The man who laughs: The Joker thread

[gwynplaine]

from the same artist:
Cool drawing. I wonder if the Joker has ever been drawn as Conrad Veidt in TMWL, not as Cesare ?

[Schlosser85]

Sarg92, very nice.

[Juanigi]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/4b/Sweeneylarge.jpg

[Axtech]

Not sure why you posted it in this thread, but I can't wait for Sweeney Todd!

[Juanigi]

his pose is very batman #1-ish

[sasquatchs]

For a moment I thought it was Ledger. Looking forward to that one

[Mr. Socko]

I once wanted Depp for Joker

[Saves The Day]

So who has these coordinates all mapped out, does anyone know where they lead?

[Saves The Day]

Is it the WB studio?

[Juanigi]

they lead to nolan's office actually, where you get served a warm cup of tea

[Saves The Day]

Honestly does anyone know? and how do I change things by my avatar like what it says under my name?

[Untilteld]

I once wanted Depp for Joker

same.

[StarvingArtist]

Honestly does anyone know? and how do I change things by my avatar like what it says under my name?

The coordinates lead to the convention center in San Diego.

[darknight7]

cool...11 hours to go, let's see what happens..

--dk7

[darknight7]

soo...everyone is worried that The Joker is a texan...

does that mean this wasn't a joke?

Ledger on The Joker's Nationality & A Return to the Windy City?
Author: Jett
Sunday, December 17, 2006 - 10:00 AM: For all of you who were curious as to where The Joker would hail from, no need to wonder any longer. I'll let Ledger tell you himself:
"The Joker...is definitely an American."
Actually, I've heard that not only is he an American, but a Texan as well! Can't wait to hear Heath's Joker say "I'm fixin' to kill y'all, HAHAHAHAHA!"
Thanks to "J.T." for the lead! Source: STLTODAY.COM... According to "Armor & Co." in the CHICAGO TRIBUNE, Warner Bros. has committed to shooting part of TDK in Chicago.

-dk7

[sasquatchs]

Joker pic from Checkpoint 6 of whysoserious

http://whysoserious.com/images/theknife.jpg

[Watson]

^fangasm!!!

[Blitzz]

Joker pic from Checkpoint 6 of whysoserious

http://whysoserious.com/images/theknife.jpg

very nice

[Golgo-13]

Joker pic from Checkpoint 6 of whysoserious

http://whysoserious.com/images/theknife.jpg

Sssswwwwwweeeeeeetttttttt!!!!!!:heart: :wow: :yay:

[Golgo-13]

Looks like he's about to carve a smile into her face!

[theShape]

I just don't like the puffyness of his "cut" smile. It looks awkward. Aside from that, I love it. The black around the eyes is really cool, IMO.

[Akimych]

http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x197/Akimych23/theknife23.jpg

[Agentdemon]

^.....?

[the_ultimate_evil]

sorry i've still got an open mind, but what the hell's with the make-up. if he stays like that its just a nut who got into mummy's handbag

[Nepenthes]

ledger is wearing prosthetic nose and chin?

it's very subtle but definitly not his natural features

[sasquatchs]

This one's a pretty interesting read, not sure how closely it matches the film

http://img66.imageshack.us/img66/9836/226582qr1zn9.jpg

[Hunter Rider]

Joker pic from Checkpoint 6 of whysoserious

http://whysoserious.com/images/theknife.jpg

Love this

[Nepenthes]

yeah that pic is what we've been waiting for. beautiful. looks like he's wearing fake nose



This one's a pretty interesting read, not sure how closely it matches the film
http://forums.superherohype.com/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=12303496

cool, they're going to a bit effort alright.


can anyone match those offense numbers?

[Upset Spideyfan]

I really hope he doesn't look like that for the whole movie.

Thumbs down on the Joker look.

[Batman jr.]

I really hope he doesn't look like that for the whole movie.

Thumbs down on the Joker look.

So, you don't know THE twist... not the BIG twist, but THE twist...

[Batman jr.]

it's starting to get pathetic:

THIS is my man Jack his real smile:

http://upload.moldova.org/movie/actors/j/jack_nicholson/jack_nicholson_8.jpg

His Joker smile WAS fake okay ?

[Nepenthes]

^ what are you talking about? he covers up his white skin with make-up. is that it?

[Batman jr.]

^ what are you talking about? he covers up his white skin with make-up. is that it?

I thought "fans" already knew that it's revealed that he's totally white at some point.

[Untilteld]

Jack Nicholson sucked, you all think he'll be the only great joker, well HE'S THE ONLY JOKER IN A MOVIE. Heath will blow his Joker right out of the park.

[NoName86]

Yea, I think, even though the senses tell us opposite at this point, that Nolan and Goyer and company wouldn't let the Joker go as someone with just make up on. I don't are I'm not believing such a scenerion for a minute.

How many times have we thought something was for sure, and people said it was set in stone, only to find out we didn't know the full story?

This kinda reminds me about when someone told me that when they were filming Begins and someone seen Bale with the ski mask on instead of a cowl, and everyone freaked out about it. lol I got kinda dried up from lack of news, but between hearing the laugh and voice, and then seeing that new picture my enthusiasm has kicked into full gear again.

[Lunar_Wolf]

I just don't like the puffyness of his "cut" smile. It looks awkward. Aside from that, I love it. The black around the eyes is really cool, IMO.

Yeah it's too puffy near the lips. But I do love everything else.

[GoldenState]

Higher res pic of the joker card in the teaser

http://xs317.xs.to/xs317/07305/TDK_Teaser_HD_Medium_bV78g1K.mov_000045545.jpg.xs. jpg (http://xs.to/xs.php?h=xs317&d=07305&f=TDK_Teaser_HD_Medium_bV78g1K.mov_000045545.jpg)

[Nivek]

So, you don't know THE twist... not the BIG twist, but THE twist...


You do realize people can see flesh colored skin peeking through that white?

I hope for your sake that this twist is real (I know I have doubts), because the impression of people getting painted up as the Joker tells people that he paints his face. Thats what the photo's collaborate as well.

I dont understand that if you like this make-up design for the Joker, why this incredible insistance that he isn't some wacko guy with a Chelsa-smile that wears make-up. That he has white skin. I dont understand it. if you dont like the flesh skin, say you dont like it. Dont try to rationalize it.

[Watson]

http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x197/Akimych23/theknife23.jpg

Whadya think this is, 1-18-08?! :oldrazz:

I think it's what is happening in the photo that really makes it for me. He's threatening, he's creepy...and hey know we have evidence of him wearing gloves!

[rashad]

That pic is AWESOME! Time to make a new wallpaper.

[DSET]

okay so he applies his makeup woop dee doo ****
FRiggin AMAzING pic
shuts up everyone who didnt like the first

[Figs]

I love how his eyes are closed like he's taking it all in and savoring what he's about to do to her.

[Swordmaster]

My thoughts on the pic overall: Joker's threatening, scary, and psychotic. I love it the knife, I love the atmosphere the scene creates, I love it all. I also like how the red on the lips seems less messy, more streamlined.

However, the puffiness of the scarring is kind of, as theShape said, awkward, and I do not like the flesh tone, at all. So I'm hoping that the supposed twist is true, or people will die. After all, I am a man of my word.

[Nivek]

okay so he applies his makeup woop dee doo ****
FRiggin AMAzING pic
shuts up everyone who didnt like the first

Dont think it works like that, chum. If anything, it reinforces why I dont like it in the first place. Nice photo, sh***y make-up design.

[ToddIsDead]

As if I needed to be more convinced that this Joker sucked. He looks absolutely horrible. At least now I know t wasn't the bad quality of the previous pictures that made him look like ****.

[Capt Throbberson]

http://img116.imageshack.us/img116/1042/omgvenomvu2.jpg

OMG LOOK!!!!

[8atman]

Higher res pic of the joker card in the teaser

http://xs317.xs.to/xs317/07305/TDK_Teaser_HD_Medium_bV78g1K.mov_000045545.jpg.xs. jpg (http://xs.to/xs.php?h=xs317&d=07305&f=TDK_Teaser_HD_Medium_bV78g1K.mov_000045545.jpg)

AWESOME shot!!! Plus I was selected to win two free IPod Nanos!!! Today's my lucky day.

[bosef982]

You know, fans have taken their opintions and inflated them with this insane and arrogant sense of ownership that is really just pissing me off. We're going to whine about fleshtones and the "puffiness" of a smile.

You know what, none of you guys are on the production crew or the studio board who really are busting their asses to make this picture and make it good...they have to right to ***** about such innane and petty things at that.

You, you're sitting at home or work on a computer using the screen as a clever protection to hide your superficial concerns and petty ego.

This is just ridiculous. I use to think the "you can't win with fans" phrase was cliche and just an excuse.

After reading through the past few pages here, it is undoubtedly true that fans cannot be pleased. And that, above all, is both the reason and justification for why they should be ignored most of the time.

