Catwoman / Selina Kyle thread [Archive] - Page 10

peteagassi

01-18-2008, 06:59 PM

Majik1387

01-18-2008, 07:05 PM

That's a pretty damn close minded view.

escobar2248

01-18-2008, 07:26 PM

BatmanFanatic

01-18-2008, 08:26 PM

Reread what you just typed aloud and then you'll realize that you make yourself contradictory.

Based on what you typed, if Catwoman was crazy, she'd be a legit character in a Nolan Batman film.

I'd really enjoy seeing Selina/Catwoman in one of these films. Especially in a half ally/half foe type role. If Two/Face can be worked into this film series, Catwoman/Selina wouldn't be a problem.

:woot::oldrazz::woot: Not only that, but this series tends to be a sausage fest :oldrazz::woot::oldrazz:

I don't think Catwoman would fit into Nolans world and I don't think he'd ever use her. Honestly because I don't think he'd know what to do with her, just like he doesn't know what to do with Robin.

But I don't think she's crazy for dressing up like an animal and that Batman should be the only one to do that. Half the girls at my college wear cat ear hair-bands or other animal-ear-hats because it's the cool, anime-style thing to do. I imagine if you're a sexy cat-burglar and a woman who loves fashion and style and jewelry as Selina Kyle does, there's no reason why she'd have to be crazy in order to put some cute cat ears on her burglary disguise/outfit and a little jeweled belt or something. Not to mention the tongue in cheek joke about "cat-burglar" and the fact that she really does love and own a lot of cats.

Makes perfect sense to me. She wants to stand out from the crowd. Selina Kyle is proud of her prowess and wants to have a signature look. If the security cameras or Batman catch a glimpse of her, she wants them to know it was the Catwoman that ripped them off and got away with it.

batboy99

01-18-2008, 08:34 PM

After what you said about Eliza and Beckinsale I can't take anything you say about acting to heart.

Sorry...

:csad:

As for Russell...

She can act, I'll give you that, but she has no sex appeal. She's a great big :sleepy: fest!!!!!why because eliza is a better actress than kate? evne if eliza isnt all that great, shes a hell of alot better than beckinsale, beckinsale is just eye candy, shes a horrible,wooden actress. Thanks, but i know the difference between bad acting and good acting

though, based o looks, beckinsale probably looks the most like selina. Hey, if she was a better actress, i wouldnt be saying this, in fact shed probably bew one of my top choices.

David Rice

01-18-2008, 09:16 PM

Catwoman would not work in this series. Period. I know you guys will be like, "But if they make her a super realistic, hi-tech, burglar. It will work." No. No, it won't. Nobody should have reason to dress up like an animal except Bruce Wayne. Bruce Wayne is crazy; that's why he does what he does. And that's why I love him. Of course, in this film, we're going to see others dress up like Batman; this is because it is the notion of realism. They arent doing it on their own accord; theyre copying batman: he's a symbol. Why do we wanna dress up like Batman? I mean, the guy is a bat! I wanna dress up like him because he stands for good, for change. Batman is a complex character, and I don't think the zany characters will fit with this incarnation: The chris nolan incarnation.

On Robin:

"I wouldn't know how to handle that." - Chris Nolan

On Penguin:

"No. I just don't see those more extreme characters fitting in this world."

- Chris Nolan

Don't get mad at me for saying this. The man himself, Chris Nolan, the helmer, is pretty much saying it himself.

Why? Why wouldn't others have a reason to dress up like animals? Catwoman first put on her costume after seeing Batman in action in order to help herself and others. So, she would fit perfectly in the world Nolan has been creating.

Did he say Catwoman? No, he said Robin and Penguin. I'll also bet that Nolan was talking about the Tim Burton Penguin. If not then tell me how could a Crime Boss/Arms Dealer nor fit into his films?

Oh, and Bruce wayne is not crazy. You can't call someone crazy just becuase you don't understand them.

That's a pretty damn close minded view.

Yes, it is! :cwink:

David Rice

01-18-2008, 09:19 PM

why because eliza is a better actress than kate? evne if eliza isnt all that great, shes a hell of alot better than beckinsale, beckinsale is just eye candy, shes a horrible,wooden actress. Thanks, but i know the difference between bad acting and good acting.

though, based o looks, beckinsale probably looks the most like selina. Hey, if she was a better actress, i wouldnt be saying this, in fact shed probably bew one of my top choices.

No, she's not.

Clearly you don't sir, but that's ok. :cwink:

Majik1387

01-18-2008, 09:21 PM

Thanks But really, do we really need to know her motivation to don cat ears?
Do we know even Joker's motivation for his clown make up for TDK? :huh:

DieSmiling

01-18-2008, 09:22 PM

why because eliza is a better actress than kate? evne if eliza isnt all that great, shes a hell of alot better than beckinsale, beckinsale is just eye candy, shes a horrible,wooden actress. Thanks, but i know the difference between bad acting and good acting

though, based o looks, beckinsale probably looks the most like selina. Hey, if she was a better actress, i wouldnt be saying this, in fact shed probably bew one of my top choices.

Kate Beckinsale > Eliza Dushku

By a lot.

The Battousai

01-18-2008, 09:23 PM

Kate Beckinsale > Eliza Dushku

By a lot.

QFT

:hoboj: :up:

David Rice

01-18-2008, 09:27 PM

Kate Beckinsale > Eliza Dushku

By a lot.

Thank you sir! :cwink:

BatmanFanatic

01-18-2008, 10:09 PM

Thank you sir! :cwink:

Good lord, I can't believe we're wasting time on this thread arguing over who is the better BAD actress.

Meryl Streep can act okay? Michelle Pfeiffer can ACT. Julianne Moore can act. Helen Mirren can act ... circles around others.

These pop-tarts you're discussing are meant to be posters on your bedroom walls and sultry magazine covers appealing to the 'young and hip.' That's it.

Geez, good thing you're not having that discussion in a theater class or drama school. It would be embarrassing.

jmc

01-18-2008, 10:16 PM

Thanks But really, do we really need to know her motivation to don cat ears?
Do we know even Joker's motivation for his clown make up for TDK? :huh:

I think we do, it would just seem odd if there wasn't some reasonable explanation for her to steal whilst wearing the mask.

As for the Joker, well he's just insane. :woot:

David Rice

01-18-2008, 10:44 PM

Good lord, I can't believe we're wasting time on this thread arguing over who is the better BAD actress.

Meryl Streep can act okay? Michelle Pfeiffer can ACT. Julianne Moore can act. Helen Mirren can act ... circles around others.

These pop-tarts you're discussing are meant to be posters on your bedroom walls and sultry magazine covers appealing to the 'young and hip.' That's it.

Geez, good thing you're not having that discussion in a theater class or drama school. It would be embarrassing.

I'm not arguing, just giving opinions. I don't think Kate is a "bad actress" and I don't think Eliza is a "bas actress". Do I think either could pull off Catwoman? Kate, yes. Eliza, no.

Pop-tarts? What does that mean? She's not some teenage looking pop princess.

The only thing embarrassing here is you making a big deal over nothing.

The Battousai

01-18-2008, 11:13 PM

Kate Beckinsale (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000295/) - 34

Eliza Dushku (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0244630/) - 27

BatmanFanatic

01-18-2008, 11:20 PM

I'm not arguing, just giving opinions. I don't think Kate is a "bad actress" and I don't think Eliza is a "bas actress". Do I think either could pull off Catwoman? Kate, yes. Eliza, no.

Pop-tarts? What does that mean? She's not some teenage looking pop princess.

How about we define "bad actress" as *not a good actress*!

What have those pop-tarts (pop-culture-eye-candy-females) ever been in that you would say is GOOD acting? What awards have they won of any merit? What critics have sung their praises?

Catwoman is a complicated character, with multiple motivations and issues. She had a bad childhood and re-invented herself into a high society woman, so she spends her time pretending to be wealthy by default while secretly despising the people she's around and robbing them. She loves Batman but loves to throw him off buildings and laugh even more. She fancies herself as robbing from the rich and undeserving, but is often egotistical, vain and hedonistic herself. She is an accomplished athlete, incredibly sexy, self-confident, rebellious and sometimes at odds with herself. She is kind and humanitarian at heart, but sometimes more so to pets than to people.

It would take a really great actress to be able to capture those things, and I'm almost offended that pop-tarts are being considered for this iconic role. At least Nolan didn't make the mistake of having The Rock play Batman, and Adam Sandler play Joker, just because they're POPULAR.

The Battousai

01-18-2008, 11:23 PM

How about we define "bad actress" as *not a good actress*!

What have those pop-tarts (pop-culture-eye-candy-females) ever been in that you would say is GOOD acting? What awards have they won of any merit? What critics have sung their praises?

It would take a really great actress to be able to capture those things, and I'm almost offended that pop-tarts are being considered for this iconic role. At least Nolan didn't make the mistake of having The Rock play Batman, and Adam Sandler play Joker, just because they're POPULAR.

Just because you're only familiar with one role that someone has played doesn't mean they're only as good as they show themselves to be in that one particular instance.

DaddyGrayson

01-19-2008, 03:04 AM

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 03:59 AM

Actually, I don't think either one of those actresses are that popular. Definitely not as popular as Heath who is playing the Joker. So that's a bad example.

That being said, do I want either as Catwoman? No. But that's not related to them being popular, cuz let's face it, neither one of them is that big.

Just about everyone people have suggested on the forum to play Catwoman has been a pop-tart, a sex symbol, etc. It's like they can't get past the "look" to see there is actually a real CHARACTER in Catwoman, that would take a real ACTRESS to play. Not a sexy female with a lot of magazine covers who is always pretty much herself in movies ... thats not an actress, that's a personality.

Gianakin_

01-19-2008, 04:04 AM

Just about everyone people have suggested on the forum to play Catwoman has been a pop-tart, a sex symbol, etc. It's like they can't get past the "look" to see there is actually a real CHARACTER in Catwoman, that would take a real ACTRESS to play. Not a sexy female with a lot of magazine covers who is always pretty much herself in movies ... thats not an actress, that's a personality.

Qft. Some people have said dropped good ideas, though. But only some.

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 04:20 AM

Qft. Some people have said dropped good ideas, though. But only some.

A tiny minority perhaps. Chances are if it's an actress who is 18-30 and everyone on here knows her name, she's a pop-tart.

jmc

01-19-2008, 04:25 AM

Just about everyone people have suggested on the forum to play Catwoman has been a pop-tart, a sex symbol, etc. It's like they can't get past the "look" to see there is actually a real CHARACTER in Catwoman, that would take a real ACTRESS to play. Not a sexy female with a lot of magazine covers who is always pretty much herself in movies ... thats not an actress, that's a personality.

Catwoman is more than just some hot chick in a skin tight suit, she deserves not only to be written as more than just eye candy but also deserves a quality actress.

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 04:28 AM

Catwoman is more than just some hot chick in a skin tight suit, she deserves not only to be written as more than just eye candy but also deserves a quality actress.

Exactly. Thank-you.

That's why I wish people would stop suggesting the names of women who basically are experts at skin-tight clothing.

jmc

01-19-2008, 04:32 AM

Exactly. Thank-you.

That's why I wish people would stop suggesting the names of women who basically are experts at skin-tight clothing.

There is a tendency for people to suggest actresses who have played a similar kind of role to the Cat, it's sort of expected though, it's a point of reference I guess. There's really only been maybe 2-3 names mentioned on any of the Cat threads that haven't made me roll my eyes.

Gianakin_

01-19-2008, 04:52 AM

That's the problem.
People here choose actors according to how similar roles they've played before, not if they can actually act, which is their job.

So they want a guy who's played crazy roles or is a little crazy himself as the Joker, or someone who's played 2 extremes of a personality for Two-Face, or someone who can be sexy in leather tights as Catwoman.

If that was the case, then no actor/actress would never go anywhere, because people would never want them for a diffrent role than the one they've already played.

