Assuming Batman had prep time, HOW would he beat Superman?

[KrypJonian]

This is a calm response to that ridiculous thread where absolutely nothing was discussed or put up for debate.

Personally, I think too many people are quick to say Batman would beat Superman in a one on one fight. Whether it's popularity, the fact he's a smart mother f**cker, or whatever else, I don't know. But I want to find out.

This thread is open to anyone who would like to share their view of WHAT WOULD OCCUR in a fight between Supes and Bats. I bet we could come up with something ten times better than Miller's fight or that garbage Jeph Loeb spewed out.

Please don't come in here and start sh** :)

[Whack Arnolds]

Deep down Supes would win if really wants to...but he always hold himself back and Batman doesn't. That's why most of the time Batman wins.

[pspring5]

Or How About This One? Would Batman Defeat Doomsday

[KrypJonian]

Or How About This One? Would Batman Defeat Doomsday
Ooooh, I like it :up:

[SKSpawn]

Or How About This One? Would Batman Defeat Doomsday

Again, no, Doomsday is pretty much unbeatable.

Batman, or anyone ever, can beat Superman using one simple thing- Kryptonite. Or, somehow lure Superman to a place with a red sun, wait for his powers to drain, then beat the hell out of him.

[Morg]

you know, we do have a thread about this

[The Question]

Okay, here's how I see it. If he had months to prepare, and had the aid of the entire "bat family", here's how I see it:


Step one: Buy a sonic device that emits hyper sonic frequencies.

Step two: Buy a **** load of balistic missiles.

Step three: Buy some Thanagarian cloaking technology.

Step four: Place missiles in Death Valley, hiding them with the cloaking tech.

Step five: Get Oracle to falsify reports of extreme paranormal phenomina in Death Valley.

Step six: As Superman flies over Death valley, hit him with the hypersonic emiter. Because of his enhanced hearing, his should cripple him momentarily.

Step seven: Shoot the missiles at the temporarily defenseless Superman. Continue until he's unconscious and/or dead.


That's the only logical way I could see it happening. And that would take several months to put together, and the usage of every resource Batman has.

[Super_Ludacris]

Iced out Kryptonite Bat Suit

[The Question]

Iced out Kryptonite Bat Suit


Except that would probably give Batman cancer.

[GL1]

Well... there are several strategies which Batman can employ to damage and incapacitate superman. How successful he is at these depends on the conditions of their meeting, and thus, are in the hands of the writer.

1) Hypersonics. As stated above there are frequencies which could, conceivably cripple the man of steel due to his superheraring. There are also, in hypersonic theory, frequencies which cause physical damage to tissues that resonate at that frequency. Batman, if he could deduce these two frequencies would be able to cause superman a great deal of pain at a fair large range, perhaps with a relatively small device.

2) Kryptonite. Pretty straightforward. Rings. Batarangs. Kryptonite Gas. Ambient Kryptonite Radiation... Metallo's Kryptonite Lasers... Batman has a number of ways to deploy and employ kryptonite for pain and weaknening of superman. this is a powerful tandem move because, in tandem with other strategies, Superman is constantly getting weaker and more susceptible to other attacks, and he could potentially leave himself open if he tries to deal with the krptonite first. This is to say nothing of other kryptonite colors.

3) Light Flashes. Superman's eyes are suceptible to light attacks. Extremly bright light attacks, perhaps lasers, but still. Similarly, it could be concluded that large bursts of ultraviolet radiation or infrared or x-ray radiation could 'blind' him as well, or at least draw him to shield his eyes. In tandem with sound attacks you can leave Superman senseless and thus, unguarded.

4) Loopholes. There's a ton of them and they're tempting for the writer because they make sense. Eardrums for instance (used by Midnighter on Apollo in Authority: Revolution). Eardrums HAVE to be sensitive so that they can move with sound and the person can ear. Striking a person on their eardrum at sufficient force could burst the eardrum and further deafen the man. Of course, Superman's eardrums have been through worse, so it doesn't work on him, but it technically should. There are many other such cases.

5) Loved Ones. Superman is probably not convinced that Batman won't hurt Lois Lane or Lana Lang. That gives Batman leverage to control and direct superman. Batman can set traps, Batman can hold hostages. Batman can direct and control a situation, if, in the very least, as a distraction. Put civillian in danger around some Kryptonite, and get to kicking butt on a distracted Superman.

