Bane

[antsman41]

Bane worked for Ras in Batman: Legacy.

[Knight Rise]

Ahhh ok, I understand.

Apologies for assuming.

--dk7

its fine. okay here are my Final 2 Thoughts For Hardy Role

1. Hush
2. Black Mask

those are personally my thoughts and if Hardy isnt Hush, i at least want them to have Hush as a secondary villain. Black Mask for Batman, Hush for Bruce Wayne. its a good balance

[darknight7]

Now I ask this, are Hush and Black Mask powerful enough villains to make Batman recognizable as a hero to the city? Or are they just personal threats to the hero himself.

Because right now Batman is a vigilante fugitive, and the only way to redeem him in the eyes of the city, is to threaten more than just Batman himself.

--dk7

[raybia]

Seriously, why do you think this? It's a major role, and likely a villain. I don't see how that leads to Harvey Bullock.

Its a hunch more than anything and I think Nolan knows how to play the crowd.

He knows that announcing him as a player in the next movie was going to lead to the conclusion that he is the main villain.

This announcement is Nolan's trump card and I just don't think he would play it at this point.

Of course there is no reason whatsoever that Harvey Bullock cannot be a major role. If you read the bio on the character, especially the post crisis version, Bullock can be a very juicy role for an actor like Hardy.

Bullock can be an outsider brought in to assist in the investigation of Batman and I can see him and Gordon butting heads when he sees that Gordon isn't trying very hard to bring in this fugitive.

At some point Gordon may even lose control of the manhunt to Bullock which becomes very bad news for Bruce as Bullock's detective work actually threaten to expose that Wayne is the Batman.

Bullock could also have such a hard-on to capture Batman that he uses some highly unorthodox and controversial tactics such as hiring some bounty hunters (Lady Shiva, Bane, etc) and even releasing Scarecrow and Deadshot in an attempt to bring Batman to the surface.

Like I said, its a hunch. If you ever watched The Presige, then Nolan is the master magician who is using misdirection to surprise us.

[The Demon's Head]

One more thing: Bane can fit very easily into TDKR's storyline. Not only is he threatening enough to repair Batman's image, there are a lot of ways to write him into the story. He can be a "Freak" trying to take over the mob, a bounty hunter hired by the GCPD or the mob, or a member of The Leauge of Shadows.

I'm hoping it's him.

[darknight7]

I must admit, my knowledge of Black Mask and Hush are very limited. I don't know them as well as some of the more classic characters and this is why I ask these questions.

What are good stories to read? That will show me these characters can be MAIN villains.

I've read Batman Hush, but that just made me realize that Riddler was awesome lol. And I've read Heart of Hush which was pretty awesome. But once again, Hush only messed with Batman on a personal level.

Black Mask I've never read about, I saw Under The Red Hood and he seems like a cool bad guy, but I don't know enough about him to judge if he could be a main character for the final act of a (so far) successful franchise

--dk7

[Knight Rise]

Black Mask is not a personal threat to Batman. He is a threat to Gotham itself and a big one at that. The mob has played an important role in the first 2 films and to add the man behind it all at the end would be perfect. Hush, on the other hand, is the personal villain to Batman. He wants Bruce's life to be miserable or gone for that matter. This is a good balance because now it shows that not only will Batman have threats in his life, but now you see that Bruce himself will have to overcome some as well.

[Micah12345]

Hush and heart of hush for hush.

War Games and Under the Hood for Black Mask. Not a whole lot of history. I don't understand why so many people expect them to be next. Doesn't make sense after having done Ras and Joker.

[darknight7]

Its a hunch more than anything and I think Nolan knows how to play the crowd.

He knows that announcing him as a player in the next movie was going to lead to the conclusion that he is the main villain.

This announcement is Nolan's trump card and I just don't think he would play it at this point.

Of course there is no reason whatsoever that Harvey Bullock cannot be a major role. If you read the bio on the character, especially the post crisis version, Bullock can be a very juicy role for an actor like Hardy.

Bullock can be an outsider brought in to assist in the investigation of Batman and I can see him and Gordon butting heads when he sees that Gordon isn't trying very hard to bring in this fugitive.

At some point Gordon may even lose control of the manhunt to Bullock which becomes very bad news for Bruce as Bullock's detective work actually threaten to expose that Wayne is the Batman.

Bullock could also have such a hard-on to capture Batman that he uses some highly unorthodox and controversial tactics such as hiring some bounty hunters (Lady Shiva, Bane, etc) and even releasing Scarecrow and Deadshot in an attempt to bring Batman to the surface.

Like I said, its a hunch. If you ever watched The Presige, then Nolan is the master magician who is using misdirection to surprise us.

Batman Begins: The Pledge

The Dark Knight: The Turn

The Dark Knight Rises: The Prestige

*Although I don't think Bullock was ever corrupt enough to release or hire bad guys to get Batman. That wouldn't be right for the character in my opinion.

One more thing: Bane can fit very easily into TDKR's storyline. Not only is he threatening enough to repair Batman's image, there are a lot of ways to write him into the story. He can be a "Freak" trying to take over the mob, a bounty hunter hired by the GCPD or the mob, or a member of The Leauge of Shadows.

I'm hoping it's him.

I'd also be happy with Bane

--dk7

[raybia]

Question for anyone who wants to answer. "Who was the main villian in the 3rd Bourne movie?"

[raybia]

Batman Begins: The Pledge

The Dark Knight: The Turn

The Dark Knight Rises: The Prestige



--dk7

I hope you are serious about that because I agree wholeheartedly.

[darknight7]

Black Mask is not a personal threat to Batman. He is a threat to Gotham itself and a big one at that. The mob has played an important role in the first 2 films and to add the man behind it all at the end would be perfect. Hush, on the other hand, is the personal villain to Batman. He wants Bruce's life to be miserable or gone for that matter. This is a good balance because now it shows that not only will Batman have threats in his life, but now you see that Bruce himself will have to overcome some as well.

Interesting.

Hush and heart of hush for hush.

War Games and Under the Hood for Black Mask. Not a whole lot of history. I don't understand why so many people expect them to be next. Doesn't make sense after having done Ras and Joker.

Cool, those are the only Hush stories I've read.

And I've seen UTRD, but I'm sure the book is much better.

--dk7

[Knight Rise]

Black Mask is not a personal threat to Batman. He is a threat to Gotham itself and a big one at that. The mob has played an important role in the first 2 films and to add the man behind it all at the end would be perfect. Hush, on the other hand, is the personal villain to Batman. He wants Bruce's life to be miserable or gone for that matter. This is a good balance because now it shows that not only will Batman have threats in his life, but now you see that Bruce himself will have to overcome some as well.

incase nobody saw it ^

[darknight7]

I hope you are serious about that because I agree wholeheartedly.

I am 100% whole heartedly serious about that statement.

No sarcasm.

--dk7

[jmc]

whoops. wrong thread.

[darknight7]

Batman Begins: The Pledge

The Dark Knight: The Turn

The Dark Knight Rises: The Prestige

This just makes sense to me. 3 acts, and the third being the spectacle, being the finale.

In my opinion the greatest Prestige of all would be bringing Heath back :(

--dk7

[Knight Rise]

Black Mask is not a personal threat to Batman. He is a threat to Gotham itself and a big one at that. The mob has played an important role in the first 2 films and to add the man behind it all at the end would be perfect. Hush, on the other hand, is the personal villain to Batman. He wants Bruce's life to be miserable or gone for that matter. This is a good balance because now it shows that not only will Batman have threats in his life, but now you see that Bruce himself will have to overcome some as well.

in case you still didnt see it, dk7

[antsman41]

Question for anyone who wants to answer. "Who was the main villian in the 3rd Bourne movie?"

Who cares, Bourne sucks.

[raybia]

Black Mask is not a personal threat to Batman. He is a threat to Gotham itself and a big one at that. The mob has played an important role in the first 2 films and to add the man behind it all at the end would be perfect. Hush, on the other hand, is the personal villain to Batman. He wants Bruce's life to be miserable or gone for that matter. This is a good balance because now it shows that not only will Batman have threats in his life, but now you see that Bruce himself will have to overcome some as well.

I think if it was going to be Hush, then there would have been some foreshadowing in one or both of the previous movies.

I really think that Black Mask makes more sense in terms of Nolan's previous Batmovies and how the mob has been of great significance.

[antsman41]

In my opinion the greatest Prestige of all would be bringing Heath back :(

I'm just upset that we didn't get a Joker/Scarecrow scene that was homage to Knightfall.

[Figs]

Black Mask is not a personal threat to Batman. He is a threat to Gotham itself and a big one at that. The mob has played an important role in the first 2 films and to add the man behind it all at the end would be perfect. Hush, on the other hand, is the personal villain to Batman. He wants Bruce's life to be miserable or gone for that matter. This is a good balance because now it shows that not only will Batman have threats in his life, but now you see that Bruce himself will have to overcome some as well.

Very true. With Black Mask taking over the mob and Gotham territory he could have a stranglehold on the citizens of Gotham. Much like regular mobsters he would terrorize the citizens on a personal level as opposed to Joker's way of scaring the **** out of them by blowing things up and murdering off public officials.

With Black Mask in control of the mob he can push around business owners for a cut of their profits to grow his empire/territory more. Take that along with having war on the streets with any other rivals trying to gain control he could very well be a good threat to the people of Gotham City. That's just my take on it at least.

[raybia]

I am 100% whole heartedly serious about that statement.

No sarcasm.

--dk7

:up:

Then this movie is the pledge and Nolan has something very special up his sleeve. In other words, this will not be a traditional close to a trilogy.

[darknight7]

in case you still didnt see it, dk7

Scroll up my friend, I quoted you before you asked me if I saw it the first time :awesome:

--dk7

[Symbiotic]

I'm just upset that we didn't get a Joker/Scarecrow scene that was homage to Knightfall.What was the scene like?

[raybia]

Who cares, Bourne sucks.

Then obviously that question didn't apply to you did it. :dry:

[Gianakin_]

Question for anyone who wants to answer. "Who was the main villian in the 3rd Bourne movie?"

I think the answer you're trying to derive is "Bourne himself", and I do like the idea of Bats being the "villain" of TDKR, with the other bad guys hunting him for their own purposes.

[darknight7]

:up:

Then this movie is the pledge and Nolan has something very special up his sleeve. In other words, this will not be a traditional close to a trilogy.

Isn't the 3rd act the prestige? Or am I missing something here

--dk7

[Knight Rise]

Scroll up my friend, I quoted you before you asked me if I saw it the first time :awesome:

--dk7

oh. whoops! my bad :p

[darknight7]

oh. whoops! my bad :p

No worries, this thread is flying right now. It's very easy to miss posts around here

--dk7

[darknight7]

I'm just upset that we didn't get a Joker/Scarecrow scene that was homage to Knightfall.

What was the scene like?

I'm pretty sure Scarecrow sprays Joker, but he's immune to the fear toxin because he doesn't fear anything? Or he's absolutely insane?

And he proceeds by beating Scarecrow with a chair lol

--dk7

[Symbiotic]

I'm pretty sure Scarecrow sprays Joker, but he's immune to the fear toxin because he doesn't fear anything? Or he's absolutely insane?

And he proceeds by beating Scarecrow with a chair lol

--dk7...Why did we not get this?! That would've been a great scene between Heath and Cillian.

[antsman41]

What was the scene like?

Scarecrow and Joker and hanging out and Joker gets out of control so Scarecrow gases him. Joker starts freaking out and then calmly asks, "Do you have another flavors?". Basically stating the fear toxin has nothing on the mind of the Joker.

[raybia]

Very true. With Black Mask taking over the mob and Gotham territory he could have a stranglehold on the citizens of Gotham. Much like regular mobsters he would terrorize the citizens on a personal level as opposed to Joker's way of scaring the **** out of them by blowing things up and murdering off public officials.

With Black Mask in control of the mob he can push around business owners for a cut of their profits to grow his empire/territory more. Take that along with having war on the streets with any other rivals trying to gain control he could very well be a good threat to the people of Gotham City. That's just my take on it at least.

I think you are on the mark. I see Gotham in a state of Marshall Law with chaos on the streets as a result with the "Batman wannabes" engaging the regulars crimes and making matters worse. The whole situation will be much more than what the GPD will be able to handle.

Batman will have to deal with trying to bring order to the streets of Gotham while being viewed and feared as a villain by the citizens, avoid being captured or killed by Bullock's task force, and bring down Black Mask and his empire while avoid being killed by Black Mask and whatever muscle he hires to go after him.

[raybia]

Isn't the 3rd act the prestige? Or am I missing something here

--dk7

I'm sorry, I meant this movie is the prestige. My bad.

[darknight7]

Scarecrow and Joker and hanging out and Joker gets out of control so Scarecrow gases him. Joker starts freaking out and then calmly asks, "Do you have another flavors?". Basically stating the fear toxin has nothing on the mind of the Joker.

