Luthor's Evil Plot

[Spare-Flair]

So it seem apparent that Luthor's plot is to blow off part of the U.S. continent to create his own which will cause billions of deaths. Isn't this just a rehash of the original Superman's plot to knock off the pacific coast for real estate? Just with alien technology instead of ICBMs?

Does anybody else have a problem with this? It seems very unoriginal to me and again, smacks of unoriginality and the Hackman characterization of Luthor which completely goes against what Luthor actually is in the comics. It's too blatantely obvious, over-the-top, and ultimately stupid thing for Luthor to do.

Luthor should be a cold, calculating, cold-blooded, and ruthless individual but ultimately he sees himself as the salvation of mankind against the alien (Superman) and that's the source of his enmity with Superman. He wouldn't cause billions of deaths to help himself (wouldn't blowing off 1/4 of the U.S. ruin this economy and his empire as well?), although he wouldn't blink at killing behind the scenes, never getting his actual hands dirty enough to be incriminated or disdained by the general population.

He's someone who revels in his own genius in weaving impossibly intricate plots beyond even Superman's ability to decipher as his true weapon and ability to beat his foe. He's someone incredibly evil, but also incredibly smart and restrained who has his work done by others in the shadows unless it aids his public persona (ie: running for President). In the comics, one of the reasons he hates Superman is that Superman takes the glory away from him as being a great contributer to mankind.

It just frustrates me so much that Singer seems to have no idea who Lex Luthor is, thinks, or has things done and has just gone back to the same concept of Hackman's crazy Luthor done to the same exact plot. Would Luthor even do something like kidnap Lois and her kid and openly taunt them? It all seems so childish. He also seems to be keeping the exact same company as the Hackman Luthor, a bunch of comical henchman and a spoiled comical lady companion. What happened to Luthor's adept agents, cold blooded killers, evil business partners (keeping his enemies closer than his friends), and keeping women (or being kept around by powerful women) like the Contessa?

Why do all comic book villains in movies have to be the same? I realize we've only seen a sliver of his character from the trailer but it's just remininding me of Tommy Lee Jones playing Two-Face like the Joker and every other crazy manically laughing villain because Schumacher had no idea what he was doing. Let's hope Singer fares better.

[bsquad]

He is trying to create his own continent. That and get revenge on Superman. What other people do don't matter to him, as long as he gets what he wants. Land, power, and a dead Superman.

[Agnarr]

Luthor should be a cold, calculating, cold-blooded, and ruthless individual but ultimately he sees himself as the salvation of mankind against the alien (Superman) and that's the source of his enmity with Superman. He wouldn't cause billions of deaths to help himself (wouldn't blowing off 1/4 of the U.S. ruin this economy and his empire as well?), although he wouldn't blink at killing behind the scenes, never getting his actual hands dirty enough to be incriminated or disdained by the general population.



You are contradicting yourself, here. Cold, calculating, and ruthless . . . is not planning world domination by creating your own continent which you can sell parts of for millions of dollars and setting yourself up as a dictator, whereby in the process countless people will die?

Okay then.

The different incarnations of Lex are as varied as Superman. As Singer has repeated again and again, no one version is "right" or "better" than the others. We are just seeing his version of Lex.

A lot of assumptions on your part. WAFO. Watch and find out, then come back with complaints if this Lex doesnt work within the context of the movie.

[bsquad]

Spare-flair your mad he didn't choose the version of Lex that you liked. Just because he chose a different version-does not make it the wrong version.

[Spare-Flair]

You are contradicting yourself, here. Cold, calculating, and ruthless . . . is not planning world domination by creating your own continent which you can sell parts of for millions of dollars and setting yourself up as a dictator, whereby in the process countless people will die?

Okay then.

The different incarnations of Lex are as varied as Superman. As Singer has repeated again and again, no one version is "right" or "better" than the others. We are just seeing his version of Lex.

A lot of assumptions on your part. WAFO. Watch and find out, then come back with complaints if this Lex doesnt work within the context of the movie.

Where does it say that cold, calculating, and ruthless --- and being a dictator are mutually inclusive? Luthor is an intellectual. He should realize that eschatonic plots and isolationist tyranny doesn't work in the long run...unless he's a student of Darkseid and uses the technology to brainwash and zombify all the inhabitants of his new continent into slavish work. Is that something Luthor would want?

