Favorite Peter/MJ moment?

[ragingdemon155]

These two have been through alot through out the history of Spider-man and are easily in my opinion the best couple in comics...or at least my favorite.

Anyway, just made a thread to see some of the fans of the Peter and MJ marriage post some of there favorite moments.

There are a ton but some of mine right off the bat...

- Peter's reaction after MJ tell's him she's pregnant. He was literally jumping off the wall.

-Spider-man #26 - story called "These Great Powers"....MJ tries to sneak up on Peter with the lights off to sock him in the head with a pillow. Spider-sense goes off and Peter dodges it. From there MJ and him discuss all of his powers in detail. Pretty cool moment.

-Kraven's Last Hunt - Peter and MJ were portrayed so perfectly in this story. Especially MJ. Love the moment when after returning of the "grave". Peter wearing his Spider-man costume looks back at a worried MJ...takes her hand and puts it to the side of his face before heading back out after Kraven.

[shinlyle]

I (heart) Marvel: Web of Romance.

This is easily one of the best Spider-comics in recetn memory. Spider-Man struggles and asks the advice of everyone from Griffin to Luke Cage about what kind of gift he should get MJ for Valentine's Day. The gift is incredibly cool, and, in true Spidey fashion, he and MJ play a prank on the HUman Torch, and then get busy on a neighboring high-rise! Giggity!

Amazing how well they read when they're handled as a young married couple.

Amazing Spider-Man (vol.2) #50
Despite my distaste for anything JMS seems to do, there was a time when he wrote the marriage quite well. This issue is his crowning achievement in that realm. This is the issue where Peter and MJ finally reconcile, and MJ gets to see just HOW MUCH she means to Peter, and we see that these two really are meant to be together forever.

Spider-man: Blue #6
This storyline is more or less about Peter & Gwen, but, in the end, MJ catches Peter "talking to" Gwen, and, instead of going crazy, she simply smiles at her husband, and tells Peter to tell Gwen that she says "hi". This is a rare case of MJ being written as very understanding...something we need much more of in the current books.

[ragingdemon155]

I (heart) Marvel: Web of Romance.

This is easily one of the best Spider-comics in recetn memory. Spider-Man struggles and asks the advice of everyone from Griffin to Luke Cage about what kind of gift he should get MJ for Valentine's Day. The gift is incredibly cool, and, in true Spidey fashion, he and MJ play a prank on the HUman Torch, and then get busy on a neighboring high-rise! Giggity!

Amazing how well they read when they're handled as a young married couple.

Amazing Spider-Man (vol.2) #50
Despite my distaste for anything JMS seems to do, there was a time when he wrote the marriage quite well. This issue is his crowning achievement in that realm. This is the issue where Peter and MJ finally reconcile, and MJ gets to see just HOW MUCH she means to Peter, and we see that these two really are meant to be together forever.

Spider-man: Blue #6
This storyline is more or less about Peter & Gwen, but, in the end, MJ catches Peter "talking to" Gwen, and, instead of going crazy, she simply smiles at her husband, and tells Peter to tell Gwen that she says "hi". This is a rare case of MJ being written as very understanding...something we need much more of in the current books.

Forgot about that Web of Romance issue. Beautiful issue.

[Miss Webb]

:) One of my favorites was an old issue where Pete was moving out of his apartment and MJ threw him a party. It was pretty funny, the music was so loud everyone was shouting and giving wrong answers. And a pair of his nosy neighbors that liked to sunbathe came down, too. I think one of them was Mandy or something, and they liked Peter and would knock on his door. A lot of times he couldn't get in through the skylight fearing they would see him. I'm not sure of the issue, its pretty old and I'd have to dig through my collection. Pete was worried about the noise but MJ told him to loosen up since it was his last day. Basically she said "what are they gonna do, throw you out?" So he enjoyed himself after that. Really cute story. :)

[gliderpilotgirl]

ah yes..that web of romance was awesomeness..

[MaraJanesSlave]

I can't remember the stand-alone ish, but it took place when Pete & MJ were living in the building that Harry and Liz owned, just before Harry died (and Liz kicked them out).

Pete goes out to fight Mysterio and during the fight he sees a woman that he thinks is MJ fall from a building. He rushes to save her, saying something like, "it's okay, honey, I've got you." But then he realizes it isn't really her and snaps out of Mysterio's illusion. When he gets home that night, he kneels by the bed where MJ is sleeping and kisses her. She awakens and asks, What was that for?" And Pete replies, "for being the woman of my dreams and for being real."

Awww... I just melted. :)

~Mara Jane

[ragingdemon155]

I can't remember the stand-alone ish, but it took place when Pete & MJ were living in the building that Harry and Liz owned, just before Harry died (and Liz kicked them out).

Pete goes out to fight Mysterio and during the fight he sees a woman that he thinks is MJ fall from a building. He rushes to save her, saying something like, "it's okay, honey, I've got you." But then he realizes it isn't really her and snaps out of Mysterio's illusion. When he gets home that night, he kneels by the bed where MJ is sleeping and kisses her. She awakens and asks, What was that for?" And Pete replies, "for being the woman of my dreams and for being real."

Awww... I just melted. :)

~Mara Jane

Damn, try and remember the issue.lol.

I want it!

[Cullen]

I'm torn between when she left for Florida the first time (or whereever, I misremember) or when went to L.A.. Good times. Good times. Too bad they didn't last.

...

...

What? :D

A bit less jerky, there was one issue, where Peter is describing his night as Spider-man to her, where he casually mentions various threats to his life and limbs and she drops a dish each time. That was a nice scene.

Beyond that... Nothing springs to mind, though I am interested in hearing other favs.

[Silver Sable]

When Peter first meets MJ and she saids:

"Face it tiger, you just hit the jackpot!"

[Captivated]

GREAT idea for a thread!

Hummm... there are several things that come to mind.

I really liked Amazing Spider-Man #49 - #53 (Vol.2) where Peter and MJ decide to reconcile. (JMS does a good job with their relationship.)

In #53, Peter was laying on his sofa, his head in Mary Jane's lap, discussing his latest "case" with her. After awhile Peter suggested it was getting late and that he should get her back to her hotel. Mary Jane insisted on staying, rejecting Peter's concern that he was distracted by the case and tired and that he wanted the first night they spent together after their reconciliation to be just right. Mary Jane told Peter why she came back: PETER PARKER (SPIDER-MAN): I should get you back to the hotel before it's too--

MARY JANE: No.

PETER PARKER: No?

MARY JANE: Not tonight. . . I think it's time, don't you?

PETER PARKER: It's just . . . I want it to be right, MJ. No distractions, not when I'm tired, or chasing a case or--

MARY JANE: And will there ever be a day when that happens? I came back for you, Peter. I love you. For everything you are, for everything you think you're not. Distracted or not, tired or not, you're my lover. My husband. And the dearest thing in the world to me. . . Let me prove it.

[Mary Jane then kisses Peter, and he acquiesces to her intentions. Even JRjr's cartoony art conveyed the passion that intensifies. Later, after some off-panel "husband and wife" activities, Peter lies awake and thinks about how blessed he is to have Mary Jane in his life. He explicitly thanks God for his wife.]



http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/SpiderMan_ThankYouForMJ.jpg



PETER PARKER (thinking): I can bench press a car. I can climb up the side of a wall. Fight twenty guys to a standstill. Swing across chasms thirty stories deep. Feel a bullet coming my way and move fast enough to get clear. But something in her makes me gentle. Makes me shy. Makes me strong. Makes me happy to be alive. And maybe that's it. Maybe that's what it really comes down to. She makes me. Makes me whole . . . She completes me . . .

So here's the thing, God . . . I know I complain a lot, and I know that you and me, we've got issues, but right now, just for tonight . . . Thank you for her. Thank you.

Even though that "she completes me" line is way cliche after Jerry Maguire, it was overall good stuff. :)

[ragingdemon155]

You know, for all of JMS's faults and mistakes he's made as the writer of ASM...he writes the marriage better then most writers ever have. He really handles the relationship between Peter and MJ extremely well. Through out his run there have been several great moments dealing with the marriage.

[Captivated]

Spider-man: Blue #6
This storyline is more or less about Peter & Gwen, but, in the end, MJ catches Peter "talking to" Gwen, and, instead of going crazy, she simply smiles at her husband, and tells Peter to tell Gwen that she says "hi". This is a rare case of MJ being written as very understanding...something we need much more of in the current books. While I wasn't particularly thrilled with a few aspects of this story... for one, it's implied that Peter is depressed over Gwen EVERY Valentine's Day... THAT was a good scene. I happen have a pic of it:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/SpiderMan_Blue.jpg

PETER PARKER: For years I've tried to make some sense of your death. Something -- anything -- that I could call "good" that came after all that . . . bad . . . And all the time I've been sitting up here talking to you, I remembered something I don't think I've told anyone.

The night of your funeral. MJ came to see me at the apartment. I was . . . putting it mildly . . . rude to her. I just wasn't up for that "Life is a party and MJ is the cake" thing. But, something happened that night. I think now your death was MJ's wake-up call -- that we weren't going to live forever and the party was going to end. Gwen, I don't think Mary Jane Watson could've had a serious relationship with me until she realized how much we all lost with you gone. She would later become my wife. I had to learn to love again, and she taught me how--

MARY JANE WATSON: Peter...?

[Peter looks up and sees his wife, Mary Jane Watson, standing at the top of the stairs.]

MARY JANE WATSON: Hi.

PETER PARKER: MJ...? How... How long have you been listening...?

MARY JANE WATSON: Long enough.

PETER PARKER: I... I'm sorry, MJ. I didn't mean for you to hear...

MARY JANE WATSON: It's all right. I just came up to make sure you were okay.

PETER PARKER: Yeah. I'm okay...

MARY JANE WATSON: Will you do me a favor, Peter? Say "Hello" for me and -- tell Gwen I miss her too...

[ragingdemon155]

Amazing Spider-man #521 - While watching MJ's play Peter goes on to say

"When you live with someone day after day, it's easy to forget sometimes who they really are, and what they can do. Then when you see it, when you're remembered just what they can do....it's a revelation. People see me swinging around skyscrapers and they think I'm pretty special. But it's not me. It's her. It's always been her. And at the after-party, every eye is on her....and I know that I'm the luckiest guy on the face of the planet."

Beautiful piece of writing from JMS.

[stillanerd]

When Peter first meets MJ and she saids:

"Face it tiger, you just hit the jackpot!"

Agreed. Let's relive that classic moment, shall we?

http://pc59te.dte.uma.es/cdb/series/marvel/bitmaps/mj.jpg

However, I am shocked, shocked that no one, NO ONE has mentioned this yet as a possible great Peter/MJ moment:

http://www.spidervillain.com/SpiderManCovers/Amazing/ASM148/Page2.jpg

Shame, shame, shame on you all....:D

[Joker]

I was looking for the picture of Spider-Man punching her in the face from the clone saga, but couldnt find it :(

[Kevin]

When Peter first meets MJ and she saids:

"Face it tiger, you just hit the jackpot!"

yes that is one of my favorite mj moments, but the moment, their moment, when we know they're right for each other, let me try to remember it right

i think peter was feeling sick or whatnot. puma was in the story and he tracked peter as spider-man so he starts crashing peters house. mj's outside trying to get in.. she trys busting through the door. she doesn't care what happenes to her, she's only caring about peter's well being. she finally burst through the door but peter isn't there. when he comes back, she reveals that she knows he's spider-man. that she's always known. that's the mj i love.

