Police Aggression for the Conventions

[Malice]

I have been hearing more and more about the Police raiding houses....
Cuffing the people there...
Forcing them to stay on the ground for a significant amount of time, then un-cuffing the people and simply leaving.

They are not charging anyone with crimes.

This is wholly unacceptable...
Have you heard about this?

(its not being covered by mainstream media of course)

[Matt]

No offense Mal, but I'd like to see more than a rumor before I judge.

[Malice]

No offense Mal, but I'd like to see more than a rumor before I judge.

I have seen associated press notes and the like. Its reported in St Paul...but not being picked up roughly anywhere else.

Amy Goodman of the Podcast "Democracy Now" was arrested for simply taking pictures and trying to get interviews.

[danoyse]

When the RNC was in NY in 2004, my dad was walking a friend from work to the bus and they happened to be crossing the street in front of a protest group. As they were waiting for the light to change, the cops started rounding them up to arrest all of them, and they actually wouldn't let my dad or my friend leave either, claiming they were part of the group.

They wouldn't listen when they said they weren't part of the group (my dad's friend was crying at this point--they were trying to cuff them), and finally he ended up taking out his government ID to show that he was not a protester. Finally they let them go.

I also remember they also approached a group outside the stage door of The Boy From Oz to ask a group what they were protesting. They were waiting to get Hugh Jackman's autograph. That ended up on the radio, it was pretty funny.

In their defense, angry protest groups are really scary up close (even the ones you agree with) and can spiral out of control very fast. So it's not always a clear case of overzealous cops.

[Superman4ever]

I have seen associated press notes and the like. Its reported in St Paul...but not being picked up roughly anywhere else.

Amy Goodman of the Podcast "Democracy Now" was arrested for simply taking pictures and trying to get interviews.

oYjyvkR0bGQ

Why we were falsely arrested

AMY GOODMAN
SYNDICATED COLUMNIST

ST. PAUL, Minn. -- Government crackdowns on journalists are a true threat to democracy. As the Republican National Convention meets in St. Paul, Minn., this week, police are systematically targeting journalists. I was arrested with my two colleagues, Democracy Now! producers Sharif Abdel Kouddous and Nicole Salazar, while reporting on the first day of the RNC. I have been wrongly charged with a misdemeanor. My co-workers, who were simply reporting, may be charged with felony riot.

The Democratic and Republican national conventions have become very expensive and protracted acts of political theater, essentially four-day-long advertisements for the major presidential candidates. Outside the fences, they have become major gatherings for grass-roots movements -- for people to come, amidst the banners, bunting, flags and confetti, to express the rights enumerated in the Constitution's First Amendment: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press, or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

Behind all the patriotic hyperbole that accompanies the conventions, and the thousands of journalists and media workers who arrive to cover the staged events, there are serious violations of the basic right of freedom of the press. Here on the streets of St. Paul, the press is free to report on the official proceedings of the RNC, but not to report on the police violence and mass arrests directed at those who have come to petition their government, to protest.

It was Labor Day, and there was an anti-war march, with a huge turnout, with local families, students, veterans and people from around the country gathered to oppose the war. The protesters greatly outnumbered the Republican delegates.

There was a positive, festive feeling, coupled with a growing anxiety about the course that Hurricane Gustav was taking, and whether New Orleans would be devastated anew. Later in the day, there was a splinter march. The police -- clad in full body armor, with helmets, face shields, batons and canisters of pepper spray -- charged. They forced marchers, onlookers and working journalists into a nearby parking lot, then surrounded the people and began handcuffing them.

Nicole was videotaping. Her tape of her own violent arrest is chilling. Police in riot gear charged her, yelling, "Get down on your face." You hear her voice, clearly and repeatedly announcing "Press! Press! Where are we supposed to go?" She was trapped between parked cars. The camera drops to the pavement amidst Nicole's screams of pain. Her face was smashed into the pavement, and she was bleeding from the nose, with the heavy officer with a boot or knee on her back. Another officer was pulling on her leg. Sharif was thrown up against the wall and kicked in the chest, and he was bleeding from his arm.

I was at the Xcel Center on the convention floor, interviewing delegates. I had just made it to the Minnesota delegation when I got a call on my cell phone with news that Sharif and Nicole were being bloody arrested, in every sense. Filmmaker Rick Rowley of Big Noise Films and I raced on foot to the scene. Out of breath, we arrived at the parking lot. I went up to the line of riot police and asked to speak to a commanding officer, saying that they had arrested accredited journalists.

