View Full Version : Will Batman's cowl and costume remain the same?
Webhead38
07-16-2006, 10:32 PM
I always thought the treatment given to Batman's look in "Begins" was strictly a work in progress. Is Warner Bros. simply going to evolve him into the Michael Keaton look or is there a possibility for something closer to the Neal Adams' Batman? Blue and grey hues maybe? I think people would flip if Warner Bros finally got away from the concept look and actually gave the fans the classic comic book version. I think it would go over very well.
FaT_tONle
07-16-2006, 10:49 PM
The suit is fine... I hate the yellow in the middle.... just leave it as is...
The Fallen
07-16-2006, 11:18 PM
Leave the suit the way it is. I hate that the batsuit always has to change. The suit serves a purpose in the movie, to be intimitating and stelathy, and it works. What works in the comics can't always work in the movies, it can for some, but not all, and Batman is one of them.
The Fallen
07-17-2006, 12:00 AM
Just let him turn his neck in the Batsuit and it's perfect.
Well in the current suit he can, maybe not fully, but I doubt any suit they make will allow for full movement.
theShape
07-17-2006, 12:38 AM
a work in progress? that cowl was one of the best aspects of the new suit, along with the cape. it better be left alone.
My main problem with the suit was that it just didn't blend into the atmosphere of the movie as well as I would've liked it to. I know it was supposed to be a high-tech suit in the context of the movie, but try as I might, I couldn't see it as anything else than rubber. It kinda took me out of the movie. I don't care how they do it, but they need to do something to the suit to get rid of the blatant foam latex look. Give it a texture, paint it, whatever you have to.
This goes without saying, but improving flexibility and mobility is always important. This time around, I want them to try and minimize the amount of creasing the suit does. Perhaps applying the suit as pieces of prosthetics could help(?). Luckily it wasn't too noticable in the final product, but when you could see the creasing, it was kind of an eye sore (IMO).
The cowl needs serious work and redesigning. The thing is ****ing ugly. The huge jawbones, combined with the ears curving inward, make him look chunky and (to put it simply) stupid. If ANYTHING is to be changed on the suit, this is the priority. Change the ears, and reduce the size of the jawbones. And like with the suit, work on the flexibility of the cowl. I want to see Batman be able to turn his head, and by that I mean looking over his shoulder (at least).
As for the cape, lighten the color of it so it matches the suit. Also, get rid of the clasps and join the cape together at the collar bone.
Everything else is fine.
The bold is the only thing I agree with; I don't know about anyone else.
It's really up to Nolan in the end. Honestly, none of us know what Nolan's thoughts on the suit are at the point (if he has any at all).
For all we know, he could very well decide that he wants to tweak the design a bit. It's nothing unheard of.
I really do expect to see SOME alterations to the design. They're bound to happen. Even Spider-Man's suit from the first movie, which many thought was flawless, was tweaked for the sequel. A year after the first movie's release, I'm sure Nolan would have some changes that he feel would make for a better suit, even if they're small.
Some of you say the Begins suit is perfect, but I'm sure if Nolan did make changes, you'd be the saying the exact same thing about the new suit as well (this isn't meant as an attack).
I say the cowl needs to be slimmed down a bit looks too bulky and maybe have the cape modified so it can cover up he whole body.
Ratwing Returns
07-17-2006, 08:39 AM
I don't see how dislike for the original costume could take away from your viewing experience. I mean, with all the closeup shots, the dark suit itself...it was visibly difficult to see, so how would it take away from the film?
Payle Gray
07-17-2006, 08:51 AM
I will be very suprised if the suit isn't at least a little different. WB wants to sell NEW Batman merchandise.
DAVIDYR1
07-17-2006, 09:04 AM
The problem of Merchandising in the past is what was the heart of the demise of the original 4 films.
Hopefully, Batman Begins wont evolve that way with it's sequels..
Having said that...could some things change regardless?? Sure..why not?
First let me say I love the suit as is.
OK...look at it from this point of view...the Tumbler was filmed and shown on TV during the helicopter chase sequence. You dont think some ex Wayne Corp employee would recognize it?? That right there is reason enought to customize it a bit. I'm not saying cover it in little bats or give it neon lighting but some small tweaks.
