WoW=overhyped

[Joker]

so I downloaded the free trial of this, and man...talk about all my hopes for it being totally dashed...I've been wanting to play this since it was announced, and even more since everyone talks about how awesome it is, but it's not that good...I preffer city of heroes/villains...

[Mee]

so I downloaded the free trial of this, and man...talk about all my hopes for it being totally dashed...I've been wanting to play this since it was announced, and even more since everyone talks about how awesome it is, but it's not that good...I preffer city of heroes/villains...
It stinks at low level. It gets fun at about 30-40 depending on your class. Few months after I got 60 I quit though, nothing left to do.

[Wilhelm-Scream]

The art design is too cartoony and colorful. It looks like scenes from Walt Disney's Alice In Wonderland.
Won't be playing it even for free.
My friend did and said it was utter crap and that it's enormous success was more proof that the majority of the population is stupid.

[Boom]

The art design is too cartoony and colorful. It looks like scenes from Walt Disney's Alice In Wonderland.
Won't be playing it even for free.
My friend did and said it was utter crap and that it's enormous success was more proof that the majority of the population is stupid.
People held a WoW FUNERAL, A FUNERAL, for a dead player.

Further confirmation of your friend's statement.

[Mee]

People held a WoW FUNERAL, A FUNERAL, for a dead player.

Further confirmation of your friend's statement.
Yes it's sad for the funeral people, but the video was hilarious.

[Boom]

Yes it's sad for the funeral people, but the video was hilarious.
I have it saved under my favorites :up:.

[XwolverineX]

MMORPG = Suckage

[SouLeSS]

I play WoW...I've played nearly every other MMO out there. WoW's the best IMO.

People that don't like WoW are people that don't like any MMO. Period. EIther that, or they didn't give it enough time. The game sucks until around 20 when you start doing instances and such.

[Zenien]

Wow is fun as long as you have friends in real life to play with. That being said, I've lost all interest in it. I think I'm almost level 39. Going to instances every day is boring as anything "Oh but we have to run this instance all the time they drop X item"

Shut the hell up pathetic WOW addict. I want a game that's fun to play, and the higher the level you are in that game the more it becomes a boring chore.

[Joker]

so for the game to be any good, I have to play it with it sucking for a month? uh, no thanks...and I actually really like the cartoony design, it's just like Warcraft 3, my favorite RTS of all time :o

[Red]

What's WOW?

[Joker]

World Of Warcraft

[drmick]

I play WoW...I've played nearly every other MMO out there. WoW's the best IMO.

People that don't like WoW are people that don't like any MMO. Period. EIther that, or they didn't give it enough time. The game sucks until around 20 when you start doing instances and such.

I think you have hit the nail on the head there. I would go further and say that if you don't like RPGs (there are plenty of us who despise FF, KOTOR, Neverwinter etc) then stay away from MMORPGs. Even action-y ones like COH.

What I don't understand is why are there no MMO action games? Think an MMO Halo or an MMO GTA!

[THWIP*]

I think you have hit the nail on the head there. I would go further and say that if you don't like RPGs (there are plenty of us who despise FF, KOTOR, Neverwinter etc) then stay away from MMORPGs. Even action-y ones like COH.

What I don't understand is why are there no MMO action games? Think an MMO Halo or an MMO GTA!



THEY ARE COMING. 'HUXLEY' (PC/360) IS AN MMORPG FPS.

[Electro UK]

THEY ARE COMING. 'HUXLEY' (PC/360) IS AN MMORPG FPS.

:eek: *goes to find out more*

[lars573]

Also Planetside (MMOFPS), if it's still around. Came out 3 years ago.

[Wilhelm-Scream]

I play WoW...I've played nearly every other MMO out there. WoW's the best IMO.

People that don't like WoW are people that don't like any MMO. Period. EIther that, or they didn't give it enough time. The game sucks until around 20 when you start doing instances and such.WoW, you couldn't be more wrong. My friend who played it, his life has pretty much been destroyed by his MMORPG addiction. Asheron's Call was his life for years, he even payed rent and bills just by selling items and some bad-ass characters. Then Everquest was his life. Then a stint with Lineage and Anarchy Online. Then we blasted through Everquest 2 together till we got bored and now, I swear, it's as if any day his body will be sucked into the monitor because he has abandoned everything he once held dear just to live inside Shadowbane.
And sorry, if you can't have any fun in a game until level 20? That's retarded.

Also it's a matter of aesthetics. Some people like that Disney looking, colorful theme, but it looks like poo to me.

[iceberg325]

wow is the best MMO period. 6 million subcribers says alot. Ive only played wow, FF11, and city of heroes, and wow is the best out of all 3. Hands down. Im level 54 right now and still addicted!!! Love it!!!!

[Wilhelm-Scream]

Lol, how can you say it's "the best.period." when there are like 60 of 'em out there and you've only played 3 of 'em?
But, if you love it, cool.
I'm jealous 'cause I used to love Asheron's Call and Everquest so much I'd start to buzz when I'd log on.
Now I couldn't be bothered to do the same old tired, "start out weak, kill some rats, take this box of blooby berries to Mayor Winkleback, upgrade your armor, craft a chair, get in a group, get uber-items, wait till they raise the level cap" - thing ever again.

[WhatsHisFace]

Joker, you really buy into hype a lot.

[The Leaguer]

Everyone needs to shut up, because none of you know anything. There is only one word that one needs to define the ultimate MMO.

EverQuest.

[Jager X]

does anyone play ragnarok online? i honestly think its better than world of warcraft. if you are into oldschool looking 2-d games then its for you. multiple characters,diverse builds,even babies. look it up joker, you may like it.

[DarkStorm12]

you know I dont understan how Ever Quest is the best online game when I actually saved up all my lunch money for that ***** and subcribed for 6 months and played it, and the next 2 hours i got my money back because the ***** suck ass. if u told me that in my face that Ever Quest was the best game, I would of slaped ur ass to the ground and pissed on your face you damn *****less noob!!

[iceberg325]

Lol, how can you say it's "the best.period." when there are like 60 of 'em out there and you've only played 3 of 'em?
But, if you love it, cool.
I'm jealous 'cause I used to love Asheron's Call and Everquest so much I'd start to buzz when I'd log on.
Now I couldn't be bothered to do the same old tired, "start out weak, kill some rats, take this box of blooby berries to Mayor Winkleback, upgrade your armor, craft a chair, get in a group, get uber-items, wait till they raise the level cap" - thing ever again.

Out of 3 mmo's It is the best. I know alot of people who play other MMO's and switched because WoW is much much better. I know people who play phantasy star, everquest, Guild wars, FF11, runescape, night, star wars, city of heroes/villains. Cant think of any more. Guess what, they all play wow now. Its a great game. A little repetetive, but a great game.

[The Leaguer]

you know I dont understan how Ever Quest is the best online game when I actually saved up all my lunch money for that ***** and subcribed for 6 months and played it, and the next 2 hours i got my money back because the ***** suck ass. if u told me that in my face that Ever Quest was the best game, I would of slaped ur ass to the ground and pissed on your face you damn *****less noob!!
Sorry guy, but you started being wrong as soon as you got to "understan."

EverQuest is not only better than any game you've played, but you as well.

[LobokDaikon]

you know I dont understan how Ever Quest is the best online game when I actually saved up all my lunch money for that ***** and subcribed for 6 months and played it, and the next 2 hours i got my money back because the ***** suck ass. if u told me that in my face that Ever Quest was the best game, I would of slaped ur ass to the ground and pissed on your face you damn *****less noob!!

What curse word is that, anyway?

[The Leaguer]

It isn't one. He just hit the asterisk a few times, and then got right back to mispelling every other word.

[SouLeSS]

so for the game to be any good, I have to play it with it sucking for a month? uh, no thanks...and I actually really like the cartoony design, it's just like Warcraft 3, my favorite RTS of all time :o

If you play right, and are not a complete idiot to MMOs, it takes less than a week to get to lvl 20.

In fact, I started a Mage yesterday at 12pm EST. He's lvl 26 right now, and it's 2am EST the next day. He has just under 1day logged into him.

The more you play the game though, the more the first 20 levels suck. I personally have many multiple lvl 60's, and I make a ton selling items/accounts/gold on various sites or to various sites to sell to others. So much, that I can net at least 1grand a week playing this game.

