Confirmed Line-up and rumors

[ShadowBoxing]

the CONFIRMED line-up is

Optimus Prime (Long nose Semi)
Ironhide (pick up)
Ratchet (ambulance we think)
Bumblebee (camaro)
Jazz (Sports Car)
(Possible fifth)

Decepticons
Megatron (Tank??)
Devestator (Abrams Tank)
Vortex (Helicopter)
Brawl (Police Car)
Scorponok (huge Scorpion)
Starscream (F 22).

From ALLSPARK.Com
As many have speculated, the Decepticons do in fact outnumber the Autobots in the script.

It had me scratching my head when I learned who they are, and what their alt modes are.

Brawl--a police car (for a chase scene)
Devastator--M1 Abrams tank (and a single bot)
Bonecrusher--Mine clearing vehicle

It just seems like a bunch of random names slapped on random alt modes.
If they want to use a Decepticon car, I think the names Runamuck or Runabout would be more suitable.
The tank should be Brawl, since he was a tank in G1.
Not sure how I feel about Bonecrusher. He was a bulldozer in G1 and there are mine clearing vehicles that look like bulldozers, but I think they should just stick with Combaticon names and go with Swindle or Onslaught.

And as with Angelophile, I can't reveal my source, sorry.

Potential rumor from unconfirmed source
Apparently product placement have greatly affected the design choices as general motors have their cars all over the movie. I have not seen the film but i saw the proofs for the height ratios and color proofs. here are the decepticons: Megatron, vortex, scorponok, starscream, bonecrusher, devastator and brawl. DO NOT PICTURE THE CLASSIC DESIGNS! you will be upset if you do. if you pretend your childhood transformers never existed you will be more accepting as I am.the auto bots are comprised of: Prime Ironhide, ratchet, bumblebee and jazz. I can't show you the pics because I promised my friend i wouldn't but i will say this bumblebee is not a beetle he is a sedan

Hey guys remember what I told you this is not your childhood transformers devastatore is a tank in the movie bone crusher is a constuction vehicle but i cant describe hime its one of those trucks that siphons sand i believe but it has a crane to dig with. in robot form it becomes a third arm or tail. vortex was supposed to be soundwave but thank god they relized that helocopters cannot break the sound barrier so they changed his name to vortex. I dont know that megatron is because the sheet did not show his transformation. he has claws and looks very scary. he looks like he's made of junk its weired and hard to describe. Scorponok is a scorpion but not a battlestation he is a tiny robot scorpion. dont know if he can transform because the sheet did not show the robot from in scale to rumble or frenzy. he might serve a a spy I'm guessing. prime is a long nose semi ratchet is a hummeriron hide is a Dodge ram truck starscream is a f-22 and his robot form is brown and gorilla esk very mean and intimidating. I like the designs but they bear absolutely no resemblence to the classic versions. I cant really say much more because the sheet had no descriptions I'm merely describing to the best of my ability.

This information is *fairly* truthworthy take with grains of salt though.

[Mic]

Ah for **** sake, this is ****.
Prime is not a ****ing long nose. He is a god damn flat front Mac.
Bay confirmed he was a Mac truck, but im not familiar with the Mac range to know whether there are flat front and long nose tractor trailers.

And devastator a ****ing tank?
Retarded to say the god damn least

[zer00]

Considering the AICN report sort of debunks this. IT did say Scorpnok was doing some devestation and didn't make it seem like he was tiny. And it didn't say Prime was a long nose did it?

[ShadowBoxing]

Ah for **** sake, this is ****.
Prime is not a ****ing long nose. He is a god damn flat front Mac.
Bay confirmed he was a Mac truck, but im not familiar with the Mac range to know whether there are flat front and long nose tractor trailers.

And devastator a ****ing tank?
Retarded to say the god damn leastYou have to understand names in Transformers have been rotating for years now. This Movie IS NOT G1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. I mean the name Smokescreen has been applied to a car, a jet, a crane, another car and a new suburu Impreza and I did not hear fans complain about that. The point is everyone has the wrong impression on Transformers. I have seen every episode of TF shows, read every last comic, even own practically every G1 toy....you gotta understand everytime they make a new show its totally different. This is not G1 the Movie, its to G1 as RiD or Energon is to G1....same names for characters but totally different storyline and in many cases alt modes.

[ShadowBoxing]

Considering the AICN report sort of debunks this. IT did say Scorpnok was doing some devestation and didn't make it seem like he was tiny. And it didn't say Prime was a long nose did it?He isn't tiny, the guy even says he had to scale to base him off of. the Long nose Semi comes from another article I am trying to find. Pretty much though the characters have been confirmed 3 times now, this is not G1....I have to re-enforce this. It is a wholly separate entity...don't expect G1 characters (beyond Megatron and Optimus) to look, sound or be like their originals.

[Mic]

You have to understand names in Transformers have been rotating for years now. This Movie IS NOT G1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. I mean the name Smokescreen has been applied to a car, a jet, a crane, another car and a new suburu Impreza and I did not hear fans complain about that. The point is everyone has the wrong impression on Transformers. I have seen every episode of TF shows, read every last comic, even own practically every G1 toy....you gotta understand everytime they make a new show its totally different. This is not G1 the Movie, its to G1 as RiD or Energon is to G1....same names for characters but totally different storyline and in many cases alt modes.
Actually as far as Iv heard this IS G1, re imagined. Just like the Dreamwave comics are a G1 based comic.
Its G1 based.
Its the simple things that are just ****ing the fans over. Why the **** is devestator a tank? Why devestator? What was the point in making that tank devestator? Why not one of the many other ACTUAL tank transformers in G1?
It just doesnt make sense. Why kick the fans in the balls like that? The general joe public who will make up 98% of the viewing audience wouldnt give a **** what that tank was called. But the fans will.

