Lex Luthor Hype!

[Keyser Soze]

Hello everyone! I don't know whether or not I'm in the majority, but Lex Luthor is what is making me most excited about seeing "Superman Returns" next year. Luthor is one of the greatest villains in comics, and in this movie he is being played by Kevin Spacey, one of the greatest actors working today.

But in these boards, there hardly seems to be any talk on Luthor. Discussion is mainly about the costume, or Brandon Routh, or the hunt for new pictures. But on the rare occasion that a Lex Luthor thread does pop up, there tends to be some really interesting conversation there. So there must be other people out there wanting to talk about Luthor. Perhaps what is needed is a thread specifically created for general discussion of the character.

I tried this a couple of years ago with "Doctor Octopus Hype", which was a great success over in the Spider-Man 2 boards. So let's see if we can do the same for Lex Luthor. In this thread, feel free to discuss all aspects of Lex Luthor:

- What you want to see him say and do in the film
- Comic arcs with Luthor you like
- Past appearances of the character in film an TV
- Kevin Spacey - past performances, what he'll bring to the role

And of course, any images of Luthor are welcome. Hopefully, this thread will evolve into a comprehensive account of the development of Lex Luthor as we approach the release of "Superman Returns". I'll start things off with a picture and some quotes. Any comments?

http://www.bluetights.net/gallery/albums/cast/LexLuthor.jpg

'Romans built the roads. Persians built the ships. Americans built the atom bomb.'

'The Gods are selfish beings who fly around in red capes and don't share their power with mankind.'

[musclesforsupes]

My opinion is Lex should be killed off and we get a new villian emerge.

[boywonder13]

I don't want to see Luthor in another Superman film after Returns.

It gets repetitive...

very repetitive.

[RedIsNotBlue]

I don't want Lex Luthor to be the main bad guy in the Superman films but always be there like Magneto has been in the X-Men films so far. But I have to say I am a fan of Spacey and I think he is going to own this role..he is a very talented man. I am glad to see he isn't one of these celebrities that looks down on comic book films.

[Morg]

I like to see muscles killed off ;)

[RedIsNotBlue]

I like to see muscles killed off ;)

http://www2.hawaii.edu/~jnavor/group6/agree.jpg

[musclesforsupes]

Have I told everyone how much I love you guys, you guys remind me of my own personnel orko.:)

[Saph]

I think Lex Luthor is in good hands. Spacey should have the capability to play a Luthor that you like, until he does something so evil it surprises you.

[The Sage]

I think what we're gonna get is a classic performance by Spacey as Lex Luthor. I know a lot of people are worried about a campy Lex, but nothing has indicated a campy Lex. Every promo pic has shown him to look dead serious, bald and sinister. Usually promo pics are used to give you an idea of how the film will be, so...

Singer's Lex is springboard from Donner's, yet it looks Singer's will be more captivating, and in fact more in line with the Lex of the comics, both past and present. Just look at those lines from premiere, they're very reminiscent of Lex Luthor Man of Steel.

It's interesting. Lex considers himself Prometheus, who was a titan. Titans were greater than the gods, and in Lex's eyes Superman is a god. So although he's calling Superman selfish he still sees himself as being greater than Superman and the world. Full blown Lex arrogance.

Prometheus stole fire from the gods and gave it to the world, since the gods were too selfish to do it. Could that be an allusion to Lex stealing Superman's kryptonian technology?

Another thing: remember, the titans existed before the gods. I wonder if this an illusion of Lex being the great criminal mind of the world, essentially ruling it until Superman debuted and became its savior, "ruling it". As much as this is man vs demigod, mind vs muscle, it also looks to be titan vs god.

Those are my thoughts. It looks like will be very fleshed out and we'll see why he is the DC Comics' greatest villain.

[Keyser Soze]

I don't understand the people who say they want to see Lex Luthor killed off, or they don't want him to appear in any more films. The fact is, apart from Superman himself (and MAYBE Lois), Lex Luthor is the most important character in the Superman mythos. A movie just wouldn't be the same without him.

I agree, after this film we should let a new villain take centre stage, but Lex Luthor should always be a presence, just as he is in the comics.

[Mentok]

It's interesting. Lex considers himself Prometheus, who was a titan. Titans were greater than the gods, and in Lex's eyes Superman is a god. So although he's calling Superman selfish he still sees himself as being greater than Superman and the world. Full blown Lex arrogance.

Good to see I am not the only one who noticed that :up:

[Superman79]

I don't understand the people who say they want to see Lex Luthor killed off, or they don't want him to appear in any more films. The fact is, apart from Superman himself (and MAYBE Lois), Lex Luthor is the most important character in the Superman mythos. A movie just wouldn't be the same without him.

I agree, after this film we should let a new villain take centre stage, but Lex Luthor should always be a presence, just as he is in the comics.

Damn straight...you can't have good without evil

What is the old proverb? Without the devil, God woulld have nothing to do...or something like that...

[boywonder13]

I don't understand the people who say they want to see Lex Luthor killed off, or they don't want him to appear in any more films. The fact is, apart from Superman himself (and MAYBE Lois), Lex Luthor is the most important character in the Superman mythos. A movie just wouldn't be the same without him.

I agree, after this film we should let a new villain take centre stage, but Lex Luthor should always be a presence, just as he is in the comics.

People don't want him because he has appeared as the villian 3 superman movies and is exposed enpugh in the comics and Cartoon. It also stops other great villains from getting a chance in the franchise.

Another thing is logic. Luthro cannot get out of jail anymore.It's to unrealistic for my taste.

So you want to have the joker in all three Batman movies. (Okay maybe u would) but not everybody.

I don't see Robin in BAtman Begins when Robin is closer than Superman and Lex.

[Strange]

Would Spacey come back for another movie? That really dose not seem like his style to sign a multi movie deal. If we had Spacey for Lex in this movie and another person for Lex in the next that would be bad, so making Lex the main villian in this movie and then moing on to another villian in the next would probably be the best way to go.

[Superman79]

Would Spacey come back for another movie? That really dose not seem like his style to sign a multi movie deal. If we had Spacey for Lex in this movie and another person for Lex in the next that would be bad, so making Lex the main villian in this movie and then moing on to another villian in the next would probably be the best way to go.

Oh, I think if Spacey feels he can really develop/own the role he might be up for at least one sequel if not two...the key is to keep the character development on a high note, that would definatley attract a guy like him back to the role.

[Keyser Soze]

Oh, I think if Spacey feels he can really develop/own the role he might be up for at least one sequel if not two...the key is to keep the character development on a high note, that would definatley attract a guy like him back to the role.

Agreed. Bryan Singer was able to lure Ian McKellan back to the role of Magneto for X2, and he'll be returning in X3. So, if the role is interesting enough, I'm sure Kevin Spacey will be happy to return in sequels.

[RedIsNotBlue]

Agreed. Bryan Singer was able to lure Ian McKellan back to the role of Magneto for X2, and he'll be returning in X3. So, if the role is interesting enough, I'm sure Kevin Spacey will be happy to return in sequels.

I seriously doubt Ian was "lured" back. He found the role interesting and returned. I hope the same goes with Spacey.

[Pickle-El]

I seriously doubt Ian was "lured" back. He found the role interesting and returned. I hope the same goes with Spacey.

He has been in talks for the role of Brainiac or Lex since 93....I think he would make the time, again. :up: Great Thread BTW.

[Pickle-El]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v519/DaBadGuy82/LexSlap.jpg


Looks like Lex won't be taking **** from anyone. NICE.

[Keyser Soze]

I seriously doubt Ian was "lured" back. He found the role interesting and returned. I hope the same goes with Spacey.

I didn't mean anything by "lure". I was merely implying that he returned to the role because he found it interesting, as you said.

On another note, I have just started playing as Lex Luthor in the "One Universe RPG" over on the Misc. Comics boards. The basic premise is creating a continuity that includes both the Marvel and DC universes, existing in the same world. So, we are pretty much starting from scratch, re-introducing the characters we are playing, and toying with their origins and motivations. Here was my opening post. Tell me what you think:

Lex Luthor: King of Metropolis. Luthor smiled at the recollection of the headline. It had been many years now since the Daily Planet had published it in big, bold letters on their front page, but Luthor still remembered how he’d felt when he saw it. He had thought to himself, I’ve finally done it, now I can die happy.

Well, that’s what he’d thought for all of five minutes.

The thing that Lex Luthor soon learned about success was that you could never have enough of it. It was like a drug – you always needed more. And after that first high, what you did get was never quite enough. Yes, he was King of Metropolis. But why settle for that? Why rule a city, when you could take control of America, conquer the world? Until the day he had done that, climbed to the very pinnacle of human achievement, the highest peak of success and power, Lex Luthor could never again say that, finally, he had “done it”, that he could “die happy”.

But for now, he was King of Metropolis. He stood in his office on the top floor of Lexcorp Towers, looking out the full-length window, down at his kingdom. He had spent many silent hours standing at this spot, just watching. He loved the sense of power he felt, looking down on this great city, knowing that nobody else could see its glory better than him. Every time he looked out this window, he had been able to remind himself that he was the most powerful man in the world. Not anymore.

“Superman….”

Lex Luthor fists clenched as he held them behind his back. As high above the ground as he was right now, Superman could fly higher. Lex Luthor could build all the state-of-the-art fighter planes he wanted: Superman didn’t even need them to fly through the air, to reach the heavens. Lex Luthor could indeed aspire to reach the pinnacle of human achievement, but Superman was more than human, more than Luthor could ever be…

No.

Luthor kept his thoughts in check. This was not about envy. What was there to be jealous about? Superman was stronger than any man, but in this modern age, that had little to do with true power. Power was being able to buy anything you wanted, limited only by how much you wanted it. Power was having a multi-national corporation named after you. Power was being able to commit any crime, break any law, and never be punished, or even questioned, because of your status, because you had 100 people waiting to take the fall for you. Power was what Lex Luthor had.

So no, this was not about envy. This was about Superman himself. The fact was that, despite what he called himself, he was not a man. He was not one of us. He was something else. Luthor had spoken the truth earlier. All it would take was a change of heart, and Superman would become the most dangerous threat Metropolis had ever faced. With his monumental, potentially terrifying power, Superman truly could conquer the world. Superman was part of a disturbing trend Luthor had noticed emerging in recent times. There was this mysterious “Bat-Man” in Gotham City, and a cascade of costumed vigilantes springing up in New York City. That was one of the motivating factors behind his merger with Fisk – he needed eyes in the Big Apple.

But even amongst all these “heroes”, the worst was Superman. He had the audacity, the gall, to appear in this very office and confront Lex Luthor!? Who did he think he was? Luthor recalled the anger he had felt, being questioned as if he was some little boy caught stealing from the cookie jar. But the fact was that Superman had no evidence to back up his accusations. Luthor had proved that, in spite of this freak’s so-called power, he was still no match for Lex Luthor.

But that did nothing to quell Luthor’s growing hatred for Superman. Luthor hated how Superman could just fall out of the sky, appear out of nowhere, and already be viewed as a saviour all over the world. Luthor had worked, fought, lied, cheated and stolen his whole life to get where he was today. He had climbed from the very bottom, risen through the ranks to become the man who he was today. He had no need for superpowers – he had earned his position. But this “Superman”, he’d had it all given to him on a silver platter! He had no intelligence, no ambition, not like Lex. All he needed to do was fly around and smash some things, and the people of Metropolis loved him. Metropolis belonged to Lex Luthor! How dare he try to dethrone the King of Metropolis?

How dare he!?

“Mr. Luthor, sir?”

The buzz from the intercom stirred Luthor from his meditation. Walking back to his desk, Luthor picked up the phone.

“Yes, Diane?”

“Mr. Luthor, you have received an invitation to a party, being hosted by Oliver Queen.”

Oliver Queen? Luthor almost laughed down the receiver. Queen was small-time; for him to even presume to invite Lex Luthor to one of his little shindigs was an insult. But Luthor reminded himself that Queen had been making a name for himself recently, and if he was throwing a party, odds were that the likes of Wilson Fisk and Bruce Wayne would be attending. Luthor needed to show face. It would be good for publicity.

“Diane, send notice to Mr. Queen that I would love to attend his party,” replied Luthor, “And have my Lear Jet prepared for departure to Star City.”

Luthor hung up the phone before Diane could reply. He paced across his office, walking back up to the window and looking out. Remembering what Superman had said, Lex Luthor looked up into the blue skies that even the peak of Lexcorp Towers could not reach. No sign of Superman. And that was where Superman was inferior to Luthor. As fast as he was, Superman could only be one place at once. But Luthor was everywhere, his influence felt all over the world. But most of all, Lex Luthor held power over Metropolis, this city…

“…My city.”

I've been into Batman for a long time now, and in recent months have began following DC in general. But I haven't really bought much in the way of Superman comics, as Lex Luthor is the only character who really interests me. But since I'm playing as Luthor now in this RPG, I need to do some research on the character. I was thinking of getting "Lex Luthor: Man Of Steel". Would you guys recommend it?

[Superman79]

^yes it's one of my favortes from the past year

And for getting Spacey back...lets not forget that deep down every man is a big kid (look at the "Spacey poking the \S/ just to freak out Singer" article)

I would say the kid in him would have him doing at least two more Super-films. That and think of how cool it would be to be immortalized on film (more than once) as one of the greatest villians in the world not to mention as part of the history of the greatest hero in the world...That will certainly play into it i'm sure...

[The Sage]

I didn't mean anything by "lure". I was merely implying that he returned to the role because he found it interesting, as you said.

On another note, I have just started playing as Lex Luthor in the "One Universe RPG" over on the Misc. Comics boards. The basic premise is creating a continuity that includes both the Marvel and DC universes, existing in the same world. So, we are pretty much starting from scratch, re-introducing the characters we are playing, and toying with their origins and motivations. Here was my opening post. Tell me what you think:



I've been into Batman for a long time now, and in recent months have began following DC in general. But I haven't really bought much in the way of Superman comics, as Lex Luthor is the only character who really interests me. But since I'm playing as Luthor now in this RPG, I need to do some research on the character. I was thinking of getting "Lex Luthor: Man Of Steel". Would you guys recommend it?

I'd highly recommend it, especially after reading those Lex quotes from Premiere magazine.

[Admiral_N8]

I didn't mean anything by "lure". I was merely implying that he returned to the role because he found it interesting, as you said.

On another note, I have just started playing as Lex Luthor in the "One Universe RPG" over on the Misc. Comics boards. The basic premise is creating a continuity that includes both the Marvel and DC universes, existing in the same world. So, we are pretty much starting from scratch, re-introducing the characters we are playing, and toying with their origins and motivations. Here was my opening post. Tell me what you think:


You wrote that?! :eek:

Ya that was pretty much one of the sweetest things about Luthor I've seen...very true to the character.

[CConn]

I was thinking of getting "Lex Luthor: Man Of Steel". Would you guys recommend it?The best mini-series of the year, IMO. :o

[THE MR. TERRIFIC]

I think a lot of the reason why people were not really talking about Lex is because they knew that Spacey could pull it off without a hitch. Well that was my opinion I really can't speak for everyone else. Spacey has already proven himself on the big screen. Routh is relatively new and the new guy is always going to face opposition. I personally wanted to see Welling in the role but I understand Singers reasons. I think the movie will be good because Singer has proven himself as an excellent director. Spacey will command respect as Luthor just as Rosenbaum on Smallville.

[Octoberist]

I agree with you SON OF BLADE.

Although, I would RATHER not have a continuation of a vague connection to Hackman's Lex (hated his take, but I love Gene), I'm looking foward to it.

But I have to admit that we're due for another villain besides Luthor and Zod. If Singer doesn't go with Brainaic or whomever, that's when I'll be hard on him.

If Singer goes with Zod in the next movie, I will cry. I'll be like "For God's sakes, pick up a comic book. There's more out there!" Zod is cool...but we've been there and done that. I want Brainaic.

Long live Spacey!

[Steelsheen]

Hello everyone! I don't know whether or not I'm in the majority, but Lex Luthor is what is making me most excited about seeing "Superman Returns" next year.
same here. this is pretty much the only thing that's keeping me afloat througout these months: seeing Spacey's take as Lex Luthor. as impressive as his work may have been as other characters if there is one role that this man was born to play its Lex Luthor. i waited for years for this momment, all the way back since seeing his work in The Usual Suspects and Se7en that i wished this guy can play Lex Luthor. so you can imagine how damn ecstatic i was when it was confirmed that he signed up for the role :).

i'll admit i've been more of a follower of Pre-Crisis Supes (well... to be honest i'm not much of a follower of Post-Crisis anything ;) :p) so i was kinda hoping to see a more science-oriented Lex rather than megalomaniac millionare, but what i'm really looking forward to is to see a story/ characterization that justifies his arrogance. of all the portrayal of Lex i've seen over the years SV's Rosenbaum comes closest to what i think Lex is (John Shea's L&C comes somewhat close)-- and in truth Rosenbaum's portrayal is merely scratching the surface of who Lex Luthor really is as Superman's chief adversary. i'm trying not to set any expectations for Lex in SR, but its hard, considering how i view Lex -- how he has grown as a uniquely formidable character and knowing how capable Spacey is in turning that into a reality.

[The Guard]

I'm looking forward to Spacey's Lex Luthor a lot more than I am Brandon Routh's Superman or any of the other characters (I'm sure they'll all be at least solid, though). I can't wait. He's been my dream choice for the role for a long time (Braniac? You idiots!). First Liam Neeson as Ra's Al Ghul now Kevin Spacey as Lex Luthor...like I said, I can't wait.

[Eros]

The sad thing about the Lex Luthor character is that Superman could kill him with a mere thought...Lex is more scared of superman IMO. MY personal fav lex luthor is Jhon Shea from Lois and Clark. But like a i said if superman decided killing Lex luthor would save lives..all he need do is breathe reall hard on baldy lol.
I admit Lex is not as deep as Darth vader..or as unpredictable as Joker..but hes a top 20 villian. I think real draw to Lex is that he is way way more interesting then Superman. I mean what problems can an indistructible man have? Superman is brave cause he can't be hurt, but people like Batman can be shot or killed yet they battle evil anyway. If superman didn't have his powers he would not help people, where as batman does. cops can be shot and killed, but they go into burning buildings anyway. I think the real reason Luthor is a great villian is because he does so without powers..hes like the Batman of the villian community.:up:

[Pickle-El]

The sad thing about the Lex Luthor character is that Superman could kill him with a mere thought...Lex is more scared of superman IMO. MY personal fav lex luthor is Jhon Shea from Lois and Clark. But like a i said if superman decided killing Lex luthor would save lives..all he need do is breathe reall hard on baldy lol.
I admit Lex is not as deep as Darth vader..or as unpredictable as Joker..but hes a top 20 villian. I think real draw to Lex is that he is way way more interesting then Superman. I mean what problems can an indistructible man have? Superman is brave cause he can't be hurt, but people like Batman can be shot or killed yet they battle evil anyway. If superman didn't have his powers he would not help people, where as batman does. cops can be shot and killed, but they go into burning buildings anyway. I think the real reason Luthor is a great villian is because he does so without powers..hes like the Batman of the villian community.:up:

Men with absolute power can also be cruel and abusive. Need I list any examples.....

[CConn]

Men with absolute power can also be cruel and abusive. Need I list any examples.....Janet Reno.

[Pickle-El]

Janet Reno.

(uncalled for, but)


Thank you.

[Keyser Soze]

The sad thing about the Lex Luthor character is that Superman could kill him with a mere thought...Lex is more scared of superman IMO. MY personal fav lex luthor is Jhon Shea from Lois and Clark. But like a i said if superman decided killing Lex luthor would save lives..all he need do is breathe reall hard on baldy lol.
I admit Lex is not as deep as Darth vader..or as unpredictable as Joker..but hes a top 20 villian. I think real draw to Lex is that he is way way more interesting then Superman. I mean what problems can an indistructible man have? Superman is brave cause he can't be hurt, but people like Batman can be shot or killed yet they battle evil anyway. If superman didn't have his powers he would not help people, where as batman does. cops can be shot and killed, but they go into burning buildings anyway. I think the real reason Luthor is a great villian is because he does so without powers..hes like the Batman of the villian community.:up:

Yes, you have a point. Technically, Superman COULD just kill Lex Luthor. But how could he justify flying up to Lexcorp Towers and killing one of the richest, most powerful, most respected men in the world? The key to their Post-Crisis power dynamic was that Superman could suspect all he wanted, but he had no proof to link Lex Luthor to any crimes. And that was where Luthor's power truly lay. Of course, now that dynamic seems to have changed, with Luthor shifting back to something resembling his Pre-Crisis identity. It will be interesting to see how that develops.

Actually, I think it's a shame that a lot of people immediately crap all over Lex Luthor returning to his Pre-Crisis status quo. Yes, since his reinvention as an evil businessman in The Man Of Steel, Luthor has been pretty much the top villain in DC. But I think his progression back to being a fugitive, a notorious criminal, has been excellently done. And others seem to agree - hence the various "Villain Of The Year" awards he's picking up.

Yestreday, I finally read "All-Star Superman". I only just got back into regularly buying comics last year, and in the past I was always a Marvel guy. So this was the first Superman comic I've picked up, though I know aquite a lot about the character through other media. Anyway, Lex Luthor is pretty much Pre-Crisis Luthor here, and he's excellently written. I think that it should really matter if Luthor is a businessman or a terrorist. If they nail his personality right, he will still be a great villain.

Oh, and I picked up "Lex Luthor: Man Of Steel" yesterday as well. Only read the first part so far, but it's set to be really good. Thanks for recommending it!

[Zooks]

while i think Luthor as a businessman is the best way to go, I did enjoy Luthor's gradual fall from grace. A lot of people were satisfied that we got both Luthors this year in the comics. Business Luthor, who was an imposter, and fugitive power suit Luthor.

Singer's choice to have Lex fresh out of jail squashes my hopes of a President Luthor ever appearing in the movies. Although Luthor has seemingly done the same in the comics and cartoons.

[Keyser Soze]

I'm assuming by being fresh out of jail, he has managed to "clear his name" so to speak. He's out of prison, and in Superman's absense has established himself as a legitimate businessman, a saviour of Metropolis. Depending on where Luthor ends up by the climax of "Superman Returns", I think the sequel will see him either on the run, fully reverted to a Pre-Crisis style persona, or running for President. All depends on whether Superman can bring him to justice in this film.

[theleech]

i think le should have been played by Arnold Vosloo (http://movies.go.com/filmography/film?person_id=265329)


http://tm.ask.com/r?t=c&s=p&sv=0a30051e&uid=075DD5ACBD97C4B34&sid=15CF4B74EC6A27B34&o=0&id=30751&p=fr&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ez-entertainment.net%2FVosloo_Arnold.jpg

[theleech]

i think le should have been played by Arnold Vosloo (http://movies.go.com/filmography/film?person_id=265329)


http://tm.ask.com/r?t=c&s=p&sv=0a30051e&uid=075DD5ACBD97C4B34&sid=15CF4B74EC6A27B34&o=0&id=30751&p=fr&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ez-entertainment.net%2FVosloo_Arnold.jpg

[Keyser Soze]

Arnold Vosloo is a good actor, but he's not Kevin Spacey. Spacey is one of the best actors in the world today. I'd rather have him playing Luthor than someone who happens to be bald.

[Spike_x1]

I'm liking what I'm hearing about Spacey's Lex, but I can definitely do without the connection to Hackman's portrayal (in fact, the connection to the previous movies is my main gripe about SR). IMHO, the best versions of Lex have been when he's the businessman, but certain elements of Pre-Crisis Luthor are shown, like at the beginning of the 5th issue of Byrne's Man of Steel where Lex hired one of his men to fight Superman in the old power armor, but the flip side is that the man became a vegetable and Superman couldn't prove that Lex was behind it. Things like that, where the story combines some of the best elements of both versions of Lex are my personal favorites and what I'd like to see in SR.

In Superman Returns, I'm fine with the idea of Lex being the only villain. But in a sequel, Luthor should still be the main villain (akin to Magneto in the X-Franchise), but he should manipulate an ordinary person in order to create and introduce one (or more) of the supervillains from the comics to destroy Superman physically while Luthor comes up with a plot to destroy him spiritually.

[Keyser Soze]

I definitely agree with your ideas about Luthor. I would like to see him somehow be behind the creation of a future supervillain in the sequels. And you make good points about him being a Machiavellian manipulator, ruining Superman's life without directly confronting him.

But I disagree about the connection to the previous movies being a flaw. Yes, at first, I thought it was a bad idea. But then I thought - what is the alternative?

Yes, you could retell the origin story. But we've had a highly-successful TV series do that in much more depth than a 2 hour movie could hope to accomplish. And you could make the story a sequel to "Smallville" rather than the previous movies, but TV spin-offs rarely do well at the box office. The only other option would be to create a completely new continuity, with Superman already established. But then you may confuse and alienate some of the audience democgraphic.

So, yes, following on from the Donner films is a flawed idea, but it is, in my opinion, the lesser of many evils.

[Spike_x1]

I definitely agree with your ideas about Luthor. I would like to see him somehow be behind the creation of a future supervillain in the sequels. And you make good points about him being a Machiavellian manipulator, ruining Superman's life without directly confronting him.

But I disagree about the connection to the previous movies being a flaw. Yes, at first, I thought it was a bad idea. But then I thought - what is the alternative?

Yes, you could retell the origin story. But we've had a highly-successful TV series do that in much more depth than a 2 hour movie could hope to accomplish. And you could make the story a sequel to "Smallville" rather than the previous movies, but TV spin-offs rarely do well at the box office. The only other option would be to create a completely new continuity, with Superman already established. But then you may confuse and alienate some of the audience democgraphic.

So, yes, following on from the Donner films is a flawed idea, but it is, in my opinion, the lesser of many evils.IMO, people don't really need that connection to Donner's movies. I like to think that most people who go to see SR are smart enough when it comes to two characters that have been immortalized in pop culture that they don't need to rely on a connection to Donner's movies. Most audiences know who Superman is and what he's capable of and they know that Lex is a businessman and Superman's main nemesis just from catching glimpses of the two characters in Smallville and memories of S:TAS. And even if they don't know about them, it wouldn't take more than twenty minutes of a movie's running time to establish them and their rivalry.

[Zooks]

i think it would've been best to just start the franchise years into Superman's career. Everyone is aware of the vague history. This is pretty much what they are doing but linking the first two movies, which I would've avoided if only to establish Lex in a different light.

[Iceman/Psylocke]

Kevin Spacey as Lex Luthor has got to be one of the best castings in all superhero movies

[Keyser Soze]

Hey, need some feedback on this latest RPG post I made. I had worked on developing Luthor's motivations as a character, but realised that one thing I'd missed out was that he is such a bastard. :p But I wasn't sure if this was too OTT.

To give some context, Lex Luthor offered Reed Richards a job at Lexcorp, which Richards declined. Angry at the rejection, Luthor had sent a robot to kidnap Richards. After a long battle, in which Luthor took control of the robot via some remote equipment, Superman, Spider-Man and the Fanstastic Four were finally able to destroy the robot. And while they could not link the attack to him, Lex Luthor is still not a happy camper...

Everything seemed to happen within a few seconds. Ben Grimm pushing Superman out of the way, Reed Richards re-appearing, that weapon being fired at his robot. Then - nothing! The camera-feed in Luthor's helmet was replaced with static, and high-pitched white noise blasted through his ears, forcing him to throw the helmet to the ground.

As Luthor took off the arm-gauntlets, he tried to figure out what went wrong. His robot was indestructible. Surely no weapon could destroy it, unless...that was it! Richards had used an electro-magnetic pulse to shut the robot down! Luthor had to admit, Reed Richards was a genius. That was why Luthor had wanted him to work for Lexcorp. Now, that plan was in ruins, thanks to the Fantastic Four and Spider-Man. And Superman. Oh, he couldn't forget the part he'd played in this travesty.

With a roar of anger, Luthor kicked the helmet across the room. Then he picked up the gauntlets and smashed them across the wall. Those interfering parasites had already flushed millions of dollars worth of research and development down the toilet by taking his robot out of commission, so what harm would a little more property damage do? It certainly made him feel better. Luthor stalked across his office to the phone at his desk, stamping on the helmet as he passed it. He clicked on the intercom.

"Diane, could you come in here for a minute?" he seethed, trying to restrain the anger in his voice.

"Yes, Mr. Luthor," Diane replied.

Luthor paced back and forth in his office, the anger and humiliation washing over him in waves. How dare they spoil his plans, make him look like a fool? Luthor stopped pacing when his assistant, Diane, entered the room.

"You wanted to see me Mr..." she started.

Before she could finish, Luthor gave her a backhand slap across the face. Before the shock could even fully register, he slapped her again.

"That will be all, Diane," Luthor said, walking back to his desk and pouring himself a drink, "Oh, before you go, tell me - do I have any new messages?"

"Umm, I...yes, Mr. Luthor," Diane said, wiping a tear away from her eye, "Dr. Feinstein from your Arctic research team is actually on the line, says he has some important information you'll want to hear."

"Oh, good," said Luthor, smilling warmly, "Patch him straight through to my office."

Diane nodded, and began to exit the office.

"Oh, and Diane," added Luthor, stopping her, "Don't wear that blouse again. It looks like you bought it out a charity store."

"Yes, Mr. Luthor," murmured Diane, walking out of the office and closing the door behind her.

Luthor sat back down at his desk. He closed his eyes and took a deep breath. He felt better now. The incident with the robot was a setback, nothing more. Now he had to move on. There was Oliver Queen's party to think about. Luthor let the phone ring twice before picking up.

"Dr. Feinstein! Great to hear from you," said Luthor, with a well-rehearsed tone of false familiarity, "What did you want to speak with me about?"

"Mr. Luthor, we found something out here in the Arctic," Feinstein replied, "Or rather, we found someone, frozen in ice. It's...I don't know how to say this, but it's Captain America."

Lex Luthor didn't reply for a few seconds. But in those seconds, a plan was already beginning to form.

"The Captain America?" he finally asked.

"Yes, Mr. Luthor," Dr. Feinstein answered, "I don't know how, but somehow, he's been preserved in the ice. He appears to be in some kind of suspended animation."

"I see. Great work, Dr. Feinstein. I want you to head back to America straight away. Our first priority is going to be bringing the legendary Captain America back to life..."

[Keyser Soze]

I've just finished reading "Lex Luthor - Man of Steel". Man, what an excellent read. Quite possibly the best comic of 2005.

The characterisation of Lex Luthor is just so fascinating. For most of the TPB, you are actually convinced by many of Luthor's arguments. And just when he is becoming a sympathetic protagonist, we are given a sucker-punch when Luthor revelas himself to be as evil and scheming as ever. But at least now, we have a better idea of why he does what he does.

[The Batman]

I truly laugh at the people who actually complain that lex is the only villain in this flick.

When hes done right, hes tied with Dr. doom as greatest comic villain

[Keyser Soze]

Don't forget The Joker...

[GoldGoblin]

Is Lex Luthor the only villain in this movie?

[BareKnucklez]

I agree with you SON OF BLADE.

Although, I would RATHER not have a continuation of a vague connection to Hackman's Lex (hated his take, but I love Gene), I'm looking foward to it.

But I have to admit that we're due for another villain besides Luthor and Zod. If Singer doesn't go with Brainaic or whomever, that's when I'll be hard on him.

If Singer goes with Zod in the next movie, I will cry. I'll be like "For God's sakes, pick up a comic book. There's more out there!" Zod is cool...but we've been there and done that. I want Brainaic.

Long live Spacey!


Honestly the ZOD character shouldn't even be in any of the new movies I mean we already had the perfect actor for the role now let it go, and I agree they should bring in someone like Brainiac into the new movie... Maybe Doomsday... Lex alone would be kind of corny imo... :(

[BareKnucklez]

I truly laugh at the people who actually complain that lex is the only villain in this flick.

When hes done right, hes tied with Dr. doom as greatest comic villain

Yea I would say Joker is a much better Villian then Lex but Lex is a very good character to.
I for one wasn't a fan of Hackman's Lex, and im not a big Spacey fan... Can't stand him really but I am willing to give him a chance... He does kind of look like Gene lol...

[BareKnucklez]

I'm assuming by being fresh out of jail, he has managed to "clear his name" so to speak. He's out of prison, and in Superman's absense has established himself as a legitimate businessman, a saviour of Metropolis. Depending on where Luthor ends up by the climax of "Superman Returns", I think the sequel will see him either on the run, fully reverted to a Pre-Crisis style persona, or running for President. All depends on whether Superman can bring him to justice in this film.

lol I would love to see LEX run for president in the movie or in the sequel... That would be killer! :up:

[Keyser Soze]

Well, I just thought I'd give my thread THE BIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIG BUUUUUUUUMP!

The first reviews are filtering in, and the general concensus is that Kevin Spacey is awesome as Lex Luthor. And, to finally put the whisperings of camp to rest, the reviews all say this is the most sinister Lex Luthor we've ever seen. I can't wait to see how Spacey pulls off Luthor!

http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0606/09/superman11.jpg

[Steelsheen]

honestly speaking, Spacey is the one reason i'm going to watch this film.

i've been dissapointed about a lot of things about this production, but those few clips from Spacey in the tv spots and trailers won me back.:up:

so yeah SPACEY DAMMIT!!!:D

[NotFadeAway]

Jaquin Phoenix was my choice for Lex, but anyway....

Singer's big mistake IMO with this film was making it a continuation of Hackman, the worst Lex of all time. Ive stated this a million times so Im keeping it brief, from the trailers, reviews, character desrcriptions, novel, etc etc Lex is making stupid jokes, referring to himself as a " criminal mastermind ", keeping a goon squad around so he can make assinine remarks, and he has his Teshmacker like bimbo girlfriend, the horrible Parker Posey. Singer has to much of a 70's vibe going on with Luthor, with the cheesy comments and big evil-doer plan to KILL BILLIONS. It's ridiculous that Singer didn't use the updated version, the best version, of Lex Luthor from the comics today. Infact, while the writers may have read them, Singer didn't use ANY influences from anything post-Donner, and thats a slap in the face to some of the best Superman work ever. Just because he uses Fleischer like images does not mean he has a more well rounded respect for Superman and the mythos. The Lex Luthor of todays comics and Smallville would have fit much better based on everything thats going on in the world today, crooked and scheming politicians, greedy corporations. If anything, this Luthor is like the joker, which I have stated over and over again. And skruloos, before you come along and say that I want corporate Luthor because thats my favorite and thats not good enough for you, keep in mind that Im also saying this vision of Lex isn't good enough for the big screen. Movie goers might love the film yes, but a stronger, more sinister, less funny villian will be called for the sequel.

Now I will sit and wait to be called a dumb ass by certain posters, one armed with harmless " Nerd Lunch Table " humor that I find so amusing.:)

[Keyser Soze]

Jaquin Phoenix was my choice for Lex, but anyway....

Singer's big mistake IMO with this film was making it a continuation of Hackman, the worst Lex of all time. Ive stated this a million times so Im keeping it brief, from the trailers, reviews, character desrcriptions, novel, etc etc Lex is making stupid jokes, referring to himself as a " criminal mastermind ", keeping a goon squad around so he can make assinine remarks, and he has his Teshmacker like bimbo girlfriend, the horrible Parker Posey. Singer has to much of a 70's vibe going on with Luthor, with the cheesy comments and big evil-doer plan to KILL BILLIONS. It's ridiculous that Singer didn't use the updated version, the best version, of Lex Luthor from the comics today. Infact, while the writers may have read them, Singer didn't use ANY influences from anything post-Donner, and thats a slap in the face to some of the best Superman work ever. Just because he uses Fleischer like images does not mean he has a more well rounded respect for Superman and the mythos. The Lex Luthor of todays comics and Smallville would have fit much better based on everything thats going on in the world today, crooked and scheming politicians, greedy corporations. If anything, this Luthor is like the joker, which I have stated over and over again. And skruloos, before you come along and say that I want corporate Luthor because thats my favorite and thats not good enough for you, keep in mind that Im also saying this vision of Lex isn't good enough for the big screen. Movie goers might love the film yes, but a stronger, more sinister, less funny villian will be called for the sequel.

Now I will sit and wait to be called a dumb ass by certain posters, one armed with harmless " Nerd Lunch Table " humor that I find so amusing.:)

Now, I've largely stayed away from spoilers, so I know very little about what happens with Lex Luthor in the film. But I've always assumed that in many ways, "Superman Returns" would be about new beginnings for all the key players. Superman starts the film as an outcast, but by the end will most likely be embraced as the world's saviour again. Lois Lane has moved on with her life, but by the end will have gotten together with Clark Kent once more. But what about Lex Luthor? I know that at the start of the film, he has recently been released from prison, and that early on in the story he inherits a billion-dollay shipping industry. No major spoilers there, btw. But where do we go from here? We know Kevin Spacey is signed on for sequels. I've been assuming that the film will likely end with the creation of Lexcorp, and Luthor transforming from a character like Hackman's movie Luthor to something more closely resembling his comic book incarnation.

[Triligors]

A poster has asked me if I could post this here. Thus, here it is. For those cautious about a possibly "campy" Lex the following scene DEFINITELY shows otherwise. Lex is someone to definitely fear..... btw, his plan isn't to kill billions.... Lois states that his plan could kill millions, but Luthor laughs it off- 'just collateral damage, nothing important as long as I get my way.'

Also- this is a scene close to the ending of the film, so !!!spoiler!!! matterial. Scared about Lex being campy? Read on, the following might make you change your mind...

Note: The following is written by Marv Wolfman

Superman tried to move, but Luthor had a foot pressed against his back, pinning him to the floor. His saw that his hands were turning green.

Luthor chuckled, "Kryptonite. You're asking yourself 'how'? Well, didn't your dad ever tell you to look before you leap?"

Superman felt his head nearly explode as he struggled to aim his X-Ray vision at the crystal. The back of his skull was throbbing, and he could barely see what was directly in front of him. But, slowly in front of him. But slowly, an out-of-focus image began to come together. In the ground and walls of the Fortress replica were pockets and veins of Kryptonite which had somehow fused with the crystal, beoming one.

"How?"

"Crystals are amazing, aren't they?" Luthor laughed, then smashed his foot into Superman's back. He laughed again as Superman recoiled in pain.

Luthor hunkered down and looked him in the eyes. "They inherit thr traits of the minerals around them. Sort of like a son inheriting the traits of his father."

Luthor stood bak up again and smashed heel into Superman's side. He thought he heard a bone break, and he laughed out loud. "Oh, this is so good. This is so good."

Luthor kicked him again, reveling in his anger, living for the violence, crude and barbaric. "Look, Superman, you've got no one to blame but yourself. We sent you there to die, but you had to come back!"

Superman could feel blood smearing his face and hands.

"Don't you know where you're wanted and where you're not?"

Superman forced his eyes to look up, his expression turning from agony to realization. Luthor laughed at his dumbfounded look.

"Oh yeah. All these photos? Those stories about Krypton still existing." He pointed to himself in glee. "It was me. And, oh yes, him," he said gesturing to Stanford. "Thankfully, the press don't check facts like they used to."

Superman tried to speak, but blood was filling his mouth. Luthor glared at him again as he kicked him once more in his side. This time Superman yelped in pain. Blood spattered against the glittering crystal.

"You took away five years of my life. I just returned the favor."

TO BE CONTINUED IN THEATERS....

Note that Lex continues to abuse Superman in his time of weakness. Lex is VERY sadistic the whole way through. And add what Kevin Spacey can bring to this- yikes!!!!

[Steelsheen]

thanks Triligors :D :up:


now even before reading anything from the novel i had every confidence in Spacey that he will deliver the goods. now with a scene like what Tril posted, Spacey wont only deliver, he gonna friggin own this role! :D:up:

[Dark Knight]

Once again......Spacey will rule as Lex!

[Kal-El 8]

A poster has asked me if I could post this here. Thus, here it is. For those cautious about a possibly "campy" Lex the following scene DEFINITELY shows otherwise. Lex is someone to definitely fear..... btw, his plan isn't to kill billions.... Lois states that his plan could kill millions, but Luthor laughs it off- 'just collateral damage, nothing important as long as I get my way.'

Also- this is a scene close to the ending of the film, so !!!spoiler!!! matterial. Scared about Lex being campy? Read on, the following might make you change your mind...

Note: The following is written by Marv Wolfman

Superman tried to move, but Luthor had a foot pressed against his back, pinning him to the floor. His saw that his hands were turning green.

Luthor chuckled, "Kryptonite. You're asking yourself 'how'? Well, didn't your dad ever tell you to look before you leap?"

Superman felt his head nearly explode as he struggled to aim his X-Ray vision at the crystal. The back of his skull was throbbing, and he could barely see what was directly in front of him. But, slowly in front of him. But slowly, an out-of-focus image began to come together. In the ground and walls of the Fortress replica were pockets and veins of Kryptonite which had somehow fused with the crystal, beoming one.

"How?"

"Crystals are amazing, aren't they?" Luthor laughed, then smashed his foot into Superman's back. He laughed again as Superman recoiled in pain.

Luthor hunkered down and looked him in the eyes. "They inherit thr traits of the minerals around them. Sort of like a son inheriting the traits of his father."

Luthor stood bak up again and smashed heel into Superman's side. He thought he heard a bone break, and he laughed out loud. "Oh, this is so good. This is so good."

Luthor kicked him again, reveling in his anger, living for the violence, crude and barbaric. "Look, Superman, you've got no one to blame but yourself. We sent you there to die, but you had to come back!"

Superman could feel blood smearing his face and hands.

"Don't you know where you're wanted and where you're not?"

Superman forced his eyes to look up, his expression turning from agony to realization. Luthor laughed at his dumbfounded look.

"Oh yeah. All these photos? Those stories about Krypton still existing." He pointed to himself in glee. "It was me. And, oh yes, him," he said gesturing to Stanford. "Thankfully, the press don't check facts like they used to."

Superman tried to speak, but blood was filling his mouth. Luthor glared at him again as he kicked him once more in his side. This time Superman yelped in pain. Blood spattered against the glittering crystal.

"You took away five years of my life. I just returned the favor."

TO BE CONTINUED IN THEATERS....

Note that Lex continues to abuse Superman in his time of weakness. Lex is VERY sadistic the whole way through. And add what Kevin Spacey can bring to this- yikes!!!!

I read that part too. Spacey is going to be DAMN right awesome as Lex, This Lex isn't campy . This Lex is down right evil .

[DvilDog]

Venom you know i think your cool dude. But your bringing me down man:) LOL Phoenix for Lex. Sorry I dont agree with that. And Lex is not going to be campy in the flic bud, sorry. I dont see anything campy about him kicking the s**t out of superman. I have read the novel 4 times and it keeps getting better everytime i read it. Come on JUNE 25TH

[KaptainKrypton]

And skruloos, before you come along and say that I want corporate Luthor because thats my favorite and thats not good enough for you, keep in mind that Im also saying this vision of Lex isn't good enough for the big screen. Movie goers might love the film yes, but a stronger, more sinister, less funny villian will be called for the sequel.

Now I will sit and wait to be called a dumb ass by certain posters, one armed with harmless " Nerd Lunch Table " humor that I find so amusing.:)
This vision of Lex isn't good enough for the big screen? From the nine minutes of footage you've seen? Whew. On another note, none of us have to call you anything. You have a dope reference in your handle. You might as well walk around sporting a "kick me" sandwich board. It's funny, people still don't get the concept of what makes Lex Luthor work in all of his different incarnations (whether you like the mad scientist or billionaire tycoon). It's simple. He is the one human criminal who can match Superman without physical force and without genuine fear. Never mind the fact Luthor is pretty "corporate" in this film by living in a mansion. Maybe he's a small business owner.

[LEX]

Honestly? I wasn't all that interested in the movie, Superman Returns. The first teaser didn't convince me. The second trailer -- OH, YEAH!!! Fell off my chair when I saw Spacey as Lex being sadistic and madman. Yeah, yeah, it's ironic that I'm named Mr Lex Luthor, but that was inspired from Michael Rosenbaum's Lex in Smallville (loved the episode, Onyx, by the way). I'm only seeing Superman Returns just for Kevin Spacey, James Marsden, the story and action. Can't wait.

[NotFadeAway]

Venom you know i think your cool dude. But your bringing me down man:) LOL Phoenix for Lex. Sorry I dont agree with that. And Lex is not going to be campy in the flic bud, sorry. I dont see anything campy about him kicking the s**t out of superman. I have read the novel 4 times and it keeps getting better everytime i read it. Come on JUNE 25TH

DvilDog, about Phoenix, I DON'T feel he would be good as the Luthor that will be brought to life in Returns, campy or not. But as the corporate, jealous, S:TAS like version of Luthor, he would rule the screen.

[DvilDog]

DvilDog, about Phoenix, I DON'T feel he would be good as the Luthor that will be brought to life in Returns, campy or not. But as the corporate, jealous, S:TAS like version of Luthor, he would rule the screen.

Hmm you do have a pretty good point there!

[NotFadeAway]

This vision of Lex isn't good enough for the big screen? From the nine minutes of footage you've seen? Whew. On another note, none of us have to call you anything. You have a dope reference in your handle. You might as well walk around sporting a "kick me" sandwich board. It's funny, people still don't get the concept of what makes Lex Luthor work in all of his different incarnations (whether you like the mad scientist or billionaire tycoon). It's simple. He is the one human criminal who can match Superman without physical force and without genuine fear. Never mind the fact Luthor is pretty "corporate" in this film by living in a mansion. Maybe he's a small business owner.

You know, it's people like you who irritate me and take shots below the belt while Im away. First off, Im combining my knowledge of said 9 minutes, Singer's love for S:TM and the fact that this is a continuation of that story, online readings describing the character, characters that act as Lex's entourage which consist of Kitty K. the bimbo girlfriend and a doof squad for Lex to fire his sarcasm at, and other tidbits. If Im wrong, then Im wrong. If Im right, then Im right.

And now we can move on to a personal matter. You say that I have a dope reference in my title. Now, 420 couldn't possibly mean something else entirely could it. No way. Well, actually you ass, it does have a WAYYYY different meaning. My mother died on April 20th seven years ago, ya know the 20th day of the 4th month. So how about you keep your f^cking remarks and quips to yourself, most importantly sh^t you know nothing about. If I saw you face to face right now Id break your neck. No seriously, I would. And the next time you feel like making those kind of comments, come on up, or down, to Oxford, Ohio and I can hold a sign over your nuts that says " kick me " and then I will proceed. Internet message boards should be fun, but people like you have to make it personal. I hate you.

P.S. Do you introduce yourself to girls as Kaptain Krypton, because the look on there face afterwards would be hilarious.