FF 451 (Spoiler) Dang Reed.

[HandOfFate]

A group of timetravellers arrive from the future, Doom, Black Panther and Namor, to convince Reed to not enact a plan he devised that would turn the World into an Utopia. They reveal that Sue will leave him for Namor...

http://img161.imageshack.us/img161/7091/ff551dcp0032aa8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img161.imageshack.us/img161/3684/ff551dcp0033aa8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Damn.:wow: See that's what you get when you mess with Reed's woman.

[Darthphere]

Wait, what?

[PhotoJones]

Yizzikes.

[Red]

Cheese.

[Doc Destruction]

damn red x boxes of death :(

[SuperFerret]

Doom looks pleased.

[arachnid-guy]

...HAH!

Reed you badass.

[Not Jake]

Oh big deal. The time travellers are like robots or something probably. Who cares. Why is Namor's blood black.

[PhotoJones]

Because it's an all ages book?

[Bubonic]

Reeds a killer?

[Upset Spideyfan]

Jesus Christ.

[PhotoJones]

Reed is going to join X-Force in the next storyline. :(

[Upset Spideyfan]

And he'll get breasts.

[CaptainStacy]

Oh big deal. The time travellers are like robots or something probably. Who cares. Why is Namor's blood black.

'cause he's a filthy atlantean. :yay:

[PhotoJones]

And he'll get breasts.

And lose his feet. :(

[Upset Spideyfan]

Reed doesn't need feet. He does need breasts however.

[Doc Destruction]

Who doesn't?

[PhotoJones]

Reed doesn't need feet. He does need breasts however.

According to Liefeld, no one needs feet. :(

[Upset Spideyfan]

According to Liefeld, no one needs feet. :(

Liefeld is a visionary.

[PhotoJones]

HAHAHA. Yeah, I guess he is. ;)

[HR-PUFF&STUFF]

this has been 60 some years coming

[Upset Spideyfan]

The FF haven't been around that long. :confused:

[HR-PUFF&STUFF]

The FF haven't been around that long. :confused:for namor it has.

[wolvie2020]

A group of timetravellers arrive from the future, Doom, Black Panther and Namor, to convince Reed to not enact a plan he devised that would turn the World into an Utopia. They reveal that Sue will leave him for Namor...

http://img161.imageshack.us/img161/7091/ff551dcp0032aa8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img161.imageshack.us/img161/3684/ff551dcp0033aa8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Damn.:wow: See that's what you get when you mess with Reed's woman.

What the heck book is this from:huh:

[Upset Spideyfan]

Fantastic Four.

[PhotoJones]

What the heck book is this from:huh:

Um...the thread title pretty much spells it all out, dude.

[Zenien]

The hell? Reed is a murderer? WHAT?!?!?!?!?!

[hippie_hunter]

The hell? Reed is a murderer? WHAT?!?!?!?!?!

Oh come on, we've all wanted to see that for YEARS!

[Lord Blackbolt]

maybe Reed is a Skrull

[hippie_hunter]

maybe Reed is a Skrull

Can't be, the Illuminati Skrull was already revealed to be Skrull Bolt.

[Zenien]

Oh come on, we've all wanted to see that for YEARS!

Maybe so, but... seriously... isn't that like Civil War Reed levels of mischaracterization. :o

[hippie_hunter]

Maybe so, but... seriously... isn't that like Civil War Reed levels of mischaracterization. :o

Not really, Reed has a long standing tradition of wanting Namor to suffer:

http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/9244/marvelknights4030page128sd.jpg

[Lord Blackbolt]

Can't be, the Illuminati Skrull was already revealed to be Skrull Bolt.

Ok...maybe the namor he killed from the future is a skrull or something. Reed would never kill like that.

[hippie_hunter]

Ok...maybe the namor he killed from the future is a skrull or something. Reed would never kill like that.

Can we just say that Reed has a tendency of always wanting to kick Namor's ass

http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/1653/image50nv.jpg

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x55/Demonic-Ascension/Marvel-Comics/Fantastic-Four/Marvel-Knights/Issue-8/20.jpg

Shooting Namor is just the ultimate form of ass kickery.

