Official Cyclops/marsden Thread

[xwolverine2]

my mistake... you said

"SO WHAT!, people come and go....."

and I wrote that you said

"WHO CARES? people come and go..."
OH....no..lol i wasnt talking about THAT

i was talking about this....

but if anybody else dies... the fans are whiners!

^
what the hell did i say that led you to beleive i meant that?????:confused: :confused:

[Iceman]

not just comics.... pro wrestling, movies... everything became more muscular in the 80's and 90's. A bizarre time for sure. Cyclops was far from slim for a long time... sometimes he was even the biggest guy of the group. Just a trend thing that came and went

^ Definitely true :up:

[larryfilmmaker]

You can certainly make an educated guess that a film will not be very good but I don't think the signs for X3 are all bad (unlike films such as Bloodrayne / Aliens Vs Predator / Mortal Kombat).

What's your view on the two trailers that have been released for X3?

I think that the first trailer look gawdawful (on these forums you get called names for saying that but in other places it's highly acknowledged) but I think they covered up a lot of the crappy stuff in the second trailer w/ good music and voice over. I think Cyclops and Angel look interesting but not a damn thing otherwise does. Why are X-Men fans so loyal to these movies? They've remained loyal to like 3 or 4 characters and that's it... the rest they just mishmash and move around however they feel like it and they do it in ways that don't improve the story at all. Just bad storytelling in my opinion. I don't WANT X3 to suck but I'm sure it will. Honestly, I would so much love for this X-Men series to die and for a new one to be made by a director who is both 1) an X-Men fan BEFORE going in and 2) A big enough name to have the pull to make the movie he wants to make... not the one the studios tell him to make revolving around the cash cow characters. I've seriously become less of a Wolverine fan because of these movies... it opened my eyes to how over used and overexposed the guy is in ever medium right now. They mystique is almost completely dead when the mysterious "loner" is in the spotlight.

[Iceman]

I think that the first trailer look gawdawful (on these forums you get called names for saying that but in other places it's highly acknowledged) but I think they covered up a lot of the crappy stuff in the second trailer w/ good music and voice over. I think Cyclops and Angel look interesting but not a damn thing otherwise does. Why are X-Men fans so loyal to these movies? They've remained loyal to like 3 or 4 characters and that's it... the rest they just mishmash and move around however they feel like it and they do it in ways that don't improve the story at all. Just bad storytelling in my opinion. I don't WANT X3 to suck but I'm sure it will. Honestly, I would so much love for this X-Men series to die and for a new one to be made by a director who is both 1) an X-Men fan BEFORE going in and 2) A big enough name to have the pull to make the movie he wants to make... not the one the studios tell him to make revolving around the cash cow characters. I've seriously become less of a Wolverine fan because of these movies... it opened my eyes to how over used and overexposed the guy is in ever medium right now. They mystique is almost completely dead when the mysterious "loner" is in the spotlight.

For a new trilogy, I would also like to see a director who is an X-Men fan before signing on and one with the power to dictate what happens in his films. However, the screenwriters for X3 Simon Kinberg & Zak Penn are proper X-fans with knowledge of the history.

As a massive X-fan, I am ultra critical of anything that comes out but I also realise that not everything I want will be possible onscreen. I thought both trailers were great and a lot better than expected given all the negative news surrounding X3.

At this moment, I am still very optimistic about X3.

[Specter313]

1. who the would be laughing at it?!?!? AND WHY?!
2.WHAT THE F*** DOES CHARLIZE THERON KNOW!?..isnt she the same b**ch that started some s*** with halle (and halle shut-her up!!!LOL!)of course that idiot is all angry..
3.crumbling behind me?!!??!!........WHAT!?...all we have seen are two trailers!!..and they were undeniably awesome!
4.YOUR INSANE!

Are we all forgetting that Larry is the same guy who said that one of these "sources" or whatever told him that Cyclops would be taken by the Morlocks from Alkali Lake and then make a triumphant return at the end, and then went on to say that everything he's seen tells him that Scott will die? Best to just put him on ignore like I have.

[tonytr1687]

I've noticed that this thread has divided into two camps: those who didnt like any of the previous films and think this one will suck two b/c they're deviating from the source material...and those who liked the previous films and are generally optimistic. I guess I must be the only one who liked the previous films but is worried about X3...and it doesnt relly have to do with Ratner or deviating from the source material. Cyclops' death is not merely a problem b/c it deviates, its a problem simply b/c it's just bad storytelling and bad character development. At this point his death (if it happens) seems to only exist for the purpose of making Jean go crazy...and thats just an insult to Cyke's character that his only purpose is to become a plot device for SOMEONE ELSE'S character development. Having his character, who has been somewhat underdeveloped in the first two (probably so that he could have his time to shine in X3 no less), killed off in the first 15 mins is just bad writing either way you look at it, and an excuse to get his character out of the way. People here then say "well if it has an emotional impact then its all good," but here's the thing...his character hasn't been developed enough for it to have emotional impact and even if it did it wouldnt make the movie any better if you dont have smart writing to back it up. Something in a movie can have an emotional impact but then afterwards you stop to think about it and say "that was incredibly half-assed." And the argument is more than just "he dies in the first 15 mins," its also that this is (or might be) happening in the DARK PHOENIX SAGA! And no I'm not bringing this up b/c of deviation I'm bringing this up b/c it should be a given that a story that focuses on Jean should focus on BOTH of her love interests, especially the one she chose over the other in the previous movie, and especially the one who had less screentime in X2 than the much bally-hooed, supposed "horrible treatment" of Storm even though she was the one who saved the freakin' day. Its all about storytelling. Then there's those that say "they did the best they could with the amount of time James had." The amount of time? So they were only able to give him 3 or 4 scenes at the beginning when he had a whole month and a half to shoot for them? If they really cared about making Cyke an important part they would have worked around things and made sure they used all the time they had with him. Of course, I'm saying all of this in light of if Cyke DOES die in the beginning of the film. We shall see about that but if it does happen...all of the above applies deeply.

[larryfilmmaker]

Are we all forgetting that Larry is the same guy who said that one of these "sources" or whatever told him that Cyclops would be taken by the Morlocks from Alkali Lake and then make a triumphant return at the end, and then went on to say that everything he's seen tells him that Scott will die? Best to just put him on ignore like I have.

I'm perfectly willing to be knocked for that. I was told one thing, reported it, and then IMMEDIATELY he told me, "no, I was wrong... Cyclops dies". I felt like an idiot and it's not like there's a such thing as beign forgiven on a comic book forum (or that it really keeps me up at night whether or not I am) so that's that.

As for Wolverine2 saying you don't know ANYBODY who thinks X3 is going to suck?! What?! Go visit the FILMTHREAT forums... you know... the ones where almost everybody on there is either a filmmaker or a film critic and go read the X3 topic there. It's a laughing stock. Email Harry at AintitCoolNews and ask what he thinks about it. I mean... I understand that every time I make a point the subject slightly shifts like now everybody will go from "Nobody thinks X3 will suck" to "well yeah, they do but everybody knows AintitCool doens't know anything" or something. I mean... you just can't reach any sort of compromise on these boards. If it were any other movie... one that I didn't know anything about, I'd agree "don't judge it til ya see it"... and I know everybody here wants to say "it will be awesome!" "cyclops wont die!" "even if he does it will be awesome!"

[larryfilmmaker]

Eh... I better take this out. Dropping names is something I was told was a big "no no". Heh, so many horrible politics and rules in LA.

[tonytr1687]

I'm perfectly willing to be knocked for that. I was told one thing, reported it, and then IMMEDIATELY he told me, "no, I was wrong... Cyclops dies". I felt like an idiot and it's not like there's a such thing as beign forgiven on a comic book forum (or that it really keeps me up at night whether or not I am) so that's that.

As for Wolverine2 saying you don't know ANYBODY who thinks X3 is going to suck?! What?! Go visit the FILMTHREAT forums... you know... the ones where almost everybody on there is either a filmmaker or a film critic and go read the X3 topic there. It's a laughing stock. Email Harry at AintitCoolNews and ask what he thinks about it. I mean... I understand that every time I make a point the subject slightly shifts like now everybody will go from "Nobody thinks X3 will suck" to "well yeah, they do but everybody knows AintitCool doens't know anything" or something. I mean... you just can't reach any sort of compromise on these boards. If it were any other movie... one that I didn't know anything about, I'd agree "don't judge it til ya see it"... and I know everybody here wants to say "it will be awesome!" "cyclops wont die!" "even if he does it will be awesome!"

How is it that you have these "sources" though? Is he or she a friend or what? And how did your source find out Cyke's fate was one thing and then another?

[Eros]

Larryfilmmaker im asumeing your much older then i am, but no offense you come off as a whiney kid in this "thread". If you don't like the movies because "cyclops" is not a major charatcer, thats rather dumb. So why are you even here if you have no faith in this movie? Are you here to bad mouth the movies? You only thing you have done since you have been posting is come off as a person who only comes here to bad mouth the movies. i don't get yor purpose here, why are you here if you hate te moives. Go to the comic book forums if you hate the X movies.

[jcykeson]

Larryfilmaker has some points...

if other boards are checked(non-X-men sites like Filmthreat, Joblo...) while we fans gape and gawed at some scenes, most of the general movie viewers who posted there pointed out some things i realised is quite true and stupid to be in X-3. I'm not saying it's gonna be bad, but it does give me another view on how i would perceive the movie.. and quite many in general disagree on the fact that Cyclops hit the shaft again.. sad sad case...

[Octoberist]

Honestly, I have to admit that outside of this board, the buzz on X3 is a bit mixed at best. I mean, the trailers ARE proving some people wrong, but we all have to wait.

Initially, my faith in the movie DID sizzle last year when: The rumors of Cyclops became a huge debat, and the absence of Gambit.

But even after that, I'm still looking forward to it, AS LONG as Cyclops is not wasted, and if there's room for X4 (Gambit United!)

[Chris M]

Hmmm...this thread seems to have degenerated into the same fruitless discussion again.

What happened to the postings of pictures of the best moments of our favorite character. That brightened things up for a while....

[Torch]

I think you shouldn't come to this board and start saying to everyone the movie is going to suck. We can make up our own minds if it sucks or not. And just coming to a board to say that is so childish. Don't you have any better things to do? Go make a film or something. Get a life. Let the true fans have a good time here discussing, talking about characters, etc.

[Aiden]

As for Wolverine2 saying you don't know ANYBODY who thinks X3 is going to suck?! What?! Go visit the FILMTHREAT forums... you know... the ones where almost everybody on there is either a filmmaker or a film critic and go read the X3 topic there. It's a laughing stock. Email Harry at AintitCoolNews and ask what he thinks about it. I mean... I understand that every time I make a point the subject slightly shifts like now everybody will go from "Nobody thinks X3 will suck" to "well yeah, they do but everybody knows AintitCool doens't know anything" or something. I mean... you just can't reach any sort of compromise on these boards. If it were any other movie... one that I didn't know anything about, I'd agree "don't judge it til ya see it"... and I know everybody here wants to say "it will be awesome!" "cyclops wont die!" "even if he does it will be awesome!"
I went there. I only found one thread. It was about the trailer. There were a few people being positive. Only 3 were negative if I remember rightly. Surprise surprise, one of them was you.

I won't waste my time by e-mailing Harry. Harry will never admit he only dislikes X3 because of studios not treating him correctly in his eyes. Apart from Harry, most of AICN is positive.

[miketx]

i dont think it going to be bad my sister and sister-n-law saw the trailers and said they wanted to see it and they are not even fans of comic book movies so i think if a film can bring in new fan in already established fan base then it has to be pretty good

[The Original Bamfer]

All's I gotta say is that as much as I don't want him to, If Cyke dies - it will not spoil the movie for me.

[LEX]

http://img49.imageshack.us/img49/8689/cycklly0ka.gif (http://imageshack.us)

(avatar sizes in avy thread)
^That's really good. :up:

[JokerNick]

Does anyone have a hi-res pic of Scott and Jean together in X3, I saw it on here a few days ago but can't find it now...

[LEX]

Can't really tell if it's hi-res.

http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/8242/x40big5ab.jpg

[JokerNick]

close enough, thanks

[LEX]

You're welcome.

[LMason]

Looks like James Marsden gets to sing in his next movie:
From an interview with Idina Menzel.

Idina Menzel Provides a Few Details on “Enchanted:” “Amy Adams is playing this princess in a real fairy tale world. It starts out with eight minutes of animation, like a spoof on Disney, and she plays this princess, and James Marsden is the prince. They fall in love in one day, they sing a song where they find each other, and the birds sew her dress. Susan Sarandon is the queen and hates her, and she pushes her down a well so that she won’t marry her son. So, she falls in a well and ends up in a manhole in New York City. And then it’s a real life, New York City romantic comedy.
She meets Patrick Dempsey who is a cool single dad with a little daughter, and he falls in love with her. I play his fiancée, who is a cool fashion designer, New York chick that is sort of jaded about love.

And then the prince follows her down the well to find her, and they walk around in Renaissance clothing in the middle of New York City. I end up getting the glass slipper and the prince decides he doesn’t like the princess, he likes sassy me. And we go back to the animated world and we sing a song to each other, and I throw the Blackberry out at the wedding ceremony.”
Idina Menzel Gets Animated: Asked if she’s seen sketches of what she’ll look like in animated form, Menzel said, “A little bit. I went over there and they are very excited about showing you that kind of stuff. It’s such an amazing process. It’s cool to see yourself animated.”

The Song Style of “Enchanted:” Menzel said hers is a Disney style song. “There’s a couple songs in it. Stephen Schwartz and Alan Menken are writing the songs for it and he [Schwartz] wrote ‘Wicked.’ It’s a big-budget movie. Amy is going to be great because she’s got to do that princess, fish-out-of-water thing in the middle of New York. It’s a romantic comedy with music and some animation in it. It’s kind of clever.”

[LEX]

Cool, a musical. :D Susan Saradon is in, too, so that should be interesting. I loved her previous movies. :up:

[Optic Rage]

Heh i wonder if he's a good singer.....its goona be werid seeing cyclops up on stage singing.

[LEX]

Has Jimmy sang before?

[Hugh'sMrs]

Marsden sang on the soundtrack for "Gossip" and also on several episodes of "Ally McBeal". Yes, he's a great singer. I recall an article that said he was offered the role of Peter Allen's boyfriend Greg in "The Boy From Oz". The Wolverine and Scott slashers would've been overjoyed at that casting.

[chaseter]

Heh i wonder if he's a good singer.....its goona be werid seeing cyclops up on stage singing.
They should have X-Men The Musical or X-Men on Ice.:)

[LEX]

Ah, I need to hear him sing. :(

I think when I was watching X-Men 1.5, Bryan mentioned that he wanted to do an X-Men musical somewhere.

