The man who laughs: The Joker thread

[regwec]

Linda Hemming described the Joker's look as being based around his personality, in which "he doesn't care about himself at all."
It was this comment that troubled me, too. But I think she has made a bad choice of words: if a guy wears a purple frock coat, pinstripe trousers, a velvet waistcoat and a fob-chain, then it is safe to say that he is making a statement with his appearance...

[gwynplaine]

It was this comment that troubled me, too. But I think she has made a bad choice of words: if a guy wears a purple frock coat, pinstripe trousers, a velvet waistcoat and a fob-chain, then it is safe to say that he is making a statement with his appearance...
Agreed. Good point.

[El Payaso]

Doesn't sound very much like the Joker.
More like the opposite.

The only thing Joker actually does give a damn about is himself.
Pretty much.
well its not that vital.

1. joker gets slashed in the face and pulls back "NOT THE FACE" (yes like american psycho) getting really angry.

2. Joker gets slashed in the face and laughs and continues forward continuing getting slashed laughing the whole time

both are intense in their own respect.
But the clothes have more to do with him in his house choosing what to wear for the world to see, not what he'd do in a crucial moment of combat.
This movie ain't going to be The Joker's Vanity hour...
It doesn't have to be.
It was this comment that troubled me, too. But I think she has made a bad choice of words: if a guy wears a purple frock coat, pinstripe trousers, a velvet waistcoat and a fob-chain, then it is safe to say that he is making a statement with his appearance...
Yes. I have the feeling that Joker got his clothes from street and such and - being that the scenario - yes, he cares a lot for what he picks up to wear.

[Sunburned Hand]

Costume designer Linda Hemming described the Joker's look as being based around his personality, in which "he doesn't care about himself at all." She avoided his design being vagrant (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vagrancy_%28people%29), but nonetheless it is "scruffier, grungier and therefore when you see him move, he's slightly twitchier or edgy." The clown make-up is minimal; it only took an hour to apply to Ledger on each day of shooting, and the character is merely exaggerating his facial scarring. He never removes his make-up, and during the course of the film it worsens, resembling an infection

When reading this, is anyone else reminded of the female producer character from the Simpsons, the one who uses gross 'buzzwords' and who endlessly trend surfs? I shudder a little bit when she describes the Joker's appearance as 'grungier' and 'edgy,' not for what she describes, but the way she describes it - using these moronic, corporate labels. I wouldn't take what she says as an in-depth analysis of the Joker's character or psychology in this film.

[shapeshifter]

oh dear whatever will we talk about after this movie is out?

[bkey]

Batman 3?

[shapeshifter]

anyone else impressed with how well they have managed to keep 2 face's face a secret?

[Mr. Socko]

oh dear whatever will we talk about after this movie is out?


Once TDK is released we will dissect it from beginning to end throughout the rest of '08. By '09, the steam train for Batman 3 will begin to roll.

[TV's Frank]

Costume designer Linda Hemming described the Joker's look as being based around his personality, in which "he doesn't care about himself at all." She avoided his design being vagrant (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vagrancy_%28people%29), but nonetheless it is "scruffier, grungier and therefore when you see him move, he's slightly twitchier or edgy." The clown make-up is minimal; it only took an hour to apply to Ledger on each day of shooting, and the character is merely exaggerating his facial scarring. He never removes his make-up, and during the course of the film it worsens, resembling an infection

What I think she meant was that the Joker doesn't care that he has these scars. Where a typical human would do there best to cover it up or hide it, he embraces and "loves" it. And he chooses this absurd purple ensemble to accentuate his character even more. I think that the vanity of the Joker is that he loves his new look, and embraces it and it's the fact that it bothers everyone else that makes even more enjoyable for him.

Thats how I see it at least.

[sasquatchs]

The film could do with a little moment where he catches himself in a reflection

[CaptainClown]

But the clothes have more to do with him in his house choosing what to wear for the world to see, not what he'd do in a crucial moment of combat.
.
this is concerning the make up and look in general not the clothing. The clothing just looks dirty. I like it better because it means he gets dirty and isn't worried about if he ripped his jacket

[TheLongestDay]

anyone else impressed with how well they have managed to keep 2 face's face a secret?

totally,but im guessing its the Joker card ending for this movie

[El Payaso]

this is concerning the make up and look in general not the clothing. The clothing just looks dirty. I like it better because it means he gets dirty and isn't worried about if he ripped his jacket

Then why choosing purple and certain style if he doesn't care at all what he looks like?

That sounds so un-Joker. A character that stands out for his clothes style amongst other things.

[gwynplaine]

Then why choosing purple and certain style if he doesn't care at all what he looks like?

That sounds so un-Joker. A character that stands out for his clothes style amongst other things.
Heath is very stylish in TDK IMO. He looks like a strange version of a 19th century dandy, a cross between Dorian Gray and the Marquis de Sade(for the sadistic tendencies):woot: .

[Nivek]

Heath is very stylish in TDK IMO. He looks like a strange version of a 19th century dandy, a cross between Dorian Gray...

Well, thats standard Joker attire though. Thank god they at least stuck with that, because then there would be a bloodbath.


and the Marquis de Sade(for the sadistic tendencies):woot: .


....and totally lost me there. And how, prey tell, did the Marquis dress, sir? Leather loin cloth? Maplethorp bullwhip wear? :huh:

[gwynplaine]

Well, thats standard Joker attire though. Thank god they at least stuck with that, because then there would be a bloodbath.





....and totally lost me there. And how, prey tell, did the Marquis dress, sir? Leather loin cloth? Maplethorp bullwhip wear? :huh:
That's why I said for the sadistic tendencies, I didn't mean for the attire but I see how it could be misleading, sorry.
Anyway Joker looks good with a Marquis' wig, just check Conrad in TMWL:woot: .

[nathan andrew]

http://wizarduniverse.com/_images_/006550/Dark%20Knight%20Opener.JPG

was this already posted? sorry I didn't want to go through hundreds of pages.

[The Caped Knight]

http://wizarduniverse.com/_images_/006550/Dark%20Knight%20Opener.JPG



Awesome pic .

[LostSon88]

Not the full on shot ...just the cover from Wizard, I believe.

Wow...you can actually see his goons in the background.

[Darkness Falls]

http://wizarduniverse.com/_images_/006550/Dark%20Knight%20Opener.JPG

was this already posted? sorry I didn't want to go through hundreds of pages.

why is micheal myers in the background

is it a psycho convention or somthing lol

[darknight7]

why is micheal myers in the background

is it a psycho convention or somthing lol

HAHAHAH you made me LOL

--dk7

[darknight7]

http://wizarduniverse.com/_images_/006550/Dark%20Knight%20Opener.JPG

was this already posted? sorry I didn't want to go through hundreds of pages.

I love the look in his eye in this pic

--dk7

[gwynplaine]

Yeah me too and like I said before he's got a Romero vibe to him (Georges not Cesar:woot: ).

[Mr. Socko]

Only because the pose was so damn similar.

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/2514/454534cz1.jpg


Now if I could find a pic of Romero like this...

[TV's Frank]

Only because the pose was so damn similar.

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/2514/454534cz1.jpg


Now if I could find a pic of Romero like this...

Is that really the pants that Jack wore in the movie?!

Wow! It's obviously been a long time since I have seen that movie. I really thought he wore normal purple pants. :oldrazz:

[The Caped Knight]

Only because the pose was so damn similar.

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/2514/454534cz1.jpg




http://www.worldsfinestonline.com/WF/batman/btas/bios/joker/07.jpg
http://www.worldsfinestonline.com/WF/jl/bios/villains/joker/07.jpg
http://www.worldsfinestonline.com/WF/beyond/bios/joker/18.jpg

[Axtech]

Is that really the pants that Jack wore in the movie?!

Wow! It's obviously been a long time since I have seen that movie. I really thought he wore normal purple pants. :oldrazz:

he actually wears a bunch of different outfits throughout the movie!

[Luchastyle]

Is that really the pants that Jack wore in the movie?!

Wow! It's obviously been a long time since I have seen that movie. I really thought he wore normal purple pants. :oldrazz:
they were gonna do stripes but nicholson likes plaid =D

[Luchastyle]

http://wizarduniverse.com/_images_/006550/Dark%20Knight%20Opener.JPG

was this already posted? sorry I didn't want to go through hundreds of pages.
seriously though, isn't this the baddest f-ckin thing you've ever seen in your life?

[TV's Frank]

they were gonna do stripes but nicholson likes plaid =D

They look like PJ's.

I remember he also wore a silk robe with a fez, and the mime outfit he wore.

I liked the mime outfit, the robe and fez I could've done without. And those awful pajama pants.

[Darkness Falls]

Only because the pose was so damn similar.

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/2514/454534cz1.jpg


...

wow
joker and his twisted physcotic f***ed up son

[Luchastyle]

Only because the pose was so damn similar.

