Civil War: Whos side are you on?

[XwolverineX]

Wow this is just sick! Any word on Torch if he if indeed involved with the civil war?


:rolleyes:

[TheCorpulent1]

ouch...that neck on NITRO is worse than anything liefield would draw....
The saddest part is that Ramos actually knows how to draw well. At least in Liefeld's case he can't help himself because he just isn't very talented. :(

[XwolverineX]

I find his art just disgustin'.. There is no appeal in it for me.

[supermarvelman]

If your into overly cartoony, its a cool looking.

[XwolverineX]

If your into overly cartoony, its a cool looking.


Which I am not. Cartoony art = :down:down:o


Now I am done complainin', back to Civil War.

[supermarvelman]

Then lets get back to it.

[XwolverineX]

Then lets get back to it.


Well, ya should've said somethin' on-topic. Don't leave it to me, that's unfair.

[supermarvelman]

You could've got back on topic to instead of typing some reply telling me to get back on topic like im wasting my time doing the same thing right now.

[XwolverineX]

You could've got back on topic to instead of typing some reply telling me to get back on topic like im wasting my time doing the same thing right now.



Yer wastin' yer own time, it 'aint up to me to watch over yer time. :o

[supermarvelman]

What kinda Impact would Hulk have on Civil War if he was not exiled to Planet Hulk. Since he has caused a ton of damage over the years and that would help justify the registration. Who's side would he be on. Would Bruce be on one side and the Hulk on the other or more than likely Hulk wouldnt take a side he would make his own.

[supermarvelman]

well who's trying to get back on topic now.

[supermarvelman]

Why doesnt anyone make this thread for Marvels Big 3 Events.

[XwolverineX]

Why doesnt anyone make this thread for Marvels Big 3 Events.



What?!? :confused:

[supermarvelman]

Civil War, Planet Hulk, Annihilation
Sorry I'm not using the proper lingo

[supermarvelman]

Thunderbolts look to have a big part in the Civil War, will the New Squadren Sinister play a role in the Civil War at all?

I was wondering what the Grandmaster was up to at the end of 16/97

He looks to be controlling everybody involved in the Thunderbolts, and they havent addressed it since.

[TheCorpulent1]

Civil War, Planet Hulk, Annihilation
Sorry I'm not using the proper lingo
Because the thread would be cluttered. There's a lot to discuss for all three events. Or at least for Annihilation and Civil War. Not much on the Planet Hulk front, actually.

[supermarvelman]

Okay cool it was hust a suggestion.

[supermarvelman]

What will silver Surfers role be in Planet Hulk

[TheCorpulent1]

Hopefully he'll kick the Hulk's ass. Any other outcome wouldn't make much sense unless his powers are being suppressed or some other plot device gets in the way.

[supermarvelman]

Well i'm sure they'll fight and they'll both take there fair share of punishment.

[XwolverineX]

Hopefully he'll kick the Hulk's ass. Any other outcome wouldn't make much sense unless his powers are being suppressed or some other plot device gets in the way.


He should kick Hulks ass, but it's a Hulk book. So somethin' stupid might come outta they're battle..:o:down

[roach]

Yeah considering how Silver Surfer can increase his strength at will... and that is starting at class 100 strength

[XwolverineX]

Yeah considering how Silver Surfer can increase his strength at will... and that is starting at class 100 strength


He can also rearrange Molecules... He doesn't even need strength..

[roach]

that too

[TheCorpulent1]

If the Surfer were smart, he wouldn't bother physically fighting the Hulk or trying to transmute him. He'd just suck the gamma energy out of him. He's basically the top energy manipulator in the entire Marvel universe, after all.

[deemar325]

^ Hmm.. If that's the case could Bishop, Vulcan, and other energy manipulators beat Hulk? That's a really interesting idea Corp.

[TheCorpulent1]

It wasn't mine, it actually happened in the comics already. Bishop can't manipulate energy at will like the Surfer can, he can just absorb and redirect energy aimed at him. I don't know who Vulcan is.

[supermarvelman]

Can bishop absorb kinetic energy?

[TheCorpulent1]

I don't think so. He gets hurt when people punch him and stuff.

[supermarvelman]

Speedball can he absorb more than just kinetic energy.
Could he take a punch from the Hulk

[deemar325]

It wasn't mine, it actually happened in the comics already. Bishop can't manipulate energy at will like the Surfer can, he can just absorb and redirect energy aimed at him. I don't know who Vulcan is.

Vulcan is the Third Summers brother over in X-men: Deadly Genesis, he's for energy manipulation what Magneto is for magnetism. He's like two steps below SilverSurfer in power.

[deemar325]

I don't think so. He gets hurt when people punch him and stuff.

He does asbord kinetic energy, he just metabolizes it as enhanced strength, he's let stopped a moving train before be aborbing the impact.

[TheCorpulent1]

I thought Vulcan had heat manipulation. Anyway, if he's close to the Silver Surfer in power, I imagine he could drain the Hulk's gamma energy.

Speedball could take a punch from pretty much anyone. His whole deal is kinetic energy manipulation. He can't absorb other kinds of energy as far as I know, though.

[supermarvelman]

so his body is conditioned to take all the impact, thats pretty cool, but what exactly does he do with it after that, just hit people back.

[supermarvelman]

So who is really behind the wjole registraion, I doubt that it is just the Government.

[XwolverineX]

So who is really behind the wjole registraion, I doubt that it is just the Government.


Maybe it's Xavier, and he has another secret. He controls th' Government!! :eek:

[Dread]

so his body is conditioned to take all the impact, thats pretty cool, but what exactly does he do with it after that, just hit people back.
He uses the energy to make his energy orbs, which he uses for a variety of effects, like jumping, attacking, etc. A very wonky power. If he had claws and was overzealously violent, he wouldn't have been as consistantly mishandled to the point where Marvel's EIC is almost giving a bonus check to any writer who kills him off.

It does seem silly to "disassemble" the New Avengers considering they're the biggest unofficial team since the Defenders. The entire roster has, to date, never actually assembled. Hopefully THE COLLECTIVE arc fixes that. The most consistant members have been Cap, Iron Man, Spider-Man, Spider-Woman, Luke Cage, and Wolverine. Anyone else has been a part-timer. But, I hardly consider this team Avengers rather than, "Marvel's Pimp Team", so I guess it doesn't irk me as much. It's just a shame that the only other place a fan can go for classic Avengers stuff is either the usually-late YOUNG AVENGERS or THUNDERBOLTS, who are reformed villians. You'd think a relaunch of Avengers West Coast with some equally hot writer-artist team would be a no-brainer, which is probably why it's not out. It's too logical. Plus, they'd have to eat crow if it outsold NEW AVENGERS (which is unlikely anyway; Bendis is at the top of his popularity now; Stan Lee himself wouidn't be able to outsell him).

I'm still game to see what CIVIL WAR comes up with, and have faith it'll be more entertaining than HOM. I'm just anticipating Millar having some juvenile "shawk and awe" moments. Just so long as it doesn't read like wanting us to commit suicide to attone for America's Sins as much as Ultimates 2 does, I'm sold.

[stillanerd]

Some Civil War spoilers from Fantastic Four #536 concerning what the Superhero Registration Act actually intails and how machivellian Tony Stark actually is:

http://www.popcultureshock.com/pcs/gallery.php?g2_view=core.ShowItem&g2_itemId=17574

[deemar325]

He uses the energy to make his energy orbs, which he uses for a variety of effects, like jumping, attacking, etc. A very wonky power. If he had claws and was overzealously violent, he wouldn't have been as consistantly mishandled to the point where Marvel's EIC is almost giving a bonus check to any writer who kills him off.

It does seem silly to "disassemble" the New Avengers considering they're the biggest unofficial team since the Defenders. The entire roster has, to date, never actually assembled. Hopefully THE COLLECTIVE arc fixes that. The most consistant members have been Cap, Iron Man, Spider-Man, Spider-Woman, Luke Cage, and Wolverine. Anyone else has been a part-timer. But, I hardly consider this team Avengers rather than, "Marvel's Pimp Team", so I guess it doesn't irk me as much. It's just a shame that the only other place a fan can go for classic Avengers stuff is either the usually-late YOUNG AVENGERS or THUNDERBOLTS, who are reformed villians. You'd think a relaunch of Avengers West Coast with some equally hot writer-artist team would be a no-brainer, which is probably why it's not out. It's too logical. Plus, they'd have to eat crow if it outsold NEW AVENGERS (which is unlikely anyway; Bendis is at the top of his popularity now; Stan Lee himself wouidn't be able to outsell him).

I'm still game to see what CIVIL WAR comes up with, and have faith it'll be more entertaining than HOM. I'm just anticipating Millar having some juvenile "shawk and awe" moments. Just so long as it doesn't read like wanting us to commit suicide to attone for America's Sins as much as Ultimates 2 does, I'm sold.


Spot on! and a WC Avengers would out sale New Avengers, with a great creative team. I think your right Marvel don't want that, a old school Avengers book to out sale Bendis' New Avengers.

[Not Jake]

If the Surfer were smart, he wouldn't bother physically fighting the Hulk or trying to transmute him. He'd just suck the gamma energy out of him. He's basically the top energy manipulator in the entire Marvel universe, after all.
you really need to get over your surfer hate:(

unless you hate superman for never using his powers efficiently too:)

because everyone knows it's american to hate superman

[Dread]

Spot on! and a WC Avengers would out sale New Avengers, with a great creative team. I think your right Marvel don't want that, a old school Avengers book to out sale Bendis' New Avengers.
The point I made was that I don't think Marvel would mind something "outselling" NEW AVENGERS if it came from Marvel (and to be fair, if something outsells NEW AVENGERS, that just push NEW AVENGERS maybe a notch or two lower, but still in the Top 5 of the month), it would be very hard to find a creative team that can outsell Bendis at this point. He is at the peak of his popularity. Stores and fans have faith in him. The only writer whose works have at times outsold NEW AVENGERS recently have been Johns on various DC books, and naturally that is DC; he didn't do well at Marvel. Of course, the ALL-STAR books have also outsold NA, but I don't think anyone wants Frank Miller or Grant Morrison on WEST COAST AVENGERS (unless you wanted the team cursing at naked women, or having adventures inside the lower intestines of a goat while philosophizing about the British Crown, respectively).

Still, though, it would be a bit harder to brag about NA if a book starring older Avengers characters and more "straightfoward" Avengers stuff outsold it, but at this point I doubt that would be possible without Busiek or Perez. They're the only two Avengers creators who agrueably have the namepower to sell closely with NA, but even that isn't certain. Granted, Perez alone likely holds considerable namepower.

[Doomed_hero]

Sp I am kinda lost, Tony was for the act in that FF preview but against it in the latest Spider-Man? is he playing both sides or is this just a major mix up(which with marvel would not surprise me.)

[Dread]

Sp I am kinda lost, Tony was for the act in that FF preview but against it in the latest Spider-Man? is he playing both sides or is this just a major mix up(which with marvel would not surprise me.)
I'll wait and see for this one. Marvel screwing up continuity for a major event isn't new (DECIMATION titles do it constantly; are there 198 mutants left or simply "10% out of hundreds of thousands, a million maybe", which would equal more than 198), but the story is just unfolding so I'll give it a chance before I pass judgement.

[GNR]

Well, it looks like I was wrong again. Here's what Newsarama has to say about Tony Stark and Civil War.

http://www.newsarama.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=63483



So it looks like Tony is not so much pro-registration as he is taking advantage of the political situation in order to build his collalition. I also have this feeling that Reed and Susan are going to have some marital seperation based on whichever side Reed comes down on. And now I'm more convinced that ever that the "shocking moment" Spider-Man does is that he reveals his identity, which I think is opening up a huge can of worms for the writers if they want to make him have a secret identity again.

That review sounds good.

[3dman27]

Some Civil War spoilers from Fantastic Four #536 concerning what the Superhero Registration Act actually intails and how machivellian Tony Stark actually is:

http://www.popcultureshock.com/pcs/gallery.php?g2_view=core.ShowItem&g2_itemId=17574
the link doesn't work for me wha does the item say?

[XwolverineX]

I wouldn't want th' webslinger to reveal his identity. That'd move 'em even further from what he used to be. And I don't like that...:down

[BrianWilly]

The only writer whose works have at times outsold NEW AVENGERS recently have been Johns on various DC books, and naturally that is DC; he didn't do well at Marvel. Of course, the ALL-STAR books have also outsold NA, but I don't think anyone wants Frank Miller or Grant Morrison on WEST COAST AVENGERS (unless you wanted the team cursing at naked women, or having adventures inside the lower intestines of a goat while philosophizing about the British Crown, respectively). Whedon outsold Bendis:p.
http://www.newsarama.com/marketreport/Feb06charts.html

I don't think that Iron Man playing both sides in ASM and in FF is a mistake, mostly because JMS wrote both titles and, well, if the same writer can't get his own events right then we're really in troublehttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v229/friskablefriek/Emoticons/hahano.gif.

This entire civil war could be of Iron Man's design. He could intentionally leak info to some parties (Spider-Man) and encourage them to be against the act, and then he could intentionally leak info to other parties (the Illuminati) and encourage them to be for the act. That way, it's like he's provoking conflict and ensuring that a civil war will erupt.

Maybe, if he's actually for the SRA, he thinks that all these superheroes fighting each other will make the government even more convinced that they have to register them. Or, if he's actually against the SRA, he thinks that all these superheroes fighting each other will make the government convinced that they can't ever control superheroes, and that superheroes will police themselves.

Or maybe I'm giving him and Marvel too much credit.

He is a drunkard, after allhttp://smilies.vidahost.com/cwm/cwm/rcain.gif.

[The_Mystery]

Maybe Tony has just be "convinced" to fall in line?

[TheCorpulent1]

Maybe Tony has just be "convinced" to fall in line?
What, like you mean he woke up one morning with Lockjaw's head under his sheets? ;)

[The_Mystery]

What, like you mean he woke up one morning with Lockjaw's head under his sheets? ;)

lol The mental image of that is hilarious.

[3dman27]

What, like you mean he woke up one morning with Lockjaw's head under his sheets? ;)
WOOF

[XwolverineX]

WOOF


Wow, yer "WOOF" just killed th' thread, man. BUMP!

[3dman27]

Wow, yer "WOOF" just killed th' thread, man. BUMP!
not my intention whe i go WOOF in a thread in means the post is a hoot

[huskerwebhead]

Some Civil War spoilers from Fantastic Four #536 concerning what the Superhero Registration Act actually intails and how machivellian Tony Stark actually is:

http://www.popcultureshock.com/pcs/gallery.php?g2_view=core.ShowItem&g2_itemId=17574

I just read this book (New Avengers: The Illuminati) and I actually think this is "starting" as a pretty good story. They've got my interest. The fight between Namor and Ironman was great. "You're a warrior, I'm a King." "Not up here you're not" WHAM! Loved it! :)

[chris moore]

Just whose side is Tony on anyway? He tells the Illuminati that they should support the act, then takes Peter to the senate to argue against it? Iron-Man for it and Tony Stark against it sure - but the Illuminati and Peter know he is both, only the Senate doesnt.

[Harlekin]

Just whose side is Tony on anyway? He tells the Illuminati that they should support the act, then takes Peter to the senate to argue against it? Iron-Man for it and Tony Stark against it sure - but the Illuminati and Peter know he is both, only the Senate doesnt.
An interesting approach to that, that I read, is that Tony is simply telling the Illuminati that they should support it, at least covertly, since it will win out in the end anyway. This would make his bannering against it a farce for his true goals.

[GyLocke]

I expected it to suck, and somehow it was great.
Even I can be wrong, it seems like.

[Norman Osborn]

This is probably a stupid ass question but timeline wise.....the meeting of the Illuminati.....Stark arguing with the senate....these events are happening before the accident that causes the death of the civillians, correct?....

....if so , isn't that quite convenient?......The Senate's arguing to have Superheros more culpable and down the street a group of Super heros accidentally cause the death's of 100's?...hmm?

[Sentry2005]

This is probably a stupid ass question but timeline wise.....the meeting of the Illuminati.....Stark arguing with the senate....these events are happening before the accident that causes the death of the civillians, correct?....

....if so , isn't that quite convenient?......The Senate's arguing to have Superheros more culpable and down the street a group of Super heros accidentally cause the death's of 100's?...hmm?

yeah, the death of the civillians is in issue one of civil war.

and it's what tony was saying in the iluminati special; this was always going to happen. the ammount of people in costumes running around the city, someone was bound to mess up eventually.

you can say that is a bit convenient, but then most things are in comics. example; the traitor to the ultimates just happens to have a series of nanites injected into her that lead to tony stark taking her out... isn't it convenient that the traitor happened to be the one he could manipulate?

or the crisis in dc... its a convenient way to reset continuity, homage the old days and clean up any problems they have made for themselves over the years. convenient happenings are an age old custom when it comes to story telling, i mean, just look at any victorian novel...

[Fantastic Fan22]

This is probably a stupid ass question but timeline wise.....the meeting of the Illuminati.....Stark arguing with the senate....these events are happening before the accident that causes the death of the civillians, correct?....

....if so , isn't that quite convenient?......The Senate's arguing to have Superheros more culpable and down the street a group of Super heros accidentally cause the death's of 100's?...hmm?

Well in the Illuminati special, Stark talks about how disassembled, House of M, and some other recent events have led this issue to come up in the Senate. The group "down the street" seems to be what is going to bring the public's attention to the issue.

[RAMORE]

Whedon outsold Bendis:p.
http://www.newsarama.com/marketreport/Feb06charts.html

I don't think that Iron Man playing both sides in ASM and in FF is a mistake, mostly because JMS wrote both titles and, well, if the same writer can't get his own events right then we're really in troublehttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v229/friskablefriek/Emoticons/hahano.gif.

This entire civil war could be of Iron Man's design. He could intentionally leak info to some parties (Spider-Man) and encourage them to be against the act, and then he could intentionally leak info to other parties (the Illuminati) and encourage them to be for the act. That way, it's like he's provoking conflict and ensuring that a civil war will erupt.

Maybe, if he's actually for the SRA, he thinks that all these superheroes fighting each other will make the government even more convinced that they have to register them. Or, if he's actually against the SRA, he thinks that all these superheroes fighting each other will make the government convinced that they can't ever control superheroes, and that superheroes will police themselves.

Or maybe I'm giving him and Marvel too much credit.

He is a drunkard, after allhttp://smilies.vidahost.com/cwm/cwm/rcain.gif.


Or maybe he just wants them to openly support since all the illuminatti are known anyways that way the government won't suspect that they are against it and helping heros avoid it;)

[spidertwit]

Why do I get the distinct impression that Peter Parker will be the hero who is unmasked and publicly outed? Why, even though I'm well aware of all the twists and swerves still to come, and the fact that the book isn't even out for another month, all signs are still pointing me to Spidey?

[XwolverineX]

not my intention whe i go WOOF in a thread in means the post is a hoot


O.K? :confused:

[supermarvelman]

Just whose side is Tony on anyway? He tells the Illuminati that they should support the act, then takes Peter to the senate to argue against it? Iron-Man for it and Tony Stark against it sure - but the Illuminati and Peter know he is both, only the Senate doesnt.

Ironman is for it cause he feel like there is no other logical choice, so he makes a last ditch effort to stop it from happening, and realizes it's unavoidable.

[Themanofbat]

If done properly, this could arguably be one of the BEST inter-Marvel cross-overs ever told.

:o

[deemar325]

Ironman is for it cause he feel like there is no other logical choice, so he makes a last ditch effort to stop it from happening, and realizes it's unavoidable.

I agree with that. Tony is a very practical man and he's dabbled in politics so he knows what coming.

[supermarvelman]

Things look to be going in the right direction, all those people talking **** about Civil War are gonna be eating there words once it's all said and done with. It looks to be more than just a re-hash of an old story line.

[deemar325]

^ I hope so, I have more faith in Millar and none in Bendis.

[supermarvelman]

Millar is pretty damn good.

[deemar325]

^ That he is.

[Roachman]

Xavier is gonna come back and clear everyone's memory after the fact anyway. They really need to lay of Peter. Geez can he have a private life ? Even though Nick fury and 75% of the superhero universe know who he is ?

[stillanerd]

^ That he is.

Course, considering the "Civil War quiz" Wizard has now and the possible "answers," it could go to hell in a hand basket even if it is well written (and thank god Bendis isn't the scribe).

BTW, we should start tallying up the sides:

So far it's:

PRO-REGISTRATION:
Iron Man
Mister Fantastic

ANTI-REGISTRATION:
Doctor Strange

NEUTRAL:
Namor

UNKNOWN:
Black Bolt (considering he's a mute)

[deemar325]

^ I still haven't got my Wizard in the mail. Dammit.

[iloveclones]

Course, considering the "Civil War quiz" Wizard has now and the possible "answers," it could go to hell in a hand basket even if it is well written (and thank god Bendis isn't the scribe).

BTW, we should start tallying up the sides:

So far it's:

PRO-REGISTRATION:
Iron Man
Mister Fantastic

ANTI-REGISTRATION:
Doctor Strange

NEUTRAL:
Namor

UNKNOWN:
Black Bolt (considering he's a mute)

Actually, I though BB was agreeing with Tony.

[stillanerd]

^^^
Well, that pointing towards him with his head bowed could've been his disagreeing with Tony for all I know. That's why it would've helped if Medusa had been there to speak for him--like she's supposed to. That's why I put it the unknown, unless further evidence indicates otherwise.

^ I still haven't got my Wizard in the mail. Dammit.
Lucky for you, I've got a thread that has them courtesy of Millar World :)
http://www.superherohype.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8271144&postcount=1

[supermarvelman]

Didn't he point at Tony than himself and give the nod or was that the issue with exiling the Hulk.

[deemar325]

^^^
Well, that pointing towards him with his head bowed could've been his disagreeing with Tony for all I know. That's why it would've helped if Medusa had been there to speak for him--like she's supposed to. That's why I put it the unknown, unless further evidence indicates otherwise.


Lucky for you, I've got a thread that has them courtesy of Millar World :)
http://www.superherohype.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8271144&postcount=1

If my daddy didn't beat the sissy out of me I'd hug ya. (In a manly way of course.)

:up:

[supermarvelman]

Which Pair of Heroes will join the Fantastic Four after Civil War?

A)Luke Cage/Jessica Jones
B)Human Galactus/Silver Surfer
C)Storm/Black Panther
D)She-Hulk/Hawkeye

Which Character willingly reveals their secret identity to the world during Civil War?

A)Spider-Man
B)DareDevil
C)Spider-Women
D)Iron Man

Which hero will choose retirement over registration as a result of the events of Civil War?

A)Iron Fist
B)Firestar
C)Falcon
D)Wonder Man

Which hero is arrested during Civil War?

A)Captain America
B)The Punisher
C)Iron Man
D)Nick Fury

Which two heroes will make their triumphant return in the pages of Civil War?

A)Thor
B)Captain Marvel
C)Ant-Man
D)Hawkeye

Civil War brings out the dark side of one Hero. Which one will resort to brutal torture?

A)Black Panther
B)Dr. Strange
C)Iron Man
D)Namor

Which Hreo gets beaten into a coma during Civil War?

A)Kitty Pryde
B)Human Torch
C)Spider-Women
D)Shang-Chi

Which suprise character will join the Avengers at the end of Civil War?

A)Speedball
B)Ares
C)Iron Fist
D)Hyperion

Which Team will be reformed as a result of Civil War?

A)The Champions
B)Alpha Flight
C)X-Force
D)West Coast Avengers

Which Character will switch sides during Civil War

A)Mr. Fantastic
B)Spider-Man
C)Wolverine
D)Invisible Women

Which team will be featured on 'America's Most Wanted' during Civil War?

A)Runaways
B)Young Avengers
C)X-Men
D)Millar/McNiven

These are from the latest Wizard 175

[supermarvelman]

If my daddy didn't beat the sissy out of me I'd hug ya. (In a manly way of course.)

:up:

A nod of the head usually means yes

A shake of the head usually means no

About my above post, sorry, didnt know that a thread was already started for the Wizard Quiz for Civil War.

[3dman27]

^^^
Well, that pointing towards him with his head bowed could've been his disagreeing with Tony for all I know. That's why it would've helped if Medusa had been there to speak for him--like she's supposed to. That's why I put it the unknown, unless further evidence indicates otherwise.

why wouldn't black bolt be allowed to bring medusa as his interpeter
since black bolt can't speak for all practical purposes why wouldn't the illuminatti allow medusa as his interpeter? that dosen't sound too "illuminated " to me

[Zaptoitnow]

The way I see it, Tony is against it in principle, and will go to Washington to argue for his cause, but his contingency upon failing, as he has convinced himself will happen, is that they all come out in support of it, once it is law. That will be the way that Pete gets sucked in, seeing Tony give his best to stop this from happening, then after it does, Tony tells him that they can't change what happened, but rather they need to do what is required of them, and support it. Also, I am not completely convinced that Spidey will reveal his ID publicly. He may, but I think an all too easy answer to that question is Iron Man. He's for it, why wouldn't he reveal himself. It's not like he really has a secret ID anyways. :rolleyes:

[supermarvelman]

Which Pair of Heroes will join the Fantastic Four after Civil War?

A)Luke Cage/Jessica Jones
B)Human Galactus/Silver Surfer
C)Storm/Black Panther
D)She-Hulk/Hawkeye - only logical choice.

Which Character willingly reveals their secret identity to the world during Civil War?

A)Spider-Man
B)DareDevil - all the **** he's gone through.
C)Spider-Women
D)Iron Man

Which hero will choose retirement over registration as a result of the events of Civil War?

A)Iron Fist
B)Firestar
C)Falcon
D)Wonder Man - He has a career besides just a hero.

Which hero is arrested during Civil War?

A)Captain America - Just seems like they would wanna make an example of him.
B)The Punisher
C)Iron Man
D)Nick Fury

Which two heroes will make their triumphant return in the pages of Civil War?

A)Thor
B)Captain Marvel - Genis just died
C)Ant-Man - Its kinda been announced
D)Hawkeye

Civil War brings out the dark side of one Hero. Which one will resort to brutal torture?

A)Black Panther - Just guessing
B)Dr. Strange - My second choice
C)Iron Man
D)Namor

Which Hreo gets beaten into a coma during Civil War?

A)Kitty Pryde
B)Human Torch - Two members of the FF will be replaced
C)Spider-Women
D)Shang-Chi

Which suprise character will join the Avengers at the end of Civil War?

A)Speedball
B)Ares - Just another guess
C)Iron Fist
D)Hyperion

Which Team will be reformed as a result of Civil War?

A)The Champions
B)Alpha Flight - They just got taken out, it's a set up for a big return.
C)X-Force
D)West Coast Avengers

Which Character will switch sides during Civil War

A)Mr. Fantastic
B)Spider-Man - It's obvious from some of the CW covers
C)Wolverine
D)Invisible Women

Which team will be featured on 'America's Most Wanted' during Civil War?

A)Runaways - There a bunch of Runaway children whose parents are villians
B)Young Avengers
C)X-Men
D)Millar/McNiven

These are from the latest Wizard 175

My Pics

[Fantastic Fan22]

Did anyone else notice that DC pushed back the final issue of Infinite Crisis to the same day the first issue of Civil War is released

[deathshead2]

If spider-man reveals his secret identity to the world im going to know marvel has lost it.

[hippie_hunter]

Which Pair of Heroes will join the Fantastic Four after Civil War?

A)Luke Cage/Jessica Jones
B)Human Galactus/Silver Surfer - Silver Surfer has a connection with the Fantastic Four along with Galactus, I see Luke Cage, Jessica Jones, She-Hulk and Hawkeye joining the new Heroes for Hire with Iron Fist, Colleen Wing, and Misty Knight. However Sue and Johnny will return soon.
C)Storm/Black Panther
D)She-Hulk/Hawkeye

Which Character willingly reveals their secret identity to the world during Civil War?

A)Spider-Man
B)DareDevil - after all he has done to protect his secret identity he willing gives it up
C)Spider-Women
D)Iron Man

Which hero will choose retirement over registration as a result of the events of Civil War?

A)Iron Fist
B)Firestar
C)Falcon
D)Wonder Man

Which hero is arrested during Civil War?

A)Captain America - for leading the opposition
B)The Punisher
C)Iron Man
D)Nick Fury

Which two heroes will make their triumphant return in the pages of Civil War?

A)Thor - obvious, needs to come back
B)Captain Marvel
C)Ant-Man
D)Hawkeye - obvious, but damn he's been dead for less than a year - AGAIN

Civil War brings out the dark side of one Hero. Which one will resort to brutal torture?

A)Black Panther
B)Dr. Strange
C)Iron Man
D)Namor - just seems in character for Namor, if not him then Black Panther, I can never see Iron Man or Dr. Strange condoning torture

Which Hreo gets beaten into a coma during Civil War?

A)Kitty Pryde
B)Human Torch - the other Fantastic Four member needs to be replaced
C)Spider-Women
D)Shang-Chi

Which suprise character will join the Avengers at the end of Civil War?

A)Speedball
B)Ares
C)Iron Fist
D)Hyperion - Iron Fist is a Hero for Hire, Speedball might die, and Ares just simply doesn't belong on the Avengers

Which Team will be reformed as a result of Civil War?

A)The Champions
B)Alpha Flight
C)X-Force
D)West Coast Avengers - East Coast consisting of Captain America, Spider-Man and others, West Coast consisting of Iron Man, Wolverine, and others

Which Character will switch sides during Civil War

A)Mr. Fantastic
B)Spider-Man - confirmed
C)Wolverine
D)Invisible Women

Which team will be featured on 'America's Most Wanted' during Civil War?

A)Runaways
B)Young Avengers
C)X-Men
D)Millar/McNiven

These are from the latest Wizard 175

Thats how I see it

[deemar325]

Did anyone else notice that DC pushed back the final issue of Infinite Crisis to the same day the first issue of Civil War is released

Just good business.

[supermarvelman]

Its what i would do, but **** them they just want CW to do bad.

[deemar325]

^ Yep DC hatin' on Marvel.

[supermarvelman]

Pretty much.

Instead of letting fans enjoy IC when they expect to they would rather piss us off and try to **** over Marvel.

[CantThinkOfAName]

Just good business.
You need to learn basic economics:(

[deemar325]

^ Dude get off my d-ck please.

straight stalker mode.

[CConn]

IC was pushed back this month, which casued it to be pushed back next month as well; doesn't really seem to involve CW to me. :confused:

But then I'm young and naive. :(

[deemar325]

^ It's a move I'd have done with IC to takes some shine away from CW.

[CantThinkOfAName]

^ Dude get off my d-ck please.

straight stalker mode.
Well since you asked nicely I will, but next time I expect my ass to be filled with spermatazoa:mad:

[CantThinkOfAName]

^ It's a move I'd have done with IC to takes some shine away from CW.
All youd do is hurt IC sales.:rolleyes::down

[3dman27]

falcon retireing due to the civil war makes sense to me

[SpideyInATree]

I know I'm definitely in the minority on this one but I'm kind of excited to see if the hero who willingly reveals their identity is Spider-Man. I'd like to see how things get handled if he goes public with his ID. It'd pretty much change the face of the Spider-Man comics and it'd make for a VERY interesting read each and every month. :o

And I'm hoping that MJ gets killed during the event as well. Quesada said he'd never divorce the two but he didn't say anything about death.

Daredevil is such a logical and easy choice for it though.

But from what I've seen of Mark Millar's comments about Civil War Spidey is going to be the one who's most affected by the outcome.

So, sounds to me like Spider-Man is going public as Peter Parker.

[supermarvelman]

Wonderman was a stunt man and had a small movie career didn't he.

I would put money on Wonderman, he doesn't need to be a hero, he was a hero in the beginning cause he liked the attention and fame, not nesicarilly to help people out of the goodness in his heart (Booster Gold). I haven't spotted Wonderman in any of the Civil War covers, but Falcon is there.

Wonderman could just say **** this ****, if everybody is gonna become registered heroes, I'll be an actor again or run my own company again.

[Sentry2005]

Which Pair of Heroes will join the Fantastic Four after Civil War?

A)Luke Cage/Jessica Jones
B)Human Galactus/Silver Surfer
C)Storm/Black Panther
D)She-Hulk/Hawkeye

Which Character willingly reveals their secret identity to the world during Civil War?

A)Spider-Man
B)DareDevil
C)Spider-Women
D)Iron Man

Which hero will choose retirement over registration as a result of the events of Civil War?

A)Iron Fist
B)Firestar
C)Falcon
D)Wonder Man

Which hero is arrested during Civil War?

A)Captain America
B)The Punisher
C)Iron Man
D)Nick Fury

Which two heroes will make their triumphant return in the pages of Civil War?

A)Thor
B)Captain Marvel
C)Ant-Man
D)Hawkeye

Civil War brings out the dark side of one Hero. Which one will resort to brutal torture?

A)Black Panther
B)Dr. Strange
C)Iron Man
D)Namor

Which Hreo gets beaten into a coma during Civil War?

A)Kitty Pryde
B)Human Torch
C)Spider-Women
D)Shang-Chi

Which suprise character will join the Avengers at the end of Civil War?

A)Speedball
B)Ares
C)Iron Fist
D)Hyperion

Which Team will be reformed as a result of Civil War?

A)The Champions
B)Alpha Flight
C)X-Force
D)West Coast Avengers

Which Character will switch sides during Civil War

A)Mr. Fantastic
B)Spider-Man
C)Wolverine
D)Invisible Women

Which team will be featured on 'America's Most Wanted' during Civil War?

A)Runaways
B)Young Avengers
C)X-Men
D)Millar/McNiven

These are from the latest Wizard 175

thats my two choices any way

[deemar325]

Well since you asked nicely I will, but next time I expect my ass to be filled with spermatazoa:mad:

*sigh*

hopeless.

[masteryoda]

Actually, I though BB was agreeing with Tony.
No, Blackbolt made a fist and then pointed at Tony and Reed. I took that to mean he'd fight them.

[masteryoda]

falcon retireing due to the civil war makes sense to me
That's probably because you haven't read it yet.

[supermarvelman]

He was saying yes, its only my opinion, but ill bet money BB was agreeing with them. We'll find out when CW happens.

[masteryoda]

Totally diagree with ya, Tony's line after that was "I get the jist" meaning it wasn't a good jist.

[supermarvelman]

exactly

[supermarvelman]

Its not rocket science, it was a nod(yes) you dont need madusa to figure that out.

[masteryoda]

He wasn't nodding in agreement, learn how to read comics.

[Darthkush]

I think it's now clear that they didn't do a good job in portraying which side Black Bolt was on in the book. I came here trying to see if any of you guys knew but judging by the discussion, i'm not the only one who's lost on that one.

[supermarvelman]

He wasn't nodding in agreement, learn how to read comics.

Learn to read comics what the **** are you talking about. You think he said no, I think he said yes. I dont see why i need to learn how to read comics, I'm not stupid.

This issue with BB is strictly opinion, we'll see.

[supermarvelman]

He tips his head down, no matter what language you speak that usually means yes.

[The Leaguer]

It's pretty obvious he was in disagreement with Stark.

[Calendar Man]

This story should have been called "Crisis on Infinite Marvel Dudes Bank Accounts." I might have bought it then.

[deemar325]

^ Heh.

[iloveclones]

No, Blackbolt made a fist and then pointed at Tony and Reed. I took that to mean he'd fight them.

I actually took that to mean a sign of solidarity, sort of like the black athletes at the 1968 Olympics.


1968: Black athletes make silent protest
Two black American athletes have made history at the Mexico Olympics by staging a silent protest against racial discrimination.
Tommie Smith and John Carlos, gold and bronze medallists in the 200m, stood with their heads bowed and a black-gloved hand raised as the American National Anthem played during the victory ceremony.


I actually think it's cool that people don't know where he stands. I don't need everything to be told to me. Let it be vague and reveal itself later. People were all offended that Black Panther wasn't part of this group, but his part in it was a lot of fun to read. So be patient. The whole fun of a series like this is speculating on who takes what side, and then watching it unfold. No need to start insulting one another already (plenty of time for that later...)

[iloveclones]

He tips his head down, no matter what language you speak that usually means yes.

It could also mean disappointment, resignation, defeat. I think the "I will fight you" line of thinking makes perfect sense (although that's not what I think)

[yenaled]

He was obviously in disagreement, he did a kind of finger wag when pointing also. Looking down in disagreement, annoyance at what they were doing.

What I do find a little stupid that Black Bolt didn't have a translator for him, like Medusa, especially after Prof. X had disappeared. Even if this was a super secret club it is a little redudant to go along if you can't contribute anything other than a nod or a finger shaking.

I'm looking forward to Civil War mainly because I really like Black Bolt always been my favourite Marvel character.

[CaptainStacy]

I actually took that to mean a sign of solidarity

Same here. A fist, then pointing led me to believe BB was telling Reed and Tony he is on their sides...

With all that both the Fantastic Four AND The Avengers have done for The Inhumans, i find it hard to believe that BB would desert them (much less raise hand to them) now.....especially over politics that have little to do with his kingdom, as it isn't even on earth anymore (iirc)...

We'll find out for sure soon enough though....

[supermarvelman]

Yea Namor clearly said no, same with Dr. Strange. This is the reason Madusa wasnt there, so we would all argue over whether or not BB was with them or against them.

[Dread]

Here's a repost of what I thought of ILLUMINATI SPECIAL, with spoilers:
NEW AVENGERS: ILLUMINATI: Not sure quite what the NEW AVENGERS have to do with this, other than this group debuting in one issue, and one of them being Iron Man (who is the prime drive behind this loose group). Yes, this is yet another Marvel retcon; the special attempts to convince you that shortly after the first Kree-Skrull War back in the 60's, Iron Man attempted to gather Mr. Fantastic, Namor, Black Bolt, Dr. Strange, Prof. X and Black Panther into a cabal to better organize and unite Earth's heroic powers into a global protection unit. Yet this story comes off better than DEADLY GENESIS, and I think it is because it is very obvious that this "team" is barely functional, and that they rarely met throughout the span of Marvel's "modern age". Bendis does a good job of explaining why Black Panther is no longer part (he found the overreaching and secrecy of it all disturbing) and also is at home with the political talking heads. The group can barely meet without agrueing and Namor is easily the most hot-headed of the group, willing to become the patron saint of even The Hulk if it means disagreeing with the rest of the "surface-dwellers" (or maybe he doesn't hate The Hulk as much as he claimed). Bendis for once has a fair grasp of continuity with the Kree/Skrull and Dr. Strange's "otherworld" bansishing of the Hulk during the 70's-80's (as well as explaining "Fury's" rampant and disjointed appearences since SECRET WAR; are they just covering or was this always the plan? For once, continuity done well). The team is wracked by disagreeing over sending Hulk to space (Namor's words and reactions are chilling), the disappearence of Xavier after HOM and the upcoming Superhero Registration Act, which causes the group to dispand all-together because none of them can agree on what to do. Dr. Strange comes off a little mild and there are some art/coloring errors in the beginning (or was it intentional? The 60's were known for that stuff), but despite my nitpicking I couldn't help but find the read rivetting, and the preview of CIVIL WAR #1 at the end was appropriate. I just hope CW doesn't go EXACTLY as Iron Man plans, because then it'd be predictable. True, this storyline is all very topical and won't seem nearly as poignant once Bush is out of office, but Marvel's usually been topical, so this is nothing new. Reflecting the real world in literal ways has always seperated Marvel from DC. The best issue of NEW AVENGERS yet, featuring almost none of them. Hah!
Further thoughts:

- Technically, some people HAVE died due to some of Iron Man's mistakes. Back when he had alcohol problems inside the armor, a foriegn dignatary died. Plus, back when the armor was "sentient" due to "Y2K" (secretly some Ultron plot), he iced Blacklash; true, that wasn't Tony's fault, but he'd have a tricky time proving it to a jury. Of course, maybe Tony wouldn't be quick to talk about it, and no one else in the room either knew or felt like bringing it up (it seems unlikely that said events wouldn't have been known by at least Mr. Fantastic).

- The Black Bolt debate continues! I didn't take Tony's words at the end to seem cheery, but it was tense situation, and I guess Black Bolt's side will be revealed during CIVIL WAR. True, it would seem OOC for Black Bolt to totally abandon the Fantastic Four and the Avengers after all of their adventures together, but as someone said, the Inhumans are offworld and he could see it in a way like Namor; "their" problem. Plus, it's not like Marvel isn't willing to have characters make some wiggy decisions if it was for the sake of a story. DC, too. There're still people buggy about those JLA mindwipes.

- This month's WIZARD also had many hints to things that may happen in CIVIL WAR, and I am concerned for one thing; if Marvel writes itself into too much of a corner with some of these decisions, it'll be hard to go back. Which is something to consider as, well, Marvel never sticks with anything for longer than 2 years. To assume they will now is to abandon the last 5+ years of history. Maybe they'll surprise me. But still, certain "points of no return" will forever shatter what made a lot of their characters work for 30-40 years, and finding a new niche will be hard. For example, without a secret identity, Spider-Man would lose the very last of his relatability to the common man, and would essentially become The Flash, only less competant and without the legacy (granted, Flash managed to get out his "known identity" jam thanks to some convient mind-wiping events; proving that such a plotline runs its course with many heroes). And if I wanted Spider-Man to become the Flash, I'd just...read the Flash. Marvel has screwed with Spider-Man's formula before, at their peril.

Plus, the problem with writing a "ending on a shock event cliffhanger every issue" series is that it can quickly become tedious very quickly if you don't do it right, or ship it on time (even INFINITE CRISIS is having this problem). At best it can be like IDENTITY CRISIS; done poorly, it can become, say, X-MEN: DEADLY GENESIS, where one retcon and event comes after the other and I honestly don't care much anymore. Millar at least is good at writing exciting action sequences and build-up, better at it than Bendis usually is (outside crime noir). Millar's problem is climaxes; historically his finales have been "hit or miss", and that's even with his peak game in Ultimate. Hopefully, Marvel's had a lot of roundtable discussions about the pace of CW and that means this will be their A-Game. It's already looking much more exciting than HOM was.

[supermarvelman]

Yes i understand about how BB could take the same approach as Namor "there world there problem" but i think the registration would benifit BB, He would be able to gain knowledge of most of the superpowered people/mutants on the planet earth. Maybe the Inhumans would like to return to earth one day.

[Dread]

As SON OF M is showing, the Inhumans may have a good reason to continue to stay hidden; a lot of forces may want access to their Terragin Mists now.

Of course, the downside of registration, as many of the characters siding against it probably know, is that once the government knows your name, your powers, your weaknesses, your friends & family, and where you live, what is to happen one day if a registered hero disobeys "orders"? What happens if one day the Commander in Chief is a fairly-elected Wilson Fisk (don't laugh; Luthor had a criminal record and he got to be president at DC for a while) or something like it? What happens if any supervillian with connections or hacking skills decides to research all of their enemies? For a people as oft to "hiding" as the Inhumans are, I can't see Black Bolt siding with regristration unless he REALLY trusted Iron Man and Mr. Fantastic's word and the humans who work for them.

It's not being "rotten" if BB sides against them; hey, like Reed, he has a wife and kid to think about. That is one thing Iron Man CAN'T consider. He's very isolated and alone, whereas lots of heroes do have families. I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of the pro-registration types are heroes who don't have extended family units to worry about, but I could be wrong. I mean, of course Reed will be for it; after illegally flying into space, he's been a government stooge until the end. The Fantastic Four have been the "narcs" of the superhero community for a while, especially now with the Avengers fallen from grace.

[supermarvelman]

The Inhumans wouldnt be registered, but everybody on earth with some kinda power would be, and thats good for the Inhumans.

[Dread]

I just hope that this story has the sort of payoff a lot of people may want. "Heroes fighting heroes" is a gimmick that starts out hot and burns out very quickly; at the end of the day there needs to be some kind of "villian". Granted, that can be seen as a cop-out, and maybe it is; JLU did this with their "Camdus" arc last season. But DAMNED if it didn't work. But best to leave yourself a well written cop-out then to write oneself into a box of no return (save for an even cheesier retcon, like the sort Marvels done to negate about 80% of Morrison's run; "Xorneto" anyone? Imagine that on a larger scale).

Of course, this is the off-chance that this time, this time Marvel will get all their ducks in a row and actually, for once in a god damned decade, pull off something like this right. Miracles happen, after all. And they've had 2 years of DC becoming a fierce competitor to put on their game-face and get things done. Joe Q's heralded a hero because he got Marvel out of rock bottom, now let's see how he handles staying at the top, which can be a harder challenge. Just look at ROCKY III. ;)

[supermarvelman]

There will be a villian when its all said and done with.

[CantThinkOfAName]

At Wizardworld LA, Quesada said that their isn't going to be some villain that pops oout at the end revealing that he's been manipulating everyone the whole time, and Bendis added that everyone isnt just going to hug and kiss and forgive at the end, that someone is going to lose the war.

I like it this way much better. Having a villain pop out at the end only trivializes the ethical issues that the heroes are fighting about. This Civil War is going to be a real war, not some sham by Mephisto or something, and its going to have consequences.

I think that's why this hero-vs.-hero story is actually going to be real interesting, because its not going a misunderstanding between the two sides or a trick by a villain behind the scenes.

[Dread]

There will be a villian when its all said and done with.
Likely. Millar dusted off a few decent C-stringers for the CW preview pages, and he's not nearly as afraid as honest-to-goodness superheroics as Bendis is (he's too damned SOPHISTICATED for that, you see, which is why NEW AVENGERS has them talking a lot and then being whipped by ninjas). Out of the pair he's a better choice for something like this.

I guess it should be said that while HOM I looked at with a weary, unexcited eye, this story actually has me jazzed up, which is why I fear that Marvel will bungle the potential somehow. HOM had little potential, and lost it very quickly; almost none of the X-books are even bothering to deal with the Decimation fallout aside for a few passing mentions, which is why you have mini's like THE 198 floating about. This time Marvel's talking a very good game so far with CIVIL WAR, and I'm concerned, but hoping, that for once they can back it up.

[supermarvelman]

Cool, that would make sense, and it wouldnt be cliche

[Dread]

At Wizardworld LA, Quesada said that their isn't going to be some villain that pops oout at the end revealing that he's been manipulating everyone the whole time, and Bendis added that everyone isnt just going to hug and kiss and forgive at the end, that someone is going to lose the war.

I like it this way much better. Having a villain pop out at the end only trivializes the ethical issues that the heroes are fighting about. This Civil War is going to be a real war, not some sham by Mephisto or something, and its going to have consequences.

I think that's why this hero-vs.-hero story is actually going to be real interesting, because its not going a misunderstanding between the two sides or a trick by a villain behind the scenes.
The problem of all that, which sounds wonderful at cons, is that if Marvel writes themselves into a corner, they will have a hard time coming out of it. Marvel NEVER has stuck with ANY MAJOR CHANGE IN THEIR ENTIRE UNIVERSE for longer than 2 years, for better or worse (at least within my 20+ years of life and readin' comics). The only reason they're bothering now is to match INFINITE CRISIS, which is revamping DC's entire line. The problem is that DC's done this, with success and failure, a bunch of times; Marvel never has. They've rarely had the balls to stick with any decision, good or bad. Which is fine when they screw up, but when they do something you like, it becomes tedious to see it retconned away for the next hottest writer's arc.

Even if a story itself is fantastic, if it is eventually muddled and undone by a retcon, even a great story can be made to feel worthless. Look at what happened to "The Death of Gwen Stacy" after the Osborn resurrection and "Sins Past". It's still a great story, but a lot of the oomph is gone. That is a real shame for genuinely good stories. Maybe that is why most people's "best comic stories" lists contain self-contained, finite stories that can NEVER be undone.

I'm not being pessimistic. I am being a realist. I won't believe that Marvel honestly has any intention of sticking with the ramifications of this or any "event" until it's 2016 and this story STILL matters. Only time can tell that. I remembered when Onslaught was supposed to change the MU forevermore, and he did...for about 2 years.

The problem this time? For once Marvel's started the story for the event and is doing a decent job of it, laying groundwork in many places, and it's not just the damned X-Men for the 100th time. For once it looks like they're honestly trying to do this one right, they've been paying attention to DC for the past year and now want to show off some new moves. So being a realist, and knowing that Marvel's usually bungled even crappy events in past years, or retconned them the moment they become inconvient, leading to fan apathy, sometimes it makes it hard to be genuinely optimistic here. But I am expecting a helluva ride.

[Fantasyartist]

The recent "Civil War" storyline in Marvel (about Congressional demands for superheroes to register their secret identities with the Federal Government) has some intriguing questions-not the least of which is what would happen to any hero/heroine who refused to do so? (what about the constitutional right of privacy). Also how would these identities be kept secret( if the Mafia can penetrate the Witness Protection Programme and the KGB can infiltrate both the FBI and CIA, pace the Aldrich Ames and Robert Hanssen spy cases, then any super-villain worth his salt such as Dr.Doom, or the Red Skull can surely offer bribes or use blackmail enough to breach security )?
Also, would foreign based heroes visiting the US such as Canada's Alpha Flight or Russia's Winter Guard be compelled to register as well(one presumes that the Governments in Ottawa and Moscow are aware of their true identities)? Common sense indicates that they would be required to do so, as non-US citizens visiting or residing in America are subject to both State and Federal laws(whether they are tourists visiting relatives for Thanksgiving as I do to see my cousins in Philly) or green card holders. What if the foreign Government in question didn't know the hero/heroine's identity; would the US turn over details of the individual's identity even if he/she explicitly asked for this not to be done.
These are far from abstract concerns; in real life the National Rifle Association and kindred groups like the Gun Owners of America have opposed registration of legally held weapons arguing that these are a slippery slope for confiscation, and of course the current administration has strongly opposed the International Criminal Court, arguing that it might engage in "frivolous or politically motivated" lawsuits against US policymakers or peacekeeping forces and in general infringes on American sovereignty.
Personally I think this legislation has come about simply because superheroes unlike ethnic/religious groups or even business and labour, have no demonstratable group to lobby for their interests and are fair game for virtual victimization!

Terry

[Harlekin]

So why did this require a new thread?

[Doc Destruction]

I know it requires paragraphs!

[Darthphere]

Im not reading this.

[Elijya]

Terry, people are more likely to read a lengthy post like that if you space out the paragraphs. Just a suggestion

[Darthphere]

Edit

[GoldenAgeHero]

im on no ones side, why? cuase marvel suck! hell these are the same people who are gonna bring back heroes reborn, no thank you! losers!

[Darthphere]

im on no ones side, why? cuase marvel suck! hell these are the same people who are gonna bring back heroes reborn, no thank you! losers!


Then why come to the Marvel forum? Honestly youve become a better poster lately, dont resort to this kind of crap.

[Elijya]

yeesh, relax. So they're bringing back Heroes Reborn, so what? it's not impacting the 616 universe, and you're not forced to buy it, shouldn't effect you in the least. I don't see you complaining about them bringing back the New Universe

[yenaled]

I agree fully with Dread on this, I can't remember the last time a Marvel crossover had be even interested. But with Civil War I keep on seeing positives - not Bendis, not just the X-Men - to name a few (If Millar could keep Wolverine away from this story I'll be happy as Larry). Change the Universe forever or not, I think this story has a lot of potential to be an interesting and fun ride.

Granted they havn't convinced be to buy everything on their check list; I'll just stick to Civil War and my usual handful of titles.

[Elijya]

ditto

If registration actually DOES change the MU, even if just for a year or two, I'll be happy. But if the bill is retracted by the end of the mini, well, that'd be kind stupid, IMO.

[CaptainStacy]

ditto

If registration actually DOES change the MU, even if just for a year or two, I'll be happy. But if the bill is retracted by the end of the mini, well, that'd be kind stupid, IMO.


I doubt Marvel will close all the loose ends by the end of the mini...they more than likely will have a sequel to it the following year.

And honestly; if THIS mini is actually as good as it looks to be, then i DO hope they play it out a bit, and maybe have a follow up next year.

Just so long as it doesn't become a drawn out, 2 year + convoluted mess like the Clone Saga...

Like Dread has been saying; Marvel has to be careful they don't paint themselves TOO far into a corner.

[XwolverineX]

im on no ones side, why? cuase marvel suck! hell these are the same people who are gonna bring back heroes reborn, no thank you! losers!


Ban!!?? :confused::(:up:

[euroq]

Today's LITG had some Civil War/Alpha Flight spoilers. Johnston gave it a green light.

http://www.comicbookresources.com/columns/?column=13

The new Alpha Flight series will be manned by American heroes who have moved to Canada as a result of the government legislation enacted in the 'Civil War' megacrossover. It plays off the history of Americans escaping the draft during the Vietnam War, as well as recent declarations by certain people that they'd move to Canada if Bush was re elected (and then not). It's politically observant, satirical, colonialist and intentionally controversial. And leading the team? Captain America, obviously.

Also, preview art from ASM #531
http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/newsitem.cgi?id=7026

Kirkham is pretty bad, luckily he's gone after this issue.

[Darthphere]

Spoilers sound like they could be really good or really bad. Really shaky.

Spiderman preview could be a lot worse art wise.

[3dman27]

Likely. Millar dusted off a few decent C-stringers for the CW preview pages, and he's not nearly as afraid as honest-to-goodness superheroics as Bendis is (he's too damned SOPHISTICATED for that, you see, which is why NEW AVENGERS has them talking a lot and then being whipped by ninjas). Out of the pair he's a better choice for something like this.


comics SHOULD have honest to goodness superheroics and ZERO decompressed storytelling

[PWN3R]

Cap leading Alpha Flight?!?!

[Darthphere]

Cap leading Alpha Flight?!?!


I doubt it. Certain person doesnt cut and run.

[PWN3R]

Yeah that doesn't sound right.

[Not Jake]

that would be awesome:o

Okay, I'm done with reading spoilers.

[PWN3R]

that would be awesome:o

Okay, I'm done with reading spoilers.

Yeah it would be I think. But his name says why it wouldn't work...;)

[Darthphere]

Yeah it would be I think. But his name says why it wouldn't work...;)


The letter doesnt stand for France....I just gave it away.:(

[PWN3R]

Yup you so did.

It could be cool, they might have to get a new temp name then though huh?

:eek: :(

[Not Jake]

not for france, and not for france jr:(

[Not Jake]

Yup you so did.

It could be cool, they might have to get a new temp name then though huh?

:eek: :(
they're fleeing the alpha country...alpha flight:)

[hippie_hunter]

not for france, and not for france jr:(

Quebec :confused:

[PWN3R]

So Cap is leading a bunch of heros from America on the new Alpha Flight. Any guess on who hes leading?


If that spoiler is not true, then grrr.

[Darthphere]

I cant see it, its way too out of character for *ahem*.

[PWN3R]

Yeah but you've seen the pics of *ahem* in the previews. They don't look happy.

I think CW will bring everyone out of character. Which has potential of being a really good story. But yeah could be really bad...

[Not Jake]

Quebec :confused:
yes quebec. SIGH.

[Not Jake]

I cant see it, its way too out of character for *ahem*.
not if the dream is dying. the baseball and apple pie dream.

[PWN3R]

Yeah but the baseball and applie pie dream is why he exists.

Thank GOD Bendis isn't writing...

[Not Jake]

well if the baseball and apple pie dream is why he exists, and then it starts fading away, he's gonna do anything necessary to bring it back. including what he's rumored to be doing:up:

[PWN3R]

I like the idea. Can't wait to see the art, if its true. :eek:

[iloveclones]

And leading the team? Captain America, obviously.

That could be seriously interesting. I wonder who else would go with him(Spidey, Hawkeye, DD, She-Hulk), and who's writing this. This actually gives an opportunity for something I posited before: I would love for them to switch Wolverine out for Cyclops in NA. I think it would be interesting to see how he copes with leadership outside the mansion.

[PWN3R]

Millar is writing Civil War.


And I think your team members are good cept for DD. Specially after DD#83, I think he will be the one to willingly reveal himself. What has he got left???

[iloveclones]

I didn't mean who is writing CW, I meant who is writing this incarnation of Alpha Flight.
It wasn't really a team, just ones that I thought would make an interesting dynamic. As far as DD goes, keep in mind that >ahem<'s identity is also known. I'd imagine (if this isn't a late AFD joke) that he'd be doing it out of principle.

[PWN3R]

But *Ahems* identity is different. Its been known. DD's is secret. I dunno thats just my opion.

An 'out of principle' thing sound right for *ahem* lol.

You got a point.

[Darthphere]

But *Ahems* identity is different. Its been known. DD's is secret. I dunno thats just my opion.

An 'out of principle' thing sound right for *ahem* lol.

You got a point.


What if *ahem* is actually John Walker

[iloveclones]

Good call, but not as interesting, imo.

[Darthphere]

Good call, but not as interesting, imo.


You never know, whens the last time we saw him? He could be the ultimate wild card.

[PWN3R]

Interesting thought Darthphere.

But I don't like his shield so no. :p

[iloveclones]

You never know, whens the last time we saw him? He could be the ultimate wild card.

Oh, I definately think it would be interesting to see him again, but if you're going to do something like this, go full out, and do it with the real deal. Maybe John Walker could take his place in NA and shake things up there.

[PWN3R]

^^I would finally buy NA if that happens.

[supermarvelman]

I would love to see Cyclops be part of the New Avengers.

[PWN3R]

It would be way better than Logan. :(

[supermarvelman]

Way Better

I'd love to see him and Cap America as co-leaders.

They should also put Beast back on the team.

[Dread]

So the new Alpha Flight may be made up of American heroes who've fled and Cap may become its leader? My concern about this is that if Millar tries to write this like he writes ULTIMATES 2, than the politics will more than outweigh the rest of the plot, which would not be good. This is reminding me of all those people who vowed they'd move to Canada if Bush was re-elected. Any of them actually do it? I don't think so. But Millar writes from a very extreme viewpoint (as in, I doubt even most Liberals would blame America for ALL the problems of, say, Communist and Post-Communist Russia and China like he seems to do in ULTIMATES 2).

This is the major downside of Millar. While he often offers MUCH more action and MUCH more exciting build-up for superhero comics than Bendis does (just read some of his ULTIMATES and ULTIMATE X-MEN or ULTIMATE FANTASTIC FOUR work to see), but if he pigeonholes the story too firmly in political mire, the work will suffer for it. He's much better when he is more subtle with things like he is in ULTIMATE FANTASTIC FOUR, which I currently enjoy more than ULTIMATES 2, if only because it doesn't make me want commit suicide for all the "original sin" I must bare as an American.

However, this is a major Marvel event and while Millar is one of the handful of Marvel writes, Bendis included, who Marvel would give cart blanche to do anything to any book so long as they got sales for it in return, it is also a group process. WIZARD #175 had an article about a group planning session that included not only Millar and Bendis, but Jeph Loeb, Brubaker, Joe Q and Joss Whedon (and likely other editors) in helping to plan out the story and aftermath of CIVIL WAR. They even took a vote regarding certain processes. So, this story by definition can't be 100% Millar because I am sure there are bits he didn't plan and is following from others. On the flipside, if CW turns out to be disappointing, it may be unfair that Millar will get the brunt of the blame.

Perhaps the most noticable thing about said interview (and you can read it yourself in WIZARD #175) was that Bendis seems to consistantly use Loeb's experience at DC as a way of agruing down his points: "This isn't the DC Universe, Marvel works differently". While Bendis is right about that (Marvel, since WW2, has ALWAYS used current political points for story ideas, so CW using current bits is really nothing new; heck, the Silver Age was full of Cold War relevant stuff), there are things that DC does right, and I hope that in trying to remain seperate from the "Distinguished Competition" that Marvel doesn't remain closed-minded about learning some things. It would be the supreme irony if Marvel, a company whose comics often ridicule the "isolationist, close-minded workings, go-it-alone-cowboy tactics" of the Bush administration, in practice does the EXACT SAME THING, only naturally on a smaller scale. There is a lot to be learned from DC right now, and there is a lot about comics they do right without having to forever rely on some political setting. Marvel is all about injecting realism into comics, but too much can be a bad thing. These are stories about men being bitten by radioactive spiders, after all. The audience expects some fantastic stuff. But the audience also expects to be inspired. Remember, in REAL LIFE, even the most dire situations can inspire professional helpers like cops, fire-fighters, EMS workers, and even ordinary people to become heroes.

Superheroes are already heroes. The audience wants to see them eventually rise up, and do it in a satisfying, inspirational way. This is hardly an easy job, but why should writing comics be considered easy? No, it's an art like anything else to do it right.

There's a lot to like about CW right now, but unfortunately that also means that Marvel has more to lose if they screw this up, and they have more of a risk of painting themselves into some deep, deep corners as they race to maintain sales and "light up the internet". Even Loeb admitted in that session that, "The worst thing you could do is have everyone like it". I do have faith that even at his worst, Millar will make each issue exciting to read (the first 6 pages of the New Warriors got my blood rushing), but like I have been saying all along, this time because Marvel seems to be getting so much right, they also risk having something to lose, risk repeating their recent history of miscalculations. Once upon a time, they were treating Morrison's 40 issue run on X-MEN as permenant canon, and now most of that may as well have been a WHAT IF. Even if you disliked Morrison's run, seeing Marvel tuck their tail between their legs and retcon whenever the going gets tough, year after year, gets embarassing and leads to apathy.

So, please, Marvel, don't screw this up, and don't be so quick to "change" your cast of great characters that you alter them from what made them great in the first place. Every time that has happened, the ramifications have usually spoken for themselves.

[stillanerd]

So the new Alpha Flight may be made up of American heroes who've fled and Cap may become its leader? My concern about this is that if Millar tries to write this like he writes ULTIMATES 2, than the politics will more than outweigh the rest of the plot, which would not be good. This is reminding me of all those people who vowed they'd move to Canada if Bush was re-elected. Any of them actually do it? I don't think so. But Millar writes from a very extreme viewpoint (as in, I doubt even most Liberals would blame America for ALL the problems of, say, Communist and Post-Communist Russia and China like he seems to do in ULTIMATES 2).

This is the major downside of Millar. While he often offers MUCH more action and MUCH more exciting build-up for superhero comics than Bendis does (just read some of his ULTIMATES and ULTIMATE X-MEN or ULTIMATE FANTASTIC FOUR work to see), but if he pigeonholes the story too firmly in political mire, the work will suffer for it. He's much better when he is more subtle with things like he is in ULTIMATE FANTASTIC FOUR, which I currently enjoy more than ULTIMATES 2, if only because it doesn't make me want commit suicide for all the "original sin" I must bare as an American.

However, this is a major Marvel event and while Millar is one of the handful of Marvel writes, Bendis included, who Marvel would give cart blanche to do anything to any book so long as they got sales for it in return, it is also a group process. WIZARD #175 had an article about a group planning session that included not only Millar and Bendis, but Jeph Loeb, Brubaker, Joe Q and Joss Whedon (and likely other editors) in helping to plan out the story and aftermath of CIVIL WAR. They even took a vote regarding certain processes. So, this story by definition can't be 100% Millar because I am sure there are bits he didn't plan and is following from others. On the flipside, if CW turns out to be disappointing, it may be unfair that Millar will get the brunt of the blame.

Perhaps the most noticable thing about said interview (and you can read it yourself in WIZARD #175) was that Bendis seems to consistantly use Loeb's experience at DC as a way of agruing down his points: "This isn't the DC Universe, Marvel works differently". While Bendis is right about that (Marvel, since WW2, has ALWAYS used current political points for story ideas, so CW using current bits is really nothing new; heck, the Silver Age was full of Cold War relevant stuff), there are things that DC does right, and I hope that in trying to remain seperate from the "Distinguished Competition" that Marvel doesn't remain closed-minded about learning some things. It would be the supreme irony if Marvel, a company whose comics often ridicule the "isolationist, close-minded workings, go-it-alone-cowboy tactics" of the Bush administration, in practice does the EXACT SAME THING, only naturally on a smaller scale. There is a lot to be learned from DC right now, and there is a lot about comics they do right without having to forever rely on some political setting. Marvel is all about injecting realism into comics, but too much can be a bad thing. These are stories about men being bitten by radioactive spiders, after all. The audience expects some fantastic stuff. But the audience also expects to be inspired. Remember, in REAL LIFE, even the most dire situations can inspire professional helpers like cops, fire-fighters, EMS workers, and even ordinary people to become heroes.

Superheroes are already heroes. The audience wants to see them eventually rise up, and do it in a satisfying, inspirational way. This is hardly an easy job, but why should writing comics be considered easy? No, it's an art like anything else to do it right.

There's a lot to like about CW right now, but unfortunately that also means that Marvel has more to lose if they screw this up, and they have more of a risk of painting themselves into some deep, deep corners as they race to maintain sales and "light up the internet". Even Loeb admitted in that session that, "The worst thing you could do is have everyone like it". I do have faith that even at his worst, Millar will make each issue exciting to read (the first 6 pages of the New Warriors got my blood rushing), but like I have been saying all along, this time because Marvel seems to be getting so much right, they also risk having something to lose, risk repeating their recent history of miscalculations. Once upon a time, they were treating Morrison's 40 issue run on X-MEN as permenant canon, and now most of that may as well have been a WHAT IF. Even if you disliked Morrison's run, seeing Marvel tuck their tail between their legs and retcon whenever the going gets tough, year after year, gets embarassing and leads to apathy.

So, please, Marvel, don't screw this up, and don't be so quick to "change" your cast of great characters that you alter them from what made them great in the first place. Every time that has happened, the ramifications have usually spoken for themselves.

Excellent post:up:

A couple of points if this rumor is indeed true:

1. Essentially, what Marvel would be doing is changing Alpha Flight from a group of Canadian superheroes into a group of Avengers in exile and calling it Alpha Flight. And I’m sorry, but just because you call a group Alpha Flight doesn’t mean it IS Alpha Flight.

2. As another poster mentioned, Captain America is supposed to represent the United States of America and ideals that country was founded on. Even when the US went to hell in a hand-basket and he became Nomad and the Captain, he not only stayed true to representing the ideals of the United States, but he never abandoned the country, choosing instead to stay and fight for the spirit and idea of America. Except of course the "Man Without a Country" mini.

3. Wouldn’t Canadians be a little upset in that a superhero group which is based in Canada, possibly comprised of Canadians, is lead by a guy who essentially wears the flag of another country? I would think their reaction would be “Who the hell do you think you are? You’re leading a group based in Canada yet you still wear your country’s flag? You complain that your home country is imposing it’s will onto you, denying you liberty, but who gave you the right to impose your values on us? It’s bad enough your country exported it’s culture onto us, so much so that we barely have a national identity anymore, that you treat it as though we we’re your 51st state. Now you want us to except you? We’re not a bunch Yanks, we’re Canadians!” Could be an interesting subplot, though.

4. If this doesn’t convince anybody that Marvel is totally stacking the deck in favor of the anti-registration side, nothing will.

[CaptainStacy]

I doubt it. Certain person doesnt cut and run.

No, but he might be arrested and exiled.

[IronSpidy]

Found this... http://www.marvel.com/news/comicstories.318
For some reason the pic with all the Marvel characters wont become bigger can some one post a big pic of it.

[PWN3R]

Dread, your posts are always freakin awesome.

[PWN3R]

http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/3416/1268full37598860lr.jpg

Ghost Rider, MK, Hercules, Punisher, Nova....good to see them in Civil War.

I just got a lil more excited.

[IronSpidy]

How the hell did you do that? Your the MAN!!

[PWN3R]

How the hell did you do that? Your the MAN!!

Magic...:ghost:

[IronSpidy]

Ok, lol. Who is that green guy next to Hulk? I'm glad Moon Knight is in the Civil War!

[supermarvelman]

Radioactive man (R-Man) from the Thunderbolts, very good comic book right now.

[supermarvelman]

Hulk, Silver Surfer, Nova. They seems out of place since Hulk is in Planet Hulk, and Nova is involved in Annhilation, and SS is involved in both.

Looks like Speedball, Namorita, and Microbe survive. Possibly

Looks like Gaurdian and Sasquatch survive also.

[IronSpidy]

Yes, true that does seem odd....Hmmm time will tell.

[UK_Stu]

So the new Alpha Flight may be made up of American heroes who've fled and Cap may become its leader? My concern about this is that if Millar tries to write this like he writes ULTIMATES 2, than the politics will more than outweigh the rest of the plot, which would not be good. This is reminding me of all those people who vowed they'd move to Canada if Bush was re-elected. Any of them actually do it? I don't think so. But Millar writes from a very extreme viewpoint (as in, I doubt even most Liberals would blame America for ALL the problems of, say, Communist and Post-Communist Russia and China like he seems to do in ULTIMATES 2).

This is the major downside of Millar. While he often offers MUCH more action and MUCH more exciting build-up for superhero comics than Bendis does (just read some of his ULTIMATES and ULTIMATE X-MEN or ULTIMATE FANTASTIC FOUR work to see), but if he pigeonholes the story too firmly in political mire, the work will suffer for it. He's much better when he is more subtle with things like he is in ULTIMATE FANTASTIC FOUR, which I currently enjoy more than ULTIMATES 2, if only because it doesn't make me want commit suicide for all the "original sin" I must bare as an American.

However, this is a major Marvel event and while Millar is one of the handful of Marvel writes, Bendis included, who Marvel would give cart blanche to do anything to any book so long as they got sales for it in return, it is also a group process. WIZARD #175 had an article about a group planning session that included not only Millar and Bendis, but Jeph Loeb, Brubaker, Joe Q and Joss Whedon (and likely other editors) in helping to plan out the story and aftermath of CIVIL WAR. They even took a vote regarding certain processes. So, this story by definition can't be 100% Millar because I am sure there are bits he didn't plan and is following from others. On the flipside, if CW turns out to be disappointing, it may be unfair that Millar will get the brunt of the blame.

Perhaps the most noticable thing about said interview (and you can read it yourself in WIZARD #175) was that Bendis seems to consistantly use Loeb's experience at DC as a way of agruing down his points: "This isn't the DC Universe, Marvel works differently". While Bendis is right about that (Marvel, since WW2, has ALWAYS used current political points for story ideas, so CW using current bits is really nothing new; heck, the Silver Age was full of Cold War relevant stuff), there are things that DC does right, and I hope that in trying to remain seperate from the "Distinguished Competition" that Marvel doesn't remain closed-minded about learning some things. It would be the supreme irony if Marvel, a company whose comics often ridicule the "isolationist, close-minded workings, go-it-alone-cowboy tactics" of the Bush administration, in practice does the EXACT SAME THING, only naturally on a smaller scale. There is a lot to be learned from DC right now, and there is a lot about comics they do right without having to forever rely on some political setting. Marvel is all about injecting realism into comics, but too much can be a bad thing. These are stories about men being bitten by radioactive spiders, after all. The audience expects some fantastic stuff. But the audience also expects to be inspired. Remember, in REAL LIFE, even the most dire situations can inspire professional helpers like cops, fire-fighters, EMS workers, and even ordinary people to become heroes.

Superheroes are already heroes. The audience wants to see them eventually rise up, and do it in a satisfying, inspirational way. This is hardly an easy job, but why should writing comics be considered easy? No, it's an art like anything else to do it right.

There's a lot to like about CW right now, but unfortunately that also means that Marvel has more to lose if they screw this up, and they have more of a risk of painting themselves into some deep, deep corners as they race to maintain sales and "light up the internet". Even Loeb admitted in that session that, "The worst thing you could do is have everyone like it". I do have faith that even at his worst, Millar will make each issue exciting to read (the first 6 pages of the New Warriors got my blood rushing), but like I have been saying all along, this time because Marvel seems to be getting so much right, they also risk having something to lose, risk repeating their recent history of miscalculations. Once upon a time, they were treating Morrison's 40 issue run on X-MEN as permenant canon, and now most of that may as well have been a WHAT IF. Even if you disliked Morrison's run, seeing Marvel tuck their tail between their legs and retcon whenever the going gets tough, year after year, gets embarassing and leads to apathy.

So, please, Marvel, don't screw this up, and don't be so quick to "change" your cast of great characters that you alter them from what made them great in the first place. Every time that has happened, the ramifications have usually spoken for themselves.

Good post here Dread, as have been most of your posts on this thread. I particularly enjoyed your review of theNA: Illuminati.

I hope that Millar doesn't try and make this too political as well, but have a feeling it will be - Millar can be very left-wing in his political beliefs and it shows.

My main point though is the Alpha Flight issue. I like the idea that US heroes might flee the USA to avoid the registration act, and though the Canadians might hate it, it would make a lot of sense the heroes leaving for Canada. What is the point of taking te name Alpha Flight though, why not just take another name? (like the Thunderbolts did).

Plus does this mean we can expect more US heroes to move to other countires? Possibly Europe or the Far East too?

[XwolverineX]

So yer all thinkin' Alpha Flight is goin' to be an american super-hero team now?:confused:


But, JQ said in his latest Joe Friday that Canada will be gettin' it's own superheroes pretty soon, when asked about Alpha Flight. So that would mean that if it were americans, you'd all be correct and it would be Americans headin' north. An' that would suck, I want real Canadians!

[3dman27]

So yer all thinkin' Alpha Flight is goin' to be an american super-hero team now?:confused:


But, JQ said in his latest Joe Friday that Canada will be gettin' it's own superheroes pretty soon, when asked about Alpha Flight.
i wonder if the k'un l'un kid will be among them:spidey:

[UK_Stu]

So yer all thinkin' Alpha Flight is goin' to be an american super-hero team now?:confused:


But, JQ said in his latest Joe Friday that Canada will be gettin' it's own superheroes pretty soon, when asked about Alpha Flight. So that would mean that if it were americans, you'd all be correct and it would be Americans headin' north. An' that would suck, I want real Canadians!


Thats exactly it.

As I said the idea of a group of exiled US heroes moving to another country is an interesting idea, but why would a group like that take the name of a previous group of Canadian only heroes?


Hope this doesn't lead to some kind of US vs Other Countries type of battle, as seen in Millars - Ultimates 2

[XwolverineX]

Thats exactly it.

As I said the idea of a group of exiled US heroes moving to another country is an interesting idea, but why would a group like that take the name of a previous group of Canadian only heroes?


Hope this doesn't lead to some kind of US vs Other Countries type of battle, as seen in Millars - Ultimates 2


U.S Vs. Canada... I think we would put up a good fight.. LOL!! :down


Yeah, Canada sucks.... :(:down

[3dman27]

Thats exactly it.

As I said the idea of a group of exiled US heroes moving to another country is an interesting idea, but why would a group like that take the name of a previous group of Canadian only heroes?


Hope this doesn't lead to some kind of US vs Other Countries type of battle, as seen in Millars - Ultimates 2i think thats the idea, marvel did say it wanted to make the 616&ultimate worlds more alike THIS may be how they do it:spidey:

[Harlekin]

http://images.comicbookresources.com/previews/marvelcomics/amazingspiderman/531/ASM531_lCOV_col.jpg
Although I'm probably giving the credit where it isn't due:
The two sides of Civil War are portrayed here (Iron Man | Captain America), with Spidey in the middle, but another interesting piece is that Iron Man is out of costume and being Tony Stark. Captain America on the other hand is fully dressed in his outfit, and Spidey being the middle road.

Tony Stark = Secret identity (officially), pro registration
Captain America = No secret identity, anti registration.

That's probably not intended tho.

[IronSpidy]

Good point....I just noticed that Spideys is in his classics duds. Why is that?

[Harlekin]

Uhm... he isn't. He's wearing his Iron Spidey outfit.

[IronSpidy]

No, is the pic with all the Marvel characters.

[XwolverineX]

Good point....I just noticed that Spideys is in his classics duds. Why is that?


HUH? :confused:

[3dman27]

as was mentioned before spidey is arrested during the course of the CIVIL WAR so maybe the feds confiscated the IRON SPIDEY suit citing national security to mass reprduce it and the powers it gives and assign them to the armored guardsmen project

[Harlekin]

No, is the pic with all the Marvel characters.
They didn't want to spoil it yet. That image is quite old by now.

[IronSpidy]

They didn't want to spoil it yet. That image is quite old by now.Is that soo? Hopefully your right.:spidey:

[Harlekin]

Is that soo? Hopefully your right.:spidey:
I am right.

[IronSpidy]

So let me get this clear. The civil war lasts 6 monthes?

[BrianWilly]

I can totally see Captain America defecting to Canada to lead a group of heroes there. In a lot of people's eyes, and most definitely in Miller's, there's absolutely nothing as Patriotic and as American as dissent. And having written Captain America as one political extreme in the Ultimate universe, this may be Miller pointedly placing him at the other end of the spectrum.

I'm finding this interesting. It's been pretty obvious from the outset that Captain America was going to be Iron Man's main opponent on this issue, even going as far as to go against the government's decisions, but for him to purposefully abandon his own country for another is a whole other issue, and has a lot of potential (there is, however, the question of why in the world he hadn't taken such drastic measures when the government started registering mutants). Good, progressive characterization comes from finding that balanced area between what's so in-character that it's utterly boring, and what's so out-of-character that it's like a different character completely.

Every character, yours or not, new or very old, has a list of rules. You always know which ones not to break. For example, Gwen Stacy would never have sex with Norman Osborn and give birth to super-powered twins (Obviously). But the fun is always examining the rules and seeing which ones will bend, because that’s where the character’s true dimensions lie.

It's important to remember, though, that just because Marvel hints that Civil War is a shared group effort between writers doesn't mean that Civil War is actually a shared group effort between writers. Last time around, Bendis bragged in an interview that he was working with Whedon to bring House of M to play, and after the fact Whedon said in another interview that communication between him and Bendis at the time was pretty scant.

[chris moore]

http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/3416/1268full37598860lr.jpg

Ghost Rider, MK, Hercules, Punisher, Nova....good to see them in Civil War.

I just got a lil more excited.

Nova's not in Civil War - cos he left NW at the end of the first "season" to go to space, where he is now embroiled in the Annihalation saga.

This picture isnt anything to go by - nor are any of the others they've released as some show Iron-Man and Mr Fantastic on opposing sides, some show Spidey with Cap, others with Tony. That and Tony's statement to the illuminati that they should abide by the act, then goes and argues against it in Congress make things very confusing.

[IronSpidy]

Is it just me or do Silver Surfer and Iceman have the same head. Chris are you saying some of thease characters might notbe involved with Civil War?

[Elijya]

Silver Surfer, Nova and Hulk are all off planet, so I'd say they're probably not involved. And I doubt Punisher or Ghost Rider will be involved either, they don't usually interact with the rest of the Marvel universe, and Punisher isn't superpowered anyway

...unless he sees non-registered heroes as criminals and goes after them. That might be interesting...

[IronSpidy]

Thats a shame but I really like Hulks current storey..

[chris moore]

Hercules is currently involved in the Ares book - so he's probably a bit more concerned with the downfall of Olympus than he is a government act of a country he is neither a citizen of, or on the same plane as.

Punisher, as Elijya said wont be involved - he's a hunted criminal already. As is deadpool. All kinds wont be in it. Even though they've said everyone will appear (or something like that).

[Norman Osborn]

Punisher, as Elijya said wont be involved - he's a hunted criminal already. As is deadpool. All kinds wont be in it. Even though they've said everyone will appear (or something like that).

If Punisher's not involved, why is Punisher War Journal 1-3 on the "Civil War Check List?.....I don't think it's a spoiler but why risk it :)

[Elijya]

oh, that's a sucky way to start off that title....

[DBM]

oh, that's a sucky way to start off that title....

In this case, I think it might be good. This new War Journal series is supposed to be the one where Punisher interacts with the rest of the Marvel Universe more. By starting off during Civil War, they'll accomplish this right away.

[supermarvelman]

Punisher has been confirmed to be part of CW, its like his return to mainstream marvel comics.

[NateGray]

thats fine if it doesnt last but I'm glad things are changing, I know so many people who havent read a FF comic in years cause its the same **** over and over.
How many people in the marvel universe have some kind of flame based powers, there a dime a dozen.
How many telekinetic/Jedi types are there in the marvel universe
Shake things up

You know if you say knew any Marvel history you would know they loose tons of people when they kill off important hero's fans like.

So your shake things up comment is craptastic ask anyone how well that hero's reborn did or how well any of there other shake things up crap did.

Yep they did sooo frackin frellin goraim terrible they end up going back to what it was before there craptastic shakeup.

Now I am all for CW and hope it does well but killing off two FF members is just crap and me like many more people will unsubscribe and I am willing to bet they well end up reversing it.
Then bringing them back due to lacklsuter numbers because people like you who do not care for the history of there hero's and are ok with just killing them off are far out numbered by people who do not want to see there favorite hero's killed off for stupid reasons like this.:mad:

[Harlekin]

Actually Heroes Reborn did great... in the beginning anyway.

[Darthphere]

Actually Heroes Reborn did great... in the beginning anyway.


The Tortoise and the Hare.:(

[NateGray]

Actually Heroes Reborn did great... in the beginning anyway.

I know for the first month or two then bam.
I have them all.
Sorry it just got under my skin that he admits to being new and doesn't mind killing off established hero's because he is not that attached to them.
Not caring that many people are attached to the FF as a team of four family members.

Again I read Avengers Illuminiti and thought it was a decent story as well as FF 536 and Spidey 529 and am ok with change it would just be nice if it didn't seem forced and poorly thought out.
At least IMO but we will see JQ did say the FF deaths would not be related to CW.
I subscribe to about 20 marvel titles a month and about 10 DC and enjoy them very much I am hoping they do not shake me right out of being a fan of Marvel after all these years.

[Zaptoitnow]

I want to know how the two members will die, but it will not affect CW, like JoeQ sai din Joe Fridays.

[Dread]

Going to try to reply to many posts at once. May Heaven help me. ;)
Excellent post:up:

A couple of points if this rumor is indeed true:

1. Essentially, what Marvel would be doing is changing Alpha Flight from a group of Canadian superheroes into a group of Avengers in exile and calling it Alpha Flight. And I’m sorry, but just because you call a group Alpha Flight doesn’t mean it IS Alpha Flight.

2. As another poster mentioned, Captain America is supposed to represent the United States of America and ideals that country was founded on. Even when the US went to hell in a hand-basket and he became Nomad and the Captain, he not only stayed true to representing the ideals of the United States, but he never abandoned the country, choosing instead to stay and fight for the spirit and idea of America. Except of course the "Man Without a Country" mini.

3. Wouldn’t Canadians be a little upset in that a superhero group which is based in Canada, possibly comprised of Canadians, is lead by a guy who essentially wears the flag of another country? I would think their reaction would be “Who the hell do you think you are? You’re leading a group based in Canada yet you still wear your country’s flag? You complain that your home country is imposing it’s will onto you, denying you liberty, but who gave you the right to impose your values on us? It’s bad enough your country exported it’s culture onto us, so much so that we barely have a national identity anymore, that you treat it as though we we’re your 51st state. Now you want us to except you? We’re not a bunch Yanks, we’re Canadians!” Could be an interesting subplot, though.

4. If this doesn’t convince anybody that Marvel is totally stacking the deck in favor of the anti-registration side, nothing will.
Thanks! Now I'll answer using your handy number system:

1. A fair point; to many fans, simply calling the team that Bendis has assembled "The New Avengers" doesn't exactly mean they are the Avengers. Of course, they have Cap, Iron Man, Stark-funded duds and rides, and they've announced their roster to the public (sort of; Wolverine sat it out, Sentry has yet to really be a team player and Ronin was an overglorified guest-star for an arc). Alpha Flight are supposed to be officially sanctioned by the government of Canada (barring storyline purposed of course), so in the literal sense you are right. Sort of like if a team of heroes moved to Britain and called themselves THE SECRET SERVICE, it would not mean they are the same as the actual Secret Service or affiliated officially with Great Britain legally (as, say, Union Jack is).

2. Capt. America, as you have stated, has at times disagreed with the course of the nation and adopted alternate identities. But that is not the same as defecting to another nation and possibly wearing ITS flag instead, even if said nation is an "ally" of the U.S., as Canada is. On the other hand, could Marvel actually be clever? More than one man has been Capt. America; it hasn't always been Steve Rogers. Could the Cap that possibly leads a rogue "Alpha Flight" actually be someone else?

3. I would agree that the Canadians likely would not be too fond of it realistically, which could make the team fugatives there, too. Or, Canada could be in support of anti-registration (which would be VERY hypocritical since Alpha Flight has almost always been affiliated with Dept. H and the Canadian Government) and accept them as political exiles. It depends on how far from reality Millar & Marvel want to take it. For all we know the Canadian gov't may not approve, but the citizens may be enthused to have some popular "Yank" heroes showing up for a bit. I doubt Americans couldn't have been the only people laughing at Puck. :p

Good post here Dread, as have been most of your posts on this thread. I particularly enjoyed your review of theNA: Illuminati.

I hope that Millar doesn't try and make this too political as well, but have a feeling it will be - Millar can be very left-wing in his political beliefs and it shows.

My main point though is the Alpha Flight issue. I like the idea that US heroes might flee the USA to avoid the registration act, and though the Canadians might hate it, it would make a lot of sense the heroes leaving for Canada. What is the point of taking te name Alpha Flight though, why not just take another name? (like the Thunderbolts did).

Plus does this mean we can expect more US heroes to move to other countires? Possibly Europe or the Far East too?
Another thanks for kind words!

The reason that team that assembles north of the border takes on the name is dependant on the story. Maybe they somehow become legal Canadian citizens (especially since Canada may be overeager to replace their now-dead team)? Maybe it is done out of honor of that fallen team? Maybe it is done so Millar can push for "shocking"? Or perhaps to launch a new title?

I doubt all of Marvel's heroes will flee for long, if only because that would require writers to actually research other areas. This is a company that fears having any cast take place anywhere aside for NYC or LA, which is conviently where most writers live, so I doubt the MU is splitting to Armenia or Italy for long spells. And of course, to be fair, many NY heroes have jets or means of transportation to arrive at alternate places anyway.

I can totally see Captain America defecting to Canada to lead a group of heroes there. In a lot of people's eyes, and most definitely in Miller's, there's absolutely nothing as Patriotic and as American as dissent. And having written Captain America as one political extreme in the Ultimate universe, this may be Miller pointedly placing him at the other end of the spectrum.

I'm finding this interesting. It's been pretty obvious from the outset that Captain America was going to be Iron Man's main opponent on this issue, even going as far as to go against the government's decisions, but for him to purposefully abandon his own country for another is a whole other issue, and has a lot of potential (there is, however, the question of why in the world he hadn't taken such drastic measures when the government started registering mutants). Good, progressive characterization comes from finding that balanced area between what's so in-character that it's utterly boring, and what's so out-of-character that it's like a different character completely.



It's important to remember, though, that just because Marvel hints that Civil War is a shared group effort between writers doesn't mean that Civil War is actually a shared group effort between writers. Last time around, Bendis bragged in an interview that he was working with Whedon to bring House of M to play, and after the fact Whedon said in another interview that communication between him and Bendis at the time was pretty scant.
Very true; at least from how Millar writes ULTIMATES 2, the most evil people are those who are completely patriotic and loyal to their government, perhaps to the point where they see that it has no flaws (although this vital bit is rarely shown; usually it comes down to American soldiers just acting thuggish and Left-Wing plot points; Millar sometimes has issues depicting characters outside a very extreme point view). Everyone has a right to criticize and disagree with their country in a democracy, but there is a difference between disagreeing and outright DEFECTING, as a Cap in Alpha Flight may be doing. Of course, it could simply be a super-protest; "My god, if even Capt. America has lost his faith in America because of this, then maybe Registration isn't so hot after all!" I mean, Cap is pretty much the only hero (aside for maybe Iron Man) who could run for election and without using some form of mind control, probably win (of course then he would become EX MACHINA, which may be a good plot point for him, at least for a year or so).

As for why Cap hasn't taken such drastic measures for mutants (as a registration act for mutants has been a longtime plot point for X-books and even cartoons), you could say that for most MU. Aside for letting a few token mutants join the Avengers or shaking their hands after a team-up, popular, "official" heroes like Avengers and Fantastic Four have done very little to help out the mutant cause, at least on panel, despite the fact that the X-Men have been heavilly involved in hero affairs for years, and most heroes would disagree with mutant-phobia. But, if Marvel wanted their mutant status quo to evolve, they wouldn't have retconned away Morrison's 40 issues of X-MEN so earnestly, now would they? The X-books need that niche, which is why Cap and most other heroes barely lift a finger to help them long-term. I remember Whedon has Cyclops give his "takes" on several figures in a WIZARD article revolving around SECRET WAR/HOM/DISASSEMBLED and it indicated that Cyke has great mistrust for Cap and Iron Man, and rightly so. I thought it was a brilliant POV from Whedon.

With that all said, perhaps this "superhero registration" thing may bring this point to a head; maybe now that the heroes are in the same boat as the mutants, they'll mobilize formally. Maybe some mutants may refuse, going, "oh, NOW you guys want to seriously help us? You're just hypocrites!"

While I fear for the aftermath and ramifications for CIVIL WAR, especially given Marvel's historical inability to remain focused on one agenda for long enough to get it done right (yet another criticism of the Bush administration that, ironically, Marvel practices with their own policies), I admit easily that this story has the potential for a lot of relevent discussions and plot points, and story twists. If Millar is not too extreme, is on the top of his game, then he can combine both honest debate AND the sort of pulse-pounding action as seen in the first 6 pages with NEW WARRIORS (even if the dialogue all sounds sarcastic).

I know WIZARD has become nothing more than a cheerleader for the Big Two, I do get the sense that perhaps Marvel is trying to get more cohesion going as this is supposed to be a bigger event than HOM was. HOM sounded half-arsed and so I had little faith or expectations in it, and was not disappointed (my low expections were, sadly, met to the letter). This time, the expectations are high because the story has promise. Millar may do the issue by issue writing alone, but I do have a sense that the core plotlines likely involved some imput from others like Bendis, Loeb, Brubaker, etc.

That middleground between character growth and character assassination that Whedon describes, of course, is a tightrope that not every writer can achieve for every character. Hence, all the worries.

[GNR]

I cannot wait to start buying a Punisher book where he goes around killing super villains.August can't come any sooner.

Brevoort mentioned over at CBR about Punisher playing a radical role in CW.

[Darthphere]

I cannot wait to start buying a Punisher book where he goes around killing super villains.August can't come any sooner.

Brevoort mentioned over at CBR about Punisher playing a radical role in CW.


I thought he said tubular?:confused:

[GNR]

I think the Alpha Flight thing,if true,would be a good shake up and who better at shake ups than Millar?If Millar is writing this,I could see Hitchy drawing as well.Hitch already said his next project is going to be with Mark.

[stillanerd]

I can totally see Captain America defecting to Canada to lead a group of heroes there. In a lot of people's eyes, and most definitely in Miller's, there's absolutely nothing as Patriotic and as American as dissent. And having written Captain America as one political extreme in the Ultimate universe, this may be Miller pointedly placing him at the other end of the spectrum.

I'm finding this interesting. It's been pretty obvious from the outset that Captain America was going to be Iron Man's main opponent on this issue, even going as far as to go against the government's decisions, but for him to purposefully abandon his own country for another is a whole other issue, and has a lot of potential (there is, however, the question of why in the world he hadn't taken such drastic measures when the government started registering mutants). Good, progressive characterization comes from finding that balanced area between what's so in-character that it's utterly boring, and what's so out-of-character that it's like a different character completely.

Character progression I'm all for, but the problem I have with the idea of Captain America forced into self-imposed exile and leading Alpha Flight (an what I argued on the CBR boards) is that Alpha Flight is closely associated with Canada as Captain America is with the United States. If Alpha Flight is still sponsored by the Canadian government and is lead by a guy who wears a variation of the Stars and Stripes, then not only would I think that would be an insult to Canadians, but to Americans as well, unless of course the government had become a totalitarian state (say like the Nazi controlled Vichi government in France during World War II) then it would be a different story. However, the implication by having Captain America be exiled in another country implies that the United States has become an oppressive regime. Now you may argue that because of the superbeing registration that--in the comic books anyway--it is--and that's because Millar/Marvel have essentially rigged it so you can't see it any other way.

Also, by Joe Q's own admission, Marvel is using Civil War to comment on comtemporary events such as 9-11, the Patriot Act, the War on Terrorism, wire-tapping, etc. By having Captain America--the symbol of the United States and what it is supposed to be--siding with the anti-registration side and then being forced into exile to Canada, Marvel is essentially saying that the United States has lost it's ideals and is therefore no better than it's enemies, which is of course is what is being bandied about by the far-left. I could be wrong but I have the feeling that Civil War is not going to be as "fair and balanced" as Marvel is trying to claim, and, if this rumor is true, then it clinches it.

http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/3416/1268full37598860lr.jpg

The way I interpret this is that those facing or turned to the right eventually are pro-registration. Those facing or turned to the left are eventually anti-registration. And those who are positioned in the middle are either M.I.A., off-world, or neutral.

[Dread]

Character progression I'm all for, but the problem I have with the idea of Captain America forced into self-imposed exile and leading Alpha Flight (an what I argued on the CBR boards) is that Alpha Flight is closely associated with Canada as Captain America is with the United States. If Alpha Flight is still sponsored by the Canadian government and is lead by a guy who wears a variation of the Stars and Stripes, then not only would I think that would be an insult to Canadians, but to Americans as well, unless of course the government had become a totalitarian state (say like the Nazi controlled Vichi government in France during World War II) then it would be a different story. However, the implication by having Captain America be exiled in another country implies that the United States has become an oppressive regime. Now you may argue that because of the superbeing registration that--in the comic books anyway--it is--and that's because Millar/Marvel have essentially rigged it so you can't see it any other way.

Also, by Joe Q's own admission, Marvel is using Civil War to comment on comtemporary events such as 9-11, the Patriot Act, the War on Terrorism, wire-tapping, etc. By having Captain America--the symbol of the United States and what it is supposed to be--siding with the anti-registration side and then being forced into exile to Canada, Marvel is essentially saying that the United States has lost it's ideals and is therefore no better than it's enemies, which is of course is what is being bandied about by the far-left. I could be wrong but I have the feeling that Civil War is not going to be as "fair and balanced" as Marvel is trying to claim, and, if this rumor is true, then it clinches it.



The way I interpret this is that those facing or turned to the right eventually are pro-registration. Those facing or turned to the left are eventually anti-registration. And those who are positioned in the middle are either M.I.A., off-world, or neutral.
Pretty good analysis.

[PWN3R]

Black Panther is looking at Spidey's butt. :(

What does that mean?

[Dread]

Black Panther is looking at Spidey's butt. :(

What does that mean?
Maybe because since Spider-Man has been gaining more "genuine spider" esque powers, he is waiting for webbing to shoot from there like a REAL spider.

C'mon! You know if it'd make ASM sell at #1 for 3 months, Marvel'd do it in a heartbeat. ;)

[PWN3R]

C'mon! You know if it'd make ASM sell at #1 for 3 months, Marvel'd do it in a heartbeat. ;)

Scary part is, you may have a point.

[PWN3R]

The way I interpret this is that those facing or turned to the right eventually are pro-registration. Those facing or turned to the left are eventually anti-registration. And those who are positioned in the middle are either M.I.A., off-world, or neutral.

Nice man, that could hold some ground.

If your right, Cykes and Xavier disagree. And Wolverine is looking neutral, and I don't want plot time on him! :mad:

And it would look like Hulk and Thing are on the same side. :D

[stillanerd]

And it would look like Hulk and Thing are on the same side. :D

Well, I admit, my theory on the picture isn't perfect, but the Thing is turned a little more to the left. Although, considering how big Thing and Hulk are respectively, and since Hulk is off-world, it would be hard to tell. :)

[PWN3R]

I put the smiley there as a jest.

Hulk is doing his thing, I know.

Its just they are in the same pose. Same as Ice and Sufer...

And I know Sufer won't be in it.

[stillanerd]

Maybe if he was on Earth he would be...Hey, I said my thoery wasn't perfect. :D

[X-Punisher]

I cannot wait to start buying a Punisher book where he goes around killing super villains.August can't come any sooner.

Brevoort mentioned over at CBR about Punisher playing a radical role in CW.


I know. Punisher is going to kick ass and take names!!!

[supermarvelman]

You know if you say knew any Marvel history you would know they loose tons of people when they kill off important hero's fans like.

So your shake things up comment is craptastic ask anyone how well that hero's reborn did or how well any of there other shake things up crap did.

Yep they did sooo frackin frellin goraim terrible they end up going back to what it was before there craptastic shakeup.

Now I am all for CW and hope it does well but killing off two FF members is just crap and me like many more people will unsubscribe and I am willing to bet they well end up reversing it.
Then bringing them back due to lacklsuter numbers because people like you who do not care for the history of there hero's and are ok with just killing them off are far out numbered by people who do not want to see there favorite hero's killed off for stupid reasons like this.:mad:

I dont care how crappy heroes reborn was, this isnt heroes reborn, Its almost certain they'll come back theres no doubt in my mind they'll come back, if you unsubscribe big whoop cause I wont and a lot of other people wont either. Your craptastic.:cyclops: Who says I dont care for the history of the characters, my opinions dont imply that in any way.:bomb:

[supermarvelman]

Hercules is currently involved in the Ares book - so he's probably a bit more concerned with the downfall of Olympus than he is a government act of a country he is neither a citizen of, or on the same plane as.

Punisher, as Elijya said wont be involved - he's a hunted criminal already. As is deadpool. All kinds wont be in it. Even though they've said everyone will appear (or something like that).


These are characters that will justify the registraion, they are straight up vigilantes.

[stillanerd]

BTW, with regards to that rumor about Captain America going off to Canada and leading Alpha Flight after Civil War, here's what Ed Brubaker had to say:


There's a reason they call them 'rumors' and this one isn't worth commenting on beyond that.

http://www.comicboards.com/camb/view.php?rpl=060404185033

Sounds like he's offically debunked it...and I couldn't be more happy.

[Union Jack]

i wonder if civil war will branch into excalibur...so captain britain gets involved.
union jack was shown too on the picture to civil war too...i'd love to see his take on things too..

[Not Jake]

that blows

[XwolverineX]

i wonder if civil war will branch into excalibur...so captain britain gets involved.
union jack was shown too on the picture to civil war too...i'd love to see his take on things too..


Isn't this takin' place in America? So I doubt it.

[Darthphere]

Isn't this takin' place in America? So I doubt it.


But Cap is leading Alpha Flight.:up:

[PWN3R]

So it was just a fanboy rumor??

I thought it would be kinda interesting.

[Union Jack]

i don't know this is a pic from civil war and you can see UJ and Cap.B in the top right hand corner...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v396/technomole/Mcnivencivilwar.jpg

[roach]

which makes about as much sense as Namor, Black panther and Black Bolt being involved in American politics

[chris moore]

How are the promises of Civil War even going to work? How can they say they make sense? Every hero who registers will be given a job in the security force S.H.I.E.L.D is making and their identity will remain a secret to the public so enemies wont be able to target their familes?

The Red Skull managed to infiltrate the Government as the freakin Secretary of Defence! And there was the high ranking guy who committed suicide before Cap got him for treason! Oh yeah - they're real good at keeping secrets as important as the identity of every superhero in America! No villain will ever be in a position to see those...

[supermarvelman]

I'm sure if the registration passes, and is somewhat succesful other countries will follow. I could see the registration effecting countries like Africa. The reason I think BB, and Namor are involved is because they where part of the Illuminati, and BP was originally supposed to be part of the Illuminati but did not like the idea of a group of Superhumans diciding the fate of the world in secret.

I think the rules of the registration would work, when they need your specific power for a specific reason/situation they would be able to call upon you, since you would be registered. Lets say a bomb was dropped, they would beable to call upon somebody like Radioactive Man or the Hulk to absorb radiation before it got to out of hand. That would've probably helped in Bludhaven when that Big Green Radioactive guy was dropped. Or when the Sentry was found, the Government would have a database of qualified people to help with that situation.

[GNR]

http://www.comicbookresources.com/news/newsitem.cgi?id=7061

[stillanerd]

“I can’t help but be affected by the world around me” said Millar when CBR News asked if this kind of book would resonate so strongly without the current political climate. The series is not meant to be a political statement, but is relevant to changes in the sociopolitical framework of the world. (http://www.superherohype.com/forums/%E2%80%9CI%20can%E2%80%99t%20help%20but%20be%20aff ected%20by%20the%20world%20around%20me%E2%80%9D%20 said%20Millar%20when%20CBR%20News%20asked%20if%20t his%20kind%20of%20book%20would%20resonate%20so%20s trongly%20without%20the%20current%20political%20cl imate.%20The%20series%20is%20not%20meant%20to%20be %20a%20political%20statement,%20but%20is%20relevan t%20to%20changes%20in%20the%20sociopolitical%20fra mework%20of%20the%20world.)

Well, if the series is supposed to be relevant to changes in the sociopolitical climate, how can you NOT make a political statement?

Captain America was initially planned to be pro-government in the series, but Marvel said that as debate went on, it didn't make sense for Captain America to support to Registration Program. (http://www.superherohype.com/forums/Captain%20America%20was%20initially%20planned%20to %20be%20pro-government%20in%20the%20series,%20but%20Marvel%20s aid%20that%20as%20debate%20went%20on,%20it%20didn% 27t%20make%20sense%20for%20Captain%20America%20to% 20support%20to%20Registration%20Program.)

I initially thought Cap was going to be pro-registration when I first heard about this--I didn't realize how close to reality that actually was.

Cap is who I want to be, but Tony is who I am: a drunk and a letch. (http://www.superherohype.com/forums/%E2%80%9CCap%20is%20who%20I%20want%20to%20be,%20bu t%20Tony%20is%20who%20I%20am:%20a%20drunk%20and%20 a%20letch.%E2%80%9D)

Classic. :up::)

[The Leaguer]

I didn't see this posted anywhere, although it may have been and I missed it, since I don't frequent the Marvel boards, but this is from today's Joe Fridays on Newsarama (http://www.newsarama.com/JoeFridays/JoeFridays45.html):

”Sharcque”: What did Black Bolt mean to say in the Illuminati Special? I mean, Iron Man says that "that's clear enough," or something like that, but it's not.

Is he saying:

1. I'm with you guys. 2. I'm against you guys. 3. I'll be watching you guys.

Or was I supposed to be unclear to us? But if it was clear to Tony, why wasn't it to us?

JQ: I believe what Black Bolt said was, “Screw you and you!”

[XwolverineX]

i don't know this is a pic from civil war and you can see UJ and Cap.B in the top right hand corner...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v396/technomole/Mcnivencivilwar.jpg



Everyone in this promo picture will NOT be in Civil War.

[Darthphere]

http://www.newsarama.com/marvelnew/CivilWar/MCW3coverfinal_100.jpg

[Speedball]

Is Speedball dead?
OR did he use his powers and negate the explosion?
if he is dead i will be very sad and my fan fic will be destroyed.:(