Catwoman's new baby is named...

[sinewave]

Spoiler warning




















Helena!

Not only that, but Bruce said he'd give her a scholarship to the college of her choice. Sounds like he's the baby-daddy and it's eerily similar to the E-2 versions of the characters.

[Tamanon]

Just so you know, you might wanna start with the word Spoiler and some spacing in your post, when you just mouse over the thread title, all the words show up clear as day;)

And either way Bruce does that with a lot of kids actually, or he has. He just really likes making sure kids are taken care of

[The Question]

I'd say that makes Bruce the reighning man whore champion of DC. His illigitimate child count (since Morrison seems to be bringing Son Of the Demon back into continuity) would be two if Catwoman's child is his, and Green Arrow's is only one. I'd also love to see Ibn and Helena growing up together:


Helena: Yeah....well.....by grandad was a crime boss!

Ibn: And mine was an international terrorist!

Helena: ......YOU'RE A MEANY!!!!

[Assassin]

ha?

[sinewave]

edit

[The Question]

You could just edit and put a bunch of spaces in front of what you typed.

[Not Jake]

just edit your original post and hit enter a lot at the start of it, pushing your text down

[sinewave]

cool, thanks guys!

[twylight]

Why would they name her Helena..? There's already a Helena in the DCU..:confused: :(

[Assassin]

same reason why Magpie is dead. They're getting rid of the post CoIE

[The Question]

Why would they name her Helena..? There's already a Helena in the DCU..:confused: :(


So, there can only be one person named Helena in the entire world?


same reason why Magpie is dead. They're getting rid of the post CoIE





Which, I think, is a VERY big mistake.

[Tamanon]

But Huntress is still around. There'll just be two Helena's. It should be easy to tell them apart;)

[twylight]

No, its not that there 'can't' be two Helena's, I just think it's odd, since Helena Bertinelli took the place of Helena Wayne (Pre-Crisis Catwoman's Daughter).

Seems like a step backwards, from all that DC's built up, to name the daughter of Catwoman, Helena.

Someones nostalgic, and tripping down sentimental trail. :o

[Cap1970]

No, its not that there 'can't' be two Helena's, I just think it's odd, since Helena Bertinelli took the place of Helena Wayne (Pre-Crisis Catwoman's Daughter).

Seems like a step backwards, from all that DC's built up, to name the daughter of Catwoman, Helena.

Someones nostalgic, and tripping down sentimental trail. :o

I'm agree with Twy, here. While I can completely see the ties to Earth-2, I can't say I'm at all pleased with Helena being the baby's name. Exactly what does this mean more post-Infinite Crisis Huntress? Anything at all, or a wheezy attempt to breath life back into the multiverse...:(

[The Question]

No, its not that there 'can't' be two Helena's, I just think it's odd, since Helena Bertinelli took the place of Helena Wayne (Pre-Crisis Catwoman's Daughter).

Seems like a step backwards, from all that DC's built up, to name the daughter of Catwoman, Helena.

Someones nostalgic, and tripping down sentimental trail. :o


Well, if the child is a product of Catwoman and Batman makin' sweet lovin' to one another down by the fire, naming the child Helena seems like an obvious nod. It's not a step backwards. At least, not in the way that Superman: Birthright was.

[twylight]

Well, if the child is a product of Catwoman and Batman makin' sweet lovin' to one another down by the fire, naming the child Helena seems like an obvious nod. It's not a step backwards. At least, not in the way that Superman: Birthright was.


It's too obvious of a nod. And if that's the case I think it's done in bad form. DC HAS a Helena..HAS a Huntress, naming a child from Catwoman and Batman "Helena" is like trying to force us to remember the Pre-Crisis Huntress.

We're fan's, we don't NEED to be reminded of that. We don't NEED a Helena Wayne. We don't even need a Helena from Selina.

It feels like DC is forcing us to remember Pre-Crisis and it's uncomfortable feeling.

[Tamanon]

I don't see it as FORCING us to remember it, I see it as an homage to things. When you think about it, Helena won't really be that involved in anything being only a baby. You'll barely even see her. It's more just a nod to some things working out the same.

[Assassin]

Batman prob. shared the earth 2 storys with Selina that earth 2 superman shared w/ him.

[The Question]

It's too obvious of a nod. And if that's the case I think it's done in bad form. DC HAS a Helena..HAS a Huntress, naming a child from Catwoman and Batman "Helena" is like trying to force us to remember the Pre-Crisis Huntress.

We're fan's, we don't NEED to be reminded of that. We don't NEED a Helena Wayne. We don't even need a Helena from Selina.

It feels like DC is forcing us to remember Pre-Crisis and it's uncomfortable feeling.


I understand. Still, as long as baby Helena doesn't become Huntress, I'll be fine with it.

[twylight]

I don't see it as FORCING us to remember it, I see it as an homage to things. When you think about it, Helena won't really be that involved in anything being only a baby. You'll barely even see her. It's more just a nod to some things working out the same.

But with all the work they went through to wipe out the Pre-Crisis stuff why make it so some thing do work out the same?

[stillanerd]

It's too obvious of a nod. And if that's the case I think it's done in bad form. DC HAS a Helena..HAS a Huntress, naming a child from Catwoman and Batman "Helena" is like trying to force us to remember the Pre-Crisis Huntress.

We're fan's, we don't NEED to be reminded of that. We don't NEED a Helena Wayne. We don't even need a Helena from Selina.

It feels like DC is forcing us to remember Pre-Crisis and it's uncomfortable feeling.

Well, the current DCU is an amalgamation of various Earth's but it's also supposed to be an amalgamation of different timelines. In the Return of Donna Troy #4, it was learned that the future for the merged universe wrong, meaning that the end result of COIE was incomplete. It seems as a result of Infinite Crisis, that future will come to pass, quite possibly along a similar, but different track that Superman, Batman, and Wonder Woman took in Earth 2. In a sense, some people from Earth 2 didn't cease to exist--they just haven't been born yet. Also, Helena Bertinelli is from Earth 8, which cements the fact that there was more than one version of certain heroes like the Flash, Green Lantern, Robin, etc. Besides, there were already references to Earth 2 long before Selina giving birth to a "Helena" such as the JSA, Power Girl, Superman being married to Lois Lane, etc.

[twylight]

I understand. Still, as long as baby Helena doesn't become Huntress, I'll be fine with it.

Thank you just as long as my Grandchildren don't see her as Huntress I'm happy. :up:

At least we can both agree on that....;)

On my part I can accept the baby's name as Helena, but I'm not to happy about it. *I have to pick my fights. ;)*

However, if the baby does turn out to be Bruce's it will be intolerable and I shall stand outside DC's HQ and picket.

[Assassin]

I understand. Still, as long as baby Helena doesn't become Huntress, I'll be fine with it.

Not in our lifetime. Tim Drake aged 2 years in 15 years

[Tamanon]

Thank you just as long as my Grandchildren don't see her as Huntress I'm happy. :up:

At least we can both agree on that....;)

On my part I can accept the baby's name as Helena, but I'm not to happy about it. *I have to pick my fights. ;)*

However, if the baby does turn out to be Bruce's it will be intolerable and I shall stand outside DC's HQ and picket.

Oh it won't be Bruce's, I'm positive of that. The name is probably just a tease and it'll be one of the Bradleys I'm thinking. Or maybe just someone new.

Or isn't Dick Grayson a man-whore again?;)

[twylight]

Oh it won't be Bruce's, I'm positive of that. The name is probably just a tease and it'll be one of the Bradleys I'm thinking. Or maybe just someone new.

Or isn't Dick Grayson a man-whore again?;)

It's one of my fears, I'm hoping DC isn't as stupid as that....

I'm pretty sure it'll be Slam's, out of the two Bradley's. :up:



:eek:

Well...he did break it off with Babs :o

[Green Lantern]

I'd say that makes Bruce the reighning man whore champion of DC. His illigitimate child count (since Morrison seems to be bringing Son Of the Demon back into continuity) would be two if Catwoman's child is his, and Green Arrow's is only one. I'd also love to see Ibn and Helena growing up together:


Helena: Yeah....well.....by grandad was a crime boss!

Ibn: And mine was an international terrorist!

