Adapting Stories From the Comics for the 3rd Film

[BATS N' HORNETS]

wouldn't it be great if Nolan would do an adaptation of TLH/Dark Victory for the 3rd BATMAN MOVIE... think off it:

* they could include a robin origin

* harvey could become two-face

* scarecrow could turn bat signal into a jackolantern

IT WOULD BE NEAT.....

all of your thoughts! ! ! ???????

[jsf]

yeah i guess

[FaT_tONle]

Dark Victory means the climax has been reached... Batman kicks ass at the end and the title already confirms that... no one would watch cause we'd all know what would happen

[FlawlessVictory]

I think the 3rd film is too early to bring Robin in.

[Mr. Wooden Alligator]

Freaks versus the Mob, with an increasing tension between Bats and Gordon. Bruce could take in the orphaned Tim Drake, and we could see the paralells between Time and Bruce (such as the Father's Day stuff from Dark Victory) The most of Robin we should see is Tim killing the man responsible for his parents' death, and how it affected him. I don't know about everyone else, but Dick Grayson looked pretty upset when Bats tried to lead him away from Zucco's body after Grayson had killed him.

I say use Tim Drake because Dick Grayson brings up terrible Forever memories best left forgotten.

[Robin91939]

Dark Victory means the climax has been reached... Batman kicks ass at the end and the title already confirms that... no one would watch cause we'd all know what would happen

Do you realize what a Dark Victory means? It's not just victory and putting "dark" in front of it cause it's Batman and he's dark and it sounds cool. It is a dark victory in the story because, yes, Batman wins and is victorious, but it's the cost that makes it dark. He loses his friend and ally Harvey Dent to the dark side entirely (he even presumes him to be dead). He loses Catwoman again, and the body of the Roman is gone without a trace. The good guys win, but Sophia Gigante is dead without having been tried. So much good came out of so much bad and the ends may not have justified the means. It's almost like it's a "bitter-sweet" victory. People go into virtually every super hero film knowing the hero will triumph (Superman Returns did the best job in recent memory to make me think the hero could die) so the point of watching it isn't to see if the hero dies, it's to see how he wins and at what cost. A dark victory alludes to a great cost that has to be paid for the greater good....something that people would want to see. Also, it's putting dark in the title of a Batman film and that just looks cool, right?

It would make a great ending to the trilogy to adapt Batman: Dark Victory.

-R

[Robin91939]

Freaks versus the Mob, with an increasing tension between Bats and Gordon. Bruce could take in the orphaned Tim Drake, and we could see the paralells between Time and Bruce (such as the Father's Day stuff from Dark Victory) The most of Robin we should see is Tim killing the man responsible for his parents' death, and how it affected him. I don't know about everyone else, but Dick Grayson looked pretty upset when Bats tried to lead him away from Zucco's body after Grayson had killed him.

I say use Tim Drake because Dick Grayson brings up terrible Forever memories best left forgotten.

If you were to use Tim Drake in this fashion it is a bastardization of his character. Tim's appeal is that he is a well to do kid who chooses to be Robin. It is not out of nessecity. He seeks out the role. If you want an orphan Robin that is not Dick Grayson, use Jason Todd...you could even have the Joker kill him in the sequel. Yet...I have when people say that Dick Grayson can't be used to "avoid memories of Batman Forever". Wasn't Two-face in Batman Forever? Should we not include him in the new franchise because one misguided director messed him up? No. We give him another chance...what makes Robin/Dick Grayson any different? Batman was messed up in the old franchise, and in this one, he works. That reasoning, my friend, stinks.

-R

[Mr. Wooden Alligator]

Two-Face and the delightfully grotesque visuals that could accompany the character are good enough to excused the drivel from Forever. Dick Grayson being Robin brings up sidesplitting jokes one should not get from a Batman movie. The name, age, and fact that he lives with an adult when he's like 20.

Therefore use Tim Drake. It'd be no different then what was done with Penguin. In the comics he was a mob boss, and in Returns he was a mob boss of a circus gang. See, both are mob bosses in a sense, and it worked. Therefore bring on Tim Drake.

Maybe Batman could inadvertantly orphan Tim Drake, like drag a battle between himself and the "freaks" into Drake's neighborhood. So Bruce adopts Tim because he feels responsible for the situation.

But I liked the DV story for Robin a hell of a lot better.

I'd love to see Freeze have a role in BB3 like he did in DV. No origin, just there helping out Two-Face:

Freeze: "Have you ever been in love?"