[jcykeson]

haha, our boy jimmy plays the guitar too... yeap, he does sing in a few episodes of Ally Mcbeal... talented...

[LEX]

What episode did he sing in? I'll try and download it off online.

[vanillacyke]

Looks like James Marsden gets to sing in his next movie:
From an interview with Idina Menzel.

Idina Menzel Provides a Few Details on “Enchanted:” “Amy Adams is playing this princess in a real fairy tale world. It starts out with eight minutes of animation, like a spoof on Disney, and she plays this princess, and James Marsden is the prince. They fall in love in one day, they sing a song where they find each other, and the birds sew her dress. Susan Sarandon is the queen and hates her, and she pushes her down a well so that she won’t marry her son. So, she falls in a well and ends up in a manhole in New York City. And then it’s a real life, New York City romantic comedy.
She meets Patrick Dempsey who is a cool single dad with a little daughter, and he falls in love with her. I play his fiancée, who is a cool fashion designer, New York chick that is sort of jaded about love.

And then the prince follows her down the well to find her, and they walk around in Renaissance clothing in the middle of New York City. I end up getting the glass slipper and the prince decides he doesn’t like the princess, he likes sassy me. And we go back to the animated world and we sing a song to each other, and I throw the Blackberry out at the wedding ceremony.”
Idina Menzel Gets Animated: Asked if she’s seen sketches of what she’ll look like in animated form, Menzel said, “A little bit. I went over there and they are very excited about showing you that kind of stuff. It’s such an amazing process. It’s cool to see yourself animated.”

The Song Style of “Enchanted:” Menzel said hers is a Disney style song. “There’s a couple songs in it. Stephen Schwartz and Alan Menken are writing the songs for it and he [Schwartz] wrote ‘Wicked.’ It’s a big-budget movie. Amy is going to be great because she’s got to do that princess, fish-out-of-water thing in the middle of New York. It’s a romantic comedy with music and some animation in it. It’s kind of clever.”

She just gave away the WHOLE MOVIE!!!! What the hell???? :confused::p

[LEX]

^Haha, I was waiting for someone to point that out. :p Is she even allowed to do that?

[The Batman]

I'm perfectly willing to be knocked for that. I was told one thing, reported it, and then IMMEDIATELY he told me, "no, I was wrong... Cyclops dies". I felt like an idiot and it's not like there's a such thing as beign forgiven on a comic book forum (or that it really keeps me up at night whether or not I am) so that's that.

As for Wolverine2 saying you don't know ANYBODY who thinks X3 is going to suck?! What?! Go visit the FILMTHREAT forums... you know... the ones where almost everybody on there is either a filmmaker or a film critic and go read the X3 topic there. It's a laughing stock. Email Harry at AintitCoolNews and ask what he thinks about it. I mean... I understand that every time I make a point the subject slightly shifts like now everybody will go from "Nobody thinks X3 will suck" to "well yeah, they do but everybody knows AintitCool doens't know anything" or something. I mean... you just can't reach any sort of compromise on these boards. If it were any other movie... one that I didn't know anything about, I'd agree "don't judge it til ya see it"... and I know everybody here wants to say "it will be awesome!" "cyclops wont die!" "even if he does it will be awesome!"

Thats what pisses me off...it just seems like, people here could really care less if cyclops dies. This movie can do no wrong in their eyes, just because kinberg and penn answer all their questions, and tells them how their favorite character's gonna kick ass.

[Optic Rage]

Yeh i know what you mean there batman.....its like if there favs are done justice then everything is amazing!....quite shortsighted.

[StevieNicks1988]

Yeah, so, whats your point? If you want to get down to the nitty-gritty, then if you look at it, pretty much everybody's character got screwed in the movie-verse, somehow, someway. So what's the problem? Does that mean they are still good movies? Either way, hell yes, they are. Do I think they could've done Cyclops better? Yes. Do I think they will at some point? Yes. But do I think Cyclops will have a relatively important part in this film, other than the supposed "dying"? Yes.

[Optic Rage]

I can barely understand what your getting at.

[FieryBalrog]

lots of characters have been changed. It does suck, and if I could change the X-men movies in some way, as top priority I would have given Scott more of a introverted hard-ass leader role + more screentime and Logan more of a ugly, rough and volatile role. Scott felt too emotional in the first two films and Marsden doesn't have a stiff enough jaw.

But whats done is done, and whatever they do to Cyclops happens. I'll still love the movie if it tells a great story.

[Maze]

Yeah, so, whats your point? If you want to get down to the nitty-gritty, then if you look at it, pretty much everybody's character got screwed in the movie-verse, somehow, someway. So what's the problem?.

yup , i agree..

but you know the real problem?

The Xmen movies are good movies but not that good Xmen movies


Exactly like Batman89 and Batman returns imo are really great movies, but not great Batman movies..

Really i like Singer movies ( hell i sleep every night with it lol) and i believe that they respect some of the ideas of the comics ( like the intolerance issue) but they are way too hollywoodised ( god love man kill mirror really reflect way better the intolerance issue) i really believe that it could be more easily be more faithful to the comics ( forgetting the spandex costume , the time travel stuff and all the more outlandish side of the comics)..the movies could be more about the Xmen as a group .. ..And some of the characters could be really more faithful and hence more interesting (Logan and cyke for example)


Xmen movies are not living up to their potential ,that's the problem..

[The Batman]

X-Men movies can be alot more faithful. And if people stopped accepting things for what they are in cases when they could be better, they'd realize it too.

[Paste Pot Pete]

You know what the most aggravating thing about this "Cyclops problem" is?

We shouldn't even be HAVING this conversation. It should not be a question.

In a perfect world, an X-Men movie simply would not go forward if the actor who played Cyclops was temporarily unavailable. Production would wait for him, or begin to shoot around him, not "do the best with what they had."

Yes, it's an ensemble movie, but even an ensemble movie has certain characters/stars that it shouldn't move forward without. It's like going forward with a Star Wars movie without heavy presence from Luke or Han.

And for X-Men, it's Cyclops. He IS the necessity. Aside from Xavier, he's just about the only character I would call "a MUST" for every X-Men movie.

Now I can't put all the blame on the X3 crew, because they're following a precedent. And I can't put it all on Singer's crew either. I can't even put it all on FOX, because you have to expect them to sell what sells. And Wolverine, not Cyclops, sells. And for that, I can pretty much only blame "the people" for.

So I'm not blaming Ratner; I'm lamenting what could've been. What should've been. It's just sad that we have to be spending hundreds of message board pages not even questioning his death per se, but questioning how much we'll see of him at all. We shouldn't be scraping for screentime when it comes to Cyclops. He's not Chamber. He's not even Gambit. He's not a cult favorite. He IS the X-Men.

[FieryBalrog]

You know what the most aggravating thing about this "Cyclops problem" is?

We shouldn't even be HAVING this conversation. It should not be a question.

In a perfect world, an X-Men movie simply would not go forward if the actor who played Cyclops was temporarily unavailable. Production would wait for him, or begin to shoot around him, not "do the best with what they had."

Yes, it's an ensemble movie, but even an ensemble movie has certain characters/stars that it shouldn't move forward without. It's like going forward with a Star Wars movie without heavy presence from Luke or Han.

And for X-Men, it's Cyclops. He IS the necessity. Aside from Xavier, he's just about the only character I would call "a MUST" for every X-Men movie.

Now I can't put all the blame on the X3 crew, because they're following a precedent. And I can't put it all on Singer's crew either. I can't even put it all on FOX, because you have to expect them to sell what sells. And Wolverine, not Cyclops, sells. And for that, I can pretty much only blame "the people" for.

So I'm not blaming Ratner; I'm lamenting what could've been. What should've been. It's just sad that we have to be spending hundreds of message board pages not even questioning his death per se, but questioning how much we'll see of him at all. We shouldn't be scraping for screentime when it comes to Cyclops. He's not Chamber. He's not even Gambit. He's not a cult favorite. He IS the X-Men.

True, he is the first and most constant X-man. At least the group they went with in the first movie is about as close to a core, essential group of X-men you can get (Cyclops, Jean, Storm, Wolverine)

[The Batman]

You know what the most aggravating thing about this "Cyclops problem" is?

We shouldn't even be HAVING this conversation. It should not be a question.

In a perfect world, an X-Men movie simply would not go forward if the actor who played Cyclops was temporarily unavailable. Production would wait for him, or begin to shoot around him, not "do the best with what they had."

Yes, it's an ensemble movie, but even an ensemble movie has certain characters/stars that it shouldn't move forward without. It's like going forward with a Star Wars movie without heavy presence from Luke or Han.

And for X-Men, it's Cyclops. He IS the necessity. Aside from Xavier, he's just about the only character I would call "a MUST" for every X-Men movie.

Now I can't put all the blame on the X3 crew, because they're following a precedent. And I can't put it all on Singer's crew either. I can't even put it all on FOX, because you have to expect them to sell what sells. And Wolverine, not Cyclops, sells. And for that, I can pretty much only blame "the people" for.

So I'm not blaming Ratner; I'm lamenting what could've been. What should've been. It's just sad that we have to be spending hundreds of message board pages not even questioning his death per se, but questioning how much we'll see of him at all. We shouldn't be scraping for screentime when it comes to Cyclops. He's not Chamber. He's not even Gambit. He's not a cult favorite. He IS the X-Men.


Yes...this and the fact that fans of other characters want to downgrade his importance in the x-universe is most annoying.

[The Guard]

Which comic inspired them to demolecularize Cyclops, kill Xavier, and give leadership to Hugh and Halle? Must have missed that issue.
I'm pretty sure that Xavier has died before in the comic mythology. Cyclops has appeared to have been killed by Phoenix before in the comics, I believe (I think Mastermind was involved), and has also died, and Wolverine and Storm have held leadership roles off and on for years in the X-Men mythos. The X-Men's leadership has changed several times during it's history. The writers never said everything onscreen comes right from the comics, but that it is based on something that happened in the comics at some point or another.
For 6 years, I've given this franchise my time and money at the theater, hoping and wishing they'd get it right.
I could have sworn that X-MEN and X2 were only in theatres for a couple of months. You must be really dedicated.
All I've gotten from it is Wolverine being the hero of the franchise when he's not supposed to be.
Wolverine's not supposed to be a hero? What X-Men mythology have you been following where Wolverine wasn't front and center? Go read ESSENTIAL X-MEN Volumes 1 and 2 and come back. And what X-Men movies have you been watching? Wolverine is the main character, but he has not, in any way shape or form, been the only "hero" in this franchise.
a bobby drake who's merely cyclops jr.
You're going to have to explain that one.
a logan/jean relationship that comes off as more interesting than a scott/jean one
The end of X-MEN. Go watch it. If you still choose not to see it (rest of sentence omitted for politeness).
and a cyclops who's never been given the chance to be a leader.
If you find the Logan/Jean relationship more interesting than the Scott/Jean one, you don't get relationships to begin with.
And now he's not going to be an important part of the phoenix saga.
Says who? He's not going to have a huge role, probably, but saying he won't be an important part strikes me as a bit of a stretch at this point.
And apologists can make up the excuse that this isnt the comics, but that only work when talking about the shiar or the hellfire club. Not only that, it looks like logan steals the show once again, takiing the leader position of the time.
Difficult for someone to steal the show when they are clearly the main character to begin with. And it's Magneto and Beast, I think, who will steal the show. And some of you need to get the hell over the Cyclops thing. It's really getting pathetic.
officially, at least, cause lets fact it, logan took scotts role long ago.
Really? Is that why he and Jean are together? Why she desired to be with Logan when confronted about it? Why Logan is clearly leading the X-Men in the first two films and...oh, wait...NONE OF THAT HAS COME TO PASS!
And what? Some writers who claim to be long time comic fans are supposed to give me hope?
Nothing would give you hope. You can't wrap your head around the fact that this is not a comic book, and that certain actors have not gotten their due because of very non-story related reasons.
A director who cant go two minutes without cursing is supposed to reassure me that things are going to be ok? I'm sick of waiting. I've been waiting six years, and they still havent learned anything apparently.
Oh, very mature. Judging a book by it's cover. What exactly have you waited six years to see?
They dont care about the comics all that much, no matter how many times they brag that they do. Every director and writer says that now a days.
And every fanboy with a victim complex and an inability to face reality says what you are saying. Your point?
So yeah, unless they can fufill they're promise and actually deliver an X-Men film, and actually deliver on making Cyclops look good, I probably wont see this movie.
Sure you won't. And heaven forfend FOX doesn't get your 10 dollars. How will they ever survive?
And people can say I'm not an X-Man fan all they want, cause honestly, i dont care what most of them think, especially with their condescending attitudes toward cyclops fans.
It doesn't make you not an X-Men fan if you choose not to see X3 because Cyclops might/does die or isn't the main character. It just makes you a damned fool. To pass up a movie featuring
The war to end all wars
The Dark Phoenix Saga
The Cure
The Danger Room
Sentinels?
Xavier
Cyclops
Wolverine
Storm
Beast
Angel
Rogue
Iceman
Colossus
Kitty Pryde
Magneto
Phoenix
Mystique
Juggernaut
Pyro
Callisto
Multiple Man
Arclight
Trask
all because Cyclops might or does die or because he isn't suddenly the main attraction, is just moronic. Simply moronic.
You guys are saying it looks "Damn Good" and I'm saying it looks "Damn Bad".
Based on what, exactly?
A couple peeps in the film biz I know (mostly FX guys) claim that everybody is laughing at this film right now.
So, we're supposed to panic because a couple of your friends claim something?
Another, who WORKED with her on Aeon Flux, told me that Charlize Theron was very pissed she didn't get to play Mystique originally but now, because of X3, is glad she didn't. (it came up during the makeup application in Flux and the molding of a body cast)
Based on what, exactly?

