Official Justice League Status Update Thread

[Showtime]

Seems like the same exact quotes he made months and months ago to me...

[BATZARRO WWD]

'Flight of the Conchords' Bids Farewell After Season 2
Wednesday, September 03, 2008
Yahoo! Buzz
flight of the conchordsJemaine Clement and Bret McKenzie may soon have to end their comedic antics on the small screen after the broadcast of the sophomore season of Flight of the Conchords, the HBO series that follows the adventures of the New Zealand folk duo as they seek fame and success in New York City.

According The New Zealand Herald, Jemaine Clement and Bret McKenzie revealed to British magazine Q that they are seriously contemplating on ending the series after the second season due to the creative struggles they've encountered in making it.
Your Take
kaycee said: aw, that's sad. i liked the show!
see all »


"The second series seems to me like it would be a good end to the show. I feel like another 10 [episodes]... that will be enough," McKenzie said of the show.

The Grammy Award-winning New Zealand comedy duo, who used already written tunes during the first season of Flight of the Conchords, is still in the process of writing the new music narratives for the new season, which they've found “difficult.”

"We've got a lot of half-songs," Clement said. "We've got an album's worth of beginnings of songs."

Flight of the Conchords was not deemed a huge HBO hit last summer. However, it attracted a devoted cult of fans and massive critical praise. The show is also up for four Emmys, one each for writing and directing for a comedy series and two in the original music category. As of this moment, there is no word yet on when season 2 will premiere.

Meanwhile, Clement and McKenzie have been pursuing other projects, including auditioning for movies. In fact, Clement recently landed a leading role in the American movie Gentlemen Broncos while McKenzie applied for a part in a film adaptation of the Justice League of America. Additionally, McKenzie wants to focus on music and script writing, as well as being a member Wellington band The Black Seeds.

http://www.theage.com.au/ffxImage/urlpicture_id_1041990095196_2003/01/10/11e_elf,0.jpg

[biolumen]

Dan Lin
Ex-exec anticipates studio's needs

By MICHAEL FLEMING

When Dan Lin transitioned from Warner Bros. creative exec to producer, he hoped his finance background (Harvard Business School), understanding of studio politics and talent relations would make him a valuable bridge between studios and makers of global-minded tentpole fare.

Apparently he was right.

With five pictures on the WB release calendar for 2009, Lin's already off and running. He's exec producer on the McG-directed "Terminator Salvation" and the Robert Rodriguez-helmed "Shorts," and he has producer credits on Richard Kelly's "The Box," starring Cameron Diaz, and the Ricky Gervais/Jennifer Garner comedy "This Side of the Truth." He's lead producer on Guy Ritchie's "Sherlock Holmes," which begins shooting with Robert Downey Jr. in October, and is waiting for WB's marching orders on "Justice League."

http://www.variety.com/article/VR1117991549.html?categoryId=3231&cs=1

Looks like if or when WB decides to move on a JLA movie, Lin might remain attached as producer.

[Webhead2006]

Probably but with what was said a few weeks ago that batman 3, superman reboot, and two other films ga/gl or flash/ww are the films they are looking for within the next 4 or so years we are likely not going to see jla to around 2013-2015 now more likely.

[biolumen]

Though WB has yet to lay out any specifics regarding their plans, I'm sorta resigned to those time frames. Sucks, but what can be done about it? Just hope for the best.

I mentioned a couple weeks ago that George Miller was scheduled for a Sept. 8 appearance on that Australian interview program Gale was on last week called 'Enough Rope'. Well, I just checked the shows' website and some other guest is now scheduled instead of Miller for that day. JMC mentioned before that the shows are filmed up to 6 weeks in advance of their airing. If this interview was done prior to Robinov's revelations that the JL movie was dead for now, then possible statements to the contrary by Miller in the interview might have proven problematic.

[dnno1]

It's probably not going to happen (any announcements) until after a deal is settled with the Screen Actors Guild. I am betting we won't hear anything this month since there is a film festival in New York and there is Rosh Hashanah at the end of this month.

[Webhead2006]

Well if robinov's comments were true about their plans and all that, he said they will be announcing their dc slate plans within a month or so.

[I Am The Knight]

Wich should be like 2 weeks from now, I think.

[Steelsheen]

http://www.variety.com/article/VR1117991549.html?categoryId=3231&cs=1
Looks like if or when WB decides to move on a JLA movie, Lin might remain attached as producer.

It's probably not going to happen (any announcements) until after a deal is settled with the Screen Actors Guild. I am betting we won't hear anything this month since there is a film festival in New York and there is Rosh Hashanah at the end of this month.

perhaps. when is the SAG strike set for anyway?

[dnno1]

perhaps. when is the SAG strike set for anyway?

I think there's supposed to be an election on September 18th. The strike will depend on what administration is elected.

[Steelsheen]

I think there's supposed to be an election on September 18th. The strike will depend on what administration is elected.

So if the Democrats take the Whit House there wont be any strike? :cwink:

[dnno1]

So I guess the Mulroneys are into directing as well as writing:
http://www.variety.com/article/VR1117991841.html?categoryid=13&cs=1
Actors join Mulroneys' 'Paper' chase
Daniels, Reynolds, Kudrow set for comedy
By MICHAEL FLEMING

Jeff Daniels, Ryan Reynolds and Lisa Kudrow will star in “Paper Man,” a comedy that marks the feature directing debut of Kieran and Michele Mulroney, who wrote the film as well as “Justice League.”

FilmColony’s Richard Gladstein will produce with Management 360’s Guymon Casady and Artfire’s Art Spigel and Ara Katz. Artfire is financing the film, and shooting begins Nov. 12 in New York and Montauk.

The coming-of-middle-age comedy chronicles an unlikely friendship between a failed author (Daniels) and a Long Island teen.

“Paper Man” was developed through Sundance writer and director labs.

Darin Friedman and Dan Fireman will be executive producers.

Reynolds just wrapped the Greg Mottola-directed “Adventureland.”

Daniels next appears in “The Dream of the Romans” and “State of Play.” Kudrow recently wrapped “Powder Blue.”

[Steelsheen]

this sounds, and its got a pretty solid cast, lets see how this film turns out with the Mulroneys having more creative power over their work.

[Webhead2006]

I remember hearing something of this project a long while ago.

[biolumen]

Another Dan Lin / Justice League mention by Variety.

WB, Lin join Christensen's 'Coalition'
Studio fast-tracking singer's sci-fi thriller

By TATIANA SIEGEL

Warner Bros. has snapped up Shawn Christensen's sci-fi thriller "Karma Coalition" for Dan Lin to produce.

Preemptive deal is pegged at high-six against mid-seven figures.
Christensen, who is the lead singer of the indie rock band stellastarr*, penned the screenplay while working on the Gotham-based group's upcoming third album.

"Karma Coalition" centers on a falsely accused fugitive who embarks on a quest to uncover the truth behind his wife's death before the world comes to an end.

WB is fast-tracking the pic.

Stephen Gilchrist, who brought the project into WB-based Lin Pictures, will co-produce.

Lin is producing a number of pics for the studio, including superhero film "Justice League," the Image Shadowline comicbook series "Hiding in Time" and the Guy Ritchie-helmed "Sherlock Holmes." He is also exec producing "Terminator Salvation" and the Robert Rodriguez-directed "Shorts."

Though "Karma Coalition" is a solo project, Christensen typically works with writing partner Jason Dolan. The pair penned the script "Sidney Hall," which was bought by Scott Free out of its discretionary fund. Michael Costigan is producing, with Joe Russo directing.

http://www.variety.com/article/VR1117992019.html?categoryId=1972&cs=1

[Retroman]

The man who was almost Batman has landed another post JL gig...

Question: If you want to keep your title as spoiler king, you need to hit us with some major Reaper scoop. -- Jeff
Ausiello: This just in -- major Reaper scoop! Armie Hammer (no relation to the baking soda) is joining the cast as Morgan, Sam's half bro. Although it would seem he's only concerned with spending time at the hottest clubs and dating supermodels, Morgan is secretly jealous of Sam, and has a darker agenda which will prove to be dangerous to Sam and the gang. Do I get to keep my title? Source:http://ausiellofiles.ew.com/2008/08/post.html

[Webhead2006]

I heard he has a role in season 2 of reaper, good to hear most of the what looked to be a crummy cast for jla is able to find some other work for themselfs.

[biolumen]

It would appear that Miller wasn't scheduled to appear on the Sept 8 broadcast of the interview program 'Enough Rope' after all.

Comment george miller by aaron - 9/09/2008 4:32 PM

What happened to the advertised George Miller interview?

Moderator Comment:

Dear Aaron

Thank you for your query regarding the ENOUGH ROPE interview with George Miller.

Unfortunately the wrong guest information was forwarded to certain TV program guides.

George Miller will be on the show in the coming months.

Keep an eye out for him in the 'Coming Soon' section of our website: http://www.abc.net.au/tv/enoughrope/

Thanks again for writing and we hope you enjoy ENOUGH ROPE this year.
Kind regards

Rope Moderator

http://www2b.abc.net.au/guestbookcentral/addcomment.asp?GuestbookID=181&EntryID=2012573&view=&numtoview=&start=&sort=&filter1=&filter1val=&filter2=&filter2val=&filter3=&filter3val=&advanced=&pagestart=2

[Webhead2006]

Ha stupid mix ups lol. But we know now we are not likely going to be seeing a jla film untill 2013 the earliest now since they want to follow the marvel plan some what and get a few solo films going which will be gl possibly for 2010, batman 3/superman reboot for 11, and then ga/flash/ww between 12-13/15 range. It would have been great if they could have gotten jla to happen now and be doing it correctly but its good it got dropped for now since it wasnt looking to be what jla should be.

[I Am The Knight]

Ha stupid mix ups lol. But we know now we are not likely going to be seeing a jla film untill 2013 the earliest now since they want to follow the marvel plan some what and get a few solo films going which will be gl possibly for 2010, batman 3/superman reboot for 11, and then ga/flash/ww between 12-13/15 range. It would have been great if they could have gotten jla to happen now and be doing it correctly but its good it got dropped for now since it wasnt looking to be what jla should be.

Getting a Batman and a Superman movie in the same year makes my juices flow.

[Webhead2006]

Yes i really hope wb is finally getting on the ball and make some good serious adaptions for their characters now due to iron man's and the TDK sucesses. Crossing fingers everything works out for them, green lit green lantern and have that set to go for mid/late 2010(it could easily work out for say july-dec 10 release if they could be rolling by may 09) then get batman 3 and superman reboot for 2011 with filming start late 09 or early 10, then for 4th film i dont really knows all counts on if it is GA/flash/WW and how quickly they could get script ready if either of them are ready to go along with gl then have it go for 2010 release to or hold them off to 2012/2013/2014 range and then we get jla probably 2012-2015 baring where ever GA/flash/ww can fall into place.

[The Major]

It would have been great if they could have gotten jla to happen now and be doing it correctly but its good it got dropped for now since it wasnt looking to be what jla should be.

IMO WB made the right decision.

[Webhead2006]

Hopefully they really are now major, we dont need them to fall back into the crap phrases of batman & robin, catwoman again.

[The Major]

Hopefully they really are now major, we dont need them to fall back into the crap phrases of batman & robin, catwoman again.

True.

They could still do that, though.

That's why its good they aren't doing JLA yet. If they did that with JL they would destroy several franchises at once with it while the others are only hurt individually.

Hopefully they've learned from their mistakes but we'll only find out with results.

[TheVileOne]

I think what annoys me the most when it seems like every other month someone would come up with some FALSE report probably perpetrated by Miller's camp or something that the movie is still being made and set for such and such release date.

But the absolute worst was Baghdad Uncle Bingo Bob and how people would actually post his trash here like it actually meant something.

[BizarroAids]

They only keep mentioning the project and it's date, even after WB said it would be on hold, to keep the buzz alive. They probably believe that by generating enough buzz and fan craziness that WB will give the greenlight for JL.

I'd love to see a JL movie, but it's pretty much a safe bet that's not going to happen for a very long time....or at least until we get a successful Superman franchise going..the a Wonder Woman then Flash feature.

[Antonello Blueberry]

Interview with Arnie Hammer.
http://it.eonline.com/uberblog/marc_malkin/b30975_holy_double_take_batman_here_comes_new.html
Watch out, Christian Bale—there's a new Batman coming to town!

His name is Armie Hammer, an unknown actor handpicked by Mad Max and Happy Feet director George Miller to play Bruce Wayne and his Caped Crusader alter ego in the upcoming superhero-filled Justice League Mortal.

Hammer insists he has not intention of stirring up a battle of the Batmans. "That guy's got his s--t down," Hammer says of Bale.

Even so, Hammer does point out that there's at least one big difference between the two. "My codpiece is bigger," he said with a laugh the other day from Vancouver, where he's shooting the CW's The Reaper (he plays the son of the devil).

While there have been reports that the Justice League flick has been shelved because of too many setbacks (including the writers' strike), Hammer says it's still set to go...

"As far as I know, we're on hold looking for another location," he said.

They were supposed to shoot in Australia, where Hammer and his castmates suffered through several months of physical training.

"I would spend hours training with actual guns to prepare me for this stuff," Hammer said. "It was very intense. Our workout regimens were so rigorous that most of us would vomit."

He added, "We weren't trying to get ourselves aesthetically good looking. We were trying to get ready for the demands of shooting."

Not that the 22-year-old great-grandson of oil tycoon Armand Hammer has anything to worry about in the looks department. At 6'5" with a smile and hulking body to match, he has movie star written all over him.

He's already been fitted for the superhero costume, which he says features functioning equipment, including trademark Batman weapons like spring-loaded titanium Bat-erangs. "I was looking down, and I was thinking, This is the best," Hammer said of the first time he put on the entire ensemble. "Then I stood up, and they turned me around, and I faced a mirror—there was Batman. But then it hit me like a ton of bricks—it's not just Batman, it's me!"

For now, Hammer is working on spreading the word on a much different project. He stars as the Rev. Billy Graham in Billy, an independent film about the religious leader's early years costarring Bionic Woman star Lindsay Wagner as his mother and Martin Landau as a lifelong friend.

Hammer hasn't met the 89-year-old Graham yet, but he's been told the movie has his blessing.

"It's one of the more terrifying and intimidating things," Hammer said about playing arguably the world's most famous Christian evangelist. "If I go up there and portray Billy Graham not exactly as Billy Graham, there are a billion people on this planet who will say, 'That's not Billy Graham!' "

I would love to see photos of the actors in the WETA costumes.

[jmc]

Did someone forget to give him the memo?

[TheComicbookKid]

At least they could drop the artwork for the costumes.

[Crook]

I'm really interested in what the suits look like. Especially since WETA was behind it. Just a little peek... :(

[Kevin Smith]

I'm really interested in what the suits look like. Especially since WETA was behind it. Just a little peek... :(

I know! damn! :/

fingers crossed for black and gray....

[The Navigator]

Subscribe.

[biolumen]

Sounds like Hammer is just trying to keep it "alive" for the sake of self-publicity. In the wake of TDK, quotes like "Hey, I've been cast as Batman in the Justice League movie" might get the attention of some uninformed people. I would hope he knows better than that. If not, he must have been living under a rock (hmm, make that a boulder) these past couple of months.

Looks like Miller will be on "Enough Rope" around mid October. That should put an end to any further speculation.......I hope.

And I too really want to see these costumes.

[Webhead2006]

yea from everything we know the film has been canned/shelved for a few years now since they are now adapting the marvel solo film approach. Since we already know they want to get batman 3, superman reboot, green lantern, and one more solo out in the next few yrs. I agree since we know miller's jla is likely never to see the light of day i would love to see costume artwork/and know really what they were planning on doing.

[Brian Braddock]

I can't believe no-ones said anything yet about the "I would spend hours training with actual guns to prepare me for this stuff," comment.

[I Am The Knight]

Interesting. So, who's gonna leak the WETA costumes?

[DACrowe]

guns?

Oh well, the movie is dead now.

[Evil Twin]

Sounds like they literally ran them through boot camp. Seems extreme, although obviously knowing what is in the script would clarify things.

I'll chime in as another in being extremely interested in WETA's costumes. What happened to good old fashioned spy sites that actually broke scoops that the studio wasn't feeding them?

[ironman29758]

guns?

Oh well, the movie is dead now.
grapling gun? in defense against guns? And besides whats worse a Dark Knight like Superman and Flash movie or a Justice Leauge/Spin off movies

[protocida]

Who knows? The movie can still be alive after all. We'll have to wait and see. And i would LOVE to see how Weta was doing the costumes also. :csad:

[batman strikes]

I would love to see the costumes WETA designed and read the script. I Know someone who has the first 14 pages but you have to tread with him for a script that he wants. I don't have those type of connections, I was lucky to find the scripts to Green Arrow: Escape from Supermax, Thor, and Jonah Hex.

[BATZARRO WWD]

guns?

Oh well, the movie is dead now.

Could you be any more(self contains)

Honey, did you see The Dark Knight, sweetie?

http://www.mtv.com/movies/photos/d/dark_knight_toys_080311/alt/07_grappling_gun.jpgGrappling gun replica.

And as I recalled, batman used a rifle like device to shoot plastic explosives during the Hong Kong scene, baby. Ain't no need to soil your diapies.

[Saint]

As glad as I am that this movie is dead and gone, I would love to see the Batsuit they concocted.

[Sawyer]

As glad as I am that this movie is dead and gone, I would love to see the Batsuit they concocted.

I guess seeing it wouldnt be the worst thing to get a peek at, but I dont want to give Warner Bros. the opportunity to think that JLM was a good idea...

[protocida]

''JLA'' was a good idea.

[ironman29758]

I would love to see the costumes WETA designed and read the script. I Know someone who has the first 14 pages but you have to tread with him for a script that he wants. I don't have those type of connections, I was lucky to find the scripts to Green Arrow: Escape from Supermax, Thor, and Jonah Hex.

can you pm Green Arrow: Escape from Supermax, and Thor. But what if JL:Mortal was a great comic book movie. If I remember correctly some people on the board hated Dark Knight because of Heath Ledger and Joker wore face paint but when the movie came everyone said it stook to the comics and it was the best comic book movie ever! So the lesson of the story don't judge a book (or a movie) by its cover(or some info).

[Sawyer]

''JLA'' was a good idea.

You're right, JLA is a good idea. The way Warner Bros was going to do it? Not so much.

[ironman29758]

Could you be any more(self contains)

Honey, did you see The Dark Knight, sweetie?

http://www.mtv.com/movies/photos/d/dark_knight_toys_080311/alt/07_grappling_gun.jpgGrappling gun replica.

And as I recalled, batman used a rifle like device to shoot plastic explosives during the Hong Kong scene, baby. Ain't no need to soil your diapies.
what about batman begins where batman technially use a gun to shoot a guy's foot or defense against guns or the original comics where Batman used guns. Plus Batman in the Christiphor Nolan movies where he said he worked alone with support of Chris Nolan and Chris Bale said that Batman would not team up with any superheroes and from what I read Batman would'nt trust the other superheroes and made Brother Eye(ala comics). So Batman would have stuck to the comics and many old actors(30 year old Clark Kent playing a 20 year old Clark Kent) played young people and many old actors and in some version Batman was in his twenies when he joined the Justice Leauge and it supports the fact the comic book characters look young even though their history was over 50 years old.

[batman strikes]

I sent the two scripts to you ironman29758.

[ironman29758]

thanks

[Webhead2006]

Yea even though everything to a degree for jl:mortal sounded like crap and i am glad it got dropped and wb looking to finally be on the ball with dc films i do really hope photos/artwork of the costumes do get leaked out so we could atless see the direction of the costumes.

[BATZARRO WWD]

can you pm Green Arrow: Escape from Supermax, and Thor. But what if JL:Mortal was a great comic book movie. If I remember correctly some people on the board hated Dark Knight because of Heath Ledger and Joker wore face paint but when the movie came everyone said it stook to the comics and it was the best comic book movie ever! So the lesson of the story don't judge a book (or a movie) by its cover(or some info).

Well, I felt a bit suspicious when the Dark Knight was better than everything before anyone had actually SEEN the thing...:woot:

Yes, us geeks are a superstitious and cowardly lot. Details A and B would make the movie a COMPLETE FAILIURE or THE BEST MOVIE IN HISTORY depending on how it is sold. This movie in particular seemed universally hated, and I never understood why. I never read anything that sounded negative regarding the tone or story, and the bulk of the hate that fell on the casting was really unfair, niggling details that wouldn't really be problematic if the plot was strong, wich again, there was no indication it wouln't be.

I've personally given up on WB making this or any other movie featuring heros that haven't been done. They got a 3 Potter films left, and they got other stuff, they'll do Batman again, they'll do Superman all over again, and sure they'll do Green Lantern...LoL! Gotcha on that last one! It's a script like Teen Titans is a script, like Batman vs Superman is a script like Wonderwoman is a script and so they shall remain...scripts.