Two-Face: "What's that got to do with it?!"

Freeze: "When dealing with me, it means everything."

^With lines like that to hint at his motivation.

[Deaths Head II]

I prefer Drake to Grayson as Robin (always preferred Dick as Nightwing), but I don't buy into that reasoning. You can't really suggest that they change Dick's role into Tim's and then say Dick would cause so-and-so to happen while Tim wouldn't. The way you said it up it would be the same character with a different name. You can't talk about how interesting the Dark Victory story is and how good it would be for Tim and say Dick would offer only side-splitting jokes. The story you're suggesting is Dick's story, either Dick's plot helps the movie or it ruins it. Make up your mind. Changing the name doesn't change the effectiveness of the narrative provided. So keeping the name Dick (or Richard if you're so antsy about it) doesn't mean much in the way you arranged things besides association to the character in Forever. But everyone else was so bastardized in that film I don't see the big deal in pointing that out.

I agree that if Tim does get introduced, he should seek the role out. I don't want him to be merged with Dick for the films like he was merged with Jason for the TAS.

[Mr. Wooden Alligator]

I'm not talking about DV Robin. I'm talking about BF Robin.

[Deaths Head II]

But why even bother bringing up Batman Forever's Robin? If you want to bring in Dark Victory and use the story's version of Robin, then use the story's version of Robin. Keeping the story but changing the name isn't going to make people go "Okay, this kid has a similar backstory to the Robin we saw in Batman Forever....but wait, he has a different name. Therefore, I am not reminded of Batman Forever at all."

[Mr. Wooden Alligator]

Does me. So we disagree, and I understand the faithfulness to your source material and respect that (Don't get me started on what the studios did to The Relic).

Aren't you glad I'm not directing? :oldrazz:

Oh, replace Grundy with Killer Croc, and we'd have an impressive assembly of Freaks :up:.

[Robin91939]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v295/robin91939/02.jpg

Two-Face and the delightfully grotesque visuals that could accompany the character are good enough to excused the drivel from Forever. Dick Grayson being Robin brings up sidesplitting jokes one should not get from a Batman movie. The name, age, and fact that he lives with an adult when he's like 20.

First thing, pick up a comic book. When Dick Grayson was orphaned in Batman: Year 3 and in Dark Victory he was a boy. Much smaller than Batman, Tim Sale even described him as "impish". Hardly a 20 year old man, not requiring a house and guidance as in Batman Forever. The real Dick Grayson is about 13. He trains under Batman's watch until he is about 15 and is Robin. He is not a 20-22 year old man.
This is just like Two-Face is not a comedian, as seen in Batman Forever. He is a cold blooded killer and a well-to-do man. He is split between his sense of justice and his inability to dispense justice fairly. In the '95 film they got this wrong. Just like they did with Dick Grayson/Robin. So you're saying that if Nolan makes Two-face more ruthless and grotesque and more "comic accurate" people will forgive Batman Forever? Why not if they made Dick Grayson/Robin more accurate would we not do the same? You clearly don't understand the actual character, hell you think he's 20 years old, maybe other people are as misguided and Nolan can rectify this and show the world the character that has thrived just as long as Batman has.

Therefore use Tim Drake. It'd be no different then what was done with Penguin. In the comics he was a mob boss, and in Returns he was a mob boss of a circus gang. See, both are mob bosses in a sense, and it worked. Therefore bring on Tim Drake.
It would be completely different. And another thing, there is a huge base of fans that hate what Tim Burton did to the Penguin. Yet, if you simply changed Dick Grayson/ Jason Todd's story with Tim Drake, that is a complete bastardization of the character. Tim Drake was not an orphan when he became Robin (he is now after the events of Identity Crises but still, he has a stepmother, Dana) he was not a product of tragedy. He was a good-willed boy who wanted to help the Dark Knight and the world. That's his appeal. He is a true hero. He puts his life on the line to help people. He has no vendetta, no vow and no inner guilt that makes him do what he does. He helps because he wants to, because he thinks he can. That is his appeal and motivation. If you can't see the difference between the three Robins then, again, you severely underestimate the characters and need to open a comic book with them in it.

Maybe Batman could inadvertantly orphan Tim Drake, like drag a battle between himself and the "freaks" into Drake's neighborhood. So Bruce adopts Tim because he feels responsible for the situation.

Again, Tim is not an orphan. Batman could maybe do this to Jason Todd. He couldn't do this with Dick Grayson, because the "circus death" background accounts for all of his training and why he can step into the role of Robin with only about a year of training.