It really is buffling most of the time.

jmc

01-19-2008, 05:08 AM

The best actors I find are the ones who can do the roles they don't seem suited for, and usually those roles are memorable ones. Honestly, how many people thought of Heath Ledger as being the Joker? Hell, he's never even played a bad guy until now, and yet from what we've seen so far, the casting was a stroke of genius.

Laderlappen

01-19-2008, 05:37 AM

An actress that isn't usually known to be a huge-hot-sexy-whatever, can if that actress is good enough actress, be able to bring alot of sexuality to a role. Even people you would never imagine.

Catwoman should be sexy, but it should be different from "movie-star" sexy.

If you're NOT a good enough actress, you'll be just boring to look at, no matter how "hot" you're are.

escobar2248

01-19-2008, 06:35 AM

If you're NOT a good enough actress, you'll be just boring to look at, no matter how "hot" you're are.

Couldn't agree more.

Why is everyone trying to come up with a rather unknown/unproven actress in this role??

itsthebatman

01-19-2008, 06:39 AM

Just about everyone people have suggested on the forum to play Catwoman has been a pop-tart, a sex symbol, etc. It's like they can't get past the "look" to see there is actually a real CHARACTER in Catwoman, that would take a real ACTRESS to play. Not a sexy female with a lot of magazine covers who is always pretty much herself in movies ... thats not an actress, that's a personality.
Charlize Theron is an Oscar-winning actress. I think she could pull it off. That said,who would you like to see in the role?

Vs-F-J

01-19-2008, 07:10 AM

God, everyone has just become so high and mighty in this thread it beggars belief. I don't even know if I disagree with what you're all saying, but the self-righteousness is so stifling I don't even want to get involved.

escobar2248

01-19-2008, 07:35 AM

Charlize Theron is an Oscar-winning actress. I think she could pull it off. That said,who would you like to see in the role?

Either Jolie or Theron are the only two I'd consider.

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 07:37 AM

escobar2248

01-19-2008, 07:37 AM

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 07:44 AM

Charlize Theron is an Oscar-winning actress. I think she could pull it off. That said,who would you like to see in the role?

Charlize is a great actress, and Monster was an amazing performance from her. Given however that she was lack-luster in a very similar type of role, as a female acrobat/martial artist who is tough and sexy and wears a skin-tight black outfit, I wouldn't want a repeat performance like that. She's very attractive, and has great physical skills (was a dancer, very flexible, learned gymnastics quickly) but did not portray the strong, @$$-kicking character convincingly.

I would like to see someone in the role who is not already a super-star, so they can bring something fresh and mysterious to the part. I would like to see Catwoman (if they ever use her again) to captivate the audience with an aura of "who IS this wonderful woman!" not, "Oh look, it's her again. And now she's got cat ears." I would like it to be someone who went through a long series of competitive auditions to "win" the part, someone with the look and the skills required (at least some of them) and someone who can play the part with a high level of confidence, charisma and passion.

I wouldn't pick the name of anyone I already know because I think it should be strictly based on auditions, and seeing how the actress can say the lines and act the movements in character, rather than what she looks like (they're all pretty...) or how already popular she is.

Those are my personal criteria =P

Juha

01-19-2008, 07:51 AM

BatmanFanatic clearly wants to make out with Catwoman. And I don't blame her! Actually I would like to tape that and watch it over and over again! :woot:

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 07:56 AM

BatmanFanatic clearly wants to make out with Catwoman. And I don't blame her! Actually I would like to tape that and watch it over and over again! :woot:

There's a random and funny comment... It's almost siggy worthy. :whatever::cwink:

Gianakin_

01-19-2008, 08:00 AM

Charlize is a great actress, and Monster was an amazing performance from her. Given however that she was lack-luster in a very similar type of role, as a female acrobat/martial artist who is tough and sexy and wears a skin-tight black outfit, I wouldn't want a repeat performance like that. She's very attractive, and has great physical skills (was a dancer, very flexible, learned gymnastics quickly) but did not portray the strong, @$$-kicking character convincingly.
level of confidence, charisma and passion.

However, Aeon Flux was a crappy film (imo) and the director of that film was a crappy one, too.
So, I'd say that you're falling into the trap I mentioned earlier in this thread. That you judge her by another role, and not by her capabilities as an actress.

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 08:07 AM

However, Aeon Flux was a crappy film (imo) and the director of that film was a crappy one, too.
So, I'd say that you're falling into the trap I mentioned earlier in this thread. That you judge her by another role, and not by her capabilities as an actress.

I don't think so, because I've seen many of her films. And all actors have a range. There are things they do well, and things they do not so well. You can get an Oscar for something you do very well, and still be terrible at another type of part.

Of course the movie was rather bad, but that doesn't change the fact that she was not believable as a tough leader / assassin / martial artist. She was never dangerously threatening, she just went through the motions of the choreography. I never said to myself while watching that film, even for a moment, "Wow, that Aeon Flux is a bad-@$$ chick!" All I thought was, wow, "I'm not sure how this skinny girl is winning. I don't think even the skinny girl is sure why she's winning!"

I don't think you should compare actors ability based on un-related roles. But if the characters have some common characteristics ... like INTENSITY or CONFIDENCE ... and she didn't capture that at all, that's reason to worry for me.

Vs-F-J

01-19-2008, 08:09 AM

You British cats sure like to sound smart.....:oldrazz::oldrazz:

Mainly because we are. :oldrazz: :cwink:

Charlize is a great actress, and Monster was an amazing performance from her. Given however that she was lack-luster in a very similar type of role, as a female acrobat/martial artist who is tough and sexy and wears a skin-tight black outfit, I wouldn't want a repeat performance like that. She's very attractive, and has great physical skills (was a dancer, very flexible, learned gymnastics quickly) but did not portray the strong, @$$-kicking character convincingly.

I would like to see someone in the role who is not already a super-star, so they can bring something fresh and mysterious to the part. I would like to see Catwoman (if they ever use her again) to captivate the audience with an aura of "who IS this wonderful woman!" not, "Oh look, it's her again. And now she's got cat ears." I would like it to be someone who went through a long series of competitive auditions to "win" the part, someone with the look and the skills required (at least some of them) and someone who can play the part with a high level of confidence, charisma and passion.

I wouldn't pick the name of anyone I already know because I think it should be strictly based on auditions, and seeing how the actress can say the lines and act the movements in character, rather than what she looks like (they're all pretty...) or how already popular she is.

Those are my personal criteria =P

I had this idea, once upon a time. But then people pointed out to me that none of the other cast members are "unknowns" who were discovered just for Batman, and I kinda agreed with them.

Charlize was obviously briefed by the director on how to play Aeon Flux, and that is exactly what would happen for Catwoman, so it's unlikely she'll play them the same. It isn't her saying, "I'm going to play her this way (cos it's the only way I know how)". I can just imagine an interview with Nolan saying "Charlize and I spent a lot of time together talking about how she should play Catwoman, what motivates her, and what makes her individual and not like the others. It's a difficult challenge, but she's such a talented actress I had no doubt she'd understand what I was trying to achieve, and I think she really pulled off a great performance".

You have to give Charlize more credit than thinking she can only play the action role one way. She's not Jennifer Garner or Milla Jovovich!

Gianakin_

01-19-2008, 08:11 AM

Charlize was obviously briefed by the director on how to play Aeon Flux, and that is exactly what would happen for Catwoman, so it's unlikely she'll play them the same. It isn't her saying, "I'm going to play her this way (cos it's the only way I know how)". I can just imagine an interview with Nolan saying "Charlize and I spent a lot of time together talking about how she should play Catwoman, what motivates her, and what makes her individual and not like the others. It's a difficult challenge, but she's such a talented actress I had no doubt she'd understand what I was trying to achieve, and I think she really pulled off a great performance".

Thank you.

Vs-F-J

01-19-2008, 08:14 AM

Of course the movie was rather bad, but that doesn't change the fact that she was not believable as a tough leader / assassin / martial artist. She was never dangerously threatening, she just went through the motions of the choreography. I never said to myself while watching that film, even for a moment, "Wow, that Aeon Flux is a bad-@$$ chick!" All I thought was, wow, "I'm not sure how this skinny girl is winning. I don't think even the skinny girl is sure why she's winning!"

Also, as someone else pointed out to me, Catwoman isn't just about looking tough and being able to kick the crap out of people. Catwoman's not a tough leader or assassin, and she doesn't walk about the place looking dangerous or threatening, and it's her attitude that is bad-@$$ more than her physicality. She is agile and graceful like a dancer, and if someone hassles her she can take them out, but she's not Xena Warrior Princess.

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 08:18 AM

Mainly because we are. :oldrazz: :cwink:

I had this idea, once upon a time. But then people pointed out to me that none of the other cast members are "unknowns" who were discovered just for Batman, and I kinda agreed with them.

Charlize was obviously briefed by the director on how to play Aeon Flux, and that is exactly what would happen for Catwoman, so it's unlikely she'll play them the same. It isn't her saying, "I'm going to play her this way (cos it's the only way I know how)". I can just imagine an interview with Nolan saying "Charlize and I spent a lot of time together talking about how she should play Catwoman, what motivates her, and what makes her individual and not like the others. It's a difficult challenge, but she's such a talented actress I had no doubt she'd understand what I was trying to achieve, and I think she really pulled off a great performance".

You have to give Charlize more credit than thinking she can only play the action role one way. She's not Jennifer Garner or Milla Jovovich!

Well I guess that's just where we diverge. Like I said, I think all actors have a range, even the great Oscar winning ones. I think this part would not be good for Charlize. Charlize has a wonderful "real" "vulnerable" and "feminine" quality to her expression, and she combined that vulnerability along with self-destruction and rage to create a fascinating character in "Monster." The passion and charisma and brash confidence needed for Catwoman however, I don't see that as in her repetoire.

Now, since Nolan is never going to have Catwoman, it's all good anyway.

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 08:20 AM

Also, as someone else pointed out to me, Catwoman isn't just about looking tough and being able to kick the crap out of people. Catwoman dosn't walk about the place looking dangerous or threatening, and it's her attitude that is bad-@$$ more than her physicality. She is agile and graceful like a dancer, and if someone hassles her she can take them out, but she's not Xena Warrior Princess.

I agree, but Aeon Flux didn't remotely make me believe she could take anyone out. It was like a ballerina with supernatural powers. Catwoman doesn't have superpowers. She's strong and fit along with being graceful, like a gymnast.

Vs-F-J

01-19-2008, 08:22 AM

Well then, get Charlize to put on muscle like they did for Halle in Catwoman. Bad film - but Halle's body looked great!

Gianakin_

01-19-2008, 08:24 AM

Now, since Nolan is never going to have Catwoman, it's all good anyway.

How did you go from "I hope Nolan won't include her" to "Since he won't include her" in one week? It's astounding.

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 08:26 AM

How did you go from "I hope Nolan won't include her" to "Since he won't include her" in one week? It's astounding.

I never "hoped" he wouldn't include her, I was always sure he wouldn't. Given that two face is the big bad in B3, I'm 99% positive Catwoman will be nowhere in sight. Plus he doesn't like melo-drama stories. He prefers plot and structure based film-making.

Why Are You Crouching Spock?

01-19-2008, 08:28 AM

I like the catwoman from the long haloween, she had a body like a pumu.
The dinkyer "Hush" catwoman was cool too, looked less of a fantastical suit.

http://batman.ugo.com/images/galleries/batman_thelonghalloween_comics/batman_thelonghalloween_1.jpg

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 08:29 AM

Well then, get Charlize to put on muscle like they did for Halle in Catwoman. Bad film - but Halle's body looked great!

She could put on as much muscle as Demi Moore for GI Jane (amazing job btw) and she still wouldn't be even remotely intimidating. She doesn't ever have that glint in her eye of real threat or power that comes from inside. If she played opposite Bale's scary, fierce, obsessive Batman, she would be like a dewy eyed leaf being blown around in the wind.

