Political Prejudice: Gay, Black, Or Atheist Republicans

[Spider-Bite]

For some reason I always feel bothered or offended when I hear about or meet a black, gay, or atheist republican. I just feel like WTF is wrong with you? How could you? How dare you?

I know it isn't right for me to feel that way. Those things shouldn't even matter.

I look at black republicans and say "How can you not be liberal after what happened to your grandfather. And gays? I say the same thing. Look at what's happening. And atheists, I feel like they just don't have any excuse. I don't really feel like that towards Hippie Hunter though.

When I see this black political analyst on MSNBC a lot, who's name I can't remember, defending republicans on everything I just feel so angry. I feel like he's a traitor to his own race. That's kind of how I feel about black, gay, or atheist republicans. I feel like they are traitors.

Am I the only person that feels this way?

[Kritish]

Atheists are the repressed minority that doesn't get any attention. There's actually laws in Oklahoma and Texas that say an atheist can't run for office.

[Speedball]

Well...
The Republicans DID free the slaves...

[Kritish]

Well...
The Republicans DID free the slaves...

The political parties have changed a lot since then, the republicans used to be the more social and liberal of the two. Back then it was the democrats that were conservatives.

[The Question]

For some reason I always feel bothered or offended when I hear about or meet a black, gay, or atheist republican. I just feel like WTF is wrong with you? How could you? How dare you?

I know it isn't right for me to feel that way. Those things shouldn't even matter.

I look at black republicans and say "How can you not be liberal after what happened to your grandfather. And gays? I say the same thing. Look at what's happening. And atheists, I feel like they are just blind. I don't really feel like that towards Hippie Hunter though.

When I see this black political analyst on MSNBC a lot, who's name I can't remember, defending republicans on everything I just feel so angry. I feel like he's a traitor to his own race. That's kind of how I feel about black, gay, or atheist republicans. I feel like they are traitors.

Am I the only person that feels this way?

Yeah, probably. If someone is conservative, someone is conservative. It doesn't make them a traitor to anything.

[The Chairman]

I don't see the big deal. If I can be a Christian and consider myself a Democrat, than I don't see the problem with an atheist Republican. Not all people vote based on religion when it comes to Republican.

[Kritish]

Article IX, Sec. 2, of the Tennessee constitution ("No Atheist shall hold a civil office") states: "No person who denies the being of God, or a future state of rewards and punishments shall hold any office in the civil department of this state." Arkansas, Maryland, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, South Carolina, and Texas have similar laws.

[Kritish]

I don't see the big deal. If I can be a Christian and consider myself a Democrat, than I don't see the problem with an atheist Republican. Not all people vote based on religion when it comes to Republican.

Well, Christians do tend to lean towards the right...

[Spider-Bite]

Well...
The Republicans DID free the slaves...


Back then republicans were liberals and democrats were conservative. Abraham LIncoln was actually a libertarian and the founding father of the republican party. As the parties traded values they also traded electoral maps. Back then the north was liberal and the south was conservative. That's why the north freed the slaves. And today the north is still liberal and the south is conservative.

[The Chairman]

Well, Christians do tend to lean towards the right...

Th extremely conservative ones, yes.

I myself am more liberal with my belief in the Christian faith, and I tend to have a leftist view on issues like gay marriage and abortion.

And I think the only state to elect an atheist to public office is Minnesota.

[Spider-Bite]

Article IX, Sec. 2, of the Tennessee constitution ("No Atheist shall hold a civil office") states: "No person who denies the being of God, or a future state of rewards and punishments shall hold any office in the civil department of this state." Arkansas, Maryland, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, South Carolina, and Texas have similar laws.

I'm sure if it ever becomes an issue the supreme court will strike it down.

[Speedball]

Back then republicans were liberals and democrats were conservative. Abraham LIncoln was actually a libertarian and the founding father of the republican party. As the parties traded values they also traded electoral maps. Back then the north was liberal and the south was conservative. That's why the north freed the slaves. And today the north is still liberal and the south is conservative.
I knew that...
I was trying to be funny...which I guess doesn't go off so well in thread like this.:dry:

[Kritish]

I'm sure if it ever becomes an issue the supreme court will strike it down.

I don't know that atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered patriots. This is one nation under God. -- George Herbert Walker Bush (http://www.holysmoke.org/sdhok/aa011.htm)

[The Question]

Article IX, Sec. 2, of the Tennessee constitution ("No Atheist shall hold a civil office") states: "No person who denies the being of God, or a future state of rewards and punishments shall hold any office in the civil department of this state." Arkansas, Maryland, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, South Carolina, and Texas have similar laws.

While that is fascinating, and is a law that certainly should be changed, I don't really see what it has to do with the topic at hand.

[Spider-Bite]

Th extremely conservative ones, yes.

I myself am more liberal with my belief in the Christian faith, and I tend to have a leftist view on issues like gay marriage and abortion.

And I think the only state to elect an atheist to public office is Minnesota.


I personally feel that religion discourages free thought, so in some ways I feel like Christains who are republican at least have an excuse. They are conservative for the same reason they are christain, and that is that they are bound and confined by tradition.

I know that sounds offensive to you, and it's regrettable because with you being a liberal Christain your clearly not the enemy, or the problem.

[Kritish]

While that is fascinating, and is a law that certainly should be changed, I don't really see what it has to do with the topic at hand.

No, it's very valid, blacks can run for office, gays can run for office but atheists can't.

[Sloth7d]

My friend once voted for Bush.

[Spider-Bite]

I don't know that atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered patriots. This is one nation under God. -- George Herbert Walker Bush (http://www.holysmoke.org/sdhok/aa011.htm)

I hate that man. Like father like son!

[The Chairman]

I personally feel that religion discourages free thought, so in some ways I feel like Christains who are republican at least have an excuse.

I know that sounds offensive to you, and it's regrettable because with you being a liberal Christain your clearly not the enemy, or the problem.

Christianity is not even a religion for me. I see it as a lifestyle. I feel that it only discourages free thought if you take everything in The Bible blindly without putting some things in perspective.

Since the people who wrote it were flawed men, I do not hold the belief that The Bible is infallible, because I honestly can't believe that God would condemn and support certain things. My belief that is man is flawed, and men have temptations, and prejudices, and some are in The Bible.

[Spider-Bite]

Christianity is not even a religion for me. I see it as a lifestyle. I feel that it only discourages free thought if you take everything in The Bible blindly without putting some things in perspective.

Since the people who wrote it were flawed men, I do not hold the belief that The Bible is infallible, because I honestly can't believe that God would condemn and support certain things. My belief that is man is flawed, and men have temptations, and prejudices, and some are in The Bible.

See I feel that their inability to realize those things is the very reason they believe in God in the first place. Obviously that's not the reason you believe in God, because your not like that. I couldn't say what your reason is for believing in God.

But when I meet an athest republican I feel like they've already overcome the confines of thought, in order to break free of thousands of years of traditional belief, yet they can't break free of other tradtional beliefs such as supporting war, hating gays, and trying to keep society the way it is.