But I liked the DV story for Robin a hell of a lot better.
Wait, you liked the Dark Victory origin of Robin better than the Batman Forever origin? You just made my point for me. If you liked it done right in the comics, with a kid of the appropriate age, what's stopping you and the rest of the audience liking it done in a third Nolan film with an actor of the right age and done in the same vein of Dark Victory and not like Batman Forever, much how Two-face will be handled?


I'd love to see Freeze have a role in BB3 like he did in DV. No origin, just there helping out Two-Face:

Freeze: "Have you ever been in love?"

Two-Face: "What's that got to do with it?!"

Freeze: "When dealing with me, it means everything."

^With lines like that to hint at his motivation.
I like the exchange, and wouldn't mind Mr. Freeze, but do you think Nolan, a guy who needed to explain the utility belt, cape, suit, cowl, gloves, gauntlets, Batmobile, Batcave, Batcave elevator, so on and so forth, will have a guy freezing people without an explanation?

-R

[BurtonBegan]

I can't see Nolan using Robin, only hinting at him maybe in the 3rd film. It's just not plausible to have a teenage kid taking on brutal thugs and coming out on top, it destroys the realism. If he was included, and was actually fighting (not just a batcave tea boy) he would have to be at least 20.

[BubbaGump]

Dark Victory means the climax has been reached... Batman kicks ass at the end and the title already confirms that... no one would watch cause we'd all know what would happen

LOTR: Return of the King? People watched that.

[Malone]

I like the idea of mobsters versus freaks in the third film. It would also be interesting to see the tension between Two-Face, Batman, and Gordon; it would make for good storylines.

[Mr. Wooden Alligator]

I can't see Nolan using Robin, only hinting at him maybe in the 3rd film. It's just not plausible to have a teenage kid taking on brutal thugs and coming out on top, it destroys the realism. If he was included, and was actually fighting (not just a batcave tea boy) he would have to be at least 20.


He wouldn't be taking on thugs, just the man responsible for his parents death, just like in DV. Other than that, no Robin costume or anything in BB3.

@Robin91939: Can we just agree to disagree here? I mean, I just don't think the kid should be Dick Grayson. It would only be a simple name change since neither of the other chars Jason Todd or Tim Drake are likely to make it into the franchise. So can we just disagree and drop it?

And I guess Nolan wouldn't use Freeze, though there's no telling where all the freaks and psychos from the Arkham incident went...one could've broken into Victor's research facilities and unwittingly caused him to become Freeze. Still, I don't think he's Nolan's cup of tea. :csad:

But what do you think about Killer Croc taking Grundy's role from TLH/DV for BB3?

[Robin91939]

He wouldn't be taking on thugs, just the man responsible for his parents death, just like in DV. Other than that, no Robin costume or anything in BB3.

@Robin91939: Can we just agree to disagree here? I mean, I just don't think the kid should be Dick Grayson. It would only be a simple name change since neither of the other chars Jason Todd or Tim Drake are likely to make it into the franchise. So can we just disagree and drop it?

And I guess Nolan wouldn't use Freeze, though there's no telling where all the freaks and psychos from the Arkham incident went...one could've broken into Victor's research facilities and unwittingly caused him to become Freeze. Still, I don't think he's Nolan's cup of tea. :csad:

But what do you think about Killer Croc taking Grundy's role from TLH/DV for BB3?

I'll drop it, but I still don't agree with neglecting Grayson and changing Tim's character...it's more than a "simple name change". When you change that name you change both characters immensely.

Next, no, I don't think that Mr. Freeze is Nolan's thing. We may get a glimpse or a cameo of a Doctor Victor Fries, but that's it.

As far as Croc, if we got him, expect a toned down Batman: Broken City interpretation of him. Also, if you used Dick Grayson and the Haly's Circus, Nolan could intertwine Dick and Waylan Jones' (Croc's) story lines and have Croc as a side show freak at the same circus. Just a thought....


-R

[CConn]

What if we just pretend Dick and Barb doesn't exist and go right to Tim and Cass? :o

[CConn]

Because Dick and Barb are important as is Tim but Cass sucks balls.:o
No, Dick and Barb suck. Tim and Cass are awesome.

[Deaths Head II]

Tim and Cass will most likely never appear in a film. Tim's origin might be considered too much to swallow, especially without a prior Robin. And Dick's story is just more recognized and would probably make for a more interesting film. Cass is more likely, but I think if were to be a toss up between the two Batgirls, I bet they would go for the classic one.