...Why did we not get this?! That would've been a great scene between Heath and Cillian.



"Later, during the Knightfall saga, after Scarecrow and the Joker team up and kidnap the mayor of Gotham City, Scarecrow turns on the Joker and uses his fear gas to see what Joker is afraid of. To Scarecrow's surprise, the gas has no effect on Joker, who in turn beats him with a chair."

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/8932/450pxjokervsscarecrow.jpg

--dk7

[Figs]

I think you are on the mark. I see Gotham in a state of Marshall Law with chaos on the streets as a result with the "Batman wannabes" engaging the regulars crimes and making matters worse. The whole situation will be much more than what the GPD will be able to handle.

Batman will have to deal with trying to bring order to the streets of Gotham while being viewed and feared as a villain by the citizens, avoid being captured or killed by Bullock's task force, and bring down Black Mask and his empire while avoid being killed by Black Mask and whatever muscle he hires to go after him.

Glad someone agrees. I was hoping I wasn't just talking out of my ass in that post. :woot:

The fire is definitely going to be lit under Batman's butt in this next film. As you said, he's got to take out the criminals as well as avoid getting caught/arrested, so it isn't going to be as simple as when the cops didn't mind him so much.

[raybia]

I think the answer you're trying to derive is "Bourne himself", and I do like the idea of Bats being the "villain" of TDKR, with the other bad guys hunting him for their own purposes.

Yes, thank you. That is exactly what I was getting at. Think about it. Team Nolan had to ask themselves the question, "How do we top the Joker?" The answer is: "You don't." So rather than cast the Riddler who would automatically be compared to the Joker and come across as "Joker-lite", you write this movie as a gigantic manhunt and cast a number of villians who are utilized by both the GPD and Black Mask's crime organization to hunt Batman down while Batman himself has to bring down Black Mask and restore order to a Gotham that both hates and fears him.

[darknight7]

^^you guys are really getting somewhere, this is all making sense...

--dk7

[Gianakin_]

Yes, thank you. That is exactly what I was getting at. Think about it. Team Nolan had to ask themselves the question, "How do we top the Joker?" The answer is: "You don't." So rather than cast the Riddler who would automatically be compared to the Joker and come across as "Joker-lite", you write this movie as a gigantic manhunt and cast a number of villians who are utilized by both the GPD and Black Mask's crime organization to hunt Batman down while Batman himself has to bring down Black Mask and restore order to a Gotham that both hates and fears him.

The only part I disagree with is the Riddler being Joker-lite (if you meant that he's got similar qualitites to the Joer, that is). Other than that, I'd love to see a movie whose screentime revolves around mainly Bruce and Batman trying to rise above the mess from TDK.

In that respect, Black Mask could work as the big baddie, Catwoman as the love interest, Strange as the antagonist/underdog who becomes a very dangerous threat by film's end and smaller villains to give Bats a hard time.

[darknight7]

SMALLER VILLAINS!!! KILLER CROC!!!! :) would be a great henchman for Black Mask

--dk7

[The Demon's Head]

the "Batman wannabes" engaging the regulars crimes and making matters worse. That's a very likely scenario. I think that's the best way to introduce Catwoman.

[Mr. Earle]

"Later, during the Knightfall saga, after Scarecrow and the Joker team up and kidnap the mayor of Gotham City, Scarecrow turns on the Joker and uses his fear gas to see what Joker is afraid of. To Scarecrow's surprise, the gas has no effect on Joker, who in turn beats him with a chair."

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/8932/450pxjokervsscarecrow.jpg

--dk7
I never liked how Scarecrow's gas doesnt affect the Joker. I know he's Batman's ultimate villain but this is proposterous. Will Ras sword not cut him either?

So anyway, we all know that Nolan doesnt always stick to the comics canon, so he could easily make a less interesting villain interesting. I could easily see Deadshot, Firefly, etc turned into more than they are in the comics.

[antsman41]

That's a very likely scenario. I think that's the best way to introduce Catwoman.

"The League of Batmen" died when Brian died.

The are dumb enough no fight crime with their little skills and tools after they found out the real villains (Joker) would pick them off one-by-one.

[raybia]

The only part I disagree with is the Riddler being Joker-lite (if you meant that he's got similar qualitites to the Joer, that is). Other than that, I'd love to see a movie whose screentime revolves around mainly Bruce and Batman trying to rise above the mess from TDK.

In that respect, Black Mask could work as the big baddie, Catwoman as the love interest, Strange as the antagonist/underdog who becomes a very dangerous threat by film's end and smaller villains to give Bats a hard time.

Yes, I like it!

Also with Riddler, I didn't mean that he is similar to Joker, I just think that the critics would automatically and unfairly compare this main baddie to the TDK main baddie and say, he's no Heath Ledger.

I actually think the Riddler could have worked and would have made him a combination of John Doe from Seven and the Zodiac killer but that would work better with a Batman that has been proven innocent from the charges in TDK and is back working closely with Gordon.

[Sawyer]

I almost want Nolan to just completely catch us off guard and have Hardy end up being Mr. Freeze.

[darknight7]

I never liked how Scarecrow's gas doesnt affect the Joker. I know he's Batman's ultimate villain but this is proposterous. Will Ras sword not cut him either?


It is kind of silly, he is just a man...

Does this mean he couldn't get high off marijuana, cocaine or ecstasy?

Or not drunk off of alcohol?

Is his body immune to substance abuse because he was took a bath in chemicals? lol

--dk7

[raybia]

SMALLER VILLAINS!!! KILLER CROC!!!! :) would be a great henchman for Black Mask

--dk7

Exactly. This is a logical way to introduce these villains that would probably never have made it in Nolan's Batman series, especially assuming Nolan is not returning. If I was Nolan, I would see, all what the hell, lets swing for the fences on this one and go all out.

[The Joker]

It is kind of silly, he is just a man...

Does this mean he couldn't get high off marijuana, cocaine or ecstasy?

Or not drunk off of alcohol?

Is his body immune to substance abuse because he was took a bath in chemicals? lol

--dk7

It means he's not afraid of anything.

[regwec]

I never liked how Scarecrow's gas doesnt affect the Joker. I know he's Batman's ultimate villain but this is proposterous. Will Ras sword not cut him either?

So anyway, we all know that Nolan doesnt always stick to the comics canon, so he could easily make a less interesting villain interesting. I could easily see Deadshot, Firefly, etc turned into more than they are in the comics.
Plus, The Joker has been shown to show fear on a number of occasions, most usually when begging Batman to save his life.

You could argue that The Joker has unusual mental resilience, however. He seems to lack any empathy for anything other than himself, and only then when he is directly threatened, so the taunting phantoms generated by the gas may leave him untroubled.

Also, you have to remember that The Joker's pharmacology is rather altered. Perhaps Crane just has the wrong recipe for him.

[raybia]

That's a very likely scenario. I think that's the best way to introduce Catwoman.

She can be a Cat burglar who sees this as an opportunity to rob Gotham rich socialites blind, such as and including Bruce Wayne and no would notice little old her.

[darknight7]

I almost want Nolan to just completely catch us off guard and have Hardy end up being Mr. Freeze.

I'm also hoping for a surprise cast by Nolan. And when it comes to being surprising, I would think Bane or Joker would be as unexpected as Mr. Freeze.

I know it's been quoted that Joker won't be returning, and that Nolan cherished Heath's friendship and acting and that he was his ideal Joker and would not recast.

But like many have argued, it doesn't seem right to stray away from the original story. As great as Heath was, and as much as I didn't want them to recast, sad to say... The "character" is much bigger than the "actor"

If Bale died, would they stop making Batman movies?

Just my opinion, sorry to bring up the Joker debate again, but I like the idea of pulling the wool over our eyes and totally surprising us with someone everyone is doubting or not expectin

Exactly. This is a logical way to introduce these villains that would probably never have made it in Nolan's Batman series, especially assuming Nolan is not returning. If I was Nolan, I would see, all what the hell, lets swing for the fences on this one and go all out.

I like your thinking, why not open up the world of Batman to a whole new level for whoever wants to take over after his trilogy is done.

--dk7

[raybia]

I almost want Nolan to just completely catch us off guard and have Hardy end up being Mr. Freeze.

:woot: Yes it would!

[darknight7]

It means he's not afraid of anything.

SEE! If you look at it that way it makes sense, and I thought that's what they were implying. So maybe in Joker's mind he is seeing a bunch of holucinations, he just doesn't feat any of them :cwink: ...and that's cool.

--dk7

[raybia]

"The League of Batmen" died when Brian died.

The are dumb enough no fight crime with their little skills and tools after they found out the real villains (Joker) would pick them off one-by-one.

It did?:huh:

You will be surprised on how dumb people can be.

[darknight7]

Plus, The Joker has been shown to show fear on a number of occasions, most usually when begging Batman to save his life.

You could argue that The Joker has unusual mental resilience, however. He seems to lack any empathy for anything other than himself, and only then when he is directly threatened, so the taunting phantoms generated by the gas may leave him untroubled.

Also, you have to remember that The Joker's pharmacology is rather altered. Perhaps Crane just has the wrong recipe for him.

Also a possibility I've pondered before

--dk7

[itsthebatman]

Also, you have to remember that The Joker's pharmacology is rather altered. Perhaps Crane just has the wrong recipe for him.
I think this has been stated somewhere - Joker's chemical bath made him immune to toxins. I think he utilised this in the (awful) Last Laugh?
EDIT: Apparently, Morrison stated it in The Clown At Midnight, that Joker had built up immunity to poisons after years of abuse.

[Symbiotic]

Just my opinion, sorry to bring up the Joker debate again, but I like the idea of pulling the wool over our eyes and totally surprising us with someone everyone is doubting or not expecting.My sig is my thoughts on the matter. To be honest, Joker's chances of being in the movie are probably .1%. And it's probably not Hardy. But I enjoy picturing the possibilities.

[Doctor Jones]

I don't know why dude. You're wasting alot of time. He ain't showing up. Nolan is usually cryptic. He outright said he wouldn't be comfortable with Heath being replaced. He would never lie about something like that. So that's that.

[raybia]

I don't know why dude. You're wasting alot of time. He ain't showing up. Nolan is usually cryptic. He outright said he wouldn't be comfortable with Heath being replaced. He would never lie about something like that. So that's that.

Thats cold, even for a man like me...to take someone's hope away, regardless of how false it is.

[darknight7]

I don't know why dude. You're wasting alot of time. He ain't showing up. Nolan is usually cryptic. He outright said he wouldn't be comfortable with Heath being replaced. He would never lie about something like that. So that's that.

You're totally right...and I can only respond with emoticons:

:waa::shock:barf::bh::down

--dk7

[Knight Rise]

I don't know why dude. You're wasting alot of time. He ain't showing up. Nolan is usually cryptic. He outright said he wouldn't be comfortable with Heath being replaced. He would never lie about something like that. So that's that.

very true. On my command...unleash HARDY

[regwec]

I don't know why dude. You're wasting alot of time. He ain't showing up. Nolan is usually cryptic. He outright said he wouldn't be comfortable with Heath being replaced. He would never lie about something like that. So that's that.
I don't understand why you think that you are wasting your time any less than he is wasting his. I mean, are you making better use of your time on earth by speculating on the relatively likely rather than the unlikely? Or is Symbiotic actually making good use of his time by finding amusement in his daydreams?

[darknight7]

I'm depressed that Symbiotic took the quote out of his sig :(

I don't think Doctor Jones was being that harsh, he was just being realistic. So I wouldn't be harping on him.

Everyone needs to chill out around here, respect each others opinion, and don't lose hope in your dreams.

Until 2012, none of us can predict the outcome of anything. Don't be at each others throats. We're all going to be wrong in one way or another. :)

--dk7

[darknight7]

Tom Hardy...
Just trying to be out of the box again...http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/8362/profpyg.jpg

...Anyone?

--dk7

[The Joker]

Tom Hardy...
Just trying to be out of the box again...http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/8362/profpyg.jpg

...Anyone?

--dk7

I doubt Nolan even knows of that character's existence. He's way too recent.

[regwec]

I don't know why anyone thinks that Pyg is an acceptable personage for the comics, let alone the movies.

[Secret Fawful]

Tom Hardy...
Just trying to be out of the box again...http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/8362/profpyg.jpg

...Anyone?

--dk7
The only character that could possibly top the Joker. Just imagine it. :oldrazz:

[Mr. Earle]

Tom Hardy...
Just trying to be out of the box again...http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/8362/profpyg.jpg

...Anyone?