[AhabTheArab]

My friend once voted for Bush.


so hes not your friend anymore right....?

[The Chairman]

See I feel that their inability to realize those things is the very reason they believe in God in the first place. Obviously that's not the reason you believe in God, because your not like that. I couldn't say what your reason is for believing in God.

But when I meet an athest republican I feel like they've already overcome the confines of thought, in order to break free of thousands of years of traditional belief, yet they can't break free of other tradtional beliefs such as supporting war, hating gays, and trying to keep society the way it is.

I see your point. Oddly enough, one of Bush's closest cabinet members is an atheist...well, almost (agnostic).

[Spider-Bite]

so hes not your friend anymore right....?

LOL

[Addendum]

If someone has a different political ideology than me, I don't see the big deal.

Only thing I don't get is joining a political party

[The Question]

I personally feel that religion discourages free thought, so in some ways I feel like Christains who are republican at least have an excuse. They are conservative for the same reason they are christain, and that is that they are bound and confined by tradition.

I know that sounds offensive to you, and it's regrettable because with you being a liberal Christain your clearly not the enemy, or the problem.

I don't really think anyone can say that religion does any one thing. Yes, religion can discourage free thought. But it can also encourage it. Religion's alot lite a swis army knife. Yeah, it's a knife. But there's a screwdriver and a melon baller in there too.

See I feel that their inability to realize those things is the very reason they believe in God in the first place. Obviously that's not the reason you believe in God, because your not like that. I couldn't say what your reason is for believing in God.



But when I meet an athest republican I feel like they've already overcome the confines of thought, in order to break free of thousands of years of traditional belief, yet they can't break free of other tradtional beliefs such as supporting war, hating gays, and trying to keep society the way it is.

I don't think there's anything to break free from. I think their minds are perfectly free. The catch with someone having a free mind is that it's free to think in ways that you don't.

[Spider-Bite]

I see your point. Oddly enough, one of Bush's closest cabinet members is an atheist...well, almost (agnostic).

That is odd.

The other day on MSNBC I saw Sharpton verses Hatchel, I think his name was. He was an atheist who wrote a lot of books, and he was bordering on bigotry towards Christains, and I thought he was a total hypocrite.

He wanted to point to the atrocities that religion causes and then claimed that religion can never cause anything good to happen.

sharpton said to the guy "your trying to have it both ways. when bush does something you disagree with, you blame it on religion, but when he does something you agree with, you claim religion had nothing to do with it"

Sharpton was referring to his support for the Iraq war, and bush's comments "God told me to strike at Saddam."

But this guy was claiming while religous people are all gungho for war, while he was claiming that the United States should invade Iran right now, and that we were right to invade Iraq. I just wished this guy could step outside himself and look at himself. He was just as narrow minded as any conservative Christain I ever heard of, and his views were just as dangerous. I don't even believe in God and I do believe that a lot of the time religion is dangerous, but Reverend Sharpton totally whipped this guy's butt in their debate.

I believe that when a Christain does something good it's out of the goodness of their heart, and not out of their religious belief. But religion can provide inspiration, and the Christain's Children's charity fund from latter day saints is the best charity in the world.

[The Chairman]

I don't really think anyone can say that religion does any one thing. Yes, religion can discourage free thought. But it can also encourage it. Religion's alot lite a swis army knife. Yeah, it's a knife. But there's a screwdriver and a melon baller in there too.

Haha, that is an excellent analogy.

[JTIZZLEVILLE]

I don't understand. I know plenty of people who are Christians, yet believe in very liberal ideas. Religion is all about your belief and relationship with God. Now, that relationship would and should effect your living and social habits. But it can't tell you what to believe. You have to search your heart and come to your own conclusion.

And Spider-Bite, I'm offended at your anger for blacks, gays and atheists who are conservatives. To categorize those groups solely into the democratic party is stereotyping, and stereotyping is basically prejudice.

Your first post makes you sound like a liberal, yet your profiling puts you in a very conservative corner. It seems like you aren't even sure what you truly believe in. This just makes your point even less valid.

[The Chairman]

That is odd.

The other day on MSNBC I saw Sharpton verses Hatchel, I think his name was. He was an atheist who wrote a lot of books, and he was bordering on bigotry towards Christains, and I thought he was a total hypocrite.

He wanted to point to the atrocities that religion causes and then claimed that religion can never cause anything good to happen.

sharpton said to the guy "your trying to have it both ways. when bush does something you disagree with, you blame it on religion, but when he does something you agree with, you claim religion had nothing to do with it"

Sharpton was referring to his support for the Iraq war, and bush's comments "God told me to strike at Saddam."

But this guy was claiming while religous people are all gungho for war, while he was claiming that the United States should invade Iran right now, and that we were right to invade Iraq. I just wished this guy could step outside himself and look at himself. He was just as narrow minded as any conservative Christain I ever heard of, and his views were just as dangerous. I don't even believe in God and I do believe that a lot of the time religion is dangerous, but Reverend Sharpton totally whipped this guy's butt in their debate.

I believe that when a Christain does something good it's out of the goodness of their heart, and not out of their religious belief. But religion can provide inspiration, and the Christain's Children's charity fund from latter day saints is the best charity in the world.

Interesting debate you brought up.

In retrospect, many philanthropists are atheists or agnostics. (Bill Gates, Bob Geldoff). There's good and bad on both sides of the coin.

[Addendum]

He has the same mindset as the hardcore religious.

[The Chairman]

BTW, I thought while we're on this subject, many consider Jesus a liberal.

[Spider-Bite]

[quote=The Question;12094500]I don't really think anyone can say that religion does any one thing. Yes, religion can discourage free thought. But it can also encourage it. Religion's alot lite a swis army knife. Yeah, it's a knife. But there's a screwdriver and a melon baller in there too.

Of course. It's like guns. Guns dont' kill people. People kill people. But the reason it discourages free thought is because they think they are letting God think for them. I don't believe it encourages free thought ever, except for Buddhism. I'm not saying Christains and Muslims can't be free thinkers. I'm just saying their religion did not encourage it.


I don't think there's anything to break free from. I think their minds are perfectly free. The catch with someone having a free mind is that it's free to think in ways that you don't.
I think that free thinking leads to atheism most of the time. I dont' know how a person can set aside their desires, traditions, and emotions, while looking at the evidence objectively and come to the conclusion that God created us.

I think that people believe in God for the following reasons only.

Fear of death or hell
Tradition, going along with their ancestors
Or they enjoy believing in God, and there is nothing wrong with that. For some people it improves the quality of their life, and helps their life feel meaningful. I don't believe there is anything wrong with that, but it's still not objective.

[The Chairman]

Tradition, going along with their ancestors
Or they enjoy believing in God, and there is nothing wrong with that. For some people it improves the quality of their life, and helps their life feel meaningful. I don't believe there is anything wrong with that, but it's still not objective.

This is more or less my reason.