[stillanerd]

Here's another good one which really says a lot about Mary Jane's character:

http://www.spidervillain.com/SpiderManCovers/Amazing/ASM122/Page4.jpg

And what about this? Surely, we Peter/MJ shippers have to include this:

http://www.thecomicshop.com.au/covers/comics/a/amazingspiderman-annual-21-marvel-nm-peter.jpg

Also, here's one for those who are wondering who the first Spider-Girl was. :D

http://www.pastandpresentcomics.com/store/images/product/small/000809.jpg

[Cullen]

http://www.spidervillain.com/SpiderManCovers/Amazing/ASM148/Page2.jpg

And thus a new wallpaper for my desktop is born.

Where's this from, anyway?

[Kevin]

Here's another good one which really says a lot about Mary Jane's character:

http://www.spidervillain.com/SpiderManCovers/Amazing/ASM122/Page4.jpg
you go mj!

[stillanerd]

And thus a new wallpaper for my desktop is born.

Where's this from, anyway?

Amazing Spider-Man #148, by Gerry Conway, which was part of the first clone saga that involved the first appearance of the Gwen Stacy clone. BTW, Peter, once he realized that he essentially slammed the door in MJ's face--being distracted by thoughts of Gwen--ended up feeling like a total dope.

EDIT: Of course, they..ahem..."reconciled" an issue later:

http://www.spidervillain.com/SpiderManCovers/Amazing/ASM149/Page3.jpg

Yes, folks. This is when comics were a little more discreet about Peter getting some "Spidey action." :D

[Kevin]

yeah, sometimes peter can be a jackhole, but it's mostly not his fault... there are some times when i hate him

[ragingdemon155]

Amazing Spider-Man #148, by Gerry Conway, which was part of the first clone saga that involved the first appearance of the Gwen Stacy clone. BTW, Peter, once he realized that he essentially slammed the door in MJ's face--being distracted by thoughts of Gwen--ended up feeling like a total dope.

EDIT: Of course, they..ahem..."reconciled" an issue later:

http://www.spidervillain.com/SpiderManCovers/Amazing/ASM149/Page3.jpg

Yes, folks. This is when comics were a little more discreet about Peter getting some "Spidey action." :D

Heh lol.

Great moment :up:

[ragingdemon155]

Here's another good one which really says a lot about Mary Jane's character:

http://www.spidervillain.com/SpiderManCovers/Amazing/ASM122/Page4.jpg


This is "the" moment for MJ in my opinion.

[Cullen]

Amazing Spider-Man #148, by Gerry Conway, which was part of the first clone saga that involved the first appearance of the Gwen Stacy clone. BTW, Peter, once he realized that he essentially slammed the door in MJ's face--being distracted by thoughts of Gwen--ended up feeling like a total dope.

EDIT: Of course, they..ahem..."reconciled" an issue later:

http://www.spidervillain.com/SpiderManCovers/Amazing/ASM149/Page3.jpg

Yes, folks. This is when comics were a little more discreet about Peter getting some "Spidey action." :DOh well, the bad must come with the good... :)

Thanks for the info.

[stillanerd]

^^^^
No problemo.

EDIT: BTW, you might want to avert your eyes (or get a bucket ready) as I post this moment from ASM #143:

http://www.spideykicksbutt.com/WhyYouMaryJane/WhyYouMaryJanePart2E.jpg
http://www.spideykicksbutt.com/WhyYouMaryJane/WhyYouMaryJanePart2F.jpg

[Citizen_Kaine]

I was never much of an MJ fan, however the moment when she tells he's pregnant ranks high on my list, as well as her staying behind to console him after he basically tells her that she wouldn't be sad if her own mother died(Something that actually did happen, and something that nearly tore MJ apart). I love the moment in paralell lives when we actually learn that MJ knew his secret identity the whole time, as well as Untold Tales 16 which is basically a sequel to it.

Ultimate MJ is great however, mainly due to Bendis' teenage angst dialouge. Popular moments here include Peter telling her flat our his secret in USM 13, and the two of them reconcilling in USM 42

[MyPokerShirt]

im glad to say i have the identity reveal, the acceptance and the marriage in my collection:
ASM 257 292 ANNUAL 21
As much as i have reprints/original issues of later events, these will always be 3 of my favourites as theyre 3 of the classics. no matter what anyone can do to MJ/Pete these issues will/should stay important to any spider-man fan. nuff sed

PS revelations was good, but horrible MJ/pete moments (poor baby may), so the least sed about that the better!

[Spydernorbs]

there are tons and I did like Web of Romance, but I thought this was cute...a scene where Peter is having a bad dream and wakes up screaming, MJ asks if everything is okay, he assures her it is, says he'll watch a movie, or eat something then she just says

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v43/spydernorbs/3707.jpg

Perfect wife! Go MJ!

From: Batman/Spider-Man #1

[MyPokerShirt]

gotta love the overly buff pete and early 90s hairdo MJ
gawwwd wat were they thinkin?!

[The Caped Knight]

I love The wedding & The honeymoon issue .

[freemadison]

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y132/theothernersi/ImWithSpidey2.jpg

Spwat?

[JLBats]

Here's another good one which really says a lot about Mary Jane's character:

http://www.spidervillain.com/SpiderManCovers/Amazing/ASM122/Page4.jpg



That might be my favourite Spider-Man moment ever. Although I think it's power is lost on some people, for some reason.

[Kevin]

i miss peter's hair...

[The Caped Knight]

I love this moment too .

from Amazing Spider-Man 253

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v623/askmegrimlock/amazingspider-manv253pharo07.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v623/askmegrimlock/amazingspider-manv253pharo08.jpg

[Kevin]

Go, Peter, Gonna Hit That. Go, Peter, Gonna Hit That.

[The Caped Knight]

these are funny Peter & MJ moments .
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/dasbooch/Valentine-1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/dasbooch/Valentine-2.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/dasbooch/Valentine-3.jpg

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b120/chdb4/Page07.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v26/liviapenn/suchaboy.jpg

[The Caped Knight]

http://www.spyder-25.com/PICTURES/maryjane/mj_017.jpg
http://www.spyder-25.com/PICTURES/maryjane/mj_018.jpg

[Dragon]

I love this moment too .

from Amazing Spider-Man 253

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v623/askmegrimlock/amazingspider-manv253pharo07.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v623/askmegrimlock/amazingspider-manv253pharo08.jpg

This is the kind of trite BS that makes me want to barf. Conway's stuff was much better.

[Scar Predator]

I'm drawing a blank on what issue contains this moment but I remember Peter taking some shots of MJ for a fashion mag but getting depressed in the middle of it and quitting. To make him feel better, MJ drops her outfit on the floor ( you just see her lower legs and the outfit dropping ) and tells him to take some pics for their "personal collection". Then, the description says "slowly Peter's spirits begin to rise.":eek: :)

[The Caped Knight]

I'm drawing a blank on what issue contains this moment but I remember Peter taking some shots of MJ for a fashion mag but getting depressed in the middle of it and quitting. To make him feel better, MJ drops her outfit on the floor ( you just see her lower legs and the outfit dropping ) and tells him to take some pics for their "personal collection". Then, the description says "slowly Peter's spirits begin to rise.":eek: :)

http://img121.imageshack.us/img121/6966/spirits5hl.jpg

[spideylover89]

Most of the best ones have already been posted. :O

The scene after Gwen's death where MJ stays behind with Pete is the Peter/MJ moment, a true classic. :up:

I'm not good at specific issue numbers, but there was one issue where Pete wanted to spice things up for him and MJ so he dressed himself up as a "waiter" (can anyone say chipendales :p) but when MJ walked in she had a friend with her. Pete, as embarassed as he could get, hauled ass into the bedroom and locked the door. :D

The moment when MJ tells Pete she's pregnant is also one of my favorites.

[Scar Predator]

http://img121.imageshack.us/img121/6966/spirits5hl.jpg

THAT'S THE ONE! THANKS, KAL-EL!

[DACrowe]

My top ones are the last two pages of ASM #122, MJ in ASM #257(?) where she basically refuses to be shewed and realizes that he really is Spider-Man, the entire wedding issue (how often are they that well written?) a moment, one of the stories where they got oFlordia and are on vacation/fighting the Lizard and she SAVES him, that was just a very playful story, their entire creconciliation that JMS wrote (after Mackie ****ING BUTCHERED HER CHARACTER.....much like Marvel is doing to them again....) and a few others I can't pinpoint scattered throughout the early and mid-90s.

I also liked how she just can be his rock like in Hobgoblin lives and there moment together in the last page of PPSM #75 when they realize baby May is dead but with few words are ready to survive it goether in tight form. Damn't Mackie almost ruined that though.

[DACrowe]

Oh as much as I hate Sins Past, I ithought just as the first issue offered some good moments for Gwen's relationship with Pete (possibly the only ones in this lousy story) where he sneaks off to visit her grave at night and is guilty about it (and mentions how he ahs so many friends here he can find his way in the dark to their spots) is i nthe last issue how she is there for Peter even at his weakest and giving him strength.

Still a bad story though.

On a weaker moment I like how in the Lifethreat story she is basically almost assassinated at a soap show selling spot in for her career and goes insane and when she comes home to get comforted Pete due to being aged 70 years by the Vulture can't comfort her but leaves her in distress and lonely brooding. I thought this was a really nice moment for the strain of marriage and I hope there is a scene like this (sans the Pete being a 70 year old +) in SM3.

Also, I don't have the issue where she reveals she's pregnant, could someone please post it? I do have the one where she names the baby May which is a nice moment though.

[spideylover89]

She reveals the pregnancy in Spectacular Spider-man #220 at the very end and the story continues in ASM #398. I can't post the whole issue, but here are the last few pages of spectacular and the first few pages of amazing.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/spideylover89/1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/spideylover89/2.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/spideylover89/3.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/spideylover89/4.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/spideylover89/5.jpg

It's really too bad that didn't last...Pete was so happy. :(

[spideylover89]

-Kraven's Last Hunt - Peter and MJ were portrayed so perfectly in this story. Especially MJ. Love the moment when after returning of the "grave". Peter wearing his Spider-man costume looks back at a worried MJ...takes her hand and puts it to the side of his face before heading back out after Kraven.

:D :up: :up:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/spideylover89/WebOfSpiderman032-18.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/spideylover89/WebOfSpiderman032-20.jpg

[spideylover89]

I'm not good at specific issue numbers, but there was one issue where Pete wanted to spice things up for him and MJ so he dressed himself up as a "waiter" (can anyone say chipendales :p) but when MJ walked in she had a friend with her. Pete, as embarassed as he could get, hauled ass into the bedroom and locked the door. :D


I found the issue I was talking about. ASM #298:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/spideylover89/7.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/spideylover89/8.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/spideylover89/9.jpg

[Kevin]

I found the issue I was talking about. ASM #298:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/spideylover89/7.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/spideylover89/8.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/spideylover89/9.jpg love that issue, is that larsen or mcfarlen(Sp)?

[The Caped Knight]

I found the issue I was talking about. ASM #298:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/spideylover89/7.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/spideylover89/8.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/spideylover89/9.jpg

That's funny .