[Deaths Head II]

What do you have against Cass, by the way?

[Mr. Socko]

Sorry, you guys can dream all you want but it won't happen. Nolan borrows from many different comics, he's not just going to adapt a single one. Batman Begins was not Batman: YO. The third film may be very close to DV/LH but it won't be exactly.

[Mr. Wooden Alligator]

If I may lend a machete to my idea about name changing Robin-It doesn't have to be the circus origin. The thing I liked about the DV origin was that Bruce took him in because he saw himself in Dick, being that both were orphaned around the same age. To take this a step further, the Narrows Kid from BB could be a potential candidate, whose parents are victims in a crossfire during the speculative gang war. Feeling somewhat responsible for their deaths, Bruce could choose to adopt the boy, teach him a few moves, and let him get his vengeance on the man responsible for his parents' death.

[Rorschach2012]

Dark Victory would be great! It's me favorite graphic novel!

[Changeling]

No it would only be great if 2 was tlh

[Nefilim]

Seeing as this is Bruce Wayne's rookie season as Batman, I thought the escalation theme of TDK would take an even more aggressive turn coming into further sequels. In BB, the gates of Arkham Asylum were forcibly opened and chaos ran amok in Gotham City by Ra's Al Ghul, so I don't see why some other criminal mastermind (i.e, Bane) wouldn't try it once again just to piss Batsy off..

My idea of a Knightfall adaptation is that it closely resembles the comic book plotline, however no Robin or Nightwing would exist, and would fit in nicely with Batman's beginnings as a crime fighter, considering that after 3 movies directed by Nolan, another three-part arc would seem appropriate. A Jean Paul Valley would be ok with me, yet there should be an entire separate movie that would introduce him into the mix and further develop his characterization, which leads into the Knightfall movie adaptation. It could be possible that Jean Paul Valley was actually a student of Ra's Al Ghul prior to Bruce Wayne, only that he was taking the law into his own hands in some other part of the globe. Upon hearing of Ghul's death, he ventures into Gotham City to seek vengeance and there he meets Bruce Wayne. As Batman, Bruce defeats Jean Paul, and confines him into Arkham Asylum. It would also help that Jean Paul actually knows who Batman is, yet due to his learnings from other continents, perhaps somewhere like Japan, he decides not to reveal Batman's secret identity as some sort of code of honor.

Bane enters into the mix upon the next movie, with the same introduction as Joker, without any knowledge of who he is, and upon arriving he breaks out all the inmates from Arkham to once again cause trouble for Batsy and the GCPD. Following the plot of the comic book, Batman grows weary with each encounter of an arch-nemesis.

Prior to Bane's true reveal to Batsy, our hero would have a final encounter with the Joker in the streets at dawn. After defeating and neutralizing Mr. J, Bane introduces himself and gives Bats a hard time, seeing as he has grown physically tired and too weak to give Bane a good fight. Then Bane breaks his back.

In the third and final chapter of the film, Jean Paul Valley discovers Batman has been broken. He decides to take our hero back to the Batcave, and helps him recuperate (with the mindset that only he should bring down the Caped Crusader). As Bruce regains his health, Jean Paul forcibly takes the mantle of the Bat as his own and battles Bane. (I foresee this taking place in the middle of the entire flick, somewhere around the 45minute to 1 hour mark)

Gotham is thankful to this new Batman, yet perhaps after a few weeks they are rather surprised by the tactics he employs upon capturing what's left of the Arkham inmates, namely morally incomprehensible acts of violence by killing off criminals here and there. Bruce becomes 100% and there he decides to take down Jean Paul for a final showdown and an end to the whole plot.

Tell me what you think, all this I just typed on to go so pardon me for any hints of repetitiveness with my grammar and such... (plus, its 8:10am in here and I haven't slept a wink lol)

[Christmas]

Couldn't find a thread to really express this opinion exactly, so please excuse the new thread I've made, but I think it's warranted.

I think Batman: War on Crime should be used as a template for the third and final chapter of the presumed Nolan-Bat trilogy. For those unfamiliar with this truly great Batman story, please take a look at Mr. Mark S. Reinhart's excellent run-down of the graphic Novel:

http://www.batman-on-film.com/opinion_batman-war-on-crime-msreinhart_4-14-08.html

Batman/Bruce Wayne should be a more mature, wizened hero, understanding the boundless philanthropic power he has in a corrupt city, establishing a better report with Commissioner Gordon and the entire GCPD, and IMO he should reach out to the working class of Gotham; seeing from their p.o.v will help put his War in perspective -ie: just cracking skulls and kicking ass is not going to reduce villainy in Gotham (though of course he's going to take them on violently, just with a clearer approach to what will bring results). All of these elements are more brilliantly and succinctly put together in the book so go out and pick it up if you have not.