Helena: ......YOU'RE A MEANY!!!!Ollie has two; Conner and a child with the assassin Shado (forgive me I don't remember the child's name or gender)

[Green Lantern]

I'm pretty sure it'll be Slam's, if it's one of the two Bradley's. :up:

:eek:

Well...he did break it off with Babs :oand sleep with a different red headed chick that he picked up in a bar Don't forget that part Twy ;)

[GoldenAgeHero]

ha you guys are falling for it. its a setup. batman aint the father, if grant morrison is gonna try and retcon that kid he(bruce) had with thalia, then this is just a false lead. giving batman two kids is pushing it. bruce was just being a friend and offering her a scholarship of her choice. the writers are to smart to already spoiler the father bit. they know you guys know of hellena from earth-2, theyd figure you guys would put the two together, thus bruce is the father. yeah right, nice try DC.

[Assassin]

how do u know he broke it off, it could be her that broke it off, he's the one who looked sad and she had no emotion on BoP

[The Question]

Not in our lifetime. Tim Drake aged 2 years in 15 years


Three years, actually. Four after OYL.

[twylight]

Ollie has two; Conner and a child with the assassin Shado (forgive me I don't remember the child's name or gender)

Robert....it's a boy. :o

EDIT Robert not Richard :O

[GoldenAgeHero]

Three years, actually. Four after OYL.

so wouldnt it be 3 years in 16 years

[The Question]

Richard....it's a boy.



Man, I'd love to see Helena, Lian, Ibn, Richard, and Conner get together at some support group for illigitimate children or something.

[The Question]

so wouldnt it be 3 years in 16 years


No. It would be four years in fifteen years.

[Assassin]

Three years, actually. Four after OYL.

He was 15 when he got his licesnce (he got it early because his dad was handicapped and he needed his help), thats when batman was jean paul valley

Last i checked he was 16..OYL means hes 17

did he become robin at 14?

[The Question]

There abouts. He first met Bruce when he was thirteen, trained for about a year, and set out on his own as a vigilante at 14.

[BlackOpsTengu]

Yay! That's great news for two of my favorite characters! :D

[twylight]

Man, I'd love to see Helena, Lian, Ibn, Richard, and Conner get together at some support group for illigitimate children or something.

Helena: My moms the best reformed villian ever!

Ibn: My mom PWNS!

Lian: My mom can kill all your moms...

Richard: YA! You wish! Mine CAN! Besides..I'm your UNCLE.

Lian: ARE NOT! *kick*

Richard: Are TOO!

*Conner stands over them all*

Conner: Knock it OFF you two! Or I'll have you fletching my arrows!


When did this Ibn news come out..I don't remember reading that they were going to make it cannon... :(

And why the sprock now? :mad:
Leave Batman alone!?! :mad:

[Assassin]

so is he 17 now?

[GoldenAgeHero]

so is he 17 now?

yeah tim is 17 now.

[GoldenAgeHero]

Yay! That's great news for two of my favorite characters! :D

dont get your hopes up, its not even official. and i think the setup is false.

[The Question]

Helena: My moms the best reformed villian ever!

Ibn: My mom PWNS!

Lian: My mom can kill all your moms...

Richard: YA! You wish! Mine CAN! Besides..I'm your UNCLE.

Lian: ARE NOT! *kick*

Richard: Are TOO!

*Conner stands over them all*

Conner: Knock it OFF you two! Or I'll have you fletching my arrows!


When did this Ibn news come out..I don't remember reading that they were going to make it cannon... :(

And why the sprock now? :mad:
Leave Batman alone!?! :mad:



Morrison said his run on Batman is going to hark back to the "hairy chested love god" days of the 70s under the O'Neil/Adams team. He's also strongly hinted that he's bringing "Son of the Demon" into continuity. Not that I'd complain. Although, if Catwoman's daughter is Bruce's, this could make things VERY interesting for Bruce.

[Mee]

I doubt Bats is the father of either baby. But it's just a feeling, nothing to back it up. I seriously doubt he's the father of both.

[sinewave]

yeah, they didn't actually come out and say bruce is the dad. batman made some reference to how beautiful baby helena is when he showed up in selina's apartment like it was the first time he set eyes on her. if he was really the father he probably would have visited them in the hospital at least once before they released selina and the baby. they did show slam giving selina and the baby a ride home from the hospital but selina was definitely not expecting him and he made no reference to the baby like you would expect a father to do. it could very well be sam bradley, based on those factors.

[GoldenAgeHero]

yeah i think theyll let the mystery unfold later in the issue. like a freakin maury pauvich show.

[hippie_hunter]

I'd say that makes Bruce the reighning man whore champion of DC. His illigitimate child count (since Morrison seems to be bringing Son Of the Demon back into continuity) would be two if Catwoman's child is his, and Green Arrow's is only one. I'd also love to see Ibn and Helena growing up together:


Helena: Yeah....well.....by grandad was a crime boss!

Ibn: And mine was an international terrorist!

Helena: ......YOU'RE A MEANY!!!!

Actually he's tied with Green Arrow. Green Arrow has two illegitmate sons. However Batman did adopt Dick Grayson and Jason Todd, while Ollie only adopted Roy Harper and Mia Dearden is currently his ward and not his adopted daughter so I guess Batman does win in a way

[BrianWilly]

I wouldn't leap to the conclusion that this is Batman's kid without having read any of this, but I definitely wouldn't mind if it is.

One thing to remember is that the post-Crisis Helena Bertinelli isn't the same character as Earth-2 Helena Wayne. She's the Huntress from Earth-8; calling her Helena Wayne is like saying that Jason Rusch is Ronnie Raymond.

[Green Lantern]

Or Kyle Rayner is Hal Jordan, which would be the worst insult you could ever throw at poor Kyle :(

[hippie_hunter]

Also if the kid wasn't Batman's many many Batman fans would b***h just like they are about Dick Grayson sleeping with a random woman.

[BrianWilly]

Or Kyle Rayner is Hal Jordan, which would be the worst insult you could ever throw at poor Kyle :(I know, that was actually the first example I thought of, but refrained from using for obvious reasons:p.

[stillanerd]

I doubt Bats it the father of either baby. But it's just a feeling, nothing to back it up. I seriously doubt he's the father of both.

That's certainly a likely possibility. Batman being the father of Selina's daughter is a bit obvious, but certainly possible. There's always the possibility that if baby Helena is Bruce's child that he and Selina have agreed to stay apart in order to keep the child safe, just like the setup for the short-lived Brids of Prey TV series. And even though Grant Morrison is bringing "Son of the Demon" back into continuity, there's always the possibility that Batman doesn't really have a son but it's just a child unrelated to Bruce and Talia that the later is using to try and win Bruce over. Although, the idea of Bruce fathering a child with a woman who he used to love and who is now his sworn enemy would be interesting.

[GyLocke]

If it`s not Bruce`s it will be retconned to be his in four years. Or at least we won`t be sure who is the real father, and there`s gonna be a huge fuss about it, when the Joker kidnaps her or something.
Is Bruce fighting for his own daughter? Stuff like this. So whoever they settle on as the father, doesn`t mean he will be father forever.

[Harlekin]

I'd say that makes Bruce the reighning man whore champion of DC. His illigitimate child count (since Morrison seems to be bringing Son Of the Demon back into continuity) would be two if Catwoman's child is his, and Green Arrow's is only one. I'd also love to see Ibn and Helena growing up together:


Helena: Yeah....well.....by grandad was a crime boss!

Ibn: And mine was an international terrorist!

Helena: ......YOU'RE A MEANY!!!!
Green Arrow also has two illegitimate children. Shado and Connor.

(sorry if it has already been posted)

[Caliber]

It's too obvious of a nod. And if that's the case I think it's done in bad form. DC HAS a Helena..HAS a Huntress, naming a child from Catwoman and Batman "Helena" is like trying to force us to remember the Pre-Crisis Huntress.

We're fan's, we don't NEED to be reminded of that. We don't NEED a Helena Wayne. We don't even need a Helena from Selina.

It feels like DC is forcing us to remember Pre-Crisis and it's uncomfortable feeling.

Thats why I don't like this crisis crap.

[sinewave]

Or Kyle Rayner is Hal Jordan, which would be the worst insult you could ever throw at poor Kyle :(

what's with all the anti-Hal sentiment?

[GoldenAgeHero]

its not batman's period. selena has brunette hair and bruce has black hair. the babay has blonde hair.as far as genetics go those dotn add up, so im ready to throw the whole bruce is the father out thru the window.

[sinewave]

its not batman's period. selena has brunette hair and bruce has black hair. the babay has blonde hair.as far as genetics go those dotn add up, so im ready to throw the whole bruce is the father out thru the window.

that makes no sense, dude. i'm a brunette but had light blonde hair as a baby. it happens all the time.