[Lazlo Panaflex]

I won't believe anything until actual movie photos are released.

[Jamie Madrox]

Regardless of all the negativity surrounding this movie, I still want it to happen.

[jmc]

^ You still want this particular version of JL made?

[BATZARRO WWD]

^ You still want this particular version of JL made?
I know I would!

[Showtime]

No thanks. Luckily it isn't, and we'll get something different later.

[protocida]

Steve, from http://www.savesuperman.com/ said that ''Justice League'' will problably be released in 2012/2013, with a new director, a new cast and a new locations, but nothing was said about the script.

I Wonder...

[I Am The Knight]

Hey, don't remind me of that a**hole.

[Antonello Blueberry]

^ You still want this particular version of JL made?
The one with the Oscar winning director and DoP, and award winning production and costumer designers with a story straight out of the comic-books?
Why not?

[BATZARRO WWD]

The one with the Oscar winning director and DoP, and award winning production and costumer designers with a story straight out of the comic-books?
Why not?

Oh, no, no Antonello. You're looking at what the movie has! You have to look at what it doesn't have, or what you don't know about it! Why focus on wide positive elements of it, when you can concentrate on wich Green Lantern is in it?

[Antonello Blueberry]

Oh, no, no Antonello. You're looking at what the movie has! You have to look at what it doesn't have, or what you don't know about it! Why focus on wide positive elements of it, when you can concentrate on wich Green Lantern is in it?
The same one that was in the animated series. I didn't read people complaining about that in these years. Hal Jordan could have been mentioned as being off-world for a mission.
If the Justice League were successful, we would have seen a Green Lantern origin trilogy, starting with Hal Jordan and getting by the third movie to have Stewart and Gardner as temporary replacements/back-ups. No Kyle, please.

[BATZARRO WWD]

The same one that was in the animated series. I didn't read people complaining about that in these years. Hal Jordan could have been mentioned as being off-world for a mission.
If the Justice League were successful, we would have seen a Green Lantern origin trilogy, starting with Hal Jordan and getting by the third movie to have Stewart and Gardner as temporary replacements/back-ups. No Kyle, please.

Wrong! I'm seriously starting to think you can't apreciate the fine art of nitpicking.

You're supposed to say "No! John Stewart is boring!"

Because just "a guy" using a powerfull ring to create constructs out of pure energy in itself is boring. Only "THE ONE" can make it fun!

In any case, you're not supposed to worry wether Justice League will entertain you. You're supposed to worry wether other guys are willing to forgo mountains of cash and not do their own movies because they're uncomfortable with this one. That's the important thing!

Yeah, sorry for the sarcasm, but it peeves me a bit that people's reasons for disliking a movie are so shallow. But I guess folks will apreciate it more when we have "nothing"(DC related) coming to a theater near us. It wasn't so long ago such was the case...

[The Major]

Steve, from http://www.savesuperman.com/ said that ''Justice League'' will problably be released in 2012/2013, with a new director, a new cast and a new locations, but nothing was said about the script.

I Wonder...

Aren't WB using the Marvel method now? They had better get cracking on the solo films before JL is released if they are doing that.

The only solid JL franchise they have is Batman.

Flash and WW are MIA, Superman is getting a reboot but they're far from close to shooting scenes yet, GA is in development hell, GL is the farthest along with a rookie director who needs to be replaced by a sci-fi veteran and it's not greenlit IIRC.

It would take years to release them all before the first JL movie.

[The Major]

Wrong! I'm seriously starting to think you can't apreciate the fine art of nitpicking.

You're supposed to say "No! John Stewart is boring!"

Because just "a guy" using a powerfull ring to create constructs out of pure energy in itself is boring. Only "THE ONE" can make it fun!

Agreed.

In any case, you're not supposed to worry wether Justice League will entertain you.

Being an entertaining movie will mean nothing if it tanks, the film shows crappy versions of certain characters which will taint how the public view them for generations and takes several good DC franchises with it in the process.

You're supposed to worry wether other guys are willing to forgo mountains of cash

They forgo mountains of cash every day they can't make other DC super-hero franchises which aren't Batman and Superman, fail to execute the ones who do get into movies then bury them for decades when they can't make them reach their creative and financial potential or do nothing with successful franchises (Teen Titans, Legion, WW).

and not do their own movies because they're uncomfortable with this one. That's the important thing!

The important thing is that the lesser franchises be in the best shape possible.

JL puts several of the higher profile ones at risk for nothing. If they fail they'll blame the franchises only and we'll be stuck with Batman and Superman for another 20 years in film and tv.

Yeah, sorry for the sarcasm, but it peeves me a bit that people's reasons for disliking a movie are so shallow. But I guess folks will apreciate it more when we have "nothing"(DC related) coming to a theater near us.

WB have failed to get any non-Superman and Batman franchises up and running with decades of time to do it and the times they did get them on screen have failed to deliver since they don't understand their own super-hero franchises despite having DC Comics at their beck and call.

We're better off with nothing being constantly bombarded with crappy films which destroy good super-hero properties.

It wasn't so long ago such was the case...

You mean like Batman and Superman for the thousandth time? Or the crappy Catwoman movie?

[Antonello Blueberry]

You mean like Batman and Superman for the thousandth time? Or the crappy Catwoman movie?
V for Vendetta? A History of Violence? Watchmen?

[The Major]

V for Vendetta?

One shot story, not a DC serial super-hero franchise.

A History of Violence?

Not a DCU super-hero franchise.

Watchmen?

Not released yet.

It is ironic how WB does seem to get the non-DCU franchises fine but they can't even get Catwoman right in a solo movie. :(

[Dotten]

Originally, back in the days when superman could jump and not fly, Batman was a guy using guns. If i remember correctly. So in a sence, it's respecting the source-material to have Batman use firearms :D

[BATZARRO WWD]

Being an entertaining movie will mean nothing if it tanks, the film shows crappy versions of certain characters which will taint how the public view them for generations and takes several good DC franchises with it in the process.

So...when you go to a movie you want what?

They forgo mountains of cash every day they can't make other DC super-hero franchises which aren't Batman and Superman, fail to execute the ones who do get into movies then bury them for decades when they can't make them reach their creative and financial potential or do nothing with successful franchises (Teen Titans, Legion, WW).
PPSSSSST! Don't tell no one, but they still CAN'T "make other DC super-hero franchises which aren't Batman and Superman"! If you really think anything else is moving, is something more than a script, then, well, I guess i can apreciate a man of faith.

You really oughtta pay attention to Warner. They are "reactors". They'll never get anything done. If you think they won't cancell Green Lantern because Star Trek fails, then just you wait.

But if you're willing to wait more for nothing then more power to ya'.

The important thing is that the lesser franchises be in the best shape possible.

The important thing is that the movie delivers and insofar neither you nor anyone alse has shown me the script that has the movie be horrible, or even a wrong representation of the characters. Wich really lends itself to me thinking that opinion is drawn directly from someone's rectum.

WB have failed to get any non-Superman and Batman franchises up and running with decades of time to do it and the times they did get them on screen have failed to deliver since they don't understand their own super-hero franchises despite having DC Comics at their beck and call.

We're better off with nothing being constantly bombarded with crappy films which destroy good super-hero properties.
Well, straight up Superhero movies, the only one between Batman and Robin and Batman Begins was Catwoman, and it's potential as a Superhero franchise is arguable at best. You want it either to be a blooming forest or a desert and that's it? Well, that's your prerrogative I guess, but I still don't see why the hate on the movie itself. And what's the point of not being bombarded with "crappy" films if the alternative is no films at all? They're not "saving " the franchises, more like, stowing them forever. If your point is that if they don't make it the best film in history(c) they're destroying any film possibilities is ridiculous. If they don't make ANY movies ever, that doesn't make it more likely a good movie will be done! If the characters don't ever get done in film and other mediums that means more people fail to have access to the characters. By your standards, if they hadn't done the many Batman movies and cartoon they have done, then we'd still have had Batman Begins and Dark Knight? Beach, Pleez! Obviously the more known characters get done more, wich makes them even more known wich makes them more profitable wich makes it more likely Warner will reserve a space in their schedule for them. WIch is why, since Harry Potter is more known than Green Lantern, it's very likely Green Lantern stays in the land of scripts.

But you like reading scripts of websites, don'tcha?

[BlackLantern]

Harry Potter is the WB cash cow....moooooo

[jmc]

The one with the Oscar winning director and DoP, and award winning production and costumer designers with a story straight out of the comic-books?
Why not?

You mean the same one that was being rushed into production, staring a below par cast, had script issues despite it being 'fantastic', was tried to be past off as an Australian film to get made cheaper and the constant division within the studio as to whether the film should be made in the first place? If that's you idea of a movie that's looking in good shape then good luck to you.

[The Major]

So...when you go to a movie you want what?

A good film.

PPSSSSST! Don't tell no one, but they still CAN'T "make other DC super-hero franchises which aren't Batman and Superman"!

They do, but its incredibly rare and usually crappy.

It's really quite confusing. Surely they want their super-hero films to succeed? They cant get cash from a super-hero franchise they kill.

If you really think anything else is moving, is something more than a script, then, well, I guess i can apreciate a man of faith.

That wouldn't surprise me at this point.

You really oughtta pay attention to Warner. They are "reactors". They'll never get anything done.

They react to what they want to react to.

Marvel's been making good super-hero movies for years but WB's response has been crappy adaptions, a defanged Americanized Hellblazer, comic adaptions which aren't super-hero films, a weak Superman and good Batman films.

Dark Horse is even giving them a run for their money in the genre with Hellboy.

The film industry is under-going a super-hero craze and all they can do is give us Batman.

If you think they won't cancell Green Lantern because Star Trek fails, then just you wait.

True.

It really doesn't make any sense, though. By that logic GL should be fine since TDK was a hit.

But if you're willing to wait more for nothing then more power to ya'.

It's better then watching terrible adaptions.

The important thing is that the movie delivers

And if it doesn't Miller would have killed about seven potentially huge super-hero franchises at once.

and insofar neither you nor anyone alse has shown me the script that has the movie be horrible,

Fair enough.

or even a wrong representation of the characters.

They hired Megan Gale to be WW. They may as well have put a bullet to the WW franchise's head with that.

Wich really lends itself to me thinking that opinion is drawn directly from someone's rectum.

You think everything was going great for JL, then? What did you like about it?

Well, straight up Superhero movies, the only one between Batman and Robin and Batman Begins was Catwoman, and it's potential as a Superhero franchise is arguable at best.

The reason it didn't have much potential is because they didn't come close to using it.

They took away any connection to Batman in it, didn't use any comic characters which made the title Catwman iconic in the first place, altered the mythos completely into being a bad Cheetah impersonation and execute it horribly.

Potential only works if it's used.

Ony a complete idiot could have screwed that movie up and WB found that idiot.

You want it either to be a blooming forest or a desert and that's it?

It's already a desert.

WB needs their training wheels for the solo super-hero films. This requires one or two then expanding once they're sure they got it right. JL is beyond that. They can't even get one lesser super-hero right what makes you think they can take several at once?

Well, that's your prerrogative I guess, but I still don't see why the hate on the movie itself.

JL failing removes the possibility of there ever being a "forest" of the high profile superheroes and possibly other non-Batman and Superman super-hero films as well.

That's to much risk at once. It's unnecessary.

And what's the point of not being bombarded with "crappy" films if the alternative is no films at all?

Because it means WB might use them proerly in the future if they finaly get around it.

A bad film not only doesn't show the public its potential, it taints how Hollywood and the public view it for future generations and the franchise gets buried.

Lowering your standards only mean WB will make more crappy adaptions.

They're not "saving " the franchises, more like, stowing them forever.
Like that's any better.


If your point is that if they don't make it the best film in history(c) they're destroying any film possibilities is ridiculous.

It's true.

Any failed movie or high profile project put the franchise on the line.

The only ones except are Superman and Batman since they have faith since their succeeded since prior generations made enough good work to make relevant, good versions in different high profile formats and allowed the public to know those two franchises on an intimate level so they know what theyre getting into.

No other DC franchise has it on that level like those two.

If they don't make ANY movies ever, that doesn't make it more likely a good movie will be done!

It's better then watching crap. Why would I want to watch a horrible movie about a franchise I care about? Especially when I know the people making it can do a better job with their adptions.


If the characters don't ever get done in film and other mediums that means more people fail to have access to the characters.

People aren't going to care about the characters if they are given sub-standard movies or tv shows about them.

They're going to avoid them and WB will bury them in a vault for decades.

By your standards, if they hadn't done the many Batman movies and cartoon they have done, then we'd still have had Batman Begins and Dark Knight? Beach, Pleez!

No, I mean if they did their usual tactics they employ today Batman would have stopped existing in solo movies, cartoons etc after Adam West's show.

That's what they've done to the lesser properties.

Obviously the more known characters get done more, wich makes them even more known wich makes them more profitable wich makes it more likely Warner will reserve a space in their schedule for them.

Only that hasn't worked out very well for them, either. Even when they succeed for a time they get ignored not set up to the next stage.

The only lesser property they did this with was Justice League and they still couldn't set it up properly where its failure wouldn't hurt its lesser franchises.


WIch is why, since Harry Potter is more known than Green Lantern, it's very likely Green Lantern stays in the land of scripts.

Wonder Woman was more known before Harry Potter was a hit it still didn't get a big budget, A-list cast great film or even an excellent cartoon series.

It's WB's own fault GL and the others aren't more popular. They have the resources to do this yet they chooose not to. How do they expect the public to become fans of something they never see?

No-one's going to care about GL untl they do something about it, it was the same with Harry Potter. No-one cared until Rowling did her books, built up the franchise's name with good product in the public and raised its profile into juggarnaut status. WB could do this with any of their lesser properties and some are easier to do this then others like Wonder Woman, Legion and Teen Titans.

But you like reading scripts of websites, don'tcha?

I like good results. WB hasn't delivered them.

[Antonello Blueberry]

You mean the same one that was being rushed into production, staring a below par cast, had script issues despite it being 'fantastic', was tried to be past off as an Australian film to get made cheaper and the constant division within the studio as to whether the film should be made in the first place? If that's you idea of a movie that's looking in good shape then good luck to you.
Again, the first X-Men movie was rushed into production, had a criticized cast (with a last minute replacement for Wolverine) and was being rewritten on the set. My only concern was with a couple of the cast members.

[jmc]

Again, the first X-Men movie was rushed into production, had a criticized cast (with a last minute replacement for Wolverine) and was being rewritten on the set. My only concern was with a couple of the cast members.

JL was rushed in simply because Superman under performed, nothing but a knee jerk reaction, X-men at least had studio backing for it, execs at WB were divided, it was ill conceived and fans wanted nothing to do with it, WB panicked. As for the script, it was said to have had the entire third act re-written, that's not exactly the same as a few changes here and there on set, an entire portion of the film re-written, and only after the writers strike started did they decide to do it. It matters little now, the film is dead and any potential JL movie is years away.

[The Major]

JL was rushed in simply because Superman under performed, nothing but a knee jerk reaction, X-men at least had studio backing for it, execs at WB were divided, it was ill conceived and fans wanted nothing to do with it, WB panicked. As for the script, it was said to have had the entire third act re-written, that's not exactly the same as a few changes here and there on set, an entire portion of the film re-written, and only after the writers strike started did they decide to do it.

X-men had a much better cast then JL, too.

It matters little now, the film is dead and any potential JL movie is years away.

:D

[jmc]

X-men had a much better cast then JL, too.


About 20 times better, you had a great line up of good solid actors in that bunch, no superstars, but a solid line up. JL couldn't even get that, $200 million and that was the best cast they could get?

[Antonello Blueberry]

JL was rushed in simply because Superman under performed, nothing but a knee jerk reaction, X-men at least had studio backing for it, execs at WB were divided, it was ill conceived and fans wanted nothing to do with it, WB panicked. As for the script, it was said to have had the entire third act re-written, that's not exactly the same as a few changes here and there on set, an entire portion of the film re-written, and only after the writers strike started did they decide to do it. It matters little now, the film is dead and any potential JL movie is years away.
JL was fast tracked (not exactly rushed) because WB had a good script and lacked a blockbuster for summer '09.
And the first X-men didn't have a complete studio backing. They had to cut several scenes (and characters like Blob and Beast) because of the budget limitations.
Anyway it's useless to discuss it again

[BATZARRO WWD]

A good film.

Exactly. Your enjoyment of a film should not be hampered by "did this just affect another film?"

It's better then watching terrible adaptions.
Well, I hope you enjoy the DC movies under production right now, then(pssst! not one). Sure, some movies that might have been at least good will never happen.

Thing is, sometimes projects that the fans can't apreciate generate interest in the general public. Look at the Teen Titans cartoon: I'm sure the fans considered that an abomination. But guess what? The mainstream liked it. It brought the characters to people who didn't even know them. I don't know if you follow me? Was that cartoon a setback for the franchise? Or wasn't it?

True.

It really doesn't make any sense, though. By that logic GL should be fine since TDK was a hit.
No. You see, it works like this:
Transformers is a hit: QUICK! FASTTRACK VOLTRON/GOBOTS/POWERRANGERS/MAZINGER!
Transformers fails: "Giant Robots are out, Docudramas are in"
Star Trek is a hit: "Space is in! Cash in on the Space Craze!"
Star Trek Fails: "The audience is reacting negatively to space movies. No space movies from us, then."

The don't ever see the factors of quality and timing. They say "people won't pay to see X element right now."

The reason it didn't have much potential is because they didn't come close to using it.
Sorry, but Catwoman as a movie concept without Batman doesn't have much potential.

Because it means WB might use them proerly in the future if they finaly get around it.

Kinda like Supeman, right? They held of tweanty years, and that helped make the best movie possibe:whatever:.

What I'm trying to say is WB is already "cautious" with their franchises, and that does not really help them when they do do them. They turtle-peek at a movie. If it's a success then they do another one. If they fail, then they hide back in their shell. They should have done this one to spark interest. At this point, irregardless of "The summit" and "the plan" all they have is "We'll try what's proven, and if it fails, then retreat".

It's true.

Any failed movie or high profile project put the franchise on the line.

The only ones except are Superman and Batman since they have faith since their succeeded since prior generations made enough good work to make relevant, good versions in different high profile formats and allowed the public to know those two franchises on an intimate level so they know what theyre getting into.

No other DC franchise has it on that level like those two.

What are they "not doing them" for if they ain't ever doing them? See here:


Batman and Robin: Comercial failiure.
Years later the franchise is revived.

Flash: No movie ever.
Years later "it's an unproven character" so no movie still.

You know what, if they don't at least TRY and get Flash in a movie, how in the hell is he gonna be in one? How can a franchise be born if the movie never gets done? This movie could have done that. Don't tell me Flash is cornier than cars transforming into Robots, and even that concept when applied to solid Blockbuster materials is a hit.

They're going to avoid them and WB will bury them in a vault for decades.
Unlike now that...

Wonder Woman was more known before Harry Potter was a hit it still didn't get a big budget, A-list cast great film or even an excellent cartoon series.

It's WB's own fault GL and the others aren't more popular. They have the resources to do this yet they chooose not to. How do they expect the public to become fans of something they never see?

No-one's going to care about GL untl they do something about it, it was the same with Harry Potter. No-one cared until Rowling did her books, built up the franchise's name with good product in the public and raised its profile into juggarnaut status. WB could do this with any of their lesser properties and some are easier to do this then others like Wonder Woman, Legion and Teen Titans.

Well, they were gonna "do something about it". Now it's all for nought. But we will forever comfort ourselves in that it isn't gonna step on someone's toes or that it was gonna suck.

But hey, we still have Young X-Men, right?:oldrazz:

I like good results. WB hasn't delivered them.

If you like results, why jump ahead of them?

[The Major]

Exactly. Your enjoyment of a film should not be hampered by "did this just affect another film?"

It does when it could mean other franchises get caught in the crossfire if it fails.

Well, I hope you enjoy the DC movies under production right now, then(pssst! not one). Sure, some movies that might have been at least good will never happen.

True.

Thing is, sometimes projects that the fans can't apreciate generate interest in the general public. Look at the Teen Titans cartoon: I'm sure the fans considered that an abomination. But guess what? The mainstream liked it. It brought the characters to people who didn't even know them. I don't know if you follow me? Was that cartoon a setback for the franchise? Or wasn't it?

That I actually liked. It's not perfect but it works as a stepping stone for future projects like Super Friends was to Justice League.

TT was a success. It's one of the successful franchises I was talking about WB has lost interest in when the tv show stopped.

So much more potential in that franchise beyond that kids cartoon. It's the same with Legion.

No. You see, it works like this:
Transformers is a hit: QUICK! FASTTRACK VOLTRON/GOBOTS/POWERRANGERS/MAZINGER!
Transformers fails: "Giant Robots are out, Docudramas are in"
Star Trek is a hit: "Space is in! Cash in on the Space Craze!"
Star Trek Fails: "The audience is reacting negatively to space movies. No space movies from us, then."