The suit...well, when Fox pulls the suit out of the cabinet it's a huge dresser like storage unit with other doors also. What if there are other earlier prototype military suits in there? Again...why not?
I'm fine with them changing the suit and stuff...just follow the same logic as Begins and I'll be happy.
As for the whole creases and buckles in the suit...sorry..personally I dont buy it one bit. We saw all those creases in the photos released but in the film you have a hard enough time seeing the suits details because it's always just a big black shadow that actually making out any buckles is next to impossible. It's a movie..it's a costume...it's going to move, react, look, and feel like something man made no matter how close this is to a comic book movie you are not going to eliminate that aspect of the costume. Some call it a flaw...I say that is the highest and best technically advanced foam costume to date in Hollywood...beaten only by the Nomax suit which itself deserves and Oscar for it's technical achievement.
David
The suit...well, when Fox pulls the suit out of the cabinet it's a huge dresser like storage unit with other doors also. What if there are other earlier prototype military suits in there? Again...why not?
I thought of this as well, and it is a perfectly reasonable explanation for bringing in a new suit. One line of dialogue is all that is needed to explain this.
kame-sennin
07-17-2006, 12:35 PM
My main problem with the suit was that it just didn't blend into the atmosphere of the movie as well as I would've liked it to. I know it was supposed to be a high-tech suit in the context of the movie, but try as I might, I couldn't see it as anything else than rubber. It kinda took me out of the movie. I don't care how they do it, but they need to do something to the suit to get rid of the blatant foam latex look. Give it a texture, paint it, whatever you have to.
This goes without saying, but improving flexibility and mobility is always important. This time around, I want them to try and minimize the amount of creasing the suit does. Perhaps applying the suit as pieces of prosthetics could help(?). Luckily it wasn't too noticable in the final product, but when you could see the creasing, it was kind of an eye sore (IMO).
The cowl needs serious work and redesigning. The thing is ****ing ugly. The huge jawbones, combined with the ears curving inward, make him look chunky and (to put it simply) stupid. If ANYTHING is to be changed on the suit, this is the priority. Change the ears, and reduce the size of the jawbones. And like with the suit, work on the flexibility of the cowl. I want to see Batman be able to turn his head, and by that I mean looking over his shoulder (at least).
As for the cape, lighten the color of it so it matches the suit. Also, get rid of the clasps and join the cape together at the collar bone.
Everything else is fine.
I agree with everything except lightening the cape. I think the goal that you have could be reached by darknening the cowl instead. However I agree with you that the cape and cowl should be the same tone.
Some of you say the Begins suit is perfect, but I'm sure if Nolan did make changes, you'd be the saying the exact same thing about the new suit as well (this isn't meant as an attack).
QFT
JokerNick
07-17-2006, 12:41 PM
as long as there's bat nipples, I'm cool with it
kame-sennin
07-17-2006, 12:51 PM
Leave the suit the way it is. I hate that the batsuit always has to change. The suit serves a purpose in the movie, to be intimitating and stelathy, and it works. What works in the comics can't always work in the movies, it can for some, but not all, and Batman is one of them.
You really shouldn't make a statement like that considering that it hasn't ever been tried (no, DE doesn't count). No studio has ever poured thousands of dollars into making a faithful, aesthetically pleasing, *high quality* Batman costume. Until we see a multi-million dollar Batman film attempt such a feat, I feel it is unfair to say that it is impossible to pull off.
The suit is fine... I hate the yellow in the middle.... just leave it as is...
I think it was obvious in Batman Begins that his costume was some what of a "first draft". Whether you like the suit or not, it had a very unfinished look, which I believe was intentional. There will most likely be a new suit in the next film. That said, I don't think there should be a new costume in each film. It just needs to be updated and "finished" in the next film, and they can keep the costume the same from then on.
As for the whole creases and buckles in the suit... I say that is the highest and best technically advanced foam costume to date in Hollywood...beaten only by the Nomax suit which itself deserves and Oscar for it's technical achievement.
David
But why be limited to foam rubber in the first place?
DAVIDYR1
07-17-2006, 12:55 PM
But why be limited to foam rubber in the first place?