[Green Lantern]

My mom has blonde hair, my step dad has blonde hair, my sister's is dark brown, so that doesn't really matter GAH, you don't know what Selina's parents hair colors were. The blonde could have been a recessive gene. Or many times a baby is born blonde and it gets darker. I was born bright blonde, and now have dark brown hair.

Sinewave: I've always had anti-Hal sentiment. The only time I've even somewhat liked him is: A) Denny O'Neil B) Geoff Johns, and Johns has been lacking the past few issues.

[sinewave]

Sinewave: I've always had anti-Hal sentiment. The only time I've even somewhat liked him is: A) Denny O'Neil B) Geoff Johns, and Johns has been lacking the past few issues.

yeah, i'm a fan of the o'neil/adams era hal. johns' has been pretty cool, too. i also loved darwyn cooke's version of him in "dc: the new frontier".

[The Question]

New Fronteir probably has the best Hal cgaracterization in years. As for Johns, he can write Hal's personality well, but the stories in his GL series are pretty generic super hero fare. If Hal had actually kept some responsibility for Paralax, they could have had some great stories with Hal trying to regain the trust of the corps.

[GoldenAgeHero]

that makes no sense, dude. i'm a brunette but had light blonde hair as a baby. it happens all the time.

it doesnt really matter. bruce has black hair,which is a dominant gene, the baby is really suppose to have black hair.

[drastic_quench]

I'm WAY more excited about Ibn al Xu'ffasch. He could be introduced as teenager (a much better character to write than a baby) by Morrison.

[The Caped Knight]

Spoiler warning

Helena!

Not only that, but Bruce said he'd give her a scholarship to the college of her choice. Sounds like he's the baby-daddy and it's eerily similar to the E-2 versions of the characters.

:eek: Now I really believe Bruce is The Father & Selina knows it

[Assassin]

Thats why I don't like this crisis crap.

Then go back to the marvel thread buddy!:mad: :down

[sinewave]

I'm WAY more excited about Ibn al Xu'ffasch. He could be introduced as teenager (a much better character to write than a baby) by Morrison.

is that really the name of talia's kid? where do they come up with that stuff?

[Assassin]

it suposidly means son of the deamon in arabic, but its not (well not in iraqi tounge anyway)

[sinewave]

it suposidly means son of the deamon in arabic, but its not (well not in iraqi tounge anyway)

i thought "ra's" was supposed to mean demon? is this like when black girls are named "shaniqua" and "uniqua" and other variations on those names and they're all supposed to translate to "african princess"?

[GoldenAgeHero]

i thought "ra's" was supposed to mean demon? is this like when black girls are named "shaniqua" and "uniqua" and other variations on those names and they're all supposed to translate to "african princess"?


nah they just make it up for the hell of it. some, i can make them up as a i please, bonifa, taniqua,shanta, fanisha,telekenua(lmao). names like ashanti stand for african princess(or something like that)

[Assassin]

Ra's does mean head

Ras al gaoul translated to head of the heamon, but deamon isnt said like that in the arabic i know

[ChrisBaleBatman]

Isn't Ghul translated into Head? which is why Talia's last name is Head?

I think I read that his son's name might mean Son of the Bat, or something like that.

[sinewave]

Ra's does mean head

Ras al gaoul translated to head of the heamon, but deamon isnt said like that in the arabic i know

ok, hold on a second. if "ra's" is supposed to mean "head", then i would assume that "al ghul" is supposed to mean "demon", right? if so, why is talia's last name "al ghul" and everyone calls her "talia head"? i think you've got them backwards.

[The Question]

I'm assuming that arabic grammar is different from english.

[Assassin]

dude, i speak arabic, Raas means head, i think al ghul is some bs they made up because of the english word GOUL...like ghosts gouls and goblins?

Ibin does mean Son in arabic, and that isnt how u say bat.

and yea you're right his name is son of the bat, my bad.

[drastic_quench]

Ibn al Xu'ffasch means Son of the Bat.

[Assassin]

according to DC..but not in real life

[Cap1970]

Call me crazy, but at the end of Son of the Demon, weren't the adopting couple Caucasian in appearance?? Not saying that they couldn't name the kid Ibn al Xu'ffasch or anything, but it would seem odd, wouldn't it?

[drastic_quench]

according to DC..but not in real life
Maybe it's Farsi?

[GyLocke]

Lol.
Talia Head.
*pointing out the obvious.

[drastic_quench]

She actually goes by the name Talia Head in the comics, now. Still not as good as Bond's Dr. Goodhead.

[Assassin]

maybe..but IBin and Rass translate

[twylight]

Green Arrow also has two illegitimate children. Shado and Connor.

(sorry if it has already been posted)


Connor and Robert from Shado. :o ;)

[Swordmaster]

Not sure if this has been stated already (if it has I beg your forgiveness :o)

Maybe the reason the baby's name is Helena is because Huntress did something really good to Catwoman, like sacrificing herself for her during 52.

[Harlekin]

Connor and Robert from Shado. :o ;)
Yep. Right.

Sorry. :blush:

[twylight]

Yep. Right.

Sorry. :blush:


;)

Remember, I'm the Black Canary fan so any child by her ex-lover is of interest to me.
And I also misnamed him a few pages back anyway so. :o ;)

[sinewave]

;)

Remember, I'm the Black Canary fan so any child by her ex-lover is of interest to me.
And I also misnamed him a few pages back anyway so. :o ;)

is that who that is in your avatar?

[The Question]

Not sure if this has been stated already (if it has I beg your forgiveness :o)

Maybe the reason the baby's name is Helena is because Huntress did something really good to Catwoman, like sacrificing herself for her during 52.



That. Cannot. Happen. If that happens, the two of my four favorite DC characters will be dead. And I shall tear down the very pillars of creation in retribution.

[Batman]

Not sure if this has been stated already (if it has I beg your forgiveness :o)

Maybe the reason the baby's name is Helena is because Huntress did something really good to Catwoman, like sacrificing herself for her during 52.

I sure as hell hope not.

[hippie_hunter]

Not sure if this has been stated already (if it has I beg your forgiveness :o)

Maybe the reason the baby's name is Helena is because Huntress did something really good to Catwoman, like sacrificing herself for her during 52.
The Huntress is still alive in Birds of Prey One Year Later :o

[Motown Marvel]

has there been any confirmation as to wo the father is? is is bruce being the father still speculation? havent been reading catwoman....

[hippie_hunter]

Batman snuck in to Selina's house offered tuition to any college in the world and a teddy bear. Selina then said that they needed to talk. Also the child is named Helena: the daughter of the Batman and Catwoman of Earth-2.

[Assassin]

Not sure if this has been stated already (if it has I beg your forgiveness :o)

Maybe the reason the baby's name is Helena is because Huntress did something really good to Catwoman, like sacrificing herself for her during 52.

I thought of that, but i thought of IC..but she's in BoP OYL so we're both wrong:down

[droogiedroogie2]

So, there can only be one person named Helena in the entire world?








Which, I think, is a VERY big mistake.Yeahr.

[droogiedroogie2]

So you guys think she got Slammed by Bradley? Sounds like a great DCU porno title.

[hippie_hunter]

No, I think the father is Batman. DC wouldn't risk alienating so many fans by having Selina father someone elses child, plus the general public basically sees it as Batman + Catwoman, not Batman + Talia, not Batman + Silver St. Cloud, not Batman + Sasha Bordeaux, not Batman + Wonder Woman, not Batman + Vickie Vale, or Batman + Julie Madison.

[MinNoir]

I say, I've had one hell of a time reading this. The folks over at CBR, say that Slam is the Daddy. I perfer this crowd. I like the idea that Bruce/Bats is the father. Now it would be funny if Bruce and Talia's Ibn came about in this continuity teenager or not, it makes for one hell of a family comedy.

Oh, by the way Twy http://canarynoir.com my mentor CanaryNoir's website. She is one of the biggest Black Canary fans on the face of the earth. I'm sure you two would love chatting about her. CN is very nice, and is like a dictionary on the Birds of Prey. She also loves FMA.

Now getting back to Cats, Bats and other children. I was planning to pick up CW but got sidetracked by an American Association for Cancer Research. So I'll try to see if my local shop saved me a copy. But after reading all the spoilers, I'll conclude that he is more than likely the possible father, but wasn't he out of the country? I don't know maybe I'm reading to much into the folks at CBR's thread about Cats and her baby girl.