The don't ever see the factors of quality and timing. They say "people won't pay to see X element right now."

Agreed.

Sorry, but Catwoman as a movie concept without Batman doesn't have much potential.

What do you know about Catwoman? Have you read the Pfeifer/Brubaker/Dixon runs of her comic series? Why don't you think she can work as a solo movie franchise?

Kinda like Supeman, right? They held of tweanty years, and that helped make the best movie possibe:whatever:.

WB has faith in Superman. They have for decades.

He doesn't need a film to be in the spotlight. They'll give him several tv shows to keep him around any way.

SR wasn't perfect, I agree, but it was still a good film. Catwoman didn't even have that much going for it. Steel was even worse.

What I'm trying to say is WB is already "cautious" with their franchises, and that does not really help them when they do do them. They turtle-peek at a movie. If it's a success then they do another one. If they fail, then they hide back in their shell. They should have done this one to spark interest. At this point, irregardless of "The summit" and "the plan" all they have is "We'll try what's proven, and if it fails, then retreat".

Yes, but they're erratic with it.

A lesser DC property could go through all the hoops it needs to get them interested but the most they can hope for from WB is short term success on tv then into the vault never to be heard from again. And that's if they're lucky.

What are they "not doing them" for if they ain't ever doing them? See here:


Batman and Robin: Comercial failiure.
Years later the franchise is revived.

Batman is one of the rare properties which will be revived no matter what. Batman and Superman are the most solid DC franchises they know and trust since their predessors layed the groundwork for them. They need to do this for the lesser properties IMO. If WB had continued this behavior with DC's other properties the situation would be so dire.

The rest don't have that much faith or understanding from WB. They get one shot, and if they don't succeed they get thrown under a bus. Or they do succeed then ignored for decades with no good follow-ups so the next time they use them the public needs to be reintroduced again.

Flash: No movie ever.
Years later "it's an unproven character" so no movie still.

And that won't change unless they do something to get it in the spotlight. It doesn't have to be a movie either. A quality solo cartoon or tv show with good marketing would be fine. Keep that up until the public are interested enough to want a movie made.

You know what, if they don't at least TRY and get Flash in a movie, how in the hell is he gonna be in one? How can a franchise be born if the movie never gets done? This movie could have done that. Don't tell me Flash is cornier than cars transforming into Robots, and even that concept when applied to solid Blockbuster materials is a hit.


Unlike now that...

I agree with you about that.

Well, they were gonna "do something about it". Now it's all for nought.

They were going to likely fail and damage other franchises in the process. That's not progress, that's sabotage.

The stakes are to high to risk that.

If Miller really wants to make a DC movie he should use his clout on a solo project made first. This could get the ball rolling for a future JL film without the burden of putting other vulnerable franchises in danger.

Maybe he could ask his director friends to help with other solo JL adaptions. Does he know Alex Proyas? He should try to get him on Green Lantern or Green Arrow.

But we will forever comfort ourselves in that it isn't gonna step on someone's toes or that it was gonna suck.

It will do more then step on other people's toes. It will damage franchises with untapped potential for generations unless it is perfect.

It sucking means killing off DC's super-hero line, including the highest ranking franchises that aren't Batman and Superman, for decades or longer with no sign of ever coming back into WB's interest which was negligible at best.

But hey, we still have Young X-Men, right?:oldrazz:

No thanks.

If you like results, why jump ahead of them?

I like good results which don't mess up other franchises in the process if they fail. JL could be done without doing that.

[BATZARRO WWD]

I like good results which don't mess up other franchises in the process if they fail. JL could be done without doing that.

It could be done without doing that, if it could be done at all. But it won't.

Have you read the Pfeifer/Brubaker/Dixon runs of her comic series? Why don't you think she can work as a solo movie franchise?

Well, Catwoman as a solo character works in the comics. But she's known to the mainstream as a Batman character for a long time. Since we already established audiences are stupid and can't tell the difference between separate franchises, they will be confused and wondering where Batman is. The movie will not be a success, irregardless of quality or fidelity to the source.

The stakes are to high to risk that

Yeah, they could totally ruin a lot of stuff they have in the pipeline:whatever:

And that won't change
And THAT I can agree on.

[BlackLantern]

all it takes is one high budget comic book film to fail miserably and Hollywood will jump right off the CBF wagon...these movies are only getting done because they are the current "fad"....

[The Major]

It could be done without doing that, if it could be done at all.

They'll never find out unless they do it.

But it won't.

It won't because they don't want it to. They're still stuck in the status quo since everyone thinks it benefits them the most.

Well, Catwoman as a solo character works in the comics.

It works because the comic readers saw that side of her character. The public hasn't seen that yet. The audience who watched Batman:TAS have some idea, though.

But she's known to the mainstream as a Batman character for a long time.

It was the same in the comics.

Since we already established audiences are stupid

You underestimate the public. They react only to what they are shown, and WB hasn't shown them much about Catwoman in the movies.

Give them a good movie with a good Selina Kyle with good marketing and they'll give it a chance.

and can't tell the difference between separate franchises,

How are the public supposed to know that when WB doesn't know it themselves?

they will be confused

They'll only be confused if the movies don't explain themselves.

and wondering where Batman is.

Which can be easily done without messing up Catwoman's movie.

The movie will not be a success, irregardless of quality or fidelity to the source.

Why?

Yeah, they could totally ruin a lot of stuff they have in the pipeline:whatever:

Stuff will never be in the pipeline if it gets sabotaged early on by other movies.

And THAT I can agree on.

Change can only occur when people try to do it.

[BATZARRO WWD]

They'll never find out unless they do it.
They'll never find out period. Because they won't do it.

Quote:
Well, Catwoman as a solo character works in the comics.
It works because the comic readers saw that side of her character. The public hasn't seen that yet. The audience who watched Batman:TAS have some idea, though.

Quote:
But she's known to the mainstream as a Batman character for a long time.
It was the same in the comics.

Quote:
Since we already established audiences are stupid
You underestimate the public. They react only to what they are shown, and WB hasn't shown them much about Catwoman in the movies.

Give them a good movie with a good Selina Kyle with good marketing and they'll give it a chance.

What threads have you been reading? It's been established as cannon since, like 20 pages ago or more that people would never accept a different Batman in a different franchise because it would confuse them! Imagine explaining to them that "Catwoman does stuff even when Batman's not around". Their heads would explode! And Catwoman's a villain to most folks! We are not underestimating the audience, the audience is dumb and needs to be told everything's origin and that's what most folks in this thread believe! Catwoman as a solo character is WAY too complicated for them anyway.

Or do you believe that a Catwoman movie will fly without establishing her first in a Batman movie?

Change can only occur when people try to do it.
So do you believe they should take risks or not? Because half of you is saying "They oughta try!" and the other half is yelling "Don't try, you'll screw it up!" The fact is, the general audience that isn't completely corroded by geeky cynisism won't care what Green Lantern they use, or "no that isn't the real Batman!" or stuff like that when they see a trailer, or stills. And like the Teen Titans show, it might attract a whole new set of people to the franchises involved. Does have it be completely faithfull? What is? But cynisism(i'm misspelling am'nt I?) and other factors seem to have killed this project, so that's it. It's been like waching a pregnant woman and saying her child should die because he WAS gonna be a criminal. To me it sounded like it had a good, serious, conspirational plot(wich inmediately takes away any "Running to be the new 'Batman and Robin' comments to rest" with an award winning director. And now we'll never really know. Fin.

[The Major]

They'll never find out period. Because they won't do it.

True.

What threads have you been reading? It's been established as cannon since, like 20 pages ago or more that people would never accept a different Batman in a different franchise because it would confuse them!

This isn't a simple question to answer.

It may have worked or it may have not, but Nolan's realistic Batman has made it much harder to transition, especially in the draft with Talia wanting revenge on him killing her father.

If the Bat films were more fantastic like Burton's were this wouldnt be such a problem.

But they don't need Batman in JL to succeed. They have Superman.

Imagine explaining to them that "Catwoman does stuff even when Batman's not around". Their heads would explode!

I disagree.

And Catwoman's a villain to most folks!

No, she isn't.

We are not underestimating the audience, the audience is dumb and needs to be told everything's origin

Wanting to know a character's origin doesn't make them stupid. They need to care about these characters and origins allow them to do that.

and that's what most folks in this thread believe!

I agree with them.

Catwoman as a solo character is WAY too complicated for them anyway.

No, she isn't. The audience has seen femme fatales before and even liked previous high profile versions of the character, even if they weren't completely faithful. I'm not counting Halle's version, btw.

Or do you believe that a Catwoman movie will fly without establishing her first in a Batman movie?

That was originally what the Catwoman movie was supposed to do only they dropped all connections to the Bat franchise and delivered a crappy movie.

I do think that starting her off in Batman's movies first has merit.

So do you believe they should take risks or not?

Not all risks are the same. Some are bad and unnecessary, others are not.

Because half of you is saying "They oughta try!" and the other half is yelling "Don't try, you'll screw it up!"

That's the delicate balance Hollywood adaptions live by.

You're making it all to extreme, though. There are good chances and good risk and bad risks and bad changes. They can do various things to make it less risky for JL or any franchise but it requires complete understanding of that they're adapting, a good long term plan and a good execution.

WB could have done this with JL but they chose not to with Miller. Thankfully it never got to far off the ground or it would have failed. They may be doing better with the Marvel method but who knows whether it will ever happen.

The fact is, the general audience that isn't completely corroded by geeky cynisism won't care what Green Lantern they use, or "no that isn't the real Batman!" or stuff like that when they see a trailer, or stills.

They won't care about GL at all unless they can watch him do something, the adaptions make them care about him and they're good movies.

It doesn't matter what GL they use as long as its executed great.

And like the Teen Titans show, it might attract a whole new set of people to the franchises involved.

Might? It got an entirely new generation's interest.

That's a built in audience they can use to do a more serious, more faithful cartoon or live action tv show with the franchise. They can keep building this up to it's a high profile property.

Does have it be completely faithfull?

It better try or they aren't adapting ****.

While not everything from the comics can be faithful for various reasons but they had better be good reasons for the changes and it better be executed great. Fandom will forgive if this is done well.

What is?

X-men 1 and 2, Hellboy, Spider-man 1 and 2, Iron Man, the two recent Hulk films, V for Vendetta, Donner's Superman and Nolan's Batman got close enough.

Burton's weren't perfect but they were good, too.

But cynisism(i'm misspelling am'nt I?) and other factors seem to have killed this project, so that's it.

The cynicsm didn't come from nowhere.

WB's bought it on themselves with their numerous failured adaptions.

Miller's controversial casting and plot was just asking to be questioned.

To much was on the line at this point for this to fail, as well. He would have had to be perfect.

It's been like waching a pregnant woman and saying her child should die because he WAS gonna be a criminal.

You haven't said anything to discount my argument that it faiing or having bad versions of lesser characters would destroy their solo franchises prematurely.

I've already mentioned a way Miller and his friends could make JL happen with a long term plan by establishing the lesser solo heroes first.

To me it sounded like it had a good, serious, conspirational plot(wich inmediately takes away any "Running to be the new 'Batman and Robin' comments to rest" with an award winning director.

Didn't Batman and Robin have an award winning director?

It's cast was better then JL's, too.

Talia al Ghul was a bad idea, as well. Besides having a blonde Australian acting rookie in the role these people wanted to use her as a connection to events in Nolan's movies while at the same time saying they aren't connected. That's going to confuse anyone.

And now we'll never really know. Fin.

True.

[BATZARRO WWD]

X-men 1 and 2(Suits, issues with Mistique not being Nightcrawler's mother, Stryker not being a preacher. Wolverine's ties to Stryker etc. And indeed, common consensus is aparently now both of these sucked as well! Horray for historical revissionism!) Spider-man 1 and 2(Goblin Suit, the nature of Dock Ock's villainy, Organic Webbing, Mary Jane being firstAnd indeed, common consensus is aparently now both of these sucked as well!) Iron Man( suit made into modern version in the span on one film) the two recent Hulk films(Hulk's whole father thing and he becoming a villain,Hulk accident on purpose), V for Vendetta (so highly inspired by modern events, some say it strays from the book's true source), Donner's Superman(No, Ultrahumanite is nowhere to be found) and Nolan's Batman (IIt's completely faithfull. Except that Batman doesn't really "hate" guns in it. Oh, and Two Face dies real early in his career. And the suit, it is NOTHING like the comics. And the car is also nothing alike. And that Ra'as al Ghoul is neither a hundreds years old nor an Arab. And Scarecrow is a push over. And Rachel Dawes is there. And Joker is a mostly Bomb exclusive terrorist, he does nothing else that doesn't involve either knives or explosives.


None of those were fully completely fully faithfull? Sin City? Did you see Jessica Alba nude? Now, did that detract you from the rest of the entertainment value? Did any of what I quoted above did?

It's cast was better then JL's, too.
Well, imagine that. A great cast couldn't save an awefully written film, huh? So, by default, do-you-mean-to-say-an-unknown-cast in a better written movie might be, erm...good? Or should Superheroes cast only ever be known celebrities? Before you answer, look at the list you made.

You haven't said anything to discount my argument that it faiing or having bad versions of lesser characters would destroy their solo franchises prematurely.

I've already mentioned a way Miller and his friends could make JL happen with a long term plan by establishing the lesser solo heroes first.

Well, the original plan was to have the movie first and then the spinoff's later. Lesser known characters became known and the audience is brought in by the more known characters. If it fails that doesn't mean they still can't do solo reboots anyway.

Red Sonja is getting a remake, and even the makers admit that it's only movie sucked. And you gonna sit here and tell me Wonderwoman has less chances of being remade than Red Sonja, should the movie fail?

But if you your logic is that you're willing to wait 10/20 more years for a good Flash movie, then why are you worried this would have delayed that?

[Retroman]

Interview with Arnie Hammer.
http://it.eonline.com/uberblog/marc_malkin/b30975_holy_double_take_batman_here_comes_new.html


I would love to see photos of the actors in the WETA costumes.

Same here.

With it being unlikely that this project will happen in it's current form maybe WB and WETA could strike a deal to release maquette or statue versions of JLM as merchandise with photos of the actors in costume.

[Infinity9999x]

So what are the official updates? Is WB still going ahead with this movie for sure?

[I Am The Knight]

So what are the official updates? Is WB still going ahead with this movie for sure?

More like the opposite.

[biolumen]

More like the opposite.

Then someone should alert the ombudsman for "The Australian".

Movers & Shapers
September 29, 2008

Megan Gale – The Model’s Model

Megan Gale became a star in Italy long before she made it in her home country, perhaps thanks to her Anglo-Polynesian heritage: her look is more 21st century Sophia Loren than Aussie beach babe. But as the face of David Jones for seven years, Gale redefined the role of a store model. She retired from the catwalk this year at age 32 and is primed to fight new battles as Wonder Woman in George Miller’s forthcoming film Justice League: Mortal.
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,24396039-5012694,00.html

[TheVileOne]

Australia exists in an isolated vaccuum. Well they are an island. It figures they would be 5 years behind the rest of the world in everything, including entertainment news.

I'm so glad after reading that report that Arm and Hammer isn't playing Batman.

[biolumen]

It's official.

Enough Rope With Andrew Denton
9:35pm Monday, 13 Oct 2008

Andrew's guest is acclaimed Australian film director/producer Dr. George Miller (Mad Max, Babe, The Witches of Eastwick).

Maybe he'll spill some interesting behind-the-scenes tidbits.

Hmm, probably not, but at least his appearance should put an unequivocal end to any further speculation some uninformed folks (not us) might still have about the project (i.e. Hammer, editors at "The Australian, etc).

I'd also like to hear him talk some about Mad Max 4.

[Jake Cassidy]

Australia exists in an isolated vaccuum. Well they are an island. It figures they would be 5 years behind the rest of the world in everything, including entertainment news.

I'm so glad after reading that report that Arm and Hammer isn't playing Batman.

You seem to have a beef with Australia. It's understandable considering we're smarter, funnier, more talented and a hell of a lot better looking than you Yanks will ever be. :oldrazz: :woot:

[Webhead2006]

hopefully he will settle the crap finally.

[BATZARRO WWD]

http://www.news.com.au/entertainment/story/0,26278,24428157-5013560,00.html

The stunning supermodel, who was cast to play Wonder Woman in George Miller's Justice League of America, hasn't given up on Hollywood. The DJs ambassador revealed her plans at the launch of the David Jones American Express Card in Darlinghurst last night. "I'm looking at going to LA in three to four weeks to meet with studio heads and directors," she said yesterday.
Gale said while Warner Bros still wants to make Justice League, it has been put on hold following the success of The Dark Knight.
"Batman (the central character in The Dark Knight) is part of the Justice League and so there are a lot of other things that have to be taken into consideration before they shoot," she said. But being cast in the film has at least gotten Gale's name out there.

[Webhead2006]

I saw that earlier today, i wish gale the best of luck and hopefully she can get the right roles and build up her skills as an actor.

[ironman29758]

http://www.news.com.au/entertainment/story/0,26278,24428157-5013560,00.html
apparently alot of people want Megan Gale to be Wonder Woman:

http://www.zimbio.com/Megan+Gale/polls/1/results?add=True

[The Major]

apparently alot of people want Megan Gale to be Wonder Woman:

http://www.zimbio.com/Megan+Gale/polls/1/results?add=True

Doesn't mean they're right.

[BATZARRO WWD]

Let's be fair here: Two choice slots are wasted on Garner and Simpson...

[The Major]

Let's be fair here: Two choice slots are wasted on Garner and Simpson...

I agree about Simpson.

Garner is a good actress.

[I Am The Knight]

apparently alot of people want Megan Gale to be Wonder Woman:

http://www.zimbio.com/Megan+Gale/polls/1/results?add=True

That is an awful poll. No wonder she won.

Anyway, WW should be a bit more feminine than Gale. Gale has hands powerful enough to strangle a horse. She probably intimidated poor DJ.

[The Major]

That is an awful poll. No wonder she won.

:D

Anyway, WW should be a bit more feminine than Gale.

Actually, I think Gale is a little to feminine for the role.

WW requires an actress who can show she could seriously mess up people in a fight and I don't get that from Gale at all. She looks like she'd faint if she saw her own blood.

Gale has hands powerful enough to strangle a horse. She probably intimidated poor DJ.

Haha.

[BATZARRO WWD]

I agree about Simpson.

Garner is a good actress.

Well, two things:

1) She already played Elektra

2) It's not a knock on her acting ability or anything, but she's not, at least to me, cut out to be Wonderwoman.

[I Am The Knight]

:D



Actually, I think Gale is a little to feminine for the role.

WW requires an actress who can show she could seriously mess up people in a fight and I don't get that from Gale at all. She looks like she'd faint if she saw her own blood.

:hehe:

[The Major]

Well, two things:

1) She already played Elektra

True.

I thought she did a great job in the Elektra solo movie. :D

2) It's not a knock on her acting ability or anything, but she's not, at least to me, cut out to be Wonderwoman.

What exactly makes you think Garner would be a bad WW? She's not my first choice but she's got all the qualities I'd like to see in the role.

[BATZARRO WWD]

True.

I thought she did a great job in the Elektra solo movie. :D



What exactly makes you think Garner would be a bad WW? She's not my first choice but she's got all the qualities I'd like to see in the role.

I guess it kinda goes into the realm of the abstract, but her face and body structutre seem too thin-ish for the job. She could get away with it in Elektra because her character was more of a Ninja than a warrioress. But Wonderwoman should be at least a bit "naturally built".

[The Major]

I guess it kinda goes into the realm of the abstract, but her face and body structutre seem too thin-ish for the job. She could get away with it in Elektra because her character was more of a Ninja than a warrioress. But Wonderwoman should be at least a bit "naturally built".
True.

The main reason I'm willing to over look that for Garner is the odds of finding an actress with that exact shape and great acting talent are very slim.

Garner has proven she has the acting skills, is a competent action hero in both weapons and unarmed combat and she could pass close enough with looks, even if she isn't a clone in appearance like Gale is.

[Crook]

I'd rather have no film at all than to see her in the role. There are very few actresses in Hollywood that could pass as WW, and Garner isn't near close to them.

[BATZARRO WWD]

http://www.iesb.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=5563&Itemid=99

IESB has awesome non-news to not really report on the subject and others.

While watching the WATCHMEN footage (which by the way, I can't even begin to tell you how awesome and mind blowing it was, but more on that later) during a press event put on by Warner Brothers.


