The "New" Doctor Who

[DX]

And now we have to wait until Christmas for Cybermen.

[Lord Valumart]

why put it in a spoiler:huh:

we've been talking openly about it for like the last 5 pages:huh:

[livrule]

Also should add that again I was very impressed with Julian Bleach as Davros ...

I think it may be a long time before we see the Daleks again but when they do return I hope they bring the old fella with them.

[SpideyLad]

why put it in a spoiler:huh:

we've been talking openly about it for like the last 5 pages:huh:

Cause DX sucks....Remember?

What did you think of the episode DX?

[Lord Valumart]

Also should add that again I was very impressed with Julian Bleach as Davros ...

I think it may be a long time before we see the Daleks again but when they do return I hope they bring the old fella with them.

well since the daleks were blown up davros and caan are the only ones left to do anything and i can see davros keeping caan as a pet...

[DX]

why put it in a spoiler:huh:

we've been talking openly about it for like the last 5 pages:huh:
No you haven't...:huh:
Cause DX sucks....Remember?

What did you think of the episode DX?
You shut it :cmad:

It was good.

[Lord Valumart]

No you haven't...:huh:

well it's been said many times...

cybermen at christmas...cybermen at christmas...david morissey...cybermen at christmas...

[DX]

well it's been said many times...

cybermen at christmas...cybermen at christmas...david morissey...cybermen at christmas...
Well...my bad, I guess...:o

[regwec]

Just briefly- all very good and fun, on a great scale. But lacked the courage to advance the over-arching story; everything was resolved/retconned by the end. We're back to square one.

[Vapor]

Overall I thought the finale was entertaining but very 'meh'.

Dr Who can be entertaining at times but I find it very hit and miss. There have been some good episodes such as the one with the library and shadows and apart from the ninja monks, Tooth was alright.. Then there have been some great eps like Blink.. but then they go and give us the series finales, all of which I have found to be huge let downs.

Take tonights for example.. Now I don't know if it's just me but I find the daleks to be more threatening when there is either just a few or when they couldn't fly.. I mean all the scenes of them flying in formation like something from Independance Day were laughable. It had some good points, I liked the whole thing of 'getting the gang back together' and the two Tennants was cool but felt like it had fallen short of something great. The Rose/Doctor love thing felt like it was just there for the female audience.. Why does it need a happy ending? Why bring Rose back at all.. she was suppose to be stuck there for good. Towing the planet through space? :whatever:

(oh the way they handle the public reaction/perception of all these alient related events seems very silly too and why do all these attacks take place in the same generation of London? :o)

The thing that killed the ep for me was making Donna into something special. The idea that she become part time lord, I'm sorry, was lame and spoils it and it doesn't help when it's Catherine Tate.

Davies did it before in the series 1 finale with the whole Bad Wolf thing.. some good build up but then it turns out that it's possible to absorb the Tardis energy and Rose turned into some kind of female Neo and 'scattered the warning through time and space' which again, I just found incredibly lame.. it was like a last resort/quick fix solution because he couldn't come up with anything better.

The series finale involving The Master fell short as well.. Something which had great potential, especially when you get John Simm to play The Master, and it comes out like a kid has written the story. Here Come The Drums? Again, good build up but a big let down.. Something inside his head getting stronger and it turns out to be little flying robots with childrens voices :huh: Aging the Doctor? lame. The Toclafane? lame. And as for The Master himself - the doctors equal? his rival? well they played him like a villain in an episode of Power Rangers or something..

Oh well.. atleast it wasn't as bad as what the bbc did with Robin Hood. Oh and why bring back the Cybermen, haven't they used them already this series?

[Lord Valumart]

cybermen haven't been used since series 2...

but all you're points are valid...apart from blink being good...it is with out a doubt the biggest waste of screen time ever created

[livrule]

Just briefly- all very good and fun, on a great scale. But lacked the courage to advance the over-arching story; everything was resolved/retconned by the end. We're back to square one.

I think getting back to square one is a small gift from RTD to SM ... Unless something major happens in next years specials he has a clean slate to take the show to the next level.

[DX]

cybermen haven't been used since series 2...

but all you're points are valid...apart from blink being good...it is with out a doubt the biggest waste of screen time ever created
Worse than "The Doctor's Daughter"? :wow:

[livrule]

cybermen haven't been used since series 2...

but all you're points are valid...apart from blink being good...it is with out a doubt the biggest waste of screen time ever created

You may be the only person in the Universe that thinks Blink was anything less than brilliant ....

[Vapor]

cybermen haven't been used since series 2...

but all you're points are valid...apart from blink being good...it is with out a doubt the biggest waste of screen time ever created

oh right, my mistake, fair enough then.

[DX]

I gotta say, the part with the Doctor and all his companions (and Jackie and Clone Doctor) flying the Earth back home was probably the best scene of the episode IMO. :up:

[MattBearPig]

Anyone know where I can download episodes with good quality? I'm tired of watching Sci-Fi's edited Doctor Who.:huh:

[regwec]

Who else thinks that Wilfrid is the dog's?

[Vapor]

I gotta say, the part with the Doctor and all his companions (and Jackie and Clone Doctor) flying the Earth back home was probably the best scene of the episode IMO. :up:

Yeah, the group thing was cool and it looked good.. but interspersing it with the shots of people having to hang on to stuff, just felt like it 'de-valued' the idea.. I know I'm looking way too much into it, but surely the effects would be more disastrous than acting like a roller coaster.. so I dunno, looked good but felt like a bit of a cheap glory shot.

oh and when do we see who picked up the masters ring..

[SpideyLad]

Yeah, the group thing was cool and it looked good.. but interspersing it with the shots of people having to hang on to stuff, just felt like it 'de-valued' the idea.. I know I'm looking way too much into it, but surely the effects wouldnt be more disastrous than acting like a roller coaster.. so I dunno, looked good but felt like a bit of a cheap glory shot.

oh and when do we see who picked up the masters ring..

The Master's Ring is probably gonna be explained in one of the specials.

[kez1984]

I thought the episode try'd to do alittle too much.
There's nothing wrong with being alittle more straight foward.
Also, I really hate Mickey and Martha, they should die.

[IronLion]

a few things.....donna's ring, dont you think that it looked like it absorbed some of the energy, it was seen quite a lot.

who will be the new companion?? any rumours??

in last weeks confidential it was stated no more classic villains left, but who do you think it will be next year/full season??

i'm glad rhey didnt actually have either doctor say those three ****ing words.

[black_dust]

i'm glad rhey didnt actually have either doctor say those three ****ing words.

I love Lamp ???

[Logan's Lady]

I cried when he wiped Donna's memory.
Yeh...... me too.

i'm glad rhey didnt actually have either doctor say those three ****ing words.
Yeh, makes some happy and they can delude themselves that the doctor never loved Rose. And the others can say awww, he whispered it in her ear and enjoy the mushfest at the end.

i swear to god someone was high and suffering from WAY to many hugh grant movies when they wrote that...
Being a chick..... i'm glad Rose settled for the 1/2 and 1/2 doctor.

[Lord Valumart]

in last weeks confidential it was stated no more classic villains left, but who do you think it will be next year/full season??
lies...filthy lies!!

ice warriors, zygons, silurians, yeti, the REAL cybermen, proper auton invasions...and if all else fails you could always bring back something that was a good idea and done badly...
Being a chick..... i'm glad Rose settled for the 1/2 and 1/2 doctor.

damn you womens and your love of mush:cmad:

[Logan's Lady]

Well at least it was the 1/2 and 1/2 doctor that stayed with Rose....... and not the full blooded Timelord!!

[Captain_BluTac]

So I really liked the episode except for the conclusion to Donna's story they made it so good and then went "yeah but she cant remember or her head will explode", I loved all of them round the TARDIS console and the set up for Torchwood Series 3 (especially since I was right about Martha and Mickey) also I'm glad they made it appear that the part Human thing was exclusive to Doctor 8 and Doctor 10.1 so Doctor 10 is full Timelord, but my favourite bit, GERMAN DALEKS!:o

[regwec]

Exterminaten!

[JustABill]

I'm not quite sure how I feel about how they wrapped up both of my favorite companions stories.

[ihateusernames]

Loved it, like how SJ told him how he had such a huge family, only for him to end up alone again, and poor Donna. The only problem I have is, we all know she'll more than likely be back, at some point in the future. It's Dr Who, after all.

I kinda wish she had some kind of memory of it, I mean... all that character development... just throw away. I hate stuff like that, regardless of wether or not we'll be seeing them again.

I don't know how to feel about the Cybermen coming back.

[Dr Lee]

Hope we get Cribbins back in Dr Who ASAP....

[The Lizard]

.

I like the one comment made on here that i cant find now

Rose would never settle for a Doctor clone!!!

And she almost didnt!



That was BY FAR the most forehead-slap-inducing element of this episode. Arg!!! -It was just so fangirl fan-fictionish! :cmad:

Rose was so much more poignant a character when her silly, unrealistic love for the Doctor had to remain unrequited. But now, a mere 2 seasons later, look everybody - Rose now has a human Doctor clone of her very own, ain't that grand? :whatever:

And what was up with the whole talk about a half-human Doctor being so unusual? Didn't the McGann TV movie determine that the Doctor is in fact part-human to start with?