[droogiedroogie2]

No, I think the father is Batman. DC wouldn't risk alienating so many fans by having Selina father someone elses child, plus the general public basically sees it as Batman + Catwoman, not Batman + Talia, not Batman + Silver St. Cloud, not Batman + Sasha Bordeaux, not Batman + Wonder Woman, not Batman + Vickie Vale, or Batman + Julie Madison.You're very correct, and that's one of the reasons that I wish it would turn out to be Batman's kid. But you also notice that DC is afraid of committing to anything that is a real change to the universe. They wouldn't let Dick and Babs finally marry. They wouldn't kill Blue Beetle without bringing another one back. They're repealing all the alterations post-COIE, at least it appears so. They even brought back Jason Todd. Everything that changed something in the last 20 years is being rolled back, and every time it looks like we're ready for a substantial development in the present, it's snatched away from us. A progression in the relationship between Bruce and Selina doesn't look likely.

[twylight]

is that who that is in your avatar?

No, my Avatar is Imra Ardeen AKA Saturn Girl from the Legion of Super-Heroes..my second DC fan favorite.;)


I say, I've had one hell of a time reading this. The folks over at CBR, say that Slam is the Daddy. I perfer this crowd. I like the idea that Bruce/Bats is the father. Now it would be funny if Bruce and Talia's Ibn came about in this continuity teenager or not, it makes for one hell of a family comedy.

Oh, by the way Twy http://canarynoir.com my mentor CanaryNoir's website. She is one of the biggest Black Canary fans on the face of the earth. I'm sure you two would love chatting about her. CN is very nice, and is like a dictionary on the Birds of Prey. She also loves FMA.

Now getting back to Cats, Bats and other children. I was planning to pick up CW but got sidetracked by an American Association for Cancer Research. So I'll try to see if my local shop saved me a copy. But after reading all the spoilers, I'll conclude that he is more than likely the possible father, but wasn't he out of the country? I don't know maybe I'm reading to much into the folks at CBR's thread about Cats and her baby girl.

I'm with the Slam/Selena Trippers :up:

Thank you Min. I've been there. ;)
It's actually my favorite site. Sadly I wouldn't have a clue how to get in touch with her. Also I'm touch and go on out sites since, I'm always...here....

The last time in which we saw Slam was ...the last issue. :(
In #52 He was unconcious and beat up badly. But Selina was talking to him. She wanted an opinion and went to him, not Batman which for me is more than a little telling.
Also this is 12 months later, since gestation is 9 months she became pregnant 3 months into the One year gap. Since she's shown close to Slam in the last issue it seems like he'd be the logical choice.

[sinewave]

No, my Avatar is Imra Ardeen AKA Saturn Girl from the Legion of Super-Heroes..my second DC fan favorite.;)


cool, i couldn't tell who it was from the headshot.


I'm with the Slam/Selena Trippers :up:

Thank you Min. I've been there. ;)
It's actually my favorite site. Sadly I wouldn't have a clue how to get in touch with her. Also I'm touch and go on out sites since, I'm always...here....

The last time in which we saw Slam was ...the last issue. :(
In #53 He was unconcious and beat up badly. But Selina was talking to him. She wanted an opinion and went to him, not Batman which for me is more than a little telling.
Also this is 12 months later, since gestation is 9 months she became pregnant 3 months into the One year gap. Since she's shown close to Slam in the last issue it seems like he'd be the logical choice.

i'd be fine with slam being the pappa. i've always liked that guy.

[twylight]

cool, i couldn't tell who it was from the headshot.


She's licking a Saturn shaped lollipop. :(




Yeah and it's issue #52 isn't it? :(

Darn..I'm on a roll...

[MinNoir]

I'd be a little ticked if Bruce wasn't the father, I don't have a thing aganist Slam, it's just I grew up a Bat/Cat fan, and so I have my own natural bias.

Oh! If you want to chat with CN, let me know! PM me, I'll send you to her forum, you don't have to post like you do here, just a little hi and what not, small talk really. But she is a lovely person!

[twylight]

I'd be a little ticked if Bruce wasn't the father, I don't have a thing aganist Slam, it's just I grew up a Bat/Cat fan, and so I have my own natural bias.

Oh! If you want to chat with CN, let me know! PM me, I'll send you to her forum, you don't have to post like you do here, just a little hi and what not, small talk really. But she is a lovely person!


I grew up one to. Then I discovered Slam..now I'm a rebel. :up:
I love that man so much.

My problem with Bat/Cat is what I said earlier in the thread.
If it's Bruces child that's nice. But since Selina named her 'Helena' I've got issues with that.

This isn't Pre-Crisis, they shouldn't be treating it like it is. Nice 'homage' there DC, but pushing it JUST a bit much.


I'd love to talk to her. :) I'll shoot you a PM.

[raybia]

It's too We don't NEED a Helena Wayne. We don't even need a Helena from Selina.

It feels like DC is forcing us to remember Pre-Crisis and it's uncomfortable feeling.


Well it beats Brucana Wayne.

[Assassin]

ay, you seem to know arabic raybia, am i right on what I said in the other page?

[sinewave]

She's licking a Saturn shaped lollipop. :(




Yeah and it's issue #52 isn't it? :(

Darn..I'm on a roll...

i couldn't tell what that was in her mouth and am regretting bringing it up now due to your responses. :(

[raybia]

ay, you seem to know arabic raybia, am i right on what I said in the other page?


Ra's does mean "Head."

Al-Ghul means "the Ghoul"

Ibn means "son".

I believe the arabic word for bat is χuffá.

[Assassin]

what kind of toung do you speak? I know the Iraqie slang, but i can understand almost all except farsi

[sinewave]

Ra's does mean "Head."

Al-Ghul means "the Ghoul"

Ibn means "son".

I believe the arabic word for bat is χuffá.

so talia's last name should be ra's, not al-ghul, right? otherwise talia head would be an inaccurate translation.

[stillanerd]

Here's a question: If Batman isn't the father of Selina's baby, would you feel that Will Pfeifer, and likewise DC, have squandered a golden opportunity in having Batman and Catwoman have child together? Marketing wise, it would be a huge event, considering how the average person on the street associates Catwoman as Batman's love interest.

[hippie_hunter]

Here's a question: If Batman isn't the father of Selina's baby, would you feel that Will Pfeifer, and likewise DC, have squandered a golden opportunity in having Batman and Catwoman have child together? Marketing wise, it would be a huge event, considering how the average person on the street associates Catwoman as Batman's love interest.

There will be mass b**hing, no doubt about it. It would be like how people were complaining about Nightwing sleeping with a random woman, but worse.

[Assassin]

so talia's last name should be ra's, not al-ghul, right? otherwise talia head would be an inaccurate translation.

Yup

I was right about 3 of the 4 words

[twylight]

Here's a question: If Batman isn't the father of Selina's baby, would you feel that Will Pfeifer, and likewise DC, have squandered a golden opportunity in having Batman and Catwoman have child together?

No.


Marketing wise, it would be a huge event, considering how the average person on the street associates Catwoman as Batman's love interest.

When would this marketing event occur? We've got 52 going on right now and OYL stuff. Not to mention tons of fallout in all the books with the potential to go on for years.

Besides, she's just a baby. They can't do anything with her until she get's older.
In that case Selina could say the baby is anyones and then 20 years down the line say "Oops..look at the DNA I lied..it's Bruce's baby."

In which case I'd drop many DC titles.

[sinewave]

Yup

I was right about 3 of the 4 words

i like "talia the demon", that has a nice, ominous ring to it.

[raybia]

so talia's last name should be ra's, not al-ghul, right? otherwise talia head would be an inaccurate translation.


In old arab tradition, an Arabic name will begin with a given name, followed by the name of the person's father, perhaps followed by the names of other ancestors, and ended with a family or clan name.

Based on this, Talia name should be: Talia Bint Ra's.

Today, many Arab use the traditional method, so it wouldn't be incorrect, and probably more common for her to use Talia Al-Ghul as well.

Essentially a choice between "Old school" and "New school".

[stillanerd]

When would this marketing event occur? We've got 52 going on right now and OYL stuff. Not to mention tons of fallout in all the books with the potential to go on for years.

Besides, she's just a baby. They can't do anything with her until she get's older.
In that case Selina could say the baby is anyones and then 20 years down the line say "Oops..look at the DNA I lied..it's Bruce's baby."

In which case I'd drop many DC titles.