I'm mostly frustrated that we're getting the same thing over again as in 1977. Knock off part of the U.S. continent for the benefit of personal real estate. Can't we get some cool, mysterious, elaborate, twisting plot that really makes you think? Something subtle with clues, like ... (I hate to use this analogy) but an M. Night Shyamalan plot? Like what you get in the comics where you don't realize just how well planned out, complicated, and evil what Luthor is doing until the very end? That the evil is compounded by the fact that he hides everything and does it with so much tact that he avoids all responsibility and just laughs at Superman who can do nothing but stare at him menacingly through his high-rise window?

And bsquad, like I said in the other thread, that one version of Luthor was done once in 1977 was an amalgam of pre-crisis zany comic book plots, Donner's direction, (who knows how much Mario Puzo put into what we got in the end, reportedly, it's not much), and Hackman (great actor nonetheless).

The darker comic version of Luthor has been done thousands of times since 1986 and is the realistic and considered proper characterization of Luthor, otherwise, Spacey is just playing another random crazy dollar store movie villain only with the Luthor name and baldness attached to signify who he is.

Okay, fine, this is supposed to be a spiritual sequel to Superman I and II, fine. But can't Lex come up with something different? He's just doing the same thing all over again...This is going to shape what Superman is to the public for the next 10 years. I don't want it to be all the same again. Lex values power, true power. Not land, which is a very liquid power. I suppose it will work if this really is the EXACT same character as Hackman, who is bent on revenge for Superman ruining his 1977 plot and simply wants to do it again out of sheer stubborness. That's not Lex Luthor to me. That's Donner and Hackman's Luthor. I though this was 2006, not 1977.

[The Incredible Hulk]

why does movie Lex Luthor always have to have hard-on for real estate? He's like an even more insane version of Donald Trump...

[bsquad]

If he makes his own continent, with Kryptonian technology way beyond anythign on Earth to protect it and he is backed up with a way to stop the only force that can stand toe to toe with him-what does he have to fear and worry about. Who will eb able to stand up to him? Especially if he cripples half the world by making his continent.

I think the idea is that he is gaining his power and control thanks to Superman. Thanks to Superman's technology and in the long scheme of things, thanks to the fact that Superman even arrived on Earth. This is about revenge and power. He gets what he always wanted which is his own land to rule over, and ebough tecnhnology to bully the world into submission and he gets it by using Superman's heritage against not only Superman but the world. That's a major kick in the nuts if I do say so myself.

[Spare-Flair]

why does movie Lex Luthor always have to have hard-on for real estate? He's like an even more insane version of Donald Trump...

Haha! Great analogy. The question is, which one has better hair? :)

[VGPOP]

Well in the original Superman, he wanted to blow out the poorest part of California.

In this movie, he still continue with his idea, but is now thinking bigger. Half of America gone.

What's wrong with that?

Time in prison does a lot of things to a lunatic, brilliant mind.

[bsquad]

why does movie Lex Luthor always have to have hard-on for real estate? He's like an even more insane version of Donald Trump...
Its economics. He's gaining all the main resources neccessary: Land, Capital, Labor, Entrepreneurship and Technology. Put it together and what does he have: immense power

[Spare-Flair]

If he makes his own continent, with Kryptonian technology way beyond anythign on Earth to protect it and he is backed up with a way to stop the only force that can stand toe to toe with him-what does he have to fear and worry about. Who will eb able to stand up to him? Especially if he cripples half the world by making his continent.

I think the idea is that he is gaining his power and control thanks to Superman. Thanks to Superman's technology and in the long scheme of things, thanks to the fact that Superman even arrived on Earth. This is about revenge and power. He gets what he always wanted which is his own land to rule over, and ebough tecnhnology to bully the world into submission and he gets it by using Superman's heritage against not only Superman but the world. That's a major kick in the nuts if I do say so myself.

The comic Lex Luthor would hire someone to stab your mother rather than kicking you in the nuts. He's indirect and cherishes public glory. Making your own continent, setting up a fence, and then arming yourself against invaders...isn't he just a super Fidel Castro?

I'll shut-up and eat my own shoe if in the movie, he causes devastation and hardship through something like a 9/11 conspiracy (and pretends to rush to America's aid), then does it through dummy corporations and has a puppet pretending to be the dictator or something discreet like that.

[bsquad]

The comic Lex Luthor would hire someone to stab your mother rather than kicking you in the nuts. He's indirect and cherishes public glory. Making your own continent, setting up a fence, and then arming yourself against invaders...isn't he just a super Fidel Castro?

I'll shut-up and eat my own shoe if in the movie, he causes devastation and hardship through something like a 9/11 conspiracy (and pretends to rush to America's aid), then does it through dummy corporations and has a puppet pretending to be the dictator or something discreet like that.