I just have a hunch for a final film Nolan will want a more sober Batman so to speak, and War on Crime has many great elements to develop, not to mention appearances by Penguin, Riddler, Selina Kyle, among others are woven into the story. Hopefully we'll see that multi-layered universe of villains implanted into the last film as we have seen so far.

But that's just me, what stories or particular runs in the comics do you think can fit into a 3rd Nolan Bat film? Please think and discuss. :brucebat:

[elgato]

Sounds cool, but it would be really nice if this thread served as a place qhere people express how they want BB3 to be

[Christmas]

That was kind of my intention, having a spot for the plot/themes/storylines of the 3rd movie, i dont mind if a mod renames the thread to suit that a little better. I obviously had my preferences but i hope it gets people thinking.

[nOvAkAiNe]

as dark knight is LOOSELY based on the long halloween, i feel that if they introduce the riddler in "bats 3" it should be loosely based on the hush storyline. with the riddler learning his identity, harvey dent still on the loose, and maybe even introducing the catwoman in a role like she has in long halloween/dark victory where she plays both sides of the fence. i think it could be great as well and it will hopefully not need the joker (since who can really fill in heaths rip shoes) and i dont think we need robin yet, there are so many good batman stories where he hasnt had robin, maybe then the 4th one could be loosely based on dark victory and its introduction of robin, which is by far the best robin origin story. thoughts?

[tekken]

all of my favorite batman stories have robin in one way or the other, lol. in fact, batman's not much of loner like he says he is. when one robin quits/dies, he finds another one, haha.

but i wouldn't like a movie based on HUSH unless it was done right. i'd like an animated movie for HUSH, but not in nolan's universe. i say use riddler, just not his scheme in hush.

[az824]

Its WAAAY to soon to do a Hush movie, most of the characters havent been introduced. but if u do it like u said (loosely based) it wouldnt be so bad

[nOvAkAiNe]

yeah thats what i meant for it to be loosely based it could have harvey's obsession with duality drives him to get the riddler to help figure out batmans secret identity and it could also take the BASIC outline of hush with a bit of dark victory thrown in there. I'd just like to see catwoman and riddler introduced and i enjoyed catwoman in dark victory and when in rome and riddler from the hush storyline...it would be impossible and terrible to introduce everyone from hush, but it would be awesome for two face to just wreck batmans life, using the riddler and MAYBE even solomon grundy...but that shouldnt happen, too many villains always ruin the movies.

[Nepenthes]

Well, I was gonna make fun of you but it's actually not a bad idea. Do a tour of Gotham City as Batman unravels the identity of his mysterious tormentor, who in the end is some geek we previously knew from the 60's show and Jim Carrey. Suddenly the Riddler is bad arse; it would be a nice reveal fo normal audiences just as it was for fans in the comics. Two-Face, Catwoman, Penguin, Killer Croc, the Venquilotrist, Firefly, they're all manipulated in the plot. The minor villains only need a couple of scenes each.

[JokerLedger]

A third movie being based on HUSH would've worked if Rachel Dawes was actually a dude.

[nOvAkAiNe]

i was just rereading it today and it made me think how much of a threat the riddler could really be, we've never seen the riddler as an actual bad guy, he's been more of comic relief and a guy that gets his butt handed to him by bats.

[Joker]

I wouldnt mind them introducing the character of Tommy Elliot, as set up for a future movie, but Hush should be saved for later. At least movie 6 or so, so they can do it right.

[Crook]

The unfortunate thing about adapting "big" stories such as Hush, Knightfall, or TLH, is you practically need at least 3 or so films to introduce all the major characters and develop them. Even then, it's not even guaranteed you'd have all the actors back, or if you'll be successful enough to reach that stage.

It'd take a whole bunch of meticulous planning to set up that kind of universe, and frankly DC/WB aren't those type of people.

[kage88]

i wouldn't go with hush on the third movie. perhaps a 2 1/2-3 hour animated movie in the lines of the spawn animated series that aired on hbo;very violent and "moderate" use of blood. with that said, lighten up the daylight scenes. i swear, all the daylight scenes in spawn were very dark!