Well, whenever the issue of Catwoman that sports the burlb: "The Father is Revealed!" which will happen, I bet, probably around the same issue of 52 where we see how Helena was concieved. And if those issues DO reveal that Batman is Baby Helena's father, the media is going to eat that up, and it will most likely appear in a short burlb in Time Magazine (which is an affliate of AOL/Time/Warner which owns DC comics) similair to what they did when Superman recieved electric powers. Might even caption it off with "Holy Fatherhood, Batfans! Batman and Catwoman have a child together!" or something along those lines. This of course will make people buy that issue of Catwoman to read about Selina announcing Bats being the father. If the father of Selina's baby isn't Bats but someone else, then DC basically threw away a sales opportunity.

[twylight]

Well, whenever the issue of Catwoman that sports the burlb: "The Father is Revealed!" which will happen, I bet, probably around the same issue of 52 where we see how Helena was concieved. And if those issues DO reveal that Batman is Baby Helena's father, the media is going to eat that up, and it will most likely appear in a short burlb in Time Magazine (which is an affliate of AOL/Time/Warner which owns DC comics) similair to what they did when Superman recieved electric powers. Might even caption it off with "Holy Fatherhood, Batfans! Batman and Catwoman have a child together!" or something along those lines. This of course will make people buy that issue of Catwoman to read about Selina announcing Bats being the father. If the father of Selina's baby isn't Bats but someone else, then DC basically threw away a sales opportunity.


Oh, I see, DC's bid to drag in more non-comic customers? It wouldn't really get them anything.
I know it looks like it might be magical, but people aren't going to run out and buy the books because of that..if anything the casual reader is going to wonder if they'll show that in a movie.

In the process it wouldn't do much for the fan base. Some would rejoice, some would hate it. But it would effect the Batman character. People would look critically on him as to why he's not more involved with the baby, why Selina won't let him be involved. Etc..etc...soap opera stuff.

[raybia]

Oh, I see, DC's bid to drag in more non-comic customers? It wouldn't really get them anything.
I know it looks like it might be magical, but people aren't going to run out and buy the books because of that..if anything the casual reader is going to wonder if they'll show that in a movie.

In the process it wouldn't do much for the fan base. Some would rejoice, some would hate it. But it would effect the Batman character. People would look critically on him as to why he's not more involved with the baby, why Selina won't let him be involved. Etc..etc...soap opera stuff.

It would be cool to see Bruce change a diaper!

Bruce: Uh, Alfred!!!

[Benstamania]

I just find it hilarious that the master of Self Discipline can't keep it in his pants. :p

[Assassin]

In old arab tradition, an Arabic name will begin with a given name, followed by the name of the person's father, perhaps followed by the names of other ancestors, and ended with a family or clan name.

Based on this, Talia name should be: Talia Bint Ra's.

Today, many Arab use the traditional method, so it wouldn't be incorrect, and probably more common for her to use Talia Al-Ghul as well.

Essentially a choice between "Old school" and "New school".

Talia Daughter of Head

Sounds like a porn star:up:

[stillanerd]

Oh, I see, DC's bid to drag in more non-comic customers? It wouldn't really get them anything.
I know it looks like it might be magical, but people aren't going to run out and buy the books because of that..if anything the casual reader is going to wonder if they'll show that in a movie.

In the process it wouldn't do much for the fan base. Some would rejoice, some would hate it. But it would effect the Batman character. People would look critically on him as to why he's not more involved with the baby, why Selina won't let him be involved. Etc..etc...soap opera stuff.

Well, you certainly make some good points, and it certainly would be a temporary hike in interest at best. However, from a marketing standpoint, I'd be very surprised if DC hasn't considered it. And as for Bruce not being involved and Selina not letting him be involved, I'm sure that, if Helena is their child, DC will just borrow an idea from the short-lived Birds of Prey series and say that it was for their daughter's own protection that she be raised by Batman, in case somebody found out and could possibly harm Selina or Helena to get to him.

[WompuM]

I think DC should throw a wrench in all of our gears and make the teenaged Ibn the father. That would be crazy.

[twylight]

Well, you certainly make some good points, and it certainly would be a temporary hike in interest at best. However, from a marketing standpoint, I'd be very surprised if DC hasn't considered it. And as for Bruce not being involved and Selina not letting him be involved, I'm sure that, if Helena is their child, DC will just borrow an idea from the short-lived Birds of Prey series and say that it was for their daughter's own protection that she be raised by Batman, in case somebody found out and could possibly harm Selina or Helena to get to him.


Easy way to brush the child under the carpet and dodge the subject of how it would really effect Bruce's character. Not Batman..Bruce.

As you said it would be for Marketing only and would do nothing to really 'grow' the characters. They aren't going to put Bruce in a position to have to handle a child.

Which comes back to my absolute hatred of the baby being Bruce's.

[MinNoir]

Stillanerd has a point, as does Twy, and I have to support Stillanerd only because it makes sense. It puts the plug in for that short-lived series, damn WB really should have waited. Character wise, it does do something to Bruce. It kinda throws him back to being the paranoid/angry guy he sorta kinda is. Because of the life he has chosen, it puts not only him, but everyone around him in danger.

It hurts him, it hurts Selina and importantly it hurts the child. He can't be in her life, that hurts him, it hurts Selina that the possible love of her life can't be there to share the tender moments. Helena then possibly harbors resentment aganist her father, which isn't really off base, but is.

The "Soap Opera" factor, c'mon that's a gimme. Comic books are kinda like Soap Operas. Minus some of the cheese factor. Look at what has happened over the last twenty some odd years tell me that doesn't speak Soap Opera.

[RAMORE]

i read a preview that indicated to me that she was raped by some thugs she tried to stop one night. it wasn't exsplicit but that seemed to be what might happen knowing she was gonna have the baby.

[droogiedroogie2]

i read a preview that indicated to me that she was raped by some thugs she tried to stop one night. it wasn't exsplicit but that seemed to be what might happen knowing she was gonna have the baby.Oooh, let's play the rape card again, see if we can sell some more books! YAY! AND we can have some pregnancy and a baby! Even better! Marketing score!

I hadn't seen that preview. Care to hook a guy up, or are you just full of ****?

[sinewave]

i read a preview that indicated to me that she was raped by some thugs she tried to stop one night. it wasn't exsplicit but that seemed to be what might happen knowing she was gonna have the baby.

hmmmm, so is gotham in south dakota?

[droogiedroogie2]

hmmmm, so is gotham in south dakota?Why, because SoDak is known for its rapes?

I mean, is it? I've never heard that. Almost everybody I live with is from there and I've never heard that.

[sinewave]

Why, because SoDak is known for its rapes?

I mean, is it? I've never heard that. Almost everybody I live with is from there and I've never heard that.

i was referring to the new abortion laws there. you know, where you can't get an abortion even if you've been raped.

[droogiedroogie2]

Except on Indian territory. Chief Cecilia Thunderfire (or Firethunder) has declared that she will put a clinic on her own land if she has to. For the same reasons that the res can have a casino when other places in a state can't, the res can have an abortion clinic. Way to go Native American badasses.

Of course, if it goes through, there'll be a war between the Native Americans and the local rednecks who hate them anyway.

[sinewave]

Except on Indian territory. Chief Cecilia Thunderfire (or Firethunder) has declared that she will put a clinic on her own land if she has to. For the same reasons that the res can have a casino when other places in a state can't, the res can have an abortion clinic. Way to go Native American badasses.

Of course, if it goes through, there'll be a war between the Native Americans and the local rednecks who hate them anyway.

yeah, i read about that. good for her.

anywho, we probably shouldn't let this thread devolve into a political debate. who knows who might get all self-righteous about this topic.

that'd kinda suck if selina's baby is the result of a rape. i think at this point i'd rather have slam be the dad.

[Miss Webb]

"Helena," huh.

How fresh. How original. How cornball. Let's just jam and force characters and circumstance to fit, and figure it all out later.

[twylight]

"Helena," huh.

How fresh. How original. How cornball. Let's just jam and force characters and circumstance to fit, and figure it all out later.


Join the club for the Helena Frustrated. :up:

[MinNoir]

Well you know its not like we get a say on who she screwed with or got screwed by. It doesn't matter either way, Helena "Kyle" still kicks ass just for being Selina's daughter.

[RAMORE]

Oooh, let's play the rape card again, see if we can sell some more books! YAY! AND we can have some pregnancy and a baby! Even better! Marketing score!

I hadn't seen that preview. Care to hook a guy up, or are you just full of ****?


Sorry don't know where it's at i looked for it someone else posted the link. It had her checking out some crooks she jumps in on them and one she doesn't see hits her from behind. And that was it but i immediately thought she's having a baby soon i wonder if those punks rape her?