Within seconds, they grabbed me, pulled me behind the police line and forcibly twisted my arms behind my back and handcuffed me, the rigid plastic cuffs digging into my wrists. I saw Sharif, his arm bloody, his credentials hanging from his neck. I repeated we were accredited journalists, whereupon a Secret Service agent came over and ripped my convention credential from my neck. I was taken to the St. Paul police garage where cages were set up for protesters. I was charged with obstruction of a peace officer. Nicole and Sharif were taken to jail, facing riot charges.

The attack on and arrest of me and the Democracy Now! producers was not an isolated event. A video group called I-Witness Video was raided two days earlier. Another video documentary group, the Glass Bead Collective, was detained, with its computers and video cameras confiscated. On Wednesday, I-Witness Video was again raided, forced out of its office location. When I asked St. Paul Police Chief John Harrington how reporters are to operate in this atmosphere, he suggested, "By embedding reporters in our mobile field force."

On Monday night, hours after we were arrested, after much public outcry, Nicole, Sharif and I were released. That was our Labor Day. It's all in a day's work.

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/opinion/377611_amyonline04.html

[Hobgoblin]

I heard a woman from St Paul say the other night that there were somany cops around that it seemed like a police state. They were even in unusual places, like alleys. Take that as you will.

[bell110]

Sounds like Amy is an idiot.

[Addendum]

As are the police in this case

[Franklin Richards]

Sounds like Amy is an idiot.


What? Why?


:doom: :doom: :doom:

[Gilpesh]

What? Why?


:doom: :doom: :doom:

She thought the constitution still protected her rights. :hehe:

[bell110]

If she want to put herself in a middle of a riot, she shouldn't complain when she gets roughed up.

[Addendum]

What riot, it was a protest.

[MaskedManJRK]

What riot, it was a protest.

I guess at this point, any sign of dissent is considered a riot. :whatever:

[ManofmyWord]

Getting a weird vibe that reminds me of.....
http://tienda.leer-e.es/images/products/1984.jpg

[bell110]

The way the article reads, it sounds like a riot. Here are some excerpts.

"My co-workers, who were simply reporting, may be charged with felony riot."

"Later in the day, there was a splinter march. The police -- clad in full body armor, with helmets, face shields, batons and canisters of pepper spray -- charged. They forced marchers, onlookers and working journalists into a nearby parking lot, then surrounded the people and began handcuffing them."

"I was charged with obstruction of a peace officer. Nicole and Sharif were taken to jail, facing riot charges."

"When I asked St. Paul Police Chief John Harrington how reporters are to operate in this atmosphere, he suggested, "By embedding reporters in our mobile field force.""
There, now she know what to do next time so she isn't arrested. There is a difference between reporting a story and trying to be part of the story. Of course she doesn't call it a riot in her story because if she did, she'd lose her martyrism that she was going for.

[Addendum]

The way the article reads, it sounds like a riot. Here are some excerpts.

"My co-workers, who were simply reporting, may be charged with felony riot."

Being charged with something is similar to being accused of something. By itself, it is not proof. A month or so ago in New York, a cop arrested a bicyclist for "assaulting an officer" and "resisting arrest". The video showed that the "assault" happened when the officer stepped into the cyclist's path and clotheslined him. The "resisting arrest" part happened when the cyclist was falling off the bike.

"Later in the day, there was a splinter march. The police -- clad in full body armor, with helmets, face shields, batons and canisters of pepper spray -- charged. They forced marchers, onlookers and working journalists into a nearby parking lot, then surrounded the people and began handcuffing them."

Splinter march reads like a protest or march that isn't "authorized" or "doesn't follow procedure"

"I was charged with obstruction of a peace officer. Nicole and Sharif were taken to jail, facing riot charges."

Re my first point

"When I asked St. Paul Police Chief John Harrington how reporters are to operate in this atmosphere, he suggested, "By embedding reporters in our mobile field force.""
And only tell what the police approve

There, now she know what to do next time so she isn't arrested. There is a difference between reporting a story and trying to be part of the story. Of course she doesn't call it a riot in her story because if she did, she'd lose her martyrism that she was going for.
She was only part of the story because she went down to street level to report what was going on, and was arrested for asking questions, since the police in that instance were arresting everyone not in riot gear.