[Crook]

You, you're sitting at home or work on a computer using the screen as a clever protection to hide your superficial concerns and petty ego. .
Brilliant deduction. :dry:

[Bright Knight]

the famous card!!!

http://file032a.bebo.com/9/large/2007/07/27/19/8650403a5105521804l.jpg

[Juanigi]

may I have the other ipod nano

[GoldenState]

Wow, bravo.

Well said

[Killing Joke926]

Joker pic from Checkpoint 6 of whysoserious

http://whysoserious.com/images/theknife.jpg

:wow: :wow: :wow:.................I crapped my pants again. THERE IS A GOD!!!!!!!!:woot:

[MiniBond]

http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/2807/theknifeee4.jpg






I can almost hear him say: "What about a pretty little smile darling ????":woot: :woot: :woot: :woot:

[ToddIsDead]

You know, fans have taken their opintions and inflated them with this insane and arrogant sense of ownership that is really just pissing me off. We're going to whine about fleshtones and the "puffiness" of a smile.

You know what, none of you guys are on the production crew or the studio board who really are busting their asses to make this picture and make it good...they have to right to ***** about such innane and petty things at that.

You, you're sitting at home or work on a computer using the screen as a clever protection to hide your superficial concerns and petty ego.

This is just ridiculous. I use to think the "you can't win with fans" phrase was cliche and just an excuse.

After reading through the past few pages here, it is undoubtedly true that fans cannot be pleased. And that, above all, is both the reason and justification for why they should be ignored most of the time.

So we're supposed to just love everything they toss at us? Even if we don't like it? We're not allowed to criticize something that isn't up to snuff and we don't like. If that's so, what's the point of even making movies if we're not supposed to have and voice opinions about it?

[sasquatchs]

Were there any other goodies besides these 3 case files and the pic, there were only 3?
http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/8104/154tmr8121ye4.th.jpg (http://img158.imageshack.us/my.php?image=154tmr8121ye4.jpg) http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/4940/226582qr1uu3.th.jpg (http://img158.imageshack.us/my.php?image=226582qr1uu3.jpg) http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/4760/3511jsr99bd6.th.jpg (http://img158.imageshack.us/my.php?image=3511jsr99bd6.jpg)

[8atman]

You know, fans have taken their opintions and inflated them with this insane and arrogant sense of ownership that is really just pissing me off. We're going to whine about fleshtones and the "puffiness" of a smile.

You know what, none of you guys are on the production crew or the studio board who really are busting their asses to make this picture and make it good...they have to right to ***** about such innane and petty things at that.

You, you're sitting at home or work on a computer using the screen as a clever protection to hide your superficial concerns and petty ego.

This is just ridiculous. I use to think the "you can't win with fans" phrase was cliche and just an excuse.

After reading through the past few pages here, it is undoubtedly true that fans cannot be pleased. And that, above all, is both the reason and justification for why they should be ignored most of the time.

WELL SAID. Agree with you a 100%. Everyone complains like there not going to see the movie now because it's going to be terrible yet you know they'll be there opening day.

Nolan made way to fine of a film the first time to let us down.

[RedIsNotBlue]

You know, fans have taken their opintions and inflated them with this insane and arrogant sense of ownership that is really just pissing me off. We're going to whine about fleshtones and the "puffiness" of a smile.

You know what, none of you guys are on the production crew or the studio board who really are busting their asses to make this picture and make it good...they have to right to ***** about such innane and petty things at that.

You, you're sitting at home or work on a computer using the screen as a clever protection to hide your superficial concerns and petty ego.

This is just ridiculous. I use to think the "you can't win with fans" phrase was cliche and just an excuse.

After reading through the past few pages here, it is undoubtedly true that fans cannot be pleased. And that, above all, is both the reason and justification for why they should be ignored most of the time.

Well it is just a fact that no matter what was done there were gonna be complainers, comparisons to Nicholson, comparisons to the comicbook counterpart, etc. Nolan adapted the character for what he thought would work best with his vision for the movie and he was going to get some bashing from people no matter what he did. I have accepted the look at this point and right now am just looking to enjoy myself because so far this has a great shot at knocking Batman Begins off as my favorite comic book film.

[marty mcfly]

the teaser might be kinda boring, but i mean come ON! look at all the other sweet stuff they're doing to hype this filme

ibelieveinharveydent

ibelieveinharveydenttoo

see you in december

whysoserious?

this is awesome, why is everyone complaining SO much? we have a whole YEAR before this movie comes out, just sit back and enjoy the ride

[Juanigi]

Were there any other goodies besides these 3 case files and the pic, there were only 3?
http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/8104/154tmr8121ye4.th.jpg (http://img158.imageshack.us/my.php?image=154tmr8121ye4.jpg) http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/4940/226582qr1uu3.th.jpg (http://img158.imageshack.us/my.php?image=226582qr1uu3.jpg) http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/4760/3511jsr99bd6.th.jpg (http://img158.imageshack.us/my.php?image=3511jsr99bd6.jpg)where was the third one?

[Figs]

So we're supposed to just love everything they toss at us? Even if we don't like it? We're not allowed to criticize something that isn't up to snuff and we don't like. If that's so, what's the point of even making movies if we're not supposed to have and voice opinions about it?


He's not meaning that your supposed to love everything. He's saying how people have no lives to were they ***** about something soooooo trivial like a little teen tiny bit of puffiness near the scar.....since in reality if you had been sliced like that it would puff out. As for the whats the point of movies.....:huh: :huh: :huh: . Movies are not made just to give people a reason to feel special for voicing their opinion to everyone like everyone gives a damn. They are for entertainment. Yes, everyone has different opinions and a right to them but the way you worded that sentence implies that there to be made just and only for criticization(sp?) and not for any entertainment value. Basically, if that's not what you meant then you in fact need to change the way that sentence is worded.

[8atman]

Were there any other goodies besides these 3 case files and the pic, there were only 3?
http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/8104/154tmr8121ye4.th.jpg (http://img158.imageshack.us/my.php?image=154tmr8121ye4.jpg) http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/4940/226582qr1uu3.th.jpg (http://img158.imageshack.us/my.php?image=226582qr1uu3.jpg) http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/4760/3511jsr99bd6.th.jpg (http://img158.imageshack.us/my.php?image=3511jsr99bd6.jpg)


Possible multiple Jokers huh? Could that explain the whole his skin is bleached white vs. it's makup. He uses decoys?

[Crook]

He's saying how people have no lives to were they ***** about something soooooo trivial like a little teen tiny bit of puffiness near the scar.....since in reality if you had been sliced like that it would puff out.
I love how everything in this film can be explained with "...well you know in real life, THAT'S how it would actually go down." followed by a quick flash of Reality Expert badge pinned on their shirt. :o

[Figs]

the teaser might be kinda boring, but i mean come ON! look at all the other sweet stuff they're doing to hype this filme

ibelieveinharveydent

ibelieveinharveydenttoo

see you in december

whysoserious?

this is awesome, why is everyone complaining SO much? we have a whole YEAR before this movie comes out, just sit back and enjoy the ride


I am in total agreement! For the answer to your question about why people are complaining so much just look at our current society for that. Most people now days are a bunch of crybaby spoiled brats, where nothing is ever good enough and they always want more regardles of what they got.

[Capt Throbberson]

Isn't the guy in the third one the "Winner"

[DSET]

Dont think it works like that, chum. If anything, it reinforces why I dont like it in the first place. Nice photo, sh***y make-up design.

As if I needed to be more convinced that this Joker sucked. He looks absolutely horrible. At least now I know t wasn't the bad quality of the previous pictures that made him look like ****.





Call the WWWWWWWWWWaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaMbulance

you guys are narrow minded, arent open to anything different

[sasquatchs]

where was the third one?

I dunno, I just saw the direct image links posted, only saw one when I went through the game

[Figs]

I love how everything in this film can be explained with "...well you know in real life, THAT'S how it would actually go down." followed by a quick flash of Reality Expert badge pinned on their shirt. :o


Nice try to be a smartass. Didn't work, I don't go around with a "Reality Expert badge" :ninja: on my shirt or whatever the hell that childish thing is. It's a fact that only requires common sense which most people don't have now days. If you get cut/stabbed/sliced, it cuts and irritates the nerves. The skin will in most cases get puffy, hell it does that even for bruises.

[the_ultimate_evil]

You know, fans have taken their opintions and inflated them with this insane and arrogant sense of ownership that is really just pissing me off. We're going to whine about fleshtones and the "puffiness" of a smile.

You know what, none of you guys are on the production crew or the studio board who really are busting their asses to make this picture and make it good...they have to right to ***** about such innane and petty things at that.

You, you're sitting at home or work on a computer using the screen as a clever protection to hide your superficial concerns and petty ego.