[RAMORE]

i was referring to the new abortion laws there. you know, where you can't get an abortion even if you've been raped.


Really how did they get around the supreme court decision? I wish we could do that in our state. Sorry don't wanna offend anyone but i'm not for it.

[sinewave]

Sorry don't know where it's at i looked for it someone else posted the link. It had her checking out some crooks she jumps in on them and one she doesn't see hits her from behind. And that was it but i immediately thought she's having a baby soon i wonder if those punks rape her?

that's from the latest issue where holly is catwoman. i'm guessing we won't find out how she got pregnant and by who until well into "52".

[sinewave]

Really how did they get around the supreme court decision? I wish we could do that in our state. Sorry don't wanna offend anyone but i'm not for it.

it's the state's decision. they passed a bill in their supreme court, i believe.

[Green Lantern]

it's the state's decision. they passed a bill in their supreme court, i believe.Being a native South Dakotan, (and one in full support of the bill) Our legislators passed the bill so that it will challenge Roe v. Wade with the two new Justices. I'm also sad to say regarding the "SoDak is known for its rapes" comment that sadly my home town of Rapid IS the per capita rape capital of the country :(

[droogiedroogie2]

Being a native South Dakotan, (and one in full support of the bill) Our legislators passed the bill so that it will challenge Roe v. Wade with the two new Justices. I'm also sad to say regarding the "SoDak is known for its rapes" comment that sadly my home town of Rapid IS the per capita rape capital of the country :(You're from Rapid, huh? Gotta say I always love to visit the town but I'd never wanna live there. You still live in Rapid?

[Green Lantern]

Yessir, where do you hail from?

[droogiedroogie2]

Middle of Kansas. I'm going to college with a bunch of guys from Freeman, near Sioux Falls. They're from near Sioux Falls, I mean. The college is in Kansas. We're all Mennonites at a Mennonite college. I make it up to Freeman sometimes with them, and last Spring Break I was in Rapid.

[Green Lantern]

Ah.

[Assassin]

you mean you're from kansas and you didnt go to smallville high?

[The Caped Knight]

This might be proof that Bruce is in Fact Helena father. apparently this Batwoman [named Helena] has The same D.N.A as Bruce.

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c111/Phoenix_Skyborne/scansdaily/sb08-09.jpg

Superman/Batman #24.

[droogiedroogie2]

you mean you're from kansas and you didnt go to smallville high?Yep. Figured that might be coming.

Smallville High, incidentally, is nothing like the real Kansas. Our jocks and preppies are *******s, no exceptions. Hell, everyone in a Kansas high school is an *******. Clark would have been no different.

[sinewave]

Being a native South Dakotan, (and one in full support of the bill) Our legislators passed the bill so that it will challenge Roe v. Wade with the two new Justices. I'm also sad to say regarding the "SoDak is known for its rapes" comment that sadly my home town of Rapid IS the per capita rape capital of the country :(

that sucks. i've always been interested in visiting rapid city. i live in omaha right now and we're not far from you. anywho, bummer about being "rapetown". :(

[stillanerd]

This might be proof that Bruce is in Fact Helena father. apparently this Batwoman [named Helena] has The same D.N.A as Bruce.

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c111/Phoenix_Skyborne/scansdaily/sb08-09.jpg

Superman/Batman #24.

A child inherits genetic traits from the DNA of BOTH parents and would NOT have indentical DNA from a single parent. Most likely Batwoman in Superman/Batman is a "duplicate from another dimension" (unless somebody can correct me on this) only instead of becoming male, that universe's "Bruce" was a female--similair in concept to an episode of Sliders where Quinn visited a world in which his duplicate was female. Which makes sense in the context of this: http://www.biology-online.org/2/6_sex_chromosomes.htm
and this: http://paternityangel.com/Articles_zone/How_it_happens/How-4.htm

[drastic_quench]

Rapid City's a hole (without even getting into the rapes). Really, it's one of the seediest places I've ever been. It's dripping with crappy little run down 'casinos', loan shark paycheck huts, and trailers.

[droogiedroogie2]

Rapid City's a hole (without even getting into the rapes). Really, it's one of the seediest places I've ever been. It's dripping with crappy little run down 'casinos', loan shark paycheck huts, and trailers.That's why it's cool. I love places like Rapid because there's none of the high-class coast-liberal bullsht to bother with. People don't expect you to drink a latte to prove your progressivism. They don't expect you to prove anything at all. They expect you to drink beer like any good Midwestern boy does, and to have a good reason for getting into fights. And that's about it.

[trustyside-kick]

its not batman's period. selena has brunette hair and bruce has black hair. the babay has blonde hair.as far as genetics go those dotn add up, so im ready to throw the whole bruce is the father out thru the window.

I have a cousin whose dad has black hair and his mom has brown/brunette hair and he has blonde hair and blue eyes along with his sister...

[Purple Man]

I still got my fingers crossed for Wayne.

Bruce and Selina getting married and having a kid was always the future I imagined for Batman and Catwoman even before I knew what an Earth 2 or a Huntress were. I never got to witness any of that until much later since I was born the year of the crisis (1985, better than saying year of the Ox)

A child in the Batmans life would always be an interesting dynamic.

[Anubis]

I have a cousin whose dad has black hair and his mom has brown/brunette hair and he has blonde hair and blue eyes along with his sister...

...I think momma mighta been messin around behind daddys back for those two.

[GoldenAgeHero]

...I think momma mighta been messin around behind daddys back for those two.


or albino.

[GoldenAgeHero]

This might be proof that Bruce is in Fact Helena father. apparently this Batwoman [named Helena] has The same D.N.A as Bruce.

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c111/Phoenix_Skyborne/scansdaily/sb08-09.jpg

Superman/Batman #24.

god i hate that book, and mcguiness still sucks. plus does is the book labeled OYL, if its not ignore it.

[Purple Man]

Funny thing is, I still love the book and love the art.


You are a stupid stupid man. As evident by the use of the words "Wonder P*ssy"

Grow up.

[ShadowBoxing]

I'd say that makes Bruce the reighning man whore champion of DC. His illigitimate child count (since Morrison seems to be bringing Son Of the Demon back into continuity) would be two if Catwoman's child is his, and Green Arrow's is only one. I'd also love to see Ibn and Helena growing up together:


Helena: Yeah....well.....by grandad was a crime boss!

Ibn: And mine was an international terrorist!

Helena: ......YOU'RE A MEANY!!!!having illegitimate children doesn't make you a man whore, just an irresponsible deuschbag

[The Caped Knight]

More proof that BATMAN is in fact Helena father.

Catwoman : OYL

http://img67.imageshack.us/img67/5241/catwoman5457ay.jpg
No other preson in Gotham knows how dangerous Gotham really is other than Bruce/BATMAN .

[trustyside-kick]

...I think momma mighta been messin around behind daddys back for those two.

No...she didn't...

[Green Lantern]

It could also be Slam... he's worked the Gotham streets for years as a detective, so that blanket statement doesn't really scream "OMIGOD IT'S BRUCES BABY!"

[ToddIsDead]

At this point, I don't think we really need any more evidence. I'm sure we all pretty much know.

[twylight]

It could also be Slam... he's worked the Gotham streets for years as a detective, so that blanket statement doesn't really scream "OMIGOD IT'S BRUCES BABY!"

I was just going to comment on that.

Wasn't Slam beaten senseless by Black Mask before OYL?

[hippie_hunter]

I'd say that makes Bruce the reighning man whore champion of DC. His illigitimate child count (since Morrison seems to be bringing Son Of the Demon back into continuity) would be two if Catwoman's child is his, and Green Arrow's is only one. I'd also love to see Ibn and Helena growing up together:


Helena: Yeah....well.....by grandad was a crime boss!

Ibn: And mine was an international terrorist!

Helena: ......YOU'RE A MEANY!!!!

No way, Green Arrow also has two illegitimate children and has slept with way more women than Batman has. His only rival is his pupil: Arsenal (who also has a bastard child)

[sinewave]

It could also be Slam... he's worked the Gotham streets for years as a detective, so that blanket statement doesn't really scream "OMIGOD IT'S BRUCES BABY!"

that's what i was thinking. slam's been around gotham longer than batman has.

[sinewave]

At this point, I don't think we really need any more evidence. I'm sure we all pretty much know.

i'm still not totally convinced it's bruce's kid. he's still the most likely suspect, but it's not a lock.