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/2514/454534cz1.jpg


Now if I could find a pic of Romero like this...
that really is perfect. it shows the difference really well. nicholson looks pretty cool there. but you can see the difference in tones. even though the look on nicholson's face looks pretty evil, the clothes give it a lighter tone. but then ledger....he just looks plain evil. the difference in colors really changes it all.

[Luchastyle]

They look like PJ's.

I remember he also wore a silk robe with a fez, and the mime outfit he wore.

I liked the mime outfit, the robe and fez I could've done without. And those awful pajama pants.
they do look like pj's. i have pj pants like that. i don't wear pj's, but i wanna get some purple/green one's so i can sleep like the joker =D

[TV's Frank]

seriously though, isn't this the baddest f-ckin thing you've ever seen in your life?

I saw Jack-Joker when I was 6, maybe 7 and it' didn't really bother me. Maybe because I also grew up on reruns of the 60's TV Show with Romero.

But I think if I saw this when I was 6, I would've had nightmares.

[Mr. Socko]

http://www.worldsfinestonline.com/WF/batman/btas/bios/joker/07.jpg
http://www.worldsfinestonline.com/WF/jl/bios/villains/joker/07.jpg
http://www.worldsfinestonline.com/WF/beyond/bios/joker/18.jpg

I love the TAS design, well besides not having a collar, but it was great. Never was too fond of the New Batman Adventures design for the Joker. No red lips and just a blue highlight in the hair always bothered me, and he only wore green and purple, needed more color.

They look like PJ's.

I remember he also wore a silk robe with a fez, and the mime outfit he wore.

I liked the mime outfit, the robe and fez I could've done without. And those awful pajama pants.

Haha, the plaid pants were awesome I thought but he should have worn normal purple ones as well.

[Darkness Falls]

that really is perfect. it shows the difference really well. nicholson looks pretty cool there. but you can see the difference in tones. even though the look on nicholson's face looks pretty evil, the clothes give it a lighter tone. but then ledger....he just looks plain evil. the difference in colors really changes it all.

that is a really good evaluation
good job luchastyle, i'm always impressed with what you add to discussions :up:

[Luchastyle]

I saw Jack-Joker when I was 6, maybe 7 and it' didn't really bother me. Maybe because I also grew up on reruns of the 60's TV Show with Romero.

But I think if I saw this when I was 6, I would've had nightmares.
yeah. i saw jack's joker in theatres and i was like 2. i loved him. i think i may have been afraid of ledger at the age of two. who knows? joker has a special place in my heart. i loved romero and nicholson growing up. i try not to compare them all TOO much because they are all certain interpretations for certain incarnations. but this joker, i feel like i was too young for B89 to be for me, and now this feels like the new series is my series. i'm at the right age to see it all develop and this joker is the joker of the new generation. and i'm lovin every minute of it.

[Mr. Socko]

that really is perfect. it shows the difference really well. nicholson looks pretty cool there. but you can see the difference in tones. even though the look on nicholson's face looks pretty evil, the clothes give it a lighter tone. but then ledger....he just looks plain evil. the difference in colors really changes it all.


I agree here, the attire really sets off two different tones for the exact same character. Nicholson's look is more on the clown side, Heath's look is more on the darker side.

[Luchastyle]

that is a really good evaluation
good job luchastyle, i'm always impressed with what you add to discussions :up:
^_^ thanks darkness. i appreciate that. =)

[TV's Frank]

yeah. i saw jack's joker in theatres and i was like 2. i loved him. i think i may have been afraid of ledger at the age of two. who knows? joker has a special place in my heart. i loved romero and nicholson growing up. i try not to compare them all TOO much because they are all certain interpretations for certain incarnations. but this joker, i feel like i was too young for B89 to be for me, and now this feels like the new series is my series. i'm at the right age to see it all develop and this joker is the joker of the new generation. and i'm lovin every minute of it.

I grew up on it and loved it. Well, Ghostbusters may have been first, but Batman was right there with them.

I remember having all the toys and loving them. But I have a nephew and I wanted to get him some cool toys or action figures for his birthday. Everyone gets him those crappy HOME DEPOT fake plastic tool things. So I got him the only Batman Action Figures that are out there which are from "The Batman" cartoon. The kid is scared *****less of the Joker toy. He will not touch the thing, now just imagine if he saw Heath-Joker in action. It'd probably kill the kid.

[Luchastyle]

I grew up on it and loved it. Well, Ghostbusters may have been first, but Batman was right there with them.

I remember having all the toys and loving them. But I have a nephew and I wanted to get him some cool toys or action figures for his birthday. Everyone gets him those crappy HOME DEPOT fake plastic tool things. So I got him the only Batman Action Figures that are out there which are from "The Batman" cartoon. The kid is scared *****less of the Joker toy. He will not touch the thing, now just imagine if he saw Heath-Joker in action. It'd probably kill the kid.
i also loved ghostbusters growin up =D but for some reason batman/joker were at the top for me.

yeah, i could see the "the batman" joker scarin a kid. and yeah, the fact that younger kids may ACTUALLY be afraid to see TDK really also shows the change in the two series'. joker is supposed to be frightening. if he is so frightening that a kid is afraid to see the movie, then mission accomplished.

[The Caped Knight]

I love the TAS design, well besides not having a collar, but it was great. Never was too fond of the New Batman Adventures design for the Joker. No red lips and just a blue highlight in the hair always bothered me, and he only wore green and purple, needed more color.





I Agree 100%

[TV's Frank]

i also loved ghostbusters growin up =D but for some reason batman/joker were at the top for me.

yeah, i could see the "the batman" joker scarin a kid. and yeah, the fact that younger kids may ACTUALLY be afraid to see TDK really also shows the change in the two series'. joker is supposed to be frightening. if he is so frightening that a kid is afraid to see the movie, then mission accomplished.

If that happens I will be happy. I can't tell you how annoying it was to go see S3 and have those smelly, unwashed miscreants running around pretending to shoot webs, while adding on to the crap that was S3. :woot:

[Luchastyle]

If that happens I will be happy. I can't tell you how annoying it was to go see S3 and have those smelly, unwashed miscreants running around pretending to shoot webs, while adding on to the crap that was S3. :woot:
definitely. i went to a midnight show and there were still a bunch of kids. i want to stand in line, with joker make-up on and make little kids cry. >=D

[TV's Frank]

definitely. i went to a midnight show and there were still a bunch of kids. i want to stand in line, with joker make-up on and make little kids cry. >=D

I had the same thing. Who takes their 5 year old to a Midnight showing?!

Don't get me wrong, I have no problem with kids. Just stay the hell out of my theatre at midnight.

Am I getting old? Oh, no I'm becoming my parents!

:yellow:

^don't know why I picked the Yellow Bastard, guess he just looked old.

[Luchastyle]

he's a good crazy lookin smiley. it's all they got.

[TV's Frank]

Alright. Time to get some sleep and get ready for fun day tomorrow while I get none of my projects done at work because of the Joker. Damn you Joker!!

It's been a interesting night hopefully tomorrow is even better.

[Luchastyle]

definitely. later TV.

[El Payaso]

Alright. Time to get some sleep and get ready for fun day tomorrow while I get none of my projects done at work because of the Joker. Damn you Joker!!

It's been a interesting night hopefully tomorrow is even better.

I'm having the same problem.

[American_Idiot]

Well, a mod has already posted almost immediately after my posting of the forbidden picture and he didn't seem to care, so looks like alls fair in love & war. j/k In all seriousness, I had no idea certain Joker pics were banned while others weren't. Re-read the previous sentence and try and find some logic in there. A dozen high quality images of the Joker floating around and I should be worried about posting a ok-to-decent-quality photo of the Joker kicking Batman in his kidney. If the mods/Gods want to ban me for that, well, fack, give me the guillotine, but you'll never take my freeeedom!

By the way, cool new smilies. I like. --->:bh::im::brucebat:

[Luchastyle]

well. what happened was those pictures were leaked without WB's consent and then they were all over the internet so WB took action and asked most of the bigger sites to not display them under penalty of law. so SHH is still adhering to that rule.

[WhatA.Tool]

so dont kill me for this but...

when can i get an avy?? and how do i put one up anyway?

and i looked all over the FAQs page for this..couldnt find anything...and i asked a mod but he didnt respond. :cmad:


and how do i post pics ? =D thx.

[Luchastyle]

avvy= 300 posts. it'll be a little while still

post pics= url here

[WhatA.Tool]

avvy= 300 posts. it'll be a little while still

post pics= url here

thx alot ive been wondering.

k. back on topic. =D


im sure those banned pics will be re-released eventually probably this month anyway.

[Luchastyle]

i don't know. rumor has it, that they were supposed to be used for a viral site. but yeah, it's possible that they will be used for regular promotion. in magazines and such

[WhatA.Tool]

thats what i was thinking.

id like to see the one of the joker kicking batman in the nards on like a doritos bag HA lol

[Luchastyle]

haha. probably won't see that. but it'd be funny.

[WhatA.Tool]

er i maniped that long ago when they came out ...and i hadnt joined the hype yet...i was just a reader.

i think i deleted it. but it was funny.