[The Question]

Of course. It's like guns. Guns dont' kill people. People kill people. But the reason it discourages free thought is because they think they are letting God think for them. I don't believe it encourages free thought ever, except for Buddhism. I'm not saying Christains and Muslims can't be free thinkers. I'm just saying their religion did not encourage it.

No, it definately can encorage free thought. Not all religious people let God think for them. Hell, I've never met a religious person who felt that way personally. It's all based around how you use it.


I think that free thinking leads to atheism most of the time. I dont' know how a person can set aside their desires, traditions, and emotions, while looking at the evidence objectively and come to the conclusion that God created us.

I think that people believe in God for the following reasons only.

Fear of death or hell
Tradition, going along with their ancestors
Or they enjoy believing in God, and there is nothing wrong with that. For some people it improves the quality of their life, and helps their life feel meaningful. I don't believe there is anything wrong with that, but it's still not objective.

Free thinking doesn't lead to atheism. Free thinking leads to, well, free thinking. Free thinking isn't looking at things scientifically or objectively. It's thinking for yourself. It's coming up with your own ideas, beliefs, and conclusions. And it has nothing to do with how you reach those conclusions. I believe in God, and my mind is perfectly free. The thing is, part of that means that it's free to think differently than you do.

[Spider-Bite]

BTW, I thought while we're on this subject, many consider Jesus a liberal.

I believe that a person by the name of Jesus did exist back then, who revolutionized religion around the world, and I believe he was crucified. and I also believe he was liberal, intelligent, and brave. He had to have known that his teachings and sayings were going to get him killed and tortured but he did it anyways.

For me the "forgive them father, for they know not what they do" is powerful.

In a way it kind of reminds me of terrorism. These people don't even know that what they are doing is wrong. They know not what they do.

[Kritish]

BTW, I thought while we're on this subject, many consider Jesus a liberal.

Yeah, a neo-con wouldn't eat with prostitutes and tax collectors.

[Addendum]

But a neo-con would still make use of a prostitute

[Spider-Bite]

Free thinking isn't looking at things scientifically or objectively. It's thinking for yourself. It's coming up with your own ideas, beliefs, and conclusions. And it has nothing to do with how you reach those conclusions.

I feel that is entirely false. Looking at things scientifically means looking at it free of biased or prejudiced. You look at the evidence and weight it, and make a conclusion based on that, without any interferrence from what your ancestors thought, your emotions, or what you want to be true.

Science is about discovery, new insight, and new knowledge. That is the epitamy of free thought or "new" thought.

In the words of a Christain whom I know very well personally, "Do you really want to believe that we came from apes or from some soup?"

It doesn't matter what I want to believe, because I am not confined by what I want to believe. You show me the evidence and I will take it into consideration and I will weight it. I am free to do so.

[Addendum]

And a person is free to believe in a god-claim if they so choose

[Sloth7d]

so hes not your friend anymore right....?

I wish it was that easy.

[Spider-Bite]

And a person is free to believe in a god-claim if they so choose

Of course. When a person says free thinker, they aren't talking about civil rights. They are talking about mindset.

[The Chairman]

I believe that a person by the name of Jesus did exist back then, who revolutionized religion around the world, and I believe he was crucified. and I also believe he was liberal, intelligent, and brave. He had to have known that his teachings and sayings were going to get him killed and tortured but he did it anyways.

For me the "forgive them father, for they know not what they do" is powerful.

In a way it kind of reminds me of terrorism. These people don't even know that what they are doing is wrong. They know not what they do.

It is actually because of that verse I do not believe that only Christians go to Heaven.

[kytrigger]

For some reason I always feel bothered or offended when I hear about or meet a black, gay, or atheist republican. I just feel like WTF is wrong with you? How could you? How dare you?

I know it isn't right for me to feel that way. Those things shouldn't even matter.

I look at black republicans and say "How can you not be liberal after what happened to your grandfather. And gays? I say the same thing. Look at what's happening. And atheists, I feel like they just don't have any excuse. I don't really feel like that towards Hippie Hunter though.

When I see this black political analyst on MSNBC a lot, who's name I can't remember, defending republicans on everything I just feel so angry. I feel like he's a traitor to his own race. That's kind of how I feel about black, gay, or atheist republicans. I feel like they are traitors.

Am I the only person that feels this way?
You'd really hate one of my friends who seriosly is a gay, black Republican. And I am almost positive he is athiest too.

And I don't agree with your view on this. The fact is that there are section of Republicans just like there are with anythign else. I am a mix between conservative and libertarian but that doesn't mean I shout gospel quotes ou tin public and twist them into meaning that all gays are evil. At it's very root Rpublican is just a set of political ideals just like the Democrat party. The problem is that many people seem to mix up peronal views with political views, including many politician's themselves instead of actaully focusing on political ideals that the republican party is actually (like a smaller federal government and more power to the states etc.)

I'm sure many people do feel the same way as you, which is a shame IMO because it just shows that personal beliefs have gotten mixed up in an area where they should usually be left out of, the politacl arena.

Unfortunately, this won't change until many politicians on both sides start getting their act together and set a good ****ing example for once in their life. My hope is that the newer generation of Republicans and Democrats will help this when their time to become politicians is finally here.

[The Question]

I feel that is entirely false. Looking at things scientifically means looking at it free of biased or prejudiced. You look at the evidence and weight it, and make a conclusion based on that, without any interferrence from what your ancestors thought, your emotions, or what you want to be true.

Science is about discovery, new insight, and new knowledge. That is the epitamy of free thought or "new" thought.

In the words of a Christain whom I know very well personally, "Do you really want to believe that we came from apes or from some soup?"

It doesn't matter what I want to believe, because I am not confined by what I want to believe. You show me the evidence and I will take it into consideration and I will weight it. I am free to do so.

Well, I have looked up the definition of the term "free thinking." And yes, it is used to describe a philosophy of being free from social and religions traditions and dogmas in one's thought. So yes, the term "free thinking" does in fact have the definition you're talking about.

But this doesn't mean that religious people don't think for themselve. There are plenty of religious people who's minds are perfectly free. It's just that, in that freedom, they turned to religion.

[Spider-Bite]

It is actually because of that verse I do not believe that only Christians go to Heaven.

I see what you mean. Like assuming I'm incorrect in my belief that God doesn't exist, I would be not knowing what I do, or not knowing I'm incorrect, therefore Jesus would believe in forgiveness for me.

[The Chairman]

Well, I have looked up the definition of the term "free thinking." And yes, it is used to describe a philosophy of being free from social and religions traditions and dogmas in one's thought. So yes, the term "free thinking" does in fact have the definition you're talking about.

But this doesn't mean that religious people don't think for themselve. There are plenty of religious people who's minds are perfectly free. It's just that, in that freedom, they turned to religion.

Exactly.

[Spider-Bite]

Well, I have looked up the definition of the term "free thinking." And yes, it is used to describe a philosophy of being free from social and religions traditions and dogmas in one's thought. So yes, the term "free thinking" does in fact have the definition you're talking about.