[The Caped Knight]

http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0510/18/friendly4.jpg
http://www.kaareandrews.com/img/bigkiss.jpg

[Captivated]

I love this moment too .

from Amazing Spider-Man 253

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v623/askmegrimlock/amazingspider-manv253pharo07.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v623/askmegrimlock/amazingspider-manv253pharo08.jpg
Thanks for posting all these great pics Kal-El 8! I LOVED this issue... I was so glad to see they were back together, and JMS did it so well. :)

[The Caped Knight]

http://www.cheap-software-megastore.com/Desc/2669/1.jpg
http://www.newsarama.com/Marvel/amazing500.jpg
http://spider-man.info/AmazingSpider-ManT/Large/AmazingSpider-Man495.jpg
http://www.samruby.com/AmazingSpider-ManT/Large/AmazingSpider-Man493.jpg
http://www.samruby.com/AmazingSpider-ManT/Large/AmazingSpider-Man492.jpg

[MaskedManJRK]

:D :up: :up:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/spideylover89/WebOfSpiderman032-18.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/spideylover89/WebOfSpiderman032-20.jpg

When is Kraven's Last Hunt being put in that special TPB again? Now I REALLY want to read that sucker. :up:

[Captivated]

these are funny Peter & MJ moments .
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/dasbooch/Valentine-1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/dasbooch/Valentine-2.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/dasbooch/Valentine-3.jpg


What was this from?

[JLBats]

This is the kind of trite BS that makes me want to barf. Conway's stuff was much better.

lol, I wish Spider-Man had decided to beat the **** out of her instead.

If there had been thought balloons instead of boxes, I can basically see Stan Lee writing something very similar to that.

[spideylover89]

love that issue, is that larsen or mcfarlen(Sp)?


It was McFarlane, his style seemed so different from the torment days. It's amazing how different his people can look when he ditches the big hair. :D

[Captivated]

This is the kind of trite BS that makes me want to barf. Conway's stuff was much better.

lol, I wish Spider-Man had decided to beat the **** out of her instead.

One man's trite BS is another man's TREASURE...

But, geeze... I'm surprized at you two. :( Posting comments like that in a thread titled "Favorite Peter/MJ moment" kinda makes you a troll by definition... aren't you usually above that sort of thing?

Troll - From the fishing term. As a noun, synonymous with flamebait. As a verb, to post controversial or provocative messages in a deliberate attempt to provoke flames.

[spideylover89]

When is Kraven's Last Hunt being put in that special TPB again? Now I REALLY want to read that sucker. :up:

Yeah it's being put together into a hardcover TPB. :up:
Donald Thomas also has Last Hunt up on his website (the coolest site in the world) if you want to read it, but I still suggest getting the TPB if you enjoy it.
http://www.donaldspidermanthomas.com/html/

[MyPokerShirt]

I love this moment too .

from Amazing Spider-Man 253

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v623/askmegrimlock/amazingspider-manv253pharo07.jpg


AMS 253? that long ago? its not... is it?

[spideylover89]

feels like it :(

[DACrowe]

Could someone please post the pregnancy page(s) reveal?

[DACrowe]

No it is in the 490s I believe during the mob story and is their long awaited reconciliation sub plot too.

[MyPokerShirt]

thanx. the colours are very modern and they seem to be patching it up, but i didnt see this. i like :)

[spideylover89]

Could someone please post the pregnancy page(s) reveal?

Check page 2, I already posted them ;)

[Captivated]

Here is the wedding from Parallel Lives. I really like the art.... very JRSr-ish.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/ParaLives_MJ_IDo.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/ParaLives_Peter_IDo.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/ParaLives_Married.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/ParaLives_Wedding.jpg



Later... after a Spider-Slayer had threatened Aunt May and MJ... Peter feels like he can't be close to anyone without putting them in danger, and it just won't work... MJ gives him some perspective.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/ParaLives_Backyard1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/ParaLives_Backyard2.jpg

[Captivated]

Soon after Peter and Mary Jane got back together, he was up early, had made a breakfast of soggy, microwaved waffles, and was going on and on about his latest "case" while MJ struggled to stay awake. It was way too early for her, but it was cute to see her try to be there for him... and to see he appreciated it.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/Soggywaffles1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/Soggywaffles2.jpg

[Thirteen Shadows]

I love this moment too .

from Amazing Spider-Man 253

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v623/askmegrimlock/amazingspider-manv253pharo07.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v623/askmegrimlock/amazingspider-manv253pharo08.jpg

Can someone post the cover to this issue please :O

[Captivated]

From the Hydra arc... there are several good moments... here are a couple.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/NA_Babe.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/NA_MJ_Play.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/NA_MJ_Yahoo.jpg

[MaraJanesSlave]

AMS 253? that long ago? its not... is it?

It's Amazing vol. 2, issue 53, not Amazing 253. :)

Oh, and I think the issue that I mentioned before with the Mysterio story is Web of Spider-Man #90. It's the one with the red foil and 3-D image on the cover.

~Mara Jane

[Captivated]

I won't mention the arc... but this is one of my favorite pictures.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/PeterMJ_ohGod.jpg


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/Bigfeet-whoopsie.jpg

PETER: Something wrong?

MJ: Just keeping an eye out. One of the nurses tried to slip in here with a camera about an hour ago. She was going straight for your mask.

PETER: Where is she now?

MJ: In recovery. Big feet. Food cart. Clumsy me. Oopsie.

PETER: I love you.

MJ: You better.

[Kevin]

It was McFarlane, his style seemed so different from the torment days. It's amazing how different his people can look when he ditches the big hair. :D
Thank you very much. Mcfarlane, Larsen, and Bagley are my favorite spidey-artists ever! :up: i can't choose who's my favorite... ok, it's Mcfarlane, but Erik is a Mili-Inch after. I feel that after 300, Todd's art became his own style and got much better. I LOVE THE 80s AND 90s! WOoOoO!!!

[The Caped Knight]

http://www.spyder-25.com/PICTURES/maryjane/mj_005.jpg

[Citizen_Kaine]

http://pics.livejournal.com/rabican/pic/000f83sa

[gliderpilotgirl]

wow..such awesome panels..thanks for putting em up..I wish the current writers would do some homework, they'd clearly see that the spider marriage works beautifully.

[DACrowe]

I liked McFarlen during his first 20 issues or so. Then he went insane. And as I said I think his run on Spider-Man (as writer/artist) was bull**** with choppy and mediocre exaggerated art and down right horrendous exploitation writing.

I really like Bagely on his Amazing run but for some reason my favorite goes back to the Romitas, Sr. for classic and Jr. for modern.

Anyway, what was that wedding issue about because I have the wedding issue and it is a bit different, what is "Parallel Lives?"

Also, I really wish they were allowed to have a kid again. I mean after losing Baby May it was a great tragedy in Peter's life for three years and then they never mentioned baby May again. Stan Lee wrote the character to grow up. He graduated from high school, he went to college, grad school, dropped out, has a real job, gotten married after a multitude of love interests and heartache. The next step is to start a family. That ais how you break the status quo.

Sure it ages him (mind you he is about 30 now if not a little bit older) and he needs to grow up some anyway. I just think he should have some kids. It would offer new drama in his life which is what makes the comic books work for decades as the kid(s) can grow about a year every 5-10. Sure maybe in 30 years she might get too old but hey then they can move maybe forward and perhaps introduce Ultimate as the main line (though I would hate that).

I just think they should have a kid again now.

[Grim Goblin]

there was this one scene from the issue where they announce their engagement to aunt May and Anna.

MJ is cooking and Peter hangs upside down from the ceiling (out of costume), kneels down and shows her the ring. Mj just laughs it up and plays with his hair while saying something about having to clean up his footprints from the ceiling afterwards.

can't remeber the issue number but I thought it was a cute, relatable moment between the two.

[The Caped Knight]

http://images.comicbookresources.com/solicits/marvel072005/big/SPIDUNL010.jpg
SPIDER-MAN UNLIMITED #10

[JLBats]

One man's trite BS is another man's TREASURE...

But, geeze... I'm surprized at you two. :( Posting comments like that in a thread titled "Favorite Peter/MJ moment" kinda makes you a troll by definition... aren't you usually above that sort of thing?

Troll - From the fishing term. As a noun, synonymous with flamebait. As a verb, to post controversial or provocative messages in a deliberate attempt to provoke flames.




Pssst, I was being sarcastic. I love that moment.

[MaraJanesSlave]

there was this one scene from the issue where they announce their engagement to aunt May and Anna.

MJ is cooking and Peter hangs upside down from the ceiling (out of costume), kneels down and shows her the ring. Mj just laughs it up and plays with his hair while saying something about having to clean up his footprints from the ceiling afterwards.

can't remeber the issue number but I thought it was a cute, relatable moment between the two.

That's the wedding issue, ASM Annual #21. :)

Oh, and I don't know if this counts, but I remember the Pete/MJ wedding that Stan wrote in the daily newspaper comic strip. Pete and MJ rode to their wedding on Pete's motorcycle, he in his tux, and she in her dress. People in the streets cheered them on. It was very cute; kind of a love letter to New York, IMO.
~Mara Jane

[MaskedManJRK]

Yeah it's being put together into a hardcover TPB. :up:
Donald Thomas also has Last Hunt up on his website (the coolest site in the world) if you want to read it, but I still suggest getting the TPB if you enjoy it.
http://www.donaldspidermanthomas.com/html/

Sweet. :up:

Do you know when it's coming on and will it be at a reasonable price?

[Citizen_Kaine]

Sweet. :up:

Do you know when it's coming on and will it be at a reasonable price?

It's coming out August 23rd in hardcover format, and set at 19.99 US.

[MaskedManJRK]

It's coming out August 23rd in hardcover format, and set at 19.99 US.

Cool--I'll definately buy it...I just hope I have the ability to have money by myself by then. :o :)

[TheVileOne]

My favorite scene hasn't happened yet. It will be when Peter and Mary Jane go to that freaking bridge and Peter spits on it.

Peter says it will be the last time he ever goes there and he doesn't care about Gwen anymore because she was a **** and didn't deserve his love. And that Mary Jane is his one true love and he never loved Gwen more than her.

And Gwen Stacy will never be seen or mentioned again in comic history. Any Gwen lookalikes will be shot on sight.

[Scar Predator]

That's funny .

That's why I love Spidey. What other hero would go "EEP!" ?

[Dragon]

One man's trite BS is another man's TREASURE...

But, geeze... I'm surprized at you two. :( Posting comments like that in a thread titled "Favorite Peter/MJ moment" kinda makes you a troll by definition... aren't you usually above that sort of thing?


I'm sorry you feel that way, Cap. But if that's treasure- then it should indeed be buried. It also bothers me that based on your knowledge of me, you'd take my comments as mere attempts to provoke anyone.

I'm not knocking writing two people in love. But the truth of the matter is that JMS wrote that same dialogue for those two in pretty much every issue. This is what's brought the relationship down to where the writers find them boring to write. They never dealt with them as two unique individuals in a relationship with numerous stress factors, who still manage to keep things together. Every storyline with them comes down to them saying in voice or caption- "I love the way she.." "I love the way he..." That's not progression.

Just prior to MJ's return she and Peter brought up some serious relationship issues which were never dealt with. That cop-out in ASM #50 about her needing to hear he needed her was silly and said how little real regard there was for MJ to be anything more than window dressing.

[TheVileOne]

I will say, the quoted Stracynski ones are pretty good.

So it continually mystifies me how from that, the guy could've actually written Sins Past. I mean what f'n absolute garbage.

I think I could read a Spider-man comic with nothing but Peter and MJ-ness. That's right. No action. No villains. Just Peter and Mary Jane being together and loving each other. Why? Because I like it.

[ragingdemon155]

JMS for all his faults...has written the marriage better then most writers ever have. You could probably argue that he's written Peter and MJ together the best.

[TheVileOne]

Eh, I think Parallel Lives nailed it more than any other. That's the definitive Peter/MJ story to me.

And as good as Stracynski does Peter/MJ at times, other times he totally ****s it up.

I will say, one Peter/Mary Jane moment I liked in Peter Jenkins' run on Spectacular was when Peter's shoulder was dislocated by Doc Ock and Mary Jane had to give him some emergency medical treatment and pop it back into place. MJ watching TLC for tips for her husband is pretty funny/cool to me. Jenkins did make it kind of funny/sweet as well.