This is just ridiculous. I use to think the "you can't win with fans" phrase was cliche and just an excuse.

After reading through the past few pages here, it is undoubtedly true that fans cannot be pleased. And that, above all, is both the reason and justification for why they should be ignored most of the time.

you make some extremely valid points, and i agree 9 times outta 10 fanboys are simply *****ing for the hell of, but to basically go on the attack because some people don't agree with you, is just as bad.

you like what you see so far, super your happy. me there are some elements i like and some i don't, but I'm willing to keep an open mind cause we still have a year to go. so come on there no need to add more wood to the flame war on this subject

[aSyluM7]

Did anyone else notice that in all the pics officially released of the joker we have yet to see his eyes open? I can see why they would not release a pic with the smile, but whats with the eyes?

[The Last Meatbag]

Well he's recruiting for his crew :o

Not all of them have to be wearing make up...they could be wearing those rubber clown masks :o

[Untilteld]

I just think scar looks too softcore, needs to be gruesome.

[Mysterio]

Isn't the guy in the third one the "Winner"i think it is.

and "see you in december" pops up once again...

[Crook]

Nice try to be a smartass. Didn't work, I don't go around with a "Reality Expert badge" :ninja: on my shirt or whatever the hell that childish thing is. It's a fact that only requires common sense which most people don't have now days. If you get cut/stabbed/sliced, it cuts and irritates the nerves. The skin will in most cases get puffy, hell it does that even for bruises.
I'm frankly just tired of hearing that statement a billion times. It's the number one thing people here fall back on, when trying to explain a change in design.

I'll accept the fact that it's a choice made by Nolan, but at times I get the feeling that people believe that is the only way to go, as if people will shout in the middle of a scene, going "hey....that's not realistic!" at every detail.

[DSET]

I just think scar looks too softcore, needs to be gruesome.

Lol really?
i think the majority of people think its the other way around

but anyhow

[stonecold]

it looks dark... i am now officially scared of this Joker. This is the true Joker in my mind despite the new look..crazed, brilliant , dangerous, murderous, elegant but repulsive. i love his demonic yuckyuckyuck laugh at the end of the teaser.

that new image.. he looks operatic.. kind of theatrical and tragic.

[Saint]

i think it is.

and "see you in december" pops up once again...

Huh? Where?

[Bond]

Were there any other goodies besides these 3 case files and the pic, there were only 3?
http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/8104/154tmr8121ye4.th.jpg (http://img158.imageshack.us/my.php?image=154tmr8121ye4.jpg) http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/4940/226582qr1uu3.th.jpg (http://img158.imageshack.us/my.php?image=226582qr1uu3.jpg) http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/4760/3511jsr99bd6.th.jpg (http://img158.imageshack.us/my.php?image=3511jsr99bd6.jpg)
The guy in the 3rd one looks like a fat Ledger.

Twist much?

[stonecold]

that guy in the police report is the winner from san diego! the guys running this campaign turned it round fast.. awesome.

[JP]

I'll withhold judgment.

[Jacobhiggins]

It's obvious from the leaked pictures that Joker goes through some transformations in appearence in the movie. Maybe even multiple times. I think he will slowly get more and more gruesom and then by the end of the movie he will be the ghoul that we've seen in some of the leaked pictures!

[stonecold]

It's obvious from the leaked pictures that Joker goes through some transformations in appearence in the movie. Maybe even multiple times. I think he will slowly get more and more gruesom and then by the end of the movie he will be the ghoul that we've seen in some of the leaked pictures!

i think actually the images we are seeing is him from the start of the film... as the true joker takes hold.. the psycho mass killing bankribber Joker gets crazier and crazier - ultimately becoming the Joker we know and love.. All white skin, full costume, he might even then exaggerate his own mouth scarring, i dunno ... this is going to be Joker Begins too, but without an origin, he just gets more extreme throughout

[GoldenState]

Lol really?
i think the majority of people think its the other way around

but anyhow I think people thought the scar from how it looked in the first press shot of Joker was a bit much, but now that we get a closer looks it seems more tame. Better not to be too distracting.

[Jacobhiggins]

where was the third one?

I'm thinking that could be one of the huge twists, what if there is multiple jokers and maybe even Heath.....isn't the real one. That could be really wild! I dont' think that's the case but it's obvious that he looks much different in some of the pictures.

[Untilteld]

I'm thinking that could be one of the huge twists, what if there is multiple jokers and maybe even Heath.....isn't the real one. That could be really wild! I dont' think that's the case but it's obvious that he looks much different in some of the pictures.

no.

[Compi716]

The police documents are really cool. WB is adding so many great touches to the marketing campaign.

[darknight7]

If that was the case: Heath not being the Joker...kind of like how...Ducard ended up being Ra's...

Than I will be greatly disapointed...


EDIT:

I know it is just speculation, but what I am saying is that it is a bad idea...lol


--dk7

[Compi716]

About "See You in December":

I like it. It seems that the Joker is going for that "undead" thing. He's a ghost - someone who isn't supposed to be alive. It makes his nature more mysterious, and his origin all the more unknown. It also explains his "appearence" at the end of Batman Begins. Great move on the part of whoever thought this up.

[sasquatchs]

The guy in the 3rd one looks like a fat Ledger.

Twist much?

Seems more like a hint that the Joker will fake his own death, then reappear later. Also, a confirmation that Loeb is still commissioner?

[Bond]

Seems more like a hint that the Joker will fake his own death, then reappear later. Also, a confirmation that Loeb is still commissioner?
Yep. :up:.

[Fresh Tendrils]

I really love the laugh in the teaser. The voice ranges from good to decent, but I want to hear his voice in the context of the film before I really assess it.

[dkbatman06]

Seems more like a hint that the Joker will fake his own death, then reappear later. Also, a confirmation that Loeb is still commissioner?


I can see it now...

Batman: Joker? You're supposed to be dead!

Joker: Sorry to disappoint.

[stonecold]

listened to heath about 100 times now.... if you listen when he says 'starting tonight'.. its almost like he's faking/imitating a broadcaster, newsreader saying 'on tonights show'.. when he says 'people will die' he spits it out with relish and venom.. he means it. then 'im a man of my word..' this is his real, low, scary voice but he leads into the best laugh.. literally my dream laugh for the Joker.. demon, gutteral.. and then high pitched frenzy in an instant.. ****ing hell!!!!

i honestly think this is perfect... he also sounds like Freddie Kruger or Hannibal at the end too.. he's like ultimate monster all in one.... respect ledger... this is next level

[DaJanksta]

My thoughts on the pic overall: Joker's threatening, scary, and psychotic. I love it the kinfe, I love the atmosphere the scene creates, I love it all. I also like how the red on the lips seems less messy, more streamlined.

However, the puffiness of the scarring is kind of, as theShape said, awkward, and I do not like the flesh tone, at all. So I'm hoping thatthe supposed twist is true, or people will die. After all, I am a man of my word.




hey im out of the loop! what is the supposed twist??

[sglass03]

For people who don't know, here's the twist, as according to Miranda and/or Anjow...

...the Joker "isn't what he seems." Apparently, people (i.e., Dent, Gordon, Batman, the police) think he's just some makeup-wearing loon, but it's revealed at some point that he is ALL-WHITE.

This seems to suggest Joker wears skin-colored makeup on his neck, hands, etc., to make it look like he's just some whacko who wants to look like a clown, thereby fooling his pursuers. It's quite ingenius and Nolan-ish, if true, and I surely hope it is. It would be quite a shock to pull that on the casual audience during the film.

[TedKordLives]

The supposed twist:
The only make-up the Joker wears is flesh-colored. His white face is his actual skin tone

[Boom]

Amazing. I start warming up to the look based on set photos, and now I come crashing back down to skepticism with an official one.

Talk about a half-assed design. Meh.

[ICXCNIKA]

It was reported earlier that the Joker will have grayish skin, and the new image clearly doesn't feature him with grayish skin. So, maybe, he actually has the grayish skin, wears skin-colored makeup on top of it, then paints his face to look like the Joker from the comics. That's all I've come up with.

[Kevin Roegele]

It's not actually stated in the earliest Joker stories (which the movie is based on) whether the Joker is wearing make-up or not. As he is a clown, and clowns wear make-up, it's logical. I mean, the actor playing the Joker is wearing make-up, so that saves any suspension of disbelief that it's the unlikely event of some chemical or something.

[ToddIsDead]

Amazing. I start warming up to the look based on set photos, and now I come crashing back down to skepticism with an official one.

Talk about a half-assed design. Meh.

Watch out. You've expressed disappointment in the design. Now the fascists on this site will all come out and flame you for being a "whiny fanboy." Because of course, if you have a negative opinion, it's just not valid.

[bosef982]

Dont think it works like that, chum. If anything, it reinforces why I dont like it in the first place. Nice photo, sh***y make-up design.