Also note, that the game doesn't really suck sub 20, it's more or less a borefest for people like me who have done the same quests 300 times and have grinded on the same mobs for 1000+ hours.

Matter of fact, my main character is a lvl 60 Dwarf Warrior. He has 458 days on his /played. And for those who don't know what "/played" means, it has to do with how many hours the character has been actually logged onto the game.

[Joker]

If you play right, and are not a complete idiot to MMOs, it takes less than a week to get to lvl 20.

In fact, I started a Mage yesterday at 12pm EST. He's lvl 26 right now, and it's 2am EST the next day. He has just under 1day logged into him.

The more you play the game though, the more the first 20 levels suck. I personally have many multiple lvl 60's, and I make a ton selling items/accounts/gold on various sites or to various sites to sell to others. So much, that I can net at least 1grand a week playing this game.

Also note, that the game doesn't really suck sub 20, it's more or less a borefest for people like me who have done the same quests 300 times and have grinded on the same mobs for 1000+ hours.

Matter of fact, my main character is a lvl 60 Dwarf Warrior. He has 458 days on his /played. And for those who don't know what "/played" means, it has to do with how many hours the character has been actually logged onto the game.

yeah, some of us dont have time to play 24/7 cause we work full time every day and have actual things to do on our days off...so it would probably take me more than a week to get to level 20 because I wasnt "playing right"...douche...

[iceberg325]

Alot of people dont have that amount of time to play. Im a level 55 nightelf druid. I cant seem to get to 60 because I cant play for 10hrs straight like I did last summer. Thats the good thing about the game. There is no rush, you can play to your speed. Do whatever you want, and take as long as you want to do it. I couldnt see myself get more than one character to level 60. Its too time consuming!!!! The good thing about WoW is, its probably one of the easiest MMOs to level in. You get Xp for everything. Plus if you havent played the game in a day or 2, you xp meter goes up 200% faster. Most MMOs are tedious.

[Drakon]

The art design is too cartoony and colorful. It looks like scenes from Walt Disney's Alice In Wonderland.
Won't be playing it even for free.
My friend did and said it was utter crap and that it's enormous success was more proof that the majority of the population is stupid.

It's more of a casual-styled MorePig. The art design is pretty much copied from Warcraft III, which really helps to keep it all within the same feel in the universe.

People held a WoW FUNERAL, A FUNERAL, for a dead player.
Further confirmation of your friend's statement.

Mourning a friend's death by celebrating something he loved is stupid? Wow, that's rather shallow.

WoW, you couldn't be more wrong. My friend who played it, his life has pretty much been destroyed by his MMORPG addiction. Asheron's Call was his life for years, he even payed rent and bills just by selling items and some bad-ass characters. Then Everquest was his life. Then a stint with Lineage and Anarchy Online. Then we blasted through Everquest 2 together till we got bored and now, I swear, it's as if any day his body will be sucked into the monitor because he has abandoned everything he once held dear just to live inside Shadowbane.
And sorry, if you can't have any fun in a game until level 20? That's retarded.

Also it's a matter of aesthetics. Some people like that Disney looking, colorful theme, but it looks like poo to me.

I've got a few friends who've paid for their characters to be powerleveled, which I don't get on a game like that. First off, why do it? How can you be proud of work you didn't even do? Secondly, why pay for it?

[Drakon]

If you play right, and are not a complete idiot to MMOs, it takes less than a week to get to lvl 20.

In fact, I started a Mage yesterday at 12pm EST. He's lvl 26 right now, and it's 2am EST the next day. He has just under 1day logged into him.

The more you play the game though, the more the first 20 levels suck. I personally have many multiple lvl 60's, and I make a ton selling items/accounts/gold on various sites or to various sites to sell to others. So much, that I can net at least 1grand a week playing this game.

Also note, that the game doesn't really suck sub 20, it's more or less a borefest for people like me who have done the same quests 300 times and have grinded on the same mobs for 1000+ hours.

Matter of fact, my main character is a lvl 60 Dwarf Warrior. He has 458 days on his /played. And for those who don't know what "/played" means, it has to do with how many hours the character has been actually logged onto the game.

That's the beauty of the game. You can play at your own speed. It's geared more towards the casual gamer. Granted, you can't get the absolute best stuff, but you can get to see most of the stuff relatively easily.

[SouLeSS]

yeah, some of us dont have time to play 24/7 cause we work full time every day and have actual things to do on our days off...so it would probably take me more than a week to get to level 20 because I wasnt "playing right"...douche...

What part of " I personally have many multiple lvl 60's, and I make a ton selling items/accounts/gold on various sites or to various sites to sell to others. So much, that I can net at least 1grand a week playing this game" Didn't you understand?

Oh wait, I'm assuming you read my whole post. SOrry.

[The Leaguer]

The problem with WoW, and most other new MMO's, is that they are gear towards sissies.

Classic (pre-Luclin) EverQuest was f***ing hardcore. There were no stupid windriders or portals. If you had to go somewhere, you either paid another player to take you, or you f***ing walked. And there were no girlie mounts. Just arrow keys and an auto-run button.

And there was actually a consequence for dying, not just the inconvenience of running back to your corpse (in a f***ing ghost form, where nothing can hit you) and paying for repairs. In EQ, you lost your damn experience, the most valuabe commodity in the game. And if you didn't get back to your corpse fast enough, that f***er DECAYED! That means that s*** was gone! Forever! All your inventory, gone. And there was no pussy ghost form. You respawned where you were bound, and you found out how the f*** to get your corpse back. And if you died in bad spot, that s*** didn't just magically appear at the front of the zone. No, you had to go in after the bastard, unless you shelled out hard-earned money for someone to summon it. That isn't for newbs.

And there were no instances. Instances are for women. In EQ, you had to actually COMPETE WITH OTHER PLAYERS FOR CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT! Oh noes! And I don't mean the sissy honor crap from WoW, I mean, if there was a monster you wanted dead, you had better get to that s*** first, or you're gonna lose out.

And maps? F*** maps. In classic EQ, you used your damn memory, or your ass was lost.

And leveling was a b****, too. There was no getting to level 60 in five days. No, you had to work at that crap. And term "Hell level" is one that struck fear in the hearts of EQ players everywhere. The closest WoW comes to a Hell level is when you run out of rested experience.

And another thing. Rested experience? Jesus, why don't they just hand the crap to you on a plate.

EQ was a man's game.

[Drakon]

The problem with WoW, and most other new MMO's, is that they are gear towards sissies.

Classic (pre-Luclin) EverQuest was f***ing hardcore. There were no stupid windriders or portals. If you had to go somewhere, you either paid another player to take you, or you f***ing walked. And there were no girlie mounts. Just arrow keys and an auto-run button.

And there was actually a consequence for dying, not just the inconvenience of running back to your corpse (in a f***ing ghost form, where nothing can hit you) and paying for repairs. In EQ, you lost your damn experience, the most valuabe commodity in the game. And if you didn't get back to your corpse fast enough, that f***er DECAYED! That means that s*** was gone! Forever! All your inventory, gone. And there was no pussy ghost form. You respawned where you were bound, and you found out how the f*** to get your corpse back. And if you died in bad spot, that s*** didn't just magically appear at the front of the zone. No, you had to go in after the bastard, unless you shelled out hard-earned money for someone to summon it. That isn't for newbs.

And there were no instances. Instances are for women. In EQ, you had to actually COMPETE WITH OTHER PLAYERS FOR CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT! Oh noes! And I don't mean the sissy honor crap from WoW, I mean, if there was a monster you wanted dead, you had better get to that s*** first, or you're gonna lose out.

And maps? F*** maps. In classic EQ, you used your damn memory, or your ass was lost.

And leveling was a b****, too. There was no getting to level 60 in five days. No, you had to work at that crap. And term "Hell level" is one that struck fear in the hearts of EQ players everywhere. The closest WoW comes to a Hell level is when you run out of rested experience.

And another thing. Rested experience? Jesus, why don't they just hand the crap to you on a plate.

EQ was a man's game.

Next you'll be telling us that your mage had to walk uphill both ways in the snow with no shoes just to learn Fireball. :p

Seriously, though, think about it. If the game remained a "man's game" for that long, do you really think it would be as successful as it is now? Probably not. The genre and eventually the game itself would eventually drop in support, until it was killed off forever.