--dk7He's too handsome to be Dr Pyg. Also, something tells me that Nolan would rather have Batman fighting aliens than a dude who wears a silly pig mask and gives lapdances to Robin. Unless he nolanized him and took all the fun out of it.I don't know why anyone thinks that Pyg is an acceptable personage for the comics, let alone the movies.
He is awesome. He's just like the Joker, only creepier and sicker. And sillier. He is the perfect example of a soul tarnished by Dr Hurt.

I dunno, i just love Morrison's silly villains. Mr Toad, Flamingo, Pyg, etc. You can only top that with a mobster Raptor in a suit and a tommy gun. :awesome:The only character that could possibly top the Joker. Just imagine it. :oldrazz:
I honestly think that Pyg could show the Joker a trick or two, but i doubt he's smart enough to really take him on.

[Sawyer]

Mr. Freeze, Goddammit! :cmad:

[Knight Rise]

FINAL THOUGHT FOR HARDY VILLAIN

and it is.....

1. Hush

Okay i know a lot of you are thinking "Yeah maybe in your world", but i see Hardy personally playing Hush. i sat there for a few hours looking over Black Mask, Hush, and past roles of Hardy. And in my final conclusion i think he will play Thomas "Tommy" Elliot/Hush. And there may be high chances that my final thought is completely wrong and that he may turn out to be Black Mask or even Deadshot. But this is who i think Hardy will be. Black Mask should also appear in TDKR as an even bigger role, but for now I say Hardy for Hush.

[darknight7]

I'm just trying to think of names that haven't been thought of yet. Just for fun, how many pages can we argue about Hardy being a great RIDDLER, or not being right for PENGUIN, or being perfect for BLACK MASK, not big enough to be BANE, could work as DEADSHOT OR HUSH.

So that's why I suggested Pyg.

And now, Maxie Zeus.

--dk7

[Mr. Earle]

I'm just trying to think of names that haven't been thought of yet. Just for fun, how many pages can we argue about Hardy being a great RIDDLER, or not being right for PENGUIN, or being perfect for BLACK MASK, not big enough to be BANE, could work as DEADSHOT OR HUSH.

So that's why I suggested Pyg.

And now, Maxie Zeus.

--dk7I love you darknight7! That's the spirit! :applaud

[Bat-Mite]

They could always turn Hardy into Baby Doll. CGI him into appearing as a little person and have him with a cute little Shirley Temple hairdo.

[darknight7]

I love you darknight7! That's the spirit! :applaud
:oldrazz:
Thanks, just trying to lighten the mood, but at the same time...I'm serious. It's more fun to discuss the oddball characters than it is to bank on the obvious ones

They could always turn Hardy into Baby Doll. CGI him into appearing as a little person and have him with a cute little Shirley Temple hairdo.

Now THAT! is something I would wait in line at midnight to see :awesome:

--dk7

[Mr. Earle]

They could always turn Hardy into Baby Doll. CGI him into appearing as a little person and have him with a cute little Shirley Temple hairdo.
Now that you mentioned shrinking... Take a look at your avatar. What about Bat-mite? :awesome:

[DarthDaveBanner]

Hardy is the REAL Batman. Bale's Bats is just a dream being implanted into Jason Todds head by Crazy Quilt.

[darknight7]

Now that you mentioned shrinking... Take a look at your avatar. What about Bat-mite? :awesome:

YOU BEAT ME TO IT! hahahahaha

--dk7

[ModestMr.Green]

I personally wouldn't be shocked if the third Batman film didn't have a traditional villain at all. Gordon or Bullock or whomever leading a manhunt against Bats, while Bruce comes into his own as the hero with a face that Gotham needs, would be a perfectly compelling movie.

[Secret Fawful]

How about Tom Hardy for Farmer Brown or Clock King? :oldrazz:

[Mr. Earle]

Hardy is the REAL Batman. Bale's Bats is just a dream being implanted into Jason Todds head by Crazy Quilt.
Maybe Inception was made as a side story that explains the Bat trilogy. :cwink::oldrazz:
Thanks, just trying to lighten the mood, but at the same time...I'm serious. It's more fun to discuss the oddball characters than it is to bank on the obvious ones

I agree, but unless he is just a random nutjob that batman takes down in one of his daily patrols, i doubt Nolan will actually use him. How about Tom Hardy for Farmer Brown or Clock King? :oldrazz:
In all seriousness Clock King would be ****ing awesome and could work in the Nolanverse just fine.

[Bat-Mite]

Now that you mentioned shrinking... Take a look at your avatar. What about Bat-mite? :awesome:Oh yes. They could say the microwave emitter created an interdimensional somethingorother and caused him to pop up. It would give Nolan an excuse to toss the realism stuff out the window and open the doors for all kinds of fun!

[Doctor Who]

Mr. Freeze, Goddammit! :cmad:

That role is strictly meant for Stanley Tucci when the time comes. End of story. :brucebat:

Due to the guy's capabilities and talent, I'm still saying he's up for literally anybody. And with ruling out Joker, Two-Face, Scarecrow, Ra's Al Ghul, Zsas, and several of the mob characters, also including that Riddler will not be in the film, there's still several opportunities to go with. That being said, I'm thinking he could be Bane, Black Mask, Deadshot or Deathstroke, Firefly, Hugo Strange, Hush, Killer Croc (if done very realistically), Holiday, Great White Shark, etc. Some can be done perfectly, and others not so much; it will all just depend where the flow of the movie where go when we get more news.

I'm hoping for a bit of Knightfall or War Games for either Bane or Black Mask though. :woot:

[Doctor Who]

Oh yes. They could say the microwave emitter created an interdimensional somethingorother and caused him to pop up. It would give Nolan an excuse to toss the realism stuff out the window and open the doors for all kinds of fun!

I actually had fan plans for the microwave emitter!!! Plausibly thinking though, of course... :O

[Cordoba]

It's going to be mega interesting to see which character he will play. He is a pretty big actor and has proven his versatility. It could really be anyone. Very exciting.

[Bat-Mite]

I'm sure Hardy would be willing to put on a little weight. Just think of the possibilities...

http://img821.imageshack.us/img821/4607/harleyx.jpg

[Doctor Who]

I'm sure Hardy would be willing to put on a little weight. Just think of the possibilities...

http://img821.imageshack.us/img821/4607/harleyx.jpg

*looks up and down, pondering* *inhales a sigh of recognition* Ye-No. :hoboj:

[Symbiotic]

Or is Symbiotic actually making good use of his time by finding amusement in his daydreams?Meh. It's Saturday and I'm on the Hype instead of hanging out with my friends. Allow me my daydreams.

[raybia]

Nice read. Of course I'm with the Bullock one.

http://www.obsessedwithfilm.com/features/8-picks-for-who-will-tom-hardy-might-play-in-the-dark-knight-rises.php

[Secret Fawful]

So someone thought outside the box and considered the idea of Hardy as Cobblepot. And he makes a case for it. Although the same case could be applied easily to Black Mask.

[darknight7]

Meh. It's Saturday and I'm on the Hype instead of hanging out with my friends. Allow me my daydreams.

Same. Everyone is out celebrating Halloween tonight (my favourite holiday of the year, even more than Christmas).

Been suffering from an injury, can't do much :(

sucks.

--dk7

[The Joker]

Nice read. Of course I'm with the Bullock one.

http://www.obsessedwithfilm.com/features/8-picks-for-who-will-tom-hardy-might-play-in-the-dark-knight-rises.php

I'm all for The Penguin. He's very underrated.

[Bat-Mite]

I'd love Penguin, but it'd be surprising if he were used in this movie, given Nolan's past comments about him. And it would be even more surprising if he chose Hardy to play him.

[RachelDawes]

I personally wouldn't be shocked if the third Batman film didn't have a traditional villain at all. Gordon or Bullock or whomever leading a manhunt against Bats, while Bruce comes into his own as the hero with a face that Gotham needs, would be a perfectly compelling movie.

I've said this before, but no villain would be a huge letdown after the Joker. Plus, how would Batman come into his own as a hero without a significant villain to fight?

[raybia]

I've said this before, but no villain would be a huge letdown after the Joker. Plus, how would Batman come into his own as a hero without a significant villain to fight?

Oh, there will be a villain, it just won't be one in the vein of the last two movies. In fact, look at TKR as a James Bond movie that has no main baddie. cough Bourne Trilogy cough.

[RachelDawes]

Oh, there will be a villain, it just won't be one in the vein of the last two movies. In fact, look at TKR as a James Bond movie that has no main baddie. cough Bourne Trilogy cough.

I don't know much about Bond or Bourne, but I suspect neither of them have villains that are as famous or memorable as Batman's.

[Keyser Soze]

Actually, with Ledger, while most here were against the casting, he did have a decent following because he could actually fit the look of the character.

Alas, there were two schools of thought amongst fanboy circles for why Ledger didn't look the part. Some people thought he was too young and pretty to play The Joker. And others thought he had too much of a "fat face".

[Keyser Soze]

Question for anyone who wants to answer. "Who was the main villian in the 3rd Bourne movie?"

The always-excellent David Straitharn. :awesome:

[Lungrocket]

Came across this article which has an interesting (http://forums.superherohype.com/#) morsel in it.

"Inception (http://forums.superherohype.com/#)" star Tom Hardy was recently reported to be circling the role of the Huntsman, but he's focused on preparing for an unknown role in Christopher Nolan's "The Dark Knight Rises," which starts shooting in April. However, what's really interesting is that Hardy seems to have been offered the Huntsman role ahead of Depp, signaling Hardy's fast-rising status in Hollywood.

http://www.thewrap.com/movies/column...he+Wrap+RSS%29 (http://www.thewrap.com/movies/column-post/exclusive-johnny-depp-has-been-offered-date-snow-white-22090?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+thewrap%2Flatest-news+%28The+Wrap+RSS%29)

I do not think Tom Hardy will be playing any new D.A. or Harvey Bullock in The Dark Knight Rises. Unless of course Hardy needs to study criminal law or eat donuts for 4 months to get into character.

More than likely he will be working out for a specific character... probably someone imposing.

[Keyser Soze]

My guess still stands as Tom Hardy playing Hugo Strange. It makes the most sense to me.

[Lungrocket]

We know that Nolan likes to have deeper or multiple meanings and themes to his films.

The first film dealt with fear. He chose two villains that best represented this. Scarecrow, and Ra's Al Ghul.

The second film dealt with order vs chaos (obviously the Joker best represents chaos)

So The Dark Knight RISES... I think this could possibly be some sort of theme of spirituality. This title could infer a biblical connotation.

And since Nolan likes to create a tightly woven plot and pick characters & villains that best represent the themes of his films, these are some of the characters that COULD work with that in mind.

AZRAEL (the name I believe is a hebrew translation of Angel Of Death)

THE REAPER (from Batman: Year Two) A figure of death.

Batman RISES could also imply he dies in the end of the film, like a Heavenly ascent, becoming a spiritual figure. Just throwing those thoughts out there.

[Mr. Earle]

Oh, there will be a villain, it just won't be one in the vein of the last two movies. In fact, look at TKR as a James Bond movie that has no main baddie. cough Bourne Trilogy cough.
I always hate it when people talk about things they dont know like they re fact.

"Hey guys TDKR will have no villain."

How the hell do you know? :cmad:My guess still stands as Tom Hardy playing Hugo Strange. It makes the most sense to me.
He looks nothing like him!

[Boom]

I just realized Hardy is 5'9". I guess that makes it unlikely that he is playing Bane.

[raybia]

I always hate it when people talk about things they dont know like they re fact.

"Hey guys TDKR will have no villain."

How the hell do you know? :cmad:
He looks nothing like him!

Of course there will be a villain however all of my comments on these boards are my own opinions so if I appear to be presumptuous then I do apologize.

[raybia]

I just realized Hardy is 5'9". I guess that makes it unlikely that he is playing Bane.

Of course not. In Nolan's universe Bane is a midget.

[Mr. Earle]

Of course there will be a villain however all of my comments on these boards are my own opinions so if I appear to be presumptuous then I do apologize.Its ok, but it did seem kinda presumptuous.

[raybia]

We know that Nolan likes to have deeper or multiple meanings and themes to his films.

The first film dealt with fear. He chose two villains that best represented this. Scarecrow, and Ra's Al Ghul.

The second film dealt with order vs chaos (obviously the Joker best represents chaos)

So The Dark Knight RISES... I think this could possibly be some sort of theme of spirituality. This title could infer a biblical connotation.

And since Nolan likes to create a tightly woven plot and pick characters & villains that best represent the themes of his films, these are some of the characters that COULD work with that in mind.

AZRAEL (the name I believe is a hebrew translation of Angel Of Death)

THE REAPER (from Batman: Year Two) A figure of death.

Batman RISES could also imply he dies in the end of the film, like a Heavenly ascent, becoming a spiritual figure. Just throwing those thoughts out there.

Thats a great premise. Of course it could also be a sexual connotation and you will see Catwoman, Harley, Poison Ivy, Talia, Lady Shiva verses Batman. He has to fight both the villains and and his raging hormones at the same time.