[Red Mask]

Why is Namor's blood black.

As explained in the more fun Astroboy anime, deep sea creatures don't have water in their blood but a more oil-based liquid. Thus they are able to survive in the depths.

But chances are Marvel decided it was more kid friendly to color it black.

[Not Jake]

Well I mean, they already show a decapitated body.

[Not Jake]

As an aside, I find it funny that all the pages posted in this thread are pretty terrible. Especially the art

[imdaly]

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x55/Demonic-Ascension/Marvel-Comics/Fantastic-Four/Marvel-Knights/Issue-8/20.jpg


LMAO! Okay, so I only scrolled this page down enough to see the top half of this page at first, and I thought that it was Reed being stabbed in the chest by some sort of mini-Blue Whale that Namor had sent or something. :wow::wow:

That would've been AWESOME! hahaha!

[Roughneck]

OKay...so the first pic....Reed Blowing Future Namor`s head off..........Yeah, that`s awesome, I should be reading F4

[Odin's Lapdog]

There's going to be an obvious twist, namor wouldn't go down that easily and reed wouldn't particularly go to such drastic measures.

besides I thought that sue ends up with doom in the future anywho and that's how valeria is born, right?

or is she actually reeds?

[Fading]

Maybe so, but... seriously... isn't that like Civil War Reed levels of mischaracterization. :o

Not really, Reed has a long standing tradition of wanting Namor to suffer:



Not that I don't see your point hippie, but I agree with Zenien on this one. It's one thing to want to kick the ass of the guy always after your girl, it's another thing to blow his head off. I can see Reed punching Namor in the face, he I could see him laying into Namor with several punches nearly knocking him out, bloodying his nose, and then the other F4 restraining him, but can't see Reed blowing someones head off with a gun.

Kinda eager to see what explanation they give for this, cause I think blowing the head off of the future version of the guy your girls secretly has the hots for could turn Invis Woman right into Namors arms anyway.

Do have to say tho, was a badass moment :).

[GyLocke]

Reed, once again has laid down the law.

Where's the "That wacky fantastic four" thread?

[wobbly]

There's going to be an obvious twist, namor wouldn't go down that easily and reed wouldn't particularly go to such drastic measures.

It probably isn't Namor at all. They are dealing with Dr. Doom, a master of robotics in the here and now, let alone the future, after all.
My best guess is Reed will up and say there's no way Sue would ever shack up with the real Namor without him having a damned good gloat about it: His being apologetic about nailing Sue was the giveaway (and that fancy gun being designed to destroy tech rather than biology being Reed's safety net if he were wrong, at a guess).


besides I thought that sue ends up with doom in the future anywho and that's how valeria is born, right?

or is she actually reeds?

Valeria is Reed's, but Doom did act as Doctor/mid-wife at her birth (hence why Sue agreed to give her a name that Doom chose).
I think you're thinking of the future Valeria from an alternate time-line who was raised by Doom for some reason I really cant remember.

[BrianWilly]

That's actually the same Valeria. The current Valeria is her, reborn as a fetus.

No, seriously.

Along with Rachel Grey, she has basically the single most convoluted backstory of any Marvel character. And that was before she was even born.

[wobbly]

That's actually the same Valeria. The current Valeria is her, reborn as a fetus.

No, seriously.

Along with Rachel Grey, she has basically the single most convoluted backstory of any Marvel character. And that was before she was even born.

Wasn't Valeria supposed to be the child Sue miscarried ages back given a second chance or something?
I didn't follow the books much back then so I'm just guessing on bits I've read here and there.

[BrianWilly]

Yes.

She was originally that miscarried child, but then it was revealed that at the time, Franklin used his powers to save it, sending her into an alternate future to be raised by an alternate Doom and Sue. She then came back in time to the current reality as an adult. Finally, to stop Abraxas (the antithesis of Eternity), she and Franklin merged their powers which caused her to use all of hers up and to regress back to an infant in Sue's womb, near the end of her term. Doom helped to deliver her, and thus we have the powerless toddler Valeria we know today.

And yes, all of that above is serious, 100% canon. Like I said, the single most convoluted backstory of any Marvel character.

