Elfman vs. Zimmer/Howard

[Catman]

I liked the music in this film, but I still think Elfman has this beat. What do you guys think?

[Batman15]

nothing beats Elfman. But this came close. :up:

[Spider-Steve]

Like the music from Elfman a lot, but other people can also do a great job.

Steve

[Catman]

Yeah, this was much more epic, but Elfman's score really represented the Batman character.

[P. Cushing]

Elfman! Not to say the BB Score was bad, but it was nowhere near as good as ELFMAN. The Elf is supreme!

[FCEEVIPER]

Elfman can't be beat, but the new score was no chop liver!

[TheBat812]

i loved this score. Only thing about Elfman's that i did liek was the theme, and pretty much only because it became engraved in my head from watching the movies (and BTAS, which has the same theme) so much when i was little.

[buggs0268]

The only thing I missed. The music was good, but like Williams score for Superman, it didn't have a defined theme for Batman like Elfman's did.

[The Caped Knight]

Hans Zimmer and James Newton Howard bb music was fantastic, but Elfman theme is still Bats.

[DarkKnightYone]

I can't see Elfman's music in this film. I like the new soundtrack a lot better than the "fantasy" style score Elfman wrote.

[antmanx68]

The only thing I missed. The music was good, but like Williams score for Superman, it didn't have a defined theme for Batman like Elfman's did.


ARE YOU KIDDING ME? The entire Superman THEME is Superman's theme. Hell, you can even sing along with it if you'd like... "Duuh duh duh duh duh, SU-PER-MAN.... Duuh duh duh duh duh... SUPERMAN!"

[greenlantern530]

ARE YOU KIDDING ME? The entire Superman THEME is Superman's theme. Hell, you can even sing along with it if you'd like... "Duuh duh duh duh duh, SU-PER-MAN.... Duuh duh duh duh duh... SUPERMAN!"

Seriously. Best.Theme.Ever

I like the BB theme better, Elfman's is great but the BB one is so epic.

[buggs0268]

ARE YOU KIDDING ME? The entire Superman THEME is Superman's theme. Hell, you can even sing along with it if you'd like... "Duuh duh duh duh duh, SU-PER-MAN.... Duuh duh duh duh duh... SUPERMAN!"
No I meant that Batman Begins didnt have a theme, unlike the William's Superman or the Elfman Batman score. Sorry. I guess I typed it wrong. The begins score didn't have a heroic march type of theme for Batman, and that was my only complaint.

[Captain_Obvious]

I can't pick...they are both too different for me to even choose.

I love them both in their own way.

[mopho]

cmon i thought it would be imposible, but BB is as good as burton's film, but face it elfman is elfman

[Payle Gray]

In the car ride home while thinking about the movie, Elfman's score kept popping in my head. It'll take me a couple of more trips to the theatre to even attempt to associate Zimmer's score with Batman. I did like the new theme though. Another reason why Elfman's score IS Batman, to me, is because of Batman: The Animated Series.

[MatchesMalone]

Shirley Walker's score from Mask of the Phantasm beats both Zimmer and Elfman, to me. Zimmer/Howard is second, with Elfman closely following. Elfman's theme just wouldn't work with this film.

[theJust]

nothing memorable about this score. elfman you hum in the car on the way to work

[Stupidnewb]

I'd rather hum Shirley Walker's theme than Danny Elfman's. I really like Zimmer and Howard's work and it is very appropriate for Begins but if I want a really catchy superhero theme then I'd go with Walker's over Elfman's.

[Stupidnewb]

Pale Gray, are you talking about the opening to every episode of the animated series? If so, then that's Elfman's, but the Batman theme and other pieces of music actually used during the show are Walker's and are completely different.

[_achilles_]

i like the music from begins very much i'ts better then elfman because you hear : Fear , Anger , revenge , Epic and Emotion i like that very much

[Stupidnewb]

Here's a wav of Shirley Walker's Batman theme. This one is taken from the episode Perchance to Dream. They play a lot of variations of it during the episodes.

http://s41.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=05VDAXKM39T1935HCV90C1L1NP

[Payle Gray]

Pale Gray, are you talking about the opening to every episode of the animated series? If so, then that's Elfman's, but the Batman theme and other pieces of music actually used during the show are Walker's and are completely different.


The opening sequence of course. Walker uses pieces of the Elfman score throughout the episodes as well as original compositions.

[Stupidnewb]

Walker only used parts of Elfman's scores in the early episodes which were mostly forgotten. Her Batman and villain themes sound nothing like Elfman's work.

[Catman]

Bottom line is that Shirley Walker was Danny Elfman's conductor during the late `80s and early `90s. That is perhaps the reason why she was hired. She knows Elfman's style and used it during the animated series. Zimmer/Howard made a more epic score. Elliot Goldenthal went for a more light-hearted, action theme score. Elfman and Walker both approached Batman with the same style and same idea. It is kind of pointless to debate this.


Back to the topic: The problem I had with Zimmer/Howard is that the character's didn't really have a musical voice. They did a great job creating the mood with the music, but Elfman also did this and gave each character a theme. Batman had a theme, Joker had a theme, Pengin, Catwoman, etc. In BB none of the characters really had a theme. The music was done to serve the film alone. At least Elfman gave each character their own musical voice aside from serving the film itself with scores like "Descent Into Mystery."

[-rc2k-]

This score was great, loved it very much. But it just can't top Elfman.

[buggs0268]

Bottom line is that Shirley Walker was Danny Elfman's conductor during the late `80s and early `90s. That is perhaps the reason why she was hired. She knows Elfman's style and used it during the animated series. Zimmer/Howard made a more epic score. Elliot Goldenthal went for a more light-hearted, action theme score. Elfman and Walker both approached Batman with the same style and same idea. It is kind of pointless to debate this.


Back to the topic: The problem I had with Zimmer/Howard is that the character's didn't really have a musical voice. They did a great job creating the mood with the music, but Elfman also did this and gave each character a theme. Batman had a theme, Joker had a theme, Pengin, Catwoman, etc. In BB none of the characters really had a theme. The music was done to serve the film alone. At least Elfman gave each character their own musical voice aside from serving the film itself with scores like "Descent Into Mystery."
Yep, and if you look closely, Walker also did the aranging on the Elfman scores. So she took the peiano notes that he wrote for the theme adn fleshed them out to make the Elfman score for the movie.

[Catman]

And let's not forget Steve Bartek. He contributed a lot as a producer for the scores.

[Equint77]

I'm not a huge Elfman fan.. I think all of scores sound the same.... or similar....

the only piece of music that I like of his from the SM movies is this short melody they play when Peter's talking to MJ.... other than that... if you hear his scores for Batman, Batman Returns, Edward Scissorhands, SM & SM2, Beetlejuice.. they all have a similar sound.

[Catman]

You can say the same about Hans Zimmer.

[Catman]

No Hans Zimmer defenders?

[Stupidnewb]

I'm not going to try to defend him but could you list ~3 Zimmer scores that sound the same to you?