Catwoman is Batmans equal in confidence and capability. Where he is strong she is quick, where he is self-righteous she is playfully wicked ... I just don't think it's the kind of part she's right for or that she could pull it off with the right amount of animal intensity.

Gianakin_

01-19-2008, 08:30 AM

I never "hoped" he wouldn't include her, I was always sure he wouldn't. Given that two face is the big bad in B3, I'm 99% positive Catwoman will be nowhere in sight. Plus he doesn't like melo-drama stories. He prefers plot and structure based film-making.

I beg to differ. You did say in one of your posts some days ago that you shudder the thought of Nolan "getting his hands on her".
And one can never be sure. Not sure enough to declare "Since we wont see her" as the basis of one's statement.

Gianakin_

01-19-2008, 08:31 AM

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 08:32 AM

Since when is Catwoman intimidating?

Apparently you haven't read the comics much. I have. I own them starting at Catwoman #1 -- proud to say.

Intimidating doesn't mean she glares at people and they cry in the corner. It just means she's a tough enough cookie that if Batman were to pop out in front of her and growl, she wouldn't be phased by it at all. She has a VERY strong sense of self. And her skills/looks are intimidating to all the men she runs into. Security guards practically wet themselves when they catch her in action.

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 08:36 AM

I beg to differ. You did say in one of your posts some days ago that you shudder the thought of Nolan "getting his hands on her".

I can shudder at the thought of him getting his hands on her and not actually believe it will ever happen.

I mean honestly. I can have nightmares about space aliens coming to get me, doesn't mean I believe it will occur.

And one can never be sure. Not sure enough to declare "Since we wont see her" as the basis of one's statement.

Thats why I said I'm 99% sure, not 100%. Are you going to argue over that now of all things?

Gianakin_

01-19-2008, 08:39 AM

Apparently you haven't read the comics much. I have. I own them starting at Catwoman #1 -- proud to say.

I refuse to go to "my fandom is bigger than yours" kind of discussion.

Intimidating doesn't mean she glares at people and they cry in the corner. It just means she's a tough enough cookie that if Batman were to pop out in front of her and growl, she wouldn't be phased by it at all. She has a VERY strong sense of self. And her skills/looks are intimidating to all the men she runs into. Security guards practically wet themselves when they catch her in action.

That's what intimidating means?
I'm not American or English, so I looked it up in the dictionary (no, I'm not being a smartass, I really checked to see):
Intimidating (adj): frightening or threatening, esp because of being very large, important or difficult.

Considering that:
The fact that she's not phased by Batman, doesn't make her intimidating, it makes her fearless, or not intimidated.
A very strong sense of self also doesn't mean intimidating.
As far as security guards are concerned, I only saw that in BR. From the comics I've read (you've probably read more, as you declare), people see her and attack her. I've never seen them run away scared, or intimidated. But I've been wrong before.

batboy99

01-19-2008, 08:42 AM

Kate Beckinsale > Eliza Dushku

By a lot.
not in acting :o, i think kate is alot better looking(though i do prefer eliza, but kate is still hotter), but shes a horrible, horrible actress. the only movie she was actually ok in was the aviator

Gianakin_

01-19-2008, 08:43 AM

I can shudder at the thought of him getting his hands on her and not actually believe it will ever happen.

I mean honestly. I can have nightmares about space aliens coming to get me, doesn't mean I believe it will occur.

That's true. I stand corrected.

Thats why I said I'm 99% sure, not 100%. Are you going to argue over that now of all things?

I just don't like it when people behave as if something is a fact.
And you posted the 99% bit, after I argued over the "since we won't see her" bit (which would be something one would post after a statement by Nolan like "I won't include Selina in BB3").
I know I'm probably playing with words, but I'm a person who takes things quite literally, so I can't help it.

batboy99

01-19-2008, 08:43 AM

No, she's not.

Clearly you don't sir, but that's ok. :cwink:
says the guy who thinks Beckinsale can act.

and i admit, eliza isnt all that great either, but she is better than Beckinsale, i really wish beckinsale was better, but shes not, hey if she gets some acting lessons, then maybe she can be selina

whateve,r i just prefer eliza
if you like beckinsale, thats fine, i respect that. But anyway, lets just end this right here.

escobar2248

01-19-2008, 08:44 AM

Apparently you haven't read the comics much. I have. I own them starting at Catwoman #1 -- proud to say.

That's pretty lame to play that card dude.

Gianakin_

01-19-2008, 08:47 AM

That's pretty lame to play that card dude.

She's not a dude!:oldrazz::woot:

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 08:48 AM

I refuse to go to "my fandom is bigger than yours" kind of discussion.

That's what intimidating means?
I'm not American or English, so I looked it up in the dictionary (no, I'm not being a smartass, I really checked to see):
Intimidating (adj): frightening or threatening, esp because of being very large, important or difficult.

Considering that:
The fact that she's not phased by Batman, doesn't make her intimidating, it makes her fearless, or not intimidated.
A very strong sense of self also doesn't mean intimidating.
As far as security guards are concerned, I only saw that in BR. From the comics I've read (you've probably read more, as you declare), people see her and attack her. I've never seen them run away scared, or intimidated. But I've been wrong before.

Okay, you are right that being fearless and having a strong sense of self are not the dictionary definition of intimidating. However, in the comics she is intimidating because she is a difficult and skilled opponent. Not as much as Bats certainly, who uses that as his #1 strategy, and maybe not as much as some other baddies, but none the less, to regular humans - cops, security guards, muggers, etc, she is intimidating. And back to the original issue, I dont see CT as being able to intimidate cops and security guards.

And BR was the least cannon-true interpretation of Catwoman ever made aside from that HB thing I won't even mention. BR was like alternate universe Catwoman it was so far removed from her comic persona.

Okay, I wont go to the fandom thing either, except to reference known character traits that I don't think CT would play very well. Those things include a Batman-equal iron will, an intimidation factor from strength and skill, as well as being able to stand up to raging-Bale-Batman without batting an eyelash.

That takes a very strong character, and a certain kind of actress I just dont think CT is. Nothing against her, I think she's very good, but no more Catwoman than that chick who plays Buffy the Vampire Slayer.

You know if Hellen Mirren was about 30 years younger, she'd be very good. She has the right kind of presence.

escobar2248

01-19-2008, 08:48 AM

**dude-ette

I didn't mean to come off harsh with my statement, but I hate it when people get on here and question who's a bigger fan based on their inventory of books/comics. It's one of those things that I don't understand.

Same thing goes for something like pizza. If we both agree that we like pizza, then we're fans. But then I begin to belittle you based on the fact you don't know every intricate detail or ingredient of the sauce/crust. It's childish. I know that it's unfair to compare Batman/Catwoman to something like a pizza.

A fan is a fan to me. No sense in arguing over who the bigger fan is.

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 08:51 AM

**dude-ette

:heart::meow::heart:

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 08:53 AM

**dude-ette

I didn't mean to come off harsh with my statement, but I hate it when people get on here and question who's a bigger fan based on their inventory of books/comics. It's one of those things that I don't understand.

A fan is a fan to me. No sense in arguing over who the bigger fan is.

Did I ever say anything about who the bigger fan is?

No, I merely pointed out that he was clearly not basing his views of the character off the comic canon, and instead on one film by Burton.

I'm not trying to be the 'biggest fan.' Just accurate.

Gianakin_

01-19-2008, 08:53 AM

However, in the comics she is intimidating because she is a difficult and skilled opponent. Not as much as Bats certainly, who uses that as his #1 strategy, and maybe not as much as some other baddies, but none the less, to regular humans - cops, security guards, muggers, etc, she is intimidating. And back to the original issue, I dont see CT as being able to intimidate cops and security guards.

Judging by Year One and Loeb's take on her, I wouldn't call her intimidating, but formidable.

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 08:56 AM

Judging by Year One and Loeb's take on her, I wouldn't call her intimidating, but formidable.

Uggg...year one. Shoot me now. Year One changed everything which had been previously established in the comics. That's Millers pet thing to do. Miller desperately wants Catwoman to be some kind of hooker. Thats what he does in Year One and TDKR. But thats not true to the origin at all.

How about her own series, which has been going on since I was in middle school? Or all her appearances in Batman, from the 40's on up?

Anyway, even formidable. This is about CT playing her. CT is not formidable, even when she needs to be for a character. That's why my vote is a nay.

escobar2248

01-19-2008, 08:59 AM

That takes a very strong character, and a certain kind of actress I just dont think CT is. Nothing against her, I think she's very good, but no more Catwoman than that chick who plays Buffy the Vampire Slayer.

You need to watch Monster or North Country and you'll retract that statement. She's got the chops to pull off Catwoman. She's curvy, saavy, and can be very intimidating when the time comes.

Gianakin_

01-19-2008, 09:03 AM

Uggg...year one. Shoot me now. Year One changed everything which had been previously established in the comics. That's Millers pet thing to do. Miller desperately wants Catwoman to be some kind of hooker. Thats what he does in Year One and TDKR. But thats not true to the origin at all.

How about her own series, which has been going on since I was in middle school? Or all her appearances in Batman, from the 40's on up?

Anyway, even formidable. This is about CT playing her. CT is not formidable, even when she needs to be for a character. That's why my vote is a nay.

But the thing is, when in the end it comes down to which version is your (or my) favorite, every comic book character changes.
So, in some she's intimidating (which I still don't believe, but I'll take your word for it for the time being), in others (the ones I've read) she's not.

As far as formidable is concerned. Again, if you say that Charlize has range and consider her a good actress, then she can act formidable.
Bale isn't badass (I know someone's gonna joke about this), but he can act badass. Keaton, too.

I think that if we get a good and beautiful (+good body etc etc) actress, then she can act as Catwoman, even though her previous roles are nothing like that. Which, again, is a very basic thing of acting, at least imo.
I'd never dream of Ledger playing the Joker. He has none of the qualities of the character. But, as time has proven to many people, he can act all these qualities and play the Joker successfully.

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 09:04 AM

You need to watch Monster or North Country and you'll retract that statement. She's got the chops to pull off Catwoman. She's curvy, saavy, and can be very intimidating when the time comes.

If you were paying attention I talked about Monster in detail on this very thread. And I've seen both. And I don't think she was intimidating in either. Monster was twisted and raging and vulnerable. North Country was butch and willing to take on conflict. But neither IMO showed a strong sense of self, intimidation or any other Catwoman-like qualities.

escobar2248

01-19-2008, 09:05 AM

I'd never dream of Ledger playing the Joker. He has none of the qualities of the character. But, as time has proven to many people, he can act all these qualities and play the Joker successfully.

Nice anology

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 09:06 AM

But the thing is, when in the end it comes down to which version is your (or my) favorite, every comic book character changes.
So, in some she's intimidating (which I still don't believe, but I'll take your word for it for the time being), in others (the ones I've read) she's not.

As far as formidable is concerned. Again, if you say that Charlize has range and consider her a good actress, then she can act formidable.
Bale isn't badass (I know someone's gonna joke about this), but he can act badass. Keaton, too.

I think that if we get a good and beautiful (+good body etc etc) actress, then she can act as Catwoman, even though her previous roles are nothing like that. Which, again, is a very basic thing of acting, at least imo.
I'd never dream of Ledger playing the Joker. He has none of the qualities of the character. But, as time has proven to many people, he can act all these qualities and play the Joker successfully.

Yes but I had never seen Ledger attempt to play a scary guy and fail, because he'd never been asked to play that before. So I wont judge.

CT was asked to play an intimidating, bad@$$ character and she failed. So why would she suddenly do it right for Catwoman?