[fifthfiend]

The way the article reads, it sounds like a riot. Here are some excerpts.

"My co-workers, who were simply reporting, may be charged with felony riot."

"Later in the day, there was a splinter march. The police -- clad in full body armor, with helmets, face shields, batons and canisters of pepper spray -- charged. They forced marchers, onlookers and working journalists into a nearby parking lot, then surrounded the people and began handcuffing them."

"I was charged with obstruction of a peace officer. Nicole and Sharif were taken to jail, facing riot charges."

"When I asked St. Paul Police Chief John Harrington how reporters are to operate in this atmosphere, he suggested, "By embedding reporters in our mobile field force.""
There, now she know what to do next time so she isn't arrested. There is a difference between reporting a story and trying to be part of the story. Of course she doesn't call it a riot in her story because if she did, she'd lose her martyrism that she was going for.

So what you're actually saying is that the story reads nothing at all like there was an actual riot, but you've decided to pretend there was one because part of your fetish for the violent abuse of power is imagining that the victim did something to deserve it.

Thanks, glad we cleared that up.

[Addendum]

And before bell replies, I'm not one that says the police are always at fault. In this case, the police are for arresting people that were protesting or having the audacity to report on it.

There is such a thing as a free press

[bell110]

Being charged with something is similar to being accused of something. By itself, it is not proof. A month or so ago in New York, a cop arrested a bicyclist for "assaulting an officer" and "resisting arrest". The video showed that the "assault" happened when the officer stepped into the cyclist's path and clotheslined him. The "resisting arrest" part happened when the cyclist was falling off the bike.

I understand that there are SOME corrupt cops out there. But, MOST are just trying to do their job. Most cops are not going to go around and charge someone for no reason.

Splinter march reads like a protest or march that isn't "authorized" or "doesn't follow procedure"

That's how it reads to you. It reads to me that a group of people decided they didn't want to be part of a peaceful protest and went out to start trouble. The police saw this and responded. These reporters, I guess, thought that the riot, and subsequent police action, would make a better story, so they got involved.

Re my first point


And only tell what the police approve

No, they do that so they know who is a threat and who isn't.

She was only part of the story because she went down to street level to report what was going on, and was arrested for asking questions, since the police in that instance were arresting everyone not in riot gear.

Just because you have a press badge on doesn't mean you are above the law. When a riot breaks out, it's the police's job to restore order and protect innocent people and property. The police are usually out numbered in a situation like that, so they have to act harshly in order to keep things from escalating. The don't have time to be answering questions from the press, and if they tell you to do something, you do it or, hence, you'll be arrested for "obstructing a peace officer". The courts will decide if her first amendment rights were violated.

I read the comments section from that story, and it's sadly ironic how many people wrote about "opening your eyes" and "don't believe what the mainstream media tells you" yet when highly bias acticles like this appear, it's more "proof" that we're turning into a police state.

Look, some peoples idea of "protesting" is really just going out and causing trouble. I've seen too many incidents in the media, ie "don't tase me, bro" boy, and in real life where people instigate the police then cry corruption when they get arrested. This lady just practices irresponsible journalism.

[Addendum]

The police are the ones saying it's a riot. Nowhere else in the article does it mention it being a riot. There have been no articles describing riots last week during the RNC, nor the week prior during the DNC in Denver.

You say the press isn't above the law. I agree. Neither are the police.

[bell110]

So what you're actually saying is that the story reads nothing at all like there was an actual riot, but you've decided to pretend there was one because part of your fetish for the violent abuse of power is imagining that the victim did something to deserve it.

Thanks, glad we cleared that up.

So what you're saying is that everybody that gets in trouble with the law who say they "didn't do anything" should be taken at face value, assume that it's our corrupt police and justice system fault, and let everybody out of jail?

[bell110]

The police are the ones saying it's a riot. Nowhere else in the article does it mention it being a riot. There have been no articles describing riots last week during the RNC, nor the week prior during the DNC in Denver.

You say the press isn't above the law. I agree. Neither are the police.

Of course the article doesn't say it's a riot. That would ruin the martryism that she is going for. There are two sides to every story, this is hers.

