The Official Hype Fitness Thread

[Superman79]

Wow...I decided to work with some supersets for the next 3-4 weeks to try and chisel myself a bit and break some plateaus. I really shoulda started slow, I did everything 4x10 (back day yesterday) and wow...it kicked my ass. But it hurts so good

[jaguarr]

Wow...I decided to work with some supersets for the next 3-4 weeks to try and chisel myself a bit and break some plateaus. I really shoulda started slow, I did everything 4x10 (back day yesterday) and wow...it kicked my ass. But it hurts so good

I've been using some drop sets for the same purpose. Definitely kicking my ass. :up:

jag

[kainedamo]

I'm gonna take your advice jag and get some protein shakes. I've never had one before. They come in all sorts of flavours huh? I don't work on my arms as much as I do cardio I have to admit. I'll set out a few days a week for it.

[Super Kal]

ok, I'm doing crunches on the floor on a mat, but I still don't know how to hold a medicine ball properly while i do them...

[Super_Child]

I really don't know how im supposed to get in 6 meals a day? let alone up it to 4. Can a meal be some kind of healthy snack bar?

[Colossal Spoons]

Chest/biceps in a few hours. 100lb DBs...I'm comin!!

[Colossal Spoons]

I really don't know how im supposed to get in 6 meals a day? let alone up it to 4. Can a meal be some kind of healthy snack bar?

If you make a protein shake with some extras like oats, fruit, and PB; I'm sure that'd count as a meal replacement.

[Superman79]

Chest/biceps in a few hours. 100lb DBs...I'm comin!!


Did you get em?? Incline or flat??

[Colossal Spoons]

Nah, I decided to wait for my flat to catch up to my incline before attempting 100lbs. I'm currently doin 95lbs on both for 6-8 reps. Next week though :up:

I'll try to get my DB decline bench caught up eventually. What an awkward lift

[BeatKonducta]

Nah, I decided to wait for my flat to catch up to my incline before attempting 100lbs. I'm currently doin 95lbs on both for 6-8 reps. Next week though :up:

I'll try to get my DB decline bench caught up eventually. What an awkward lift

I upped my flat and incline db to 75lbs the other day for 6 reps. I am stoked! Next month I'll try to move up to 80lbs on both. Dont cha love progress?
:bh:

[jaguarr]

Go slow and easy with the DB presses, particularly the inclines, boys. Don't want to EFF up your rotator cuffs trying to do too much too soon. :up:

jag

[Colossal Spoons]

I upped my flat and incline db to 75lbs the other day for 6 reps. I am stoked! Next month I'll try to move up to 80lbs on both. Dont cha love progress?
:bh:

Progress is always good :D

Go slow and easy with the DB presses, particularly the inclines, boys. Don't want to EFF up your rotator cuffs trying to do too much too soon. :up:

jag

Word :up:

[BeatKonducta]

hey guys i have a question. How close of a grip do you use for close grip benches? I've seen thumb width apart and i've seen people use no space inbetween their hands. What do you guys use?

[jaguarr]

hey guys i have a question. How close of a grip do you use for close grip benches? I've seen thumb width apart and i've seen people use no space inbetween their hands. What do you guys use?

Just a little bit closer than your shoulders are wide should be fine. I never go closer than my pinkies being just inside the knurling at the center of the bar, personally. Most people try to put their grip too close together and wind up giving themselves wrist and/or shoulder problems.

jag

[Manic]

Good news, everyone! I've lost enough weight to justify buying a new belt.

[jaguarr]

Good news, everyone! I've lost enough weight to justify buying a new belt.

That's awesome, dude. Nice work! Make it a weight belt and we'll start you on your powerlifting regimen! Double win! :up:

jag

[BeatKonducta]

Just a little bit closer than your shoulders are wide should be fine. I never go closer than my pinkies being just inside the knurling at the center of the bar, personally. Most people try to put their grip too close together and wind up giving themselves wrist and/or shoulder problems.

jag

Ok that is almost the grip I use, I am slightly closer together than that. Thanks for the quick answer.

[Starbird]

May 29th I weight 194 pounds. Meals consisted of Pancakes for breakfast with Orange juice and a banana..and then fattening school food.

July 16th- weight-183 pounds. I've been eating more fruits (bananas, apples, bananas)

So I guessed that help :up:

[Colossal Spoons]

I bought some whole wheat pancakes(Aunt Jemima too :up:) last week. I just need somebody to make them for me. And not because I'm lazy, but b/c I'm absolutely HORRIBLE at flipping pancakes.


I wanna taste them :(

[AndThePickles]

I bought some whole wheat pancakes last week. I just need somebody to make them for me. And not because I'm lazy, but b/c I'm absolutely HORRIBLE at flipping pancakes.


I wanna taste them :(

Aww, I'll make them for you :heart:

[Colossal Spoons]

I need somebody in my state lol

[Starbird]

:hehe:

[AndThePickles]

I need somebody in my state lol

If you'd be patient, I'll be seeing you soon enough. Do you want those pancakes or not? :cmad: I always make you damn good pancakes, it's worth a short wait :o

[Manic]

I bought some whole wheat pancakes(Aunt Jemima too :up:) last week. I just need somebody to make them for me. And not because I'm lazy, but b/c I'm absolutely HORRIBLE at flipping pancakes.


I wanna taste them :(
Get a Perfect Pancake (http://www.perfectpancake.net/). It encloses the pancake so that when it's time to flip it over, you just flip over the whole pan. It's the only way I can make a pancake.

[Colossal Spoons]

That would probably work wonders but it looks like cheating :(

[AndThePickles]

Stop it Manic, you're messing up my usefulness :o

[Manic]

That would probably work wonders but it looks like cheating :(
I feel kinda guilty for endorsing it, really. It is cheating. Furthermore, it's a one-use item, and no one should ever have a tool in their kitchen that can only be used for one thing.
Stop it Manic, you're messing up my usefulness :o
It's okay. You can pop over and show him how it's really done.

[Mario_Galaxy]

I got my hands on ON's Double Rich Chocolate today. Man it's wonderful. :heart:

[jaguarr]

I got my hands on ON's Double Rich Chocolate today. Man it's wonderful. :heart:

That's my favorite flavor that comes in 10 lb. bags. I'm a dark chocolate fiend and that's pretty close to a dark chocolate flavor (for a protein shake, anyway). :up:

jag

[The FallenAngel]

That's the one I'm using now. Fantastic. :up:

[Colossal Spoons]

Extreme Milk Choc is the bees knees too :up:

[jaguarr]

Extreme Milk Choc is the bees knees too :up:

It is good, except it doesn't come in 10 lb. bags and I've occasionally gotten a batch of that stuff that had a weird aftertaste to it; it would seem they have some inconsistencies in their factory process on that flavor.

jag

[Colossal Spoons]

I ask for extra steroids and glutamine in mine. Really gets rid of the aftertaste :up:

[AndThePickles]

Har har

[mrvlknight21]

I think everyone on this board likes ON protein (in some flavor)...maybe we should get an endorsement deal.

[Colossal Spoons]

I keep meaning to try BSN's Syntha-6 but I always forget lol

[kainedamo]

I've only lost 1lb since last week. I'd say this is due to the fact that I did my cardio only 3 days out of the week. It has to be everyday! Every.day!!!

[mrvlknight21]

Didnt we tell you to stop weighing yourself so often kaine?

[kainedamo]

Yeah I weigh myself once a week now. I meant I need to do cardio everyday.

[jaguarr]

Quit weighing yourself every week, dude. Once a month, tops. That's it. Otherwise, do work and quit playing the numbers game.

jag

[hammy]

Made some garbanzo bean brownies. Eggscellent. :up:

[jaguarr]

Made some garbanzo bean brownies. Eggscellent. :up:

I've never even heard of such a thing. Sounds like that could be unsurprisingly horrid or surprisingly very good with absolutely no gray area inbetween.

jag

[hammy]

They were excellent. The texture and consistency was perfect. I used grain sweetened chocolate chips, agave and a touch of baking powder. Very easy. They didn't taste exactly like traditional flour based brownies, but they were close enough for me. Eat them with a little 365 Vanilla Soy Cream and you've got yourself a bonafide dessert that won't kill you. :up:

[jaguarr]

They were excellent. The texture and consistency was perfect. I used grain sweetened chocolate chips, agave and a touch of baking powder. Very easy. They didn't taste exactly like traditional flour based brownies, but they were close enough for me. Eat them with a little 365 Vanilla Soy Cream and you've got yourself a bonafide dessert that won't kill you. :up:

I'm intrigued. Could you post the recipe? I won't touch soy products, though; the impact soy has on the hormonal panel isn't worth it.

jag

[BeatKonducta]

Soy sucks big time. The bad thing is that its in darn near everything. I'm feeding my boy nothing but steaks and whey protien lol!!! Well, when I have a son.

I had a great chest and tricep workout over the weekend I upped my max bench to 225! I was doing some pyramids i was feeling good so i said F it i'll try it and did 1 rep, not bad for my weight. Too bad i didnt have a spotter probably could have done 2 or 3 more. I highly recommend cross bench tricep dumbell extensions to really hit the long head of your tri's i only use 60lbs dumbell anything more and im flying off the opposite side of the bench LOL!! Next up i have back and biceps. Stay focused!

[hammy]

I'm intrigued. Could you post the recipe? I won't touch soy products, though; the impact soy has on the hormonal panel isn't worth it.

jag

Here it is:

1 ½ Cups Grain-sweetened, Dairy-free Chocolate Chips
4 Organic Eggs
15 oz. Chickpeas (Garbanzo Beans), drained and rinsed
¾ Cup Agave Nectar
½ Tsp Baking Powder

Preheat oven to 350 degrees. Melt chocolate chips by heating water in a small pan, placing chips in a metal bowl (or smaller pan) and stacking bowl over the boiling water. Stir until melted. Blend eggs and chickpeas in a food processor or blender until smooth. Add melted chocolate, sweetener and baking powder and blend until smooth. Pour batter into a lightly oiled baking pan (8"x8") and bake for 35 to 40 minutes.

Yummy :up:

But you guys are freaking me out about the soy. I eat a lot of soy. What's going to happen to me? Everything I read about it is positive. So what's so bad about it? :huh:

[AndThePickles]

Oh wow, that recipe sounds great, casey! I've always wondered about soy myself...I like a lot of soy products, but I've heard conflicting information about the hormonal effects :huh:

[jaguarr]

Here it is:

1 ½ Cups Grain-sweetened, Dairy-free Chocolate Chips
4 Organic Eggs
15 oz. Chickpeas (Garbanzo Beans), drained and rinsed
¾ Cup Agave Nectar
½ Tsp Baking Powder

Preheat oven to 350 degrees. Melt chocolate chips by heating water in a small pan, placing chips in a metal bowl (or smaller pan) and stacking bowl over the boiling water. Stir until melted. Blend eggs and chickpeas in a food processor or blender until smooth. Add melted chocolate, sweetener and baking powder and blend until smooth. Pour batter into a lightly oiled baking pan (8"x8") and bake for 35 to 40 minutes.

Yummy :up:

Thanks. I may have to give this a try. :)



But you guys are freaking me out about the soy. I eat a lot of soy. What's going to happen to me? Everything I read about it is positive. So what's so bad about it? :huh:

From a previous post about it:

Soy contains phytoestrogens which mimics the hormone estrogen in the human bloodstream and actually converts to bio-available estrogen. If you eat enough soy, it can absolutely raise your estrogen levels. There's a lot of disinformation about all of it out there as well as a lot of research that reflect both sides of the "soy is bad" argument. The long and short of it, is that there is a lot of research that does show that soy products can and will raise your estrogen levels but there's a lot of debate over how much you have to consume for that to happen. I suspect it's different for every person. Personally, I'm not willingly going to consume something that has a proven potential to adversely affect my hormonal profile, so I won't touch anything with soy in it. Ever. There's too much unknown about what it really does in the human body with reference to impact on hormonal impact, and I'm inclined to lean on the side of caution and just consider it a taboo food altogether for me.

Some reading for you:

http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=461709

http://www.t-nation.com/findArticle.do?article=body_143soy

http://www.t-nation.com/article/diet_and_nutrition/soy_whats_the_big_deal


jag

Obviously, this is of greater concern to a male, particularly one trying to build muscle, than it might be a woman. However, the fact that it can and will elevate your estrogen levels if you eat enough or eat it consistently enough for a long enough period of time could also present short and long-term health issues and risks for a woman.

jag

[kainedamo]

Do you know what my mother said to me today? She said that I've lost too much weight and asked if I'm eating properly :whatever:

I mean, she's SEEN me eat breakfast and dinner. She sees me making lunch or a midnight snack. What the hell is she talking about?

I suspected she was trying to sabotage my efforts before today. She repeatidly cooks me frys (bacon, sausages) when I've repeatidly told her I'm not having it. When I'm not making my own meal she tries to serve me up chips, and I keep telling her not to cook me chips.

[AndThePickles]

Sounds like my grandmother (who is overweight). Love her a heap, but for some reason, pudge-o's want everyone else in the family to be fatty, too. :csad:

[Manic]

Everyone in my family is fat. My family supports my efforts at weight loss since I've so far stuck to my plan longer than any of them ever have. The problem is that they keep a lot of snacks and desserts in the house. I've finally nagged them into not buying so much cake, but I can't fight peanut butter cookies. They're my one weakness. Well, that and cake.

[AndThePickles]

I have that problem, too...if it's in the house and I get a craving, it's really difficult for me not to eat it. Luckily, my mother is a health nut so we tend not to have much sugar and junk in the house.

[Colossal Spoons]

Here's an article about Christian Bale's workout and dieting. Way better than that 300 hooplah:

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/dark_knight_workout.htm

Which lead me to this article:

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/post_workout_carbs.htm

Interesting point from that article: I'm gonna try eating my only carbs of the day for breakfast and post-workout. I was getting a good sized helping pre-workout, not post.

[hammy]

From a previous post about it:
jag

Okay, thanks. I'll read up on it. Let me know if you try the brownies. :up:

[jaguarr]

Okay, thanks. I'll read up on it. Let me know if you try the brownies. :up:

You will find A LOT of disinformation on soy on the web. The soy cartels seem to have flooded the market with "independent studies" on the stuff and it makes it very difficult to separate the good information from the bad. When it comes down to brass tacks, though, soy is a phytoestrogen that mimics estrogen in the human body so closely that it will actually raise your estrogen count in blood tests, and then actually converts to natural, bio-available estrogen once it's been in the bloodstream long enough. Anything that actively manipulates your hormonal profile like that is going to have SOME effect on you, but to what extent and severity (or benefit, depending on the application) has a lot of unanswered questions attached to it. For males, I'd say soy is definitely something to avoid, particularly if they have hormonal imbalance issues to begin with or are still developing (going through puberty). And DEFINITELY something to avoid for anyone trying to put on muscle. For women, it's probably not quite as big of a deal as long as it's in small quantities and not a constant part of the diet (meaning, some soy milk with your cereal once in awhile probably won't do much damage to a woman).

Might try the brownies this weekend. Thanks for the recipe. :up:

jag

[AndThePickles]

The only time that I'm POSITIVE it's harmful to women is women who have breast cancer/have a history of it shouldn't ingest soy.

[Manic]

Aww. I had just discovered BumbleBee's ready-to-eat tuna with sundried tomato & basil, but it's marinade lists soya oil as one of its ingredients.

Looks like it's back to regular tuna in water again. :o

[Colossal Spoons]

I'm sure that little amount of soy would be ok to ingest every now and then. The protein pudding I eat as soy in it. Just gotta eat it in moderation.

[jaguarr]

The only time that I'm POSITIVE it's harmful to women is women who have breast cancer/have a history of it shouldn't ingest soy.

Or if they are on Hormone Replacement Therapy or have a history of abnormally high estrogen counts. :o

jag

[Colossal Spoons]

I switched yogurt brands after Pickles pointed out the HFCS in the one I used to eat(:cmad:) and almost immediately I could notice the lack of HFCS and unfortunately taste. :up::down:

[jaguarr]

HFCS: The Tastiest Poison.

jag

[Colossal Spoons]

Tell me about it

[AndThePickles]

I switched yogurt brands after Pickles pointed out the HFCS in the one I used to eat(:cmad:) and almost immediately I could notice the lack of HFCS and unfortunately taste. :up::down:

Haha awww. Sorry baby, Yoplait is the devil!

[jaguarr]

Haha! Yoplait is *****e. Look for a local dairy's yogurt products that don't have a bunch of sugars or HFCS added to them and have lots of active cultures. :up:

jag

[ShadowBoxing]

You will find A LOT of disinformation on soy on the web. The soy cartels seem to have flooded the market with "independent studies" on the stuff and it makes it very difficult to separate the good information from the bad. When it comes down to brass tacks, though, soy is a phytoestrogen that mimics estrogen in the human body so closely that it will actually raise your estrogen count in blood tests, and then actually converts to natural, bio-available estrogen once it's been in the bloodstream long enough. Anything that actively manipulates your hormonal profile like that is going to have SOME effect on you, but to what extent and severity (or benefit, depending on the application) has a lot of unanswered questions attached to it. For males, I'd say soy is definitely something to avoid, particularly if they have hormonal imbalance issues to begin with or are still developing (going through puberty). And DEFINITELY something to avoid for anyone trying to put on muscle. For women, it's probably not quite as big of a deal as long as it's in small quantities and not a constant part of the diet (meaning, some soy milk with your cereal once in awhile probably won't do much damage to a woman).

Might try the brownies this weekend. Thanks for the recipe. :up:

jag
Yeah, my vegetarian cousin eats this ***** by the pound, and I always tell him "it raises you estrogen levels" to which he tells me "it's never given me man boobs". Yep, great logic...perhaps the fact that he's 130lbs of nothing should be a better indication to him.

[jaguarr]

Yeah, my vegetarian cousin eats this ***** by the pound, and I always tell him "it raises you estrogen levels" to which he tells me "it's never given me man boobs". Yep, great logic...perhaps the fact that he's 130lbs of nothing should be a better indication to him.

Does he cry and bleed out of his vagina when you tell him that?

jag

[Colossal Spoons]

No, but he does go into labor. It's kinda weird

[ShadowBoxing]

Does he cry and bleed out of his vagina when you tell him that?

jag
Looking back I wish I had snapped back "you're a girly man" (in my Ah-nuld voice), hoping that would get the point across, but alas family was present. He can go on his way, lifting weights and not getting anywhere because he refuses to eat the most anabolic food sources on the planet: meat.

He claims it's a moral dilemma because we mistreat the animals (like chickens, who are kept in a box), yet the last time I checked, Gazelles still don't like having their throats ripped out by lions.

[jaguarr]

No, but he does go into labor. It's kinda weird

Does he have a soy-based food baby?

jag

[jaguarr]

Looking back I wish I had snapped back "you're a girly man" (in my Ah-nuld voice), hoping that would get the point across, but alas family was present. He can go on his way, lifting weights and not getting anywhere because he refuses to eat the most anabolic food sources on the planet: meat.

He claims it's a moral dilemma because we mistreat the animals (like chickens, who are kept in a box), yet the last time I checked, Gazelles still don't like having their throats ripped out by lions.

They're called free-range chickens and free-range, hormone/antibiotic free cattle. He should look into it.

jag

[Hush]

So yeah this thread cant be on the second page, so here is my comment, I LOVE WORKING OUT! Yeah yeah yeah I know that was dumb.

[ShadowBoxing]

They're called free-range chickens and free-range, hormone/antibiotic free cattle. He should look into it.

jag
He works at Whole Foods, so there ought to be that ***** by the pound there. He equates animal eating to murder though, which I suppose it is, but they should have thought of that before the ended up lower on the food chain than us.

[hammy]

Yep, great logic...perhaps the fact that he's 130lbs of nothing should be a better indication to him.
Does he cry and bleed out of his vagina when you tell him that?

jag
Looking back I wish I had snapped back "you're a girly man" (in my Ah-nuld voice),
:cmad: Knock it off. Just because a guy doesn't choose to distort his body with over blown muscles, doesn't make him a woman. :cmad: You should have respect for your fellow man, even if his choices are different from yours. That's what you expect from everyone else, isn't it? :cmad:

[ShadowBoxing]

:cmad: Knock it off. Just because a guy doesn't choose to distort his body with over blown muscles, doesn't make him a woman. :cmad: You should have respect for your fellow man, even if his choices are different from yours. That's what you expect from everyone else, isn't it? :cmad:He lifts weights, and tries very much in vain to become stronger. He won't accomplish these things unless he's willing to eat the meat.

[hammy]

Being naturally thin or choosing not to eat meat does not make him a girly man. I doubt you'd like it if people called you a big meat head because they thought you were a*dumb* body builder.

[Manic]

I thought there were ways for vegetarians to work out and get stronger.

[jaguarr]

:cmad: Knock it off. Just because a guy doesn't choose to distort his body with over blown muscles, doesn't make him a woman. :cmad: You should have respect for your fellow man, even if his choices are different from yours. That's what you expect from everyone else, isn't it? :cmad:

It was a joke. Lighten up on the soy, lady. :hehe:

jag

[ShadowBoxing]

Being naturally thin or choosing not to eat meat does not make him a girly man. I doubt you'd like it if people called you a big meat head because they thought you were a*dumb* body builder.
...You see the difference is I know my haters are just jealous:cwink:.
I thought there were ways for vegetarians to work out and get stronger.
It's very hard, if not impossible, to get adaquate protein, from good clean sources, unless you're willing to throw meat into the equation. Bill Pearl claimed to be one such person, but it's since been revealed he wasn't that strict and he really didn't switch to vegetarianism until after he competed.

[Colossal Spoons]

*sniff*

There was estrogen in this thread not too long ago.

[Hush]

Yeah but its gone, oh well.

[AndThePickles]

*brings in happy estrogen*

[hammy]

It was a joke. Lighten up soy lady. :hehe:

jag
http://bestsmileys.com/hitting/24.gif

...You see the difference is I know my haters are just jealous:cwink:.


If it helps you sleep at night ... :whatever:

Btw, I saved that soy article to word and it's like 7 pages long. I'm going to read it and do some research on it this weekend.

[hammy]

I'm out of nighty-night tea. :( poo.

[Colossal Spoons]

Research is welcome. We can't have people saying false crap and risk new gym-goers believing them and getting injured.........like bb.com. For as accurate as the articles are on that website, the majority of the posters are lying meatheads :(

[jaguarr]

Research is welcome. We can't have people saying false crap and risk new gym-goers believing them and getting injured.........like bb.com. For as accurate as the articles are on that website, the majority of the posters are lying meatheads :(

The Over 35 section at BB.com used to be awesome; great posters who really knew their *****e and would share their experience and expertise. Sadly, even that section has been overrun by morons. Most of the people with real knowledge are at that other bodybuilding site I sent you the link for, Spoons. :up:

jag

[jaguarr]

Btw, I saved that soy article to word and it's like 7 pages long. I'm going to read it and do some research on it this weekend.

Like I said, you'll find a lot of conflicting information on the subject. In the end, though, it's undeniable that soy is a phytoestrogen that mimics and then converts to bioavailable estrogen in the human body.

I'm out of nighty-night tea. :( poo.

Nightshade tea? :huh:

:p

jag

[Colossal Spoons]

The Over 35 section at BB.com used to be awesome; great posters who really knew their *****e and would share their experience and expertise. Sadly, even that section has been overrun by morons. Most of the people with real knowledge are at that other bodybuilding site I sent you the link for, Spoons. :up:

jag

Yeah, I lurk there sometimes :up:

[jaguarr]

Yeah, I lurk there sometimes :up:

Post more. It's kind of slow over there, lately. Hit them up with a few questions.You'll get some kick-ass info there. :up:

jag

[Colossal Spoons]

I really should. I'm in need of another message board.

[AndThePickles]

I really should. I'm in need of another message board.

Haha, aren't you a member of like, 4 already? :oldrazz:

[Colossal Spoons]

This would be a replacement ;)

[jaguarr]

I really should. I'm in need of another message board.

Beware the Shoutbox on that site. It pulls you in like a magnet some days.

jag

[ShadowBoxing]

Went to an ex-girlfriend's father's funeral today, had one hell of a leg workout afterwards. All in all the day felt very long and draining. I hate funerals, and I hate dealing with other people's grief, but it was good to get in the gym and blow off some steam.

[LastSunrise1981]

I've made GREAT progress in my weight loss journey as of late. I've lost a grand total of 38lbs and I'm at 244lbs now, whereas when I first started working out, my weight was at 282lbs of fat.

Last night on a group outting with some co-workers I had a Osakas Chinese food which was my first bit treat of fast food for five mouths. But I am not making a habit out of it, because I am doing great and I see the results, I feel the confidence, and I feel so much better because of the significant amount of weight loss that I've experienced.

So many people I know who want to lose weight are asking me for tips and asking me how long it's taken me to lose it.

[LastSunrise1981]

Edit: Double Post

[AndThePickles]

Beware the Shoutbox on that site. It pulls you in like a magnet some days.

jag

Does whatever site this is have a good women's section?

[jaguarr]

I've made GREAT progress in my weight loss journey as of late. I've lost a grand total of 38lbs and I'm at 244lbs now, whereas when I first started working out, my weight was at 282lbs of fat.

Last night on a group outting with some co-workers I had a Osakas Chinese food which was my first bit treat of fast food for five mouths. But I am not making a habit out of it, because I am doing great and I see the results, I feel the confidence, and I feel so much better because of the significant amount of weight loss that I've experienced.

So many people I know who want to lose weight are asking me for tips and asking me how long it's taken me to lose it.

That is awesome to hear, man. Keep up the good work and holler if you need anything or get stuck. :up:

Does whatever site this is have a good women's section?

Yeah, it does. There are some women there who actually LIFT (and not just with pink dumbbells, either) that look fantastic. Very feminine but with great muscle tone and definition. Some have done figure competitions and I think one has done full-on bodybuilding competitions. You could probably learn a lot from them, Pickles. A few of them keep journals there, so you could see what they're doing. Spoons was supposed to give you the link, but apparently he has not. I think he's holding out on you.

jag

[AndThePickles]

No, he has not :csad: Spoons :cmad:

[jaguarr]

No, he has not :csad:

Maybe Runt and I need to give you those links to some of those online kink stores we talked about in the Female thread. Sounds like you could use a good paddle and maybe a rattan cane for times like this to put him in his place.

jag

[AndThePickles]

Also, this lag is driving me crazy.

[AndThePickles]

Maybe Runt and I need to give you those links to some of those online kink stores we talked about in the Female thread. Sounds like you could use a good paddle and maybe a rattan cane for times like this to put him in his place.

jag

Indeed, he needs a good spanking :cmad:

I like BB.com and all, but I mainly lurk lol. I prefer their article database over their forum.

[Colossal Spoons]

I didn't know I was supposed to share the link

[mrvlknight21]

Guys, (Jag is particular)
Anyone used/heard of results w/ ZMA (good or bad)?

[jaguarr]

Guys, (Jag is particular)
Anyone used/heard of results w/ ZMA (good or bad)?

I use ZMA every night before bed. It's good for immune system and CNS support and will help induce more restful REM sleep. It won't MAKE you sleepy (try GABA for that), but it will help you sleep deeper and more peacefully when you do fall to sleep.

jag

[AndThePickles]

I didn't know I was supposed to share the link

Well, now you know, and you still haven't :cmad: *paddles*

[TheFuture]

I wonder if someone can help me here....

In the past two years, i've lost about four stone, going from 16 to 12 (awful considering my height). I know it's not great but I did it without actually sticking to a diet regime and just using an excerise bike I bought.

Since the start of June however, I have been really trying to get serious with it. For five out of seven days each week, i'm on my bike everyday for 40 minutes, and I work my shoulders with weights and push up's. I've cut out potatoes all together and I only eat bread (at most 2 slices and it's wholewheat) at the weekend. I think i've put a lot of effort in but i'm disappointed with my loss since the start of the summer.....

I've lost about a stone in the past 8 weeks. I'm disappointed because I lost about half a stone in the two weeks, but it has been a struggle to lose the other half stone for the other 6 weeks. Plus, I've noticed that if I have a bad day (no excerising and eating junk food) I put on a few pounds. There is something wrong when I spend a week getting somewhere and it's undone by one bad day.

Someone suggested I should buy a rowing machine because the body gets used to the same routine (the bike). Anyone have any tips? I've hit a brickwall with the excerise bike (bad pun, I know:oldrazz:....)

[Manic]

12 stone... that's about 168 pounds, right? How tall are you?

[TheFuture]

12 stone... that's about 168 pounds, right? How tall are you?

I'm not sure. I am between 5 6" or 5 7" I think. I could do with losing another stone or two. Any suggestions?

[Manic]

You're roughly my height. I'd kill to be 12 stone. Hell, I'm aiming for 15 stone.

[jaguarr]

I'm not sure. I am between 5 6" or 5 7" I think. I could do with losing another stone or two. Any suggestions?

It's most likely your diet. See link in sig.

jag

[TheFuture]

You're roughly my height. I'd kill to be 12 stone. Hell, I'm aiming for 15 stone.


I could be wrong about my height I could be smaller. Just to be clear, and I am going to have to embarass myself here, I've still got a significant gut and, i'm going red right now, significant moobs.

[Manic]

I wear shirts in layers...

[TheFuture]

It's most likely your diet. See link in sig.

jag

I'll print it out.

But honestly, i'm not been doing much wrong. My typical daily diet would be:


Porridge for breakfast
One bag of Manhattan Popcorn ("surprisingly low in calories" apparently) and an orange or two for lunch.
Chicken/ or Ham/ or mince meat (depends what day it is) + mushrooms/ or carrots/ or beans/ or lettuce
McVities "Go ahead plain yoghurt bars" as a light snack before bed.

I wear shirts in layers.

Heh heh

What's your story Manic? Have you been at the dieting for long?

[jaguarr]

I'll print it out.

But honestly, i'm not been doing much wrong. My typical daily diet would be:
Porridge for breakfast
One bag of Manhattan Popcorn ("surprisingly low in calories" apparently) and an orange or two for lunch.
Chicken/ or Ham/ or mince meat (depends what day it is) + mushrooms/ or carrots/ or beans/ or lettuce
McVities "Go ahead plain yoghurt bars" as a light snack before bed.

Not enough protein, too much processed food, too infrequent on the meals and you are definitely not even coming close to your ideal caloric intake for a day (you aren't eating enough).

jag

[TheFuture]

Not enough protein, too much processed food, too infrequent on the meals and you are definitely not even coming close to your ideal caloric intake for a day (you aren't eating enough).

jag

I'm speechless....

You're the expert and I am actually reading the diet section of your sig right now, but I am perplexed as to how me not eating enough (I don't go to bed starving, hungry yes, but starving never) can stunt my goal of losing weight (considering i'm sweating out 600 cals on the excerise bike everyday too).

[jaguarr]

I'm speechless....

You're the expert and I am actually reading the diet section of your sig right now, but I am perplexed as to how me not eating enough (I don't go to bed starving, hungry yes, but starving never) can stunt my goal of losing weight (considering i'm sweating out 600 cals on the excerise bike everyday too).

When you eat too far below your ideal caloric intake, your body goes into starvation mode and starts storing every single calorie it possibly can because it doesn't know when it's going to start getting enough calories to support it's basic needs and functions in addition to any additional activities you put on it (like cardio). That results in weight gain. Use the links on the link in my sig to figure out your ideal caloric intake and macro-nutrient breakdown (percentage of protein, carbs & good fats per day) and then use fitday.com to track your daily caloric intake. Quit eating those processed foods. They are garbage. And try to hit 5-6 meals per day with a good balance that matches your macro-nutrient breakdown for every meal rather than three meals per day.

jag

[TheFuture]

Can you clear a few things up for me jag as far as Protein and Carbs goes?

I was told cheese and nuts were bad for you.

Plus, I was told potatoes were bad for you.

Would you include all three in your daily meals?

[Manic]

This reminds me. I never put my diet or workout routine on here. I'll post my diet now, and toss up my workouts later (as soon as I figure out all the names for all the stuff I've been doing).


Meal One (before work): Peanut butter and toast w/ apple juice.
Meal Two (10 minute work break): Oatmeal-Raisin Granola Bar*
Meal Three (lunch break): Chicken Salad or green salad w/chicken or chicken sandwich or turkey sandwich
Meal Four (10 minute work break): Oatmeal-Raisin Granola Bar
Meal Five: Can of Tuna or green salad with chicken or turkey sandwich, sometimes w/apple juice
Workout (details later)
Meal Six: Protein Shake**

There's also a couple of fish oil caps and multivitamins mixed in there.




*I recently discovered that my granola bars, while only 90 calories, contain the dreaded HFCS. I try to limit my HFCS intake to bread (since I have no clue where to find bread without it), so I'll have to find a new food that I can keep with me at work without having to trek to the break room (which takes about 3-4 minutes out of my 10 minute break).

**I've probably got one or two scoops left of my Cookies & Cream, and I need a new flavor!

[TheFuture]

Meal One (before work): Peanut butter and toast w/ apple juice.
Meal Two (10 minute work break): Oatmeal-Raisin Granola Bar*
Meal Three (lunch break): Chicken Salad or green salad w/chicken or chicken sandwich or turkey sandwich
Meal Four (10 minute work break): Oatmeal-Raisin Granola Bar
Meal Five: Can of Tuna or green salad with chicken or turkey sandwich, sometimes w/apple juice
Workout (details later)
Meal Six: Protein Shake**


Nice. Is that the type of diet that Jag suggested? I was worried before you posted this because I'm crap at cooking, but that diet certainly seems doable!

[Manic]

Hell, I'm in the same boat as you. Shadow, Jag, and all the others will more than likely reject that meal plan (see my footnotes).

[TheFuture]

Hell, I'm in the same boat as you. Shadow, Jag, and all the others will more than likely reject that meal plan (see my footnotes).

Hey, if you're seeing results using that diet you can't go wrong man.

[Manic]

Potentially, I could see results from eating at Subway sandwich restaurants (god knows their mascot Jared did), but I've seen that franchise bad-mouthed in this thread before.

[TheFuture]

Potentially, I could see results from eating at Subway sandwich restaurants (god knows their mascot Jared did), but I've seen that franchise bad-mouthed in this thread before.

Didn't he have "aids" to help him lose weight?:oldrazz: Bad joke, sorry, blame South Park.....

[ShadowBoxing]

I'm speechless....

You're the expert and I am actually reading the diet section of your sig right now, but I am perplexed as to how me not eating enough (I don't go to bed starving, hungry yes, but starving never) can stunt my goal of losing weight (considering i'm sweating out 600 cals on the excerise bike everyday too).
Just to add to what Jag is saying, because I hear this a lot. Most fat people don't overeat, and I'm not saying you're fat (I have no idea, actually), they undereat and store most of it.

The funny, funny story, is a lot of mothers come to me with their chubby sons, say when they're around high school age wanting them to play football. Of course they don't want senior Twinkie to get thrown around on the field like a rag doll, so they always ask what they need to do to gain muscle (weight). Now of course I'm already wise to the fact that they're neglecting their diet, even if they aren't. So I'll say almost immediately "You're not eating enough", to which I always get "(chuckles) no, I eat tons of food" when these people don't even know what "tons of food" looks like. I eat 10 times a day, and even in pre-contest mode I'm eating at least about 70-80 egg whites and two or three chicken breasts a day. It's hard to explain this to people so the lightbulbs will go off, but generally when you break down a truly dialed in diet for them, they start to understand.

If you're wondering exactly why you need 3000 or more calories, 200 grams of protein, so on and so forth, the reason is simple. Your body has a baseline caloric intake, even if your not exercising, whether that be weights or cycling. Now, when you workout, not only do you burn that 600 calories, you burn additional calories on top of that baseline as your body attempts to heal itself afterwards. The more you train, the more lean tissue you have and the more training and eating you have to do to maintain it.

[TheFuture]

Just to add to what Jag is saying, because I hear this a lot. Most fat people don't overeat, and I'm not saying you're fat (I have no idea, actually), they undereat and store most of it.

No problem, I am fat. But i've gone from 16 to 12 stone in the past two years, i'm just trying to figure out how to lose that last stone or two.

f you're wondering exactly why you need 3000 or more calories, 200 grams of protein, so on and so forth, the reason is simple. Your body has a baseline caloric intake, even if your not exercising, whether that be weights or cycling. Now, when you workout, not only do you burn that 600 calories, you burn additional calories on top of that baseline as your body attempts to heal itself afterwards. The more you train, the more lean tissue you have and the more training and eating you have to do to maintain it.

You know it's weird. In the past two years, I haven't cut anything out. I've just been sensible about what i've eaten and excerised 3 or 4 days a week. It's since the start of the Summer i've begun to cut out bread and potatoes, sweets and chocolate etc etc and i'm excerising nearly every day. But all i've got to show for it is just under a stone lost in 8 weeks, with half of that stone being lost in the first two weeks of the summer. The rest of the 6 weeks has been a struggle to lose the other half stone. It's ****ing crazy....

[jaguarr]

Can you clear a few things up for me jag as far as Protein and Carbs goes?

I was told cheese and nuts were bad for you.

Plus, I was told potatoes were bad for you.

Would you include all three in your daily meals?

It depends on the nuts and the cheese, but all three of those things can be part of a complete diet as long as you map out your ideal caloric intake and macro-nutrient breakdown.

jag

[jaguarr]

This reminds me. I never put my diet or workout routine on here. I'll post my diet now, and toss up my workouts later (as soon as I figure out all the names for all the stuff I've been doing).

I'm assuming you've mapped out your ideal caloric intake and macro-nutrient breakdowns and that you're tracking them using Fitday.com?



Meal One (before work): Peanut butter and toast w/ apple juice.

All natural peanut butter like Natty or Adams without the added sugars? Whole grain bread without a bunch of HFCS? Apple juice without any added sugars or HFCS?

Meal Two (10 minute work break): Oatmeal-Raisin Granola Bar*

Those are garbage. Candy bars more than anything else. How about some nuts, fruit, string cheese, something like that?


Meal Three (lunch break): Chicken Salad or green salad w/chicken or chicken sandwich or turkey sandwich

Not bad, depending on the dressing involved. How does this map into your daily caloric intake and macro-nutrient breakdowns, though?


Meal Four (10 minute work break): Oatmeal-Raisin Granola Bar

:cmad:


Meal Five: Can of Tuna or green salad with chicken or turkey sandwich, sometimes w/apple juice

Again, not bad, but need to see where this fits in the scheme of your caloric and macro-nutrient breakdown.


Workout (details later)
Meal Six: Protein Shake**


Good that you're getting a shake after your workouts to immediately feed your muscles, but you should also be getting a meal about an hour after. Your body needs that nutrition, too.


There's also a couple of fish oil caps and multivitamins mixed in there.


:up:


*I recently discovered that my granola bars, while only 90 calories, contain the dreaded HFCS. I try to limit my HFCS intake to bread (since I have no clue where to find bread without it), so I'll have to find a new food that I can keep with me at work without having to trek to the break room (which takes about 3-4 minutes out of my 10 minute break).

Try a local bakery for your bread. Even some grocery stores have good bakeries that produce natural bread without all the extra added crap.


**I've probably got one or two scoops left of my Cookies & Cream, and I need a new flavor!

Extreme Milk Chocolate is good as is Double Chocolate (more of a dark chocolate flavor on that one).

jag

[jaguarr]

Double post.

jag

[Manic]

I'm assuming you've mapped out your ideal caloric intake and macro-nutrient breakdowns and that you're tracking them using Fitday.com?
I have not, no. I used a few different calculators online and asked a couple of people who've lost weight, and it appears I need to consume between 2000 and 2500 calories per day. I kinda base my diet off of that. I'm concentrating more on losing fat than gaining muscle, though I'm still experiencing muscle gains.

All natural peanut butter like Natty or Adams without the added sugars? Whole grain bread without a bunch of HFCS? Apple juice without any added sugars or HFCS?
The peanut butter has added sugar, so I guess I'll be switching brands.
The bread has HFCS, but you addressed how to fix that later.
The apple juice is all natural. It tastes better than the stuff with added sugar. That's a preference I've had since childhood.

Those are garbage. Candy bars more than anything else. How about some nuts, fruit, string cheese, something like that?
I chose the bars for the convenience, really. I have to squeeze those snack-meals into the middle of my work day, but I work retail in a fairly large store. I get 10 minute breaks before and after lunch, but the journey from my department to the break room takes 3-4 minutes without running across the store, and 3-4 minutes to get back. That means I'd have to whoof down my food if I kept it in there, where we keep the employee fridge and lockers to store our stuff. And my manager writes down break times, so I'm not taking any extra time. I want something I can keep in my pocket, so that narrows it down to nuts. Or I can look up a granola recipe, and keep a baggy of homemade mixed stuff in my pocket.

Not bad, depending on the dressing involved. How does this map into your daily caloric intake and macro-nutrient breakdowns, though?
Sad truth: I use ranch dressing. However, I use so little, 90% of my salad is eaten completely without dressing. I also tend to make or buy sandwiches more often than salads.
It fits into my ideal calorie intake.

:cmad:
I'm sorry, alright?

Again, not bad, but need to see where this fits in the scheme of your caloric and macro-nutrient breakdown.
See my lunch response.


Good that you're getting a shake after your workouts to immediately feed your muscles, but you should also be getting a meal about an hour after. Your body needs that nutrition, too.
I get off work at 7pm on the average day (except Friday, where I've just been rescheduled to work until 11pm). In the time it takes for me to handle whatever I need to do before the stores close, eat, and hit the gym, I end up leaving the gym at around 10-10:30pm. I don't think I have the time to wait an hour, eat, wait a while before going to bed, then get a good night's rest.

:up:
:woot:

Try a local bakery for your bread. Even some grocery stores have good bakeries that produce natural bread without all the extra added crap.
Time to go on a hunt!

Extreme Milk Chocolate is good as is Double Chocolate (more of a dark chocolate flavor on that one).
*writes down flavors*




You need to give me a break, though. Before I changed my diet a while back, my days basically consisted of no breakfast, Hawaiian BBQ for lunch (if not a big ass Chipotle burrito or a cheese burger), and maybe some other fast food for dinner if nobody at home cooked.

[jaguarr]

I have not, no. I used a few different calculators online and asked a couple of people who've lost weight, and it appears I need to consume between 2000 and 2500 calories per day. I kinda base my diet off of that. I'm concentrating more on losing fat than gaining muscle, though I'm still experiencing muscle gains.

Try this one:

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/macronutcal.htm

I'd strongly recommend using Fitday.com to track your diet for even just a month to make sure you really know what fits inside your caloric allotment and macronutrient breakdown.



The peanut butter has added sugar, so I guess I'll be switching brands.
The bread has HFCS, but you addressed how to fix that later.
The apple juice is all natural. It tastes better than the stuff with added sugar. That's a preference I've had since childhood.

:up: Also, just good old oatmeal with a protein shake is a quick, easy breakfast if you want some variety.


I chose the bars for the convenience, really. I have to squeeze those snack-meals into the middle of my work day, but I work retail in a fairly large store. I get 10 minute breaks before and after lunch, but the journey from my department to the break room takes 3-4 minutes without running across the store, and 3-4 minutes to get back. That means I'd have to whoof down my food if I kept it in there, where we keep the employee fridge and lockers to store our stuff. And my manager writes down break times, so I'm not taking any extra time. I want something I can keep in my pocket, so that narrows it down to nuts. Or I can look up a granola recipe, and keep a baggy of homemade mixed stuff in my pocket.

You can go for some nuts, maybe a banana or a fruit cup (get the natural kind without any additional sugars or HFCS, though). No refrigerator required. The granola thing is a good idea, too. Check your grocery store's whole foods or natural foods section. :up:


Sad truth: I use ranch dressing. However, I use so little, 90% of my salad is eaten completely without dressing. I also tend to make or buy sandwiches more often than salads.
It fits into my ideal calorie intake.

A little isn't going to kill you. It sounds like you keep it in check enough to me.


I'm sorry, alright?


:cmad:


I get off work at 7pm on the average day (except Friday, where I've just been rescheduled to work until 11pm). In the time it takes for me to handle whatever I need to do before the stores close, eat, and hit the gym, I end up leaving the gym at around 10-10:30pm. I don't think I have the time to wait an hour, eat, wait a while before going to bed, then get a good night's rest.

Then make sure that last shake after your workout has a mix of whey AND casein in it (and maybe some waxy maize starch for carbs). Actually, a product like Optimum Nutrition's 2:1:1 Recovery might be a really good fit for you for that PWO shake, since you're treating it as a meal.


You need to give me a break, though. Before I changed my diet a while back, my days basically consisted of no breakfast, Hawaiian BBQ for lunch (if not a big ass Chipotle burrito or a cheese burger), and maybe some other fast food for dinner if nobody at home cooked.

<German Voice>NEIN!!! Zere vill be no mercy, here! You vill strive for pervekshun!!!!!! :cmad: </German Voice> Seriously, you've come a long way, dude. Keep up the good work. :up:

jag

[Colossal Spoons]

Seeing SB say he east 2-3 chicken breasts a day makes me want more....and I already had one for lunch. I need it! :rabies:

[Colossal Spoons]

If you workout hard, follow these guidelines:

3565 calories per day.
269 grams of protein per day.
359 grams of carbs per day.
117 grams of fat per day.

Split these up into 6 equal meals daily. This would mean that you would take in the following at EACH meal:

594 calories per meal.
45 grams of protein per meal.
60 grams of carbs per meal.
20 grams of fat per meal.

Holy crap, am I undereating. I can easily make up the calories but where the hell am I finding 117g of good fat everyday? Almonds, here I come.

[jaguarr]

Holy crap, am I undereating. I can easily make up the calories but where the hell am I finding 117g of good fat everyday? Almonds, here I come.

Fish oil caps. Olive oil. Almonds. Bacon grease. Okay, one of those is wrong. Good luck.

jag

[Colossal Spoons]

I get fish oil, flax seed oil, and PB everyday. I could say "screw it" with the almonds and take the plunge into Cashew Land. Those damn things are full o' fat.

[jaguarr]

I get fish oil, flax seed oil, and PB everyday. I could say "screw it" with the almonds and take the plunge into Cashew Land. Those damn things are full o' fat.

God I miss being able to eat peanuts, pistachios, cashews and almonds. Adult Onset Nut Allergies FTMFL! :down

jag

[Colossal Spoons]

Idk how you avoid peanuts. That's gotta be harder than steering clear of HFCS.

[jaguarr]

Idk how you avoid peanuts. That's gotta be harder than steering clear of HFCS.

If you thought HFCS was in everything, try looking at labels for peanut oil in the ingredients or an allergy notice saying that it was handled or processed in a plant that also processes peanuts and other tree nuts. :down

jag

[Colossal Spoons]

I'm actually very excited to find out I should be eating like 900-1000 more calories, cuz I love to eat. I'll be starting a cut in December but until then......nomnomNOM

[Colossal Spoons]

If you thought HFCS was in everything, try looking at labels for peanut oil in the ingredients or an allergy notice saying that it was handled or processed in a plant that also processes peanuts and other tree nuts. :down

jag

You'd think they could just keep the handling separate right?

[jaguarr]

I'm actually very excited to find out I should be eating like 900-1000 more calories, cuz I love to eat. I'll be starting a cut in December but until then......nomnomNOM

Just keep your cardio up and you'll be fine. That's been my downfall this summer as it's gotten hotter (and I've been getting less sleep because of the kiddo).

jag

[jaguarr]

You'd think they could just keep the handling separate right?

Yeah, apparently that's like...impossible. :(

jag

[Colossal Spoons]

Just keep your cardio up and you'll be fine. That's been my downfall this summer as it's gotten hotter (and I've been getting less sleep because of the kiddo).

jag

Yeah, my cardio needs to get more serious. If I put 1/2 the energy I have for lifting into cardio, I'd look amazing.

[Manic]

Try this one:

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/macronutcal.htm
Okay, let's see...

If you workout hard, follow these guidelines:

3432 calories per day.
259 grams of protein per day.
345 grams of carbs per day.
113 grams of fat per day.

Split these up into 6 equal meals daily. This would mean that you would take in the following at EACH meal:

572 calories per meal.
43 grams of protein per meal.
58 grams of carbs per meal.
19 grams of fat per meal.
Where the hell am I supposed to get 43 grams of protein in a single meal? I'm just gonna have to start keeping chicken in a cooler and a grill in my trunk at all times, huh?


If you don't workout hard, follow these guidelines:

1943 calories per day.
173 grams of protein per day.
230 grams of carbs per day.
37 grams of fat per day.

Split these up into 6 equal meals daily. This would mean that you would take in the following at EACH meal:

324 calories per meal.
29 grams of protein per meal.
38 grams of carbs per meal.
6 grams of fat per meal.
Yikes. That's closer to what I've been following, and I think I workout kinda hard.

[TheFuture]

If you don't workout hard, follow these guidelines:

1943 calories per day.
173 grams of protein per day.
230 grams of carbs per day.
37 grams of fat per day.

Split these up into 6 equal meals daily. This would mean that you would take in the following at EACH meal:

324 calories per meal.
29 grams of protein per meal.
38 grams of carbs per meal.
6 grams of fat per meal.


Jag,

Please excuse my complete lack of knowledge but could you give me a brief example of what 6 meals you think would suit the parameters in the above post? I've joined fitday and I am trying to map out 6 meals with the right balance but I am having difficulty

[jaguarr]

Okay, let's see...


Where the hell am I supposed to get 43 grams of protein in a single meal? I'm just gonna have to start keeping chicken in a cooler and a grill in my trunk at all times, huh?



Yikes. That's closer to what I've been following, and I think I workout kinda hard.

For you, I'd recommend splitting the difference. That 3432 calories per day is really more for the bodybuilder or powerlifter type. You're most likely not working out at that level (and that's perfectly fine, you don't need to for your goals). So it would look something like this:

2687 calories per day
216 grams of protein per meal
287 grams of carbs per meal
13 grams of fat per meal

As for the extra protein, nuts, cheese, protein shakes...all easy to grab on your break.

jag

[jaguarr]

Jag,

Please excuse my complete lack of knowledge but could you give me a brief example of what 6 meals you think would suit the parameters in the above post? I've joined fitday and I am trying to map out 6 meals with the right balance but I am having difficulty

Why are your caloric intake numbers the exact same ones as Manic's low-end number? Are you just copying his numbers? If you are, you need to go run your own numbers.

I'll give you a very brief example of a meal for YOUR numbers, not Manics, but this is one of those areas that I feel it's really beneficial for people to map out what they currently eat in fitday.com just to get a real idea for how severely they are undereating. I also feel it's especially beneficial for folks to use the food examples from my sig link and just play around in fitday.com with them, trying to puzzle together meals that meet their macronutrient and caloric intake goals. Why? Because you LEARN a lot in the process. You basically learn how to eat all over again when you go through that exercise, and you learn how much certain portions of certain foods count towards your caloric and macronutrient goals and how to piece them together to meet those goals for every meal. It's sort of the "Give a man a fish, he eats for a day. Teach him how to fish and he eats for the rest of his life." approach. Could I map out your entire diet for you? Absolutely. But then you wouldn't learn anything and you would be getting something from me for free that ought to cost you. I'm not everyone's dietician or nutritionist nor do I have the time or inclination to be. I'd rather give you the tools so you can be your own.

Now give me YOUR caloric intake and macronutrient breakouts, rather than Manics, and I'll give you one meal as an example.

jag

[TheFuture]

Why are your caloric intake numbers the exact same ones as Manic's low-end number? Are you just copying his numbers? If you are, you need to go run your own numbers.

I'll give you a very brief example of a meal for YOUR numbers, not Manics, but this is one of those areas that I feel it's really beneficial for people to map out what they currently eat in fitday.com just to get a real idea for how severely they are undereating. I also feel it's especially beneficial for folks to use the food examples from my sig link and just play around in fitday.com with them, trying to puzzle together meals that meet their macronutrient and caloric intake goals. Why? Because you LEARN a lot in the process. You basically learn how to eat all over again when you go through that exercise, and you learn how much certain portions of certain foods count towards your caloric and macronutrient goals and how to piece them together to meet those goals for every meal. It's sort of the "Give a man a fish, he eats for a day. Teach him how to fish and he eats for the rest of his life." approach. Could I map out your entire diet for you? Absolutely. But then you wouldn't learn anything and you would be getting something from me for free that ought to cost you. I'm not everyone's dietician or nutritionist nor do I have the time or inclination to be. I'd rather give you the tools so you can be your own.

Now give me YOUR caloric intake and macronutrient breakouts, rather than Manics, and I'll give you one meal as an example.

jag

First of all, I didn't know they were Manic's numbers. I thought they were numbers that you were suggesting as the norm. You are talking about macronutrient goals and I have no idea what you are talking about, that's why I asked for help.

Plus, when i'm trying to find the things on fitday that I have been eating, I can't find them so how am I supposed to have accurate numbers? But is my rough typical day of dieting-

159 grams of Carbs
67 grams of Protein
21 grams of Fat
Total intake: 1059 Calories

This is the diet I follow when I'm excercising, burning 600 Cals on an excercise bike over 40 mins. I stick to this regime for 4/ 5 days, take a day or two off for rest, and start the regime again.

[ShadowBoxing]

Oh, awesome news: the guest poser at my next show (August 23) is going to be King Kamali.

[jaguarr]

First of all, I didn't know they were Manic's numbers. I thought they were numbers that you were suggesting as the norm.

No, you have to calculate your own numbers at the link I gave:

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/macronutcal.htm


You are talking about macronutrient goals and I have no idea what you are talking about, that's why I asked for help.

I already explained this once; macronutrients are your daily percentages of proteins, carbs (hopefully complex carbs) and fats (hopefully good fats) that comprise your daily caloric intake goals.


Plus, when i'm trying to find the things on fitday that I have been eating, I can't find them so how am I supposed to have accurate numbers?

Create a custom food in Fitday (the labels on the things you are eating will give you all the information you need to do so or you can look them up on calorieking.com).


But is my rough typical day of dieting-

159 grams of Carbs
67 grams of Protein
21 grams of Fat
Total intake: 1059 Calories

This is the diet I follow when I'm excercising, burning 600 Cals on an excercise bike over 40 mins. I stick to this regime for 4/ 5 days, take a day or two off for rest, and start the regime again.

The average person (meaning someone who's not overly active) burns 2000-2500 calories per day just through normal activity and bio-functions (breathing, sleeping, walking, etc.) and their other daily activities (showering, doing laundry, driving, etc.). When you are looking to lose weight, you ideally have to have a ~500 caloric deficit in comparison to what you eat and how many calories you burn per day. Any more than that and your body starts to slip into starvation mode and retains any fat it already has and adds any new calories it can to those fat stores because it's not getting enough fuel and your metabolism is shutting down. Take it too far and your endocrine system can and will shut down and things like testosterone production will start becoming interrupted.

You are barely consuming 1000 calories per day and burning off ~600 of those per day through exercise. Your body doesn't have enough calories to do what it needs to do and is slipping into starvation mode.

Let's just start by getting you to the standard 2000 calories per day for a couple of months, with the correct macronutrient breakdown, using good foods and see what happens for you since you are eating roughly HALF of what your base caloric intake should be (and a lot of what you are eating is garbage). Set these as your goals in Fitday:

~2000 calories per day.
~150 grams of protein per day.
~201 grams of carbs per day.
~65 grams of fat per day.

The examples of foods in my sig link can help you construct some meal plans. Search for healthy recipes on the net based on those foods. Avoid fried foods, sugar, excess salt, processed foods. Try to eat baked or grilled meats and vegetables (a sautee' in olive oil is fine for veggies). You're going to have to learn how to cook. Anyone who is serious about their health and controlling their weight has to learn how to cook for themselves. It's a good learning process; helps you learn more about the foods you should be eating and how to prepare them in not just delicious but healthy ways. Taking control of your own health and diet requires some work and effort; most people aren't willing to take a little bit of extra time and effort to do that, though, and stay stuck where they are at. It's worth it, though, even if it can be frustrating. Stay strong and stick to your guns. You'll be glad you did.

jag

[jaguarr]

Oh, awesome news: the guest poser at my next show (August 23) is going to be King Kamali.

That's awesome. Hope you get a chance to see him do his thing amongst all the other things you'll have going on while you're at the show.

jag

[TheFuture]

No, you have to calculate your own numbers at the link I gave:

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/macronutcal.htm



I already explained this once; macronutrients are your daily percentages of proteins, carbs (hopefully complex carbs) and fats (hopefully good fats) that comprise your daily caloric intake goals.



Create a custom food in Fitday (the labels on the things you are eating will give you all the information you need to do so or you can look them up on calorieking.com).



The average person (meaning someone who's not overly active) burns 2000-2500 calories per day just through normal activity and bio-functions (breathing, sleeping, walking, etc.) and their other daily activities (showering, doing laundry, driving, etc.). When you are looking to lose weight, you ideally have to have a ~500 caloric deficit in comparison to what you eat and how many calories you burn per day. Any more than that and your body starts to slip into starvation mode and retains any fat it already has and adds any new calories it can to those fat stores because it's not getting enough fuel and your metabolism is shutting down. Take it too far and your endocrine system can and will shut down and things like testosterone production will start becoming interrupted.

You are barely consuming 1000 calories per day and burning off ~600 of those per day through exercise. Your body doesn't have enough calories to do what it needs to do and is slipping into starvation mode.

Let's just start by getting you to the standard 2000 calories per day for a couple of months, with the correct macronutrient breakdown, using good foods and see what happens for you since you are eating roughly HALF of what your base caloric intake should be (and a lot of what you are eating is garbage). Set these as your goals in Fitday:

~2000 calories per day.
~150 grams of protein per day.
~201 grams of carbs per day.
~65 grams of fat per day.

The examples of foods in my sig link can help you construct some meal plans. Search for healthy recipes on the net based on those foods. Avoid fried foods, sugar, excess salt, processed foods. Try to eat baked or grilled meats and vegetables (a sautee' in olive oil is fine for veggies). You're going to have to learn how to cook. Anyone who is serious about their health and controlling their weight has to learn how to cook for themselves. It's a good learning process; helps you learn more about the foods you should be eating and how to prepare them in not just delicious but healthy ways. Taking control of your own health and diet requires some work and effort; most people aren't willing to take a little bit of extra time and effort to do that, though, and stay stuck where they are at. It's worth it, though, even if it can be frustrating. Stay strong and stick to your guns. You'll be glad you did.

jag

I appreciate everything you have said. As I said in my first post I have lost 4 stone without doing any strict dieting. Put I have been doing a strict diet since the start of the summer yet this has been my worst period (total lack of weightloss). It's nice to know that starvation is the wrong way of going about weightloss. I'll try and follow the parameters who have set and i'll get back to you on my progress....

[jaguarr]

The thing about starvation diets is that they almost ALWAYS result in the yo-yo effect; you drop some weight and then when you start eating normally again, you gain all the weight back and then some because now your body is ravenous but still stuck in the mode of storing more calories than it needs to as fat because it's still in starvation mode. Good luck. Keep us posted on your progress.

jag

[TheFuture]

The thing about starvation diets is that they almost ALWAYS result in the yo-yo effect; you drop some weight and then when you start eating normally again, you gain all the weight back and then some because now your body is ravenous but still stuck in the mode of storing more calories than it needs to as fat because it's still in starvation mode. Good luck. Keep us posted on your progress.

jag

You may be surprised, or maybe not, but this comment literally sums up the problems/ frustrations that I have been having this summer. Thanks again jag......

[BeatKonducta]

You may be surprised, or maybe not, but this comment literally sums up the problems/ frustrations that I have been having this summer. Thanks again jag......

Learning to cook is vital for creating meals to help maintain a healthy weight, it really dosent take much work to make some good meals. George Forman grill is my best friend in about 10 min you can grill up some turkey burgers, chicken breasts, fish and other foods. I can have a meal seasoned cooked and ready to eat in 20 mins, thats it! For breakfast i boil 4 or 5 eggs and eat the whites and eat all of 1 of them, a piece of 100% whole wheat organic braed with natual peanut butter and a glass of OJ or pomegranate juce and im out the door. It really does not take much just a little time and effort. :up:

[Hush]

Better to keep your head up or down while doing squats? I have heard down is better caus eitsome how helps you focus on your hip flexors more.

[jaguarr]

Better to keep your head up or down while doing squats? I have heard down is better caus eitsome how helps you focus on your hip flexors more.

I focus on a point dead in front of me, just a little bit below eye level; right about where my chest would be if I were standing about three feet away from myself, watching myself do squats. Looking too low or too high will throw your sense of balance off enough to make the lift harder than it needs to be and take your focus off your core (which includes your hip flexors).

jag

[hammy]

So I read that soy stuff you left me, jag. Two of the links didn't go anywhere any more, but one had a long article, which I read. It was very technical and a bit hard to follow. I'll have to do more research. A lot of what they said had to do with infants, and my thinking is that adults very well may metabolize substances differently. Like I said, I'll have to look in to it more. From what was said, I can see why a man who is interested in body building might want to limit his intake, but so far I haven't seen anything terribly compelling for why women would. I can't help but think of the billions of Asian people who eat a soy based diet and seem to be fine. :huh:

[ShadowBoxing]

I focus on a point dead in front of me, just a little bit below eye level; right about where my chest would be if I were standing about three feet away from myself, watching myself do squats. Looking too low or too high will throw your sense of balance off enough to make the lift harder than it needs to be and take your focus off your core (which includes your hip flexors).

jag
I need to pick that imaginary high spot on the wall.

[Colossal Spoons]

^It works really well. Makes you look a bit crazy if you're lifting really heavy cuz I tend to stare very intensely but w/e :o

[jaguarr]

So I read that soy stuff you left me, jag. Two of the links didn't go anywhere any more, but one had a long article, which I read. It was very technical and a bit hard to follow. I'll have to do more research. A lot of what they said had to do with infants, and my thinking is that adults very well may metabolize substances differently. Like I said, I'll have to look in to it more. From what was said, I can see why a man who is interested in body building might want to limit his intake, but so far I haven't seen anything terribly compelling for why women would. I can't help but think of the billions of Asian people who eat a soy based diet and seem to be fine. :huh:

It's a phytoestrogen that mimics and then converts to estrogen in the human body. It WILL impact the endocrine system and hormonal profile in humans. There is no denying that. What is under debate is what forms of soy (processed vs. fermented) and how much in terms of quantity, frequence and consistency of use, and length of use are factors that will allow this. Asian people tend to eat only the fermented version of soy rather than processed like Americans do. They also tend to eat a diet rich in vegetables and fish oils, which are very healthy. There are studies that suggest that even so, many Asians are subject to greater risk of certain types of cancer (breast, thyroid, prostate) and hormonal development issues during puberty if they are eating a heavy soy diet, even of the fermented nature. Like I said, it's a controversial subject with a huge amount of disinformation and conflicting studies around it. To me, common sense dictates that since it does function as a phytoestrogen with such easy conversion to natural estrogen in the human bloodstream, it will impact the hormonal panel somehow and that's reason enough for me to avoid it. YMMV.

I need to pick that imaginary high spot on the wall.

I find too many people who arch their back way too much when they pick too high of a spot (or slump their shoulders too much with too low of a spot). In the end, it's about finding what's comfortable for you while allowing for proper form, I suppose.

jag

[Spider-Nerd]

saturated fats are good for you. They are not devil incarnate. Balance mono and poly unsaturated fats with a fair amount of saturated fats. Cheese, milk, meat. It's not going to kill you. What's gonna kill you are the blood sugar spikes over the course of ur life. There i said it.

[jaguarr]

Ehhhh....okay, sort of a random post, but let's talk about this:

saturated fats are good for you.

I think it's important to be clear on the different TYPES of saturated fats because they aren't all lumped together. There are four major types of fatty acids that are categorized as saturated fats: lauric acid, myristic acid, palmitic acid and stearic acid. Different saturated fat food sources provide varying levels of these. While saturated fats (particularly myristic and palmitic acids) have been linked to proper endocrine system development and support as well as proper hormonal panel balance, they have also been linked to high cholesterol and triglycerices (which are what comprise most saturated fatty acids), coronary disease, arterial clogging, increased risk of stroke, increased cancer risk and increased insulin resistance ; when eaten in inappropriate quantities they're also linked to obesity. Saturated fats also have a tendency to produce a heavy amount of glycotoxins during the cooking process, which compounds their dangers exponentially. So, I think saying "saturated fats are good for you" is a bit simplistic because they carry a host of issues and health risks with them when used improperly (which most people do).


They are not devil incarnate. Balance mono and poly unsaturated fats with a fair amount of saturated fats. Cheese, milk, meat.

Most people don't have the proper macronutrient balance in their diets (or caloric intake for that matter). Research has shown mono and poly unsaturated fats such as fish oil, extra virgin olive oil (also known as EVOO), flaxseed oil, sesame oil, oatmeal, whole grain foodes, etc. have been shown in studies to lower LDL (bad cholesterol) while raising HDL (good cholesterol), balance triglycerides, balance insulin resistance and reduce risk of coronary disease (all of that being particularly true of polyunsaturated fats). Studies have also shown that polyunsaturated fats can provide just as much support to the endocrine system as saturated fats.

All that said, saturated fats are much better for you than any trans fats (hydrogenated or partially hydrogenated fats) by far, so you're better off with a little bit of butter than you are some margarine. The evils of trans fats is a dissertation unto itself.


It's not going to kill you. What's gonna kill you are the blood sugar spikes over the course of ur life. There i said it.

If you are eating too much saturated fat, it very well could kill you. And if you're eating a lot of it, it contributes to insulin resistance which brings on harsh blood-sugar spikes among other things thereby reducing your lifespan considerably over the long-haul.

jag

[jaguarr]

Double post. Damn lag.

jag

[mrvlknight21]

The turnout for my little workout group is growing!
We had 6 people (not including me) on Monday and I have a few people @ work who are interested.
Just passing on the good news.

[ShadowBoxing]

^It works really well. Makes you look a bit crazy if you're lifting really heavy cuz I tend to stare very intensely but w/e :oI do it for squats and deadlifts, and it really helps, my trainer likes my form. It think the only thing I do that's kinda weird is my "under my breath" conversation I have with myself to convince my head there is no weight on the bar.

[Colossal Spoons]

The turnout for my little workout group is growing!
We had 6 people (not including me) on Monday and I have a few people @ work who are interested.
Just passing on the good news.

Fantastic :up:

[Colossal Spoons]

I do it for squats and deadlifts, and it really helps, my trainer likes my form. It think the only thing I do that's kinda weird is my "under my breath" conversation I have with myself to convince my head there is no weight on the bar.

Recently, while deadlifting; all I can think of is the scene in the Hulk where he choked Abom with the chain. :up:

[avengerscaptain]

Red Meat is awesome for a great protein source and I have read some articles that say eating more saturated fat (not overloaded but a decent amount from red meat) may increase testosterone levels which is awesome.

Also if you wanna talk about really phenominal fats that you need which will really boost your daily living.

Flaxseed Oil
Fish Oil
CLA

I take probably 3 - 6 softgels of each every day.:cwink:

[Manic]

I learned today that Pemmican brand beef jerky is high in protein, but also ridiculously high in salt.

[Colossal Spoons]

Red Meat is awesome for a great protein source and I have read some articles that say eating more saturated fat (not overloaded but a decent amount from red meat) may increase testosterone levels which is awesome.

Also if you wanna talk about really phenominal fats that you need which will really boost your daily living.

Flaxseed Oil
Fish Oil
CLA

I take probably 3 - 6 softgels of each every day.:cwink:


I'd eat more red meat if there wasn't a cholesterol warning and if it didn't render my creatine powder useless.

We were always encouraged to sell CLA with fat burners when I worked at GNC, haha.

[jaguarr]

I learned today that Pemmican brand beef jerky is high in protein, but also ridiculously high in salt.

Nearly all jerky is astronomically high in sodium.

I'd eat more red meat if there wasn't a cholesterol warning and if it didn't render my creatine powder useless.

We were always encouraged to sell CLA with fat burners when I worked at GNC, haha.

Salmon has creatine in it. :)

And... CLA... :hehe: ....snakeoil...

jag

[hammy]

It's a phytoestrogen that mimics and then converts to estrogen in the human body. It WILL impact the endocrine system and hormonal profile in humans. There is no denying that. What is under debate is what forms of soy (processed vs. fermented) and how much in terms of quantity, frequence and consistency of use, and length of use are factors that will allow this. Asian people tend to eat only the fermented version of soy rather than processed like Americans do. They also tend to eat a diet rich in vegetables and fish oils, which are very healthy. There are studies that suggest that even so, many Asians are subject to greater risk of certain types of cancer (breast, thyroid, prostate) and hormonal development issues during puberty if they are eating a heavy soy diet, even of the fermented nature. Like I said, it's a controversial subject with a huge amount of disinformation and conflicting studies around it. To me, common sense dictates that since it does function as a phytoestrogen with such easy conversion to natural estrogen in the human bloodstream, it will impact the hormonal panel somehow and that's reason enough for me to avoid it. YMMV.
jag

I don't know what YMMV means. :huh: This is the problem I have with such issues .. when there is so much conflicting information and even the so called experts disagree, how is a layperson supposed to know what to do. It "might" be somewhat questionable under certain circumstances, eating certain quanitities, etc. On the other hand, there is so much benefit that comes from it. So do you give up the benefits in fear of what may or not be a real risk? It's frustrating, to say the least.

Btw, do you know, is soy the only substance that does affect the hormonal panel? I wouldn't think so.

[hammy]

The average person (meaning someone who's not overly active) burns 2000-2500 calories per day just through normal activity and bio-functions (breathing, sleeping, walking, etc.) and their other daily activities (showering, doing laundry, driving, etc.). When you are looking to lose weight, you ideally have to have a ~500 caloric deficit in comparison to what you eat and how many calories you burn per day. Any more than that and your body starts to slip into starvation mode and retains any fat it already has and adds any new calories it can to those fat stores because it's not getting enough fuel and your metabolism is shutting down. Take it too far and your endocrine system can and will shut down and things like testosterone production will start becoming interrupted.
jag

I've always been suspicious of the starvation mode issue. It makes a little more sense, the way you explained it. I wonder if this is what happened to my sister. She used to fast a lot when she was young and now she has a really hard time losing weight. But if a person did screw up their metabolism that way, can they actually restore it to normal functioning?

[jaguarr]

I don't know what YMMV means. :huh: This is the problem I have with such issues .. when there is so much conflicting information and even the so called experts disagree, how is a layperson supposed to know what to do. It "might" be somewhat questionable under certain circumstances, eating certain quanitities, etc. On the other hand, there is so much benefit that comes from it. So do you give up the benefits in fear of what may or not be a real risk? It's frustrating, to say the least.

Btw, do you know, is soy the only substance that does affect the hormonal panel? I wouldn't think so.

YMMV = Your Mileage May Vary

And, no, soy isn't the only substance that can affect the hormonal panel. Tea Tree Oil has been known to be a testosterone suppressor and studies have shown that even tea tree oil shampoos can be rapidly absorbed through the scalp and affect the hormonal panel. The hormones and antibiotics in commercially produced meats and dairy products can also impact the hormonal panel in supsceptible individuals (which is why I eat only free-range beef, chicken, turkey, buffalo and fish that hasn't been subjected to hormones and minimal antibiotics). If you look at Japanese culture, the women in that culture started experiencing puberty much, much earlier when they started consuming those foods that had hormones and antibiotics used in it's production, as well as started growing much larger bosoms than traditionally had been grown in that culture.

Really I think it's the responsibility of each person to understand what's in the foods and substances they put in and on their body and how that affects them both short-term and long-term. Most people don't, though, which is quite evident going by what the average person eats. And, it's really up to each person to decide whether they want to use products that could impact things like their hormonal panel, endocrine system or immune system. For me, if it even smells like it might, I'll avoid it until the scientist sort it out conclusively. Luckily for me, I've never had a soy product I really liked anyway, so it's not a big loss to me. YMMV. :D

jag

[jaguarr]

I've always been suspicious of the starvation mode issue. It makes a little more sense, the way you explained it. I wonder if this is what happened to my sister. She used to fast a lot when she was young and now she has a really hard time losing weight. But if a person did screw up their metabolism that way, can they actually restore it to normal functioning?

You have to think of it in terms of teaching your body behaviors, basically. Just as you can teach it to grow it's cardiovascular capacity through walking, running, biking, etc., and that it can ramp up metabolism to provide you with more efficient fuel burning to provide you with the energy needed to do that (or weight lifting, or skiing, or whatever), you can also teach it to not burn fuels efficiently and conserve energy and fuel as much as possible. It becomes habitual. So, yes, it's absolutely possible to change your body's behavior and teach it to burn fuel efficiently rather than store it through a normal or even a ramped up metabolism by eating properly and getting enough exercise. But that requires work, commitment, learning how to take responsibility for yourself and learn how to affect change for yourself, time and patience and a lot of people aren't willing to do those things, sadly.

jag

[hammy]

YMMV = Your Mileage May Vary

And, no, soy isn't the only substance that can affect the hormonal panel. Tea Tree Oil has been known to be a testosterone suppressor and studies have shown that even tea tree oil shampoos can be rapidly absorbed through the scalp and affect the hormonal panel. The hormones and antibiotics in commercially produced meats and dairy products can also impact the hormonal panel in supsceptible individuals (which is why I eat only free-range beef, chicken, turkey, buffalo and fish that hasn't been subjected to hormones and minimal antibiotics). If you look at Japanese culture, the women in that culture started experiencing puberty much, much earlier when they started consuming those foods that had hormones and antibiotics used in it's production, as well as started growing much larger bosoms than traditionally had been grown in that culture.

Really I think it's the responsibility of each person to understand what's in the foods and substances they put in and on their body and how that affects them both short-term and long-term. Most people don't, though, which is quite evident going by what the average person eats. And, it's really up to each person to decide whether they want to use products that could impact things like their hormonal panel, endocrine system or immune system. For me, if it even smells like it might, I'll avoid it until the scientist sort it out conclusively. Luckily for me, I've never had a soy product I really liked anyway, so it's not a big loss to me. YMMV. :D

jag

I agree about the meats. I eat primarily wild caught fish and only beef without antibiotics and hormones. The chicken (I've been told) was always raised free of such things. That doesn't sound right though.

The unfortunate part of this for me is that I do, really like soy. A lot. And it's inexpensive and very easy to use in recipes as a meat substititue. So I will have to do some extensive research to see if I can make any more sense of this issue. If you come across any new info, please let me know. Thanks.

[jaguarr]

I agree about the meats. I eat primarily wild caught fish and only beef without antibiotics and hormones. The chicken (I've been told) was always raised free of such things. That doesn't sound right though.

The unfortunate part of this for me is that I do, really like soy. A lot. And it's inexpensive and very easy to use in recipes as a meat substititue. So I will have to do some extensive research to see if I can make any more sense of this issue. If you come across any new info, please let me know. Thanks.

Oh, I'll definitely post any new info I come across for soy. It's something I keep an eye on. I'd say that, if you just HAVE to eat it, go for the fermented products that aren't processed at all (similar to what is eaten in Asia, if you can find it...maybe try an Asian market) as those seem to have a bit less impact than most of the soy products I see here in the U.S.

As for poultry, a lot of it has hormones and antibiotics used in it's production. I look for free-range poultry and eggs, personally. I found a local farmer not too far outside of town that sells both for a very good price (cheaper than the grocery store, actually), so we get our eggs from him and buy quite a bit of chicken, which we freeze. My folks raise beef cattle for our family (no hormones and antibiotics only when it's truly needed for them), so we always get at least a side of beef every year from them. :up:

jag

[hammy]

You have to think of it in terms of teaching your body behaviors, basically. Just as you can teach it to grow it's cardiovascular capacity through walking, running, biking, etc., and that it can ramp up metabolism to provide you with more efficient fuel burning to provide you with the energy needed to do that (or weight lifting, or skiing, or whatever), you can also teach it to not burn fuels efficiently and conserve energy and fuel as much as possible. It becomes habitual. So, yes, it's absolutely possible to change your body's behavior and teach it to burn fuel efficiently rather than store it through a normal or even a ramped up metabolism by eating properly and getting enough exercise. But that requires work, commitment, learning how to take responsibility for yourself and learn how to affect change for yourself, time and patience and a lot of people aren't willing to do those things, sadly.
jag

Yeah. That's her. She's too impatient and thinks if she tries something for a week and doesn't see results, that it's not going to work. I think part of her problem is her age though. She's old enough to be my mom and even though she hasn't been through menopause yet, I think she might be getting close enough that her hormones are making it harder. In fact, she's one of the people who turned me on to soy. :D She read it was good to take during menopause.

[jaguarr]

Yeah. That's her. She's too impatient and thinks if she tries something for a week and doesn't see results, that it's not going to work. I think part of her problem is her age though. She's old enough to be my mom and even though she hasn't been through menopause yet, I think she might be getting close enough that her hormones are making it harder. In fact, she's one of the people who turned me on to soy. :D She read it was good to take during menopause.

Age isn't as big of a factor as most people would like to make it out to be. I know 45 year old women who went from being OBESE to competitive bodybuilders within a couple of years, so....yeah. The problem is that most people have no idea how to eat or get into shape. They try fad diets and fad exercise programs and get frustrated when they don't work or when their results yo-yo up and down. I've only ever seen ONE comprehensive program that really teaches people how to eat right AND work out for health and fitness properly and that's the P90X program (I think DV8 uses that one...kind of).

jag

[hammy]

Age isn't as big of a factor as most people would like to make it out to be. I know 45 year old women who went from being OBESE to competitive bodybuilders within a couple of years, so....yeah. The problem is that most people have no idea how to eat or get into shape. They try fad diets and fad exercise programs and get frustrated when they don't work or when their results yo-yo up and down. I've only ever seen ONE comprehensive program that really teaches people how to eat right AND work out for health and fitness properly and that's the P90X program (I think DV8 uses that one...kind of).

jag

Okay, thanks for mentioning that. I'll pass it on to her. I think the hard thing for her is that she was really skinny as a kid, so she probably thought she would never have this problem. When I look at old pics, it's hilarious. She was like Olive Oyl. :D And to make matters worse, we have the exact opposite body type. She is tall and big like our dad's side and I'm short and petite like our mom's side, so she gets frustrated because she thinks she got the bad genes. But she can sing and I can't. :mad:

[hammy]

As for poultry, a lot of it has hormones and antibiotics used in it's production. I look for free-range poultry and eggs, personally. I found a local farmer not too far outside of town that sells both for a very good price (cheaper than the grocery store, actually), so we get our eggs from him and buy quite a bit of chicken, which we freeze. My folks raise beef cattle for our family (no hormones and antibiotics only when it's truly needed for them), so we always get at least a side of beef every year from them. :up:
jag
I recently had an opportunity to purchase some beef from a grower who doesn't administer antibiotics and hormones. I was very interested, but I would have had to purchase such a huge quantity, it would have taken me two years to eat it. I don't eat a lot of beef. If it weren't so expensive, I'd eat fish every day. Mostly I eat chicken (and soy) :D And I only get the organic eggs that were laid by free range chicken. I'm still suspicious though, if things are as they say they are or I'm just paying $4.00 a dozen for nothing. :(

Btw, where do you get all your info for this stuff? I'd like to keep up on it more myself, so if you have a definitive source, please let me know.

[jaguarr]

I recently had an opportunity to purchase some beef from a grower who doesn't administer antibiotics and hormones. I was very interested, but I would have had to purchase such a huge quantity, it would have taken me two years to eat it. I don't eat a lot of beef. If it weren't so expensive, I'd eat fish every day. Mostly I eat chicken (and soy) :D And I only get the organic eggs that were laid by free range chicken. I'm still suspicious though, if things are as they say they are or I'm just paying $4.00 a dozen for nothing. :(

Btw, where do you get all your info for this stuff? I'd like to keep up on it more myself, so if you have a definitive source, please let me know.

I'll tell you, the difference in taste between grass-fed, hormone free beef and the stuff you can generally buy in the store is enormous. It's SO much better. But, yes, it can sometimes require an investment (and a big freezer). I eat a lot of fish because I love it, too, but I try to limit it a bit just because of the mercury content issue.

I get a lot of my info from bodybuilding related forums and articles as well as from nutrition-oriented sources. I pick up blurbs here and there and then Google around for more information. The nutrition forums at bodybuilding.com have some good info (and some crappy info, of course). A little common sense and research usually goes a long way in sorting out the B.S. from the valid info.

jag

[LastSunrise1981]

I've officially lost 40lbs after weighing myself today. Right now I weigh 242 and I'm still looking to lose more weight. Before I didn't really have a particular body I wanted to shoot for until I watched The Amityville Horror(the remake) and saw Ryan Reynolds.

I saw how great of shape he was in and decided to look for information on how he did it. Believe it or not, I am quite motivated and I've printed out his workout regime, his diet, and so forth in order to give me an idea on how to go about it. Today I did something different with my work-out. For instance I was doing the same thing and while I was losing right, something different needed to be done, I needed to trick my muscles so I basically just did an upper body/arm work-out today and I felt great still.

Tomorrow it'll be abs mixed in with a bit of an arm work out and of course cardio. I'm slowly building up to the Ryan Reynolds regime instead of jumping right into it.

[TheFuture]

I've officially lost 40lbs after weighing myself today. Right now I weigh 242 and I'm still looking to lose more weight. Before I didn't really have a particular body I wanted to shoot for until I watched The Amityville Horror(the remake) and saw Ryan Reynolds.

I saw how great of shape he was in and decided to look for information on how he did it. Believe it or not, I am quite motivated and I've printed out his workout regime, his diet, and so forth in order to give me an idea on how to go about it. Today I did something different with my work-out. For instance I was doing the same thing and while I was losing right, something different needed to be done, I needed to trick my muscles so I basically just did an upper body/arm work-out today and I felt great still.

Tomorrow it'll be abs mixed in with a bit of an arm work out and of course cardio. I'm slowly building up to the Ryan Reynolds regime instead of jumping right into it.


That's nearly, or basically is, 3 stone. Well done man, that's amazing. How long have you been at it?

[hammy]

Congrats, LastSunrise.

I am getting to be such a good cook. :) Last night I made the best chicken stew, ever. And over the weekend I made some chilled cantaloupe soup. Yummy.

[jaguarr]

I've officially lost 40lbs after weighing myself today. Right now I weigh 242 and I'm still looking to lose more weight. Before I didn't really have a particular body I wanted to shoot for until I watched The Amityville Horror(the remake) and saw Ryan Reynolds.

I saw how great of shape he was in and decided to look for information on how he did it. Believe it or not, I am quite motivated and I've printed out his workout regime, his diet, and so forth in order to give me an idea on how to go about it. Today I did something different with my work-out. For instance I was doing the same thing and while I was losing right, something different needed to be done, I needed to trick my muscles so I basically just did an upper body/arm work-out today and I felt great still.

Tomorrow it'll be abs mixed in with a bit of an arm work out and of course cardio. I'm slowly building up to the Ryan Reynolds regime instead of jumping right into it.

Awesome to hear, LS. Glad your hard work and dedication is paying off. If I might, though, I'd like to suggest that you NOT pursue the Ryan Reynolds workout. Very, very rarely have I seen the published versions of actor routines be complete and contain everything they were doing. You also have to remember that his routine and diet were custom made for HIM, not for you. You may be able to borrow pieces from what he was doing, but otherwise I would suggest sticking to what is working for you and adding in little tweaks and changes here and there as needed (you've already discovered the wonders of muscle confusion, for example). If you have a link to the routine and diet that were published, I'll look them over if you like. But don't dump what is working for you in order to pursue a diet and routine that were designed explicitly for someone else, dude.



On another note, I altered my leg routine a bit last night and did some lunges rather than deep squats. I've had a nagging neck/shoulder issue that makes loading up a bar with heavy weight to do squats with prohibitive at the moment. So I kept it light and ran a few sets of lunges and then threw a set of widowmakers in at the end. If you ever want to feel like your workout just might kill you, try running a round of widowmaker lunges. :wow: My legs are damn sore today as a result! :up:

jag

[TheFuture]

I probably know the answer to this already but....

Is it possible for the body to get "used to" an exercise? Can it adapt and no longer react like it once did to a routine exercise? Before anyone says to lose weight "you need to mix it up when it comes to exercise", bear in mind that I have lost 4 stone with my exercise bike. I'm only 1-1 and a half stone away from where I want to be. But the bike is not having the same effect that it once did. Is it possible for the body to adapt? My brother's boxing gym doesn't open back up until September and I want to really push myself for the month of August. Someone has suggested to me buying a rowing machine as it works various parts of the body. Thoughts?

[hammy]

Yes, absolutely your body adapts! If you really like the bike, you can always mix it up with interval training. Peddle for a couple of minutes at a moderate rate, then go all out for a minute, etc. Mixing it up can trick your muscles and get a better response.

[jaguarr]

Yes, absolutely your body adapts! If you really like the bike, you can always mix it up with interval training. Peddle for a couple of minutes at a moderate rate, then go all out for a minute, etc. Mixing it up can trick your muscles and get a better response.

:up:

jag

[TheFuture]

Yes, absolutely your body adapts! If you really like the bike, you can always mix it up with interval training. Peddle for a couple of minutes at a moderate rate, then go all out for a minute, etc. Mixing it up can trick your muscles and get a better response.

Interesting. I have done interval training before and it undoubtedly gets more of a reaction from my body but I can never sustain it.

When i'm "behaving" eating-wise I can't stand the thought of not doing any exercise on the bike. So when I do interval training I try do it every day but it really takes it's toll on the legs, by the 5th straight day I can't sustain it and fall back into old habits.

Maybe a rotation system would work better for me, i.e., light training(normal) one day and hard training (interval) the next day. Thanks Casey!

[LastSunrise1981]

That's nearly, or basically is, 3 stone. Well done man, that's amazing. How long have you been at it?

I officially stopped eating fast food around the beginning of February and didn't start working out until close to the end of that month. I wanted to clean my system out before I got into my work-out regime.

So I've lost 40lbs in five months. It's came from working out 3-4 to days a week and I haven't missed a gym day. If I get the impression that I have plans one day then I'll go to the gym back to back days. I love working out, I am motivated beyond belief, and I see the results of my hard work and dedication and what it's done for my confidence is just amazing.

@Jag- I'm not doing the exact Ryan Reynolds work-out. I'm adding in some new ideas to my work-out and diet in order to help the weight loss and the muscle gain. For instance I have begun my weight lifting only days and it's virtually the same work-out that I've been doing, it's just that work-out only consists of weight lifting and my ab routine.

Then the next day will be cardio and so forth. I also read he did a no carb eating after 8PM and I started that last night too. Believe me I'm not doing any of the insane work-outs he did or the the 300 workout.

[TheFuture]

I officially stopped eating fast food around the beginning of February and didn't start working out until close to the end of that month. I wanted to clean my system out before I got into my work-out regime.

So I've lost 40lbs in five months. It's came from working out 3-4 to days a week and I haven't missed a gym day. If I get the impression that I have plans one day then I'll go to the gym back to back days. I love working out, I am motivated beyond belief, and I see the results of my hard work and dedication and what it's done for my confidence is just amazing.

*Holds on to 4 stone lost in 2 years very insecurely:csad:*

Seriously man, nearly 3 stone in 5 months. That is nothing short of phenomenal. :up: What's your target Sunrise?

[Colossal Spoons]

DB flat benched 100lbs for 6 reps yesterday. My summer goal realized a month early! :D:D

I'm thinking 110 for at least 2 reps by the end of August :cmad:

[ShadowBoxing]

Awesome to hear, LS. Glad your hard work and dedication is paying off. If I might, though, I'd like to suggest that you NOT pursue the Ryan Reynolds workout. Very, very rarely have I seen the published versions of actor routines be complete and contain everything they were doing. You also have to remember that his routine and diet were custom made for HIM, not for you. You may be able to borrow pieces from what he was doing, but otherwise I would suggest sticking to what is working for you and adding in little tweaks and changes here and there as needed (you've already discovered the wonders of muscle confusion, for example). If you have a link to the routine and diet that were published, I'll look them over if you like. But don't dump what is working for you in order to pursue a diet and routine that were designed explicitly for someone else, dude.Bwahahahahaha

You actually are giving them a little too much credit. My friend's teacher wrote for Men's Health, Muscle and Fitness and a few other publications and the funny story is they never onced used the real "(insert celebrity name) routine". In fact they just used to have one of the writers make up a routine, completely, and then they just had to make sure the star signed off on it. That part was easy too, since the celebrities rarely gave a sh**.

I recall an article I read a while back about Batista (C-Spoons should like this). It was called "Batista's leg routine", or something like that. Now I'm sure you're at least passably familiar with Batista, and what he looks like. So I read over this routine. Lunges for 3 sets, Leg extensions for 3 sets, leg curls for 3 sets, some calf movements, and some leg press. Most of the rep schemes were in the 8-10 range. Now think about this for a minute:....Batista doesn't do squats? Okay, c'mon, like they really expect us to believe that. Of course they do.

[Directed at LastSunrise]: From what I understand, from speaking to this guy, is the magazines really want to sell you a workout they think you will actually do. If they show you a workout that's squats supersetted with deadlifts supersetted with leg press, ending with another ten leg busted exercises ('cause the guy in question is probably juicing) then the reader will go "f*** that sh**, that's a lot of work" and burn the magazine. If you really want a sick routine, try picking up a credible book, should be about kino or human phys, and read it and really take it to heart. You should be careful though. Don't pick up anything that makes promises, or uses the word "HARDCORE" a bunch of times. They're just trying to rob you blind.

[LastSunrise1981]

Bwahahahahaha

You actually are giving them a little too much credit. My friend's teacher wrote for Men's Health, Muscle and Fitness and a few other publications and the funny story is they never onced used the real "(insert celebrity name) routine". In fact they just used to have one of the writers make up a routine, completely, and then they just had to make sure the star signed off on it. That part was easy too, since the celebrities rarely gave a sh**.

I recall an article I read a while back about Batista (C-Spoons should like this). It was called "Batista's leg routine", or something like that. Now I'm sure you're at least passably familiar with Batista, and what he looks like. So I read over this routine. Lunges for 3 sets, Leg extensions for 3 sets, leg curls for 3 sets, some calf movements, and some leg press. Most of the rep schemes were in the 8-10 range. Now think about this for a minute:....Batista doesn't do squats? Okay, c'mon, like they really expect us to believe that. Of course they do.

[Directed at LastSunrise]: From what I understand, from speaking to this guy, is the magazines really want to sell you a workout they think you will actually do. If they show you a workout that's squats supersetted with deadlifts supersetted with leg press, ending with another ten leg busted exercises ('cause the guy in question is probably juicing) then the reader will go "f*** that sh**, that's a lot of work" and burn the magazine. If you really want a sick routine, try picking up a credible book, should be about kino or human phys, and read it and really take it to heart. You should be careful though. Don't pick up anything that makes promises, or uses the word "HARDCORE" a bunch of times. They're just trying to rob you blind.

http://www.drabbuh.com/chadsspace/images/misc/Ryan_Reynolds_blade3.jpg

I don't think Ryan juiced for his role. From what I read on his work-out log he worked his ass off and got his body fat down to 3%. Of course I've never heard of anyone having a 3% body fat honestly, but hey, I'm not an expert on dieting or fitness details.

[ShadowBoxing]

I don't think Ryan juiced for his role. From what I read on his work-out log he worked his ass off and got his body fat down to 3%. Of course I've never heard of anyone having a 3% body fat honestly, but hey, I'm not an expert on dieting or fitness details.
(The roids comment was more directed at the articles in general, Reynolds doesn't look like a juicer, but it's impossible to really tell).

My point was more the workout you read was probably faked, as was his diet, I assume.

[AndThePickles]

I'm thinking 110 for at least 2 reps by the end of August :cmad:

Whoa, calm down there, killer.

[Colossal Spoons]

Whoa, calm down there, killer.

Nah yo

[AndThePickles]

Nah yo

Stop the roid rage! :cmad:

[Colossal Spoons]

Stop the roid rage! :cmad:

I couldn't be more calm lol

[AndThePickles]

You must have taken your milk thistle :o

[Colossal Spoons]

Milk thistle FTW

[jaguarr]

http://www.drabbuh.com/chadsspace/images/misc/Ryan_Reynolds_blade3.jpg

I don't think Ryan juiced for his role. From what I read on his work-out log he worked his ass off and got his body fat down to 3%. Of course I've never heard of anyone having a 3% body fat honestly, but hey, I'm not an expert on dieting or fitness details.

Professional bodybuilders diet down to ~4% bodyfat for competitions. That bodyfat percentage is sustainable only for a very short period of time. If you tried to keep it that low constantly most of your vital functions including your central, immune and endocrine systems would slowly shut down on you and you'd have zero energy. Reynolds looks around ~9-10% bodyfat in that pic.

jag

[jaguarr]

DB flat benched 100lbs for 6 reps yesterday. My summer goal realized a month early! :D:D

I'm thinking 110 for at least 2 reps by the end of August :cmad:

Nice work, Zippy! Now let's run the rack!!!!! :cmad:

jag

[hammy]

Do you guys eat before you work out? I always preferred to work out first thing in the morning on an empty stomach. Then this meat-head trainer at my gym said that was wrong, I really needed to eat some complex carbs before I worked out. So I decided to try it, but I don't like it. I still prefer working out on an empty stomach. I also met another trainer (both of these guys compete) who has a completely different body style, which to me is far more aesthetically pleasing, and he says work out on an empty stomach.

So basically I'm just being nosey. What do you do?

[Colossal Spoons]

Nice work, Zippy! Now let's run the rack!!!!! :cmad:

jag

I'll meet you there. "Go Team" on 3!

[Colossal Spoons]

Do you guys eat before you work out? I always preferred to work out first thing in the morning on an empty stomach. Then this meat-head trainer at my gym said that was wrong, I really needed to eat some complex carbs before I worked out. So I decided to try it, but I don't like it. I still prefer working out on an empty stomach. I also met another trainer (both of these guys compete) who has a completely different body style, which to me is far more aesthetically pleasing, and he says work out on an empty stomach.

So basically I'm just being nosey. What do you do?


I work out right after lunch so there's no empty stomach here. I assume you mean lifting weights and not just cardio though right?

[jaguarr]

Do you guys eat before you work out? I always preferred to work out first thing in the morning on an empty stomach. Then this meat-head trainer at my gym said that was wrong, I really needed to eat some complex carbs before I worked out. So I decided to try it, but I don't like it. I still prefer working out on an empty stomach. I also met another trainer (both of these guys compete) who has a completely different body style, which to me is far more aesthetically pleasing, and he says work out on an empty stomach.

So basically I'm just being nosey. What do you do?

It depends on the workout and your goals. The whole theory behind it is that you will have low levels of glucogen and lipotrophic hormones (i.e. insulin) first thing in the morning after not eating for ~8 hours, so ketogenesis will be increased. Lower intensity cardio would be preferable in this instance because you will burn more calories from stored fat while you're working out. You'll burn through the glucogen stores (which are basically carbs) first, and then the bodyfat. After ~60 minutes or so, your body will start turning more and more to muscle protein to burn as it's a more readily burnable fuel and your body will already be catabolic from sleeping and not eating and your cardio will be compounding that because you haven't eaten (that's why low to medium intensity cardio would be preferrable with this approach, because it will burn the glucogen and then the bodyfat at a bit of a slower rate rather than cooking right through those fuels and your body's ability to use them for fuel and then on to the more easily burnable muscle protein; it sort of draws out the benefit of pre-breakfast cardio).


Higher intensity cardio will burn more glycogen and sugars while you're working out, while increaseing post-workout oxygen consumption when you're finished (thus increasing metabolism, and burning more fat while you're at rest). This is the kind of cardio you'd want to do with at least a little bit of fuel in the tank (i.e. having eaten some protein and carbs of some kind).

NEVER engage in weight training without having eaten at least something (unless you're a pro and have a very, very good reason for doing it; the average person has absolutely no reason to lift without eating). Your body needs the fuel for strenuous activity like weight training and it's counterproductive to train on an empty stomach because now you've set the body up to go catabolic during your training which means it will be burning muscle for fuel while you are trying to build muscle. Counterproductive. You also want to make sure you are at your strongest and sharpest so you can execute the movements of weight training with maximum intensity, maximum focus, maximum weight and razor sharp form to get the most benefit out of them and do them safely so you don't get hurt. Lifting on an empty stomach is conducive to none of that.

Just my two quid. :)

jag

[jaguarr]

I'll meet you there. "Go Team" on 3!

Awesome! Grab those 140's for me, would you? :up:

jag

[Colossal Spoons]

Awesome! Grab those 140's for me, would you? :up:

jag

Hells yeah, I'll grab somebody to help

[LazloSpeeker]

So I'm thinking about taking some steroids and I then find this video on Greg Valentino and decide to rethink my position.

I've taken legal steroids before and eaten protein bars and shakes on a regular basis and never really had any problems. The legal supplements didn't do much and the protein bars gave me a real bad bathroom problem.

I know there is some type of triple-stack that is supposed to be the best of the legal steroids you can use but I really don't remember the names. Any advice on legal supplements to use?

[ShadowBoxing]

So I'm thinking about taking some steroids and I then find this video on Greg Valentino and decide to rethink my position.

I've taken legal steroids before and eaten protein bars and shakes on a regular basis and never really had any problems. The legal supplements didn't do much and the protein bars gave me a real bad bathroom problem.

I know there is some type of triple-stack that is supposed to be the best of the legal steroids you can use but I really don't remember the names. Any advice on legal supplements to use?
Heh Heh, I think you mean prohormones or steroid precusors (like Halo D, Viraloid, etc, etc.). Those aren't really steroids. Unless by that you mean you took them under directions of your doctor to treat some medical condition.

[LazloSpeeker]

Heh Heh, I think you mean prohormones or steroid precusors (like Halo D, Viraloid, etc, etc.). Those aren't really steroids. Unless by that you mean you took them under directions of your doctor to treat some medical condition.
No.

[ShadowBoxing]

No.
Well then what did you take, because if you took steroids for recreational purposes, then they weren't legal and you had to get them from a dealer. What were they called? Where did you get them?

[LazloSpeeker]

Well then what did you take, because if you took steroids for recreational purposes, then they weren't legal and you had to get them from a dealer. What were they called? Where did you get them?

I think one of them was androstine and I forget where i got them.

[ShadowBoxing]

I think one of them was androstine and I forget where i got them.That's not a steroid, it's an aromatase inhibitor. It's sold over the counter [at places like GNC] as if it were a steroid sometimes, usually because the salesperson doesn't know the difference. It's been claimed by such products that it acts like a steroid because by blocking estrogen it theoretically improves the testosterone/estrogen ratio in your body.

Mark my words though: Unless you live in Mexico or a country where steroids are legally bought and sold over the open market, you cannot purchase steroids from a store. You can purchase legal, non-steroidal compounds that are often marketed as if they were steroids. Carefully read the label though and you will find out they don't.

Steroids is a very dicey business, and is treated like any other drug deal. You have a dealer, you go to his house or neutral location, and always pay in cash. Steroids transport in non-descript containers, and usually come with accessories like needles and dividers. It's impossible to get them over the open market.

[jaguarr]

From a bodybuilding perspective, anabolic steroids (real ones, not the snake oil all these supplement companies are marketing as "prohormones" or "steroid precursors") are for people who have their diet and routines dialed in as tightly as possible and have taken things as far as they can naturally and are looking to take things beyond that by leveraging the increased and more efficient healing power and recovery that steroids will bring to them. And, those people will work TWICE as hard to realize the benefits of those steroids than they were already. You cannot just simply take a substance like a magic pill or shot and suddenly get huge muscles and massive amounts of strength; especially if you don't have your diet and routine perfected to begin with.

The other thing I will add on the subject of steroids is that they can and WILL mess up your endocrine system, sometimes for the rest of your life, if you don't know what you are doing. People who successfully use steroids know EXACTLY what they are doing. They know what they are taking and why they are taking it. They know how it effects the body and what it's purpose is and in what dosages are not only safe but proper for them and their goals. They understand which substances should be used together and which should not, and what they should be doing after their primary cycle is over to restore their body's natural hormonal production and regulation (and there are plenty of examples of people who weren't able to do that, even when they did everything perfectly). Even PCT is tricky (and if you don't know what PCT is, then you have no business even thinking you ought to be taking steroids).

It's been awhile since I've said it in here, so let me say it loud and clear:

There are no shortcuts!!!!!

You want it? Work for it. Commitment. Self discipline. Learn how to eat and lift right. If you can't do it naturally, steroids sure as hell aren't going to help you do it any better. I have met idiots who were proud of being juicers who were smaller and weaker than me by far, and that was before I even started my HRT because I really do have hormonal imbalance issues (hypogonadism) that keep my natural testosterone levels extremely low. If a guy with low testosterone is bigger than you and lifting more than you while you are juicing, you're doing absolutely everything wrong. Period.

Also, Greg Valentino was using Synthol, which is a Site Enhancement Oil (SEO) not an androgen. Synthol is not a steroid.

There are no shortcuts.

jag

[TheFuture]

Heavy stuff lads:bh:

So, no-one got back to me on my thoughts on investing in a rowing machine.

[jaguarr]

Heavy stuff lads:bh:

So, no-one got back to me on my thoughts on investing in a rowing machine.

If you enjoy rowing, go for it. It will break up the monotony of only having your exercise bike.

jag

[obiwan]

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=fk_usVg7Fp0



try doin THIS ab workout, lol. i tried it, but its way too fast!

[TheFuture]

If you enjoy rowing, go for it. It will break up the monotony of only having your exercise bike.

jag

I've no experience of rowing. But my friend, who has no experience or interest in rowing also, has one and speaks highly of it and recommended to me getting one. Apparently a rowing machine works various parts of the body. They are relatively cheap too and small so they don't take much room up.

[jaguarr]

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=fk_usVg7Fp0



try doin THIS ab workout, lol. i tried it, but its way too fast!

So, some kid strung every ab exercise he's ever tried into a single routine and suddenly it's an "ab program"? Okay.

jag

[jaguarr]

I've no experience of rowing. But my friend, who has no experience or interest in rowing also, has one and speaks highly of it and recommended to me getting one. Apparently a rowing machine works various parts of the body. They are relatively cheap too and small so they don't take much room up.

Go try your friend's rower out and see if you like it. Maybe he's trying to butter you up to sell you his because he doesn't like it. :funny:

jag

[TheFuture]

Go try your friend's rower out and see if you like it. Maybe he's trying to butter you up to sell you his because he doesn't like it. :funny:

jag

:woot: I wouldn't mind that, I'd make sure I'd give him no more than 50 euro! :funny: :oldrazz:

[mrvlknight21]

I've no experience of rowing. But my friend, who has no experience or interest in rowing also, has one and speaks highly of it and recommended to me getting one. Apparently a rowing machine works various parts of the body. They are relatively cheap too and small so they don't take much room up.

They are awesome tools bud. But, like all things there are cheap shotty ones and some built like a tank. Give his a shot and see how it holds up to some very fast, hard intervals. Concept 2 rowers are pretty much the model over here, but I see you have Dublin listed as your location, so it may be a different story/marketplace there...unless that is Dublin, Georgia. If thats the case, come by my house and workout sometime!

[TheFuture]

They are awesome tools bud. But, like all things there are cheap shotty ones and some built like a tank. Give his a shot and see how it holds up to some very fast, hard intervals. Concept 2 rowers are pretty much the model over here, but I see you have Dublin listed as your location, so it may be a different story/marketplace there...unless that is Dublin, Georgia. If thats the case, come by my house and workout sometime!

It's Dublin, Ireland.:cwink: I got my Roger Black Exercise Bike for about 270 euro and it's held up pretty well for 2 years, the rowing machine i'm looking at is about the same price and make too. Thanks for the info though man :up:

[obiwan]

So, some kid strung every ab exercise he's ever tried into a single routine and suddenly it's an "ab program"? Okay.

jag



i know i was thinking the same thing. what do you think is the best way to exercise the abs?

[AndThePickles]

jag knows the name of the exercise and I forget it, but there's one ab exercise in particular that involves crunching while passing a ball from your arms to your legs...one of my favorites and it HURTS!

[jaguarr]

i know i was thinking the same thing. what do you think is the best way to exercise the abs?

Most people absolutely overtrain their abs, either overdoing it all in one sitting or training them every damn day. Like any muscle, they need time to recover and overworking them will limit gains. You get a 6-pack from getting your diet in line, not just doing a sh**load of ab-work. Everyone's a bit different as well. Some people can get away with a few sets of low reps of cruches a few times a week, some people need to hammer the hell out of them every other day. It really depends on the individual

jag knows the name of the exercise and I forget it, but there's one ab exercise in particular that involves crunching while passing a ball from your arms to your legs...one of my favorites and it HURTS!

I call those Murderball Crotch Passes. :up:

jag

[obiwan]

personally, i think a day of rest for any muscle, including abs, is ideal. then the next day you just work them out again. the problem with me has always been motivation and keeping up with it. i seem to start and stop countless times. ill work out for like a few weeks to a month, then....stop. and then a couple months later ill start up again and then stop again. wtf, i hate this sh** its so tough to keep up!

[jaguarr]

personally, i think a day of rest for any muscle, including abs, is ideal. then the next day you just work them out again. the problem with me has always been motivation and keeping up with it. i seem to start and stop countless times. ill work out for like a few weeks to a month, then....stop. and then a couple months later ill start up again and then stop again. wtf, i hate this sh** its so tough to keep up!

Muscle groups can take anywhere from 48-72 hours to repair and recover in the average person, sometimes longer in certain individuals or depending on the type of workouts they are doing.

jag

[jaguarr]

Remember how I keep saying that there are no shortcuts? Some geeks in lab coats are trying to change that:

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/01/science/01muscle.html?ref=sports

By NICHOLAS WADE
Published: August 1, 2008

For all who have wondered if they could enjoy the benefits of exercise without the pain of exertion, the answer may one day be yes — just take a pill that tricks the muscles into thinking they have been working out furiously.

Researchers at the Salk Institute in San Diego reported that they had found two drugs that did wonders for the athletic endurance of couch potato mice. One drug, known as Aicar, increased the mice’s endurance on a treadmill by 44 percent after just four weeks of treatment.

A second drug, GW1516, supercharged the mice to a 75 percent increase in endurance but had to be combined with exercise to have any effect.

“It’s a little bit like a free lunch without the calories,” said Dr. Ronald M. Evans, leader of the Salk group.

The results, Dr. Evans said, seem reasonably likely to apply to people, who control muscle tone with the same underlying genes as do mice. If the drugs work and prove to be safe, they could be useful in a wide range of settings.

They should help people who are too frail to exercise and those with health problems like diabetes that are improved with exercise, Dr. Evans said.

The chemicals involved are already available, and such muscle-enhancing drugs would also have obvious appeal to athletes seeking to gain an edge in performance. Dr. Evans said athletes often showed up at public lectures he had given and asked him about the drugs.

With money from the Howard Hughes Medical Institute, Dr. Evans has devised a test to detect whether an athlete has taken the drugs and has made it available to the World Anti-Doping Agency, which prepares a list of forbidden substances for the International Olympic Committee. Officials at the anti-doping agency confirmed that they were collaborating with Dr. Evans on a test but could not say when they would start using it.

Experts not involved in the study agreed that the drugs held promise for treating disease. Dr. Johan Auwerx, a specialist in metabolic diseases at the University Louis Pasteur in Strasbourg, France, said the result with Aicar looked “pretty good” and could be helpful in the treatment of diabetes and obesity. “The fact you can mimic exercise is a big advantage,” he said, “because diet and exercise are the pillars of diabetes treatment.”

Dr. Richard N. Bergman, an expert on obesity and diabetes at the University of Southern California, said the drugs might prove to have serious side effects but, if safe, could become widely used. “It is possible that the couch potato segment of the population might find this to be a good regimen, and of course that is a large number of people.”

The idea of a workout in a pill seems almost too good to be true, but Dr. Evans has impressive research credentials, including winning the Lasker Award, which often presages a Nobel Prize. He is an expert on how hormones work in cells and on a powerful gene-controlling protein called PPAR-delta, which instructs fat cells to burn off fat.

Four years ago he found that PPAR-delta played a different role in muscle. Muscle fibers exist in two main forms. Type 1 fibers have copious numbers of mitochondria, which generate the cell’s energy and are therefore resistant to fatigue. Type 2 fibers have fewer mitochondria and tire easily. Athletes have lots of Type 1 fibers. People with obesity and diabetes have far fewer Type 1 and more Type 2 fibers.

Dr. Evans and his team found that the PPAR-delta protein remodeled the muscle, producing more of the high-endurance Type 1 fiber. They genetically engineered a strain of mice whose muscles produced extra amounts of PPAR-delta. These mice grew more Type 1 fibers and could run twice as far as on a treadmill as ordinary mice before collapsing.

Given that people cannot be engineered in this way, Dr. Evans wondered whether levels of the PPAR-delta protein could be raised by drugs. Pharmaceutical companies have long tried to manipulate PPAR-delta because of its role in fat metabolism, and Dr. Evans found several drugs were available, although they had been tested for different purposes.

In a report in the Friday issue of Cell, he described the two drugs that successfully activate the muscle-remodeling system in mice, generating more high-endurance Type 1 fiber. The drug GW1516 activates the PPAR-delta protein but the mice must also exercise to show increased endurance. It seems that PPAR-delta switches on one set of genes, and exercise another, and both are needed for endurance.

Aicar improves endurance without training. Dr. Evans believes that it both activates the PPAR-delta protein and mimics the effects of exercise, thus switching on both sets of genes needed for the endurance signal.

Aicar signals to the cell that it has burned off energy and needs to generate more. The drug is “pretty much pharmacological exercise,” Dr. Evans said.

He said the drugs worked off a person’s genetics, pushing the body to an improved set-point otherwise gained only by strenuous training. “This is not just a free lunch,” he said. “It’s pushing your genome toward a more enhanced genetic tone that impacts metabolism and muscle function. So instead of inheriting a great set-point you are using a drug to move your own genetics to a more activated metabolic state.”

Aicar has been tested for various diseases since 1994 and is in advanced trials for treating a heart condition known as ischemic reperfusion injury. But neither Aicar nor GW1516 has been tested in people for muscle endurance, so the side effects of the drugs, particularly over the long term, are not precisely known.

That may change if pharmaceutical companies pursue Dr. Evans’s findings. “The drugs’ effect on muscle opens a window to a world of medical problems,” he said. “This paper will alert the medical community that muscle can be a therapeutic target.”

The drugs activate at least one of the chemical pathways triggered by resveratrol, a substance that also showed increased endurance in mice. Resveratrol is found in red wine though in amounts probably too low to significantly affect muscle.

In 2006 Dr. Auwerx and colleagues at University Louis Pasteur showed that large doses of resveratrol would make mice run twice as far as usual on a treadmill before collapsing. It is unclear just how resveratrol works, but one of its effects may be to bind with a protein that helps activate PPAR-delta. Dr. Auwerx’s resveratrol-treated mice remodeled their muscle fibers into the Type 1, with greater endurance.

That is the same result Dr. Evans has found can be obtained with Aicar. The relationship between the two drugs is not yet clear. Dr. Evans believes that resveratrol acts on so many pathways in the cell, particularly at high doses, that it is hard to know how it is achieving any given effect, whereas the role of Aicar and GW1516 is well defined. But Dr. Auwerx said he did not think Aicar was necessarily working in the way Dr. Evans described.

The days of excuses for people to be lazy fatties are slowly fading. :up:

jag

[Prison Mike]

what is the appropriate amount of time to start your workout after eating?

[Manic]

I call those Murderball Crotch Passes. :up:
You make it sound like an STD.

[jaguarr]

what is the appropriate amount of time to start your workout after eating?

~60 minutes if you're eating a regular meal. I'll down a whey shake 15 minutes before a workout, though.

You make it sound like an STD.

Wear a condom while you do them, too. :up:

jag

[Colossal Spoons]

You make it sound like an STD.

It burns like one :(

[mrvlknight21]

anybody got the official name of the Murderball Crotch Pass so I can find a video of it?
Or if you guys have a link to a vid..let me know.

[kainedamo]

Remember how I keep saying that there are no shortcuts? Some geeks in lab coats are trying to change that:



The days of excuses for people to be lazy fatties are slowly fading. :up:

jag

Kinda disturbing.

"Now I don't have to get off my lazy ass - I have this pill!" that actually kinda makes me worried about the future of the human race.

[hammy]

I work out right after lunch so there's no empty stomach here. I assume you mean lifting weights and not just cardio though right?

Yeah, I should have clarified that. I meant to say, regardless of cardio or strength training, I was in the habit of rolling out of bed and getting after it. I just felt better, working out that way.

It depends on the workout and your goals. The whole theory behind it is that you will have low levels of glucogen and lipotrophic hormones (i.e. insulin) first thing in the morning after not eating for ~8 hours, so ketogenesis will be increased. Lower intensity cardio would be preferable in this instance because you will burn more calories from stored fat while you're working out. You'll burn through the glucogen stores (which are basically carbs) first, and then the bodyfat. After ~60 minutes or so, your body will start turning more and more to muscle protein to burn as it's a more readily burnable fuel and your body will already be catabolic from sleeping and not eating and your cardio will be compounding that because you haven't eaten (that's why low to medium intensity cardio would be preferrable with this approach, because it will burn the glucogen and then the bodyfat at a bit of a slower rate rather than cooking right through those fuels and your body's ability to use them for fuel and then on to the more easily burnable muscle protein; it sort of draws out the benefit of pre-breakfast cardio).


Higher intensity cardio will burn more glycogen and sugars while you're working out, while increaseing post-workout oxygen consumption when you're finished (thus increasing metabolism, and burning more fat while you're at rest). This is the kind of cardio you'd want to do with at least a little bit of fuel in the tank (i.e. having eaten some protein and carbs of some kind).

NEVER engage in weight training without having eaten at least something (unless you're a pro and have a very, very good reason for doing it; the average person has absolutely no reason to lift without eating). Your body needs the fuel for strenuous activity like weight training and it's counterproductive to train on an empty stomach because now you've set the body up to go catabolic during your training which means it will be burning muscle for fuel while you are trying to build muscle. Counterproductive. You also want to make sure you are at your strongest and sharpest so you can execute the movements of weight training with maximum intensity, maximum focus, maximum weight and razor sharp form to get the most benefit out of them and do them safely so you don't get hurt. Lifting on an empty stomach is conducive to none of that.

Just my two quid. :)

jag

:o I was doing just that, going directly to the lifting on an empty stomach. Hmm. So you're saying that on days when I might just want to do some light cardio, it's okay to do it on an empty stomach, as long as it doesn't go past an hour. If I wanted to go longer, I should stop and eat, right? And I should always eat before I lift. Hmm. I actually felt more alert and on track on an empty stomach. If anything eating (even though what I eat is very healthy) is more likely to make me feel sluggish or a bit tired, less sharp, etc. So I always felt like I did a better workout if I waited to eat.

[Hush]

I Started to try to gain weight this week by eating like 4 meals a day I think its working im trying to get my size up to Hugh Jackmans. I saw the footage and it was incredible. So yeah any advice on what to eat, not form your sig jag! lol

[jaguarr]

:o I was doing just that, going directly to the lifting on an empty stomach. Hmm. So you're saying that on days when I might just want to do some light cardio, it's okay to do it on an empty stomach, as long as it doesn't go past an hour. If I wanted to go longer, I should stop and eat, right? And I should always eat before I lift. Hmm. I actually felt more alert and on track on an empty stomach. If anything eating (even though what I eat is very healthy) is more likely to make me feel sluggish or a bit tired, less sharp, etc. So I always felt like I did a better workout if I waited to eat.

Like I said, it's counterproductive to lift on an empty stomach because you're trying to build or at least tone your muscle and lifting without some fuel in the tank induces catabolism early on your workout which is when your body starts feeding off your muscle protein for fuel and that's completely detrimental to that goal. Just get a light meal of some complex carbs and protein at least (a bit of good fats included wouldn't hurt) about an hour before you lift. You might feel a bit sluggish at first but I'm willing to bet that you'll feel pretty good by the time you get done with your warmup cardio before you lift. (You are doing ~10 minutes of light warmup cardio before you lift, aren't you?).

As for pre-breakfast cardio, yes you can do it if you keep it light to maximize fat burning. I'd keep it limited to 30-45 minutes, personally, though. But don't stop in the middle of a workout to eat and then go back to working out as you'll likely just wind up making yourself sick or preventing your body from either digesting the food or effectively working the muscle groups (including your cardiovascular system) because it will be trying to send blood to both tasks and not have enough to properly do either one.

I Started to try to gain weight this week by eating like 4 meals a day I think its working im trying to get my size up to Hugh Jackmans. I saw the footage and it was incredible. So yeah any advice on what to eat, not form your sig jag! lol

Same foods that are in the link, just more of them. You need to average roughly ~500 calories a day more than you are consuming and burning just to maintain in order to gain muscle. Try upping your complex carbs like yams, oatmeal, wheat pasta and brown rice a little bit and I bet you'll see a difference in your gains. Keep your cardio up while you're doing it, though. And, really, 5-6 meals per day will get you to your goal more effectively. :up:



Had a really satisfying back/bi's workout tonight. My shoulders and neck are finally starting to loosen up from all the nasty knots I've had in them for a couple of weeks. Lovin' it.

jag

[hammy]

(You are doing ~10 minutes of light warmup cardio before you lift, aren't you?).

I wasn't until that trainer got on me about eating and that, too. Honestly, why does everything seem to work better for me, backwards. :rolleyes: I never warmed up before but I never had any problems. I never strained anything, felt tight or whatever. In fact, on days that I did both cardio and weights, I always preferred doing the cardio last. :dry: I never seemed to have a problem. But I don't want to injure myself, obviously.

[The FallenAngel]

So, I've had this feeling in my right arm for a while now, right where the elbow joint is, the tendon in that area. Whenever I've done my biceps work, it's started to hurt a bit. I didn't think it was anything severe, so I took a few weeks off from working that area, and felt fine. Today, I went to work the bis again, and sure enough, pain in that area. I'm setting up an appointment for the doctor, but I feel like the difference in my left and right is big. When I feel around that area, compared to my left arm, it feels almost shredded, is the best word I can use to describe it. Hope I didn't tear anything.

Goddamn I wanna destroy some weights, this is pissin' me off! :cmad:

[Hush]

Same foods that are in the link, just more of them. You need to average roughly ~500 calories a day more than you are consuming and burning just to maintain in order to gain muscle. Try upping your complex carbs like yams, oatmeal, wheat pasta and brown rice a little bit and I bet you'll see a difference in your gains. Keep your cardio up while you're doing it, though. And, really, 5-6 meals per day will get you to your goal more effectively. :up:

jag

I have upped my Oatmeal in take with 3 bowls a day and thatis breakfeastwitha glass of Milk or juice, then i pack my lunch, 2 PBJ's and either an apple or orange with a maybe some tortilla chips and may a sandwhich and Quizno's and Dinner is usually what mom cooks and a Snack later

[Mario_Galaxy]

So, I've had this feeling in my right arm for a while now, right where the elbow joint is, the tendon in that area. Whenever I've done my biceps work, it's started to hurt a bit. I didn't think it was anything severe, so I took a few weeks off from working that area, and felt fine. Today, I went to work the bis again, and sure enough, pain in that area. I'm setting up an appointment for the doctor, but I feel like the difference in my left and right is big. When I feel around that area, compared to my left arm, it feels almost shredded, is the best word I can use to describe it. Hope I didn't tear anything.

Goddamn I wanna destroy some weights, this is pissin' me off! :cmad:
That sucks. I've had this nagging pain in my wrist for the past week or two. Makes front squats a total *****.:down

[Golgo-13]

Pulled a muscle in my lower back doing Deadlifts (yes...without a weight belt!) last week. I was bed bound for two days after that, taking Tylenol every 4 hours, and using Bengay patches every 8, faithfully. Now i can at least walk upright again (without looking like i'm constipated). This **** is really painful.

How's the Kettlebell's going, mrvlkinght?

[mrvlknight21]

Pulled a muscle in my lower back doing Deadlifts (yes...without a weight belt!) last week. I was bed bound for two days after that, taking Tylenol every 4 hours, and using Bengay patches every 8, faithfully. Now i can at least walk upright again (without looking like i'm constipated). This **** is really painful.

How's the Kettlebell's going, mrvlkinght?

Good, I have been using them a lot with the guys I am "training."
Strangely, we havent been doing the standard kbell movements like the swing and snatch. We have used them a lot for 1 arm rows, farmers walks, overhead presses and front squats.
But we did do swings with them on Wednesday.
I am so excited to have these guys coming over and doing stuff. We have been doing a lot of circuit type training so far and bodyweight stuff.

Today, (by myself), I did barbell squats, ring pushups and ring rows.

Anyone find that video or link to video for those murderball crotch passes yet?

[mrvlknight21]

wow...700 pages...good job guys!

[Colossal Spoons]

Hooray!

[Hush]

Wow 700 pages of Meatheads talking about weights and 17,502 posts included in those pages. This thing should be printed out and turned into a ****ing book.