[The Leaguer]

Do I think support would drop off? Of course not. EverQuest subscription was constantly growing in numbers until two things happened: 1) designers focused far too much on adding more and more endgame content and not focusing enough on newbie content, while at the same time throwing in new content without fixing or revitalizing the old, and 2) other MMO's popped up like weeds, targeting the largest demographic EQ was ignoring: newbies.

Would they be as successful as they are now? Of course not. For the most part, people who play video games are casual. Hardcore gamers are far fewer than casual gamers. Because of that, designers targeted them when creating new MMO's. Even EverQuest started taking that route: content alone, EQ is virtually identical to WoW right now. The only drawback, however, is that once games (MMO's, at least) get casual, they lose a lot of what made them fun in the first place.

[Drakon]

Do I think support would drop off? Of course not. EverQuest subscription was constantly growing in numbers until two things happened: 1) designers focused far too much on adding more and more endgame content and not focusing enough on newbie content, while at the same time throwing in new content without fixing or revitalizing the old, and 2) other MMO's popped up like weeds, targeting the largest demographic EQ was ignoring: newbies.

Think about it like this. As a new gamer, [Completely new, not just new to MMORPGs] you're gonna want an easier learning curve. Imagine being the guy with a girl who hates games. If you can get her interested in this game, then it's a start. If she starts playing and she's hooked, you just got yourself a golden ticket--you now have something to bond over, Christmas and Birthdays just got a lot simpler, and she's not hounding over you because you want to go kill VanCleef instead of watching Legally Blonde.

As a developer, sure, you're making a lot of money off the 50k subscribers you have, but in order to progress, you need more people and more money. This is where newbies come in. If you're not getting any extra profit from newbies, then you're stagnant and not really making a whole lot of progress. And with a game like EQ, once you get your class, you're basically stuck with it, so if you want a Rogue to play instead of your Necromancer, you're back to being a newbie. And without that extra content, even oldbies will leave the game, leaving you without profit. And as we all know, if you're not making money off it, it's not a good idea to keep around.

Would they be as successful as they are now? Of course not. For the most part, people who play video games are casual. Hardcore gamers are far fewer than casual gamers. Because of that, designers targeted them when creating new MMO's. Even EverQuest started taking that route: content alone, EQ is virtually identical to WoW right now. The only drawback, however, is that once games (MMO's, at least) get casual, they lose a lot of what made them fun in the first place.

I completely agree. I hate seeing all these Neo-Nintendo Nitwits aged 13 or so who are all "Old School Gaming is the ****!" and then you ask them to define Old school, they go back to early PS2.

[TheCorpulent1]

Newbies are definitely being targeted for higher sales in all genres. Look at the difference between Morrowind and Oblivion in the SP RPG category. Oblivion dropped a bunch of the customizability that made Morrowind so much fun. The only increases in customizability Oblivion features are cosmetic ones that are basically to be expected of a next-gen engine. I played Morrowind through about 4 or 5 times with different characters, but I got bored of Oblivion and uninstalled it before making it through the main storyline with my first character. :o

[The Leaguer]

Think about it like this. As a new gamer, [Completely new, not just new to MMORPGs] you're gonna want an easier learning curve. Imagine being the guy with a girl who hates games. If you can get her interested in this game, then it's a start. If she starts playing and she's hooked, you just got yourself a golden ticket--you now have something to bond over, Christmas and Birthdays just got a lot simpler, and she's not hounding over you because you want to go kill VanCleef instead of watching Legally Blonde.
I perfectly understand why tailoring a game to newbies leads to more players and more money. I'm not debating that. My problem with it is when what's fun about the game is sacrificed, the challenge.

When I had to walk everywhere in EQ, the world seemed massive. I couldn't believe the awesome zones I would travel through. Once they added portals, and even mounts to some extent, it felt like the world shrunk. Suddenly, a zone half-a-world away was only two minutes away. The magic was gone.

When I would lose experinece (and even levels), and I would have to run and get my corpse, or God-forbid, I died in a dungeon, or a raid zone, dying was a terrifying concept to me. I did everything I could to survive, even (a few times) sacrifice group- and raid-mates. However, once it reached the point where the only thing dying meant was a trip through ghost-world, the dying in the game lost all meaning. The fun was gone.

It's in ways like that that I feel newbie-fying games, particularly MMO's, is a terrible thing.

Do I undestand the reasoning from the perspective of the company? Sure. Does it impove my gaming experience, as a customer? Not a chance.

As a developer, sure, you're making a lot of money off the 50k subscribers you have, but in order to progress, you need more people and more money. This is where newbies come in. If you're not getting any extra profit from newbies, then you're stagnant and not really making a whole lot of progress. And with a game like EQ, once you get your class, you're basically stuck with it, so if you want a Rogue to play instead of your Necromancer, you're back to being a newbie. And without that extra content, even oldbies will leave the game, leaving you without profit. And as we all know, if you're not making money off it, it's not a good idea to keep around.
Now what you're talking about is less about newbie-fying games, and more about the approaches designers take towards designing and upkeeping games, and, for the most part, is a matter of opinion.

What you're talking about in reference to classes is really primarily a debate about linear class progression versus tree progression. Personally, I prefer linear progression. I love starting two new characters and, right off the bat, being able to tell a fundamental difference. And as for being stuck with a class, I can normally tell within ten levels whether or not I'm going to like a class, and regardless of what game you're playing, the first ten levels are normally extremely quick.

On the other hand, I really dislike tree progression. Tree progression is something I felt helped to completely ruin EverQuest 2. By the time I hit level 20 with my Defender, I couldn't tell any difference at all from when I was level one. Each time I hit a split in the class tree, I couldn't tell a difference beyond what my character was actually called. I believe class trees take away from the uniqueness of classes.

Don't get me wrong, I am certainly not saying adding content is bad. Far from it, I love new content. How content was added, however, is extremely important. EverQuest did two things wrong, and it ended up completely ruining the game.

The first thing they did wrong was their overall approach to content: add, add, add. When improving a game, you can do two things: improve what is already there, and add new stuff. The first was a foreign concept to EverQuest designers. If you have five newbie zones, and one hundred newbies, the proportions are rather nice: 20 newbies per zone. But once you add ten more newbie zones, and the number of newbies isn't going up, you start to have a drop in zone population, and some zones are abandoned altogether. The same principle works for end-game zones.

The second thing EverQuest did wrong is add new things way, way too quickly. By the time guilds were beginning to take full advantage of end-game content, new content was being thrown their way. And normally, this new content usually had equipment that rendered all old equipment obsolete, so guilds had no choice but to immigrate. Entire tiers of zones were being abandoned every few months.

But zones weren't the only things affected. Actual in-game features were beginning to be rendered obsolete, as well. One EQ expansion introduced something called Dungeons, which were dungeon-based, timed quests with a few different goals. A few expansions later, they did little more than waste time. EverQuest's downfall resulted from adding content instead of fixing content.

[Mr. Smash'n Bash]

**** WoW, I'm waiting for Warhammer Online before I get back into MMORPGs.

[Benstamania]

WoW is by far the BEST MMO out there, and I don't know what you guys are talking about, the LOW levels are the fun ones.

[The Leaguer]

It's funny how not-the-best it is.

[Zen]

One day...

heroes journey will creep out from underneath your bed while you were sleeping and you'll wonder how the *&%$ you didnt notice it sooner...


Everquest pre-lucen was only heaven to people who made it their lives. everyone else hated it because it was a **** grind-fest worse then WoW, with stiff penalties that made you value certain things alot and hate other things more... when it was one of the ONLY choices out there, people were forced to play it. Lemme let you in on a little secret... without any sheep the wolves starve, all the innocent people that were forced to play that game now have other choices which would leave a Pre-lucen EQ without any of those people... only ruthless snarks would be left, and therefor youd have the game you want but it will NEVER be the game you HAD. you want to hear about stiff penalties? if you died in gemstone without a deed your character was dead... forever! goodnight Irene! and that was a text game... where you actually roleplayed....

ohh wait, NOBODY DOES THAT ***** ANYMORE

...that is, untill hero's journey releases.