I ran into a few executives and friends who I hadn't seen in a bit and got a few updates to share! After the footage screened and a Q&A with director Zack Snyder, a cocktail reception was held on the lot where I got some goodies on upcoming WB properties!
First up, Batman. There have been rumors making the internet rounds this week basically saying that the third Chris Nolan Batman film had entered into pre-production and was looking for crew members. A WB exec told me directly that another Batman film is not in pre-production and is not getting ready to shoot. Not at all. We were told this rumor is total BS and that Nolan just got back from vacation and while WB is keen (duh) to make a third film, there has been no immediate conversations with Nolan and that the rumor is totally bogus.
Next up, Green Lantern. As reported in the past, GL is looking extremely good and it looks like it will definitely be going forward Spring of 09.
On to Justice League. Yes, Justice League. I know, I know, it's a dead horse but I had to ask about it. I asked our source about the Armie Hammer quote that made the rounds last week that the JL production was still looking for a location to shoot, which has to be total BS. He said that they are not doing anything with JL. The studio doesn't want to do JL just to do it. They want to make it when the time is right. Very similar to what WB's Jeff Robinov said to WSJ last month.
And finally, the Superman sequel Man of Steel. The WB insider recognizes there has been a lot of buzz on the internet following the success of Iron Man and The Dark Knight, for a Superman sequel, but they really just don't know what's going on at this time. I asked him if Bryan Singer was still attached. He said he didn't know where it stands right now at the studio level since Singer has been busy on Valkyrie.
But he also said one thing is for certain, WB has a lot of properties available and they plan on mining them.
Stay tuned to the IESB for the latest!


Mamma bird is done regurgitating in our mouths yet?

[I Am The Knight]

Funny how things change. A year ago, JL was "top priority" for the studio and was being fast tracked. Now it's all about "Doing it when the time is right" ...

But I agree, of course. No need for JL at the moment.

[TheVileOne]

That's because a year ago, the industry was facing a work stoppage strike. That = green-lighting as many tentpoles pre-strike as possible.

[BATZARRO WWD]

But on the other hand, should they have done it, they could have had the new Potter film now, and left Justice League to cover next year.

[TheVileOne]

And then they would've had another Batman movie starring someone who wasn't Christian Bale a year after THE DARK KNIGHT. Which would've been STUPID. And made Chris Nolan furious. Also stupid.

Moving Harry Potter to 2009 was a brilliant move. Halting a Justice League project that shouldn't have been rushed like it was at all, also a good move.

I'm glad we aren't getting a strike rushed JL movie. Or that stupid Robert Smigel/Jack Black GL movie. No disrespect to Smigel or Black because they are both talented comedians and writers and very good at what they do. But fans deserve better. And Iron Man proves that it can be better. That's NOT GL. GL needs to be a serious, comic book sci-fi action super hero movie. It needs to be like Raiders of the Lost Ark in space. It can't be like freaking NACHO LIBRE in space.

Sometimes all these years after Batman and Robin it feels like these studio guys haven't learned anything at all.

[BATZARRO WWD]

And then they would've had another Batman movie starring someone who wasn't Christian Bale a year after THE DARK KNIGHT. Which would've been STUPID. And made Chris Nolan furious. Also stupid.

Moving Harry Potter to 2009 was a brilliant move. Halting a Justice League project that shouldn't have been rushed like it was at all, also a good move.

I'm glad we aren't getting a strike rushed JL movie. Or that stupid Robert Smigel/Jack Black GL movie. No disrespect to Smigel or Black because they are both talented comedians and writers and very good at what they do. But fans deserve better. And Iron Man proves that it can be better. That's NOT GL. GL needs to be a serious, comic book sci-fi action super hero movie. It needs to be like Raiders of the Lost Ark in space. It can't be like freaking NACHO LIBRE in space.

Sometimes all these years after Batman and Robin it feels like these studio guys haven't learned anything at all.


Potter fans didn't think it was a brilliant move. I mean, since we're focusing on how this affects people we don't necessarilly live with...

[biolumen]

Gale blurbs about Justice League.

As for the fate of Justice League – which is now slated for a 2011 release – Gale is optimistic the flick will recover from its early production glitches.

"We didn't get permission to shoot (in Australia) so they've been going back to the drawing board and changing the script a little bit to reflect what's happened in Batman," she said.

http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/story/0,23739,24467227-5012980,00.html

I'm sure it's a bit more complicated than that.

[BlackLantern]

Wow...so Gale can read something her publicist wrote for her....I doubt she's even heard of Batman

[FlawlessVictory]

As for the fate of Justice League – which is now slated for a 2011 release

:rolleyes:

[jmc]

As for the fate of Justice League – which is now slated for a 2011 release – Gale is optimistic the flick will recover from its early production glitches.


"We didn't get permission to shoot (in Australia) so they've been going back to the drawing board and changing the script a little bit to reflect what's happened in Batman," she said.


2011? Give me a break, who wrote this piece of crap. And seriously Megan, it's going to require more than a little script change to reflect what happened in TDK, the JL film will have to be totally rewritten.

[Two-Face]

I thought this Batman was gonna different than TDK...? it's a sign that WB should stop making this movie.

[FlawlessVictory]

2011? Give me a break, who wrote this piece of crap. And seriously Megan, it's going to require more than a little script change to reflect what happened in TDK, the JL film will have to be totally rewritten.

It's as if they live in their own world and are completely oblivious to what has actually happened with the project.

[Jake Cassidy]

Wow...so Gale can read something her publicist wrote for her....I doubt she's even heard of Batman


:whatever:

[Jake Cassidy]

I know people are gonna argue with this, but, I'm pretty sure that she would know more about what's going on than any of you.

[jmc]

It's as if they live in their own world and are completely oblivious to what has actually happened with the project.

I'm almost certain they just looked at IMDB to get that 2011 release date, coz that's the only place on the net that says JL coming out in 2011, quality journalism right there.

[Jake Cassidy]

What was I thinking? Of course, a bunch of geeks sitting in front of a computer on a message board knows more than the people actually involved in the movie. :oldrazz: :woot:

[BlackLantern]

I know people are gonna argue with this, but, I'm pretty sure that she would know more about what's going on than any of you.

I'm sure, as an actress involved in a project she does, but this is just a paycheck for her....studios know that the public likes to hear news and gossip from the stars of the film.....I doubt she cares if JL gets off the ground or not, there are other things she can move on to

[jmc]

Numerous sources have said the project isn't getting made anytime soon, Gale is just spewing the same crap she has been for the last few months now, "location issues, script changes", this JL project is dead.

[Jake Cassidy]

I actually don't really care about this movie anymore. I'm just bored.

[biolumen]

I doubt she cares if JL gets off the ground or not, there are other things she can move on to

I disagree. This film is the kind of once-in-a-lifetime opportunity most aspiring actors dream of. Of course Gale wants it to happen.

And no, there doesn't appear to be anything comparable to move on to at this time, hence the second self-promotional visit to Hollywood next month.

[biolumen]

Justice League screenplay being revised to tie in with The Dark Knight, says Megan Gale

By David Bentley on Oct 9, 08 04:04 PM in Film gossip

AUSTRALIAN actress and supermodel Megan Gale says the Justice League movie project is being rewritten to make it consistent with events in The Dark Knight.

Gale, 33, who's of British and Polynesian descent, was cast as Wonder Woman in the Justice League Mortal film project to have been directed by Happy Feet helmer George Miller.

Also cast in the movie were Armie Hammer as Batman, D.J. Cotrona as Superman, rapper Common as Green Lantern, Adam Brody as The Flash, Santiago Cabrera as Aquaman and Hugh Keays-Byrne as Martian Manhunter.

The film, penned by American husband and wife team Kieran and Michele Mulroney, was put on hold after a string of production problems including the refusal of vital tax concessions by the Australian government.

Gale (pictured on right in image at top, and on left in my quick image makeover as the Amazon superheroine) says she is now giving up modelling and will move to Los Angeles next month to develop her career as an actress.

She told Aussie news site Couriermail that Justice League was still being considered and claimed it was slated for a 2011 release.

She said: "We didn't get permission to shoot (in Australia) so they've been going back to the drawing board and changing the script a little bit to reflect what's happened in Batman."

This is an interesting comment. Justice League already included a different actor as Batman, so it was assumed to be set in a different reality.

How might the storyline of The Dark Knight affect the storyline of Justice League Mortal? The main villain in JLM was said to be Maxwell Lord but did it also include Harvey Dent/Two Face (who died) and Joker (who's unlikely to reappear because Heath Ledger is dead)? Could a Justice League form as a result of events in the next Batman movie?

http://blogs.coventrytelegraph.net/thegeekfiles/2008/10/justice-league-screenplay-bein.html

I suppose script work might continue on this movie as a backup plan in the unlikely event Nolan decides against making a third movie.

[BlackLantern]

I disagree. This film is the kind of once-in-a-lifetime opportunity most aspiring actors dream of. Of course Gale wants it to happen.

And no, there doesn't appear to be anything comparable to move on to at this time, hence the second self-promotional visit to Hollywood next month.

Jessica Biel and three other actresses turned down an offer to even come in and read/screen test for Wonder Woman...anyone with a brain knows this project is poison....

[biolumen]

Miller still hopes to make Justice League; talks about other future movies.

Little feet bring film industry back to life

Garry Maddox Film Writer
October 10, 2008

For a city that has struggled to attract film production, there is good news from the Oscar-winning director George Miller. Work has started in Sydney on sequels to two of the country's most loved films, Happy Feet and Babe.

After losing the battle to shoot the comic book movie Justice League Mortal this year, Miller has returned to two earlier hits. Happy Feet, about a penguin with a talent for dancing, was expected to spawn a sequel after it grossed $US379 million around the world and won the best animated feature Oscar last year.

The hiring of the digital film-making crew for Happy Feet 2 is under way.

But a second sequel to Babe, the 1995 film about a cute piglet who behaved like a sheepdog, is a surprise after disappointing returns for Miller's Babe: Pig In The City a decade ago. The original Babe, directed by Chris Noonan, grossed $US249 million and was nominated for seven Oscars including best picture, winning for visual effects.

Whether Babe 3 will be closer in tone to the sweet-natured first movie or the darker sequel is not yet clear. "We're still at the scripting stage so we'll wait and see," Miller said. "But that won't be the next film we're doing.

"There's another script I've got for a digital film which I want to run off the back of [the] Happy Feet [sequel]."

Miller still hopes to make Justice League, which was knocked back in March for the Federal Government's new film production incentive, though where it would be shot remains unclear.

The $US200 million movie sparked heated debate in the film industry over its eligibility for the 40 per cent tax offset.

At the time, Miller said the industry needed movie franchises, even if they were not identifiably Australian, to boost production, improve skills and draw talent back from overseas. The Happy Feet and Babe sequels are part of a long-term plan for more digital production in Sydney.

"You've got to have enough films lined up to be able to entice people to come back for five to 10 years," Miller said. "They need to know that they're not going to come here for a short term then have to go again. So we have to line up quite a few digital projects."

Miller said executives at the Hollywood studio Warner Bros remained enthusiastic about making Justice League, especially given the phenomenal box office success of the comic book movie The Dark Knight.

"Warners is strategising on that at the moment," he said. "With [the success of] the Batman franchise, they're paying a lot of attention to it."

http://www.smh.com.au/news/entertainment/film/life-inducing-sequels/2008/10/09/1223145545624.html

Mad Max 4, RIP.

[biolumen]

BlackLantern, it appears our definition of an "aspiring actor" differs from each other.

[BlackLantern]

BlackLantern, it appears our definition of an "aspiring actor" differs from each other.

It doesn't....It's just my opinion that A)This project is way too big for WB right now, they haven't done enough CBFs to get a feel for what really works and this could be the big bomb that basically stops the current tide of CBFs getting adapted/optioned....B)the only reason Hollywood is cranking these things out is because they make money....the second one comes out that is a big huge flop it's all over....Marvel will be the only studio putting out CBFs

[biolumen]

Thank you for sharing you opinion, but none of that, while possibly true, changes the fact that Gale wants this movie to happen for herself. I'm sure the other actors, including Common, feel the same way.

[jmc]

Here lies the problem for the current JL movie that links with TDK, it simply won't work, the entire film would have to be revamped head to toe not just simple script changes as Gale's says to fit within TDK universe, the whole thing is gonna have to be re-written. Originally it was going to be 'ultra stylized' in tone, now you've got to somehow cram super powered beings into Nolan's 'real' world. Originally it had a cast of nobodies, now you've got to give us the same quality cast as TDK. Then of coarse there's the whole getting Christian Bale on board (which I'm not certain is guaranteed). They've effectively got to start with a blank page and that's going to take time.

[The Guard]

Good lord, can we please stop with this "But how will Batman fit into the DC Universe" nonsense?

He's been doing it for almost 70 years now.

[The Guard]

Good lord, can we please stop with this "But how will Batman fit into the DC Universe" nonsense?

He's been doing it for almost 70 years now.

[jmc]

Yeah, in comics not on film, different media.

[Evil Twin]

Yeah, how will a costumed superhero work on film with other costumed superheroes?

I see the problem with injecting superpowers into a Nolan film. I don't see the reverse being a problem. Especially since I think the "realism" elements of Nolan are overblown. Nolan's Batman exists in a universe of cell phone sonar, microwave emitters that can vaporize the water supply of a city, and memory fabric flying capes.

[The Guard]

Yeah, in comics not on film, different media.

So? Explain to me how the concept changes. You take a character without powers, who has existed just fine for YEARS in a world with other characters who have powers, and you put him into a film where his presence makes sense and has thematic relevance.

I agree will Evil Twin. It's one thing to have Superman show up in a third Batman film. It's quite another to take the concept of Batman, and put that realistic element into a Justice League film, whether Bale plays the role or someone else does.

This was, and continues to be, the stupidest fanboy quibble ever.

[jmc]

Easier said than done.

[The Guard]

Everything's easier said than done. I've not seen one concrete, realistic example of why Chris Nolan's Batman wouldn't work with other superheroes.

[Webhead2006]

Yea we will probably never know what the hell is going on with jla. Only thing that is clear right now is they are not going to do it now and will wait to batman 3 is done, revamp superman, green lantern, and atless flash/ww films get off the ground first.

[Rishi]

eh, I don't know. I think Superman Returns and Batman Begins fit together quite well. I can ignore stuff easily though

[Webhead2006]

Well we dont have to worry about superman returns fitting into future films/jla. SR is dead and superman will be getting a fresh start(hopefully the new director/writers are good and know the character well).

[jmc]

Everything's easier said than done. I've not seen one concrete, realistic example of why Chris Nolan's Batman wouldn't work with other superheroes.

And I've seen no example of how Nolan's Batman could work with super powered beings given they spent the last two films trying to present a realistic as possible version of the character. So it's a stalemate.

[Webhead2006]

yea really if there would be any other heros in nolan's realistic world it would probably be characters like the question, huntress, and other characters in that area.

[FaT_tONle]

Way to beat a dead horse with this topic guys... but I agree with the previous poster... TDK had a lot of sci fi high technological elements.... expect and even more overthetop BB3... Batmobile and all... if and when that gets made I honestly think it will finally feel like an old school Batman film that we are all accustomed too. As far as Justice League... gut tells me Bale walks anyhow.... so I honestly think it's a lost cause. The fact that these other projects hinges on Batman's success (indicated by WB)... Bale has all the leverage in the world. Good luck to WB getting him onboard this project... haha.

[jmc]

Bale and Nolan really are WB golden boys at the moment.

[mclay18]

I feel like I have to reiterate some stuff already:

If BB3 doesn't happen, Bale is still contracted for a third movie (which could also be an ensemble pic). If Nolan declines to return for a third, Warners can easily use that third film option on Bale for JL:M if they're reworking it into the Nolanverse continuity.

Bale won't like it, but if he doesn't do it WB will likely sue him. Unless there was a contract proviso that he can only work with Nolan on a third Bat-film...

[FaT_tONle]

Yeah but if BB3 doesn't happen... according to the latest reports from WB/DC, the studio WILL NOT move forward with other solo projects like Superman/Flash/WW/JLA. WB doesn't want to move from franchise A to B to C... they want to do everything at the same time and tie their characters into the same universe like Marvel is doing. So more than likely you'd be asking Bale to play Batman the fourth time and it would be in something completely different. I mean Johnny Depp is making 56 freaking MILLION for POTC4... you wonder what Bale's salary would be for a Justice League film. You'd be looking at 100 million for the cast alone.

[jmc]

I feel like I have to reiterate some stuff already:

If BB3 doesn't happen, Bale is still contracted for a third movie (which could also be an ensemble pic). If Nolan declines to return for a third, Warners can easily use that third film option on Bale for JL:M if they're reworking it into the Nolanverse continuity.

Bale won't like it, but if he doesn't do it WB will likely sue him. Unless there was a contract proviso that he can only work with Nolan on a third Bat-film...


Contracts aren't worth the paper they are written on, if Bale doesn't want to come back, he won't, there's always a loophole.

[Crook]

Yeah but if BB3 doesn't happen... according to the latest reports from WB/DC, the studio WILL NOT move forward with other solo projects like Superman/Flash/WW/JLA. WB doesn't want to move from franchise A to B to C... they want to do everything at the same time and tie their characters into the same universe like Marvel is doing. So more than likely you'd be asking Bale to play Batman the fourth time and it would be in something completely different. I mean Johnny Depp is making 56 freaking MILLION for POTC4... you wonder what Bale's salary would be for a Justice League film. You'd be looking at 100 million for the cast alone.
That'll never happen. Salaries fluctuate based on the project, and it's certainly standardized with ensemble pictures. Not only is it highly doubtful that Bale would ever get anywhere near 50 million for the first JL film, but neither will any of his other castmates. They're not on that level.

The Ocean series managed to nab 2 big Hollywood stars, yet still had a budget well below 150 million.

[FaT_tONle]

That'll never happen. Salaries fluctuate based on the project, and it's certainly standardized with ensemble pictures. Not only is it highly doubtful that Bale would ever get anywhere near 50 million for the first JL film, but neither will any of his other castmates. They're not on that level.

The Ocean series managed to nab 2 big Hollywood stars, yet still had a budget well below 150 million.

I see your point... but if I am Bale I am demanding a couple of million just to have a sit down with WB... why would he not make that powerplay? WB needs Bale/Batman. Otherwise JLA would pale in comparison to an Avengers movie... it would be like replacing Robert Downey Jr. as Stark. I am demanding nothing less than 30 million if I am Bale. WB has to pay it or they have nothing... even with actors like Routh and Gosling... it won't be enough to carry the film if you have a scrub in there for Bruce Wayne. I just don't see Bale doing this movie under any circumstances regardless of how much money is involved.

[I Am The Knight]

I see your point... but if I am Bale I am demanding a couple of million just to have a sit down with WB... why would he not make that powerplay? WB needs Bale/Batman. Otherwise JLA would pale in comparison to an Avengers movie... it would be like replacing Robert Downey Jr. as Stark. I am demanding nothing less than 30 million if I am Bale. WB has to pay it or they have nothing... even with actors like Routh and Gosling... it won't be enough to carry the film if you have a scrub in there for Bruce Wayne. I just don't see Bale doing this movie under any circumstances regardless of how much money is involved.

You are overestimating Bale's appeal. He's not Ledger's wonderful perfomance in TDK. He's not Depp's...Popular performance in POTC. He's not Robert Downey Jr's charismatic leading man performance in Iron Man. Thanks to TDK, more people see him as Batman now, sure...But the most he would get for a JLA film would be $10 million, IMO.

And now we are going back into the whole "But only X person can play Y character" argument from last year...

[Crook]

We'll see. I don't see him doing a JL film in it's current state, but with the project apparently getting an overhaul, it could easily change his mindset. This is the same guy that is starring in a film made by the director of Charlie's Angels after all. Nothing is out of the realm of possibility given the direction and script takes to his liking.

The point is moot now however with JL being on hold. Plus it seems like he'd only consider the ensemble pic after the third is out.

[FaT_tONle]

You are overestimating Bale's appeal. He's not Ledger's wonderful perfomance in TDK. He's not Depp's...Popular performance in POTC. He's not Robert Downey Jr's charismatic leading man performance in Iron Man. Thanks to TDK, more people see him as Batman now, sure...But the most he would get for a JLA film would be $10 million, IMO.

And now we are going back into the whole "But only X person can play Y character" argument from last year...

Okay you want to say it won't be 30 million then fine... 10 million is, however, is completely laughable... the guy will be making 20 million plus with BB3 IMO. Look at TDK's gross. He is going to want the same amount for JLA. He isn't going to take a pay cut. He didn't sign on as Batman to star in a Justice League movie. The character appealed to him for different reasons, and now you are asking him to do something completely different... RDJ will probably make 10-15 million with IM2... I guarantee you his salary will be close to 30-35 million combined for both IM2/Avengers. Bale will probably want more because his movies gross slightly more. Plus it would be his fourth film... not his third. RDJ's fourth film (if there is one) will most likely be IM3 and his salary will be 40 million plus ALONE for that film... much like Depp's salary for POTC 4.

We'll see. I don't see him doing a JL film in it's current state, but with the project apparently getting an overhaul, it could easily change his mindset. This is the same guy that is starring in a film made by the director of Charlie's Angels after all. Nothing is out of the realm of possibility given the direction and script takes to his liking.