[Catman]

Gladiator, The Last Samurai, Batman Begins

[drknight]

They were both good for their movies.

Elfman's over the top style would have sounded ridiculous with the realist tone of BB.

Zimmer/Howard would have been to understated for B89's uber-gothic feel.

[Catman]

I agree and disagree. Yes, of course Elfman would be to over the top for BB and Zimmer/Howard to understated for B89. You compose music to fit the movie. NOW if you were to judge the score itself I would still say Elfman was better.

[nosebleed.]

They were both good for their movies.

Elfman's over the top style would have sounded ridiculous with the realist tone of BB.

Zimmer/Howard would have been to understated for B89's uber-gothic feel.

this is short, sweet and straight to the point. thank you sir!

[DACrowe]

Okay this is just ridiculous.

This proves my point that some are fans that will say anything new (Batman Begins) is better. If anyone thinks that the BB theme (which is good, but not memorable) is better than Elfman's much better well rounded score (and then he just outdoes himself in BR, the best part of that movie was the even better score) is delliusional.

Just my opinion though.

Sorry for that outburst, it was way too obnoxious and pretentious of me, I am sorry if I came off as a jackass, but that is how I feel about this.

[drknight]

Everyone know the main theme from BF and B&R is the best one... J/k

[skorponok]

Elfman wrote a GREAT theme, but his score wasn't as emotive as the zimmer/howard one.

[DACrowe]

I'd like to hear you defend that point.

[Pink Ranger]

Yeah, Elfman's theme was the only thing the old movies did better than the new one.

The ONLY thing.

[Michael Corleone]

I think any "theme" in the movie would have pulled me out of the film. This film stands on its own. No need to have a rising fanfair when it would only seem out of place with the rest of the tone of the film.

[KenK]

Elfman's score is just classic. Zimmer/Howard's just sounds like every historical drama score of the last five years. It's okay, but Elfman really nailed a signature sound that you can associate with Batman. Nothing beats "Descent Into Mystery".

[Dark Knight]

I can't see Elfman's music in this film. I like the new soundtrack a lot better than the "fantasy" style score Elfman wrote.


this score was more epic.....the Elfman score was to fantasy and whimsical.

[DACrowe]

I don't think any bit of HOward/Zimmer's score was as epic as when it played when Batman took down that first thug on the roof top at the beginning and said "I'm Batman," certainly not nearly as epic as "Descent into Mystery," not as epic or with as much pathos as when Batman enters the cathedral half-dead for the first time and climbs the stair case with that epic powerhouse score music playing, and not as grand and old school epic as the whole 2 minutes of "Finale" is.

Honestly, if you want epic listen to those four scenes music in B'89. Then go watch BR and listen to any Batman cue, or if to save time just the main titles and skip to the end starting with Batman confronting a half-broken Catwoman and Walken and enjoy.

[Joker62389]

You can't beat the Finale from Batman 89...it gives me chills every time I hear it. :batman: :joker:

[Lazlo Panaflex]

Elfman's score are the best for the Burton movies because it fits with the mood, that music would be out of place in Batman Begins, Zimmer/Howard's music is just as great that I went out to buy the soundtrack because it fits in with Nolan's grittier take on Batman.

All three composers are good in their own way and I can't single out who's the best, of course Elfman gave Bats a memorable theme while BB doesn't have a recognizable theme it's still moody and creepy.

just thank god they didn't go with Elliot Goldenthal.

[P. Cushing]

Nothing beats "Descent Into Mystery".
What about Birth of the Penguin?

[aquiles]

i like better the zimmer-howards theme.
more epic.although elfmans theme was cool to.

[DACrowe]

That was good, but Penguin's main theme is good too.

I personally think the best is Finale it is just so damn triumphant and powerful. I mean it was one of the most beautiful endings I've ever seen, and the best ending in a superhero movie to date (yes better than the Joker card rooftop chat/swooshing down at camera again one last time).

[Catman]

Yeah, Elfman's theme was the only thing the old movies did better than the new one.

The ONLY thing.

Two things actually. Lets not forget the editing of the fight scenes. Not very well done. I LOVED Begins, but that was the ONLY thing that really bothered. I mean DAMN give us a master shot, Nolan!

[TheBat812]

I prefer the new fighting scenes MUCH more. Especially the first time Batman appears. it's gritty, and really you're not supposed to completely see what's going on, just as the thugs dont. It's more frightening that way.

[Kipobe]

I'm THE biggest Elfman whore around, and while I think his music for Bats will probably be not only the most memorable, but the best Batman related music ever, this music did its job. It played key where it needed to, and it seperated itself well from any other Batman film made up to this point.

I personally liked the epic theme that played in brief sparatic moments in the movie... but it hardly qualified for a score (not that it was trying to) and independantly it doesn't really make for a great listen... but again I say: it did its job, and being a fan of film composing, I can honestly say that's the most important thing.

Truth be told, the two can't really be compared. After all, they're so different.... and they're trying to be so different. There's nothing Batman '89 in Batman Begins, and vice versa. Everything from the Batmobile to the character builds have changed... so no doubt I expect a completely different sound. Alot of the film felt like quick cuts between scenes... the music complemented that.

I guess the better question is, what score did its job better? Which complimented the movie better? (Incidentally, something I personally believe no one does better than Elfman himself. He tends to forego "epic" to allow his music to fit well!) While Batman Begins did a good job of adding to the scene with its music, there'll never be anything like Elfman's theme drumming hard as the Batmobile charged up... or theatrically during the final moments of the film as you see Batman standing up starring at the signal... those memories were instantly engraved into my mind, and they'll need alot more that what I heard in Begins to wipe that away.

[Exabyte]

Its all the same to me, but I love the sound that started when the WB logo appeared in BB.

[Guason]

Yeah, Elfman's theme was the only thing the old movies did better than the new one.

The ONLY thing.
Really, BR`s romance still the best so far.
I voted for Elfman.

[Wrath of Khan]

I'm not a huge Elfman fan.. I think all of scores sound the same.... or similar....

the only piece of music that I like of his from the SM movies is this short melody they play when Peter's talking to MJ.... other than that... if you hear his scores for Batman, Batman Returns, Edward Scissorhands, SM & SM2, Beetlejuice.. they all have a similar sound.

But they are all a similar genre: Burton films and fantasy (and I disagree with Spidey theme bashin, I think it rules, and not similar to the others)

But lets remember Elfman also did Desperate Housewives, Simpsons, Family Man, Red Dragon etc. He is versatile, but he will always be remembered for the iconic stuff.

[Catman]

Really, BR`s romance still the best so far.

To be fair the romance was not the focus of the film. Returns focused a lot on the whole Bruce Wayne/Selena Kyle relationship. I wonder how Nolan will handle it.

[The Guard]

I like Elfman's better. Can't explain why. Zimmer and Howard's is good, but it feels a little generic. The typical horror sounds when "horror" is supposed to be onscreen, drums every five minutes...I dunno...I need to get ahold of the soundtrack and listen to it all alone.