You certainly dont have to. No doubt about that. My point was simply that the buckling is not a 'movie' issue considering the suits is never really seen in action other than it seeming to be a black shadow. You see the cowl, cape and gauntlets a lot and can make out the details but hardly ever is the case with the suit itself.
Want to see it in another material?? I'm fine with that...:)
David
JokerNick
07-17-2006, 02:26 PM
okay, what do you guys think about nipples on the suit?
You're very persistent, aren't you?
Katsuro
07-17-2006, 02:27 PM
annoying is more like it.
y2jversion1
07-17-2006, 02:27 PM
If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
I hope they don't change anything about the suit (or anything else for that matter)
JokerNick
07-17-2006, 02:28 PM
You're very persistent, aren't you?
you sound like my Girl friend now. lol
whats the deal though, why do people not like the nipples.....
Batsuit nipples and Gredo shooting first are like the most hated things ever in the geek universe
If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
I hope they don't change anything about the suit (or anything else for that matter)
If it ain't broken, don't fix it...but a tune-up never hurts ;).
gillberg2k1
07-17-2006, 03:23 PM
It'll change. No doubt.
The goal with any sequel is to improve upon the solid foundations laid in the film before it. So, I'd expect they'll firstly improve things mechanically. I.E. Any problems they encountered on set will addressed first. For instance, if Nolan needed a shot of Batman turning his head and the Begins incarnation couldn't do this effectively enough for the shot, then that issue will be at the top of the list.
Now, in doing that, they'll obviously have to make some cosmetic updates as well, simply to keep the suit new and fresh. But obviously thats a secondary concern to performance.
Expect it to look very similar, but very new at the same time. Probably a bit sleeker, and not as rough around the edges. They'll also get to experiment with some technology that they wanted to use in the first one but didnt have time, so that's a factor as well.
StorminNorman
07-17-2006, 03:43 PM
If the Batsuit changes at all they will be rather small.
Octoberist
07-17-2006, 04:13 PM
I want the cowl to be less elongated. Sometimes it looks too tight on Bale (when Batman was explaing Ra's plan to Gordon).
Make the suit even more flexible and that's it.
lujho
07-17-2006, 04:48 PM
I'd like to see the head part of the cowl separated from the neck. Huge and instant increase of mobility - turning side-to side.
I'm in complete agreement with my associate, but being that the previous film was a "year one" of sorts, there is license there to do a new suit for that reason alone. And it stands to reason that it'd make the merchandising barrons happier than pigs in ****, if I may be so bold.
GoldGoblin
07-17-2006, 07:51 PM
The suit is fine... I hate the yellow in the middle.... just leave it as is...
^Agreed.
Octoberist
07-17-2006, 08:00 PM
even in the comics, the yellow took alot away from the costume.
I'm glad that it's gone now, in both the movie and comic worlds.
batman7289
07-17-2006, 08:21 PM
the new suit rocks,
but 89bm suit was kool to
ArmsHeldOut
07-17-2006, 08:47 PM
It'll change. No doubt.
The goal with any sequel is to improve upon the solid foundations laid in the film before it. So, I'd expect they'll firstly improve things mechanically. I.E. Any problems they encountered on set will addressed first. For instance, if Nolan needed a shot of Batman turning his head and the Begins incarnation couldn't do this effectively enough for the shot, then that issue will be at the top of the list.
Now, in doing that, they'll obviously have to make some cosmetic updates as well, simply to keep the suit new and fresh. But obviously thats a secondary concern to performance.
Expect it to look very similar, but very new at the same time. Probably a bit sleeker, and not as rough around the edges. They'll also get to experiment with some technology that they wanted to use in the first one but didnt have time, so that's a factor as well.
Listen to the man, for he is wise beyond all measure. :up:
The Last Meatbag
07-17-2006, 08:56 PM
I would like the cowl a bit more if it was thinner but the neck was more flexible...a couple slight changes would be nice to see, kinda like what they did with the suit from Spider-man 2.....
I would just be happy to see a little bit of change for the next movie :O
DA Harvey Dent
07-17-2006, 09:32 PM
Leave the suit as is. Having the cowl look chunky and slighlty distorted is a good thing b/c it hides his facial features. In Nolan's world of realism it makes sense that Wayne would not want to be identified so easily. In fact, this is the first batman where you can't tell instantly that he and bruce wayne are the same person. Plus the whole suit, shoulders, cowl make him look badass.