I'm telling you guys... you're all standing boldly shoulder to shoulder defending something that is crumbling behind you.
Based on what, exactly? How exactly has it been crumbling, again?
When Hugh goes from saying he's not sure he's going to want to play Wolverine to all of a sudden everybody is saying "Hugh is very dedicated to making this movie happen" there is some serious BS and politics going on. Go ahead, tell me I'm wrong. Jeeeust wait.
At no point, at no point, has Hugh Jackman ever said he wasn't sure he wanted to, or didn't want to play Wolverine in X3. What he has said is that he doesn't want to play Wolverine forever. He has, however, clearly committed to three X-Men films, and now committed to doing at least one WOLVERINE prequel spinoff. Does that sound like a man who wants out?
I think that the first trailer look gawdawful (on these forums you get called names for saying that but in other places it's highly acknowledged) but I think they covered up a lot of the crappy stuff in the second trailer w/ good music and voice over.
1. What about the first trailer looks godawful?
2. What crappy stuff?
I think Cyclops and Angel look interesting but not a damn thing otherwise does. Why are X-Men fans so loyal to these movies? They've remained loyal to like 3 or 4 characters and that's it...
What does "loyal" mean, exactly? Exactly the same as the comics?
the rest they just mishmash and move around however they feel like it and they do it in ways that don't improve the story at all.
Examples?
Just bad storytelling in my opinion. I don't WANT X3 to suck but I'm sure it will. Honestly, I would so much love for this X-Men series to die and for a new one to be made by a director who is both 1) an X-Men fan BEFORE going in and 2) A big enough name to have the pull to make the movie he wants to make... not the one the studios tell him to make revolving around the cash cow characters.
FOX did not just decide to make Wolverine the main player JUST BECAUSE. Wolverine has always, always, always been one of, if not the main player/s in the X-Men mythos.
I've seriously become less of a Wolverine fan because of these movies... it opened my eyes to how over used and overexposed the guy is in ever medium right now. The mystique is almost completely dead when the mysterious "loner" is in the spotlight.
Right there is a general misunderstanding of Wolverine's character to begin with. He's not always supposed to be a mysterious loner (at least, he wasn't when he first joined the X-Men way back when). Especially to the audience. His past is a mystery, yes, and he tends not to want to talk about his problems (even though he does). Who he is, however, isn't a mystery, and very rarely has been written as such. He's had numerous friendships/relationships over the years, and been very open with many characters. The man wears his heart on his sleeve, and has, even in the comic books. He's gruff, yes, but he's not what I would consider an emotional loner most of the time. He's not Batman.

Oh, and you're wrong. And this, I'm afraid, is another hilariously biased and flat-out wrong series of posts that we will bring up when X3 is released.

Outside these boards, the only people I see who hate X3 are the ones who are so anal about comic adaption that they cannot handle ANY change (even when it works, and yet they still forgive BATMAN BEGINS for it, odd) and those who love taking potshots at Brett Ratner and FOX based on other things they have done in the past (I.E, FOX made ELEKTRA and FANTASTIC FOUR, so X3 will suck, right?). Most people with half a brain have at least conceded that X3 is full of good actors, an interesting story, has a director who seems to know what he is doing, and could easily be a good film. Those who haven't are still going on their "Ratner did this film and this film, and therefore he sucks" tangents.

[Torch]

Right on, TG. :) :up:

[kytrigger]

Very good post Guard. :up:

[Darkie]

good post man!

[The Batman]

"Wolverine's not supposed to be a hero? What X-Men mythology have you been following where Wolverine wasn't front and center? Go read ESSENTIAL X-MEN Volumes 1 and 2 and come back. And what X-Men movies have you been watching? Wolverine is the main character, but he has not, in any way shape or form, been the only "hero" in this franchise"

Well, for one thing, back when he was on the team, he was at the front and center, but not at the expense of other characters. He was a main character, but everyone got equal time. This is of course before the x universe became a franchise instead of good stories.

You're going to have to explain that one.

Well lets see...movie Iceman is a stand up guy who dosent break to rules to much, and is sometimes at odds with a badboy. sounds like cyclops to me. not to mention james marsden stated in the X2 souvinier magazine that Cyclops sees him as....a young cyclops.


Sure you won't. And heaven forfend FOX doesn't get your 10 dollars. How will they ever survive?

Yup...there goes that condescending attitude...back to rear its ugly head. And you guys wonder why people havent come around to your view yet? I'm not like kuro or larry, hoping the movie would bomb. i never said Fox wouldnt survive. All i said is that i wont see it.

And every fanboy with a victim complex and an inability to face reality says what you are saying. Your point?

My point is that they're saying the same thing every actor, writer, etc is saying..."Oh, we're big fans of the comics! Our movies will be faithful!" Dosent make it true.

It doesn't make you not an X-Men fan if you choose not to see X3 because Cyclops might/does die or isn't the main character. It just makes you a damned fool.

Oh yes, I'm a fool because i'm gonna pass up logan getting the most screentime, again, a Dark Phoenix Saga where the guy who's supposed to bring jean back from the brink will be missing or dead, a bunch of second rate characters i could care less for, a Danger Room scene that probably wont last more than 5 minutes, and a plot that seems to ripoff the past two movies.

[The Batman]

Oh, very mature. Judging a book by it's cover. What exactly have you waited six years to see?


An X-Men movie that gets its freaking characters right. A movie that dosent push two of its main characters into the backround.

Difficult for someone to steal the show when they are clearly the main character to begin with. And it's Magneto and Beast, I think, who will steal the show. And some of you need to get the hell over the Cyclops thing. It's really getting pathetic.

no, whats real pathetic is you people finding the need to judge cyclops fans. Get over it? This is the Dark Phoenix Saga, and it seems like all Scott will do is go to alkali lake and get blasted to bits.

Nothing would give you hope. You can't wrap your head around the fact that this is not a comic book, and that certain actors have not gotten their due because of very non-story related reasons.

And you(And some other), cant seem to wrap your heads around the fact that cyclops fans arent freaking asking for much.

[kytrigger]

The Batman, you always talk about how everyone on this thread has a condescending attitude towards anyone negative about X3 when it simply isn't true. Yes there are a few posters that I feel have unfairly labeled people that are upset that they feel Cyke is gtting shafted again, but there are just as many "angry cyke fans" doing the exact same thing.

While some posters have disagreed with your point of view, most posters are no more condescending than you are. You constantly characterize the people who believe Cyke will live, or believe that even if he does die that the movie will still be good as apologists. This is no better or worse than what Guard or many posters have said to you.

[The Batman]

The Batman, youalways talk about how everyone on this thread has a condescending attitude towards anyone negative about X3 when it simply isn't true. Yes there are a few posters that I feel have unfairly labeled people that are upset that they feel Cyke is gtting shafted again, but there are just as many "angry cyke fans" doing the exact same thing.

While some posters have disagreed with your point of view, most posters are no more condescending than you are. You constantly characterize the people who believe Cyke will live, or believe that even if he does die that the movie will still be good as apologists. This is no better or worse than what Guard or many posters have said to you.


Well, when cyke question their maturity, common sense, call them whiners and complainers, Call them fools, Speak to them in a sarcastic manner, and ask them if they live on planet stupid, then maybe you can say that. Calling them "Apologists" is quite tame.

[kytrigger]

Well, when cyke question their maturity, common sense, call them whiners and complainers, Call them fools, Speak to them in a sarcastic manner, and ask them if they live on planet stupid, then maybe you can say that. Calling them "Apologists" is quite tame.

But posters have done that, on both sides of the argument. Maybe not you, but it has been said. Those posters on both extreme ends of the argument are not the ones I was really referring to, hence the reason I addressed you and not them.

I was refering to the posters that have made a number of good posts in this thread, like Worthy Stevens, and that you characterize him, and all others that believe this movie can still be good if Cyke dies as apologists. And your posts, to me atleast, seem to cover everyone that has that opinion, even the ones that haven't in any way insulted you and are actually here for the right purpose-to actually discuss and debate the matter. These are the people that are constantly debating you and you keep calling them apologists. And while being an "apologist" is not in any way the harshest name calling on this thread, it is still somewhat hypocratic of you to try and take the high road, while still calling people that.

[The Batman]

But posters have done that, on both sides of the argument. Maybe not you, but it has been said. Those posters on both extreme ends of the argument are not the ones I was really referring to, hence the reason I addressed you and not them.

I was refering to the posters that have made a number of good posts in this thread, like Worthy Stevens, and that you characterize him, and all others that believe this movie can still be good if Cyke dies as apologists. And your posts, to me atleast, seem to cover everyone that has that opinion, even the ones that haven't in any way insulted you and are actually here for the right purpose-to actually discuss and debate the matter. These are the people that are constantly debating you and you keep calling them apologists. And while being an "apologist" is not in any way the harshest name calling on this thread, it is still somewhat hypocratic of you to try and take the high road, while still calling people that.


I dont call everyone apologists. I'm referring to those guys who say "This isnt the comics" everytime a cyke fans says cyke is supposed to have an important role in the story. Worthy's just real optimistic...

[kytrigger]

I dont call everyone apologists. I'm referring to those guys who say "This isnt the comics" everytime a cyke fans says cyke is supposed to have an important role in the story. Worthy's just real optimistic...

I see, and my apology then. I always felt that your posts were referring to everyone on the other side of the debate, and that was what had irked me. Sorry again.

[The Batman]

It's alright.

[Kurosawa]

There is nothing-NOTHING that they could possibly do to be MORE of a slap in the face to fans of Cyclops-who in the first two films have so far got NOTHING-then to have his place in the Dark Phoenix Saga taken by Wolverine. That's a bigger abomination than Bat-nipples ever could have been. Changing the end of the Dark Phoenix Saga is like changing Romeo and Juliet and putting Paris in Romeo's place at the end after killing Romeo in Act I. It's just disgusting.

[gap5ewl]

There is nothing-NOTHING that they could possibly do to be MORE of a slap in the face to fans of Cyclops-who in the first two films have so far got NOTHING-then to have his place in the Dark Phoenix Saga taken by Wolverine. That's a bigger abomination than Bat-nipples ever could have been. Changing the end of the Dark Phoenix Saga is like changing Romeo and Juliet and putting Paris in Romeo's place at the end after killing Romeo in Act I. It's just disgusting.
Amen to that.

[kytrigger]

Gap5ewl, while I really like your new avatar, I can't help but miss the old one...

[Storm22]

You guys are saying it looks "Damn Good" and I'm saying it looks "Damn Bad". A couple peeps in the film biz I know (mostly FX guys) claim that everybody is laughing at this film right now. Another, who WORKED with her on Aeon Flux, told me that Charlize Theron was very pissed she didn't get to play Mystique originally but now, because of X3, is glad she didn't. (it came up during the makeup application in Flux and the molding of a body cast)

I'm telling you guys... you're all standing boldly shoulder to shoulder defending something that is crumbling behind you. When Hugh goes from saying he's not sure he's going to want to play Wolverine to all of a sudden everybody is saying "Hugh is very dedicated to making this movie happen" there is some serious BS and politics going on. Go ahead, tell me I'm wrong. Jeeeust wait.

Dunt dunt dunt dunt dun dun dunt dunt dunt dunt dun dun

MORTAL KOMBAT!!!!

A couple of your FX friends claim everyone is laughing at this film?! well MY GOD, based on that none of us should go see X3!! It's obviously gonna be awful because some of your alleged sources claim everyone is laughing at this film! And, OH NO, the genius that is Charlize Theron allegedly claims she's now happy she never got to play Mystique, based on what exactly - her magic little private screening of X3?! TOTAL BS!!!

Seriously man, I know you're of the opinion that X3 is gonna blow, and you're entitled to that opinion but ENOUGH with the further attempts at misleading and LYING with your "sources" and your "claims" from people in the biz and imaginary friends supposedly in the know who suddenly, SHOCK HORROR, retract their claims on Cyclops!!! It really is pathetic!

Now before you start waffling on that I'm blindly positive about X3 and standing shoulder to shoulder with fans for a movie that's gonna be crap, I'm purely basing my opinions on what we've seen of X3 so far and set reports etc. and imo it's looking bloody good! Just stop resorting to your fake a$$ sources to back up your arguments will ya, it shouts out desperation! Grow up!

[xwolverine2]

Gap5ewl, while I really like your new avatar, I can't help but miss the old one...
true... if you cant get it to move then you might want to stick with your old one

[WorthyStevens]

You guys are saying it looks "Damn Good" and I'm saying it looks "Damn Bad". A couple peeps in the film biz I know (mostly FX guys) claim that everybody is laughing at this film right now. Another, who WORKED with her on Aeon Flux, told me that Charlize Theron was very pissed she didn't get to play Mystique originally but now, because of X3, is glad she didn't. (it came up during the makeup application in Flux and the molding of a body cast)

Um, Aeon Flux finished filming over a year ago, so she would have had to have said that right around the time the AICN script was leaked... :confused:

We're talking about NOW. Alot has changed since last year.

[xwolverine2]

let me repost what i said earlier.......

WHAT THE F*** DOES CHARLIZE THERON KNOW!?..isnt she the same b**ch that started some s*** with halle (and halle shut-her up!!!LOL!)of course that idiot is all angry..

[Kira]

Question for you larryfilmmaker: Sorry if I sound like an idiot, but I have to ask about this... :O

So everyone (your FX friends) in Hollywood are laughing at X-Men 3? How does that will affect on X-Men success or non success? I mean, it's the general audience that will bring money to the movie and so far so good. People have seemed to like the trailer and those teaser posters have been received pretty well. And magazine's have written more positive stories about X-Men lately than negative stories... I just believe that all this will have greater impact to general audience than some FX guys opinions. Just a though. And hey... There were a lot of people who were laughing at Titanic. :)

[terry78]

It's clearly gotten to the point where Wolverine is a franchise among himself, like Hulk, Spider-Man, etc. There was a poll on Marvel.com asking who is your favorite Marvel character, and they had the Fantastic Four, The Hulk, Spider-Man, etc., but in the X-Men choice, they had it as X-Men/Wolverine, who is apparantly now the star of the X-teams, period. While it's not the way it was meant to be when he was first introduced, he's overshadowed everyone else in the books, except when writers make him simply the ill-tempered subplot character.

[Paste Pot Pete]

xwolverine2, chill out. larrythecableguy has a credibilty level of about 0%, anyway.

[SlimDayspring]

Well, anyway...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v247/notanumber/CykeAstonishing08-pg19.jpg

[Storm22]

If anything, the FX in X3 so far seem to be top notch and are one of the best things THE MOVIE has going for it!! x3 may end up having a weak story/dialogue but alot of people seem to be very positive about X3's FX and we haven't even seen the final version of these FX yet!

[WorthyStevens]

Well, anyway...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v247/notanumber/CykeAstonishing08-pg19.jpg

Now THAT is the Scott Summers we should've seen more of. :D

[terry78]

Well, anyway...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v247/notanumber/CykeAstonishing08-pg19.jpg
That right there is how he should've been portrayed in the movie. Wolverine doesn't always go along with him, but he respects him due to the power he knows he has.

[Kira]

SlimDayspring, I love that one! Although, I don't think I have seen it before... Where is that from?

[Storm22]

Cyclops would be great against Sentinels in X3 imo! He could really unleash his powers and would be one of the most effective mutants against them!

[tonytr1687]

If anything, the FX in X3 so far seem to be top notch and are one of the best things THE MOVIE has going for it!! x3 may end up having a weak story/dialogue but alot of people seem to be very positive about X3's FX and we haven't even seen the final version of these FX yet!

You think good effects would make up for a weak story and dialogue? I'm not saying X3 will be weak in those departments but if it is...no amount of jaw-dropping effects can make things right and turn it into a good movie.

[SlimDayspring]

SlimDayspring, I love that one! Although, I don't think I have seen it before... Where is that from?
It's from Astonishing X-Men #8 (from Joss Whedon's current run).

[Kira]

It's from Astonishing X-Men #8 (from Joss Whedon's current run).

So I will see that pretty soon. Thanks. :)

[Storm22]

You think good effects would make up for a weak story and dialogue? I'm not saying X3 will be weak in those departments but if it is...no amount of jaw-dropping effects can make things right and turn it into a good movie.

No that's not what I meant at all. I'm saying that IF X3 had a weak plot and dialogue then so be it but it could still have great FX! Think of The Phantom Menace - it didn't have the best story/dialogue but the visual FX were great. Now I'm aware the FX wouldn't be near enough to make a great movie but the FX, from what we've seen, seem to be one of the things going right for X3 and a definite positive aspect of the movie! Imo the story and dialogue, from what we've seen, also seem to be a positive aspect!!

My point is that if larrythefilmmaker's FX friends are laughing at X3 then I'm not worried because the FX so far look great!

[Aiden]

Yeah, the FX should be great considering that WETA is working on a couple hundred shots

[LMason]

As for Wolverine2 saying you don't know ANYBODY who thinks X3 is going to suck?! What?! Go visit the FILMTHREAT forums... you know... the ones where almost everybody on there is either a filmmaker or a film critic and go read the X3 topic there.

Using the FILMTHREAT forums is not a way to back up your point. THat's almost as bad as people going to other boards and using SHH as their backup. A few scattered posters, industry professionals or not, is not the way to lay down the groundwork for the "it's going to suck" movement. Most of the posters were "I'll wait til DVD" and apathetic, and in the most recent thread, your screenname is one of the most prominent.

As far as the FX go, X3 has some of the best second-unit members in the business. John Bruno is leading the charge. Until I see a clip that screams the FX are in trouble, I'm cool. I saw the X3 trailer on the Uptown screen in DC - its curved screen measures 32 feet x 70 feet. All the trailers were for summer movies and boy could you tell how ridiculous the FX (and the stories) were.

[WorthyStevens]

Q: What exactly will Cyclops be doing? I only saw him once in the teaser trailer. Will he play a important part, or will his part be more laid back? Also will he and Jean cross paths? - TJ (Feb 9 2006)

A: Cyclops and Jean will definitely cross paths in some emotional scenes. While small, Cyclops role will have importance to the events in the film.

http://www.xmenfilms.net/fanletters.html

I wanted to bring that back up. Notice the plural... scenes. Not scene.

[Storm22]

Not to sound offensive or anything but isn't that just a1ant's opinion or does he actually know more than us?

[Kira]

While small, Cyclops role will have importance to the events in the film.

While small. I wonder does he mean X2 kind of small..?

But still... Glad to hear that he has more than one scene. :)

[xwolverine2]

xwolverine2, chill out. larrythecableguy has a credibilty level of about 0%, anyway.
LOL!....sorry, i just dont know why theres people that feel such a way..

Quote:
As for Wolverine2 saying you don't know ANYBODY who thinks X3 is going to suck?! What?! Go visit the FILMTHREAT forums... you know... the ones where almost everybody on there is either a filmmaker or a film critic and go read the X3 topic there.


Using the FILMTHREAT forums is not a way to back up your point. THat's almost as bad as people going to other boards and using SHH as their backup. A few scattered posters, industry professionals or not, is not the way to lay down the groundwork for the "it's going to suck" movement. Most of the posters were "I'll wait til DVD" and apathetic, and in the most recent thread, your screenname is one of the most prominent.

As far as the FX go, X3 has some of the best second-unit members in the business. John Bruno is leading the charge. Until I see a clip that screams the FX are in trouble, I'm cool. I saw the X3 trailer on the Uptown screen in DC - its curved screen measures 32 feet x 70 feet. All the trailers were for summer movies and boy could you tell how ridiculous the FX (and the stories) were.

LMFAO!!!!!!...i cant beleive he actually told me to go to FILMTHREAT.COM!!!!
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!
....man there just getting desperate.....i wonder what he searched to find that website in google, "x-men sucks websites"!?!?.....LOL!!!

im sorry for being mean but thats pathetic!:D :D :D

[xwolverine2]

While small. I wonder does he mean X2 kind of small..?

But still... Glad to hear that he has more than one scene. :)
HANNIBAL LECTER was in slience of the lambs for 15min!....

......he is the most iconic villain in film history.

[Aiden]

And he won an Oscar

[WorthyStevens]

Not to sound offensive or anything but isn't that just a1ant's opinion or does he actually know more than us?

In this case, I hope he knows more than us. :p

[Chris M]

http://x-mencomics.com/xfan/4images/data/media/188/uxmen280.jpg

My favorite X-Men cover of all time, it says so much about Cyke in one image. This is the cover that hooked me into X-Men.

<sigh> Soooo long ago.

[Exploding Boy]

Its really weird how he is so iconic to the Xmen yet in the films he has tiny parts.

[WorthyStevens]

That is a damn good cover.

[GothicPowerMix1]

Glad to hear that he has more than one scene. :)

Mansion - 5 Minutes

Lake & Jeans Ressurection - 5 Minutes

His Death - 5 Seconds

10 Minutes Later Team Gets Over It & Cyclops Will Be Forgotten

:(

[xwolverine2]

And he won an Oscar
OH YEAH I FORGOT ABOUT THAT!....


i love you.

[TheVileOne]

http://x-mencomics.com/xfan/4images/data/media/188/uxmen280.jpg

My favorite X-Men cover of all time, it says so much about Cyke in one image. This is the cover that hooked me into X-Men.

<sigh> Soooo long ago.
God forbid Cyclops gets an image like this grieving over the professor in the movie.

Instead Wolverine and Storm get it.

[Storm22]

Mansion

Lake

His Death

:(

If it's more than one scene with Jean then surely that points to Cyclops being in the final battle.

[Exploding Boy]

Jean looks like shes smiling

[xwolverine2]

Its really weird how he is so iconic to the Xmen yet in the films he has tiny parts.
yeah true...

some people at school like cyclops in the x-films (with no knowledge of the comics) as their fav. character.....:confused:

[WorthyStevens]

Mansion - 5 Minutes

Lake & Jeans Ressurection - 5 Minutes

His Death - 5 Seconds

10 Minutes Later Team Gets Over It & Cyclops Will Be Forgotten

:(

The Q&A said he and Jean will cross paths in some emotional scenes.

[SlimDayspring]

The Dark Phoenix saga gave us three inconic Cyclops covers in a row...

Uncanny X-Men 136
http://www.uncannyxmen.net/covers/uncanny/uncanny136.jpg

Uncanny X-Men 137
http://www.uncannyxmen.net/covers/uncanny/uncanny137.jpg

Uncanny X-Men 138
http://www.uncannyxmen.net/covers/uncanny/uncanny138.jpg

[TheVileOne]

If it's more than one scene with Jean then surely that points to Cyclops being in the final battle.
It said, "small role".

[Aiden]

OH YEAH I FORGOT ABOUT THAT!....


i love you.
How could you forget.


I love you too

:D

[xwolverine2]

Mansion - 5 Minutes

Lake & Jeans Ressurection - 5 Minutes

His Death - 5 Seconds

10 Minutes Later Team Gets Over It & Cyclops Will Be Forgotten

:(
HANNIBAL LECTER was in slience of the lambs for 15min!....
And he won an Oscar
i smell an osssscccarrr........:D :D

[WorthyStevens]

God forbid Cyclops gets an image like this grieving over the professor in the movie.

Instead Wolverine and Storm get it.

We don't know that yet. Although it would be very, very, very stupid to do that.


I really, really like this cover:

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b378/ScottStevensDevils/xmen30.jpg

[Storm22]

It said, "small role".

It still would be small, he could be gone for most of the film then show up at some stage in the final battle.

[xwolverine2]

Uncanny X-Men 138
http://www.uncannyxmen.net/covers/uncanny/uncanny138.jpg
:eek: just like the backpack in the movie!

[WorthyStevens]

It said, "small role".

That doesn't equate to him dying.

[Kira]

Mansion - 5 Minutes

Lake & Jeans Ressurection - 5 Minutes

His Death - 5 Seconds

10 Minutes Later Team Gets Over It & Cyclops Will Be Forgotten

:(

Aww... Another Negative Nelly. Even if he dies, I don't think he will be forgotten. Not at all. If/when Jean will come back to her senses, I'm sure she will grieve him. A lot. :(

[TheVileOne]

It still would be small, he could be gone for most of the film then show up at some stage in the final battle.

Once again, considering the subject matter of this movie, that should be the last thing to do with the character.

[WorthyStevens]

Once again, considering the subject matter of this movie, that should be the last thing to do with the character.

I'd rather he be presumed dead and come back to victory in the final battle than him just being killed off at the very beginning.

[Storm22]

Once again, considering the subject matter of this movie, that should be the last thing to do with the character.

Better than him just dying imo!

[the_scream]

There is nothing-NOTHING that they could possibly do to be MORE of a slap in the face to fans of Cyclops-who in the first two films have so far got NOTHING-then to have his place in the Dark Phoenix Saga taken by Wolverine. That's a bigger abomination than Bat-nipples ever could have been. Changing the end of the Dark Phoenix Saga is like changing Romeo and Juliet and putting Paris in Romeo's place at the end after killing Romeo in Act I. It's just disgusting.

:cyclops: Couldn't have put it better myself. I can't believe fans are willing to sell out and accept a butchered version of the Phoenix saga simply because it is the only thing on offer.

Sure, seeing Beast and Angel is cool. Seeing the Danger room is fun. But, you know what? It was cool to see the batmobile, Joker, Batman, batwing, Penguin, Catwoman, Robin and Batgirl in a big feature film. Still didn't make the films decent or the characters accurate.

The way I see it, the only things that have gone completely right with these X-Men films are:

Patrick Stewart as Xavier
Hugh Jackman as Wolverine
Alan Cummings as Nightcrawler
Ian McKellen as Magneto
Kelsey Grammer as Beast
Vinnie Jones as Juggernaught

Some good casting IMHO and some nice scenes here and there. But, on the whole, they are not true to the X-Men comics.

[FieryBalrog]

The Dark Phoenix saga gave us three inconic Cyclops covers in a row...

Uncanny X-Men 136
http://www.uncannyxmen.net/covers/uncanny/uncanny136.jpg

Uncanny X-Men 137
http://www.uncannyxmen.net/covers/uncanny/uncanny137.jpg

Uncanny X-Men 138
http://www.uncannyxmen.net/covers/uncanny/uncanny138.jpg

love those covers.

[GothicPowerMix1]

It still would be small, he could be gone for most of the film then show up at some stage in the final battle.

& then the last Scene in the Movie is Cyclops with Jean on the back of his Motorcycle driving into the Sun Set & going on Vacation & then suddenly the Bike stops & we hear Cyclops say

"****ing Logan"

[xwolverine2]

I can't believe fans are willing to sell out and accept a butchered version of the Phoenix saga simply because it is the only thing on offer.

BUTCHERED!?!?!?!

have you seen the dam movie yet?......have you seen famkes performance?!?!?!?!?!

[xwolverine2]

& then the last Scene in the Movie is Cyclops with Jean on the back of his Motorcycle driving into the Sun Set & going on Vacation & then suddenly the Bike stops & we hear Cyclops say

"****ing Logan"
i hope your joking.....LOL!

[the_scream]

BUTCHERED!?!?!?!

have you seen the dam movie yet?......have you seen famkes performance?!?!?!?!?!

The Phoenix saga minus Cyclops is BUTCHERED. Who gives a **** whether Famke is great? The storyline is still torn to shreds. A good performance can't save it.

[GothicPowerMix1]

i hope your joking.....LOL!

Of course but would have been funny though :up::):up:

[WorthyStevens]

The Phoenix saga minus Cyclops is BUTCHERED. Who gives a **** whether Famke is great? The storyline is still torn to shreds. A good performance can't save it.

Um, I do. And I'm sure every other person who sees this movie will care a great deal about her performance.

[xwolverine2]

The Phoenix saga minus Cyclops is BUTCHERED. Who gives a **** whether Famke is great? The storyline is still torn to shreds. A good performance can't save it.
im sorry but if the movie was ALL about the pheonix saga then it would probably suck...

what they wanted to do is make everything much more massive with many old and new ideas......giving magneto a purpose to have an army and the government to react...

this in NO WAY looks butchered!!!

[xwolverine2]

Um, I do. And I'm sure every other person who sees this movie will care a great deal about her performance.
INCLUDING ME!!!

[TheVileOne]

If Cyclops has a small role, and does die in the beginning of the movie...I would say...they butchered it.

This should be Cyclops time to take to the forefront. NOT Storm.

[Kira]

Um, I do. And I'm sure every other person who sees this movie will care a great deal about her performance.

Ditto. I care a lot.

But I do believe that this should have been Jean's & Scott's movie, but the movie is done so there's no point whining about what should have been. :O

[WorthyStevens]

If Cyclops has a small role, and does die in the beginning of the movie...I would say...they butchered it.

Agreed. But, we can't say that until the movie's out. Once again, he could die, but he just might live.

This should be Cyclops time to take to the forefront. NOT Storm.

Again, agreed. But, we have no real idea as to who will be the one to save Jean, or anything of that nature.

[xwolverine2]

If Cyclops has a small role, and does die in the beginning of the movie...I would say...they butchered it.

This should be Cyclops time to take to the forefront. NOT Storm.
who said storm will take the forefront???:confused:

they just said her role is bigger and meaningfull this time....

[DarknessOfDeath]

INCLUDING ME!!!

Me 3 :D

[vanillacyke]

I like cyclops

[Storm22]

I disagree, Storm deserved to come to the front more in this movie, as did Cyclops! I really think Wolverine should have been the one to die and Cyclops and Storm lead the X-Men! That's just me though, I'm really getting sick of Wolverine now!

[WorthyStevens]

I disagree, Storm deserved to come to the front more in this movie, as did Cyclops! I really think Wolverine should have been the one to die and Cyclops and Storm lead the X-Men! That's just me though, I'm really getting sick of Wolverine now!

Aren't we all. :o ;)

[TheVileOne]

Agreed. But, we can't say that until the movie's out. Once again, he could die, but he just might live.

Again, agreed. But, we have no real idea as to who will be the one to save Jean, or anything of that nature.

Its already confirmed his role is small, in a story where he should be one of the central characters. So, I'm not going to just accept it when we already know the truth.

[Storm22]

I'm not even bothered about his prequel tbh, I'm looking forward to the Magneto movie more!