[Seen]

I enjoyed Zimmer/Howard's work better. While I always liked Elfman's scores, he's too bombastic and in-your-face. The music for BEGINS was gradual, moving, emotional, and driven. I really liked the theme too, plus the horror parts were very well done. Overall it blended in with the film, which is what scores are supposed to do, and didn't stand out like a sore thumb which Elfman's music did in the Burton flicks (which perhaps they were meant to do, who knows).

I can't wait to buy the CD, though. I'm probably going to listen to it about a million times...like the film, I just absolutley love it.

[Riven]

Danny Elfman's music was GREAT with the kind of movie he scored for.


Zimmer/Howard's music was GREAT with the kind of movie they scored for.


Imagine Elfman's bombastic fanfare themes with Nolan's subdued, down to earth aproach... or Zimmer/Howard's moody score with Burton's operatic and extravagant stylings. Both would have been horribly out of place. But as they are, both are now exceptionally good scores to exceptionally good movies.

[Bat-Justin]

^ I totally agree!

Elfman's music would not have worked for this film just as this films musice would not have worked for Burton's

[hulkamania85]

Begins had a great score, but Elfman's is a classic.

The best Batman theme I think is the Animated Series one (it took the 1989 one and improved it). I was hoping it would be incorprated into the Begins score. I almost thought it was slightly in the beginning.

[Stupidnewb]

What do you mean it took the 1989 one and improved on it? The Batman theme from TAS is nothing like Elfman's theme.

[Shadowflare]

I'm a huge Danny Elfman fan. I own a lot of his movie soundtracks. But I also now own the Zimmer/Howard BB score, and I have to say that I love it. The Elfman score was perfect and always will be the definitive musical take on the character, IMHO.
I do really like the BB score though, and it does a great job for what it sets out to do, for the kind of movie that BB is. From the opening notes at the beginning of the film, it immediately lets you know what the movie is all about.
Neither is better than the other when put in the proper context. But as far as raw music is concerned, completely unattached from any Batman connotations, I do think that I prefer the Zimmer/Howard score just a little more. I'll listen to it a few more times to be sure, but I do really like what they did. That's just my personal preference though.
Elfman's main Batman theme will always be tops in my book, but as far as overall score, I think that Zimmer/Howard did a grand job.

[Catman]

and I disagree with Spidey theme bashin, I think it rules, and not similar to the others

It's funny how different Batman and Spider-Man fans are. Spider-Man fans are mad cause according to them Spider-Man doesn't have a theme. Yet Batman doesn't really have a theme in Begins and no one is complaining. Interesting huh?

[Kipobe]

The funny thing is, Batman Begins wasn't trying to create an actual theme... more just mood music. I wonder if they'd continue to do this with future movies, or if they'd settle for making a true score instead of thematic mood music.

Spider-Man has a theme... a great theme. I personally am on a crusade to kill everyone who says Spider-Man doesn't have a theme.

[Catman]

Spider-Man has a theme... a great theme. I personally am on a crusade to kill everyone who says Spider-Man doesn't have a theme.

Good luck.

[Atomic Crusader]

Elfmans' music was the best thing about Burton's Batman films (did he score the Schmacher films?) his Batman theme is terrific. But, something like that would have been out of place in Begins so at this point I'd say the Zimmer/Howard soundtrack was entirely appropriate and was infused in the film beautifully. Gonna pick up the CD soon.

The Spiderman music is really good too but hardly overt like Batman '89, neither is it just mood or ambient.

[Kipobe]

Shoemakers films were done by Elliot Goldenthal. Neither really had a score as such... Forever (I believe) had a soundtrack with some composed cues (that was nothing more than the brash theme playing a few times here and there) and B&R just had and overture.

[Conjob2008]

ELFMAN ,***DAMMIT!!!!

[Cobblepot]

Right now Zimmer and Howard nailed it with there score.
Elfman was great too, but has left the building.

[Jack Torrance]

i didn't like the new score AT ALL

[thechubbysaint]

One great thing about the Batman '89 score was the end song when Batman was looking at the activated bat signal. I could have seen a similar ending in this film.

[db85usa]

there is a THEME in the BB soundtrack

just listen closely for it :)

you hear it mostly in Molossus.

[Lazlo Panaflex]

Someone mentioned that Zimmer/Howard's music sounded like horror music, it's funny that it's mentioned it kind of reminded me of John Carpenter's Halloween music where he would just do variotions on the Halloween theme and intercut it in the scenes.

[DIRECTOR]

when i left BB, i didn't have the theme in my head, it wasn't burned on the film. Tim burton's Danny Elfman's theme was in the first film Batman. But, i think BB concentrated on people remembering the movie rather than the music more, but the music in BB was more elegant than in Burton's film, which is i believe

[DACrowe]

More elagent? How so?

[Dark Knight]

the theme is actually still in my head. The deep dark parts that go........"DAHHHHHH......DAH...DAHHHHHHHHH.....DA DAHHHHH....DA DAHHH.....DAHHHHHHHHHHHH.......classic stuff.

[Catman]

People say that Elfman wouldn't fit for Begins. You guys are aware that Elfman is a flexible composer. If Nolan would have hired him to compose this film he would have made music to fit the film. Just look at Batman and Batman Returns. The music is very different because the style and mood of the films were different. Just thought I should bring that up.

[Stupidnewb]

I don't notice anything different between the scores for Batman and Batman Returns except maybe he loosened up a little. But I'm not saying he's one dimensional. His score for Spiderman is a completely different tone than his Batman score. I don't know if he could have done a good score for Begins but I'm glad Zimmer and Howard did it. They are my two favorite composers and they did a great job.

[treeringralph]

I think this is sort of an unfair poll. Burton NEVER strives for realism in his films. It's this nebulously set, gothic, "operatic" fantasy feel, and Elfman's score was appropriate (and amazing) for that movie's setting and tone. Elfman's score would've been out of place in Nolan's more sublte/realistic in tone film. So...

Elfman did great for the movies he worked on. The music fit and complimented the film.

Zimmer/ Newton Howard did great for the movie they worked on. The music fit and complimented the film.

-trr

[DACrowe]

True, but which is the one that really knocks your socks off. Which do you remember. Which do you feel defines the feeling of Batman or the essence?

The answer is Elfman. It is very unique and iconic and sounds like a specific theme for Batman. The music by Howard and Zimmer was terrific mood music, but it did not stand out very much and the "epic theme" people refer to sounds almost exactly like Zimmer's epic theme for Gladiator and his epic theme for King Arthur. In fact BB's score could fit well into any historical war epic. Elfman's Batman score can only fit into the dark gothic Batman and can only be associated with Batman.

That combine with it sticks with you and just not the themes but the mood music (like the finales for both Burton films or the music where Batman is climbing the cathedral's bell tower, that was mood music) is also compeletly memorable. That is why Elfman blows away their score.

[Stupidnewb]

Well if you were asking that then I think Walker's theme for Batman is much more definitive than Elfman's. And if you ask the average person, they probably wouldn't be able to hum Elfman's score. But they would most likely know the theme from the 60's tv show.