[twylight]

No way, Green Arrow also has two illegitimate children and has slept with way more women than Batman has. His only rival is his pupil: Arsenal (who also has a bastard child)

We've been over that :p

[hippie_hunter]

We've been over that :p

You slept with Arsenal :eek:

**** :mad:

[The Caped Knight]

It could also be Slam... he's worked the Gotham streets for years as a detective, so that blanket statement doesn't really scream "OMIGOD IT'S BRUCES BABY!"

Are you kidden me, Bruce knows everything their is to know about Gotham. More than Slam. Their's more things that show that bruce is the father more than slam.

for starters The name is a deadgive away


Helena

[GoldenAgeHero]

More proof that BATMAN is in fact Helena father.

Catwoman : OYL

http://img67.imageshack.us/img67/5241/catwoman5457ay.jpg
No other preson in Gotham knows how dangerous Gotham really is other than Bruce/BATMAN .


i really dont read anything that proves batman is the father, stop trying to make blank statements.

[sinewave]

Are you kidden me, Bruce knows everything their is to know about Gotham. More than Slam. Their's more things that show that bruce is the father more than slam.

for starters The name is a deadgive away


Helena

have you ever considered that the writers and editors might be trying to fool us into thinking it's batman? i'm still not totally convinced.

[GoldenAgeHero]

i'm still not totally convinced it's bruce's kid. he's still the most likely suspect, but it's not a lock.

i very much doubt its batmans kid, i mean he was right there when he offered the baby a full scholarship etc, plus bats is a detective so im pretty sure he wouldve known and wouldve been hinted throughout the batman books or solicits.

[GoldenAgeHero]

have you ever considered that the writers and editors might be trying to fool us into thinking it's batman? i'm still not totally convinced.

exactly, and he was stupid enough to fall for it.

[The Caped Knight]

have you ever considered that the writers and editors might be trying to fool us into thinking it's batman? i'm still not totally convinced.

It's possible althought I still believe BATS is the father .

[sinewave]

It's possible althought I still believe BATS is the father .

fair enough.

[Nightwing]

More proof that BATMAN is in fact Helena father.

Catwoman : OYL

http://img67.imageshack.us/img67/5241/catwoman5457ay.jpg
No other preson in Gotham knows how dangerous Gotham really is other than Bruce/BATMAN .

It still doesn't mean that Bruce is the father, sure he understands more than anyone how rough those streets can be. But if anyone can remember, Slam Bradley used to be a real tough hard hitting private detective and also knows what Gotham's deep and darkest corners are like. Whoever the baby belongs too, Bruce or Slam, I'll be happy.

[batnkevlar]

What about Wildcat? What if it's HIS kid?

[GoldenAgeHero]

wildcat? how so?

[twylight]

Others have mentioned it and the only basis is a bathtub call and him training her. I'm not seeing anything substantial.

[Nightwing]

What about Wildcat? What if it's HIS kid?

They had nothing more then a mutual attraction toward eachother.

[Anubis]

It's Nightwing, thats why He and Babs broke up. :)

[GoldenAgeHero]

It's Nightwing, thats why He and Babs broke up. :)

haha that'll be effed up.

[BatmanReborn]

well, since they seem to be incorporating pre crisis with current, and they named the baby Helena, I think it will be Bruce's kid. could you imagine an issue where selenas sleeping an batman comes in through the window for a quick booty call. If anything, it probably would have happened during Hush

[TheCorpulent1]

They had nothing more then a mutual attraction toward eachother.
It's been implied that Wildcat visits Selena for the odd booty call here and there.

[GoldenAgeHero]

It's been implied that Wildcat visits Selena for the odd booty call here and there.

damn selena is a hoe; wildcat, slam and bats....im surprised shes not on maury pauvich.
if the baby was really bruce's and it was the writers intent to give out the secret in issue 52 by naming the baby helena, then why the hell are they still being so cryptic about it? it's not bruce's kid, they just wanna keep ya'll guessing.

[TheCorpulent1]

They'd be cryptic about it for the same reason they're cryptic about anything: because it makes fans like us talk and keeps us interested. Whoever the father is, most people will probably keep reading at least until they get an answer.

[Assassin]

isnt wild cat like 60?

[TheCorpulent1]

His body's around 40-something, I think. The last explanation I heard for it was that he and some of the other JSAers were hit by chronal energy that retarded their aging. Plus he had his 9 lives before he used his 8 spares up--most against the Crimson Avenger and the last to Jay Garrick so he would no longer be a metahuman subject to the Spear of Destiny's power.

[Anubis]

And he's probally pushing 80 by now.

[MinNoir]

Bit of an even trade but I'm with Kal-El 8 on this one. But you know it never hurts to put a little money on both sides, I say twenty on Bruce to be the father and seventeen on Slam, so the most I'd loose is three dollars top. I still smile at the fact that Selina is a Mother now, its a good change for the lass, but if she keeps walking around like that that little girl might get some ideas growing up. ;)

[Harlekin]

well, since they seem to be incorporating pre crisis with current, and they named the baby Helena, I think it will be Bruce's kid. could you imagine an issue where selenas sleeping an batman comes in through the window for a quick booty call. If anything, it probably would have happened during Hush
That would be impossible. The impregnation needs to have occurred during 52.

[Iron Man™]

And he's probally pushing 80 by now.

No way, the dude looks ATLEAST 55 by now. http://www.superherohype.com/forums/images/icons/icon6.gif

[GoldenAgeHero]

That would be impossible. The impregnation needs to have occurred during 52.

hey i forgot about that thats very much true. now i know bruce is not the father. catwoman OYL open up with her giving birth. so the baby wouldve been concieved at least three months into 52. but batman,robin and nightwing were out of the country in budapest.

[Anubis]

No way, the dude looks ATLEAST 55 by now. http://www.superherohype.com/forums/images/icons/icon6.gif

Yeah, he looks 55, but remeber, he's been a hero scince the 40's. He was doing the aging fighter bit way back in the 50's. That guys in his 70's, 80's tops.

[Iron Man™]

oh, and I also think the baby belongs to slam's son Slam Jr.

[sinewave]

Yeah, he looks 55, but remeber, he's been a hero scince the 40's. He was doing the aging fighter bit way back in the 50's. That guys in his 70's, 80's tops.

yeah, i'd say he's in his mid-to-late 60's.

[hippie_hunter]

hey i forgot about that thats very much true. now i know bruce is not the father. catwoman OYL open up with her giving birth. so the baby wouldve been concieved at least three months into 52. but batman,robin and nightwing were out of the country in budapest.

Perhaps Batman went to Gotham for a very short while to check on Alfred, Selina, Onyx, and others.

[GoldenAgeHero]

Perhaps Batman went to Gotham for a very short while to check on Alfred, Selina, Onyx, and others.

doubt it. alfred can pretty much take care of himself. hell he left him alone while batman went on to train with shiva after bane broke his back. the same can go for everyone else. all these characters can take care of themselves. so thats not really a reason why he would return to gotham.

[hippie_hunter]

doubt it. alfred can pretty much take care of himself. hell he left him alone while batman went on to train with shiva after bane broke his back. the same can go for everyone else. all these characters can take care of themselves. so thats not really a reason why he would return to gotham.

But Batman wasn't gone for a year when he left to train with Shiva. It's not to see if they could take care of themselves, have you considered that maybe Batman wanted to actually see them just to see them. To say hello and maybe get some action.

[twylight]

Bit of an even trade but I'm with Kal-El 8 on this one. But you know it never hurts to put a little money on both sides, I say twenty on Bruce to be the father and seventeen on Slam, so the most I'd loose is three dollars top. I still smile at the fact that Selina is a Mother now, its a good change for the lass, but if she keeps walking around like that that little girl might get some ideas growing up. ;)


No offense, but I hope you lose the three dollars. ;)

hey i forgot about that thats very much true. now i know bruce is not the father. catwoman OYL open up with her giving birth. so the baby wouldve been concieved at least three months into 52. but batman,robin and nightwing were out of the country in budapest.

Gee...:rolleyes:


Also this is 12 months later, since gestation is 9 months she became pregnant 3 months into the One year gap. Since she's shown close to Slam in the last issue it seems like he'd be the logical choice.


:o

[GoldenAgeHero]

No offense, but I hope you lose the three dollars. ;)



Gee...:rolleyes:




:o


what?

[Anubis]

She was pointing out that she already came to that conclusion like a couple of pages before you.

[hippie_hunter]

It will completely suck if either of the Bradleys are the father of Selina's baby.

[Anubis]

Why?