[Man Who Laughed]

I know this is a diff. character and all, but while we're on the subject of HUGE adaptations, I gotta say, I've always wanted to see a adaptation of The Death and Return of Superman. Every time I read those, I can't help but think you could easily pull 5-6 movies out of that storyline.

But back on topic, I would love to see Hush adapted. I've been a Batman fan for as long as I can remember, but last year when I got TLH, DV, Haunted Knight, Hush 1 & 2, and Hush Returns, and read them all within two weeks, I've never felt more like I truly knew how Batman should be defined. After I finished Hush, I set it down and just thought, "Damn. THAT'S Batman." Same goes for the Sale+Loeb collabs.

For some reason, I just think that this is Batman in his element. And Hush. There's a f***ing good villain if I ever saw one. It's amazing how deep that storyline went.

Sliding OT once more here, what was supposed to happen after the end of Hush Returns? I don't buy the comics, because I have an addictive personality, so I stick to the TPBs. And if I remember, Hush Returns just sort of...stopped. WTF?

[Nepenthes]

The unfortunate thing about adapting "big" stories such as Hush, Knightfall, or TLH, is you practically need at least 3 or so films to introduce all the major characters and develop them. Even then, it's not even guaranteed you'd have all the actors back, or if you'll be successful enough to reach that stage.

It'd take a whole bunch of meticulous planning to set up that kind of universe, and frankly DC/WB aren't those type of people.

but say for example the cast of a 'Hush' movie included Scarecrow, Firefly, Killer Croc, Venquilotrist.......the type of villains that fit more easily into NolansWorld. Apart from the main players of Two-Face, Catwoman and Riddler, would any of these guys really need to be what you call 'major characters'? They're interesting and striking enough to exist without a backstory imo. The 'Hush' movie, as I see it, would mainly have to dwell on Catwoman as the new major character. Two-Face has been introduced in TDK and Riddler would only be revealed and fleshed out towards the end.

Question is....who would the actual 'Hush' character be, the mystery, the red herring? I really don't like Tommy Elliot and there's nothing special about him that's calling to be transferred to film. It's easy to say Two-Face should act as the 'Hush' plot device, but then again in the comic we all presumed Hush was actually Harvey anyway (if not Tommy Elliot) and that served a second purpose in itself. It would have to be someone other than Harvey, but someone that Harvey could easily imposter if we wanted to. Hence the bandages as a full face mask, to cover Harvey's scarring. Black Mask, Bane and Deadshot all wear full face disguises.

so, my movie three cast based off the premise of Hush is;

CENTRAL PLAYERS
Batman
Two-Face
Catwoman
Deadshot (who we assume is actually Two-Face and the central mystery antagonist)

CAMEO ROLES
Firefly
Killer Croc
Venquilotrist
Scarecrow

ACT THREE VILLAIN
Riddler

Hhm, maybe you don't need a Hush character after all....

[Man Who Laughed]

I think that you should have Tom Elliot. If not for anything else, then at least for the emotional factor. That was the best part of the entire arc, IMO. The fact that he and Bruce were friends, his parents "accident."

Also, Gotham Knight is gonna deal with Deadshot, so we'll have to see how Bats handles that.

[HappyCat]

I think it's obvious that Christopher Nolan used Batman : Year One as the basis for Batman Begins and from what I understand The Dark Knight is riffing on The Long Halloween. So, if Nolan is going to do another movie to wrap it up as a trilogy then I can't think of a better way then taking ceratin elements from TDKR for the basis of Batman 3.

Now, there are morons on the IMDB that think that since Year One and The Long Halloween are back to back stories that Dark Victory would be used next. I really think most of the posters there are 12 year olds. They didn't seem to understand why I was suggesting TDKR's as the basis for Batman 3. Given that The Dark Knight deals with The Joker and Two-Face, and depending on those characters fates, TDKR is a logical choice.

Now I'm NOT suggesting a direct adaptation. I am NOT suggesting putting Superman in the movie. To be honest, I never liked The Dark Knight Returns because of the way Miller used and then just killed off The Joker. Miller just wanted Batman and Superman to fight and the Joker wasn't important to him. But there is alot of really good stuff in the book that could be used for Batman 3.

I'm sure IF Nolan does a third film then he'll no doubt draw elements from various comic's but if you we're going to use any of them as a jumping off point then TDKR wouldn't be bad place to start.