[zer00]

He isn't tiny, the guy even says he had to scale to base him off of. the Long nose Semi comes from another article I am trying to find. Pretty much though the characters have been confirmed 3 times now, this is not G1....I have to re-enforce this. It is a wholly separate entity...don't expect G1 characters (beyond Megatron and Optimus) to look, sound or be like their originals.

...That's nice. It's an adaption. not a seperate entity. I cannot re-enforce this enough. Just like every other movie like this. It's an adaption. So stop pertending it's not. And does this guy have good sources or are you just saying he's trustworthy?

[ShadowBoxing]

Actually as far as Iv heard this IS G1, re imagined. Just like the Dreamwave comics are a G1 based comic.
Its G1 based.
Its the simple things that are just ****ing the fans over. Why the **** is devestator a tank? Why devestator? What was the point in making that tank devestator? Why not one of the many other ACTUAL tank transformers in G1?
It just doesnt make sense. Why kick the fans in the balls like that? The general joe public who will make up 98% of the viewing audience wouldnt give a **** what that tank was called. But the fans will.
(By the way all this news is found on Don Murphy's own website)

Actually I am on the ALLSPARK forums right now and to be honest fans don't really give a ****....in fact I should show you some posts from fans

I rather like the idea of a Decepticon police car. Sure the evil authority figure shtick is a bit done, like T-1000, but it seems like the totally evil thing a Decepticon would do to really decieve the local population.

Devastator is simply one of the best names of G1. Sure we associate it with a certain green gestalt, but the name itself fits any bot of mass destruction. I welcome the inclusion of an Abrams.

Bonecrusher seems fitting enough, and a slightly more obscure wrecking machine seems to fit the style they're going for in the Decepticons for the movie.



Let's say it again:
This
Is
Not
G1.

This
Is
The
Movie's
Own
Continuity.

Therefore, Devastator could be an Autobot submarine for all intents and purposes and it wouldn't diminish the original Devastator's character-- what little he had. Because it's a completely different universe.

(And Devastator's been a single bot before-- he was Scavenger in Micron Legend, the Japanese Armada.)

If this is genuine its pretty obvious why this would happen. Seriously, how many rememberable G1 Decepticons are there at large?

At most it would be sweet if they changed the con police cars name to Breakdown, Dead End or even Runamuck.

Tankstator is fine since G1 Devastator whas just a big brute but since Dev whas a combiner then even Demolishor would be a better name. Thinking of Con G1 tanks then even Brawl or Bludgeon would do.

But overall if I have to be honest it really doesn't face me that much. Imagining the possible scenarios this film might play with then it kind of makes sense. But names could be better assigned.

Anyway; if the designs are similar to how the characters look elsewhere as well in the end... Don't see me minding if this makes it into the finished film.

If I can accept Optimus as a munky, I can accept Devastator as a single robot and Brawl as a car.

Because, you know, different characters and continuity and stuff.

Hell, in the last few years we have had Scavenger as a large Autobot merc who trained Optimus Prime, Blurr as a brooding loner, Sideswipe as a blue newb, Ironhide as a big newb, Wheeljack as a traitor Decepticon, Cliffjumper as Wheeljack as Downshift as a pimpmobile, Prowl as everybody else...

And now people want blood for switching alt-modes and names on non-G1 namesakes?

I see nothing there worth getting worked up about.

http://www.allspark.com/forums/index.php?showforum=7 Go see what the fans think yourself

Truth is we Transformers fans are used to this. There was a G1, it hasn't been seen or heard from in 17 YEARS. We don't care. We've seen Optimus as a long nose Semi (laser Prime), Space Ship Semi (Star Convoy), Combiner (Super Link), Monkey (Beast Wars), Lion (Beast Wars II), Mammoth (Beast Wars Neo), Firetruck (Galaxy Force and RiD) and his traditional. If you are a Transformers fan than this is NOT f---ing with you, NOT.IN.THE.SLIGHTEST. The only people who would be mad are people who curse everytime a show comes on thats not G1...I'd love G1 to return its all I collect...but its not coming back, its very dated.

And also Don Murphy said "vaguely based on G1"....every show excluding Beast Wars (which was a continuation to G1) was vaguely based.

[ShadowBoxing]

...That's nice. It's an adaption. not a seperate entity. I cannot re-enforce this enough. Just like every other movie like this. It's an adaption. So stop pertending it's not. And does this guy have good sources or are you just saying he's trustworthy?Most of this stuff all shows up in Don Murphy's message board. No its a separate entity. G1 is its own continuity, you should familiarize yourself with it. Outside of Beast Wars/Machines and minor cameos G1 has never resurfaced...not in 17 years (cartoon wise...comics have been coming out regularly over the past five). Armada, RiD, Cybertron, Beast Wars Neo and II are all separate entities as is this movie (and all those shows reused G1 names I might add). The Transformers Universe is huge with 20 separate a distinct continuities I can think of off the top of my head. This is another addition, NOT G1, not G1....I don't know any other way to say it. The Transformers Universe for the last 17 years has had 6 different cartoon Universe, 6 different comic Universes, 1 Robotmasters Universe available on DVD, and even a separate Universe that runs out of Botcon exclusives comics.

Transformers is not X-Men or Batman...it does not have one distinct interconnected storyline

Even Generation 1 has 2 cartoon storylines which cannot reconcile eachother.

[ShadowBoxing]

This is worth the check out too
http://www.d13satellite.com/donmurphy/forumdisplay.php?forumid=8

[DrSpengler]

Names don't bother me. They've done it so much over the years. Anyone whose been payng attention has noticed. If I can get over Grimlock being a steamshovel, I can get over Devastator being a tank.