That's fine for the comic Lex. But I just don't see what is wrong with what this Lex wants to do and the fact that he isn't worried about what the public thinks. Its what he wants that is driving him. Why hire someone to stab your mother when he can kick you in the nuts and, in the case of this film, go ahead to stab you in the back with his own 2 hands

[Spare-Flair]

Its economics. He's gaining all the main resources neccessary: Land, Capital, Labor, Entrepreneurship and Technology. Put it together and what does he have: immense power

I went to business school, that's just business school bunk :) I also have a poli sci degree, that's not power. Lex's libido ad domini is smarter than that. You can't sustain land, capital, labor, entrepreneurship (especially that one) and techology under tyrannical dictatorship behind alien guns. Lex Luthor will run for U.S. President to use all it's infrastructure to his own advantage. He won't blatently destroy all that infrastructure and create a political enemy in making himself the president of his own island.

Sigh, it's just a movie. And a comic book movie to boot about a solar powered alien baby...and I know I am nerdy and totally stupid to be overthinking this not to mention making so many posts...


I just want something grittier and new. Not a rehash of the same old thing. I just want Singer to earnestly listen to fans and make an effort to get something out of the comics which have been published hundreds of thousands of times for decades versus taking so much from one movie back in the 70s. Do something like what Nolan did in listening to fans for their choice in Bale, working with David Goyer to write the script with so much of the comic in it that fans were just oozing with acknowledgement at all the homages to Year One, Chronicles of the Dark Knight, tons of Bat comics, and various name drops and proper characterizations. Sure Ras turned out to be more Irish than Arab, but he was the proper character and the plot was subtle and hidden. Everything about SR seems overdone and the obvious...jump the shark material.

Lois has a kid? Is it Superman's? What's Lex going to do? Oh, the same thing?

[Spare-Flair]

That's fine for the comic Lex. But I just don't see what is wrong with what this Lex wants to do and the fact that he isn't worried about what the public thinks. Its what he wants that is driving him. Why hire someone to stab your mother when he can kick you in the nuts and, in the case of this film, go ahead to stab you in the back with his own 2 hands

http://xe0.xanga.com/cd7b8bf46233353805766/b36065020.gif

1 hand :P
okay, okay, I give p. :O :up: :up: :)

(p.s. don't get me started on Lex's fashion sense)

[bsquad]

I went to business school, that's just business school bunk :) I also have a poli sci degree, that's not power. Lex's libido ad domini is smarter than that. You can't sustain land, capital, labor, entrepreneurship (especially that one) and techology under tyrannical dictatorship behind alien guns. Lex Luthor will run for U.S. President to use all it's infrastructure to his own advantage. He won't blatently destroy all that infrastructure and create a political enemy in making himself the president of his own island.

Sigh, it's just a movie. And a comic book movie to boot about a solar powered alien baby...I just want something grittier and new. Not a rehash of the same old thing. I just want Singer to earnestly listen to fans and make an effort to get something out of the comics which have been published hundreds of thousands of times for decades versus taking so much from one movie back in the 70s. Do something like what Nolan did in listening to fans for their choice in Bale, working with David Goyer to write the script with so much of the comic in it that fans were just oozing with acknowledgement at all the homages to Year One, Chronicles of the Dark Knight, tons of Bat comics, and various name drops and proper characterizations. Sure Ras turned out to be more Irish than Arab, but he was the proper character and the plot was subtle and hidden. Everything about SR seems overdone and the obvious...jump the shark material.

Lois has a kid? Is it Superman's? What's Lex going to do? Oh, the same thing?

If you went to business cool you would know how stupid what you just said is. Its basic economics the 3 basic concepts being Land, Capital, and Labor. Look around-what do all these major corporations and moguls have alot of other than money?
So having your own land and technology does not give you power? What does it give you then?

Plus the guy is willing to destroy half the world to gain power-I think its safe to say he will go that extra length for more, especially seeing as though its unlikely anyone on this planet will have the means to stop him.

Plus youu assuming Goyer and Nolan were listening to the fans. I'm willign to bet money they weren't. I'm sure they said they were but the decisions they made were their decisions, not based on what fans thought. Believe it or not-fans don't have as much power as you may think they do.

[Spare-Flair]

If you went to business cool you would know how stupid what you just said is. Its basic economics the 3 basic concepts being Land, Capital, and Labor. Look around-what do all these major corporations and moguls have alot of other than money?
So having your own land and technology does not give you power? What does it give you then?