[Manic]

Well, there we are. The hand absorbed the regeneration and grew into a second Doctor. Kudos to whoever predicted all that stuff.

How effed up is it that Donna is practically the only character in the show Jack hasn't flirted with? He flirted with Chantho, but not Donna.

I have to ask, has Martha's voice gotten squeakier this year? I swear, I was only annoyed by her voice last year a few times, but everything she said in these episode has been simply horrible. That said, I did find it weird that she was saddled with the job of destroying the Earth. It strikes me as something Martha wouldn't do, but it was kinda her job, and if Martha has any flaw (other than her squeaky voice), it's her unwavering loyalty.

I like how they pointed out how the Doctor refuses to carry a gun, but he forges his companions into living weapons and cannon fodder. Jack became a soldier for Torchwood. Martha became a soldier for UNIT. Rose and Mickey became soldiers for an alternate Torchwood. Sarah Jane is a bit more like the Doctor than any of them, what with her preferring not to carry a gun, and surrounding herself with her own young companions. After all that, maybe it's a good thing Donna lost her memories.

EVERLASTING death, Caan? Really? That's what you call an everlasting death? Donna lost her memories. Ooooh. What a horrible death. "One of them will still die." My ass.

Interesting note: That little bit of human in the Doctor was just enough to convince him to build and create a gun that'd kill Davros and the Daleks.

I still don't see what people hate about Mickey.

I loved when Donna became Doctor-Donna, and started playing around with the Daleks. It was basically Tate putting on her best Tennant-as-Doctor impression, but it was funny.

Did anyone else notice that Jackie did absolutely nothing in this episode? After shooting one of the Daleks that attacked Sarah Jane, she basically stood there the whole time. Even when the Daleks were rendered harmless and everyone was kicked & shoving them around, Jackie stood there with her hands on her hips.

Question: If Dalek Caan saw into the whole of time while rescuing Davros, and he saw that he hated his own kind, why didn't he try to stop Davros from creati-- aw, nevermind. He probably only did stuff the way he did because he saw it was going to happen. Wibbly wobbly, timey wimey. God, I hate time travel sometimes.

You know, the Doctor is very good at passing judgement on others, including his own clone, for doing stuff he would've done himself. "What have you done? You've committed genocide!" How many times has the the Doctor committed genocide in the past? First he killed the Dalek race AND his own race at the same time. When Rose committed genocide at the end of series 1, he didn't say two words to her about it (and instead immediately chastised Harriett Jones for blowing up a single ship an episode later). He attempted to kill the Dalek race again by sending them into the Void. Then he killed the entire Racnoss race. The Daleks were about to destroy all of creation, and the Doctor chastised his clone for killing them first. "He's too dangerous to be left on his own." I mean... really? What his clone did was nothing compared to wiping out both the Daleks and Time Lords at the same time.

There are so many things wrong with the scene where the TARDIS dragged the Earth back into place, but I'll pretend that scene never happened, save for the Doctor finally having a full crew to pilot his box.

Rose finally got her Doctor. Now here's hoping we never see her again.

By the by, the Doctor's an idiot. The only reason he's lonely is because he never goes back to visit any of his friends. He never visits Torchwood, even though he knows it's in Cardiff. He never visits Sarah Jane. Hell, he's got allies he made in other time periods that he never looks for.

If there's one thing I liked about Donna becoming a genius, it's that there was someone hanging around the Doctor who can do a little technological jiggery-pokery. I've got a few DVDs with Romana in them, and I loved that she "got" all the science, but was still young and inexperienced enough to serve as a sidekick. Give us a clever companion in 2010, Moffat.

[Gold Samurai]

I enjoyed the irony of the original Doc telling the other one he's committed genocide for killing all the Daleks, ignoring the fact that he did that himself to end the Time War. True we never saw it, but he admitted it himself in the first series (first new series. See "Dalek" and "Parting Of Ways")

and then theres the Racnoss


You'd think that incarnations like the First, Sixth, and Ninth Doctors would be the reason for an eventuality like the Valeyard. But you know what? I think it may actually be incarnations like the Fifth and Tenth. They're full of repressed rage and anger. Christ, man, go to a shrink and get some therapy. Face those demons. Have a jellybaby! Stop being such a killjoy.

[Manic]

I enjoyed the irony of the original Doc telling the other one he's committed genocide for killing all the Daleks, ignoring the fact that he did that himself to end the Time War. True we never saw it, but he admitted it himself in the first series (first new series. See "Dalek" and "Parting Of Ways")

and then theres the Racnoss


You'd think that incarnations like the First, Sixth, and Ninth Doctors would be the reason for an eventuality like the Valeyard. But you know what? I think it may actually be incarnations like the Fifth and Tenth. They're full of repressed rage and anger. Christ, man, go to a shrink and get some therapy. Face those demons. Have a jellybaby! Stop being such a killjoy.
The Valeyard is a potential future incarnation of the Doctor who condemned the Doctor for his past actions, right? Yeah, that sounds about right.

[The Lizard]

I've got a few DVDs with Romana in them, and I loved that she "got" all the science, but was still young and inexperienced enough to serve as a sidekick. Give us a clever companion in 2010, Moffat.

I would love, love, LOVE to see Romana return somehow. Lala Ward's too old to play her now of course, but with the right actress, a Romana episode could be fantastic.

Sarah Jane is a bit more like the Doctor than any of them, what with her preferring not to carry a gun, and surrounding herself with her own young companions.

Yes, Sarah Jane is still by far the best companion. Ever. Eat that, Rose.

[Manic]

Rose being the best companion is kinda laughable. She's not the best. She's just the only one in love with the Doctor. Grace was only attracted to him enough to kiss him, and Martha was over him as soon as she found a new man.

Rose was a ho who insisted that her life had to be spent only with the Doctor, but she had no problem calling up Mickey everytime she needed a good grind.

[SpideyLad]

lies...filthy lies!!

ice warriors, zygons, silurians, yeti, the REAL cybermen, proper auton invasions...and if all else fails you could always bring back something that was a good idea and done badly...

What about bringing back the REAL Macra aswell? And not the crappy de-evolved things we saw in 'Gridlock'. :cmad:

[Happenstance]

What im wondering now, is David Tennant now the 10th and 11th Doctor?

[SpideyLad]

What im wondering now, is David Tennant now the 10th and 11th Doctor?

Well, technically, he didn't actually regenerate, so probably not.

[Happenstance]

Yeah but he used the regeneration energy to heal so you'd think that would still count

[Pirateking]

I'm interested to see that Donna's ring has been mentioned again...it could have absorbed something and this paves the way for CT to come back in future episodes.

[COMPO]

i wonder who the bad guy for the next season will be I mean they always bring an old villain back:

Series 1: Daleks

Series 2: Cybermen

Series 3: The Master

Series 4: Davros

Who's next?

And I actually liek the Rose/Doctor romance and always wanted them to get together but, now that tehy are I don't know just don't like them together.

[chamber-music]

Also, I really hate Mickey and Martha, they should die.

Why kill off the ethnic minority characters? They should kill losers like Donna and Rose

[black_dust]

And I actually liek the Rose/Doctor romance and always wanted them to get together but, now that tehy are I don't know just don't like them together.

It was kinda forced i thought "this evil bastard is staying here with you, do with him what you will"

[union_jak]

Now that Donna has a part Timelord hidden inside her, does that mean she could regenerate when killed? Obviously she doesn't know about it all anymore, but if the slightest thing reminded her and, as The Doctor and Dalek Caan said she'd die, she could return briefly and regenerate as a result? Or is she still too human for all that?

[regwec]

How do we know that Caan's prophesy won't come to pass? Just because he said that one of the companions would die, it does not mean that it had to happen within the 60-odd minutes of that episode. Caan could concievably return in the future, as a kind of insane, rambling version of The Face of Bo, capable of moments of far-reaching forsight.

[Happenstance]

Now that Donna has a part Timelord hidden inside her, does that mean she could regenerate when killed? Obviously she doesn't know about it all anymore, but if the slightest thing reminded her and, as The Doctor and Dalek Caan said she'd die, she could return briefly and regenerate as a result? Or is she still too human for all that?

I think the only part of her that is timelord is her mind so she shouldnt really have the ability to regenerate

[livrule]

I think the only part of her that is timelord is her mind so she shouldnt really have the ability to regenerate

Exactly ...

Thats why the Dr had to clean her brain ... too much info, not enough space.

[SpideyLad]

Yeah but he used the regeneration energy to heal so you'd think that would still count

But, The Doctor's Regenerations always have side-effects. Nothing really happened here.

He clearly didn't Regenerate.

[The Englishman]

But, The Doctor's Regenerations always have side-effects. Nothing really happened here.