You want PvP, clan-guild-faction warfare... you want your clothes to not dictate your level-profession or strength... or you can its your choice, look like a pirate or a decrepit old man, it doesnt matter... you can still burninate, and have the Defense of platemail. you want you weapons and armor to stay with you and have them gain fame in it and of themselves... you want real quests that effect the game, that actually have thought put into them... you want a nemesis to taunt you throughout the game... building an army to eventually cause an endgame showdown with you when you finally get sick of it all? you want warfare to actually be intelligent? with multi-person combos and spells that are more then click and cast? spells where you actually draw a line in the sand that sets on fire? or in a spiral...whatever! you want NPC"s that actually do something in game besides hand out quests... like replant burnt forest and rebuild sundered towns, speaking of which you want town warfare... buildings destroyable, you want a quest tree that tailors to you, quests you can actually fail... and a different outcome arises... you want an army of GM's running live events and playing the roles of bosses... screw that, you want and ARMY OF GM's adding new content everyday... new events everyday...youi want to actually be able to use the environment against your enemy...like drop bridges, roll boulders down mountains... you want MOBS with actual intelligent AI, Mobs that work together creatively instead of aggro to the damage/healer dealer... you want a dual class system where you major in one and minor in another... you want an apprentice master program that benefits both in a fair mannor, you want quests to scale so you can play with any level player and have fun(and not just scale but cater to the group so as to make it more fun to be there) youi want socketed items that accept magical abilities that you gained as experience from doing quests... and you want a game that makes it so the powergamer who neglects quests and focuses on leveling is hampered in the end...

and last but not least, you want to build a mage tower on the back of a magical turtle... and not just any magical turtle, but one that moves and swims... and has an aura that enhances your magical abilities... yeh, well the game is hero's journey.

Massively Multiplayer roleplaying game that you actually ROLEPLAY within... imagine that.

http://vaultmedia.ign.com/rpgvault/image/herosjourney06020904_1139448362.jpg

http://vaultmedia.ign.com/rpgvault/image/herosjourney06020902_1139448350.jpg

http://vaultmedia.ign.com/rpgvault/image/herosjourney06020903_1139448362.jpg

yeh, ill be up in there, roastin all ya asses and making potions in my freaking laboratory!

[Zen]

WoW is by far the BEST MMO out there, and I don't know what you guys are talking about, the LOW levels are the fun ones.

Wow is crap. its watered down crap that the masses are eating like some kinda strawberry flavored gruel fed to slaves... its got no variety in the quests, its all hunter gatherer crap... get this many of these, kill this many of these... raid this dungeon, get this armor drop... and battlegrounds is just awfull... the honor system is still F*&^%$ed to hell and its extremely boring after 60... there is nothing to do. when the expansion comes out... and youve tired of flying on your mount and jewelcrafting, there will be nothing to do after 70 except wait for the next expansion to 80 and a new race and a new profession... why cant they pump money into fixing the quests and making the game actually fun to play

EVE is 10 times the game WOW is but sadly it takes even more time then WoW does. theres actually political structure in EVE...

Instances are boring, you know... after youve done 3 er 4 its the same things over and over.

WoW is what youve been spoonfed because you dont know what else is out there/else is possible.

[imdaly]

One day...

heroes journey will creep out from underneath your bed while you were sleeping and you'll wonder how the *&%$ you didnt notice it sooner...


Everquest pre-lucen was only heaven to people who made it their lives. everyone else hated it because it was a **** grind-fest worse then WoW, with stiff penalties that made you value certain things alot and hate other things more... when it was one of the ONLY choices out there, people were forced to play it. Lemme let you in on a little secret... without any sheep the wolves starve, all the innocent people that were forced to play that game now have other choices which would leave a Pre-lucen EQ without any of those people... only ruthless snarks would be left, and therefor youd have the game you want but it will NEVER be the game you HAD. you want to hear about stiff penalties? if you died in gemstone without a deed your character was dead... forever! goodnight Irene! and that was a text game... where you actually roleplayed....

ohh wait, NOBODY DOES THAT ***** ANYMORE

...that is, untill hero's journey releases.

You want PvP, clan-guild-faction warfare... you want your clothes to not dictate your level-profession or strength... or you can its your choice, look like a pirate or a decrepit old man, it doesnt matter... you can still burninate, and have the Defense of platemail. you want you weapons and armor to stay with you and have them gain fame in it and of themselves... you want real quests that effect the game, that actually have thought put into them... you want a nemesis to taunt you throughout the game... building an army to eventually cause an endgame showdown with you when you finally get sick of it all? you want warfare to actually be intelligent? with multi-person combos and spells that are more then click and cast? spells where you actually draw a line in the sand that sets on fire? or in a spiral...whatever! you want NPC"s that actually do something in game besides hand out quests... like replant burnt forest and rebuild sundered towns, speaking of which you want town warfare... buildings destroyable, you want a quest tree that tailors to you, quests you can actually fail... and a different outcome arises... you want an army of GM's running live events and playing the roles of bosses... screw that, you want and ARMY OF GM's adding new content everyday... new events everyday...youi want to actually be able to use the environment against your enemy...like drop bridges, roll boulders down mountains... you want MOBS with actual intelligent AI, Mobs that work together creatively instead of aggro to the damage/healer dealer... you want a dual class system where you major in one and minor in another... you want an apprentice master program that benefits both in a fair mannor, you want quests to scale so you can play with any level player and have fun(and not just scale but cater to the group so as to make it more fun to be there) youi want socketed items that accept magical abilities that you gained as experience from doing quests... and you want a game that makes it so the powergamer who neglects quests and focuses on leveling is hampered in the end...

and last but not least, you want to build a mage tower on the back of a magical turtle... and not just any magical turtle, but one that moves and swims... and has an aura that enhances your magical abilities... yeh, well the game is hero's journey.

Massively Multiplayer roleplaying game that you actually ROLEPLAY within... imagine that.

http://vaultmedia.ign.com/rpgvault/image/herosjourney06020904_1139448362.jpg

http://vaultmedia.ign.com/rpgvault/image/herosjourney06020902_1139448350.jpg

http://vaultmedia.ign.com/rpgvault/image/herosjourney06020903_1139448362.jpg

yeh, ill be up in there, roastin all ya asses and making potions in my freaking laboratory!

<goes to look up Heroes Journey>

...why have I never heard of this game before??

[Zen]

<goes to look up Heroes Journey>

...why have I never heard of this game before??




One day...

heroes journey will creep out from underneath your bed while you were sleeping and you'll wonder how the *&%$ you didnt notice it sooner...


lengthen message by 3 characters? damn you mirko!!!

[imdaly]

Game has my attention now.








...but I still insist on getting my True Fantasy Live Online.... :(

[Addendum]

If I want to roleplay with others...

1) I find some others in my town. This was easier in college
2) I get a blank character sheet, and flip through a couple books to find a character class
3) After the various stuff in creating a character, I roleplay.

Besides, it's better to roleplay wired on Pizza, Mountain Dew, and Cheetos

[iceberg325]

Wow is crap. its watered down crap that the masses are eating like some kinda strawberry flavored gruel fed to slaves... its got no variety in the quests, its all hunter gatherer crap... get this many of these, kill this many of these... raid this dungeon, get this armor drop... and battlegrounds is just awfull... the honor system is still F*&^%$ed to hell and its extremely boring after 60... there is nothing to do. when the expansion comes out... and youve tired of flying on your mount and jewelcrafting, there will be nothing to do after 70 except wait for the next expansion to 80 and a new race and a new profession... why cant they pump money into fixing the quests and making the game actually fun to play

EVE is 10 times the game WOW is but sadly it takes even more time then WoW does. theres actually political structure in EVE...

Instances are boring, you know... after youve done 3 er 4 its the same things over and over.

WoW is what youve been spoonfed because you dont know what else is out there/else is possible.

Its not crap. It does get a little repetetive though.

[Phantom Lantern]

GemStone IV and dragonrealms offer three account types for players to choose from: standard ($14.95), premium ($39.95) and platinum ($49.95).

the plantinum accounts allow players to get to use player housing, larger inventory space, better customer service

basically stuff you take for granted in other games you have to fork out $50 a month for

they are being very coy about the fees in heroes journey

this is definately their biggest ever project will they risk messing up with outrageous fees ?

[SouLeSS]

The problem with WoW, and most other new MMO's, is that they are gear towards sissies.

Classic (pre-Luclin) EverQuest was f***ing hardcore. There were no stupid windriders or portals. If you had to go somewhere, you either paid another player to take you, or you f***ing walked. And there were no girlie mounts. Just arrow keys and an auto-run button.