Plus youu assuming Goyer and Nolan were listening to the fans. I'm willign to bet money they weren't. I'm sure they said they were but the decisions they made were their decisions, not based on what fans thought. Believe it or not-fans don't have as much power as you may think they do.

Google has almost no land and little labor, yet more capital than most real estate tycoons and the largest employers in America. Land and labor are as not readily liquifiable. Power can be influence, it can be fear. Rising economics of scale make being a tyranical dictator of a continent unrealistic.

Listening doesn't have to be direct, two way communication. By staying true to concepts lifted out of the comics, by employing comic book writers familiar with the material, familiar with what has proved most enduring in the mythos, what has proved the most popular (just in terms of sales and sheer impact into the mythos - ie: Year One), they indirectly listened to what fans desired. SR to me, seems like a production seeking to revive the first movie and a mishmash of names trying to make money on convoluted material and what would work for non-comic book audiences...but none of it seems to be clicking for me and many other people. Superhero movies easily go wrong. Many of us cannot be easy going as you and say: "it's just a movie, it's just collar". It's also just what is going to define Superman for 10 years, it's a major motion picture event and franchise foundation.

We may be critical, but really, comic book fans just don't want the movie and the future franchise to be a disappointment. All the best to SR, but so far, it seems lacking.

Like Chris Reeve said, "Superman should be an event movie". It should live it to that standard for everybody but most importantly for those people who have been buying the comics and supported the character through the years. Many people are predicting a serious lack of ...things just clicking, bang, sparkle, and quality, from what we've seen.

[Dope Nose]

Where does it say that cold, calculating, and ruthless --- and being a dictator are mutually inclusive?

ever heard of a warm, merciful dictator?

[Superman \S/]

New Krypton Is basically what Lex has in mind. And really it should be awesome to see how Superman will deal with the task to stop him.

[explode7]

Why spoiler New krypton everyone knows about it dude.

[Superman \S/]

Why spoiler New krypton everyone knows about it dude.

Cause i feel like it. :o

[explode7]

Why?

[Superman \S/]

Why?

I just told you.

[explode7]

Really? Why?

[Superman \S/]

Really? Why?

Do not be an idiot.

[explode7]

Dude I'm just messing with you it's all good right?:) :O :(

[Superman \S/]

Dude I'm just messing with you it's all good right?:) :O :(

Ok i apologize, i just wasn't in a good mood. It's all good man. :) :up:

[explode7]

Cool I feel much better I can go to sleep like a baby now:)

[Superman \S/]

Ok lol, good night. :)

[Cinemaman]

Look, as I think, Luthor want to destroy big part of US and billions of people, to become the main leader. If he has so dangerous weapon, he will get power.

This is my point of view, and I think it has sense.

[Cinemaman]

New Krypton Is basically what Lex has in mind. And really it should be awesome to see how Superman will deal with the task to stop him.

Agreed, it is really intersting how Superman will stop NK.

[The Guard]

Luthor hates Superman because he's an alien, he wants power, and he wants to satisfy his ego, and he wants Superman dead. And he doesn't care who he harms to get those things accomplished.

Sounds like the Luthor I know.

[Superman \S/]

Agreed, it is really intersting how Superman will stop NK.

:up:

[The Guard]

Oh hell yes. I pray it's what I think it is.

[Superman \S/]

Oh hell yes. I pray it's what I think it is.

And what would that be?

For me i see it as chaos all over Metropolis, and as we know an eartquake will occur. After Superman finds NK and has to fight his way to Lex by avoiding pieces of kryptonite.....Something like that but with a visual of intense action.

[Dope Nose]

Agreed, it is really intersting how Superman will stop NK.

weren't there rumors back in the day of Superman hurling New Krypton into space?

[Superman \S/]

weren't there rumors back in the day of Superman hurling New Krypton into space?

The only rumor i remember when SR was staring out was Metallo had some involvement in the film. I don't remember something of Supes throwing NK into space though.....

[lujho]

So it seem apparent that Luthor's plot is to blow off part of the U.S. continent to create his own which will cause billions of deaths. Isn't this just a rehash of the original Superman's plot to knock off the pacific coast for real estate? Just with alien technology instead of ICBMs?

Does anybody else have a problem with this? It seems very unoriginal to me and again, smacks of unoriginality and the Hackman characterization of Luthor which completely goes against what Luthor actually is in the comics. It's too blatantely obvious, over-the-top, and ultimately stupid thing for Luthor to do.