As if I needed to be more convinced that this Joker sucked. He looks absolutely horrible. At least now I know t wasn't the bad quality of the previous pictures that made him look like ****.

you make some extremely valid points, and i agree 9 times outta 10 fanboys are simply *****ing for the hell of, but to basically go on the attack because some people don't agree with you, is just as bad.

you like what you see so far, super your happy. me there are some elements i like and some i don't, but I'm willing to keep an open mind cause we still have a year to go. so come on there no need to add more wood to the flame war on this subject

I actually haven't said whether or not i like it one way or another.

[darknight7]

http://img162.imageshack.us/img162/2650/tdkjokercardhf6.jpg

cool card...from the teaser

--dk7

[Boom]

Watch out. You've expressed disappointment in the design. Now the fascists on this site will all come out and flame you for being a "whiny fanboy." Because of course, if you have a negative opinion, it's just not valid.
Seriously. It looks like a Halloween costume. So hastily and cheaply done. I guess that makes him "MORE PSYCHOTIC!!!1"

:whatever:

[Dark Sentinel]

http://video.whysoserious.com/3511jsr99.jpg

Hmm...in the last paragraph it mentions "DA Dent"...I guess Harvey's already DA when the movie starts..

[ICXCNIKA]

In the new pick, are those a clown's/The Crow-like vertical black lines above and below his right eye?:huh:

[regwec]

Okay, The Joker looks less-than-impressive when he is reduced to scars and talc. At least he is wearing purple.

All the same, I the use of decoys revealed in the "whysoserious" site probably gave us some explanation; he has modified his own appearance to represent that of his decoys. It's not a perfect explanation, but an explanation it is, and it does at least mean that Nolan hasn't screwed around with the character on a whim.

[the_ultimate_evil]

is anyone hearing the slightest hint of both nichelson and hamill in the voice

[bosef982]

He's not meaning that your supposed to love everything. He's saying how people have no lives to were they ***** about something soooooo trivial like a little teen tiny bit of puffiness near the scar.....since in reality if you had been sliced like that it would puff out. As for the whats the point of movies.....:huh: :huh: :huh: . Movies are not made just to give people a reason to feel special for voicing their opinion to everyone like everyone gives a damn. They are for entertainment. Yes, everyone has different opinions and a right to them but the way you worded that sentence implies that there to be made just and only for criticization(sp?) and not for any entertainment value. Basically, if that's not what you meant then you in fact need to change the way that sentence is worded.

So we're supposed to just love everything they toss at us? Even if we don't like it? We're not allowed to criticize something that isn't up to snuff and we don't like. If that's so, what's the point of even making movies if we're not supposed to have and voice opinions about it?


Which goes directly back to my point about fans feeling like they are owed these films.

[ICXCNIKA]

http://img162.imageshack.us/img162/2650/tdkjokercardhf6.jpg

cool card...from the teaser

--dk7

That looks like his tail he's holding, or maybe the cable that cuts his face. He looks like a devil, there.

[SalaciousVC]

i'm guessing everybody saw this by now?
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x135/symbiote24/the-dark-knight-20070727113649106-0.jpg

[regwec]

It's obvious from the leaked pictures that Joker goes through some transformations in appearence in the movie. Maybe even multiple times. I think he will slowly get more and more gruesom and then by the end of the movie he will be the ghoul that we've seen in some of the leaked pictures!

I don't like the idea, and I doubt it will go that way. Batman, Scarecrow and Ra's were all more or less unrecognisable at the start of Begins, but became quite representative of their classic guises by the end. Maybe The Joker will follow suit.

[darknight7]

It does indeed look like the devil holding his tail...very cool

--dk7

[dark_b]

i like the new joker pic. everythign that i hated in the first official pic lookc in this new pic 1000 times better.

i have agai nfaith in hte look of joker.

[darknight7]

The Joker's face looks WAAAAAAAAAAY more mangled in the first pic now that I look at it

--dk7

[Watson]

In the new pick, are those a clown's/The Crow-like vertical black lines above and below his right eye?:huh:

HE IS NOT THE CROW. THE RESEMBLANCE IS MINIMAL.

Can everyone get off that? PLEASE?!

[Carnotaur3]

The Joker's face looks WAAAAAAAAAAY more mangled in the first pic now that I look at it

--dk7

That was because of the high contrast lighting.

[millennium movies]

Looks odd :(

[dark_b]

i am again obssesed with the look of the joke. he looks amazing in this new pic. i dont even care for the teaser anymore. this new pic is badass.

[Tempest19]

This, with the teaser- personally, I find it safe to say- that we got ALOT more for the Dark Knight at this point than we got for Batman Begins.

Teaser with footage, or no teaser with footage... I think the best marketing is the whole mystery of the Joker- only seeing him from the side even in the official pic and then complete reveal in December.

[Lunar_Wolf]

i am again obssesed with the look of the joke. he looks amazing in this new pic. i dont even care for the teaser anymore. this new pic is badass.

The new pic is far more exciting then the teaser.

[manic-cure]

is anyone hearing the slightest hint of both nichelson and hamill in the voice

I thought the same thing too.

[sasquatchs]

"I'm a man of my word". Does anyone think Joker knows there's more to Dent than meets the eye? Or just straightforward mocking of his golden boy image?

[Spade]

The Joker is seldom serious in his jests. With this incarnation being sadistic, I don't think he's serious about his last comment. It's more of a sinister way of threatening the powers that be so they know he's serious when it comes to killing these hostages/ civilians. The fact that he says it dripping with sarcasm is a giveaway.

[regwec]

I don't really see what you mean. Why are sadism and seriousness incompatible?

[Spade]

I'm not saying that, just that he's probably not being as honest as some who are scrutinizing the line believe the implication of his statement to be.

[hegele]

he looks great, he sounds scary. I can't wait.

[dark_b]

i think it is paint afterall.
http://whysoserious.com/images/theknife.jpg

watch the part where the hair starts. if he would have white skin than under the hair the skin would still be white. but it is normal color.

[sasquatchs]

listened to heath about 100 times now.... if you listen when he says 'starting tonight'.. its almost like he's faking/imitating a broadcaster, newsreader saying 'on tonights show'.. when he says 'people will die' he spits it out with relish and venom.. he means it. then 'im a man of my word..' this is his real, low, scary voice but he leads into the best laugh.. literally my dream laugh for the Joker.. demon, gutteral.. and then high pitched frenzy in an instant.. ****ing hell!!!!

i honestly think this is perfect... he also sounds like Freddie Kruger or Hannibal at the end too.. he's like ultimate monster all in one.... respect ledger... this is next level

I agree, they could easily both be put on. Personally I'd prefer his natural voice to be deeper and less pinched than the "starting tonight" part, more towards mock Dent. But it'll probably be all over the place throughout the film depending on the situation, like Batman's

[Nivek]

i think it is paint afterall.
http://whysoserious.com/images/theknife.jpg

watch the part where the hair starts. if he would have white skin than under the hair the skin would still be white. but it is normal color.

...as is the inside of the ear, and the "peaks" on the scars. Unless they blend everything digitally in color correction, he looks like a guy wearing make-up.

[darknight7]

I agree, they could easily both be put on. Personally I'd prefer his natural voice to be deeper and less pinched than the "starting tonight" part, more towards mock Dent. But it'll probably be all over the place throughout the film depending on the situation, like Batman's


I posted this idea in another thread...

Judging by the tone of his voice...I am still convinced that he is mocking someone...

As if Harvey was speaking to an audience and said: "Ladies and Gentlemen of Gotham City. We are striving for new hope. I will make everyone believe that we can change Gotham. Starting tonight, people will believe. I am a man of my word." [audience claps]

*So The Joker sees this, and than mocks him in saying*

JOKER: Starting tonight, people will DIE. I am a man of my word.

I know it is SOOO EARLY to speculate this much, but that is just the vibe I get from The Joker's voice. And it is just what I am guessing for now.

--dk7

--dk7

[dark_b]

...as is the inside of the ear, and the "peaks" on the scars. Unless they blend everything digitally in color correction, he looks like a guy wearing make-up.i agree. of course we will knwo not until the last 2 months. but from this pic it looks like he doesnt hide that eh has white skin.

now i need to writte that i will wait until the movie comes out because some defender will jump here and start talking how i need to wait until hte movie comes out. than at the end he will add the definition of a teaser trailer :woot:

[Kevin Roegele]

I'm a man of my word > Never rub another man's rhubarb

[ABleedingCorpse]

I like Ledger's Joker voice. His laugh is fantastic IMO. He really seems to be crazy in his speech. As for the comparisons, meh. I'm not comparing his voice to anyone or anything. It's Ledger, It's The Joker. That's all there is to be said. He's playing a bad guy and needs a 'bad guy' voice. The voice and sound he uses works. I'm sure we'll get more of sense of what he'll really be like when December comes along. As for why he sounds like that (as in a speech problem due to scarring), I like that idea.

[Spade]

The ebbs in his white skin have flesh tones underneath. Unless he conveniently applies it just perfectly to his face over each crease, I'd have to lean towards the white face being applied by make-up. I've had to put OXY solutions on my face, and that same effect occurs. I imagine it would be useless to try and apply it to the scars as close as it shows the flesh tones to be to his wounds.

Plus, I don't think the SDCC promo was that far off from the real thing.

[dark_b]

i am now watchign the imax pic and in the new pic the red paint looks smaller. i think this new makes the joker look 100 times better.

thanks WB for this good pic.

[darknight7]

Judging by the tone of his voice...I am still convinced that he is mocking someone...

As if Harvey was speaking to an audience and said: "Ladies and Gentlemen of Gotham City. We are striving for new hope. I will make everyone believe that we can change Gotham. Starting tonight, people will believe. I am a man of my word." [audience claps]

*So The Joker sees this, and than mocks him in saying*

JOKER: Starting tonight, people will DIE. I am a man of my word.

I know it is SOOO EARLY to speculate this much, but that is just the vibe I get from The Joker's voice. And it is just what I am guessing for now.


I would actually love to see this, it would be wicked.

--dk7

[sasquatchs]

i agree. of course we will knwo not until the last 2 months. but from this pic it looks like he doesnt hide that eh has white skin.

now i need to writte that i will wait until the movie comes out because some defender will jump here and start talking how i need to wait until hte movie comes out. than at the end he will add the definition of a teaser trailer :woot:

You mean he doesn't hide that he has normal skin? Its difficult to compare with the others but in this one he clearly wants people to know its clown makeup, possibly its been partially washed off by something, or its lightly applied throughout. His smile is much stronger in the set videos though

[dark_b]

You mean he doesn't hide that he has normal skin? Its difficult to compare with the others but in this one he clearly wants people to know its clown makeup, possibly its been partially washed off by something, or its lightly applied throughout. His smile is much stronger in the set videos thoughyeah thats what i meant. to me in this pic it looks liek make up.
it looks like that because of hte ears and because of the skin under teh hair. and teh CGI argument makes no sense to me.

[RedIsNotBlue]

You mean he doesn't hide that he has normal skin? Its difficult to compare with the others but in this one he clearly wants people to know its clown makeup, possibly its been partially washed off by something, or its lightly applied throughout. His smile is much stronger in the set videos though

Yeah I mean just looking at your avatar the make-up looks much more vibrant and professional.

[dark_b]

You mean he doesn't hide that he has normal skin? Its difficult to compare with the others but in this one he clearly wants people to know its clown makeup, possibly its been partially washed off by something, or its lightly applied throughout. His smile is much stronger in the set videos thoughyeah thats what i meant. to me in this pic it looks liek make up.
it looks like that because of hte ears and because of the skin under teh hair. and teh CGI argument makes no sense to me.

[Joker8906]

the best part of this pic is that it no longer looks like the lipstick melted on top of his lips but its kinda well done.

[Milkman95]

Hilarious, Jack looked like a guy in make-up as well.......I still think the jury is out on whether or not he's perma-white or not.....

[Tempest19]

Just wondering, am I the only one scared of a Batman Returns reception from some?

The first film wasn't that dark, similar to Batman 89'.

But, the second IS dark. And by the released pic and telephone call, I think it's safe to say that this film is definitely going to be dark, creepy and genuinely unsettling at times.

With that in mind, is anyone else somewhat scared of some parents starting a boycott screaming "too dark!" as they did to Batman Returns? Or do you think the times have changed and it can get away with darkness now?

[dark_b]

Hilarious, Jack looked like a guy in make-up as well.......I still think the jury is out on whether or not he's perma-white or not.....everything can happen. i would like that twist in the movie. but i am looking at the pic and it makes no sense.

[Milkman95]

Just wondering, am I the only one scared of a Batman Returns reception from some?

The first film wasn't that dark, similar to Batman 89'.

But, the second IS dark. And by the released pic and telephone call, I think it's safe to say that this film is definitely going to be dark, creepy and genuinely unsettling at times.

With that in mind, is anyone else somewhat scared of some parents starting a boycott screaming "too dark!" as they did to Batman Returns? Or do you think the times have changed and it can get away with darkness now?

Well, you've got a point, but I think you hit the nail on the head when you said it's different now - 16 years will have passed when TDK is released. I think this change to further darkness will be welcomed.

[sasquatchs]

Just wondering, am I the only one scared of a Batman Returns reception from some?

The first film wasn't that dark, similar to Batman 89'.

But, the second IS dark. And by the released pic and telephone call, I think it's safe to say that this film is definitely going to be dark, creepy and genuinely unsettling at times.

With that in mind, is anyone else somewhat scared of some parents starting a boycott screaming "too dark!" as they did to Batman Returns? Or do you think the times have changed and it can get away with darkness now?

I hope not, I think Begins should have been darker, but a few conventional elements ruined the suspense and atmosphere, too restrained in the misery and danger department

[The Sage]

For people who don't know, here's the twist, as according to Miranda and/or Anjow...

...the Joker "isn't what he seems." Apparently, people (i.e., Dent, Gordon, Batman, the police) think he's just some makeup-wearing loon, but it's revealed at some point that he is ALL-WHITE.

This seems to suggest Joker wears skin-colored makeup on his neck, hands, etc., to make it look like he's just some whacko who wants to look like a clown, thereby fooling his pursuers. It's quite ingenius and Nolan-ish, if true, and I surely hope it is. It would be quite a shock to pull that on the casual audience during the film.



I don't get the point of the twist.

So what if his skin is really all-white? Why not just show that from the start?

[sasquatchs]

I don't get the point of the twist.

So what if his skin is really all-white? Why not just show that from the start?

It makes his origin a dead-end for the police and Batman

[Crook]

I don't get the point of the twist.

So what if his skin is really all-white? Why not just show that from the start?
Yeah, NOW he reads the spoilers, lol.

I guess it is for the people not really familiar with the Joker's origins. I didn't really notice at first, but I told a few of my friends about Joker putting on white make-up, and how that was stupid....and I got a lot of "wait, you mean it's NOT make-up?" comments. Some people just don't know it's permanently bleached I guess.

Other than that, yeah it is pretty pointless. I don't see how it'd move the story along, but it seems to go along with the Nolan-eque tradition of surprising the audience.

[The Sage]

It makes his origin a dead-end for the police and Batman

I guess. Maybe it'll make sense in the context of the story. I'm hoping that the entire movie isn't focused on that.

[Spade]

I can see why that might be a twist, but...I just don't know why they can't make it more discernable if that is indeed a real spoiler. He looks covered in make-up from what I can see. It'd make a good shock, but I don't know if the fans will hold faith long enough for that to transpire.

[sasquatchs]

Oh, I don't think it's suppose to be the huge twist, just a big frustration for Batman's investigation and detective skills

[ABleedingCorpse]

Well I was 8 or so when Returns came out. My parents took me to see it. I still have the Batman Returns popcorn bucket. My parents thought it was a little dark, but they didn't have a problem with it. They didn't complain or anything. They knew I understood the difference between real and fake. I loved Burton's Batman films. They were dark and had a sense of 'out of world' feel to them.

As for today's standards, I think The Dark Knight will be in the clear of parents complaining. Well, in the clear from the majoritiy. With this new Joker thing, it's definatly going to be dark and extream. Not R rated extream, but close. I just hope that WB does a good job in the future with tv ads and makes it look and appear to be what it's about. Not water down the ads and the PR. Make people KNOW what they are getting into and know that children are not their focus point for The Dark Knight.

[General Vulcun]

I don't know if this has been said yet, but his skin looks a lot whiter in the set videos and in the first official Joker pic, but it's all spotty-white in this one. And going with reports from Jow/Miranda that his skin is really all white and it's revealed at some point in the film, does anyone else think that in scenes like the Joker/semi chase he's just wearing the white make-up, and the scene with Rachel has him with his REAL skin?

[Aerius]

As for today's standards, I think The Dark Knight will be in the clear of parents complaining. Well, in the clear from the majoritiy. With this new Joker thing, it's definatly going to be dark and extream. Not R rated extream, but close. I just hope that WB does a good job in the future with tv ads and makes it look and appear to be what it's about. Not water down the ads and the PR. Make people KNOW what they are getting into and know that children are not their focus point for The Dark Knight.

I agree. I feel that Chris Nolan is a very classy director and has good taste when it comes to content.

[stlblues84]

Is there also the possibility of someone dunking his head in chemicals? so it leaves his hair green and his face white, then he applies the lipstick and dark eyes?

[sasquatchs]

Hilarious, Jack looked like a guy in make-up as well.......I still think the jury is out on whether or not he's perma-white or not.....

But Ledger's is supposed to look like makeup, big difference. B89 confused alot of people because the makeup was a bit ****

[ABleedingCorpse]

[/quote]does anyone else think that in scenes like the Joker/semi chase he's just wearing the white make-up, and the scene with Rachel has him with his REAL skin?[/quote]

You know, I was just thinking the same thing.

[DarthSkywalker]

Wait BB wasn't dark? People getting shot in the head isn't dark?

[millennium movies]

Im just getting sick of this wondering, i just wish Nolan would make his skin plain white, neck, arms etc all white no crappy lame "make-up" theory. Im worried about the joker in this film frankly. His personality not so much but his look very...

[DarthSkywalker]

does anyone else think that in scenes like the Joker/semi chase he's just wearing the white make-up, and the scene with Rachel has him with his REAL skin?[/quote]

You know, I was just thinking the same thing.[/QUOTE]

You can see his neck line.

[TheBat812]

does anyone else think that in scenes like the Joker/semi chase he's just wearing the white make-up, and the scene with Rachel has him with his REAL skin?[/quote]

You know, I was just thinking the same thing.[/QUOTE]

yup, i was actually about to post this theory. I think his natural skin on his face is messed up, and he just makes it more pronounced.

[millennium movies]

Wait BB wasn't dark? People getting shot in the head isn't dark?

How is that dark? So any movie where a guy gets shot is automatically dark? :dry:

[DarthSkywalker]

Im just getting sick of this wondering, i just wish Nolan would make his skin plain white, neck, arms etc all white no crappy lame "make-up" theory. Im worried about the joker in this film frankly. His personality not so much but his look very...

Yes, F depth. We just want it simple. :whatever:

[DarthSkywalker]

How is that dark? So any movie where a guy gets shot is automatically dark? :dry:

I just can't see any film that involves a scene where a man is taken to the docks to be executed not being called dark.

There are levels of darkness here.

[sasquatchs]

I just can't see any film that involves a scene where a man is taken to the docks to be executed not being called dark.

There are levels of darkness here.

But it wasn't dwelled on at all, they could have hit him with a tranq dart for all we know, no mess, too clean

[TheBat812]

But it wasn't dwelled on at all, they could have hit him with a tranq dart for all we know, no mess, too clean

That's still dark, just not gory. This film will likely be in teh same vein. Implied gore and violence. It's also much more effective, because the effect is fear, rather than being grossed out.

[millennium movies]

But it wasn't dwelled on at all, they could have hit him with a tranq dart for all we know, no mess, too clean

Exactly...some parts in begins were really just gleamed over, barely giving it much Impact or Intensity. That's where the first film lacks imo and this Joker better look good because if i wanted to see just another normal looking psycho i could watch any cop movie out there.

[NoName86]

I personally believe that it will go like this...

Batman is using his detective skills to figureo ut who this man is, remember "I'll look into it". Well, he probably spends a majority of the movie trying to figure out who this guy is. Perhaps he doesn't find anything, or he finds bits and pieces of his past and thinks he has put it together, only to find that this man isn't really what he seems at all.

I think it sounds exactly like something Nolan will do, and it gives them a chance to explore both origin and Batman's detective skills.

[sasquatchs]

That's still dark, just not gory. This film will likely be in teh same vein. Implied gore and violence. It's also much more effective, because the effect is fear, rather than being grossed out.

Its too sanitised in my opinion, you don't have to have gore, but the kill has to mean something by not cutting away instantly

[Hunter Rider]

Yes, F depth. We just want it simple. :whatever:

Putting make up on gives him depth ?

[DarthSkywalker]

These films need to be PG-13 here, remember. There will be no gore. There are no fantasy beast to kill here.

[darknight7]

Has everyone already seen this page?

http://www.whysoserious.com/wannabes.aspx

with all the pictures of the WANNABES?

--dk7

[Boom]

Putting make up on gives him depth ?
It makes him more psychotic I guess.

[Hunter Rider]

It makes him more psychotic I guess.

I'm not sure I'd go along with that,Joker has been shown as plenty psychotic in many acts without altering that bit of cannon

[TheBat812]

It makes him more psychotic I guess.

it definitely reflects a psychotic mind to have him make himself look like a clown? Only a disturbed mind would do that. It makes more sense than coincidentally looking like a clown.

[DarthSkywalker]

Putting make up on gives him depth ?

Maybe? Perhaps it becomes permit for a reason. Nolan seems to be enjoying the little things. Why Batman can glide, his training, where his care came from, the cowl, etc.

The Joker here is already more complex then anything we have seen on film from the baddies so far. He is sticking away from deformed children and people resurrected by cats. We are looking at a man that has been twisted. What and how he got there may not be explored, but the character will grow in the film.

For some reason I don't see this as the end of the Joker. Just the beginning. He won't disappeared in the third film.

[millennium movies]

Whats with you guys? I hate to stereotype people but i keep getting this vibe from you guys. None of you seem to have a clue that it has nothing to do with gore but with impact/drama/tension and building up a moment, key things directors should focus on. Whats with all this gore talk, it's like an easy excuse to defend the BB was dark issue...

[Boom]

it definitely reflects a psychotic mind to have him make himself look like a clown? Only a disturbed mind would do that. It makes more sense than coincidentally looking like a clown.
My brother does every Halloween :dry:.

[Two-Face]

Has everyone already seen this page?

http://www.whysoserious.com/wannabes.aspx

with all the pictures of the WANNABES?

--dk7

Hehe. There's Harley looklikes dressed up as Joker wannabes :joker:

[TheBat812]

My brother does every Halloween :dry:.

the obvious conclusion here is that your brother is a twisted homicidal maniac.:o :dry: :oldrazz:

[sasquatchs]

Whats with you guys? I hate to stereotype people but i keep getting this vibe from you guys. None of you seem to have a clue that it has nothing to do with gore but with impact/drama/tension and building up a moment, key things directors should focus on. Whats with all this gore talk, it's like an easy excuse to defend the BB was dark issue...

Yea, its about creating an atmosphere of dread and showing the consequences, if not the gory act itself. The thing that annoyed me about Begins was Finch was hit with a silenced gun, cut, 5 minutes later Rachel says he's probably at the bottom of the river, like it was just a mild annoyance. No impact

[DarthSkywalker]

Whats with you guys? I hate to stereotype people but i keep getting this vibe from you guys. None of you seem to have a clue that it has nothing to do with gore but with impact/drama/tension and building up a moment, key things directors should focus on. Whats with all this gore talk, it's like an easy excuse to defend the BB was dark issue...

Yeah like the reveal of Scarecrow? Bruce's final task? Bat's facing that dude in the bathroom? "Where are you? Here."

Yep no drama, build up, tension, or impact in BB.

[TheBat812]

Yea, its about creating an atmosphere of dread and showing the consequences, if not the gory act itself. The thing that annoyed me about Begins was Finch was hit with a silenced gun, cut, 5 minutes later Rachel says he's probably at the bottom of the river, like it was just a mild annoyance. No impact

It's not a huge part of the story, they're not going to linger on every minor moment. It's dark where it needs to be. The way Bruce's parents die? Fast, and brutal, hardhitting. The entire Narrows' scene? Dark and with little sense of hope. It's there, just not overbearingly. Besides, this film will be much darker, but in a similar sense.

[millennium movies]

Yeah like the reveal of Scarecrow? Bruce's final task? Bat's facing that dude in the bathroom? "Where are you? Here."

Yep no drama, build up, tension, or impact in BB.

Im glad you found it...im still searching :(

Maybe next year?

[ABleedingCorpse]

The Wannabee's look like Juggalos. Man, the Insane Clown Posse should make a cameo in The Dark Knight. That would be funny. Not going to happen and for good reason, but still funny tought.

[DarthSkywalker]

Im glad you found it...im still searching :(

Maybe next year?

Whatever problems people had with that film I think they should of went out the door during Batman's raid of Arkham. The simple reaction from Scarecrow and his gang is worth it.

[millennium movies]

Whatever problems people had with that film I think they should of went out the door during Batman's raid of Arkham. The simple reaction from Scarecrow and his gang is worth it.

It was ok except the typical comic book movie dialog from the goons.

"Is it true he can fly"...

[DarthSkywalker]

It was ok except the typical comic book movie dialog from the goons.

"Is it true he can fly"...

It is a comic book movie. :dry:

[millennium movies]

It is a comic book movie. :dry:

That's the whole point it could have been so much more, specially after all the praise that movie got and the hype from Nolan and co on how this wasnt a typical comic book. Even Bale wasn't too keen on using comic book as the term he used "graphic novel" instead.

[DarthSkywalker]

That's the whole point it could have been so much more, specially after all the praise that movie got and the hype from Nolan and co on how this wasnt a typical comic book. Even Bale wasn't too keen on using comic book as the term he used "graphic novel" instead.

Not sure what you are saying here. Honestly.

[Hunter Rider]

Maybe? Perhaps it becomes permit for a reason. Nolan seems to be enjoying the little things. Why Batman can glide, his training, where his care came from, the cowl, etc.

The Joker here is already more complex then anything we have seen on film from the baddies so far. He is sticking away from deformed children and people resurrected by cats. We are looking at a man that has been twisted. What and how he got there may not be explored, but the character will grow in the film.

For some reason I don't see this as the end of the Joker. Just the beginning. He won't disappeared in the third film.

It's not a big issue for me but i just don't see the point in messing with such an iconic character and his details

[millennium movies]

Not sure what you are saying here. Honestly.

It's all up there man, if you can't understand that well then it's probably because you dont want to or don't care. Seriously, not trying to be a smartass. :ninja:

[Mr. Socko]

Glad the gash isn't as big as it was in the first pic.

[millennium movies]

Time machine anyone? :(

[AndrewGilkison]

It was ok except the typical comic book movie dialog from the goons.

"Is it true he can fly"...

Damn, you sure are picky.

[millennium movies]

Damn, you sure are picky.

Only for movies that really take themselves very serious and are praised like the next big wonder in the world. I guess im just used to Michael Mann movies ...:wow: :oldrazz:

EDIT: But yes to answer your complaint, i am very picky, specially for Batman movies.

[Mr. Socko]

Only for movies that really take themselves very serious and are praised like the next big wonder in the world. I guess im just used to Michael Mann movies ...:wow: :oldrazz:


Your avatar reminds me of Zorro:oldrazz:

[millennium movies]

You've told me before, lol, in the TF Jazz lounge. I'll take it as a compliment :D

[DarthSkywalker]

It's not a big issue for me but i just don't see the point in messing with such an iconic character and his details

The same reason why scenes in the LOTR where omited or changed. It is necessary to make something a bit new and different for the big screen.

[DarthSkywalker]

It's all up there man, if you can't understand that well then it's probably because you dont want to or don't care. Seriously, not trying to be a smartass. :ninja:

I don't get why you where talking suddenly about the crew not taking the film as a comic book film. Are you implying that because they attempted to make it more serious then usually they should of omitted all things comic booky?

[Beanjuice]

Glad the gash isn't as big as it was in the first pic.
actually im disapointed in that, i think the first pic looked cooler now it looks like he has a rash

[Mr. Socko]

You've told me before, lol, in the TF Jazz lounge. I'll take it as a compliment :D


lol i just forgot to take me meds today, I become forgetful.



*squeezes morphine drip*

[DarthSkywalker]

Scar could progress. I am still praying for one side being damaged and the Joker matching the other side himself.

[millennium movies]

lol i just forgot to take me meds today, I become forgetful.



*squeezes morphine drip*

LOL! I was about to change it though because the smile is starting to irritate me :wow::o

I don't get why you where talking suddenly about the crew not taking the film as a comic book film. Are you implying that because they attempted to make it more serious then usually they should of omitted all things comic booky?

No just the silly things that they could have more time for the important scenes to get the proper drama and such.

[Hunter Rider]

The same reason why scenes in the LOTR where omited or changed. It is necessary to make something a bit new and different for the big screen.

those weren't quite the same as altering such a fundamental part of The Jokers appearence

[Spade]

LOL! I was about to change it though because the smile is starting to irritate me :wow::o

The new you look serial-murderous. :csad:

[millennium movies]

Socko...look now i just look like a killer...damn... :(

EDIT: wow talk about irony :eek: (post above)

[Mr. Socko]

Gandalf looks exactly as he's described in the book, it worked out perfectly.

[DarthSkywalker]

LOL! I was about to change it though because the smile is starting to irritate me :wow::o



No just the silly things that they could have more time for the important scenes to get the proper drama and such.

Maybe because BB couldn't do what you wanted it to do? Nolan seemed to be going for the first of three acts with the film, limiting himself.

[Mr. Socko]

Socko...look now i just look like a killer...damn... :(


Put the smile back!!!:oldrazz:

[Mr. Socko]

Socko...look now i just look like a killer...damn... :(

EDIT: wow talk about irony :eek: (post above)


LOL

Irony or did his post go back in time!

[DarthSkywalker]

Gandalf looks exactly as he's described in the book, it worked out perfectly.

But Aragorn was a complete overhaul.

[millennium movies]

Put the smile back!!!:oldrazz:

Im working on it!!!! :csad::ninja:

EDIT: this time machine is creepy!

[DarthSkywalker]

those weren't quite the same as altering such a fundamental part of The Jokers appearence

True, but we don't know how this is actually going to end up. Remember this film seems to span a hell of a lot.

[Hunter Rider]

But Aragorn was a complete overhaul.

He looked exactly how i pictured him when reading the books:huh:

[DarthSkywalker]

He looked exactly how i pictured him when reading the books:huh:

Aragorn never came off as a small, middle aged man to me. He was more of a big, strong guy, who lead with his voice. In the film he is far more mild and laid back.

[millennium movies]

Now you see Darth, you are acting the same way i was about BB. We all have our materials we want to see done in a certain way. Yours is LOTR and me its Batman in the movies. :)

PS: Socko if your reading this, is this better?

[Hunter Rider]

Aragorn never came off as a small, middle aged man to me. He was more of a big, strong guy, who lead with his voice. In the film he is far more mild and laid back.

He read as rugged and world worn but noble and with a calm commanding presence as opposed to a shouter and tough guy IMO

[Mr. Socko]

Now you see Darth, you are acting the same way i was about BB. We all have our materials we want to see done in a certain way. Yours is LOTR and me its Batman in the movies. :)

PS: Socko if your reading this, is this better?


Better, much bettah.

You live to please the Socko!

[DarthSkywalker]

Now you see Darth, you are acting the same way i was about BB. We all have our materials we want to see done in a certain way. Yours is LOTR and me its Batman in the movies. :)

PS: Socko if your reading this, is this better?

Oh and completely get that, only I preferred film Aragorn. :o

But we all see things differently. I can completely get that.

[Keyser Sushi]

But Aragorn was a complete overhaul.

No he wasn't... he was done exactly as described in the books! :confused:

[DarthSkywalker]

He read as rugged and world worn but noble and with a calm commanding presence as opposed to a shouter and tough guy IMO

I never got that, but then again he was the least of my cares while reading the books. Didn't like him all that much after the Strider scenes. Somehow though he was my favorite in the films far and away.

[Keyser Sushi]

Aragorn never came off as a small, middle aged man to me. He was more of a big, strong guy, who lead with his voice. In the film he is far more mild and laid back.

Um.... I don't think Viggo came off as "a small, middle-aged man" either. He came off as rather kingly, IMO, which is how Aragorn should be.

Aragorn was a worn-out, rough-around-the-edges traveler, someone who looked a bit disreputable (hence the "Strider" name) and yes, he was a strong, mighty individual. Viggo to me embodied all of that. He also made the transformation into Kingship very gracefully, IMO.

[DarthSkywalker]

Um.... I don't think Viggo came off as "a small, middle-aged man" either. He came off as rather kingly, IMO, which is how Aragorn should be.

Aragorn was a worn-out, rough-around-the-edges traveler, someone who looked a bit disreputable (hence the "Strider" name) and yes, he was a strong, mighty individual. Viggo to me embodied all of that. He also made the transformation into Kingship very gracefully, IMO.

See that was the thing, he came off a bit meek in the films in the battle scenes. He relied a bit two much on the others in battle and was the only one getting the tar beat out of him, but always was the first one up. While the others where cracking jokes he nearly dies about 50 times.

But again, just me.

[Keyser Sushi]

See that was the thing, he came off a bit meek in the films in the battle scenes. He relied a bit two much on the others in battle and was the only one getting the tar beat out of him, but always was the first one up. While the others where cracking jokes he nearly dies about 50 times.

But again, just me.

That had less to do with characterization and more to do with Peter Jackson & crew's insistence on beating the snot out of him.

The only thing that was changed, character-wise, was they gave him a measure of reluctance, of self-doubt. Beating the snot out of him was their rather heavy-handed way of giving him a "dramatic arc." But I think the character's leadership and his strength remain true.

[DarthSkywalker]

That had less to do with characterization and more to do with Peter Jackson & crew's insistence on beating the snot out of him.

The only thing that was changed, character-wise, was they gave him a measure of reluctance, of self-doubt. Beating the snot out of him was their rather heavy-handed way of giving him a "dramatic arc." But I think the character's leadership and his strength remain true.

I guess you are right. But then again isn't self-doubt the opposite take on the character?

Here though the Joker seems to have all his motivates and his look. The only difference maybe how he gets his look and whether or not it is authentic.

[Mr. Socko]

Falling into the vat of chemicals is what drives the Joker mad.

Seems like in here he's just another nut who uses face paint(still reserved on the final verdict though)

[Tempest19]

Not neccessarily, those who know the Joker know that he never has one backstory- he likes to change it up, he prefers it to be "multiple choice."