[raybia]

Its ok, but it did seem kinda presumptuous.

It was. I just got a little overzealous cause I really think it could work. I kinda envision a cat and mouse chase with a Knightfall type of climax.

Hey, I'm a fanboy. :csad:

[Mr. Earle]

No problem man!

[Lungrocket]

Thats a great premise. Of course it could also be a sexual connotation and you will see Catwoman, Harley, Poison Ivy, Talia, Lady Shiva verses Batman. Wow. Greatest trilogy ever.

That would definitely be the better film. :woot:

[raybia]

That would definitely be the better film. :woot:

Could beat Avatar. :cwink:

[Doctor Who]

You know, something has just occurred to me: Deadshot, as many think would be a bit pointless, would actually work. Not as a main villain, but a beneficial factor none the less. Let's think about this more: Floyd Lawton is a guy who's world revolves around guns and a motive to die a spectacular death; not that he's completely suicidal, but is reckless with his life. With Batman now on the run from the GPD with the accusation of murdering 5 people, Gotham in general has nobody to turn to. One way or another the police corruption in which Dent warned Gordon that was in his unit is going to hit the news after the death of 2 D.A.'s, and with the many attempts to find out Batman's identity publicly by Reese and Joker, finding out who Bats is and how to get rid of him is sounding very tempting now. Whether the police break the law to get him, or even society in general giving into the mob possibly.

The point is, Joker left his mark, and people are going to turn to chaos; there's now a price on Batman's head, and who better for a hired assassin? It's important to acknowledge Bruce Wayne's hatred for guns as well, with the tragedy of his parents, and how someone so unhinged and going out killing for a living would make him go nuts! It's that 2 sided battle of Bruce Wayne wanting to kill Deadshot with his bare hands, and yet Batman sympathizing for his careless mental health. The more you think about it, he's sort of a villain with a soft end.

That being said, if there's a possibility of Deadshot being portrayed by Tom Hardy, and it was treated with respect I'm totally cool with it. :word:

[Keyser Soze]

He looks nothing like him!

Tom Hardy doesn't look any less like Hugo Strange than Heath Ledger looked like The Joker or Cillian Murphy looked like The Scarecrow. Like with them, the main problem is that he's a lot younger than the comics incarnation and has a different hairdo.

[ronny]

Let's say he is Hugo Strange. You don't think he'll have an Austrian accent do you? I read that Strange was actually born in the slums of Gotham and went into a childrens home. But just to clarify, he's definenetly American, right? That silly Freud accent is just creative license on the part of the animated series, correct?

[Keyser Soze]

Let's say he is Hugo Strange. You don't think he'll have an Austrian accent do you? I read that Strange was actually born in the slums of Gotham and went into a childrens home. But just to clarify, he's definenetly American, right? That silly Freud accent is just creative license on the part of the animated series, correct?

Yeah, he was always American. The Austrian accent was an invention of the TV series. Though I personally wouldn't mind him being English.

[Knight Rise]

You know, something has just occurred to me: Deadshot, as many think would be a bit pointless, would actually work. Not as a main villain, but a beneficial factor none the less. Let's think about this more: Floyd Lawton is a guy who's world revolves around guns and a motive to die a spectacular death; not that he's completely suicidal, but is reckless with his life. With Batman now on the run from the GPD with the accusation of murdering 5 people, Gotham in general has nobody to turn to. One way or another the police corruption in which Dent warned Gordon that was in his unit is going to hit the news after the death of 2 D.A.'s, and with the many attempts to find out Batman's identity publicly by Reese and Joker, finding out who Bats is and how to get rid of him is sounding very tempting now. Whether the police break the law to get him, or even society in general giving into the mob possibly.

The point is, Joker left his mark, and people are going to turn to chaos; there's now a price on Batman's head, and who better for a hired assassin? It's important to acknowledge Bruce Wayne's hatred for guns as well, with the tragedy of his parents, and how someone so unhinged and going out killing for a living would make him go nuts! It's that 2 sided battle of Bruce Wayne wanting to kill Deadshot with his bare hands, and yet Batman sympathizing for his careless mental health. The more you think about it, he's sort of a villain with a soft end.

That being said, if there's a possibility of Deadshot being portrayed by Tom Hardy, and it was treated with respect I'm totally cool with it. :word:

Batman and Deadshot are complete opposites: Batman is the guy against guns whereas Deadshot loves them, Batman is the more silent type and Deadshot cant shut up. Its cool to see these 2 clash because they are complete opposites, but Deadshot isnt a stand alone villain. He needs someone else. Maybe with Black Mask, but never alone.

I still stand my opinion on Hardy being Hush. Just because he has an important role doesnt meen someone cant have an even bigger role.

And for the Black Mask look i say he doesnt have a mask. He tattooed a "black mask" over his entire face. Thats the look i see for Black Mask in the Nolanverse.

[The Demon's Head]

I actually think Hush is a much more interesting villain than Black Mask. His backstory is far more interesting IMO, and his reason for hating Bruce is much more compelling.

[Knight Rise]

I actually think Hush is a much more interesting villain than Black Mask. His backstory is far more interesting IMO, and his reason for hating Bruce is much more compelling.

agreed. there were some sites that said Hush was Nolan's favorite villain, but that really doesnt give him a reason to be in the film. like i said before, Black Mask and Hush would be a perfect combination for TDKR

[Mister H.]

^ That's pretty interesting, if true. Maybe it is Hush. I think the dark mirror to Bruce Wayne is something needs to be explored in this film, whether its Black Mask or Hush. Hush would probably be a bit more "PG-13", if that makes any sense. I'm no expert on Black Mask, but I know his backstory and read a recent run featuring him (War Games?). He's a nasty dude. And I'll be honest, I've never read a single Hush story. I probably own less than 20 comics, but I do own graphic novels like Year One, Arkham Asylum, TDKR, The Man Who Laughs, Broken City, Dark Legends, Joker, TLH, and The Killing Joke...none of which feature Hush. I'm mostly a Joker fan, as you can see.

Can you guys suggest a couple of really good Hush storylines?

[Lungrocket]

I actually think Hush is a much more interesting villain than Black Mask. His backstory is far more interesting IMO, and his reason for hating Bruce is much more compelling.

I agree. Not to mention he has a cooler character name.

[The Guard]

Deadshot could work with literally anyone. Regular mobsters, The Penguin, Black Mask, even the police or the FBI in some sense.

[Knight Rise]

^ That's pretty interesting, if true. Maybe it is Hush. I think the dark mirror to Bruce Wayne is something needs to be explored in this film, whether its Black Mask or Hush. Hush would probably be a bit more "PG-13", if that makes any sense. I'm no expert on Black Mask, but I know his backstory and read a recent run featuring him (War Games?). He's a nasty dude. And I'll be honest, I've never read a single Hush story. I probably own less than 20 comics, but I do own graphic novels like Year One, Arkham Asylum, TDKR, The Man Who Laughs, Broken City, Dark Legends, Joker, TLH, and The Killing Joke...none of which feature Hush. I'm mostly a Joker fan, as you can see.

Can you guys suggest a couple of really good Hush storylines?

Black Mask: The threat to Gotham
Hush: The threat to Batman

Its quite a good balance

[Superhero 101]

it'd be so cool if Hardy was Blackmask because its not a villain that the audience has seen before

[Knight Rise]

it'd be so cool if Hardy was Blackmask because its not a villain that the audience has seen before

oh you mean along with Penguin, Riddler, Mr. Freeze, Deadshot, Hush, Hugo Strange, Catwoman, Firefly, Crazy Quilt, Bat-Mite, Harley Quinn, Poison Ivy, Calendar Man, Bane, Catman, Blockbuster, Clayface, The Ventriloquist. MUST I GO ON lol none of them are villains an audience has seen before!

[souvlaki]

^ That's pretty interesting, if true. Maybe it is Hush. I think the dark mirror to Bruce Wayne is something needs to be explored in this film, whether its Black Mask or Hush. Hush would probably be a bit more "PG-13", if that makes any sense. I'm no expert on Black Mask, but I know his backstory and read a recent run featuring him (War Games?). He's a nasty dude. And I'll be honest, I've never read a single Hush story. I probably own less than 20 comics, but I do own graphic novels like Year One, Arkham Asylum, TDKR, The Man Who Laughs, Broken City, Dark Legends, Joker, TLH, and The Killing Joke...none of which feature Hush. I'm mostly a Joker fan, as you can see.

Can you guys suggest a couple of really good Hush storylines?

The only problem I have with Hush is that Rachel kind of played the part of Tommy in Batman Begins. And honestly, if they were going to go with a smart villain that also poses a physical threat toward Batman AND knows his secret identity, I'd rather they went with Bane.

[Figs]

oh you mean along with Deadshot, Hush, Hugo Strange, Firefly, Crazy Quilt, Bat-Mite, Harley Quinn, Calendar Man, Catman, Blockbuster, Clayface, The Ventriloquist. MUST I GO ON lol none of them are villains an audience has seen before!

Fixed

[Knight Rise]

The only problem I have with Hush is that Rachel kind of played the part of Tommy in Batman Begins. And honestly, if they were going to go with a smart villain that also poses a physical threat toward Batman AND knows his secret identity, I'd rather they went with Bane.

woah there! you cant compare anybody but Batman to Hush lol. besides they have these nice little things called flashbacks they can use. they didnt show all of bruce's life, only the key things you needed to know.

And that also leads me back to the Black Mask/Hush duo. One villain for Gotham, one villain for Batman

[Lungrocket]

oh you mean along with Penguin, Riddler, Mr. Freeze, Deadshot, Hush, Hugo Strange, Catwoman, Firefly, Crazy Quilt, Bat-Mite, Harley Quinn, Poison Ivy, Calendar Man, Bane, Catman, Blockbuster, Clayface, The Ventriloquist. MUST I GO ON lol none of them are villains an audience has seen before!

All have had screentime, wether or not they were done justice to is another matter entirely, but they've been in the limelight cinematically.

Blackmask is overrated though. He's just a gangster with a gimmick.

I'd much rather see either THE REAPER, KGBEAST (Bane was a knock-off of him anyway) DEACON BLACKFIRE, HUSH, or a revamped AZRAEL (hate Knightfall but could just be a more extreme vigilante who goes to far (and doesn't take up the Batman mantle) that Batman has to stop.

[Knight Rise]

woah there! you cant compare anybody but Batman to Hush lol. besides they have these nice little things called flashbacks they can use. they didnt show all of bruce's life, only the key things you needed to know.

And that also leads me back to the Black Mask/Hush duo. One villain for Gotham, one villain for Batman

for those who didnt see it

All have had screentime, wether or not they were done justice to is another matter entirely, but they've been in the limelight cinematically.

Blackmask is overrated though. He's just a gangster with a gimmick.

I'd much rather see either THE REAPER, KGBEAST (Bane was a knock-off of him anyway) DEACON BLACKFIRE, HUSH, or a revamped AZRAEL (hate Knightfall but could just be a more extreme vigilante who goes to far (and doesn't take up the Batman mantle) that Batman has to stop.

you have to think of a villain that needs Batman to "Rise" against the villains of Gotham forever (unless of course you have a different take on the title in which case im sorry)

[Mr. Earle]

Since this has become the TDKR general villain discussion thread, i'd like to say that i want to feel like i'm in gotham, and to do that they'll have to fill it with freaks. I'm not saying that we should have 10 active villains in the movie, but some cameos of villains locked up in Arkham, Dr Harley Quinzel, Bruce shaking hands with Tommy Elliot in some fundraiser, Penguin and the Iceberg Lounge (without Penguin even being a villain of the movie), etc would certainly help. The Arkham Asylum game had tons of easter eggs and cameos and while some of them were forced, most of them didnt because those characters were worked in the story and because villains are ingrained in the way of life in Gotham. "Here's a story of a swat guy fighting two villains in a generic american city" doesnt seem like much of a batman story to me.

It would also help if Gotham didnt look like a generic american city. In BB the monorail and Wayne tower were shown a lot, but they kinda forgot them in TDK. Use them again, show us the Iceberg Lounge, the crappy neighbourhoods (it shouldnt be just the Narrows), the Gotham skyline visible in the background of a rooftop scene, the docks with all the skyscrapers reflecting on the water, etc.

[Bat-Mite]

It would also help if Gotham didnt look like a generic american city. In BB the monorail and Wayne tower were shown a lot, but they kinda forgot them in TDK. Use them again, show us the Iceberg Lounge, the crappy neighbourhoods (it shouldnt be just the Narrows), the Gotham skyline visible in the background of a rooftop scene, the docks with all the skyscrapers reflecting on the water, etc.It also wouldn't hurt to show a few gargoyles. The city I live in isn't very big, but even here, a couple of the buildings downtown have them. Gotham is supposed to be known for that kind of thing.

[Keyser Soze]

Whatever role Tom Hardy ends up playing, I hope it's the villain. Having him just be Harvey Bullock or another supporting character would be a waste. American audiences only familiar with his work in Inception may be unaware of what a great villain Tom Hardy can play. Yes, he got well-deserved praise for his terrifying turn in Bronson, but people should also seek out UK TV series The Take. Tom Hardy played a truly vile, repugnant villain in that show. If he played a villain half as nasty in The Dark Knight Rises, Heath Ledger would have a worthy successor.

[cerealkiller182]

Im guessing he is definitely playing a villain

[Sawyer]

Whatever role Tom Hardy ends up playing, I hope it's the villain. Having him just be Harvey Bullock or another supporting character would be a waste. American audiences only familiar with his work in Inception may be unaware of what a great villain Tom Hardy can play. Yes, he got well-deserved praise for his terrifying turn in Bronson, but people should also seek out UK TV series The Take. Tom Hardy played a truly vile, repugnant villain in that show. If he played a villain half as nasty in The Dark Knight Rises, Heath Ledger would have a worthy successor.

What are you nuts? People loved Star Trek: Nemesis. :cool:

[itsthebatman]

What are you nuts? People loved Star Trek: Nemesis. :cool:
Yeah, I remember the queues around the block in my neighbourhood when it played.

[Secret Fawful]

Blackmask is overrated though. He's just a gangster with a gimmick.
All supervillains have a gimmick.

[Octoberist]

Whatever role Tom Hardy ends up playing, I hope it's the villain. Having him just be Harvey Bullock or another supporting character would be a waste. American audiences only familiar with his work in Inception may be unaware of what a great villain Tom Hardy can play. Yes, he got well-deserved praise for his terrifying turn in Bronson, but people should also seek out UK TV series The Take. Tom Hardy played a truly vile, repugnant villain in that show. If he played a villain half as nasty in The Dark Knight Rises, Heath Ledger would have a worthy successor.

I AGREE. This guy is young, imposing and talented, and at this point, I can't see him playing Bullock or even the new DA (unless they're the spine of the film. I doubt it.)

[Knight Rise]

I AGREE. This guy is young, imposing and talented, and at this point, I can't see him playing Bullock or even the new DA (unless they're the spine of the film. I doubt it.)

yeah this i agree with

[cerealkiller182]

So, I was thinking about who Hardy could play and I thought about what Ra's Al Ghul (Liam's) said about immortality and what not. I took that pretty literally knwoing what I know about the comic, but a friend of mine took it that Ra's Al Ghul is a title inherited. So when Watanabe died, Neeson took over. What if Hardy is taking over the League of Shadows

[Bat-Mite]

So, I was thinking about who Hardy could play and I thought about what Ra's Al Ghul (Liam's) said about immortality and what not. I took that pretty literally knwoing what I know about the comic, but a friend of mine took it that Ra's Al Ghul is a title inherited. So when Watanabe died, Neeson took over. What if Hardy is taking over the League of ShadowsI really think the League of Shadows storyline is finished and won't be revisited in any way, shape, or form. I've heard the theory that the title is passed on, and think it's an interesting one, but I think Neeson was the true Ra's. I think both of the decoys presented were meant to represent Ubu, and both of them did bear a strong resemblance to him.

[Wolverine1988]

So, I was thinking about who Hardy could play and I thought about what Ra's Al Ghul (Liam's) said about immortality and what not. I took that pretty literally knwoing what I know about the comic, but a friend of mine took it that Ra's Al Ghul is a title inherited. So when Watanabe died, Neeson took over. What if Hardy is taking over the League of Shadows


That is a really stupid idea.

We already saw the League of Shadows and Ras storyline, doing that in the third movie would be taking a huge step back.

[cerealkiller182]

yet Nolan is always talking about finishing his trilogy as if everything comes full circle.

[antsman41]

So, I was thinking about who Hardy could play and I thought about what Ra's Al Ghul (Liam's) said about immortality and what not. I took that pretty literally knwoing what I know about the comic, but a friend of mine took it that Ra's Al Ghul is a title inherited. So when Watanabe died, Neeson took over. What if Hardy is taking over the League of Shadows

I think this is why in the end credits Liam is listed as Ducard.

It's a title, plain and simple. I've always seen it that way since 2005. In sense, I think the LOS trains heirs (like Bruce) to prep them so they'll eventually make rank of Ra's once the man before them falls.

[The Joker]

I can't wait for these Ra's Al Ghul theories to be debunked.

[itsthebatman]

I can't wait for these Ra's Al Ghul theories to be debunked.
No ras and jokr will be in thiz movie u just wait and c nolan has been planting clues all along oh god where r my meds

[cerealkiller182]

I can't wait for these Ra's Al Ghul theories to be debunked.

LOL. Its just as good as any other theory, all of which are based on nothing

No ras and jokr will be in thiz movie u just wait and c nolan has been planting clues all along oh god where r my meds

Three posts in. Don't make it out to be "Eddie Murphy as The Riddler"

Just because you don't like the theory doesnt mean it isnt possible

[Bat-Mite]

It's not like Nolan to revisit old territory, especially when there's so much potential in other villains/storylines he could use. He's a man who likes to do new things, and Talia/Ra's wouldn't exactly be somethin' new. When he says he's coming full circle, he likely means thematically.

[cerealkiller182]

It's not like Nolan to revisit old territory, especially when there's so much potential in other villains/storylines he could use. He's a man who likes to do new things, and Talia/Ra's wouldn't exactly be somethin' new. When he says he's coming full circle, he likely means thematically.

Its not like Nolan to revisit old terriotry? I suggest you look up any analysis of Nolan's films: the motivation of his male protagonists and lack of character in his fridge-stuffing (er..I mean female characters) is far more similar movie to movie.

In fact, practically all of his movies can be boiled down to: "Due to the loss of a female loved one, a male protagonist spirals into a darkness that he is trying to crawl his way out of"

[PreK]

Heh, glad I'm not the only that noticed. It's a key aspect present in almost every single one of his films. He's done a tremendous job differentiating his works, but he's most definitely not as flexible of a director as say, David Fincher.

[Lungrocket]

All supervillains have a gimmick.

Yeah, but Black Mask isn't very super. And his gimmick is lame...he would need some heavy retooling to be featured as a main villain in the film.

There's also far better adversaries to use.

[Secret Fawful]

Yeah, but Black Mask isn't very super.
If you mean he doesn't have any superpowers, neither does Batman. If you mean he's not very intelligent, he's actually highly intelligent. If you mean he's not very strong, he can hold his own in hand to hand combat against Batman and the Joker and various other rogues and can keep fighting while taking loads of damage due to the fact he enjoys and embraces pain. If you mean he's never had any good plans, he is a master strategist and has managed to take control of the entire criminal underworld of Gotham City. Twice.

And his gimmick is lame...he would need some heavy retooling to be featured as a main villain in the film.Oh you mean his black mask? Who cares about supervillains for just their gimmicks? It's what they do that makes them interesting. If the Joker just put whoopie cushions on people's chairs all the time he wouldn't be a very interesting villain would he?

There's also far better adversaries to use.Well The Riddler and Mr. Freeze have been ruled out. So that's two down. And I didn't say he had to be the main villain. He could be, and he has the strategic capabilities to be, but he doesn't have to be. And I doubt Nolan would make him the main villain. He'd probably take the position of someone, as many have said, like Maroni in TDK.

[Lungrocket]

If you mean he doesn't have any superpowers.

I don't. I mean he's just not that interesting or doesn't stand out. He's a second tier villain at best.

If you mean he's not very strong, he can hold his own in hand to hand combat against Batman

I'd rather see a villain who can best Batman, not just hold there own.

If you mean he's never had any good plans, he is a master strategist and has managed to take control of the entire criminal underworld of Gotham City. Twice.

Saw that already, with the Joker. Gimme something new.

Oh you mean his black mask? Who cares about supervillains for just their gimmicks? It's what they do that makes them interesting.

Right. And nothing mentioned so far sounds very interesting or unique.

Well The Riddler and Mr. Freeze have been ruled out. So that's two down.

Give me someone like Deacon Blackfire, someone that manipulates and twists the minds of Gotham, turning the homeless into a Cult. Turn Gotham into the streets of a John Carpenter film.

Give me a new genre, not the same old same old. Turn it into a thriller or a horror film. Just as Begins was an action adventure, TDK was a crime drama, give me something different for RISES.

Black Mask just doesn't do anything new. Even if its not the above example, I still want to be taken elsewhere with the story. Somewhere we haven't gone and isn't a retread.

[Lungrocket]

Deacon Blackfire could work quite well in Rises. After the events in TDK the people of Gotham need someone to turn to. In steps Blackfire to offer spiritual guidance but in fact is a manipulator. Someone that uses Gotham's weakest moment to build an army of followers. A Cult. Bane could be his heavy, his right arm who believes in Deacon's cause.

[Secret Fawful]

I don't. I mean he's just not that interesting or doesn't stand out. He's a second tier villain at best.
If you put the Joker, Two Face, The Riddler, The Penguin, and Catwoman on Tier One, sure.

Saw that already, with the Joker. Gimme something new. Fair enough but since Black Mask and the Joker are completely different in method and personality, and Black Mask is closer to an average joe than the Joker, I would say that Black Mask did a pretty darn good job.

Right. And nothing mentioned so far sounds very interesting or unique. I would say it comes down to different taste. I find him to be a very entertaining character, but I won't expect you to change your mind. My mind could be changed but not with an argument like "Black Mask sucks. He's Tony Soprano wearing a mask." I see more to the character than that, especially in terms of his potential.

Give me someone like Deacon Blackfire, someone that manipulates and twists the minds of Gotham, turning the homeless into a Cult. Turn Gotham into the streets of a John Carpenter film.

Give me a new genre, not the same old same old. Turn it into a thriller or a horror film. Just as Begins was an action adventure, TDK was a crime drama, give me something different for RISES. :dry: Maybe after Nolan's trilogy. :dry::dry::dry: I mean I believe Nolan has made a fantasy movie with a realistic tone, but I think that's a bit much.

Black Mask just doesn't do anything new. Even if its not the above example, I still want to be taken elsewhere with the story. Somewhere we haven't gone and isn't a retread.Black Mask wouldn't be a retread of TDK or BB. As far as films go his origin and his attack on Bruce Wayne personally and Wayne Enterprises isn't the sort of thing we have really seen in a Batman film. Black Mask has proved he can be both a threat to Gotham as a whole and a threat to Bruce Wayne personally just as much as any other villain. Even though a lot of other villains have done this, if we believe Nolan that Riddler and Freeze are out, and Goyer that Penguin and Catwoman are out, and assume that Poison Ivy and Clayface and Croc are out (lol), he could even do what he did in War Games and find the Batcave and even lead news crews there and broadcast it live! :oldrazz: He really is a character with somewhat untapped potential though.

[Keyser Soze]

I AGREE. This guy is young, imposing and talented, and at this point, I can't see him playing Bullock or even the new DA (unless they're the spine of the film. I doubt it.)

I think the DA should die in every movie in the series. Being District Attorney of Gotham should be like being Defense Against the Dark Arts teacher at Hogwarts, or Director of CTU, or Debra Morgan's boyfriend.

[Gianakin_]

Hahahahaha:up:

[Bat-Mite]

Its not like Nolan to revisit old terriotry? I suggest you look up any analysis of Nolan's films: the motivation of his male protagonists and lack of character in his fridge-stuffing (er..I mean female characters) is far more similar movie to movie.

In fact, practically all of his movies can be boiled down to: "Due to the loss of a female loved one, a male protagonist spirals into a darkness that he is trying to crawl his way out of"When has he ever repackaged the exact same story and tried to sell it to the audience twice? Of course, ANY director is going to have similarities between his/her movies, sometimes even revisiting some of the same themes. Sergio Leone's movies all had violent gun battles, women being abused, an Ennio Morricone soundtrack, and tons of facial closeups, but The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly is a very different animal from Once Upon A Time in America. Likewise, most of M. Night Shyamalan's movies feature a cheesy, predictable twist at the end, but the stories in his movies all vary greatly.

[craigdbfan]

Don't know why Black Mask is being pushed so hard as a villain.

I understand what people mean when they feel the character would be retreading old ground. The mob will always be important to any Batman story but they work a lot better as side villains (tools basically for the main villain).

We've already seen an intelligent "mad man" take control of the mob, topple it and send Gotham into disarray. While the one difference with Black Mask would be his attempt to keep control over Gotham which just seems like something Maroni and the other Italian mob goons are going for.

Knowing Christopher Nolan he'll bring one last big name from the rogues gallery.

Personally Victor Fries is the perfect character to use I think. The weaponry he is involved with that backfires and turns him into Mr. Freeze could be tied back to Wayne Corps armed division somehow.