Luthor should be a cold, calculating, cold-blooded, and ruthless individual but ultimately he sees himself as the salvation of mankind against the alien (Superman) and that's the source of his enmity with Superman. He wouldn't cause billions of deaths to help himself (wouldn't blowing off 1/4 of the U.S. ruin this economy and his empire as well?), although he wouldn't blink at killing behind the scenes, never getting his actual hands dirty enough to be incriminated or disdained by the general population.

He's someone who revels in his own genius in weaving impossibly intricate plots beyond even Superman's ability to decipher as his true weapon and ability to beat his foe. He's someone incredibly evil, but also incredibly smart and restrained who has his work done by others in the shadows unless it aids his public persona (ie: running for President). In the comics, one of the reasons he hates Superman is that Superman takes the glory away from him as being a great contributer to mankind.

It just frustrates me so much that Singer seems to have no idea who Lex Luthor is, thinks, or has things done and has just gone back to the same concept of Hackman's crazy Luthor done to the same exact plot. Would Luthor even do something like kidnap Lois and her kid and openly taunt them? It all seems so childish. He also seems to be keeping the exact same company as the Hackman Luthor, a bunch of comical henchman and a spoiled comical lady companion. What happened to Luthor's adept agents, cold blooded killers, evil business partners (keeping his enemies closer than his friends), and keeping women (or being kept around by powerful women) like the Contessa?

Why do all comic book villains in movies have to be the same? I realize we've only seen a sliver of his character from the trailer but it's just remininding me of Tommy Lee Jones playing Two-Face like the Joker and every other crazy manically laughing villain because Schumacher had no idea what he was doing. Let's hope Singer fares better.

Amen to all that. Another thing though - Luthor is evil but he doesn't think he is. No truly evil person does. He thinks he's doing good. He's helping mankind - he means well. He thinks knows what's best for us all, and the ends justify the means. He commits criminal acts but does not believe himself to be a criminal - he's above the law and common morality. There are a LOT of people like that in the real world and throughout history.

Hackspace's Luthor is evil, well, "just because". He's evil because he's the villain, and it really doesn't go beyond that. It's lazy and over the top, and belongs in the past. Modern Luthor is just 100 times more interesting. HE SHOULD NEVER SEE HIMSELF AS A VILLAIN! He should be aware that some people think of him as one, be he's also way smarter than them and knows they're wrong. He's a great benefactor and protector of mankind, not a villain.

[Binker]

Luthor going after Kryptonian technology for his own twisted use. Guys seem to have a problem with this. But how is this different from the others? It's happened before, how is it so bad now?

Luthor sees himself as the all powerful man. He wants power. But Superman is powerful than him in his superpowers and technology of his origin. Thus, he feels threatened. So he feels that the technologies that are powerful and deadly should belong to him. And if he is not gonna have it, he'll make sure no one does.

With the technology in his plate, he can do anything. He could become a dicator of his own created country but I believe theres something else that he would do to make sure he'll stay that way. For example: since he has the technology that surpasses any other, he could make weapons for any army (with how to disable them in his posession in case they were used on him) and whoever was the highest bidder would get it and others would fight each other to get anything else Luthor created next.

For Luthor: the kryptonian technology is business. Superman is saved for personal.

Thats what I believe on his plot.

[skruloos]

Amen to all that. Another thing though - Luthor is evil but he doesn't think he is. No truly evil person does. He thinks he's doing good. He's helping mankind - he means well. He thinks knows what's best for us all, and the ends justify the means. He commits criminal acts but does not believe himself to be a criminal - he's above the law and common morality. There are a LOT of people like that in the real world and throughout history.

Hackspace's Luthor is evil, well, "just because". He's evil because he's the villain, and it really doesn't go beyond that. It's lazy and over the top, and belongs in the past. Modern Luthor is just 100 times more interesting. HE SHOULD NEVER SEE HIMSELF AS A VILLAIN! He should be aware that some people think of him as one, be he's also way smarter than them and knows they're wrong. He's a great benefactor and protector of mankind, not a villain.
I think that's one type of evil. I also think that there are evil people who just truly believe they are superior to everyone else. They don't care about helping mankind because mankind isn't worth it.

Frankly, your definition of a villain bores me.

[Binker]

Continuation of my post (#38)

For something like this plan, not just the US but every nation would make sure it wouldn't happen. But once Luthor reveals what weapon he created, and that he was willingly to give it to the highest bidder including United Nations and its governments, and you would know that even terriorists, or sides of war, would go after it making their enemies do the same and others following suit. That's their weakness, and Luthor knows it.

From that, they wouldn't go fight him if that meant their power gone and their enemies taking over.