[Luchastyle]

heh. sounds funny

[Nepenthes]

okay we've seen pictures of the Joker with a wallet chain hanging at his side.....

however we also know that there are "no ID, no prints" on the Joker....according to Jim Gordon. Then why the hell does Joker need a wallet chain if he only carries around "some lint and a knife"? Heh? Could someone tell me that? I find this unrealistic. What the fecks on the end of the chain! :cmad: :ninja:

[CaptainClown]

he could have cash in his wallet. Maybe a subway card. Maybe he has an ID of him flipping the bird to whoever opens it

[Luchastyle]

in all seriousness, it's a watch though, right?

[Nepenthes]

a trick wallet? holy sht, of course!

Best.Joker.Evah! http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g74/ngorsh01/tdksmiley.gif

[CaptainClown]

who puts a watch in their back pocket.

anyway hell I put stupid stuff in my wallet all the time. I have had friends trying to take money out but all can find is a coupon for a free back rub by me

[Luchastyle]

but isn't that your job already? "but these are coupons.."

[CaptainClown]

oh man whats that from... VENTURE BROS YESSS YESS!

[Luchastyle]

yeah. u made a subconscious reference. at least, that's the way i took it. i love venture bros =D

[CaptainClown]

well it wasn't a reference. I really have coupons in my wallet for back rubs... I kind of hand em out to girls I meet in class that I think are attractive. You would be surprised with the responses I get back.

[Luchastyle]

haha. awesome. back rubs are good. the ladies dig em

[CaptainClown]

who said ladies? I am talking girls. you know sweet 16s... just kidding...saying that is kind of incriminating.... oh well for the sake of humor

[Luchastyle]

my girlfriend is young. she was a freshmen when i was a senior :shrug: what can ya do.

[CaptainClown]

creepy... I like older women personally.

[Luchastyle]

heh. i like em all. i'd never go out with a younger girl now. but this was goin on before i was even 18. so =\ there it is.

[CaptainClown]

aye lets move this to the lounge.

[Killing Joke926]

Now then, since in the prologue Joker does not use a towl, would the thing in his hand be the mask or concussion grenade?
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0705/31/darkknight1.jpg

[sandman01]

can anyone please post a link or send me a high res version of the empire cover picture, but without the "Empire" title...(a clean one if there is...i only have a scanned one)

[thejestergod6]

can anyone please post a link or send me a high res version of the empire cover picture, but without the "Empire" title...(a clean one if there is...i only have a scanned one)

damn if only i had a better photoshop sorry man

[thejestergod6]

Now then, since in the prologue Joker does not use a towl, would the thing in his hand be the mask or concussion grenade?
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0705/31/darkknight1.jpg




looks like a towel.. maybe hes wiping something....or its just a hands-rest:huh:

[Nepenthes]

this towel ***** again :csad:

[ChocheTheHero]

My friends, please enjoy:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p30VYoPP-b8 (http://es.youtube.com/watch?v=p30VYoPP-b8)

[d.k.]

really cool video

[Rogzilla]

Now then, since in the prologue Joker does not use a towl, would the thing in his hand be the mask or concussion grenade?
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0705/31/darkknight1.jpg

I assume you mean in his raised hand, the one that starts to go behind the camera, correct? Yes, I bet that is his mask. The towel or whatever that he has his hand on is for Heath Ledger's comfort. Much nicer than having to place your hand on something hard.

[Mercurius]

You people really go into detail. How can we possibly know? Leave it alone.

[mrsparkle]

Just bought my copy of empire. :hoboj:

Its beautiful.

[Vengeance of Bane]

Now then, since in the prologue Joker does not use a towl, would the thing in his hand be the mask or concussion grenade?
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0705/31/darkknight1.jpg

The white "towel" lying beneath the camera has nothing to do with the scene. We use them in film school and all they do is reflect the light onto specific areas. Beside if you look closely you can see that the Joker is holding a small paper card in front of the camera lense.

[Magenta666]

his silouette is amazing in that picture...it got me so suped...so do you not think this is from the prolouge?

[Yurka]

Just bought my copy of empire. :hoboj:

Its beautiful.

Are you in the States?, I've been looking and I can't find it here.

[turtlefocker]

Just bought my copy of empire. :hoboj:

Its beautiful.

scan that ****

[hegele]

concerning the picture, i think hes just leaning on the towel because they likely have to do a lot of set ups with the lights and multiple takes. the film has enough money to supply comfort for the actors.

[Magenta666]

i dont get it, its just a towel to reflect light...who cares?

[turtlefocker]

i dont get it, its just a towel to reflect light...who cares?


The raised hand...

[Magenta666]

:wow: oh!

[TheLongestDay]

enough about that bloody towel! lol

[Gary Glitter]

I use towels to hit people

*POW*

[Magenta666]

anyways....who else is a bit a little worried Joker wont have a sence of humor in this movie?

[ActuallyRobin]

not be, i think he will have a sense of humor, but it will be totally sick and twisted

[Hole Shot]

The white "towel" lying beneath the camera has nothing to do with the scene. We use them in film school and all they do is reflect the light onto specific areas. Beside if you look closely you can see that the Joker is holding a small paper card in front of the camera lense.


That his mask in his right hand.

[Magenta666]

oh i understand that, but i want to actually be able to laugh at his jokes...i do in the comics and even in TAS but i dont really see anything funny here. except for maybe the hahaha times

[bkey]

anyways....who else is a bit a little worried Joker wont have a sence of humor in this movie?


I'm not. Its gunna be a sick, twisted sense of humor, but it will definitely be there.

[blueblazer2]

Lindsay Lohan (http://imdb.com/name/nm0517820/) ditched snowboarder lover Riley Giles after hooking up with single Oscar-nominated Brokeback Mountain (http://imdb.com/title/tt0388795/) star Heath Ledger (http://imdb.com/name/nm0005132/), according to reports. The Georgia Rule (http://imdb.com/title/tt0791304/) actress split with Giles - who she met in rehab - last week, supposedly so the actress could concentrate on her career. But Australian magazine NW claims she dumped Giles after meeting Ledger in a New York club over Thanksgiving. The magazine reports, "Lindsay and Heath hit it off straight away. When she left the club she started texting him straight away and they hooked up a few times while she was still in New York. They were meeting late at night for sex. It was purely physical." Ledger has been single since splitting from fiancee Michelle Williams (http://imdb.com/name/nm0931329/) in September.

[Sun_Down]

anyways....who else is a bit a little worried Joker wont have a sence of humor in this movie?

We haven't really seen anything yet (except a lucky few), so I'd say it's too early to say that.

[The Last Meatbag]

I know this is obvious to the rest of you but..."See You in December" they really meant it...I mean I was only expecting to see a good picture of him on Whysoserious...but, he's on the cover of Wizard, Empire...on cakes in bakeries...on bazillion foot tall IMAX screens....Teaser poster, "leaked" promo pictures :o


LOVE THAT JOKER :o

[Lead_Tester]

A simple question

HOW SMART IS THE JOKER?

I have a LOT of batman comics and he always seems to know everything of anything of the DC Universe, I've heard from a lot of sources that Lex is one of the smartest persons in DC (with Batman in the first places) but noone ever mentions anything about the Joker.
Everything anyone says is that he has a very strong knowledge in chemistry and his improvissation skills are flawless....
I've seen that he's been able to fool LEX and even BATMAN himself.

What do u think?

[CaptainClown]

I have read many things, I do believe he is a genius and he is probably smarter then Batman and if he wasn't crazy he could kill batman. But he has that insane handy cap where he has to theme his gags and he likes to play cat and mouse with Batman. It really could be up for grabs, you could have Joker be really smart but Batman is smarter causing Joker to have this fixation in trying to beat him, but its all up to you

[The Caped Knight]

p30VYoPP-b8

This is cool

[TheLongestDay]

I use towels to hit people

*POW*

did you just hit ME?

:cwink:

[CrypticOne]

not be, i think he will have a sense of humor, but it will be totally sick and twisted

I agree with that, and that is what I want from him. He is a sick and twisted individual, I can't wait.

[The Joker]

p30VYoPP-b8

This is cool

That is VERY cool!

Love this new smiley, too :hoboj:

[Paste Pot Pete]

Joker will totally have a sense of humor. If the HAHAHA TIMES are any indication, he should be damn funny - some of that stuff had me rolling.

Especially crybaby Bruce missing his mommy. Hahaha :funny: :funny: :funny:

Oh, and that gossip article about Heath and Lindsay, I would assume it was purely physical. Heath seems like a pretty smart guy, and Lindsay appears... barely smarter than a sack of doorknobs.

[WhatA.Tool]

so ...Joker is the guy in the back pointing the gun right.?


http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa298/MovieLover909/The%20Dark%20Knight/JokersMinion.jpg

[Nepenthes]

^ nah. there's pics of ledger wearing the same clothes and holding the same mask as the guy in front. i'm too lazy to find them.

the guy with the gun will get taken out by the schoolbus through the glass doors........