[Man_of_Steel]

Both scores are great, but for different reasons. Danny Elfman created a great Batman theme. Zimmer and Howard created a great Batman score. The difference between the two is, for the most part, Danny Elfman's score was carrying the first two Batman movies. Don't get me wrong, they're decent movies, but not the best representations of what Batman should be (and why don't we just call Batman the Joker and Batman Returns The Catwoman and the Penguin's Night Out). Batman Begins' score goes along with what's happening in the movie. It doesn't carry anything, that's the actor's job, and all the actors do a brilliant job of it. The score just accompanies it and is like a puzzle piece that you need to finish a giant puzzle.

Bottom line?

Two great scores for some great movies

[Catman]

I think this is sort of an unfair poll.
-trr

I never asked which score complements the film better. I simply asked which was the better score.

[Seen]

People say that Elfman wouldn't fit for Begins. You guys are aware that Elfman is a flexible composer. If Nolan would have hired him to compose this film he would have made music to fit the film. Just look at Batman and Batman Returns. The music is very different because the style and mood of the films were different. Just thought I should bring that up.

I don't think he could handle BATMAN BEGINS. It's just not his style. Besides, even if he could, we've heard his take on Batman. It was time for someone else. Period.

[DACrowe]

I don't know why people say that Elfman only had themes and no mood music. He did manipulate his Batman theme, his love theme, his parents death theme, his Joker theme, Penguin theme, etc. to fit moods, but also he had mood music which is just as iconic and the best examples of this are Descent into Mystery, Fire up the Batmobile, the Belltower climb, and Finale.

And they are so I conic some just have names that do not describe the scene and you know what piece of musical composition I am speaking of.

[Seen]

Elfman has good music. He just wouldn't fit the musical structure and essence that BEGINS required.

[dred one]

I wonder what would happen if they all callaborated(sp?) on the next one.

[Catman]

I don't think he could handle BATMAN BEGINS. It's just not his style. Besides, even if he could, we've heard his take on Batman. It was time for someone else. Period.

Elfman has composed all sorts of movies. He could have handled this! Have you seen Dead Presidents? The man can handle a gritty movie. And what's the deal about its time for someone else? We've already gotten Shirley Walker and Elliot Goldenhal. I think based on those two we could all have arrived to the conclusion that Elfman is to Batman what John Williams is to Superman.

[DorkyFresh]

It's unfair to compare the 2. Yes...both scores are for Batman movies....but Elfman's score is for a significantly campy/hollywood Batman while Christopher Nolan's is for an epic, very dark, gritty, and realistic Batman.

I will say Elfman's theme is more catchy.....but I think Zimmer/Howard's score fits Batman better.

[Punisher 04]

I liked the music in this film, but I still think Elfman has this beat. What do you guys think?

I agree. :unishr:

[Catman]

The Punisher is always right.

[Farva]

Elfman's still is better, but this one was good enough.

However, in the background rhythm of the new score, It sounded almost the same as Elfman's heavy vibrations of some of his music, like when the batmobile is driving to the cave w/ Vale in B89. Any one else notice the small similarity? Or maybe its just me.

[Catman]

I think it's just you.

[t-800]

Does anyone think the BB score sounded kinda like Shirley Walker's music. The main theme seemed to sound alot like the first part of Walker's theme, kinda like a shortened version. They should have just have hired Shirley Walker (and maybe with another composer), which would have been cheaper and would probably have same or similar theme with some music from the cartoon series and movies.

[That-Guy]

Such a close race. I love both scores. I voted for Zimmer/Howard just because it is the most vibrant in my memory, and because for the more realistic version of Batman (the one I prefer) their score suited it perfectly. However, for more of a goth-type batman movie, Elfman's theme was amazing.

[Kipobe]

I own the score on it's own, and while it makes for a good listen, and it's starting to paint the picture of "Batman" in my head when I hear the theme, I still think they made a mistake by teaming up two huge composers (and epic composers nonetheless) to complete this project.

This was in effect an "Indy" film... it needed an indy composer.... and though my love for Elfman and his work in '89 and '92 runs strongly in my veins, I can definately picture something outside of his/Burton's world. I'd of liked to have seen Mychael Danna do this score for his use of unique instruments and independant style... or even Trevor Rabin... yes, a little more epic as oppose to indy, but he wouldn'tve overdone it -- not that I'm accusing Zimmer/Howard of "overdoing" it, but their combined "indy" style came off sounding forced instead of natural.

Nevermind all that though, the score itself is weak because of having so much deadweight on the tracks. That being said, when it kicks up a notch, it's amazing... although it can get repetitive... and this is where I think developing a main theme would've helped them... even if it was building the entire film just to be released in a small dose at the end. It felt as if it got nowhere.... which in a timeline sense I guess it worked in harmony with the movie. After all, this wasn't exactly a "progessional" story. From the beginning to the end, Bruce had already suffered his loss and found what he wanted to do within the first hour. The second hour was merely following through on this. A theme however could've developed during the first hour and be hinted at right on down until the end.

The epic moments of the score are indeed fantastic and underwhelming... I love it... but it comes down to two major portions. 1) what I'll dub as the "Batman/Justice" theme, and 2). a reflection/childhood theme. The childhood theme is spectacular and works well in hand with the Justice/Batman theme. If they had defined these themes however, they could've done so much more. My guess is they didn't want to do more as it could seem overwhelming, and I can understand that to an extent, but the overall problem is that you leave the theater not having anything to hum and think of Batman with. It hasn't established itself musically, which is of great importance with a movie of this magnitude.

Please note -- I am not one of those guys who sees a movie and complains there is no main theme, or I can't hum along, or remember the theme... my complaint more points towards the fact that this was an independant score done by epic composers, and it seems wrong. It's as if you asked a proffessional builder to build a home in Zulu. Sure, he's talented and probably the best at his craft... but you're putting him in a situation where he is not at his element, and a couple of locals could probably do the job much better.

My vote for Bats 6 -- get rid of Zimmer and let Howard take what he's developed thus far and build a true score instead of elements of themes.

All in all, I own the CD, and it's not bad... but it just seems like a missed opportunity and poorly presented with alot of dead weight added to pad it out.

[Kipobe]

Oh, and this poll is horrible because it shouldn't be "which score is better", it should be "which did it's job better". Two different movies altogether... you can't do real math with fractions that don't share the common denominator. :up:

[Dr. MIX]

Batman 89 has a fantastical kind of score, and Begins has the epic scope to it.

[Ruined Angel]

I prefer Elfman but I was really impressed by the BB score, much more than I thought I'd be. Must buy a copy of that soundtrack when I next get enough money. I normally refuse to buy CDs but I'll support BB.

[kpjoon]

I prefer Zimmer and Newton's score over Elfman's.

[Carter]

I can't even believe this is close.
Elfman tops Zimmer in every way.