[MatchesMalone]

This is taking over-analysis to a new, depressingly, morbidly, and frighteningly low state.

[Spare-Flair]

Look, I simply don't want the Hackman version of Luthor. It's just Donald Trump gone berserk with greed with a dabble of comical outbursts.

Luthor isn't someone driven by greed. He's a person driven by intellect. He's the evil scientist WHO HAPPENS to be rich because he's a genius and has invented and patented everything for good or for bad. Luthor feels alone in the world, that everyone else is a simpleton and his intelligence defines him and his mission. It also makes him look down on everyone else, therefore his inhummanity and superiority complex that allows him to be cold blooded and ruthless.

Luthor's motivation is hatred of Superman and desire to destroy him, perfect way is to frame Superman and make him look bad in the public image. I hope some element of that character takes place because it hurts Superman more to be loathed by humanity (through Luthor's deceptions) than for Luthor to physically stab him.

Go read Lex Luthor: Man of Steel, Superman: Birthright, or Superman for All Seasons for some of what I'm talking about.

[Kane]

This is taking over-analysis to a new, depressingly, morbidly, and frighteningly low state.

Sadly, it is.

[bosef982]

http://www.superherohype.com/forums/showthread.php?t=230004

[MatchesMalone]

Look, I simply don't want the Hackman version of Luthor. It's just Donald Trump gone berserk with greed with a dabble of comical outbursts.

Luthor isn't someone driven by greed. He's a person driven by intellect. He's the evil scientist WHO HAPPENS to be rich because he's a genius and has invented and patented everything for good or for bad. Luthor feels alone in the world, that everyone else is a simpleton and his intelligence defines him and his mission. It also makes him look down on everyone else, therefore his inhummanity and superiority complex that allows him to be cold blooded and ruthless.

Luthor's motivation is hatred of Superman and desire to destroy him, perfect way is to frame Superman and make him look bad in the public image. I hope some element of that character takes place because it hurts Superman more to be loathed by humanity (through Luthor's deceptions) than for Luthor to physically stab him.

Go read Lex Luthor: Man of Steel, Superman: Birthright, or Superman for All Seasons for some of what I'm talking about.

Go read All-Star Superman or the 40 years of comics before Byrne's crap to get what I'm talking about. And Birthright? Lex was whacko and made really lame jokes in that story.

[Cinemaman]

Luthor hates Superman because he's an alien, he wants power, and he wants to satisfy his ego, and he wants Superman dead. And he doesn't care who he harms to get those things accomplished.

Sounds like the Luthor I know.

He also want to be better than Superman.

As Luthor think, with help of NK he will get power, because only he will have so dangerous weapon.

[Cinemaman]

weren't there rumors back in the day of Superman hurling New Krypton into space?

NO, it will not be as I know.

[Octoberist]

Go read All-Star Superman or the 40 years of comics before Byrne's crap to get what I'm talking about. And Birthright? Lex was whacko and made really lame jokes in that story.

Most people are more familar with the current Lex Luthor. From what I know, Lex NOW is a merging of the mad scientist and business man right? Good choice.

BTW, how are Lex's jokes lame in "Birthright" when you got Hackman wearing wigs and flamboyant outfits are worse? "Wanna see my long arm"?

[bosef982]

And its sick, using SUperman's own heritage against him and his adopted planet. There's a cruelty in that.

[Metropolis_Man]

There is a ton of cruelty in that. Spacey's face looks so scary when he stabs Superman as well.

[Binker]

I watched JLU's final two episodes and Luthor wanted to use Brainiac (a Kryptonian piece of technology) becasue he wanted to be a god. See a similar picture here?

[The Kid]

I wonder if spacey gave routh tips on how to play an alien.

[The Guard]

Luthor isn't someone driven by greed. He's a person driven by intellect. He's the evil scientist WHO HAPPENS to be rich because he's a genius and has invented and patented everything for good or for bad.

He is indeed driven by greed, or lust. A lust for power. Which is a kind of greed.

Luthor feels alone in the world, that everyone else is a simpleton and his intelligence defines him and his mission. It also makes him look down on everyone else, therefore his inhummanity and superiority complex that allows him to be cold blooded and ruthless.

Luthor doesn't neccessarily feel alone. He feels superior.

Luthor's motivation is hatred of Superman and desire to destroy him, perfect way is to frame Superman and make him look bad in the public image. I hope some element of that character takes place because it hurts Superman more to be loathed by humanity (through Luthor's deceptions) than for Luthor to physically stab him.

Of course it will. Since it will end up apparently Luthor who made Superman think Krypton survived to begin with.

Go read Lex Luthor: Man of Steel, Superman: Birthright, or Superman for All Seasons for some of what I'm talking about.

Those are three sources. Lex Luthor has shown a desire for power and money before (money equals power). His characterization in SUPERMAN RETURNS is extremely consistent with several eras of the comics.

[Metropolis_Man]

I wonder if spacey gave routh tips on how to play an alien.

K-Pax maybe?

[Cinemaman]

K-Pax maybe?

I love this movie! Also American Beauty, Swimming with Sharks and L.A. Confedential.

Spacey is one of the greatest actors for me :)

[Binker]

Remember what I said about Luthor using this technology in the film for people to buy and use?

Loom atbteh back of Lex vs. Lois

http://www.superherohype.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8849348&postcount=254

I WAS RIGHT!

[SuperDaniel]

Wich is somehow what he would do if he was owner of LexCorp but more visually interesting and fun, i guess.

[NotFadeAway]

So it seem apparent that Luthor's plot is to blow off part of the U.S. continent to create his own which will cause billions of deaths. Isn't this just a rehash of the original Superman's plot to knock off the pacific coast for real estate? Just with alien technology instead of ICBMs?

Does anybody else have a problem with this? It seems very unoriginal to me and again, smacks of unoriginality and the Hackman characterization of Luthor which completely goes against what Luthor actually is in the comics. It's too blatantely obvious, over-the-top, and ultimately stupid thing for Luthor to do.

Luthor should be a cold, calculating, cold-blooded, and ruthless individual but ultimately he sees himself as the salvation of mankind against the alien (Superman) and that's the source of his enmity with Superman. He wouldn't cause billions of deaths to help himself (wouldn't blowing off 1/4 of the U.S. ruin this economy and his empire as well?), although he wouldn't blink at killing behind the scenes, never getting his actual hands dirty enough to be incriminated or disdained by the general population.

He's someone who revels in his own genius in weaving impossibly intricate plots beyond even Superman's ability to decipher as his true weapon and ability to beat his foe. He's someone incredibly evil, but also incredibly smart and restrained who has his work done by others in the shadows unless it aids his public persona (ie: running for President). In the comics, one of the reasons he hates Superman is that Superman takes the glory away from him as being a great contributer to mankind.

It just frustrates me so much that Singer seems to have no idea who Lex Luthor is, thinks, or has things done and has just gone back to the same concept of Hackman's crazy Luthor done to the same exact plot. Would Luthor even do something like kidnap Lois and her kid and openly taunt them? It all seems so childish. He also seems to be keeping the exact same company as the Hackman Luthor, a bunch of comical henchman and a spoiled comical lady companion. What happened to Luthor's adept agents, cold blooded killers, evil business partners (keeping his enemies closer than his friends), and keeping women (or being kept around by powerful women) like the Contessa?

Why do all comic book villains in movies have to be the same? I realize we've only seen a sliver of his character from the trailer but it's just remininding me of Tommy Lee Jones playing Two-Face like the Joker and every other crazy manically laughing villain because Schumacher had no idea what he was doing. Let's hope Singer fares better.

My friend, I am in 100% agreement with you. The Hackman Lex needed to stay buried in the past.

I have twisted feeling's about this film. I like that it wasn't an origin story, as everyone over the age of 5 knows about Krypton blowing up, etc. And I like the story of Superman returning from a long absence to a world that has forgotten him, it's so true on many levels.But I don't like that there using the same 1977, pre-crisis characterizations. I fear that it's just not going to cut it in this day and age!!!!

If they were going to use any previous characterizations as a base, they should have checked out the Animated Series. For me individually, it's still the most enjoyable adaption!!!!

[Metropolis_Man]

I love this movie! Also American Beauty, Swimming with Sharks and L.A. Confedential.

Spacey is one of the greatest actors for me :)

Yes, definately. Hes one of my all time favorites as well.

[The Caped Knight]

Spacey is going to be awesome as Lex Luthor

[Mr. Sinister05]

The Hackman Lex needed to stay buried in the past.

I have twisted feeling's about this film. I like that it wasn't an origin story, as everyone over the age of 5 knows about Krypton blowing up, etc. And I like the story of Superman returning from a long absence to a world that has forgotten him, it's so true on many levels.But I don't like that there using the same 1977, pre-crisis characterizations. I fear that it's just not going to cut it in this day and age!!!!


I also don't like the whole pre-crisis characterization thing cause I don't care for seeing another planet get spun around.
Hopefully, that whole billions of people are going to die line is just Lex trying to get a reaction out of Lois cause I think the whole mastermind trying to destroy the world has become too cliche. The type of Lex Spare-Flair described sounds more suitable for a modern film adaptation.

[Cinemaman]

Yes, definately. Hes one of my all time favorites as well.

:) :up: I was happy, when I had known about Spacey acting Lex Luthor.

He is perfect choice for this role.

[zanos]

I went to business school, that's just business school bunk :) I also have a poli sci degree, that's not power. Lex's libido ad domini is smarter than that. You can't sustain land, capital, labor, entrepreneurship (especially that one) and techology under tyrannical dictatorship behind alien guns. Lex Luthor will run for U.S. President to use all it's infrastructure to his own advantage. He won't blatently destroy all that infrastructure and create a political enemy in making himself the president of his own island.

Sigh, it's just a movie. And a comic book movie to boot about a solar powered alien baby...and I know I am nerdy and totally stupid to be overthinking this not to mention making so many posts...

I just want something grittier and new. Not a rehash of the same old thing. I just want Singer to earnestly listen to fans and make an effort to get something out of the comics which have been published hundreds of thousands of times for decades versus taking so much from one movie back in the 70s. Do something like what Nolan did in listening to fans for their choice in Bale, working with David Goyer to write the script with so much of the comic in it that fans were just oozing with acknowledgement at all the homages to Year One, Chronicles of the Dark Knight, tons of Bat comics, and various name drops and proper characterizations. Sure Ras turned out to be more Irish than Arab, but he was the proper character and the plot was subtle and hidden. Everything about SR seems overdone and the obvious...jump the shark material.


First of all Singer has never read a Superman comic so how can he get something out of there to make a story? Second BB was far from being the utlimate Superhero movie. There were a ton of flaws in that film both creative and techinical.


Lois has a kid? Is it Superman's? What's Lex going to do? Oh, the same thing?

Lex getting that land will be an underlying theme throughout this entire franchise. It's like the ring in LOTR. Once Lex gets that Land he'll be all powerful and not even Superman will be able to stop him! Unless... he gets help from super-BOY in the third film. Now do you see the genius that is Singer?

[Binker]

Guys, from what I've seen, this Lex Luthor is the modern day version with a tweek of the STAS/JLU one

[bsquad]

check out the cards for Lex's plan: he will have weapons, vehicles from an advanced civilization, on a self sustaining land, virtually indestructible (and if the tech is like that to than he is sitting in the middle of a giant shield basically)and he is looking to sell some of the tech to the highest bidders. so in the end its economics and revenge that is driving his planhttp://www.superherohype.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8849348&postcount=254

[Binker]

Yeah, that is the businessman part of him.

[skruloos]

First of all Singer has never read a Superman comic so how can he get something out of there to make a story?
Because he's familiar enough with Superman from other media. You ARE aware that Superman exists in other media, are you not? After that, when working on the details of the story, it is well documented that they read a lot of comic books provided to them by DC Comics.

Second BB was far from being the utlimate Superhero movie. There were a ton of flaws in that film both creative and techinical.
There are a ton of flaws in any film. And it's bound to be more noticeable when some people cannot accept changes in an adaptation.

[The Guard]

I just want something grittier and new. Not a rehash of the same old thing. I just want Singer to earnestly listen to fans and make an effort to get something out of the comics which have been published hundreds of thousands of times for decades versus taking so much from one movie back in the 70s.

Not to be a bunghole, but Lex Luthor's last few "big moves" in the DC Universe involved land grabs and power seeking.

Do something like what Nolan did in listening to fans for their choice in Bale, working with David Goyer to write the script with so much of the comic in it that fans were just oozing with acknowledgement at all the homages to Year One, Chronicles of the Dark Knight, tons of Bat comics, and various name drops and proper characterizations.

Wow. Goyer took vague references from the comics. Think Singer, Harris and Doughtery didn't? You'll see.

Sure Ras turned out to be more Irish than Arab, but he was the proper character and the plot was subtle and hidden.

Subtle my ass.


First of all Singer has never read a Superman comic so how can he get something out of there to make a story? Second BB was far from being the utlimate Superhero movie. There were a ton of flaws in that film both creative and techinical.

Singer has definitely read Superman comics. He, Dan Harris and Mike Doughterty were required to do so by DC. And they read TONS of them. He knows the mythology. And SUPERMAN RETURNS takes elements from the comics, the movies, TV and radio shows.

[The Incredible Hulk]

there's an understatement....