None of the news leaked yet has "upset" me, as none of it is "upsetting". Naming a tank Devastator is not "****ing over the fans". Not at all.

If anything I'll wait until I see some character designs before I even come close to getting that worked up.

So far, all this news has just intrigued me.

[ShadowBoxing]

Names don't bother me. They've done it so much over the years. Anyone whose been payng attention has noticed. If I can get over Grimlock being a steamshovel, I can get over Devastator being a tank.

None of the news leaked yet has "upset" me, as none of it is "upsetting". Naming a tank Devastator is not "****ing over the fans". Not at all.

If anything I'll wait until I see some character designs before I even come close to getting that worked up.

So far, all this news has just intrigued me.Exactly...if you think re-assigning G1 names to different forms is "f---ing with Transformers fans" you haven't been watching Transformers very long :D

Grimlock being a steamshovel on that dimwhitted team the Build Team was pretty lame...I suppose no lamer than naming a bicycle minicon Nightbeat

[ShadowBoxing]

Seriously I will stress this again...its not an adaptation, because in the TF Universe everything always starts over from scratch. This is its own thing, trust me.

[Evoldog]

I guess this is where the "problem" stems from. When Tom Desanto first declared a "Transformer" movie a couple of years ago, he specifically said that it was going to be based on G1. Sure, there has been alternates (i.e. Beast Wars, Armada etc.), but lets not forget, it was G1 (the cartoons and the toys) that launched it's popularity into the stratosphere...the one original fans grew up with.

I don't know the level of Tom Desanto's involvement with the current project, but the sad fact is, G1 is no longer a template for the movie. It is definitely going to be an Alternate Transformers spin-off...which is disheartening.

In all honesty, I don't like the direction the movie is going, but hey, I don't have a financial stake in the movie, so let them do what they wanna do. Hell, surprise me.

[ShadowBoxing]

I guess this is where the "problem" stems from. When Tom Desanto first declared a "Transformer" movie a couple of years ago, he specifically said that it was going to be based on G1. Sure, there has been alternates (i.e. Beast Wars, Armada etc.), but lets not forget, it was G1 (the cartoons and the toys) that launched it's popularity into the stratosphere...the one original fans grew up with.

I don't know the level of Tom Desanto's involvement with the current project, but the sad fact is, G1 is no longer a template for the movie. It is definitely going to be an Alternate Transformers spin-off...which is disheartening.

In all honesty, I don't like the direction the movie is going, but hey, I don't have a financial stake in the movie, so let them do what they wanna do. Hell, surprise me.Right well it is "based" in the same way Armada and RiD are based. They never said this is G1 the movie...they said from the beginning it was vaguely based of G1.

Listen to me carefully. Anyone who thinks G1 is the end all be all of Transformers doesn't know or watch anything related to Transformers. Those people are not true fans. Fans who are diehard fans by now ought to be used to this.

And G1, it certainly started the line, but Beast Wars was far more acclaimed...because since Beast wars there has been a new TF show every year. Transformers G1 disappeared for a full 4 years before returning again in a very short lived G2 form. G1 has and will always be my favorite (its all I collect), but the TF verse stopped revolving around it a long time ago. Cybertron, Beast Wars most notably are regarded as much better cartoons and toylines already.

You must understand something if its disheartening that Transformers is doing something unrelated to G1, you aren't much of a TF fan to begin with. This movie is not concerned with either A) the small number of G1 purists or B) People who misconception is all there is of Transformers is G1. Most people don't know anyone outside of Optimus and Megatron, there is no reason for fans or gen aud. to doubt this film at this point.

[muscaremy]

i can live with those decisions soon as i find out what a long nose semi is..... and the only problem i have is bumblebee.... he HAS to be a vbug its like a must...either that or someother other dinky car like a mini or sumtin but not a camaro.... camaro makes no sense for him

[roach]

Right well it is "based" in the same way Armada and RiD are based. They never said this is G1 the movie...they said from the beginning it was vaguely based of G1.

Listen to me carefully. Anyone who thinks G1 is the end all be all of Transformers doesn't know or watch anything related to Transformers. Those people are not true fans. Fans who are diehard fans by now ought to be used to this.

And G1, it certainly started the line, but Beast Wars was far more acclaimed...because since Beast wars there has been a new TF show every year. Transformers G1 disappeared for a full 4 years before returning again in a very short lived G2 form. G1 has and will always be my favorite (its all I collect), but the TF verse stopped revolving around it a long time ago. Cybertron, Beast Wars most notably are regarded as much better cartoons and toylines already.

You must understand something if its disheartening that Transformers is doing something unrelated to G1, you aren't much of a TF fan to begin with. This movie is not concerned with either A) the small number of G1 purists or B) People who misconception is all there is of Transformers is G1. Most people don't know anyone outside of Optimus and Megatron, there is no reason for fans or gen aud. to doubt this film at this point.

Thanks for pointing this out. I assumed it was gonna be G1 and now that information was shared with me I have a better feeling about this movie

[ShadowBoxing]

i can live with those decisions soon as i find out what a long nose semi is..... and the only problem i have is bumblebee.... he HAS to be a vbug its like a must...either that or someother other dinky car like a mini or sumtin but not a camaro.... camaro makes no sense for himI hear ya...but VW refused to be part of the film.:( :down

[CGHulk]

The main question is, is Bay's ego to big to listen to the fans?