[DACrowe]

He at least is the best writer of the relationship since the Clone Saga (save for maybe DeMatthis during Identity Crisis) and when he focused on her she was a compelling character and they are fun to be together again. However there are issues where she is just kinda' window dressing and there are issues where she is a major subplot.

I'd also like to mention that JMS has done some real good at the beginning of his run people forget. He did afterall do the great Morlun story, high school, Coming Home, Out of the Closet (Aunt May finding out), 9/11 and the Book of Ezkiel. But the Sins Past was terrible (it was decently written and the first two give some good insights into Pete) but the story and premise and theme is absolute ****. And of course there is The Other.

I really like when they have their moments or when MJ ends up saving him too though.

[spideylover89]

The marriage has had problems, but when you go back and look at all these issues, it's clear that it works really well too. I think the worst period for Pete and MJ was around the time she started smoking. Around that period not only was MJ a royal b****, but Pete was a complete jerk too. Oh and Mackie's run really killed them though more damage was done to MJ than anyone else. Aside from that they've been a great couple and a strong one at that.

[spideylover89]

My favorite scene hasn't happened yet. It will be when Peter and Mary Jane go to that freaking bridge and Peter spits on it.

Peter says it will be the last time he ever goes there and he doesn't care about Gwen anymore because she was a **** and didn't deserve his love. And that Mary Jane is his one true love and he never loved Gwen more than her.

And Gwen Stacy will never be seen or mentioned again in comic history. Any Gwen lookalikes will be shot on sight.

OUCH! lol :D

[Captivated]

Anyway, what was that wedding issue about because I have the wedding issue and it is a bit different, what is "Parallel Lives?"

You're in luck. It is available for download on Donald's site:
http://www.donaldspidermanthomas.com/html/library_limited_page7.html

FYI - The program you need to view it with is free too.

[Captivated]

I'm sorry you feel that way, Cap. But if that's treasure- then it should indeed be buried. It also bothers me that based on your knowledge of me, you'd take my comments as mere attempts to provoke anyone.

I'm not knocking writing two people in love. But the truth of the matter is that JMS wrote that same dialogue for those two in pretty much every issue. This is what's brought the relationship down to where the writers find them boring to write. They never dealt with them as two unique individuals in a relationship with numerous stress factors, who still manage to keep things together. Every storyline with them comes down to them saying in voice or caption- "I love the way she.." "I love the way he..." That's not progression.

Just prior to MJ's return she and Peter brought up some serious relationship issues which were never dealt with. That cop-out in ASM #50 about her needing to hear he needed her was silly and said how little real regard there was for MJ to be anything more than window dressing.
People are posting moments they love, in a thread created for it, and you are calling the moments trite, nauseating, deserving to be buried... but you don't mean to be provoking... Alrighty then... :rolleyes:

The expanded explanation is more your style. I think I get your other point... that this is trivial compared to the possibilities, and that the writers are just lazy concerning the relationship and the character of Mary Jane. I'd agree with that... but I still enjoy the heck out of the simple mushy stuff too. :) I'm obviously not the only one.

[Captivated]

I will say, the quoted Stracynski ones are pretty good.

So it continually mystifies me how from that, the guy could've actually written Sins Past. I mean what f'n absolute garbage.

I think I could read a Spider-man comic with nothing but Peter and MJ-ness. That's right. No action. No villains. Just Peter and Mary Jane being together and loving each other. Why? Because I like it.
Exactly. :up: :)

I know I've said it before, but people don't read every post... If you want to read a few excellent stories with Peter and Mary Jane WELL written... not to mention the villains... read Adam-Troy Castro's Sinister Six trilogy, especially the first book "The Gathering of the Sinister Six."

Mary Jane is still in modeling/acting, but it's obvious that, being the wife of a superhero, and dealing with the extrordinary situations she has found herself in, she is a good student of psychology. I love the way Castro writes her.

Another good one is a short story by Peter David called "Five-Minutes" It's found in this book:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0425170004/ref=si3_rdr_bb_product/104-6035943-6320746?ie=UTF8

[Captivated]

I can't believe no one has referred to MJ teasing Peter about May and Jarvis...

Here they are in bed and MJ has told him something -- OK, I didn't understand it, but I gathered it was something intimate -- and Peter is a million miles away... (You have to admit, a girl has to be pretty secure to survive Peter's distractability...) He's struggling to come to grips with May and Jarvis holding hands, when MJ implies there's probably more. He flees the room... "Not lisssstening..." Funny scene.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/NA_PeterMJ_Bed.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/NAPeterMJBed2.jpg

[GoblinScrier]

You know, for all of JMS's faults and mistakes he's made as the writer of ASM...he writes the marriage better then most writers ever have. He really handles the relationship between Peter and MJ extremely well. Through out his run there have been several great moments dealing with the marriage.

That was the ONLY highlight of the entire "The Other" was the way he writes Mary Jane...her devotion shines through in his writing....

[Captivated]

Continuing the hospital scene...

PETER: Superguys have groupies? Looks like I picked the wrong time to get marr...

MJ: Hey!

PETER: Just kidding.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/Ihavegroupies.jpg

[spideylover89]

That was the ONLY highlight of the entire "The Other" was the way he writes Mary Jane...her devotion shines through in his writing....

The scene in the hospital room before Pete...well...DIES is one of her shining moments in the whole arc. Everything else was crap especially the events directly after that scene *shudder* :(

I prefered the way JMS was writing Pete and MJ when he first brought them back into the book because it seemed like they were moving to new stages in their relationship, but he suddenly cut that off and forgot all the problems they needed to work on. I find it funny that everything came to a halt development wise when JRJR left (no that's not a bash at Deodato), kind of an interesting coincidence...I miss Rominta Jr.

[SpideyStu2]

Yeah, I always claimed that the whole Sins Past and subsequent terribles arcs were all because John Romita JR left. When he was on Amazing everything was good and the only thing people ever complained about was the damn totem-mystical-spider-god crap. I miss those days!

[Venomfan]

My favorite scene hasn't happened yet. It will be when Peter and Mary Jane go to that freaking bridge and Peter spits on it.

Peter says it will be the last time he ever goes there and he doesn't care about Gwen anymore because she was a **** and didn't deserve his love. And that Mary Jane is his one true love and he never loved Gwen more than her.

And Gwen Stacy will never be seen or mentioned again in comic history. Any Gwen lookalikes will be shot on sight.

AMEN preach it brotha

[DACrowe]

Yeah what is Romita doing now and is there any chance he'll return to Spidey....because he really has been the best Spidey artist of the last 10 years or so in my opinion though.

[TheVileOne]

What I hate most about Sins Past is that I kind of hate MJ for keeping that crap a secret.

MJ dumps Peter for Hollywood and Lobster guy and has kept this from him that whole time? While Peter is acting all sad and heart-broken over her? Who really deserves who?

[Captivated]

there was this one scene from the issue where they announce their engagement to aunt May and Anna.

MJ is cooking and Peter hangs upside down from the ceiling (out of costume), kneels down and shows her the ring. Mj just laughs it up and plays with his hair while saying something about having to clean up his footprints from the ceiling afterwards.

can't remeber the issue number but I thought it was a cute, relatable moment between the two.
It was in Amazing Annual #21. Here are some cute/poignant scenes.

MJ moves in...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/HiTiger.jpg



After his party at the Bugle Peter encounters Betty, who is not in her right mind after Neds death... He starts to worry that the women in his life are doomed to suffer...

The following scene where Peter gives MJ the ring and she "complains" of footprints on the ceiling... one of my favorites. (I would be a happy Spidey fan if this scene is in a movie someday... :) )

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Footprints_on_ceiling.jpg




Peter continues his worry when he finds a photo of Gwen. His thoughts are verbalized when Aunt May startles him...

AUNT MAY: Peter. Why so jumpy?. Do you always flinch away from the people who love you?

PETER: No, but may-be I should..

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Telling_May_Anna.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Telling_May_Anna2.jpg

[Captivated]

Peter here has exchanged worry about his "right" to marry anyone, to brooding over WHO it was MJ left with earlier and why she wasn't home yet... he says he not the jealous type, but just as he is about to go look for her, she shows up at his door.

She has been doing some thinking herself and asks him where he goes when he needs to think. Peter swings her off to the top of the Empire State building.

MJ: On the outside?! I'm not Fay Wray, you know!

PETER: And I'm not some big ape, I'm Peter! Do you really think I'd drop you, or let you be hurt in any way?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/PreWedding_Swing2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/PreWedding_Swing3.jpg



Later, love conquers fears and they both say " I do." Back from the honeymoon...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/backfromhoneymoon1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/backfromhoneymoon2.jpg

[MaraJanesSlave]

I love it when, on their honeymoon, MJ decides to take Pete's mind away from his money worries by ripping her dress off and running into the ocean nekkid. :)

~Mara Jane

[Captivated]

I love it when, on their honeymoon, MJ decides to take Pete's mind away from his money worries by ripping her dress off and running into the ocean nekkid. :)

~Mara Jane
That's one good example of how MJ's personality complements Peter's... :)
I'll have to scan that scene.

Hey, any baby news...? Hope things are well. :)

[MaraJanesSlave]

That's one good example of how MJ's personality compliments Peter's... :)
I'll have to scan that scene.

Hey, any baby news...? Hope things are well. :)

Angela (Angie) Josefina was born July 8 via c-section. She was 6 lbs, 10 oz., and is very healthy. She's actually screaming my ear off as I type this one handed. Thanks for asking, Cap. :)

~Mara Jane

[Captivated]

Angela (Angie) Josefina was born July 8 via c-section. She was 6 lbs, 10 oz., and is very healthy. She's actually screaming my ear off as I type this one handed. Thanks for asking, Cap. :)

~Mara JaneThat's wonderful news! :up: I thought you had said she was due in July, but then I didn't see an announcement... So glad to hear all is well! Congratulations! :)

Also glad to see you still have TIME to check the SSH boards. ;)

[stillanerd]

There was a scene (wish I a copy of this issue still) from Todd McFarlane's Spider-Man #13 where Mary Jane is talking about getting together with their friends for a night on the town and Peter decides to test his web shooters by webbing her up to where she's dangling helplessly. MJ basically tells him that he's being very naughty, but Peter, feeling MJ will be at his mercy for about an hour, decides to tickle her in a particular areas, to which MJ responds in mock horror "Oh no, Peter, not THERE!"

Also, I know this isn't exactly a moment from a comic book, but what about Peter David's short story "Five Minutes?" especially the scene where, after Peter stops a domestic violence situation and Peter acts nonchalant about it, MJ pours out her fears of Peter not coming back alive--one of the few moments from the 90s when MJ behaved like the "cop's wife" that came across as genuine.

BTW, belated congrats to Mara Jane and MaraJanesSlave.

[Captivated]

I know this is different... what follows are "word" pictures. This is a short story called Five Minutes, by Peter David. And as Stillanerd said, it a GREAT Peter/MJ story!

Set in the early "adjustment" days of the marriage, the story is intense, with loving, fighting and... just take my word for it, WORTH the read. :spidey:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_0Cover.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_3.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_4.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_5.jpg

[Captivated]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_6.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_7.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_8.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_9.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_10.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_11.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_12.jpg

[Captivated]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_13.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_14.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_15-1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_16.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_17.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_18.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Five_Minutes_Story/Five_Mins_19.jpg

[fangrl06]

Here's another good one which really says a lot about Mary Jane's character:

http://www.spidervillain.com/SpiderManCovers/Amazing/ASM122/Page4.jpg

And what about this? Surely, we Peter/MJ shippers have to include this:

http://www.thecomicshop.com.au/covers/comics/a/amazingspiderman-annual-21-marvel-nm-peter.jpg

Also, here's one for those who are wondering who the first Spider-Girl was. :D

http://www.pastandpresentcomics.com/store/images/product/small/000809.jpg
OMG....The top one is my favorite....right after Gwen dies....I was going to post that....