In another origin story, the Joker tells us that he was born a monster. Enjoyed torturing animals and collecting their bones as well as listening to his father beat his mother. Then his first kills are a neighborhood boy and his abusive father, all that when he's a child!

'On a summer day, he was'

[Mr. Socko]

Not neccessarily, those who know the Joker know that he never has one backstory- he likes to change it up, he prefers it to be "multiple choice."

In another origin story, the Joker tells us that he was born a monster. Enjoyed torturing animals and collecting their bones as well as listening to his father beat his mother. Then his first kills are a neighborhood boy and his abusive father, all that when he's a child!

'On a summer day, he was'

I've still always believed his skin being chalk white is a reason to his insanity.

Oh and while we're at it, why not just have Two Face just use makeup as well?

[Keyser Sushi]

I guess you are right. But then again isn't self-doubt the opposite take on the character?

To the degree that Aragorn's character in the book is one of confidence. But it's merely one aspect of his character. Also I don't think movie Aragorn doubts his physical prowess in a fight (how may orcs did he behead in Fellowship alone?) - what he doubts is his worthiness to be king, due to the fact that he is Isildur's heir and Isildur was corrupted by the ring. Aragorn knows exactly how badass he is. He just chooses to bear the metaphorical cross of his ancestor, and come to terms with it, rather than absolving himself of it right off the bat. To be fair, Aragorn in the book would probably have had to go through that at some point (in his younger life, well before the events of the book). Jackson & co. just wanted to put it onscreen, I suppose.

Here though the Joker seems to have all his motivates and his look. The only difference maybe how he gets his look and whether or not it is authentic.

Agreed. I doubt it's meant to be just makeup (I know the black and red are makeup, but the white I don't think is meant to be).

[NoName86]

I've still always believed his skin being chalk white is a reason to his insanity.

Oh and while we're at it, why not just have Two Face just use makeup as well?
I think you bring up a good point that, in a way, may further prove the assumption that his skin is indeed white, and not just make up. I'm certain that in nearly every origin of the Joker in the comics his insanity was a result of his "mutation" if you will.

[TheCosmonaut]

I thought this film wasn't going to have a Joker origin...

[Mr. Socko]

If the white is permanent..how could it have happened...just Joker's face was scarred?

Or hey, maybe they won't even explain it.

[sasquatchs]

Well one of the reasons I think the chemical avenue won't be explored in the the slightest is that it just stretches things to have 2 people snap because of disfigurement in 1 film

[millennium movies]

Not neccessarily, those who know the Joker know that he never has one backstory- he likes to change it up, he prefers it to be "multiple choice."

In another origin story, the Joker tells us that he was born a monster. Enjoyed torturing animals and collecting their bones as well as listening to his father beat his mother. Then his first kills are a neighborhood boy and his abusive father, all that when he's a child!

'On a summer day, he was'

Are you talking about the new Halloween movie? :oldrazz::o

[Tempest19]

Two-Face's origins haven't really ever strayed from the main origin story, whereas Joker's has.

In a 'On a summer day, he was' Joker tells us that he was born a monster, whereas the classic 'Killing Joke' origins the Joker does break down due to his deformity.

One interesting thing is that both Harv and Mr. J had abusive fathers!!! Weird coincidence that I found while doing research for a school project, going to post that maybe this weekend on the general Batman board. Some very interesting information that I found out are in it.

[Milkman95]

I still think we're being led to believe something that will turn out different in the end.

One thing's for sure, I'm very curious as to how this story is going to be told. Knowing both Jonathon and Chris, this should be one hell of a story full of characterization, intrigue, and more than likely, a nice twist at the end.

[Tempest19]

Are you talking about the new Halloween movie? :oldrazz::o

In the short story "On a Beautiful Summer's Day, He Was" by Robert McCammon, featured in the anthology The Further Adventures of the Joker, the Joker is suggested to have been born a monster, not made one by bad luck. The story concerns him as a young boy who derives pleasure from killing small animals (considered the hallmark sign of a budding sociopath) and collecting their bones. The story notes that his father is also insane and, in a chilling scene, beats his mother while the boy listens through the wall, grinning. The end of the story has him graduating to murder, killing a neighborhood boy who discovers his makeshift graveyard. The story identifies the Joker's last name as Napier.

In "Best of All," another story in the anthology, the Joker murdered his abusive father as a child. His mother was revealed to be Batman's old friend and confidante Leslie Thompkins, which he revealed to Batman to torment him.

Any recountings of the Joker's origin are largely unreliable, however, as they are taken directly from his own memories, and as he himself puts it in The Killing Joke, "I'm not exactly sure what happened. Sometimes I remember it one way, sometimes another... If I'm going to have a past, I prefer it to be multiple choice!"

Link (http://www.dcdatabaseproject.com/Joker)

Trust me, I was just as surprised as you were when I read/found out about that Joker origin story.

[Mr. Socko]

Two-Face's origins haven't really ever strayed from the main origin story, whereas Joker's has.



Exactly.

Two Face's origin has always had half of his face scarred.

Just as Joker has always been given permanent chalk white skin.

Some things are best left alone.

[millennium movies]

Link (http://www.dcdatabaseproject.com/Joker)

Trust me, I was just as surprised as you were when I read/found out about that Joker origin story.

I was refering to the torturing animals part and born a monster. It's exactly what Rob Zombie did to Myers now in the new movie. :(

[Tempest19]

On Two-Face, just extra clarification on scarring and him becoming Two-Face:

Also, forgot to mention it wasn't really Harvey Dent's deformity that made him go insane, well- it was and it wasn't, it was more of a trigger.

When he was growing up he had an abusive father who played a sadistic game of "heads." If the coin landed heads he would hit his son, if it landed tails he wouldn't. He often used a rare double-headed coin, which Harvey (Two-Face) later on recieves in the mythos.

So, it's more his psychological trauma as a boy remerging due to the scarring that makes him become Two-Face than the deformity itself.

[Tempest19]

Exactly.

Two Face's origin has always had half of his face scarred.

Just as Joker has always been given permanent chalk white skin.

Some things are best left alone.

I was actually only referring to the chemicals and deformity being "what made Joker insane." Not the deformity being permanent or not.

Not necessarily, in another origin story he was born a monster, thus he was already insane and the deformity just added to it but isn't the cause for his insanity like it is in the Killing Joke.

Which even then, is more of a "the world is absurd- everything goes to hell!" type push than the chemicals, in that situation the chemicals acted as a trigger to further push and reinforce that, thus driving him mad. I am pretty sure at one point during the finale he asks Batman if he finds the world to be funny/absurd and everything about it.

[Mr. Socko]

Oh yes, you're right. The psychological problems for both Joker and Two Face have changed and differ in many comics. So my previous post may not have been entirely correct. But two things have always remained the same. Joker's skin is permanently chalk white, and half of Harvey's face is disfigured. Those are two things that should never be changed, it's what made them most popular in the first place.

[Mr. Socko]

If it weren't for Goyer's help, Begins wouldn't have been what it was. Nolan has said before he directed the film, he didn't know nearly enough about Batman to be able to write a script. He came to Goyer for help with the story.

edit, that is to sasquatchs post, my post just time traveled.

[sasquatchs]

I was actually only referring to the chemicals and deformity being "what made Joker insane." Not the deformity being permanent or not.

Not necessarily, in another origin story he was born a monster, thus he was already insane and the deformity just added to it but isn't the cause for his insanity like it is in the Killing Joke.

Which even then, is more of a "the world is absurd- everything goes to hell!" type push than the chemicals, in that situation the chemicals acted as a trigger to further push and reinforce that, thus driving him mad. I am pretty sure at one point during the finale he asks Batman if he finds the world to be funny/absurd and everything about it.

They definitely shouldn't pin it down, but the Nolans don't like to explain everything anyway. Although that didnt stop them in the Begins finale, I blame GOyer

[Tempest19]

You mean with Ra's? Ra's can be killed actually and has been killed in the comics- I think, but I'm not entirely sure that he has to repeatedly go to the Lazarus Pit to remain immortal. In the comics he was killed by his daughter, who was furious that he left her in a concentration camp- not Talia, the other one starts with an N... point is though, Ra's isn't exactly immortal- the Lazarus Pit is what keeps him alive.

Unless there are minute details that explain specifically how to kill Ra's? I only know his daughter killed him.

[millennium movies]

They definitely shouldn't pin it down, but the Nolans don't like to explain everything anyway. Although that didnt stop them in the Begins finale, I blame GOyer

What part?

[Tempest19]

Oh...

[sasquatchs]

Nah, I meant, there's drugs in the pipes, Wayne Towers gonna blow, there's drugs in the pipes, Wayne Towers gonna blow,there's drugs in the pipes, Wayne Towers gonna blow.