And there was actually a consequence for dying, not just the inconvenience of running back to your corpse (in a f***ing ghost form, where nothing can hit you) and paying for repairs. In EQ, you lost your damn experience, the most valuabe commodity in the game. And if you didn't get back to your corpse fast enough, that f***er DECAYED! That means that s*** was gone! Forever! All your inventory, gone. And there was no pussy ghost form. You respawned where you were bound, and you found out how the f*** to get your corpse back. And if you died in bad spot, that s*** didn't just magically appear at the front of the zone. No, you had to go in after the bastard, unless you shelled out hard-earned money for someone to summon it. That isn't for newbs.

And there were no instances. Instances are for women. In EQ, you had to actually COMPETE WITH OTHER PLAYERS FOR CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT! Oh noes! And I don't mean the sissy honor crap from WoW, I mean, if there was a monster you wanted dead, you had better get to that s*** first, or you're gonna lose out.

And maps? F*** maps. In classic EQ, you used your damn memory, or your ass was lost.

And leveling was a b****, too. There was no getting to level 60 in five days. No, you had to work at that crap. And term "Hell level" is one that struck fear in the hearts of EQ players everywhere. The closest WoW comes to a Hell level is when you run out of rested experience.

And another thing. Rested experience? Jesus, why don't they just hand the crap to you on a plate.

EQ was a man's game.

Amen to that. DAoC was similar, with the exception that we had horse rides to take us from one place to another, and no perma decay corpse. I love WoW for many reasons., but hate how incredibly easy it is, and how redundant dying and retriving your corpse is.

In fact, people use the die / ghost as an advantage to get through areas from one side of the world to another without having to worry about mobs or anything.

[Mr. Smash'n Bash]

Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning

Based on Games Workshop's popular Warhammer fantasy world. Dominated by force of arms and magic, this world provides a rich setting for hundreds of thousands of players to experience the epic nature of war and the glory of battle.

Join one of six Armies and fight for the Armies of Order (Dwarf, High Elf and Empire) or the Armies of Destruction (Greenskin, Dark Elf, or Chaos). Wage war across three unique battlefronts.

Next generation Realm vs. Realm game system integrating both PvP combat and PvE quests on the same map in support of the greater war.

Engage in four levels of RvR combat:

- Skirmishes: Incidental PvP combat
- Battlefields: Objective-based battles in the game world
- Scenarios: Instanced, point-based battles balanced with NPC Dogs of War
- Campaigns: The invasion of enemy lands culminating in the assault on their capital city


Undertake a wide variety of PvE quest types related to an army's war efforts, including:

- Public quests that benefit from the participation of the entire army
- Conflict quests that pit players against an enemy with opposing goals
- Branching quests that let you choose the outcome of the quest and your reward
- Xmas quests that reward exploration with high value loot


A robust combat system introduces Player Tactics (earned powers you equip prior to battle) and Morale Skills (combat options that increase in power when the momentum of battle is in your favor).

Player models that change to reflect the relative power of a character (i.e., Orcs grow in size and Dwarfs' beards get longer). Customizable armor and a visual guild system allow a player to make their character truly unique.

Embark on an epic quest to complete the Tome of Knowledge and unlock Warhammer lore, detailed monster information, and major story plotlines.

Online play requires a subscription and Internet connection

http://pcmedia.ign.com/pc/image/article/707/707529/warhammer-online-age-of-reckoning-20060510070525091.jpg

http://pcmedia.ign.com/pc/image/article/707/707529/warhammer-online-age-of-reckoning-20060510070544121.jpg

http://pcmedia.ign.com/pc/image/article/707/707529/warhammer-online-age-of-reckoning-20060510070533121.jpg

http://pcmedia.ign.com/pc/image/article/707/707529/warhammer-online-age-of-reckoning-20060510070555714.jpg

http://pcmedia.ign.com/pc/image/article/699/699806/warhammer-online-age-of-reckoning-20060403103433075.jpg

http://pcmedia.ign.com/pc/image/article/695/695074/warhammer-online-20060310100446536.jpg

This is what WoW Should have been.

[Drakon]

Wow, had the description not won me over, those screenies would have

[Mr. Smash'n Bash]

Thats what Orcs and Goblins should look like. :o

[Mr. Smash'n Bash]

So, will I be seeing you in WAR when it releases Drakon?

[Drakon]

Maybe. I meant Heroe's Journey, specifically, but it did apply to both. My buddy will probably pick up WAR, so I'll probably play on his account.

[Mr. Smash'n Bash]

Maybe. I meant Heroe's Journey, specifically, but it did apply to both. My buddy will probably pick up WAR, so I'll probably play on his account.


Ahh damn .. :(

[Drakon]

If you ever get into my neck of the woods, I'll play you some REAL Warhammer. Deal?

[Mr. Smash'n Bash]

If you ever get into my neck of the woods, I'll play you some REAL Warhammer. Deal?



Deal, As long as it's 40k because my Dwarf army isn't above 500 points yet. :o

[Drakon]

Okay.

[The Leaguer]

One day...

heroes journey will creep out from underneath your bed while you were sleeping and you'll wonder how the *&%$ you didnt notice it sooner...


Everquest pre-lucen was only heaven to people who made it their lives. everyone else hated it because it was a **** grind-fest worse then WoW, with stiff penalties that made you value certain things alot and hate other things more... when it was one of the ONLY choices out there, people were forced to play it. Lemme let you in on a little secret... without any sheep the wolves starve, all the innocent people that were forced to play that game now have other choices which would leave a Pre-lucen EQ without any of those people... only ruthless snarks would be left, and therefor youd have the game you want but it will NEVER be the game you HAD. you want to hear about stiff penalties? if you died in gemstone without a deed your character was dead... forever! goodnight Irene! and that was a text game... where you actually roleplayed....

ohh wait, NOBODY DOES THAT ***** ANYMORE
I'm not quite sure what your point is, but your're wrong about "everyone else hated it." You're speaking for a massive group of people that you know pretty much nothing about.

As for the choices thing... duh?

I've learned to take any hype about a game, screenshots included, with a grain of sand. Hype and graphics don't mean too much. EverQuest 2's graphics were mindblowing. The game sucked. The crap Dark and Light was promising sounded incredible. The game (what Settlers of Goranth showed, at least) sucked. D&D promised both, a ton of content and nice graphics. The game sucked.

[WhatsHisFace]

When will the last gameworld to be completely surrounded by giant mountains finally release so I don't have to look at it again? Other than that, it looks good graphically.

[Capt Throbberson]

I have my hopes up for Vanguard.

[SouLeSS]

Fact of the matter is, a LOT of MMO's lately have been very...undersomething or other. In other words, they had AMAZING potential (Auto Assult, Dark and Light, DND Online) but they ended up sucking hard.

[stryfe]

Fact of the matter is, a LOT of MMO's lately have been very...undersomething or other. In other words, they had AMAZING potential (Auto Assult, Dark and Light, DND Online) but they ended up sucking hard.


Agreed.

[devilgirl]

MMORPG = Suckage
They arent bad, just that they all fall into the same traps.
You lose intrest.
I've played Everquest 1+2 , City of heroes + villains, Matrix online, Guild Wars

In EQ it lacked community and after awhile all it was , was hack and slash and downtime.

City of Heroes +Villains had what eq lacked but it too just became the same routine.

Matrix online had everything these other games lacked but it became boring as hell and the gameplay was terrible.

Guild wars is basically a fantasy version of Halo.

I havent touched WOW because it looks like the smurfs on acid and i like my elves dark and evil, not purple. The game is way over hyped to the point that it's annoying.


I am still on the search for a good MMORPG, till i find one, im playing Diablo.

[Drakon]

I should reinstall Diablo. You play on USWest or East?

[iceberg325]

I think alot of people dont like WoW because its so popular. Thats silly. In everquest when you die what happens? You owe xp. Ok its hardcore w/e. in FF11, what happens when you die, you lose like 30 xp. It takes along time to get xp in that game. It sucks because you earned alot of xp, you get chased by an overpowered mad sheep that can attack you form 100 yards away. Is that hardcore, no. Its bad game design. WoW is good because it doesnt take you to quit your job in order to play it. Its accesible, and that is why it appeals to the masses. EQ, FF11 and other mmos are for the hardcore only. That is why they only appeal to there respective gamers. Wow is a great game. Its fun, yes its easy, the graphics are great. The only 2 problems I have with it are, its a bit laggy, and too repetetive. Out of all the mmos Ive seen or played, IMO wow is the best.