And Bale has a long history of playing bad@$$es, and we don't know him in real life, maybe he is one. He's played a lot of killers, a lot of martial arts stuff, a lot of nasty street fighters ... you didn't have any doubts he could be intimidating when his name was up for Batman if you had seen his other films.

escobar2248

01-19-2008, 09:08 AM

If you were paying attention I talked about Monster in detail on this very thread. And I've seen both. And I don't think she was intimidating in either. Monster was twisted and raging and vulnerable. North Country was butch and willing to take on conflict. But neither IMO showed a strong sense of self, intimidation or any other Catwoman-like qualities.

Sorry,

I don't have the time to flip through 80 some pages of a Catwoman thread to see if you've offered opinion on those two movies.

escobar2248

01-19-2008, 09:09 AM

CT was asked to play an intimidating, bad@$$ character and she failed. So why would she suddenly do it right for Catwoman?

What role did she fail at?

Gianakin_

01-19-2008, 09:10 AM

CT was asked to play an intimidating, bad@$$ character and she failed. So why would she suddenly do it right for Catwoman?

In Aeon Flux? The one thing that this movie tried ooze of, was "coolness", including her role. Not an intimidating character.
I'm starting to suspect that the whole disagreement is coming out of one of us using the word "intimidating" in the wrong way.

And Bale has a long history of playing bad@$$es, and we don't know him in real life, maybe he is one. He's played a lot of killers, a lot of martial arts stuff, a lot of nasty street fighters ... you didn't have any doubts he could be intimidating when his name was up for Batman if you had seen his other films.

Indeed, but that was partly a coincidence, as far as I'm concerned.

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 09:10 AM

Nice anology

Flawed analogy. I am not comparing peoples personal qualities to the characters they may play. I am comparing their artistic range to the characters they may play. I have no idea how CT is in real life, but given her range of expression as an actress, that doesn't encompass Catwomans qualities.

It's like someone asks you to sing a G above C and you sing it. Then they ask you to sing a G two octaves above C and you can't. That doesn't mean you're a bad singer, but it is outside of your range. She was asked to hit the high note of intimidating action character, and she couldn't hit it. Catwoman is not in her range.

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 09:14 AM

In Aeon Flux? The one thing that this movie tried ooze of, was "cool". Not intimidation of her. I'm starting to suspect that the whole disagreement is coming out of one of us using the word "intimidating" in the wrong way.

So you think they wanted an UN-intimidating super assassin from the future? That doesn't make much sense. They were clearly out to show how incredibly scary she was with all her fighting craziness, but there was absolutely nothing believable about the look in her eyes when about to beat the $#!t out of someone. I'm sure it's because she's just a very nice person. =P

Maybe you're right about the word intimidating being used the wrong way so lets just drop it and have me say it differently - I don't think CT could portray the qualities of Catwoman. I don't think CT could stand up to Bale's beasty-Batman and look like she belongs there, completely comfortable and cocky no matter what he throws at her.

That is exactly Catwoman from the comics ... while everyone in Gotham is terrified of Batman, Catwoman just laughs at him, winks and does a backflip off a rooftop.

Gianakin_

01-19-2008, 09:18 AM

So you think they wanted an UN-intimidating super assassin from the future? That doesn't make much sense. They were clearly out to show how incredibly scary she was with all her fighting craziness, but there was absolutely nothing believable about the look in her eyes when about to beat the $#!t out of someone. I'm sure it's because she's just a very nice person. =P

No, I got none of that from how the character was written. They tried to make her the female Neo. Which is described as uber-cool. And the whole thing failed. And I blame the director mostly, not CT. Well, I could blame er for not trying, but I won't, 'cause in a movie like that, why would you try?

Maybe you're right about the word intimidating being used the wrong way so lets just drop it and have me say it differently - I don't think CT could portray the qualities of Catwoman. I don't think CT could stand up to Bale's beasty-Batman and look like she belongs there, completely comfortable and cocky no matter what he throws at her.

That's another story. And I agree.

That is exactly Catwoman from the comics ... while everyone in Gotham is terrified of Batman, Catwoman just laughs at him, winks and does a backflip off a rooftop.

That's partly true. She's also very interested/attracted to him, she doesn't just mock him. She considers him (in a twisted way) a full man, the only man for her. Of course, she's right.:woot:

escobar2248

01-19-2008, 09:39 AM

Flawed analogy. I am not comparing peoples personal qualities to the characters they may play. I am comparing their artistic range to the characters they may play. I have no idea how CT is in real life, but given her range of expression as an actress, that doesn't encompass Catwomans qualities.

I didn't come across that he was implying personal qualities, I assumed (We all know what happens when we assume :cwink: ) that he meant Heath's acting qualities. As far as CT's abilities go, I think she could pull off the tease/"not Catwoman again" type character, even though I think that Jolie would be more successful with that kind of role.

Of all of the books I have read that have related to Catwoman, she's been more of a tease to Batman than anything else. Especially with her winking, then backflip off the building into thin air.

I think that irratating is a better way of describing her more recent roles to the other Rogues in Batman. Every time she commits some sort of act against whoever, and succeeds....the victim is more agitated/irritated that she succeeded than anything else, at least to me. I may be wrong, lord knows I'm good at it.

I must say that I've enjoyed our little debate on here :woot:

David Rice

01-19-2008, 09:40 AM

How about we define "bad actress" as *not a good actress*!

What have those pop-tarts (pop-culture-eye-candy-females) ever been in that you would say is GOOD acting? What awards have they won of any merit? What critics have sung their praises?

Catwoman is a complicated character, with multiple motivations and issues. She had a bad childhood and re-invented herself into a high society woman, so she spends her time pretending to be wealthy by default while secretly despising the people she's around and robbing them. She loves Batman but loves to throw him off buildings and laugh even more. She fancies herself as robbing from the rich and undeserving, but is often egotistical, vain and hedonistic herself. She is an accomplished athlete, incredibly sexy, self-confident, rebellious and sometimes at odds with herself. She is kind and humanitarian at heart, but sometimes more so to pets than to people.

It would take a really great actress to be able to capture those things, and I'm almost offended that pop-tarts are being considered for this iconic role. At least Nolan didn't make the mistake of having The Rock play Batman, and Adam Sandler play Joker, just because they're POPULAR.

That's just it, I don't need to define Beckinsale that way because I think she's a fine actress given the right role. Pearl Harbor, The Aviator.

So you think that an actor must win awards and have critics singing praises to be considered a "good actor"? That's a pretty close minded view.

I wouldn't say she is even that POPULAR and she's definitely not a "pop-culture-eye-candy-female". The kind of "girl" you're talking about is in the news everyday, has her picture plastered all over newstands and (for some reason) whatever is going on in her life is more important in this country than anything in the world. That is not Kate Beckinsale.

And your point is that The Rock and Adam Sandler are bad actors because they are "POPULAR"? They're not bad actors, they are just not right for those roles.

Just about everyone people have suggested on the forum to play Catwoman has been a pop-tart, a sex symbol, etc. It's like they can't get past the "look" to see there is actually a real CHARACTER in Catwoman, that would take a real ACTRESS to play. Not a sexy female with a lot of magazine covers who is always pretty much herself in movies ... thats not an actress, that's a personality.

Thank you for assuming we just pick people who we think are "hot".

:whatever:

A tiny minority perhaps. Chances are if it's an actress who is 18-30 and everyone on here knows her name, she's a pop-tart.

That is the worst form of generalizing I've ever heard. You know this is just a personal observation, but baised on the posts I've read, you seem like a very negative person. You don't like Holmes, you KNOW that we will NEVER see Catwoman in Nolan's series and now you think every actress who has been suggested is a pop-culture-eye-candy-female?

Small minds, very sad. :csad:

Gianakin_

01-19-2008, 09:42 AM

escobar: Yes, I was talking about Heath's acting qualities, although I could've made it clearer.

batboy99

01-19-2008, 09:48 AM

And your point is that The Rock and Adam Sandler are bad actors because they are "POPULAR"? They're not bad actors, they are just not right for those roles.
agreed

and GC, im sorry if i offended you in a way. Ok,maybe Kate isnt that bad, shes jsut not my personal pic. As i said before, if she got acting lessons or put more emotion into her roles, shes catwoman,hands down.

David Rice

01-19-2008, 09:53 AM

agreed

and GC, im sorry if i offended you in a way. Ok,maybe Kate isnt that bad, shes jsut not my personal pic. As i said before, if she got acting lessons or put more emotion into her roles, shes catwoman,hands down.

You didn't offend me man. If I ever come off like I'm mad or pissed, I'm not. Don't sweat it! :yay:

Everyone has his or her tastes and opinions and SOME people here would do well to remember that. :woot:

batboy99

01-19-2008, 09:56 AM

Its not that i dont want beckinsale for selina, its just, shes never really impressed me with her roles, but i hope she gets better, i cant wait to see whiteout.

David Rice

01-19-2008, 10:05 AM

Its not that i dont want beckinsale for selina, its just, shes never really impressed me with her roles, but i hope she gets better, i cant wait to see whiteout.

The comic-con footage was cool.

batboy99

01-19-2008, 10:10 AM

yeah it was, even though she isnt my choice, im working on a GIF with her as catwoman/selina Kyle.

David Rice

01-19-2008, 10:25 AM

yeah it was, even though she isnt my choice, im working on a GIF with her as catwoman/selina Kyle.

Cool.

Vs-F-J

01-19-2008, 10:58 AM

She could put on as much muscle as Demi Moore for GI Jane (amazing job btw) and she still wouldn't be even remotely intimidating. She doesn't ever have that glint in her eye of real threat or power that comes from inside. If she played opposite Bale's scary, fierce, obsessive Batman, she would be like a dewy eyed leaf being blown around in the wind.

Catwoman is Batmans equal in confidence and capability. Where he is strong she is quick, where he is self-righteous she is playfully wicked ... I just don't think it's the kind of part she's right for or that she could pull it off with the right amount of animal intensity.

You couldn't possibly know that, because Charlize has never played Catwoman before. She doesn't have a huge repertoire of action heroines under her belt (which I thought was supposed to be a good thing?) - and Aeon Flux is not Catwoman - so you don't know what Charlize might bring to a new role, you can only judge on the fact that she is renowned as an excellent actress.

Bad movies and even bad performances aren't always just down to the actor - it's the director too. I don't know how anyone could possibly think that Nolan and Charlize working together would produce anything lacklustre or less than brilliant. :huh: :whatever:

Crook

01-19-2008, 12:09 PM

That's the problem.
People here choose actors according to how similar roles they've played before, not if they can actually act, which is their job.
I wouldn't say range is of the upmost importance here. As long as the actress can nail THIS role, then I couldn't care less what her previous characters were like.

The best actors I find are the ones who can do the roles they don't seem suited for, and usually those roles are memorable ones. Honestly, how many people thought of Heath Ledger as being the Joker? Hell, he's never even played a bad guy until now, and yet from what we've seen so far, the casting was a stroke of genius.
Ledger is one of those people that don't have a "persona" that can be identified. Same with Bale, and same with Depp. It's a lot easier for them to blend into their roles.

The initial shock of his casting wasn't necessarily that he wasn't suited for it, but people weren't sure if he could pull it off due to his filmography. He is a good actor, but could his range extend into Joker territory? That was the lingering question.

itsthebatman

01-19-2008, 01:23 PM

Well, I think Charlize has the looks and ability to pull the role off; if the script and role were strong enough, I think she could do a great job. That said, auditions do have a way of sorting out the wheat from the chaff, and can throw up surprising results: Jake Gyllenhaal was Goyer's favourite for Bruce Wayne/Batman for a while after his audition, and Cillian landed the Scarecrow role off the back of a failed Batman one. Who knows, if Selina did appear in this franchise, it could be the making of a new star. However, Nolan seems to have a habit of casting well-established actors in the main roles in these movies, and when he deviated from that once, we got Katie Holmes. So I suspect any future Selina Kyle will already be a well-known name.
Well, that was a rambling post.

jmc

01-19-2008, 02:26 PM

Ledger is one of those people that don't have a "persona" that can be identified. Same with Bale, and same with Depp. It's a lot easier for them to blend into their roles.

The initial shock of his casting wasn't necessarily that he wasn't suited for it, but people weren't sure if he could pull it off due to his filmography. He is a good actor, but could his range extend into Joker territory? That was the lingering question.

And that question has been answered. I do remember reading alot of posts saying Ledger was an awful choice, where are those people now? :whatever:

Laderlappen

01-19-2008, 02:38 PM

So I suspect any future Selina Kyle will already be a well-known name.
Well, that was a rambling post.Well known as in Heath Ledger/Aaron Eckhart/Maggie Gyllenhaal well known.

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 05:01 PM

That's another story. And I agree.

That's partly true. She's also very interested/attracted to him, she doesn't just mock him. She considers him (in a twisted way) a full man, the only man for her. Of course, she's right.:woot:

Yes and double yes ;)

To everyone else - I'm not keeping this thing going. I feel the reasons CT wouldn't fit the role are obvious, and to continue to argue the point wouldn't make it any clearer than it already is.

I also don't appreciate being called 'small-minded' because I'd rather have an actress who is *undoubtedly* fantastic as an actress, and not "well we can keep arguing about whether she is or isn't good" as an actress in the role of my favorite character. There are certain actresses that are so good and so proven no one can argue about whether they have the chops anymore. And I prefer one of that caliber.

Lastly I never said that people with awards and reviews were the ONLY great actresses, there may be great actresses that have not had enough exposure, but this is ONE WAY to have an objective judgment -- because bad actresses don't get tons of good reviews and awards. Anyone who's going to pick apart the logic of that to insult me, just really wants to argue over anything.

itsthebatman

01-19-2008, 05:06 PM

Well known as in Heath Ledger/Aaron Eckhart/Maggie Gyllenhaal well known.
Yes, as opposed to a complete unknown. A good actor, as opposed to a big star.

Crook

01-19-2008, 05:11 PM

I still say Catwoman is one of the few comic book roles where the actress' popularity doesn't matter in the least.

jmc

01-19-2008, 05:46 PM

Solid actresses only. :up:

Vs-F-J

01-19-2008, 05:56 PM

Paste Pot Pete

01-19-2008, 06:39 PM

Yes, as opposed to a complete unknown. A good actor, as opposed to a big star.

Yeah, I mean just look at Begins. There's not an unknown in the bunch; the smallest star at the time was probably Cillian, and even he had 28 Days Later under his belt and has since risen quite well.

That being said, I still haven't thought of anyone that perfectly suits Selina for me. But it won't be an unknown (if she'll ever be in these movies at all).

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 07:17 PM

And that question has been answered. I do remember reading alot of posts saying Ledger was an awful choice, where are those people now? :whatever:

Yoo hoo! Over here! :cwink:

Actually, I'm reserving judgement until I've seen TDK, but you won't hear "it was a stroke of genius!" from me UNTIL I've seen it and seen the reaction from the fans.

As opposed to some of these other actors(tresses) we're talking about, Heith had never been asked to play a part with any common qualities to the Joker previously, so I reserved judgment on whether he would be good or not in the role. And from what little I've seen, I think he will be. That's completely different than seeing (for example) Heith in something else where he had to be crazy or terrifying and failing completely and then having doubts about whether he should be cast as the Joker. Which is how I feel about some of these other actresses mentioned.

Now I ALWAYS said that he didn't look right for the part of the joker - too much of the pretty boy, and I still feel that way. And I always hated the make-up ... and probably always will.

You have to separate the "look" of the actor from the "performance" and the "makeup/costume" aspect. Ideally, all three would be just right. Unfortunately sometimes you get a great actor who does the performance perfectly but the costume is horrible and the look doesn't fit... and other times you get a perfect looking actor for the role but they can't act it believably at all. If I have to choose, I'd rather a great performance with an incorrect look... which is why everyone basing their picks for Catwoman mostly on looks is irritating.

Honestly, I would rather see Helen Mirren play an older version of Catwoman who is no longer active, ala TDKR, than someone like Kate B play her in her prime and muck it up.

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 07:31 PM

If someone needs an older Catwoman...

http://www.jimandellen.org/ellen/RobertMaxwellPhotoHelenMirren.jpg

If only it were 30 years ago... *sigh*

http://ns4w.org/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/Mirren1.jpg

Why Are You Crouching Spock?

01-19-2008, 07:32 PM

She's a good looking woman for her age.

BatmanFanatic

01-19-2008, 07:36 PM

She's a good looking woman for her age.

Damn straight ;)

batboy99

01-19-2008, 08:19 PM

helen would make an awesome leslie neilson

Gianakin_

01-20-2008, 03:58 AM

I wouldn't say range is of the upmost importance here. As long as the actress can nail THIS role, then I couldn't care less what her previous characters were like.

Partly agree. I don't judge someone by his/her previous, but those roles' quality helps me estimate if they made a good choice by casting that particular actor/actress.
The similarities of their previous roles has most of the times nothing to do.

The initial shock of his casting wasn't necessarily that he wasn't suited for it, but people weren't sure if he could pull it off due to his filmography. He is a good actor, but could his range extend into Joker territory? That was the lingering question.

I'd say it was both.

Gianakin_

01-20-2008, 04:02 AM

They need to make a DKR movie pronto, and cast her as Selina.

BatmanFanatic

01-20-2008, 04:08 AM

They need to make a DKR movie pronto, and cast her as Selina.

Yah if they were going to do TDKR she's the one.

GoogleMe94

01-20-2008, 09:23 AM

Well, these forums are extremely fickle, cos I'm sure that only a month ago the majority was decided that Charlize would be the best choice for the role.

Charlize perfectly combines superb acting talent with almighty sex appeal (and only almighty sex appeal is worthy of Catwoman!) I still stand by her for Catwoman - even if I now stand alone. :whatever:

http://laviecommeellevient.blog.20minutes.fr/album/pour_le_plaisir/charlize-theron-paris.jpg

thats got to be the only good picture ive seen of her, ever. other then that though, shes not very attractive. her face just isnt very good looking to me..

many of the actresses named are too big to play catwoman. i still think pfieffer wont be touched, and that the next time they recast her to play in a movie, they will make her like the lame sex-kitten jewel theif with no seriousness or depth to her character.

oh wait, wasnt that already done? lol. i hate you berry. i dont think they are gonna attempt to bring back catwoman after THAT disaster.

Laderlappen

01-20-2008, 10:14 AM

the next time they recast her to play in a movie, they will make her like the lame sex-kitten jewel theif with no seriousness or depth to her character.
Why?

i dont think they are gonna attempt to bring back catwoman after THAT disaster.The only difference between bringing back Catwoman after the movie Catwoman, and bringing back Batman after the movie Batman & Robin is that Halle Berry didn't play the actual character.

Why would it matter anyway? Would people hate the character because someone before did an awful job? If anything it would have great responding because the difference perfomance wise between the new girl and the last girl.

Two-Face

01-20-2008, 10:17 AM

Well you know who I want for this role but a man can only dream.....

GoogleMe94

01-20-2008, 11:49 AM

The only difference between bringing back Catwoman after the movie Catwoman, and bringing back Batman after the movie Batman & Robin is that Halle Berry didn't play the actual character.

Why would it matter anyway? Would people hate the character because someone before did an awful job? If anything it would have great responding because the difference perfomance wise between the new girl and the last girl.

but thats kinda a cheap shot. of course ANYTHING was bound to be better then batman and robin, and same goes for catwoman. the real trick is to try to top something that is already considered really good.

Laderlappen

01-20-2008, 12:31 PM

What are you saying? What's a cheap shot?

Paste Pot Pete

01-20-2008, 01:22 PM

I don't see why it would be difficult to bring in another Catwoman with seriousness and depth by simply going back to the source material.

There have been two Catwomen in the last two decades, one good and one lousy, but neither were accurate to their comic counterpart. I think it's time we had one.

elgato

01-20-2008, 02:44 PM

You aren't alone with Charlize as Catwoman Vs-F-J, I still have her as my number 1 choice :cwink:

Well, but I would still LOVE Angelina Jolie or (Specially) Keri Russell.
Though I don't see any wrong thing with Anne Hathaway, just give her more films to act on and she has a profile :cwink:

Conebone69

01-20-2008, 02:49 PM

I hope catwoman isnt in the third movie

PyroChamber

01-20-2008, 02:53 PM

Majik1387

01-20-2008, 02:55 PM

elgato

01-20-2008, 02:56 PM

That's true, I think literally she could break a nail (well thought) :cwink:

elgato

01-20-2008, 02:57 PM

I hope catwoman isnt in the third movie

You are the guy who doesn't want catwoman!
I am your worst nightmare :hoboj:
:oldrazz:

Paste Pot Pete

01-20-2008, 03:13 PM

Here's my thing with Anne Hathaway, I can't see her being the physical kickass Catwoman.

She's too...eh, soft, for lack of a better term. Sexy, beautiful, great actress, but just not tough enough.

ArmsHeldOut

01-20-2008, 03:29 PM

She's too...eh, soft, for lack of a better term. Sexy, beautiful, great actress, but just not tough enough.

If they ever introduce Catwoman into the series, I'd prefer they cast an unknown with solid acting prowess, a somewhat lean figure and dark good looks (preferably brown hair and green eyes).

If they can't find someone who fits that bill, Kate Beckinsale would do nicely in my opinion. She was born to play the role.

elgato

01-20-2008, 03:34 PM

If she would only knew how to act :whatever: (I mean Kate)

ArmsHeldOut

01-20-2008, 03:42 PM

Damn!

Yeah Helen Mirren was pretty hot back in her day. Hell, she still looks good. Some women can do that, like the great Jacklyn Smith, for example.

I recall there was some controversey over Mirren being cast as Queen Elizabeth solely because she went topless on numerous occasions. And go topless she did ... :cwink: :woot:

ArmsHeldOut

01-20-2008, 03:45 PM

If she would only knew how to act :whatever: (I mean Kate)

She's a decent actress.

Majik1387

01-20-2008, 03:52 PM

She's a decent actress.

If by decent you mean terribly wooden.

jmc

01-20-2008, 03:56 PM

Here's my thing with Anne Hathaway, I can't see her being the physical kickass Catwoman.

Although she does come across as being a bit soft, I've always wanted to see Hathaway in an action role, Get Smart will probably give somewhat of an indication (assuming it has action elements in it). She's a good actress, I see no reason why she could play a kickarse character.

ArmsHeldOut

01-20-2008, 04:47 PM

If by decent you mean terribly wooden.

No. I think she's a fairly good actress and Batman isn't exactly Shakespeare, so Kate would be a nice fit.

Majik1387

01-20-2008, 04:57 PM

No. I think she's a fairly good actress and Batman isn't exactly Shakespeare, so Kate would be a nice fit.
I hate when people say 'So and so isn't Shakespeare' because it just shows how little they know of his plays, besides his popular ones.:whatever:

She's a terrible actress and the only reason people keep suggesting her is because they liked how she looked in her catsuit in Underworld. All she is is a living mannequin, she shows no emotions in her acting which is required for any role, and her lack of emotion is what makes her wooden,

ArmsHeldOut

01-20-2008, 05:16 PM

I hate when people say 'So and so isn't Shakespeare' because it just shows how little they know of his plays, besides his popular ones.:whatever:

She's a terrible actress and the only reason people keep suggesting her is because they liked how she looked in her catsuit in Underworld. All she is is a living mannequin, she shows no emotions in her acting which is required for any role, and her lack of emotion is what makes her wooden,

I thought she did a fine job of conveying emotion in the film Laurel Canyon and I do admit she looked great in the Underworld catsuit. Regardless, Catwoman isn't a terribly complex character much in the same vein as Bruce Wayne. Again, I'd prefer they go with an unknown, but Beckinsale isn't a bad choice.

Laderlappen

01-20-2008, 05:23 PM

Beckinsale IS a bad choice. Just because it isn't Hamlet doesn't mean we shouldn't get the best person for the job. And why should we get an unknown when nobody of the main characters in these 2 first movies are unknown?

My problem with A Hathaway is that in my oppinion she has never really impressed me. I always feel that she's overshaddowed by her co-stars.

Paste Pot Pete

01-20-2008, 05:27 PM

What about Mia Kirshner?

Majik1387

01-20-2008, 05:30 PM

Mia Kirshner is missing the presence of Selina/Catwoman for me.

Laderlappen

01-20-2008, 05:34 PM

Why Mia Kirshner?

ArmsHeldOut

01-20-2008, 05:38 PM

And why should we get an unknown when nobody of the main characters in these 2 first movies are unknown?

That makes no difference to me. Unknowns have been known to come in and hit the ball right out of the park at times. Christopher Reeve, is a good example. Bale himself was not overly popular when he was cast in the lead role of BB.

You already know my stance on Beckinsale. :cwink:

Laderlappen

01-20-2008, 05:41 PM

It doesn't fit.

ArmsHeldOut

01-20-2008, 05:48 PM

It doesn't fit.

Sure it does. I'm not suggesting that they find someone who doesn't have any acting experience whatsoever if that's what you're thinking. Again, Bale was not very well known at the time he was cast as Bats and he "fit" in just fine.

PyroChamber

01-20-2008, 05:48 PM

I'm curious as to how Nolan would do Catwoman in his "Batworld", being that Tim Burton did it where she died and came back to life because of cats and was somewhat of a nut.

I guess in order to have Catwoman also, they'd have to write out Rachel Dawes.

jmc

01-20-2008, 05:49 PM

What about Mia Kirshner?

She'd need to put on some serious weight, the girl is very thin.

jmc

01-20-2008, 05:51 PM

Paste Pot Pete

01-20-2008, 06:09 PM

Why Mia Kirshner?

She just has a nice sort of mysterious aura about her. Her eyes are really captivating and her voice sounds very Catwoman to me. I can't comment on her weight; I haven't seen her recently, but she's been in fine shape in the past.

Vs-F-J

01-20-2008, 06:20 PM

I hate when people say 'So and so isn't Shakespeare' because it just shows how little they know of his plays, besides his popular ones.:whatever:

I dunno if that means you think Shakespeare wrote terrible plays except his popular ones, but I could never agree to that.

Majik1387

01-20-2008, 06:23 PM

I'm curious as to how Nolan would do Catwoman in his "Batworld", being that Tim Burton did it where she died and came back to life because of cats and was somewhat of a nut.
She never actually died in Burton's Batman
I guess in order to have Catwoman also, they'd have to write out Rachel Dawes.
They wouldn't have to write out Rachel at all. There can be more than one female character in Batman.:huh:
I think he'd do a modified version of the burglar/thief/grifter angle.
Yeppers.

Majik1387

01-20-2008, 06:26 PM

I dunno if that means you think Shakespeare wrote terrible plays except his popular ones, but I could never agree to that.
No that's not what I meant at all.
What I mean is that besides his popular ones, his other aren't as complex or anything, they're very crass and he wrote them to please the people who controlled the theatre in his time, not really written to be great pieces of literature.

Laderlappen

01-20-2008, 06:34 PM

Sure it does. I'm not suggesting that they find someone who doesn't have any acting experience whatsoever if that's what you're thinking. Again, Bale was not very well known at the time he was cast as Bats and he "fit" in just fine.Do you want "unknown" or "not very well known". Because Bale was absoutley NOT an unknown pre-Batman! He have done American Psycho, The Mashinist, Empire Of The Sun, Equilibrium, & many other movies. A lesser known actors is what they SHOULD have. If that is what you mean, then I agree with you.

Laderlappen

01-20-2008, 06:37 PM

I guess in order to have Catwoman also, they'd have to write out Rachel Dawes.NO! F'ck that! Write her off? Why? We can finally for the first time have 2 love interests in the same movie, in a nice little love triangle.

BatmanFanatic

01-20-2008, 06:43 PM

NO! F'ck that! Write her off? Why? We can finally for the first time have 2 love interests in the same movie, in a nice little love triangle.
Or even better, we could bring back Katie as Rachel just to have Catwoman push her off a building and watch her go "splat."

I'd pay $100 to see that in a movie.

Izzy_23

01-20-2008, 06:53 PM

Or even better, we could bring back Katie as Rachel just to have Catwoman push her off a building and watch her go "splat."

I'd pay $100 to see that in a movie.

She is married to Tom Cruise.

She just might do it herself soon enough.

David Rice

01-20-2008, 07:07 PM

NO! F'ck that! Write her off? Why? We can finally for the first time have 2 love interests in the same movie, in a nice little love triangle.

Why does Rachel even have to be a love interest? From the looks of things they could just be friends.

Majik1387

01-20-2008, 07:08 PM

Why does Rachel even have to be a love interest? From the looks of things they could just be friends.

Exactly.

BatmanFanatic

01-20-2008, 07:10 PM

She is married to Tom Cruise.

She just might do it herself soon enough.

:lmao::lmao::lmao:

Laderlappen

01-20-2008, 07:13 PM

Why does Rachel even have to be a love interest? From the looks of things they could just be friends.Love interest/ex love interest. Whatever. :yay:

DieSmiling

01-20-2008, 07:13 PM

I'm surprised people are so down on Kate Beckinsale. She's nothing special as an actress but she isn't bad either. With all the young, talentless sexpots in hollywood these days, a Batman movie could do much worse than Kate Beckinsale, and she has basically the perfect look for the role.

Laderlappen

01-20-2008, 07:26 PM

I'm surprised people are so down on Kate Beckinsale. This is why ->

She's nothing special

BatmanFanatic

01-20-2008, 07:41 PM

Why? Because Catwoman is as much an iconic part of the Batverse as Joker and Batman, and the comic book fans love her and don't want to see it screwed up yet again.

Why would we want a lame actress to play her? No more than we would want a lame actor to play the Joker or Batman. Bale and Ledger are on top of their game and I want a woman who is of their caliber as a performer. And no one is going to convince me that KB is on their level. Who cares if she's pretty. There are THOUSANDS of pretty actresses. Any of them can be dolled up and corseted into a Catwoman look, but acting can't be improved by the hair make-up and costume people.

jmc

01-20-2008, 07:57 PM

I've said it before, the Cat deserves not only to be written as a character with depth, but she also deserves a good actress, one who like Ledger, can bring something fresh.

BatmanFanatic

01-20-2008, 07:59 PM

I've said it before, the Cat deserves not only to be written as a character with depth, but she also deserves a good actress, one who like Ledger, can bring something fresh.

:meow: Yes.

The Joker

01-20-2008, 08:00 PM

A Catwoman thread?

She's not even in this movie o_O

BatmanFanatic

01-20-2008, 08:01 PM

A Catwoman thread?

She's not even in this movie o_O

:wow:

:whatever:

elgato

01-20-2008, 08:04 PM

A Catwoman thread?

She's not even in this movie o_O

But she may be so now shut up and go to bed! :cmad:

:woot:

The Joker

01-20-2008, 08:08 PM

But she may be so now shut up and go to bed! :cmad:

:woot:

Hahahaha :oldrazz:

I think we'd know by now if Selina Kyle was in this movie. I think we have enough in this flick without adding her to the plot.

DieSmiling

01-20-2008, 08:13 PM

Eh, I'd still take Beckinsale over someone like Kerri Russell, who very simply isn't hot enough. I mean, really, is this your idea of Catwoman?

http://www.therandommuse.com/photos/scientologists/kerirussell07.jpg

Angelina Jolie is probably the best of both worlds. Dunno if she'd do a superhero movie though...

jmc

01-20-2008, 08:25 PM

I'll take good acting over hotness, Catwoman is more than just eye candy.

Majik1387

01-20-2008, 08:35 PM

Eh, I'd still take Beckinsale over someone like Kerri Russell, who very simply isn't hot enough. I mean, really, is this your idea of Catwoman?
Way to use an old pic of Keri.:whatever:
Now for more recent pics.
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/entertainment/2006-04/27/xin_5204032911381461412938.jpg
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r129/spicypants/CSmack/keri6.jpg
http://images.popsugar.com/uploads12/keri-russell-vf.jpg
http://www.vanityfair.com/images/culture/2006/12/cusl13_year0612.jpg
:o

x-fan

01-20-2008, 09:02 PM

i wanted cathrin zeta jones back when she did entanglement with connary, not sure if she would be good now though, but then she would have been purr-fect

Izzy_23

01-20-2008, 09:37 PM

I think you mean Entrapment not entanglement which I don't think is even a movie?

Paste Pot Pete

01-20-2008, 09:42 PM

BatmanFanatic

01-20-2008, 09:45 PM

And just when I rant about focusing solely on "hotness" and not on any measure of tallent or ability, we get a post like this.

Eh, I'd still take Beckinsale over someone like Kerri Russell, who very simply isn't hot enough.

It's Hollywood people. Everyone is "hot." Get someone who can act.

Paste Pot Pete

01-20-2008, 09:55 PM

Yeah, people have a tendency to go just by one criteria (looks) or the other (talent).

Beckinsale has the looks, I think she's physically near perfect for the role. I just don't think she's good enough for it.

Russell, Hathaway, these women have the talent but they just don't have the physical traits I'd expect for Selina. They're more the pretty girl next door and less the mysterious beauty.

Who knows, though? I would never have pegged Cillian Murphy, who I can admit as a firmly heterosexual male is one of the prettiest men in the world, as the typically gangly and creepy Scarecrow, yet he pulled that off remarkably. Ditto Gary "Lord of the Villains" Oldman as the most honest man in Gotham.

Nolan has a knack for casting, he'd pull out a winner I'm sure. ...if the character ever appears. :o

Crook

01-20-2008, 10:09 PM

Of course Jolie would do a superhero movie. She basically is already, she's in Wanted. And she also played Lara Croft, one of the cartooniest characters out there.

That being said, no thank you for Catwoman. Maybe it's just that her name constantly gets brought up in the discussion, but she is the most over-obvious and cliche` choice for the role.
One could say the exact same thing for half the cast of BB. Hell, the only real true casting surprises for this franchise have been Oldman, Cillian, and Ledger. Everyone else has pretty much done what we have expected them to do based on previous roles.

But that's not a bad thing. I've said it before, I really do not give a damn about obvious or popular casting choices. In some ways, that's narrow-minded. As long as this role is perfectly captured, I am a happy man.

And just when I rant about focusing solely on "hotness" and not on any measure of tallent or ability, we get a post like this.

It's Hollywood people. Everyone is "hot." Get someone who can act.
While I agree with your last statement, not "everyone" is hot. There's just some things not even makeup or movie-magic can hide.

I don't think making it a requirement for the actress to be sexually appealing is wrong in the least. It's Catwoman for god's sake. That's part of her character whether some people like it or not.

Paste Pot Pete

01-20-2008, 10:34 PM

One could say the exact same thing for half the cast of BB. Hell, the only real true casting surprises for this franchise have been Oldman, Cillian, and Ledger. Everyone else has pretty much done what we have expected them to do based on previous roles.

But that's not a bad thing. I've said it before, I really do not give a damn about obvious or popular casting choices. In some ways, that's narrow-minded. As long as this role is perfectly captured, I am a happy man.

It can be, if it's not balanced out by surprises like the ones mentioned above. I just hate when I can imagine exactly how the character will be played. And yes, Morgan Freeman and Liam Neeson wouldn't have been my first choices for their roles, largely because of this. I thought both turned out great, so I would definitely give someone like Jolie a shot, but they wouldn't be at the top of my list.

I'm not so narrow-minded as to be strongly against such contenders, it just sometimes feels like...settling, whereas a move like Ledger feels like really striving for the best. I just like bold; if I wanted predictable, I'd stick to just reading the comics, where their voices never change inside my head. :word:

GoogleMe94

01-20-2008, 10:44 PM

Who knows, though? I would never have pegged Cillian Murphy, who I can admit as a firmly heterosexual male is one of the prettiest men in the world, as the typically gangly and creepy Scarecrow, yet he pulled that off remarkably.

i disagree. he was a poor version of scarecrow. not creepy at all without the mask. just a pretty boy lawyer type, and IMO too young to be a convincing doctor. same with katie holmes, not believeable as an assistant DA. poor casting.

Crook

01-20-2008, 10:44 PM

It can be, if it's not balanced out by surprises like the ones mentioned above. I just hate when I can imagine exactly how the character will be played. And yes, Morgan Freeman and Liam Neeson wouldn't have been my first choices for their roles, largely because of this. I thought both turned out great, so I would definitely give someone like Jolie a shot, but they wouldn't be at the top of my list.
With these type of situations, it's not just that the casting is predictable, but the writing also isn't very much original. So when you have two strikes like that going into the film, it's hard for the actor to bring something "new".

I would hope that whenever Selina is brought intro the fray, that she is given layers and depth we haven't seen on film before. Because let's face it, we have very few female roles that are truly gripping. Source material has already proved that Selina has the potential to be this type of character. So if the script nails that essence, then I feel whomever is eventually cast, as long as they can bring that script to life, will be no problem whatsoever.

I'm not so narrow-minded as to be strongly against such contenders, it just sometimes feels like...settling, whereas a move like Ledger feels like really striving for the best. I just like bold; if I wanted predictable, I'd stick to just reading the comics, where their voices never change inside my head. :word:
I get what you're saying, but I guess I'm also of a simple mind about this. To me, whether the choice is bold or apparent, we all want to get to the same exact place in the end; which is a strong and memorable performance.

Settling to me, would be going for a choice that is subpar when you could do a lot better if you tried harder. I don't feel Jolie is like that all. There are plenty of female actresses who can do this role, pretty equally I'd think. So there's not much room for settling when you have all-around good actresses with their own strengths.

GoogleMe94

01-20-2008, 10:47 PM

i dont think you can get "deeper" then michelle pfieffers catwoman. at best they can try to make her character a bit more comic book accurate, but her character in the comics isnt exactly what i would call "deep" or "gripping".

Mr. Socko

01-20-2008, 10:47 PM

While I agree with your last statement, not "everyone" is hot. There's just some things not even makeup or movie-magic can hide.

I don't think making it a requirement for the actress to be sexually appealing is wrong in the least. It's Catwoman for god's sake. That's part of her character whether some people like it or not.

I am in agreement. Nothing wrong with wanting a sexier actress to be Catwoman. Just one who can act well.

ArmsHeldOut

01-20-2008, 11:12 PM

And just when I rant about focusing solely on "hotness" and not on any measure of tallent or ability, we get a post like this.

It's Hollywood people. Everyone is "hot." Get someone who can act.

See .. that's where it gets tricky. Now, a lot of you on here claim to take preference in an actress who can perform well as opposed to one who looks smoldering hot. But shouldn't Selina Kyle be the perfect blend of both qualities, as she appears in the books? I certainly think so. With that stated, what actress is out there that can pull off both hottie and intellectual simultaneously? Russel doesn't look like Catwoman to me (too wholesome) and she isn't much better of an actress than Beckinsale IMO. You want a truly superior actress? Try Cate Blanchett, but can you really see her as Catwoman? Much as I admire her genius, Cate isn't Catwoman in my eyes.

ArmsHeldOut

01-20-2008, 11:19 PM

Do you want "unknown" or "not very well known". Because Bale was absoutley NOT an unknown pre-Batman! He have done American Psycho, The Mashinist, Empire Of The Sun, Equilibrium, & many other movies. A lesser known actors is what they SHOULD have. If that is what you mean, then I agree with you.

An actress with a solid background who isn't very well known. An indie-actress perhaps.

jmc

01-20-2008, 11:28 PM

See .. that's where it gets tricky. Now, a lot of you on here claim to take preference in an actress who can perform well as opposed to one who looks smoldering hot. But shouldn't Selina Kyle be the perfect blend of both qualities, as she appears in the books? I certainly think so. With that stated, what actress is out there that can pull off both hottie and intellectual simultaneously? Russel doesn't look like Catwoman to me and she isn't much better of an actress than Beckinsale IMO. You want a truly superior actress? Try Cate Blanchett, but can you really see her as Catwoman? Much as I admire her genius, Cate isn't Catwoman in my eyes.

10 years earlier and I dare say Blanchett would have been a great Catwoman. I love her work, she is such a chameleon.

ArmsHeldOut

01-20-2008, 11:32 PM

10 years earlier and I dare say Blanchett would have been a great Catwoman. I love her work, she is such a chameleon.

She's the best actress of our generation I think. Still don't think she fits the physical type required for Catwoman, but if anyone could transform herself into a role .. it is Cate Blanchett.

BatmanFanatic

01-20-2008, 11:56 PM

Who knows, though? I would never have pegged Cillian Murphy, who I can admit as a firmly heterosexual male is one of the prettiest men in the world, as the typically gangly and creepy Scarecrow, yet he pulled that off remarkably.

:wow::wow::wow:
I so don't think so. Speaking as a woman =P He's very odd looking. He makes a better drag queen than a man (as proven by photos posted earlier on the boards =P )

As for pulling it off remarkably? Well, I don't really care about scarecrow, but I didn't think there was anything remotely remarkable about that part or the acting. The only moment that had any hint of good acting for me was ...
"It's... the BAT ... man." Lol.

i dont think you can get "deeper" then michelle pfieffers catwoman. at best they can try to make her character a bit more comic book accurate, but her character in the comics isnt exactly what i would call "deep" or "gripping".

Well I would disagree with you about Catwoman not being deep or gripping in the comic books. She has a very complicated relationship with Bruce/Batman and her motives in what she does are equally complex. Her walking the line between good and evil is gripping and powerful - would be in any character. Thats why humans love anti-heros!

And BR's Catwoman was deep ONLY because of Michelle's stunning performance. The part written for her was a cook in a tight costume, plain and simple. A throw-away almost. And had nothing to do with the real Catwoman from the source material.

jmc

01-21-2008, 12:05 AM

And BR's Catwoman was deep ONLY because of Michelle's stunning performance. The part written for her was a cook in a tight costume, plain and simple. A throw-away almost. And had nothing to do with the real Catwoman from the source material.

As much as I love Burton's versions (Pfeiffer was good), it was Catwoman/Selina Kyle in name only, it's time we saw a proper adaption of the character.

ArmsHeldOut

01-21-2008, 12:39 AM

As much as I love Burton's versions (Pfeiffer was good), it was Catwoman/Selina Kyle in name only, it's time we saw a proper adaption of the character.

Amen.

jimmy

01-21-2008, 12:40 AM

10 years earlier and I dare say Blanchett would have been a great Catwoman. I love her work, she is such a chameleon.

But she's Hollywood's ugliest hot chick. :(

BatmanFanatic

01-21-2008, 12:41 AM

As much as I love Burton's versions (Pfeiffer was good), it was Catwoman/Selina Kyle in name only, it's time we saw a proper adaption of the character.

Amen and check. :cwink:

ArmsHeldOut

01-21-2008, 12:41 AM

:cwink: But she's Hollywood's ugliest hot chick. :(

Nah. You're mistaking her for Daniel Craig. :cwink:

jimmy

01-21-2008, 12:42 AM

Nah. You're mistaking her for Daniel Craig. :cwink:

Poor Daniel Craig. :(

ArmsHeldOut

01-21-2008, 12:48 AM

Poor Daniel Craig. :(

Honestly, Cate Blanchett is an amazing actress. Who cares what she looks like? And she's not terribly unattractive in my book; just average.

jimmy

01-21-2008, 12:52 AM

Poor Cate Blanchett. :(

Bond

01-21-2008, 01:16 AM

10 years earlier and I dare say Blanchett would have been a great Catwoman. I love her work, she is such a chameleon.
Bob Dylan ftw!

:cwink:

Nah. You're mistaking her for Daniel Craig. :cwink:
Aw man :csad:

ArmsHeldOut

01-21-2008, 01:53 AM

Poor Cate Blanchett. :(

Plenty of space indeed.
:csad:

jmc

01-21-2008, 02:06 AM

But she's Hollywood's ugliest hot chick. :(

Yes Blanchett isn't the 'hottest' actress, but she's not ugly, and she can act circles around any other female mentioned so far in this thread. And I said 10 years ago she would have made a great Catwoman had the current series been in development then.

Bond

01-21-2008, 02:17 AM

She's kinda cute in "Notes On a Scandal" :O

Gianakin_

01-21-2008, 03:45 AM

Cate Blanchett can play any character in any age.
I'd always want her to be Catwoman.

slicendice

01-21-2008, 05:12 AM

I think that a nolanized catwoman could be interesting if done right...but I'd need to see something pretty kickass to convince me

BatmanFanatic

01-21-2008, 05:22 AM

http://www.wallpapergate.com/data/media/485/cate_blanchett_bm002.jpg

http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/9243/c3d51vp9.jpg

Majik1387

01-21-2008, 05:24 AM

She's not ugly at all, though I do find her facial features too pronounced for Catwoman

Gianakin_

01-21-2008, 05:46 AM

She has something, that's for sure. She's extremely classy, majestic.

Laderlappen

01-21-2008, 07:19 AM

So while I've been sleeping, some people have said that Keri Russell and Cate Blanchett isn't good looking or good looking enough. Has the whole world gone CRAZY?!!!

David Rice

01-21-2008, 07:49 AM

i disagree. he was a poor version of scarecrow. not creepy at all without the mask. just a pretty boy lawyer type, and IMO too young to be a convincing doctor. same with katie holmes, not believeable as an assistant DA. poor casting.

:whatever:

i dont think you can get "deeper" then michelle pfieffers catwoman. at best they can try to make her character a bit more comic book accurate, but her character in the comics isnt exactly what i would call "deep" or "gripping".

:whatever:

David Rice

01-21-2008, 07:52 AM

See .. that's where it gets tricky. Now, a lot of you on here claim to take preference in an actress who can perform well as opposed to one who looks smoldering hot. But shouldn't Selina Kyle be the perfect blend of both qualities, as she appears in the books? I certainly think so. With that stated, what actress is out there that can pull off both hottie and intellectual simultaneously? Russel doesn't look like Catwoman to me (too wholesome) and she isn't much better of an actress than Beckinsale IMO. You want a truly superior actress? Try Cate Blanchett, but can you really see her as Catwoman? Much as I admire her genius, Cate isn't Catwoman in my eyes.

Thank you.

Laderlappen

01-21-2008, 08:42 AM

You have been very thankful lately gc :cwink:

ArmsHeldOut

01-21-2008, 10:43 AM

You have been very thankful lately gc :cwink:

He's in bed with Laura Vandervoort. I'd be thankful too. :cwink:

ArmsHeldOut

01-21-2008, 11:08 AM

She has something, that's for sure. She's extremely classy, majestic.

Cate Blanchett is a cut above the rest. I actually think a role like Catwoman is beneath her. Selina just isn't that complex.

Leslie Thompkins on the other hand would be interesting, but Thompkins is a little too old.

Gianakin_

01-21-2008, 11:13 AM

Well, it depends on the way Catwoman would be written.
Gordon wasn't deep in BB, and Oldman is a cut above the rest, but nevertheless he enjoyed playing the part and, imo, played it well.

ArmsHeldOut

01-21-2008, 11:19 AM

Well, it depends on the way Catwoman would be written.
Gordon wasn't deep in BB, and Oldman is a cut above the rest, but nevertheless he enjoyed playing the part and, imo, played it well.

Gordon > Catwoman. Much better character.

Gianakin_

01-21-2008, 11:23 AM

Gordon > Catwoman. Much better character.

Perhaps, but in BB he wasn't really deep, was he? That's my point.
Chris Cooper turned down the role because of (not only) that. However, Oldman, who is an enormously talented actor could've thought the same, but didn't.
Same could go for Blanchett (not that it ever will).

The Guard

01-21-2008, 11:25 AM

Catwoman wasn't deep in BATMAN RETURNS. But Pfeiffer gave a great performance. This thread makes me wish "Rachel" had never existed. She could have easily been "Selina". Can you imagine that? A three movie arc about Bruce and Selina, with the tragic overtones of her becoming Catwoman in response to the situation in Gotham and in her own life?

Gianakin_

01-21-2008, 11:30 AM

Yes, that would've been tops.

ArmsHeldOut

01-21-2008, 11:44 AM

Perhaps, but in BB he wasn't really deep, was he? That's my point.
Chris Cooper turned down the role because of (not only) that. However, Oldman, who is an enormously talented actor could've thought the same, but didn't.
Same could go for Blanchett (not that it ever will).

I see what you're saying and I'm so glad Cooper turned down Gordon. Oldman just inhabited the role in every possible way.

Still, the great Cate Blanchett isn't quite my idea of Selina Kyle. Who knows though?

Of course, I'd like someone who looks a little closer to this:

http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0TgDMHOAWqXE*qHVRNPszCSCf2mtqPUB7Lmlr9ZWF6ZC8ExUaa 9JVxVX9pdG9ATsLUWCit!L4EqI09bffjGU5DXt9KPTdzMii4D2 x4QfvRgrfQTsz15tqmQ/P?dc=4675414614613549224

Laderlappen

01-21-2008, 11:51 AM

Cate Blanchett is a cut above the rest. I actually think a role like Catwoman is beneath her. Selina just isn't that complex.

Leslie Thompkins on the other hand would be interesting, but Thompkins is a little too old.Now, how the hell is Leslie Thompkins NOT beneath her. Seriously, if they would have Leslie Thompkins in a Batman movie, I very much doubt they would get the biggest actress in the world. And how old is Leslie supposed to be? 60?

Edit: :yay:

Crook

01-21-2008, 11:54 AM

So while I've been sleeping, some people have said that Keri Russell and Cate Blanchett isn't good looking or good looking enough. Has the whole world gone CRAZY?!!!
As much as I adore Cate, her look is all wrong for Selina. I would not want her anywhere near this role to be honest.

Gordon > Catwoman. Much better character.
I never found Gordon all that interesting. Selina is leagues above him in complexity and depth imo.

ArmsHeldOut

01-21-2008, 11:57 AM

Now, how the hell is Leslie Thompkins NOT beneath her. Seriously, if they would have Leslie Thompkins in a Batman movie, I very much doubt they would get the biggest actress in the world. And how old is Leslie supposed to be? 60?

First of all, calm down a little. Breathing again? Ok. Good.

Yes, Leslie is far too old, which is why I said a younger version might work. I just like the character. She has more depth and always seemed to be a very maternal figure in Bruce's life in the absence of his real mother. Even though she disagrees with Bruce's violent tactics, she would always be there to support him.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Thompkins << more on Leslie.

If Cate was ever welcomed into this franchise, I don't know who else I'd rather see her portray. They could work on making her look a bit older, as well.

The Guard

01-21-2008, 11:57 AM

You know what would be cool? A version of Catwoman who was Leslie Thompkins.

Ooooh.

Gianakin_

01-21-2008, 12:04 PM

You know what would be cool? A version of Catwoman who was Leslie Thompkins.

Ooooh.

That would put the Ra's/Ducard twist to shame.

Laderlappen

01-21-2008, 12:19 PM

First of all, calm down a little. Breathing again? Ok. Good.

Yes, Leslie is far too old, which is why I said a younger version might work. I just like the character. She has more depth and always seemed to be a very maternal figure in Bruce's life in the absence of his real mother. Even though she disagrees with Bruce's violent tactics, she would always be there to support him.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Thompkins << more on Leslie.

If Cate was ever welcomed into this franchise, I don't know who else I'd rather see her portray. They could work on making her look a bit older, as well.I guess I have to put atleast 1 smiley face on my message or else people think I'm screaming at the comuter :yay:

Laderlappen

01-21-2008, 12:23 PM

As much as I adore Cate, her look is all wrong for Selina. I would not want her anywhere near this role to be honest.
Well, neither do I. But that somebody said that she was not attractive enough or ugly or whatever was what I reacted on.

Crook

01-21-2008, 12:27 PM

Well, neither do I. But that somebody said that she was not attractive enough or ugly or whatever was what I reacted on.
Maybe he meant in regards to playing Selina?

In any case, she does have some weird features. I can't exactly describe it. She's certainly not hideous or ugly, but I wouldn't exactly call her amazingly attractive.

ArmsHeldOut

01-21-2008, 12:30 PM

Well, neither do I. But that somebody said that she was not attractive enough or ugly or whatever was what I reacted on.

That was Jimmy. He tends to say things that don't make a whole lot of sense from time to time. :cwink:

Anyhow, you know who might be a good choice to portray Selina? Lena Headey. Her acting chops are pretty solid and she's attractive enough, although not in a "poptart" kinda way.

Laderlappen

01-21-2008, 12:41 PM

I wouldn't exactly call her amazingly attractive.I would. She's one of the most beautiful women in Hollywood in my oppinion.

Why Are You Crouching Spock?

01-21-2008, 12:46 PM

Cate Blanchett is terrific actress, to be honest, I'd rather have her than someone such as Angelina Jolie who cant act worth ****.

Crook

01-21-2008, 12:48 PM

I would. She's one of the most beautiful women in Hollywood in my oppinion.
Well, she's a beautiful person... :o

When I think of Hollywood beauties, I think the likes of Naomi Watts, Angelina Jolie, and Scarlett Johansson. They have the "classic Hollywood" features if you will.

Cate just looks off. :O

Cate Blanchett is terrific actress, to be honest, I'd rather have her than someone such as Angelina Jolie who cant act worth ****.
Eh, her recent performance in 'A Mighty Heart' proves to me she still has it, if she puts work and has the right role.

Why Are You Crouching Spock?

01-21-2008, 12:52 PM

You must be seeing I'm not buddy.
Also, her personal life or celebrity'izm is too prominent, every time I see her in a movie, it's Angelina Jolie, not a character.

Crook

01-21-2008, 12:59 PM

You must be seeing I'm not buddy.
Me and whole bunch of critics and viewers that have seen the movie, apparently. :o

Also, her personal life or celebrity'izm is too prominent, every time I see her in a movie, it's Angelina Jolie, not a character.
What exactly was "Angelina Jolie" in A Mighty Heart? Have you even seen it?

:huh:

Why Are You Crouching Spock?

01-21-2008, 01:03 PM

Never claimed I did.
I have however, seen pretty much most of her other movies, and guess what?
It was Angelina Jolie in every one.

As for critics. they can suck my balls, this is my opinion.

jmc

01-21-2008, 01:08 PM

Cate Blanchett is terrific actress, to be honest, I'd rather have her than someone such as Angelina Jolie who cant act worth ****.

Jolie's not a bad actress, but casting her as Catwoman is too predictable, it's the Catwoman we can already see in our heads.

Crook

01-21-2008, 01:10 PM

Never claimed I did.
I have however, seen pretty much most of her other movies, and guess what?
It was Angelina Jolie in every one.

As for critics. they can suck my balls, this is my opinion.
She's had quite a few subpar roles, I must admit. I'm gonna have to disagree that she acts like herself in all her roles though.

I've seen many of her interviews and such, so I have a pretty good idea of what "Jolie" is probably like in real-life. And I don't see that in her roles for:

Gia
Bone Collector
Alexander
A Mighty Heart
Beowulf

...just to name some off the top of my head. Probably her closest role to herself would be in "The Good Shepherd". However, she did well in that role too.

There's a difference between just acting like yourself, and having mannerisms/nuances that carry over from role to role.

DCnightwing23

01-21-2008, 01:14 PM

kate beckinsale would be a good catwomen for sure, but im sure there are other choices, maybe like a small time actress, so the actress can be remmebered for the role

Juha

01-21-2008, 01:14 PM

Jolie has lost it IMO. There was a time when I thought she was the hottest thing on Earth but something happened to her. Maybe too many "meh" roles in too many "meh" movies. She's just not interesting anymore. And definitely not my ideal Catwoman.

Crook

01-21-2008, 01:19 PM

Jolie's not a bad actress, but casting her as Catwoman is too predictable, it's the Catwoman we can already see in our heads.
Maybe so, but if the role has the depth required to bring the character justice, I don't see why it'd be a problem.

Can we honestly say we didn't have a general idea where Bale, Caine, Freeman, and Neeson would take their respective roles?

Jolie has lost it IMO. There was a time when I thought she was the hottest thing on Earth but something happened to her. Maybe too many "meh" roles in too many "meh" movies. She's just not interesting anymore. And definitely not my ideal Catwoman.
Yeah, something happened alright, to her body at least. Her mother died and she got all skinny from depression. :down :o

I wouldn't recommend her for the role at her current state. If she got healthier and bulked up, she'd be on the top of my list again. As I said before, her performance as Mariane Pearl reinvigorated my hopes that she still has the acting chops.

jmc

01-21-2008, 01:30 PM

Maybe so, but if the role has the depth required to bring the character justice, I don't see why it'd be a problem.

Can we honestly say we didn't have a general idea where Bale, Caine, Freeman, and Neeson would take their respective roles?

With the exception of Caine, I couldn't see the characters in the others prior, especially Bale who until then I'd seen little of. I want a fresh approach to Catwoman, like what Ledger is doing.

ArmsHeldOut

01-21-2008, 01:30 PM

Jolie's not a bad actress, but casting her as Catwoman is too predictable, it's the Catwoman we can already see in our heads.

You make plenty of sense my friend. :woot:

ArmsHeldOut

01-21-2008, 01:35 PM

With the exception of Caine, I couldn't see the characters in the others prior, especially Bale who until then I'd seen little of. I want a fresh approach to Catwoman, like what Ledger is doing.

What do you think of Lena Headey of 300 and Sarah Connor Chronicles fame? She's phenotypically a good fit for the role, but I'm not entirely convinced by her acting just yet.

http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/2842/lenaheadey3002topqf6.jpg

http://photos.ifmagazine.com/graphics/Unsorted/terminatorchroniclesposter3.jpg

Crook

01-21-2008, 01:36 PM

With the exception of Caine, I couldn't see the characters in the others prior, especially Bale who until then I'd seen little of.
Well I guess you had to have been one of the Bale advocates pre-BB to understand. His roles in American Psycho and Equilibrium were pretty much the deciding factor for the fans to rally him up. And you could see the similarities with his performance in BB.

Freeman and Neeson pretty much phoned in their performances imo. I mean, they were good for what it was, but yeah. :o

I want a fresh approach to Catwoman, like what Ledger is doing.
Of course half of that is credited to the script.

DCnightwing23

01-21-2008, 01:38 PM

They should get a small time actress, and have the actress's career as Catwomen

Laderlappen

01-21-2008, 01:43 PM

Well, she's a beautiful person... :o

When I think of Hollywood beauties, I think the likes of Naomi Watts, Angelina Jolie, and Scarlett Johansson. They have the "classic Hollywood" features if you will.

Cate just looks off. :O

I prefer Cate to those actually. Then it is in that order you said. Both beauty and acting. But I have to say that Scarlett Johansson is probably on of the, or even the most overrated actress in terms of beauty. Sure she has a very great body no doubt about it. But her face is very average. Not just Hollywood average, but average average.
And Cate has definetly the "classic Hollywood" Hollywood look.

In hollywood today, beauty isnt as important as "hotness". Or what I like to call "jerkoffable". And the reason people like Scarlett J is one of the popular actresses in Hollywood is not because of her acting or her beauty. It's because she's "jerkoffable".

WHatever, back to the cat :yay: