2005-2006 NBA thread

[Equint77]

I figured it's about time we got a new NBA thread for all NBA news and discussions for the upcoming year.

Training camp officially opened up today with most teams getting ready for the upcoming season.

And of course the big news today is the Knicks getting Eddy Curry/Antonio Davis for Mike Sweetney/Tim Thomas/Jermaine Jackson and some picks.

So basically the Knicks got Curry for Sweetney. Which I can deal with... the draft picks were a bit of a stretch but this upcoming draft doesn't seem deep so it's not much of a risk. Also losing Sweetney wasn't a huge loss... sure he was maybe gonna be the starting PF but he wasn't gonna make or break NY. Getting Curry, with his heart condition was a risk but he's been cleared by every doctor..except one, who felt a DNA test was due. The NY doctors are gonna do everything they can to make sure he's not gonna drop dead. I have a feeling Curry used the DNA thing as leverage for a trade..which is why Paxton was so irritated today in his PC.

So the Knicks have now improved their backcourt, frontcourt while maintaining their core young players.... Lee, Frye, Nate, JC, QR, Ariza... and now add Curry.

I'm happy with the direction.

[Ultimate_Superman]

I want to put everybody on notice and warn you to beware of the WIZARDS this year we are taking it all.

[Doomed_hero]

I am holding out a silm hope that my Lakers will be good this year. But it will most likely come down to Spurs and Heat imo.

[Ultimate_Superman]

Forget the Lakers till the make an statement telling Shaq how wrong they were for pretty much f***ing him in the ass and picking Kobe over him I will never support them again.

[Doomed_hero]

shaq was eqaul in all that to. It is not like he was the blamless victim. But I am over that and ready to see the team move on.

[MakeMineMarvel]

Kind of ticked off that my Bulls got rid of a guy who's scoring average has only gone up every year. A guy who is one of maybe 6 or 7 true "5's" in the league. Sweetney better go to the stinkin' glass with TC, or else they will get rocked when it comes to rebounding. Our roster is now full of ones and threes, with a couple of fours mixed in.

[Equinox]

The Bulls are going to the playoffs this year :up:

[Equint77]

Kind of ticked off that my Bulls got rid of a guy who's scoring average has only gone up every year. A guy who is one of maybe 6 or 7 true "5's" in the league. Sweetney better go to the stinkin' glass with TC, or else they will get rocked when it comes to rebounding. Our roster is now full of ones and threes, with a couple of fours mixed in.

I like Mike and didn't want to see him since he was part of our core of young guys... he's a georgetown guy and proved it by his willingness to keep improving.

Unfortunately he never got a chance to show his true skills in NY.. I wish him the best of luck and wouldn't be surprised to see him flourish in Chicago. Undersized or not he's got skill around the basket.

[Equint77]

Forget the Lakers till the make an statement telling Shaq how wrong they were for pretty much f***ing him in the ass and picking Kobe over him I will never support them again.

The Lakers are interesting cause I'm not sure what Phil is gonna do this season. You know he'll never fully respect Kobe.. and vice versa and they're a losing streak away from going at each other.

I still go back to what I thought originally when Phil went back to LA.. he's gonna wait out his 3 years... marry Jeanie Buss and become either GM or Lakers President and ship Kobe as far away from LA as humanly possible.

Either way.. Phil will outlast Kobe in LA IMO. And I really thought LA had a shot at Amare till yesterday.

[Equint77]

Rafer Alston just got traded to Houston for Mike James...

what the hell is Toronto thinking... and this puts Houston to top level WC team.

Amazing what the Raptors Gm is thinking.

[unknownuser]

Rafer Alston just got traded to Houston for Mike James...

what the hell is Toronto thinking... and this puts Houston to top level WC team.

Amazing what the Raptors Gm is thinking.
babcock is an idiot :mad: :down
i think alston got traded because he didn't get along with the coach

(i dont really follow basketball that much so pardon me if im mistaken :()

[Equint77]

babcock is an idiot :mad: :down
i think alston got traded because he didn't get along with the coach

(i dont really follow basketball that much so pardon me if im mistaken :()

you're totally right Unknown.. he didn't get along with Sam Mitchell but that goes for about 70% of NBA players.. they hardly get along with their coaches but that doesn't mean you take an already flawed roster and make them even weaker.

I would understand draft picks for the future but the Raptors got nothing except a back up (at best).. while Houston got what they needed to become an even stronger team in the west.. a starting PG to feed both Yao and Tmac.

This was absolute rape on the part of the Houston GM....

[Ultimate_Superman]

The Lakers are interesting cause I'm not sure what Phil is gonna do this season. You know he'll never fully respect Kobe.. and vice versa and they're a losing streak away from going at each other.

I still go back to what I thought originally when Phil went back to LA.. he's gonna wait out his 3 years... marry Jeanie Buss and become either GM or Lakers President and ship Kobe as far away from LA as humanly possible.

Either way.. Phil will outlast Kobe in LA IMO. And I really thought LA had a shot at Amare till yesterday.Well you got a point there. I still would like to see Phil mess Kobe over like how he did Shaq :mad:

[Kipobe]

Losssssss Angeeeeelllllllllllleeeeeesssssssssssssssss baybee! :cool:

[Immortalfire]

My Hawks got Marvin Williams, hope he's as good pro as he was for N.C.

[MakeMineMarvel]

I like Mike and didn't want to see him since he was part of our core of young guys... he's a georgetown guy and proved it by his willingness to keep improving.

Unfortunately he never got a chance to show his true skills in NY.. I wish him the best of luck and wouldn't be surprised to see him flourish in Chicago. Undersized or not he's got skill around the basket.
Only thing is that now we have a bunch of guys (Othella Harrington included) that played for a team that didn't make the playoffs last year. Oh well, I'll pray that Deng, Gordon, Nocioni, Heinrich, Duhon, and Chandler keep it alive.

[GammaMike]

My Hawks got Marvin Williams, hope he's as good pro as he was for N.C.

He wasn't much for UNC........I'd be more interested in Josh Smith's development......he could be good.

[GammaMike]

Only thing is that now we have a bunch of guys (Othella Harrington included) that played for a team that didn't make the playoffs last year. Oh well, I'll pray that Deng, Gordon, Nocioni, Heinrich, Duhon, and Chandler keep it alive.

Our teams keep swapping guys that weren't able to get us over the top......

[Whack Arnolds]

NY is going to be damn fun to watch...
Nate the Great... dude is 5'9 and can throw down like VC!!!
JC, one of the sickest handles in the league...
Starbury, always one of the premier pg's in the league..
Q-Rich, hittin all them 3's. They are going to be a damn fun team to watch. I still want to see my Heat take it home w/ my guy D Wade and the new addittion of White Chocolate. Hopefully Antoine won't be a cancer like he is EVERYWHERE else.

[Whack Arnolds]

My Hawks got Marvin Williams, hope he's as good pro as he was for N.C.He will be a better pro than he was in college. His athletic game will be more exposed and he can show case his strengths more in the NBA. Less confined... etc. :up:

[Whack Arnolds]

Only thing is that now we have a bunch of guys (Othella Harrington included) that played for a team that didn't make the playoffs last year. Oh well, I'll pray that Deng, Gordon, Nocioni, Heinrich, Duhon, and Chandler keep it alive.Hell Pargo got game as well... atleast we ditched the contract of AD. Curry was a bust anyway, he basically told me when I talked to him back in early September that he was going to be on his way out. I mean, the Bulls couldn't rely on him with a bum ticker and all. :(

[Super_Ludacris]

Houston on poise to make big improves in the West with Swift, Anderson and now Alston on the team. Word to the Avy son.Phoenix will take a small step back witht he loss of Joe Johnson but with Nash, Amare and Marion they'll still be there
Obviously San Antonio still got it on lock though. On the East I'm sure bout Miami, Will J-Will,Walker and Payton comprimise with the team chemistry and will O'Neal stay healthy. Detroit is still there if they can keep it together. Cavs should make the playoffs and Indiana will probably take the conference barring Ron-Ron flipping out on cats again.

[Whack Arnolds]

Houston on poise to make big improves in the West with Swift, Anderson and now Alston on the team. Word to the Avy son.Phoenix will take a small step back witht he loss of Joe Johnson but with Nash, Amare and Marion they'll still be there
Obviously San Antonio still got it on lock though. On the East I'm sure bout Miami, Will J-Will,Walker and Payton comprimise with the team chemistry and will O'Neal stay healthy. Detroit is still there if they can keep it together. Cavs should make the playoffs and Indiana will probably take the conference barring Ron-Ron flipping out on cats again.Holy ****, they picked up Skip? That is now my new fav. team in the west. Though Stromile is kind of overrated...he will add aggressivness that Yao lacks. Naturally PHO will drop off in wins (they took kats by suprise last year) but they are actually a better team. They added much needed size and defense, while keeping their 3 best players. Joe sat out the Dallas series when PHO murdered them...he won't be missed that much, and Jackson can fill Q-Rich's role quite nicely. The Pacers are a lock to be in the top 3 teams in the west...barring Ron-Ron from the BK doesn't flip out and go punch a fan like say Spike Lee during the games. :p

[Super_Ludacris]

Ron-Ron from the QB not BK

[ben_thuggin]

I am a diehard Tim Duncan fan. Spurs all the way. Again.

[Super_Ludacris]

Media Pics from training camp:
http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/55848364.jpg?x=x&dasite=GettyImages&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=FB916B867A0335FCC66A64405541C8D1781CF461BB66 06AD
http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/55848028.jpg?x=x&dasite=GettyImages&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=FB916B867A0335FC7AA84B46BA02178E781CF461BB66 06AD
http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/55846006.jpg?x=x&dasite=GettyImages&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=FB916B867A0335FC224EF5202FE1A053781CF461BB66 06AD

[Unthinkable]

Why are we even having this discussion? The Heat won't win the east, neither will New York. Its going to come down to Detroit and Indiana. Those two teams are too hardcore.

[The Riddler]

heat/rockets final is my pick.

[The Riddler]

Why are we even having this discussion? The Heat won't win the east, neither will New York. Its going to come down to Detroit and Indiana. Those two teams are too hardcore.
because the heat were a healthy shaq away from the finals this year.

not only that but they've made some nice changes wheres the pistons have lost larry brown.

indy will be dangerous though, but the heat definitely have a very good shot.

[Unthinkable]

because the heat were a healthy shaq away from the finals this year.

not only that but they've made some nice changes.

They really aren't going to mesh, unless 'Toine can chill on the shooting random three's, and bad shots all together, and White Chocolate shows that he actually has skills beyond the hype. And they both are going to worry about the less shots. I'm not worried about NY at all really, Robinson is ill, but they don't have a real backbone defensively.

So Indiana/Detroit for Eastern. Spurs take the West, no contest.

[The Riddler]

They really aren't going to mesh, unless 'Toine can chill on the shooting random three's, and bad shots all together, and White Chocolate shows that he actually has skills beyond the hype. And they both are going to worry about the less shots. I'm not worried about NY at all really, Robinson is ill, but they don't have a real backbone defensively.

So Indiana/Detroit for Eastern. Spurs take the West, no contest.
you've got to be kidding me.

the talent alone makes them favroites for the east and gp is always a SOLID pg. he may not be one of the best point guards like he used to be but he can still play and he's not a ball hog. walker isn't that good but he can definitely provide on the offensive side. it'll take awhile to mesh, yes, but the truth is a season is long and by the playoffs they should be fine.

as for the west, the spurs are certainly the favorites but i see an improved rockets team taking it. yao's had rest and he's been weight training. this should be his breakout year.

[Unthinkable]

the talent alone makes them favroites for the east and gp is always a SOLID pg. he may not be one of the best point guards like he used to be but he can still play and he's not a ball hog. walker isn't that good but he can definitely provide on the offensive side. it'll take awhile to mesh, yes, but the truth is a season is long and by the playoffs they should be fine.

as for the west, the spurs are certainly the favorites but i see an improved rockets team taking it. yao's had rest and he's been weight training. this should be his breakout year.

I never said the Heat weren't the favorites by most people. I'm just saying, I personally do not see them taking the East. It just like a overload, kinda like the Lakers a couple years ago. GP is only getting older. The Rockets taking it? Maybe, but Finley, Ginobili, Parker, Duncan, Bowen? Too good.

[The Riddler]

I never said the Heat weren't the favorites by most people. I'm just saying, I personally do not see them taking the East. It just like a overload, kinda like the Lakers a couple years ago. GP is only getting older. The Rockets taking it? Maybe, but Finley, Ginobili, Parker, Duncan, Bowen? Too good.
rockets and spurs match up very well, very well.

remember, houston's defense last year was rated pretty high.

[Whack Arnolds]

Ron-Ron from the QB not BKYou sure bout that? I thought he was reppin BK? That's what he said last year at the Rucker...

[Whack Arnolds]

They really aren't going to mesh, unless 'Toine can chill on the shooting random three's, and bad shots all together, and White Chocolate shows that he actually has skills beyond the hype. And they both are going to worry about the less shots. I'm not worried about NY at all really, Robinson is ill, but they don't have a real backbone defensively.

So Indiana/Detroit for Eastern. Spurs take the West, no contest.True, they traded the defensive back bones to PHO. White Chocolate ha sgame now...he learned alot under Hubie, he can control himself....it's the whining and *****ing of Toine that I am worried about. Allowing Dwyane to run the 2 at his natural position is only going to free him up and allow him to concentrate on scoring and not running the offense as well. Because believe it or not...thats one of the reasons they lost last year, cause they had no good ballhandler besides Wade. Jones was overrated and pumped up too much, all the dude can do is hit open J's, and he really isn't even as good as advertised with doing that. A back court of J Dub and D. Wade is going to tear the east apart. GP coming off the bench is icing on the cake. It's also scary cause Miami got even better at D and transition game with the players they picked up in FA. They can run the floor now. James Posey is underrated, cause the guy has game.

[Super_Ludacris]

You sure bout that? I thought he was reppin BK? That's what he said last year at the Rucker...


Nah the boy from Queesbridge, hence why Nas, Cormega and Mobb Deep used to shout him out in his Bulls

[Equint77]

Only thing is that now we have a bunch of guys (Othella Harrington included) that played for a team that didn't make the playoffs last year. Oh well, I'll pray that Deng, Gordon, Nocioni, Heinrich, Duhon, and Chandler keep it alive.

They have a good young core.. if Skiles doesn't push any of them away and Reinsdorf doesn't get cheap they should be able to keep all them in tact for years.

[Equint77]

Media Pics from training camp:


http://cache.gettyimages.com/comp/55846006.jpg?x=x&dasite=GettyImages&ef=2&ev=1&dareq=FB916B867A0335FC224EF5202FE1A053781CF461BB66 06AD

I love Allan and he's been a great Knick but that picture should have had Channing and David Lee as well as Ariza... it should show NY's future.

Great pic though... I hope Nate gets his chance to show the league what we know he can do.

Not a knock on Q but he looks like Daman Wayans as Blank-man.

[Immortalfire]

Josh Smith's development......he could be good. The slam-dunk king :up:

[Equint77]

The slam-dunk king :up:

I wish more players did what he did for Nique in the dunk contest..wear his jersey as a tribute and mean it. :up: :up:

That was awesome.

[The Incredible Hulk]

http://basketbrax.free.fr/Logos%20NBA/detroit%20pistons.jpg

Nuff said

[Equint77]

Charlie Ward has decided to retire...

I was never a fan of his in NY.... and I hated all the years he was our starting PG. His jumpshot was suspect... his decision making was sub par... he couldn't run the break for his mother and was just as useless in the halfcourt. He got owned regularly by quicker PG's.



Oh and it's his fault the Knicks lost to Miami in 1997.

[Super_Ludacris]

Best Hiesman Trophy winner to never play pro football

[Whack Arnolds]

Nah the boy from Queesbridge, hence why Nas, Cormega and Mobb Deep used to shout him out in his BullsMy fault then, I must be thinking of someone else.

[Whack Arnolds]

Best Hiesman Trophy winner to never play pro footballTrue. McNabb has game as a bballer as well...

[Whack Arnolds]

The slam-dunk king :up:I wouldn't go that far. :o

[Super_Ludacris]

True. McNabb has game as a bballer as well...


TO too

[Whack Arnolds]

I love Allan and he's been a great Knick but that picture should have had Channing and David Lee as well as Ariza... it should show NY's future.Houston is done for, as well as penny. They should trade them and pick up some defense. Ariza is going to be a player though.

Great pic though... I hope Nate gets his chance to show the league what we know he can do.Nate has so much G!! NY is going to love him, but maybe they won't since Larry Brown has a habit of not letting rookies play. Especially guards since he is the hardest on them. It's crazy to think Nate and JC went to the same high school.

Not a knock on Q but he looks like Daman Wayans as Blank-man.Haha, that's the first thing I thought as well. :up: Since he is a former alumn of my school, and we see him from time to time, I may have to tell him this. LOL

[Whack Arnolds]

TO tooIf you wanna go with reciever's, hehe... Moss had game as well.

[Equint77]

Houston is done for, as well as penny. They should trade them and pick up some defense. Ariza is going to be a player though.


I love Allan but I wish he'd retire this season.... if he plays well that just makes the team a bit deeper. Penny will be gone before the season. I'm not sure what Isiah will do or get for him but Hardaway will be gone before February.


Nate has so much G!! NY is going to love him, but maybe they won't since Larry Brown has a habit of not letting rookies play. Especially guards since he is the hardest on them. It's crazy to think Nate and JC went to the same high school.

Watching him play summer league... he won me over. Some players have that excitement they bring to the game. Nate has it. Players and coaches all went to Vegas just to see Nate play. I have a feeling he's gonna get PT with Brown. Nate was captain of his college team and has proven himself during his time in Washington.. not only that but I'm sure the summer league coaches have told LB how poised he was.


Haha, that's the first thing I thought as well. :up: Since he is a former alumn of my school, and we see him from time to time, I may have to tell him this. LOL

I'm glad Q is our SF now... hopefully he'll be a great fit in NY. :up:

[Super_Ludacris]

Anfernee Deon "Penny" Hardaway forever! :(

[Whack Arnolds]

Anfernee Deon "Penny" Hardaway forever! :(I just copped a re-release of the og's penny's in a new color way. Those kicks are still fiyah.

[MakeMineMarvel]

Hell Pargo got game as well... atleast we ditched the contract of AD. Curry was a bust anyway, he basically told me when I talked to him back in early September that he was going to be on his way out. I mean, the Bulls couldn't rely on him with a bum ticker and all. :(
Pargo got game but won't crack the lineup with all these guards. He's a mid third quarter, early fourth breather-guard. He gives Gordon, Duhon and Heinrich a quick breather so they can hit the fourth quarter right.

AD may end up right back on the Bulls since he won't leave his family in Naperville. Watch the Knicks drop him in 20 days. Curry was a bust initially, but his scoring avg. has risen every year and he's only 22, as well as the fact that there was no proof that he had a bum ticker, just an inability for his agent and Pax to agree on how the severance would work if he did have a bad heart.

They'll be competitive, but when you look around the East and see the assemblage of talent and then look at the Bulls, they don't look like even Conference Finals contenders. They are a star or two away.

[Super_Ludacris]

I just copped a re-release of the og's penny's in a new color way. Those kicks are still fiyah.


Same I copped all white with the blue swish back in July. Illest kicks back in the days

[MakeMineMarvel]

I still say Starbury is chemistry poison. All they've done is add more guys who need the rock from a PG that doesn't really like to share it.

[Whack Arnolds]

Pargo got game but won't crack the lineup with all these guards. He's a mid third quarter, early fourth breather-guard. He gives Gordon, Duhon and Heinrich a quick breather so they can hit the fourth quarter right.

AD may end up right back on the Bulls since he won't leave his family in Naperville. Watch the Knicks drop him in 20 days. Curry was a bust initially, but his scoring avg. has risen every year and he's only 22, as well as the fact that there was no proof that he had a bum ticker, just an inability for his agent and Pax to agree on how the severance would work if he did have a bad heart.

They'll be competitive, but when you look around the East and see the assemblage of talent and then look at the Bulls, they don't look like even Conference Finals contenders. They are a star or two away.Yeah, his fam is in Naperville. My parents got a house out there. But I mean Curry was still lazy, and wasn't hititng his potential man. He actually has better foot speed than Shaq, and he rarely utilized it. The man is 6'11/7'0 and this was his numbers from last year: 16.1 ppg 5.40 rpg and due to never being in shape, only averaged 28 mins. a game. But only 5 rebounds a game, for a huge center is absolutely pathetic. There is guards and small forwards out there who average way more than that. I don't think he was ever going to truly reach his potential in Chicago, too many distractions playing in his home town. And who knows, he could have collapsed and died on the court for all we know... it was definetely a smart move by Paxson to dump him. You wouldn't want the Curry situation to leave a cloud over the team for the duration of the season. But I do agree with you. I tis going to be tuff for the Bulls this year. They got a mark on their back and no longer have the element of suprise. We'll see how far Kirk/Benny G/ and Deng can carry them.

[Whack Arnolds]

I still say Starbury is chemistry poison. All they've done is add more guys who need the rock from a PG that doesn't really like to share it.Are you kidding me? get the hell out of here... Starbury has never been "poison". The media labled him that and don't even look at the facts. He averaged 8 assists per game last year...while distributing the ball to sub par teammates who couldn't put the ball in the hole. If you want to get down to the nitty gritty, PHO played way better again the Spurs when Marbury was leading them, then when Nash was. Marbury is definetely not chemistry poison..you can't be a poison when you are the entire team. Granted JC helped out at times, but he was too inconsistent. Marbury will be just fine. he is a good kid, that had the unfortunate side effect of getting a bad label by the sports media. No coach has ever actually called him a team cancer. :o

[Whack Arnolds]

Same I copped all white with the blue swish back in July. Illest kicks back in the daysYeah, I want them to re-release the next version as well. The Penny's were always hot.

[Super_Ludacris]

I hope Brown instills some confidence in him to be a aggressive and provide veteran advice

[Whack Arnolds]

I hope Brown instills some confidence in him to be a aggressive and provide veteran adviceBrown always even further develops pg's. Look what he did for Chauncey Billups. A kid who was lost, even though he had talent, and he turned him into an elite pg. Imagine what the guy can do for someone like Marbury who is up there in the league's elite in terms of talent.

[Super_Ludacris]

Brown always even further develops pg's. Look what he did for Chauncey Billups. A kid who was lost, even though he had talent, and he turned him into an elite pg. Imagine what the guy can do for someone like Marbury who is up there in the league's elite in terms of talent.


Well I meant Penny. I know people say he'll be waived or traded but LB likes vets and Penny along with Antonio Davis has good playoff experience and he may look to them to help the other guys in there minimal roles

[Whack Arnolds]

Well I meant Penny. I know people say he'll be waived or traded but LB likes vets and Penny along with Antonio Davis has good playoff experience and he may look to them to help the other guys in there minimal rolesPossibly. Penny will be more of an advisor I guess you'd say. He's lost too much pyhsical skill to even make a difference now. :(

[Whack Arnolds]

Oh yeah, luda. Did you cop Live 06 or NBA 2k6?

[Equint77]

AD may end up right back on the Bulls since he won't leave his family in Naperville. Watch the Knicks drop him in 20 days. Curry was a bust initially, but his scoring avg. has risen every year and he's only 22, as well as the fact that there was no proof that he had a bum ticker, just an inability for his agent and Pax to agree on how the severance would work if he did have a bad heart.

They'll be competitive, but when you look around the East and see the assemblage of talent and then look at the Bulls, they don't look like even Conference Finals contenders. They are a star or two away.

I hope they decide to keep AD for his veteran leadership.. and he's still productive.

As far as NY... I'm optimistic... with no unrealistic expectations. They got 7 new players.. 6 of which are at an average age of 22. Not only that but they got a new coach.. who's a hard ass. I see things after this year really showing what the Knicks have. I do expect this season to be exciting though just based on the off season moves.

Playoffs maybe....

[Super_Ludacris]

Oh yeah, luda. Did you cop Live 06 or NBA 2k6?


Nah but my man in the other dorm got 2k6...so he says. I might check it out tonight

[Whack Arnolds]

NY is going to be fun to watch. They are going to catch novice ball fans off guard. I can't wait to watch them go at it.

[Equint77]

Well I meant Penny. I know people say he'll be waived or traded but LB likes vets and Penny along with Antonio Davis has good playoff experience and he may look to them to help the other guys in there minimal roles

I wish Anfernee would have a larger role on the team but between his age, the Knicks rotation and his attitude last season... as well as his contract expiring.. he's trade bait.

He's played well in NY and has done great as a back up PG, SG and SF. I wish him best but it's time for this Knicks youth movement to continue.

[Super_Ludacris]

I wish Anfernee would have a larger role on the team but between his age, the Knicks rotation and his attitude last season... as well as his contract expiring.. he's trade bait.

He's played well in NY and has done great as a back up PG, SG and SF. I wish him best but it's time for this Knicks youth movement to continue.

Yeah, I mean I think he could still help.He did ok for you guys in the '04 Playoffs against NJ. Penny always stepped up in the playoffs throughout his career

[MakeMineMarvel]

Are you kidding me? get the hell out of here... Starbury has never been "poison". The media labled him that and don't even look at the facts. He averaged 8 assists per game last year...while distributing the ball to sub par teammates who couldn't put the ball in the hole. If you want to get down to the nitty gritty, PHO played way better again the Spurs when Marbury was leading them, then when Nash was. Marbury is definetely not chemistry poison..you can't be a poison when you are the entire team. Granted JC helped out at times, but he was too inconsistent. Marbury will be just fine. he is a good kid, that had the unfortunate side effect of getting a bad label by the sports media. No coach has ever actually called him a team cancer. :o
Alright, I'll bite on that ... for now. Hopefully he's grown since his days in 'Sota with the easiest superstar to play with in the league (KG.) Now that he does have the talent on this team, I'll be interested to see if the ego raises up and the assists go down or if he as truly come of age. He can be an 8 assists/game guy when he's being jumped on the double team, but can his ego take being option #3 or 4 night in/night out. Hope so. I like shoulder-load players and he's willing to throw a squad on his back.

As far as Curry with the Bulls, when you've got a PF willing to snag double-d boards/game and lane cloggers off the bench, you get to focus on offense and don't have the crash the boards like that. Jabbar's RPG dropped to about 7 the minute James Worthy showed up. Parish only occassionally dipped over 10 once McHale arrived. The previous Bulls mainstay centers were not big rebounders either. I'm not saying Curry is Jabbar or that Chandler is Rodman, but Chandler took pressure off of Curry to rebound.

[Equint77]

he's still got the smarts to still do a lot on the court... which he's shown.

By the way... NBA TV showed Game 7 of the 1994 ECF last night and luckily I TIVO'ed it. Great freakin memories.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v144/equint77/Ewing_Garden_horizontal.jpg

[Super_Ludacris]

he's still got the smarts to still do a lot on the court... which he's shown.

By the way... NBA TV showed Game 7 of the 1994 ECF last night and luckily I TIVO'ed it. Great freakin memories.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v144/equint77/Ewing_Garden_horizontal.jpg


Yes Ewing demonstrating the wonders of using Right Gaurd were good times. Ah, the days of NBA endorsments

[Pksoze]

he's still got the smarts to still do a lot on the court... which he's shown.

By the way... NBA TV showed Game 7 of the 1994 ECF last night and luckily I TIVO'ed it. Great freakin memories.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v144/equint77/Ewing_Garden_horizontal.jpg


The year they only played in the ECF because of some stupid foul on Hubert Davis.

[Equint77]

The year they only played in the ECF because of some stupid foul on Hubert Davis.

Doesn't make up for that no-call on Charles Smith in 1993... with Jordan Pippen and Grant Hacking the ***** out of him.

Not like Charles Smith was competant but I saw that tape over and over again.. he was hacked.

[Pksoze]

Doesn't make up for that no-call on Charles Smith in 1993... with Jordan Pippen and Grant Hacking the ***** out of him.

Not like Charles Smith was competant but I saw that tape over and over again.. he was hacked.


Thats the playoffs.

The 90's Knicks made hacking & personal fouls an unequaled art form.

I saw a lot of their games on msg...they made Detroit look like Pikers.

And Charles Smith sucked.

You have one point though I know the roster of the 90's Knicks & the early 90's all star teams far better than the current Knicks & the current players.

[Equint77]

Thats the playoffs.

The 90's Knicks made hacking & personal fouls an unequaled art form.

I saw a lot of their games on msg...they made Detroit look like Pikers.

And Charles Smith sucked.

You have one point though I know the roster of the 90's Knicks & the early 90's all star teams far better than the current Knicks & the current players.


The Knicks were bruisers... which is why I became a fan of the team in 1992.. Nothing made me happier than watching X and Mase try to take Jordan's head off.

I sorta wish NY implemented the Jordan rules.... they had rougher players (maybe not as dirty) as the Pistons.

I met Charles Smith on the subway one day. He was nothing but a total waste for NY. A soft erratic jumpshooting marshmellow. His knees were softer than jello.

The Knicks of the 90's were great cause thier defense made a joke of most of the teams in the NBA. And like in most sports... it's all timing... they got the right guys under the right system at the right time. Did the play great together? Yeah... Pat had been there for years and years... Oak had been there... Starks, Mason... then they had veterans Doc Rivers and Derek Harper. They played beyond their talents and rode Ewing about as much as you can. I loved that team cause they played with grit and I'll never love a Knick team like I did that those. However this new team is talented beyond anything Riley or Van Gundy had in NY. The problem is most of these players are young... have had no structure or stability in the league.

I have realistic expectations for this team... and what makes it better was thinking about what this team was 3 years ago under Scott Layden. He should have stayed in Utah.. and I'm glad they took him back.

[Whack Arnolds]

As far as Curry with the Bulls, when you've got a PF willing to snag double-d boards/game and lane cloggers off the bench, you get to focus on offense and don't have the crash the boards like that. Jabbar's RPG dropped to about 7 the minute James Worthy showed up. Parish only occassionally dipped over 10 once McHale arrived. The previous Bulls mainstay centers were not big rebounders either. I'm not saying Curry is Jabbar or that Chandler is Rodman, but Chandler took pressure off of Curry to rebound.Of course he took the pressure off...but that is still no excuse for 5 rebounds a game for a starting center. You have to remember TC came off the bench last year. Eddy started the game. He had no defensive skills wat so ever, and was an atrocious rebounder. Even in HS he had went a game with out grabbing ONE rebound. That is pathetic for someone his size playing up against much smaller HS players. He always has been a lazy kid, that will never change. And when you're the building block for a new franchise, you can't afford your proposed "superstar" to be lazy. Chi got more out of the deal than NY.

[JMT]

UH OH!!!!!!!
Gilbert ARENNNAASSSS!!!!!!

[Whack Arnolds]

The Knicks were bruisers... which is why I became a fan of the team in 1992.. Nothing made me happier than watching X and Mase try to take Jordan's head off.And boy did I love seeing my guys take you down for 3 straight years, as MJ was dropping double nickels almost every other game on that Knick squad. :D

[Equint77]

And boy did I love seeing my guys take you down for 3 straight years, as MJ was dropping double nickels almost every other game on that Knick squad. :D

he scored 55 once against NY.. he abused Cleveland.

I hate to admit it but I preferred the Bulls of the early 90's to the later Bulls.

Paxson, Hodges, Stacy King, BJ Armstrong, Grant, Cartright, Pippen before he realized he wasn't the go to guy.

[Whack Arnolds]

he scored 55 once against NY.. he abused Cleveland.

I hate to admit it but I preferred the Bulls of the early 90's to the later Bulls.

Paxson, Hodges, Stacy King, BJ Armstrong, Grant, Cartright, Pippen before he realized he wasn't the go to guy.He dropped another game of 50 in one of those series... Let me go look it up. And by series I don't just mean the 1993 Conference finals. They also played NY in the second round in 1992 and won in 7 games, and they swept them in 1991 in the first round.

[Equint77]

He dropped another game of 50 in one of those series... Let me go look it up.

if it did it might have been game 7 of the 1992 playoffs

[MakeMineMarvel]

Of course he took the pressure off...but that is still no excuse for 5 rebounds a game for a starting center. You have to remember TC came off the bench last year. Eddy started the game. He had no defensive skills wat so ever, and was an atrocious rebounder. Even in HS he had went a game with out grabbing ONE rebound. That is pathetic for someone his size playing up against much smaller HS players. He always has been a lazy kid, that will never change. And when you're the building block for a new franchise, you can't afford your proposed "superstar" to be lazy. Chi got more out of the deal than NY.
In the end, I'll agree that we got more out of the deal than the Knickerbaby's, but I just don't want to see a 22 year old come back to haunt us.

[Equint77]

In the end, I'll agree that we got more out of the deal than the Knickerbaby's, but I just don't want to see a 22 year old come back to haunt us.

it's a toss up... you guys are getting cap space next summer... and we're banking on Brown doing what Skiles, Cartright and Flloyd couldn't with Curry.

I don't think Curry wanted to be in Chicago anymore and forced them to make the deal.

And at first I was gonna say something about your Knickerbaby comment but it's actually true... they've got a young team.

[MakeMineMarvel]

We're also probably going to snag your first round pick in '06 as well. Jermaine Jackson will get his walking papers shortly, AD will end up back in Chicago, and that will be the end of it.

... And yes, the Knicks are young.

[Equint77]

We're also probably going to snag your first round pick in '06 as well. Jermaine Jackson will get his walking papers shortly, AD will end up back in Chicago, and that will be the end of it.

... And yes, the Knicks are young.

I think you guys get our 06 pick we got from SA.. and as well all know they're probably gonna go deep into the playoffs.. barring injury. So it's a loss but not one that would have killed had it been Charlotte or Atlanta.

I read the Knicks are gonna keep AD... but I'm not sure. His contract is up at the end of the year too so it would just make sense to keep him and pay him the year then let him walk and still pay him the year.

Jermaine was thrown in to balance out salaries.... I wasn't even away he was on the active roster.

[Whack Arnolds]

My 2nd favorite player of all-time, and boy would I love to see him get back to the finals. (Notice the spider-man arm sleeve he is rockin)
http://images2.sportsline.com/u/ap/photos/NCGB105100415_1024x768.jpg

[Super_Ludacris]

My 2nd favorite player of all-time, and boy would I love to see him get back to the finals. (Notice the spider-man arm sleeve he is rockin)
http://images2.sportsline.com/u/ap/photos/NCGB105100415_1024x768.jpg




That's kinda ill, we should all root for Iverson in some shape or form

[Whack Arnolds]

"We Run New York" (feat Larry B, Starbury, JC, Penny, and Allan Houston):
http://www.nba.com/media/knicks/camp_051005_300.jpg
Melo:
http://images2.sportsline.com/u/ap/photos/COJD104100516_1024x768.jpg
Kobe guarded by Scottie Pip:
http://images2.sportsline.com/u/ap/photos/XHU101100420_1024x768.jpg
Yao and T-Mac:
http://images2.sportsline.com/u/ap/photos/HT102100419_1024x768.jpg
New Look Heat:
http://images2.sportsline.com/u/ap/photos/MH103100417_1024x768.jpg
GP aka "The Glove":
http://images2.sportsline.com/u/ap/photos/MH102100416_1024x768.jpg

[Go Web Go!]

FEAR NOT! I HAVE ARRIVED! Ok, big deal, but what's an NBA thread without me right? Right...Ok, whatever. Anyway, you have to go with the Spurs this year. They took it last year and are only going to get better with the additions of Finley and Van Exel. I'm obviously rooting for Miami, but I don't know if I should be expecting a title from them with this revamped roster. I do believe they will be the 1 or 2 seed in the East though. Should be a good season either way.

[Equint77]

Dwanye Wade's game should be illegal.

I don't say this often but he's one of the few players in the league I'm jealous doesn't play for NY. Him and LB are insane. God bless the NBA.

[Equint77]

http://aol.nba.com/media/knicks/nba_training_drill_051005.jpg

those 3 on the break.. with Curry down low... scary.

[MakeMineMarvel]

What's scary for the Knicks is that they won't get to have all those basketballs on the court at the same time. That's like a dream-sequence picture for those guys.

As far as the Spurs taking it all - only if much more isn't too much more. They have succeeded previously without the bevy of names that they currently have. Van Exel is gonna really press Parker for playing time and that could erupt, they're trying to deal Nesterovic quickly because they want to avoid the logjam of Duncan, Marks, Nazy and Oberto. Finley and Bowen will either be a great counterpunch or will have issues figuring out who should start. I trust Pop will handle things the way he always does, but all I'd guarantee is that there are no guarantees.

[Equint77]

What's scary for the Knicks is that they won't get to have all those basketballs on the court at the same time. That's like a dream-sequence picture for those guys.

As far as the Spurs taking it all - only if much more isn't too much more. They have succeeded previously without the bevy of names that they currently have. Van Exel is gonna really press Parker for playing time and that could erupt, they're trying to deal Nesterovic quickly because they want to avoid the logjam of Duncan, Marks, Nazy and Oberto. Finley and Bowen will either be a great counterpunch or will have issues figuring out who should start. I trust Pop will handle things the way he always does, but all I'd guarantee is that there are no guarantees.

I'm confident that Larry Brown will get these guys to play within the team. If he can handle Rasheed, Iverson and turn Billups into an actual Point Guard.. he shouldn't have trouble with anyone on the Knicks (knocks on wood).

Now with SA.... they just re-loaded without really reloading. Adding Finley and Van Exel just makes them even tougher to beat. Finley still has years in him and has never ever been a selfish player so he's a great fit for the Spurs.

Nick... he's a clutch shooter who's been in the league long enough to finally realize winning supercedes everything else. He's become another great addition to SA.

I won't be surprised if they repeat.

[Super_Ludacris]

I don't know if anyone caught this cause it is a couple of days old but it seems like Amare's knee injury is getting a little worse. I hope this magnify into anythng serious :(
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2185365
TUCSON, Ariz. -- The revamped Phoenix Suns locked up in an intrasquad scrimmage Saturday night in front of 7,688 spectators at the University of Arizona's McKale Center, still without the services of All-Star forward Amare Stoudemire.

Seven offseason acquisitions took the court for the Suns.

"The new guys came in and got an idea of our style," said Suns head coach Mike D'Antoni. "Their spacing was good and they're starting to get in a rhythm with running up and down the court. It's reassuring to see those guys filling their roles."

Just three players from the current roster -- Leandro Barbosa, Shawn Marion and Steve Nash -- were on the Phoenix roster for last season's training camp.

Meanwhile, Stoudemire's status remains in question as he continues to suffer from soreness in his left knee.

"It's the type of deal where he'll go see another doctor, get two or three opinions and then try to make the decision from there," D'Antoni said. "Hopefully that happens quick so we can get him back pretty soon."

Stoudemire, a 6-foot-10 power forward who played center for the Suns last season, signed a five-year, $73 million contract extension on Monday.

During Saturday's scrimmage, Shawn Marion led all scorers with 29 points, guiding his orange-uniformed crew back from a seven-point halftime deficit, to share an 83-83 tie.

"Everybody is still learning what each other can do out there," Marion said. "We're getting used to each other. I think you saw that tonight. But we still moved it aggressively."

Marion was flanked by 24 points from free-agent signee Raja Bell, usually known as a defensive expert.

Steve Nash directed the white-jerseyed Suns squad, racking up a double-double with 22 points and 11 assists.

Center Kurt Thomas, acquired in an offseason trade from New York, also notched a double-double, pulling down 11 rebounds and scoring 12 points




I hope dude is ok

[Equint77]

it's amazing how one potential injury to your star player can completely change a season.

Amare is a monster... I also hope his injured knee is nothing serious.

[Super_Ludacris]

it's amazing how one potential injury to your star player can completely change a season.

Amare is a monster... I also hope his injured knee is nothing serious.

For real, and I should know I'm a Penny Hardaway fan

[Whack Arnolds]

Dwanye Wade's game should be illegal.

I don't say this often but he's one of the few players in the league I'm jealous doesn't play for NY. Him and LB are insane. God bless the NBA.Hell they made A.I.'s game illegal. When his cross was killing people on the court, the league had to ban it.

[Equint77]

Hell they made A.I.'s game illegal. When his cross was killing people on the court, the league had to ban it.

He was carrying the ball like crazy.. he'd cross over but would have the ball cuffed under his wrist.

And I meant illegal in a good way.... I read some sports writer describe his game as having no flaws... and the truth is he might be right.

[Super_Ludacris]

It's the speed and toughness with AI, speed and toughness

[Whack Arnolds]

He was carrying the ball like crazy.. he'd cross over but would have the ball cuffed under his wrist. Not really. The evolution of ballhandling evolved into that. Originally you could only have your hand on the top of the ball ala Bob Cousy. Most players today palm and "carry" when dribbiling regular. It was a situation of limiting A.I.'s game. Shortly after he broke Jordan off 2 times in the same play, it wasn't long after the league banned it. At the time he was the new look generation bad boy v.s. the golden boy image of the NBA in Jordan. I think that had more to do with it than anything. But if you call A.I.'s cross a carry.....everyone in the league carries, and on a consistant basis.

And I meant illegal in a good way.... I read some sports writer describe his game as having no flaws... and the truth is he might be right.Yeah, D. Wade is my guy. But he does however have a weakness, and hopefully he gets better at it. And that is his long range game. If he could start efficentely hitting the 3, he'd be un-guardable.

[Ghostvirus]

Not really. The evolution of ballhandling evolved into that. Originally you could only have your hand on the top of the ball ala Bob Cousy. Most players today palm and "carry" when dribbiling regular. It was a situation of limiting A.I.'s game. Shortly after he broke Jordan off 2 times in the same play, it wasn't long after the league banned it. At the time he was the new look generation bad boy v.s. the golden boy image of the NBA in Jordan. I think that had more to do with it than anything. But if you call A.I.'s cross a carry.....everyone in the league carries, and on a consistant basis.

First off don't Put A.I's name and Jordan's in the same sentence.:spidey:

Second A.I. is going to do what Miller did for Indiana. 17 years of hopes and dreams with no delivery, and then retire completely overrated.

Although maybe.... MAYBE!!! Chris Webber will put them over the top. If A.I. learns to pass.

[Super_Ludacris]

First off don't Put A.I's name and Jordan's in the same sentence.:spidey:

Second A.I. is going to do what Miller did for Indiana. 17 years of hopes and dreams with no delivery, and then retire completely overrated.

Although maybe.... MAYBE!!! Chris Webber will put them over the top. If A.I. learns to pass.


Nah AI is official and Webber aint gonna **** for them. Iverson can pass and score he proved that last year duh.

[Ghostvirus]

Nah AI is official and Webber aint gonna **** for them. Iverson can pass and score he proved that last year duh.

I think you are taking what I say to literally. Of course A.I. can pass. But when person has one of the lowest field goal percentages in the league, but leads in scoring should say something. Also what did he prove at all last year? They can lose in the first round? Trust me, unless A.I. changes is ways (having a press conference explaining why he shouldn't have to practice!) then he will only keep the team from succeeding.

[Whack Arnolds]

I think you are taking what I say to literally. Of course A.I. can pass. But when person has one of the lowest field goal percentages in the league, but leads in scoring should say something. Also what did he prove at all last year? They can lose in the first round? Trust me, unless A.I. changes is ways (having a press conference explaining why he shouldn't have to practice!) then he will only keep the team from succeeding.First of all shorty, I wasn't comparing Iverson to Jordan. So don't take that tone with me. All I said was Iverson broke him off with two consecutive nasty crossovers. And this is a KNOWN fact. It doesn't make someone any less of a ball player if they get their ankles broken. Second of all, A.I. is NOT selfish and has a low shooting percentage for a reason. I obviously gave you too much credit for even knowing the game, because if you did you would retract that idiotic statement about A.I. and his field goal percentage. A.I. has for years been the only consistent player on his team. He was constantly surrounded by average players, and sub-par scorers. The coach gives Iverson the right to hoist those shots, regardless the situation...because it is HIS scoring that even keeps them in ball games. He is hands down, pound for pound the most talented offensive player in the league...and is virtually the best scoring little man to EVER play the game, so he has every right to put up shots...especially with the offensively challenged teammates that surround him. And don't make it sound as if just because he shoots alot, that is why he leads the league in scoring...cause that isn't the case either. It is another known fact, that in the NBA it is difficult enough just to free yourself up for your own shot, and to have the ability like A.I. to put it up at anytime (especially at his height of 5'11/6'0) that is one hell of an accomplishment in itself. In regards to Iverson passing...you have no clue what you;re talking about. If you ever watched Iverson in an All-Star game, or the Olympics where he is surrounded with other players who can score, he has no problem dishing the ball off and doing it damn well. Plus he averaged 7.9 assists last year, WHILE leading the league in scoring. You my friend have no idea what you're talking about in concerns with Allen Iverson. And just cause Miller didn't win a title doesn't make him overrated. The same goes with Malone, Stockton, Barkely, Ewing and all the other great players who went with out rings.

[Whack Arnolds]

A.I. changes is ways (having a press conference explaining why he shouldn't have to practice!) Once again, no F-ing clue what you're talking about. That was taken out of context. GO look for the entire interview first, then read how that statement came about. Ontop of that, if you followed Philly's traininc camp..Iverson is the first one in the gym and the last one to leave each day.

[Super_Ludacris]

Tell him why you mad son!

[Tangled Web]

I like the Lakers, but my second favorite is the Golden State Warriors because of former Bruins Baron Davis and Ray Young. The Lakers could have easily aquired B Diddy last year but didn't.

[Ghostvirus]

Whatever! You all can try and sell me the cult that is Iverson. I am not having It. He represents everything that I hate about these new crop of players. Mostly flash. Lebron is great & will go down as Great Wade is great. These players play to win.

As for Stockton, Malone, Barkley, & Ewing not winning.

Ewing was hit by the Jordan Disease.

Barkley has said himself that he was surrounded by crap players. Except in Pheonix, once again struck with the Jordan Disease.

Malone & Stockton - I have no clue why they didn't win they should have totally won. But near the end they were again struck by the Jordan Disease.

Iverson may win it. Looking at his statistics he certainly is capable. Unfortunetely he doesn't have what older players had. Heart. That is my main reason for not liking him. Same goes for Miller.

You kids can sit that & tell me I don't know what I am talking. Slander doesn't really bother me. I have been watching basketball for about 20 years. One thing that I have learned from watching & playing it takes alot more than skill to win.

[Whack Arnolds]

Whatever! You all can try and sell me the cult that is Iverson. I am not having It. He represents everything that I hate about these new crop of players. Mostly flash. Lebron is great & will go down as Great Wade is great. These players play to win. AKA, you don't like his look. There was plenty of players with worse attitudes than Iverson back in the 80's and 90's.


Iverson may win it. Looking at his statistics he certainly is capable. Unfortunetely he doesn't have what older players had. Heart. That is my main reason for not liking him. Once again talking out of your ass I see!!! Iverson year in year out has been known as having the biggest heart in the league. Just ask Shaq, Dr. J, Magic or even Jordan himself..all have emphasized the fact that this 6'0 150 lbs guy can dominate in a league of huge players, and does so by having the biggest heart on the floor. "It's not the size of the dog in the fight...but the size of the fight in the dog." Look how many times AI has battled severe injuries only to lead his teams to victories. Hell look at the entire 2001 season where he put them on his shoulders while having a dislocated elbow and won MVP. Once again I emphasis you are not knowledgeable in basketball at all...no matter how long you've been watching it. You're just bitter and a hater of Allen Iverson. You don't like the appearance, so you make up excuses to hate his game. A.I. has just about as much heart as anyone who has ever played the game.


You kids can sit that & tell me I don't know what I am talking. Slander doesn't really bother me. I have been watching basketball for about 20 years. One thing that I have learned from watching & playing it takes alot more than skill to win.Son, I play D1 college basketball... that alone puts any of your supposed "knowledge" to shame.

[JMT]

Iverson has the most heart in the league.....

Just got back from the Wizards game....
Im telling you nuk, this peter john ramos guy is a beast.
He's their secret weapon

[The Brian]

i think the rockets got it this season.

[droogiedroogie2]

NBA is bloated and dull. NCAA all the way.

[Tangled Web]

Go Bruins!

[Go Web Go!]

i think the rockets got it this season.

Got what? They're not going to take the West away from the Spurs. Swift and Alston aren't pushing them over the top. Sorry. And even if it did I don't think they'd be able to beat the East's top 3 teams in Miami, Indy, and Detroit.

[The Riddler]

Got what? They're not going to take the West away from the Spurs. Swift and Alston aren't pushing them over the top. Sorry. And even if it did I don't think they'd be able to beat the East's top 3 teams in Miami, Indy, and Detroit.
you forget last year i think the heat split with houston.

alston is exactly what they needed: good ball handler and distributer and swift is the athletic big man they needed to help yao.

also, expect yao to have a breakout season.

this could be their year.

[Go Web Go!]

What does last year have to do with anything? Last year Charlotte beat Miami and Detroit. Does that mean they'll challenge them this year? Not so much...Houston should improve, but I don't think they have enough to get them to the Finals. They're not a better team than San Antonio or the top 3 teams in the East. And Alston is a tad bit overrated...

[The Riddler]

What does last year have to do with anything? Last year Charlotte beat Miami and Detroit. Does that mean they'll challenge them this year? Not so much...Houston should improve, but I don't think they have enough to get them to the Finals. They're not a better team than San Antonio or the top 3 teams in the East. And Alston is a tad bit overrated...
alston isn't overrated.

he isn't much more than a ball handler and solid passer which is exactly what the rockets need.

[CConn]

Whatever! You all can try and sell me the cult that is Iverson. I am not having It. He represents everything that I hate about these new crop of players. Mostly flash. Lebron is great & will go down as Great Wade is great. These players play to win.You don't think Iverson plays to win? You don't think he was playing to win when he could barely walk, but still in the game putting up 20+ points a game one year? You don't think he was playing to win when again, and again, and again, he took the ball, and scored points for his team, when no one else could?

Iverson is renown for his heart and will to win. I don't like the guy personally, he's not my favorite player in the world on the court either, but I see him play 80-some games a year, and to say he plays for the celebrity of it is simply not true and a very unimformed opinion.

[Ghostvirus]

Nuk Nukk why is it that you feeel the need to call me basically stupid? Just because I disagree with you? Take your head out of Iverson's ass dude! I disagree that is all. It doesn't make me less educated in basketball. It just makes me opinionated. I still feel that I am not wrong. you throw all you want at me and I will not change my mind. I watched the press conference on ESPN when Iverson defended what he had to say about practicing. To me he was taking a crap on the game that I enjoy. I am sure that other players did just as worse back in the day. They are the players that you don't hear about anymore.

I am sorry Iverson to me does not seem to me to be a great player. That is my opinion. I would much rather watch Lebron, Wade, Kidd, & Nash than Iverson. I believe that these players are in it for the team. Not for themselves. Once again my opinion. With all that said I will take what you have said (negating the immature slander) and watch a few more sixers games and see if my opinion will change of him. I doubt it will but I am open to the possibility.

What team do you play for in college? Are you a starter?

[Eyeballing]

I want to put everybody on notice and warn you to beware of the WIZARDS this year we are taking it all.


Hahahaha, seriously? Come on. First you've got to get past The Heat and the Pistions. Not that the Wiz are a bad team but i'm sorry they're just not on that level yet. Even if by some miracle they make it all the way they are going to have to get past the spurs.

[Eyeballing]

Iverson is overrated. But not as much as Chris Webber :D :down:

[Eyeballing]

NBA is bloated and dull. NCAA all the way.


Agree except Nash and Wade are incredible to watch. Lebron, I'm still waiting for him to become a huge defensive threat, once he does he will be averaging more than 30 game :D

[Ghostvirus]

Iverson is overrated. But not as much as Chris Webber :D :down:

I am still trying to get past the fact that he cost me a crap load of money when he was playing for Michigan. He couldn't count time outs!!! AHHH :mad:

[CConn]

Iverson is overrated. But not as much as Chris Webber :D :down:Both because of their age declining their skills.

[CConn]

I am sorry Iverson to me does not seem to me to be a great player. That is my opinion. I would much rather watch Lebron, Wade, Kidd, & Nash than Iverson. I believe that these players are in it for the team. Not for themselves.Iverson's definitely selfish. But at times (especially early in his career) he had to be selfish for the team to win. He does want to win without question, and if Iverson wins, everyone else on the team does as well.

[Eyeballing]

Both because of their age declining their skills.

Yeah but Webber has been overratted now for about 6 years or so.

[CConn]

Yeah but Webber has been overratted now for about 6 years or so.He was solid for Sac for quite a few years...though probably the last three he's been running on steam.

[Eyeballing]

He was solid for Sac for quite a few years...though probably the last three he's been running on steam.

One can be solid and still overratted. :D

[Whack Arnolds]

Iverson isn't getting worse because of aging. In fact it has allowed him to settle down and evaluate and play with his mind as well as his blinding quickness. He had arguably his best year last year. Dude dropped 60 points and he is only 5'11!!! That is F'ing amazing.

[Eyeballing]

Iverson isn't getting worse because of aging. In fact it has allowed him to settle down and evaluate and play with his mind as well as his blinding quickness. He had arguably his best year last year. Dude dropped 60 points and he is only 5'11!!! That is F'ing amazing.

Not when you take 40-50 shots a game. Don't get me wrong Iverson is good and I have a lot more respect for him than I used to due to the past couple of years and the comments he has made. But I just don't think he is in that elite category of players.

[Whack Arnolds]

Not when you take 40-50 shots a game. Don't get me wrong Iverson is good and I have a lot more respect for him than I used to due to the past couple of years and the comments he has made. But I just don't think he is in that elite category of players.You don't get it either. Are you saying that just because someone shoots alot means they will drop 60 points? I don't think so captain. Not many players can go out there and score 60, regardless of how many shots they put up, this is a mis informed statement by you. And once again you're one of those ignorant "basketball fans" who is over exaggerating Iverson's shooting percentage...which is low (but not that low), due to the fact HE HAS to take a large majority shots for his team to even have a chance at winning...and naturally he is bound to miss some of those said shots. Iverson is hands down in the elite group of players, just look at what he is done through out his entire career. But the funny thing is, if you asked the other "elite" and upper echelon players in the League if AI is one of the best...they surely would answer "yes".

[Eyeballing]

You don't get it either. Are you saying that just because someone shoots alot means they will drop 60 points? I don't think so captain. Not many players can go out there and score 60, regardless of how many shots they put up, this is a mis informed statement by you. And once again you're one of those ignorant "basketball fans" who is over exaggerating Iverson's shooting percentage...which is low (but not that low), due to the fact HE HAS to take a large majority shots for his team to even have a chance at winning...and naturally he is bound to miss some of those said shots. Iverson is hands down in the elite group of players, just look at what he is done through out his entire career. But the funny thing is, if you asked the other "elite" and upper echelon players in the League if AI is one of the best...they surely would answer "yes".


Of course they would, when do players ever not? I'm ignorant? What has Iverson done? Nothing, went to the finals ONCE, but Larry Brown was coaching, has he been back since? Nope, will he? Nope. Know why because he is not in the Elite group of players, he is good/great but not elite. And why does he have to take all those shots? Oh that's right because no one on his team is any good. BULL ****!

Look at the Suns, look at what an ELITE Point Guard did for them, don't give me crap about they have Stoudamire, they had him the year before too. An Elite point guard makes everyone around them better. Look at college ball, the best teams have the best point guards. Iverson is not one of the best point guards in the league. Plain and simple. He is like Kobe, great individually but that's it. Kobe can't get it done on his own either.

I'm not saying Iverson isn't good, he is an amazing player, I have a lot of respect for him as of the things he has said of late, but he is not an elite player. Sorry there are only a few in the league. And as for your as the players in the leauge statement.

Ask Charles Barkely how many superstars in the league there are. Know what he will say TWO, and Iverson isn't one of them. Does that prove anything no, just like your statement doesn't.

[Whack Arnolds]

Of course they would, when do players ever not?
Son it is a rarity when someone scores 60 points. Ray Allen has a great field goal percentage, but I doubt he will ever score 60 points in a single game.

I'm ignorant? What has Iverson done? Nothing, went to the finals ONCE, but Larry Brown was coaching, has he been back since? Nope, will he? Nope. Know why because he is not in the Elite group of players, he is good/great but not elite. And why does he have to take all those shots? Oh that's right because no one on his team is any good. BULL ****!

Look at the Suns, look at what an ELITE Point Guard did for them, don't give me crap about they have Stoudamire, they had him the year before too. An Elite point guard makes everyone around them better. Look at college ball, the best teams have the best point guards. Iverson is not one of the best point guards in the league. Plain and simple. He is like Kobe, great individually but that's it. Kobe can't get it done on his own either.

I'm not saying Iverson isn't good, he is an amazing player, I have a lot of respect for him as of the things he has said of late, but he is not an elite player. Sorry there are only a few in the league. And as for your as the players in the leauge statement.

Ask Charles Barkely how many superstars in the league there are. Know what he will say TWO, and Iverson isn't one of them. Does that prove anything no, just like your statement doesn't.First of all Steve Nash is a GREAT player, and is on top of his game right now...but he is no where even close to being an elite player. An elite player consistently has great years, year in and year out. Steve Nash just started playing at the level he is at, and he did so because he was put in a perfect system for him that was suited for his style of ball, and YES his teammates are far greater players than the ones Iverson has to deal with. Nash has 2 other all stars in his starting lineup alone, and the Suns were going just as far into the playoffs with Marbury at the helm as they did with Nash!!! Their style fit Nash to a tee as he was a product of a system, run all day long, and kick it to his slashers. Nash HAS no D, and you can't be an elite player w/o being able to play defense. And how can Nash be an elite player if he allowed his team to get their asses handed to them by the Spurs? At least AI has had the capability to be a one man wrecking crew and take his team all the way to the finals. As for the Barkley comment...no one takes heed to what he says, because he is ALWAYS running his mouth and saying the most off the wall bull ****. I remember a few years back he said something to the effect that Yao Ming would never score over 15 pts in a game.... that right there shows you how qualified he is to judge other ball players. AI holds it down on offense and defense EVERY YEAR, something that can't be said at all for Nash. But please, don't give me that the reason the Sixers went to the finals in 2001 was because of the coach. They would have been there every year if it was because Larry Brown was that good (and he isn't, he is actually overrated and an over emotional headcase). That season it was all Iverson, just as it is every year for the Sixers. He is the driving force for that team...they still really don't have anyone to rely on for consistant scoring. Andre Iguodala will be good eventually, but he isn't there right now. Plus Webber has too many nagging injuries to truly be effective. I can't believe I am having to argue with you that AI is in the elite in the NBA. Take Iverson away from the Sixers...and they might win 20 games..MAX. Take Nash away from the Suns, and they still win close to 45 games.

Elite Players in the League:
1) Timmy Duncan
2) KG
3) Shaq
4) Kobe
5) AI
6) T Mac
7) J. Kidd
8) Dirk "the Diggler" Nowitzki
9) LeBron James
10) Vince Carter

[Super_Ludacris]

I'd put Amare ahead of Carter and maybe Dirk, where's the boy Wade?

[Super_Ludacris]

The Suns season is over before it even began

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2186795


PHOENIX -- Amare Stoudemire will undergo diagnostic surgery on his left knee on Tuesday to determine what is causing the soreness that has bothered the Phoenix Suns All-Star in recent months.
The arthroscopic operation will be conducted by team physician Tom Carter, the Suns announced on Monday.
Stoudemire, who signed a five-year, $73 million contract extension a week ago, sat out the final two days of training camp in Tucson because of the injury to the knee's articulate cartilage. He received opinions from three specialists before deciding to have the surgery
If no serious damage is detected, Stoudemire probably will be out three to four weeks, coach Mike D'Antoni told The Associated Press. Then, it will be only a matter of getting back in shape.
"Hey, the guy's an unbelievable talent," D'Antoni said. "In about an hour and a half he'll be in shape and ready to go.
Stoudemire will miss the entire preseason, which begins at Seattle on Friday night. The Suns open their regular season Nov. 1 at home against Dallas.
D'Antoni acknowledged that hearing the words surgery and Stoudemire in the same sentence "sends shivers up everybody's spine."
"But he's young and he's healthy and hopefully everything will be fine," the coach said.
Suns president Bryan Colangelo declined to comment on Stoudemire's status. The Suns wrapped up training camp on Sunday and had Monday off. They will resume workouts on Tuesday.
The 22-year-old power forward was a dominant force playing out of position at center for a Suns team that won an NBA-best 62 games last season, his third in the NBA. He averaged 37 points against Tim Duncan when the Suns were eliminated by the San Antonio Spurs in the Western Conference finals.
The soreness had bothered Stoudemire during the summer, and he worked out sparingly in Tucson. His last practice was Friday morning.
The No. 9 pick in the 2002 draft, Stoudemire won the Rookie of the Year award over Yao Ming in 2002-03 and has improved each season. He was fifth in the NBA in scoring last season at 26 points per game. He averaged just under 30 in the playoffs.
D'Antoni said Stoudemire's absence could have a silver lining because other players will have more opportunities to show their abilities.
"Actually, we can make better judgment on our guys in the rotation," he said, "because we know what Amare's going to do."

[MakeMineMarvel]

There's no way you can tell me AI isn't one of the elite players in the league and in the games history. He has done more at his height than anyone since Tiny Archibald and I would rate AI ahead of him in total value. He competes night in and nght out with guards 3-7 inches taller than him and dominates. He consistently averages over 25ppg and leads a team who mostly wouldn't start anywhere else in the league. If Nash is so elite, where was the big drop-off by the Mavs? They hardly suffered. Amare costs the Suns far more than Nash does.

[Whack Arnolds]

I'd put Amare ahead of Carter and maybe Dirk, where's the boy Wade?Wade's my guy...and friend, but I can't put him in that elite category yet. If he continues to put it down like he has been the past 2 years, and his progress continues...He will be up there, until then he is just a great player on the verge. Same goes for Amare IMO. Jermaine O'Neal is also one of those great players that is near the upper echelon, just not quite there yet.

[Whack Arnolds]

There's no way you can tell me AI isn't one of the elite players in the league and in the games history. He has done more at his height than anyone since Tiny Archibald and I would rate AI ahead of him in total value. He competes night in and nght out with guards 3-7 inches taller than him and dominates. He consistently averages over 25ppg and leads a team who mostly wouldn't start anywhere else in the league. If Nash is so elite, where was the big drop-off by the Mavs? They hardly suffered. Amare costs the Suns far more than Nash does.PREACH, thanks alot for the re-assurance. You definetely know your bball. Iverson is hands down the greatest player ever to play the game under 6'6". He is like Isiah Thomas version 2.0 +.

[Whack Arnolds]

The Suns season is over before it even began

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2186795


PHOENIX -- Amare Stoudemire will undergo diagnostic surgery on his left knee on Tuesday to determine what is causing the soreness that has bothered the Phoenix Suns All-Star in recent months.
The arthroscopic operation will be conducted by team physician Tom Carter, the Suns announced on Monday.
Stoudemire, who signed a five-year, $73 million contract extension a week ago, sat out the final two days of training camp in Tucson because of the injury to the knee's articulate cartilage. He received opinions from three specialists before deciding to have the surgery
If no serious damage is detected, Stoudemire probably will be out three to four weeks, coach Mike D'Antoni told The Associated Press. Then, it will be only a matter of getting back in shape.
"Hey, the guy's an unbelievable talent," D'Antoni said. "In about an hour and a half he'll be in shape and ready to go.
Stoudemire will miss the entire preseason, which begins at Seattle on Friday night. The Suns open their regular season Nov. 1 at home against Dallas.
D'Antoni acknowledged that hearing the words surgery and Stoudemire in the same sentence "sends shivers up everybody's spine."
"But he's young and he's healthy and hopefully everything will be fine," the coach said.
Suns president Bryan Colangelo declined to comment on Stoudemire's status. The Suns wrapped up training camp on Sunday and had Monday off. They will resume workouts on Tuesday.
The 22-year-old power forward was a dominant force playing out of position at center for a Suns team that won an NBA-best 62 games last season, his third in the NBA. He averaged 37 points against Tim Duncan when the Suns were eliminated by the San Antonio Spurs in the Western Conference finals.
The soreness had bothered Stoudemire during the summer, and he worked out sparingly in Tucson. His last practice was Friday morning.
The No. 9 pick in the 2002 draft, Stoudemire won the Rookie of the Year award over Yao Ming in 2002-03 and has improved each season. He was fifth in the NBA in scoring last season at 26 points per game. He averaged just under 30 in the playoffs.
D'Antoni said Stoudemire's absence could have a silver lining because other players will have more opportunities to show their abilities.
"Actually, we can make better judgment on our guys in the rotation," he said, "because we know what Amare's going to do."That sucks pimpn..but he will definetely be back by mid season sometime though, so don't worry too much. I rather they get it out of the way now and fix it, instead of let the problem linger and effect the Suns playoff run. But on the real, The Suns "just LOST." ;) :)

[Ghostvirus]

Son it is a rarity when someone scores 60 points. Ray Allen has a great field goal percentage, but I doubt he will ever score 60 points in a single game.

First of all Steve Nash is a GREAT player, and is on top of his game right now...but he is no where even close to being an elite player. An elite player consistently has great years, year in and year out. Steve Nash just started playing at the level he is at, and he did so because he was put in a perfect system for him that was suited for his style of ball, and YES his teammates are far greater players than the ones Iverson has to deal with. Nash has 2 other all stars in his starting lineup alone, and the Suns were going just as far into the playoffs with Marbury at the helm as they did with Nash!!! Their style fit Nash to a tee as he was a product of a system, run all day long, and kick it to his slashers. Nash HAS no D, and you can't be an elite player w/o being able to play defense. And how can Nash be an elite player if he allowed his team to get their asses handed to them by the Spurs? At least AI has had the capability to be a one man wrecking crew and take his team all the way to the finals. As for the Barkley comment...no one takes heed to what he says, because he is ALWAYS running his mouth and saying the most off the wall bull ****. I remember a few years back he said something to the effect that Yao Ming would never score over 15 pts in a game.... that right there shows you how qualified he is to judge other ball players. AI holds it down on offense and defense EVERY YEAR, something that can't be said at all for Nash. But please, don't give me that the reason the Sixers went to the finals in 2001 was because of the coach. They would have been there every year if it was because Larry Brown was that good (and he isn't, he is actually overrated and an over emotional headcase). That season it was all Iverson, just as it is every year for the Sixers. He is the driving force for that team...they still really don't have anyone to rely on for consistant scoring. Andre Iguodala will be good eventually, but he isn't there right now. Plus Webber has too many nagging injuries to truly be effective. I can't believe I am having to argue with you that AI is in the elite in the NBA. Take Iverson away from the Sixers...and they might win 20 games..MAX. Take Nash away from the Suns, and they still win close to 45 games.

Elite Players in the League:
1) Timmy Duncan
2) KG
3) Shaq
4) Kobe
5) AI
6) T Mac
7) J. Kidd
8) Dirk "the Diggler" Nowitzki
9) LeBron James
10) Vince Carter

First this just screams blind fanboy! I think everyone here only needs one guess as to where you live.

1) Timmy Duncan (Agreed)

2) KG (he should be a little lower)

3) Shaq (He should be in the number one spot simple!)

4) Kobe (Why is he even here? if it wasn't for Shaq & Jackson he would be in the same position as Iverson except he probably wouldn't of made it to the finals. I thought that was proven last year?)

5) AI (He should be number ten simple!)

6) T Mac ( get him the hell off your list! It has even been stated by many experts that this guy has no idea what it takes to win.)

7) J. Kidd (Put him where Iverson is)

8) Dirk "the Diggler" Nowitzki (Just fine)

9) LeBron James (He should probably be in kobe position)

10) Vince Carter (Again why is he here? a few years ago when he was injured the raptors actually did better without him!)

[Super_Ludacris]

I think someone lost there League Pass subscription

[Eyeballing]

Son it is a rarity when someone scores 60 points. Ray Allen has a great field goal percentage, but I doubt he will ever score 60 points in a single game.

First of all Steve Nash is a GREAT player, and is on top of his game right now...but he is no where even close to being an elite player. An elite player consistently has great years, year in and year out. Steve Nash just started playing at the level he is at, and he did so because he was put in a perfect system for him that was suited for his style of ball, and YES his teammates are far greater players than the ones Iverson has to deal with. Nash has 2 other all stars in his starting lineup alone, and the Suns were going just as far into the playoffs with Marbury at the helm as they did with Nash!!! Their style fit Nash to a tee as he was a product of a system, run all day long, and kick it to his slashers. Nash HAS no D, and you can't be an elite player w/o being able to play defense. And how can Nash be an elite player if he allowed his team to get their asses handed to them by the Spurs? At least AI has had the capability to be a one man wrecking crew and take his team all the way to the finals. As for the Barkley comment...no one takes heed to what he says, because he is ALWAYS running his mouth and saying the most off the wall bull ****. I remember a few years back he said something to the effect that Yao Ming would never score over 15 pts in a game.... that right there shows you how qualified he is to judge other ball players. AI holds it down on offense and defense EVERY YEAR, something that can't be said at all for Nash. But please, don't give me that the reason the Sixers went to the finals in 2001 was because of the coach. They would have been there every year if it was because Larry Brown was that good (and he isn't, he is actually overrated and an over emotional headcase). That season it was all Iverson, just as it is every year for the Sixers. He is the driving force for that team...they still really don't have anyone to rely on for consistant scoring. Andre Iguodala will be good eventually, but he isn't there right now. Plus Webber has too many nagging injuries to truly be effective. I can't believe I am having to argue with you that AI is in the elite in the NBA. Take Iverson away from the Sixers...and they might win 20 games..MAX. Take Nash away from the Suns, and they still win close to 45 games.

Elite Players in the League:
1) Timmy Duncan
2) KG
3) Shaq
4) Kobe
5) AI
6) T Mac
7) J. Kidd
8) Dirk "the Diggler" Nowitzki
9) LeBron James
10) Vince Carter

Was Nash there the year before? Did they win 45 games? I didn't think so.

Tmac is overrated, and vince carter is also overrated.

[Whack Arnolds]

I think someone lost there League Pass subscriptionHahaha.

NBA League Pass operator: "Oh it's you again, my supervisors said not to accept any money transfer from you and to not allow you to have League Pass. They said something to the effect of you're an idiot and know nothing about basketball!!"

Maximum Carnage: "....."

[Super_Ludacris]

Was Nash there the year before? Did they win 45 games? I didn't think so.

Tmac is overrated, and vince carter is also overrated.


They did the year before with Steph though :o

[Whack Arnolds]

Was Nash there the year before? Did they win 45 games? I didn't think so.

Tmac is overrated, and vince carter is also overrated.Vince Carter single handedly turned the Nets season around and led them to the playoffs. If you remember they were headed for the Lottery until Vince came and picked up his game. As for T-Mac..HE WAS THE ROCKETS. He was the only one the team could rely on. Because I know 4th graders with more heart and aggressivness than Yao.

[Whack Arnolds]

They did the year before with Steph though :oAnd they also got in the asses of the Spurs, something that the Nash led Suns didn't do. :o

[Whack Arnolds]

First this just screams blind fanboy! I think everyone here only needs one guess as to where you live.

1) Timmy Duncan (Agreed)

2) KG (he should be a little lower)

3) Shaq (He should be in the number one spot simple!)

4) Kobe (Why is he even here? if it wasn't for Shaq & Jackson he would be in the same position as Iverson except he probably wouldn't of made it to the finals. I thought that was proven last year?)

5) AI (He should be number ten simple!)

6) T Mac ( get him the hell off your list! It has even been stated by many experts that this guy has no idea what it takes to win.)

7) J. Kidd (Put him where Iverson is)

8) Dirk "the Diggler" Nowitzki (Just fine)

9) LeBron James (He should probably be in kobe position)

10) Vince Carter (Again why is he here? a few years ago when he was injured the raptors actually did better without him!)Shaq didn't play well enough last year to be at the number one spot. And I doubt he will this year either. Once the playoffs begin is when he turns it on.

[Super_Ludacris]

Mac has one disatrous season (03-04) after 3 previous seasons carrying a squad in the playoffs with no talent and everyone gunning for him. Disgusting

[Ghostvirus]

T Mac was the Rockets!!! are stupid! FYI I don't have a league pass because I will never... NEVER!!! get satellite. You need to watch more ball "SON!" piss off!!

[Super_Ludacris]

T Mac was the Rockets!!! are stupid! FYI I don't have a league pass because I will never... NEVER!!! get satellite. You need to watch more ball "SON!" piss off!!


lol@this chump getting genuinley mad :o

[Eyeballing]

PREACH, thanks alot for the re-assurance. You definetely know your bball. Iverson is hands down the greatest player ever to play the game under 6'6". He is like Isiah Thomas version 2.0 +.

HA, how many rings did Isiah win? How many has AI won? Exactly, don't give me that bull**** about Iverson has to score, his team sucks blah blah blah. Isiah himself said. If I wanted I could score 40 points a night, but we wouldn't win.

He was all about the team and he knew what it took to win. Don't give me that bull**** that it's the coaching. When players get to the NBA they shouldn't need very much coaching at all.

Bobby Knight one of the greatest teachers of the game, if not the greatest. Himself said, if a coach does his job right he shouldn't have to be on the floor when the game is being played.

If Iverson ever wins anything maybe I will reconsider, but since he hasn't he is overrated. Did magic ever drop 60? Is Iverson better than him? Did Bird ever drop 60?

Look Iverson may very well when it's all over and done be in the top 50 greatest players of all time, then again maybe not.

I'm not questioning his heart, or desire to win or his talent. He plays hard night and night out. But dropping 60 does not make you elite, also not dropping 60 shouldn't disqualify you from being elite. When it all comes down to it, all that matters is the Championship.

[Ghostvirus]

lol@this chump getting genuinley mad :o

I am getting pissed because Nuk feels the need to demean people that don't agree with him. I don't like the same players he does. So what! don't tell me I don't know about basketball that bull! I love debates on sports. However when 3rd grader name calling starts to make its way into the convo it kills a good debate.

[Ghostvirus]

However all this bickering about Iverson is pointless. He is but a blip on the radar screen this year considering the strength of Miami.

[Eyeballing]

Vince Carter single handedly turned the Nets season around and led them to the playoffs. If you remember they were headed for the Lottery until Vince came and picked up his game. As for T-Mac..HE WAS THE ROCKETS. He was the only one the team could rely on. Because I know 4th graders with more heart and aggressivness than Yao.


I know fourth graders with more work ethic and disipline than T-Mac. :rolleyes: What do you want from Yao? His style of play is more of the Hakim, not that Hakim wasn't aggressive, but you can't challenge his heart. For one the guy is 7'5" and only weighs 310lbs and is only 25. On top of it the guy barely gets a break all year, he plays in the NBA 82 game seaon (which we all know it to long anyway) then the playoffs, then he has to go back to China and play for his coutnry. Then it's back here for summer league, then pracitce.

If he is still the same further down the line then okay, the kid is soft. But he is just entering his prime. To early to judge him fully. T-Mac on the other hand
is in his prime, best shape of his life and possibly the MOST talented player in the league. Does he play defense? No. You think that this guy ISN'T overrated?

His comment on when the NBA changed their policy on zone defense

" I never learned to play against it, so I don't think it's fair that they implement it now."

Wow, that's just brilliant, since he came straight out of highschool he thinks that the NBA shouldn't be allowed to change the leagues rules on defense since he doesn't know how to play against it? How about asking ummm I don't know, your COACH? Maybe pick up a book and read about it? How about study some film? Isn't that what this guy gets paid to do?

All he does is play basketball and he makes up excuses? That is some weak ass ****. Just plain lazy and shows he has no work ethic. Iverson maybe just slightly overrated, and maybe it may just be my opinion, but T-Max is definately overated. The guy could be hands down top 3 or even the best player in the league. But he is happy just to be as good as he is without having to work to be better.

[JMT]

T Mac was the Rockets!!! are stupid! FYI I don't have a league pass because I will never... NEVER!!! get satellite. You need to watch more ball "SON!" piss off!!
You really know nothing about basketball.
That comment about AI not having heart was enough.

[JMT]

I know fourth graders with more work ethic and disipline than T-Mac. :rolleyes: What do you want from Yao? His style of play is more of the Hakim, not that Hakim wasn't aggressive, but you can't challenge his heart. For one the guy is 7'5" and only weighs 310lbs and is only 25. On top of it the guy barely gets a break all year, he plays in the NBA 82 game seaon (which we all know it to long anyway) then the playoffs, then he has to go back to China and play for his coutnry. Then it's back here for summer league, then pracitce.

If he is still the same further down the line then okay, the kid is soft. But he is just entering his prime. To early to judge him fully. T-Mac on the other hand
is in his prime, best shape of his life and possibly the MOST talented player in the league. Does he play defense? No. You think that this guy ISN'T overrated?

His comment on when the NBA changed their policy on zone defense

" I never learned to play against it, so I don't think it's fair that they implement it now."

Wow, that's just brilliant, since he came straight out of highschool he thinks that the NBA shouldn't be allowed to change the leagues rules on defense since he doesn't know how to play against it? How about asking ummm I don't know, your COACH? Maybe pick up a book and read about it? How about study some film? Isn't that what this guy gets paid to do?

All he does is play basketball and he makes up excuses? That is some weak ass ****. Just plain lazy and shows he has no work ethic. Iverson maybe just slightly overrated, and maybe it may just be my opinion, but T-Max is definately overated. The guy could be hands down top 3 or even the best player in the league. But he is happy just to be as good as he is without having to work to be better.
Talent-wise, Yao is one of the worst players in the league. He is known just for his height, nothing else. He barely even has the fundamentals down

[Whack Arnolds]

Mac has one disatrous season (03-04) after 3 previous seasons carrying a squad in the playoffs with no talent and everyone gunning for him. DisgustingHe did lead the league in scoring though that year. Either way he is an elite player. He's the second best SG in the entire leage for christ sakes.

[Whack Arnolds]

I know fourth graders with more work ethic and disipline than T-Mac. :rolleyes: What do you want from Yao? His style of play is more of the Hakim, not that Hakim wasn't aggressive, but you can't challenge his heart. For one the guy is 7'5" and only weighs 310lbs and is only 25. On top of it the guy barely gets a break all year, he plays in the NBA 82 game seaon (which we all know it to long anyway) then the playoffs, then he has to go back to China and play for his coutnry. Then it's back here for summer league, then pracitce.

If he is still the same further down the line then okay, the kid is soft. But he is just entering his prime. To early to judge him fully. T-Mac on the other hand
is in his prime, best shape of his life and possibly the MOST talented player in the league. Does he play defense? No. You think that this guy ISN'T overrated?

His comment on when the NBA changed their policy on zone defense

" I never learned to play against it, so I don't think it's fair that they implement it now."

Wow, that's just brilliant, since he came straight out of highschool he thinks that the NBA shouldn't be allowed to change the leagues rules on defense since he doesn't know how to play against it? How about asking ummm I don't know, your COACH? Maybe pick up a book and read about it? How about study some film? Isn't that what this guy gets paid to do?

All he does is play basketball and he makes up excuses? That is some weak ass ****. Just plain lazy and shows he has no work ethic. Iverson maybe just slightly overrated, and maybe it may just be my opinion, but T-Max is definately overated. The guy could be hands down top 3 or even the best player in the league. But he is happy just to be as good as he is without having to work to be better.First of all, once again another douche who took a quote out of context. He wasn't saying it as if "how dare the NBA impliment this system because I have no knowledge of it"...that comment was reffering to the fact that zone defenses makes the game less fun (it does) as this elite athletic players are now limited in showing their physical abilities. Plus I think it is more fun to see someone have to man up and stop a player as to sag into a zone. That's the EASY way out... and they do it in college because not everyone is a superstar. In the NBA you have the best of the best. All most every player in the League was the best player on their college squad, so they all have skills to some extent. Playing zone limits things for the fans and the players. As for T-Mac's work ethic... what the hell do you know about his work ethic? Do you follow him around on a day to day basis? Are you his coach or trainer? Maybe even his teammate? I didn't think so... you probably have never even played on your high school squad, so what the hell would you know about playing ball? I'm sure T-Mac has a work ethic, it's obvious...he was the guy leading the Rockets the entire season and carrying them in the playoffs, with occasional help from Bobby Sura. There is no question he is an elite player.

[Whack Arnolds]

I am getting pissed because Nuk feels the need to demean people that don't agree with him. I don't like the same players he does. So what! don't tell me I don't know about basketball that bull! I love debates on sports. However when 3rd grader name calling starts to make its way into the convo it kills a good debate.you weren't debating. you were trying to kill Iverson's character by making fall statements with no actual facts behind them. I was bringing up facts that PROVE you wrong, and you were backing up your ridiculous statements with bias opinion. Same goes for the argument with T-Mac.

[Eyeballing]

First of all, once again another douche who took a quote out of context. He wasn't saying it as if "how dare the NBA impliment this system because I have no knowledge of it"...that comment was reffering to the fact that zone defenses makes the game less fun (it does) as this elite athletic players are now limited in showing their physical abilities. Plus I think it is more fun to see someone have to man up and stop a player as to sag into a zone. That's the EASY way out... and they do it in college because not everyone is a superstar. In the NBA you have the best of the best. All most every player in the League was the best player on their college squad, so they all have skills to some extent. Playing zone limits things for the fans and the players. As for T-Mac's work ethic... what the hell do you know about his work ethic? Do you follow him around on a day to day basis? Are you his coach or trainer? Maybe even his teammate? I didn't think so... you probably have never even played on your high school squad, so what the hell would you know about playing ball? I'm sure T-Mac has a work ethic, it's obvious...he was the guy leading the Rockets the entire season and carrying them in the playoffs, with occasional help from Bobby Sura. There is no question he is an elite player.


Appraently your ignorance knows no bounds. You'r right I didn't play basketball in highschool so I guess that means I know nothing of the game. I mean Dennis Rodman must not know a damn thing since he didn't play start playing basketball until he was in his 20's. :rolleyes:

Again you'r right I wouldn't know about his work ethic since I don't follow him around on a daily basis. I mean only every team he has been on his coaches and teammates say he does not have a good work ethic. Also you can tell that he is not into working out all that much. Look at his body, he is just naturally built that way, has been since he came into the league and still is.

Look at guys like Bonds, Kobe, Shaq, Walter Payton, Jerry Rice, you can TELL they work out and have a good work ethic you can see it in their body and their performances. Like I said T-Mac is a great player and probably the MOST naturally talented in the leauge but that's all he relys on.

His numbers have been close to the same his entire career. Imagine how much better he could be if he actually worked hard. I'm sure he plays basketball all the time to stay on top of his game and his skills. But what does he do beyond that? Lift weights? Study Film? Learn more about the game?

Stop yoru narrow minded thinking and putting others down thinking that you know all there is to know about basketball. As I said you have your opinion and I have mine, stop trying to force your views onto me. I'm not doing so to you, simply stating my opinion and view. You don't have to agree with me and that's fine I don't care if you do. I am simply stating what I think, it's not fact just the same as what you think is not fact.

[Whack Arnolds]

HA, how many rings did Isiah win? How many has AI won? Exactly, don't give me that bull**** about Iverson has to score, his team sucks blah blah blah. Isiah himself said. If I wanted I could score 40 points a night, but we wouldn't win.Because he didn't need to like Iverson does. He had one of the greatest supporting casts ever. Let me list some of those players, which all were All-Star caliber players:
Bill Lambier
Dennis Rodman
Rick Mahorne
Mark Aguirre
Joe Dumars
Vinnie Johnson


He was all about the team and he knew what it took to win. Don't give me that bull**** that it's the coaching. When players get to the NBA they shouldn't need very much coaching at all.

Bobby Knight one of the greatest teachers of the game, if not the greatest. Himself said, if a coach does his job right he shouldn't have to be on the floor when the game is being played.That's exactly the point. It wasn't Larry Brown leading the team. It is up to the players to go out and get it done. The coach is just the template. It wasn't Larry Brown "leading" them into the finals. It was AI. And having the ability like AI to carry your entire team without a legitimate number 2 option puts you in an elite category as well.

If Iverson ever wins anything maybe I will reconsider, but since he hasn't he is overrated. Did magic ever drop 60? Is Iverson better than him? Did Bird ever drop 60?So are you saying someone is overrated till they win a championship? Was Jordan overrated for the first 7 years of his career because he had yet to win a championship? I don't think so... Sometimes its just not in the cards for a player to win. No but bird Dropped 50 and 40 many a time. And having the ability to do that many times puts you up there as an elite player in itself.

Look Iverson may very well when it's all over and done be in the top 50 greatest players of all time, then again maybe not.He already is, off pure stats alone.

I'm not questioning his heart, or desire to win or his talent.Yes you did, don't cop out on your previous statement. You said A.I. had no heart, when he clearly has the most in the ENTIRE League. Please don't make me back track and find it for you. :o Or maybe that was the clown known as Maximum Carnage?


He plays hard night and night out.Damn skip., probably the hardest in the league.

But dropping 60 does not make you elite, also not dropping 60 shouldn't disqualify you from being elite.Did I say that was the reason he was/or wasn't elite? No... But you have to have elite level of talent to be able to do that. Plain and simple.

When it all comes down to it, all that matters is the Championship.
Does it really? So that means Reggie Miller, Karl Malone, Charles Barkely, John Stockton are all overrated and weren't elite players and are not Hall of Famers and a few of the best ever to play the game?

Does winning rings equate to being a better player? Bill Cartwright won more rings than Karl Malone, Charles Barkely, Pat Ewing, Hakeen etc. does that mean he is a better individual player? No... your argument is flawed from the start.

[Whack Arnolds]

Appraently your ignorance knows no bounds. You'r right I didn't play basketball in highschool so I guess that means I know nothing of the game. I mean Dennis Rodman must not know a damn thing since he didn't play start playing basketball until he was in his 20's. :rolleyes:

Again you'r right I wouldn't know about his work ethic since I don't follow him around on a daily basis. I mean only every team he has been on his coaches and teammates say he does not have a good work ethic. Also you can tell that he is not into working out all that much. Look at his body, he is just naturally built that way, has been since he came into the league and still is.

Look at guys like Bonds, Kobe, Shaq, Walter Payton, Jerry Rice, you can TELL they work out and have a good work ethic you can see it in their body and their performances. Like I said T-Mac is a great player and probably the MOST naturally talented in the leauge but that's all he relys on.

His numbers have been close to the same his entire career. Imagine how much better he could be if he actually worked hard. I'm sure he plays basketball all the time to stay on top of his game and his skills. But what does he do beyond that? Lift weights? Study Film? Learn more about the game?

Stop yoru narrow minded thinking and putting others down thinking that you know all there is to know about basketball. As I said you have your opinion and I have mine, stop trying to force your views onto me. I'm not doing so to you, simply stating my opinion and view. You don't have to agree with me and that's fine I don't care if you do. I am simply stating what I think, it's not fact just the same as what you think is not fact.Don't be so ignorant and stupid to say dumb **** like T-Mac doesn't work hard. Because that is an opinion and an argument based entirely off speculation on your part. And no T-Mac's numbers haven;t been the same through out his entire career. He obviouslly worked on his game and came into his own from when he was on the Raptors to where he is now. Eventually players peak off and they stay at a similair status, especially in terms of stats. No one's numbers keep going up every year, they fluctuate or level off...

[Whack Arnolds]

You really know nothing about basketball.
That comment about AI not having heart was enough.YUP. :up:

[Go Web Go!]

The Phoenix Suns will be without all-star forward Amare Stoudemire for about four months after he underwent surgery to repair damage to his injured left knee Tuesday.

And "bye bye" to the Suns championship hopes. They'll be lucky to make it into the playoffs.

[ledzep96]

the knicks got curry they are going to the playoffs

[MakeMineMarvel]

This will be a tell-tale season for T-Mac. He actually has a contention ready team and if there was ever a point to showcase leadership and turning it up a notch, it is here. To claim that he is overrated would be a bit much, however, considering stats prove otherwise. It is understood that defense is the other part of the game and a part that he has not locked down as of yet, but being of lesser defensive stock does not qualify you as an overrated player. He has carried the Rockets and the Magic as well as posting some gaudy numbers and performances. He has proven to not be a flash in the pan and more than a dunker.

AI isn't even up for debate. Isiah is the only player you can even put up against him, inch for inch. "Is there no one else?" No. Name me a better guy, 6'2" and under. Offense, heart, defense, heart, durability, HEART. He's scored 40 or more 50 times, but he's also posted triple doubles, led the team in rebounding in numerous games (at 6'0", maybe) and also holds the single season steals record for the Sixers. Add to that numerous All-Star appearances, a trip to the Finals with a less than competitive team and you have one of the elite.

Ewing went to one Finals. Is he not an elite center? Stockton went to two. Elite point guard? Barkley went to a Finals. Elite power forward? Yes, yes and yes. How is AI not on the list?

[Whack Arnolds]

This will be a tell-tale season for T-Mac. He actually has a contention ready team and if there was ever a point to showcase leadership and turning it up a notch, it is here. To claim that he is overrated would be a bit much, however, considering stats prove otherwise. It is understood that defense is the other part of the game and a part that he has not locked down as of yet, but being of lesser defensive stock does not qualify you as an overrated player. He has carried the Rockets and the Magic as well as posting some gaudy numbers and performances. He has proven to not be a flash in the pan and more than a dunker.

AI isn't even up for debate. Isiah is the only player you can even put up against him, inch for inch. "Is there no one else?" No. Name me a better guy, 6'2" and under. Offense, heart, defense, heart, durability, HEART. He's scored 40 or more 50 times, but he's also posted triple doubles, led the team in rebounding in numerous games (at 6'0", maybe) and also holds the single season steals record for the Sixers. Add to that numerous All-Star appearances, a trip to the Finals with a less than competitive team and you have one of the elite.

Ewing went to one Finals. Is he not an elite center? Stockton went to two. Elite point guard? Barkley went to a Finals. Elite power forward? Yes, yes and yes. How is AI not on the list?Exactly, absolute beautiful post. People forget that A.I. jus doesn't do it on the offensive end, he does it on defense as well. I think the reason for their dislike for him is his image, and he may be a little too "street" for them and they rather root for the "non threatning" African Americans that conforms more towards regular White American looks and values. At least that is my opinion, but that is generally the consensus that is against him is middle aged, un-cool (j/k), middle class white Americans. They see him as being of some sort of threat because of his look. But if you actually read up on Iverson, he is the family man that most people dream of being. He is so good with kids, he was prone to ignore Larry Brown before games as he played with HIS kids. A.I. is by no means a bad character, don't simply judge someone by their outward appearance.

[Whack Arnolds]

I LOVE the Bobcat jerseys!!!

http://www.dimemag.com/Gallery_Piece/piece_2.jpg
http://www.dimemag.com/Gallery_Piece/piece_5.jpg
http://www.dimemag.com/Gallery_Piece/piece_19.jpg

[JMT]

Boner! :up:

[LarryLegend]

PREACH, thanks alot for the re-assurance. You definetely know your bball. Iverson is hands down the greatest player ever to play the game under 6'6". He is like Isiah Thomas version 2.0 +.

Oscar Robertson was 6ft5 and so was Elgin Baylor. Both better than AI and both under 6ft6.

[Eyeballing]

Exactly, absolute beautiful post. People forget that A.I. jus doesn't do it on the offensive end, he does it on defense as well. I think the reason for their dislike for him is his image, and he may be a little too "street" for them and they rather root for the "non threatning" African Americans that conforms more towards regular White American looks and values. At least that is my opinion, but that is generally the consensus that is against him is middle aged, un-cool (j/k), middle class white Americans. They see him as being of some sort of threat because of his look. But if you actually read up on Iverson, he is the family man that most people dream of being. He is so good with kids, he was prone to ignore Larry Brown before games as he played with HIS kids. A.I. is by no means a bad character, don't simply judge someone by their outward appearance.

Now your making assumptions about the way we think? As Peter Griffin would say "stop it, stop it"

[ledzep96]

ok i no a.i. is a very good player but he just needs to shut up for a whole season




practice we're talkin about practice

[BK]

I LOVE the Bobcat jerseys!!!

http://www.dimemag.com/Gallery_Piece/piece_2.jpg
http://www.dimemag.com/Gallery_Piece/piece_5.jpg
http://www.dimemag.com/Gallery_Piece/piece_19.jpg
I love it when girls wear their shirts like that! http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v132/Dex4788/Smilies/Shocked/011.gif

[Go Web Go!]

I LOVE the Bobcat jerseys!!!

http://www.dimemag.com/Gallery_Piece/piece_2.jpg
http://www.dimemag.com/Gallery_Piece/piece_5.jpg
http://www.dimemag.com/Gallery_Piece/piece_19.jpg

I don't. It's in the way!

[Whack Arnolds]

ok i no a.i. is a very good player but he just needs to shut up for a whole season




practice we're talkin about practiceLook at his first preseason game. 23 points in 23 minutes of play and he shot 8-14.... Dude has a sick game. And once again that quote is taken out of context. I think its funny, because he does play hard in practice.

[Super_Ludacris]

Ah crap I just saw Sportscenter and they said that Amare injury is smilar to what Penny Hardaway had :( . They gotta be careful, Penny's inital mistake was trying to come back early and further damage the knee (as well as being timidly confused and having misdiagnosed reports from the whack ass Orlando Magic medical team). I'm concerned about how this affects the kid's future cause he's a superstar

[Equint77]

Ah crap I just saw Sportscenter and they said that Amare injury is smilar to what Penny Hardaway had :( . They gotta be careful, Penny's inital mistake was trying to come back early and further damage the knee (as well as being timidly confused and having misdiagnosed reports from the whack ass Orlando Magic medical team). I'm concerned about how this affects the kid's future cause he's a superstar

Yeah I was about to post that.. that Amare has the same injury that slowed Anfernee down.

The Suns are in a corner cause they already lost 2 of their starters from last years team.. now they've lost their leading scorer and possibly main threat. They have to make due without that for 4 months in the West... and by that time the might have played themselves out of the playoffs.

Then they have to watch out they don't rush him back too soon and really really screw themselves over. Like I said in my previous post.... it's amazing how one injury to your superstar can throw a whole season.

[Super_Ludacris]

Shawn Marion has got to be on some God Body T-Mac in 2000-2003 and Penny in 95 type ish for real

[MakeMineMarvel]

So much for Amare jumping. People need to stop naming their b-ball talented kids funky "A" names. Anfernee used to be able to "spring" jam at the bucket and became all finga' rolls after the injury. Amare is 6'10" so it'll be a little different but probably no more arcing-arm-swing dunks from the lower part of the circle ...

[Equint77]

I read that Jason Kidd, Houston and Webber have had the same surgery. Not sure if that's any better news but Kidd manages to play without really showing after effects.

[Equint77]

I was watching this show on NBATV that had shaq doing some charity game for Kids and asked Wade to participate..

Now it could have been just acting for the camera but I don't think it is... cause you can actually tell how much Shaq likes being around Dwayne... it's like night and day compared to when he was with Hardaway or Kobe.

And I never really thought Shaq was a bad guy so it makes me wonder much much more of a jackass Kobe is behind the scenes.

[Whack Arnolds]

I was watching this show on NBATV that had shaq doing some charity game for Kids and asked Wade to participate..

Now it could have been just acting for the camera but I don't think it is... cause you can actually tell how much Shaq likes being around Dwayne... it's like night and day compared to when he was with Hardaway or Kobe.

And I never really thought Shaq was a bad guy so it makes me wonder much much more of a jackass Kobe is behind the scenes.Definetely dude... plus Kobe has always had an enormous ego and I'm sure that doesn't help. I personally know Dwyane, and he is one of the most down to earth kids you can meet, and he truly is just an overall good dude. His wife is a nice lady as well, and they been together for God knows how long.. Shaq was never known to be a bad guy, he is actually another good hearted person. Penny isn't a "bad character" like Kobe off the court, I think his problems with Shaq stemmed from on the court problems. Kobe was confrontational both on the court and off. And it always seemed he had a "houlier than thou" attitude towards everybody. But aside from all that, my cousin is a lawyer out in L.A., and she met Kobe Bryant in person on her birthday at a club and her friends got him to wish her Happy Birthday and he gave her a kiss. So at least he seems to be nice, but maybe it was because it was a white girl...and we all know how much Kobe secretly loves white women. :p

[The Joker™]

I think the media might intentionally portray Kobe to be like that.

If not, Shaq has always seemed like such a nice guy though I don't know how Kobe couldn't get along with him.

[The Joker™]

Ah crap I just saw Sportscenter and they said that Amare injury is smilar to what Penny Hardaway had :( . They gotta be careful, Penny's inital mistake was trying to come back early and further damage the knee (as well as being timidly confused and having misdiagnosed reports from the whack ass Orlando Magic medical team). I'm concerned about how this affects the kid's future cause he's a superstar



I hope it doesn't effect him in NBA live.

I killed all my friends last year with the Suns. :joker:

[Equint77]

Definetely dude... plus Kobe has always had an enormous ego and I'm sure that doesn't help. I personally know Dwyane, and he is one of the most down to earth kids you can meet, and he truly is just an overall good dude. His wife is a nice lady as well, and they been together for God knows how long.. Shaq was never known to be a bad guy, he is actually another good hearted person. Penny isn't a "bad character" like Kobe off the court, I think his problems with Shaq stemmed from on the court problems. Kobe was confrontational both on the court and off. And it always seemed he had a "houlier than thou" attitude towards everybody. But aside from all that, my cousin is a lawyer out in L.A., and she met Kobe Bryant in person on her birthday at a club and her friends got him to wish her Happy Birthday and he gave her a kiss. So at least he seems to be nice, but maybe it was because it was a white girl...and we all know how much Kobe secretly loves white women. :p

1 - I geniuinely believe Wade is a great guy and he's one of the true players I root for not wearing a Knick uniform. And it was great watching him and Shaq have fun with those kids playing basketball.

2 - Yeah... when Shaq first came into the league I wasn't his biggest fan... but I watch how much he gets along with his teammates and how much fun he wants to have... I'd give anything to have a player like that on my team... as well as his rebounding, scoring... :D

3 - From day 1 Kobe has had an agenda and that was to eclipse Jordan.. in every way possible. And I'm not surprised he's now one of the least wanted spokespeople in the NBA. And it's kinda funny cause when he was a FA I was hoping he'd make a sign and trade with NY... but that changed quickly... I started to realize he'd just screw the team up with his ego. I'm really interested in seeing how he and Phil are gonna work together.

4 - And yeah.. you should tell your friend to bring a taser with her if she ever runs into Kobe again... LOL. When I think about it.. Kobe must not be the man he thinks he is.... doesn't anyone remember a few years ago. Karl Malone was hitting on his wife? LMAO.... that grandfather tried to take Kobe's woman... at laker games no less. :D

Classic.

[The Joker™]

I can't imagine how much s**t Kobe must talk well hes guarding you.

They said Jordan talk the most, but with Kobe's ego hardly fitting in the stadium I'm suprised nobodys hit him yet.

[Equint77]

I can't imagine how much s**t Kobe must talk well hes guarding you.

They said Jordan talk the most, but with Kobe's ego hardly fitting in the stadium I'm suprised nobodys hit him yet.


I'm sure someone will and it'll probably be from his own team. :o


I don't wish anything wrong on the guy but damn... he spent 4 Million on a ring to say sorry for cheating on her... But I guess when she could have divorced his ass and taken half his salary.. I guess 4 million is a bargain. :eek:

[Whack Arnolds]

I'm sure someone will and it'll probably be from his own team. :o


I don't wish anything wrong on the guy but damn... he spent 4 Million on a ring to say sorry for cheating on her... But I guess when she could have divorced his ass and taken half his salary.. I guess 4 million is a bargain. :eek:Look for the videoa of Chris Childs on the Knicks whooping his ass like he was Ali throwing a combo. Or the video of Reggie Miller beating him up on the scores table. :eek:
Kobe always has been a *****.

[Equint77]

Look for the videoa of Chris Childs on the Knicks whooping his ass like he was Ali throwing a combo. Or the video of Reggie Miller beating him up on the scores table. :eek:
Kobe always has been a *****.

Yeah... I remember that game against LA... it was funny how Chris socked him in the jaw... :D

Now if only Shaq would punch his face... but I'm afaid he'd end up killing him. :eek:

[Whack Arnolds]

Yeah... I remember that game against LA... it was funny how Chris socked him in the jaw... :D

Now if only Shaq would punch his face... but I'm afaid he'd end up killing him. :eek:If Shaq hit anybody he would kill them. He just hit some dude in a club recently for looking at his wife...

[Equint77]

http://aol.nba.com/media/knicks/Nate-Robinson.gif

For all the talk about LB not liking rooks.. he's given praise to all 3... Frye, Lee and Nate.

If he can find them minutes as well as speed up their development.... man.. when will NOVEMBER GET HERE!!!

[NOFX]

Hmmm Didnt know about this thread...But anyways Ill be rooting for Lakers and the Clippers but I hope the Heat will go all the way.

[Whack Arnolds]

http://aol.nba.com/media/knicks/Nate-Robinson.gif

For all the talk about LB not liking rooks.. he's given praise to all 3... Frye, Lee and Nate.

If he can find them minutes as well as speed up their development.... man.. when will NOVEMBER GET HERE!!!I was just talking to him on the internet....

[Go Web Go!]

While we're talking about Kobe...I don't know, I think he's really fake. It feels as if he's forcing himself to do all this charity work and what not to help repair his image. He doesn't seem like the sincerest guy in the world.

Oh, and who heard about Darko getting arrested? Hehe. Good stuff right there (driving with a suspended license for those wondering)

[Equint77]

While we're talking about Kobe...I don't know, I think he's really fake. It feels as if he's forcing himself to do all this charity work and what not to help repair his image. He doesn't seem like the sincerest guy in the world.

Oh, and who heard about Darko getting arrested? Hehe. Good stuff right there (driving with a suspended license for those wondering)


they should arrest him for perpetrating an NBA player.

[Lobo]

H20 is no more


Allan Houston retires :)

[Super_Ludacris]

word?

[Whack Arnolds]

yeap, dude retired..it's about time though..he wasn't gonna get any play anyway. Especially with Penny and Nate playing so well in preseason!!!

[Super_Ludacris]

Penny's playing well?

*inserts Tease alert*

[Lobo]

I wonder if the Knicks will give Houston a job within the orginazation?

[Eyeballing]

Penny's playing well?

*inserts Tease alert*


Wow I'm shocked :eek:

[BK]

^^ I demand you to send me a pm of the full gif of your avvy. :up:

[Lobo]

^^ I demand you to send me a pm of the full gif of your avvy. :up:



I'd like that pm as well ;)

[The Riddler]

the rockets will win the championship.

[The Riddler]

1 - I geniuinely believe Wade is a great guy and he's one of the true players I root for not wearing a Knick uniform. And it was great watching him and Shaq have fun with those kids playing basketball.

2 - Yeah... when Shaq first came into the league I wasn't his biggest fan... but I watch how much he gets along with his teammates and how much fun he wants to have... I'd give anything to have a player like that on my team... as well as his rebounding, scoring... :D

3 - From day 1 Kobe has had an agenda and that was to eclipse Jordan.. in every way possible. And I'm not surprised he's now one of the least wanted spokespeople in the NBA. And it's kinda funny cause when he was a FA I was hoping he'd make a sign and trade with NY... but that changed quickly... I started to realize he'd just screw the team up with his ego. I'm really interested in seeing how he and Phil are gonna work together.

4 - And yeah.. you should tell your friend to bring a taser with her if she ever runs into Kobe again... LOL. When I think about it.. Kobe must not be the man he thinks he is.... doesn't anyone remember a few years ago. Karl Malone was hitting on his wife? LMAO.... that grandfather tried to take Kobe's woman... at laker games no less. :D

Classic.
the scary thing is, kobe is a better all around player tha jordan, he's stronger, has a better shot (especially three point range) and can defend almost as well.

the only way he can prove he's like jordan though, is if he wins without shaq. i'm pretty sure that was his mind set.

[The Riddler]

While we're talking about Kobe...I don't know, I think he's really fake. It feels as if he's forcing himself to do all this charity work and what not to help repair his image. He doesn't seem like the sincerest guy in the world.

Oh, and who heard about Darko getting arrested? Hehe. Good stuff right there (driving with a suspended license for those wondering)
the funny thing is, prior to the rape allegeations, he was considered an all around nice guy.

i think it's funny that because he cheated on his wife, everyone thinks he's an a-hole.

[The Riddler]

I wonder if the Knicks will give Houston a job within the orginazation?
why?

allen houston is scrub anyway.

[Super_Ludacris]

the funny thing is, prior to the rape allegeations, he was considered an all around nice guy.

i think it's funny that because he cheated on his wife, everyone thinks he's an a-hole.


Before the rape charge most people thought he was a cocky wannabe Jordan, certainly with most heads. It was White America that was feeling him

[The Riddler]

Before the rape charge most people thought he was a cocky wannabe Jordan, certainly with most heads. It was White America that was feeling him
ok...

[Super_Ludacris]

ok...


oh come on you know it. Did you like Kobe before the rape charge anyways? Most NBA fans I knew that he was arrgoant and trying to be like Jordan (which he does, on and off the court) and was on Shaq's coatails. It was a reaction to his popularity with younger suburban bandwagon fans and bandwagon Laker fans

[The Riddler]

oh come on you know it. Did you like Kobe before the rape charge anyways? Most NBA fans I knew that he was arrgoant and trying to be like Jordan (which he does, on and off the court) and was on Shaq's coatails. It was a reaction to his popularity with younger suburban bandwagon fans and bandwagon Laker fans
i didn't like kobe as much before the rape allegations because i hated how he was playing almost as well as jordan.

now that he'll never challenge jordan, in terms of being the greatest, i like him a lot more.

kobe is still the best player in the nba at the moment.

[Super_Ludacris]

kobe is still the best player in the nba at the moment.

I'm sorry, did Kevin Garnett, Tim Duncan, Tracy McGrady, Allen Iverson and Steve Nash die?

[The Riddler]

I'm sorry, did Kevin Garnett, Tim Duncan, Tracy McGrady, Allen Iverson and Steve Nash die?
skill wise, kobe is the best player in the nba.

the only guy, that can challenge him skill wise is t-mac and though his defense is getting better, he's still not as a good a defender as kobe is.

[Super_Ludacris]

skill wise, kobe is the best player in the nba.

the only guy, that can challenge him skill wise is t-mac and though his defense is getting better, he's still not as a good a defender as kobe is.

Kevin Garnett trumps him. A 7 footer with the ability to damn near run the floor by himself on any position. Inside, outside defense, offense

[The Riddler]

Kevin Garnett trumps him. A 7 footer with the ability to damn near run the floor by himself on any position. Inside, outside defense, offense
garnett doesn't play defense that well.

he gets blocks, but he isn't a real good defender.

plus, i think kobe being clutch, gives him an edge.

[Equint77]

I wonder if the Knicks will give Houston a job within the orginazation?

he says he wants to continue to be part of the team... and because he's friends with the owner... it's likely he will.

I never had a problem with Allan... he's had some of the most memorable games in the last 10 years. the shot against miami... game 6 against Indy in the 1999 ECF.

I'm 50/50 on his retirement. On one hand I'm glad he's decided to call it quits cause the team is moving in a younger direction and lets that plan move ahead. It also gives the Knicks cap relief as well as being able to get some money to sign another player using the money they'll recieve off medical exception.

On the other hand I wish his knee heeled so he could play this season.. he'd be a great bench player... spot up shooter to free up Steph, JC, Curry, even QR.

I want him to remain a Knick though.

[Whack Arnolds]

skill wise, kobe is the best player in the nba.

the only guy, that can challenge him skill wise is t-mac and though his defense is getting better, he's still not as a good a defender as kobe is.I love you and all Riddler...but NO he isn't. You're kind of biased being from California and all... I could go into why he isn't as good, but it would be redundant.

[Equint77]

garnett doesn't play defense that well.

he gets blocks, but he isn't a real good defender.

plus, i think kobe being clutch, gives him an edge.

At certain points in the game you see KG guarding all 5 positions.. from 1 - 5.

Who does that?

You'll never see Kobe go from guarding the PG to the PF.

[NOFX]

At certain points in the game you see KG guarding all 5 positions.. from 1 - 5.

Who does that?

You'll never see Kobe go from guarding the PG to the PF.
KG doesnt make his teammates better....Wait a mins Kobe doenst either :confused:

[Doomed_hero]

I still think Kobe is the best all around player as well. Thats not to take anything from Duncan, Garnett, or Nash, but Kobe just has a better all around game from what I have seen. However they each have something Kobe doesn't have yet which gives them the edge against him, there able to lead there teams. Thats the step Kobe has to work on if he wants to get more respect like they have.

[Eyeballing]

I love you and all Riddler...but NO he isn't. You're kind of biased being from California and all... I could go into why he isn't as good, but it would be redundant.


And your extremley biased towards your own opinion Nuk Nuk. I'm not putting you down or trying to start a fight, it just seems that you like to think yourself the know all NBA source around here.

Yes I know I am very stubborn as well when it comes to my own opinion. But I am from CA as well, and I can't stand Kobe I don't care for him as a player or as a person.

But the kid is phenomenal. His major set backs are his attitude, leadership and the ability to make the players around him better. Other than that offensivley and defensively he is a great talent. Do I think he is the best player in the league, no close though.

[Go Web Go!]

Who took part in the SHH Fantasy Draft last night? How did you guys do?

And opening night is less than a week away. I'll be there! Woohoo!

[Kipobe]

The Kings played horribly tonight, but I'm still very positive about the Lakers defense. Their defense really was poised, and gives me a good feeling about this season, despite the obvious of not having exactly the best team.

I think the Phil/Kobe situation will stay tempered and businesslike for the most part... but that's gonna require some wins, or at the very least, some positive losses.

I'm really pumped about this season. Way more than I was about last season! :cool:

[The Dude]

Who took part in the SHH Fantasy Draft last night? How did you guys do?

And opening night is less than a week away. I'll be there! Woohoo!

I did. I think it went alright. I'm weak at the center position and have a few potential injury conserns but other than that I'm pretty soild. I have a good group of guards that I hope can take me far

[NOFX]

The Kings played horribly tonight, but I'm still very positive about the Lakers defense. Their defense really was poised, and gives me a good feeling about this season, despite the obvious of not having exactly the best team.

I think the Phil/Kobe situation will stay tempered and businesslike for the most part... but that's gonna require some wins, or at the very least, some positive losses.

I'm really pumped about this season. Way more than I was about last season! :cool:
Last season was a throw away season!!! I am too excited this season not just for the Lakers but the clippers as well!:)

[Kipobe]

Eh... never was much of a Clippers fan, but I'd cheer for them over others, no doubt... even against Miami (another favorite of mine...)

Lakers are looking good. I don't understand all this "they won't make the playoffs" garbage. They will! You have it here in text to quote in February if you like... THE LAKERS WILL MAKE THE PLAYOFFS!!

[Eyeballing]

Bah lakers shhhmakers. IF Kobe distributes the ball they might but the west is so stacked if he trys to do it all himself not a chance. Plus Phil is not a Larry Brown type coach he doesn't turn bad teams around he turns good teams into champs.

But we shall see if he really is the master.

[Whack Arnolds]

And your extremley biased towards your own opinion Nuk Nuk. I'm not putting you down or trying to start a fight, it just seems that you like to think yourself the know all NBA source around here.

Yes I know I am very stubborn as well when it comes to my own opinion. But I am from CA as well, and I can't stand Kobe I don't care for him as a player or as a person.

But the kid is phenomenal. His major set backs are his attitude, leadership and the ability to make the players around him better. Other than that offensivley and defensively he is a great talent. Do I think he is the best player in the league, no close though.But that doesn't mean he is THE most skilled player in the league. He is one of the better all around players..no doubt. But he lacks court vision and/or the ability to properly distribute the ball to even be considered the best all around player. In fact, Dwyane Wade as of right now is a better all around player than Kobe. He may not be on the level of Kobe at certain skills and/or aspects..but D. Wade is a better overall player. And I'm not even getting into the Timmy Duncans or KG's of the league that can seemingly do everything.

[JMT]

I missed the draft last night.
I got an alright team.
Gilbert Arenas babyyyyy

[Whack Arnolds]

Bah lakers shhhmakers. IF Kobe distributes the ball they might but the west is so stacked if he trys to do it all himself not a chance. Plus Phil is not a Larry Brown type coach he doesn't turn bad teams around he turns good teams into champs.

But we shall see if he really is the master.Well we have never really seen Phil get a chance to turn a bad team around... so we don't know that for sure. They will at least 10 more games this year, just due to his precense. I guarantee it.

[C-$]

If you're a Atlanta Hawk fan, can you please tell how Marvin Williams has looked in the preseason so for?

[Immortalfire]

The other night he had 11 points and 13 rebounds in the win over New Orleans.

[C-$]

The other night he had 11 points and 13 rebounds in the win over New Orleans.

Thanks! :up:

[Eyeballing]

But that doesn't mean he is THE most skilled player in the league. He is one of the better all around players..no doubt. But he lacks court vision and/or the ability to properly distribute the ball to even be considered the best all around player. In fact, Dwyane Wade as of right now is a better all around player than Kobe. He may not be on the level of Kobe at certain skills and/or aspects..but D. Wade is a better overall player. And I'm not even getting into the Timmy Duncans or KG's of the league that can seemingly do everything.

I agree, I wasn't saying he is THE MOST SKILLED. I would gladly take Wade over Kobe anyday. His rookie season the same as James and Anthony I was on the D. Wade bus not james or Anthony. I watched him play at Marquette and get college player of the year award. So I'm with you on that and with Kobe.

I agree with KG and Duncan as well, incredible players. :up:

[Whack Arnolds]

I agree, I wasn't saying he is THE MOST SKILLED. I would gladly take Wade over Kobe anyday. His rookie season the same as James and Anthony I was on the D. Wade bus not james or Anthony. I watched him play at Marquette and get college player of the year award. So I'm with you on that and with Kobe.

I agree with KG and Duncan as well, incredible players. :up:With that post, you are now one of my favorite people on this board. Nice to see someone who liked D. Wade before he blew up in the NBA. :up:

[Whack Arnolds]

BTW in pre-season..Nate Robinson has been arguably NYC best player thus far...

[Kipobe]

With that post, you are now one of my favorite people on this board. Nice to see someone who liked D. Wade before he blew up in the NBA. :up:
I was talking about him long before he hit the league. Phenominal player.... and I'm glad he ended up in Miami (if he wasn't gonna go to either the Clippers or the Lakers. Actually, I'm glad he didn't go to the Clips because his career woulda been over.....)

Anyway, the fact is Wade is probably the better player because he already knows how to adapt his playing skills to an organized team. He's young, and doesn't have the experience Kobe has... but he definately has the potential to surpass him. Wade is phenominal. Kobe is extremely talented too... but the one thing that's giving him the edge is that playoff knowledge. Wade is getting there though.

I'd like to see these guys in about 5 years becoming real rivals.

[Equint77]

BTW in pre-season..Nate Robinson has been arguably NYC best player thus far...

Nate isn't the best player in NY... but he is the most exciting player they have.

He's made rookie mistakes and that's expected... He also needs to improve his decision making.. as well as working on a mid-range jumpshot.

I'm hoping he gets his minutes this season.. and I have a feeling all 3 rookies will get their time... LB likes their hustle and skill which is great considering he's never been a fan of rookies.

If he gives all 3 their minutes.. you just have to imagine how much he must have hated Darko.

[Eyeballing]

I was talking about him long before he hit the league. Phenominal player.... and I'm glad he ended up in Miami (if he wasn't gonna go to either the Clippers or the Lakers. Actually, I'm glad he didn't go to the Clips because his career woulda been over.....)

Anyway, the fact is Wade is probably the better player because he already knows how to adapt his playing skills to an organized team. He's young, and doesn't have the experience Kobe has... but he definately has the potential to surpass him. Wade is phenominal. Kobe is extremely talented too... but the one thing that's giving him the edge is that playoff knowledge. Wade is getting there though.

I'd like to see these guys in about 5 years becoming real rivals.


IMPO I think Wade was the best of the three rookies that year. His stats didn't show it but even in the post season he already showed that he could not only get into pressure situations but handle them as well. The kid is amazing and I think he still doesn't get his due.

[Equint77]

IMPO I think Wade was the best of the three rookies that year. His stats didn't show it but even in the post season he already showed that he could not only get into pressure situations but handle them as well. The kid is amazing and I think he still doesn't get his due.

good points Eyeballing... but IMO.. I think Lebron still ranks top in that draft... on talent alone.

I'm hoping LB makes the playoffs and shows he can put up those same stats when it counts. But you are right.. Wade is amazing at pressure situations.

Either one you can't lose. And is it just me or is Carmello overrated? All he can do is score... he doesn't do much else.

[Eyeballing]

good points Eyeballing... but IMO.. I think Lebron still ranks top in that draft... on talent alone.

I'm hoping LB makes the playoffs and shows he can put up those same stats when it counts. But you are right.. Wade is amazing at pressure situations.

Either one you can't lose. And is it just me or is Carmello overrated? All he can do is score... he doesn't do much else.

I think the problem with Camrello is he is still young. So are James and Wade but they already have that more mature stature about them. Carmello seems like the "stereotypical" young talented player that just does what he needs to do and gets paid. He doesn't seem like the type that studies the game or that improves on his game constantly. Feeling the need to get better and improve because he is already so talented.

But like I said I am sure this is because he is still young, maybe this year or in another year he will realize hey there is a lot more I can do not only to improve my game but help my team. But we shall see.

And I agree James is the overall most talented of the three no doubt but that does not necessarily make him the better player to have on your team. Stats and highlights are nice but when it comes down to it, what counts is where your team ends ups at the end of the season. Not to say it is all Lebron's fault.

[Whack Arnolds]

He's made rookie mistakes and that's expected... He also needs to improve his decision making.. as well as working on a mid-range jumpshot.Which is to be expected, and can be basically said for their roster as well. Including vets like Jamal Crawford, who is actually worse in regards to shot decisions than Nate.

[Equint77]

actually... JC has toned his jacking up shots in preseason.. he looks in more control on offense and his ballhandling in pressure, as well as his height make him a capable PG.

It's like night and day compared to how he was last year under Lenny. Lenny pretty much let JC do what he wanted on offense which is why he chucked up so many shots.

And IMO... David Lee has been the biggest stand out of the rookies in NY. He's a solid rebounder.. can handle the ball for his size.. and is strong enough not to get pushed around. LB loves him already.

[Whack Arnolds]

actually... JC has toned his jacking up shots in preseason.. he looks in more control on offense and his ballhandling in pressure, as well as his height make him a capable PG.

It's like night and day compared to how he was last year under Lenny. Lenny pretty much let JC do what he wanted on offense which is why he chucked up so many shots.

And IMO... David Lee has been the biggest stand out of the rookies in NY. He's a solid rebounder.. can handle the ball for his size.. and is strong enough not to get pushed around. LB loves him already.JC still has bad shot selection. And he still can't play any defense. Wait till you see him in the regular season, I'm sure he will be jacking up shots as well. But I doubt LB will stand for it. He will either pull him, or request a trade to managment. I have seen Jamal play for a long while now, and he has yet to truly learn how to play basketball. He has physical talents that would put him up their with the elite in the league, but he just doesn't know how to play. This could be due to the fact that he didn't start playing organized ball untill late in his life..but he has long ways to go. As for D. Lee...I really haven't seen him play much. Maybe when I get league pass I will see him do his thing. Untill then, NY may not have enough basketballs to go around for that team.

[Equint77]

JC still has bad shot selection. And he still can't play any defense. Wait till you see him in the regular season, I'm sure he will be jacking up shots as well. But I doubt LB will stand for it. He will either pull him, or request a trade to managment. I have seen Jamal play for a long while now, and he has yet to truly learn how to play basketball. He has physical talents that would put him up their with the elite in the league, but he just doesn't know how to play. This could be due to the fact that he didn't start playing organized ball untill late in his life..but he has long ways to go. As for D. Lee...I really haven't seen him play much. Maybe when I get league pass I will see him do his thing. Untill then, NY may not have enough basketballs to go around for that team.

Well I'm hoping Jamal is learning... I think he can. And yeah his defense is below average at best... which is what I'm hoping LB will correct this season.

I guess you can say coaching was an excuse..... and the constant transition in Chicago wasn't much help..... the same thing could be said about Curry.

I'm trying to stay optimistic about the team in general.. they are fairly young and without it being their fault... are still learning the game.

[Go Web Go!]

Nice to see someone who liked D. Wade before he blew up in the NBA. :up:

*AHEM!* :o

[NOFX]

Yahooo Lakers Win!!! Kobe with a game winning shot against Denver!!! 1-0 Baby!!! :cool:

[NOFX]

And my beloved Clipper are undefeated!!!:cool:

[Equint77]

man... I'm glad Redd was drafted to my team... he's scored 71 points in his first 2 games... and Brad Miller bounced back from that horrible first game.

[Ultimate_Superman]

My Wizards won.