[DACrowe]

I really like in the wedding issue as we are posting quite a bit from that, when MJ and Pete tell the aunts of their marriage plan. I also REALLY like when Pete goes on top of the Brooklyn Bridge the night before and talks to Gwen 'til the sun comes up. It is not a MJ moment neccesarily but it works. It is poignant because we've all been there, letting go of somebody and still hurts and just sitting all night....you can honestly feel his pain there and it is him saying goodbye to Gwen because hte next pages are him getting married, which was done very nicely, especially the one page marriage pic.

Also I was reading some of Jenkins' earlier stuff and I was reading his Doc Ock Countdown storyline which I recomend to EVERYBODY as the best Ock storyline decades, even if a little dated now due to....events happening in the world. Anyway, as I was saying though there is a really nice 2 page scene where MJ is treating Pete's wounds in Spectacular Spider-Man (Vol. 2) #7 right at the beginning.

I'm not the biggest fan of Ramos' art but that was a really nice moment too though.

[The Caped Knight]

http://img331.imageshack.us/img331/9636/images647579spidermankissqd9.jpg
http://img17.exs.cx/img17/1638/spidey4lg5tp.jpg

[ragingdemon155]

heh didn't think my thread would still be going this strong. :up: :up: :)

That Alex Ross design of Spidey and MJ looks freaking amazing and I usually don't care for his style.

Good to see all the love that Peter and MJ are getting.

:up: :)

[The Caped Knight]

heh didn't think my thread would still be going this strong. :up: :up: :)

That Alex Ross design of Spidey and MJ looks freaking amazing and I usually don't care for his style.

Good to see all the love that Peter and MJ are getting.

:up: :)

Their a very popular superhero couple, Peter & MJ are right up their with Lois & Clark, Bruce & Selina etc .

[ragingdemon155]

Their a very popular superhero couple, Peter & MJ are right up their with Lois & Clark, Bruce & Selina etc .

Agreed.

There easily my favorite couple in comic books.

[The Caped Knight]

Agreed.

There easily my favorite couple in comic books.

My favorite superhero couple is still

(1) Lois & Clark

followed by

(2) Peter & Mary Jane

Then

(3) Bruce & Selina

[Captivated]

I also REALLY like when Pete goes on top of the Brooklyn Bridge the night before and talks to Gwen 'til the sun comes up. It is not a MJ moment neccesarily but it works. It is poignant because we've all been there, letting go of somebody and still hurts and just sitting all night....you can honestly feel his pain there and it is him saying goodbye to Gwen because hte next pages are him getting married, which was done very nicely, especially the one page marriage pic. Actually, in context, he's not up there "saying goodbye" to Gwen... the story, up to this point, has had him worrying if it was FAIR or right to get married, when his "lifestyle" puts the people he loves in danger.

When he expresses doubt at his bachelor party, Flash gives him a "if you love her don't screw it up like I did" lecture.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/Flash_Peter.jpg



Later that night Pete has a nightmare in which all his enemies are at the wedding and go after MJ... he had just promised her that he would never let her get hurt, but now he can't save her... much like Gwen. He wakes up in a cold sweat.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/Nightmare.jpg



It's after this terrible dream that he goes to the bridge. He tells Gwen that he's going to marry someone else... but he doesn't know if it's RIGHT or FAIR. He's obviously talking about the danger inherent with his lifestyle since that is what he has been worrying about for days.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/Peter_ponders.jpg



The next day... the wedding... they have both put their doubts aside.

I love what MJ says, but Peter's vows are a little strange... His obvious resolution to his quandry was basically, Mary Jane KNOWS, better than any other person in my life, what she is getting into, and she wants me anyway. How can I turn that down? More focused on himself, the words are not all that romantic, but I guess MJ understands.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/IDo.jpg

[DACrowe]

Then the one pag spread.

I honestly think comic book Pete and MJ are the best couple in comic books. They compliment each other so well. Lois and Clark are a little dull together IMO and Bruce and Selina and Bruce and Natalia....well they just aren't long lasting things. The only other couples that I think stand up to them is Cyclops/Jean Grey, Gambit/Rogue (because of its inability to ever really work) and....maybe, MAYBE Reed Richards and Sue.

But Pete and MJ seem to last in my opinion.

By the way, RagingDemon155 speaking of couples what ish of SM is your avy from? That looks like a recent issue the way...BC is drawn and I think it is safe to say that he is married at that point in the comics then.

[ragingdemon155]

Then the one pag spread.

I honestly think comic book Pete and MJ are the best couple in comic books. They compliment each other so well. Lois and Clark are a little dull together IMO and Bruce and Selina and Bruce and Natalia....well they just aren't long lasting things. The only other couples that I think stand up to them is Cyclops/Jean Grey, Gambit/Rogue (because of its inability to ever really work) and....maybe, MAYBE Reed Richards and Sue.

But Pete and MJ seem to last in my opinion.

By the way, RagingDemon155 speaking of couples what ish of SM is your avy from? That looks like a recent issue the way...BC is drawn and I think it is safe to say that he is married at that point in the comics then.

It was from the Kevin Smith series, The Evil that Men Do #2. It was during the period when MJ left Peter and they were seperated.

[DACrowe]

Ah I remember that. Yeah they were great back in the '80s but....it just doesn't work now though.

[Venomfan]

he kissed black cat while they were seperated???? isnt that still like cheating? seems out of character to me

did pete and mj have "maritals" before marriage? cuz if they did, to me that also seems out of character

oh and that five minutes story was awesome

[MaraJanesSlave]

he kissed black cat while they were seperated???? isnt that still like cheating? seems out of character to me

did pete and mj have "maritals" before marriage? cuz if they did, to me that also seems out of character

oh and that five minutes story was awesome

She kissed him in a rush of adrenaline after they fell out a window; but the way that pic is edited makes it look mutually consensual.

And, yeah, they did have relations before marriage... although I think it was only when they were in college. Somehow, I don't think they did when she came back later on and they were friends. There wasn't time since he was dating Felicia.

Cap, I wasn't sure if it would be appropriate to post a thread here about the baby or not. :)

~Mara Jane

[DACrowe]

Yes, they did have "relations" and you can read ASM #150 for verification and it seems quite in keeping with MJ's character. He also had "relations" with Black Cat when they were partners and she found out his dentity (read some of the comics when they were partners and all the innuendos make it feel like a Bond movie). And it is implied I thought that since she would spend the night once they were engaged that....MJ and Peter were back.

It is not that big a deal. The real question is if Pete had "relations" with Gwen, but according to JMS he did not though.

[spideylover89]

The Gwen fans will tell you they did, the non Gwen fans will tell you they don't really care. Frankly I don't think it matters...for all we know he could have been with Betty too! Pete's a player. :p

[The Caped Knight]

This is a funny moment from Spiderman 11

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v38/liliaeth/spare/FNSpider-Man11-012.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v38/liliaeth/spare/FNSpider-Man11-013.jpg

[Captivated]

The Gwen fans will tell you they did, the non Gwen fans will tell you they don't really care. Frankly I don't think it matters...for all we know he could have been with Betty too! Pete's a player. :pNo. Way. Peter's no player... I hope the :p meant you were kidding!

[The Caped Knight]

From Marvel Valentine Special 1997
http://img61.imageshack.us/img61/2082/valentine73bx.jpg
http://img61.imageshack.us/img61/6159/valentine98bn.jpg
http://img70.imageshack.us/img70/8871/valentine104jf.jpg

[Captivated]

^
I gotta look up that Valentine Issue... I love the fact that this thread is uncovering things I have not seen before. :) Very cool.

Anyone know where the following came from?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/mjwebs_cx.jpg

[The Caped Knight]

^
I gotta look up that Valentine Issue... I love the fact that this thread is uncovering thisng I have not seen before. :) Very cool.



This is the issue
http://www.samruby.com/Series/Holiday/valentine1.gif

[The Caped Knight]

Anyone know where the following came from?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/mjwebs_cx.jpg

It's Spiderman Torment issue 1 .

[Captivated]

Anyone know where the following came from?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/mjwebs_cx.jpg
Oh... Spider-man Torment?

Seriously?

LOL... you almost had me...

[spideylover89]

No. Way. Peter's no player... I hope the :p meant you were kidding!


Yeah I was kidding...or was I... o_O :p

[The Caped Knight]

Oh... Spider-man Torment?

Seriously?

LOL... you almost had me...

I'm serious, I have the issue .

http://www.samruby.com/SpidA/Large/Spiderman001G.jpg

[DACrowe]

Oh I just read ASM #506 and try that one, there is a very nice scene where Peter tries to scare MJ that he is a man-spider monster and pretends he's Jeff Goldblum from The Fly. Quite funny one-page interaction from JMS there.

[ragingdemon155]

I'm serious, I have the issue .

http://www.samruby.com/SpidA/Large/Spiderman001G.jpg

I have the issue too.

It's not in there.

[ragingdemon155]

Just read that "Five Minutes" short story Captivated.

Wow, it was amazing.

:) :up:

[Eddie Brock]

I have the issue too.

It's not in there.
same here, i have it as well, no webbed MJ

best moment ever, no competition:
http://pc59te.dte.uma.es/cdb/series/marvel/bitmaps/mj.jpg

[Captivated]

I'm serious, I have the issue .

http://www.samruby.com/SpidA/Large/Spiderman001G.jpgOhhhh... it's a story arc in the Spider-Man title... That makes more sense. Thanks. :)

[Captivated]

We have the wedding in this thread... how about scenes from the HONEYMOON.

An admirer of Mary Jane's (when he couldn't talk her out of getting married) gave her use of his villa in the south of France. She is positively giddy over being "Mrs. Spider-Man"... but Peter seems to miss that and spend way too much time brooding that he won't be able to give MJ the things she is used to. (Of course it's a set up, so he will accept the job that the Puma offers.)

It's cute how MJ is constantly reassuring and distracting him...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/Honeymoon1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/Honeymoon2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/Honeymoon3.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/Honeymoon4.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/Honeymoon5.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/Honeymoon6.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/Honeymoon7.jpg

[Captivated]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/Honeymoon8.jpg

[The Caped Knight]

I love The honeymoon issue .

[shinlyle]

I have the issue too.

It's not in there.

It was in Spider-Man #13... which featured the same cover, only with Spidey in his black suit. It was "Sub-City" part one of two.

http://www.samruby.com/SpidA/Large/Spiderman013.JPG

[Dragon]

Yes, they did have "relations" and you can read ASM #150 for verification and it seems quite in keeping with MJ's character. He also had "relations" with Black Cat when they were partners and she found out his dentity (read some of the comics when they were partners and all the innuendos make it feel like a Bond movie). And it is implied I thought that since she would spend the night once they were engaged that....MJ and Peter were back.

It is not that big a deal. The real question is if Pete had "relations" with Gwen, but according to JMS he did not though.

JMS only said that to sell his idiotic plot twist. But we know he believes Peter and Gwen slept together, since his initial idea was that the kids were Peter's.

[The Caped Knight]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v26/liviapenn/exiles/cosmic_kink.jpg

[spideylover89]

Ah the Captain Universe days, that costume was pretty bada$$. I just wish Bagley's art was backed up with decent colors, everything was always so neon. :down

[ragingdemon155]

Ah the Captain Universe days, that costume was pretty bada$$. I just wish Bagley's art was backed up with decent colors, everything was always so neon. :down

Bagley??

Bagley wasn't drawing Spider-man around that time.

I'm pretty sure that's Larson.

[spideylover89]

Sorry I meant Larson, I get them mixed up sometimes because they always gave MJ big hair. :D

[freemadison]

Sorry I meant Larson, I get them mixed up sometimes because they always gave MJ big hair. :D

Eeeesh. I love Bagley but I am no fan of big hair MJ.

[spideylover89]

It's better than super curly mega button nose MJ that McFarlane did in the 80's :p (I like MF but I just can't take curly hair :( )
I find it funny that Bags drew MJ with crazy hair for so long and now Ultimate MJ's hair couldn't get any limper.

[Venomfan]

what is everyones favorite MJ look? i really like ultimate, the original, and the one from the comic where wolverine is like caressing her chin, and spidey is in the background freaking out

[spideylover89]

I think the Romitas drew the best MJ with Bagley in a close second. :up:

[DACrowe]

Ah I haven't seen the honeymoon issue in ages (now not having a copy) so good. And what was that one about Flash from, was it in Frinedly recently? Oy, I REALLY, REALLY, REALLY hate how they have reverted Flash back and wasted about 40 years of character development. From Pete's best man back to "puny Parker" is really degrading and insulting in my opinion.

[spideylover89]

Yeah it was from the newest FNSM. I agree about the Flash thing too, it really sucks. :down

[freemadison]

*whew* i'm glad i'm not the only one who hates the flash thing. you might as well say that the flash that we've come to know and love for the last 30 years was *gasp* a clone while the real flash has just awoken from stasis and can reclaim his mantle as the rightful flash. lame.

[spideylover89]

I hate Marvel right now :(

[Kevin]

*whew* i'm glad i'm not the only one who hates the flash thing. you might as well say that the flash that we've come to know and love for the last 30 years was *gasp* a clone while the real flash has just awoken from stasis and can reclaim his mantle as the rightful flash. lame. you actually thought you were the only one?:eek: wow...

[freemadison]

you actually thought you were the only one?:eek: wow...

i guess i just don't happen to come across people's outrage about flash as much as i would expect. they're too busy complaining about Peter being a retard, or being Iron Man's *****, or unmasking, or Gwen's promiscuity, or Spidey being an Avenger, or Norman's still being alive, or Reilly not being alive, or about the people who want Reilly alive, or the Other, or Quesada, or JMS.

Let's complain about Flash now. Please.

This needs a thread.

EDIT: http://www.superherohype.com/forums/showthread.php?t=245635

[spideylover89]

DACrowe already made a thread about this. It's called Flash...

[The Caped Knight]

http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/4808/alriospideymjmorein4.jpg
Spidey/Parker, MJ & Villians

http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/9614/alriomjmp3.jpg
Spidey & MJ

[Dragon]

Those drawings are beautiful. Perfectly captures the light and dark of Spidey. This guy really needs to be on a Spidey book.

[The Joker]

I agree.

That art is magnificent :up: Speaking of getting good talent on the Spidey books, hire Adam Troy-Castro dammit. He knows how to write an interesting Spidey marriage.

[The Caped Knight]

Mary Jane novel

http://img508.imageshack.us/img508/3048/young20ppmjpk1.jpg
Young Peter & MJ

http://img238.imageshack.us/img238/2521/mj201exc2.jpg

http://img234.imageshack.us/img234/2923/mj205xhd4.jpg

http://img234.imageshack.us/img234/3743/mj2020ppva2.jpg

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/5899/mj20peter20and20the20spideryy1.jpg

[Dragon]

Those are beautiful drawings as well, but that doesn't look like MJ, IMO. And Peter looks a little too much like Harry Potter.

[The Caped Knight]

http://img58.imageshack.us/img58/3576/mj206cus2.jpg
Mary Jane with Heartbroken Peter

http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/6751/mj9ayp0.jpg
MJ Consoles Peter at Uncle Ben's Funeral

http://img302.imageshack.us/img302/2216/mj4d2096dpizq6.jpg

http://img387.imageshack.us/img387/9606/20absiv2.jpg
Secret Revealed

[The Caped Knight]

http://img258.imageshack.us/img258/2480/mj8g2096dpiyd6.jpg

http://img272.imageshack.us/img272/6818/mj20novel20cover2gi4.jpg

http://img272.imageshack.us/img272/2397/mj203cgf9.jpg

http://img115.imageshack.us/img115/2919/mj120cover2096yx3.jpg

[Smoke87]

Those are all from the Mary Jane Novel's? They're awesome!

[spideylover89]

Those are beautiful drawings as well, but that doesn't look like MJ, IMO. And Peter looks a little too much like Harry Potter.

It's because they were going more toward the look of the film. I agree about the Harry Potter thing though :D

[The Caped Knight]

Those are all from the Mary Jane Novel's? They're awesome!

Yes, they are .

It's because they were going more toward the look of the film. I agree about the Harry Potter thing though :D

Exactly

[DACrowe]

Oh my favorite MJ look is definetly the Romita look (Sr.) followed by his son no less, and mid 80's MJ (her finding out his identity until the honeymoon issue) was well done and Bagley is the only big hair artist who I liked....but oy did I ever hate the art of McFarlen doing her. Besides making the hair too big she was a mindless big-breasted boring image.

I'm also not a big fan of Dodson's MJ who is rather cliche and bland which was surprising considering he drew such a good Black Cat (who benefits from a whoreish look).

Just my opinion though.

[spideylover89]

Dodson's MJ is gorgeous, but so are all the other women he draws which kind of spoils her ability to stand out. Essentially all of Dodson's women are the same woman with different hair.

[freemadison]

I think the Romita Jr. anything works for me. :woot:

[Dragon]

It's because they were going more toward the look of the film. I agree about the Harry Potter thing though :D

I can see that, but still, MJ is just too skinny and she doesn't have any of the qualities that make her unique. I mean Kirsten Dunst looks a bit juicier than the girl depicted. And her hair needs to be fuller and a deeper red.

In the Spidey 3 forum they show recent pictures from an interview with Bryce Dallas Howard, and her hair is EXACTLY like MJ's, even down to the shape of her bangs. Ironic.

The above Al Rio drawings manage to capture her look, making her curvy without having to use the Terry Dodson/Frank Cho cop-out of just making her breasts gigantic.

[spideylover89]

Yeah I agree, she has to have that "bombshell" look that makes you go wow.
Any artist that can make MJ gorgeous without being ****ty or fake looking is great in my book (Romitas :up: ). And as far as the colossal boobs go, Cho definitely has the throne for that one. The issues of MK that he did were ridiculous, MJ looked like she was about to pop! :eek:

[DACrowe]

Dodson's MJ is pretty but is just bland and generic for him. He just has a lto more fun drawing Black Cat and you can tell that too.

[Venomfan]

can someone post pics of the different artists versions of her, cuz i only know like 3, and dont know the names of the others

[The Joker]

http://www.kostyasmarket.com/kimg/store/comics/otherM/gn_parellel.jpg


Has anyone here read this?? I'm curious as to what the storyline of it is.

[Captivated]

http://www.kostyasmarket.com/kimg/store/comics/otherM/gn_parellel.jpg


Has anyone here read this?? I'm curious as to what the storyline of it is.
I have it. Enjoyed it. In fact, I posted some pictures from it earlier in this thread.

You are in luck. It is up on Donald's website right now.
http://www.donaldspidermanthomas.com/html/library_limited_page7.html

[Captivated]

I agree.

That art is magnificent :up: Speaking of getting good talent on the Spidey books, hire Adam Troy-Castro dammit. He knows how to write an interesting Spidey marriage.I do love Al Rio's Spidey drawings!

And you KNOW how I feel about Castro. Writes the best Spidey EVER - including MJ, villains AND supporting cast, with attention to continuity. :up::up::up:

I'm currently reading the X-Men/Spider-Man Times Arrow trilogy and can't wait to get to book 2, by Castro. Good fun. :)

[Captivated]

It's better than super curly mega button nose MJ that McFarlane did in the 80's :p (I like MF but I just can't take curly hair :( )
I find it funny that Bags drew MJ with crazy hair for so long and now Ultimate MJ's hair couldn't get any limper.I scanned some pics from that era... shortly after the marriage. (I'll have to post them when I get some time, later.)

I'm NOT a fan of the changes that McFarlane introduced then. MJ was over the top, with the HUGE hair and clothes, etc... Crazy.

I don't have anything against curly hair (I have natural waves myself!) but it just wasn't classic MJ.

Currently, I think Ringo is the only one doing a decent MJ on the 616 titles... the other's, (esp. Medina), kinda suck. Bagley can make her look beautiful one panel, and strange/ugly the next... but mostly he does ok. Don't like that he just gave her a haircut though... MJ should have longish hair.

[Secret_Riddle]

my fave peter m.j moment is actually from the ultimate spider-man series. when m.j gives peter the letter and then they make out it was actually a really good scene with them.

[Lt. Figgnuts]

Continuing the hospital scene...

PETER: Superguys have groupies? Looks like I picked the wrong time to get marr...

MJ: Hey!

PETER: Just kidding.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v308/Captivated_Edge/Spidey_MJ/Ihavegroupies.jpg

What issue is this from? Was it Deodato's most recent run on ASM? Because I have all of those issues...

...was it Sins Past, maybe?

[spideylover89]

Maybe...yeah it was.

[Secret_Riddle]

What issue is this from? Was it Deodato's most recent run on ASM? Because I have all of those issues...

...was it Sins Past, maybe?

wow i love the inking there...the art in general is awesom.:D

[spideylover89]

I scanned some pics from that era... shortly after the marriage. (I'll have to post them when I get some time, later.)

I'm NOT a fan of the changes that McFarlane introduced then. MJ was over the top, with the HUGE hair and clothes, etc... Crazy.

I don't have anything against curly hair (I have natural waves myself!) but it just wasn't classic MJ.

I do too and that's why I hate it. :D
I know why Todd went with the curly hair though, it was the 80's. Now straight hair or a little wave is the essential look, but 20 years ago a lot of people were sporting curls...and big hair.

Currently, I think Ringo is the only one doing a decent MJ on the 616 titles... the other's, (esp. Medina), kinda suck. Bagley can make her look beautiful one panel, and strange/ugly the next... but mostly he does ok. Don't like that he just gave her a haircut though... MJ should have longish hair.

Ringo draws nice looking people, but his style just bores me. It's a little too classic if you catch my drift. If Medina only knew how to draw people without being fugly then he would be my favorite artist. Bagley is the weird one because he used to draw such a gorgeous MJ and now he seems to have some difficulties with her (it's probably the short hair). Plus Bags can be really inconsistent, he's a great artist, but he is definitely up and down through the whole book (I still love him on USM though).

[spideylover89]

Dodson's MJ is pretty but is just bland and generic for him. He just has a lto more fun drawing Black Cat and you can tell that too.

That's because you can make Black Cat look ****ty and no one cares, MJ has to be classy. :o

[J. J. Jameson]

I think that Bagley does an awesome job on MJ in Ultimate Spider-Man. I think the best one he drew was at the end of "Dumped" and the last page was MJ.

Great pic. I would scan it, but I'm too fussy about my trade paperbacks. :(

[DACrowe]

That image is from Sins Past by the way. A horrid little storyline in my opinion.

[Venomfan]

does anyone have a pic of this short haired MJ?

[DACrowe]

When was she short haired now?

[J. J. Jameson]

This is turning into a MJ pics thread. Haha!

[Captivated]

That image is from Sins Past by the way. A horrid little storyline in my opinion.Horrid, disgusting story :mad: with some BEAUTIFUL art. And some good MJ/Peter scenes.