[HandOfFate]

Yes.

She was originally that miscarried child, but then it was revealed that at the time, Franklin used his powers to save it, sending her into an alternate future to be raised by an alternate Doom and Sue. She then came back in time to the current reality as an adult. Finally, to stop Abraxas (the antithesis of Eternity), she and Franklin merged their powers which caused her to use all of hers up and to regress back to an infant in Sue's womb, near the end of her term. Doom helped to deliver her, and thus we have the powerless toddler Valeria we know today.

And yes, all of that above is serious, 100% canon. Like I said, the single most convoluted backstory of any Marvel character.

Sigh...was this Claremote writing?:huh:

[BrianWilly]

Would you believe...yes? :O Explains a lot, doesn't it.

According to the almighty wiki, Claremont created the character. To be fair, though, apparently all the unborn fetus clusterfck was brought on by Jeph Loeb when he replaced Claremont, which...also explains a lot.

[GoldenAgeHero]

wish reed would do that to black panther....

[PhotoJones]

wish reed would do that to black panther....

GAH's racist.

[SonOfCthulhu]

Skrulls...or Robots...or Skrull Robots. These future dudes clearly aren't the genuine article.

[Sugarculted]

Seems like a logical thing to do :o
He's always hitting on and sexing his wife, and he's sporting that atrocious goatee/beard thing.

[Ultra-Herald9]

Its probably a skrull. They're gonna probably give some bulls**t excuse like, Sue would never leave him for Namor and thats how he knew he was fake.

[Dread]

Reposting, with spoilers:

FANTASTIC FOUR #551: McDuffie's run has been fun and harmless so far, but lacked a bit of "oomph" so far, and this storyline is trying to add some. Unfortunately, it is a time travel story and it makes my brain hurt, especially since the way Marvel works, most time travelers are really reality-travelers, and the very act of going back in time creates some alternate reality. Anyway, the hook here is that Dr. Doom, Black Panther, and Namor from the year 2082 have traveled 75 years back in time to the present to prevent Mr. Fantastic from going through with one of his plans, which will lead to the end of the world as we know it. The Four, meanwhile, are on a high with their upteenth reunion, and are startled by the newcomers, especially Doom, whose mannerisms never instill confidence (especially in Invisible Woman). This also leads us to McDuffie's retcon contribution (it seems every writer has to retcon SOMETHING during his/her run on a book), which was this room that Reed has magically always had in the Baxtor Building for the past 13 (40+) years and has survived endless attacks, movings, removings, and curious teammates. It houses all his theories scribbled on walls and it was where he'd figured out that NOT aiding the SHRA forces would have mathmatically lead to chaos, which is a bit daffy, but makes more sense than some of what JMS was spouting. Reed's always surrounded himself with what I call "comic baloney science", so this fits in that. Apparently, his "plan #101" leads to him saving the world, but Sue leaving him and then Reed becomes distant and iron-fisted in his rule. This is hardly a new idea; WHAT IF? #1 literally had a similar plot, only the catalyst was Spider-Man joining the team circa ASM #1, and I am sure it has been done elsewhere. Anyway, Reed professes to "solve the problem"...by killing Future Namor. Um, no, Reed, that doesn't. Future Namor already HAD the affair with Sue. If you wanted to solve things by killing someone, you'd have to kill PRESENT Namor. Really, this is basic time travel logic. If Future Bob shows up and says, "yeah, you destroy the world because in like 50 years I steal your wife", then you kill Present Bob so Future Bob is altered or erased. Duh. Granted, that isn't the BEST way to handle things, and with Reed's behavior here, as well as in ILLUMINATI #5, I am wondering if he's either a Skrull, or The Brute with new stretchy powers (the Brute was Reed's evil alternate reality counter-part). Of course, considering how often Namor's hit on his wife, Reed's probably wanted to blast SOME version of him for a very long time. As usual, Pelletier's art is solid and I am interested enough to continue giving this a go. I also like Future Doom's design; tunics are for D&D players.

[Hunter Rider]

Guys, if you post spoilers from another book in here please use tags.