[hippie_hunter]

Because it's BATMAN AND CATWOMAN. Not Catwoman and some guy that no one outside of comics has ever heard of. Having a baby that is not Batman's would forever ruin any dynamic between the two outside of friendship.

[Anubis]

Not true. All it would mean is that now when somebody calls Bats a mother f**ker, it would actually be a true statement. :) Nah, Bats seems like the kinda guy that would take care of some other guys kids. Hell, he's been doing it for years.

[Green Lantern]

Yes because a woman can NEVER have a child and then have a relationship with anyone other than the father. :rolleyes: Step into the 21st century HH.

[hippie_hunter]

Yes because a woman can NEVER have a child and then have a relationship with anyone other than the father. :rolleyes: Step into the 21st century HH.

I know that, but it's freaking Batman. He's the one who supposed to be tappin' Catwoman's ass :mad:

[Anubis]

Well, she does have the Bat symbol tattooed on her Who Ha. But come on, his friends may have mind wiped her and he disappeared for a year, what was she supposed to do? The two Slams were hanging around, so she decided to make a Booty call or two.

[hippie_hunter]

Well, she does have the Bat symbol tattooed on her Who Ha. But come on, his friends may have mind wiped her and he disappeared for a year, what was she supposed to do? The two Slams were hanging around, so she decided to make a Booty call or two.

She could have done it herself if you know what I mean :mad:

[TheCorpulent1]

Batman should never be in a stable relationship until he hangs up the ears for good, in my opinion.

[GoldenAgeHero]

Batman should never be in a stable relationship until he hangs up the ears for good, in my opinion.


agreed.:up:

[MinNoir]

Well of course you'd love for me to loose three dollars which doesn't mean much these days. Gas in the UK is just about if not over six dollars a gallon, and three dollars in the US might buy me one bloody gallon of gas for the ol' bucket.

Carrying on, here, here Hippie Hunter! Catwoman & Batman forever more then. I shall be disappointed should it turn out to be Slam, but I pray Bruce would be more of the father figure which in all cases he's been good at. You'd have to admit Bruce is already a father, to Richard Grayson, he seems the same type of figure to young Timothy, and was a surrogate father to the young Cassandra Cain, so I'm sure overall to all his young protégé's he is some sort of father figure. So should the babe Helena grow up and choose to become a costumed hero, you can count on Bruce to train her, and be a father figure to her.

Dear lord, this almost takes me back to three men and a baby, wouldn't that be funny? Slam, Slam Jr, and Bruce or better yet, Slam, Dick, and Bruce.

[sinewave]

Well of course you'd love for me to loose three dollars which doesn't mean much these days. Gas in the UK is just about if not over six dollars a gallon, and three dollars in the US might buy me one bloody gallon of gas for the ol' bucket.

Carrying on, here, here Hippie Hunter! Catwoman & Batman forever more then. I shall be disappointed should it turn out to be Slam, but I pray Bruce would be more of the father figure which in all cases he's been good at. You'd have to admit Bruce is already a father, to Richard Grayson, he seems the same type of figure to young Timothy, and was a surrogate father to the young Cassandra Cain, so I'm sure overall to all his young protégé's he is some sort of father figure. So should the babe Helena grow up and choose to become a costumed hero, you can count on Bruce to train her, and be a father figure to her.

Dear lord, this almost takes me back to three men and a baby, wouldn't that be funny? Slam, Slam Jr, and Bruce or better yet, Slam, Dick, and Bruce.

that's digusting. :(

[The_Mystery]

I hope it's Bats' baby. Actually, what if it was Nightwing's. That seems like a pretty good reason for Oracle to break off the engagment.

[GoldenAgeHero]

it's not nightwing's, you guys need to styop coming up with bs stuff thats hasnt even been hinted in the books.

[MinNoir]

Oh hell, we're having a little fun! Can't you just have a little fun, the rest of you seem so serious on it that it might as well be one joke after another. Here, here let's take this to a man who can solve this kind of problem... Jerry Springer.

[twylight]

There was a whole lot of Wildcat and Slam in the last issue. :o

[TheCorpulent1]

I hope it's Slam and Wildcat beats the crap out of him for it. :)

[twylight]

I'd agree with you but you voted against me so...I can't...:o

[TheCorpulent1]

Darthphere told me to. I didn't even know what was going on. I thought Calvin was of the "and Hobbes" variety, and I could never vote against the greatest newspaper strip of all time. :(

[sinewave]

There was a whole lot of Wildcat and Slam in the last issue. :o

yeah, i loved that! they're two of my favorite characters. i wonder what slam was drowning his sorrows about? i think wildcat's supposed to be in the next few issues. supposedly he'll be training holly a little bit more. i've really enjoyed catwoman OYL.

[TheCorpulent1]

Slam was probably drinking so heavily because he didn't know whether to believe the news that cop gave him about Selena's being Black Mask's murderer. Why he was at the bar in the first place, though, I don't know.

[sinewave]

Slam was probably drinking so heavily because he didn't know whether to believe the news that cop gave him about Selena's being Black Mask's murderer. Why he was at the bar in the first place, though, I don't know.

the bartender made a comment about how much slam had been in there lately like slam is on a bender for some reason. it could be because he's freaked out about being a new dad or it could be something else. i don't know.

[TheCorpulent1]

Well, there've been hints dropped that any of the people we've suggested could be the dad. My avatar's the gigantic hint that Bats could be, since his bringing toys for someone else's kid just seems weird. Slam's drinking and hassling Selena even after she changed her identity are his hints. Slam's looking likelier at this point, since things seem tenser between them. I'm thinking it may actually be Sam Bradley, though. That would explain Slam's behavior--a grandson is as big a deal as a son, and Sam's apparently gone with no trace, so that's even more stress. Plus, if Slam were there and willing to help Selena, why would she turn him down if he's the father. I don't think she'd be that much of a *****, to just cut him out of his own son's upbringing.

[sinewave]

Well, there've been hints dropped that any of the people we've suggested could be the dad. My avatar's the gigantic hint that Bats could be, since his bringing toys for someone else's kid just seems weird. Slam's drinking and hassling Selena even after she changed her identity are his hints. Slam's looking likelier at this point, since things seem tenser between them. I'm thinking it may actually be Sam Bradley, though. That would explain Slam's behavior--a grandson is as big a deal as a son, and Sam's apparently gone with no trace, so that's even more stress. Plus, if Slam were there and willing to help Selena, why would she turn him down if he's the father. I don't think she'd be that much of a *****, to just cut him out of his own son's upbringing.

good points. although, i don't think it's too much of a stretch for batman to give someone else's kid a teddy bear, considering who that person is and how much she's meant to him over the years. you may be right about sam being the dad. that could be why slam is hitting the sauce. maybe he's jealous of sam and selina's relationship, whatever it is/was.

[twylight]

good points. although, i don't think it's too much of a stretch for batman to give someone else's kid a teddy bear, considering who that person is and how much she's meant to him over the years. you may be right about sam being the dad. that could be why slam is hitting the sauce. maybe he's jealous of sam and selina's relationship, whatever it is/was.

Geez..I HOPE it's not Sam!

Selina would go way down on my list...sleeping with the son of a guy she was and might still have feelings for?

Remember, it would have happened only 3 months into OY, and last we saw before OYL was Selina talking to Slam and asking for advice, saying she wouldn't do it if he told her not to.

Darthphere told me to. I didn't even know what was going on. I thought Calvin was of the "and Hobbes" variety, and I could never vote against the greatest newspaper strip of all time. :(

Take your excuses elsewhere.


I'll never forgive you. :(

[TheCorpulent1]

Black Canary looks to Wildcat for advice, but it's pretty clear that they're strictly platonic. I don't see a problem with her developing a relationship with Sam over those three months. That's still a pretty long time.

[Iron Man™]

The fact that Wildcat was there totally means something, am I the only one to find that odd?

[twylight]

Black Canary looks to Wildcat for advice, but it's pretty clear that they're strictly platonic. I don't see a problem with her developing a relationship with Sam over those three months. That's still a pretty long time.

Dinah never slept with Ted. :o



The fact that Wildcat was there totally means something, am I the only one to find that odd?


Wildcat is going to be training Holly.

As for him being in Gotham I don't think that's very odd. There are numerous reasons why he could be there.

[MinNoir]

Yeah, Ted is like Dinah's Uncle. Hmmm, again I'd take my twenty-seventeen bet for Bats, but again, I'm happy waiting :D

[sethcohen]

Well, she does have the Bat symbol tattooed on her Who Ha.
what what WHAT?