The point is moot now however with JL being on hold. Plus it seems like he'd only consider the ensemble pic after the third is out.

Well WB has already updated the slate...

GL 2010
BB3 2011
Supes 2012

If that current slate holds up they are obviously gearing for a 2013/2014 release for Justice League. With inflation and everything... the bugdet could EASILY surpass whatever budget Avengers/BB3 might be... hell it may be more than BOTH SM4/5 combined. You can't just make a George Miller Justice League film with a different cast. WB has made the comittment... now they have to follow through.

[Crook]

They don't have to follow through at all. Remember all the false Superman restarts?

6 years is an incredible amount of time. There's no way in hell you're gonna ask these guys to wait for you, much less tightly secure a defined crew that won't be set to work for half a decade. The Miller JL film could easily fall by the wayside, paving a way for a completely new team to take over.

[FaT_tONle]

They don't have to follow through at all. Remember all the false Superman restarts?

6 years is an incredible amount of time. There's no way in hell you're gonna ask these guys to wait for you, much less tightly secure a defined crew that won't be set to work for half a decade. The Miller JL film could easily fall by the wayside, paving a way for a completely new team to take over.

I am sorry but that makes no sense... WB has stated they are moving forward with another Superman film. That means JLA has to take a back seat... you guys hear from one camp that a JL: M movie or whatever the **** they are calling it is still fair game... then we hear from the other camp that the solo movies are fair game... Is WB retarded? Are they going to have alternate cinematic universes for the the same characters? How people even thought (or still think) this was an option for WB is just mind boggling. I just can't buy any of it. You just can't have it both ways... I don't care what we have heard the past years plus. It has to be one or the other.

Don't get me wrong... that doesn't mean they won't do a JLA movie without Bale... they'd just recast... but you have to use the same Superman actor that starred in the reboot of course. Which version of GL they use is anyone's guess, but I am sure which ever version they end up using will be featured in the GL movie beforehand in some role. Of course Flash/WW may not even get films prior to JLA. But at the very least they have to keep the same actor for Superman in both films. Of course the budget would not nearly be as high if that was your ONLY returning actor.

[Crook]

Was that a response to what I said, cause I don't see how it does. :huh:

It's more than obvious now that WB does want a unified universe ala Marvel. That's why I'm saying Miller's JL is pretty much dead. There's no possible way they can even maintain what their cast was, because the respective roles will be "recast" with the solo franchises.

[FaT_tONle]

When you said they don't have to follow through at all I thought you were saying they don't have to unite the movies into a unified DC universe... now what cast are you talking about? George Miller's cast being recasted for the solo films? Heck I agree with that... George Miller is a complete non factor... we both agree.. but WB has to follow through with the "Marvel way" of doing things... if you disagree with that then we just both disagree.

[Crook]

When you said they don't have to follow through at all I thought you were saying they don't have to unite the movies into a unified DC universe...
No, I'm saying they don't have to follow through with Miller's project.

now what cast are you talking about? George Miller's cast being recasted for the solo films? Heck I agree with that... George Miller is a complete non factor... we both agree.. but WB has to follow through with the "Marvel way" of doing things... if you disagree with that then we just both disagree.
No, I agree.

[solidsnake86]

I don't see why people think Bale being in this movie is out of the realm of possibility, the guy did reign of fire. He will probably get paid a ridiculous amount of money for maybe 30 minutes of screen time.

[FaT_tONle]

No, I'm saying they don't have to follow through with Miller's project.

Yeah but I was saying they can't do a Miller JLA with a different cast from the solo films... and they have to follow through the continuity of the solo films... so this was just a simple misunderstanding.

I don't see why people think Bale being in this movie is out of the realm of possibility, the guy did reign of fire. He will probably get paid a ridiculous amount of money for maybe 30 minutes of screen time.

Well I don't know how many people believe that with the many sc-fi elements introduced in TDK. As a said before... I think the Nolan films will continue to be less and less believable... so I think it could work. But to be honest I have little interest in seeing Bale's Batman in a JLA movie... I was never a big Justice League guy anyway so that's just me... but I am dying to see Batman/Superman together. These other characters are just a distraction/turnoff and I think a lot of general audiences who are only appealed to Batman (die hard Bat fans included) feel the exact same way. But that's another old debate that I don't think people want to rehash...

[I Am The Knight]

Okay you want to say it won't be 30 million then fine... 10 million is, however, is completely laughable... the guy will be making 20 million plus with BB3 IMO. Look at TDK's gross. He is going to want the same amount for JLA. He isn't going to take a pay cut. He didn't sign on as Batman to star in a Justice League movie. The character appealed to him for different reasons, and now you are asking him to do something completely different... RDJ will probably make 10-15 million with IM2... I guarantee you his salary will be close to 30-35 million combined for both IM2/Avengers. Bale will probably want more because his movies gross slightly more. Plus it would be his fourth film... not his third. RDJ's fourth film (if there is one) will most likely be IM3 and his salary will be 40 million plus ALONE for that film... much like Depp's salary for POTC 4.

Let's leave it at 20, for both movies. And he did sign on for an ensemble film, didn't he? Anyways, like I said, he's not that popular. He's not the reason TDK is a $500 million grosser. Ledger is. He IS one of the reasons though, so naturally WB will want him around. And for continuity's sake. But if they really had to make JLA, and, for whatever reason, he's not willing to do it, they will recast...It's especially easier with Batman, a hero with no "face", in the middle of an ensemble film.

[FaT_tONle]

Yeah but you need Bruce Wayne in there, so Bale is very much needed. Can't just have a different actor in tights the whole film. And how about we say 50 million for both BB3/JLA? That's what Tobey "fat and out of shape" Maguire is getting... not saying WB wouldn't ante up, but it's not pennies... but I already stated they'd recast so we agree.

[solidsnake86]

I just think its a misconception that people think bale wouldnt do it because he's somehow above the movie. If they have a good script and he makes a good chunk of cash I don't see why he wouldn't do it. Its an ensemble film so he doesn't have to spend that much time in the costume and it could be the stunt double for all we know. Nolan's films are already extending reality, but it doesn't mean there real, people take that to the next level. Its do-able but this is a movie that would be 7 or 8 years away with the current situation.

[Crook]

Well I don't know how many people believe that with the many sc-fi elements introduced in TDK.
That's because the story told doesn't lend itself to sci-fi elements. There are plenty of solo Batman stories that deal with the real and mundane. That same Batman also appears in a JL story that deals with the fantastical and out-of-this-world catastrophes. Same character.

As a said before... I think the Nolan films will continue to be less and less believable... so I think it could work.
Not even that, it's really about hitting the same tone as Nolan. Which is to say that it's taken seriously, and none of the film's elements are taken lightly. It is more than possible for these characters to co-exist with each other. Personally I think it's a beautiful thing for one entire universe to fit so well.

[FaT_tONle]

I just think its a misconception that people think bale wouldnt do it because he's somehow above the movie. If they have a good script and he makes a good chunk of cash I don't see why he wouldn't do it. Its an ensemble film so he doesn't have to spend that much time in the costume and it could be the stunt double for all we know. Nolan's films are already extending reality, but it doesn't mean there real, people take that to the next level. Its do-able but this is a movie that would be 7 or 8 years away with the current situation.

Bale is above JLA... although I think he'd be opened to a similar script that the Mulroneys tossed around... something dark and somewhat realistic for DC universe standards. WB has their work cut out for them if they are going to sell this to actors like Bale/Gosling. Not saying it can't be done... WB's chances may hinge on the success of Avengers, so they should hope that film is a success.

[I Am The Knight]

A JLA film has the potential to be a lot more epic than The Avengers, I'd say. Plus, it has the advantage of having Batman, Superman and Wonder Woman under one movie. We are talking about Huge icons here. So in essence, a JLA film sells itself, really.

[Evil Twin]

It wouldn't exactly be surprising if the changes to the JLA script in response to TDK are mainly in response to the "cell phone sonar" bit in the end where Batman renounced the use of the surveillance equipment. Not so much because it's contradictory, but because it's redundant.

[Webhead2006]

Well yea but we do got to remember by the look of things now with wb wanting to go the solo path like marvel has been doing for the marvel made films jla isnt likely to be happening to atless 2014 the earliest after getting gl/batman 3/superman reboot/etc... out between 2010-2014 range. And then the whole copyright thing for superman is still an issue and in 2013 wb could lose him but we dont know for sure on that untill its closer to the date shuster's heir goes to court against wb/dc. So if they do lose superman and we dont get jla before hand we will likely not see supes in it.

[FaT_tONle]

Well yea but we do got to remember by the look of things now with wb wanting to go the solo path like marvel has been doing for the marvel made films jla isnt likely to be happening to atless 2014 the earliest after getting gl/batman 3/superman reboot/etc... out between 2010-2014 range. And then the whole copyright thing for superman is still an issue and in 2013 wb could lose him but we dont know for sure on that untill its closer to the date shuster's heir goes to court against wb/dc. So if they do lose superman and we dont get jla before hand we will likely not see supes in it.

Thank God I am a Marvel guy... :grin:

[The Major]

A JLA film has the potential to be a lot more epic than The Avengers, I'd say.

It does if it's set up well.

Hopefully WB will be trying to do this.

Plus, it has the advantage of having Batman, Superman and Wonder Woman under one movie. We are talking about Huge icons here.

One of those icons isn't given the same treatment as the others. Can you guess which one?

So in essence, a JLA film sells itself, really.

True.

[I Am The Knight]

One of those icons isn't given the same treatment as the others. Can you guess which one?

Aha. I wonder (pun intended) if WB is still trying to spinoff WW from the JLA film. So far they have GL, Bats, Superman, and according to Latino Review, also The Flash as their next comic adaptations. No mention of WW. Perhaps they still believe they should introduce her in JLA, as was apparently intended before?

Personally, I think she should be put ahead of The Flash as the next superhero movie after Superman in 2012. Hopefully not with the Galester in mind.

[The Major]

Aha. I wonder (pun intended) if WB is still trying to spinoff WW from the JLA film. So far they have GL, Bats, Superman, and according to Latino Review, also The Flash as their next comic adaptations. No mention of WW. Perhaps they still believe they should introduce her in JLA, as was apparently intended before?

Sadly, you're probably right. :(

Personally, I think she should be put ahead of The Flash as the next superhero movie after Superman in 2012. Hopefully not with the Galester in mind.


Agreed.

[jmc]

A JLA film has the potential to be a lot more epic than The Avengers, I'd say. Plus, it has the advantage of having Batman, Superman and Wonder Woman under one movie. We are talking about Huge icons here. So in essence, a JLA film sells itself, really.

Don't forget the time frame, a JL film is at least 6-7 years off if WB want a single continuity, Marvel I think are biting off more than they can chew trying to cram in The Avangers by 2011. Having said that though, neither team up film is a guarantee.

[FaT_tONle]

6 or 7 years??? So now the BB and TDK continuity count toward JLA build up??? Please... The build up only starts if and when Superman cameos in GL... and that is 2010... also I doubt Marvel will make that 2011 release date because WB wants BB3 there and Marvel won't have Avengers ready in time.

[jmc]

6 or 7 years??? So now the BB and TDK continuity counts toward JLA build up???

Where did I say that?

2009 - Nothing
2010 - Green Lantern
2011 - Batman 3
2012 - Superman
2013/14 - Flash and/or WW
2014/15 - JL

6-7 years off, just an estimate.

[FaT_tONle]

2009 is nothing... so how do you just add that year on??? The build up has to start with the next incumbent film that is part of the greater universe... Nolan's Batman has not done this yet. Say Avengers gets pushed back a year... JLA and Avengers would basically get done in the same time span... four to five years max. And WB loses Superman rights in Fall 2013 so they may have to fast track... cutting either Flash/WW... but those films would have been flops IMO. That's a debate for another thread though.

[Katsuro]

2009 is nothing... so how do you just add that year on??? The build up has to start with the next incumbent film that is part of the greater universe... Nolan's Batman has not done this yet. Say Avengers gets pushed back a year... JLA and Avengers would basically get done in the same time span... four to five years max. And WB loses Superman rights in Fall 2013 so they may have to fast track... cutting either Flash/WW... but those films would have been flops IMO. That's a debate for another thread though.

His point was that a JLA movie is 6 or 7 years away. 2009 not having a movie coming out doesn't change that. 2009 is still going to occur.

His plan has JLA happening in 2014 or 2015. Is that not 6 or 7 years away from now?

[FaT_tONle]

His point was that a JLA movie is 6 or 7 years away. 2009 not having a movie coming out doesn't change that. 2009 is still going to occur.

His plan has JLA happening in 2014 or 2015. Is that not 6 or 7 years away from now?

That's my fault for misunderstanding... but I don't get how you knock Marvel for rushing when they knew how to go about their business in the first place. I don't get the feeling they are rushing Avengers... they have got all the solo films lined up... DC is just doing one superhero movie a year as opposed to two... which has it's advantages... but that doesn't mean WB is taking their time and being careful with their **** while Marvel is rushing things.

[BATZARRO WWD]

That's my fault for misunderstanding... but I don't get how you knock Marvel for rushing when they knew how to go about their business in the first place. I don't get the feeling they are rushing Avengers... they have got all the solo films lined up... DC is just doing one superhero movie a year as opposed to two... which has it's advantages... but that doesn't mean WB is taking their time and being careful with their **** while Marvel is rushing things.

Well, I felt Hulk suffered for being too close to Ironman and not being promoted enought(again, to not cannibalize on Ironman). If they did that with Avengers...

[Crook]

Hulk hurt itself. No blame need go on other properties.

[Changeling]

Ok. Heres how I see it:

2010-Green Lantern and Jonah Hex
2011-Batman 3
2012-Superman Reboot
2013- Flash
2014-Justice League

Its a lot like JMC's but with Jonah Hex lol

[FaT_tONle]

Avengers will not be undermarketed. That was Marvel's goal from the beginning. Plus Marvel has enough material to do two superhero films every year. I am not even sure DC is sold on Flash/WW movies at this point... so frankly they don't have enough Justice League characters to do two films a year. I honestly don't expect a Flash movie... WW probably has an outside chance at best but it don't look like that will be green lit any time soon.

[TheVileOne]

With the shape the economy's in, I think there is little chance of WB making Justice League or Wonder Woman any time soon.

Batman 3? Definitely will be made. Green Lantern? We'll see. Green Lantern what he lacks in name recognition he makes up for in lack of baggage. A fresher comic property to turn into a movie. Iron Man shows how much that can work in someone's favor. People thought Iron Man wouldn't fare well against the big names since to the mainstream audience he's virtually unknown.

A Green Lantern movie wouldn't be cheap, but it would still cost less than a Justice League movie. Wonder Woman movie wouldn't be cheap either, but the problem is . . . it's Wonder Woman. And WB. And Jeff Robinov doesn't want big budget movies starring women.

[The Major]

I am not even sure DC is sold on Flash/WW movies at this point... so frankly they don't have enough Justice League characters to do two films a year.

What? Of course they do. Even with the top five or six Justice Leaguer's they have enough characters to do that.

[FaT_tONle]

Then how come WW and Flash haven't even been close to getting off the ground^^^??? We aren't talking about characters like Aquaman and Green Arrow... we are talking about WW.

[The Major]

Then how come WW and Flash haven't even been close to getting off the ground^^^??? We aren't talking about characters like Aquaman and Green Arrow... we are talking about WW.

That is the question, isn't it?

That property, and others, have not been given high priority by WB for decades since WB either can't or won't see their potential as solo film franchises. Hell, they can't even see them as good cartoon franchises.

Maybe this is changing but I'm not getting my hopes up any time soon.

[FaT_tONle]

I just don't get why people are penciling in WW/Flash after a Superman reboot... I mean I am not saying it isn't possible... but if I were WB I'd just go right to a JLA movie... mostly because they are losing Superman rights soon. But besides that... it's really gonna depend on how GL/Superman reboot does. Because if they perform mediocre then there is no reason to believe these other JLA characters will ever get off the ground... with Marvel's case... I am certain we will not only get Thor/Cap films... but we'll probably get Black Panther/Black Widow/Dr. Strange films before DC gets any of their B-list characters off the ground let alone C-list characters.

[Antonello Blueberry]

That is the question, isn't it?

That property, and others, have not been given high priority by WB for decades since WB either can't or won't see their potential as solo film franchises. Hell, they can't even see them as good cartoon franchises.

Maybe this is changing but I'm not getting my hopes up any time soon.
That's not true. They've had a Wonder Woman movie in development for years, they even were close to start shooting the pilot for a Tv series years ago. The same goes for Flash; they had a couple of directors attached and David Goyer wrote a script for it.
Probably nothing was so good to grant a green light.

[The Major]

I just don't get why people are penciling in WW/Flash after a Superman reboot... I mean I am not saying it isn't possible... but if I were WB I'd just go right to a JLA movie... mostly because they are losing Superman rights soon.

They should.

Marvel is making solo movies of all the primary Avengers before making them all team up.

The Justice League would include Green Lantern, Flash, WW, Superman and Batman.

Not having a solo WW would seem out of place and not set up JL properly. It would leave major piece out of the equation.

They need them all, it's not multiple choice.

But besides that... it's really gonna depend on how GL/Superman reboot does.

This gets complicated. WB needs to stop thinking like they're making widgets with these franchises. They're not clones of each other. Especially WW.

Since TDK has proven to be a massive success it should be a huge green light to these properties for years to come no matter what.

That and Marvel's successes with Blade and Iron Man.

They didn't stop being successful comic adaptions after they left the theaters.

Because if they perform mediocre then there is no reason to believe these other JLA characters will ever get off the ground...

True.

Which means WB should make it more of an effort to do their best at executing these movies. Research, understanding, proper budget, hiring the best people for the jobs based on good resumes suiting the projects and logical decisions need to be made specific to the franchises and talking to the right people who know the comics not praying for a miracle.

with Marvel's case... I am certain we will not only get Thor/Cap films... but we'll probably get Black Panther/Black Widow/Dr. Strange films before DC gets any of their B-list characters off the ground let alone C-list characters.

Agreed.

[Crook]

They should.

Marvel is making solo movies of all the primary Avengers before making them all team up.

The Justice League would include Green Lantern, Flash, WW, Superman and Batman.

Not having a solo WW would seem out of place and not set up JL properly. It would leave major piece out of the equation.

They need them all, it's not multiple choice.
That's not necessarily true. Timm's JL series successfully introduced all these heroes without having to show an extensive origin for them. It's safe to say every one of the Big 7 are immediately recognized by the mainstream audience, at least vividly. So it's not like we'd be completely in the dark.

Worked well enough for X-Men.

I'd like the solo films first though. But it's not integral to the overall plan. They could come after a JL film, and easily be set up as taking place before the group was formed.

[The Major]

That's not necessarily true. Timm's JL series successfully introduced all these heroes without having to show an extensive origin for them.

JL has its own mythology while each separate team mate has their own mythology build in.

Less risky, too. X-men tanking would have just taken Wolverine and X-men with it.

JL takes several B franchises with it and possibly endangers the rest by DC's line super-hero at worst.

Timm's series had much more time to show these characters doing things, too. With a movie they'll get 2 hours at the most. There is no way they can explore them in the same depth.

It's safe to say every one of the Big 7 are immediately recognized by the mainstream audience, at least vividly. So it's not like we'd be completely in the dark.

I agree they may recognize them but that's all it'll do. They're not going to stay interested unless they're given the proper time to care about them. They'll get that more from solo movies then JL.

Worked well enough for X-Men.
Just because it worked for X-men doesn't mean it should or would work with JL.

I'd like the solo films first though. But it's not integral to the overall plan.

Agreed.

They could come after a JL film, and easily be set up as taking place before the group was formed.

True, but I see that as putting the cart before the horse.

The audience would never see the full potential of these characters in JL. Just glimpses if they're lucky. Assuming they're good versions. If they're bad the public will be turned off and WB would throw the character's franchise under a bus for decades or worse, make solo movies based on a horrible version the solo film makers will be stuck with.

[Crook]

JL has its own mythology while each separate team mate has their own mythology build in.
Yes, but they're exclusive to that specific mythology of the character. A JL film only requires JL mythology. Not Batman, or GL, Supes, etc etc. Unless the story calls for it.

Less risky, too. X-men tanking would have just taken Wolverine and X-men with it.
True, but it could just as easily fail the other way around too. If Wolvie got his own film first, and that one failed, do you think an X-Men film would get greenlit? We have, what, 5 solo films at the very least to worry about? If one or two of those fail, that'll deter WB from even going through with an ensemble flick.

Timm's series had much more time to show these characters doing things, too. With a movie they'll get 2 hours at the most. There is no way they can explore them in the same depth. As the show progressed, yes these character's histories were being told. I'm not talking about that though. JL's first arc only involved MM's origin.