But this doesn't mean that religious people don't think for themselve. There are plenty of religious people who's minds are perfectly free. It's just that, in that freedom, they turned to religion.

I agree with that.

[The Chairman]

I see what you mean. Like assuming I'm incorrect in my belief that God doesn't exist, I would be not knowing what I do, or not knowing I'm incorrect, therefore Jesus would believe in forgiveness for me.

That is how I feel. Hell IMO is meant for people like Hitler. Ghandi may have been Hindu, and John Lennon may have been completely ambiguous in his view of God, but they did so much good in life that they would be forgiven.

The one quote that extremely fundamentalist-based Christians use when I bring forth this belief is "I Am The Way, The Truth, And The Life, And No One Comes To The Savior But Through Me". I do believe Christ was The Savior, and I believe on his name as well as his way. However, I think following His Way matters more. Once you accept his message of thinking with your heart and treating others as you would yourself, you have earned a rightful place in Heaven.

[Spider-Bite]

You'd really hate one of my friends who seriosly is a gay, black Republican. And I am almost positive he is athiest too.

And I don't agree with your view on this. The fact is that there are section of Republicans just like there are with anythign else. I am a mix between conservative and libertarian but that doesn't mean I shout gospel quotes ou tin public and twist them into meaning that all gays are evil. At it's very root Rpublican is just a set of political ideals just like the Democrat party. The problem is that many people seem to mix up peronal views with political views, including many politician's themselves instead of actaully focusing on political ideals that the republican party is actually (like a smaller federal government and more power to the states etc.)

I'm sure many people do feel the same way as you, which is a shame IMO because it just shows that personal beliefs have gotten mixed up in an area where they should usually be left out of, the politacl arena.

Unfortunately, this won't change until many politicians on both sides start getting their act together and set a good ****ing example for once in their life. My hope is that the newer generation of Republicans and Democrats will help this when their time to become politicians is finally here.

I believe that a person black, gay, or atheist person should be just as exempt from judgement for their political beliefs as anybody else. That's why I said I don't think it's right for me to feel this way. I'm just admitting how I feel.

I feel that we should all be able to look at things and learn from them, and be liberal because of it regardless of whether were Christain, black or gay.

I get the feelings I get because these people are actually victims of the problem yet they propogate the problem and help pass it along, so I end up feeling angrier. But the reality is that these problems hurt us all even if were not black, Christain, or gay. I'm straight, yet unhappiness has fallen on me because of things that happened to my sister for being gay. As a young kid I was protected from harm, because of my friend who was black. I benefited from not being racist. That's what I mean when I say those things hurt us all. As a white man, racism could have hurt me. It didn't because me and my friend weren't racist, but it could have.

[The Question]

That is how I feel. Hell IMO is meant for people like Hitler. Ghandi may have been Hindu, and John Lennon may have been completely ambiguous in his view of God, but they did so much good in life that they would be forgiven.

The one quote that extremely fundamentalist-based Christians use when I bring forth this belief is "I Am The Way, The Truth, And The Life, And No One Comes To The Savior But Through Me". I do believe Christ was The Savior, and I believe on his name as well as his way. However, I think following His Way matters more. Once you accept his message of thinking with your heart and treating others as you would yourself, you have earned a rightful place in Heaven.

Also, one can argue that, what with the Jewish authorities being so corrupt and basically in bed with the Romans, who themselves were *******s, Jesus was the only way at the time.

[kytrigger]

I believe that a person black, gay, or atheist person should be just as exempt from judgement for their political beliefs as anybody else. That's why I said I don't think it's right for me to feel this way. I'm just admitting how I feel.

I feel that we should all be able to look at things and learn from them, and be liberal because of it regardless of whether were Christain, black or gay.

I get the feelings I get because these people are actually victims of the problem yet they propogate the problem and help pass it along, so I end up feeling angrier. But the reality is that these problems hurt us all even if were not black, Christain, or gay. I'm straight, yet unhappiness has fallen on me because of things that happened to my sister for being gay. As a young kid I was protected from harm, because of my friend who was black. I benefited from not being racist. That's what I mean when I say those things hurt us all. As a white man, racism could have hurt me. It didn't because me and my friend weren't racist, but it could have.right, I get what you're saying, and didn't mean to come off as sounding judgemental on you or anything. I am sure a lot of people feel the same way you do, and while it isn't the "right" way to feel IMO, it is very normla to feel that way becausse of our political climate. Our policticains put their personal beliefs above the political beliefs that they are supposed to be fighting for/upholding/whatever. Until the actual politicians get their **** together and just focus on actual politics instead of their gay neighbor, then MANY people will still feel the way you do, which is unfortunate IMO.

[MaskedManJRK]

BTW, I thought while we're on this subject, many consider Jesus a liberal.

"Of cource he is--he needs a shave and a haircut, he walks with the poor, he's compassionate, he has a hooker friend--he's Ted Kennedy, this guy!"
-- Bill Maher.

:woot:

And yeah, Spider-Bite, I think you're the only one with this political prejudice--well, on this board, at least. Just because the black Republican's ancestors were slaves back in the day, doesn't mean he should still be pissed off about it now. Just because a guy's gay, doesn't mean he can't like the original premise of the Republican party, which is COMPLETELY different from those who're actually in-office who call themselves Republican.

[The Chairman]

Also, one can argue that, what with the Jewish authorities being so corrupt and basically in bed with the Romans, who themselves were *******s, Jesus was the only way at the time.

Never thought about that, but it's another interesting thought.

[Manic]

There's probably some black/gay/atheist people out there who are rich, believe in capital punishment, are against gun control, and don't like the influx of immigrants. Those beliefs have nothing to do with race, sexual orientation, or religion.

[Addendum]

Did the bullies not mess with you because you had a black friend, or was your friend simply bigger than the bully

[terry78]

In comedy and some media, I admit that liberals come off as more likeable and open to things and the conservatives as these evil vampiric bloodsuckers. I'm sure that's not the case, but if you look at any female/minority repubs, some people give them a double take because some of the issues that they face aren't really addressed or are opposed by conservatives, so that's where that kind of stems from. My entire, and I mean extended family as well, are all straight democrats. I do not have a single republican relative. And if we had one, they'd probably get chewed out immensely. I tend to swing lightly liberal myself, but I'm not in agreement with all the stances.

[Spider-Bite]

Did the bullies not mess with you because you had a black friend, or was your friend simply bigger than the bully

Tougher. Well actually most of my friends were black at that time, and my closest were actually kind of tough. But the incident that came to mind was when I was 12 there was this kid who was like 14, but he seriously looked like he was a buff 20 year old. Tall, built, mustache and everything. And he was going to fight me, but my black friend named Dedgerick, totally came to my aide, and the two of us whipped his ass.

It's funny that we were kids, and the fight was over marbles, but this kid, had a record. He had hurt some people who were adults, and if it wasn't for my friend, I might have gotten hurt.

[Addendum]

So the bullies didn't mess with you because you had a friend bigger than them.