Style 92
07-19-2006, 06:15 PM
They should do either of the following, but not both.
Add the yellow oval around the Bat, so we can actually FREAKING SEE IT!
or
Make the inner part of his costume grey, like in the cartoons comics.
JBElliott
07-26-2006, 04:55 PM
Let's hope they change it into something that looks more like the Batman.
ChickenScratch
07-26-2006, 05:10 PM
Well in BB they made a point of mentioning how many parts they had to buy through dummy corps. so they will be unable to track them. I forgot who replied Alfred or Bruce but he said "Well at least we'll have spares" and it was to the tune of a couple thousand parts to assemble cowls.
So yeah, the suit might change but not the cowl.
BmAaTn3625
07-26-2006, 05:11 PM
Warners isn't going to sell the same toys a second time around. There will be "improvements" to the suit so the looks is improved and it makes the toy barrons happy. As long as the suit is made better I have no problems with it
A lot of these suggestions are excellent. I would concur that:
The ears need to be longer and straighter (more intimidating)
Jaws slimmed and mouth opening slightly bigger.
Change back of cowl (where ears meet head) to eliminate "egg-head" look.
Match colors better on cowl/suit/cape.
Reduce clasps from two to one.
Bat symbol of chest needs to have greater relief so we can actually SEE it!
(I favor the gold-ish background ala BF)
Head must turn! Head must turn!
Sleeker, more flexible suit with more of a molded musculature.
Ok....I'm done.....
BmAaTn3625
07-26-2006, 05:14 PM
not to mention I would like a night vision contact. In full light batman's eyes would look normal, but as light would lessen batman's eyes would begin to glow until they surrounding area is completely dark and batman's eyes would be a brilliant white, which would also enable him to be even more effective in low light conditions in which he thrives in.
JBElliott
07-26-2006, 06:27 PM
Well in BB they made a point of mentioning how many parts they had to buy through dummy corps. so they will be unable to track them. I forgot who replied Alfred or Bruce but he said "Well at least we'll have spares" and it was to the tune of a couple thousand parts to assemble cowls.
Wasn't that true only for the cowl. On the other hand, the complete body suit came right from Wayne Industries, which would be really easy to track down. So much for the secret identity. :D
The Batman
07-26-2006, 08:04 PM
Man, if hollywood listened to you "leave it the way it is" people, we'd have NOTHING new.
The suit has flaws that need to be changed. and i've no doubt they will be
I honestly don't understand the "Leave it as it is" nonsense. I suppose that means you're okay with them using an outdated suit? After all, the sequel is being filmed (almost) two years after the first. Of course there are going to be improved materials by that point. Hell, even the costume designer said there were better materials out there. They just weren't given enough time to find the right one, so they stuck with what they new would work (foam latex).
Gillberg explained it perfectly. I honestly couldn't put it in better words.
theShape
07-26-2006, 09:30 PM
I honestly don't understand the "Leave it as it is" nonsense. I suppose that means you're okay with them using an outdated suit? After all, the sequel is being filmed (almost) two years after the first. Of course there are going to be improved materials by that point. Hell, even the costume designer said there were better materials out there. They just weren't given enough time to find the right one, so they stuck with what they new would work (foam latex).
Gillberg explained it perfectly. I honestly couldn't put it in better words.
Well, I don't know what kind of changes you expect. If they make any, they'll be very small and barely noticeable, just to make the suit sleeker and easier to use.
It's not like they're going to do a complete overhaul of the suit from BB just to be "fresh". That's Batman's suit now. It won't change much, if at all.
BatMatt
07-26-2006, 09:40 PM
If they can find another material that's better that's fine but I would like the design to stay the same, especially the cowl
Well, I don't know what kind of changes you expect. If they make any, they'll be very small and barely noticeable, just to make the suit sleeker and easier to use.
It's a good thing you know this for sure :):up:.
jonpauluk
07-26-2006, 09:53 PM
The suit wasn't that great, it looked kinda chunky at times to me, either way I don't mind aslong as he sorts out his voice, doesn't sound right.