[WorthyStevens]

Its already confirmed his role is small, in a story where he should be one of the central characters. So, I'm not going to just accept it when we already know the truth.

But the thing is, even the AICN draft review didn't read the 3rd act. So, anything goes.

[xwolverine2]

I like cyclops
movie comic or tv cartoon version?

i like the movieversion ......and the tv version(a little)

he came off as too depressing in the comics...i hated that

I'm really getting sick of Wolverine now!
im probably gonna get killed for saying this but....im not sick of him at all, and his absence would dumb down the series...

AND NO IM NOT..a wolverine fan...(my name is xwolverine2 because i quickly came up with it and it was the only name available) MAGNETO is my favorite character!

[TheVileOne]

I disagree, Storm deserved to come to the front more in this movie, as did Cyclops! I really think Wolverine should have been the one to die and Cyclops and Storm lead the X-Men! That's just me though, I'm really getting sick of Wolverine now!

No she really shouldn't. Cyclops has almost always been "the" leader of the X-men. And this movie, this story should've been the time to finally show that. Especially in light of the Xavier issue and his little scene with Cyclops in the first movie.

Storm NEVER had a scene like that with Xavier, and it just shows how the filmmakers could care less about the continuity and universe Singer built.

[xwolverine2]

[QUOTE=TheVileOne]
Storm NEVER had a scene like that with Xavier,[QUOTE]

she never had ANY scene whatsoever!!!...all her scenes in x1 could have been deleted scenes and no one would notice a difference.....in x2 all her scenes were meaningless.....ALL of her scenes inx2 could have been replaced by any other character in the blink of an eye

hence the larger role.......

[GothicPowerMix1]

they just said her role is bigger and meaningfull this time....

& that should have gone to Cyclops considering a big part of the Movie

[WorthyStevens]

& that should have gone to Cyclops considering a big part of the Movie

It should have.

But Storm should have also gotten a bigger part as well. Nowhere near as big as Cyclops should have gotten, but still, she should be improved.

[GothicPowerMix1]

I can accept Cyclops having a small role which is a given. But if all he does is die in this Movie then I will be pissed. I wonder why Singer even included Storm in his Movies ? Since it is well known that he does not like the Storm Character

[miketx]

cyclops had a pretty decent role in x1 compared to storm in x2 they were both put on the backburner to show more of the relationship with logan and jean

[Storm22]

It should have.

But Storm should have also gotten a bigger part.

Exactly, just because Storm got a bigger role, which she DID deserve, people blame her for Cyclop's small role?! Imo James Marsden probably has alot to do with Cyclop's small role in X3. He chose to go off and film Superman, knowing too well X3 would most likely happen! He also probably didn't fight half as much as Halle did for a more meaningful/developped role. Maybe he didn't care as much about his character as Halle did!

[vanillacyke]

movie comic or tv cartoon version?

Are you serious?!?!?! EVERY VERSION!!!! My life revolves around Cyclops. I kid you not.

[GothicPowerMix1]

Maybe he didn't care as much about his character as Halle did!

If he didn't care why come back at all ? James would have made like Singer & split

[WorthyStevens]

Are you serious?!?!?! EVERY VERSION!!!! My life revolves around Cyclops. I kid you not.

Really, vanillacyke? ;)


:p

[WorthyStevens]

Exactly, just because Storm got a bigger role, which she DID deserve, people blame her for Cyclop's small role?! Imo James Marsden probably has alot to do with Cyclop's small role in X3. He chose to go off and film Superman, knowing too well X3 would most likely happen! He also probably didn't fight half as much as Halle did for a more meaningful/developped role. Maybe he didn't care as much about his character as Halle did!

I wouldn't go that far. He did say he would do X3 for free. :)

[Storm22]

If he didn't care why come back at all ? James would have made like Singer & split

Well that's a point I keep making in support of his possible surprise role in X3, ie. he makes a heroic return for the final battle and even though his role is small it'll still be hugely important and memorable! I just hope he didn't come back just for the sake of it and was totally ok with him being killed off in the way it's rumoured! Surely there was an incentive for him to come back?!

[the_scream]

I disagree, Storm deserved to come to the front more in this movie, as did Cyclops! I really think Wolverine should have been the one to die and Cyclops and Storm lead the X-Men! That's just me though, I'm really getting sick of Wolverine now!

Amen to that. They've done him to death in these films. Wouldn't hurt to see more Storm, Cyclops, Iceman, Beast, Angel, Gambit. But we all know this is the Wolverine trilogy.

[The Batman]

Are you serious?!?!?! EVERY VERSION!!!! My life revolves around Cyclops. I kid you not.


Love the TAS version, Evolution was alright. The MU version was good at first, but like most x-characters in the comics today, he's been tainted. Ultimate Cyke is awesome, and they shouldve used that cyke for the movies.

[GothicPowerMix1]

& I still think the ONLY reason FOX did this Movie NOW & in a big rush is so it can face off against Singers Movie. This is FOXs way of saying

**** YOU Singer

[Storm22]

I wouldn't go that far. He did say he would do X3 for free. :)

I know Worthy, I'm just really sick of the abuse Halle/Storm's getting! She's a hugely important X-Men character too and she deserves her moment in the light, as does Cyclops!

[The Batman]

Exactly, just because Storm got a bigger role, which she DID deserve, people blame her for Cyclop's small role?! Imo James Marsden probably has alot to do with Cyclop's small role in X3. He chose to go off and film Superman, knowing too well X3 would most likely happen! He also probably didn't fight half as much as Halle did for a more meaningful/developped role. Maybe he didn't care as much about his character as Halle did!


I would blame marsden. If they wanted, he could have had a large role.

[TheVileOne]

Exactly, just because Storm got a bigger role, which she DID deserve, people blame her for Cyclop's small role?! Imo James Marsden probably has alot to do with Cyclop's small role in X3. He chose to go off and film Superman, knowing too well X3 would most likely happen! He also probably didn't fight half as much as Halle did for a more meaningful/developped role. Maybe he didn't care as much about his character as Halle did!

Its not his fault that Fox was sitting on the issue and didn't lock him up and tell him to clear his schedule. Its Fox, not Marsden.

Let's see, X-men 3, not going into production, way behind, Singer asks you to be in a huge big budget Superman Returns movie...what are you going to do?

Halle Berry doesn't care jack about Storm. You know why? She didn't even want to do this movie. She wanted to do CINO 2, not X-men 3. X-men 3 is just her salvation from CINO.

[TheVileOne]

she never had ANY scene whatsoever!!!...all her scenes in x1 could have been deleted scenes and no one would notice a difference.....in x2 all her scenes were meaningless.....ALL of her scenes inx2 could have been replaced by any other character in the blink of an eye

hence the larger role.......

Yeah, save the whole thing in X-men 2 with her SAVING THE ENTIRE FREAKING PLANET!

And her relationship with Nightcrawler. No one spoke as intimitely and closely with Nightcrawler in the movie as Storm did.

So there are at least two examples for you. Which you won't recognize because you are an IGNORANT mark.

[Storm22]

Halle Berry doesn't care jack about Storm. You know why? She didn't even want to do this movie. She wanted to do CINO 2, not X-men 3. X-men 3 is just her salvation from CINO.

I HIGHLY doubt that! Where did you hear that? Link? She may have had some resentment towards X-Men and some hesitancy to come bac after her treatment in the first 2 films but I think she's getting the role she deserves because she cares about and fought for her character!

Tbh I will be EQUALLY as annoyed at Marsden if what's rumoured to happen to Cyclops happens and that's all we see of Cyclops! He shouldn't have come back at all/should have fought for a bigger role if he knew he was gonna be subjected to the "fart in the wind" scenario!

[WorthyStevens]

Yeah, save the whole thing in X-men 2 with her SAVING THE ENTIRE FREAKING PLANET!

And her relationship with Nightcrawler. No one spoke as intimitely and closely with Nightcrawler in the movie as Storm did.

So there are at least two examples for you. Which you won't recognize because you are an IGNORANT mark.

That was uncalled for. xwolverine may have been wrong about Storm not having any meaningful scenes, but that's just crossing the line with that "ignorant" remark.

[miketx]

if she didnt want to do x3 then she wouldn't have done it

[The Batman]

The problem with storm isnt so much that she didnt havfe anything to do...its that her character had no substance. No definite personality. But you cant say her role was small in X2. It was just empty

[GothicPowerMix1]

if she didnt want to do x3 then she wouldn't have done it

I wonder how Halle would re act if they game James Character what they are giving Halle & Halle got what James got

[The Batman]

That was uncalled for. xwolverine may have been wrong about Storm not having any meaningful scenes, but that's just crossing the line with that "ignorant" remark.

i agree. that was unnecessary

[Storm22]

That was uncalled for. xwolverine may have been wrong about Storm not having any meaningful scenes, but that's just crossing the line with that "ignorant" remark.

Agreed!

[Storm22]

I wonder how Halle would re act if they game James Character what they are giving Halle & Halle got what James got

She probably wouldn't have returned and she'd be right!! Which, again, is why I think there must be more to Cyclop's role than has been rumoured for Marsden to come back!

[miketx]

I wonder how Halle would re act if they game James Character what they are giving Halle & Halle got what James got


i wonder how the fans would act

[The Batman]

anyone else notice that with the enlarged empire pic, you can see the dark blue piping on scotts outfit?

[The Batman]

i wonder how the fans would act

They'd be doing what we're doing now. which why i get pissed when some people like to call cyke fans immature or pathetic...

[Storm22]

anyone else notice that with the enlarged empire pic, you can see the dark blue piping on scotts outfit?

Yep! He looks great in uniform, we HAVE to see him in it in X3! If they decided he was gonna die at Alkali then imo he should have gone to Alkali in uniform and visor!

[WorthyStevens]

They'd be doing what we're doing now. which why i get pissed when some people like to call cyke fans immature or pathetic...

Not to lower Storm or her fans, but we have more of a right to get pissed. At least with this movie.

I mean God, it's the freakin' Phoenix saga, and to think there's even a RUMOR of him dying. I don't like that one bit. Even if the Phoenix saga being changed from the comics, Scott should have a large part in it.

[Storm22]

Not to lower Storm or her fans, but we have more of a right to get pissed. At least with this movie.

I mean God, it's the freakin' Phoenix saga, and to think there's even a RUMOR of him dying. I don't like that one bit. Even if the Phoenix saga being changed from the comics, Scott should have a large part in it.

That's true! Hey, I'm not even a big Cyclop's fan and I'm pissed!

[The Batman]

Not to lower Storm or her fans, but we have more of a right to get pissed. At least with this movie.

I mean God, it's the freakin' Phoenix saga, and to think there's even a RUMOR of him dying. I don't like that one bit. Even if the Phoenix saga being changed from the comics, Scott should have a large part in it.

Exactly. What if, for example, they kill off storm in a movie where she's supposed to fight calisto for control of the morlocks? That's one of storm's defining moments.

[miketx]

Not to lower Storm or her fans, but we have more of a right to get pissed. At least with this movie.

I mean God, it's the freakin' Phoenix saga, and to think there's even a RUMOR of him dying. I don't like that one bit. Even if the Phoenix saga being changed from the comics, Scott should have a large part in it.

i agree with that 100% but what i dont get is how some cyke fans wanna blame halle for james's small role

[The Batman]

i agree with that 100% but what i dont get is how some cyke fans wanna blame halle for james's small role

i dunno either. maybe they just want a scapegoat

[Iceman]

Not to lower Storm or her fans, but we have more of a right to get pissed. At least with this movie.

I mean God, it's the freakin' Phoenix saga, and to think there's even a RUMOR of him dying. I don't like that one bit. Even if the Phoenix saga being changed from the comics, Scott should have a large part in it.

It doesn't make sense to do the Phoenix saga at all if Marsden only has time for a bit part role. While it is one of the best X-Men stories, you can't cram it into a film just for the sake of including it without one of the main characters involved. It would be like filming the Fantastic Four with only 3 of the guys.

[Chris M]

I really, really like this cover:

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b378/ScottStevensDevils/xmen30.jpg

That is a very, very cool cover. :up: :up:

[kytrigger]

Alright, now I was talking to one of my old highschool friends about the Cyclops situation and he asked me a question that I wasn't too sure about. I figured I'd bring it here and you guys can either clarify, or argue against his reasoning (he doesn't like Cyclops).

I was talking to him about how for the Phoenix Saga that Cycke is a major character (as we all kow) but he told me htat technically, this movie wasn't the Phoenix Saga. He said that there were interviews a long time ago with Avi Arad where he stated that the Phoenix Saga would never be the main focus of a movie. He said that the Phoenix as a character could be used, but not the actual story. I tried looking it up, but I couldn't find the article (he says it was a really long time ago...before Ratner)

He then argued that if they aren't doing the Phoenix Saga, and are only doing the character Phoenix, that Scott's role doesn't need to be as huge as it was in the comics. He says that (he believes) the main conflict in this movie isn't about Phoenix, it's about the cure and the Magneto's Army. While Phoenix is a very important and one of the main characters, "she is there to help drive this storyline, this isn't really her story." (That wasn't verbatim, but it was something like that).


First off, does anyone know if this article with Avi is real, and do you have a link? I don't think my friend would lie to me, but he might have gotten some things mixed up and mistaken a quote or something.

And secondly, please debate this! In all honesty, I was kind of left speechless. I didn't know how/what to say. All I could think of was that we don't know the actual plot and won't until the movie comes out so we have no idea how much of the main focus is on Jean/Phoenix.

[xwolverine2]

& I still think the ONLY reason FOX did this Movie NOW & in a big rush is so it can face off against Singers Movie. This is FOXs way of saying

**** YOU Singer
Fox did it because then they would loose the rights.....

and why are we talking about halle?!?!?!

and to woever posted something about cyclops just being in the movie to die is talking crap!...it was said the cyclops role would be SIGNIFICANT AND IMPORTANT!...

why arent we complaining about how mystique doesnt have a bigger role...i mean shes practically just like cyke (leader wise)....

which reminds me.....when was it established that cyke is the leader? (in themovies)

[xwolverine2]

Alright, now I was talking to one of my old highschool friends about the Cyclops situation and he asked me a question that I wasn't too sure about. I figured I'd bring it here and you guys can either clarify, or argue against his reasoning (he doesn't like Cyclops).

I was talking to him about how for the Phoenix Saga that Cycke is a major character (as we all kow) but he told me htat technically, this movie wasn't the Phoenix Saga. He said that there were interviews a long time ago with Avi Arad where he stated that the Phoenix Saga would never be the main focus of a movie. He said that the Phoenix as a character could be used, but not the actual story. I tried looking it up, but I couldn't find the article (he says it was a really long time ago...before Ratner)

He then argued that if they aren't doing the Phoenix Saga, and are only doing the character Phoenix, that Scott's role doesn't need to be as huge as it was in the comics. He says that (he believes) the main conflict in this movie isn't about Phoenix, it's about the cure and the Magneto's Army. While Phoenix is a very important and one of the main characters, "she is there to help drive this storyline, this isn't really her story." (That wasn't verbatim, but it was something like that).