[gigamaster]

Not true, I thought that the two main players - Batman and Ra's - had great "musical voices". I loved that two-note motif for Batman, where the trumpet rises and swells up, then abruptly drops. It's simple, and announces the Dark Knight perfectly. Also, you have the bittersweet Bruce theme, and the heroic, and regal Batman theme heard at the beginning of Molossus and varied throughout the entire soundtrack. For Ra's we had that twangy, atmospheric, Middle-eastern theme that fit the mystery and background of the character perfectly.

Overall, I thought the soundtrack was superb. It fit the movie and the characters perfectly, what else can you ask for? I thought the action cues really captured the daring and heroic qualities of Batman, especially track 8 where he takes down the ninjas. Great stuff there. And the music altogether gave the movie a great atmosphere, and got me pumped where needed.

Zimmer and Newton did a fantastic job.

[Sparda_Pain]

I like Zimmer-Howard score better dan Elfmans

[Stupidnewb]

I'm just disappointed that they didn't include the Arkham descent music and the music that was played while Batman was being pulled by the train.

[DarkKnightJRK]

First, I must adress something that has bothered me about the Zimmer/Howard arguement:

THERE IS A THEME.

It's the first 40 seconds of Vespertilio. It's the music that is played through credits sequence and is reapeated several times throughout the picture. What's that called, boys and girls?

Anyway, I think the true ULTIMATE Batman theme would be an amalgamation of both: Both the operatic and heroic Elfman theme and the moody and animalistic Zimmer/Howard themes.

[Stupidnewb]

Yeah, there are many themes. So far I can only pinpoint two of them but I remember a lot of different repeated themes throughout the film.

There's that two note motif that runs throughout most of the movie, kind of like the two note motif from the Matrix films.

Then there's the heroic/action/triumphant theme that is heard in 3:15-3:26 in track 3 Myotis and 0:40-1:00 of track 10 Molossus. It might be in another track too or in the film and not released as a track.

[Phaser]

It's funny how different Batman and Spider-Man fans are. Spider-Man fans are mad cause according to them Spider-Man doesn't have a theme. Yet Batman doesn't really have a theme in Begins and no one is complaining. Interesting huh?

Actually, there are about 4 different oft repeated themes in Batman Begins.

[Phaser]

Back to the topic: The problem I had with Zimmer/Howard is that the character's didn't really have a musical voice. They did a great job creating the mood with the music, but Elfman also did this and gave each character a theme. Batman had a theme, Joker had a theme, Pengin, Catwoman, etc. In BB none of the characters really had a theme. The music was done to serve the film alone. At least Elfman gave each character their own musical voice aside from serving the film itself with scores like "Descent Into Mystery."

What are you smoking? Of course the characters each have a theme.

Bruce Wayne has a theme, one that you hear at the very beginning (and also throughout) the film which gradually evolves into one of the three prominent Batman themes.

Thomas Wayne had a theme which plays whenever Bruce looked at the stethoscope of his father.

The Scarecrow has a theme. Listen to the soundtrack. It's impossible to miss it.

The troubled romance between Rachel and Bruce also has a theme which suitable varies throughout the film.

Ra's had a theme as well. You hear it when Ducard first speaks to Bruce in his solitary cell as well as at Bruce's birthday party.

Oh and, Howard/Zimmer's work on BB far surpasses Elfman's IMO. I've seen the film 7 times in IMAX now, bought the soundtrack and I just couldn't get the music out of my head. It's simply amazing.

[TheBat812]

I agree and disagree. Yes, of course Elfman would be to over the top for BB and Zimmer/Howard to understated for B89. You compose music to fit the movie. NOW if you were to judge the score itself I would still say Elfman was better.
i disagree. Besides teh theme that Elfman had, there's nothing memorable about his score.

[SolidRoar]

Well, they can't be compared really. Each one fits the tone of its respective film. That being said, I really like the recently revealed unused theme by Zimmer/Howard. I think it would work nicely with the sequel's opening.

[super-t]

ok i like both scores but when u think of BATMAN when u watch BB the scores doesnt say BATMAN like elfmam's does but i dont like the lil march that elfman uses if u took the begining of elfmans and the BB theme that would be the best but, all in all ill take elfmans.

[Catman]

Besides teh theme that Elfman had, there's nothing memorable about his score.

There's nothing memorable about his score? Have you heard Descent Into Mystery, Attack of the Batwing, Up the Cathedral, Waltz to the Death, and Finale?!

[Catman]

What are you smoking? Of course the characters each have a theme.

I take back what I said, but I still do not think they did a good job. As far as creating music to enhance the mood of the film itself I think they did a great job. As far as creating music for the characters I don't think they did a good job. At least Elfman created great themes for the characters and the movie itself. Was it a bit over the top and operatic? Yes, but so what? Ennio Morricone had electric guitars in OUATITW, but it works and it is good.

[KING ¼]

I loved Howards work on Signs and especially Collateral, and Zimmer rules in everything he does, but I was dissapointed with Begins. I thought with these 2 on the job, it should have been much better. From what little I heard, it was good, and epic, like it should be. If you cant outdo Elfman, dont try, do something different. And they did, but it wasnt as good as it could have been. These guys are better than this.
Elfman all the way, his scores are always great. I love the opening to Batman 89. With BB, there was no opening with credits, and I hate movies now a days that do that, because we dont get the cool build up with the awesome score.:(

[Phaser]

I take back what I said, but I still do not think they did a good job. As far as creating music to enhance the mood of the film itself I think they did a great job. As far as creating music for the characters I don't think they did a good job. At least Elfman created great themes for the characters and the movie itself. Was it a bit over the top and operatic? Yes, but so what? Ennio Morricone had electric guitars in OUATITW, but it works and it is good.

Well that's where I strongly disagree. In my opinion Howard and Zimmer did a fantastic job with the score. Not only did they create excellent mood music for the film, but tailored multiple themes that fit surprisingly well with the main character(s). Not to mention the music packs an emotional punch not found in Elfman's score.

[Kipobe]

There was no need for Elfman's score to have an emotional punch so to speak... where would it have fit in the 1989 Batman? Besides, this music was tailored to an extent... it was rough around the edges and could've used a bit more definition.

The only reason I skate around the word "theme" is because that's exactly what Zimmer/Howard want. To me, there is definately an overture that could be built into a theme... but it was avoided. Why? I really don't know... that's why I say their indy style sounds forced because it was if they were trying to do something significant without thinking about why they're doing what they are doing.

I mean, imagine a true score to this instead of long stretched out cues. If cut and tailored properly, this could've really been something. I remember first seeing the most recent trailer and thinking the music was quite impressive. Not that I wanted it to be thunderous for the hell of it, but it should blaze a trail that you can follow of consistancy that you can only get from a score... not 10 abstract cues. Again, it worked for this movie given the way the story was told... but it wouldn't have been my first choice as a director to see how the music would go.

For the sequel, I again say that Zimmer should be dropped and Howard should be allowed to create an independant score of his own. I think it would be insanely beautiful given the theme(s) that is already structured.

Again, did it do it's job better than Elfman's 1989 Batman? Not a chance. Elfman's 1989 Batman set a standard that was not easily gonna be topped... but I don't compare the music to each other, I compare them to what they did for the film. Elfman's Batman score not only complimented the film perfectly, but it added the bombastic feel to what we now know as Batman of the 90's. Elliot Goldenthal's music was a cheap rip-off of the same bombastic feel as Shoemaker's movies was a cheap rip-off of the same Burton-style Batman, so they don't count.

As a personal note, I'd like to add if I were doing the score I'd use alot less strings... ALOT less. Personal taste though... I don't picture strings in harmony with Batman; the character.

[Kipobe]

i disagree. Besides teh theme that Elfman had, there's nothing memorable about his score.
You are kidding me, right?! Maybe you're confusing Batman with Superman? Even then, that had two themes.

Hell, Batman '89 was possibly the most diverse use of the main theme until Elfman's work with Spider-Man and Spider-Man 2.

Have you even heard the score? There's tons of tracks on there that feature memorable moments... probably none more than the closing track "Finale" which is probably still the most memorable closing moments in a movie (especially musically) of all time. You can't be serious.

[J.R.]

Back to the topic: The problem I had with Zimmer/Howard is that the character's didn't really have a musical voice. They did a great job creating the mood with the music, but Elfman also did this and gave each character a theme. Batman had a theme, Joker had a theme, Pengin, Catwoman, etc. In BB none of the characters really had a theme. The music was done to serve the film alone. At least Elfman gave each character their own musical voice aside from serving the film itself with scores like "Descent Into Mystery."

I felt the same way. There was no realy distinct theme for ANYTHING in the film. That's why I went with Elfman.

[Kipobe]

I felt the same way. There was no realy distinct theme for ANYTHING in the film. That's why I went with Elfman.
But apparently that's what they were going for. They were going for an entire film of mood music. To me, it came of partially as a good idea, partially as stupid. I think a true score wouldve worked better.

Besides, it's hard to top what Elfman brought to Batman.

[Kipobe]

Alighty, so I'm listening to the score again with an objective mind, and all the score puts me in mind of is a sophisticated version of Daredevil (in terms of style, not sound or music).

If you own the Daredevil score and you own the Batman Begins score and you can study them and break them down, tell me how I'm wrong, because it's unbelievable the characteristics they share.

[Catman]

Not to mention the music packs an emotional punch not found in Elfman's score.

Have you seen Batman Returns by any chance?

[comicgirl]

I liked the music in this film, but I still think Elfman has this beat. What do you guys think?Elfman is the ultimate...these other guys aren't fit to hold his baton

[Superman4ever]

I can't pick...they are both too different for me to even choose.

I love them both in their own way.

That's basically how I feel...Elfman was good for Burton’s movie, but Zimmer and Howard were perfect for this movie!

However, seeing that I LOVE Begins to death, I choose the latter!

[Guason]

Have you seen Batman Returns by any chance?
of course, he hasn`t.

[Rayne]

Wow. You guys need to stop being so simple.



Zimmer & Newton-Howards score was 10x better than Elfman's. Who cares that there was a defining theme? The rest of the score is CRAP! And unlike most of you, I actually own it, and can say it. This dream team of composers delivered, and captured the true essence of Bruce Wayne/Batman. It's one of my favorite parts of the film. Go buy the soundtrack. I listen to it on the way to work, at work, when I sleep. In every way, it beats Elfman's recycled style that only resonates from Tim Burton movies. I'm so sick of hearing about how good it was, when the trumpety and high school band drum sounds don't belong anywhere near Batman. Aren't any of you true comic book fans here? When you read A Death in the Family, The Long Halloween, The Dark Knight Returns, do you hear Elfman's fruity little theme in the back of your head? I hope not. I sure don't.

Zimmer & Newton-Howard nailed it. End of story.

[Catman]

High School band? Maybe you bought a bootleg copy of the CD.

[HumanSquirrel]

Elman!

[Phaser]

Wow. You guys need to stop being so simple.



Zimmer & Newton-Howards score was 10x better than Elfman's. Who cares that there was a defining theme? The rest of the score is CRAP! And unlike most of you, I actually own it, and can say it. This dream team of composers delivered, and captured the true essence of Bruce Wayne/Batman. It's one of my favorite parts of the film. Go buy the soundtrack. I listen to it on the way to work, at work, when I sleep. In every way, it beats Elfman's recycled style that only resonates from Tim Burton movies. I'm so sick of hearing about how good it was, when the trumpety and high school band drum sounds don't belong anywhere near Batman. Aren't any of you true comic book fans here? When you read A Death in the Family, The Long Halloween, The Dark Knight Returns, do you hear Elfman's fruity little theme in the back of your head? I hope not. I sure don't.

Zimmer & Newton-Howard nailed it. End of story.


Aside from the somewhat unnecessary hostility towards Elfman, I agree with your post.

[gigamaster]

Wow. You guys need to stop being so simple.



Zimmer & Newton-Howards score was 10x better than Elfman's. Who cares that there was a defining theme? The rest of the score is CRAP! And unlike most of you, I actually own it, and can say it. This dream team of composers delivered, and captured the true essence of Bruce Wayne/Batman. It's one of my favorite parts of the film. Go buy the soundtrack. I listen to it on the way to work, at work, when I sleep. In every way, it beats Elfman's recycled style that only resonates from Tim Burton movies. I'm so sick of hearing about how good it was, when the trumpety and high school band drum sounds don't belong anywhere near Batman. Aren't any of you true comic book fans here? When you read A Death in the Family, The Long Halloween, The Dark Knight Returns, do you hear Elfman's fruity little theme in the back of your head? I hope not. I sure don't.

Zimmer & Newton-Howard nailed it. End of story.

Wow, I almost forgot how much of a dick you were. Sad to say, I actually agree with your post though.

[zanos]

Elfman's music was very good but it was also very cartoony.

[Catman]

What was so cartoony about Elfman's score? I think a lot of you are starting to pull s--t out your ass. First Elfman's score was performed by high school marching bands and now it's cartoony.

[super-t]

hey guys i mixed both elfmans and BB score together, and comming from me it doesnt sound to bad, if anyone wants to hear it i can send it to u in ur email. just let me know.

[super-t]

i am goin to mix them alot of ways to see wich sounds the best.

[jimal]

It is hard to choose one. Elfman did a fantastic job with the first batman score (Descent into Mystery was the best). His Batman Returns soundtrack was something i was disappointed in. It shines in certain areas but it is not as catchy as 89 score. Howard/Zimmer is a masterpiece. Much like 89 score, every single track is solid. Howard/Zimmer really did make music that is both bruce wayne and batman. So for that, I'll give my vote to them.

[MUGSY]

The score in Batman Begins is great. But when you see Burtons bat films, the score is something you can just hum when you finshed watching the films.

[Rayne]

High School band? Maybe you bought a bootleg copy of the CD.

I wouldn't.

Musically, the Begins score blows the Elfman scores out of the water. Just because it's catchy, doesn't mean it's good.

[Ocelot]

The music works for both movies, you cant compare them because the movies are so different as many have said already. The BB score wouldnt work for B89 and vice versa. And we are still in the Batman Begins Owns All phase as well.

[Catman]

Musically, the Begins score blows the Elfman scores out of the water. Just because it's catchy, doesn't mean it's good.

I am not the one saying it is better because it's catchy. I said Elfman was better because musically he captured the soul of Batman and the other characters better than Zimmer/Howard.

It is like comparing Williams to Walker. Yes, Shirley Walkers score for Superman was very good. However, it didn't make us believe a man could fly like John Williams score did.

[Seen]

I am not the one saying it is better because it's catchy. I said Elfman was better because musically he captured the soul of Batman and the other characters better than Zimmer/Howard.

Zimmer/Howard captured the emotionality, psychology, and trepidation better than Elfman ever could.

[TheBat812]

i hate character themes. It's supposed to fit the mood of th emovie, not a character. BB score >>> Batman score.

[Catman]

i hate character themes. It's supposed to fit the mood of th emovie, not a character.

If you say so. ;)

[Kroc1138]

As someone who Likes Elfman and really doesn't Like Hans Zimmer My answer is beyond Obvious. Zimmer is way overrated, IMO.

[Dark Knight]

Wow. You guys need to stop being so simple.



Zimmer & Newton-Howards score was 10x better than Elfman's. Who cares that there was a defining theme? The rest of the score is CRAP! And unlike most of you, I actually own it, and can say it. This dream team of composers delivered, and captured the true essence of Bruce Wayne/Batman. It's one of my favorite parts of the film. Go buy the soundtrack. I listen to it on the way to work, at work, when I sleep. In every way, it beats Elfman's recycled style that only resonates from Tim Burton movies. I'm so sick of hearing about how good it was, when the trumpety and high school band drum sounds don't belong anywhere near Batman. Aren't any of you true comic book fans here? When you read A Death in the Family, The Long Halloween, The Dark Knight Returns, do you hear Elfman's fruity little theme in the back of your head? I hope not. I sure don't.

Zimmer & Newton-Howard nailed it. End of story.


i agree Zimmers and Howards score is better than Elfmans and thats why i expect it to get an Oscar nomination for best score.

[Night Walker SL]

Ive been re reading most of my batman comic collection to both soundtracks and I feel much more into the experience listening to the Zimmer/Howard music as opposed to elfman's work. Elfman is masterful and most of his music gives me the chills when I listen to it, but reading The Long Halloween today with track 4 of the BB soundtrack...at around 2:10 until the end of the track I was just transported into another realm, it was almost euphoric....I was IN Gotham City.

I vote for Zimmer/Howard

[Catman]

When I read a Batman comic book I hear Elfman's music. Sometimes I can hear Walker's score. But I have yet to hear Zimmer/Howards score.

[etrigan69]

I will always prefer Elfman's. I'm glad that didn't use it for Begins though. The score for Begins was very good. The only thing I will say is as soon as Elfman's score starts, you think Batman. It's just so ingrained in my head much like the score for Superman or Star Wars. So it's a bit unfair of a question!

[etrigan69]

Zimmer/Howard captured the emotionality, psychology, and trepidation better than Elfman ever could.
I am kind of there with you. I was playing the game on PS2 and the score fit the scenes and vibe very distinctly.

They really both work for me, they just have different strengths.

But Elfman's just has a melody more to my liking. I will never knock either of them and again, Elfman's has a built in edge.

[Dr. MIX]

I am kind of there with you. I was playing the game on PS2 and the score fit the scenes and vibe very distinctly.

They really both work for me, they just have different strengths.

But Elfman's just has a melody more to my liking. I will never knock either of them and again, Elfman's has a built in edge.The music for the game were not the works of Zimmer/Howard I think.

[Catman]

The only thing I will say is as soon as Elfman's score starts, you think Batman. It's just so ingrained in my head much like the score for Superman or Star Wars.

Yup. Same here!

[Rockbottom]

Sorry but Elfmans just walks on Z/H's, I mean theres was okay, nothing great. The lack of theme is still the main point, but Elfman is just amazing in everything and Batman was his best imo.

[El Payaso]

Elfman is unbeatable as Batman composer so far. BB score was very good but not as much.

Walker only used parts of Elfman's scores in the early episodes which were mostly forgotten. Her Batman and villain themes sound nothing like Elfman's work.

Sound so similar it's not even funny.

[CaptainStacy]

Man, when it comes to Batman,i hear Danny Elfman's music in my head even when i read the freaking comics!

It's the definitive Batman theme, imo.

[Gale]

I used to think Elfman was unbeatable, but the more I listened to Zimmer and Howard the more I liked it. The power of it is more subtle than Elfman yet it beats Elfman's because of the sublty.

[ddddeeee]

Subtle is just about the last word I'd use to describe Zimmer/JNH's scores.

[Happy Jack]

Shirley Walker.

[Elevator Man]

I'm surprised somebody would bump a 7 year old thread instead of creating a new thread on the same topic, but anyways. My answer is obvious. Especially after judging the music ( if that's what you want to call it) that's come from the Nolan trilogy. I can say Elfman OWNS all 3 Batman scores from the Nolan trilogy combined. Elfman not only wrote an "iconic" theme that captures the essence and heart of the character as well as his universe. He also wrote a very memorable score that stays with you even after 23 years. That was both oscar worthy and groundbreaking, imho. Also both of Elfman's Batman scores are one of the best superhero/comic book movie scores ever written, imho.

The scores to Nolan's batfilms are mostly sound design and are interchangeable with any action blockbuster score (especially by Zimmer and his clones) today. It's just a big noisefest that seems to grow each score. It's a shame with all the talent involved and the additional composers for each that they couldn't come up with anything better than the final product. The character and films deserved better, imo. The scores for BB/TDK/TDKR are the weakest batscores in recent times, imo. Walker and Goldenthal also OWN the Nolan scores easily, imho. I haven't heard TDKR seperate from the film but man what a huge waste of talent on that score. It's also a huge missed opportunity for Zimmer. This is the last batman adventure in the Nolanverse. And he didn't come up with anything remote memorable or fresh in the film. The only that was memorable was the material reused from the previous two scores. It also didn't feel like a real conclusion musically. I was not impressed by it in the film. Hopefully this is it for Zimmer (and his clones) as far as Batman scores go. Though I fear for the MOS score.

Also both of Elfman's batscores deserved an oscar nomination. None of the scores to the Nolan Batfilms deserve a nomination. Let alone winning one. I don't get the praise and love for TDKR or the previous two scores. They're nothing special to my ears. But if you love those kind of scores more power to you. I guess. I just find 'em very overrated and am starting to believe the same about Zimmer.

If TDKR score gets a nomination then it must mean that that kind of music (or wall of noise) must be what's considered oscar worthy these days. And the oscars will lose more credibility than they already have for me.