He clearly didn't Regenerate.
And im really glad he did'nt. I really hope thats it for Rose Tyler, her story is finished now so we dont need to see or hear about her again.....
Also has there been any news has to who the new companion is going to be for the specials, i think theres going to be 4 is'nt there including the Christmas special and im kind of hoping the doctor stays by himself for these until moffats reign starts, what do other people think??

[IronLion]

i think it is time to create a new 'classic' villain. a villain who can have an arc across a season and be a crdible threat.......just thinking about it, that old guy from the last couple of eps from the first series of torchwood, the time guy, he could be good. what do you people think?

[Lord Valumart]

i've said before and i'll say again...

Finch for the come back

[The Englishman]

Was Finch Anthony Head??

[Lord Valumart]

yes...finch was ASH...

[Manic]

Now that'd be an awesome recurring villain.

[The Englishman]

yes...finch was ASH...
Yes bring him back, he was excellent........

[black_dust]

im kind of hoping the doctor stays by himself for these until moffats reign starts, what do other people think??

Probs fresh start for everyone then

[The Squirrel]

Good episode. I don't have anything to say that hasn't already been stated.

[Logan's Lady]

I also think it would be great to have ASH back as villian..... he was awesome!!

I watched Journey's End again today. After seeing it last night I was really sad about Donna. Today I was able to put it all into perspective and though I still am sad about Donna, I really enjoyed the episode on a whole :)

[the_ultimate_evil]

i enjoyed it though i did think when rose ended up with the clone doc, i thought for god sake the fangirls have won

and seriously its a shame to get rid of donna that way, i don't see how anyone can say she isn't the best companion of the new show, its would have been interesting to see the doctor/donna character have a bit more time to develop. the part with her spouting doctor esq lines was superb and i don't like tates comedy


on the ASH topic when he was first cast was i the only one who thought he would be the master

[The Squirrel]

Who's ASH again?

[DX]

Anthony Stewart Head

[IronLion]

just watched the ep again on iplayer, and dalek caan says one of the compaanions will still die, yet one didnt. this could still happen in the future and who do you think it will be? also, the osterhagen key is still out there, for anyone to get hold of. the key to something so powerful was left there, on the floor.

i still think they should bring this guy back

Bilis Manger, played by English actor Murray Melvin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murray_Melvin), appears in the episodes "Captain Jack Harkness (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captain_Jack_Harkness_%28Torchwood_episode%29)",[19] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Torchwood_characters#cite_note-CJH-18) and "End of Days (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/End_of_Days_%28Torchwood%29)".[7] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Torchwood_characters#cite_note-EndofDays-6) Bilis has the ability to walk between 1941 and the present time and teleport at will, manipulating the Torchwood staff into a situation where they would have to completely open the Rift and release the deity he worships.
In "Captain Jack Harkness", he is shown to be the manager of a 1941 dance hall, and in the present day remains its caretaker, ostensibly co-operating with Gwen when she visits the now derelict venue searching for Jack and Toshiko. However, he scuppered Toshiko's plans back in 1941 to send the full second half of the equations needed to bring back her and Jack more safely, by scratching away the last part of the equation. He took photographs, though, to ensure that the team would locate them in the past and have to open the rift to rescue them. In "End of Days", he reappears, first as an apparition to Gwen, then, in his shop, A Stitch in Time, where he reveals that he is able to travel between eras at will. He then infiltrates the Torchwood base, stabbing Rhys (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Torchwood_characters#Rhys_Williams), spurring Gwen to once more open the rift to save everyone's lives, however, this full opening unwittingly releases Abaddon (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Torchwood_monsters_and_aliens#Abaddon). Moments later, Manger is found outside by the members of the team, telling them that his plan all along was to release Abaddon, which had been "chained under the rift", before vanishing again.
The Torchwood website hints that Bilis had already been involved with the Torchwood Institute at least once, drugging Owen with sodium pentathol (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_thiopental) (a truth serum (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truth_drug) and sedative) and retcon (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Torchwood_items#A) in order to get information about the institute.[32] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Torchwood_characters#cite_note-31) Indeed, he was seen in the series with a file folder marked 'Torchwood' in his 1941 desk.
The character returns in the spin-off novel The Twilight Streets (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Twilight_Streets) by Gary Russell (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Russell), apparently sponsoring the advertisement of a newly developed area of Cardiff.[33] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Torchwood_characters#cite_note-TwilightStreets-32) During this encounter, it is revealed that not only is he on the staff of Torchwood despite lacking any employee information- his hand print is granted full access in all Torchwood bases, but there is no record of his employment or specific role in the Institute- but also that his actions in releasing Abaddon were fundamentally benevolent, as Abaddon was required to stop sentient particles known as 'the Dark' that would corrupt the Torchwood team and drive them to turn against Jack to find a way of using the Rift to gain access to advanced technology. With the aid of the Torchwood team, Manger manages to defeat the Dark, and is last seen leaving on a train with a box that apparently contains Abaddon's ashes.[34] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Torchwood_characters#cite_note-33) Like all Torchwood spin-off media, the canonicity (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canon_%28fiction%29) of this novel in relation to the television series remains unclear.



make it look like he manipulated time to make it look like he was helping.

[FreeRadical]

Okay episode, but did anyone notice when Martha/Freema broke the 4th wall by smiling at the camera when they were all controlling the TARDIS?

[FreeRadical]

Okay episode, but did anyone notice when Martha/Freema broke the 4th wall by smiling at the camera when they were all controlling the TARDIS?

[IronLion]

the only companion who could die is donna, sjs has her own show so its not her, martha and mickey going to torchwood, so poss not them, rose in another dimension and will never (hopefully) be seen again.

[IronLion]

the only companion who could die is donna, sjs has her own show so its not her, martha and mickey going to torchwood, so poss not them, rose in another dimension and will never (hopefully) be seen again.

[Bastila]

You guys got too many pages to go though lol

But I did like the final loads, it was happy but sad.

Doctor Donna - loved it, her impressions of him where funny, great idea.
But......I really felt sad for Donna....to not remeber all that and when she woke and was like didn't even know who he was, I really felt sorry for her loads, but...he might be able to fix that and she might remeber one day...poor girl.
When the clone appeared she made me laugh she was like your naked lol haha

I think Tate really showed she could act, more then just comdy she did really prove herself, and I really liked her....her and Rose are my fave compaions.

Rose - well....I don't think she will love the clone as much as she does the real Doctor, its not the same but its second best, and he knew he could never stay with her, I bet he knew deeep inside he wanted to say he loved her, but knew it wasn't right and can't happen, so she got second best.
Heck if she doesn't want the clone I will :p but she kissed him, lucky girl...I want a doctor lol.
But it was sad and happy, yeah she got him in a way, but awww for the real doctor.

Was cool when everyone else was in the tardis was sweet.

Martha.................you still annoy me go die lol.


But well Mickey and Martha new torchwood members?????

But good final over all sad as well. But really liked this season loads more then last years, Tate was a great choice!


I want a doctor who avvy!!!! lol Must get one !

[regwec]

Okay episode, but did anyone notice when Martha/Freema broke the 4th wall by smiling at the camera when they were all controlling the TARDIS?
I wish she'd break the fourth wall by sucking my-

[union_jak]

Okay episode, but did anyone notice when Martha/Freema broke the 4th wall by smiling at the camera when they were all controlling the TARDIS?
She was smiling at the Doctor clone, who was sat to her left. Immediately after it happened the camera cut away to a long shot and you could clearly see she smiled at him. It's not breaking the 4th wall if the camera represents a character's perspective :yay:

[grey_jeanie]

the only companion who could die is donna, sjs has her own show so its not her, martha and mickey going to torchwood, so poss not them, rose in another dimension and will never (hopefully) be seen again.


I think Donna did die, or rather the strong, independant Donna who had realised her self-worth with the Doctor died leaving the shallow Donna we met in 2006. So she didn't technically die but in a way she did. That might be an explanation.

[Bastila]

I think Donna did die, or rather the strong, independant Donna who had realised her self-worth with the Doctor died leaving the shallow Donna we met in 2006. So she didn't technically die but in a way she did. That might be an explanation.

Thats how I see it, the Donna she grew into and the Donna the Doctor and the others know is now dead to them, and her family are living with the old one again, not the one they knew who grew up and became more independant etc like you said.

And in a way its sad as its like the most exciting thing that happened to her is now dead to her, and she will never know what she is capalbe or doing or knowing her inner strengh etc.

[grey_jeanie]

I know, I loved Donna and the character she grew into. In a way, that was almost more tragic a send-off than if she had died in battle alongside the Doctor living the life she loved. Thinking about it, it was such a depressing ending!!

[Bastila]

I know, I loved Donna and the character she grew into. In a way, that was almost more tragic a send-off than if she had died in battle alongside the Doctor living the life she loved. Thinking about it, it was such a depressing ending!!

I agree, I think in a way its worse then dieing, to live and not known when you've done, who you saved and her family to know it and not to see her as that 'Donna' again must be hard.
But I thought Donna was great, and Tate did so well with the character and she was always happy and trying to do the right/good thing and to have that ending like that was very sad on her.
But who knows one day she might unlock it and her head will explode lol.