Freeze hunts down the source of the order to create such weaponry to find out that Wayne Corp is supplying Batman the wanted vigilante from Gotham.

They can even mix character traits from Hush into Freeze to make things real dynamic.

Again this is just more musing based on nothing. ;)

[Sith Scotti]

Mr Freeze ain't happening .

[craigdbfan]

Mr Freeze ain't happening .

Hello Warner Bros executive or Emma Thompson or Chris Nolan or David Goyer or......

Oh, wait you're none of those people!

Everyone is on the same boat (minus WB/Nolan & company) right now in terms of guessing the villain.

Plus do people honestly think Nolan is going to end his series with an unknown rogue?

Think again.

[Gianakin_]

Hello Warner Bros executive or Emma Thompson or Chris Nolan or David Goyer or......

Oh, wait you're none of those people!

Everyone is on the same boat (minus WB/Nolan & company) right now in terms of guessing the villain.

Plus do people honestly think Nolan is going to end his series with an unknown rogue?

Think again.

No, he's right. Nolan ruled out Freeze in a previous interview of his.

[PreK]

Hello Warner Bros executive or Emma Thompson or Chris Nolan or David Goyer or......

Oh, wait you're none of those people!

Everyone is on the same boat (minus WB/Nolan & company) right now in terms of guessing the villain.

Plus do people honestly think Nolan is going to end his series with an unknown rogue?

Think again.
Nolan said 'hello' to this post back in a March interview (http://herocomplex.latimes.com/2010/03/10/christopher-nolan-takes-flight-with-superman-we-have-a-fantastic-story-1/):
His villain choices to date have steered clear of strongly supernatural or super-science characters but he shook his head when asked if that was a trajectory he would continue. He did however concede one tidbit: “It won’t be,” he said, “Mr. Freeze.”
While we're all in the same boat, we can absolutely dismiss both Freeze and Riddler as Nolan has confirmed the absence of both.

[Sith Scotti]

Hello Warner Bros executive or Emma Thompson or Chris Nolan or David Goyer or......

Oh, wait you're none of those people!

Everyone is on the same boat (minus WB/Nolan & company) right now in terms of guessing the villain.

Plus do people honestly think Nolan is going to end his series with an unknown rogue?

Think again.
Nolan specefically stated do not expect to see Mr Freeze in his films. Unless he had a change in mind, I'll take him at his word

[craigdbfan]

Knew I read something along those lines, oh well seem like a jackass now. Kind of funny I'll leave that post. Sets me up as a total goon. :lmao:

Why he ruled him out so early is the strange part for me. Which always left me dubious.

Riddler was the name that was heavily being thrown around at that time and he went out to deny Freeze out of the blue.

Maybe we won't see Mr. Freeze but we might see Dr. Fries. :wow:

[Gianakin_]

Knew I read something along those lines, oh well seem like a jackass now. Kind of funny I'll leave that post. Sets me up as a total goon. :lmao:

Why he ruled him out so early is the strange part for me. Which always left me dubious.

Riddler was the name that was heavily being thrown around at that time and he went out to deny Freeze out of the blue.

Maybe we won't see Mr. Freeze but we might see Dr. Fries. :wow:

Don't worry, he denied the Riddler being in TDKR, too. But I don't think that there's place for Fries in the 3rd part of the trilogy, except for a glorified cameo.

[Miranda Fox]

Its not like Nolan to revisit old terriotry? I suggest you look up any analysis of Nolan's films: the motivation of his male protagonists and lack of character in his fridge-stuffing (er..I mean female characters) is far more similar movie to movie.

In fact, practically all of his movies can be boiled down to: "Due to the loss of a female loved one, a male protagonist spirals into a darkness that he is trying to crawl his way out of"

Funny, then, that you named Nolan one of your favourite directors on your blog.

And I wish everyone would STFU with the fridging stuff. I won't sit here and argue that his female characters are as deep as the male ones, but I've never been offended by them either or by their deaths because, unlike some directors I could name, he made it meaningful enough to work. Also, I find it hilarious that a board so entrenched with misogyny as this one is, is suddenly pretending to be pro-females.

[PreK]

Was that a request to keep the anti-feminist movement going here?

:huh:

[regwec]

a board so entrenched with misogyny as this one
Really?

[Doc Samson]

Hello Warner Bros executive or Emma Thompson or Chris Nolan or David Goyer or......

Oh, wait you're none of those people!

Everyone is on the same boat (minus WB/Nolan & company) right now in terms of guessing the villain.

Plus do people honestly think Nolan is going to end his series with an unknown rogue?

Think again.

I don't see why not, he certainly started it with a few. The Joker is one of the greatest (if not thee greatest) comic book villain of all time, & Two-Face is right up there as far as Batman's rogues gallery goes. Using them was pretty much a no-brainer, especially with the Joker explicitly foreshadowed in BB. There's no such situation this time, and I think if nothing else Nolan should have the trust of every Batman fan in the universe to at least deliver something entertaining. I don't believe a well-known rogue is necessary for that to happen...

[regwec]

I believe it is probably a prerequisite for a comparatively huge box office, however.

[Miranda Fox]

Was that a request to keep the anti-feminist movement going here?

:huh:

No. I'm saying Nolan's films aren't awash with misogyny.

[Doc Samson]

I believe it is probably a prerequisite for a comparatively huge box office, however.

I used to think that way, but after Inception, I don't know anymore. That movie couldn't have been anymore anti-summer blockbuster, and it was still huge. Of course Leonardo isn't some obscure actor, but certainly, I believe Nolan is starting to carve a name for himself as someone who can deliver intelligent blockbusters. At the end of the day, this is Batman, that alone should count for something.

[cerealkiller182]

When has he ever repackaged the exact same story and tried to sell it to the audience twice? Of course, ANY director is going to have similarities between his/her movies, sometimes even revisiting some of the same themes. Sergio Leone's movies all had violent gun battles, women being abused, an Ennio Morricone soundtrack, and tons of facial closeups, but The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly is a very different animal from Once Upon A Time in America. Likewise, most of M. Night Shyamalan's movies feature a cheesy, predictable twist at the end, but the stories in his movies all vary greatly.

But it isnt theme, its overall plot. None of this seems comparable. Your examples are themes and devices that are applied to different story backbones, while Nolan uses the same backbone only changing the aesthetics. Not saying its bad, but he is certainly (as you said he didnt do) "revisiting old territory"

On the subject, he also revisted Scarecrow, Batman's motivations, and gangsters (Falcone and Maroni were interchangeable, Roberts and Wilkinson could have switched movies and no one would have noticed). Not to mention the cyclical nature of both The Prestige, Memento, and Inception. There really is no evidence to suggest that Nolan wouldnt reuse the Leage of Shadows.

[cerealkiller182]

Funny, then, that you named Nolan one of your favourite directors on your blog.

I didnt say I didnt like him. Just giving an honest criticism of his work. I could give negative feedback on any of my favorite directors. I refuse to be an apologist just because they happen to be my favorite.

And I wish everyone would STFU with the fridging stuff. I won't sit here and argue that his female characters are as deep as the male ones, but I've never been offended by them either or by their deaths because, unlike some directors I could name, he made it meaningful enough to work. Also, I find it hilarious that a board so entrenched with misogyny as this one is, is suddenly pretending to be pro-females.I do not think he is misogynistic. But most of his female characters have only served one purpose: dying in order for the male protagonist to feel bad. That is by definition "fridgestuffing," which although highly criticized does not necessarily mean a bad thing. Death happens in life and should be reflected in art and serves as a very strong motivator. I only point it out because I think (warning another honest criticism. Please save all "Nolan bashing" comments) he should vary a little more. Its not like he isnt capable; Ellen Page in Inception is not fridgestuffing.

[Miranda Fox]

I didnt say I didnt like him. Just giving an honest criticism of his work. I could give negative feedback on any of my favorite directors. I refuse to be an apologist just because they happen to be my favorite.

I like how you assume my thinking a criticism is overused and exaggerated = apologist.

I do not think he is misogynistic. But most of his female characters have only served one purpose: dying in order for the male protagonist to feel bad. That is by definition "fridgestuffing," which although highly criticized does not necessarily mean a bad thing. Death happens in life and should be reflected in art and serves as a very strong motivator. I only point it out because I think (warning another honest criticism. Please save all "Nolan bashing" comments) he should vary a little more. Its not like he isnt capable; Ellen Page in Inception is not fridgestuffing.Neither was Ellie in Insomnia or Natalie in Memento.

I'm with you on Nolan changing things up, but I also think that he shouldn't be backed into a corner either. Something similar happened with Nick Hornby - he was criticised for his female characters not being well-rounded - and he wrote a book whose protagonist was a female character to try and prove he could do it. And it sucked because his heart wasn't in it.

[DV8]

I hope Killer Croc or Clayface are going to be the villain(s) of this one . . .

[Knight Rise]

I hope Killer Croc or Clayface are going to be the villain(s) of this one . . .

what are the odds of that happening though? most villains seem like they deserve this film, but its a matter of thinking which ones REALLY deserve it. im not saying they dont have a chance, but them combined doesnt sound promising

[Wolverine1988]

I am almost 100 percent positive the villain be someone we HAVEN'T SEEN yet on screen and more than likley will not be considered known villain like Joker,Two Face,Riddler,Catwoman,Penguin or Mr.Freeze

It's gonna be like someone said a "Tier 2" villain.

[DV8]

what are the odds of that happening though? most villains seem like they deserve this film, but its a matter of thinking which ones REALLY deserve it. im not saying they dont have a chance, but them combined doesnt sound promising

not necessartily combined, but I'd like to see one of them onscreen before we start a whole new series of Batman films after Nolan is done, which would likely put them on the backburner . . . AGAIN

[Knight Rise]

not necessartily combined, but I'd like to see one of them onscreen before we start a whole new series of Batman films after Nolan is done, which would likely put them on the backburner . . . AGAIN

in that case, Clayface has a higher chance than Croc because of the meaning of the movie

[raybia]

Is it possible that Clayface could be the main villain and Hardy is the actor to play him? Certainly the character would be Nolanified as maybe a master of disguise but it did work in MI:2, maybe this would be a method of bringing back Two Face so to speak and maybe Ra's too.

[DV8]

I definitely think Hardy's acting abilities are more suited for Clayface than Croc . . . I want to see Nolan get more special-effecty though Lol . . . really start pushing the suspension of disbelief a little more; we had some really well-grounded, realistic villains in Begins, a slightly more unbelievable villain in Two-Face, and Nolan can just blow the lid off of all the fanboy "That'll never happen in a Nolan movie" type of jibber jabber

[cerealkiller182]

I dont understand how a character who is so adept at making life masks that another actor would have to play him when said mask is on is "realistic." Just another way the hairs are being split to try to "Nolanize" every character./

[The Guard]

With the exception of Falcone, I hate Nolan's mobsters. They're like caricatures. I hope to see the mob element done justice in the third film, but I'm not holding my breath.

Had Nolan done anything with the League of Shadows, or developed them in any way, I wouldn't be surprised to see them back in the third film. But I doubt we'll see that.

I don't think Rachel was a bad character. Ditto Ariadne. They don't have a ton of depth, but really, none of his supporting characters do. They're mostly about story and themes. It's not just his female characters that aren't entirely satisfying.

[Mr. Earle]

I dont think Maroni and Gambol were carricatures, but the Chechen was. He was hilarious though so it doesnt matter.

[Gianakin_]

They served their purpose in their respective films, and as a bonus we got good to hilarious performances. I like them.

[solidsnake86]

If anything I thought Falcone was the worst depiction of a mobster in the films so far and it still baffles me how they couldn't even pronounce his name properly.

[Gianakin_]

If anything I thought Falcone was the worst depiction of a mobster in the films so far and it still baffles me how they couldn't even pronounce his name properly.

How's the right pronunciation? Falc-own?

[Keyser Soze]

I thought Eric Roberts' Maroni was Nolan's best gangster so far. I liked the little touches of depth there, like his realisation that things had gone too far as he goes to Gordon with information.

[Octoberist]

I never minded the mobsters, and they work for the most part. Falcone was okay, but I thought he kinda fell apart (as a character) after he got locked up.

[Gianakin_]

I thought Eric Roberts' Maroni was Nolan's best gangster so far. I liked the little touches of depth there, like his realisation that things had gone too far as he goes to Gordon with information.

Yup, he's my fav, too.

[Gianakin_]

I never minded the mobsters, and they work for the most part. Falcone was okay, but I thought he kinda fell apart (as a character) after he got locked up.

Well, he disappeared 2 scenes after he got locked up.

[Mr. Earle]

I thought Eric Roberts' Maroni was Nolan's best gangster so far. I liked the little touches of depth there, like his realisation that things had gone too far as he goes to Gordon with information.
Oh, that was a very nice scene. http://forums.superherohype.com/images/icons/icon14.gif

[The Guard]

I never minded the mobsters, and they work for the most part. Falcone was okay, but I thought he kinda fell apart (as a character) after he got locked up.

He DID fall apart as a character. That was the point.

[The Guard]

Don't get me wrong, Maroni had some decent moments in the film, but there was pretty much nothing to him other than "classic cliche gangster". There's no character to the mobsters thus far. They're just mobsters.

[Gianakin_]

Don't get me wrong, Maroni had some decent moments in the film, but there was pretty much nothing to him other than "classic cliche gangster". There's no character to the mobsters thus far. They're just mobsters.

That's all they're supposed to be in this take. "Criminals aren't complicated". Another take in the future, another characterization.

[solidsnake86]

How's the right pronunciation? Falc-own?

I'm thinking of how to type it but the E at the end of falcone isn't pronounced as E in italian. Especially because Maroni ends with an I and obviously falcone doesn't but yet they pronounced it the same way. I guess it should be fal-co-neh.

[Gianakin_]

I'm thinking of how to type it but the E at the end of falcone isn't pronounced as E in italian. Especially because Maroni ends with an I and obviously falcone doesn't but yet they pronounced it the same way. I guess it should be fal-co-neh.

I don't remember that part of BB specifically, but I think his name's pronunciation varied depending on who said his name.

[Keyser Soze]

I never minded the mobsters, and they work for the most part. Falcone was okay, but I thought he kinda fell apart (as a character) after he got locked up.

I figured that Falcone tied into the whole "fear" theme of the story, in that he's very menacing as an off-screen presence, but is found to be sorely lacking in genuine menace once he's actually revealed for the petty hood he is.

[The Guard]

There was just never much to him.

[The Joker]

I didn't like Begins Falcone much. I guess I'm always thinking of comic book Falcone, who was so much more interesting and classy. Falcone in Begins was a generic scumbag in a suit.

[Gianakin_]

I didn't like Begins Falcone much. I guess I'm always thinking of comic book Falcone, who was so much more interesting and classy. Falcone in Begins was a generic scumbag in a suit.

But the problem is that TLH Falcone was V. Corleone and BY1 Falcone wasn't that interesting (to me), he was as generic (albeit in a less comedic, tongue-in-cheek fashion) as BB Falcone.

[The Joker]

As subjective as your view there is, a Vito Corleone clone is a hundred times more interesting than the Begins Falcone.

[Gianakin_]

As subjective as your view there is, a Vito Corleone clone is a hundred times more interesting than the Begins Falcone.

I agree, but my point is that bringing a Vito in a Batman film would probably incite (negative) comments throughout the GA. The way BB did it, GA saw a mob boss that served his part in the film and it just left a sour taste in half the Batfans' mouths.

Now, I'm not saying that either you get a Marlon Brando clone or the BB interpretation. I just get their reasoning for approaching him that way.

[The Guard]

I don't really see why Falcone has to be anyone's clone. I think there's even potential for him to be more interesting on film than he was in THE LONG HALLOWEEN.

[The Joker]

Visually he looked like Brando in the comics. Plus being the head of a big crime family. But being the head of a crime family is not exclusive to Vito Corleone. And visually he didn't have to look like Brando in the movies.

[Gianakin_]

I don't really see why Falcone has to be anyone's clone. I think there's even potential for him to be more interesting on film than he was in THE LONG HALLOWEEN.

Next take. In this one, there was space for mob bosses to serve as plot tools, and I find nothing wrong with that. The problem lies with how faithful he is in the comics. He's either a Vito clone or a bland mobster from BY1. Only when you pull a "BR Penguin" could you make him more interesting. And, like I said, I'd welcome that in the next take.

[Gianakin_]

Visually he looked like Brando in the comics. Plus being the head of a being crime family. But being the head of a crime family is not exclusive to Vito Corleone. And visually he didn't have to look like Brando in the movies.

Exactly. And that's where the pickle is: Striking a balance between not ripping off a cinema icon and having his minor role serve the plot.

[Excelsior.]

Tom Hardy? Bah! Where's Crispin Glover? The man we need, the man we deserve.

[Keyser Soze]

Tom Hardy? Bah! Where's Crispin Glover? The man we need, the man we deserve.

Didn't someone who posted on here actually create a site back in 2006/2007 dedicated to the cause of having Heath Ledger removed from The Dark Knight and replaced by Crispin Glover?

[Mastodon123]

Tom Hardy? Bah! Where's Crispin Glover? The man we need, the man we deserve.

Hes at home, washing his tights. :awesome:

[TheBatman072]

Didn't someone who posted on here actually create a site back in 2006/2007 dedicated to the cause of having Heath Ledger removed from The Dark Knight and replaced by Crispin Glover?


I bet that person feels really stupid.

[The Guard]

Next take. In this one, there was space for mob bosses to serve as plot tools, and I find nothing wrong with that. The problem lies with how faithful he is in the comics. He's either a Vito clone or a bland mobster from BY1. Only when you pull a "BR Penguin" could you make him more interesting. And, like I said, I'd welcome that in the next take.

There's room for the mob to be a plot device and have a unique characterization. All it would take is a hint at a character's motivations and a slight evolution of character, and using screentime for that, instead of filling the screen with mob cliches. BATMAN BEGINS kind of had that. Kind of. That's one of the main reasons I want The Penguin and a freak mob. I want the mob to have some damn character.

[The Demon's Head]

I don't get where the Falcone hate comes from. He had a very small role, but he was extremely entertaining. Other than Maroni, most of the mobsters in TDK didn't have much of a personality, and you can't say the same about Falcone.

[Gianakin_]

That's one of the main reasons I want The Penguin and a freak mob. I want the mob to have some damn character.

That's the reply to your plea right there: The difference between regular mob and freak mob.

People know what to expect when they hear the word "mob". It worked in context of the movie. Nolan wanted this cliche approach to save him time for other stuff. I like the decision.

[craigdbfan]

There's room for the mob to be a plot device and have a unique characterization. All it would take is a hint at a character's motivations and a slight evolution of character, and using screentime for that, instead of filling the screen with mob cliches. BATMAN BEGINS kind of had that. Kind of. That's one of the main reasons I want The Penguin and a freak mob. I want the mob to have some damn character.

If the Penguin is used don't you think Nolan might want to go for the aristocrat version rather than the mutated outcast or club owner/mobster Penguin.

Nolan taking the character and making him menacing and evil by just setting up his cruelty through how the Penguin uses his money into completely taking over Gotham.

It would set up an interesting dynamic between him and Bruce Wayne. Might give Wayne some valuable screen time instead of serving as a comic relief which I feel the character is used as most of the time in the Nolan series. Not really complaining about it because Nolan's subtle sense of humor is fantastically charming.

[The Demon's Head]

Penguin can work as both an ordainary mobster, and a Freak crime-boss. Not to mention he's a much more compelling character than Black Mask. But then again, Most of the villains in Batman's rogues gallery are FAR more interesting than Black Mask.

[The Guard]

I mean, if you like a cliche mobster, fine.

I want more for the Batman mythology, and I think the writers could have done more than just present point A and point B, but no evolution or insight into the characters beyond the whole "Batman turning into a feared outcast" element.

If the Penguin is used don't you think Nolan might want to go for the aristocrat version rather than the mutated outcast or club owner/mobster Penguin.

Yup.

Nolan taking the character and making him menacing and evil by just setting up his cruelty through how the Penguin uses his money into completely taking over Gotham.

Precisely.

I really think there's been more to Wayne than comic relief, though. A lot of Batman's struggles are seen through Bruce's screentime.

Personally, I think they missed a golden opportunity if they don't try to make The Penguin into another Falcone and making the criminal control of Gotham a cyclical thing.

The Penguin really should be an ordinary mobster who tries on the freak thing, doesn't like it, and becomes a sort of a blend of the two concepts, evolving the mob in Gotham for the future.

[Gianakin_]

I want more for the Batman mythology, and I think the writers could have done more than just present point A and point B, but no evolution or insight into the characters beyond the whole "Batman turning into a feared outcast" element.


Elaborate?

PS: I like cliches just fine, when they serve their purpose.

[Mr. Earle]

http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/3251/1288800807972.jpg

Didnt TDK have enough plot threads? People wanted character development for the ****ing mobsters who were just there for the Joker to usurp?

In another thread i asked for more well known characters running around (like Harley working in Akrham) so that the movie would feel more like a Batman movie and predicted that fans would whine that all those characters didnt get development. And here we are whining about Maroni not getting character development.

[Bat-Mite]

In another thread i asked for more well known characters running around (like Harley working in Akrham) so that the movie would feel more like a Batman movie and predicted that fans would whine that all those characters didnt get development. And here we are whining about Maroni not getting character development.I was offended that they didn't give the falafel guy more character development, personally.

[TheBatman072]

I was offended that they didn't give the falafel guy more character development, personally.


Well we do know he has kids to feed.

[Cordoba]

Mob bosses are major league yawn material.

[The Guard]

Elaborate?

PS: I like cliches just fine, when they serve their purpose.

Sometimes cliches work. I don't think this worked as well as it could have in terms of how it informs the Batman mythology.

Didnt TDK have enough plot threads? People wanted character development for the ****ing mobsters who were just there for the Joker to usurp?

Here's the problem with that.

If the mob was just there for the Joker to usurp, then even then, the movie kind of failed to capitalize on this. Because in the movie, the mob came across as complete pushovers who also happened to be stupid about their dealings.

As such, I didn't give a fig that Joker did anything with/to them. I didn't consider it clever, and I didn't consider him particularly clever for doing any of it. He might as well have been trying to manipulate and take down children. Ditto with the ridiculous "The mob did this to you, Harvey, it wasn't me". Utterly childish logic at play there.

The issue seems obvious to me. What's the point in using a specific character from the comics if you're not going to either present anything resembling that character, or do anything particularly interesting with the angle? Granted, Maroni's never had that much of a character even in the comics, but for instance, why even bother to use Maroni if he's not even going to scar Harvey Dent? Did Nolan just want to throw people off so he could utilize the oh so clever "I fell with half my face in this ignitable liquid, and then I caught fire from an explosion" angle? Supposedly the movie Maroni was at war. Where was the war?

[Mister H.]

I don't get where the Falcone hate comes from. He had a very small role, but he was extremely entertaining. Other than Maroni, most of the mobsters in TDK didn't have much of a personality, and you can't say the same about Falcone.
It's insanity. Tom Wilkinson was incredible in his turn as Falcone. Who on earth would have a gripe about Falcone in BB?

[ronny]

I really liked Falcone in Batman Begins. Because the Brando-ripoff left me very cold. It was lazy, horrible writing. And I love The Long Halloween, I really do. But some of it is so damn stupid.
Like Batman mocking Falcone as he is at his sons grave. What the hell was that? Batman has a lot of human decency and compassion. Why would he do something so cruel?
And the fact that the reader is supposed to care about this mobster when everything has been done to make him a crude imitation of a character from a book.

Tom Wilkinson did not add an extra dimension to Falcone. But what he did do was make him seem like a legitimate, serious criminal. A nasty, low-down, good-for-nothing, drug dealing murderer. That guy had no class.
More class than Maroni, who went on talkshows and made a complete prat out of himself and looked coked-up half the time.

Falcone is what I imagine a mafia boss is probably like. Beyond all the shallow wealth and trappings of power. All it amounts to is an old **** in a seedy restaurant dealing drugs to schoolchildren.
He was a world away from being a cardboard Brando impersonator, and it was a real breath of fresh air.

[Lungrocket]

Tom Wilkinson did not add an extra dimension to Falcone. But what he did do was make him seem like a legitimate, serious criminal. A nasty, low-down, good-for-nothing, drug dealing murderer.

He was mesmerizing as Falcone. The way he just verbally taunted Bruce about his father and the way of the world. Great scene.

[antsman41]

Falcone is what I imagine a mafia boss is probably like. Beyond all the shallow wealth and trappings of power. All it amounts to is an old **** in a seedy restaurant dealing drugs to schoolchildren.
He was a world away from being a cardboard Brando impersonator, and it was a real breath of fresh air.

Like in Donnie Brasco. Mob bosses in the end are not really that cool or badass. They are family men, normal guys just with a different job than most of the regular people.

[Excelsior.]

The Long Halloween has some horrible writing. It makes Batman Begins' dialogue seem like it was written by Aaron Sorkin.

[Figs]

Didnt TDK have enough plot threads? People wanted character development for the ****ing mobsters who were just there for the Joker to usurp?

In another thread i asked for more well known characters running around (like Harley working in Akrham) so that the movie would feel more like a Batman movie and predicted that fans would whine that all those characters didnt get development. And here we are whining about Maroni not getting character development.

It's complete crap if you ask me. Why do so many fans give a **** about the boring mobsters?? It's all about Batman's actual rogues gallery, those guys are the ones that make the comic a bit more exciting alongside Batman of course.

I shake my head when I see people mention that they want Maroni to be alive and return or even worse...wanting Rupert Thorne in the film.

I was offended that they didn't give the falafel guy more character development, personally.

:up:

[Mr. Earle]

I was offended that they didn't give the falafel guy more character development, personally.:awesome:Mob bosses are major league yawn material.
Agreed.

Here's the problem with that.

If the mob was just there for the Joker to usurp, then even then, the movie kind of failed to capitalize on this. Because in the movie, the mob came across as complete pushovers who also happened to be stupid about their dealings.

As such, I didn't give a fig that Joker did anything with/to them. I didn't consider it clever, and I didn't consider him particularly clever for doing any of it. He might as well have been trying to manipulate and take down children. Ditto with the ridiculous "The mob did this to you, Harvey, it wasn't me". Utterly childish logic at play there.

The issue seems obvious to me. What's the point in using a specific character from the comics if you're not going to either present anything resembling that character, or do anything particularly interesting with the angle? Granted, Maroni's never had that much of a character even in the comics, but for instance, why even bother to use Maroni if he's not even going to scar Harvey Dent? Did Nolan just want to throw people off so he could utilize the oh so clever "I fell with half my face in this ignitable liquid, and then I caught fire from an explosion" angle? Supposedly the movie Maroni was at war. Where was the war?
The movie wasnt about the mob though, it was about the Joker coming to town and owning everyone including the goddamn Batman. Mob bosses represented the old guard which will soon be replaced by freaks, freak mob bosses, monsters, etc.

So the movie wasnt really about the mob. They all got their fair share of good moments, and besides, what else was there to say about them?


Btw, my list:

1) Maroni for having swagger, pimp slapping *****es and not wanting to hear them speak, and being Eric Roberts.
2) Gambol for being a badass and M.J White.
3) Falcone for being the king, and Tom Wilkinson
4) Chechen because he was hilarious!

[Mr. Earle]

I shake my head when I see people mention that they want Maroni to be alive and return or even worse...wanting Rupert Thorne in the film.

Killing all the mobsters creates a vacuum that someone has to fill. Unless the new villain is a mobster, i say keep Maroni and have him lay low after all that happened in TDK. That way the mob stays low and out of the plot of TDKR. Or have him collaborate with the main villain in some capacity.

Plot aside, Maroni was great, but i dont want to see another movie focus on mob bosses.

[antsman41]

1) Maroni for having swagger, pimp slapping *****es and not wanting to hear them speak, and being Eric Roberts.
2) Gambol for being a badass and M.J White.
3) Falcone for being the king, and Tom Wilkinson
4) Chechen because he was hilarious!

My list would be;

1. Chechen: He has the best "pronunciation" of words ever, was nonchalant about being a head of a mob, was sort of open to "Freaks" (like Scarecrow) and had DAWGS!
2. Maroni: Had the biggest balls and was very coy in his Mob-activities, and had the most "personality". Check out his interview on Gotham Tonight w/ Mike Engel, it is amazing...
3. Falcone: He owned most of Gotham at one point but couldn't handle escalation.
4. Lau: He could steal all of their money and then tell them while he did it but he was pwn'd by the Batman and the Joker because overall he wasn't that BA and kind of was a twerp.
5. Gambol: Wasn't smart and too cocky. Got knifed, sucka...

[Doc Samson]

Killing all the mobsters creates a vacuum that someone has to fill. Unless the new villain is a mobster, i say keep Maroni and have him lay low after all that happened in TDK. That way the mob stays low and out of the plot of TDKR. Or have him collaborate with the main villain in some capacity.

Plot aside, Maroni was great, but i dont want to see another movie focus on mob bosses.

I agree. I always assumed that was kind of the point of the Joker anyway, he was a new breed that pretty much wiped out the old way of doing things. Not only that, but he physically wiped out just about all the important guys himself, save for Maroni who Dent took care of personally. They'll be so fragmented that I'm not sure how much of an impact they'll have on the story, especially if the main villain isn't in that mafia vein.

[ALP]

The movie does not have to have a big focus on the mafia, but the mafia is definitely still there. Do we just act like it just disappeared?

[Doc Samson]

The movie does not have to have a big focus on the mafia, but the mafia is definitely still there. Do we just act like it just disappeared?

Definitely not, but this is why I feel Black Mask (or to a lesser extent the Penguin) make the most sense, as they bridge the gap between the mob of old and the rise of the freaks. Certainly, if a mob still exists, a traditional mob boss wouldn't command the same power anymore

[Wolverine1988]

I thought Falcone was the most intimidating Mob Boss , Tom Wilkinson is def one of the best Actors in the world and he did a pretty damn good job for the a mount of screen time he had.

I like Maroni the best though, Eric Roberts has a nice presence with Maroni and though he didn't say much but i liked that, it was change to the usual loud motuh slick talkig mob boss we always see.

[The Caped Clown]

Definitely not, but this is why I feel Black Mask (or to a lesser extent the Penguin) make the most sense, as they bridge the gap between the mob of old and the rise of the freaks. Certainly, if a mob still exists, a traditional mob boss wouldn't command the same power anymore

My sentiments exactly! And given Black Mask's inclusion in TDK early drafts and Nolan's previous statements about the Penguin not being in his films (though with Nolan, it could always be a diversion), i definitely can see Black Mask assuming the role previously occupied (both in terms of role and screen time) as the a fore mentioned mobsters. Here's to hoping that's true but at this point, who really has any idea what this film will include.

[Figs]

Killing all the mobsters creates a vacuum that someone has to fill. Unless the new villain is a mobster, i say keep Maroni and have him lay low after all that happened in TDK. That way the mob stays low and out of the plot of TDKR. Or have him collaborate with the main villain in some capacity.

Plot aside, Maroni was great, but i dont want to see another movie focus on mob bosses.

I liked Roberts as Maroni too but I just don't want to see many regular mobsters in this last film. He doesn't have to be dead, as you said he can just lay low and I'll be happy with that.

[Visceral]

My sentiments exactly! And given Black Mask's inclusion in TDK early drafts and Nolan's previous statements about the Penguin not being in his films (though with Nolan, it could always be a diversion), i definitely can see Black Mask assuming the role previously occupied (both in terms of role and screen time) as the a fore mentioned mobsters. Here's to hoping that's true but at this point, who really has any idea what this film will include.

what? whoa where?

[Wolverine1988]

But see if you have Black Mask as the new "Mob Boss' and a clear indication of Freaks taking over, than gotta think they will have another villain as well.

I mean if the movie just deals with a crazy mob boss, really not much to work with, thats why i am hoping they include another engaging villain though i am not sure who they would use, because a villain like Deadshot sure as hell doesn't fit that

I doubt she appears in this film, but i really hope Catwoman is in this.

[Carmine Falcone]

The Long Halloween has some horrible writing. It makes Batman Begins' dialogue seem like it was written by Aaron Sorkin.

:lmao:

[The Caped Clown]

what? whoa where?

I'll look for a link cuz its been a few years but i remember reading on these boards back during production of TDK that he had a role in the early drafts but was eventually written out. I'm really sorry i don't have a link, as i can see how that can be annoying. I'll try to find one but if anyone else has one please share.

In regards to Black Mask being the sole villain, i too hope he wouldn't be the main antagonist.

[Doc Samson]

But see if you have Black Mask as the new "Mob Boss' and a clear indication of Freaks taking over, than gotta think they will have another villain as well.

I mean if the movie just deals with a crazy mob boss, really not much to work with, thats why i am hoping they include another engaging villain though i am not sure who they would use, because a villain like Deadshot sure as hell doesn't fit that

I doubt she appears in this film, but i really hope Catwoman is in this.

I think it's safe to assume this movie will have at the very least two rogues villains, one minor one major, just based off the previous films. The thing to remember however, is that Nolan seems to like the more frightening, intimidating villains (as I do :cwink:)

So after Ras Al Ghul, Scarecrow, Zsasz, Joker & Two-Face, who exactly is left to follow that up who isn't supernatural, overly far-fetched or already ruled out? Looking at it that way, Black Mask seems to be one of the few who could potentially fit the bill, along with Hugo Strange or a very different Bane. My money is on Hardy portraying either one of these guys

[Secret Fawful]

what? whoa where?
I don't know the reliability but I found this- (http://superherouniverse.com/wiki/Black_Mask/index.html#Nolan_Series)

When the very first details about The Dark Knight (http://superherouniverse.com/wiki/The_Dark_Knight_%28film%29/index.html) were released, they alleged that Roman Sionis/Black Mask was to be one of the antagonists of the film. He was described as an industrial heir who loses his company to Bruce Wayne and adopts the Black Mask persona for revenge. By the time Jonathan Nolan (http://superherouniverse.com/wiki/index.php?title=Jonathan_Nolan&action=edit) wrote the final draft, he was cut.

This apparently used to be listed on the Wiki page for Black Mask as well but I don't see it there now.

[darknight7]

My list would be;

1. Chechen: He has the best "pronunciation" of words ever, was nonchalant about being a head of a mob, was sort of open to "Freaks" (like Scarecrow) and had DAWGS!
2. Maroni: Had the biggest balls and was very coy in his Mob-activities, and had the most "personality". Check out his interview on Gotham Tonight w/ Mike Engel, it is amazing...
3. Falcone: He owned most of Gotham at one point but couldn't handle escalation.
4. Lau: He could steal all of their money and then tell them while he did it but he was pwn'd by the Batman and the Joker because overall he wasn't that BA and kind of was a twerp.
5. Gambol: Wasn't smart and too cocky. Got knifed, sucka...

Hahahah brilliant. This is so on the money, so right...and it cracked me up too hahah nice:word:

--dk7

[Lungrocket]

I think it's safe to assume this movie will have at the very least two rogues villains, one minor one major, just based off the previous films. The thing to remember however, is that Nolan seems to like the more frightening, intimidating villains (as I do :cwink:)

So after Ras Al Ghul, Scarecrow, Zsasz, Joker & Two-Face, who exactly is left to follow that up who isn't supernatural, overly far-fetched or already ruled out?


http://www.nexternal.com/dreamland/images/cult3.jpg

http://www.nexternal.com/dreamland/images/cult4.jpg



http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_B49rvfQPG60/SNoWZijtz7I/AAAAAAAAA3Q/Dt9JTT-PxjI/s400/blackfire.jpg


One of the most overlooked Batman tales is also one of the best. It begins with the Batman in dire straits, held captive beneath Gotham by a group of zealots. Their leader, the charismatic Deacon Blackfire is determined to break Batman's will and brainwash him to becoming a devoted follower. It works. It's shocking, jarring and incredible. The Batman's will is destroyed and even after his escape, the Dark Knight remains on shaky ground. Outside of A Death in the Family, this is the only trade paperback to feature Jason Todd as Robin (and a likable one at that). He assists Batman in trying to reclaim his own will, but it's not an easy path. The Cult feels (and even looks) a lot like The Dark Knight Returns, but this is no futuristic tale or flight of fancy. This is real and the story is told with callous brutality that makes it all the more powerful.

[Lungrocket]

Hardy would make a great Deacon Blackfire.

[Doc Samson]

http://www.nexternal.com/dreamland/images/cult3.jpg

http://www.nexternal.com/dreamland/images/cult4.jpg



http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_B49rvfQPG60/SNoWZijtz7I/AAAAAAAAA3Q/Dt9JTT-PxjI/s400/blackfire.jpg


One of the most overlooked Batman tales is also one of the best. It begins with the Batman in dire straits, held captive beneath Gotham by a group of zealots. Their leader, the charismatic Deacon Blackfire is determined to break Batman's will and brainwash him to becoming a devoted follower. It works. It's shocking, jarring and incredible. The Batman's will is destroyed and even after his escape, the Dark Knight remains on shaky ground. Outside of A Death in the Family, this is the only trade paperback to feature Jason Todd as Robin (and a likable one at that). He assists Batman in trying to reclaim his own will, but it's not an easy path. The Cult feels (and even looks) a lot like The Dark Knight Returns, but this is no futuristic tale or flight of fancy. This is real and the story is told with callous brutality that makes it all the more powerful.

Very good. My only concern would be that that story in particular (which is the only thing I'm familiar with in regards to Deacon) was quite heavy, not only in straight brutality but also psychologically and philosophically. Certainly much more than anything Nolan's brought to the table so far, but I wouldn't be opposed to him.

[cerealkiller182]

I havent read it, but like the sound of it. I dont think it has a very broad appeal either. Im sure the studio would steer away from religion.

[Lungrocket]

Im sure the studio would steer away from religion.

Why? Indiana Jones dealt with religion in the first three films. It doesn't have to be played all taboo.