[ShadowBoxing]

The main question is, is Bay's ego to big to listen to the fans?Actually No:D! Originally Arcee was in the script, but FANS got Bay to actually write her out. Same with midget Soundwave, who will be a new character because of fans. He also recently purposed calling the matrix and "energon cube" instead...however he has asked the fans to weigh in on the name change, and it looks like it won't happen. Bay is doing a great job of listening thus far :D.

[skorponok]

I hear ya...but VW refused to be part of the film.:( :down

Was it ever stated on don's site as to WHY??? (don't remember):down

[ShadowBoxing]

Was it ever stated on don's site as to WHY??? (don't remember):downIts just a licencing thing. Don obviously wanted VW, they just said no. Its the companies call unfortunately. I mean if I were VW, I'd want my car in a summer blockbuster...especially when it sucks so bad in the first place. But they didn't...they'll live with their decision. This is not Don or Bay's fault, its just VW being high and mighty or some stuff...I know I don't like it either.:down

[ShadowBoxing]

Based on the varying reports by people who claimed to see the Optimus concept art a Allspark poster was nice enough to grace us with a rendering based on reports.

NOT OFFICIAL DRAWING...Artists did this off of written reports
http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/6436/movieprimespeculation9fi.jpg (http://imageshack.us/)

[Mic]

I can admit that I overreacted at first, but it doesnt change the way I feel. To be honest all I REALLY want is a live action version of the orignal movie. Ill never get it but thats all I want.

I dont think bay really cared that VW denied usage of the beetle. Cause if he did he would obviously get a car close to what the beetle is. A mini would have sufficed but he decides on a damn camero? Arnt they big ass muscle cars? (im not american so i cant be sure)

As for the design of prime above, i thought we were getting a more realistic version? Not a robotic Megaman. I was under the impression he would be very angular etc
And it does indeed looks like there going for a long nose Cab, as the skirt type thing hes wearing(very samurai kinda deal) looks like the nose.

What worries me about that drawing is why the red prime is labeled 'matrix- get version'
Is that what happens when he opens the matrix. Or when he receives it?

Im also glad to see he has an insignia, i was sure they wouldnt put the faction symbols on.
Id hate to have been the artist trying to recreate what the people saw lol.

[DrSpengler]

Its just a licencing thing. Don obviously wanted VW, they just said no. Its the companies call unfortunately. I mean if I were VW, I'd want my car in a summer blockbuster...especially when it sucks so bad in the first place. But they didn't...they'll live with their decision. This is not Don or Bay's fault, its just VW being high and mighty or some stuff...I know I don't like it either.:down

It has to do with Volks Wagon not wanting their cars to be associated with war and violence. Volks Wagon has the reputation of being "The car that Hitler built", and Germans are VERY sensetive about World War II.

So VW won't let them use any of their vehicles in the Transformers (wouldn't even let them use them for an Alternators Bumblebee). Even though Bumblebee is a GOOD guy, VW doesn't want their cars to be associated with war in any way whatsoever.

But Herbie sequels are fine.


And that's a pretty cool piece of fan art. I could get behind Optimus looking something like that (though I hope they'd include more red).

[Mic]

Reading the Don Murphy boards they are saying Bumblbee wont talk, that he has had his vocals cut out by a decepticon?????

I think its a cool concept...but why bumblebee, id of thought he would have most of the lines in the movie from a transformers point of view. As im sure he will have the most contact with humans.


AND, i dont care what kind of fan you are. But this one pisses me off the most
'Transformers arrive on earth in comets as big mounds of nanomachines which scan for alt modes upon arrival.'
Now that is just retarded. Id have no problems if they crashed landed and looked like a robotic george bush before finding alt modes...but nano machines? And in comets?
I thought we where getting a glimpse of cybertron? I dont care what series you have watched, loved or ejaculater over, none of them have come up with bull**** like that.

[ShadowBoxing]

Reading the Don Murphy boards they are saying Bumblbee wont talk, that he has had his vocals cut out by a decepticon?????

I think its a cool concept...but why bumblebee, id of thought he would have most of the lines in the movie from a transformers point of view. As im sure he will have the most contact with humans.


AND, i dont care what kind of fan you are. But this one pisses me off the most
'Transformers arrive on earth in comets as big mounds of nanomachines which scan for alt modes upon arrival.'
Now that is just retarded. Id have no problems if they crashed landed and looked like a robotic george bush before finding alt modes...but nano machines? And in comets?
I thought we where getting a glimpse of cybertron? I dont care what series you have watched, loved or ejaculater over, none of them have come up with bull**** like that.I would actually prefer Ratchet have his voice box cut out...because Ratchet is in fact a bada$$.

Supposedly we will see Cybertron

Its not what I love...or ejaculater over :confused: ...its what Transformers is. The last series (Cybertron) which is incredibly loved, even more than geeeewooonnnn. Had the Transformers months away from dying in a black hole come through a warp gate and exile their entire population to Earth...not much like G1 at all. RiD had Autobots as functioning members of human society, Prowl was even an actual police officer. Transtech (unreleased...but in high demand) had Autobots and Decepticons as Gundam like bodies with scary alt modes. Beast Machines had them blend organic and mechanical. Its different EVERY TIME...and very different I might add. Dr Spengler hit the nail on the head....TF fans are USED TO THIS. A very small minority believe G1 was the only universe ever...to illustrate how big TFverse is

Shows

G1

Continuity 1
Fight!Super Robot Life
TFTM
Transformers 2010
Rebirth

Continuity 2
Scramble City (lost episode)
Headmasters
Masterforce
Victory
Zone Movie
Return of Convoy (unreleased)

Comic Continuity 1
US Marvel Comic
TF/G.I.Joe
Headmasters
G.I.Joe featuring Megatron
US G2 Marvel Comic
(Out of continuity issue 68 and Transformers: the Movie)