I agree, I haven't seen any stories about riots at the RNC, but I also haven't seen any stories about innocent protesters being locked up either. Just this one, lone article. It's a bit of a stretch to call this article proof that we are turning into a police state. Not saying anybody here said that, but the comments from the original link, people were saying that.

Personally, I think this was a potential riot that got squashed before it turned into something big, which is what the police are supposed to do. Sadly for the cops, its damned if you do, damned if you don't. If they do something "too soon" they're violating people's rights. If they do something "too late" they didn't do enough to ensure people's safety.

Since none of us where there, we all are just speculating. It will be up to the courts to say whether her rights were violated. Hell, she could have made this whole thing up.

[Addendum]

http://www.philly.com/dailynews/local/20080903_For_journalists___photogs__it_s_a_rough_c onvention.html

[bell110]

That article seems to reenforce my point.

[Addendum]

Ripping off press credentials, spraying journalists with pepper spray, arresting journalists for taking pictures or asking questions doesn't make the police look good.

Instead of rushing to the police's defense every single time, take it case by case.

[Franklin Richards]

What's up with the House Invasions? I don't have anything concrete off hand, just heard alot about them. Is this true?


:doom: :doom: :doom:

[Addendum]

http://www.minnesotaindependent.com/6158/breaking-food-not-bombs-house-among-saturday-raids

Perhaps the police misplaced the phone book? :hehe:

[jaguarr]

This kind of blatant misuse of power on the press is absolutely unacceptable. Controlling angry protesters is one thing, and there are some things I'm reading that indicate even that went too far at the hands of law enforcement, but targeting the press in this fashion is absolutely unacceptable. Sadly, I was not surprised to read about this kind of thing happening in relation to the RNC. The RNC has become increasingly about jack-booted thugism and this just reinforces that viewpoint for me.

jag

[bell110]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYjyvkR0bGQ

AHAHAHAHA!!!! Look at those FACIST cops asking POLITELY for her to move along and WARNING her that she will be arrested. Did you see the way that cop totally OWNED the camera man and let him keep filming? That reminds me SO MUCH of Nazi Germany, China, and the USSR.

The whole thing is a ****ing joke.

[Addendum]

Hmm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=THMVJQUGJLM

I wonder whom you're talking to bell, since no one in this thread called the police fascist. No one in this thread mentioned the nazis, the chinese or the soviets, except for you.

Perhaps you should respond to those who have done so in the comments section of the links offered. Then it would seem that you are actually addressing such criticism instead of responding to people that exist only in your mind.

[bell110]

Ripping off press credentials, spraying journalists with pepper spray, arresting journalists for taking pictures or asking questions doesn't make the police look good.

Instead of rushing to the police's defense every single time, take it case by case.

Go to that philly.com link again. Look at the picture they have that goes along with the story. See those people back there taking pictures and not being arrested? Sort of disproves the whole "police arresting journalist for only taking pictures" theory.

I do take things case by case. And in this case, I see no evidence of police wrong doing. Plus, somebody has to be the voice of reason. There were THOUSANDS of protesters and HUNDREDS of reporters. If there's a huge conspiracy to squash protesters and silence reporters, how come they ALL weren't arrested? So there must be another reason that these people were.

Just like I shouldn't rush to the police defence every time, other people shouldn't be so quick to yell about police brutality every time the police do something they don't like.

You have to admit that some people go to protests to start trouble. A lot of people hate the Republicans so much that they are willing to break the law to protest them. Just because you have a press pass, doesn't mean you can do anything you want.

[Addendum]

Who mentioned police brutality?

What I and others in this thread have done is be critical of the police in this case.

[bell110]

Hmm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=THMVJQUGJLM

I wonder whom you're talking to bell, since no one in this thread called the police fascist. No one in this thread mentioned the nazis, the chinese or the soviets, except for you.

Perhaps you should respond to those who have done so in the comments section of the links offered. Then it would seem that you are actually addressing such criticism instead of responding to people that exist only in your mind.

You are right, nobody here said that. I was merely joking in an exaggerated manner to satirize the overreaction I think people are making of this story. I'll try and be less sarcastic.

[bell110]

Who mentioned police brutality?

What I and others in this thread have done is be critical of the police in this case.

Fine, police "aggression".

And you totally ignored my other points.

[Addendum]

Yes, there are some people that want to start trouble. If someone seriously thinks otherwise then they're deluding themselves.

There's no proof that everyone was starting trouble. It may have been a few, it may have been half, but it certainly wasn't all.

Like I said earlier, I agree that being a member of the press doesn't make anyone above the law. The same equally applies to those who wear the badge.

[jaguarr]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYjyvkR0bGQ

AHAHAHAHA!!!! Look at those FACIST cops asking POLITELY for her to move along and WARNING her that she will be arrested. Did you see the way that cop totally OWNED the camera man and let him keep filming? That reminds me SO MUCH of Nazi Germany, China, and the USSR.

The whole thing is a ****ing joke.

And this proves your point, how? It shows Amy Goodman....a JOURNALIST with legitimate press credentials....being wrongfully arrested. Those officers are on videotape violating her constitutional rights. Yay. :dry:

jag

[kainedamo]

Former FBI Agent and ACLU Counsel: St. Paul Police Behavior Is ‘Frightening’

http://firedoglake.com/2008/09/03/aclu-counsel-st-paul-police-behavior-is-frightening/

[fifthfiend]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYjyvkR0bGQ

AHAHAHAHA!!!! Look at those FACIST cops asking POLITELY for her to move along and WARNING her that she will be arrested. Did you see the way that cop totally OWNED the camera man and let him keep filming? That reminds me SO MUCH of Nazi Germany, China, and the USSR.

The whole thing is a ****ing joke.

Per my earlier post; the video clearly depicts a woman doing nothing more than attempting to speak to the police officers, for the crime of which they forcibly accost her and take her into custody. Now naturally a person like bell quite enjoys watching this sort of thing, but since he can't admit that to himself, he just pretends the video depicts something entirely different from what it in fact plainly shows.

[Cosmic]

I grew up in St. Paul. I love the city, but the cops there are reckless, rude and racist. Not all of them, of course, but these reports don't surprise me at all. And the cops in Minneapolis are true stormtroopers...they make the SPPD look like boy scouts. If you ever need help from the cops in Minnesota, and you're black, latino, native, or asian, then do yourself a big favor and ask one of your white friends or neighbors to make the call. I hate to say it, but that's how it is.

[bell110]

Yes, there are some people that want to start trouble. If someone seriously thinks otherwise then they're deluding themselves.

There's no proof that everyone was starting trouble. It may have been a few, it may have been half, but it certainly wasn't all.

Like I said earlier, I agree that being a member of the press doesn't make anyone above the law. The same equally applies to those who wear the badge.

Who said anything about "all"?

Yes, the police aren't above the law.

If you want to be critical, be critical of both sides, not just of the police.

And this proves your point, how? It shows Amy Goodman....a JOURNALIST with legitimate press credentials....being wrongfully arrested. Those officers are on videotape violating her constitutional rights. Yay. :dry:

jag

It proves my point that she's an idiot for getting herself arrested. She wasn't wrongfully arrested. She tried to push herself through the police line. The cops told her that she will be arrested. She kept it up. She got arrested.

Per my earlier post; the video clearly depicts a woman doing nothing more than attempting to speak to the police officers, for the crime of which they forcibly accost her and take her into custody.

Wrong.

Now naturally a person like bell quite enjoys watching this sort of thing, but since he can't admit that to himself, he just pretends the video depicts something entirely different from what it in fact plainly shows.

I don't pretend anything. That video is totally funny. I do enjoy idiots getting themselves in trouble. But, what the video "plainly" shows to you, is not the same as what it "plainly" shows to me.

I grew up in St. Paul. I love the city, but the cops there are reckless, rude and racist. Not all of them, of course, but these reports don't surprise me at all. And the cops in Minneapolis are true stormtroopers...they make the SPPD look like boy scouts. If you ever need help from the cops in Minnesota, and you're black, latino, native, or asian, then do yourself a big favor and ask one of your white friends or neighbors to make the call. I hate to say it, but that's how it is.

Well, I've never been to St. Paul, but like I said, most of the time when I hear people complain about the cops, it's just an "anti-cop" bias, so like in the case with this woman, I have to side with "common sense".

[kainedamo]

It proves my point that she's an idiot for getting herself arrested. She wasn't wrongfully arrested. She tried to push herself through the police line. The cops told her that she will be arrested. She kept it up. She got arrested.

What is your definition of "pushing through"?

If it is "standing there and trying to talk to the police officer then being grabbed" then you are correct. Otherwise, you're nuts.