[devilgirl]

you lose a shard too, which also costs xp and you have to go get it again, which causes you to lose more shards because you lost the first fighting a high level named. So you decide to forget it and wait 3 days for it to be returned and by that time you've realized that you havent fed your pet fish in days and it's hovering above the water.

ah the sweet addiction of MMORPGs...

I miss cuddles:(



I think alot of people dont like WoW because its so popular. Thats silly. In everquest when you die what happens? You owe xp. Ok its hardcore w/e. in FF11, what happens when you die, you lose like 30 xp. It takes along time to get xp in that game. It sucks because you earned alot of xp, you get chased by an overpowered mad sheep that can attack you form 100 yards away. Is that hardcore, no. Its bad game design. WoW is good because it doesnt take you to quit your job in order to play it. Its accesible, and that is why it appeals to the masses. EQ, FF11 and other mmos are for the hardcore only. That is why they only appeal to there respective gamers. Wow is a great game. Its fun, yes its easy, the graphics are great. The only 2 problems I have with it are, its a bit laggy, and too repetetive. Out of all the mmos Ive seen or played, IMO wow is the best.




I should reinstall Diablo. You play on USWest or East?

Hi hi, currently im on a hiatus from online gaming, I need to buy a new computer and i've been busy with my online comic.

but i shall tell you when i get things rolling again.

[SLVRSR4]

does anyone play ragnarok online? i honestly think its better than world of warcraft. if you are into oldschool looking 2-d games then its for you. multiple characters,diverse builds,even babies. look it up joker, you may like it.

that game is awesome! Also person that is making 1000 a week train me! Give me free crap too! i've played a lot of mmorpgs and all i can say it is better than runescape! My piece can't run any other games decently! oh and the leaguer i admire your hardcoreness!

[SouLeSS]

I'm not gonna train you on how to goldfarm / mob farm =( It really easy though.

[Drakon]

Hi hi, currently im on a hiatus from online gaming, I need to buy a new computer and i've been busy with my online comic.

but i shall tell you when i get things rolling again.

Please do. And update Cartridge. I'm tired of seeing Emo Spidey. :p

[Benstamania]

The WoW hate hear makes me sad. :( Thankfuly it's the only place that HAS WoW hate. :p

[The Leaguer]

"Hear?"

Lot's of places have WoW hate, it's just that in those places, it's the accepted way of thinking, so they don't bother talking about it.

[Benstamania]

Forgive me, a misplaced word, or a typo if you will...how dare I.

[The Leaguer]

I agree. Such a mistake is nigh unforgivable.

[Benstamania]

lol :p

The way I look at it is this.

If you want something that's just cool and fun, you play wow. if you want something completely 100% engrossing and life stealing, you play everquest.

If you want a digital POS you play SWG.

[The Leaguer]

I agree about SWG, but EverQuest is (was) very cool and very fun. The zones in EverQuest are unequaled.

[SouLeSS]

Personally, DAoC > EQ

[The Leaguer]

DAoC isn't as bad as WoW, but it still doesn't match EQ for sheer awesomeness. EQ is the MMO to end all MMOs.

[SouLeSS]

I've played both. SOmething about DAoC made me like it more. Probably the whole 3 realms thing.

[iceberg325]

I hear alot of wow hate. Whats wrong with it????

[stryfe]

I hear alot of wow hate. Whats wrong with it????


Thats a long road to travel and im not even sure where to start. Just off the top of my head......

1) it seems 90% of the players are under 13 years old.
2) Because of said reason the community sucks ass.
3) PvP sucks.
4) The missions are beyond dull.
5) Even the instances arent very fun.
6) The crafting system is a joke.
7) Getting to 60 is generally very easy. This actually turns into a positive when.....
8) Theres nothing to do once you reach 60 besides a few very uninteresting end games instances. How is this is positive you ask? Shorty after this point you cancel.

[The Leaguer]

stryfe seems to have nailed it.

[iceberg325]

Thats a long road to travel and im not even sure where to start. Just off the top of my head......

1) it seems 90% of the players are under 13 years old.
2) Because of said reason the community sucks ass.
3) PvP sucks.
4) The missions are beyond dull.
5) Even the instances arent very fun.
6) The crafting system is a joke.
7) Getting to 60 is generally very easy. This actually turns into a positive when.....
8) Theres nothing to do once you reach 60 besides a few very uninteresting end games instances. How is this is positive you ask? Shorty after this point you cancel.

I havent really encountered to many people who seem young. Everyone on friends list seems capable of playing so I group and tolerate them.

I never had a problem with the community on my realm. (hellscream)

I dont generally do Pvp, but thought it was fun. The battlegrounds was good fun. Only downside is it takes toooooo long to get into one match. Capture the flag against others your level is a good distraction.

Missions are OK, but sometimes become too repetetive. I give you that one.

Instances are fun when fighting bosses. Alot of missions in them consist of same objectives as normal missions, which means repetitive gameplay. Point taken.

I dont craft so I cant comment lol.

Level 60 isnt too fast if you take your time. But yes if you quest enough, you can reach it pretty fast. Is that a bad thing? No. It doesnt take too much time of your life to become strong in the game. I played FF11 for a couple months and felt like I was getting no where. That becomes discouraging, and made me cancel my account. Wow rewards you for playing. You dont have to sit in front or your computer 10 hours a day to make it far. I think that is a pro rather then a con.

Im not level 60 so I cant comment on life after 60. Im level 55. When I get to 60, ill comment on it.

I think wow is a great game because its highly accessible. It doesnt take over your life like some mmos although it can become highly addictive. The game is constantly being updated, and there is new content all the time. Great game IMO. It can be a bit laggy in high traffic areas which sucks. Out of all the mmos ive played, this is the best one.

[darkdaz]

The PvP Battle grounds Rock. When on CoH when they released Arena and could never get anoyone to go on it. Battlegrounds in Warcraft are like imense 80 man Wars well Alterac Vally is anyway.

[Benstamania]

I think wow is a great game because its highly accessible. It doesnt take over your life like some mmos although it can become highly addictive. The game is constantly being updated, and there is new content all the time. Great game IMO. It can be a bit laggy in high traffic areas which sucks. Out of all the mmos ive played, this is the best one.

You said it best man! I've saved a ton of cash playing WoW, as it's been the ONLY game I've been playing for months. I habe NO idea where some of you guys say "But teh 13 yeear olds!111!1" because I have YET to run into anyone acting immature. I play on Lothar and I'm "FOR THE HORDE!" so maybe that's the reason.

WoW is the best MMO I've played, hands down. If it's not your cup of tea, fine. But it is in NO way a joke, I think people tend to say that about the popular games though. It's cool to hate on what's popular. :p

[Drakon]

I've noticed that generally Horde players are a bit more mature than Alliance players. I think that a good part of it is because a lot of Alliance players are still new to the MMORPG circle, and pick something "Pretty", as opposed to an Orc or a Troll, as opposed to the Horde players picking Racials and the like.

That's just a theory, not fact, and I'm not changing my opinion for anyone.

[Extromaniac]

DAoC > WoW.

WoW is one of the single WORST MMORPGs ever. It's a PvE grindfest where equipment is the difference between being ganked and doing the ganking. It's such a ****ing item-ladder it's not even funny.

Secondly, you don't even have to play your god-damned character in PvP if you have 'epix', just sit there and wait til you get bored and kill the other player. The game takes zero skill, and it's all about doing 6-hour 40-man raids to get the next 'phat lewtz'. That's the worst concept for a MMO to date.

At least WAR will make up for the failure named WoW.

[SouLeSS]

Thats a long road to travel and im not even sure where to start. Just off the top of my head......

1) it seems 90% of the players are under 13 years old.
This isn't true at all. In fact, most people I've played with, and I've played since day one, are at least 16.
2) Because of said reason the community sucks ass.
Look above
3) PvP sucks.
The PvP isn't as bad as everyone says. I've played many a MMO, and the PvP BG system is one of the best
4) The missions are beyond dull.
What MMO doesn't have boring quests?
5) Even the instances arent very fun.
Thats probably because you only got to do The Deadmines and you got wiped before you kill the ogre then you ragequit your account
6) The crafting system is a joke.
It's not much different from other games. Though most of the itembased ones end up being just a huge faction rep grind, not that you would know about that or anything
7) Getting to 60 is generally very easy. This actually turns into a positive when.....
It's not easy to get to 60. It's simply easier than all the other MMO's out ther
8) Theres nothing to do once you reach 60 besides a few very uninteresting end games instances. How is this is positive you ask? Shorty after this point you cancel.
This is where you're oh so wrong. There are a ton of endgame raids. Now granted, it's really only for the hardcore (Friend of mine is a guildleader, they raid mon-thurs 5pm-2am and Fri/Sat 5pm - 4am. More than a fulltime job)

Bleh

[Extromaniac]

I'll reply to your response out of boredom.