Of course this all depends on IF Nolan does a third Batman film and if he's going to bring back The Joker and/or Two-Face. Yeah, it's blasphemy to suggest re-casting The Joker when The Dark Knight hasn't even came out but I'd bet Nolan is thinking about this. If he isn't willing to have someone else play The Joker, he would more then likely have Two-Face in it along with another villain. The Riddler would be a logical choice since the character would fit into Nolan's relistic take on Batman.

But then maybe Nolan shouldn't do a third film. After a Batman/Joker conflict as epic as TDK's promises to be, I don't see how any other villain could match it?

[Laderlappen]

Dark Victory would be an obvious choice. If Catwoman I can see them using inspirations from TLH/DV and also Hush.

[NinjaTurtleFan]

"Dark Victory", Batman: Hush, and Two-Face Strikes Twice for Two-Face.

Alot of episodes from BTAS could work out too.

[sLauGhTeR]

Why not do the Black Mask? takes control over the mob and goes after Two Face and Batman?

[omerhead]

Why don't they take elements from the Dennis 'O Niel & Neal Adams Batman comic books, Batman: Hush and bring a little bit macabre feel to it.

[Aidan2209]

Sorry, you guys can dream all you want but it won't happen. Nolan borrows from many different comics, he's not just going to adapt a single one. Batman Begins was not Batman: YO. The third film may be very close to DV/LH but it won't be exactly.

Yeah, you don't adapt a single Batman comic book/limited series into a feature film when the character has been around for so long and appears in so many different stories. They could adapt a limited series or one-shot into a DC animated film, and they probably have, but they can't adapt it into a big-budget feature. That doesn't make the least bit of sense. What they've always done is taken the character/s, as well as other story elements and inspiration from certain exemplary comics within the Batman mythos, and used them in constructing an original film. The same goes with most superheroes. It's different with something like Watchmen, which is the limited series.

[omerhead]

Taking elements is what I meant, I accidentally wrote adapt in my post, anyway I edited my post.

[Hypestyle]

...what about adapting that story, especially including Holiday and the crime mob families of Gotham..

[Nathan Petrelli]

Harvey Dent becomes Two-Face in The Dark Knight, so you would want him to be Two-Face all over again in TLH?

[TLH]

TDK is apparently heavily inspired by TLH, especially Harvey Dent's development into Two-Face, but they aren't following the plot of the graphic novel itself.

Some of the shots from the movie, including the Harvey, Gordon, Batman meeting on the rooftops and the "he does that" line are taken straight from TLH. Also, given the characters in TDK, I think it's safe to say that TDK is as close an adaptation of TLH as we are going to see.

[DACrowe]

Freaks versus the Mob, with an increasing tension between Bats and Gordon. Bruce could take in the orphaned Tim Drake, and we could see the paralells between Time and Bruce (such as the Father's Day stuff from Dark Victory) The most of Robin we should see is Tim killing the man responsible for his parents' death, and how it affected him. I don't know about everyone else, but Dick Grayson looked pretty upset when Bats tried to lead him away from Zucco's body after Grayson had killed him.

I say use Tim Drake because Dick Grayson brings up terrible Forever memories best left forgotten.

Freaks and their interaction with the mob is becoming one of the focuses of TDK and I'm sure will be more violent and destructive in BB3 (when the freaks completely usurp the mafia in Gotham).

But saying not to use Dick Grayson (the best because he'd become Nightwing) because of Batman Forever is terrible logic. If that were the case, Nolan made a huge mistake by bringing Harvey Dent and Two-Face back with TDK, after all we all remember how (badly) Two-Face was handled in Batman Forever. Come to think of it Bruce Wayne was in that AND BATMAN AND ROBIN, we don't need that lame character around either. :rolleyes:

BTW TDK is already pretty heavily inspired by The Long Halloween. But like BB was heavily inspired by Year One, don['t expect a straight adaptation, but just themes, ideas and maybe certain scenes and characters brought in from those graphic novels.

[maveholic31]

Begins was inspired by, according to Nolan and Goyer, The Long Halloween, The Man Who Falls, and Year One. TDK has elements of TLH and The Man who laughs as well as the first appearance of the Joker.
What stories would serve as a stepping stone/inspiration for the third film in this great franchise?
Dark Victory, No Man's Land, Hush? Turning Points. Knightfall...

*(I purposely left out heavy Joker-related stories because imo the joker was done true justice by Ledger and I don't want anyone else portraying this character)*

[flickchick85]

Well, idk about the villains, not having read any of the graphic novels, but if they do use Catwoman, I'd love it if they took a cue from the animated series. The Catwoman arc in that was always my favorite storyline TAS ever did.

