Oregon, and Northern California, but I also want to be setup to document "Bigfoot", if the opportunity presents itself. Realistically, I want to tranquillize a specimen, tag it with RFID Transponder (similar to how they track wolfs, and convicts), and take all the necessary DNA, and photo evidence possible. Easier said than done, right?

If, and when I go, I will be in some of the most remote, and unexplored wildernesses in the United States, but more importantly, we are going to cover an immense open space on horseback. When, and if we stumble upon an area that is deemed active and hot, we will then setup in tree-stands in the most opportune places until our unsuspecting prey comes to us. We will, of course, bait the subject, so as to further entice it/provoke it.

Ladies and Gentlemen, this is a serious matter for serious folks, and is something that I would personally like to accomplish, like gold mining. I have talked similarly about gold mining before I actually tried it, so believe me when I tell you, "There is a high likeliness that I will plan and execute a "Bigfoot" Expedition of my own design."

I am in research and development mode presently, and I am posting here to give you the heads up, for one, but I was actually drawn here, because I am looking for the Paterson-Gimlin film. I have seen the "Stabilized Enhancement", and a lot of opinions about alleged scientific evidence; however, I would like to perform the frame-by-frame analysis on my own. Therefore, I need the empirical data, or more specifically, the unedited individual frames, so that I can complete this task.

Anyway, I am not sure I will return here unless my research leads me here again, that is. However, you can still contact me scientifically at: http://12-Moderator-Matrix.com/Science-Forums.php ... I am not looking for anyone to talk me out of this, because I am going prospecting for precious minerals any way. As a scientist, I am naturally skeptical about any opinion regardless, if that opinion is validity or invalidity of specificity. For example, if I were to try and "Debunk" evidence, I would certainly be required to do just as much leg work as the competing party, and visa versus.

With that said, I as am open-minded as a statistician should be, and unbiased too boot !

- Jatslo

[Spider-Bite]

what would classify as being bigfoot? it's possible that there is a large species of primate undiscovered lurking in the jungle somewhere. if we find one how do we know if it's bigfoot or something?

I think the whole fascination with bigfoot is overrated for that reason.

[Jatslo]

The discovery of a bipedal North American primate, will undoubtedly be classified as "Bigfoot".

<i>Cryptozoology is the study of animals (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoology) that are rumored to exist, but for which conclusive proof is still missing; the term also includes the study of animals generally considered extinct (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extinction), but which are still occasionally reported. Those who study or search for such animals are called cryptozoologists, while the hypothetical (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypothesis) creatures involved are referred to by some as "cryptids (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Cryptids)", a term coined by John Wall in 1983</i>" (Wikipedia, 2006).

... Bigfoot is a "Cryptid" ...

what would classify as being bigfoot? it's possible that there is a large species of primate undiscovered lurking in the jungle somewhere. if we find one how do we know if it's bigfoot or something? I think the whole fascination with bigfoot is overrated for that reason."

[Gotendbz-2]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/ad/Csubi3.jpg


I think Big Foot might be real, but I think he'd be more likely to be in a Jungle than up north. Well, maybe in Canada...

I think Bigfoot eats his own crap, so no one can find it.

[redmarvel]

In the Himalaya's there's the Yeti
In Canada it's Saskwatch
In the U.S. it's Bigfoot

I'ld like to think there's a reason for these various legends of beings so similar.

[Arkady Rossovich]

Anyone who voted no,has something wrong with them.Reports of a large humanlike creature has been seen in other parts of the world.Not just the USA,i personally think it might be a reletive of the homo erectus or a giganthopicius-a giant ape.

[Fading]

I can't vote on it cause honestly not sure. There were tales of Giant squid attacking or being attacked by whales and dragging men down. Until a few years ago everyone branded it as myth, an old wives tale or whatever, then they started turning up.

My opinion is 70% of ppl now if not more are putting on stories when they talk about their 'experiences' with Big Foot. Maybe a good 25% of whats left actually believe they saw or heard something but didn't. Last 5% might have actually saw something, but might not be what we think of as Bigfoot.

There might be some unknown animal that started all of this and it just grew from there, who knows. I think someone, at sometimes saw some animal that we don't have catalouged yet and it started there. Not sure if I think it's -

http://images.ciao.com/iuk/images/products/normal/274/Harry_And_The_Hendersons_DVD__6460274.jpg

or not tho lol.

[Apollo]

bigfoot the wookie