1) You're actually right, the median age for players in WoW is about 26. This doesn't stop them from acting like 13 year olds, though.

2) Look above, the fact is that most of the people on WoW are gankers and not very helpful at all, because they act like they're 13. This makes for a bad community. Also, Unlike Mythic (making WAR, made DAoC) Blizzard doesn't do much in the way of keeping in touch with the community on a person-to-person basis. Hell, I'm playing in a Fantasy Football League with Richard (from Mythic) who set it up for a few of us over at WHA. THAT'S a real community-oriented developer.

3) Actually, the PvP is bad as most people say. Instead of having item grinds in PvP.. you have honour grinds. You sit there and grind for honour, the whole game's a grind. And on top of that, you have to get your 'epix' before you can even be competitive with the other end-gamers.

4) DAoC had some good ones. As far as I know from playing the trial, that is.

5) No, the instances are boring. Any instance that requires you to have an ub3r guild, with a bunch of L337 kids who you hate.. sucks. 40-man raids for 4+ hours is not, by any definition of the word, fun

6) Actually, it is different than a lot of other games crafting systems. The items you get from crafting are absolutely WORTHLESS compared to what you get when you're doing said 40-man raids.

7) You're right, I don't have a problem with this. First time. Wowza.

8) Yes, it is really only for the hardcore. How is this interesting? Being glued to your computer for many, many hours at a time just trying to raid for some new ub3r weapon that Blizzard coughed up. Yes. This is fun, oh so fun.

[The Leaguer]

It's easy as Hell to get to 60. I have a friend who hasn't played it more than a year and has four level 60 characters, all geared out their asses.

And the only good thing about WoW's PvP is the Battlegrounds. They may be fun, but it's a f***ing pain to find one if you're under 60.

[SouLeSS]

I'll reply to your response out of boredom.

1) You're actually right, the median age for players in WoW is about 26. This doesn't stop them from acting like 13 year olds, though.

2) Look above, the fact is that most of the people on WoW are gankers and not very helpful at all, because they act like they're 13. This makes for a bad community. Also, Unlike Mythic (making WAR, made DAoC) Blizzard doesn't do much in the way of keeping in touch with the community on a person-to-person basis. Hell, I'm playing in a Fantasy Football League with Richard (from Mythic) who set it up for a few of us over at WHA. THAT'S a real community-oriented developer.

3) Actually, the PvP is bad as most people say. Instead of having item grinds in PvP.. you have honour grinds. You sit there are grind for honour, the whole game's a grind. And on top of that, you have to get your 'epix' before you can even be competitive with the other end-gamers.

4) DAoC had some good ones. As far as I know from playing the trial, that is.

5) No, the instances are boring. Any instance that requires you to have an ub3r guild, with a bunch of L337 kids who you hate.. sucks. 40-man raids for 4+ hours is not, by any definition of the word, fun

6) Actually, it is different than a lot of other games crafting systems. The items you get from crafting are absolutely WORTHLESS compared to what you get when you're doing said 40-man raids.

7) You're right, I don't have a problem with this. First time. Wowza.

8) Yes, it is really only for the hardcore. How is this interesting? Being glued to your computer for many, many hours at a time just trying to raid for some new ub3r weapon that Blizzard coughed up. Yes. This is fun, oh so fun.

Did you ever play WoW and if so, what was your highest level

[Mr. Smash'n Bash]

I played it and got a character up to around 58 or something, I can't remember because I quite about 6 months ago but I found that once I reached pretty much the endgame it was both boring and nothing more then either an Epic grind or a Honor grind.

[BATS N' HORNETS]

I hate WOW because you hafta pay for it & people go too NUTS over it...

Wake the F*** UP it's a computer game

[jdlynch1]

:pal:

[Soapy]

I hate WOW because you hafta pay for it & people go too NUTS over it...

Wake the F*** UP it's a computer game


You know...in theory, I wouldn't mind paying 15 bucks a month to play a good MMO, but 15 dollars a month for WoW?

I don't know. I feel like Blizzard should pay me to play that game. :o

[Bathead]

I've been playing it for three months now, and so far, I'm enjoying it. As this is the first MMORPG I've ever played, I can't speak as to how it compares to others, but I'm having fun.

[Raiden]

WOW isn't the first MMO I played, and I do think there are flaws in this game. However, I play it because it's still fun, doesn't take over my life like other MMO, and most importantly there are friends and family who are playing that game, which gives me the incentive to keep playing so I can socialize with them. Yes, WOW is a huge grind and far too gear-dependent, and from my limited time play WAR I think it's a superior game than WOW. But I still play WOW because I like to play with people I know, and I'm very interested to see what the next expansion will offer in terms of new content and fun factor.

[GL1]

WOW isn't the first MMO I played, and I do think there are flaws in this game. However, I play it because it's still fun, doesn't take over my life like other MMO, and most importantly there are friends and family who are playing that game, which gives me the incentive to keep playing so I can socialize with them. Yes, WOW is a huge grind and far too gear-dependent, and from my limited time play WAR I think it's a superior game than WOW. But I still play WOW because I like to play with people I know, and I'm very interested to see what the next expansion will offer in terms of new content and fun factor.

Boom. This is where it is. WoW is not a great game. The gameplay is not the attraction. The community is the attraction... no, not their friendliness. WoW is the game you can talk about with people... that you can run into others who play.

And it is simple, and that attracts a lot of casual gamers. This is why the "WoW" killer claim is so silly. It's like a software company coming up with a "Windows Killer." It doesn't matter than Windows sucks - it's got superior marketing and positioning and exposure. It's here to stay. Same with Wow, just to a lesser degree.

[Why Are You Crouching Spock?]

^Yea I agree. People will still be playing this game possibly 10-15 years from now.

[Raiden]

Boom. This is where it is. WoW is not a great game. The gameplay is not the attraction. The community is the attraction... no, not their friendliness. WoW is the game you can talk about with people... that you can run into others who play.

And it is simple, and that attracts a lot of casual gamers. This is why the "WoW" killer claim is so silly. It's like a software company coming up with a "Windows Killer." It doesn't matter than Windows sucks - it's got superior marketing and positioning and exposure. It's here to stay. Same with Wow, just to a lesser degree.

I think WOW devs have a good understanding of what makes people play WOW in spite of superior competitions; people want to play a MMO that caters to both PVE and PVP (although WOW is still very much a PVE-centric game despite BG and Arena), stuff for casuals to do (achievement, dailies, quick 5-man dungeons), stuff for hardcores to do (Arena, 25-man dungeons, rep grinds), and offer a recruit-a-friend system that pays off for both you and the person you invited to play WOW.

Ultimately, people play MMO to be with the people they like and want to play along with, and this is the factor that will make other MMO hard to wrestle subscribers away from this game.

[Soapy]

[...] This is why the "WoW" killer claim is so silly. It's like a software company coming up with a "Windows Killer." It doesn't matter than Windows sucks - it's got superior marketing and positioning and exposure. It's here to stay. Same with Wow, just to a lesser degree.

^Yea I agree. People will still be playing this game possibly 10-15 years from now.

No doubt.

Of course a better and more popular MMO will come around eventually, but WoW isn't going anywhere. Blizzard won't hold their 11 million players forever, but there will always be a dedicated group who will play the game as long Blizzard keeps it running.

A fair number of people still play Everquest, and this is a game that is still being updated regularly. I think it's 15th or 16th expansion is coming out next year. Crazy.

Hell, even Ultima Online is still kicking around with it's die-hard players.

So yeah, the moral of the story is that video games are never "killed", they're just succeeded.

[GL1]

I think WOW devs have a good understanding of what makes people play WOW in spite of superior competitions; people want to play a MMO that caters to both PVE and PVP (although WOW is still very much a PVE-centric game despite BG and Arena), stuff for casuals to do (achievement, dailies, quick 5-man dungeons), stuff for hardcores to do (Arena, 25-man dungeons, rep grinds), and offer a recruit-a-friend system that pays off for both you and the person you invited to play WOW.

