Official X-MEN: LEGACY Discussion Thread

[Colossal Spoons]

I can't blame you for quitting the title. I'll let you know when it's relevant again lol


also, what's up with the pointy boobs on that cover? :dry:

[OutcryX]

I was thinking more of what if Bobby ran into a Frost giant, what they might have to say to one another, not that Thor and Bobby might fight. :)

If you play Marvel ultimate Alliance and use Iceman on that level, he and the Frost Giant DO have a nice little dialogue

[squeekness]

I really like “X-Men: Legacy,” especially Gambit’s interactions in the book. I understand the next appearance for the Cajun will be in the Rogue arc designed to finish off your Rogue plots from the last year or two. I was wondering if we are going to get anymore insight into Gambit’s state of mind during his time working with Mystique? Also, will the crafty Cajun be sticking around after his confrontation with Rogue? And has your opinion on Gambit changed since you began writing him?

Thanks, Mythogma. I’m glad you’re enjoying the book. Yeah, Gambit will be playing a major role in “Salvage,” and he will be having some face-to-face interaction with Rogue. I haven’t written those episodes yet, so I can’t be specific about exactly what they’ll discuss, but it’s more than possible that Gambit will refer back to his time as a Marauder.

Have my opinions on Gambit changed? To an extent, yeah. I definitely feel like I know him a lot better, having written him in a number of different situations. And I like his quirky, paradoxical sense of honor a lot more than I used to. He’s a lot of fun to write, especially opposite a dry and cerebral character like Professor X.

As Carey enjoys writing Gambit so much, let’s hope he has an answer for this next question from Rogelio Erandio.

Can you give us news about ‘Gambit: Origin’ and when it might publish?

Sorry, Rogelio, I can’t. It will probably be announced some time in spring, though.

Today’s final email comes from Karen S. She’s fond of the Rogue/Gambit relationship, but wants to make sure they don’t Rachel/Ross it up (please excuse the gratuitous “Friends” reference).

I’ve been an avid fan of the Rogue/Gambit situation for years now, and while I find every situation highly entertaining and I continue to read every minute of it, the couple does always seem to keep falling back into the same patterns. Do you think there will ever be a time that the two can have a definitive stance on their relationship? If only because I have waited for the day where Rogue takes full control of her abilities without losing them completely (such as “X-Treme X-Men”) and she can have the relationship with Gambit we’ve all been waiting so very patiently for – you know, maybe something that can even tie into what happens in “X-Men: The End.” (wink wink)

I know what you mean about repeated beats, Karen. I don’t like any relationship when it becomes a default option, so – while recognizing both the chemistry and the history between Rogue and Gambit – I’m not planning to sweep away recent events and bring them back together in a sort of lightning reconciliation. Gambit tried to kill Rogue at the close of Peter Milligan’s run on “X-Men,” and although he was under the influence of Apocalypse’s machines at the time – and although he’s tried to atone since by bringing her out of Sinister’s clutches alive and healed from her coma – that’s not something that can simply be forgiven and forgotten.

To be blunt, I think the mutual attraction is still there, but there’s a psychological barrier now that complicates things almost as much as the physical barrier presented by Rogue’s powers. So I’m not planning to go back to the status quo, but I’m also not planning to contrive a consummation for Rogue and Remy (whether it’s like the depowered one in X-Treme or otherwise) in the short term. But we will see a reconciliation of sorts. They don’t come out of “Salvage” as enemies, or anything like.
I don't know that I find this especially encouraging. I don't agree with Carey that he "knows" Gambit any better at all, seeing as how he's written the guy in a fairly vanilla way. Perhaps it's just as well if he never gets that Gambit Origin story off the ground. I don't know that he is the best qualified to do it. :( At least it looks like the ROMY saga is over with, thank God.

[OutcryX]

man. this title blows hard. Carey is revealing that he DOESN'T understand the characters as much as we originall thought he did. Please. Let Gambit get back to being Gambit..AWAY from Rogue and so the **** what he tried to kill her as the horseman death??? as if 20 other X-men haven't been death or even just flat out tried to kill the other x-men before? get over it.

[UraniaChang]

Did someone say that Romy is going to end?

Good, for everyone's sake. Though the male group might need to keep their alarms on high level cause that also means Rogue is on the free-for-dates lists, without Gambit as her personal shadow.

[Manic]

Yes, I'm sure men the world over will be lining up for the chance to only emotionally connect with Rogue.




Gay men in need of a hag or beard, that is.

[Colossal Spoons]

I'd rather eat glass then date Rogue

[Manic]

If you ask me, Rogue should wear an all-cloth costume that doesn't fit her form in the least bit. Like military uniforms, and how you can't always tell you're looking at a woman from a distance. She can't touch anybody, and she has no business letting her team mates know that she has any curves at all. All she's doing is providing jerking material for the students, and they have Ms. Frost & Mrs. Iqadi T'Challa for that.

[Colossal Spoons]

They need to invent that virtual sex thing like in Demolition Man for Rogue and the unlucky man she suckers into bed.

[Manic]

You know, Nightcrawler recently used the X-Center's new downgraded Danger Room to create a virtual Kitty for him to hug.


I'm just saying...

[BoredGuy]

I still say rogue just slaps on a power inhibitor and her and Remy go at it....

...Then he finds out how bad a virgin in her mid-20's as at ridin it, so he dumps her...Ha.

[Manic]

Rogue and Gambit have already had sex. Back during X-Treme X-Men, they both nearly died and their powers were temporarily burned out. They took a leave of absence from the X-Men and moved to California where Rogue got a job as an automechanic. They had a very physical relationship at the time.

The whole "powers burning out" thing is why Rogue didn't have Ms. Marvel's powers for the longest time. When Rogue's powers finally kicked back in, she didn't have anything left.

[UraniaChang]

So sex didn't help their relationship at all.
Can't say I'm surprised.

Then why holding on when obviously nothing works between them?

[UraniaChang]

-Oops!

[Havok83]

So sex didn't help their relationship at all.
Can't say I'm surprised.

Then why holding on when obviously nothing works between them?
It did help. They actually seemed happy and peaceful for those few months. Milligan is the one that started up the old drama about them being tortured bc she cant touch with Golgotha and expanded it in Bizarre Love Triangle.

[squeekness]

So sex didn't help their relationship at all.
Can't say I'm surprised.

Then why holding on when obviously nothing works between them?Exactly. It should have been a big bright neon sign that things were only going to go downhill from there. :(

[Specter313]

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X-MEN: LEGACY #220


STORY BY Mike Carey
ART BY Scot Eaton, Andrew Hennessy
COLORS BY Frank D'Armata
COVER BY Lee Bermejo
PUBLISHER: Marvel Comics
COVER PRICE: $2.99
RELEASE DATE: Wed, January 21st, 2009

“Salvage”

It’s the moment that X-Fans have been waiting for — Rogue makes her return to the X-Books. But while Xavier seeks out Rogue, who is searching for him? Hunter becomes hunted and friend becomes foe, in a story that will change your favorite Southern Belle forever. Part 1 (of 5)

[Manic]

A little late for the Secret Invasion tie-in, n'est-ce pas?

[Canemacar]

That's not a bad thing, given the reports I've heard.

[UraniaChang]

-Meditating, meditating, I must NOT think about SEX. Meditating-

[Canemacar]

-Meditating, meditating, I must NOT think about SEX. Meditating-

Kinda hard when she's surrounded by phallic shaped rocks. :woot:

[OutcryX]

...kinda hard...get it? lol...meh

[Specter313]

http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/7623/xmen223covcolqk6.jpg

X-MEN: LEGACY #223
Written by MIKE CAREY
Penciled by SCOT EATON
Cover by LEE BERMEJO
70th Anniversary Variant Cover by MARKO DJURDJEVIC
Wolverine Art Appreciation Variant by MORRY HOLLOWELL
“Salvage”
It’s the moment of truth for Danger and Professor Xavier as the seeds planted in ASTONISHING X-MEN finally bloom. Prof. X kept a sentient being almost as a slave and now that she is free of her bonds, Danger will take her revenge. And this time, the X-Men aren’t there to help him. It’s the beginning of the end of Professor Xavier’s part of X-MEN LEGACY! Part 4 (of 5)
32 PGS./Rated A …$2.99

[Havok83]

This Danger stuff actually looks interesting

[sniktsnakt]

You sound surprised.

;)

[javi1024]

i think i need to read 'Danger' again, cuz i really cant remember what her agenda is.

[Havok83]

i think i need to read 'Danger' again, cuz i really cant remember what her agenda is.
The story didnt make all that much sense to me when I read it so Im hoping this provides some more insight and simplify things. Its good that its coming from Xavier's angle bc he's the one that needs more explaining

[mightiest_mortal]

Uuh! Danger was so lame. The holodeck being broken is such a cliche, I always think of Futurama..

Kif: The Holo-Shed's on the fritz again! The characters have become real!
Zapp Brannigan: Damn! The last time that happened, I got slapped with three paternity suits!


and also.. Prof X willingly keeping a sentient being prisoner this whole time ON PURPOSE just so the danger room would work a bit better? WTF? I know to make a name for yourself as an X-Writer you have to come up with something bad to drag from Xaviers past, but that did take the piss a bit.

[UraniaChang]

Sometimes people do crazy/irrational/pointless things just for a very small reason, and it makes sense at that time and age to them.

Though most of those things turn to bite them in the back.

Such is life.

[Colossal Spoons]

Does Danger really need nipples? lol

You sound surprised.

;)

Well yeah, it is X-Men Legacy after all

[mightiest_mortal]

Does Danger really need nipples? lol

Well over in X-Force, Stryfe has light up glow nipples.... I guess its the in thing amongst the X-villains.

[Havok83]

Sometimes people do crazy/irrational/pointless things just for a very small reason, and it makes sense at that time and age to them.

Though most of those things turn to bite them in the back.

Such is life.
seems everything Xavier ever did wrong came back to bite him at the same time

[UraniaChang]

Murphy's law.

[Havok83]

Legacy 223 variant cover

http://www.isarapix.org/pix22/1232492423.jpg

[OutcryX]

sooo tired of Phoenix teases

[Manic]

The fact that I was just talking about Monet and Darwin in another thread is probably affecting the following comment, but:

Is it me, or is Jean really pale in that variant?

[OutcryX]

LMAO....well she IS dead.

and arent most redheads usually pale anyways?

[Manic]

There's Conan O'Brien pale, and then there's Michael Jackson pale. That's Michael Jackson pale.

[OutcryX]

well, again....she IS dead. lol

[Havok83]

As a Jean fan, Im sick of the teases as well. Either bring her back or stop dangling her in front of our faces every other month. She's also about to make an appearance in the next Young X-men during a flashback

[Manic]

As a Jean fan, Im sick of the teases as well. Either bring her back or stop dangling her in front of our faces every other month. She's also about to make an appearance in the next Young X-men during a flashback
Well, that has more to do with Cipher, who's apparently getting Jessica Jonesed into the X-Men.

[OutcryX]

sooo how exactly has Cipher been around since issue 1 of Young X-Men?

[Manic]

You know how Greymalkin was talking to himself, and we all just assumed he was really talking to Blindfold because she was the only psychic around? Turns out Cipher is invisible and/or telepathic.

[javi1024]

i wonder if they'll ever have a story where they bring Jean back and either keep her around as a cosmic character or finally have Phoenix exorcised from her.

[bryanss3]

yeah that would be nice. but when that damn baby with cable turns out to be jean how the hell are they gonna make that make any sense

[Manic]

By saying Hope isn't Jean's name.

[javi1024]

yeah that would be nice. but when that damn baby with cable turns out to be jean how the hell are they gonna make that make any sense
well if i were to further convolute X-Men history Claremont-style, id bring back Cable to the present without Hope, say he lost her somehow and needs the X-Men's help. brings them to the future but (insert complication) cause them to overshoot the destination and they land even further in the future where Hope is a young adult and revealed to be JEAN! and that at the end she agrees to travel back to our time to live happily ever after....until she dies again. crappy plot? absolutely. beyond possiblity? hardly.

[OutcryX]

probably then that is already planned out

[Havok83]

Well, that has more to do with Cipher, who's apparently getting Jessica Jonesed into the X-Men.
true but they could have just as easily have gotten Emma to fill in the same role

[TwilightPro101]

As a Jean fan, Im sick of the teases as well. Either bring her back or stop dangling her in front of our faces every other month. She's also about to make an appearance in the next Young X-men during a flashback

Feeling the same way in regards to Jean's situation.

[UraniaChang]

Oh, my..she's PALE isn't she?

Get some sunlight will you, dear?

Oh, I forgot that you'll swallow down the sun. Never mind.

[Manic]

Jean Grey: The only ginger who eats sunlight for breakfast.

[ragingdemon155]

Who knows...Maybe this is the real deal and Jean is finally coming back:oldrazz:

Truth be told though, I am sick and tired of these teases as well. I'm a sucker for comic book relationships so I would love to see Jean/Scott together again. I'm a bit shocked that Marvel hasn't brought her back even though I would love for it to happen. Marvel has a sick fetish for killing off characters only to bring them back in a few issues. Yet Jean, one of their more popular characters has stayed dead for some time now. Heh go figure.

[Manic]

I think they're trying to let her death sink in a little, you know? After the Dark Phoenix Saga, she stayed dead for 6 years.

[spark627]

It's sunk, she has been dead for a long time.

[Manic]

I think she can stay dead a little while longer. I'm just too damn into Scott & Emma's relationship, and I want to see Maddie's impact on their love life before I see Jean's.

[javi1024]

i don't mind staying dead longer. but honestly if she were to return she couldn't just rejoin the team without a massive retcon. after how much influence the Phoenix has had on the characters since Morrison's run she outclasses everyone on earth.

[Manic]

I think Jean should only be uber-powerful after either a few decades of incubation (like at the end of Morrison's run), or after consuming large amounts of solar energy (like what Claremont did originally, and later during X-Men: The End when she got a sudden power boost during a solar flare). Otherwise, she should be slightly more powerful than Rachel.

[javi1024]

doesn't Rachel only have a fraction of the Phoenix Force in her though compared to Jean. i have to admit i've never been able to follow Rachel and her connection to Phoenix.

[Manic]

For a while, Rachel claimed to have no connection to the Phoenix Force, but was still manifesting that Phoenix symbol over her eye and displaying power at practically the same level she had during her old partial-Phoenix Excalibur days. Frankly, I think she still had possession of the Phoenix Force.

Now she has a "shadow" of the Phoenix Force that she got from Korvus' Phoenix Blade. So far, that's allowed her to fly in space unaided again, and hold off a self-doubting Gladiator.

[Havok83]

i don't mind staying dead longer. but honestly if she were to return she couldn't just rejoin the team without a massive retcon. after how much influence the Phoenix has had on the characters since Morrison's run she outclasses everyone on earth.
why does there need to be a major retcon? Just remove the Phoenix Force from her and have her written as she was from X-factor #1 up until Morrison's New X-men. She was powerful enough without needing some cosmic entity to amplify her powers.

For a while, Rachel claimed to have no connection to the Phoenix Force, but was still manifesting that Phoenix symbol over her eye and displaying power at practically the same level she had during her old partial-Phoenix Excalibur days. Frankly, I think she still had possession of the Phoenix Force.

Now she has a "shadow" of the Phoenix Force that she got from Korvus' Phoenix Blade. So far, that's allowed her to fly in space unaided again, and hold off a self-doubting Gladiator.
Blame that on CC. Jean also manifested that Phoenix over her eye with no explanation and then he had Rachel do it as well. I dont believe Rachel had the phoenix force at all after she returned in Cable. She only just got part of it back recently in UXM

I think she can stay dead a little while longer. I'm just too damn into Scott & Emma's relationship, and I want to see Maddie's impact on their love life before I see Jean's.
Personally I dont see why Maddie should have any impact on Scott and Emma's relationship. She and he were settled a long time ago and it doesnt need revisiting. As for Emma, she and Maddie never had anything to do with each other so causing trouble for her makes Maddie look even more foolish. Maddie better enjoy her time while it lasts bc I think when Jean comes back its going to be to put her to rest. I believe the only reason why Maddie is alive is bc she has another broken Phoenix fragment. It gave her life before and I think it did so again.

[Manic]

Personally I dont see why Maddie should have any impact on Scott and Emma's relationship. She and he were settled a long time ago and it doesnt need revisiting. As for Emma, she and Maddie never had anything to do with each other so causing trouble for her makes Maddie look even more foolish. Maddie better enjoy her time while it lasts bc I think when Jean comes back its going to be to put her to rest. I believe the only reason why Maddie is alive is bc she has another broken Phoenix fragment. It gave her life before and I think it did so again.
Well, I don't want to see Maddie break them up or anything. I want Maddie and Emma to meet, and see Emma's reaction to finding out what happened. I get the distinct impression Emma doesn't know too much about Maddie, or how Scott walked out on her the moment Jean came back.

[Havok83]

Well, I don't want to see Maddie break them up or anything. I want Maddie and Emma to meet, and see Emma's reaction to finding out what happened. I get the distinct impression Emma doesn't know too much about Maddie, or how Scott walked out on her the moment Jean came back.
Im sure she knows. She's a telepath and its common knowledge that he was married to Maddie and that Jean returned when X-factor formed. It doesnt take a rocket scientest to figure out what went on there. Its not discussed bc it isnt really relevant and Emma wouldnt have much reason to care. Nothing about Maddie in regards to Scott/Jean has been since the 80s. When she returned alive in the 90s, she barely had anything to do with them aside from a 1 issue meeting with Jean in X-man and she was completely ignored in the 2 core books. She left them alone and lived her own life without seeking either of them out to cause trouble. Her fight with Jean only happen bc Jean went to her. Thats why its kind off odd that she's returned and in UXM where she'll presumably be causing trouble for Scott and his current love interest. Why go after him now?

[Manic]

My theory about Maddie's current activities is that there's some "greater good" she's aware of that requires the X-Men to leave San Francisco. So she's forming the Sisterhood and starting a bunch of non-lethal hate crimes to coax them into packing up.

Annddd I think she just feels like screwing with Scott a little for fun. Disguising herself as Emma, having sex with Scott, wiping a few hours out of Emma's memory. Today's X-writers have made a habit of ignoring good things about characters that happened prior to Morrison's run (Emma working for Xavier, James Proudstar dropping the name "Warpath" ect. ect.), so they're probably ignoring Maddie's ghost forgiving Scott to make her bitter and vengeful again.

I just hope they remember that Maddie was never evil to begin with, and that the Goblin Queen thing makes her no more twisted than Jean as the Dark Phoenix.

[Havok83]

This really should have been dealt with in the 90s an I hate how they just glossed over Maddie's return in regards to the X-men. She was a huge character who was instrumental in one of the biggest storylines (Inferno). They never followed it up with having her face her former friends.

As far as Maddie being evil, I think they've written her bad to differentiate her from Jean. She was a Jean replacement to begin with and when the real one came back, it did seem redundant having 2 of them so of course they had to make Maddie the evil clone with Jean being the good original. They went and repeated history with their sons Cable/Stryfe. I dont hold out much hope for Maddie being good bc you know Jean will come back. Im sure Marvel will want to play up the evil vs good dynamic

[Manic]

Ugh. Juggernaut, Maddie. Why do I bother believing some characters will stay good? I might as well count the days until Emma flips out and turns evil again.

[JustABill]

Emma will be harder to turn evil again though, considering how many years she has been good. Hopefully if Jean comes back, Cyclops and her will move on from one another.

I don't even want Jean on the X-Men. I think she should branch out into the main Marvel universe.

[OutcryX]

wait...i thought Maddie was back because X-man willed it to be?

[Manic]

wait...i thought Maddie was back because X-man willed it to be?
Yeah, but then a version of Jean from an alternate universe snuck up and killed her. Then X-Man died later on. Prior to Uncanny #501 (or was it #502?), the last time we saw Maddie was as a ghost who did the "kiss and makeup" thing with Scott and Cable.

[Havok83]

Emma will be harder to turn evil again though, considering how many years she has been good. Hopefully if Jean comes back, Cyclops and her will move on from one another.

I don't even want Jean on the X-Men. I think she should branch out into the main Marvel universe.
How great would it be to have her in Mighty Avengers along with Beast? If she doesnt make it back to the X-men full time, I think making her an Avenger would be a great idea


Yeah, but then a version of Jean from an alternate universe snuck up and killed her. Then X-Man died later on. Prior to Uncanny #501 (or was it #502?), the last time we saw Maddie was as a ghost who did the "kiss and makeup" thing with Scott and Cable.
Only Cable. Scott was in the issue but was passed out on the astral plane. Maddie never interacted with him. Scott has yet to speak to Maddie since she tried to kill him back in Inferno

[UraniaChang]

Whatever, I just want Madelyne far far away from Scott and Emma, especially now she sunk to the level of being a 'rapist'.

For someone who's supposed to be an ordinary Jean and build a family, become a mom, she would be very stupid to waste her time in wars if there isn't something greater behind.

[Specter313]

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[Colossal Spoons]

Nocturne?

[Specter313]

Rogue in the Austrailian Outback, when they originally fought Nimrod and she absorbed a bunch of powers at once.

[Colossal Spoons]

Haha, didn't even notice Colossus' skin :O

[Specter313]

Haha, didn't even notice Colossus' skin :O

You? Not notice something that has to do with Colossus? Never! :wow:

[Colossal Spoons]

I thought it was wrapping, like a boxer or martial artist haha

[foxx5]

Whatever, I just want Madelyne far far away from Scott and Emma, especially now she sunk to the level of being a 'rapist'.

For someone who's supposed to be an ordinary Jean and build a family, become a mom, she would be very stupid to waste her time in wars if there isn't something greater behind.

maddie wasnt to normal through the inferno story line and whats this about a rapist, please give more info about that. i hope they bring jean back soon i miss her, hope her and emma have a crazy 5 issue battle when she returns, perhaps with pillows and bikinis on ... seriously a good mind/physical battle would be awesome between the two especially with stuck in the middle lol

[Manic]

whats this about a rapist, please give more info about that.
She pretended to be Emma and had sex with Scott.

Does it count as rape when you're posing as someone they'd have consensual sex with?

[bryanss3]

wait I'm confused was she controlling Emma or did they swap I thought she was controlling her or something.

[Specter313]

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X-MEN: LEGACY #221


STORY BY Mike Carey
ART BY Scot Eaton, Andrew Hennessy
COVER BY Lee Bermejo
PUBLISHER Marvel Comics
COVER PRICE: $2.99
RELEASE DATE: Wed, February 18th, 2009

“Salvage”

The desert ghost-town that was once the X-Men's HQ has been reborn as a city of the damned with only one inhabitant: Rogue. But as Professor X and Gambit struggle to reach her, they discover that sometimes one is a very large number... Part 2 (of 5)

[Manic]

Okay...

I guess when Hope wiped Rogue clean, she wiped out the extra minds in her head, but left the repressed powers.

[UraniaChang]

How convenient, but hey, it's Carey.

[OutcryX]

you know....if rogue is back to being X-treme rogue with total power recall....i could live with that.

[Havok83]

thats the worse thing that could happen to Rogue. It made her way too powerful and made things too easy and convenient. When that happens characters either get depowered, written out or killed off. The first two ended up happening to her the last time

[Manic]

thats the worse thing that could happen to Rogue. It made her way too powerful and made things too easy and convenient. When that happens characters either get depowered, written out or killed off. The first two ended up happening to her the last time
And the third almost happened.


If this sticks, I'm going to start seeing Mike Carey as the new Claremont, only with Rogue in place of Psylocke.

[OutcryX]

then that means that rogue will die...something else i can live with....also...maybe it will mean that since Carey is becoming Claremont Jr....he will be shipped off to write AR tales and off of X-men so that it can drop the Legacy format and return to a team book

[OutcryX]

oh yeah..for a second as i was scrolling down i though it was nocturne that was about to whoop Nimrod....then i wondered how that would be possible..another improbability..if Bastion is the evolved form of Nimrod..then how is the de-evolved form still around and kicking?

[Specter313]

My guess is that somehow Xavier and Gambit stepped into some kind of memory projection from Rogue when the got to the top of the cliff. Notice how Gambit went from his climbing gear into his uniform all of a sudden, and that version of Rogue is wearing an old uniform herself. She looks exactly the same from when she fought off Nimrod the first time. From UXN:

http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/1695/rogue22em2.jpg

When attacked by Nimrod, the Super Sentinel from the future, the X-Men were almost defeated. Buried under the rubble of a construction site, Rogue saw no other chance than to absorb the powers of her unconscious teammates all at once, even though it meant to risk permanent disfigurement by absorbing physical attributes like Nightcrawler’s tail and the steel skin of Colossus. The gamble worked, as Nimrod was confused by Rogue’s use of multiple mutant signatures at once. Since after the fight Rogue’s changed form reverted back to her regular appearance, she no longer had reservations against using her powers on physical mutations. [Uncanny X-Men #194]

[bryanss3]

do you think Chuck's got anything in those pouches?

[UraniaChang]

He's no magician so it's probably some mechanic device, or medical ones, or just for the purpose of an accessary.

[Manic]

I gotta say, looking at those pages again, if that's what Valle Soleada looks like, I wish that was a real place.

[insane polaris]

[quote=Specter313;16439620]




http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/6457/prv2058pg3od8.jpg


Isnt that just loads of buildings/landmarks from different cities.

- Golden Gate Bridge
- Twin Towers (on the left)
- The building right infront of Prof. X is the recently destroyed X-mansion.

[Manic]

No wonder it's so damn pretty, then. It's Amalga City.

[squeekness]

How did Chuck get so buff? I thought he was like a guy in his 50s who'd just spent a lot of time in a wheel chair. What? Does he go to the gym every day now that he's walking again?

[Manic]

I remember the old 90's cartoon used to show him doing a lot of gymnastics that required a ton of upper body strength. I guess he's kept pretty fit in the comic, too.

[Canemacar]

[quote=Specter313;16439620]


http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/6457/prv2058pg3od8.jpg

Isnt that just loads of buildings/landmarks from different cities.

- Golden Gate Bridge
- Twin Towers (on the left)
- The building right infront of Prof. X is the recently destroyed X-mansion.

There's also
-Savage Land dinos in the foreground
-About three different versions of the x-mansion including the current, destroyed one
-Madripoor highrises

[Havok83]

How did Chuck get so buff? I thought he was like a guy in his 50s who'd just spent a lot of time in a wheel chair. What? Does he go to the gym every day now that he's walking again?
Like Magneto, he's not in his original body. That one was killed off after being infested with the Brood. He's in a Sh'iar cloned body and I think thats whats helped him look as in shape as he is. Around the time he entered the new, younger body, they showed him doing alot of excersise and training as he got used to it. Lilandra said it was a perfect physical specimen

[JustABill]

Gugh. I hate that ****.

It's really time to let Chucky go. At least with Magneto there's still somewhat of a purpose, but with Charles? He's staying alive on borrowed time just because ''Oh, he's suppose to be there."

Kinda like Aunt May in Spider-Man these days.

[Manic]

This would pretty much have to be a new, younger body, wouldn't it? As a Korean War veteran, he'd have to be at least... 70-something?

[Manic]

Gugh. I hate that ****.

It's really time to let Chucky go. At least with Magneto there's still somewhat of a purpose, but with Charles? He's staying alive on borrowed time just because ''Oh, he's suppose to be there."

Kinda like Aunt May in Spider-Man these days.
The X-Men haven't made a deal with the devil to keep Charles alive, though.

[Havok83]

This would pretty much have to be a new, younger body, wouldn't it? As a Korean War veteran, he'd have to be at least... 70-something?
and it is thanks to the cloning

Gugh. I hate that ****.

It's really time to let Chucky go. At least with Magneto there's still somewhat of a purpose, but with Charles? He's staying alive on borrowed time just because ''Oh, he's suppose to be there."

Kinda like Aunt May in Spider-Man these days.I still like Xavier and think he should stick around. Id love it if he rebuilt his estate and reopened the school. Bring Storm back and have her head up a team of X-men there. When Jean comes back, this would be a good place for her too and I can other characters like Rogue, Iceman, Psylocke, Nightrawler, the space X-men (Polaris, Rachel, Havok) joining them as well as the New Mutants

[JustABill]

Nah. Xavier's purpose is gone. I don't like characters that overstay their welcome. It's kinda why I've grown so disenchanted with Xavier, Jean, Aunt May, and to use an example from the TV realm, half the cast of Heroes.

[insane polaris]

and it is thanks to the cloning

I still like Xavier and think he should stick around. Id love it if he rebuilt his estate and reopened the school. Bring Storm back and have her head up a team of X-men there. When Jean comes back, this would be a good place for her too and I can other characters like Rogue, Iceman, Psylocke, Nightrawler, the space X-men (Polaris, Rachel, Havok) joining them as well as the New Mutants

I like the sound of Xavier reopening the mansion or rebuilding it at least (it will have to be done at some point)

Just think he left his mansion in the hands of Cyclops, thinking he was leaving it in good hands. Cyclops redesigned ithe whole estate and now has just left it all destroyed.

[UraniaChang]

The mansion has been destroyed plenty of times when he was in charge, and it won't change even if somehow he re-opens it.

[Manic]

If Professor X reopened the mansion, it would divide the mutant community. Cyclops has brought the 200+ remaining mutants to San Francisco. We can't afford half of that moving back to upstate New York.


Also, the living conditions in San Francisco are much better. Back in Westchester, the X-Men lived and worked in that old mansion. Every time someone attacked them, there was a risk of destroying the dormitories and all living quarters. The X-Men were literally homeless inbetween rebuilding the mansion after every attack.

In San Francisco, the underground bunks beneath the X-Center are temporary. Scott and Emma live in a penthouse somewhere in the middle of San Francisco, and I imagine Warren does as well. The Young X-Men secretly live in an abandoned church. Armor told Pixie that any kids still living under the X-Center are going to be partnered up with adults and moved into the city. It'll only be a matter of time before the bad guys attack the X-Center where they work, but they'd have to torch the entire metropolitan area to the ground to destroy where they live.

[Havok83]

If Professor X reopened the mansion, it would divide the mutant community. Cyclops has brought the 200+ remaining mutants to San Francisco. We can't afford half of that moving back to upstate New York.


Also, the living conditions in San Francisco are much better. Back in Westchester, the X-Men lived and worked in that old mansion. Every time someone attacked them, there was a risk of destroying the dormitories and all living quarters. The X-Men were literally homeless inbetween rebuilding the mansion after every attack.

Where was it stated that 200+ mutants moved to San Francisco with Cyclops. The number seems much smaller like 30-40 or so. Theres still threats on the East coast and those didnt simply go away bc the X-men arent there. The institute is Xavier's home and there's still former students of his who are loyal to him and havent turned on him. If he wants to rebuild it then I say go for it. Id much rather see that happen and a new team of X-men form over there rather than Legacy continue as an Xavier solo book. AXM has its set cast. UXM has a very similar core cast. It supporting cast is rotated among everyone else and unfortunetly with the exception of Angel, none of them are really significant or used in any meaningful capacity. Theres alot of characters that should be spotlighted but arent bc there isnt enough space to squeeze them in those two books. Hence why Legacy needs to go back to its old format and having Xavier head it up is a great way to go to give it a different feel and direction than AXM and UXM have while still respecting and following up with the vibe that Legacy has created over the past year or so

[Manic]

Where was it stated that 200+ mutants moved to San Francisco with Cyclops. The number seems much smaller like 30-40 or so. Theres still threats on the East coast and those didnt simply go away bc the X-men arent there. The institute is Xavier's home and there's still former students of his who are loyal to him and havent turned on him. If he wants to rebuild it then I say go for it. Id much rather see that happen and a new team of X-men form over there rather than Legacy continue as an Xavier solo book. AXM has its set cast. UXM has a very similar core cast. It supporting cast is rotated among everyone else and unfortunetly with the exception of Angel, none of them are really significant or used in any meaningful capacity. Theres alot of characters that should be spotlighted but arent bc there isnt enough space to squeeze them in those two books. Hence why Legacy needs to go back to its old format and having Xavier head it up is a great way to go to give it a different feel and direction than AXM and UXM have while still respecting and following up with the vibe that Legacy has created over the past year or so
200+ was a guess, since there are apparently 198 mutants living in the United States, and god knows that undocumented mutants have been popping up anyway.

I don't know how many mutants moved to San Francisco, but who still lives on the East Coast? What mutants still live on the East Coast for the X-Men to protect if Cyclops has asked all mutants to come to San Francisco for protection?

If Xavier rebuilt the mansion, he'd pretty much only be using it as a house. All of the teenagers have already moved across the country and are living in a much safer setup. I suppose he could convince some of the X-Men to leave Scott, but if he did that it'd only be for his own ego. There's no advantage to having X-Men in New York. Xavier's team wouldn't be operating under the umbrella of a city's mayor for protection, and would be running from the Dark Avengers just like everyone else.

The X-men were never homeless. The only real times where the mansion was unlive
That's what I said. Every time the mansion was attacked and destroyed, they were homeless. It's just a bad idea to live and work in the same place if you're not going to have defenses at the same level as the Baxter Building or Avengers Tower or something.

[Galact-Gal]

200+ was a guess, since there are apparently 198 mutants living in the United States, and god knows that undocumented mutants have been popping up anyway.

I don't know how many mutants moved to San Francisco, but who still lives on the East Coast? What mutants still live on the East Coast for the X-Men to protect if Cyclops has asked all mutants to come to San Francisco for protection?

If Xavier rebuilt the mansion, he'd pretty much only be using it as a house. All of the teenagers have already moved across the country and are living in a much safer setup. I suppose he could convince some of the X-Men to leave Scott, but if he did that it'd only be for his own ego. There's no advantage to having X-Men in New York. Xavier's team wouldn't be operating under the umbrella of a city's mayor for protection, and would be running from the Dark Avengers just like everyone else.


That's what I said. Every time the mansion was attacked and destroyed, they were homeless. It's just a bad idea to live and work in the same place if you're not going to have defenses at the same level as the Baxter Building or Avengers Tower or something.

The mansion had underground facilities. Wasn't that where the New Mutants/X-Force were living after the mansion was destroyed in Inferno?

[Manic]

Recently, the only underground facilities in the mansion were the Danger Room, hangar room, and meeting rooms. Over the past few years, the X-Men had been living in the regular upstairs rooms of the mansion, and the students had dorms built along the perimeter.

[Havok83]

The mansion had underground facilities. Wasn't that where the New Mutants/X-Force were living after the mansion was destroyed in Inferno? Yes the New Mutants lived underground

200+ was a guess, since there are apparently 198 mutants living in the United States, and god knows that undocumented mutants have been popping up anyway.

I don't know how many mutants moved to San Francisco, but who still lives on the East Coast? What mutants still live on the East Coast for the X-Men to protect if Cyclops has asked all mutants to come to San Francisco for protection?
Not every mutant out there followed Scott to SF. Besides many of the 198 left the Xavier institute long before the mansion was destroyed. Mutants are dispersed all over and not in some central location now

Scott didnt do such a great job protecting those under his watch, hence the mansion being destroyed and the casualties and mess created following Blinded By Light and Messiah Complex.



If Xavier rebuilt the mansion, he'd pretty much only be using it as a house. All of the teenagers have already moved across the country and are living in a much safer setup. I suppose he could convince some of the X-Men to leave Scott, but if he did that it'd only be for his own ego. There's no advantage to having X-Men in New York. Xavier's team wouldn't be operating under the umbrella of a city's mayor for protection, and would be running from the Dark Avengers just like everyone else.
There are global threats need rise up and need taking care of. Theres bigger issues out there like the growing Shi'ar threat posed by Vulcan and the lost X-men out there that Cyclops has chosen to ignore. Who's going to deal with that stuff? Another team of X-men under Xavier could handle that stuff. As for the Dark Avengers, all the more reason to have a mutant squad on the east coast to protect their interest since there's alot of corruption going on in the US government now.

That's what I said. Every time the mansion was attacked and destroyed, they were homeless. It's just a bad idea to live and work in the same place if you're not going to have defenses at the same level as the Baxter Building or Avengers Tower or something.I hit enter before I finished typing but most of the times the mansion needed repairs, they were still able to live in it. They lived there after Onslaught caused some major damage and they did when Juggernaut went rampaging through. There were few times were it was completely totalled and unliveable. They always had accomodations for the times they couldnt live there and or werent around so it wasnt an issue. Examples of that was when it was destroyed in Inferno (X-men were in Australia), when it was destroyed by the Sidri, they went to space for a mission with the Starjammers/Shi'ar

[Manic]

It still seems more practical for the X-Men to live in a different place from their base all the time if they're not going to supe up the automated security.

[roach]

I'd have Xavier start up a new team with a newly resurrected Jean Grey as his team leader

[Havok83]

I'd have Xavier start up a new team with a newly resurrected Jean Grey as his team leader
great idea. Im not so sure I could see Jean leading alone but I can see her co leading with someone. Ive always wanted to see her do that with Warren, but I could see her being Storm's second in command

It still seems more practical for the X-Men to live in a different place from their base all the time if they're not going to supe up the automated security.Maybe its more practical but Im looking at things from a writers stand point. A third X-men book based in San Francisco would be redundant and there are just way too many characters getting ignored to not have Legacy go back to being a team book (which I believe it will eventually). The team would need a different direction and focus to have it standout one that doesnt necesarily fall in line with what Scott and Emma are accomplishing in SF. Considering that Legacy doesnt currently focus on Xavier, he seems a naturall choice to center a team around especially considering he isnt on good terms with them as they have different methods and points of view

[OutcryX]

I'm all for a SuPeRmAx style secured X-mansion that houses the X-men....and maybe some of the students that get ignored by everyone else. Storm as leader and Jean as second in command..throw in some Bishop and i'm there!

[foxx5]

I'd have Xavier start up a new team with a newly resurrected Jean Grey as his team leader

ya and the new x-men team can be kinda like rivals to the other team, kinda what happen with the new x-men and old x-men(x-factor) of the past and eventully they would come to terms and team up

[Havok83]

ya and the new x-men team can be kinda like rivals to the other team, kinda what happen with the new x-men and old x-men(x-factor) of the past and eventully they would come to terms and team up
I wouldnt say that the X-men and X-factor were rivals. The X-men didnt even know of their existance till Inferno and they initially fought due to confusion and corruption of the Gobltn Queen's influence

[UraniaChang]

I would love to see who will want to join Xavier, who decided to lock up a sentient being for decades, and erase crucial parts of the minds of people and don't say it's the writer's fault for making the event of Danger and Vulcan happened. It happened and will stay as a part of Xavier's character unless some writer decides to retcon it.

[foxx5]

well isnt Xavier a new man right now, he doesnt know who he was, he is finding out as he meets his old students and he already has gambit, looks like rogue could be next if he can help her, i could see wolverine joining him, and if he can pull a few rabbits like jean grey and maybe some new characters

[Havok83]

I would love to see who will want to join Xavier, who decided to lock up a sentient being for decades, and erase crucial parts of the minds of people and don't say it's the writer's fault for making the event of Danger and Vulcan happened. It happened and will stay as a part of Xavier's character unless some writer decides to retcon it.
and how many would be pleased to learn about Scott creating his own secret death squad. I think Storm for one would be appalled by this and I can see her taking a more proactive stance on things by leading her own team rather than sitting back and following him and Emma

[Specter313]

http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/100/xmen224covcollu1.jpg

X-MEN: LEGACY #224
Written by MIKE CAREY
Penciled by SCOT EATON
Cover by LEE BERMEJO
“SALVAGE” Part 5 (of 5)
The climactic finale of “Salvage” is here! Rogue and Gambit fans, DO NOT MISS THIS ISSUE! The status quo is shaken and the effects of the final reckoning between Danger and Xavier are felt!
32 PGS./Rated A …$2.99

[Manic]

The status quo is shaken? This book has a status quo?

[Havok83]

Hate Remy/Rogue but thats one hot cover. It reminds me of the one from Blinded by Light

The status quo is shaken? This book has a status quo? Hopefully this means its going back to being a team book

[UraniaChang]

well isnt Xavier a new man right now, he doesnt know who he was, he is finding out as he meets his old students and he already has gambit, looks like rogue could be next if he can help her, i could see wolverine joining him, and if he can pull a few rabbits like jean grey and maybe some new characters

Being wiped out of your memory doesn't make you a new man, and it won't make people forgive you just because you don't remember, besides, if Xavier has never tried to help Rogue before there must be some hidden agenda of his for that. And making Gambit and Rogue suddenly cozy with him is incontinuous, as if they were ever really close in the past?


and how many would be pleased to learn about Scott creating his own secret death squad. I think Storm for one would be appalled by this and I can see her taking a more proactive stance on things by leading her own team rather than sitting back and following him and Emma

As if Storm never considered gone down the road of being more direct against their enemies? And there are enemies you will never make peace with, that's why the old 'X-Men Don't Kill' thing doesn't work. Everyone of them killed and will do it when it's necessary, trying to act as if she is holier and uses that as excuse to start her own team won't raise one point of her in my eyes.

[OutcryX]

isnt Storm being written as more confrontational and morally ambiguous over in Black Panther anyways? could've sworn i have seen her kill over there.

none of the X-men are angels..not even Angel...as long as they fight for what is good and right and try to achieve greater goals....all is well with me..plus I don't like how writers keep revealing all these dirty secrets about Xavier and how the editors are letting it happen

[Manic]

isnt Storm being written as more confrontational and morally ambiguous over in Black Panther anyways? could've sworn i have seen her kill over there.

none of the X-men are angels..not even Angel...as long as they fight for what is good and right and try to achieve greater goals....all is well with me..plus I don't like how writers keep revealing all these dirty secrets about Xavier and how the editors are letting it happen
It's a very simple concept. A writer comes along and thinks "Professor X is so good he practically has a halo. Let's make him a bit more morally ambiguous by creating a dark secret from his past."

Now, what an editor should say is "Read an old comic where Professor X is the central character, jackass."

Instead, what editors do is nothing.

[OutcryX]

yeah...kinda like how they have allowed for the ruining of Bishop...starting with Claremont turning him into an Aborigine(this can easily be retconned) after existing for over a decade as the most recognizable African American male super hero.

yes blade and black panther and luke cage were all out..but none were as popular as bishop was in the 90s.

and now they have completely bastardized the character. trying to kill a baby? beating the living hell(and shooting) out of forge(twice)...shooting Xavier in the head(accidentally, but still)...and betraying the X-men...wonder if it turns out the HE is the one that he came back into the past to stop?

[UraniaChang]

I know you're pissed at how Bishop has been written, but you know one thing good about the X-Men? A while later they'll try to retcon this part of Bishop, just hope they won't pull a Carey'e Legacy type of retconning, cause it's plain lazy.

[foxx5]

wonder if it turns out the HE is the one that he came back into the past to stop?

that would be awesome, i would buy that story no problem if it takes place in the x-men legacy series, i just want to see the stupid look on his face he he finds out its him, i wonder who would win the fight, it would be close but i think i would go with Bishop for the win.

I'm serious about buying the book for that story though

[OutcryX]

it would be a way for a bit of character redemption and further story development for him, that's for sure.

[squeekness]

For a book with Gambit in it it seems to me that I should be enjoying this more. He doesn't seem like himself. He seems kinda bland. :( I want the dynamic, into the action Gambit, not some guy just following Xavier around.

[Havok83]

For a book with Gambit in it it seems to me that I should be enjoying this more. He doesn't seem like himself. He seems kinda bland. :( I want the dynamic, into the action Gambit, not some guy just following Xavier around.
Carey doesnt exactly seem to be able to write an interesting Gambit bc I didnt care for him in MC or BBL. I was hoping he'd stay a villian or more of a gray character but Im not interested in a goody goody love sap Gambit

[squeekness]

I don't want him to be Rogue's lapdog. :(

[UraniaChang]

Then you probably have to wait for a long long time before Gambit can cut his tail off. :csad:

[Manic]

The X-Men according to Mike Carey...

Professor X: A good man who made some terrible and underhanded decisions in the past. Regrets all of the bads things he did.

Gambit: A good man who occasionally follows bad people when they promise to help him. He has no sense of forethought and will put every ideal he has aside to do whatever someone tells him.

Rogue: The Bestest!

Mystique: A crazy woman who wants to be good, but even her ability to show love is impaired by her uncontrollable psychotic tendencies.

Juggernaut: He's just a bastard who faked being good.



I miss Juggernaut. :csad:

[foxx5]

i always thought that professor x was the greatest telepath or whatever on earth, but it seems he has trouble fighting people with his mind, most recently Emma, i want to see professor x kick mind butt it seems he always holds back

[Brainiac 8]

The X-Men according to Mike Carey...

Professor X: A good man who made some terrible and underhanded decisions in the past. Regrets all of the bads things he did.

Gambit: A good man who occasionally follows bad people when they promise to help him. He has no sense of forethought and will put every ideal he has aside to do whatever someone tells him.

Rogue: The Bestest!

Mystique: A crazy woman who wants to be good, but even her ability to show love is impaired by her uncontrollable psychotic tendencies.

Juggernaut: He's just a bastard who faked being good.



I miss Juggernaut. :csad:

This is the only misstep that Carey made in my opinion. I thought Juggernaut worked extremely well as a hero, and I hate that they pushed him back into villian territory just because "he can't change" when he proved that he had on many occasions.

I mean look at what he did:

Turned himself in for prosecution.
Defeated Rhino and re-turned himself in.
He boned She-Hulk.
Fought alongside Excalibur for a bit.
Tried and failed to protect Sammy, and continued to blame himself for his death.
Made peace with and worked alongside the X-Men.
Fought the Hulk to help protect the X-children and charles.

Argh! :cmad:

[mightiest_mortal]

You dont understand the real juggernaut!

Point 1 - Juggernaut didnt decided to be bad again for no reason, some one in a bar told him he might as well be bad! How can he argue that?

Point 2 - Juggernauts a bully and everyone knows bullys cant change. All the bullys at school are all bullys for ever because thats what defines them! The idea that Juggernaut would just grow up and move past that after just 40 years is madness! MADNESS!!!!

[UraniaChang]

Juggernaut being a bully was a result of his jealousy towards Xavier and anger against his father, if his father has long gone and he no longer being jealous of his stepbrother, then he has no reason to be a bully anymore, unless he relishes the advantages of being one.

Is there a particular issue where Juggernaut had a valid reason/turning point to become a good guy after all these years? If there is one then the *new* plot of him becoming bad again is completely ridiculous; if not, then it's also understandable.

[Manic]

Juggernaut being a bully was a result of his jealousy towards Xavier and anger against his father, if his father has long gone and he no longer being jealous of his stepbrother, then he has no reason to be a bully anymore, unless he relishes the advantages of being one.

Is there a particular issue where Juggernaut had a valid reason/turning point to become a good guy after all these years? If there is one then the *new* plot of him becoming bad again is completely ridiculous; if not, then it's also understandable.
It's funny you should give the main reason why Cain was a bully, and then actually ask if there was a valid turning point at which he became a good guy.

It was maybe back in 2003 when it happened. A series of events had led to Juggernaut forming a truce with the X-Men, with Charles inviting him to stay at the mansion. During that time (but before Cain was actually allowed on a team), Cain and Charles talked about why they were always fighting. Cain hated Charles because Cain's dad loved Charles more. As far as Cain knew, Charles was getting showered with love, while Cain was getting constant beatings whenever he gave his dad lip or disappointed him. It was during this conversation that Charles revealed that he was also beaten by Cain's dad. What's worse, Charles never used his telepathy to stop it because he thought he deserved it.

So it turns out Charles wasn't an uppity little step-brother. Mr. Marko was just a crappy father whose shortcomings caused his sons to turn against each other.

Charles and Cain then hugged it out, and realized they were fighting over absolutely nothing all these years. Soon after, Charles sponsored Juggernaut's membership into the X-Men.


Their issues were completely and utterly resolved. Cain's sudden decision to kill Charles during a recent issue of X-Men Legacy came literally out of nowhere, and that particular issue convinced me to drop this title because it became apparent that Mike Carey is a hack writer. That bastard.

[Brainiac 8]

I didn't drop it, since I still enjoy Carey's finally using some characters well that haven't been in years.

But that issue ticked me off to no end and made me nearly rip it in half. :cmad: :down

[mightiest_mortal]

Hmm i should have made the sarcasm in my last post a bit more obvious.

The thing that annoyed me though was that Carey did it, to turn Juggs back into a villain, because he preferred him as a villain..... WHEN HES NOT EVEN USING HIM! Its not as if hes the main villain now or something, his entire point of using Juggernaut was to make him a villain again.

That said, The issue was clever in a way, as it all just happeend in Juggs head so hes still not actually done anything wrong. If another comic wants to use his as a good guy they can entirely ignore it and just make him all conflicted with the Cytorak corupting his mind.

[UraniaChang]

It's funny you should give the main reason why Cain was a bully, and then actually ask if there was a valid turning point at which he became a good guy.

What can I say? I'm a firm believer that every person does everything for a reason, even if it's on a subconscious level.


It was maybe back in 2003 when it happened. A series of events had led to Juggernaut forming a truce with the X-Men, with Charles inviting him to stay at the mansion. During that time (but before Cain was actually allowed on a team), Cain and Charles talked about why they were always fighting. Cain hated Charles because Cain's dad loved Charles more. As far as Cain knew, Charles was getting showered with love, while Cain was getting constant beatings whenever he gave his dad lip or disappointed him. It was during this conversation that Charles revealed that he was also beaten by Cain's dad. What's worse, Charles never used his telepathy to stop it because he thought he deserved it.

So it turns out Charles wasn't an uppity little step-brother. Mr. Marko was just a crappy father whose shortcomings caused his sons to turn against each other.

Charles and Cain then hugged it out, and realized they were fighting over absolutely nothing all these years. Soon after, Charles sponsored Juggernaut's membership into the X-Men.


Their issues were completely and utterly resolved. Cain's sudden decision to kill Charles during a recent issue of X-Men Legacy came literally out of nowhere, and that particular issue convinced me to drop this title because it became apparent that Mike Carey is a hack writer. That bastard.

So they did give an answer for Juggernaut being good after being a bully for years into his adulthood, then it's plain lazy for Carey to make him bad again because he likes him as a villain (that's supposed to qualify as a reason?).

[OutcryX]

It's funny you should give the main reason why Cain was a bully, and then actually ask if there was a valid turning point at which he became a good guy.

It was maybe back in 2003 when it happened. A series of events had led to Juggernaut forming a truce with the X-Men, with Charles inviting him to stay at the mansion. During that time (but before Cain was actually allowed on a team), Cain and Charles talked about why they were always fighting. Cain hated Charles because Cain's dad loved Charles more. As far as Cain knew, Charles was getting showered with love, while Cain was getting constant beatings whenever he gave his dad lip or disappointed him. It was during this conversation that Charles revealed that he was also beaten by Cain's dad. What's worse, Charles never used his telepathy to stop it because he thought he deserved it.

So it turns out Charles wasn't an uppity little step-brother. Mr. Marko was just a crappy father whose shortcomings caused his sons to turn against each other.

Charles and Cain then hugged it out, and realized they were fighting over absolutely nothing all these years. Soon after, Charles sponsored Juggernaut's membership into the X-Men.


Their issues were completely and utterly resolved. Cain's sudden decision to kill Charles during a recent issue of X-Men Legacy came literally out of nowhere, and that particular issue convinced me to drop this title because it became apparent that Mike Carey is a hack writer. That bastard.

maybe it will be a robot juggernaut...it is something easily retconned by a better writer.

it seems like much of the goodwill people granted Carey(myself included) is now wearing off as the sugar turns to sh....well...im sure u know what im saying

[squeekness]

A Juggernaut clone. :p

[Brainiac 8]

A Clonnernaut? Or a Juggerclone?

[squeekness]

Juggerclone. :p

[Manic]

I'm just going to assume that Cytorrak has influence over Juggernaut's thoughts now, just to make sure he never does anything like turn good again.

[Brainiac 8]

It wasn't said, but that is sort of what New Excalibur implied when he sought to get Cytorrak back.

I think it's all the gems fault for him going evil again. :(

[foxx5]

i miss good juggernaut and i miss fish boy :csad:

[squeekness]

i miss good juggernaut and i miss fish boy :csad:Me, too. Those were good times. :( I didn't even mind it all that much when Gambit was blind.

[OutcryX]

fishboy is on Wolverine and the X-men

[squeekness]

Yeah? That's cool. :p

[OutcryX]

he makes friends with nightcrawler and goes to live with magneto in genosha

[squeekness]

I've really only seen the Gambit episode. I lost interest after that. :(

[OutcryX]

best written gambit in over a decade

[squeekness]

I was so disappointed when I found it he was only going to be in just the one ep. I would have been happier if he was going to join up. :(

[OutcryX]

his character on the show is too gray...just like he should be. he couldnt be trusted. i dont like how rogue on the show can just absorb abilities with no negative effects

[Specter313]

Sucky voice acting for that Gambit version though. That voice just doesn't fit IMO.

[foxx5]

lets get this back to the comic, so did anyone notice the cover of issue 220 it was...um...quite perky

[Canemacar]

Sucky voice acting for that Gambit version though. That voice just doesn't fit IMO.

The voice for the movie is pretty good, though.

http://www.x-menorigins.com/us/

[Brainiac 8]

Gambit's best voice was during the 90's cartoon.

[squeekness]

I would have to agree. It's his voice I hear in my head when I read him in the comics.

[Specter313]

http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/6972/prv2232cov.jpg

http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/2968/prv2232pg2.jpg

http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/3561/prv2232pg3.jpg

http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/555/prv2232pg4.jpg

http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/3474/prv2232pg5.jpg

http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/2961/prv2232pg6.jpg

http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/9936/prv2232pg7.jpg

X-MEN: LEGACY #222


STORY BY Mike Carey
ART BY Scot Eaton, Andrew Hennessy
COLORS BY Jason Keith
COVER BY Lee Bermejo
PUBLISHER: Marvel Comics
COVER PRICE: $2.99
RELEASE DATE: Wed, March 18th, 2009

“Salvage”

Rogue’s past comes back to haunt not only her, but Professor X and Gambit. The horrors of the past are brought here by a mysterious villain who has a beef with the X-Men that they plan on settling here and now. You may not believe it, but the villain CAN win. Part 3 (of 5)

[squeekness]

Now if these issues had a little more of this:

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b317/squeekness/Gambit/GambitLegacy222.jpg

...and a little less of him being Rogue's stupid lapdog, I'd be happier. :(

[Specter313]

http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/7419/140xmenlegacy225.jpg

X-MEN: LEGACY #225
Written by MIKE CAREY
Art by Philippe Briones
Cover by DANIEL ACUÑA
90s DECADE VARIANT BY TBA
“The End”
Professor X's odyssey brings him full circle as he answers a call from the Acolytes. But what do they want? Revenge? Or a new leader? Xavier’s LEGACY journey ends here, and it’s a doozie.
32 PGS./Rated A …$2.99

[squeekness]

Does this mean this book won't be Legacy anymore after this?

[Specter313]

Yep.

[squeekness]

Back to abjectiveless or something new and funky?

[Specter313]

Not sure, they've been rather sketchy on that part, but it should be more of a team book after this though, but probably not in the way that Uncanny is or adjectiveless used to be. Like I said, sketchy on the details.

[squeekness]

Be nice if Gambit was on the roster, but that is prolly too much to ask for. :(

[Manic]

Acuna has really been making his rounds in the X-office art department, hasn't he?

[Colossal Spoons]

Banshee's gonna be on a few covers in the upcoming months. Hmmm........

[squeekness]

I thought he was daid. ...?

[Manic]

So is Jean, but she's on a new cover every other week.

[squeekness]

But she comes back all the time. Isn't she that kid Cable is running around with?

[Manic]

I'll believe that when she stops going by the name Hope Summers.

[Charlie No-One]

She needs to come back and ****ing stay awhile. Let's say for at least 30+ years. Mystique also needs to start being written better.

[Colossal Spoons]

I'd like Jean back for good too

[Canemacar]

Lettered #223 preview is here:

http://www.newsarama.com/php/multimedia/album.php?gid=960

[squeekness]

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b317/squeekness/Gambit/XMEN223_int-3.jpg

Oh, goodie. Gambit is Rogue's lapdog. AGAIN. I thought Carrey knew Gambit. Doesn't seem that way to me. Lower right corner....

[Canemacar]

Even Carey's own characters are calling him out on it now.

[squeekness]

Indeed. How deeply and terribly sad. :( Maybe Carey actually hates Gambit but just doesn't want to admit it.

[BoredGuy]

Or maybe Carey actually has a plan to improve their story...?

...Just sayin'

[Havok83]

Anybody actually still reading this?

[The Englishman]

Whens this turning back into a team book??

[Canemacar]

Whens this turning back into a team book??

July.

[javi1024]

Anybody actually still reading this?
i am. i havent read the last two issues yet but im hoping this will be a good rogue story. but i agree it needs to change formats fast.

[UraniaChang]

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b317/squeekness/Gambit/XMEN223_int-3.jpg

Oh, goodie. Gambit is Rogue's lapdog. AGAIN. I thought Carrey knew Gambit. Doesn't seem that way to me. Lower right corner....

Ouch, that comment must be hurt.
If he still has enough self-respect left. :waa::whatever: :rolleyes:

[Manic]

Anybody actually still reading this?
I dropped this book when Juggernaut turned back into a villain "just becausies"

[Colossal Spoons]

Idk why I continue to buy it, really.

[squeekness]

Ouch, that comment must be hurt.
If he still has enough self-respect left. :waa::whatever: :rolleyes:Maybe Carey will leave soon and put me out of my misery. :(

[OutcryX]

Has Carey really burned through all of the positive buzz he had when he initially started on X-men?

[The Englishman]

July.
Thank **** for that......

[OutcryX]

Iceman should be back on an X-team. leading it. nightcrawler too and colossus on a team where he does stuff...and sprinkle in some remaining x-kids...but would a team with colossus, rockslide, and nezhno be too much frontcourt/interior heavy with no outside game for the perimeter..then again Nightcrawler is arguably the best point guard in the league....ok..i'm going through withdrawal from college basketball...

[katie_girl09]

Indeed. How deeply and terribly sad. :( Maybe Carey actually hates Gambit but just doesn't want to admit it.
I suspect that he hates him (as do the rest of the writers it seems) but has been forced to write him because he'll get more popularity in the movie.
I didn't buy the last issue. Don't think I'll buy this one either.

[Manic]

Has Carey really burned through all of the positive buzz he had when he initially started on X-men?
Yep. Though to his credit, he burned through it a hell of a lot slower than Milligan.

[UraniaChang]

[quote=katie_girl09;16752530]I suspect that he hates him (as do the rest of the writers it seems) but has been forced to write him because he'll get more popularity in the movie.
[quote]


And the movie (the part in the trailer) made him look ridiculous, especially the sending a shock wave part, it's not Drangon Ball Z for heaven's sake.

It did make me laugh real hard though.

[squeekness]

The staff slam actually comes from the Marvel Alliance games. It was the first time I had ever seen Gambit use his staff that way.

[Brainiac 8]

Other than the Jugger-what? issue, I'm still enjoying this book as is. I'm also loving the focus on Gambit and Rogue, and am sort of secretly hoping we get Rogue back with Danver's abilities. :up:

[squeekness]

I was hoping to have Gambit back. Not the Rogue-puppy dog wanna be. :( Where the sass and flash? One of the other Thieves musta stold it.

[Canemacar]

I called him out on it at the height of the "Carey is god" buzz.

[squeekness]

I didn't know Carey that well at the time. I liked the rest of his story, just not the whole Rogue glorification stuff. :(

[Canemacar]

Theres hope for him yet.

http://www.marvel.com/news/comicstories.7305.X%E2%80%93Men_Origins~colon~_Gam bit_Coming_in_June

"I also felt like I had some unfinished business with Gambit, because when I wrote him in 'Messiah CompleX' it was very much as a foil for Rogue, rather than as a character in his own right. I wanted to write a Remy story, [so] writing his origin, as I saw it, really fitted the bill perfectly."

[squeekness]

That gives me some hope. Thanks, Can Can. :D You de best.

[Brainiac 8]

Sounds great. I think Gambit and Rogue work well around each other..it's just that at times they wussified him, and I honestly think Carey is working to make our cajun a force to be reackoned with again. :up:

[Manic]

You've all been saying that Carey will make Gambit a good character again ever since Carey took over this title in 2006.

[javi1024]

all i care about is what do they have planned for the book after this format is finished with.

[GambitXremy]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v653/RichieSorrows/XMEN226_CVR_colorpreview.jpg

[ChaoticPsylocke]

okay, so she's back to that costume AGAIN.

why did they revamp her old outfit for a few issues and then put her back into her OTHER old one?

[javi1024]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v653/RichieSorrows/XMEN226_CVR_colorpreview.jpg
Danger....really...:csad:

[GambitXremy]

I still believe in Carey i think the last few issues havent been up to par but the one that came out today was really good... so he's getting back on track. look what happen to PAD, x-factor was kinda sucky for awhile but then he got it back on track and it's kicking crazy A$$ now!!!

[Jake Cassidy]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v653/RichieSorrows/XMEN226_CVR_colorpreview.jpg

The beginning of a new team? :yay:

I wish. :cmad:

:woot:

[GambitXremy]

i really don't like how gambit looks in this pic... but maybe it's just me

[javi1024]

he actually looks alot like Angel on his last Uncanny cover.

TRACER!!!!!:wow:

[squeekness]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v653/RichieSorrows/XMEN226_CVR_colorpreview.jpg
Yummy! :D

The beginning of a new team? :yay:

I wish. :cmad:

:woot:Don't even tease like that. :( I want Gambit back on a team badly! :waa:

[Canemacar]

So, the new team is Rogue!, Rogue's mental version of Mystique, and a few people to stand around and talk about her all the time?

[Colossal Spoons]

^So excited :dry:

[Havok83]

So, the new team is Rogue!, Rogue's mental version of Mystique, and a few people to stand around and talk about her all the time?
anoher reason why Im not reading

[mightiest_mortal]

Danger....really...:csad:

She/it was wandering round the X-Base a month or two back in X-Force so we knew that it was going to happen... though she does seem ridiculously powerful to actually be on a team.

Her entire existence though is such a slap in the face to Xaviers character though. He finds out theres a sentient being alive powering the danger room and leaves it trapped there? WTF??

Thats like discovering theres actually some kid chained up under the hood of your car making it run and you just going "well... I guess the car does run pretty smoothly now... il leave him in there"

Its inaneness was only eclipsed by the giant sentinel that destroyed Genosha suddenly feeling really bad about killing everyone and flying off to sulk and write depressing poems on its Myspace.

[squeekness]

She/it was wandering round the X-Base a month or two back in X-Force so we knew that it was going to happen... though she does seem ridiculously powerful to actually be on a team.

Her entire existence though is such a slap in the face to Xaviers character though. He finds out theres a sentient being alive powering the danger room and leaves it trapped there? WTF??

Thats like discovering theres actually some kid chained up under the hood of your car making it run and you just going "well... I guess the car does run pretty smoothly now... il leave him in there"

Its inaneness was only eclipsed by the giant sentinel that destroyed Genosha suddenly feeling really bad about killing everyone and flying off to sulk and write depressing poems on its Myspace.LOLs. :p

[04nbod]

Rogue is the only reason I AM reading.

[Brainiac 8]

I have just enjoyed Xavier's story, and Rogue and Gambit are just icing on the cake.

The only bump in the road was the hijacked two months of Wolverine, and the Juggerlame story.

[GambitXremy]

ya i agree with brainiac on this one to. i think thats when the whole hating on mike carey started but hes back on track to

[ExiledRogue]

okay, so she's back to that costume AGAIN.

why did they revamp her old outfit for a few issues and then put her back into her OTHER old one?

Aw geez, I hate the green and white costume. I didn't really like the way her new costume was drawn in the last issue. I really liked it when the new costume first appeared at the beginning of the arc. When it had the green on the bottom of the boots. Kind of tied it in with the astonishing costumes( like Emma's and Storm's).

[squeekness]

I don't mind the green and white, but it mighta been nice if they'd remembered to color Gambit's eyes right. :(

[Canemacar]

You know, I wonder if we're going to see Gambit start appearing without his red-on-black eyes from now on since Taylor didn't have them in the movie. And as you know, the comics bend over for the flicks like a two dollar whore.

[gothicFLAVOURS]

I really hate the green and white costume! Why did they have to change it? The redesign was far better than this, and really reminiscent of her iconic costume.

[UraniaChang]

Ugh, Rogue AND Gambit, under Carey's hand.


Maybe it's a sign that I should dumb this title.

[GambitXremy]

Careys done a great job with legacy. just give it time to get on the right path again.. like i said before the same thing happen to PAD

[DJSCARLET]

You know, I wonder if we're going to see Gambit start appearing without his red-on-black eyes from now on since Taylor didn't have them in the movie. And as you know, the comics bend over for the flicks like a two dollar whore.

I wondered the same too. They seem to be giving him plain eyes more often now (in the covers, not in the pages). Maybe its just a coincidence. Gambit has had red on black eyes since his debut, I doubt that Marvel would just think fans would just forget or something.

Am I the only one looking forward to see how Carey will write Gambit and Rogue working together?

[Manic]

It took a bad artist for PAD to lose me on X-Factor. However, I can see the parallels in their writing styles. They're both writing books about multiple characters, but are centering them on one character in particular (Jamie for PAD, Anna for Carey). I think the difference is that PAD is sidelining C-list characters to concentrate on Multiple Man (oh no! Not less facetime for Siryn!), while Carey has been sidelining the likes of Gambit and Xavier.

[GambitXremy]

i can see gambit - but the book has really just been about Xavier until now. and its kinda changing back to rogue because Xaviers journey is over...

I hope gambit and rogue are in the x-men/ avengers crossover

[Havok83]

Rogue is the only reason I AM reading.
Rogue is the only reason why Id even be remotely interested in the current arc but I cant take any Rogue/Gambit crap

[squeekness]

Rogue is the only reason why Id even be remotely interested in the current arc but I cant take any Rogue/Gambit crapThis is me only opposite. I am interested because of Gambit but I don't want any Rogue crap. :p

[Canemacar]

Am I the only one looking forward to see how Carey will write Gambit and Rogue working together?

Probably. Most of the Gambit fans are sick of the Rogue crap, most Rogue fans are sick of the Gambit crap, and everyone else is just sick of their crap altogether.

[Manic]

I would say "someone needs to find a way to get those two to have sex and get this over with," but Claremont did that half a decade ago.

[OutcryX]

im sick of all the Rogue/Gambit drama bc she is too mentally ****ed up to handle ANY kind of relationship. even WITH ALL OF THE PERSONALITIES GONE...she is STILL mentally screwed. time for her to get over herself.

as for Gambit..well..he needs his balls back...and Scott Lobdell with a lil Joe MAD to regain his swag

[Canemacar]

im sick of all the Rogue/Gambit drama bc she is too mentally ****ed up to handle ANY kind of relationship. even WITH ALL OF THE PERSONALITIES GONE...she is STILL mentally screwed. time for her to get over herself.

as for Gambit..well..he needs his balls back...and Scott Lobdell with a lil Joe MAD to regain his swag

It's always a sad thing when a man's pimp hand grows weak.

[Havok83]

Probably. Most of the Gambit fans are sick of the Rogue crap, most Rogue fans are sick of the Gambit crap, and everyone else is just sick of their crap altogether.
I think this pretty much sums it up

[squeekness]

Probably. Most of the Gambit fans are sick of the Rogue crap, most Rogue fans are sick of the Gambit crap, and everyone else is just sick of their crap altogether.Yuppers, that'd be the truth. :p

[katie_girl09]

as for Gambit..well..he needs his balls back...and Scott Lobdell with a lil Joe MAD to regain his swag
I say Nicieza writes him more badass.
And I'm kinda reluctant to end Rogue/Gambit permanently. When they are in the hands of a capable writer they are one of the best couples in the Marvel Universe, in my opinion. But I do want them to break up for like 5 years or something...

[GambitXremy]

i see the whole gambit/rogue thing like i use to see cyclops/jean....jean was always the cooler one and scott was just her lapdog

[UraniaChang]

That's probably the problem. The girls of Marvel in the relationship hardly qualifie as 'cooler', they just expect to be 'loved', 'cuddled' and 'worshiped' by their male lover. Not just them, but their fans as well. (Maybe it's because female characters tend to attract female fans as a majority)

If I were a man I would stay the hell away from them. That's why I found my self loving Semma more than Jott right now.

But at least, Jean had some ''good wife'' moments in the Jott relationship, especially the time Scott and her spent in the future raising Nathan.

Rogue? Not so much. Cause the basic attraction of Rogue's character is that she is tragic in her way, not bing able to be intimate with most guys, I doubt any writer would give her control over her mutation any time soon.

[squeekness]

Giving Rogue control would change who she is too much. :( She would lose her mystery I guess. But then even when she was depowered her and Remy still had problems so her troubles run far deeper than just a lack of intimacy.

[UraniaChang]

It's a psychologically-rooted problem, it will probably never go away.

[Manic]

Gambit is gay and Rogue is his beard. The reason he keeps running back to her is because he can't find another attractive woman who will date him that he doesn't have to touch.

There. Mystery solved.

[GambitXremy]

jean way cooler the cyke back in the day i'm just saying

[squeekness]

Gambit is gay and Rogue is his beard. The reason he keeps running back to her is because he can't find another attractive woman who will date him that he doesn't have to touch.

There. Mystery solved.Uhm, no....

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b317/squeekness/Gambit/gambitlaidlil.jpg

[GambitXremy]

DAmn Gambits such a pimp in that scene