[ragingdemon155]

Horrid, disgusting story :mad: with some BEAUTIFUL art. And some good MJ/Peter scenes.

Thats pretty much the same opinion I have of the story.

[MaraJanesSlave]

When was she short haired now?

I think it was during the Romita Sr. era. It was short & curly. They were probably trying to make her look different from Gwen (from what I understand, the colorists had a hard time telling them apart).

~Mara Jane

[The Caped Knight]

Dodson's MJ is gorgeous, but so are all the other women he draws which kind of spoils her ability to stand out. Essentially all of Dodson's women are the same woman with different hair.

I love how he draws Mj .

[J. J. Jameson]

I like JR JR's or maybe Deodato's 616 MJ the best.

Bagley is just awesome at MJ in Ultimate Marvel.

[DACrowe]

What do people think of Dedato? I think he draws a decent Spider-Man and Spider-Man battles but the man cannot draw the out of mask stuff at all. HIs Pete is ugly, bland and generic, MJ isn't all that pretty and his Aunt May looks like a man.

I really wish JRjr would return but after Sins Past and The Other I don't blame him for staying out of sight from the Spidey books now.

[J. J. Jameson]

What do people think of Dedato? I think he draws a decent Spider-Man and Spider-Man battles but the man cannot draw the out of mask stuff at all. HIs Pete is ugly, bland and generic, MJ isn't all that pretty and his Aunt May looks like a man.

I really wish JRjr would return but after Sins Past and The Other I don't blame him for staying out of sight from the Spidey books now.

I don't think Deodato's that bad. His MJ's pretty good too.

[Captivated]

What do people think of Dedato? I think he draws a decent Spider-Man and Spider-Man battles but the man cannot draw the out of mask stuff at all. HIs Pete is ugly, bland and generic, MJ isn't all that pretty and his Aunt May looks like a man.

I really wish JRjr would return but after Sins Past and The Other I don't blame him for staying out of sight from the Spidey books now.:confused: :mad:

Geeze... the LAST thing I want this thread to do, is dissolve into an impossible debate over artists... but I CAN'T let this statement go unanswered. IMO, that has to be one of the most ridiculous things I have ever read on this board. People have complained about Deo's high contrast style, or the fact he uses well known faces as references, but I am flabergasted that anyone would say "he can't draw out of the mask." Absurd.

Of course, if JRJr's faces -- which were sometimes strange, blocky and overall cartoony -- are your ideal of beauty, then... I guess I understand. To each his own.

[DACrowe]

Well JRjr's work is not realistic if that is what you mjean. Yes he does tend to use block models but his art has just an asethetic quality. He really draws a all the characters very well and is probably the best artist to handle MJ since his father (who did it better obviously).

Dedato just is bland. He goes for photo realism in his art but the art looks bland, when he tries to draw emotion it makes Peter look petulant and whiney as he squints his eyes. Like when he yells at Aunt May in the Other, it is laughable. His MJ is not very pretty and I think is drawn better by the other artists right now on Spider-Man and his Peter Parker as I said earlier was bland. In the unmasking issue of #533 he doesn't even look like Peter Parker, he looks like a bland jock and that was the reaction I got when I showed it to a friend who doesn't read comics but wanted to see Spidey have done that. Even as he has grown handsome over the years he never looked so boring and broad since the overly buff days of McFarlen and his imitators.

And the worst one is Aunt May. As I said his short-haired Aunt may, with her broad shulders and square chin could be mistaken for a man and at some points when I turned the page I thought I was watching an old man at first. She is so few in details away from being Captain Stacy it is rather sad. He goes for photo realistic art and I'm not one to complain about him given Bruce Campbell's face to a snooty usher in sins Past (a nice joke in what was probably the only good scene or one of the very few in that run).

I don't mean to get into a debate but Dedato's art is either bland or ugly when it comes to human faces. He can draw action and fights quite well though.

[Venomfan]

did anyone read web of romance? i keep hearing it was really good but i cant find it anywhere, can anyone post scans?

[ragingdemon155]

did anyone read web of romance? i keep hearing it was really good but i cant find it anywhere, can anyone post scans?

Yea it was. You should really pick it up. One of the better Peter/MJ stories in recent history. Would post scans but I lost my copy...:(

[Captivated]

Yea it was. You should really pick it up. One of the better Peter/MJ stories in recent history. Would post scans but I lost my copy...:(Great story :up: terrible art :down I wonder why it is so hard for them to get these two together!

[Captivated]

Well JRjr's work is not realistic if that is what you mjean. Yes he does tend to use block models but his art has just an asethetic quality. He really draws a all the characters very well and is probably the best artist to handle MJ since his father (who did it better obviously).

Dedato just is bland. He goes for photo realism in his art but the art looks bland, when he tries to draw emotion it makes Peter look petulant and whiney as he squints his eyes. Like when he yells at Aunt May in the Other, it is laughable. His MJ is not very pretty and I think is drawn better by the other artists right now on Spider-Man and his Peter Parker as I said earlier was bland. In the unmasking issue of #533 he doesn't even look like Peter Parker, he looks like a bland jock and that was the reaction I got when I showed it to a friend who doesn't read comics but wanted to see Spidey have done that. Even as he has grown handsome over the years he never looked so boring and broad since the overly buff days of McFarlen and his imitators.

And the worst one is Aunt May. As I said his short-haired Aunt may, with her broad shulders and square chin could be mistaken for a man and at some points when I turned the page I thought I was watching an old man at first. She is so few in details away from being Captain Stacy it is rather sad. He goes for photo realistic art and I'm not one to complain about him given Bruce Campbell's face to a snooty usher in sins Past (a nice joke in what was probably the only good scene or one of the very few in that run).

I don't mean to get into a debate but Dedato's art is either bland or ugly when it comes to human faces. He can draw action and fights quite well though.You are cracking me up... :rolleyes: You just REPEATED and EXPANDED the same crazy points. I STILL could not disagree more.

[DACrowe]

i did explain them as I didn't last time. I take it we must disagree but I just can't see how anyone could like his art of Pete (especially when he tries to draw Pete at an emotional moment) or Aunt May though.

[spideylover89]

Guys guys let's not get into an artist war. Cap we know you love Deodato and DA obviously doesn't (at least Deodato's people). So just leave it at that. You can debate nonstop about why you like an artist and why you dislike an artist and at the end of the day one fact still stands - taste is a matter of personal opinion. It can't be swayed or persuaded even by facts, you either like something or you don't.

I love how quickly this thread went off topic. :D

[spideylover89]

Great story :up: terrible art :down I wonder why it is so hard for them to get these two together!

Now see this is something everyone can agree on no matter what their tastes are, that art was horific. :( :down

[Venomfan]

an awesome moment was on TAS at the end of the lizard king episodes, after pete rescues MJ there on top of a building, and he says something along the lines of "theres something i've been meaning to tell you" and he pulls his mask off, end of episode. i was so excited when i saw that, lets just forget she ended up being a clone

[farmernudie]

I thought Tom Defalco's run (especially the Alien Costume Saga) was well handled....and that he wrote Peter and MAry JAne's relationship wonderfully at the time. You cared about them as people.

He wrote a good Black Cat too....and all supporting cast for that matter.

I would love Defalco to return to Amazing, and Ron Frenz as penciller....man those were some great years!!

That's back when Hobgoblin was Ssoooo cool, and even the Rose was written to be interesting.

Even more, the black costume was handled well and made a very interesting storyline and fit with the character, black and white.

There seemed to be a real excitement in the air back then when i honestly couldn't wait forthe next issue of my Spidey. Back before foil covers, 100 varients, 12 issue writing announcements, relaunching and renumbering,......ah....gladi can go back and read those!!

Speaking of Hobgoblin, it is past time to bring back the Hobby of old, and make him a serious threat. His original costume in this run was amazing and just right.

[farmernudie]

Oh yeh...i might add too....

ANother villian that was well done besides Hobby, was Jack-O-Lantern, IMO during their run.

He is another, like Hobgoblin, that i thought really looked cool...even looking back i just LIKE that character (may not be a popular thought) but he was just written well then imo, but later mishandled and costume messed with and changed and all.

Sometimes it is better not to muck with things so much...sometimes newer is not better.

Bring back Defalco and Frenz !!

[DACrowe]

Well I never liked Jack O'Lantern but hey I'm a big fan of the Black Cat and not many are (when she is written well and just not a **** coughKevinSmithcough). I also liked....Puma from that era when he was a poor man's Kraven, he did in two issues what took Kraven 30 years to get around to doing.

But seriously I like DeFalco and Stern's run on Hobgoblin as much as the next guy. That pretty much defined the early and mid 80s (as did Black Cat) with the marriage being what defined the late '80s. I miss their epic duels as they were a bit repetive but each one was so intense and Hobby always got away and Spidey was left soggy, or nearly burned to a crisp (more than once) holding HObby's mask. And teasing the reader with "Flash Thompson is Hobby" and then the cop out "Ned Leeds is Hobby."

Stern coming back with Hobgoblin Lives was a great arc and a good final run for the character since Norman Osborn was back. Because Goblin's Gate revealed a sad truth. As cool as Kingsley/Hobby was and as clever and cunning he is no Norman Osborn. There is a scene where Norman tricks Kingsley into signing over his companies and Kingsley yells "How did you do this?!" and all Norman says is "I'm Norman Osborn" with a great grin. They then do an amazing battle with no weapons, but at the end of the day Hobby pales to the original GG.

I rather like to leave Hobby as a great character from the '80s who had a nice epilogue in the '90s. Though it would be nice to see Norman and Kingsley have ar ematch though.

[Captivated]

an awesome moment was on TAS at the end of the lizard king episodes, after pete rescues MJ there on top of a building, and he says something along the lines of "theres something i've been meaning to tell you" and he pulls his mask off, end of episode. i was so excited when i saw that, lets just forget she ended up being a cloneWas that from the long running TV show from the 90s? Is it true he married MJ towards the end of the series?

I REALLY wish they would sell the WHOLE thing, instead of these short story arcs. :( I'm about ready to try to find an unauthorized version...

[DACrowe]

Well if you don't mind spoilers I'll tell you how the end of the show (last season + went) which was very good but ended on a low note IMO:

Okay what you just heard was near the end of season 4. Harry was GG and Punisher brought MJ back to Aunt Anna who blamed Pete for her disappearence (it was really GG throwing her off a bridge and into a limbo reality in fact before being knocked in it himself). Punisher thinks Pete is GG, finds out it is Harry who gets thrown in jail and MJ is back. She doesn't remember where she was. Over the next few episodes she continues her love affair with Peter Parker, even as she works on a movie that leads to being in a death trap by Quentin Beck and his lover (who both blow up at the end). Peter then unmasks himself afterwards. She in the following Lizard episode jumps off a building for him to prove it. He saves her, they're in love and he uses a spider tracer as a wedding ring. They then work together as a confidant for two episodes.

Then in the beginning of season 5 MJ and Pete get married. But as she then tells Harry about the marriage, he goes crazy he goes mad and becomes the GG and escapes again. He tells Smythe he needs help and gets Scorpion and spider-slayers to help. He then crashes Pete's wedding (Dr. Conners is the best man) and Spider-Man is busy battling spider slayers and Scorpion with the help of the Black Cat (who as Felicia was attending the wedding)....AND WILSON FISK (who is paying for the wedding to rival with JJJ). Liz Allen then confesses she loves Harry right before he blows himself up with MJ when she refuses to marry him in the church with the priest. Harry gives up and runs away with Liz, Spidey and Black Cat win (she hits on him, he says no) and Peter and MJ get married.