Ultimately, people play MMO to be with the people they like and want to play along with, and this is the factor that will make other MMO hard to wrestle subscribers away from this game.

Sad, but so, so true.

And it is true, that WoW devs are good at what they do, and that is catering. They realized, perhaps first, that catering to the LCD playstyles would get them big rewards, and it has.

I don't think the answer is to 'wrestle subscribers from Wow.' The goal is to get new subscribers before WoW does. To get WoW's largely untapped markets (social networking peeps and the Wii generation, imho), and leverage from there. That's kinda what Mac did... they didn't go for the business world, they got the creative studios and the not-quite-computers hardware. Now they're ubiquitous, and perceived as superior, even by non-adopters. That's what another MMO will have to do to take a solid second next to WoW. Maybe, because the MMO market is a helluva lot more fickle than the Computing market, even overtake them one day.

But no one is going out-standard MMO WoW. It just will not happen.

No doubt.

Of course a better and more popular MMO will come around eventually, but WoW isn't going anywhere. Blizzard won't hold their 11 million players forever, but there will always be a dedicated group who will play the game as long Blizzard keeps it running.

A fair number of people still play Everquest, and this is a game that is still being updated regularly. I think it's 15th or 16th expansion is coming out next year. Crazy.

Hell, even Ultima Online is still kicking around with it's die-hard players.

So yeah, the moral of the story is that video games are never "killed", they're just succeeded.

Honestly... that's going to be, like, 10 years from now. Maybe more. Unless Blizzard messes up.

If Blizzard Messes up badly enough, any great MMO with exceptional marketing could dethrone them.

[Raiden]

I think in order for another MMO to dethrone WOW, it needs to have a big company behind them to give them financial backing, and working with a license that is recognizable. They also need to have a game that caters to as many player base as possible, from PVE crowd to PVP enthusiasts, to casual gamers and hardcore players. Not an easy task, but I don't think WOW will stay #1 forever.

[GL1]

No, not forever, but for an unnecessarily long time. I don't think that if a great all-catering MMO came out now for, say, Pokemon, that WoW would be dethroned. I think the marketing would play as large a part as the quality or catering of the game. Just putting something on the shelves and showing some TV commercials won't do it.

[JRPJCDJC]

It stinks at low level. It gets fun at about 30-40 depending on your class. Few months after I got 60 I quit though, nothing left to do.

I feel almost the opposite. I first played the trial and that inspired me to buy the full version. For me, playing the trial on the lower levels got me excited because this ginormous possibility for a great gaming experience was unfolding. Then, when I finally bought the full version I found it lacking a purpose. Other than leveling and buying new gear, I wasn't sure what I was supposed to be doing - what the ultimate goal was other than 'kill the bad guys.' It's still probably the best video gaming experience ther is but something is just 'off' for me.

[chronoic]

I think wow peak are 1-10, 30-31, 55, 58 or 60, 68 or 70, and 78-80, 80+ if you found a good guild. (for a new person)

the only reason I say this, is because this is when avatar gains something differ, or leave a part of one thing and start what looks to be new, but then you find out it isn't.

1-10 (when you start out and after being in so many Grinding game, you think this one might be different)

(some people) 20 (you can solo and go past 20 and not need to find a group to get good exp) (most game once you hit here good exp become hard unless you find a group which I think is a great thing because, it is hard to find one, when you start so late into a game)

30-31 (get your first mount: and you think this is so much faster)
55 (can make a Death Knight)
58 or 60 (get faster mount or hit out world for the 1st time, new content you think…)
68 or 70 (get 1st flying mount and go to Northern)
78-80 (you get to fly your flying mount in Northern after 7 level of having a useless fly mount)
80 (max level to be more correct) (this one can go either way, the only way if would be fun is the following)
1) you have friends that play
2) you are in a good guild
3) your into arena
4) you like Battle grounds
5) you like the game and want to restart
If you don’t have any of the following at 80, well mostly you be doing what (maybe 50%) of all 80 do, log in to battle ground/level profession/someone to whisper or post LFX DPS/Healer/Tank for XXXX.

Well with that say I hate to lecture, but yea, I play WoW, and I love it (now anyways). My reason for playing is some of my friend play too (real life, not Avatar) When I started I played by myself and those were my peaks too, but I was at the bore side of max level and my guild I was in wasn’t going any where. So I quit, I hesitated when my friends decided to come back and play. Now that they play it is fun, there is always something to do in game, we still hang out, but on days like weekdays, we find the time after work to run one or to instances for gears. But this is just my opium on WoW.

[chronoic]

didn't mean to double post had internet problems

[SouLeSS]

I feel almost the opposite. I first played the trial and that inspired me to buy the full version. For me, playing the trial on the lower levels got me excited because this ginormous possibility for a great gaming experience was unfolding. Then, when I finally bought the full version I found it lacking a purpose. Other than leveling and buying new gear, I wasn't sure what I was supposed to be doing - what the ultimate goal was other than 'kill the bad guys.' It's still probably the best video gaming experience ther is but something is just 'off' for me.

That's how just baout every MMO is.

[Raiden]

I love WOW, but if you don't have the time to run instances and/or do BG and grind for great gears, then there is really no reason to play WOW (or any MMO, for that matter). Right now I play Xbox 360 and it feels better not having to feel the pressure to acquire elite gears, or get killed by someone who is epic'd out. I wish that I will be able to play WOW again, but I have a feeling that I will only get less and less playing time so the chance of that happening is slim.

[JRPJCDJC]

That's how just baout every MMO is.

Honestly - I started liking it less when I figured out how the chating feature worked. I enjoyed playing the game but the chat pretty much screwed that up.

[SouLeSS]

For those sick of WoW but want to play another MMO, I suggest Warhammer Online. The games very similar, but they take everything WoW does right, and takes it to the next level.

Except instances, theres only a few and most of them suck/not worth the time. But the PVP in it is phenominal, and the public quests are fun as all hell.

[Fading]

I think WoW has that same something that Everquest 1 had that made it like virtual crack. You can want to quit, but something always pulls you back. I decided to finally go cold turkey to quit. Everytime I quit before I ended up coming. This last time I gave it to a friends kid in the guild so I had no way to come back lol.

WoW had it's bright points, playing a rogue in that game is so much fun. However I find WoW to be THE worst MMO crowd. I mean I'm fine with 'adult talk', cussing, whatever. It's just the sheer lack of maturity on any level, disrespect, annoying spam, chuck norris jokes, annoying kid talk, and so on. Barren's chat on Horde side just became a jumble of random caps locked word's at times.

The Everquest crowd I liked when I played it awhile back. I just didn't like the lonely virtual dating crowd. I was 14 or so at the time and had 30+ year old women trying to cyber and virtual date me. I had a woman in our guild buy me a very expensive weapon the day after she broke up with her BF.

[Why Are You Crouching Spock?]

I feel almost the opposite. I first played the trial and that inspired me to buy the full version. For me, playing the trial on the lower levels got me excited because this ginormous possibility for a great gaming experience was unfolding. Then, when I finally bought the full version I found it lacking a purpose. Other than leveling and buying new gear, I wasn't sure what I was supposed to be doing - what the ultimate goal was other than 'kill the bad guys.' It's still probably the best video gaming experience ther is but something is just 'off' for me.

That's the thing I like about Guild Wars, Stripping away the monotony of grind, being free to play, using a limited card-like skill set rather than best gear and most experience along with getting right to the action with a party (or with NPC's) without faffing about, it has some single player style narrative with a beginging a middle an end.

It has it's problems the voice acting, story suck balls, pretty cliche stuff but it still feels like it has a point. All but one of the expansions could be bought seperatly as a stand alone product each with a begining a middle and an end without the need to own a prevous games and they weren't some crap tacked on either, there was alot of good content and updates. I wish more people would use the Guild Wars model than try to emulate world of warcraft.

[Ugfugly]

^Yea I agree. People will still be playing this game possibly 10-15 years from now.

People still pay to play Ultima Online, doesn't make it any relevant or good now, but your statement is most likely correct.

[Why Are You Crouching Spock?]

doesn't make it any relevant

It is, without it there probably wouldn't be a world of warcraft in the first place.

or good now

That's subjective.