I agree they may recognize them but that's all it'll do. They're not going to stay interested unless they're given the proper time to care about them. They'll get that more from solo movies then JL. Yes. So let the solo movies worry about that.

Just because it worked for X-men doesn't mean it should or would work with JL.Proof of concept.

True, but I see that as putting the cart before the horse. Perhaps. But you can apply that to any narrative that doesn't follow a chronological order.

The audience would never see the full potential of these characters in JL. Just glimpses if they're lucky. Assuming they're good versions. If they're bad the public will be turned off and WB would throw the character's franchise under a bus for decades or worse, make solo movies based on a horrible version the solo film makers will be stuck with.The solo films and JL franchise are conversely related. Assuming they're all under one continuity, the baggage is shared either which way. Whether the "bad" originated in a solo film or not, that'll be carried through to the other franchise.

This doesn't have to happen, since logically any faults would then be corrected for the next project. All I'm saying is these films are all connected by a thread, and it doesn't matter which one fails, because it effects everyone else in the same exact way.

[BlackLantern]

Here's the thing....to the movie going audience at-large, it's all about who does it first....marvel will get Avengers out before WB can get out JL and WB will simply be looked at as copycats....

[Crook]

Maybe. But a lot more people know about Justice League, than they do the Avengers. I think that alone would halt any thoughts of DC copying a dream-team.

[jmc]

Whats the old saying? No one remembers who came second? Something like that. Either way I think both team up films are fraught with potentials problems, hence why I think they should be separate continuities from solo projects.

[Crook]

That'd be a waste. What makes the JL concept so exciting is to see these established characters interact in the same environment. Going with different actors for these roles just feels awkward.

[jmc]

Only if it's done at the same time is it awkward. The solo films needs to be given the same sized canvas as BB and TDK and not be limited as what Marvel are doing, ie the characters need their own environment and their own rules to get the best out of the character. The problem then is intertwining those multiple environments, to me that is the awkward part, hence why I think it's best JL remain a separate franchise and have it's own canvas to draw on.

[Crook]

Only if it's done at the same time is it awkward. The solo films needs to be given the same sized canvas as BB and TDK and not be limited as what Marvel are doing, ie the characters need their own environment and their own rules to get the best out of the character.
What prevents this if a JL film is made? Were Hulk and IM not films suitable for the characters' environment?

The problem then is intertwining those multiple environments, to me that is the awkward part, hence why I think it's best JL remain a separate franchise and have it's own canvas to draw on.
What exactly is the problem? The environments don't clash with each other since it's understood they are all within the same universe. The comics and cartoons have proven time and again there is no such issue. Awkward would be having the characters of LOTR suddenly go on in an adventure inside the Death Star. That's a clash of environment, tone, and style.

If the solo films follow a certain guideline that would plausibly place all of them within the confines of the same universe, I see no reason why problems should arise if these worlds were to brought together for a film.

[jmc]

What prevents this if a JL film is made? Were Hulk and IM not films suitable for the characters' environment?

Hulk and Iron Man were very standard superhero films with similar tone and feel, they were safe films, the risk is if they continue making the same type of film with different costumed characters in the lead Marvels films could become stale very quickly. The last thing I want WB to do is give us 'stock' superhero films. If you go TDK route with the DC characters, giving each their own unique universe, each with different tone and feel and direction, you give the character the best possible chance of bring something new and unique to the screen, the downside however is that it becomes harder to then merge the characters together without it looking forced.

What exactly is the problem? The environments don't clash with each other since it's understood they are all within the same universe. The comics and cartoons have proven time and again there is no such issue. Awkward would be having the characters of LOTR suddenly go on in an adventure inside the Death Star. That's a clash of environment, tone, and style.

The medium is the problem, it's about interpretation so environments do clash, say for instance someone wants to make a more family friendly action adventure Flash film, how do you then merge that with Nolan's Batman or an epic fantasy based Wonder Woman or a Sci-Fi based GL? It's not as easy as saying they're all in the same universe, what if each film style, tone and environment is vastly different from the others? How then do you merge 4-5 different characters from different universes together? Your LOTR and Star Wars comparison is a good one, and it does apply to this situation too. Just because it's a DC universe in comic doesn't mean it needs to be a DC universe on film.

If the solo films follow a certain guideline that would plausibly place all of them within the confines of the same universe, I see no reason why problems should arise if these worlds were to brought together for a film.

Why should we restrict the characters by giving them the same guidelines? Doing that we're potentially preventing doing something unique with that character all because it doesn't fall within guidelines. This is essentially what Marvel are doing at the moment and I'm not a fan of it, there's no real freedom to try different tones and styles. If we have no guidelines, then we're free to do pretty much anything we want with each character and not worry about 'the rules' as it were. All I want is what's best for the characters, I want kick arse solo film first and foremost, if that means not having a JL film is the same continuity then so be it, it's a sacrifice I'm ok with.

[FaT_tONle]

Yeah I agree with jmc... imagine DC churning out all these superhero flicks on top of all the Marvel films being released these days??? It's not worth it IMO... if WB's goal is a Justice League movie, after they resign Bale for BB3... WB HAS to make sure Bale is on board for Justice League. Otherwise what is the point in doing all these solo films when they'll end up being lost in the "just another comic book movie" genre? Even if WB goes the safest possible route... I find it hard to believe Flash, WW, and even GL will be much better than IM and TIH in terms of quality... and I don't think they will make as much money because Marvel has better known characters, coupled with the fact that DC has gotten off to such a late start, coupled with the fact that superhero films may get VERY old VERY quickly at the pace Hollywood is at right now... I mean WB needs to be careful. They need the same actors... and they need Bale before they make even another move forward... they can come back to GL and WW and Flash at any time. Rebooting Superman serves no purpose unless they have plans for an integrated JLA movie. Recasting Batman would kill the commerical appeal beyond belief though... I don't care what DC fans have to say about that. The movie would suffer BIG TIME with new actors. The point of crossovers is to retain the same actors... that's the only way it works without being complete cheeze...

[Crook]

Hulk and Iron Man were very standard superhero films with similar tone and feel, they were safe films, the risk is if they continue making the same type of film with different costumed characters in the lead Marvels films could become stale very quickly.
That's Marvel's problem. I was referring more to giving these characters their own field to work with. As in a developmental arc, a supporting cast, their own city, facing against classic villains, etc. That's what a solo film provides as opposed to an ensemble.

The last thing I want WB to do is give us 'stock' superhero films. If you go TDK route with the DC characters, giving each their own unique universe, each with different tone and feel and direction, you give the character the best possible chance of bring something new and unique to the screen, the downside however is that it becomes harder to then merge the characters together without it looking forced.
Uniqueness is not mutually exclusive to diversified and separated entities.

The medium is the problem, it's about interpretation so environments do clash, say for instance someone wants to make a more family friendly action adventure Flash film, how do you then merge that with Nolan's Batman or an epic fantasy based Wonder Woman or a Sci-Fi based GL? It's not as easy as saying they're all in the same universe, what if each film style, tone and environment is vastly different from the others? How then do you merge 4-5 different characters from different universes together?
It would seem to be a copout, but the simple answer is "they just are". People know WW, Batman, Supes, Flash, and GL co-exist. Especially comic book fans who have been exposed to continuous cross-overs for the better part of the comic book reading life.

As for tone; it can be generalized. I'll take your example of GL, since he would seem like a polar opposite of Batman. By tone, I meant the approach in how the character is to be adapted towards film. Obviously, certain elements are dictated by the mythos. GL is inherently gonna be more lighthearted in comparison to the dark world of Batman. That's fine to represent. It would not contradict anything simply because of the characters' nature.

But, if the material is presented in a very tightly written and epic scale in the same vein as TDK, then the two worlds are plausible enough to co-exist. Take a look at the first two Terminator films. Delved heavily into sci-fi, but the dark and gritty nature almost cancels out the fantastical elements that some would consider too silly.

If the film were to overtly display a style and tone greatly differing from the "norm" of the DC Universe, then yes I would agree it'd be hard to unite. Like say if a film used green-screen ala 300, while everyone else used real locations. Or if a film is ridiculously kid-friendly, with several winks and nods to the audience. When all the other films could be Oscar contenders.

Your LOTR and Star Wars comparison is a good one, and it does apply to this situation too. Just because it's a DC universe in comic doesn't mean it needs to be a DC universe on film.
When somewhere down the line you're planning to converge all the paths into one, then it's a necessity.

Why should we restrict the characters by giving them the same guidelines? Doing that we're potentially preventing doing something unique with that character all because it doesn't fall within guidelines. This is essentially what Marvel are doing at the moment and I'm not a fan of it, there's no real freedom to try different tones and styles. If we have no guidelines, then we're free to do pretty much anything we want with each character and not worry about 'the rules' as it were. All I want is what's best for the characters, I want kick arse solo film first and foremost, if that means not having a JL film is the same continuity then so be it, it's a sacrifice I'm ok with.
You misinterpret what I mean. You're talking as if guidelines are immediately negative to the productions. Am I gonna say it's alright for execs to say "Flash cannot be a relatable guy, GL has to be brooding, Supes has to be dark like Batman, etc"? No, of course not.

But if the rules are:
The cities must all look like they were set on-location
the canvas for the film should strive for an epic masterpiece
avoid stories that come off as cookie-cutter
cast actors that bring gravitas to the film
never break the 4th-wall

I will absolutely advocate that. I will refer to the comics again. Each solo title or arcs that feature the characters have their own unique manner to separate themselves from the rest. Different. But at the end of the day a JL story still works to bring them together.

Even if WB goes the safest possible route... I find it hard to believe Flash, WW, and even GL will be much better than IM and TIH in terms of quality...
It's unfortunate you think that way. GL's script review has already received massive praise from publications that have read it. It's only a matter of whether the director can successfully translate that to life. I have no doubt that film has every possibility of demolishing TIH and IM simply because it doesn't sound like it will be "safe" and assembly-produced.

and I don't think they will make as much money because Marvel has better known characters
300 and IM proved that recognition and popularity don't mean squat.

coupled with the fact that DC has gotten off to such a late start, coupled with the fact that superhero films may get VERY old VERY quickly at the pace Hollywood is at right now...
That's all thanks to Marvel for churning them out like crazy, and not putting out enough quality material. With the success of 300, IM, and TDK, the comic book craze isn't going anywhere. The films that will fail will be the ones that don't stand out apart from the crowd or do anything to change the genre.

Rebooting Superman serves no purpose unless they have plans for an integrated JLA movie.
No purpose? The franchise is a goldmine in itself. Easily the franchise that would rake in huge amounts of cash if he were done to the audience's taste. The guy has the most superpowers at hand, he just needs to be utilized so the people can be in awe of him again.

Recasting Batman would kill the commerical appeal beyond belief though.
That depends on when a recast would occur, and if the guy is good enough for the role. I don't believe Bale is the only person to play the part, nor the only one capable of garnering a fanbase.

I don't care what DC fans have to say about that. The movie would suffer BIG TIME with new actors. The point of crossovers is to retain the same actors... that's the only way it works without being complete cheeze...
I would agree with this.

[Evil Twin]

I disagree completely. A film only works if it's successful on its own terms, not because it piggybacked on half a dozen prior successful films. Christian Bale could sign up for JLA and it could still stink. A good approach can succeed without Christian Bale. Heck, sometimes showing the origin of everything is a less successful approach. I liked Star Wars better before we got Darth Vader's origin.

And really, I wish people would quit pretending that having the origin of everyone is necessary for a JLA film. You're not going to get a Martian Manhunter film before JLA. You're not likely to get Aquaman either. The Avengers is likely to come out before Ant Man. Watchmen isn't going to delve into the secret origin of The Comedian or Nite Owl. And there's no need to, as their origins aren't relevant to the story at hand. How is the origin of WW relevant to a JLA film? Or the Flash? Why should JLA have more storytelling restrictions placed on it than X-Men, Watchmen, or Avengers? Heck, they made Lord of the Rings before The Hobbit.

Powers are trivia. Character traits are what's important and that can be introduced with standard storytelling.

[FaT_tONle]

It's unfortunate you think that way. GL's script review has already received massive praise from publications that have read it. It's only a matter of whether the director can successfully translate that to life. I have no doubt that film has every possibility of demolishing TIH and IM simply because it doesn't sound like it will be "safe" and assembly-produced.

It might do better than TIH... but IM??? No chance... GL will already be overlooked by IM2. And it will probably be the sandwich film between IM2/Thor unless they do a winter release which they won't. It is another TIH in terms of box office at best. Maybe a little more... maybe a little less.

300 and IM proved that recognition and popularity don't mean squat.

Can DC fans stop comparing IM and Hulk to characters like GL and FLash... seriously... if you want to argue that they are both B-listers for Marvel/DC respectively then fine... but if we are going head to head??? Just stop... please stop... :csad:. And that's before Marvel made a single film this century.

That's all thanks to Marvel for churning them out like crazy, and not putting out enough quality material. With the success of 300, IM, and TDK, the comic book craze isn't going anywhere. The films that will fail will be the ones that don't stand out apart from the crowd or do anything to change the genre.

Yeah the genre is here to stay... but at what point will fans no longer see the difference... GL is a bit different... but I fail to see how characters like Flash and WW would distinguish themselves. I mean with characters like Spidey and DD out there... Flash will just end up confusing audiences... and WW is too similar to Superman/Captain America... and she's a chick. It will turn a lot of people off.

No purpose? The franchise is a goldmine in itself. Easily the franchise that would rake in huge amounts of cash if he were done to the audience's taste. The guy has the most superpowers at hand, he just needs to be utilized so the people can be in awe of him again.

As proven by SR... you are nuts... NUTS... if you think a reboot done this soon will relaunch a successful multi-picture solo franchise.

That depends on when a recast would occur, and if the guy is good enough for the role. I don't believe Bale is the only person to play the part, nor the only one capable of garnering a fanbase.


I would agree with this.

True... but to me it's going to end up being another Batman Forever if they recast... they will go back to a light tone and will gear it to kids and families. JLA would be a camp fest if Batman is not handled properly. Plus Bale is the most bankable star and has been a poster boy for WB over the last few years. The film might still make decent cash... but I think it could easily be a camp fest... especially if the other solo films are mediocre.

I disagree completely. A film only works if it's successful on its own terms, not because it piggybacked on half a dozen prior successful films. Christian Bale could sign up for JLA and it could still stink. A good approach can succeed without Christian Bale. Heck, sometimes showing the origin of everything is a less successful approach. I liked Star Wars better before we got Darth Vader's origin.

You don't think Avengers will pretty much be an origin film? No we won't get origins to every new character but still... it looks like they are going Ultimates with it... and that's an origin.

[BATZARRO WWD]

I disagree completely. A film only works if it's successful on its own terms, not because it piggybacked on half a dozen prior successful films. Christian Bale could sign up for JLA and it could still stink. A good approach can succeed without Christian Bale. Heck, sometimes showing the origin of everything is a less successful approach. I liked Star Wars better before we got Darth Vader's origin.

And really, I wish people would quit pretending that having the origin of everyone is necessary for a JLA film. You're not going to get a Martian Manhunter film before JLA. You're not likely to get Aquaman either. The Avengers is likely to come out before Ant Man. Watchmen isn't going to delve into the secret origin of The Comedian or Nite Owl. And there's no need to, as their origins aren't relevant to the story at hand. How is the origin of WW relevant to a JLA film? Or the Flash? Why should JLA have more storytelling restrictions placed on it than X-Men, Watchmen, or Avengers? Heck, they made Lord of the Rings before The Hobbit.

Powers are trivia. Character traits are what's important and that can be introduced with standard storytelling.

I require an emoticon where a character rubs his eyes in disbelief. You hit the nail right in the head.

According to this article (http://blogs.coventrytelegraph.net/thegeekfiles/2008/10/poll-still-indicates-demand-st.html) a poll showed the majority of those who answered what movie they want to see next from DC answered back "Justice League".

[Crook]

It might do better than TIH... but IM??? No chance... GL will already be overlooked by IM2. And it will probably be the sandwich film between IM2/Thor unless they do a winter release which they won't. It is another TIH in terms of box office at best. Maybe a little more... maybe a little less.
This is based off what? GL looks to be a game-changer because it's pulling out all the stops. It's a film that is epic in every imaginable way by being a space opera. If the effects hold up, I have no doubt this will be another big hit like IM. There is no way in hell this will do TIH numbers.

Can DC fans stop comparing IM and Hulk to characters like GL and FLash... seriously... if you want to argue that they are both B-listers for Marvel/DC respectively then fine... but if we are going head to head??? Just stop... please stop... :csad:. And that's before Marvel made a single film this century.
Why am I not to compare them? They are B-listers with great cinematic potential. Space and intergalactic narratives is a niche owned by SW and no one else. GL is fitting for this genre and to boot can provide something never seen before with flight and the ring's powers. Flash is a speed demon. Again, sfx and utilization of his powers is integral to his success and capturing the audience's imagination.

Yeah the genre is here to stay... but at what point will fans no longer see the difference... GL is a bit different... but I fail to see how characters like Flash and WW would distinguish themselves.
Flash is right along the lines of IM and Spidey in being a light-hearted adventure. He also has his powers on his side, which hasn't really been fully taken advantage of in the modern age. Do you see the possibilities in the glorious fights that can be choreographed using speed and time?

WW is too similar to Superman/Captain America... and she's a chick. It will turn a lot of people off.
It'll turn people off it reminds them of another film that tries to depict a strong female, when it's a little girl playing make-believe. It's a hard role to cast, but it's not impossible. They need to find a girl that can be seen as threatening, while still easy on the eyes.

And she's nothing like Superman/Captain America asides from her being a hero to the people and certain moral values. She is most definitely her own character.

As proven by SR... you are nuts... NUTS... if you think a reboot done this soon will relaunch a successful multi-picture solo franchise.
As proven by SR? I said a Superman film done right. Evidently it does not apply. Frankly, I think the bar has been set so low, that I think a film that blasts it's way into the game firing on all fronts can be a smash hit.

True... but to me it's going to end up being another Batman Forever if they recast... they will go back to a light tone and will gear it to kids and families. JLA would be a camp fest if Batman is not handled properly. Plus Bale is the most bankable star and has been a poster boy for WB over the last few years. The film might still make decent cash... but I think it could easily be a camp fest... especially if the other solo films are mediocre.
Bale is far from bankable. TDK's success rode highly on the Joker and interest in seeing Ledger's last role.

Camp-fest is not a possibility here either. Especially when the latest statement from WB indicates they're going dark to align itself better with Nolan's universe.

[FaT_tONle]

This is based off what? GL looks to be a game-changer because it's pulling out all the stops. It's a film that is epic in every imaginable way by being a space opera. If the effects hold up, I have no doubt this will be another big hit like IM. There is no way in hell this will do TIH numbers.

Yeah I just don't see it... yeah its space and fancy smancy... to me it is nothing more than what a Silver Surfer film could potentially do... GL will flat line at around 150 million. It is what it is. Unless they get some bankable stars for the role which they probably won't... I feel the same way about Thor as well. To say this will automatically be better than Hulk??? I just don't see how there will be such a huge improvement.

Why am I not to compare them? They are B-listers with great cinematic potential. Space and intergalactic narratives is a niche owned by SW and no one else. GL is fitting for this genre and to boot can provide something never seen before with flight and the ring's powers. Flash is a speed demon. Again, sfx and utilization of his powers is integral to his success and capturing the audience's imagination.

IM and Hulk don't sell JUST because of their powers... Stark has better more relatable characterization than Hal Jordan... Hulk is deeper than Flash. If you look at it objectively, Marvel's characters are more movie material than those respective DC characters. Not being Marvel bias in any way. And Hulk's powers are way more fascinating than either of those DC guys.


Flash is right along the lines of IM and Spidey in being a light-hearted adventure. He also has his powers on his side, which hasn't really been fully taken advantage of in the modern age. Do you see the possibilities in the glorious fights that can be choreographed using speed and time?

So Flash's powers will be the selling point of his film??? :hehe:

It'll turn people off it reminds them of another film that tries to depict a strong female, when it's a little girl playing make-believe. It's a hard role to cast, but it's not impossible. They need to find a girl that can be seen as threatening, while still easy on the eyes.

And she's nothing like Superman/Captain America asides from her being a hero to the people and certain moral values. She is most definitely her own character.

And yet development is nowhere on the horizon and WB is weary of female leads after Catwoman... WW will need a superstar to play her if she is to have her own movie... that's the only way it will sell. Wanted doesn't make half it's money without Jolie in there... take it seriously and cast an unknown and no one will pay attention to it IMO. Not being sexist here. That's just how I see it.

As proven by SR? I said a Superman film done right. Evidently it does not apply. Frankly, I think the bar has been set so low, that I think a film that blasts it's way into the game firing on all fronts can be a smash hit.

TIH had everything the fans wanted... yeah it could have been a little more fleshed out but still... what did it do for Marvel??? Nothing... absolutely NOTHING... a Supes reboot will barely pass SR numbers no matter how "right" it is... maybe more with inflation. It will have a lower budget so WB will still deem it a success if it comes to that... but the bar has flat lined... it's a 200 million dollar film.