In a shorter summary of the rest of the season, he teams up with old heroes to stop Kingpin from getting the old power that was harnessed by Red Skull (Captain America and the Red Skull come back). It turns out that that power is a suped up Electro who defeats the Kingpin and puts him in jail. He tries to take over the world, knocks down SHIELD (all of it) and puts MJ in the hospital. Spidey and Cap defeat him. Spidey goes on a honeymoon with MJ and they are attacked at Niagra Falls by a returning Hydro-Man. It is then revealed (this is where it goes downhill) that as Spidey and BC save MJ that she has Hydro powers and is in fact....A CLONE of the real MJ made for a clone of Hydro-Man. But Warren's cloning process sucks and her molocules break down and she melts to death in a broken Peter's arms. He is then summoned bby the Madame Web who says she'll give him the real MJ back if he joins her on his final quest. He agrees and ends up leading the forces of good (Iron Man, Storm, Fantastic Four and a seducing Black Cat) against the forces of evil (Dr. Doom as the main villain, Lizard who switches sides, Doc Ock, Red Skull and Allyster Smythe). They win barely against Dr. Doom and Spidey is then revealed that was a test.

The real challenge (and the last two episodes of the show) involves multiple dimension Spideys. He meets like five or six other Spider-Men including Ben Reilly who reveals that his clone (or the real Peter, they're not sure) had it bad by losing Uncle Ben and then Aunt May. After finding out he might be a clone he turned evil and joined forces with the Carnage symbiote and is making a machine to destroy the world. To Peter's horror this is "like a plot from some bad comic book" and leads other Spider-Men with different powers and features against Spider-Carnage who controls Kingpin and both Hobgoblin and Green Goblin. They jump demensions and realities and he meets Gwen Stacy and Uncle Ben. He uses Uncle Ben to set emo-Spidey right who then kills himself to save all realities. Spidey then meets Stan Lee on Madame Web's bidding in our reality before going to find MJ with Madame Web. And that's how the show ends.


Yeah it really should have ended with the Cap/Electro episode then?

[Captivated]

Thanks! That sounds strange... but I'd still buy the series if it was available. :)

[The Caped Knight]

http://img345.imageshack.us/img345/4599/spectacularspidermanannual0835wf9.jpg
from Spectacular Spider-Man Annual #8

[Venomfan]

ha thats right, back of gwen

[Dragon]

And what do you expect? That story was written by the very one that killed Gwen off. But Peter recinded that statement eventually.

[spideylover89]

And what do you expect? That story was written by the very one that killed Gwen off. But Peter recinded that statement eventually.

You know I'm beginning to think there's someone out there who loves Gwen even more than Peter ever has. ;)

[freemadison]

Whose art is that? Is that Bags?

[Dragon]

You know I'm beginning to think there's someone out there who loves Gwen even more than Peter ever has. ;)

No, that kind of love is reserved for real women like yourself ;) I'm just annoyed at how much hatred gets heaped at Gwen just because Peter was with her first.
But yeah, of the two, I'd pick Gwen, just like Peter :cool:

[spideylover89]

No, that kind of love is reserved for real women like yourself ;) I'm just annoyed at how much hatred gets heaped at Gwen just because Peter was with her first.
But yeah, of the two, I'd pick Gwen, just like Peter :cool:

If you think you can just charm your way out of everything, I've got news for you...it works. :O

I do agree though that it's sad how much emphasis is put on who was there first. Gwen will always hold a special place in Pete's heart (as will MJ, Betty, and everyone Peter has loved) because despite what many would like to think, Peter doesn't base his love on a first come first serve basis.

[Venomfan]

i dont care if she was his first love, just stay the heck out the way now that hes married to MJ

[The Caped Knight]

The fact of the matter is Peter loves MJ more than he loved Gwen or any of his other girlfriends.

[Venomfan]

The fact of the matter is Peter loves MJ more than he loved Gwen or any of his other girlfriends.

the other fact of the matter is that lately there trying to tell us otherwise

[The Caped Knight]

the other fact of the matter is that lately there trying to tell us otherwise

It depends on the writter of the story.

But in general, Just like Clark/Superman loves Lois Lane more than his first love Lana lang. Peter Parker/Spidey loves Mj the same way .

[Dragon]

The fact of the matter is Peter loves MJ more than he loved Gwen or any of his other girlfriends.

Well, that depends on what continuity you're going with. The Annual you posted above is largely disregarded anyway, since the clone did indeed turn out to be a clone. And like I said, Peter eventually rethought the "I love you more than I ever loved her" thing.

And, according to House of M, if Peter had a choice- Gwen is his pick.

[Happenstance]

Well no with House Of M Pete had Gwen because he wish was for nobody to die, so she didnt, so he didnt get with MJ

[Dragon]

He could have wished for no one to die and to be with MJ.

[Happenstance]

Well its not like Scarlet Witch asked everyone what their greatest wishes were, she used Xavier to find out and Pete wouldnt wish for something he already had.

[Dragon]

Plain and simple- If he were totally happy with what he had, he wouldn't be wishing for anything else.

[Happenstance]

But he obviously wasnt totally happy with having Uncle Ben and Gwen dead, who would be? Its the way the situation played out.

[The Joker]

Dragon, who do you believe Peter loves more, Gwen or MJ?? And why do you believe he loves your choice more??

[DACrowe]

It depends on the writer. Most genuinely since the 'mid-80s have developed MJ into the most important supporting cast member ever in a superhero comic book (save maybe Alfred), but every now and then you get a great writer who has nostolgia for what he read when he was young (for example, Loeb) who will change the story on its head to fit with the character he is more endeared with.

But as of right now the general tone is he is still heartbroken over being responsible for her death but has moved on and is happy (when not brooding) with MJ in a more "mature" relationship (again depends on whose writing, but that won't matter soon though).

[Dragon]

Dragon, who do you believe Peter loves more, Gwen or MJ?? And why do you believe he loves your choice more??

I believe that Gwen is the woman he wanted to spend his life with, if it were merely about his choice. He certainly would never have left her for MJ, as MJ made that attempt with no results.

I think he loves MJ and is happy to be with her and build a life with her without any regrets.

So, it isn't as some here would like it to be, a question of loving one more than the other. But ultimately Gwen is his true love. Why? Because she was structured by Stan to the woman for Pete. She's intelligent, tough, gorgeous, all that Peter would need.

[The Joker]

I believe that Gwen is the woman he wanted to spend his life with, if it were merely about his choice. He certainly would never have left her for MJ, as MJ made that attempt with no results.

Excellent point. I'd forgotten about that.

But ultimately Gwen is his true love. Why? Because she was structured by Stan to the woman for Pete. She's intelligent, tough, gorgeous, all that Peter would need.

You don't think MJ is tough, gorgeous, and intelligent too??

[Dragon]

Excellent point. I'd forgotten about that.

You don't think MJ is tough, gorgeous, and intelligent too??

MJ is obviously gorgeous. But I think, based on how she's drawn, she has a more quirkiness to her beauty, whereas Gwen has a more other worldly look to her.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v68/DragonGD/g-MeredithMacRaeLoriSaunder.jpg

These are two 60's actresses. I think the blond looks more like MJ would look in real life, whereas the brunette looks like Gwen.

MJ is tough, but not combat tough, despite the writers arming her every now and then or having her beat-up a guy with a gun (yeah, right). I think she'd fight if she had to, (and being married to Spidey she'd have to) but she's not by nature a fighter. I do think Gwen is combat tough.

As far as intelligence- she's smart. She's street smart. Gwen is book smart. You could divy it up this way: Gwen is probably 50-50 street vs. book smart. MJ is like 70-30 street smart vs. book smart. For Pete, being maybe 60-40 book smart vs. street smart, I think he and Gwen could communicate on deeper levels.

[DACrowe]

Why get mathamatical? I really do think MJ is quite an intelligent character. And I agree she is much more street smarts so I find it strange you suggest that Gwen is the "tougher" of the two....that she'd handle herself better? Well she was never written that way I thought and GG certainly proved otherwise then.

[Dragon]

Why get mathamatical? I really do think MJ is quite an intelligent character. And I agree she is much more street smarts so I find it strange you suggest that Gwen is the "tougher" of the two....that she'd handle herself better? Well she was never written that way I thought and GG certainly proved otherwise then.

Gwen had a cop Dad, so her street smartness and toughness is generated from there. MJ is just based on her experiences. She's not as tough as Gwen was. Captain Stacy would have likely taught Gwen self defense, as well as how to shoot. And also what life is like on te street, even if she didn't experience it first hand. I love when in ASM #120 Gwen called Peter naive for not knowing what a flashback was. She was involved on every level, with environmental stuff, political- Gwen was- I repeat- BADASS. It takes a real moron to not see all the immense potential of the character. But then, we are talking about Marvel's creative staff.

[The Caped Knight]

Ok before this becomes another Mj vs. Gwen Thread. I'm going to end this discussion right here & right now.

Let's get back on Favorite Peter/MJ moment

here is one of mine from this months sensational 29, the Peter and MJ phonecall [I love the playful banter between these two]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v38/liliaeth/SensationalSpider-Man29-014.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v38/liliaeth/SensationalSpider-Man29-015.jpg
Tell to him like it is MJ .:up:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v38/liliaeth/SensationalSpider-Man29-016.jpg
lol and MJ's proud of it.

[Venomfan]

kal el that was awesome, u have some great scenes, please keep them coming

[The Caped Knight]

here are some random ones I like

http://www.spidermancrawlspace.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/zgradaswp4hr.jpg

http://www.spidermancrawlspace.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/spideykittysmall1fk.jpg

http://www.spidermancrawlspace.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/XMASspideymj.jpg

[The Caped Knight]

http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/628/upsidedownkiss2tw9.jpg
One of my favorite scene's in spider-man {God I wish I was Spidey @ that moment of the movie}

http://www.spidermancrawlspace.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/sfspmjcolorsmallsized9kn.jpg
I hope to see this in Spidey 3

http://www.spidermancrawlspace.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/anniverseryspidey.jpg

[Happenstance]

http://www.spidermancrawlspace.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/spideykittysmall1fk.jpg

You do realise thats Kitty he's kissing and not MJ right?

[leftblank]

These are all great pictures. Is there any more good ones to be posted?

[Ultimate Jay]

I dunno... for some reason i always liked when Peter reveals his secret to M.J. in USM, and Aunt May comes in thinking their up to something...

Great stuff... always liked that moment.

[J. J. Jameson]

I dunno... for some reason i always liked when Peter reveals his secret to M.J. in USM, and Aunt May comes in thinking their up to something...

Great stuff... always liked that moment.
So do I. USM is awesome.

[gliderpilotgirl]

I dunno... for some reason i always liked when Peter reveals his secret to M.J. in USM, and Aunt May comes in thinking their up to something...

Great stuff... always liked that moment.

me too! so funny

[Willowhugger]

For me, the competition between Gwen Stacy and Mary Jane is an unfair one since the character of GS hasn't been updated since her death. This might have the benefit of nostalgia but the problem is that its difficult to claim what exactly is Gwen anymore.

Let's take Gwen Stacy's greates appearance in Spiderman the Movie. Wait, what? Mary Jane Watson was in Spiderman? On the contrary, no she wasn't. Some weird Gwen Watson was in Spiderman the movie. The lovable and soft friend to geeky parker. Mary Jane was the more worldly and forward woman.

The original "Betty and Veronica" comparisons came from here. Except of course, Mary Jane was genuinely nice and Gwen wasn't nearly as bizarre as Betty which only goes to show that I really shouldn't admit to having read Archie.

Frankly, if they ever did update Gwen they should probably have made her a science nerd like Peter and a geek. Then the contrasts would be more effective.