His skin color was a minor thing, compared to his size which was the major thing

[Spider-Bite]

So the bullies didn't mess with you because you had a friend bigger than them.

His skin color was a minor thing, compared to his size which was the major thing

No he wasn't that big at all. The relation to skin that I meant was that had it not been for people like Martin Luther King, me and Dedgerick never would have been friends, and I've have been on my own that day. What I'm saying is that racism hurts us all, whether your white or black, and decades ago conservatives were wrong on segregation.

This is just an example of why I know I'm wrong to feel the way I do about black, atheist, or gay conservatives. They are no more wrong than white Christain straight conservatives.

[Addendum]

And the conservatives back during segregation were members of the Democratic party.

It's called history junior.

But then, I forget that rational thought is useless when dealing with a person that has an uncanny phobia, hatred, disgust, and overpowering negative feelings toward a particular group

[hippie_hunter]

For some reason I always feel bothered or offended when I hear about or meet a black, gay, or atheist republican. I just feel like WTF is wrong with you? How could you? How dare you?

I know it isn't right for me to feel that way. Those things shouldn't even matter.

I look at black republicans and say "How can you not be liberal after what happened to your grandfather. And gays? I say the same thing. Look at what's happening. And atheists, I feel like they just don't have any excuse. I don't really feel like that towards Hippie Hunter though.

When I see this black political analyst on MSNBC a lot, who's name I can't remember, defending republicans on everything I just feel so angry. I feel like he's a traitor to his own race. That's kind of how I feel about black, gay, or atheist republicans. I feel like they are traitors.

Am I the only person that feels this way?

Republicans aren't as racist as you think. Remember that several prominent positions have been held by black Republicans (Colin Powell, Condoleezza Rice, Alan Keyes, Rod Paige, Clarence Thomas). Obviously there are disgusting racists out there and most happen to be Republicans.

And I dare you to say that to 50 Cent :oldrazz:

Although I can see where you're comming from with the gay and athiest Republicans. Especially since the neo-cons have been so intwined with the evangellicals and pretty much hate gays.

This is from the Log Cabin Republicans webpage on why many gay and even athiest Republicans support the Republican Party:


Who We Are
Log Cabin Republicans is the nation's largest organization of Republicans who support fairness, freedom, and equality for gay and lesbian Americans. Log Cabin has state and local chapters nationwide, full-time staff in California, New York City, and Washington, DC, and a federal political action committee.
What We Believe
We are loyal Republicans. We believe in limited government, strong national defense, free markets, low taxes, personal responsibility, and individual liberty. Log Cabin represents an important part of the American family—taxpaying, hard working people who proudly believe in this nation's greatness. We also believe all Americans have the right to liberty and equality. We believe equality for gay and lesbian people is in the finest tradition of the Republican Party. We educate our Party about why inclusion wins. Opposing gay and lesbian equality is inconsistent with the GOP's core principles of smaller government and personal freedom.
Why We Exist
Log Cabin Republicans work to make the Republican Party more inclusive, particularly on gay and lesbian issues. Equality will be impossible to achieve without Republican votes. Working from inside the Party—educating other Republicans about gay and lesbian issues—is the most effective way to gain new Republican allies for equality. Log Cabin also exists as a voice for GOP values among members of the gay and lesbian community.

[Spider-Bite]

And the conservatives back during segregation were members of the Democratic party.

It's called history junior.

But then, I forget that rational thought is useless when dealing with a person that has an uncanny phobia, hatred, disgust, and overpowering negative feelings toward a particular group

That's why I didn't say republicans in that post. I said conservatives. There are conservative democrats out there. Just like there are libetarian republicans.

[Addendum]

So conservatives are your c-word

[Spider-Bite]

Republicans aren't as racist as you think. Remember that several prominent positions have been held by black Republicans (Colin Powell, Condoleezza Rice, Alan Keyes, Rod Paige, Clarence Thomas). Obviously there are disgusting racists out there and most happen to be Republicans.

Yes but a person living in "black America" should not vote for the party that opposes AA bringing white and black America into one America. They should not vote for the party that insults Atheists or practices bigotry and oppression towards gays, after having been oppressed themselves. They should know better because of their own history.

And I dare you to say that to 50 Cent :oldrazz: I would from a distance.

Although I can see where you're comming from with the gay and athiest Republicans. Especially since the neo-cons have been so intwined with the evangellicals and pretty much hate gays.

This is from the Log Cabin Republicans webpage on why many gay and even athiest Republicans support the Republican Party:

[/quote]

I feel that the log cabin's goal of informing republicans from within the party isn't going to do any good. It would probably take churches to inform them from within their own party. It's probably going to take church leaders to start talking about what Jesus said about acceptance and not judging. And within the youth community liberals are making it popular and cool to accept, which will effect younger republicans.

I also believe that what Democrats need to do is actually stand up and say


If a gay couple wants to buy a house with white picket fence, buy a family dog, lift a few kids out of foster care and give them a home, and make their relationship sacred by getting married, than I say they have strong family values, which is worth more than gold in today's America.


They need to do this instead of just opposing a constitutional ammendmant. Elizabeth Edwards has come out and admitted she supports gay marriage.

[Addendum]

If someone votes for a party you're not a fan of, tough ****.

Welcome the great concept of "the right to vote for whomever you ****ing choose".

Toodles

[hippie_hunter]

Yes but a person living in "black America" should not vote for the party that opposes AA bringing white and black America into one America. They should not vote for the party that insults Atheists or practices bigotry and oppression towards gays, after having been oppressed themselves. They should know better because of their own history.
And what if there is a black person who beleives that Affirmative Action supports one over the other (which it does by the way). There are people who beleive in complete equality and that race, gender, etc. should have no effect on a person's status. Affirmative Action just reinforces this.

I would from a distance.
:oldrazz:

I feel that the log cabin's goal of informing republicans from within the party isn't going to do any good. It would probably take churches to inform them from within their own party. It's probably going to take church leaders to start talking about what Jesus said about acceptance and not judging. And within the youth community liberals are making it popular and cool to accept, which will effect younger republicans.

I also believe that what Democrats need to do is actually stand up and say

They need to do this instead of just opposing a constitutional ammendmant. Elizabeth Edwards has come out and admitted she supports gay marriage.
It's not like the Log Cabin Republicans are going out and supporting the Bush Administration, they actually stated that they do not. We support the core ideals of the Republican Party, which have already been mentioned. Social policy changes with the times, this gay marriage, abortion, etc. crap will go away eventually. But a strong military, fiscal responsibility, the size of government, etc. that is what is going to affect us in the long term

[Dan33977]

For some reason I always feel bothered or offended when I hear about or meet a black, gay, or atheist republican. I just feel like WTF is wrong with you? How could you? How dare you?

I know it isn't right for me to feel that way. Those things shouldn't even matter.

I look at black republicans and say "How can you not be liberal after what happened to your grandfather. And gays? I say the same thing. Look at what's happening. And atheists, I feel like they just don't have any excuse. I don't really feel like that towards Hippie Hunter though.