Bale is far from bankable. TDK's success rode highly on the Joker and interest in seeing Ledger's last role.

Camp-fest is not a possibility here either. Especially when the latest statement from WB indicates they're going dark to align itself better with Nolan's universe.

Let them go dark with Superman... they'll get burned... let them go dark with WW... they'll get burned... you can't do dark dark dark... a recasted Batman will cater to the rest of the heroes... it will be a camp fest. Bale gives you credibility.

[I Am The Knight]

I require an emoticon where a character rubs his eyes in disbelief. You hit the nail right in the head.

According to this article (http://blogs.coventrytelegraph.net/thegeekfiles/2008/10/poll-still-indicates-demand-st.html) a poll showed the majority of those who answered what movie they want to see next from DC answered back "Justice League".

Eh, look at the poll options. JL, GL, WW, Flash, TT, GA and...Captain Marvel??

It's well known that, after Batman & Superman, The Justice League is DC's most popular "franchise" I guess. And guess who's missing from that poll?

Plus, there was another poll last year, asking people wheter they wanted to see a Superman sequel or JL. Surprise, surprise, Superman won.

[jmc]

It would seem to be a copout, but the simple answer is "they just are". People know WW, Batman, Supes, Flash, and GL co-exist. Especially comic book fans who have been exposed to continuous cross-overs for the better part of the comic book reading life.

'They just are' is not good enough. That to me is the biggest issue, is that it's not going to feel genuine, especially since the Nolan series was trying to portray a realistic a possible interpretation, a series you now have to build other franchises around featuring super powered beings. Another problem I foresee is the devaluing character aspect, Batman is king **** in Nolan's world, yet what happens when he's got super powered beings around him? It seems like doing it that way is simply making JL for the sake of it.

As for tone; it can be generalized. I'll take your example of GL, since he would seem like a polar opposite of Batman. By tone, I meant the approach in how the character is to be adapted towards film. Obviously, certain elements are dictated by the mythos. GL is inherently gonna be more lighthearted in comparison to the dark world of Batman. That's fine to represent. It would not contradict anything simply because of the characters' nature.

But, if the material is presented in a very tightly written and epic scale in the same vein as TDK, then the two worlds are plausible enough to co-exist. Take a look at the first two Terminator films. Delved heavily into sci-fi, but the dark and gritty nature almost cancels out the fantastical elements that some would consider too silly.

I take your Terminator example, but I can't see a GL film being as possible to tone down to the same extent, there's at least some level of believability to the idea of artificial intelligence consuming us, in GL we're talking 'magic rings', more or less Hobbit territory.

If the film were to overtly display a style and tone greatly differing from the "norm" of the DC Universe, then yes I would agree it'd be hard to unite. Like say if a film used green-screen ala 300, while everyone else used real locations. Or if a film is ridiculously kid-friendly, with several winks and nods to the audience. When all the other films could be Oscar contenders.

I'm not quite sure what the 'norm' of the DC universe is because as far as I can see it doesn't exist on film, we have Nolan's universe, I don't see it as a DC universe. The thing is, a film like GL shouldn't have to restrict itself to having to go by what Nolan's universe/production has done (even loosely), it should be it's own film and options like green screen should be on the table.

You misinterpret what I mean. You're talking as if guidelines are immediately negative to the productions. Am I gonna say it's alright for execs to say "Flash cannot be a relatable guy, GL has to be brooding, Supes has to be dark like Batman, etc"? No, of course not.

But if the rules are:
The cities must all look like they were set on-location
the canvas for the film should strive for an epic masterpiece
avoid stories that come off as cookie-cutter
cast actors that bring gravitas to the film
never break the 4th-wall

I will absolutely advocate that. I will refer to the comics again. Each solo title or arcs that feature the characters have their own unique manner to separate themselves from the rest. Different. But at the end of the day a JL story still works to bring them together.


Those rules, whilst I agree with them, are still not enough to blend things together so smoothly, lets say you do all those basic rules with a WW movie, you add Amazons, Greek Gods and Greek mythological beasts and monsters, suddenly combining that character with a Batman film that uses the same basic rules, but in a completely different context, just doesn't add up to me. Honestly, I would loved to be proven wrong, but if things are to be tied together via the Nolan universe, I just don't think it's as easy as people think it is to have our cake and eat it too.

[Crook]

Yeah I just don't see it... yeah its space and fancy smancy... to me it is nothing more than what a Silver Surfer film could potentially do... GL will flat line at around 150 million. It is what it is. Unless they get some bankable stars for the role which they probably won't... I feel the same way about Thor as well. To say this will automatically be better than Hulk??? I just don't see how there will be such a huge improvement.
Because GL reaches a wider canvas for telling it's stories and setting it's battles. Hulk still has the unfortunate brick wall of having a cgi lead and technology that isn't quite there in photo-realism. There's a disconnection.

IM and Hulk don't sell JUST because of their powers... Stark has better more relatable characterization than Hal Jordan...
How is that? There aren't many billionaire playboys who f**k models every day and have no care in the world. Nor can they relate to having the power of controlling mass weaponry on a global scale and the moral implications that come with it. No, Stark is not relatable. His personality is just likable all thanks to Downey's charm and presence.

Hulk is deeper than Flash.
And? Hulk is deeper than the Spartans. Than Stark. Than Spidey. Obviously it's not that big of a factor.

If you look at it objectively.Marvel's characters are more movie material than those respective DC characters. Not being Marvel bias in any way.
I lol'd.

And Hulk's powers are way more fascinating than either of those DC guys.
Can't even disagree more. Hulk has super-strength and regenerative abilities. How in the world is that more fascinating than flight, speed of light, invisibility, transformation, and a ring that can summon anything? Of course this is all opinion, but I know there are several people that will disagree with your statement.

So Flash's powers will be the selling point of his film??? :hehe:
Absolutely. Just as bullet-time was for Matrix, and webslinging was for Spidey.

And yet development is nowhere on the horizon and WB is weary of female leads after Catwoman... WW will need a superstar to play her if she is to have her own movie... that's the only way it will sell. Wanted doesn't make half it's money without Jolie in there... take it seriously and cast an unknown and no one will pay attention to it IMO. Not being sexist here. That's just how I see it.
You get someone sexy in the role and some powerful money-shots in the trailer, you'll catch attention. It doesn't take much to gain an audience. People went to 300 because they wanted some adrenaline-filled action that involved blood and glory. People went to TF to see robots f'n smash each other to pieces. No stars necessary if you have something else to occupy their attention.


TIH had everything the fans wanted... yeah it could have been a little more fleshed out but still... what did it do for Marvel??? Nothing... absolutely NOTHING...
Because it did nothing for the mainstream. It wasn't anything special, even with the action being amped up. Hell, I saw the movie opening weekend, and I could tell this was gonna do significantly less than the first movie.

a Supes reboot will barely pass SR numbers no matter how "right" it is... maybe more with inflation. It will have a lower budget so WB will still deem it a success if it comes to that... but the bar has flat lined... it's a 200 million dollar film.
Whether it's the reboot, or it's sequel, I have no doubt it can easily pass the 200 million dollar mark if it's "right".

Let them go dark with Superman... they'll get burned... let them go dark with WW... they'll get burned... you can't do dark dark dark...
Dark to the character's extent, as WB pointed out. Serious in tone and approach to the source material is what that means.

a recasted Batman will cater to the rest of the heroes... it will be a camp fest. Bale gives you credibility.
You're pulling this camp nonsense out of nowhere. They just had their biggest studio film ever made, which was as dark as you can get. They're not going another direction for a long long time.

As for Bale, yes he gives credibility. But he is not the only actor to have that capability.

[dnno1]

With the shape the economy's in, I think there is little chance of WB making Justice League or Wonder Woman any time soon.

Batman 3? Definitely will be made. Green Lantern? We'll see. Green Lantern what he lacks in name recognition he makes up for in lack of baggage. A fresher comic property to turn into a movie. Iron Man shows how much that can work in someone's favor. People thought Iron Man wouldn't fare well against the big names since to the mainstream audience he's virtually unknown.

A Green Lantern movie wouldn't be cheap, but it would still cost less than a Justice League movie. Wonder Woman movie wouldn't be cheap either, but the problem is . . . it's Wonder Woman. And WB. And Jeff Robinov doesn't want big budget movies starring women.

Didn't you read? Hollywood was included in the bail out bill (http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/News/International_Business/Hollywood_to_get_a_share_of_USD_700_billion_bailou t_plan/rssarticleshow/3557291.cms). $470 million over 10 years.

[Evil Twin]

You're pulling this camp nonsense out of nowhere. They just had their biggest studio film ever made, which was as dark as you can get. They're not going another direction for a long long time.


Yeah, that "they're going camp" is just made up out of nowhere. People act like WB isn't completely aware of what went wrong with Batman and Robin. Heck, The OMAC Project, which was the reported basis of the Miller JLA film ISN'T camp. Heck, the reports that the cast went through boot camp should indicate that Miller wasn't intending JLA to be camp.

I really wish people wouldn't just make up stuff.

And I really think people underestimate the public's ability to process that these are actors portraying fictional characters. Fictional characters that have had different interpretations over the years. People are so eager to label something as "definitive" that they sometimes forget that many of the most iconic performances have been followed up on.

[FaT_tONle]

Because GL reaches a wider canvas for telling it's stories and setting it's battles. Hulk still has the unfortunate brick wall of having a cgi lead and technology that isn't quite there in photo-realism. There's a disconnection.

True.

How is that? There aren't many billionaire playboys who f**k models every day and have no care in the world. Nor can they relate to having the power of controlling mass weaponry on a global scale and the moral implications that come with it. No, Stark is not relatable. His personality is just likable all thanks to Downey's charm and presence.

Well... Stark is more relatable than either of those DC figures. You can't really argue that... it's not that people can't relate to a multi-million dollar playboy... you said it yourself... the personality works. And the concept is a lot more serious and legitimate than the concepts of GL/Flash. Tony Stark is something people can buy... GL/Flash are characters that require a stretch of the imagination... and that's a turn off.

And? Hulk is deeper than the Spartans. Than Stark. Than Spidey. Obviously it's not that big of a factor.

Their is a pyschological aspect there that is missing from Flash and even GL to an extent. Hulk is deeper material... might not be a huge factor but it certainly helps.

I lol'd.

Well Marvel has a track record with successful SH movies... DC has Batman... until one of these other heroes stick (and Watchmen and 300 or V for V don't really fit the same bill) it is what it is.

Can't even disagree more. Hulk has super-strength and regenerative abilities. How in the world is that more fascinating than flight, speed of light, invisibility, transformation, and a ring that can summon anything? Of course this is all opinion, but I know there are several people that will disagree with your statement.

:whatever:... we agree to disagree


Absolutely. Just as bullet-time was for Matrix, and webslinging was for Spidey.

Flash... as a fun, family, children oriented film with fancy/dazzling effects will work... anything more than that and the film will bomb. It's not exactly material you'd call "Dark Knightesque"... as a fun, special effects happy, low budget film you may have something.

You get someone sexy in the role and some powerful money-shots in the trailer, you'll catch attention. It doesn't take much to gain an audience. People went to 300 because they wanted some adrenaline-filled action that involved blood and glory. People went to TF to see robots f'n smash each other to pieces. No stars necessary if you have something else to occupy their attention.

People ain't seeing a freaking sprinter for two hours... I don't know if GL can pull off the intense action either... please don't compare the potential to Transformers... it has no chance of duplicating that in terms of action now c'mon... and 300 is a completely different animal that caught people's attention for completely different reasons.

Because it did nothing for the mainstream. It wasn't anything special, even with the action being amped up. Hell, I saw the movie opening weekend, and I could tell this was gonna do significantly less than the first movie.

Tell me how GL/Flash will be more mainstream? A more fleshed out script? You are just being overly optimistic...


Whether it's the reboot, or it's sequel, I have no doubt it can easily pass the 200 million dollar mark if it's "right".

With inflation... but the finals numbers will flat line around there IMO. And SR didn't even make up for itself world wide... not even Superman sells overseas. Why expect a reboot to completely surpass that?

Dark to the character's extent, as WB pointed out. Serious in tone and approach to the source material is what that means.

If they made up their mind that quickly that this will be the approach for the rest of their characters they are fooling both you and themselves... the minute one of these films bombs they'll go back to their old ways... MORE CAMP REQUIRED!!! That doesn't mean B & R per say... but it could certainly mean SM3, FF, etc. The cycle will never end.


You're pulling this camp nonsense out of nowhere. They just had their biggest studio film ever made, which was as dark as you can get. They're not going another direction for a long long time.

The cycle will never end...

As for Bale, yes he gives credibility. But he is not the only actor to have that capability.

Capability is irrelevant. People like continuity... it makes sense. JLA is supposed to fit into the existing continuity... otherwise it is a BIG turn off. People will seriously "wtf" when they see a new guy playing Batman in the JLA trailer.

And here's the deal with Batman... and I don't want ONE DC FAN or ANY fan for that matter to tell me otherwise. Over 50% of Batman fans... die hard and even general Batman fans... INCLUDING a significant portion of general audiences... have no interest in seeing Batman in a JLA movie... it's too out of their comfort zone IMO. You want to make a case for Batman/Superman and a World's Finest film I'll give you that... so maybe that gives WB more incentive to let Bale go? Possibly... but I still think it's a mistake because of continuity problems.

[Webhead2006]

Yea i agree with you guys for both marvel and Dc the solo films/teamup films have alot of issues/problems they need to solve and if they dont do things correctly they can all fall apart. But though for dc from the reports now it does look like they want to go the solo route now and if that true after getting gl,batman3,superman reboot, and atless a flash or ww solo out we wont be seeing jla to atless any time between 2014-2020 period which does suck dc has came out late to the game. Then the whole superman copyright in 2013 we dont know for sure what is going to happen there.

[Evil Twin]

And here's the deal with Batman... and I don't want ONE DC FAN or ANY fan for that matter to tell me otherwise. Over 50% of Batman fans... die hard and even general Batman fans... INCLUDING general audiences... have no interest in seeing Batman in a JLA movie... it's too out of their comfort zone IMO. You want to make a case for Batman/Superman and a World's Finest film I'll give you that... so maybe that gives WB more incentive to let Bale go? Possibly... but I still think it's a mistake because of continuity problems.

That's a made up statistic and you know it. You don't know if it's 90%, 50%, or 10%. You especially don't know if its true of general audiences. Yes, let's make up statistics out of thin air.

I'll bet WB has marketing studies that tell them exactly whether people are interested in Batman in JLA or not. And, if they make a JLA film with Batman, like they almost did, that will answer the question.

Continuity is much less important with the general public, the majority of which just want to see something entertaining on a Saturday night.

[FaT_tONle]

That's a made up statistic and you know it. You don't know if it's 90%, 50%, or 10%. You especially don't know if its true of general audiences. Yes, let's make up statistics out of thin air.

I'll bet WB has marketing studies that tell them exactly whether people are interested in Batman in JLA or not. And, if they make a JLA film with Batman, like they almost did, that will answer the question.

Continuity is much less important with the general public, the majority of which just want to see something entertaining on a Saturday night.

Go to the Batman boards right now... nobody gives a **** about the rest of these characters except maybe Superman... you don't need to be a genius to estimate a stat like that. They like what Nolan has done and they want Batman on an island by himself... hell people are against a live-action Batman/Superman film. Those are the facts. Not statistics pulled out of my A-hole...

[Evil Twin]

Go to the Batman boards right now... nobody gives a **** about the rest of these characters except maybe Superman... you don't need to be a genius to estimate a stat like that. They like what Nolan has done and they want Batman on an island by himself... hell people are against a live-action Batman/Superman film. Those are the facts. Not statistics pulled out of my A-hole...


The internet is NOT representative of all of fandom and, especially, the general public. And everyone should know this by now. A couple of hundred hardcore fans is probably unrepresentative of the people who watched JLU and The Batman over the years. Not to mention, fandom is fickle and changes its mind ALL THE TIME.

Heck, once fandom swore that they'd never go to an obviously camp Batman film starring Michael Keaton. How about the uproar over Daniel Craig as James Bond? You know when the general public judges that they're going to see a movie, when they see trailers and commercials.

[Antonello Blueberry]

Go to the Batman boards right now... nobody gives a **** about the rest of these characters except maybe Superman... you don't need to be a genius to estimate a stat like that. They like what Nolan has done and they want Batman on an island by himself... hell people are against a live-action Batman/Superman film. Those are the facts.
Opinions of a limited number of fanboys are not facts.

[FaT_tONle]

You guys really think that the Dark Knight audience is representative of the audience of a JLA film? Because I think that is completely laughable... Batman fans and that built in fan base would probably watch JLA no matter what... but there is no denying that a significant portion of Batman fans will be turned off by his involvement in this film especially if Bale is not involved and they won't end up seeing this film.

[Crook]

'They just are' is not good enough. That to me is the biggest issue, is that it's not going to feel genuine, especially since the Nolan series was trying to portray a realistic a possible interpretation, a series you now have to build other franchises around featuring super powered beings.
How is this different from the comics? Are there not tons of stories out there with Batman dealing in small-time affairs? This same character is then saving the world in the next?

Another problem I foresee is the devaluing character aspect, Batman is king **** in Nolan's world, yet what happens when he's got super powered beings around him? It seems like doing it that way is simply making JL for the sake of it.
Bats is the brains of the league. Being the only non-powered superhero and making that work within a dream-team isn't a new problem. Writers have been struggling and working around that issue for decades. It's proven to work.

I take your Terminator example, but I can't see a GL film being as possible to tone down to the same extent, there's at least some level of believability to the idea of artificial intelligence consuming us, in GL we're talking 'magic rings', more or less Hobbit territory.
Dude. Android assassin, who is a shapeshifter. Made out of liquid metal. C'mon. :huh:

I'm not quite sure what the 'norm' of the DC universe is because as far as I can see it doesn't exist on film, we have Nolan's universe, I don't see it as a DC universe. The thing is, a film like GL shouldn't have to restrict itself to having to go by what Nolan's universe/production has done (even loosely), it should be it's own film and options like green screen should be on the table.
Maybe it'd be better if you point out what these restrictions would be, because I'm not seeing anything that would affect the potential for a GL movie.

Those rules, whilst I agree with them, are still not enough to blend things together so smoothly, lets say you do all those basic rules with a WW movie, you add Amazons, Greek Gods and Greek mythological beasts and monsters, suddenly combining that character with a Batman film that uses the same basic rules, but in a completely different context, just doesn't add up to me. Honestly, I would loved to be proven wrong, but if things are to be tied together via the Nolan universe, I just don't think it's as easy as people think it is to have our cake and eat it too.
Of course it's not easy. But I have heard so many people that would have you thinking it's impossible, and that's just as false. I won't lie to you, my concern is how WW will fit in with the rest. You're right, the Greek mythology is a whole 'nother league. At least with everyone else, it's with typical fantasy elements such as magic and aliens.


Well... Stark is more relatable than either of those DC figures. You can't really argue that...
There are plenty of people that will argue this. I don't know why you're so intent on stating it like a fact. You know damn well people react to these characters in different ways.

it's not that people can't relate to a multi-million dollar playboy... you said it yourself... the personality works. And the concept is a lot more serious and legitimate than the concepts of GL/Flash. Tony Stark is something people can buy... GL/Flash are characters that require a stretch of the imagination... and that's a turn off.
I'm speechless. Please tell me how stretching imagination is a turn-off. I could literally give you a list of 20 films right now that are beyond plausible, yet garnered a huge audience, and are one of the top-grossing films of all time.

If there is one thing that cannot be denied here, it is that fantasy is just as viable in a Hollywood market as any other genre.

Well Marvel has a track record with successful SH movies... DC has Batman... until one of these other heroes stick (and Watchmen and 300 or V for V don't really fit the same bill) it is what it is.
In terms of being financially and critically successful, the advantage isn't much. Marvel has put out a few good films, but they have put out just as many, if not more crap ones.

Flash... as a fun, family, children oriented film with fancy/dazzling effects will work... anything more than that and the film will bomb. It's not exactly material you'd call "Dark Knightesque"... as a fun, special effects happy, low budget film you may have something.
Never said it was Dark Knight-esque. I even mentioned a couple posts ago that it's along the same category of what Iron Man and Spider-Man are. Fun action flicks with some substance.

People ain't seeing a freaking sprinter for two hours...
I don't know how you expect me to discuss with you, when you're pulling statements like this out of your ass. I talk about a Flash movie, and the first thing you think of is watching a sprinter?? Please watch the JL series, or at least a few comics. Flash is right up there with the best of them in terms of visual dazzle.