First off, does anyone know if this article with Avi is real, and do you have a link? I don't think my friend would lie to me, but he might have gotten some things mixed up and mistaken a quote or something.

And secondly, please debate this! In all honesty, I was kind of left speechless. I didn't know how/what to say. All I could think of was that we don't know the actual plot and won't until the movie comes out so we have no idea how much of the main focus is on Jean/Phoenix.
kiss this freind of yours for me will you?

he is wise in his words.....xwolverine2 agrees..LOL!

[SlimDayspring]

He then argued that if they aren't doing the Phoenix Saga, and are only doing the character Phoenix, that Scott's role doesn't need to be as huge as it was in the comics. He says that (he believes) the main conflict in this movie isn't about Phoenix, it's about the cure and the Magneto's Army. While Phoenix is a very important and one of the main characters, "she is there to help drive this storyline, this isn't really her story." (That wasn't verbatim, but it was something like that).
I'm not sure about the validity of the claims, but if the producers had any sense they would realise that any story involving the (Dark) Phoenix Saga, whether it is or isn't the dominant story of the film, should involve Cyclops. Even if the Jean/Phoenix story is just a subplot in the film, Scott should still be an important element of it.

[Chris M]

http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j165/cyke74/Cyke-XFactor.jpg

Cyke at his best!! If only we could see THIS in the film?!

[WorthyStevens]

http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j165/cyke74/Cyke-XFactor.jpg

Cyke at his best!! If only we could see THIS in the film?!


Now that's just pretty. :D

[kytrigger]

I'm not sure about the validity of the claims, but if the producers had any sense they would realise that any story involving the (Dark) Phoenix Saga, whether it is or isn't the dominant story of the film, should involve Cyclops. Even if the Jean/Phoenix story is just a subplot in the film, Scott should still be an important element of it.

Good point. Has there ever been any event (616 or another line) when Phoenix was around and Scott wasn't? I don't know that much about the comics, but every story I can think of had Scott involved in some way.

[WeaponXProject]

Cyclops... poor Cyclops. The poor man was wronged by Singer and will be righted in this film whether he dies or not.

[WorthyStevens]

Alright, now I was talking to one of my old highschool friends about the Cyclops situation and he asked me a question that I wasn't too sure about. I figured I'd bring it here and you guys can either clarify, or argue against his reasoning (he doesn't like Cyclops).

I was talking to him about how for the Phoenix Saga that Cycke is a major character (as we all kow) but he told me htat technically, this movie wasn't the Phoenix Saga. He said that there were interviews a long time ago with Avi Arad where he stated that the Phoenix Saga would never be the main focus of a movie. He said that the Phoenix as a character could be used, but not the actual story. I tried looking it up, but I couldn't find the article (he says it was a really long time ago...before Ratner)

He then argued that if they aren't doing the Phoenix Saga, and are only doing the character Phoenix, that Scott's role doesn't need to be as huge as it was in the comics. He says that (he believes) the main conflict in this movie isn't about Phoenix, it's about the cure and the Magneto's Army. While Phoenix is a very important and one of the main characters, "she is there to help drive this storyline, this isn't really her story." (That wasn't verbatim, but it was something like that).


First off, does anyone know if this article with Avi is real, and do you have a link? I don't think my friend would lie to me, but he might have gotten some things mixed up and mistaken a quote or something.

And secondly, please debate this! In all honesty, I was kind of left speechless. I didn't know how/what to say. All I could think of was that we don't know the actual plot and won't until the movie comes out so we have no idea how much of the main focus is on Jean/Phoenix.

Good analysis by your friend. :)

But they're using similar ploys from the saga, such as Phoenix's resurrection, and all that.

I'm thinking it's just a condensed version of the saga.

[Storm22]

I'm not sure about the validity of the claims, but if the producers had any sense they would realise that any story involving the (Dark) Phoenix Saga, whether it is or isn't the dominant story of the film, should involve Cyclops. Even if the Jean/Phoenix story is just a subplot in the film, Scott should still be an important element of it.

Exactly, even if they choose to ignore the Phoenix Saga backstory, the basic plot should still have Cyclops in an important role. He's distraught and an emotional wreck and then suddenly his dead lover returns. He's the first person she sees, the importance of their relationship should be portrayed in their emotional encounter at Alkali therefore even the casual viewer should realise(I'm hoping!) that Cyclops is the only one who can save her!

[SlimDayspring]

Good point. Has there ever been any event (616 or another line) when Phoenix was around and Scott wasn't? I don't know that much about the comics, but every story I can think of had Scott involved in some way.
I think that only happened when Cyclops was (presumed) dead/merged with Apocalypse. But then it wasn't really the Phoenix, it was Jean in her Phoenix outfit.

[N_z0]

First off, does anyone know if this article with Avi is real, and do you have a link? I don't think my friend would lie to me, but he might have gotten some things mixed up and mistaken a quote or something.

The most recent article i can remember where Avi says something like this is that ew article where he basically something to the effect of "To have Phoenix Saga be the main plot in this movie is just silly."

Arad should be given his own spokesperson. I know what he's trying to get at, but it's very disrespectful. This of course from the same man who called the fans idiots.

[kytrigger]

Good analysis by your friend. :)

But they're using similar ploys from the saga, such as Phoenix's resurrection, and all that.

I'm thinking it's just a condensed version of the saga.

Yeah, his points did make some sense to me, but I think you're right. Even if they aren't actually doing the Phoenix Saga, they are using some major parts of it. Like you said, the resurrection, being evil with the brotherhood could just be an adaptation of her with the Hellfire Club and so forth. I think that is the best argument to use against him.

[Storm22]

If you read any of Kinberg's answers in particular, you'll see they definitely tried to incorporate different elements from the Phoenix Saga, from different comics. At the end of the day we know the writers are huge X-Men comic book fans so I'd say there's a good, strong chance we'll see elements of the Phoenix Saga in X3! As said, I'd take what Arad says about X3 very lightly!

[miketx]

which reminds me.....when was it established that cyke is the leader? (in themovies)
in the first 1 he pretty much lead the team in ellis island but i dont think that it was as much as it was implied

[migs]

in the first 1 he pretty much lead the team in ellis island but i dont think that it was as much as it was implied

yeah. in the first one he had a better role than the second. He was clearly established as the team leader and all. He was the one making calls on liberty island and such. I really didn't think he got shortchanged too badly in that movie. he had a couple good moments...

[vanillacyke]

Also the insert inside the X-Men Collection box set says he is the "Field Leader"

[BMM]

edit . . .

[BMM]

and to woever posted something about cyclops just being in the movie to die is talking crap!...it was said the cyclops role would be SIGNIFICANT AND IMPORTANT!...

why arent we complaining about how mystique doesnt have a bigger role...i mean shes practically just like cyke (leader wise)....

which reminds me.....when was it established that cyke is the leader? (in themovies)

Well . . . Cyclops could die and his part would still be important and significant (if his supposed death were to push Jean over the edge and cause her to spiral out of control) . . . I think here it is just going to be a quality over quantity argument for some fans.

I don't think it was ever established that Cyclops was the leader in the movies in so far as him saying, "I'm Cyclops, and I am the leader." I think it was heavily implied throughout the first movie, especially during the Liberty Island incident, that Cyclops was the team's field leader. Actually, I'm glad you brought this up xwolverine2, because it leads into something that I've never understood.

I never understand what some fans are expecting Cyclops or Storm to do in order to illustrate that they are leaders . . .

For instance in X-Men:

- Cyclops is talking to the professor about how Wolverine may endanger missions

- He flies the X-Jet commanding Storm to produce "some cover please."

- He demands Wolverine to prove it is really him (instead of Mystique after battle)

- He orders Storm to fry Magneto when the X-Men are trapped in the Statue of Liberty

- He asks Storm if she can lift Wolverine up to Magneto's machine and once he finds a workable solution he orders, "Do it."

- He commands Jean to use her power to steady Wolverine


--I'm not going to list all of Storm's responsibilities in X2, as I'm sure there's a list already made in the Halle/Storm thread--


And for us fans who already have a working knowledge of the X-Universe, why is it even necessary that it be stated? We already know that Cylcops and Storm are the leaders. I think we can be given a little more credit than to have them state, "We are the leaders" . . . and the general audience isn't stupid either. They don't need it outright stated. Subtleties work better at times, especially in instances like this. It isn’t necessary for James Marsden or Halle Berry to say, “We are the leaders. We will be giving orders.”

[Kurosawa]

The Dark Phoenix saga gave us three inconic Cyclops covers in a row...

Uncanny X-Men 136
http://www.uncannyxmen.net/covers/uncanny/uncanny136.jpg

Uncanny X-Men 137
http://www.uncannyxmen.net/covers/uncanny/uncanny137.jpg

Uncanny X-Men 138
http://www.uncannyxmen.net/covers/uncanny/uncanny138.jpg

The three greatest X-Men issues ever, IMO.

[Kurosawa]

God forbid Cyclops gets an image like this grieving over the professor in the movie.

Instead Wolverine and Storm get it.

Yes, and damn them for that.

[xwolverine2]

Yes, and damn them for that.
:eek: GOD FORBID THEY WOULD SHED A TEAR FOR DEAR OLD CHARLES!!!!



lol:rolleyes: :D

[Lightning Strykez!]

So there are at least two examples for you. Which you won't recognize because you are an IGNORANT mark.

Since when does your opinion carry more water than anyone else's here? You're not in a position to call anyone else here ignorant just because they hold a different POV.

Settle down.

[xwolverine2]

Since when does your opinion carry more water than anyone else's here? You're not in a position to call anyone else here ignorant just because they hold a different POV.

Settle down.
i never even read that post ...lol

[TheVileOne]

That was uncalled for. xwolverine may have been wrong about Storm not having any meaningful scenes, but that's just crossing the line with that "ignorant" remark.

What's crossing the line is all the Halle marks who keep saying, STORM DIDN'T HAVE ANYTHING TO DO! SHE DIDN'T HAVE ANY SCENES! YOU COULD HAVE CUT HER OUT AND IT WOULDN'T HAVE MADE DIFFERENCE!

Save for the two specific examples I just mentioned.

[Lightning Strykez!]

What's crossing the line is all the Halle marks who keep saying, STORM DIDN'T HAVE ANYTHING TO DO! SHE DIDN'T HAVE ANY SCENES! YOU COULD HAVE CUT HER OUT AND IT WOULDN'T HAVE MADE DIFFERENCE!

Save for the two specific examples I just mentioned.


No.

The only person who crossed the line here is you by calling him ignorant. He's entitled to believe whatever he believes. You, however, are not entitled to question his intelligence by insulting him.

[xwolverine2]

I wonder how Halle would re act if they game James Character what they are giving Halle & Halle got what James got
woah i had to read that like ten times!...lol!!!

i bow to you LS!

[TheVileOne]

And yet Storm still had a closer relationship with the new character Nightcrawler than ANY OTHER CHARACTER in the movie.

She saves the entire human race in the big climax.

Someone please tell me how this is an insignificant character?

[WorthyStevens]

What's crossing the line is all the Halle marks who keep saying, STORM DIDN'T HAVE ANYTHING TO DO! SHE DIDN'T HAVE ANY SCENES! YOU COULD HAVE CUT HER OUT AND IT WOULDN'T HAVE MADE DIFFERENCE!

Save for the two specific examples I just mentioned.

You could've dealt with it in a less rash way. Calling him ignorant doesn't help your case.

[Lightning Strykez!]

You could've dealt with it in a less rash way. Calling him ignorant doesn't help your case.


Agreed.

It's fine to debate over passionate topics. But when people start to disrespect their peers with personalized attacks, the whole focus of the original topic is buried in pettiness. I've just got finished reading through several pages of spit and much of it had less to do with Cyclops and more to do with dissing other Hypsters with "put-downs" and "one-upping". :rolleyes:

My patience for the behavior in this thread is starting to wane. If it continues, I will lock this thread.

[The Original Bamfer]

It may be for the better - this thread is hardly enjoyable anymore.

[LEX]

^Yeah, I agree. This thread is hardly any fun. :o

[xwolverine2]

It may be for the better - this thread is hardly enjoyable anymore.
true:( ......:(

i always find myself screaming here...:confused:

[TheVileOne]

Well you know what? What they are doing to Cyclops in X-men 3 is NOT a fun and enjoyable issue. Its quite serious actually :) .

[martinbluther]

It's an emotional topic, and one that many of us are frustrated about anyway... tough to stay positive when many believe a character we love is being dissed and "vanished", but I agree with WorthyStevens.... ah, well... Still hope for an "out" for Cyclops' character, but if not, ah, well....

[WorthyStevens]

*tries to prevent thread from being locked*

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b378/ScottStevensDevils/XmenCyclops.jpghttp://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b378/ScottStevensDevils/astonishing_xmen_buste.jpg
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b378/ScottStevensDevils/cyclops02.jpg
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b378/ScottStevensDevils/43076938.jpg
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b378/ScottStevensDevils/cyclops5.jpg
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b378/ScottStevensDevils/f774da91.jpg


I REALLY, REALLY want to buy that bust.

[LEX]

^Love the bust. :up:

[xwolverine2]

i always liked to see scotts hair.....i always disliked the mask version....

very dildo--y

[vanillacyke]

I prefer Scott without the skull cap too. Then again I was introduced to Cyclops without the Skull cap so that might have something to do with it.

[LastSunrise1981]

Well you know what? What they are doing to Cyclops in X-men 3 is NOT a fun and enjoyable issue. Its quite serious actually :) .

http://www.psistar.co.uk/images/stopwhining.jpg

But seriously, not trying to step on any toes here. But wouldn't everyone say that Scott was portrayed pretty faithfully in X1? I mean he had quite a bit of screen time and they touched on his relationship with Jean, his rivalry/hatred of Wolverine at first, and of course him being the leader during the climax of the film.

So I wouldn't say he's been a total waste. Granted he wasn't used much in X2 and it was a shame, but he definitely was the Cyclops of the comics and the TAS in the first film.

[The Original Bamfer]

I've always been a fan of realism, an odd paradox to a comicbook fan, and therefor value the non-masked Scott... :up:

[vanillacyke]

I like though how when he has the skull cap but doe'snt have it cover his head y'know it's just a hood hanging off his costume. That looks pretty cool.

[WorthyStevens]

I've always been a fan of realism, an odd paradox to a comicbook fan, and therefor value the non-masked Scott... :up:

I do like the rest of the uniform in the bust, though. It fits well on Scott.