[ThePoisonPuppet]

I'd like to see elements from Dark Victory and War Games combined. I really liked War Games story arc even though it didn't have the best writing and I disliked Stephanie Brown. I still think it deserves more credit.

[maveholic31]

i enjoyed War Games as well, but i hope they use the Riddler story from Hush and brief use from TLH if he is to be the villain in the next one.

[scifiwolf]

I was going to say TAS as well. The way that show worked, it could almost be considered a living comic series. I don't know how else to describe it. Watching that show is like watching a comic book on a screen. I think it's a perfectly viable and credible source for material.

[Hole Shot]

Well the two main things about Dark Victory are Two Face and Robin, so I can't see how much influence it'll have.

This thread is a tough question for me to answer because while I can talk comic, I'm not nearly close to as well versed as many of you. And my idea for the third film doesn't remind me of anything I've read yet.

[Franklin Richards]

I think the inspiration should come from other mediums. For instance if you ask me TDK was heavily influenced by The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v418/AuntPetunia/tmp032.jpg



Like Pontius Pilate, director John Ford asks "What is truth?" in The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance--but unlike Pilate, Ford waits for an answer. The film opens in 1910, with distinguished and influential U.S. senator Ransom Stoddard (James Stewart) and his wife Hallie (Vera Miles) returning to the dusty little frontier town where they met and married twenty-five years earlier. They have come back to attend the funeral of impoverished "nobody" Tom Doniphon (John Wayne). When a reporter asks why, Stoddard relates a film-long flashback. He recalls how, as a greenhorn lawyer, he had run afoul of notorious gunman Liberty Valance (Lee Marvin), who worked for a powerful cartel which had the territory in its clutches. Time and again, "pilgrim" Stoddard had his hide saved by the much-feared but essentially decent Doniphon. It wasn't that Doniphon was particularly fond of Stoddard; it was simply that Hallie was in love with Stoddard, and Doniphon was in love with Hallie and would do anything to assure her happiness, even if it meant giving her up to a greenhorn. When Liberty Valance challenged Stoddard to a showdown, everyone in town was certain that the greenhorn didn't stand a chance. Still, when the smoke cleared, Stoddard was still standing, and Liberty Valance lay dead. On the strength of his reputation as the man who shot Valance, Stoddard was railroaded into a political career, in the hope that he'd rid the territory of corruption. Stoddard balked at the notion of winning an election simply because he killed a man-until Doniphon, in strictest confidence, told Stoddard the truth: It was Doniphon, not Stoddard, who shot down Valance. Stoddard was about to reveal this to the world, but Doniphon told him not to. It was far more important in Doniphon's eyes that a decent, honest man like Stoddard become a major political figure; Stoddard represented the "new" civilized west, while Doniphon knew that he and the West he represented were already anachronisms. Thus Stoddard went on to a spectacular political career, bringing extensive reforms to the state, while Doniphon faded into the woodwork. His story finished, the aged Stoddard asks the reporter if he plans to print the truth. The reporter responds by tearing up his notes. "This is the West, sir, " the reporter explains quietly. "When the legend becomes fact, print the legend." Dismissed as just another cowboy opus at the time of its release, The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance has since taken its proper place as one of the great Western classics. It questions the role of myth in forging the legends of the West, while setting this theme in the elegiac atmosphere of the West itself, set off by the aging Stewart and Wayne. ~ Hal Erickson, All Movie Guide


So if you want one as good as TDK, I'd start looking at other stories. Not just Batman TPB's.


:thing: :doom: :thing:

[Ziggyman]

No Knightfall...I don't want Bane...And welcome to the boards mave!

[SPIDERMAN117]

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p71/Bklynremixed/Movie%20Posters/Zodiac.jpg
The Zodiac as insperation for if they use the Riddler

[maveholic31]

No Knightfall...I don't want Bane...And welcome to the boards mave!

lol thanks, been at these boards since 02' when they had the main sections on the left, dont know why i waited this long to join :D

I dont want to see bane either but i liked the idea of a villain (like the riddler) who lets all the criminals free from gotham to tire out the batman

[ND Irish]

i would like to see Black Mask. But im not exactly the comic expert so idk which stories of his are great and could possibly be points of inspiration. Im sure some of you know tho and I'd like to hear some suggestions so I can read them myself. :)