I don't know if GL can pull off the intense action either...
Same as above.

please don't compare the potential to Transformers... it has no chance of duplicating that in terms of action now c'mon...
Flash doesn't in terms of scale. GL does considering he has a larger canvas (space) and his ring can do anything imaginable.

and 300 is a completely different animal that caught people's attention for completely different reasons.
Which is my point. There is no one singular factor that a movie must have to attract an audience.

Tell me how GL/Flash will be more mainstream? A more fleshed out script? You are just being overly optimistic...
One, none of the films have to worry about the backlash against a previously bashed story. Two, absolutely a fleshed out script is helpful. TIH was one of the most bland comic book movies I've seen in recent memory, and that is unfortunate. Audiences aren't stupid, if the movie doesn't stand out (especially during spring/summer season), they're not gonna turn out in droves.

With inflation... but the finals numbers will flat line around there IMO. And SR didn't even make up for itself world wide... not even Superman sells overseas. Why expect a reboot to completely surpass that?
Because SR was a terrible film to reintroduce the character, and had next to nothing that would truly excite audiences like a potential Superman film could. That's why.

If they made up their mind that quickly that this will be the approach for the rest of their characters they are fooling both you and themselves... the minute one of these films bombs they'll go back to their old ways... MORE CAMP REQUIRED!!! That doesn't mean B & R per say... but it could certainly mean SM3, FF, etc. The cycle will never end.
So say they manage to put out 5 or 6 films in a semi-dark tone. One underperforms, and that changes everything to camp? Sorry, not how it works. They'll make some changes to that one project, but they will continue as is with the ones that were successful in the first place.

Capability is irrelevant. People like continuity... it makes sense. JLA is supposed to fit into the existing continuity... otherwise it is a BIG turn off. People will seriously "wtf" when they see a new guy playing Batman in the JLA trailer.
As I said posts ago, depends when a recast is set. If it's after the trilogy, then it would be acceptable if Bale doesn't return. That way you won't have 2 Batman's running around at the same time. He has the Terminator franchise now, and if the replacement is good it won't be that big of a deal.

And here's the deal with Batman... and I don't want ONE DC FAN or ANY fan for that matter to tell me otherwise. Over 50% of Batman fans... die hard and even general Batman fans... INCLUDING a significant portion of general audiences... have no interest in seeing Batman in a JLA movie... it's too out of their comfort zone IMO. You want to make a case for Batman/Superman and a World's Finest film I'll give you that... so maybe that gives WB more incentive to let Bale go? Possibly... but I still think it's a mistake because of continuity problems.
That statistic is completely made up. I'm sure this is based off the fans in the TDK forum, but realize where you are. That is a board dedicated to the film and it's production crew. They are loyal to Nolan. To Bale. To "realism". It is a niche population.

You are the one fooling yourself if you don't think audiences want to see Batman interact with Superman, or any of the JL members. JL is the all-star team of superhero groups. Everyone knows about them, and with the spawn of the comic book film, people are just waiting for it to come on the big-screen. Even in my high school days, before TDK came around, people were still discussing about "who can beat up who?" within the DC universe. Superman, WW, GL, Flash, Bats, you name it. There is an underlying interest in the all-stars. Nolan fans, Bale fans, Batman fans, no matter how much they can say they have no interests in JL...are greatly outnumbered by those that do.

[The Guard]

I don't know whether Bale would sign onto JLA, and I don't really care, to be honest. He either will or he won't. The whole "But only Bale can play Batman!" argument simply isn't even worth having, it's just beyond absurd. Christian Bale may have leverage with WB, but he won't have enough to prevent a JLA film once the third Batman is completed. Once the third Batman film is in the books, WB will likely go all out, especially if GREEN LANTERN is a large success.

And I've seen no example of how Nolan's Batman could work with super powered beings given they spent the last two films trying to present a realistic as possible version of the character. So it's a stalemate.

Then, respectfully, you must be blind. Read a JLA comic. Read any Batman comic where he, a relatively realistic character, interacts with any metahuman or outlandish situation. The juxtaposition of the realistic Batman and more outlandish elements of the DCU is an approach that works, and has worked, for decades. Film need be no different, and could work much the same way. It's not rocket science. The whole point is that he's human, whereas the rest of the JLA and many of the elements of the DC Universe that he encounters are metahuman or alien. And then you build on that. It's not difficult.

The medium is the problem, it's about interpretation so environments do clash, say for instance someone wants to make a more family friendly action adventure Flash film, how do you then merge that with Nolan's Batman or an epic fantasy based Wonder Woman or a Sci-Fi based GL?

You're missing the point entirely. A JLA film shouldn't be about combining MOVIES, it should be about combining CHARACTERS. All DC heroes are based in some kind of mythology. The DC universe encompasses science fiction, mythology, and realistic elements to boot.

How do you merge them all? How have writers been doing so for decades? How does Batman ever interact with lighter-hearted or superpowered characters? He just does. It's not difficult to accomplish. Writers have been doing it for a long, long time.

It's not as easy as saying they're all in the same universe, what if each film style, tone and environment is vastly different from the others? How then do you merge 4-5 different characters from different universes together?

How do you merge 4-5 characters (from the same universe, not different ones) together? You just DO. The way writers have been putting the lighthearted Flash opposite the somber Batman for decades.

Some of you are making this whole DC films/JLA interplay seem much, much more difficult than it is, or than it needs to be. These heroes inhabit the same universe. That doesn't mean all their adventures have to have the same tone, or that a JLA adventure cannot have several tones to it, informed by the various characters who will take part in it. And it's not like Batman can't have his lighter moments, either.

'They just are' is not good enough.

That interesting. Because it's been good enough in the comics for what...over forty years now? I've said it before, I've said it again. The JLA heroes are not difficult to understand. They are not difficult to flesh out. There are ways to get to know characters without an entire origin film dedicated to each one.

Another problem I foresee is the devaluing character aspect, Batman is king **** in Nolan's world, yet what happens when he's got super powered beings around him? It seems like doing it that way is simply making JL for the sake of it.

Have you never read a JLA comic? Batman tends to be king **** there, too. Why would WB "make JLA for the sake of it"? Come on.

I disagree completely. A film only works if it's successful on its own terms, not because it piggybacked on half a dozen prior successful films. Christian Bale could sign up for JLA and it could still stink. A good approach can succeed without Christian Bale. Heck, sometimes showing the origin of everything is a less successful approach. I liked Star Wars better before we got Darth Vader's origin.

And really, I wish people would quit pretending that having the origin of everyone is necessary for a JLA film. You're not going to get a Martian Manhunter film before JLA. You're not likely to get Aquaman either. The Avengers is likely to come out before Ant Man. Watchmen isn't going to delve into the secret origin of The Comedian or Nite Owl. And there's no need to, as their origins aren't relevant to the story at hand. How is the origin of WW relevant to a JLA film? Or the Flash? Why should JLA have more storytelling restrictions placed on it than X-Men, Watchmen, or Avengers? Heck, they made Lord of the Rings before The Hobbit.

Powers are trivia. Character traits are what's important and that can be introduced with standard storytelling.

Yes. Yes. Yes. Evil Twin gets it.

Yeah, that "they're going camp" is just made up out of nowhere. People act like WB isn't completely aware of what went wrong with Batman and Robin. Heck, The OMAC Project, which was the reported basis of the Miller JLA film ISN'T camp. Heck, the reports that the cast went through boot camp should indicate that Miller wasn't intending JLA to be camp.

I really wish people wouldn't just make up stuff.

As do I. Some of the arguments against a JLA film working in context with other DC films are just...silly and clearly not very well reasoned.

[BATZARRO WWD]

Hulk is deeper than Flash
I thought people just wanted "Hulk Smash" out of the Hulk. Gotta wonder why that earlier Hulk film underperformed...

a recasted Batman will cater to the rest of the heroes... it will be a camp fest. Bale gives you credibility
YES! If it's not Bale, it will inmediately be camp. This is why George Clooney's carrer is in the toilet...

[jmc]

How is this different from the comics? Are there not tons of stories out there with Batman dealing in small-time affairs? This same character is then saving the world in the next?

Bats is the brains of the league. Being the only non-powered superhero and making that work within a dream-team isn't a new problem. Writers have been struggling and working around that issue for decades. It's proven to work.

You can get away with integrating him more easier in comics than in film. It's the nature of the beast, put 3 Dimensions around it and it's a completely different story, especially if we're talking Nolan's Batman.

Dude. Android assassin, who is a shapeshifter. Made out of liquid metal. C'mon. :huh:

You missed my point, even though T1 and T2 are fanciful, the basic idea of artificial intelligence consuming us is more believable than some guy that gets a ring that lets him do what ever he wants. Both series have a level of fantastic elements, T1 and T2, even though they're ridiculous, have a certain 'what if' mentality to it, I can't see GL being the same.

Maybe it'd be better if you point out what these restrictions would be, because I'm not seeing anything that would affect the potential for a GL movie.

The main potential restriction I foresee if you were to go TDK route with GL is you could potentially be denying a richer and more dynamic film. Although I want a more mature GL film, I don't really want it bogged down in trying to go the whole 'realism' road when it's not in the characters best interest to do so, there's only so much you can do to a sci-fi character in a 'real world' setting, the last thing I would want is watered down GL or WW or FL just to fit within a certain guideline, just let them be their own character.

Of course it's not easy. But I have heard so many people that would have you thinking it's impossible, and that's just as false. I won't lie to you, my concern is how WW will fit in with the rest. You're right, the Greek mythology is a whole 'nother league. At least with everyone else, it's with typical fantasy elements such as magic and aliens.

Neither you or I are correct in this situation, the truth is no ones knows how things would turn out for JL, some look at it and see it as simple A+B=C, I look at it and see a nightmare quadratic equation, my concern is seeing hollow and 'stock' solo films that don't do justice to the likes GL, FL and WW all for the sake of simply doing a JL film, hence why I'd prefer separate continuity. I'm not trying to be a pain in the arse here, I just want what's best for the characters, I guess we'll find out in a few years time how things pan out.

[BlackLantern]

I thought people just wanted "Hulk Smash" out of the Hulk. Gotta wonder why that earlier Hulk film underperformed...


YES! If it's not Bale, it will inmediately be camp. This is why George Clooney's carrer is in the toilet...

Clooney is hardly in the toilet....he has been producing a lot more...any films he does at this point are just to keep busy..."Good Night and Good Luck" is easily one of the best films in the past 25-30 years....I suggest you give it a watch

[The Guard]

I think Batzarro was being sarcastic. I hope so, at least.

[BATZARRO WWD]

Clooney is hardly in the toilet....he has been producing a lot more...any films he does at this point are just to keep busy..."Good Night and Good Luck" is easily one of the best films in the past 25-30 years....I suggest you give it a watch

Yes, it was sarcasm. George Clooney, after Batman and Robin, went on to have an Acclaimed career. He's a good actor, irregardless of having been in one badly done movie. And when Bale comes out the other end of the MCG Terminator films, supossing they're terrible(well, everything's possible), will Christian Bale be a terrible actor? No.

[dnno1]

What's hilarious is that people keep saying I don't want a Justice League movie which is not true. Just not the stupid Miller idea version.

I also want these forums to fold because they've been on life support for almost 7 months.

What are you talking about? You didn't want the movie until all of the Batman films were completed. You also didn't want Batman in the film. Those reasons had nothing to do with George Miller.

[RAMORE]

VileOne What do you mean about these forums? I have noticed attendance seems to be way down but the Hype HAS to be here.

[BATZARRO WWD]

Don Cheadle just substituted Terrence Howard as Jim Rhodes in Ironman 2. Budget issues are cited. Wich raises the question: How viable is it, economically, to go it "the Marvel buildup" way? With each successfull movie, actors usually demand a higher salary. Is it really possible to get the whole cast of a Hero-team with big names, when the actor demands get increasingly high?

[I Am The Knight]

The Marvel Model was always sketchy....Actors will always be actors. Greedy execs will always be greedy execs. With that said, we don't know for sure if Howard wanted a bigger piece of the pie or if Marvel just got cheap.

[jmc]

The Marvel Model was always sketchy....Actors will always be actors. Greedy execs will always be greedy execs. With that said, we don't know for sure if Howard wanted a bigger piece of the pie or if Marvel just got cheap.

In fairness to Marvel, they're only a start up movie company so it wouldn't be at all surprising if they were trying to do things as cheap as possible, they're only doing comic adaptations, so one really bad flop could cripple them.

[Evil Twin]

I've always thought that people who thought that Marvel would be able to keep everybody, everything would mesh perfectly, every movie would be a runaway success, and everything would run exactly on time were being way too optimistic.

[FaT_tONle]

I said it in the IM2 boards... the recast comes when you least expect it. Everyone thinks Norton will back out of Avengers... watch RDJ back out while Norton signs on... but at the end of the day... as long as Marvel retains RDJ and the actors for Cap/Thor they'll be fine. They have a budget... they can't pay actors like Howard over five million for a supporting role (not that that was the number)... WB has the money to keep Bale though.

[jmc]

I've always thought that people who thought that Marvel would be able to keep everybody, everything would mesh perfectly, every movie would be a runaway success, and everything would run exactly on time were being way too optimistic.

Very true, I think Iron Man may have lead some fans into a false sense of security, its success could actually be fools gold.

[biolumen]

"Dark Crystal" sequel succeeds where Miller and JL:M failed.

Offset granted to Dark Crystal sequel

Mon 13/10/2008 03:44:19
By Simon de Bruyn

Screen Australia has issued a provisional Producer Offset certificate to Omnilab Media for its sequel to the 1982 fantasy classic The Dark Crystal, which the company is currently developing.

While based on a story by Jim Henson, the film will be shot in Australia with an Australian director and crew, and is currently in development with Australian writers. Omnilab own the rights to the project.

It appears the film has passed the crucial Significant Australian Content test, required to access the Offset – less than six months after a similar property, George Miller’s Justice League, was knocked back based on the same tests.

The content test is a case-by-case analysis which covers a film's subject matter, details of production expenditure, where it is made, the nationalities and places of residence of the producer, director, and other key creatives.

As previously reported, Gabriel director Shane Abbess was attached to a Dark Crystal project but further details weren’t known. INSIDEFILM now understands this was the Omnilab project, but that Abbess has since departed. It is not known if the project is a reboot of the previously slated CGI sequel Power of the Dark Crystal, which was announced back in 2005.

The Dark Crystal sequel will have the Henson family stamp of approval, with the Jim Henson Creature Shop reportedly visiting Sydney in July. The Jim Henson Company has previously worked with Australian producers, shooting its science fiction series Farscape here.

Alex Sangston, head of Producer Offset and Co-productions at Screen Australia told INSIDEFILM the agency couldn’t provide any information on any projects which have been issued with provisional or final certificates for the Producer Offset due to taxation privacy laws.

http://www.if.com.au/2008/10/13/article/Offset-granted-to-Dark-Crystal-sequel/YSYJIRPXNW.html

[Webhead2006]

interesting.

[jmc]

^ Not really, this film appears to be in the hands of Australians from the get go, JL didn't originate here, clearly this film passed the requirements.

[biolumen]

"Billy: The Early Years" does not appear to be the starring vehicle Hammer may have hoped for.

Billy Graham movie sinks like lead at box office

My condolences to the investors: “Billy: The Early Years” raked in $192,042 at the box office over the weekend. Showing on 282 screens, it attracted an awful $681 per screen. An average of less than $230 per night. At $7 per ticket, that works out to fewer than 35 viewers per day per screen.

Fireproof, the evangelical film, and Religulous, the agnostic anthem raked in far more money, according to Boxofficemojo.com.

http://biblebeltblogger.com/index.php/religion/billy-graham-movie-sinks-like-lead-at-box-office
(http://www.boxofficemojo.com/)

[TheVileOne]

What are you talking about? You didn't want the movie until all of the Batman films were completed. You also didn't want Batman in the film. Those reasons had nothing to do with George Miller.
Untrue BS.

Ramore, the original post was referring to the JUSTICE LEAGUE sections when they existed. They should've died in January with the movie, but it was kept around for another 7 months or so. I kept going on about how the JL forums needed to fold since they were taking up unecessary space and attendance was down. With no JL movie in sight it made no sense to have them anymore.

[Webhead2006]

Wow sucks for hammer that the billy film didnt do well so far.

[Antonello Blueberry]

Wow sucks for hammer that the billy film didnt do well so far.
He's young, he'll survive and will use it for his showreel.
How many people went to see "Return to Horror High" starring George Clooney in theaters?

[biolumen]

Well, Miller is moving on to something equally big (or nearly). A sci-fi version of Homer's "The Odyssey" starring Brad Pitt. The Variety article also states that Miller remains attached to the Justice League movie.

Brad Pitt joins WB for 'Odyssey'
Actor teams with George Miller for adaptation

By MICHAEL FLEMING

After turning Homer’s epic poem "The Iliad" into the 2004 film "Troy," Warner Bros. and Brad Pitt are teaming with George Miller to adapt the Greek poet’s other masterwork, "The Odyssey."

Their intention is to transfer the tale to a futuristic setting in outer space.

Warner Bros. has quietly set up "The Odyssey," and the early hope is that Pitt will star and Miller will direct, with Pitt’s Plan B producing.Pitt played Achilles in the Wolfgang Petersen-directed "Troy," a global blockbuster that David Benioff adapted from "The Iliad."

Both Homer poems dealt with the Trojan War; "The Odyssey" focused on the exploits of Odysseus, who hatched the idea to build the Trojan Horse. "The Odyssey" deals with his long journey home after he declines to become a god.

Pitt will next be seen in the David Fincher-directed "The Curious Case of Benjamin Button" and the Terrence Malick-directed "Tree of Life." He just began shooting the Quentin Tarantino-directed "Inglourious Basterds."

Miller remains attached to direct "Justice League" at WB.

http://www.variety.com/article/VR1117994174.html?categoryId=13&cs=1

[Webhead2006]

He is likely not officially still set as a director for jl since they are now doing the solo route for now and we wont be getting jl to 2014 the earliest.

[biolumen]

Miller is interviewed on Andrew Denton's 'Enough Rope' Monday night in Oz. Hopefully some JL:M tidbits are revealed.

[Webhead2006]

Hopefully he will say that he and jl isnt going to happen, and maybe hopefully we can hear what his plan was for the film so we can set things straight on some of the details we had heard.

[biolumen]

Another article saying he's still attached to a JL movie.

Two top directors to film overseas

Michael Bodey | October 20, 2008

TWO of Australia's most revered directors will take disparate paths with their next projects.

George Miller, who recently threatened to take his upcoming movies, including Happy Feet 2, offshore after being denied access to the new 40 per cent producer rebate for his Justice League Mortal comic book adaptation, is planning to adapt Homer's masterpiece, The Odyssey with US actor Brad Pitt.

In another blow to the implementation of generous new government incentives for the film industry, Sydney director Peter Weir will shoot his next film in Bulgaria.

Weir, who last directed Master and Commander: The Far Side of the World in 2003, has written the screenplay and will direct The Way Back.

The script traces the true story of an escape by soldiers from a Siberian gulag in 1940.

It is based primarily on Slavomir Rawicz's book The Long Walk: The True Story of a Trek to Freedom, his account of capture by the Red Army in 1939 and his subsequent journey of escape across the Siberian Arctic, the Gobi desert and the Himalayas, before settling in Tibet and India. No one has been cast as yet.

The private Weir, who has directed Picnic At Hanging Rock, Gallipoli and The Truman Show, had been developing an adaptation of Gregory David Roberts's novel, Shantaram, with Johnny Depp to star.

Weir dropped out for unspecified reasons and the movie is now in turnaround.

Miller will adapt Homer's epic poem, The Odyssey, with the intention of moving the ancient tale of Greek hero Odysseus's journey home to Ithaca after the fall of Troy to a futuristic outer-space setting, according to Hollywood newspaper, Variety.

It is not known where the film will shoot, if it is produced.

Pitt starred as Achilles opposite Eric Bana and Orlando Bloom in the 2004 film adaptation of Homer's The Iliad, Troy. It earned nearly $US500million globally in cinemas despite mixed reviews.

Miller has long wanted to update the DC Comics superhero franchise, Justice League, by alluding to the mythic Greek origins of Superman, Batman and their friends.

The son of Greek immigrant parents, Miller was once an altar boy at the St George Greek Orthodox Church in Rose Bay before becoming known as the writer and director of the Mad Max series of films.

He is still developing Justice League with the Warner Bros studio, as well as Happy Feet 2 and Babe 3.

There are also plans to develop a fourth Mad Max movie and/or videogame, entitled Fury Road.

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,24521431-15803,00.html

[Webhead2006]

Yea its probably going to be like this unstill wb drops him officially or he finally gives up on it. Since we now know they are doing solo film approach now and jla isnt likely to be happening to 2014 range or later.

[BATZARRO WWD]

Hopefully he will say that he and jl isnt going to happen...

He already happened Lolsnortlol!

On a more serious note, though, I wouldn't expect any hard confirmation 'till way into next year. The only thing they're gonna confirm this year is the third Batman film, if anything.