6) Large amounts of raw damage. In Hush, Batman dazed Superman with a city power grid. Perhaps feasable. Also if Batman can get his hands on some small nukes (and he can) he could probably hurt the man of steel pretty bad. Now, collateral damage would be an issue, but, if the area is unpopulated, this is doable.

Those are just a few strategies off of the top of my head. Batman has an advantage in that Superman ALWAYS holds back. Period. The problem is of course that Superman is just so dang fast. (I've already shown how his strength can be overcome thoroughly). But honestly, Superman should get the first move and Batman typically wouldn't be able to counter it. Perhaps if the fight started and Superman didn't know where on the Planet Batman was, then Batman would probably be able to pull it off, but then, that underlines pretty amazingly that this isn't a fair fight.

[The Question]

Well, depending on the writer and thus how that writer likes to write Superman's power levels, several small nukes could probably kill Superman. And, Batman, not being the killing type, wouldn't want to risk that. So, balistic missiles would be a better bet. Besides, they're far easyer to get your hands on than small nukes.

[Ming]

I always assumed that Batman would win because he would cross lines that Superman never would.

[PWN3R]

Except that would probably give Batman cancer.

Oh no my friend! In reality yes, but if the Bats had MORE prep time, he'd figure a way around that problem! :batman:

[KrypJonian]

I always assumed that Batman would win because he would cross lines that Superman never would.
Like kicking someone in the balls or something?:confused: :)

Sorry Morg, didn't see the other thread.

[PWN3R]

Batman WITH 'prep' time is capable of truly amazing feats! ;)

[Iceman/Psylocke]

use a green rock

[user123456789]

TQ, GL1, & KJ deserve a ****in medal for this thread.

VERY good points guys.

and i think the point we must stress is this...

SUPERMAN ALWAYS HOLDS BACK, AND WOULD NEVER DO SOME OF THE THINGS THE BATMAN WOULD.

[Super_Ludacris]

Except that would probably give Batman cancer.


That's ok, Superman would still get merked first and then when Bruce dies he would follow Clark into hell and beat his ass repeatedly for all eternity

Kal-El is a chump

[true316]

I think the best way for Batman to beat Superman would be to take him by surprise. Just call him up, tell him he needs help, have him come over to the Batcave, and then pull some kryptonite out of his utility belt. If Superman knows Batman wants to fight I don't see how Batman could win because Superman would just need to keep his distance. But if he took him by surprise I think Batman could win.

[Super_Ludacris]

I think the best way for Batman to beat Superman is to send him a copy of DKR and say you dont want it me nooooooooo

Sorry I'm in one of those moods today, it's friday

[hippie_hunter]

This is how Batman would beat Superman

http://www.biggercheese.com/comics/0608.png

Did I say beat, I meant get totally pwned :o

[true316]

This is how Batman would beat Superman

Did I say beat, I meant get totally pwned :o

LOL! I don't think thats quite the way it would happen but that was still really funny so you get a big thumbs up! :p :up:

[The Question]

TQ, GL1, & KJ deserve a ****in medal for this thread.

VERY good points guys.

and i think the point we must stress is this...

SUPERMAN ALWAYS HOLDS BACK, AND WOULD NEVER DO SOME OF THE THINGS THE BATMAN WOULD.


Well, that's the only plan I could see working against Superman. And like I said, that would require several months of planning, millions of dollars, and the aid of every ally he has. But really, with enough time, anyone with half a brain and enough money could come up with that plan.

[Red X]

Okay, here's how I see it. If he had months to prepare, and had the aid of the entire "bat family", here's how I see it:


Step one: Buy a sonic device that emits hyper sonic frequencies.

Step two: Buy a **** load of balistic missiles.

Step three: Buy some Thanagarian cloaking technology.

Step four: Place missiles in Death Valley, hiding them with the cloaking tech.

Step five: Get Oracle to falsify reports of extreme paranormal phenomina in Death Valley.

Step six: As Superman flies over Death valley, hit him with the hypersonic emiter. Because of his enhanced hearing, his should cripple him momentarily.

Step seven: Shoot the missiles at the temporarily defenseless Superman. Continue until he's unconscious and/or dead.


That's the only logical way I could see it happening. And that would take several months to put together, and the usage of every resource Batman has.

Or he could just get some Kryptonite.

[Rabid_Rust]

Well, here's how batman would be Superman:

He's the bats, money.

just kidding guys. :P

but seriously, I really don't think batman would realistically stand a chance against superman. I mean, if superman knew they were gonna fight, and batman had prep time, superman, knowing batman was oh so resourcefull and rich would guess he probably had kryptonite or something tp that effect. so all he would have to do, would be... disable batman. Not permanatly of course, my boi superman doesn't roll like that. But he could obviously just, knock him out or whatever in under a second. Batman wouldn't even have time to react.

That comic posted before, really says it all.

[Super_Ludacris]

This is how Batman would beat Superman

Did I say beat, I meant get totally pwned :o


Here's the thing, anytime he's around kryptonite he gets weak, so whether he could see it with his x-ray vision is a moot point as soon as he's around him he would get weak and buckle to his knees


That dude is one overzealous supes fan with a selectivley forgetful memory lol

[The Question]

Or he could just get some Kryptonite.



Well........yeah. I was just trying to be creative.

[Super_Ludacris]

Let's keep it real people cause I know it irks Superman fans that Batman is better but facts are:

Kryptonite + Batman's smarts= Lois gonna need a new man

[Venomfan]

all the reasons people give for batman winning is only if superman is retarted, superman would just shoot his eye lasers at him from a mile away, kryptonite wont reach him from that far away, or he could just fly at him in with a fist ready, and sure when hes right next to batman hel go weak but his momentum wont stop, so he'll kill batman with the flying punch and be 100 yards away in another 0.001 seconds and be okay

[Infinity9999x]

Would batman win? Probably because right now he's the bat god. Should he win? F**ck no, but he probably will anyways. It also doesn't help that everybody and they're frickin GRAMA can get kryptonite.

[Ming]

Sure, Superman could melt Batman's head with his heat-vision from miles away. Hell, if he knew he was comming, he could do it from the balconey of his apartment while having a breakfast of eggs and toast after a hot night with Lois.

Sure, Superman could fly at Batman at mache speeds and reduce much of Batman's body to protoplasm. If he really wanted to be cool, he could grab him while flying rediculously fast, take him to space, and then give Batman what Supe's would call a "Super-piledriver" and reduce Batman into literal paste as he slams his head against the concrete.

Hell, Superman could blow at Batman with his Super-breath and send him into some powerlines. He could get real close and blow so hard that Batman's face would split in two and peel off his bones like an orange peel. Then Supes would super-laugh, have a super-smoke, and then fly off to have super-sex with Lois....which would be super-savage...

All of these are things he could do....if he were a power mad maniac and had lustful desires to turn us all into his super-playthings.

Last time I checked, Superman is a super-pleasent, really nice guy, who's somewhat nieve yet an overall peach.

The sole reason that Batman could beat Superman would be if Superman became Super-evil, which he isn't, or become misguided in his ways, like in indentity crisis or Dark Knight Returns. Then, Batman could beat Superman, because Superman would become a wrong that needed to be righted.

[SuperDaniel]

Good response, Ming. But Superman could do a lot more and not kill Batman. Super-speed, anyone? I like what he did to the leader of Elite in Action Comics #775.

[GreenKToo]

I say given enough time to prepare,and without superman knowing of course, he could beat supes.I mean batman is extremely smart, he could find a weakness, and make a plan that would work ,but bats would not kill superman,and once supes recovers,batman better be living in a lead box.

[Andy C.]

What I always love about these sort of arguments is how, when people start talking about one of the heroes' psychology (i.e. Superman has a line that he doesn't cross but Batman can), they ignore the psychology of the other. Sure, Batman is rather morally ambiguous when it comes to his methods, but there are lines he doesn't cross as well.

He's not going to deliberately put civilians in harm's way (except for in Hush, but that was to get Supes to break out of Poison Ivy's control), and he's especially not going to use lethal force. If Batman still hasn't killed the Joker by now, there's no way he's going to try and kill one of his best (and at this point, only) friends--particularly since this friend is also the single most influential person on the planet. And honestly, there's no conceivable reason why Batman would want to take out Superman in the first place unless, like Ming said, Superman had just gone completely evil, in which case the 'Superman always holds back' argument doesn't work. Or if we're talking about Frank Miller's douchebag version Superman who bears practically nothing in common with the generally accepted version.

That being said, realistically, there's absolutely no way Batman should win a fight against Superman, even with his kryptonite ring and his precious "prep time." However, since it's usually more convenient for the writers to have Batman win, such will always be the case.

[AmbientFire]

the one thing i've always wondered is how fast superman can react and how fast kryptonite drains his powers - and how fast kryptonite radiation moves through space. It seems to me like superman should be able to, if he is really super-sensitive indeed, knee-jerk spasm himself out of a given location before he is too adversely affected by kryptonite. But kryptonite will always be kryptonite, so there's no way around that of course.
As for the hyper-sonics - has it been stated that superman's super-hearing means that he is not super-resistent to hypersonics? That is, the fact that he can pick up hyper/ultrasonic frequencies - does that automatically mean he cannot resist their effects? (honest question)

[AmbientFire]

Another question - has Superman ever been afforded "Prep time"?

[Andy C.]

the one thing i've always wondered is how fast superman can react and how fast kryptonite drains his powers - and how fast kryptonite radiation moves through space. It seems to me like superman should be able to, if he is really super-sensitive indeed, knee-jerk spasm himself out of a given location before he is too adversely affected by kryptonite. But kryptonite will always be kryptonite, so there's no way around that of course.
As for the hyper-sonics - has it been stated that superman's super-hearing means that he is not super-resistent to hypersonics? That is, the fact that he can pick up hyper/ultrasonic frequencies - does that automatically mean he cannot resist their effects? (honest question)

The effectiveness of kryptonite varies from writer to writer. Sometimes it's practically instant death, sometimes he can still keep fighting for a good while. Sometimes he can be punched in the face or shot in the chest with a shard of it and he'll still be alive, and sometimes he can't go a city block near it without almost passing out. I guess an in-universe way of explaining it would be different isotopes having varying effectiveness, but really it only works as well as the writer wants it to.

Hyper-sonics, on the other hand, have been used a good number of time to momentarily stun Superman. You won't be able to take him out with them, but you can slow him down.

[Andy C.]

Another question - has Superman ever been afforded "Prep time"?

To answer your question with another question: does Superman ever need prep time?

[AmbientFire]

well, the fact that Batman can beat him with this fabled prep time suggests two things to me:

1. When drawing up "how to beat Superman" plans, Superman's awareness of his own weaknesses is under-estimated (why would Superman not plan for the possibility of his enemies having kryptonite or technology, such as hypersonics or good ol' missiles, that can harm him?
2. Superman is uncabable of imagining that somebody can beat him even though he has been harmed, even killed, before - aka, superman is at least mildly retarded. But if he isn't - why on earth wouldn't he have plans for situations that include nukes and kryptonite?

Superman needs preptime because he isn't the most powerful character on earth, we all know that title belongs to Batman w/ prep time. Now IF the writers gave him prep time too we'd be in business.

[CLARKY]

This is a calm response to that ridiculous thread where absolutely nothing was discussed or put up for debate.

Personally, I think too many people are quick to say Batman would beat Superman in a one on one fight. Whether it's popularity, the fact he's a smart mother f**cker, or whatever else, I don't know. But I want to find out.

This thread is open to anyone who would like to share their view of WHAT WOULD OCCUR in a fight between Supes and Bats. I bet we could come up with something ten times better than Miller's fight or that garbage Jeph Loeb spewed out.

Please don't come in here and start sh** :)

Not-again.

[Spare-Flair]

Or How About This One? Would Batman Defeat Doomsday

Batman would invent a time machine and send Doomsday to the end of time. Or just telephone Flash to use his treadmill thing.

[ReTrO JuNkIe 42]

How bout even though Superman was raised on earth, his home planet was how many years ahead of earth. So he should at least have more intelligence then people give him credit for.

[trustyside-kick]

Deep down Supes would win if really wants to...but he always hold himself back and Batman doesn't. That's why most of the time Batman wins.

You got a good point there...Clark is a boyscout, Bruce isn't. Like Bruce said in Hush "Deep down Clark's a good person. Deep down I'm not."...something like that. =P

[user123456789]

You got a good point there...Clark is a boyscout, Bruce isn't. Like Bruce said in Hush "Deep down Clark's a good person. Deep down I'm not."...something like that. =P

:up:

[Junfan]

This is how Batman would beat Superman

http://www.biggercheese.com/comics/0608.png

Did I say beat, I meant get totally pwned :o

That looks about right ;)

[trustyside-kick]

Haha. I love Bats more than Supes but that picture/comic strip is just awesome.