Comic Continuity 2
UK Marvel Comic
UK G2 comic
Action Force

Comic Continuity 3
DW comic miniseries 1
DW comic miniseries 2
DW ongoing comic miniseries 3
Microbots

Unrelated Comic Continuity
War Within DW
Infiltration
G.I.Joe Transformers IDW
G.I.Joe Transformers WWII
G.I.Joe Transformers DW

Beast Wars

Continuity 1
Beast Wars
Beast Wars Metals
Beast Machines (Beast Wars Continues)

Unrelated Continuities
Beast Wars Neo
Beast Wars II
Beast Wars Neo Movie

Comics
IDW Beast Wars
DW unreleased Beast Wars
Beast Wars Manga

Other

Armada/Energon (Micron Legend/Superlink)
Feature Cartoon Armada Pilot Movie
Transformers Armada
Transformers Energon
Armada/Energon comic

Cybertron/Galaxy Force
Transformers Galaxy Force

Other Notable Transformers Continuities.

Transtech (unreleased)
Transmythos (popular fan fiction)
Robotmasters (DVD available with toy)
Wreckers (Botcon exclusive comic supposedly bridges between G1 and BW)
Alternators/Binaltech presumably
Transformers The Movie (2007)

[ShadowBoxing]

I can admit that I overreacted at first, but it doesnt change the way I feel. To be honest all I REALLY want is a live action version of the orignal movie. Ill never get it but thats all I want.

I dont think bay really cared that VW denied usage of the beetle. Cause if he did he would obviously get a car close to what the beetle is. A mini would have sufficed but he decides on a damn camero? Arnt they big ass muscle cars? (im not american so i cant be sure)

As for the design of prime above, i thought we were getting a more realistic version? Not a robotic Megaman. I was under the impression he would be very angular etc
And it does indeed looks like there going for a long nose Cab, as the skirt type thing hes wearing(very samurai kinda deal) looks like the nose.

What worries me about that drawing is why the red prime is labeled 'matrix- get version'
Is that what happens when he opens the matrix. Or when he receives it?

Im also glad to see he has an insignia, i was sure they wouldnt put the faction symbols on.
Id hate to have been the artist trying to recreate what the people saw lol.Thats a fan rendering...don't take it as the actually one.

[Mic]

Thats a fan rendering...don't take it as the actually one.
I didnt.
But its a rendering based on what what we know from the designs shown.

[ShadowBoxing]

I didnt.
But its a rendering based on what what we know from the designs shown.I mean the descriptions were vague enough that this could look absolutely nothing like the Prime we are going to see...

[ShadowBoxing]

And by the way Cybertron and the Civil War is definitely a part of this movie since the subtitle is "Their War, Our World"

[Mic]

And by the way Cybertron and the Civil War is definitely a part of this movie since the subtitle is "Their War, Our World"
Taglines mean jack **** these days.
I still dont get AvP, 'Whoever wins, we lose'
When in fact they both lost and we won.

[ShadowBoxing]

Taglines mean jack **** these days.
I still dont get AvP, 'Whoever wins, we lose'
When in fact they both lost and we won.You see that title meant whoever wins this movie still sucks and you just lost eight bucks...so therefore Whoever Wins, We Loose was very much correct

Look I think people who haven't followed the movie closely got the wrong impression from the beginning. I knew from the minute Spielberg signed on and did his video fan mail that this was not going to be G1. I feel incredibly sorry for people who did. But you only have yourselves to blame for not fully understanding the dimensions of TFU. I know that sounds crass. But you have to look at it from the perspective of what the Transformers actually are. Name rotations, new continuities (as I have shown), new series, new takes and new innovations. The reason Transformers is just so popular is because it ALWAYS reinvents itself. Its never just that same ol G1, 1980s mixed with futuristic cars and gimmicks. Sometimes we get minicons, other times Cyber planet keys, other times linking power, other times robots who are functioning members of earthen society, or when they are part organic. If you fear change, or cannot handle a new take then Transformers is not for you...and it wasn't for you 17 years ago...or even 20 years ago.

Transformers killed their leader, their most popular character. That moment had defined the series as one that is not afraid to do something new and different around every corner. I don't want Transformers to stay the same, nor do most fans. Everyone in the Transfan community wants a return to G1 (we have gotten it in several forms here and there), but at the same time we have come to expect new and different phases of Transformers. Most of these turn out very popular, and some like Beast Wars, RiD and Cybertron have ended up overshadowing G1 in many regards.

So no this is not a movie like X-Men, where fans start going into crazy town when a costume is changed, or a storyline is totally altered...this is Transformers.

[muscaremy]

o yeah forgot bout the vw thing..... stupid no war movie or toys allowed....

[Evoldog]

Look I think people who haven't followed the movie closely got the wrong impression from the beginning. I knew from the minute Spielberg signed on and did his video fan mail that this was not going to be G1. I feel incredibly sorry for people who did. But you only have yourselves to blame for not fully understanding the dimensions of TFU. I know that sounds crass. But you have to look at it from the perspective of what the Transformers actually are. Name rotations, new continuities (as I have shown), new series, new takes and new innovations. The reason Transformers is just so popular is because it ALWAYS reinvents itself. Its never just that same ol G1, 1980s mixed with futuristic cars and gimmicks. Sometimes we get minicons, other times Cyber planet keys, other times linking power, other times robots who are functioning members of earthen society, or when they are part organic. If you fear change, or cannot handle a new take then Transformers is not for you...and it wasn't for you 17 years ago...or even 20 years ago.