[Eggyman]

so ...Joker is the guy in the back pointing the gun right.?


http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa298/MovieLover909/The%20Dark%20Knight/JokersMinion.jpg


Wrong, ma man.

[DarkJester]

so ...Joker is the guy in the back pointing the gun right.?


http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa298/MovieLover909/The%20Dark%20Knight/JokersMinion.jpg

He's the guy in the front... for the bajillionth time.

[WhatA.Tool]

He's the guy in the front... for the bajillionth time.

sorry . its just that the guy in the back ..his suit looks purple...and hes got the whole glove thing going on....and lastly.

in the IMAX footage joker kills his own henchmen...so i put two and two together

[The Redux 714]

Lindsay Lohan (http://imdb.com/name/nm0517820/) ditched snowboarder lover Riley Giles after hooking up with single Oscar-nominated Brokeback Mountain (http://imdb.com/title/tt0388795/) star Heath Ledger (http://imdb.com/name/nm0005132/), according to reports. The Georgia Rule (http://imdb.com/title/tt0791304/) actress split with Giles - who she met in rehab - last week, supposedly so the actress could concentrate on her career. But Australian magazine NW claims she dumped Giles after meeting Ledger in a New York club over Thanksgiving. The magazine reports, "Lindsay and Heath hit it off straight away. When she left the club she started texting him straight away and they hooked up a few times while she was still in New York. They were meeting late at night for sex. It was purely physical." Ledger has been single since splitting from fiancee Michelle Williams (http://imdb.com/name/nm0931329/) in September.

Think he wore the make-up?

I would've.

[Nivek]

sorry . its just that the guy in the back ..his suit looks purple...and hes got the whole glove thing going on....and lastly.

in the IMAX footage joker kills his own henchmen...so i put two and two together


The guy in back is about to catch the bus (if you read the spoilers, you know what I mean) in that Photo.

[Art Damage]

Only because the pose was so damn similar.

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/2514/454534cz1.jpg


Now if I could find a pic of Romero like this...

Amazing comparison!! :hoboj:

[The Caped Knight]

http://www.dccomics.com/media/heroes_and_villains/origin_stories/joker/01.jpg
http://www.dccomics.com/media/heroes_and_villains/origin_stories/joker/02.jpg

[Sonic1002]

http://www.dccomics.com/media/heroes_and_villains/origin_stories/joker/01.jpg
http://www.dccomics.com/media/heroes_and_villains/origin_stories/joker/02.jpg
PERFECT Response!

[Mr. Socko]

I love that Bolland Drawing!

[CaptainClown]

JOKER IS AWESOME IN THE CLIP!!! that is all

[Mercurius]

Bolland is simply the greatest.

His Joker is classic and, at the same time, modern. He is neat, but has this devilish smile.

[The Sage]

http://www.dccomics.com/media/heroes_and_villains/origin_stories/joker/01.jpg
http://www.dccomics.com/media/heroes_and_villains/origin_stories/joker/02.jpg

THAT. IS. EXCELLENT.

[Dark Sentinel]

i really like Bolland's Joker as well..it has a timeless quality to it which is what i like about Jim Lee's Batman as well

[Darkly Dexter]

That origin sucked.

[Cagefighterkip]

i think jack nicholsons smile was meant to look fake... like, because thats not the way anybody really smiles or looks. like it's mean to look deformed and fake that way... just my two cents though...

[El Payaso]

i think jack nicholsons smile was meant to look fake... like, because thats not the way anybody really smiles or looks. like it's mean to look deformed and fake that way... just my two cents though...

Yes. It was meant to be a deformity, which is why Napier lost his mind.

[Mike_D202]

Has there been any more new rumors about the Joker getting knocked-off in this one? Or was it the scarecrow?

[DeaDheaD]

Only because the pose was so damn similar.

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/2514/454534cz1.jpg


Now if I could find a pic of Romero like this...
Wow you know, side by side, Nicholson looks kinda dumb.

[Mike_D202]

Wow you know, side by side, Nicholson looks kinda dumb.

I guarantee if we had the pic on the right back in '89, and we had the Nicholson pic today...EVERYBODY would be pissed and saying that Shumacher came back.

[Spider-X]

So, do we know if they joker is dumped in chemicals or if he just uses face paint yet?

i don't want to shuffle through this thread anymore looking for the answer...:(

[DeaDheaD]

I guarantee if we had the pic on the right back in '89, and we had the Nicholson pic today...EVERYBODY would be pissed and saying that Shumacher came back.
Plus the "permawhite" make up on the collar would have all of us in the same fights that Heath's Joker did.

[Symbiotic]

So, do we know if they joker is dumped in chemicals or if he just uses face paint yet?

i don't want to shuffle through this thread anymore looking for the answer...:(There's your answer.

[Spider-X]

There's your answer.

thanks for answering!

that's way lame.

i kinda assumed so since his makeup seems to be running in most of these picks we've gotten of him.

the joker is always so crisp and clean looking in the comics...i wonder what made Nolan go for a grundgy unkept look.

with the dark eye circles, the dirtyness, and the nappy hair...he's like a cross between a clown and a pirate.

[Mike_D202]

Its a mixture of both (according to rumors). The make-up evens out the damage done to his face. But all we've seen are the stills which obviously shows him with make-up.

[Axtech]

Its a mixture of both (according to rumors). The make-up evens out the damage done to his face. But all we've seen are the stills which obviously shows him with make-up.

that's speculation more than anything...

[RakuMon]

Did they ever release a hi-rez version of the Joker picture in which he's sitting in the backseat of a car?

[GoogleMe94]

Only because the pose was so damn similar.

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/2514/454534cz1.jpg


Now if I could find a pic of Romero like this...


looking at this pic, i would say jack is more of the classic, comic book accurate joker cuz he looks very cleaned up, has a noticable sense of style, and theres nothing messy about him. classic joker. ledgers is something that is IMO completely original. hes got long hair, looks dirty, isnt permawhite but actually messily paints on the makeup. now this IMO seems more burton-like then what jacks joker was. not just the black circles, but the whole painted on makeup. i wonder if there gonna play out a similiar theme like burton did with catwoman cuz catwomans costume started to become more torn up and more ripped as the film went on to symbolize her loss of control and sanity, and with ledgers joker could it be that as the film goes on his makeup becomes even more sloppy and dirty and scummy to symbolize his loss of control and sanity as well? just a thought.

[TV's Frank]

looking at this pic, i would say jack is more of the classic, comic book accurate joker cuz he looks very cleaned up, has a noticable sense of style, and theres nothing messy about him. classic joker. ledgers is something that is IMO completely original. hes got long hair, looks dirty, isnt permawhite but actually messily paints on the makeup. now this IMO seems more burton-like then what jacks joker was. not just the black circles, but the whole painted on makeup. i wonder if there gonna play out a similiar theme like burton did with catwoman cuz catwomans costume started to become more torn up and more ripped as the film went on to symbolize her loss of control and sanity, and with ledgers joker could it be that as the film goes on his makeup becomes even more sloppy and dirty and scummy to symbolize his loss of control and sanity as well? just a thought.

Now I must apologize Google. That was very nice well thought out post. I take back what I said earlier about your posts.

[Magenta666]

wierd how similar the poses are, their hands are even the same

[Mr. Socko]

I guarantee if we had the pic on the right back in '89, and we had the Nicholson pic today...EVERYBODY would be pissed and saying that Shumacher came back.

Haha, laugh it up people, har har.:oldrazz:


The '89 design remains my favorite, I thought it was perfect for the Joker.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v326/bigshow321/Batman/jokerjack69.jpg

I liked the more colorful Joker look, but I know most prefer the darker, more gritty look for the Joker and that is cool. What's not cool is when people have to put down Nicholson and then to even dare suggest his look or performance wasn't comic accurate.:cmad:

[Cagefighterkip]

Yes it would be cool for Nolan to copy Burton.:brucebat:

NO! Nolan does NOT need to copy Burton in any way form or fashion sir. I respect that people have different opinions... but NO. :wow:

[Mr. Socko]

I am most certain Majik was being sarcastic.

[The Sage]

What's not cool is when people have to put down Nicholson and then to even dare suggest his look or performance wasn't comic accurate.:cmad:

Indeed. :mad::cmad::up:

[Hunter Rider]

NicHols0n T3h SuxXeD, T3h LedgEreR WilL RulLz00rS!

[CaptainClown]

NicHols0n T3h SuxXeD, T3h LedgEreR WilL RulLz00rS!

QFT!

jk Guys like that really seem to be popping up more and more

[Ridethehighwind]

So, I've barely posted here, but I wanted to throw my 2 cents into whats going on so far since I've been "sitting in the back row." I recently realized how incredible this whole viral marketing is. Joker has become this iconic character that has people describing intimate details about his personal being and thoughts in a 7 minute trailer. All of this has happened more than 6 months from the scheduled release of the film, and he was barely featured in the first one.

I for one was worried that Two-Face would steal the show, everyone waiting on when he would transform. But now **** it, this Joker has been the center of attention the whole time!

[Mr. Socko]

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/377/ldf2e54de39ffe96d934530rt4.jpg

All fanfilm Jokers look pretty bad. Thoughts?

[Yurka]

I agree, especially the caterpillar eyebrows joker

[Beanjuice]

but regardless of the look alot of the fan films are pretty good, especially patient j

[SpiderB]

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/377/ldf2e54de39ffe96d934530rt4.jpg

All fanfilm Jokers look pretty bad. Thoughts?

And yet, most fans who say they want to see a "comic-accurate" Joker portrayed on screen fail to realize this is what they'd get.

[SalaciousVC]

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/377/ldf2e54de39ffe96d934530rt4.jpg

All fanfilm Jokers look pretty bad. Thoughts?

WOW,putting Joker makeup on crap would look better :dry:

[Shoemeister]

And yet, most fans who say they want to see a "comic-accurate" Joker portrayed on screen fail to realize this is what they'd get.

Pretty much, yeah.

Or, at least, in the hands of lesser directors.

[Nivek]

Can anyone even apply make-up that doesn't look cheap when they lack a real budget? Cut them some slack,or show how it's done.

[Art Damage]

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/377/ldf2e54de39ffe96d934530rt4.jpg

All fanfilm Jokers look pretty bad. Thoughts?

Not only do fanfilm Jokers look bad, apparently they have to act bad too...

[Paste Pot Pete]

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/377/ldf2e54de39ffe96d934530rt4.jpg

All fanfilm Jokers look pretty bad. Thoughts?

I was trying to figure out who this Joker looked like (hint- Not the Joker!) when it finally came to me-

http://www.horror-wood.com/EDEAD9.jpg

Evil Dead 2, Evil Ash. :o

[Superhobo]

And yet, most fans who say they want to see a "comic-accurate" Joker portrayed on screen fail to realize this is what they'd get.

Well, no. Look at Nicholson. His was straight from the comics, design wise, and it was pert' good, I thought. Personally, I liked the Dead End Joker, as well as the Patient J Joker. I think the problem is, though, is that with a low budget, its hard to find good makeup and a good makeup artist; also, it's hard to find a way to make that purple jacket work.

[The Redux 714]

Well, no. Look at Nicholson. His was straight from the comics, design wise, and it was pert' good, I thought. Personally, I liked the Dead End Joker, as well as the Patient J Joker. I think the problem is, though, is that with a low budget, its hard to find good makeup and a good makeup artist; also, it's hard to find a way to make that purple jacket work.

Uhh...do what?

Some of us can do this rather easily. Unfortuneately, those of us that pull off the Joker look don't film ourselves.

[CaptainClown]

The fan film actors try and recreate the animated series which is like something you really can't do

[CaptainClown]

I think you could make something like the animated series but they are trying for the hamil voice and the mannerisms and it really doesn't work. If you can find someone recreate that then ya I will eat the hat I don't wear

[SpiderB]

The fan film actors try and recreate the animated series which is like something you really can't do

This is pretty much what I was getting at.

And personally, I've never found the Joker from the animated series to be scary or threatening at all. That slightly effeminate British accent (which most fans seem to love) just kills it for me. Matched with his already clean-cut and dandy appearance, he seems no more threatening than a male hairstylist.

I can't see even a professional actor managing to pull that off effectively on film.

[LexCorp]

This is pretty much what I was getting at.

And personally, I've never found the Joker from the animated series to be scary or threatening at all. That slightly effeminate British accent (which most fans seem to love) just kills it for me. Matched with his already clean-cut and dandy appearance, he seems no more threatening than a male hairstylist.

I can't see even a professional actor managing to pull that off effectively on film.

I agree but speaking as a male hairstylist I resent that. :cwink:

[Ryudoz]

The fan film actors try and recreate the animated series which is like something you really can't do

Indeed. Trying to emulate someone and their performance, no matter how great it may have been, would only remind someone about the original performance.

Be original people. A character can be portrayed differently, yet still remain true to the character. It's called interpretation.

[LexCorp]

Not sure if this has been around yet but already the new film version of the Joker has had the art treatment done.....and I like it.

http://img.photojerk.com/Killphaser/jokerbermejomanipcopyqf7.jpg

[SpiderB]

I agree but speaking as a male hairstylist I resent that. :cwink:

I was just thinking, "maybe 'drag queen' would have been more appropriate..."

How's that? :oldrazz:

[LexCorp]

I was just thinking, "maybe 'drag queen' would have been more appropriate..."

How's that? :oldrazz:

I can live with that :woot:

[dark_b]

Not sure if this has been around yet but already the new film version of the Joker has had the art treatment done.....and I like it.

http://img.photojerk.com/Killphaser/jokerbermejomanipcopyqf7.jpg
this was done by bermejo years ago.

[LexCorp]

this was done by bermejo years ago.

Interesting...still I like that there was this idea / version of tha Joker that kind of matches what has been done for the TDK.

[dark_b]

Interesting...still I like that there was this idea / version of tha Joker that kind of matches what has been done for the TDK.i think visually nolans joker looks like a mix between bermejos joker and the 1# joker

[LexCorp]

i think visually nolans joker looks like a mix between bermejos joker and the 1# joker

I can see what you mean. Do you like the Nolan version?

[Nivek]

It can be done, some poster on here, name escapes me did a really great TDK Joker make up job for Halloween.


Well, the problem is, I'm am a make-up artist. And I can do that make-up on someone with common stuff (morticians wax, latex stipple, pancake and greasepaint) out of my kit in about 20 minutes. It isn't complicated, and I could do the same exact thing for next to no money.

Nicholson's make-up, however would require lifecasts, multiple molds, foam latex casting, body airbrush paint, ect. Alot, and I mean ALOT of time went into Nicholson's Jokerdesign and application than that goes into Ledgers Hoboker.

I wish Nolan was a bit more daring, but it makes anyone here sound pretty stupid to say Ledgers make-up looks better in any way, shape or form in regards SPFX wise.

I honestly think Ledgers design was designed that way for promotion and merchandising reasons. It's so simple in comparison to any real movie make-up level.

[dark_b]

I can see what you mean. Do you like the Nolan version?i think he looks amazing. but if i would meet nolan i would slap him in the face.

make up????
f.... make up? :cmad:

[LexCorp]

i think he looks amazing. but if i would meet nolan i would slap him in the face.

make up????
f.... make up? :cmad:

Ahh I see the old make up or bleech face thing right? As I understand it the Nolan Joker has make up that is never removed...and becomes meshed with his skin...but not close enough for you I guess? :yay:

[uchiha_itachi]

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/377/ldf2e54de39ffe96d934530rt4.jpg

All fanfilm Jokers look pretty bad. Thoughts?

i think he looks like Quentin Tarantino

[LexCorp]

i think he looks like Quentin Tarantino

Hey uchiha, hows things?

You know I don't think it's that bad.

[Bat-Mite]

I wish Nolan was a bit more daring, but it makes anyone here sound pretty stupid to say Ledgers make-up looks better in any way, shape or form in regards SPFX wise.

I honestly think Ledgers design was designed that way for promotion and merchandising reasons. It's so simple in comparison to any real movie make-up level.]I seriously doubt that merchandising was the number one thing on the Nolan brothers' minds when they came up with their idea of how this Joker should look. If anything, it was probably the last thing on their mind. Also, just because something is prettier doesn't mean it's better. The Star Wars prequals were a lot prettier and better than the originals from a special effects POV, but that doesn't stop most people from liking the grittier originals more.

And as for daring... from what I've seen, most of the complainers wanted Heath to be a carbon copy of Jack's Joker. How would that have been the least bit daring if it's been done before? :huh: This design, however, has stirred up a LOT of controversy (see the makeup thread for reference). They definitely took a risk here, but I think it'll pay off in the end.

[LexCorp]

]I seriously doubt that merchandising was the number one thing on the Nolan brothers' minds when they came up with their idea of how this Joker should look. If anything, it was probably the last thing on their mind. Also, just because something is prettier doesn't mean it's better. The Star Wars prequals were a lot prettier and better than the originals from a special effects POV, but that doesn't stop most people from liking the grittier originals more.

And as for daring... from what I've seen, most of the complainers wanted Heath to be a carbon copy of Jack's Joker. How would that have been the least bit daring if it's been done before? :huh: This design, however, has stirred up a LOT of controversy (see the makeup thread for reference). They definitely took a risk here, but I think it'll pay off in the end.

Indeed I agree

[PJBoy]

http://wizarduniverse.com/_images_/006550/Dark%20Knight%20Opener.JPG

was this already posted? sorry I didn't want to go through hundreds of pages.
Badass!!

[LexCorp]

Ahh I have not yet seen that one....

Hmm the smil seems a little less extreme.

[deathfromabove]

anyways....who else is a bit a little worried Joker wont have a sence of humor in this movie?

if the prologue is any indication (which of course it is) the joker will have a sense of humour.

[LexCorp]

if the prologue is any indication (which of course it is) the joker will have a sense of humour.

I hope so...we don't need a sad clown joker.

[Comic Book Guy]

if i would meet nolan i would slap him in the face.

Me too, :csad:.

[Comic Book Guy]

not close enough for you I guess? :yay:

Me neither, :csad:.

[LexCorp]

Me neither, :csad:.

The only issue I have is I think the smile may be too normal but I can live with it.

[Etienne]

As I understand it the Nolan Joker has make up that is never removed...and becomes meshed with his skin...
Really? Are you just assuming or do you pretty much know that for sure?

[LexCorp]

Really? Are you just assuming or do you pretty much know that for sure?

It was in the Empire magazine...

[Etienne]

It was in the Empire magazine...
I see, so what do you mean by "meshed with his skin?" I assume it is just like any kind of makeup, it just sticks and is hard to come off after wearing it for a while.

[LexCorp]

I see, so what do you mean by "meshed with his skin?" I assume it is just like any kind of makeup, it just sticks and is hard to come off after wearing it for a while.

This may sound odd but you know how a fat person who sits on a couch for years becomes meshed with the couch their skin joins with it and they can not be cut free with out major incident.

I know an odd comparison but the makeup kind of "staines" the face I think....well I think.

[hannya]

"Staines" in Berkshire? Golly!

[Etienne]

This may sound odd but you know how a fat person who sits on a couch for years becomes meshed with the couch their skin joins with it and they can not be cut free with out major incident.

I know an odd comparison but the makeup kind of "staines" the face I think....well I think.
:hehe: That is an odd comparison but, I get it. Joker must've been wearing that makeup for a long time in order for it to mesh to his face.

[deathfromabove]

Well, the problem is, I'm am a make-up artist. And I can do that make-up on someone with common stuff (morticians wax, latex stipple, pancake and greasepaint) out of my kit in about 20 minutes. It isn't complicated, and I could do the same exact thing for next to no money.

Nicholson's make-up, however would require lifecasts, multiple molds, foam latex casting, body airbrush paint, ect. Alot, and I mean ALOT of time went into Nicholson's Jokerdesign and application than that goes into Ledgers Hoboker.

I wish Nolan was a bit more daring, but it makes anyone here sound pretty stupid to say Ledgers make-up looks better in any way, shape or form in regards SPFX wise.

I honestly think Ledgers design was designed that way for promotion and merchandising reasons. It's so simple in comparison to any real movie make-up level.

i have also been doing fx makeup for nearly 20 years (mostly for fun). i was making lifecasts and baking foam latex in my mother's oven in middle school.

and i completely disagree with you.

first of all jack's makeup almost looked more like makeup than ledger's and it was supposed to be permanant. on that basis alone i would say ledger's looks better because it actually looks like what its supposed to be.

and the silicone prosthetics they are using for ledger's scars are 1000 more flexible and advanced than jack's which were made using the same basic technology they used on boris karloff 70 years ago. and im certain they also required ledger to be lifecasted (if only his jaw). im sure you could fairly well replicate the look with mere wax and latex but that is clearly not what they did here. not to mention silicone appliances are used only once so they would have to cast them countless times.

to say more work and thought went into jack's look is hyperbole and has no basis whatsoever. although they look completely different the amount of time and work is certainly comparable. just because it looks like tdk's joker just applies white grease paint doesnt mean that's what the fx artists did. as a makeup artist im sure you know this.

im not sure if you saw the prologue or not but its alot harder to make someone's face look like that than just applying some white makeup and letting it sweat off a little. his face looked crazy in that shot! ledger's makeup made jack's look like a hack job! i mean aside from the big purple smudge on jack's neck there were countless scenes were you could see white makeup on his collar and sleeves. and those smile prostetics looked about as flexible as wood. dont try and make people believe that nolan's joker didnt require heath ledger to sit in a makeup chair for hours. they only reason it would have been easier to apply ledger's makeup is the fact that fx makeup has come leaps and bounds since 1989 and silicone appliances are much easier and faster to use than foam latex.

and im sure marketing was the last thing on the nolans' minds when they came up with their joker concept.

"hey you know what would sell alot of toys? a joker with horrible scars on his face who dresses like a homeless clown!"

i can completely understand if you prefer the way jack looked but enough hyperbole please.

[Mr. Wooden Alligator]

This may sound odd but you know how a fat person who sits on a couch for years becomes meshed with the couch their skin joins with it and they can not be cut free with out major incident.

I know an odd comparison but the makeup kind of "staines" the face I think....well I think.

I've heard of it, and it would be a pretty sick (in a literal sense) way of staining Joker's face. However it would seem like he would need to leave the make up on for a good while, and we have no idea of the time frame for this movie.

Why is everyone calling Joker "Hoboker"?

---Morzan

[Überlibran]

Why is everyone calling Joker "Hoboker"?

---Morzan Hobo + Joker = Hoboker. I think.

[emadz89]

the joker is the best villian to grace the batman franchise

[CaptainClown]

actually I believe that Joker is the most recognizable and favorite villain in all of the comics.. I think

[emadz89]

actually I believe that Joker is the most recognizable and favorite villain in all of the comics.. I think

touche, my friend...touche

[DaddyGrayson]

actually I believe that Joker is the most recognizable and favorite villain in all of the comics.. I think

QFT

[regwec]

"Staines" in Berkshire? Golly!
The Staines Massiv.

[Figs]

Hobo + Joker = Hoboker. I think.


I still think that's silly. Yeah his suit doesn't look like a professional dry cleaned suit from Armani or something but I don't think he looks like a hobo with a ****/dirt stained suit.

[Nivek]

i have also been doing fx makeup for nearly 20 years (mostly for fun). i was making lifecasts and baking foam latex in my mother's oven in middle school.

Not to be a shmuck, but it also states how amateur an FX artist you are, baking Foam Latex in an oven you cook food in. Thats is a big widely known no-no.Unless your Mom like ammonia as a flavor enhancer in baked foods.

and i completely disagree with you.


No Kidding

first of all jack's makeup almost looked more like makeup than ledger's and it was supposed to be permanant. on that basis alone i would say ledger's looks better because it actually looks like what its supposed to be.

[ But that make-up fit the character, as he was presented in the comics for 60 years. Ledgers design is a major departure from that cosmetic wise.

and the silicone prosthetics they are using for ledger's scars are 1000 more flexible and advanced than jack's which were made using the same basic technology they used on boris karloff 70 years ago. and im certain they also required ledger to be lifecasted (if only his jaw). im sure you could fairly well replicate the look with mere wax and latex but that is clearly not what they did here. not to mention silicone appliances are used only once so they would have to cast them countless times.

It's not like they used a type of special silicone appliance. It's silicone in place of foam latex, gelatin, or some other build up. It is soley economic (as you clearly pointed out), not anything to do with increased technology. It's not like they did anything too wild here. It's badly designed scars that look like they sculpted it in 5 minutes. It looks cheap, and Joker (in the comics and other media) NEVER HAD SCARS THERE.

to say more work and thought went into jack's look is hyperbole and has no basis whatsoever. although they look completely different the amount of time and work is certainly comparable. just because it looks like tdk's joker just applies white grease paint doesnt mean that's what the fx artists did. as a makeup artist im sure you know this.

and if you are a make-up artist, how long would it take you time wise to do ledgers design from design to application, to then do Jacks. It's not hyperbole, I'm asking flat out, as a make-up guy, which would be cheaper, simpler, and faster.

im not sure if you saw the prologue or not but its alot harder to make someone's face look like that than just applying some white makeup and letting it sweat off a little. his face looked crazy in that shot! ledger's makeup made jack's look like a hack job! i mean aside from the big purple smudge on jack's neck there were countless scenes were you could see white makeup on his collar and sleeves. and those smile prostetics looked about as flexible as wood. dont try and make people believe that nolan's joker didnt require heath ledger to sit in a makeup chair for hours. they only reason it would have been easier to apply ledger's makeup is the fact that fx makeup has come leaps and bounds since 1989 and silicone appliances are much easier and faster to use than foam latex.


Once again, Ledger has only two scars and some other spots to bring out those odd wrinkles in his face. Jacks make-up was a state of the art multi-piece foam applience in 1988, done by award winning FX artist Nick Dudman. You really seem to be straining to make it sound like Ledgers make-up was harder to make than it is. And using Silicone as some catch word isn't helping this debate, it is just starting to be used widely, but it has all if not more pratfalls as Foam latex.

and im sure marketing was the last thing on the nolans' minds when they came up with their joker concept.


"hey you know what would sell alot of toys? a joker with horrible scars on his face who dresses like a homeless clown!"

"Hey, if we make this look work, we can have face painters do this at conventions to hype the film". Oh wait, did that marketing experiment already happen?

i can completely understand if you prefer the way jack looked but enough hyperbole please.

Hyperbole? My point is it is stupid to say Jacks design looks worse than Ledger design. You can say silicone, silicone, silicone all you want, but when your talking to someone who works with and distributes silicones, foam latex, gels, foams, and other film quality SPFX supplies, your not impressing me much.

Dissing 20 year old technique thats still widely used in the industry, ON TOP of dissing a good make-up artist is pretty much making a mountain out of a mole-hill.

[chamber-music]

The Staines Massiv.
http://i2.tinypic.com/6uh9jqu.jpg (http://tinypic.com/)

Big Pimpin

[Watson]

I still think that's silly. Yeah his suit doesn't look like a professional dry cleaned suit from Armani or something but I don't think he looks like a hobo with a ****/dirt stained suit.

QFT. I don't think people have seen enough homeless people if they think Heath's Joker dresses like one. This take on the Joker is just a little more "punk" I would say...He cares about his appearance to the extent that he wants to shock people, rather like Alex in A Clockwork Orange.

[Eggyman]

http://i2.tinypic.com/6uh9jqu.jpg (http://tinypic.com/)

Big Pimpin

He looks nothing like himself there lol

Edit: 2k posts wooo hooooo!!!!

[Two-Face]

http://i2.tinypic.com/6uh9jqu.jpg (http://tinypic.com/)

Big Pimpin

The Joker is the Dracula :grin:

[sglass03]

Critiquing Ledger-Joker's look, at least in regards to SFX quality and Nicholson's Joker, seems pointless, IMO. Nolan (as well as the costume designer and many others) have stated they were going for a dirtier, more vagabond-ish Joker. Kind of like a rockstar meets an anarchist meets a serial killer. A prim n' proper makeup job would not suit this version of the character. I think it's legit to criticize if this is the right direction for the character (as opposed to the clean and well-dressed Joker we're used to), but I think we have to agree that for a "Hoboker" or "Hojoker" or whatever the hell we're calling him, it's a good look.

Not sure if this has been brought up before, but many people have been confused as to why Heath looks like he's not wearing makeup under the mask, yet as he takes it off, there it is. Some (inlcluding myself) suggest it's just an editing thing - and as IMAX is huge and shows more detail than regular film, Nolan just wasn't prepared for the amount of skin you could see around his eyes. In other words, what seemed like a safe bet (Heath not wearing the makeup during the shoot because the mask was on, anyway) turned out to be a mistake (albeit, a minor one.)

However, Nolan rarely makes these types of mistakes, and so I'm forced to ask: does this lend more credence to the permawhite argument? Joker is on the street without the mask, and his own thugs possibly see his face as they drive up. Is it possible that his skin is covered in regular makeup, and as the robbery progresses, it melts away? Many people have said that his makeup is "messy" when he first takes the mask off, because it's certainly hot under there. What if this isn't his WHITE makeup smearing, but his SKIN makeup smearing? This argument was previously applied to his hair (it darkened/dyed and gets greener as it dries/runs out.) What if that same argument can be applied to his face?

[The Joker]

actually I believe that Joker is the most recognizable and favorite villain in all of the comics.. I think

I agree! He got number 1 in Wizards greatest villains list:


http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc131/Jokerfan1980/WizardJoker1.jpg

[deathfromabove]

Dissing 20 year old technique thats still widely used in the industry, ON TOP of dissing a good make-up artist is pretty much making a mountain out of a mole-hill.


first of all i was 12 years old when i baked the foam in the oven. how many seventh graders do you know with access to industrial ovens?
:whatever:

don't be so condescending.

second of all you state that ledger's makeup design is a major departure from what has come before, that the joker never had scars and that nicholson's look was based on 60 years of comics history. that may be true but it has nothing to do with our convo and still does not prevent jack from looking like he's wearing white makeup (because he is). besides i dont really recall joker having a perma smile caused by a bullet wound in my dc back issues. i'll go look again but i dont think im going to find anything:oldrazz: i believe our conversation was about the amount of work it took to bring each look to life. and you asked me how long it would take to design the makeup.

and on silicone. im not trying to impress you. and conversely im not impressed that you work in fx. a little jealous maybe.:cwink: anyone who even remotely follows fx or reads fangoria for that matter(which im sure is alot of peopel around here) knows all about it. dont assume others dont know how things work. the fact remains that silicone is lighter, more flexible, and also has the added benefit of being somewhat translucent allowing it to have more depth and appear more realistic and allowing fx artists to make much smaller and less restrictive prosthetics that can be applied much easier. a good example is the elf ears in lotr. the one time use appliances slipped right over the tips of the actors ears, did not need additional makeup or time consuming blending edges, and allowed some light to pass through them making them look much more realistc and seamless. the fact that it can move allows fx artists to do things like make eddie murphy's jowl in nutty proffesor actually jiggle. foam doesnt do that. i would call that an improvement in technology. everyone i know who still works in fx thinks silicone is a massive improvement over traditional foam.

i read somewhere on here that ledger was talking about the makeup and said something to the effect that there were three applainces and the fx guy just "stuck them on" and that they did not hinder his movement whatsoever. maybe i'll try to find a link.

so yeah ledger's makeup was probably easier to apply but that has more to do with fx improvements than anything. and you are entitled to think ledger's scars look "like they were sculpted in five minutes" but i think they look quite like real scars actually do and not at all gratuitous and over the top like most "movie" scars do. and as far as designing the makeup wouldnt it be harder to design something new than copy something that already exists? you said yourself that jack's joker in '89 was based on comic precedent. so all they had to do was translate it to the screen. nolan and crew took joker back to the drawing board so its quite possible and probable they spent alot of time designing his look.

my point is just because ledger's face is "just makeup" in the film doesnt mean it didnt take some work to get it to look the way they wanted on screen. you can dislike the look they went with but saying the execution is amatuerish or easy is just...hyperbole.

again, i can underatand your love of jack's joker and the skill it took to bring it to life but it was 20 years ago and i think (at least to anyone who knows) it looks it. and you should really hold off from commenting on how much work went into tdk's joker until you see it on screen. it's really quite impressive and no pics that we have seen come close to doing it justice.

[turtlefocker]

I agree! He got number 1 in Wizards greatest villains list:


http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc131/Jokerfan1980/WizardJoker1.jpg

you should manip it to have ledgers joker at the top

[Mr. Socko]

first of all jack's makeup almost looked more like makeup than ledger's and it was supposed to be permanant. on that basis alone i would say ledger's looks better because it actually looks like what its supposed to be.

to say more work and thought went into jack's look is hyperbole and has no basis whatsoever. although they look completely different the amount of time and work is certainly comparable. just because it looks like tdk's joker just applies white grease paint doesnt mean that's what the fx artists did. as a makeup artist im sure you know this.

im not sure if you saw the prologue or not but its alot harder to make someone's face look like that than just applying some white makeup and letting it sweat off a little. his face looked crazy in that shot! ledger's makeup made jack's look like a hack job!

Batman'89 had a large budget during it's time, just as The Dark Knight now has a massive budget by today's standards. I don't know much about movie makeup but I'm sure a lot of work went into both. I don't even see how an argument spins from that though. If a character dons an Oscar winning makeup job it makes no difference if he was in the chair for 35 minutes or for 7 hours. But again, I do agree a lot of work probably went into Heath's design. Just the blotchy look probably took a while to perfect while applying the makeup.

But as most of you know I'll still always be here to defend Jack's Joker. There's really only one scene where the makeup bothers me and it's where the purple blotch is on his neck, but other than that I thought they did a very well job and it was good enough for me to believe it was his skin color. However, I actually could see where some would find it hard to believe. I think the biggest 'problem' for many in that area is that Jack's Joker was entirely one-tone white with no apparent veins and color through him. So while it wasn't realistic in that sense, I'll just say it was as white as he is in the comics.

http://img259.imageshack.us/img259/2782/bat062no4.jpg

[deathfromabove]

Batman'89 had a large budget during it's time, just as The Dark Knight now has a massive budget by today's standards. I don't know much about movie makeup but I'm sure a lot of work went into both. I don't even see how an argument spins from that though. If a character dons an Oscar winning makeup job it makes no difference if he was in the chair for 35 minutes or for 7 hours. But again, I do agree a lot of work probably went into Heath's design. Just the blotchy look probably took a while to perfect while applying the makeup.

But as most of you know I'll still always be here to defend Jack's Joker. There's really only one scene where the makeup bothers me and it's where the purple blotch is on his neck, but other than that I thought they did a very well job and it was good enough for me to believe it was his skin color. However, I actually could see where some would find it hard to believe. I think the biggest 'problem' for many in that area is that Jack's Joker was entirely one-tone white with no apparent veins and color through him. So while it wasn't realistic in that sense, I'll just say it was as white as he is in the comics.

http://img259.imageshack.us/img259/2782/bat062no4.jpg

i agree completely. in the context of burton's movie it worked just fine but it still looked like white makeup.

the argument seemed to come from the fact that nivek said he could replicate ledger's makeup in 20 minutes without molds or prostetics.

but i really think it stemmed from the fact that nivek doesnt care for ledger's look so he said it would be easy to do.

[StylishHokie21]

Jack's make-up just looks better, IMO.

[donk70]

http://i2.tinypic.com/6uh9jqu.jpg (http://tinypic.com/)

Big Pimpin
Jack for Ras in the reboot

[DaddyGrayson]

Jack for Ras in the reboot

TEOL

[jtfaria]

Gee, this thread is pushing one million page views.

[Cagefighterkip]

Gee, this thread is pushing one million page views.

well it's true what they say:
"LOVE THAT JOKER!"

[emadz89]

ledger was the perfect choice for joker, can't think of anyone else

[Watson]

Gee, this thread is pushing one million page views.

We're going to have to start a new one soon. Once a thread hits 20 000 posts the mods shut it down...

[SpiderB]

But as most of you know I'll still always be here to defend Jack's Joker. There's really only one scene where the makeup bothers me and it's where the purple blotch is on his neck, but other than that I thought they did a very well job and it was good enough for me to believe it was his skin color. However, I actually could see where some would find it hard to believe. I think the biggest 'problem' for many in that area is that Jack's Joker was entirely one-tone white with no apparent veins and color through him. So while it wasn't realistic in that sense, I'll just say it was as white as he is in the comics.

http://img259.imageshack.us/img259/2782/bat062no4.jpg

Well, that's the problem with permawhite that I've argued before. Chalk-white makeup will always look like makeup.

And especially in a movie where believability plays such a huge part, you can't just slap white makeup on a guy and say it's "bleached skin". It just doesn't look right.

[Mister J]

You could slap makeup on a guy and call it "bleached skin" just as easily as you could take a tank on wheels and have it fly across rooftops. The audience knows a certain suspension of belief is asked for in these films and depending on how it's framed, you can push the believability on a number of issues.

[emadz89]

that's why i'm presuming nolan went with the make up and a wise choice at that, if he did bleached....it would have to be perfect to appeal the fanboys and girls

[SpiderB]

You could slap makeup on a guy and call it "bleached skin" just as easily as you could take a tank on wheels and have it fly across rooftops. The audience knows a certain suspension of belief is asked for in these films and depending on how it's framed, you can push the believability on a number of issues.

It takes a much stronger suspension of disbelief to accept that a man could fall in some chemicals and emerge looking like clown than it does to believe that a mini tank could drive across the roof of a building.

Again, chalk white makeup will always look like makeup. The only reason it was acceptable in the '89 film was because that movie already had a surreal, comicbooky tone. It allowed for heavier suspension of disbelief. The style of Nolan's films does not. It's the same reason you didn't see Scarecrow running around in a full costume and hat.

[Mr. Socko]

Well, that's the problem with permawhite that I've argued before. Chalk-white makeup will always look like makeup.

And especially in a movie where believability plays such a huge part, you can't just slap white makeup on a guy and say it's "bleached skin". It just doesn't look right.

It looked right enough for me. But I'll just be thankful I got to see the clean pasty face Joker back in the 80s.:oldrazz:

[Magenta666]

yeah i think i might miss Mr. J from when he used to bathe

[SpiderB]

It looked right enough for me. But I'll just be thankful I got to see the clean pasty face Joker back in the 80s.:oldrazz:

Of course, and it's always been my opinion that the style of Batman '89 was perfect for showcasing the Joker in his classic form.

And now with TDK, those of us who want to see a realistic take on the character will be satisfied, too.

[ActuallyRobin]

Of course, and it's always been my opinion that the style of Batman '89 was perfect for showcasing the Joker in his classic form.

And now with TDK, those of us who want to see a realistic take on the character will be satisfied, too.

well said :) it's a different angle on the character. not necessarily better (or worse) but different. change is refreshing.

[El Payaso]

well it's true what they say:
"LOVE THAT JOKER!"

God bless Candy Walker and Amanda Keeler.

[Luchastyle]

yes. change is refreshing. i am always open to change. and i think this will be a really cool interpretation. i can't wait for the hobo j :hoboj:

[ActuallyRobin]

the Heathker! I love Jack's Joker for what it is. I just prefer more gritty and realistic stuff

[TheLongestDay]

dunno if its already been posted but Joker won BEST VILLAIN in the top 100 in FILM magazine.

BATMAN got 2nd for BEST HERO (Indiana Jones won it)

They really hyped up Dark Knight in it too!

[CaptainClown]

woo hoo I got clown shoes! They are pretty much the coolest things ever

[regwec]

Really? Cool.


I want a Tommy gun.

[CaptainClown]

Ya tommy guns are sexy, it is a shame they went out. le sigh

[mrbrownie]

This is pretty much what I was getting at.

And personally, I've never found the Joker from the animated series to be scary or threatening at all. That slightly effeminate British accent (which most fans seem to love) just kills it for me. Matched with his already clean-cut and dandy appearance, he seems no more threatening than a male hairstylist.

I can't see even a professional actor managing to pull that off effectively on film.

Ofcourse like the harmless Sweeney Todd!! :grin:

[Micah12345]

I'm going to go out on a limb and make the supposition that after the prologue and eventually the movie are released, loyalism to the Nicholson-joker will be hard to come by.

[regwec]

Doubt it. I don't see why one has to "replace" the other. I think that's rather a childish outlook.

[Micah12345]

We naturally assign higher or lower values to things with similar characteristics. That is simply the way the human mind works.

[CaptainClown]

ya, i like Nicholsons joker and so far I like heaths Joker, I wouldn't go as far to say heath is going to replace nicholson

[Mercurius]

ya, i like Nicholsons joker and so far I like heaths Joker, I wouldn't go as far to say heath is going to replace nicholson

Well, it's not THAT difficult. Nicholson would be the right guy for the role in 1979. But he did it in 1989.

[SpiderB]

Ofcourse like the harmless Sweeney Todd!! :grin:

I'll counter this by reminding you that Sweeney Todd is the Demon Barber of Fleet Street :o

[regwec]

We naturally assign higher or lower values to things with similar characteristics. That is simply the way the human mind works.
But there will be differences; much of the inspiration for Heath's Joker seems to have been an effort to differentiate it from Nicholson's. I think they will seem like entirely different sides of the same coin.

In any case, I like Romero, Nicholson and Hamill's Jokers; Heath's is just another one to add to the pile.

[Indrid Cold]

The smile for Jack's Joker was perfect. It looked very natural. They should just keep it that way. Maybe hire the same makeup guys.

That smile looked as real as Jack Nicholson having hair, and on the point of him harping to play the joker again? I have only this to say: Start collecting your check, Jackie, your done.

[Indrid Cold]

I'm just saying though...

[Mr. Socko]

the Heathker! I love Jack's Joker for what it is. I just prefer more gritty and realistic stuff

I'd say that's where my biggest problem stems. I loved Begins and will probably equally like TDK but I can't personally say I prefer the gritty realistic style.

Doubt it. I don't see why one has to "replace" the other. I think that's rather a childish outlook.
People just like to have their favorites. But hey, there are people that have said they're going to prefer Heath because of look and tone. That's fine as I already know there are those that didn't like Nicholson to begin with. I can't wait to see Heath do his thing but unfortunately he won't be able to replace Nicholson for me. If only because I dislike the tattered dirty Joker look...But at most I'm sure I could like Heath just as much if the performance is top notch.

Well, it's not THAT difficult. Nicholson would be the right guy for the role in 1979. But he did it in 1989.

He would have been even better 10 years prior yes, but I never had a big problem with that.

That smile looked as real as Jack Nicholson having hair, and on the point of him harping to play the joker again? I have only this to say: Start collecting your check, Jackie, your done.

I'm not even sure if he was serious or not. The perma-smile did look wrong in a few parts of the movie but for the most part, I liked it. But the biggest thing usually heard is how it caused restraints.

[BattyBlue]

I love seeing different interpretations of the Joker. I thought Nicholson was great and I'm intrigued to see how Ledger is going to play it. It's just another person's view.

I wonder what Schumacher would have done with the Joker given the chance? (I'm glad he wasn't btw)

[CaptainClown]

we did see what he would do with Joker, it was basically two-face and Riddler

[totaljim]

Just a discussion point..

Now that we've been shown pictures of Heath as Joker, footage in the form of the IMAX showing (which i haven't seen cos i'm an aussie :csad: ), all the viral campaigning and hearing his voice as the joker..

Can anyone say how they'd feel if Paul Bettany or Crispin Glover or any of the other rumored or discussed actors that were up for the role (in reality or in debates on this forum) got it and were in Heath's stylishly worn & beaten socks & shoes in the role..?

For example, how would Paul Bettany (who i was actually really hoping would get it, but am really happy with everything i've seen of Ledger) look/act/sound/do in the role in the new Nolanverse Gotham..?

In your opinions..?

[CaptainClown]

Wait so what? I have no idea how dedicated Bettany or Glover would be. Heath is very dedicated to the character and it seems rather rare that Bettany or Glover would put that much time that Heath says he did.

[Symbiotic]

Is the 7 minute prologue thing uploaded anywhere?No.

[Hole Shot]

Is the 7 minute prologue thing uploaded anywhere?

We're not allowed to ask that or else someone who's name sounds like Snorg will have you executed.

[turtlefocker]

No.

you must be getting tired of having to type that