[grey_jeanie]

Hurrah! It doesn't leave must scope for a reappearance does it? Not that I think they would bring her back.

[The Squirrel]

Anthony Stewart Head

Who did he play?

[union_jak]

The Headmaster of a school Sarah Jane was investigating. The teachers ate the pupils.

[Magneto29]

I finally got to finish watching the finale. I thought it was very good, cept that I felt that Rose and Donna got cheated in their goodbyes.
And the Doctor/Donna was a little annoying.

[JustABill]

Donna and Rose did get cheated.

[ihateusernames]

I don't quite understand one thing.
When Donna woke up, she was the loud mouth Donna we all dreaded coming to the show as a companion.

But in the episode where the time beetle made her choose a different path, she nevr met the Doctor, but still acted cool and collected like she has thought most of the series. Surly having never met the Doctor would cause her to be that Donna.

[Manic]

I don't quite understand one thing.
When Donna woke up, she was the loud mouth Donna we all dreaded coming to the show as a companion.

But in the episode where the time beetle made her choose a different path, she nevr met the Doctor, but still acted cool and collected like she has thought most of the series. Surly having never met the Doctor would cause her to be that Donna.
The Donna from "Turn Left" who never met the Doctor still had some of the real Donna's personality traits and character growth (as shown by her remaining collected and investigating the destruction of the Racnoss web-ship). This was probably because some remnant of the real Donna remained (she barely remembered the Doctor killing the Racnoss). However, she was still overall oblivious to the weird happenings around her, as shown by her not caring that Martha's hospital had disappeared. She was a mix of Donna having never met the Doctor, and the real Donna with a bug on her back.


If you all think about Donna losing her memory, it makes sense for what Caan and Davros pointed out about the Doctor's past companions. Sarah Jane, Rose, Mickey, and Martha had all become fighters. The Doctor tries to be such a pacifist, but when he constantly exposes his companions to some of the worst crap that could possibly happen throughout time and space, they become hard and ruthless. A woman who used to be a simple investigative journalist was holding the Dalek space station hostage with an exploding diamond necklace. A girl who used to fold shirts in a department store was walking across London with a big MF gun, as was a former automechanic and a middle aged mom. A young medical doctor was about to blow up the Earth. Then there were the flashbacks of allies the Doctor had used as cannon fodder (Jabe the tree, Lynda with a Y, Astrid, Jenny).

That couldn't happen to Donna. After seeing what everyone else had become, this was the only ending Donna could have. You know, other than actual death, as Caan predicted.

[ihateusernames]

Caan could have simpley ment death as in the Donna he knew would die, and she would return to how she was before he ever met her.

I still think, at some point, she's going to end up coming back though.
If Daleks can come back from the brink of extinction to a full scale army, Donna can come back for one episode.

It's anoying, because as much as I was dreading Tate in the show, she's become my fav companion of te new show, she really proved something to me as an actor and I have a new found respect for her.

Thats not to say I like her comedy, at all.

[Logan's Lady]

I know, I loved Donna and the character she grew into. In a way, that was almost more tragic a send-off than if she had died in battle alongside the Doctor living the life she loved. Thinking about it, it was such a depressing ending!!

I agree. I would have still been sad if she had died....... but it was more tragic the way it was written. I kept having dreams last night that the show ended differently and Donna stayed with The Doctor at the end.

[ttotheusher]

So, I've been putting off writing about my thoughts on the finale, letting it stew in my mind, before I spew off some wretched, ill-thought speech. And, of course, I've been browsing through the last few pages, seeing others reactions, and I've noticed a trend; people actually liked the episode.

Before I get into why I didnt, I'll point out the positives:

Julian Bleach as Davros. A fantastic performance, worthy of some sort of nomination. I like how his madness and rage slowly built up, rather than start him off as a bonkers mad genius. A fine example of how when RTD writes his characters well, and the actor is best suited, Doctor Who is better than most other programs.
The production team, from the practical effects, through to the set dressers, VFX artists, and the rest of the crew, did an outstanding job with this episode. I have no complaints with any of these last two episodes in terms of effects and visual presentation.
The performances were pretty standard I thought, with each actor giving it their best, althought too many characters spoiled the broth. Aside from Julian Bleach though, there was one more stand out. The legend that is Bernard Cribbins. Its an absolute crime how little screentime he got in comparison with, say, Rose or Martha's family. His elegance and grace on-screen eclipsed every other actor 10 times over.


So, overall, a fantastic job in terms of visuals and acting. However, no matter how great either of these were, nothing can save an episode when the root of the problem lies at its heart. I hate to say it again, but this episode was once again let down by Russel T Davies inability to excecute his promises, to provide a satisfactory conclusion for his setups. Heres why:

The Regeneration. Look, I'm ecstatic that Tennant is staying on. He will go down as one of the greatest Doctors ever. However, when a Regeneration starts, there should never be any going back from it. Ever. Its established mythology, and shouldnt be tampered with. I understand the need to keep Tennant on, and to have a cliffhanger for The Stolen Earth, but dont promise us an Regeration, and then let us down with a poor excuse for a Get-Out-Of-Jail free card.
The "death" of a companion. I pretty much have the same problem here as with the Regeneration; dont promise us something, and then use a poor cop-out to go back on it. You promise us a death, you deliver. Its as simple as that.
The convienent Deus Ex Machina. Again, it feels like RTD just makes things up as he goes along, not thinking about things in the long run. When it comes to finales, I want a sensible, well though out solution, one that has been planned and executed properly, not the piss-poor "meta crisis" excuse.


And, for the record, I dont mind when they through in snippets of mythology, building on things already established, such as the whole TARDIS is meant to be piloted by 6 people thing. That makes sense, and doesnt contradict anything said before. I guess, at the end of the day, I shouldnt of trusted RTD to deliver the finale we deserve, and beacause I did, and got my hopes up, I was let down once more.

[chamber-music]

RTD INTERVIEW
Russell T Davies is cross. The writer and executive producer of Doctor Who for the past five years rises to his full 6' 6" height and spits: "Little? You can call me many things but not little!"

The day before the fourth series of the top-rated show finished on Saturday, Davies is incensed by a comment piece in the Daily Mail in which Quentin Letts called him "an irksome little man with too high an opinion of himself and a tendency to proselytise for gay rights at every opportunity".



What has irked Davies most is not the gay line - though he has sharp words about that - but the mistake born, he says, of a lack of basic research. After five years masterminding the BBC drama phenomenon that is Doctor Who, the Welsh-born Davies is a well-known and, well, large presence in the TV industry. He is still going to write part of the five Doctor Who specials over the next two years. However, the next series, to be broadcast in 2010, will be overseen by Steven Moffat.

Forthright and unafraid of controversy, Davies is no stranger to public vitriol. In 2001 he received death threats for his ITV drama Bob and Rose, in which a gay man played by Alan Davies embarks on an affair with a woman played by Lesley Sharp. Police were involved and people he imagined to be a few "misogynist ... saddos in bedsits" had to be "warned off" by ITV. The idea of a gay man "betraying his sexuality" was too much for them, it seems. "[They] treated me like the betrayer of the cause, like I'd let down homosexuality."

And there was also the time when he says he spent "about three weeks solid sitting in various radio studios" defending his Channel 4 drama Queer as Folk. He seems proudest of having an American who claimed to cure homosexuality barred from a Five Live discussion with him when he asked the producer whether she would be happy to have Davies baby-sit her children.

"I love having debates with people when they are debates but some people, you just can't," says Davies. "Some people shouldn't be given the oxygen."

After this sort of history, Doctor Who must have come as a surprise, with fewer harrumphs than Davies was expecting - or perhaps actually wanted. "There was not really a whisper about that," he says of the inclusion of the bisexual Captain Jack Harkness (who at one point planted a smacker on the Doctor's face). He adds, for good measure, that there were "actually a low number of gay characters compared with heterosexual characters".

He sounds triumphant when he says: "The Daily Mail didn't complain, and there weren't any other official complaints. No complaint could have been upheld about it anyway because it was done with a sense of humour and [Captain Jack actor] John was indefatigable about it."

He makes [B]no apology for what the Mail sees as his proselytising for homosexuality. "I love the fact that that inflames people. But they can't stop me," he chuckles scornfully, about those he regards as inhabiting the "dark corners of the internet".

The arguments he says he won't miss are with people who question Doctor Who's emotional element.

"It's a drama, he's a character with a full emotional range. It is a very science fiction thing to separate the plot off and dissect a story and talk about, I don't know, the 57 emotional lines spoken by the Doctor."

He has been as critical of a tiny but vocal minority of Whovians as he is of the Daily Mail, calling them "mosquitoes". Even at the end of his tenure he continues to express regret that some of the obsessives "dominate the agenda".

"They are not real fandom, though, they are a core of mostly men who like to complain. Fandom is bigger and richer than that, and they are only about 1,000 people who give everyone else a bad name and build their life around a show."

In fact, he says if he had his time again there is "nothing" he would do differently on Doctor Who. However, he admits that the year-round schedule has been "exhausting". He always planned to work on the show for four or five years, the longest he has pursued any one project.

"I have done everything I want to do with it. I love it," he says, brimming with enthusiasm for a show he fell in love with when he was a child, dreaming of finding the Doctor waiting to take him as his next companion. "It is a very adult longing too, to escape everything."

He will miss it, of course, but he is relishing the next series, which he can finally watch as "a fan - the first time in 21 years". He has insisted that he is not sent any preview DVDs so that he can watch it live along with everybody else. He is full of praise for his successor and is confident the show is in safe hands. Besides, "it would still be a wonderful man fighting a bunch of monsters".

It's hard to have a favourite episode, he says, though if pushed he would name the one just broadcast: "Others, well you can see little bits of influences, bits of Buffy perhaps, a bit of Star Wars maybe, but this was pure Doctor Who. It was mad."

As we saw on Saturday, David Tennant lives to fight on in another Christmas special, which will be set in Victorian England and feature the Cybermen, as well as four other specials which begin filming in 2009. But Davies refuses to say whether Tennant will return when the full series returns in 2010, except that he has made his decision and that the BBC knows what it is. There's no point asking Davies, therefore, about rumours that James Nesbitt or Robert Carlyle will be taking control of the sonic screwdriver.

He is not a man to shy away from controversial comments, and says Tennant's eventual replacement should not be female. "I am often tempted to say yes to that to placate everyone but, while I think kids will not have a problem with [a female Doctor], I think fathers will have a problem with it because they will then imagine they will have to describe sex changes to their children.

"I think fathers can describe sex changes to their children and I think they should and it's part of the world, but I think it would simply introduce genitalia into family viewing. You're not talking about actresses or style, you're talking about genitalia, and a lot of parents would get embarrassed."

Typically though, Davies can't help imagining Lesley Sharp or Judi Dench in the role, adding that he thinks Amy Winehouse would be "brilliant".

[Bastila]

Donna and Rose did get cheated.

Yeah in a way they did, everyone else walked off happy, Donna really got cheated, not to remeber anything like that was harsh and for her family to know what she became and what she done.
Rose was left with second best really, she'll love him, but not as much as she loves the real one. And I felt sorry for the Doctor when she kissed the other one, but in a way its happy and sad.

[TheCorpulent1]

Eh, the second part of the finale was a series of let-downs for me. Some of it was good, but it definitely didn't live up to the promise of the first part. And now the Doctor's alone again, which is pretty much always boring, and Donna can never come back, which is a shame. The teaser for the Christmas special sucked, too. Oh noes, the Cybermen return?!?! Big ****ing whoop, they're as overused and boring as the Daleks at this point.

[ttotheusher]

Talking from personal experiance (seriously), Donna's fate really wasnt all that bad. She's alive, for one, and (here's the personal experiance) having good memories and then living an ordinary life is worse than never having those memories at all.

[TheCorpulent1]

Yeah, it didn't work out too bad for Donna because she doesn't remember anything. You can't miss what you don't know you had. It's much harder on poor old Wilf, who has to shoulder the burden of knowing how brilliant Donna was with the Doctor while she slogs through a mundane life for the rest of her days.

[Captain_BluTac]

Okay episode, but did anyone notice when Martha/Freema broke the 4th wall by smiling at the camera when they were all controlling the TARDIS?


I noticed it, but assumed it was intentional.

[TheCorpulent1]

Yeah, or you could interpret it as Martha smiling at whoever was standing next to her, since all the characters were crowded around the same console, and the camera just got in the way.

[ttotheusher]

Yeah, it didn't work out too bad for Donna because she doesn't remember anything. You can't miss what you don't know you had. It's much harder on poor old Wilf, who has to shoulder the burden of knowing how brilliant Donna was with the Doctor while she slogs through a mundane life for the rest of her days.

I'll say it again, what a travesty it was to waste Bernard Cribbins. Fantastic performance.

[TheCorpulent1]

It's too bad Wilf couldn't be a companion.

[black_dust]

It's too bad Wilf couldn't be a companion.

Yeah Wilf was awesome

[ttotheusher]

I would of been quite happy if all this season's episodes had been set on Earth just so he was featured more.

[TheCorpulent1]

Well, I wouldn't go that far.

[Lord Valumart]

The teaser for the Christmas special sucked, too. Oh noes, the Cybermen return?!?! Big ****ing whoop, they're as overused and boring as the Daleks at this point.

the cybermen have always been much worse than the daleks imo...they were us...the daleks weren't

but the reason they suck in the new series is cause they were done wrong...so very wrong:csad:

[TheCorpulent1]

It doesn't matter who they were or where they came from. If you make them a major villain in every season, they become boring, just like the Daleks have. The Doctor's little song and dance about how these Daleks were to be feared more because they're the true Dalek Empire sounded like crap and turned out to be crap when Donna and half-Doctor waltzed in and owned their entire race by pushing buttons.

[Lord Valumart]

the cybermen will only have been in 5 eps inculding the christmas special...

the daleks will have been in 8 and only in one of thsoe eps have they showed any sort of threat...

if they were to write the villians better then we would get an actual threat for the dr to have to stop...

[ttotheusher]

For me, the Master has been the best villian. He actually accomplished something, and would of gotten away with it too, if it wasnt for those meddling companions. :cmad:

[TheCorpulent1]

Yeah, the Master rocked pretty hard. I'm still pissed that they perma-killed him off. I know they can bring him back, but then they have to devise some flimsy plot device to do it and jump through all sorts of hoops when they could've done... well, anything other than have him die in the Doctor's arms and brought him back much more simply.

[ttotheusher]

I also hated the fact that they reversed everything. It would of been cooler if the Doctor stopped the Master, and left it in ruins, for the humans to fix and sort out.

[Lord Valumart]

you just know that if the humans were left to fix it it would have went all to hell and even more people would be dead...

[DX]

the cybermen will only have been in 5 eps inculding the christmas special...

the daleks will have been in 8 and only in one of thsoe eps have they showed any sort of threat...

if they were to write the villians better then we would get an actual threat for the dr to have to stop...
And that episode was?

[Lord Valumart]

And that episode was?

that would be Dalek...

where a singular dalek wipes out almost an entire underground strage area but somehow misses todd from corrie:huh:

[DX]

that would be Dalek...

where a singular dalek wipes out almost an entire underground strage area but somehow misses todd from corrie:huh:
So, stealing Earth and using it to destroy reality wasn't threatening? :huh:

[Lord Valumart]

So, stealing Earth and using it to destroy reality wasn't threatening? :huh:

not really...

when they have plans it usually goes to hell and not much really gets done...but when they're pissed off and go on killing sprees lots gets done

[Lord Valumart]

So, stealing Earth and using it to destroy reality wasn't threatening? :huh:

not really...

when they have plans it usually goes to hell and not much really gets done...but when they're pissed off and go on killing sprees lots gets done

[chamber-music]

The darleks did fire bomb that house with the family inside. Also It would be cool to see the Galatic Police after the Doctor now because he ditched them.

[TheCorpulent1]

I do kind of like the Judoon, actually.

[ttotheusher]

Small curiosity about The Stolen Earth: why wern't the Judoon translated by the TARDIS?

[Lord Valumart]

Small curiosity about The Stolen Earth: why wern't the Judoon translated by the TARDIS?

just we we could get the dr saying "jo blo ro co no so jo do etc" i'd assume...

[ttotheusher]

just we we could get the dr saying "jo blo ro co no so jo do etc" i'd assume...

Well, I knew that (the Judoon are actually an in-joke with the writers; getting Tennant, a Scot, to say "Judoon Platoon on the Moon") but I would have liked an explanation.

[Lord Valumart]

Well, I knew that (the Judoon are actually an in-joke with the writers; getting Tennant, a Scot, to say "Judoon Platoon on the Moon") but I would have liked an explanation.

er...the shadow proclimation lot's tech makes all other tech void:huh:

[The Englishman]

er...the shadow proclimation lot's tech makes all other tech void:huh:
Yeah thats a good one i'll accept that one.....

[Lord Valumart]

Yeah thats a good one i'll accept that one.....

i'm using that post to claim i am better than RTD...

[ttotheusher]

Edit: Double Post

[DX]

not really...

when they have plans it usually goes to hell and not much really gets done...but when they're pissed off and go on killing sprees lots gets done
Yeah, but what does get done and what they plan to do is pretty dangerous...

[ttotheusher]

According to the podcast for The Doctor's Daughter, the idea to ressurect Jenny came from Steven Moffat, which suggests that he wishes to use her when he takes over. Or, he knows how much fanboys like me enjoying watching her :woot:

[TheCorpulent1]

Or he just doesn't like a lot of death in Doctor Who. It's a kids' show first and foremost, after all.

[Gallagher]

A kids show designed to scare the living **** out them. :o

Anywho, just caught the finale...

It's met with a big resounding 'meh'. Although I did enjoy Catherine Tate in this episode which is a first.

[regwec]

The Jadoon are pretty good. They have great great potential as a recurring plot element.

[Savage]

Well that was depressing...I enjoyed the episode, don't get me wrong. It's just that this whole season has felt kind of "meh" to me. Especially when you compare it to season 3. Good stuff though. Show's that even when Doctor Who's not so great it's still better than 90% of the crap that's on TV anyway.

[FreeRadical]

A kids show designed to scare the living **** out them. :o

Anywho, just caught the finale...

It's met with a big resounding 'meh'. Although I did enjoy Catherine Tate in this episode which is a first.

I thought it was kind of meh as well.

Poor Doctor, TARDIS full of people then he's all by himself again....

[Magneto29]

He looked depressed at the end :( "Everyone else has someone else". Poor Doctor.

[The Question]

Yeah, the Master rocked pretty hard. I'm still pissed that they perma-killed him off. I know they can bring him back, but then they have to devise some flimsy plot device to do it and jump through all sorts of hoops when they could've done... well, anything other than have him die in the Doctor's arms and brought him back much more simply.

Hell, they could have just had him grab Jack's wrist thingy and transport away after getting shot. Although, I'm really of hoping that they'll eventually have The Rani use that ring thing to bring him back, and I'm glad that if he's coming back, it'll probably be through her. I'd like to see The Master somehow resurrect the rest of The Deca and just start stalking The Doctor. His twisted view of a school reunion.

[TheCorpulent1]

Well, how would the Rani have survived if the Master and the Doctor were supposedly the last Time Lords? They already used the "hiding as human" bit for the Master.

Also, I was thinking how cool it would be if it turned out the human-Doctor could regenerate, and Rose couldn't bring him back from being all vengeful and mean, and he eventually regenerates into the Valeyard.
He looked depressed at the end :( "Everyone else has someone else". Poor Doctor.
I couldn't really feel too bad for him, to be honest. He kind of discards people all the bloody time. He knew Jack was fine and never even bothered to pop in and say hi. He's left various other companions for one reason or another over the years. He's like a force of nature, uncaring and impartial. He may love you one minute, but he'll wind up leaving your ass sooner or later.

[ihateusernames]

But I don't think it's an intentional "leave you in the dust" kind of thing.
I mean, this is a guy who travels around in a spaceship, and can go anywhere he wants, anytime, any place.
I have trouble seeing my friends once every two weeks and all I do is go to work and play computer games, prey tell what my social life would be like if I where a timelord.

Oh, and he does have a tendancy to have the people around him die, so I can understand him not wanting to see many of his friends (apart form Jack, who can't die or have his clothing burnt in an incinarator).

I did feel bad, he has his small group of friends who all have someone else, and he was left with no one, everyone seems to think he's happy, but he's not.

Regardless, I just re-watched the finale, and I relaised how much I'm gonna miss Donna, she really has been the best companion this shows had these past 4 series', and it really upset me watching the scene where she realises whats going on and whats going to happen :(

[Manic]

Like I keep saying, the Doctor wouldn't be so damn gloomy all the time if he took a little effort. He knows where his friends and former companions live. Well, the ones that are still alive.

[IronLion]

watch the trailer again, for xmas that is, and we see tennant looking worried/shocked/scared, we see morrissey, then we see the irish acctress in red (forgot her name) but she has a wry smile, almost evil smirk, on her face, while the victorian men in the background are running away, in what looks like fear. she could be the person who has brought back the cybermen!!!!!! i'm not going to say the name, but could she have THAT ring????

we all know jenny didnt die and she came back to life, but the dr doesnt, as we saw in the flashbacks, as mentioned before, i feel she will be the new companion. the father/daughter dynamic could lead to some great stories and interaction.

tecnically the dr has used a regen, that would only leave him two. i cant remeber if this was addressed or not, but he has just used one so really he has 1 less. cant wait for when we get to dr 12 and it comes up to regen time, i would like to see them explain!!!!

[TheCorpulent1]

I'd love for Jenny to be the next companion. Sally Sparrow would also be great. The Doctor having a series-long male companion would be novel, too. Most likely, though, we'll get an entirely new woman.
But I don't think it's an intentional "leave you in the dust" kind of thing.
I mean, this is a guy who travels around in a spaceship, and can go anywhere he wants, anytime, any place.
I have trouble seeing my friends once every two weeks and all I do is go to work and play computer games, prey tell what my social life would be like if I where a timelord.
The Doctor's not actually tied down to any consistent responsibilities, unlike you. His TARDIS travels through time, so he could easily avert the same disasters on a different day (relative to him) and pop in for a visit to his ex-companions if he really wanted to. Having a machine that can travel literally anywhere means that he's choosing not to visit his old companions.

Granted, he is getting a bit better. He accepted Martha's phone and comes when she calls him, which is a start.

[IronLion]

Well, how would the Rani have survived if the Master and the Doctor were supposedly the last Time Lords? They already used the "hiding as human" bit for the Master.





maybe she was trapped in the medusa cascade, and escaped with one of the other planets, then went through time to the 'funeral' of the master to get the ring.

[JustABill]

I'd love for a familiar face to be the next full time companion. I'm not ready for a new woman yet. The only way I'd look forward to a new face would be if it was a male full time companion.

Doesn't matter anyways, whoever they are they'll become a part of The Doctor's extend family, and he'll continue to be the deadbeat uncle that doesn't show up until it's the end of the world aka family reunion time.

[TheCorpulent1]

maybe she was trapped in the medusa cascade, and escaped with one of the other planets, then went through time to the 'funeral' of the master to get the ring.
Hmm. Interesting...

Really, I just wish they'd end the last special with some hint that the Time Lords are still alive somehow, and then devote the fifth series to the Doctor and whoever his next companion is seeking them out. I think the show could really benefit from a series-long, overarching direction. Isn't that one of the things that made The Key to Time one of the best series? (I'm really asking; I haven't seen it yet.)

[JustABill]

Hmm. Interesting...

Really, I just wish they'd end the last special with some hint that the Time Lords are still alive somehow, and then devote the fifth series to the Doctor and whoever his next companion is seeking them out. I think the show could really benefit from a series-long, overarching direction. Isn't that one of the things that made The Key to Time one of the best series? (I'm really asking; I haven't seen it yet.)
Wow. That would make an interesting series long storyline for him and Jenny as his companion. Father/daughter traveling through time and space to find their next of kin. :up:

[TheCorpulent1]

Yeah, dude. Maybe pick Jack back up for a few episodes when they face the Rani or some other evil Time Lord.

[ttotheusher]

Yeah, dude. Maybe pick Jack back up for a few episodes when they face the Rani or some other evil Time Lord.

Jack would probably try to sleep with The Rani. :woot:

[JustABill]

Lol. I loved how Jack is practically sexually free and will toss anyone in the sheets with him, except when it comes to Donna. That was priceless. :up:

[IronLion]

Lol. I loved how Jack is practically sexually free and will toss anyone in the sheets with him, except when it comes to Donna. That was priceless. :up:

donna did come across a bit desperate, didnt she.

[TheCorpulent1]

Haha, yeah, that was a nice running gag.

[ttotheusher]

Jack's line about a foursome with the 3 Doctors did make me chuckle.

[JustABill]

I also liked Corpulent's idea about The Clone Doctor actually being able to regenerate after all and becoming The Valeyard. It'd allow for Rose to come back and be over this silly love romance thing for The Doctor when she sees how he could have been. I feel when I watch series 1 and early series two of Doctor, I'm watching best friends who share a deep friend love and not love of lovers, but T. Davies apparently thinks like all fan girls and thinks you can't ''love" a friend deeply, so he had that terrible Bad Wolf Bay scene at the end of this finale.

Donna could also come back through maybe finally finding Lee, her perfect man, which then triggers her time lord mind and nearly kills her, sending The Doctor, his current companion and the Tardis to her rescue. At the end of the episode, Donna could choose to stay with Lee and have her memories back for an even further future return.

[Lord Valumart]

It'd allow for Rose to come back

no...just no...

[JustABill]

Look. I'm fine with her not coming back again, I'd like to see it, but I wouldn't be as bad as a fan girl if she never came bac. My point is the ''romance" between The Doctor/Rose was so tacked on by RTD when he realized ''Oh, Tennant's attractive. Piper's attractive. That's it...let's turn this into a romance story."

I want that abolished, there were many times before the terrible closing scene at Bad Wolf Bay, where Rose and The Doctor both denied they are anything but friends, of course people who are in love but afraid to tell one another do that all the time, but with Rose and The Doctor it was vague enough before the kiss between Rose and The Clone in Journey's End that you could interpet that they just loved one another as friends.

Instead T. Davies catered to the fan girl's interpetation of their relationship and had her kiss him. I hate any kind of romantic story between The Doctor and his companion. It's one of the reasons I wasn't as big of a fan as Martha before her return this season. The idea of The Doctor picking up girls hundreds of years younger than him and wanting to lay them to bed is gross, at least with Martha it ended in a way where it was abolished. I just want that for Rose, when Rose's ''romantic" relationship with The Doctor was more vague than Martha's ever was.

PS: Never understood your hate for Rose. She's by far not the best companion of all the companions, but she's one of the better ones. There are few companions I remember and would enjoy a come back (Ace, Brig, Sarah Jane, Peri, Romana, Donna, etc.) You make her sound like the worst companion when everyone knows that's Adric.

[Logan's Lady]

Wow. That would make an interesting series long storyline for him and Jenny as his companion. Father/daughter traveling through time and space to find their next of kin. :up:
ugh no...... I don't want to see Jenny anymore.
I just hated the whole Doctor's Daughter episode.... it was horrible

Lol. I loved how Jack is practically sexually free and will toss anyone in the sheets with him, except when it comes to Donna. That was priceless. :up:
*giggle* yeah that was funny
donna did come across a bit desperate, didnt she.
She's all... hug me no really hug me :cmad:

[Lord Valumart]

the mistake of the rtd era ws creating the dr as a sexual being...

that should not have happened cause it's just not fitting with anything else, it's slightly creepy, and anyhow davison was more attractive...

and my hate for rose comes from the constant "zomgz teh roze rulzz loolz!!!111!!" crap i've heard from the OG...also she was annoying and i was happy when she was going to die and pissed when she ended up in pete's world...to bad some of pete's awesome didn;t rub off on her :O

[Lord Valumart]

She's all... hug me no really hug me :cmad:

i would have...even if i did have ianto to go back to i'd still hug her...

[TheCorpulent1]

I actually love Martha now. Seriously, if series 3 had just not had her pining for the Doctor every five minutes, I think it would've been one of the absolute best Doctor Who series ever. Certainly the best of the revamp.

[Logan's Lady]

i would have...even if i did have ianto to go back to i'd still hug her...

Well of course you would have hugged her... :whatever:
We all know your undeniable, unwaining love for Catherine Tate. :oldrazz:

[JustABill]

So far I rank the series...

1. Series Two
2. Series Four (Could have been first had it not been for the craptastic endings for Rose/Donna.)
3. Series Three (Martha's pining, and the terrible overacting to the point he wasn't threatening of The Master ruined this from being just as classic as four and two.)
4. Series One

[Lord Valumart]

Well of course you would have hugged her... :whatever:
We all know your undeniable, unwaining love for Catherine Tate. :oldrazz:

the world needs more large breasted redheads...

[JustABill]

Oh, and I also love Martha as well. She's become such an awesome character since her departure from The Doctor. Shame she's so dead set against traveling with him again. Oh well, at least she'll be in a hopefully ten times better Torchwood.

The finale even made me like Mickey and I loathed him since day one.

[Logan's Lady]

The finale even made me like Mickey and I loathed him since day one.

ugh no..... Mickey will always be the tin dog to me.....

I liked Rickey MUCH better :up:

[TheCorpulent1]

I started liking Mickey in series 2 when he started traveling with the Doctor and Rose. I really, really wish they'd quit limiting the Doctor to just one companion ach series. Two makes it much more interesting.

[JustABill]

I hated him when he was traveling with them, because instead of growing stronger as a character and getting over his whining over Rose traveling with The Doctor, he just switched over to whining about The Doctor picking Rose over him. He was much better portrayed in the brief bits he got in Journey's End. I hope that continues if he joins Torchwood. :up:

[union_jak]

How about if he travels alone for the specials and spends series 5 with a non-human brother and sister? So far it's always been females from Earth and that is getting a bit samey. Donna was slightly different in that she didn't swoon over him though.

Having said that, I would love it if he spent the series with his daughter searching for answers about the Time War/repercussions of Dalek Caan entering and altering events in the sealed off period. They need to cover the Time War sooner or later, before people stop caring at all. Maybe in a special McGann flashback episode the 10th Doctor can remember back to events during the war and deal with it.

[JustABill]

It would be kinda interesting if The Rani was the bad girl next series. Of course, then you could have her be the one that picked up the Master's Ring, but the way I would do it is to introduce a new companion have him travel with her throughout the entire series, then bam...end of the series she suddenly regenerates and announces herself as The Rani.

[TheCorpulent1]

I'd love a non-human companion. The new Doctor Who series feels very, very Earth-centric, which I don't like too much.

[SpideyLad]

So far I rank the series...

1. Series Two
2. Series Four (Could have been first had it not been for the craptastic endings for Rose/Donna.)
3. Series Three (Martha's pining, and the terrible overacting to the point he wasn't threatening of The Master ruined this from being just as classic as four and two.)
4. Series One

Series One as the worst?!

NO MORE OPINION'S FOR YOU!!!!!!! :cmad: :cmad:

[JustABill]

It's by no means the worst. It's just it's the series I enjoyed the least. Perhaps cause I was still new to Doctor Who and hadn't watched any of the old stuff, like I have now, and it was just so ''weird" to me. That and I prefer Tennant to Eccelston, but in no means was series 1 ''bad." It's just the one I enjoyed the least.

[Captain_BluTac]

I'd rather the fifth series to have a visibly alien companion even if it was just something lazy like freckly neck from star trek, or maybe even a companion from Earth's past I.E a woman from the 1920's.

[TheCorpulent1]

I can't really rate them as whole series. Every series has a lot of mundane episodes. A few have really remarkable episodes amidst a lot of boring other episodes, a few are generally good with only one or two stand-out episodes, and a few had really interesting ideas that just didn't pan out too well.

[Captain_BluTac]

Series One as the worst?!

NO MORE OPINION'S FOR YOU!!!!!!! :cmad: :cmad:

YOU BEAT ME TO IT!:cmad::cmad:

[JustABill]

Do I have to say it again? I didn't rank them in terms of ''Worst." It's from terms of which I enjoyed the least.

[chamber-music]

I'd rather the fifth series to have a visibly alien companion even if it was just something lazy like freckly neck from star trek, or maybe even a companion from Earth's past I.E a woman from the 1920's.

They should give him a confused cavewoman for a companion again :whatever:

[TheCorpulent1]

I've seen one episode with Leela and she already started annoying me.

[Captain_BluTac]

They should give him a confused cavewoman for a companion again :whatever:

Oh yeah "a posh cavewoman" that's really what I want.

[Dope Nose]

since the Doctor clone is part human does he possess "that gut instinct that comes hand in hand with planet Earth"? is it possible that he's an even better Doctor than the original?

[Lord Valumart]

since the Doctor clone is part human does he possess "that gut instinct that comes hand in hand with planet Earth"? is it possible that he's an even better Doctor than the original?

is it possible that you'll live for long now?

[regwec]

Hmm. Interesting...

Really, I just wish they'd end the last special with some hint that the Time Lords are still alive somehow, and then devote the fifth series to the Doctor and whoever his next companion is seeking them out. I think the show could really benefit from a series-long, overarching direction. Isn't that one of the things that made The Key to Time one of the best series? (I'm really asking; I haven't seen it yet.)
Hmmm. That sounds familiar. :cwink:

[Dope Nose]

is it possible that you'll live for long now?

Donna said that she could come up with ideas that the Doctor wouldn't think of in a million years because she has a human gut instinct. if the Doctor clone inherited that instinct from Donna then shouldn't it stand to reason that he could also come up with ideas that the original Doctor wouldn't think of?

I wonder if the clone with still go by the Doctor or if he'll pick a human name like John Smith.

[TheCorpulent1]

Hmmm. That sounds familiar. :cwink:
I don't get it. I'm a Doctor Who newb. :(

[Logan's Lady]

I wonder if the clone with still go by the Doctor or if he'll pick a human name like John Smith.

I say that Rose won't let him pick a name....... she's to used to Doctor.
But then again, the real Rose wouldn't have settled for a Doctor clone either :dry:
so, who really knows :huh:

[TheCorpulent1]

The "real Rose"? :huh:

[Logan's Lady]

The "real Rose"? :huh:

Meaning that the way RTD wrote her character in the finale wasn't correct. Rose shouldn't ever have settled for Doctor Clone

[TheCorpulent1]

Er... okay, whatever. Rose and the Doctor don't ever need to be in love as far as I'm concerned. Even her getting with the human-Doctor was too much for me, but at least it's out of sight in an alternate reality.

[The Englishman]

I was a bit gutted when Ross the UNIT soldier died in the poison sky, i thought he had potential to be a good companion,an example being them both going to the Rattigan mansion, some good banter between them.
Also i always thought the U.N.I.T stood for United Nations Intelligence Taskforce not Unified Intelligence Taskforce???

[TheCorpulent1]

Yeah, I liked that dude. I also liked Tim from the academy when the Doctor turned human, but he obviously has to live out his life and go to war and such. Nice that the Doctor came and visited him later in life, though.

[Dope Nose]

Also i always thought the U.N.I.T stood for United Nations Intelligence Taskforce not Unified Intelligence Taskforce???

from Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.N.I.T.):

Following the broadcast of the 2005 series, executive producer Russell T. Davies explained that the real life United Nations were no longer happy to be associated with the fictional organisation, and the UN's full name could no longer be used. However, the "UNIT" and "UN" abbreviations can be used, as long as it is not explained what the letters stand for. In 2008, he announced that the organisation's name has been changed to the "Unified Intelligence Taskforce".

[The Englishman]

from Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.N.I.T.):

Following the broadcast of the 2005 series, executive producer Russell T. Davies explained that the real life United Nations were no longer happy to be associated with the fictional organisation, and the UN's full name could no longer be used. However, the "UNIT" and "UN" abbreviations can be used, as long as it is not explained what the letters stand for. In 2008, he announced that the organisation's name has been changed to the "Unified Intelligence Taskforce".
Thats Bollocks!!!! ****ing United Nations pile of **** orginization!!!!:cmad:

[regwec]

I don't get it. I'm a Doctor Who newb. :(
I had the same ideas a few pages ago. But I forgot to patent them, alas.

[The Englishman]

Yeah, I liked that dude. I also liked Tim from the academy when the Doctor turned human, but he obviously has to live out his life and go to war and such. Nice that the Doctor came and visited him later in life, though.
Or Chris from Skins, he can come with added Jenny....:cwink:

[TheCorpulent1]

I had the same ideas a few pages ago. But I forgot to patent them, alas.
Oh, sorry. I don't think I intentionally plagiarized you, at least.

[regwec]

The United Nations is lame. It's a gaggle of ageing 1960s sociology students embezzling charitable donations while lecturing us on why we can't shoot Robert Mugabe in the face.

[regwec]

I'm flattered that our ideas are shared, comrade.

[The Englishman]

The United Nations is lame. It's a gaggle of ageing 1960s sociology students embezzling charitable donations while lecturing us on why we can't shoot Robert Mugabe in the face.
Yes Robert Mugabe should be shot in the face....

[DX]

edit

[DX]

Meaning that the way RTD wrote her character in the finale wasn't correct. Rose shouldn't ever have settled for Doctor Clone
Why? He's pretty much the same person except he's human...he still looks and thinks the same as the Time Lord Doctor. :huh:

[Lord Valumart]

I had the same ideas a few pages ago. But I forgot to patent them, alas.

i'm pretty sure that that same idea has been brought up ever time a series has ended:huh:

[TheCorpulent1]

Maybe Moffat will hear our collective thoughts like the Doctor at the end of series 3.

[Lord Valumart]

maybe moffat will HAIL THE HYPNOTOAD!!!!

[ttotheusher]

So far I rank the series...

1. Series Two
2. Series Four (Could have been first had it not been for the craptastic endings for Rose/Donna.)
3. Series Three (Martha's pining, and the terrible overacting to the point he wasn't threatening of The Master ruined this from being just as classic as four and two.)
4. Series One

If were ranking them:

Series Three (Its the Master and The Family of Blood episodes that clinch it for me.)
Series Four (I liked Tate alot more than I thought, and episodes like the Vesuvius ones are some of the best since the revivial)
Series One (I thought Eccleston was fantastic)
Series Two (The Cybermen sucked)

[regwec]

I don't think there is any doubt that the production values and the editing of the programme has improved since the first episode; I think that the low-brow elements seen in series one (burping waste bins, farting aliens) were the result of a concern that the franchise would lack mass appeal nowadays. It all seems slicker and more self-assured today, to the extent that I feel able to expect an episode of Doctor Who to be more entertaining than it is embarassing.

So, in a certain sense, I think that each series has been better than the last. With that said, I think that Eccleston did a brilliant job in holding together a show that had yet to find its feet, and which was really a massive financial gamble with public money. On the other hand, I prefer Martha to either Rose or Donna (I am willing to admit this is largely a sexual thing), and I think that the finale to series 2 was very flat. I have also grown to like Tennant more with time.

So, all in all, my picks would be: 4,3,1,2.

[SpideyLad]

Donna said that she could come up with ideas that the Doctor wouldn't think of in a million years because she has a human gut instinct. if the Doctor clone inherited that instinct from Donna then shouldn't it stand to reason that he could also come up with ideas that the original Doctor wouldn't think of?

I wonder if the clone with still go by the Doctor or if he'll pick a human name like John Smith.

Gut instinct can lead to very bad things happening though...

The Real Doctor is far better than a clone....

[TheCorpulent1]

So, in a certain sense, I think that each series has been better than the last. With that said, I think that Eccleston did a brilliant job in holding together a show that had yet to find its feet, and which was really a massive financial gamble with public money. On the other hand, I prefer Martha to either Rose or Donna (I am willing to admit this is largely a sexual thing), and I think that the finale to series 2 was very flat. I have also grown to like Tennant more with time.
I've enjoyed Tennant more with each season, too. It's at the point now where I go back to Eccleston's Doctor and I'm surprised at how un-Doctorish he feels. Although I still love his final episode.

[ttotheusher]

I've enjoyed Tennant more with each season, too. It's at the point now where I go back to Eccleston's Doctor and I'm surprised at how un-Doctorish he feels. Although I still love his final episode.

I think that for once, RTD's reasoning behind this is solid. He's explained many times that the 9th Doctor just came out of the Time War, and was battle hardened and angry and miserable because of it.

[Gold Samurai]

Meaning that the way RTD wrote her character in the finale wasn't correct. Rose shouldn't ever have settled for Doctor Clone

I kind of compare it to when the 9th doctor regenerated to 10 she wanted the old doctor back but after awhile she quickly settled into doctor 10

[chamber-music]

I've enjoyed Tennant more with each season, too. It's at the point now where I go back to Eccleston's Doctor and I'm surprised at how un-Doctorish he feels. Although I still love his final episode.
Tennant was born to play The Doctor. He really is one of the best in the role IMO.
Or Chris from Skins, he can come with added Jenny....:cwink:
Jenny needs to comeback to make up for the ugly that is catherine Tate.

[ttotheusher]

Jenny needs to comeback to make up for the ugly that is catherine Tate.

I'll second, third, and fourth that opinion. :grin:

[JustABill]

Looks should be the least important thing about a companion, Donna proved that, when she turned out to be probably the best companion of the new series so far, IMO.

Jenny should come back, but not because of her looks, but because she'd be an interesting character to explore more, as well as her relationship with The Doctor would be far different from the ones of Rose, Martha, and Donna.

[Dope Nose]

I'd like to see the Doctor's reaction to Jack hitting on Jenny.

[TheCorpulent1]

It'd be nice to see the Doctor have to coach someone else out of their warlike instincts. Although, to be honest, Jenny seemed to be over her soldier programming by the end of that one episode.

[JustABill]

I'd like to see the Doctor's reaction to Jack hitting on Jenny.
Oh god. The Doctor being a stereotypical father would be fricking hilarious.

[ttotheusher]

To be honest, I'd rather they gave Jenny a spin-off, with her own adventures, with occasional appeareances in the main program.

[JustABill]

Maybe whenever Torchwood or SJA ends. I have a feeling SJA might end first though. Depends on if Sladen wants to continue on as Sarah Jane. She's already said that The Stolen Earth/Journey's End felt like her last time on Doctor Who. :(

I don't want her to go. Sarah Jane is and always will be the bestest. :(

[JustABill]

It'd be nice to see the Doctor have to coach someone else out of their warlike instincts. Although, to be honest, Jenny seemed to be over her soldier programming by the end of that one episode.
But really he wouldn't be all of his recent companions have turned into soldiers because of his impact on their life. So really Jenny would be right back to square one and joining Rose, Martha, Mickey, and Jack in the realm of being turned into a soldier by The Doctor.

[Obsidian]

I'm hoping they can get a companion who lasts more than just one series or even two. Hopefully Jenny can fill that bit.

[TheCorpulent1]

Donna hadn't become a soldier. Jack was already a soldier, Martha chose to become a soldier after she'd chosen to leave the Doctor, Sarah Jane wasn't really being all that soldierly in the first place, and Rose was basically just doing whatever she could to warn the Doctor. Davros was twisting things for his own purposes with that little speech, in my opinion.

[ttotheusher]

Hopefully Jenny can fill that bit.

She can fill my bit. :cwink:

Actually, thats a terrible pun. We'll cut that.

[ttotheusher]

Edit: Double post.

[JustABill]

When you carry big ass guns and assumedly are a high ranking member of an alternate Torchwood like Rose was, you are pretty much a soldier.

Sarah Jane is the only one of his companions who has been in recent episodes, other than Donna (who probably wouldn't have become one had she kept her memories. :() to not reflect a soldier like persona.

[Dope Nose]

couple of my favorite bits from Journey's End -

the Doctor Donna
_-B2_mxBzHQ

Returning the Earth
IxNdffCPcOg

[Red X]

Looks should be the least important thing about a companion, Donna proved that, when she turned out to be probably the best companion of the new series so far, IMO.

Jenny should come back, but not because of her looks, but because she'd be an interesting character to explore more, as well as her relationship with The Doctor would be far different from the ones of Rose, Martha, and Donna.

Jenny gets my vote. I think there's a lot of potential in exploring The Doctors and Jenny's relationship.

[Speedball]

God...
I had to wait three weeks to finally watch the last three episodes, and damn they blew my effing mind!
Though...the end of Journey's End made me really sad... For Donna and for the Doctor...
Can't wait for the Return of the Cybermen though! Looks like it'll take place in Victorian England. :)