I guess you just skimmed through my comment. Look, Tom Desanto (one of the producers of Xmen) was the first to publicly acknowledge the live action production of Transformers a couple of years ago before Dreamworks got the actual ball rolling. He specifically said that it was going to be "based" on the "G1" mythos. That's what excited the fans (including myself) of G1 for a whole year. Of course, when Dreamworks got involved, they had their own set of ideas; and it became evident that the G1 mythos were not in the equation. That's when the complaints started mounting...and I don't blame them. If you're going to do a movie based (or vaguely based) on something, base it on what made it popular in the first place. But you're right, it's futile. I'll probably see it anyways...hey, who doesn't want to see a movie about giant transforming robots running amuck on earth rendered with the latest technology.

Concerning the popularity of G1; it had never ended. Sure,the cartoons and the toylines has ended, but that's the evolution of the toyline industry...one generation end so they could profit with another (Beastwars, Headmasters, etc.)--that's understandable, but to allude to the notion that no ones been interested for anything G1 for the past 17-20 years is ridiculous. They've reissued the G1 toyline up, remastered the original episodes on dvd, Dreamwave had a solid comic run following the original mythos, and a reputable producer (Tom Desanto) got a live-action (originally based on G1) greenlighted. G1's always been prevalent.

G1 was what made the "Transformers" trademark popular, not the incarnations. Hell, it was so popular it even got an animated movie made with a theatrical release, I can't say that about it's other incarnations. And no, you don't have to like the "other versions" to be a serious fan, you can just support the version that started the legacy.

Change? I guess it went so well for Catwoman, League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, StreetFighter, Mario Bros, Godzilla, alien vs predator, etc. studios never learn.

[Destructicus]

I am true to the transformers and I wont believe anything untile I see some true beleivable things. Unconfirmed source my a$$. Did Don post this at his website or did a fan. I know it came from allspark. Heres the thing. From past movies and info about them before they came out I have learned to not believe the speculation until around when the pictures of the set or chars come out. So many websites said that Gambit was supposed to be in the first, second and third XMen movie. Where the hell is he. They had actors that were cast to play him and everything, but it all turned out to be bull*****. I wont belive anything until 2007. Then the true info will come out.

[Batx69]

Yes there are other continuitys, but most of them feel like corps robbers. Its all way to japanesse and way to kiddy anime cliches. With the exception of a few eppisods they all suck anyway. Some of the redisings are nices but armada was ****ing trasfome mon for christs sakes.

[ShadowBoxing]

I guess you just skimmed through my comment. Look, Tom Desanto (one of the producers of Xmen) was the first to publicly acknowledge the live action production of Transformers a couple of years ago before Dreamworks got the actual ball rolling. He specifically said that it was going to be "based" on the "G1" mythos. That's what excited the fans (including myself) of G1 for a whole year. Of course, when Dreamworks got involved, they had their own set of ideas; and it became evident that the G1 mythos were not in the equation. That's when the complaints started mounting...and I don't blame them. If you're going to do a movie based (or vaguely based) on something, base it on what made it popular in the first place. But you're right, it's futile. I'll probably see it anyways...hey, who doesn't want to see a movie about giant transforming robots running amuck on earth rendered with the latest technology.

Concerning the popularity of G1; it had never ended. Sure,the cartoons and the toylines has ended, but that's the evolution of the toyline industry...one generation end so they could profit with another (Beastwars, Headmasters, etc.)--that's understandable, but to allude to the notion that no ones been interested for anything G1 for the past 17-20 years is ridiculous. They've reissued the G1 toyline up, remastered the original episodes on dvd, Dreamwave had a solid comic run following the original mythos, and a reputable producer (Tom Desanto) got a live-action (originally based on G1) greenlighted. G1's always been prevalent.

G1 was what made the "Transformers" trademark popular, not the incarnations. Hell, it was so popular it even got an animated movie made with a theatrical release, I can't say that about it's other incarnations. And no, you don't have to like the "other versions" to be a serious fan, you can just support the version that started the legacy.

Change? I guess it went so well for Catwoman, League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, StreetFighter, Mario Bros, Godzilla, alien vs predator, etc. studios never learn.

Never said it didn't

As for Tom Desanto saying it will be based on G1. Never happened. The quote was "Just like with X-Men I want to get to the core of what makes Transformers great"....then he said he was rewatching G1 episodes and comics. The people at AICN said it would be based on G1, but DeSanto has never been quoted as saying this.

as for Change working well....I guess it turned out poorly for Batman Begins, Spider-Man movies, X-Men films, every Transformers cartoon and toyline of the past 17 years, comic books, Every Sonic the Hedgehog game, James Bond films, color and talking cinema, modern medicine, the auto industry and Government...yeah people never learn :rolleyes:

I just want a good film. I'll give them a lot of freedom with Transformers since there is a lot of freedom available with that particular show/toyline/comic. So long as they deliver a good story I will be fine

[el brujo138]

I guess you just skimmed through my comment. Look, Tom Desanto (one of the producers of Xmen) was the first to publicly acknowledge the live action production of Transformers a couple of years ago before Dreamworks got the actual ball rolling. He specifically said that it was going to be "based" on the "G1" mythos. That's what excited the fans (including myself) of G1 for a whole year. Of course, when Dreamworks got involved, they had their own set of ideas; and it became evident that the G1 mythos were not in the equation. That's when the complaints started mounting...and I don't blame them. If you're going to do a movie based (or vaguely based) on something, base it on what made it popular in the first place. But you're right, it's futile. I'll probably see it anyways...hey, who doesn't want to see a movie about giant transforming robots running amuck on earth rendered with the latest technology.

Concerning the popularity of G1; it had never ended. Sure,the cartoons and the toylines has ended, but that's the evolution of the toyline industry...one generation end so they could profit with another (Beastwars, Headmasters, etc.)--that's understandable, but to allude to the notion that no ones been interested for anything G1 for the past 17-20 years is ridiculous. They've reissued the G1 toyline up, remastered the original episodes on dvd, Dreamwave had a solid comic run following the original mythos, and a reputable producer (Tom Desanto) got a live-action (originally based on G1) greenlighted. G1's always been prevalent.

G1 was what made the "Transformers" trademark popular, not the incarnations. Hell, it was so popular it even got an animated movie made with a theatrical release, I can't say that about it's other incarnations. And no, you don't have to like the "other versions" to be a serious fan, you can just support the version that started the legacy.

Change? I guess it went so well for Catwoman, League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, StreetFighter, Mario Bros, Godzilla, alien vs predator, etc. studios never learn.

This I agree with. Good post man.

[Crimson Dynamo]

Its just a licencing thing. Don obviously wanted VW, they just said no. Its the companies call unfortunately. I mean if I were VW, I'd want my car in a summer blockbuster...especially when it sucks so bad in the first place. But they didn't...they'll live with their decision. This is not Don or Bay's fault, its just VW being high and mighty or some stuff...I know I don't like it either.:down


ShadowBoxing, I like your attitude.

I've been a Transformers fan since 1984 and have been waiting for this movie since I was a kid. Me and my school friends used to spend many hours talking about which of our favourite characters we'd like to see on the big screen.

Fast-forward to today and I'm as giddy as a kid at the prospect of seeing these characters brought to life in a movie.

Who cares if they've made changes to the characters? Who cares what vehicles they change into?

If the studio saw fit to make changes for the sake of making our beloved characters more believable does it really matter?

I think it's amazing that the so-called fans will ***** about what kind of truck Prime transforms into in the movie, yet they don't bat an eyelid at the thought of him transforming into an ape!

Come 2007, we're gonna see Optimus, Megatron, and a whole host of big-ass robots kicking the crap out of each other on the big screen.
And as a bonafide, card-carrying, hardcore G1 fanatic...that's all I care about.

Bring it on, that's what I say.
The rest of the whining so-called fans can go to hell.

[Destructicus]

Sorry been to hell and I am anticipating my return. I didn't bat an eyelid when Prime turned into an ape because that was Optimus Primal. Different bot. I'm still a fan and will accept a few changes. But big ones like Shadow here is saying seems a bit farfetched and over the top.

[Evoldog]

*edit

[Evoldog]

Never said it didn't

As for Tom Desanto saying it will be based on G1. Never happened. The quote was "Just like with X-Men I want to get to the core of what makes Transformers great"....then he said he was rewatching G1 episodes and comics. The people at AICN said it would be based on G1, but DeSanto has never been quoted as saying this.

as for Change working well....I guess it turned out poorly for Batman Begins, Spider-Man movies, X-Men films, every Transformers cartoon and toyline of the past 17 years, comic books, Every Sonic the Hedgehog game, James Bond films, color and talking cinema, modern medicine, the auto industry and Government...yeah people never learn :rolleyes:

I just want a good film. I'll give them a lot of freedom with Transformers since there is a lot of freedom available with that particular show/toyline/comic. So long as they deliver a good story I will be fine

Actually this is what was reported by AICN, "DeSanto says that the film will be based on Generation One and set on Earth and that he's been rewatching all the cartoons and reading all the comics."
http://www.aintitcool.com/display.cgi?id=15972

Another from SciFi Wire, "Tom DeSanto told SCI FI Wire that the film will make use of both computer and practical effects for the signature machines and will be based primarily on the original 1980s lineup.
http://www.scifi.com/scifiwire/art-main.html?2003-07/21/12.00.film

I admit, they're not actual quotes, but anyone reading it will assume otherwise. But I don't want to beat a dead horse, so I'll agree...since he wasn't actually quoted, I'll drop the argument--my advice to the reporters, clarify your damn facts.

As for changes, I'm not an idiot. You're never going to 100% translate one medium to the next without certain changes. I can't believe that you actually think that we (anyone criticizing the production) actually want a literal translation.

Look, Batman Begins, Spiderman (1,2), Xmen (1,2), Superman (1,2), V for Vendetta, etc. were successful not because they made changes, but were successful because they knew not to deviate too far from what made them popular. Changes are a necessity for any adaptation, but you have to keep the core "iconic" concept. Just keeping the logos and names are unacceptable. When the audiences saw Batman, Wolverine, Spiderman...they saw Batman, Wolverine, and Spiderman. It wasn't like in Godzilla, where they saw a giant lizard masquarding as Godzilla. Wouldn't you be angry if you went to see Superman and you got the Greatest American Hero?

Hey, I admire your optimism (no pun intended) and passioned responses to the film production. Unfortunately my feelings are to the contrary.

[gkokujin]

^ good post.

[Alizarin]

I think that the main problem with this movie is that people who are working on it are not thinking like the fans of G1. They would change Starscream into a tank if it suited their goals or make Bumblebee a helicopter. When a fan looks at the source maerial, he tries to take a new aproach, to make a deeper story, but without major changes to the original characters. What these people are doing is mixing the characters they think would look cool on screen and making their own mythology that has nothing or little to do with the source material. After I read the report on AICN, I lost all my hopes for seeing G1 on the big screen. Althogh Michael Bay will, without a doubt, make a fun and action-packed movie, it will not be a movie that most of us expect.
Again, I must say that the problem is that they didn't take a group of long-term fans of the material to work on the film, they just do what they think would be cool. If anything, the last few comic bool/cartoon based movies showed us that it takes a little love for the source material to make a good adaptation.