[Dew k. Mosi]

The rumor is is that the Doom that fathered Valeria in the alternate future was Reed in the armor for some self imposed punishment. He does that now and then in the books

[BrianWilly]

That would almost be clever.

[Colossal Spoons]

What a skrully thing for Reed to do :ninja:

[Kelly]

Whoa...

[CBG]

And once again, Reed proves himself to be a dick.

Idea #101, eh? Nice allusion to 1984.

[Arkady Rossovich]

No,it's out of character.It's something else.

[TheDragonfly]

OH HO HO, Yes, Doom Approves

[Joker]

it's about time someone blew Namor's douchey head off :o

[notnerb]

First time post here. But I loved this issue. A few things, I've been a FF reader for some time, so I'll see if I can clear ome stuff up about Valeria. From what I remember she came back from an alternate future where all but Sue and Franklin died, and Sue ended up marrying doom. They supposedly had a kid Valeria. Now thi seemed weird, but later at the end of Claremont's run Reed was trapped in Doom's armor, so it was sort of insinuated that even in the alternate future that was probably Reed. When Abraxas came, Franklin and Valeria used their powers to bring back Galactus, and after Franklin revealed that Valeria was the miscarried child from Sue's past, and that Franklin had used his realty shaping powers to steal her away and place her in an alternate reality (which is a little confusing, because this implies that the alternate Doom wasn't Reed). Anyway, in the end, Valeria is Reed's kid.

Now, about this issue. It's not really Namor, I think most of us can see that.

First of all, he says upon first meeting Sue, that she is as beautiful as he remembers. You don't say this about your future girl (Unless she lets herself go phsyically).

Second, Namor doesn't apologize to Reed, he'd say something about how Reed is pathetic and it was only a matter of time.

Third, Reed knows the truth. Namor isn't really into chicks. It's not his thing. Back in the 60's Namor visited San Francisco and loved it, he goes back for the Pride parade every year.

(Just kidding on part 3. Love San Fran and its people.)

[VICTORVONDOOMX]

The rumor is is that the Doom that fathered Valeria in the alternate future was Reed in the armor for some self imposed punishment. He does that now and then in the booksIn an alternate future he was never able to escape the Doom armor that the Celestial imprisoned him in... hence the "Doom" is my Dad Valeria...

Umm... I guess he got a certain part of himself free...ugh.

And yeah, the actual Reed doesn't kill (even Skrulls from the future), so I'm thinking Doombot...

[XtromaniaK]

Maybe Reed has just gone insane, anyone think of that?

[CBG]

I just think that he proved himself to be the **** that he is.

[TheCorpulent1]

In an alternate future he was never able to escape the Doom armor that the Celestial imprisoned him in... hence the "Doom" is my Dad Valeria...

Umm... I guess he got a certain part of himself free...ugh.

And yeah, the actual Reed doesn't kill (even Skrulls from the future), so I'm thinking Doombot...
You think a Doombot was built to look like Reed and it infiltrated the FF?

[VICTORVONDOOMX]

No, I meant future Namor was probably a Doombot...
Reed's recent characterization problems = flawed writing.

[Infidel]

I have to hand it to Reed Richards, he sure knows how to cut to the chase and get things done.

[Shockdingo]

LMAO! Okay, so I only scrolled this page down enough to see the top half of this page at first, and I thought that it was Reed being stabbed in the chest by some sort of mini-Blue Whale that Namor had sent or something. :wow::wow:

That would've been AWESOME! hahaha!

First off, holy crap man, that was hilarious; I'm literally crying from the laughter. :woot: "Whale stab!" lol

Second off: Holy crap in a hat Reed! :wow: Now I'm coming back to ff (not just cause of this decap-tacular event, but they're all back together again which pleases me.)

[Steve Rogers]

You know they will weasel their way out of this. Somebody somewhere is a Skrull or a Doombot or an LMD or a cardboard cut out...

...but what an awesome twist in the book if it was the actual Reed taking out the actual Namor execution style. But I don't think it will be.

[GL1]

Reed is a Skrull and Namor is a robot...

Or it's just Reed is a Skrull... who cares if Future Namor dies?