The Fallen
07-26-2006, 10:12 PM
I've said it befour and I'll say it again: Leave the damn suit alone. The design should stay the same, but some extra Batman made gadges would be nice. Now if they wish to use different materials, that's fine, as long as the look and design of the suit remains the same.
LastSunrise1981
07-26-2006, 10:33 PM
I thought the suit was pretty flexible compared to the past ones. Let's face it, not every suit will be as flexible as Spider-Mans.
But in all honesty Bale moved pretty damn good in it. I'm not an expert on costume design obviously, however, I'm quite happy with the suit that I saw on the big screen and was happy to see he didn't move like he was Frankenstein.
But seriously people, what more do you want? He turned his head/neck(slightly), moved fairly quick while fighting the ninjas, got up fairly easily after descending down the stairwell of Arkham, and so on and so forth.
theShape
07-26-2006, 10:34 PM
It's a good thing you know this for sure :):up:.
No need to have an attitude.
It's just illogical to make any radical changes to the suit for the sequel. This is Nolan's vision of Batman once again. I don't see what kind of radical changes he'd want to make after the look of Batman was established in BB.
Any changes would be subtle at best.
7Hells
07-27-2006, 12:53 AM
I'd like to see the cowl and the cape connect at the neck so the gathering looks thicker when he slings his cape over his shoulders. Its just so much more romanctic that way.
I'd also like it if (since they would need to add more material for the neck gathering) his cape had the ability to do the wrap around so he can be completely enveloped in it.
Those two things are just classic Batman to me.
Having said all that I doubt they will make any changes that are really noticeable except to us die hard fans.
FCEEVIPER
07-27-2006, 03:21 AM
The suit is fine... I hate the yellow in the middle.... just leave it as is...
I agree.
heypapajinx
07-27-2006, 04:01 AM
i absolutely loved the suit. i felt that it lent itself to the believeability of a billionare with endless funds and still kept the ninja undertones. fantastic. i hope they leave it alone.
Octoberist
07-27-2006, 04:33 AM
they should steamline the suit to make it more sleek.
I wouldn't mind a few changes to the suit. I think it would be cool if we got to see Bruce add a few modifications to the suit in the next film.
Ronny Shade
07-27-2006, 07:55 AM
Sigh. Another suit thread.
*pours whiskey*
casketmouth
07-27-2006, 10:48 AM
I always thought the treatment given to Batman's look in "Begins" was strictly a work in progress. Is Warner Bros. simply going to evolve him into the Michael Keaton look or is there a possibility for something closer to the Neal Adams' Batman? Blue and grey hues maybe? I think people would flip if Warner Bros finally got away from the concept look and actually gave the fans the classic comic book version. I think it would go over very well.
No he needs to stay black. Even the yellow symbol was a destraction on keaton's suit. He's stealthy. All that cool hue crap does nothing for his agenda. I want them to explain some more of the suit as he grows and becomes an even deadlier advasery. The explanations they had in the Special Features of the DVD but forgot that those were needed in the actual thing. Also his whole mask needs a makeover. You could tell the movement still isn't as fluent as need be. He still had strain on turning his neck and they really need to work on that. Everything else is dope. I like it.
JBElliott
07-27-2006, 02:53 PM
The suit should look the way it does in the comics.
Merge this thread with the other costume threads already going.
StorminNorman
07-27-2006, 03:25 PM
I agree.
Thats one sexy Avatar. :up:
Gabroni
07-29-2006, 09:40 AM
I honestly don't understand the "Leave it as it is" nonsense. I suppose that means you're okay with them using an outdated suit? After all, the sequel is being filmed (almost) two years after the first. Of course there are going to be improved materials by that point. Hell, even the costume designer said there were better materials out there. They just weren't given enough time to find the right one, so they stuck with what they new would work (foam latex).
Gillberg explained it perfectly. I honestly couldn't put it in better words.
Did the costume designer really say that? I didn't realize that they were rushed. Is that why the infamous 'Bat-turn' of the head was alive and well even after the costume designer told of how Nolan mandated that it be done away with?
For the sequel, they need to finally eradicate this no-turn-of-the-head problem, and realize that with Bale they finally have an actor with the physique and athletic ability to do justice to Batman. Take advantage of that to the fullest.
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