When I see this black political analyst on MSNBC a lot, who's name I can't remember, defending republicans on everything I just feel so angry. I feel like he's a traitor to his own race. That's kind of how I feel about black, gay, or atheist republicans. I feel like they are traitors.

Am I the only person that feels this way?

Aren't liberals supposed to be open-minded and tolerant of other people's views?

If someone votes for a party you're not a fan of, tough ****.

Welcome the great concept of "the right to vote for whomever you ****ing choose".

Exactly!

[Arkady Rossovich]

For some reason I always feel bothered or offended when I hear about or meet a black, gay, or atheist republican. I just feel like WTF is wrong with you? How could you? How dare you?

I feel like they are traitors.

Am I the only person that feels this way?

Supremacy.:trans:

[spideyboy_1111]

gay republicans do offend me.. i just dont understand it.. they dont have to be democratic.. but republican and gay ,just doesnt make sense at all to me

[terry78]

It also comes from the myth that conservatives are uptight and boring, and not open to anything at all. For any Hype repubs, has this view ever been used to describe you by anyone that knows your stance? It shouldn't have any bearing, but there are quite a few political stances in the conservative arena that may clash with "pop culture" type things.

[Spider-Bite]

If someone votes for a party you're not a fan of, tough ****.

Welcome the great concept of "the right to vote for whomever you ****ing choose".

Toodles

You really think you had to tell me that? I never said the government should prosecute somebody for their beliefs.

Welcome to the concept of I have the right not to like what somebody does. They have the right to vote however they want, and I have the right not to like it, and to say I dont' like it.

[Spider-Bite]

Aren't liberals supposed to be open-minded and tolerant of other people's views?



Exactly!


I can tear somebody's belief to shreds if I want to. Just because I'm open minded doesn't mean I have to embrace and love the fact that others are narrow minded.

[Addendum]

And yet you have the same mindset

[Spider-Bite]

And yet you have the same mindset

How do I have the same mindset? I believe in looking at everything scientifically and then choosing what is best based on the evidence and agrument.

It is ridiculous to try and say that I am narrow minded. I explore everything from multiple angles and constantly reevaluate and ask myself am I sure? I continually try to find a way I could be wrong or a way my opponents could be right. I have proven many times that I am capable of thinking outside the box.

As far as black, gay, and atheist republicans getting under my skin? I clearly said in the first post


I know it isn't right for me to feel that way. Those things shouldn't even matter.


and I again said


I believe that a person black, gay, or atheist person should be just as exempt from judgement for their political beliefs as anybody else. That's why I said I don't think it's right for me to feel this way. I'm just admitting how I feel.

I feel that we should all be able to look at things and learn from them, and be liberal because of it regardless of whether were Christain, black or gay.



I would also ask you to read this post.

http://forums.superherohype.com/showpost.php?p=12094794&postcount=49

[Dan33977]

And yet you have the same mindset

Exactly!

He's close-minded and hypocritical. I've been trying to illustrate this for a long time and he still doesn't acknowledge it.

[Addendum]

Baby got riled up

[Spider-Bite]

Exactly!

He's close-minded and hypocritical. I've been trying to illustrate this for a long time and he still doesn't acknowledge it.


Because it's a lie. Just because you don't agree with everything I say you look to insult it because you can't face it head on. So you smear and lie.

I don't even believe that you believe what I say is narrow minded. I think it's just a smear, and I am confident in that.

There have been times when I couldn't take somebody in an argument, and the reason ended up being that they were right and I was wrong, and I adjusted my beliefs accordingly. Yes I enjoy debating and try to convince people to see my view, but I do it honestly. If a point is proven mute to me by somebody, I wont turn around use it on somebody else, who hasn't heard the effective counteragrument.

Most people do not even care about finding out when they are wrong or want any of their incorrect beliefs to be proven to them. They only want to look right.

The following post shows what bothers me about people.

edit... How in the hell am I hypocritical? Since when have I ever said it's okay for me to do something and wrong for somebody else to do the same thing?

[eat aliens]

It also comes from the myth that conservatives are uptight and boring, and not open to anything at all. For any Hype repubs, has this view ever been used to describe you by anyone that knows your stance? It shouldn't have any bearing, but there are quite a few political stances in the conservative arena that may clash with "pop culture" type things.

All the time. Whenever I talk politics with my friends I'm always called an old man because I hold several conservative view points. I don't by any means consider myself close minded though. I believe in many of the basic principles of the republican party.... republicans now days do the exact opposite of what the party's principles stand for. If they adhered to the party's principles they wouldn't be the ones trying to ban gay marriage, growing government, spending left and right, and taking away local control from schools with the no child left behind act. It's a joke.

On the topic of this thread...I'm a minority (although not black) I believe in the more traditional believes of the republican party, as in less government intrusion in peoples' lives. I'm also pro-gun rights and do not believe in affirmative action. Which is mainly why I chose to register as a republican.

[Spider-Bite]

Political bias affects brain activity, study finds

Democrats and Republicans both adept at ignoring facts, brain scans show

http://msnbcmedia4.msn.com/j/msnbc/Components/Photos/060124/060124_debate_hmed_2p.h2.jpg

Democrats and Republicans alike are adept at making decisions without letting the facts get in the way, a new study shows.
And they get quite a rush from ignoring information that's contrary to their point of view.
Researchers asked staunch party members from both sides to evaluate information that threatened their preferred candidate prior to the 2004 Presidential election. The subjects' brains were monitored while they pondered.

The results were announced today.
"We did not see any increased activation of the parts of the brain normally engaged during reasoning," said Drew Westen, director of clinical psychology at Emory University. "What we saw instead was a network of emotion circuits lighting up, including circuits hypothesized to be involved in regulating emotion, and circuits known to be involved in resolving conflicts."
Bias on both sides
The test subjects on both sides of the political aisle reached totally biased conclusions by ignoring information that could not rationally be discounted, Westen and his colleagues say.
Then, with their minds made up, brain activity ceased in the areas that deal with negative emotions such as disgust. But activity spiked in the circuits involved in reward, a response similar to what addicts experience when they get a fix, Westen explained.
The study points to a total lack of reason in political decision-making.
"None of the circuits involved in conscious reasoning were particularly engaged," Westen said. "Essentially, it appears as if partisans twirl the cognitive kaleidoscope until they get the conclusions they want, and then they get massively reinforced for it, with the elimination of negative emotional states and activation of positive ones."
Notably absent were any increases in activation of the dorsolateral prefrontal cortex, the part of the brain most associated with reasoning.
The tests involved pairs of statements by the candidates, President George W. Bush and Senator John Kerry, that clearly contradicted each other. The test subjects were asked to consider and rate the discrepancy. Then they were presented with another statement that might explain away the contradiction. The scenario was repeated several times for each candidate.

A brain-scan technique known as functional magnetic resonance imaging, or fMRI, revealed a consistent pattern. Both Republicans and Democrats consistently denied obvious contradictions for their own candidate but detected contradictions in the opposing candidate.
"The result is that partisan beliefs are calcified, and the person can learn very little from new data," Westen said.
Other relatively neutral candidates were introduced into the mix, such as the actor Tom Hanks. Importantly, both the Democrats and Republicans reacted to the contradictions of these characters in the same manner.
The findings could prove useful beyond the campaign trail.
"Everyone from executives and judges to scientists (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11009379/#) and politicians may reason to emotionally biased judgments when they have a vested interest in how to interpret 'the facts,'" Westen said.
The researchers will present the findings Saturday at the Annual Conference of the Society for Personality and Social Psychology.

source: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11009379/
------------------------------------------------------------

This Is Your Brain On Politics

Ever wonder why fear-mongering seems to work so well at the polls—while appeals to reason often leave the electorate cold? A new book applies neuroscience to politics to figure out why the Democrats struggle to push the buttons in voters’ brains.

June 27, 2007 - Do you remember when candidate George W. Bush berated Al Gore during the 2000 presidential debates for alleged funny business in his fund-raising? Bush said, “You know, going to a Buddhist temple and then claiming it wasn’t a fund-raiser isn’t my view of responsibility.” It was a direct attack on the honor of a fellow Southerner, and Gore wasn’t taking it. “You have attacked my honor and integrity,” the vice president shot back. “I think it’s time to teach you a few old-fashioned lessons about character. When I enlisted to fight in the Vietnam War, you were talkin’ real tough about Vietnam. But when you got the call, you called your daddy and begged him to pull some strings so you wouldn’t have to go to war. So instead of defending your country with honor, you put some poor Texas millworker’s kid on the front line in your place to get shot at. Where I come from, we call that a coward.

“When I was working hard, raising my family, you were busy drinking yourself and your family into the ground. Why don’t you tell us how many times you got behind the wheel of a car with a few drinks under your belt? Where I come from, we call that a drunk.
“When I was serving in the U.S. Senate, your own father’s government had to investigate you on the charge that you’d swindled a bunch of old people out of their life savings by using insider knowledge to sell off stocks you knew were about to drop. Where I come from, we call that crooked. So governor, don’t you ever lecture me about character. And don’t you ever talk to me that way again in front of my family or my fellow citizens.”
Don’t remember that reply? There’s a reason: Gore never said anything like it. Challenged by Bush on the temple fundraiser, he instead sidestepped the attack with a lofty but wimpy declaration about wanting “to spend my time making this country even better than it is, not trying to make you out to be a bad person.” The response-that-wasn’t-but-should-have-been is the work of psychology researcher Drew Westen of Emory University, one of many “what ifs” in his new book, “The Political Brain: The Role of Emotion in Deciding the Fate of the Nation.” After reading them you won’t be surprised that Westen has been approached by the campaigns of “several” Democratic hopefuls (he is too discrete to say which) for advice on how to make use of findings about how the brain operates in the political arena. Why aren’t Republicans beating a path to his door? Because the GOP has already mastered the dark art of psych-ops—of pushing the right buttons in people’s brains to win their vote.

Westen’s thesis is simple. “A dispassionate mind that makes decisions by weighing the evidence and reasoning to the most valid conclusions bears no relation to how the mind and brain actually work.” That’s true when it comes to choosing a significant other, buying a car, and choosing a president. Madison Avenue has known this for decades. Democrats haven’t. Instead, their strategists start from an 18th-century vision of the mind as dispassionate, making decisions by rationally weighing evidence and balancing pros and cons. That assumption is a recipe for high-minded campaigning—and, often, electoral failure. But by recognizing the strides that neuroscience, psychology and, in particular, the science of decision making have made in recent years, Westen argues, politicians can tap into “the emotional brain” that guides most political decisions.

If you think your political decisions are coldly rational, think again. Even when we “rationally” assess a candidate’s position on, say, tax policy or immigration, emotions shape our judgment. (In 2000 the conservative majority on the U.S. Supreme Court, famously hostile toward federal intervention in state matters, overturned the decision of the Florida Supreme Court in Bush v. Gore and put the former in the White House. Go figure.) “Behind every reasoned decision is a reason for deciding,” Westen writes. “We do not pay attention to arguments unless they engender our interest, enthusiasm, fear, anger or contempt . . . We do not find policies worth debating if they don’t touch on the emotional implications for ourselves, our families or things we hold dear.” Something you “hold dear” can be, for instance, a principled position in favour of sending more troops to Iraq; you can tell yourself that that position resides in an emotion-free zone, but in all likelihood it reflects feelings of pride, fear, commitment and the like—emotions, all.
There is no shame in being motivated by wishes, fears and values. Emotions actually provide a reasonable compass for guiding behavior. Neuroscientists find, for instance, that emotions guide moral decisions, and do so pretty well. Although the political brain is an emotional brain, this doesn’t mean that voters’ basest instincts—racism, homophobia, religious intolerance, xenophobia—are the only or even the principle emotions in play. One can feel good about, say, a ban on capital punishment even if that position also has rational underpinnings.
Because emotions are central to beliefs and values, if an appeal is purely rational it is unlikely to tickle the emotional brain circuits that affect what we do in the voting booth. To the contrary: emotions can trump rationality. “People were drawn to Reagan because they identified with him, liked his emphasis on values over policy, trusted him, and found him authentic in his beliefs,” Westen writes. “It didn’t matter that they disagreed with most of his policy positions.” The same forces were at work in 2004, when pollsters found that voters in small-town America placed more weight on issues unlikely to directly affect their lives, such as terrorism and violent crime and gay marriage in Massachusetts, than on those that were, such as mine safety. Positions on issues matter to the extent they incite voters’ emotions.

Neuroscience research backs up the poll results. When voters are hooked up to brain-imaging devices while watching candidates, it is emotion circuits and not the rational frontal lobes that are most engaged. When voters assess who won a campaign debate, they almost always choose the candidate they liked better beforehand. The rationality circuit “isn’t typically open for business when partisans are thinking about things that matter to them,” Westen notes. Yet “this is the part of the brain to which Democrats typically target their appeals.”

Just as in the imagined response by Gore to Bush’s attack on his character, Westen has penned powerful sound bites and mini-speeches that Dems could use to justify their core positions on perennial issues. Abortion, and bills outlawing it (as GOP platforms have long called for) or requiring parental consent? “My opponent puts the rights of rapists above the rights of their victims, guaranteeing every rapist the right to choose the mother of his child. . . My opponent believes that if a 16-year-old girl is molested by her father and becomes pregnant, she should be forced by the government to have his child, and if she doesn’t want to she should be forced by the government to go to the man who raped her and ask for his consent.” Tougher gun restrictions? How about an ad showing a parade of Arab-looking men walking into a gun store, setting their money on the counter and walking out with three or four semi-automatics each, with this voice-over: “My opponent thinks you shouldn’t have to show a photo ID or get a background check to buy a handgun. He thinks anyone who wants an AK-47 should be able to buy one, no questions asked. What’s the point of fighting terrorists abroad if we’re going to arm them over here?”

Pandering? Maybe. Shades of the first President Bush’s infamous race-baiting Willie Horton ad? Probably. Effective? Let’s just say that if John Kerry had used Westen’s words to attack the Swift Boaters who impugned his war record during the 2004 presidential campaign, Bush might be clearing a lot of brush in Crawford these days. There’s more—on how Dems can frame affirmative action, flag burning, domestic wiretaps, tax cuts for millionaires, embryonic stem-cell research and gay marriage to engage the voters’ political brain. Read “The Political Brain” and you’ll understand why Westen is suddenly a very, very popular guy in Democratic campaign circles.

[I]source: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19461257/site/newsweek/

[Green Lantern]

For some reason I always feel bothered or offended when I hear about or meet a black, gay, or atheist republican. I just feel like WTF is wrong with you? How could you? How dare you?

I know it isn't right for me to feel that way. Those things shouldn't even matter.

I look at black republicans and say "How can you not be liberal after what happened to your grandfather. Because it wasn't the Republican party that Abraham Lincoln belonged to when he freed the slaves? :huh:

[Spider-Bite]

Because it wasn't the Republican party that Abraham Lincoln belonged to when he freed the slaves? :huh:

this is exactly what I was talking about when I said


If a point is proven mute to me by somebody, I wont turn around use it on somebody else, who hasn't heard the effective counteragrument.



I know that you know Abraham Lincoln was a liberal, and surprise led the north to victory fighting the conservative south. The parties traded values and they traded their electoral domains since then. I know that you know this, and your hoping that the people reading your post wont know this.

And LIncoln founded the republican party. He was our country's first Republican President, and I consider him to be the best President we've ever had. He brought the largest amount of positive change.

[AhabTheArab]

might actually be picking up that book, very interesting stuff.

finally no more limp ***** on the democrat side, they are gonna learn what to say and how to say it. eat that you fear mongering whores!

[Addendum]

Lincoln was one of the first members of the Republican Party. There's no conclusive evidence that he founded it

[spideyboy_1111]

during that time though republicans were todays democrats.. and the todays republicans were called something else.. forget the name though

[Spider-Bite]

Lincoln was one of the first members of the Republican Party. There's no conclusive evidence that he founded it

My bad. To be more specific quite often while reading he has been referred to one of the founding fathers of the republican party.

[AhabTheArab]

the whig party? is that what you are referring to? or the no nothings?

[spideyboy_1111]

the whig party? is that what you are referring to? or the no nothings?

might be.. not sure... but we learned about it in highschool... forget what the original "republican" pary was called though... but i do know the democrats of today use to be the republican party

[kytrigger]

It also comes from the myth that conservatives are uptight and boring, and not open to anything at all. For any Hype repubs, has this view ever been used to describe you by anyone that knows your stance? It shouldn't have any bearing, but there are quite a few political stances in the conservative arena that may clash with "pop culture" type things.Yeah, I got that ALOT when I went to school, especially because I went to what is considered one of the most liberal colleges in America today. People were actualyl shocked to see me at a bar or party sometimes because they knew me form class or something and only knew I was republican.

Although, to be fair, I didn't get the old man/boring stereotype as much as the gay hating/racist stereotype.

[slave2catwoman]

We need more black diversity in politics. All black people are not the same, so why should they all have the same politics? My opinion is that any thinking person will be libertarian (at least on most issues).

[Dan33977]

We need more black diversity in politics. All black people are not the same, so why should they all have the same politics?

Exactly!

My opinion is that any thinking person will be libertarian (at least on most issues).

Agreed. Read my user title.

[Matt]

People vote with their wallets. Gays could care less about marrying if they are going to have to live in poverty afterwards. If they feel Republican policies are fiscally better for them, they will vote Republican.

The only real exception to this law is extreme Christians.

[spideyboy_1111]

People vote with their wallets. Gays could care less about marrying if they are going to have to live in poverty afterwards. If they feel Republican policies are fiscally better for them, they will vote Republican.

The only real exception to this law is extreme Christians.

ummm dude.. that was pretty ignorant.. we dont vote based on wallets... we vote for our own god damn rights.

[Spider-Bite]

People vote with their wallets. Gays could care less about marrying if they are going to have to live in poverty afterwards. If they feel Republican policies are fiscally better for them, they will vote Republican.

The only real exception to this law is extreme Christians.

kerry voted against the Bush tax cuts for the rich. Was he voting with his wallet? He wants the Bush tax cuts repealed even though he will lose millions of dollars.

What about all the hollywood elite donating money to democrats?

[Matt]

ummm dude.. that was pretty ignorant.. we dont vote based on wallets... we vote for our own god damn rights.

EVERYONE votes on their wallet. One way or another.

[Matt]

kerry voted against the Bush tax cuts for the rich. Was he voting with his wallet? He wants the Bush tax cuts repealed even though he will lose millions of dollars.

Kerry has enough money that it does not matter. He is simply trying to further his political goals.


What about all the hollywood elite donating money to democrats?

People like Clooney also have enough money that it doesn't matter. THey simply like the attention they get.

[The Chairman]

People like Clooney also have enough money that it doesn't matter. THey simply like the attention they get.

True!

[slave2catwoman]

People do not vote only with their wallets. Gay marriage, abortion, vice laws, drug decriminalization, etc have nothing to do with most people's pocketbooks. People vote with their emotions.
I have found that most people believe in libertarian values for themselves, just not for other people.

[spideyboy_1111]

EVERYONE votes on their wallet. One way or another.

i dont.. and i know many people who dont either...

[slave2catwoman]

I don't think so. Not all the time, anyway. What do gay marriage, school parayer, or flag burning or abortion have to do with one's wallet? Actually, sometimes people vote against their financial well being in favor of some other issue they feel is more important.

[spideyboy_1111]

i always vote from my heart, and what feels right, money wont buy me happiness

[LouFerignoDemon]

Article IX, Sec. 2, of the Tennessee constitution ("No Atheist shall hold a civil office") states: "No person who denies the being of God, or a future state of rewards and punishments shall hold any office in the civil department of this state." Arkansas, Maryland, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, South Carolina, and Texas have similar laws.


Apparently people who don't believe in God can't make decisions that benefit people. Only greedy ones.

[Trainwreck2100]

gay, black, atheists like money too, right? Repubs don't just use morals as a political strategy.

[Dark Carnage]

So, it seems most Americans just assume that everyone they meet, or know of believes in God unless said otherwise.

So lets say on that assumption, that someone made it to President only then for his Atheism to be exposed.

How would the country react, and would they try to remove him from office? Even if, lets say, he was best job as President that anyone ever had.

[S_H_F_4839]

I see what you mean. Like assuming I'm incorrect in my belief that God doesn't exist, I would be not knowing what I do, or not knowing I'm incorrect, therefore Jesus would believe in forgiveness for me.


I think thats why they say repent and all will be forgiven.