[ShadowBoxing]

Actually this is what was reported by AICN, "DeSanto says that the film will be based on Generation One and set on Earth and that he's been rewatching all the cartoons and reading all the comics."
http://www.aintitcool.com/display.cgi?id=15972
Well if you knew more about that article you'd know AICN said that not DeSanto...Don Murphy and DeSanto have NEVER been quoted as saying its G1. AICN took the fact that DeSanto was reading old source material as indicating it would be G1, but DeSanto never said those words. The only time G1 was alluded to by either Don or DeSanto was when they said it was to be a "vague representation" of G1.

It's been stated time and again on the TF boards that there was really never any direct quote to this affect. AICN has a habit of jumping the gun on these sorts of things.

[Evoldog]

I think that the main problem with this movie is that people who are working on it are not thinking like the fans of G1. They would change Starscream into a tank if it suited their goals or make Bumblebee a helicopter. When a fan looks at the source maerial, he tries to take a new aproach, to make a deeper story, but without major changes to the original characters. What these people are doing is mixing the characters they think would look cool on screen and making their own mythology that has nothing or little to do with the source material. After I read the report on AICN, I lost all my hopes for seeing G1 on the big screen. Althogh Michael Bay will, without a doubt, make a fun and action-packed movie, it will not be a movie that most of us expect.
Again, I must say that the problem is that they didn't take a group of long-term fans of the material to work on the film, they just do what they think would be cool. If anything, the last few comic bool/cartoon based movies showed us that it takes a little love for the source material to make a good adaptation.

Totally agree!!!

[Evoldog]

Well if you knew more about that article you'd know AICN said that not DeSanto...Don Murphy and DeSanto have NEVER been quoted as saying its G1. AICN took the fact that DeSanto was reading old source material as indicating it would be G1, but DeSanto never said those words. The only time G1 was alluded to by either Don or DeSanto was when they said it was to be a "vague representation" of G1.

It's been stated time and again on the TF boards that there was really never any direct quote to this affect. AICN has a habit of jumping the gun on these sorts of things.

Yes, I know and understand a lot about the articles.

Like I said, I dropped the argument due to the fact that Tom Desanto wasn't actually quoted...it was merely hearsay. Both Sci Fi Wire and AICN (I supplied the links to the articles) both reported that Tom Desanto either "says" or "told" them that he would base it on G1.

Now to me, that's just bad reporting. If he actually said what he had said, I don't know why they couldn't have just quoted him instead of speaking on his behalf. Still, I don't blame any fans for misreading the statement...like I said, just bad reporting.

[ShadowBoxing]

Yes, I know and understand a lot about the articles.

Like I said, I dropped the argument due to the fact that Tom Desanto wasn't actually quoted...it was merely hearsay. Both Sci Fi Wire and AICN (I supplied the links to the articles) both reported that Tom Desanto either "says" or "told" them that he would base it on G1.

Now to me, that's just bad reporting. If he actually said what he had said, I don't know why they couldn't have just quoted him instead of speaking on his behalf. Still, I don't blame any fans for misreading the statement...like I said, just bad reporting.No I first and foremost blaim the press completely. They have been printing from the beginning (even without interviewing) this would be G1. So yes they have been speaking on people's behalf. The quote twice now (just today actually) from DeSanto was he would "like X-Men stick to the heart of the franchise"....

[halfapple]

"Prowler974" I prefer your Artwork over then what is posted above.......I hope someone from the film is reading this to get some better ideas perhaps from your talent.

I donno your artwork just seems more practicle, todate and real.

[CFlash]

Its different EVERY TIME...and very different I might add. Dr Spengler hit the nail on the head....TF fans are USED TO THIS. A very small minority believe G1 was the only universe ever...to illustrate how big TFverse is


Perhaps a small minority of *FANS* believe this. But generally speaking anybody who came of age in the 80's (Gen X'ers) and are casual fans... not "fanboys" believe Transformers is and always will be G1. The original cartoon, the original comic, the original story line, the original characters.

I wouldn't call them a minority.... I'd call them an entire generation of guys and gals.

This movie will leave them purplexed. Word of mouth will spread. Those that did go on Opening Day won't go see the movie again... for instance, I might go see this movie with my friends on opening night..... but, I might not go again to take my daughter.

Why would I take her? To show her the SoundWave that I loved when I was kid completely changed and castrated? The Bumblebee that can't talk? There would be no bonding experience in there for us. I'd rather take her to a Pixar movie or something.

I have no doubt this movie will be "successful" as all Bay movies are.... but, will it be "X-Men" or "Spider-Man" quality? I think a lot of you guys have already resigned yourself to the fact that it will not be.

[TheCardPlayer]

Who freaking care if Bumblebee is a Camaro instead of a freaking Beetle? This is not Herby, this is Transformers.

I'd rather have them make the movie badass and serious then cheesy and kiddy. And this is what they are doing.

A MH-53 Military Chopper scrapping a military base in the opening 10 mins? Hell freakin yes.

[CFlash]

Who freaking care if Bumblebee is a Camaro instead of a freaking Beetle? This is not Herby, this is Transformers.

People have repeatedly said it doesn't have to be a Beetle. But a Camaro? Most teenager's first car isn't a Camaro (maybe Bay's was) unless you grew up in Bensenhurst Brooklyn. It was a junk hatchback of some sort or some other compact car or hand-me-down.

CliffJumper was the speedster (a Mazda spider if I remember correctly).

I'd rather have them make the movie badass and serious then cheesy and kiddy. And this is what they are doing.
A MH-53 Military Chopper scrapping a military base in the opening 10 mins? Hell freakin yes.

Then this movie is for you. I'd rather a thoughtful sci-fi movie AND badass action.