[Nite-Watchman]

I'm surprised somebody would bump a 7 year old thread instead of creating a new thread on the same topic, but anyways. My answer is obvious. Especially after judging the music ( if that's what you want to call it) that's come from the Nolan trilogy. I can say Elfman OWNS all 3 Batman scores from the Nolan trilogy combined. Elfman not only wrote an "iconic" theme that captures the essence and heart of the character as well as his universe. He also wrote a very memorable score that stays with you even after 23 years. That was both oscar worthy and groundbreaking, imho. Also both of Elfman's Batman scores are one of the best superhero/comic book movie scores ever written, imho.

The scores to Nolan's batfilms are mostly sound design and are interchangeable with any action blockbuster score (especially by Zimmer and his clones) today. It's just a big noisefest that seems to grow each score. It's a shame with all the talent involved and the additional composers for each that they couldn't come up with anything better than the final product. The character and films deserved better, imo. The scores for BB/TDK/TDKR are the weakest batscores in recent times, imo. Walker and Goldenthal also OWN the Nolan scores easily, imho. I haven't heard TDKR seperate from the film but man what a huge waste of talent on that score. It's also a huge missed opportunity for Zimmer. This is the last batman adventure in the Nolanverse. And he didn't come up with anything remote memorable or fresh in the film. The only that was memorable was the material reused from the previous two scores. It also didn't feel like a real conclusion musically. I was not impressed by it in the film. Hopefully this is it for Zimmer (and his clones) as far as Batman scores go. Though I fear for the MOS score.

Also both of Elfman's batscores deserved an oscar nomination. None of the scores to the Nolan Batfilms deserve a nomination. Let alone winning one. I don't get the praise and love for TDKR or the previous two scores. They're nothing special to my ears. But if you love those kind of scores more power to you. I guess. I just find 'em very overrated and am starting to believe the same about Zimmer.

If TDKR score gets a nomination then it must mean that that kind of music (or wall of noise) must be what's considered oscar worthy these days. And the oscars will lose more credibility than they already have for me.

That about sums it up! Elfman's score screams Batman (not literally), but it fits a specific atmosphere and character. Zimmerman's score could be put in quite a few movies and it wouldn't clash.

[Fudgie]

Zimmer

[CapedCrusader14]

Zimmer/Newton Howard for me.

[uniqueweasel]

Elfman, I used to listen to that theme every day before I went to school, it really is the music for Batman, for me anyways.

[PWN3R]

http://i.imgur.com/IHgOV.jpg

[GothamAlleys]

http://i.imgur.com/IHgOV.jpg

:up:

[Elevator Man]

http://i.imgur.com/IHgOV.jpg


Speaking for myself b/c one composer (Elfman) actually wrote two great batman scores and the other (Zimmer and co.) wrote three lackluster batman scores, imo. But if you like both equally good for you and anybody else. There's only very few things I like about the scores to the Nolan Batman films (at least the first two anyway b/c I don't own TDKR score yet) I enjoy pretty much everything about Elfman's two batscores. Now those are masterpieces, imo.

[AnneFan]

:up:
:up: :up:

[Cain]

I was playing Lego Batman 2 and it's crazy how Elfman's music just fit like a glove. I really couldn't picture playing that game with Zimmer's canned noise as the backdrop.

[CapedCrusader14]

I was playing Lego Batman 2 and it's crazy how Elfman's music just fit like a glove. I really couldn't picture playing that game with Zimmer's canned noise as the backdrop.

I couldn't either. I prefer Zimmer's work but Elfman's work sounds beautiful with the game.

[Fudgie]

It's in the first Lego game as well.

[Bruce_Begins]

Danny Elfman's score was iconic but it does not fit the tone of Nolan's Batman movies, it was suited for Burton's Batman and BATS (I know, the series got a score Shirley Walker.)

Hans Zimmer and JNH's score was perfect for the Nolan's trilogy and I don't think that it was a generic score.

[BatLobsterRises]

Elfman's is more iconic and memorable.

Zimmer (especially his work in TDKR) is more emotionally powerful. You can call it generic, you can call it sound design, I don't care.

Elfman's music makes me this, "Yeah, it's Batman!"

Zimmer's music actually makes me want to go out and be Batman. It's two entirely different musical approaches for two entirely different cinematic approaches. And IMO, each works just great.

[Elevator Man]

Elfman's is more iconic and memorable.

Zimmer (especially his work in TDKR) is more emotionally powerful. You can call it generic, you can call it sound design, I don't care.


Batman 89 score had some emotional moments too. "Childhood Remembered" anyone. heck even the track "finale" is emotional. Elfman's BR was definitely emotional. Most of the penguin material was emotional. And that last ten minutes of BR was emotional everything from when Bruce reveals himself to Selina to Penguin's funeral to bruce being lonely on Christmas Day to the Catwoman reveal at the end.

Elfman's music makes me this, "Yeah, it's Batman!"

Zimmer's music actually makes me want to go out and be Batman. It's two entirely different musical approaches for two entirely different cinematic approaches. And IMO, each works just great.

Just when I thought I heard it all when it comes to the praising of Zimmer's batscores. But good for you if Zimmer's bat scores have that effect on you.

[BatLobsterRises]

Batman 89 score had some emotional moments too. "Childhood Remembered" anyone. heck even the track "finale" is emotional. Elfman's BR was definitely emotional. Most of the penguin material was emotional. And that last ten minutes of BR was emotional everything from when Bruce reveals himself to Selina to Penguin's funeral to bruce being lonely on Christmas Day to the Catwoman reveal at the end.



Just when I thought I heard it all when it comes to the praising of Zimmer's batscores. But good for you if Zimmer's bat scores have that effect on you.

Come one now...it was just an expression. In other words, it gets me pumped up- I love driving to it, working out to it, etc.

And I shouldn't have downplayed the emotion in Elfman's score. You're right, it's there. Finale used to give me goosebumps as a kid. And Returns is a masterpiece, all of Penguin's music especially.

Zimmer's just hits me in a different way. I'm in no way calling it superior. Musically Elfman runs circles around Zimmer. It's just that Zimmer's has this raw, primal energy in its simplicity that I really think ends up embodying Batman amazingly well. It captures his anger and his indomintable will, whereas I felt Elfman captured his mysteriousness and operatic nature.

[AnneFan]

BR is a very emotional soundtrack. The most of any Batman score to date, and I really don't see it being topped in that regard.

It's just that Zimmer's has this raw, primal energy in its simplicity that I really think ends up embodying Batman amazingly well. It captures his anger and his indomintable will, whereas I felt Elfman captured his mysteriousness and operatic nature.
Yep. Both are good at what they do IMO. What I liked with Zimmer's Bat scores was the hardness (the tribal drumming of Barbastella for example) that we didn't really get in the same way with Elfman.

[Coca Cola Duracell Franklin.]

Zimmer is a lazy bastard. Elfman all the way.

[lonelywalker]

Elfman's soundtrack really makes me feel that Batman is in action.

Zimmer's score is well, just more of the same epic samey.