[LEX]

I love the mask, but I, too, am also a fan of realism. I don't think masks will work in an X-Men movie, really.

[vanillacyke]

I think Wolverine in a mask could work. I mean if Spider-Man and Batman (and bat's is the most realistic superhero of all) then I really think Wolverine could have a mask. I remeber way back when the first film came out Wizard had a special of Alex Ross designed X-Men, they all looked VERY realistic and Wolvie was wearing the most perfect mask that I've always felt could've been great for film. And his drawing of Scott had him in with the skull cap which also looked like it could've been translated to film well. And his Jean was perfect but no mask for her lol.

[JustABill]

I hate the condom suits with a passion! And no masks for anyone in these films, even in the restarts I doubt we will see the masks/condom suits.

[The Original Bamfer]

I think Wolverine in a mask could work. I mean if Spider-Man and Batman (and bat's is the most realistic superhero of all) then I really think Wolverine could have a mask. I remeber way back when the first film came out Wizard had a special of Alex Ross designed X-Men, they all looked VERY realistic and Wolvie was wearing the most perfect mask that I've always felt could've been great for film. And his drawing of Scott had him in with the skull cap which also looked like it could've been translated to film well. And his Jean was perfect but no mask for her lol.

Thank God! :p

You have this pic?

[LastSunrise1981]

I think Wolverine in a mask could work. I mean if Spider-Man and Batman (and bat's is the most realistic superhero of all) then I really think Wolverine could have a mask. I remeber way back when the first film came out Wizard had a special of Alex Ross designed X-Men, they all looked VERY realistic and Wolvie was wearing the most perfect mask that I've always felt could've been great for film. And his drawing of Scott had him in with the skull cap which also looked like it could've been translated to film well. And his Jean was perfect but no mask for her lol.

Didn't they try Wolverine in a mask though? I seem to remember seeing Hugh with the mask on in a picture or was it photoshopped?

[WorthyStevens]

Didn't they try Wolverine in a mask though? I seem to remember seeing Hugh with the mask on in a picture or was it photoshopped?

:eek:

I never saw that pic.

[vanillacyke]

Thank God! :p

You have this pic?

Here ya go it's the next page for logan's pic.

http://www.digital-burn.com/wallpaper.php?resultpage=5&catagory=Marvel

[Paste Pot Pete]

But Singer was right; Wolverine really doesn't have a reason to wear a mask. He's not out to protect his identity; he doesn't have an alter ego like Batman or Spider-Man. No one would point out Wolverine and go "Hey, that's mild-mannered reporter..Logan."

And he certainly wouldn't need it for protection.

[LastSunrise1981]

:eek:

I never saw that pic.

Someone posted it here one time and it didn't look good, which is why Bryan ditched the look and went with the unmasked version.

As I said I don't know if it was real or photoshopped.

[JustABill]

Those designs would be laughed off screen, love Alex Ross, but still.

[Kurosawa]

I prefer Scott without the skull cap too. Then again I was introduced to Cyclops without the Skull cap so that might have something to do with it.

Nah. I started reading X-Men in 1973 when it was a reprint book, but I think he looks a million times better without the skullcap. The Jim Lee costume will always be my favorite.

[vanillacyke]

But Singer was right; Wolverine really doesn't have a reason to wear a mask. He's not out to protect his identity; he doesn't have an alter ego like Batman or Spider-Man. No one would point out Wolverine and go "Hey, that's mild-mannered reporter..Logan."

And he certainly wouldn't need it for protection.

I never thought Wolvie wore a mask to protect his identity it was there to strike some fear in his enemies and when certain characters wear masks it's like they transcend humanity, Like what Bruce said in Batman begins it was something like He needs to be more than a man he needs something elemental or something like that.

[Paste Pot Pete]

That's a good point, but I still think it's different. I never thought of Wolverine as using his appearance as a weapon of fear, aside from his claws. Especially considering he's usually pitted against other superhuman beings who would probably not fear him (though they probably should), unlike the 'superstitious, cowardly lot' that Batman faces.

I think the mask, in the comics, is simply just part of an amazing character design. But it's there because of precedent, so a reason for it doesn't need to be contrived. I hate when he goes without it, though. The yellow and black w/ mask IS comic Wolverine. Love his current suit.

Anyways, back to Cyke..

[vanillacyke]

You make a good point yer self :)

[FRUITY]

Isn't it enough that Wolvie hogs the movie? Now he's taken over the Cyclops thread too, sheesh! Lol

[WorthyStevens]

Isn't it enough that Wolvie hogs the movie? Now he's taken over the Cyclops thread too, sheesh! Lol

Oh dear. Your right. :(



:p

[WorthyStevens]

Someone posted it here one time and it didn't look good, which is why Bryan ditched the look and went with the unmasked version.

As I said I don't know if it was real or photoshopped.

Ah. Well, that pic would have been interesting to see.

[vanillacyke]

Well you should see what justabill said in the Iceman will Iceup thread. He tried to edit it but you can see what he really said in reply to his post.

[JustABill]

I didn't edit my post in the Iceman icing up thread? -confused- -goes to that thread-

Huh?

[WorthyStevens]

Well you should see what justabill said in the Iceman will Iceup thread. He tried to edit it but you can see what he really said in reply to his post.

:eek:

I just saw that.


Hee. :p

[vanillacyke]

I didn't edit my post in the Iceman icing up thread? -confused- -goes to that thread-

Huh?

LMAO!!!! OH I can't quit laughin!!!!

[Supreme Power]

*tries to prevent thread from being locked*

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b378/ScottStevensDevils/XmenCyclops.jpg


I REALLY, REALLY want to buy that bust.

I have this very same card. :) Also, the one I believe that the poster Cyclops uses in his avatar.

[The Guard]

Well, for one thing, back when he was on the team, he was at the front and center, but not at the expense of other characters.
Oh? I can think of MANY Wolverine stories that become just that, Wolverine stories. And acting like Wolverine takes all the importance of other characters away is just absurd. Xavier, Magneto, Jean Grey, Storm, Rogue, Iceman, Nightcrawler, and yes, even Cyclops have had big/important moments in these films.
He was a main character, but everyone got equal time.
That's not remotely accurate. Everyone did not get equal time at any point, and everyone still doesn't. "Storytime" in the older X-Men comics was always weighted toward Xavier, Cyclops, Wolverine and Storm, even at the expense of Jean Grey much of the time (except for the Phoenix saga), with Beast, Angel, Iceman, Colossus and Kitty Pryde and Jubilee rounding out the stories in smaller, backup style roles. Everyone did not get equal time, nor did everyone get equal devleopment. What everyone did get was "moments", which the X-films have delivered on so far in fine fashion. Stop chanting this nonsense like it's a mantra.
[quopte]This is of course before the x universe became a franchise instead of good stories.[/quote]
What the hell...are you talking about? And what comic book mythos have you followed? The X-Men comics have often been just a series of superpowered battles. Don't act like everything that happens has some amazing story point behind it. It's often convoluted and bordering on absurdity.

Well lets see...movie Iceman is a stand up guy who dosent break to rules to much, and is sometimes at odds with a badboy. sounds like cyclops to me.
Well by that logic, then Xavier would be just like Cyclops, too. So would I, come to think of it. So would half the people in the world. And when you distill people to that basic an element, of course they sound similar. But tell me, does Cyclops produce ice? Does he show affection for Rogue, and frustration at not being able to touch her? Does he have any arcs where he spars with someone like Pyro? Do we see anything about his parents rejecting him? Iceman has a very different characterization than Cyclops in this franchise.
not to mention james marsden stated in the X2 souvinier magazine that Cyclops sees him as....a young cyclops.
That's James Marsden's opinion and he's entitled to it, but that doesn't mean that Iceman is just like Cyclops. In this franchise, Bobby Drake does not remotely resemble the character Marsden has been playing. He's far more open, and even a bit more charming.
Alright, now I was talking to one of my old highschool friends about the Cyclops situation and he asked me a question that I wasn't too sure about. I figured I'd bring it here and you guys can either clarify, or argue against his reasoning (he doesn't like Cyclops).

I was talking to him about how for the Phoenix Saga that Cycke is a major character (as we all kow) but he told me htat technically, this movie wasn't the Phoenix Saga. He said that there were interviews a long time ago with Avi Arad where he stated that the Phoenix Saga would never be the main focus of a movie. He said that the Phoenix as a character could be used, but not the actual story. I tried looking it up, but I couldn't find the article (he says it was a really long time ago...before Ratner)

He then argued that if they aren't doing the Phoenix Saga, and are only doing the character Phoenix, that Scott's role doesn't need to be as huge as it was in the comics. He says that (he believes) the main conflict in this movie isn't about Phoenix, it's about the cure and the Magneto's Army. While Phoenix is a very important and one of the main characters, "she is there to help drive this storyline, this isn't really her story." (That wasn't verbatim, but it was something like that).
Very well said. And this is why I continue to say "this isn't the comics". Because it isn't.

First off, does anyone know if this article with Avi is real, and do you have a link? I don't think my friend would lie to me, but he might have gotten some things mixed up and mistaken a quote or something.

And secondly, please debate this! In all honesty, I was kind of left speechless. I didn't know how/what to say. All I could think of was that we don't know the actual plot and won't until the movie comes out so we have no idea how much of the main focus is on Jean/Phoenix.
Exactly, even if they choose to ignore the Phoenix Saga backstory, the basic plot should still have Cyclops in an important role. He's distraught and an emotional wreck and then suddenly his dead lover returns. He's the first person she sees, the importance of their relationship should be portrayed in their emotional encounter at Alkali therefore even the casual viewer should realise(I'm hoping!) that Cyclops is the only one who can save her!
And that may well happen.
Yeah, his points did make some sense to me, but I think you're right. Even if they aren't actually doing the Phoenix Saga, they are using some major parts of it.
Such as? Her becoming Phoenix first? The Shi'arr? The crystal? Cosmic destruction? Seems to me they are just using the idea that Jean is reborn as Dark Phoenix, a conflicted entity with grea tpower, which is less "the Dark Phoenix saga" and more a classic element of Jean's characterization.
Like you said, the resurrection, being evil with the brotherhood could just be an adaptation of her with the Hellfire Club and so forth. I think that is the best argument to use against him.
Look at how much they AREN'T using, though. The crystal, The Shi-arr, half of what she does as Phoenix, and the Hellfire Club. Magneto may fill a similar role, but the Brotherhood is not the Hellfire Club.
Well . . . Cyclops could die and his part would still be important and significant (if his supposed death were to push Jean over the edge and cause her to spiral out of control) . . . I think here it is just going to be a quality over quantity argument for some fans.
Always has been. Some people can't even see the quality because they're so immersed in this mindset.

I don't think it was ever established that Cyclops was the leader in the movies in so far as him saying, "I'm Cyclops, and I am the leader." I think it was heavily implied throughout the first movie, especially during the Liberty Island incident, that Cyclops was the team's field leader. Actually, I'm glad you brought this up xwolverine2, because it leads into something that I've never understood.

I never understand what some fans are expecting Cyclops or Storm to do in order to illustrate that they are leaders . . .

For instance in X-Men:

- Cyclops is talking to the professor about how Wolverine may endanger missions

- He flies the X-Jet commanding Storm to produce "some cover please."

- He demands Wolverine to prove it is really him (instead of Mystique after battle)

- He orders Storm to fry Magneto when the X-Men are trapped in the Statue of Liberty

- He asks Storm if she can lift Wolverine up to Magneto's machine and once he finds a workable solution he orders, "Do it."

- He commands Jean to use her power to steady Wolverine

--I'm not going to list all of Storm's responsibilities in X2, as I'm sure there's a list already made in the Halle/Storm thread--

And for us fans who already have a working knowledge of the X-Universe, why is it even necessary that it be stated? We already know that Cylcops and Storm are the leaders. I think we can be given a little more credit than to have them state, "We are the leaders" . . . and the general audience isn't stupid either. They don't need it outright stated. Subtleties work better at times, especially in instances like this. It isn’t necessary for James Marsden or Halle Berry to say, “We are the leaders. We will be giving orders.”
There's even more to what Cyclops and Storm did as leaders in X-MEN and X2. But people don't see it, because some people need to be hit over the head with things or they can't see it's presence. And then they get upset that they didn't see it and act like it's the filmmakers fault, and that it wasn't made clear, yadda yadda yadda. It's a defense mechanism, I think.
The only person who crossed the line here is you by calling him ignorant. He's entitled to believe whatever he believes. You, however, are not entitled to question his intelligence by insulting him.
I'm all for being polite, but what do you call it when someone can't see the forest for the trees, even when quite a bit of evidence has been provided? Willing lack of admittance

Yup...there goes that condescending attitude...back to rear its ugly head.
Pardon me for thinking it's hilarious that you missing out on one of the two biggest movies in years will affect anything.
And you guys wonder why people havent come around to your view yet?
Oh, I don't wonder. I know. Basic stubborness and an inability to admit when your point of view is absurd. Defense mechanisms, I think.
I'm not like kuro or larry, hoping the movie would bomb. i never said Fox wouldnt survive. All i said is that i wont see it.
First, I don't think Larry wants the movie to bomb, he just seems to think it will. And yes, that's all you've said, but it's the way you say you won't see it (which I don't think anyone here believes, it's pretty much become fanboy cliche) that I find hilarious. Bringing money into it.

My point is that they're saying the same thing every actor, writer, etc is saying..."Oh, we're big fans of the comics! Our movies will be faithful!" Dosent make it true.
Here's the thing. Many people who say that mean it, they just can't execute artistically. Simon and Zak, though, they've pretty much backed up their statements to this effect by talking intelligently and at length with fans and interviewers about various comic book arcs, characterizations, and putting many treats into X3 that only fans could give a damn about or even recognize.

[Supreme Power]

Oh? I can think of MANY Wolverine stories that become just that, Wolverine stories. And acting like Wolverine takes all the importance of other characters away is just absurd. Xavier, Magneto, Jean Grey, Storm, Rogue, Iceman, Nightcrawler, and yes, even Cyclops have had big/important moments in these films.

That's not remotely accurate. Everyone did not get equal time at any point, and everyone still doesn't. "Storytime" in the older X-Men comics was always weighted toward Xavier, Cyclops, Wolverine and Storm, even at the expense of Jean Grey much of the time (except for the Phoenix saga), with Beast, Angel, Iceman, Colossus and Kitty Pryde and Jubilee rounding out the stories in smaller, backup style roles. Everyone did not get equal time, nor did everyone get equal devleopment. What everyone did get was "moments", which the X-films have delivered on so far in fine fashion. Stop chanting this nonsense like it's a mantra.
[quopte]This is of course before the x universe became a franchise instead of good stories.
What the hell...are you talking about? And what comic book mythos have you followed? The X-Men comics have often been just a series of superpowered battles. Don't act like everything that happens has some amazing story point behind it. It's often convoluted and bordering on absurdity.


Well by that logic, then Xavier would be just like Cyclops, too. So would I, come to think of it. So would half the people in the world. And when you distill people to that basic an element, of course they sound similar. But tell me, does Cyclops produce ice? Does he show affection for Rogue, and frustration at not being able to touch her? Does he have any arcs where he spars with someone like Pyro? Do we see anything about his parents rejecting him? Iceman has a very different characterization than Cyclops in this franchise.

That's James Marsden's opinion and he's entitled to it, but that doesn't mean that Iceman is just like Cyclops. In this franchise, Bobby Drake does not remotely resemble the character Marsden has been playing. He's far more open, and even a bit more charming.

Very well said. And this is why I continue to say "this isn't the comics". Because it isn't.

First off, does anyone know if this article with Avi is real, and do you have a link? I don't think my friend would lie to me, but he might have gotten some things mixed up and mistaken a quote or something.

And secondly, please debate this! In all honesty, I was kind of left speechless. I didn't know how/what to say. All I could think of was that we don't know the actual plot and won't until the movie comes out so we have no idea how much of the main focus is on Jean/Phoenix.

And that may well happen.

Such as? Her becoming Phoenix first? The Shi'arr? The crystal? Cosmic destruction? Seems to me they are just using the idea that Jean is reborn as Dark Phoenix, a conflicted entity with grea tpower, which is less "the Dark Phoenix saga" and more a classic element of Jean's characterization.

Look at how much they AREN'T using, though. The crystal, The Shi-arr, half of what she does as Phoenix, and the Hellfire Club. Magneto may fill a similar role, but the Brotherhood is not the Hellfire Club.

Always has been. Some people can't even see the quality because they're so immersed in this mindset.

I don't think it was ever established that Cyclops was the leader in the movies in so far as him saying, "I'm Cyclops, and I am the leader." I think it was heavily implied throughout the first movie, especially during the Liberty Island incident, that Cyclops was the team's field leader. Actually, I'm glad you brought this up xwolverine2, because it leads into something that I've never understood.


There's even more to what Cyclops and Storm did as leaders in X-MEN and X2. But people don't see it, because some people need to be hit over the head with things or they can't see it's presence. And then they get upset that they didn't see it and act like it's the filmmakers fault, and that it wasn't made clear, yadda yadda yadda. It's a defense mechanism, I think.

I'm all for being polite, but what do you call it when someone can't see the forest for the trees, even when quite a bit of evidence has been provided? Willing lack of admittance


Pardon me for thinking it's hilarious that you missing out on one of the two biggest movies in years will affect anything.

Oh, I don't wonder. I know. Basic stubborness and an inability to admit when your point of view is absurd. Defense mechanisms, I think.

First, I don't think Larry wants the movie to bomb, he just seems to think it will. And yes, that's all you've said, but it's the way you say you won't see it (which I don't think anyone here believes, it's pretty much become fanboy cliche) that I find hilarious. Bringing money into it.


Here's the thing. Many people who say that mean it, they just can't execute artistically. Simon and Zak, though, they've pretty much backed up their statements to this effect by talking intelligently and at length with fans and interviewers about various comic book arcs, characterizations, and putting many treats into X3 that only fans could give a damn about or even recognize.[/quote]

[The Guard]

Oh yes, I'm a fool because i'm gonna pass up logan getting the most screentime, again, a Dark Phoenix Saga where the guy who's supposed to bring jean back from the brink will be missing or dead, a bunch of second rate characters i could care less for, a Danger Room scene that probably wont last more than 5 minutes, and a plot that seems to ripoff the past two movies.

Hey, you said it that time, not me. And I've gotta say, some of that was just ridiculous.

If you were listening to Simon Kinberg, btw, you would have seen him say something along the lines of "Phoenix has the most screentime, I believe". No, I think you're a fool for choosing to miss some of what may well end up being a great film and some of the best performances of Patrick Stewart, Ian McKellan, Famke Janssen, Kelsey Grammar and Ben Foster's movie careers, as well as some kickass special effects, and what is sure to be a movie full of amazingly cool "moments", just because Cyclops won't have a large role, or the role he played in the comics in the film.

The second rate characters you claim to care less for are beloved my many X-fans, and played by talented actors. Way to be hypocritical.

A five minute long Danger Room would be kickass. That's a pretty long scene, considering.

And how the hell does the plot of X3 even resemble the past two movies?

You sound so bitter and just out there in your thinking that it's not funny. You are completely reaching for reasons not to like this film, and I find it pathetic.

An X-Men movie that gets its freaking characters right. A movie that dosent push two of its main characters into the backround.
X-MEN and X2 got a lot right about it's characters. More than most, if not all, comic book films have. And if Cyclops is in the background, he's not a main character now, is he? Therefore, he can't be a main character that's put into the background.

no, whats real pathetic is you people finding the need to judge cyclops fans. Get over it? This is the Dark Phoenix Saga, and it seems like all Scott will do is go to alkali lake and get blasted to bits.
I'm not judging you. I'm judging your ridiculous and unrealistic attitude/victim complex. No, this isn't the Dark Phoenix saga. This is X3: THE LAST STAND, a major motion picture adaption that is based on the X-Men comics, that used elements of The Dark Phoenix saga, The Cure, and numerous other stories, and has not followed the comic book mythos to the letter to begin with. And I don't particularly care how it "seems". You don't know what happens to Scott in X3. None of us do.

And you(And some other), cant seem to wrap your heads around the fact that cyclops fans arent freaking asking for much.
Yes you are. You're asking for quite a bit. You seem to clearly want Cyclops to be the main character in a world where that was NEVER going to happen. And to see Wolverine, who has been the main character in two films and been portrayed wonderfully by a talented actor, suddenly take a backseat to him. Or you want something that wasn't possible because James Marsden chose to do SUPERMAN RETURNS. At some point you are going to have to get over it, or you're going to be miserable for no good reason.
Well, when cyke question their maturity, common sense, call them whiners and complainers, Call them fools, Speak to them in a sarcastic manner, and ask them if they live on planet stupid, then maybe you can say that. Calling them "Apologists" is quite tame.

Hey, guilty as charged. Maybe if some of you were more mature, utlized common sense, didn't whine and complain about things you have no control over, and didn't say outrightly idiotic things, we wouldn't be treating some of you this way.
And I, at least, have not been condescending about what you all would like, in the perfect world, to see form Cyclops's character and his part in this franchise. He is my favorite X-Men, and I would also like to see that. What I have been condescending about this lame-ass "I won't see X3" stance, which will naturally dissolve when it turns out to be a fantastic film regardless of what happens to Cyclops.
I dont call everyone apologists. I'm referring to those guys who say "This isnt the comics" everytime a cyke fans says cyke is supposed to have an important role in the story. Worthy's just real optimistic...
That is not why I and others say "this isn't the comics". We are speaking of the medium itself, of film, and it's limitations. And for all we know, Cyclops may well have an important role in the story this time. He may kick things off in a big way.
There is nothing-NOTHING that they could possibly do to be MORE of a slap in the face to fans of Cyclops-who in the first two films have so far got NOTHING-then to have his place in the Dark Phoenix Saga taken by Wolverine.
What about if the producers came to your house and literally slapped you in the face? Wouldn't that be a bigger slap in the face, as you discovered they were personally trying to offend you all along?[/quote]
That's a bigger abomination than Bat-nipples ever could have been. Changing the end of the Dark Phoenix Saga is like changing Romeo and Juliet and putting Paris in Romeo's place at the end after killing Romeo in Act I. It's just disgusting.
This isn't the Dark Phoenix saga. It's X3: THE LAST STAND. And quite honestly, if Romeo were replaced with Paris, and it worked really well, would it still be disgusting? I think you mean "disappointing". Child abuse is disgusting. So are dead birds.
That right there is how he should've been portrayed in the movie. Wolverine doesn't always go along with him, but he respects him due to the power he knows he has.
I wanted to bring that back up. Notice the plural... scenes. Not scene.
I also noticed that. Could be a typo. Could be something more...
HANNIBAL LECTER was in slience of the lambs for 15min!....

......he is the most iconic villain in film history.
Exactly. And Scott was only in X2 for about ten minutes, and had some fantastic scenes. But that's not enough...we have to see him screaming and pushing Wolverine aside as he blasts a Sentinel's head off.
God forbid Cyclops gets an image like this grieving over the professor in the movie.

Instead Wolverine and Storm get it.
We have seen a Cyclops/Xavier "grieving" scene. It was in X-MEN. It kicked ass.
Couldn't have put it better myself. I can't believe fans are willing to sell out and accept a butchered version of the Phoenix saga simply because it is the only thing on offer.
I'm sorry..."sell out"? "Butchered"? Sounds like someone doesn't understand the nature of an adaption. What should we do? Hate X3 on principle because it's not a perfect adaption of one particular storyline? Sorry, I couldn't hate the portrayal of Ra's Al Ghul when he didn't rise from the dead, had no Talia, no Ubu, pretended to be Ducard, and didn't call Batman "Detective" in BATMAN BEGINS, and I won't hate X3 just because they didn't adapt The Dark Phoenix saga perfectly and Cyclops doesn't get to exactly what he did in the comic version.

Sure, seeing Beast and Angel is cool. Seeing the Danger room is fun. But, you know what? It was cool to see the batmobile, Joker, Batman, batwing, Penguin, Catwoman, Robin and Batgirl in a big feature film. Still didn't make the films decent or the characters accurate.
Are we now saying that BATMAN and BATMAN RETURNS weren't decent? Sounds like someone's losing credibility. And I'm pretty sure Beast and Angel will be pretty decent with Kelsey Grammar and Ben Foster and the character arcs they've been given.

The way I see it, the only things that have gone completely right with these X-Men films are:

Patrick Stewart as Xavier
Hugh Jackman as Wolverine
Alan Cummings as Nightcrawler
Ian McKellen as Magneto
Kelsey Grammer as Beast
Vinnie Jones as Juggernaught
Yeah...bad news. They haven't gotten those things completely right. You see, Xavier has much larger eyebrows than Patrick Stewart has, Wolverine is generally not handsome and six feet tall, and did not ever, I believe, come into contact with Stryker during his Weapon X days, Nightcrawler does not have tattoos, Magneto is not the emaciated, elderly man Ian McKellan appears to be, nor does he wear the costume he's worn, or speak as simply as McKellan's Magneto does. He tends to use much larger words. Beast, as far as I know, was not a government liason, and Juggernaut is much larger than h eis in the movie, and .Professor X's brother, which apparently in X3, is not mentioned. Also, there's no gem of Cytorrak involved here.

Some good casting IMHO and some nice scenes here and there. But, on the whole, they are not true to the X-Men comics.
Shall we list some ways that they are?
The Phoenix saga minus Cyclops is BUTCHERED. Who gives a **** whether Famke is great? The storyline is still torn to shreds. A good performance can't save it.
First, it's not the Phoenix Saga. It's a combination of The Phoenix Saga, The Cure, and god knows what other storylines. And a series of good performances damn well will save it, as if it needed to be saved in the first place just because it's not a perfect adaption.
Its already confirmed his role is small, in a story where he should be one of the central characters. So, I'm not going to just accept it when we already know the truth.
So essentially, you're not going to accept it, period, because his role is small.
I can accept Cyclops having a small role which is a given. But if all he does is die in this Movie then I will be pissed. I wonder why Singer even included Storm in his Movies ? Since it is well known that he does not like the Storm Character
Well known, is it? Find me a quote.
And yet Storm still had a closer relationship with the new character Nightcrawler than ANY OTHER CHARACTER in the movie.

She saves the entire human race in the big climax.

Someone please tell me how this is an insignificant character?
Agreed. Storm has not had a ton of character development, and has not been accurately portrayed in some ways, but has definitely been a significant part of this franchise.
But seriously, not trying to step on any toes here. But wouldn't everyone say that Scott was portrayed pretty faithfully in X1? I mean he had quite a bit of screen time and they touched on his relationship with Jean, his rivalry/hatred of Wolverine at first, and of course him being the leader during the climax of the film.

So I wouldn't say he's been a total waste. Granted he wasn't used much in X2 and it was a shame, but he definitely was the Cyclops of the comics and the TAS in the first film.
Agreed, and well said.

[Supreme Power]

What the... :confused: I didn't make that last post. :confused:
I was trying to edit mine. Excellent post above Guard by the way. :cool: :up:

[Slim_X]

This is a pic of me as Cyke :o
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b397/ed_8804/stormcyclops.jpg

[Supreme Power]

This is a pic of me as Cyke :o
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b397/ed_8804/stormcyclops.jpg

Seriously. :eek: So how many times did you fall? :confused:

[Slim_X]

Seriously. :eek: So how many times did you fall? :confused:
I--don't get it :confused:

[Supreme Power]

I--don't get it :confused:

Could you see with those?

[Slim_X]

Could you see with those?
Oh, lol. Nah, I just had them on for pictures :p.

[Supreme Power]

Oh, lol. Nah, I just had them on for pictures :p.

I thought it was halloween.:p

[JustABill]

LOL. Slim I thought he/she was using a lame pick up line like ''So how many times did you fall?" ''What?" ''From Heaven, y ou angel."

[FRUITY]

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f351/fruityemen/Gif/sign_funnypost_by_fruity.gif

[Slim_X]

LOL. Slim I thought he/she was using a lame pick up line like ''So how many times did you fall?" ''What?" ''From Heaven, y ou angel."
I thought it was something like 'So how many times did you fall?" ''Why" "Because you're face is just ****ed up"

[FRUITY]

I thought it was something like 'So how many times did you fall?" ''Why" "Because you're face is just ****ed up"

Please don't tell me that's your pick up line.

[Supreme Power]

LOL. Slim I thought he/she was using a lame pick up line like ''So how many times did you fall?" ''What?" ''From Heaven, y ou angel."

I'm not a she. :mad:
:O

[FieryBalrog]

LOL. Slim I thought he/she was using a lame pick up line like ''So how many times did you fall?" ''What?" ''From Heaven, y ou angel."
o
m
g
:ghost:

[Supreme Power]

I thought it was something like 'So how many times did you fall?" ''Why" "Because you're face is just ****ed up"

LOL I wasn't thinking of that one. :)

[Slim_X]

Please don't tell me that's your pick up line.
You see, fruity, that's how I got my girlfriend :) .


j/k

[Supreme Power]

LOL. Slim I thought he/she was using a lame pick up line like ''So how many times did you fall?" ''What?" ''From Heaven, y ou angel."
I hope nobody still uses that. :confused: