Alex Rodriguez tested positive for steroids in 2003

[FlawlessVictory]

Sources tell SI Alex Rodriguez tested positive for steroids in 2003

By Selena Roberts and David Epstein

In 2003, when he won the American League home run title and the AL Most Valuable Player award as a shortstop for the Texas Rangers, Alex Rodriguez tested positive for two anabolic steroids, four sources have independently told Sports Illustrated.

Rodriguez's name appears on a list of 104 players who tested positive for performance-enhancing drugs in Major League Baseball's '03 survey testing, SI's sources say. As part of a joint agreement with the MLB Players Association, the testing was conducted to determine if it was necessary to impose mandatory random drug testing across the major leagues in 2004.

When approached by an SI reporter on Thursday at a gym in Miami, Rodriguez declined to discuss his 2003 test results. "You'll have to talk to the union," said Rodriguez, the Yankees' third baseman since his trade to New York in February 2004. When asked if there was an explanation for his positive test, he said, "I'm not saying anything."

Phone messages left by SI for players' union executive director Donald Fehr were not returned.

Though MLB's drug policy has expressly prohibited the use of steroids without a valid prescription since 1991, there were no penalties for a positive test in 2003. The results of that year's survey testing of 1,198 players were meant to be anonymous under the agreement between the commissioner's office and the players association. Rodriguez's testing information was found, however, after federal agents, armed with search warrants, seized the '03 test results from Comprehensive Drug Testing, Inc., of Long Beach, Calif., one of two labs used by MLB in connection with that year's survey testing. The seizure took place in April 2004 as part of the government's investigation into 10 major league players linked to the BALCO scandal -- though Rodriguez himself has never been connected to BALCO.

The list of the 104 players whose urine samples tested positive is under seal in California. However, two sources familiar with the evidence that the government has gathered in its investigation of steroid use in baseball and two other sources with knowledge of the testing results have told Sports Illustrated that Rodriguez is one of the 104 players identified as having tested positive, in his case for testosterone and an anabolic steroid known by the brand name Primobolan. All four sources spoke on the condition of anonymity due to the sensitive nature of the evidence.

Primobolan, which is also known by the chemical name methenolone, is an injected or orally administered drug that is more expensive than most steroids. (A 12-week cycle can cost $500.) It improves strength and maintains lean muscle with minimal bulk development, according to steroid experts, and has relatively few side effects. Kirk Radomski, the former New York Mets clubhouse employee who in 2007 pleaded guilty to illegal distribution of steroids to numerous major league players, described in his recent book, Bases Loaded: The Inside Story of the Steroid Era in Baseball by the Central Figure in the Mitchell Report, how players increasingly turned to drugs such as Primobolan in 2003, in part to avoid detection in testing. Primobolan is detectable for a shorter period of time than the steroid previously favored by players, Deca-Durabolin. According to a search of FDA records, Primobolan is not an approved prescription drug in the United States, nor was it in 2003. (Testosterone can be taken legally with an appropriate medical prescription.)

Rodriguez finished the 2003 season by winning his third straight league home run title (with 47) and the first of his three MVP awards.

Because more than 5% of big leaguers had tested positive in 2003, baseball instituted a mandatory random-testing program, with penalties, in '04. According to the 2007 Mitchell Report on steroid use in baseball, in September 2004, Gene Orza, the chief operating officer of the players' union, violated an agreement with MLB by tipping off a player (not named in the report) about an upcoming, supposedly unannounced drug test. Three major league players who spoke to SI said that Rodriguez was also tipped by Orza in early September 2004 that he would be tested later that month. Rodriguez declined to respond on Thursday when asked about the warning Orza provided him.

When Orza was asked on Friday in the union's New York City office about the tipping allegations, he told a reporter, "I'm not interested in discussing this information with you."

Anticipating that the 33-year-old Rodriguez, who has 553 career home runs, could become the game's alltime home run king, the Yankees signed him in November 2007 to a 10-year, incentive-laden deal that could be worth as much as $305 million. Rodriguez is reportedly guaranteed $275 million and could receive a $6 million bonus each time he ties one of the four players at the top of the list: Willie Mays (660), Babe Ruth (714), Hank Aaron (755) and Barry Bonds (762), and an additional $6 million for passing Bonds. In order to receive the incentive money, the contract reportedly requires Rodriguez to make extra promotional appearances and sign memorabilia for the Yankees as part of a marketing plan surrounding his pursuit of Bonds's record. Two sources familiar with Rodriguez's contract told SI that there is no language about steroids in the contract that would put Rodriguez at risk of losing money.

Arguments before an 11-judge panel in the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit in Pasadena are ongoing between government prosecutors and the players' association over the government's seizure of the test results from the Long Beach lab. The agents who collected the material had a search warrant only for the results for the 10 BALCO-linked players. Attorneys from the union argue that the government is entitled only to the results for those players, not the entire list. If the court sides with the union, federal authorities may be barred from using the positive survey test results of non-BALCO players such as Rodriguez in their ongoing investigations.http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/baseball/mlb/02/07/alex-rodriguez-steroids/index.html?eref=T1

[Kurosawa]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/baseball/mlb/02/07/alex-rodriguez-steroids/index.html?eref=T1

As always, just like the in the (Red Sox board member) Mitchell report, no Boston players mentioned.

I'm to the point that I just flat-out hate baseball, sports and athletes in general. The world is ****.

[FlawlessVictory]

Its hard to not be skeptical now when a player hits more than 30 home runs in a season. It's almost at that point. Pujols? Howard? Who knows. What am I supposed to think anymore.

It is interesting that no Boston players have surfaced yet, but that doesn't change the fact that these other players mentioned are guilty. I guess they have managed to not get caught.

Disappointing because we all know Bonds' all-time HR record is tainted but at least there was hope that A-Rod would break it and have it be legit. Well, that's out the window now.

[Poetic Chaos]

Why would I wanna watch an athlete give 100% when I could watch them give 110%?

[The Incredible Hulk]

wow. if true, that's HUGE. I know A-Rod is kind of a tool and all but he's by far the greatest all around player of this generation. To have something like this hung on him would be a HUGE blow for MLB.

[The Chris]

My father's question is, how the hell did this get leaked? The Gov had all kinds of names and now this is leaked. He's wondering what else can get leaked from them. All around I'm very disappointed in this news. In Alex, the gov, everybody.

[souloffire]

Hank Aaron is still the all-time home run king.

[Excel]

Cant wait to see all the "A-roid" signs when he comes to Fenway this year.

[ih8nyy]

As always, just like the in the (Red Sox board member) Mitchell report, no Boston players mentioned.

I'm to the point that I just flat-out hate baseball, sports and athletes in general. The world is ****.

:whatever:

[StorminNorman]

When it comes to steroids I really don't give a damn.

I also hate the idea of changing records and putting asterisks and all that.

[Kurosawa]

:whatever:

Maybe I'm overreacting, good chance I am. It does make me sick that the media never goes after Boston players, but I'm just as disgusted at Alex. But I'm not surprised.

[BlackLantern]

anything Rodriguez does from this point forward is insignificant.....

[Spidey-Bat]

As always, just like the in the (Red Sox board member) Mitchell report, no Boston players mentioned.

I'm to the point that I just flat-out hate baseball, sports and athletes in general. The world is ****.

Manny Alexander, José Canseco, Paxton Crawford, Roger Clemens, Chris Donnels, Jeremy Giambi, Mike Lansing, Josias Manzanillo, Kent Mercker, Mike Stanton, Mo Vaughn, Steve Woodard were all Red Sox players named on the Mitchell Report. But I guess since it was no one big it doesn't matter.

This isn't about the Red Sox anyway.

[BlackLantern]

Manny Alexander, José Canseco, Paxton Crawford, Roger Clemens, Chris Donnels, Jeremy Giambi, Mike Lansing, Josias Manzanillo, Kent Mercker, Mike Stanton, Mo Vaughn, Steve Woodard were all Red Sox players named on the Mitchell Report. But I guess since it was no one big it doesn't matter.

Oh snap....someone just got BOST-OWNED!!!


sorry...couldn't resist

[Excel]

Manny Alexander, José Canseco, Paxton Crawford, Roger Clemens, Chris Donnels, Jeremy Giambi, Mike Lansing, Josias Manzanillo, Kent Mercker, Mike Stanton, Mo Vaughn, Steve Woodard were all Red Sox players named on the Mitchell Report. But I guess since it was no one big it doesn't matter.

This isn't about the Red Sox anyway.

Its stuff like this that makes me wonder ho much help roids really give somebody. Outside of Clemens and a few good seasons for Vaughn and Canseco, those guys sucked.

[redfirebird2008]

Hank Aaron is still the all-time home run king.

Indeed.

[Poetic Chaos]

when it comes to steroids i really don't give a damn.

I also hate the idea of changing records and putting asterisks and all that.

qft

[BlackLantern]

so for those of you who don't care about steroids...how would you feel if you walked into your 13 or 14 year olds room and saw him or her shooting up steroids so he or she could get size for football or some other sport he or she wanted to play??

[Poetic Chaos]

so for those of you who don't care about steroids...how would you feel if you walked into your 13 or 14 year olds room and saw him or her shooting up steroids so he or she could get size for football or some other sport he or she wanted to play??

Okay Mrs. Lovejoy. Let me think of the children in all of this.

[StorminNorman]

so for those of you who don't care about steroids...how would you feel if you walked into your 13 or 14 year olds room and saw him or her shooting up steroids so he or she could get size for football or some other sport he or she wanted to play??

I would introduce that son or daughter into a whole new world of discipline and then look at my performance as a parent.

[BlackLantern]

It's a trickle down effect....athletes take steroids and other performance enhancers to get better, it affects the level of play....college athletes see that the pros are getting bigger, faster, stronger and take steps to be able to compete at that level....HS kids see how bigger and faster the college game is....so on and so forth

[vindrow]

anything Rodriguez does from this point forward is insignificant.....


Actually, I would say anything he did from 2003 onward is insignificant.

[Kurosawa]

Manny Alexander, José Canseco, Paxton Crawford, Roger Clemens, Chris Donnels, Jeremy Giambi, Mike Lansing, Josias Manzanillo, Kent Mercker, Mike Stanton, Mo Vaughn, Steve Woodard were all Red Sox players named on the Mitchell Report. But I guess since it was no one big it doesn't matter.

This isn't about the Red Sox anyway.

The Pro-Boston Yankee hating media like NESPN completely represented the Mitchell report as "Former YANKEE (not Red Sox) Roger Clemens did steroids".

If there was a legit current Boston player on it, it wouldn't have seemed as biased.

The truth is, most pro athletes are filth as human beings anyway. They are coddled from the time they are teenagers, are generally idiots, and have no sense of decency or responsibility. Roid use is just the tip of what they get away with, including murder.

**** sports. I'm through with them.

[Spidey-Bat]

The Pro-Boston Yankee hating media like NESPN completely represented the Mitchell report as "Former YANKEE (not Red Sox) Roger Clemens did steroids".
Might have something to do with the fact that he hasn't been on the Red Sox for 11 years and was on the Yankees the season immediately before the Mitchell Report came out. But you're right, it's a conspiracy theory against the Yankees.

If there was a legit current Boston player on it, it wouldn't have seemed as biased.
What do you mean by "legit"? Anyway, Brendan Donnelly was on the Red Sox in 2007 and was busted for steroids in the Mithcell Report.

The Mitchell Report didn't get every single steroid user.

[BlackLantern]

Those working in MLB were extremely uncooperative with the Mitchell investigation....out of close to 500 personnel (players, coaches, support staff) only 87 were willing to work with the investigation....

[Spidey-Bat]

IIRC, Frank Thomas was the only player willing to talk to the investigators.

[Dr. Evil]

And he did this while playing for Texas.

Him, Juan Gonzalez, Ivan Rodriguez, Ruben Sierra, Rafael Palmeiro.

[TMC1982]

Cant wait to see all the "A-roid" signs when he comes to Fenway this year.

Yeah, there's going to be a time in which the idea of having an affair with Madonna would be considered the "good ole days".:grin:

[cyborg ninja 14]

Yeah, there's going to be a time in which the idea of having an affair with Madonna would be considered the "good ole days".:grin:

I dunno, I never gave a damn about his personal life. Athletes cheat on their wives. Whatever.

[NewYorkSpider]

I've been reading around the internet about this, and a lot of people think David Ortiz is on that list. Another that wouldn't surprise me is Andrew Jones.

[FaT_tONle]

I find it hard to believe these guys won't get into the HOF despite this... now that appears almost everyone was doing it. I mean maybe not those second tier guys like Maguire and Sosa and Palmeiro... but A-Rod, Clemens, Barroid.

[Excel]

Yeah, there's going to be a time in which the idea of having an affair with Madonna would be considered the "good ole days".:grin:

Thank god we didnt him for Manny in 2003 :hehe:

[Spidey-Bat]

I find it hard to believe these guys won't get into the HOF despite this... now that appears almost everyone was doing it. I mean maybe not those second tier guys like Maguire and Sosa and Palmeiro... but A-Rod, Clemens, Barroid.

I don't think Bonds and Clemens will get in. With A-Rod, who knows. This report wasn't supposed to be leaked so that might factor into it.

[Addendum]

so for those of you who don't care about steroids...how would you feel if you walked into your 13 or 14 year olds room and saw him or her shooting up steroids so he or she could get size for football or some other sport he or she wanted to play??

I don't have a kid.

But if I saw this happen, I'd laugh at them, give him one of his mother's bras for when he gets ***** tits or give her one of my razors and shaving cream for when she gets facial hair, and tell the coach that they should perform drug tests for their players and prospective players including testing for steroid usage.

I would also let them know that as long they do drugs, that they are no longer allowed to live under our roof, and send an ad to the paper that we have a room for rent, and I would start to move their stuff to the curb.

[ih8nyy]

Bottom line is Steroids saved baseball after the last strike. HR's exploded and fans came back. We are suckers for not thinking something was wrong then and hypocrites for complaining now.

[ih8nyy]

Let me clear up one thing. I don't think steroids have any place in any sport. But it was right there for every to see. And we didn't complain then.

[fu manchu]

I am so tired of hearing about steroids. :whatever:

[ih8nyy]

Agreed. Clean it up and move on.

[Soundwave]

Exactly. I am completely burned out on steroids now. I'm more concerned with the fact that someone within the federal government leaked this info to the press and only leaked A-Rod's name when there were 103 other players on that list. Sounds like someone had an agenda here. That drug testing was supposed to be confidential and wiped out. I understand what A-Rod did was wrong, but there's a part of me who feels his rights to privacy have been violated and now his image is tarnished forever.

[BlackLantern]

Exactly. I am completely burned out on steroids now. I'm more concerned with the fact that someone within the federal government leaked this info to the press and only leaked A-Rod's name when there were 103 other players on that list. Sounds like someone had an agenda here. That drug testing was supposed to be confidential and wiped out. I understand what A-Rod did was wrong, but there's a part of me who feels his rights to privacy have been violated and now his image is tarnished forever.

then he shouldn't have done what he did....I have no sympathy and hopefully no one else does either

[Spidey-Bat]

Exactly. I am completely burned out on steroids now. I'm more concerned with the fact that someone within the federal government leaked this info to the press and only leaked A-Rod's name when there were 103 other players on that list. Sounds like someone had an agenda here. That drug testing was supposed to be confidential and wiped out. I understand what A-Rod did was wrong, but there's a part of me who feels his rights to privacy have been violated and now his image is tarnished forever.

If you're going to leak 1 name, why wouldn't you leak the biggest one?

[Soundwave]

If you're going to leak 1 name, why wouldn't you leak the biggest one?

As far as I'm concerned, people who leak this kind of confidential information are no better than the guys who did the steroids themselves and that person needs to be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

[BlackLantern]

....and the truth shall set you free.....nice move getting Peter Gammons to do the interview

[Raiden]

A-Rod admits using performance-enhancing drugs (http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/9200338/A-Rod-admits-using-performance-enhancing-drugs)

NEW YORK (AP) - Alex Rodriguez admitted Monday that he used performance-enhancing drugs from 2001-03 when he played for the Texas Rangers.

[ih8nyy]

....and the truth shall set you free.....nice move getting Peter Gammons to do the interview

A-Rod admits using performance-enhancing drugs (http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/9200338/A-Rod-admits-using-performance-enhancing-drugs)

No matter what this guy is just gonna get abused at every stadium he goes too. I didn't think it could get any worse for him on the road, but it just did.

[NewYorkSpider]

Like I've said before, I didn't care for A-Rod before this and I still don't, but you have to respect him for coming out with the truth. He isn't going to go through what Bond and Clemens did. IMO, I think this helps get him into the HoF unlike what McGwire has gone through.

[Spidey-Bat]

He's only admitting it because he got outed.

[BlackLantern]

The best he can hope for is a WS ring because the Hall is out

[NewYorkSpider]

Does anyone else want to know the names of the other 103 players? I mean that's about 3 players per team. I'll always question a milestone or a record being broken if the names aren't brought out into the open. On the other hand, I hope they aren't leaked because of the damage it could do to baseball. What's everyone elses thoughts on this?

[BlackLantern]

I do....get em all out....there is no getting past this unless all the cards are out on the table

[Spidey-Bat]

As far as I'm concerned, people who leak this kind of confidential information are no better than the guys who did the steroids themselves and that person needs to be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

That's a waste of time and resources. There are more important things than prosecuting a guy who leaked 1 name from a report that had no repercussions on those who failed the test.

[Soundwave]

It can't be as big a waste of time and money as prosecuting 1 guy because you think he lied under oath about knowingly using steriods.

[Soundwave]

I do....get em all out....there is no getting past this unless all the cards are out on the table

None of the names should be released. These guys have a right to their privacy. They took the test under the impression that it was supposed to be anonymous and confidential.

[Spidey-Bat]

It can't be as big a waste of time and money as prosecuting 1 guy because you think he lied under oath about knowingly using steriods.

Who are you referring to?

[Soundwave]

Who are you referring to?

Barry Bonds

[Spidey-Bat]

He did commit perjury and obstruction of justice during a criminal investigation of BALCO. It's not like they're charging him with perjury b/c he lied in the congressional hearings like Palmeiro and Sosa.

[The Incredible Hulk]

^ to a grand jury no less. That's a felony.

[BlackLantern]

None of the names should be released. These guys have a right to their privacy. They took the test under the impression that it was supposed to be anonymous and confidential.

Tough ****....the minute you willingly step in front of a camera, whatever right to privacy you think you have has gone out the window....

[Excel]

Do they have tested from Sosa? He wasnt in the Mitchell report.

[Team Andino]

When I was watching Alex's interview yesterday I was annoyed with how he said he wanted to start helping kids and doing good things for them. I guess the only way for him to do something good for others is to F*** up so bad that you'll do anything to try an clean up your image.

[Excel]

I do believe A-rods always been active charity wise. Least he used to be.

[Team Andino]

I do believe A-rods always been active charity wise. Least he used to be.
I think I remember seeing something but its been so long since I stayed in touch with Baseball 24/7 but I really am annoyed that he says hes gonna do stuff for kids whens in the spotlight for the wrong reasons

[Addendum]

He did commit perjury and obstruction of justice during a criminal investigation of BALCO. It's not like they're charging him with perjury b/c he lied in the congressional hearings like Palmeiro and Sosa.

Technically, Palmiero didn't lie. The hearings were in March of '05, and the positive result on a drug test was in August.

[Spidey-Bat]

He definitely took steroids before then.

[Addendum]

And aside from Canseco's book where he claims to have injected Palmiero, where is the proof?

[Spidey-Bat]

40-year-old men do not start taking steroids 5 months after they testified in front of Congress.

[Addendum]

So you don't have proof, just an accusation from Canseco.

Weak.

[Spidey-Bat]

Do you really think a 40-year-old man would start taking steroids 5 months after he testified in front of Congress? Besides, look at his statistics. His best year was in 1999 at the age of 35. It was in Texas which has had a lot of juicers.

[Addendum]

Oh I'm sure you thought Palmeiro was taking 'roids long before Canseco wrote his book

[Spidey-Bat]

Do I think Palmeiro was taking steroids before 2005? Yes.

[BlackLantern]

same here and bash Canseco all you want but most of what he has said has panned out....to the letter....

[Excel]

Canseco has proven to be extremely knowledgeable. Everything said has come true.

[Addendum]

same here and bash Canseco all you want but most of what he has said has panned out....to the letter....

And where have I bashed Canseco? All I've done is express my skepticism and rejection of allegations as evidence of guilt.

[Soundwave]

Tough ****....the minute you willingly step in front of a camera, whatever right to privacy you think you have has gone out the window....

So you're not okay with players using illegal means(steroids) to advance their careers but you are okay with reporters and federal agents using illegal methods to advance theirs? The woman who broke this story got her info illegally. Those test results were not supposed to be leaked and it could have been someone in the government who leaked it. Are you really okay with anyone's confidential health info being made public knowledge?

[Spidey-Bat]

Getting this kind of info is neither hazardous to your health nor anything new. Journalists have been doing it forever. The union was supposed to have destroyed these test results anyway.

[Addendum]

It's still illegal and hurts her credibility

[Soundwave]

same here and bash Canseco all you want but most of what he has said has panned out....to the letter....


True.

[redfirebird2008]

Anyone see Letterman's Top 10 Messages on A-Rod's Answering Machine? Here it is:

10. "Hey, it's Mark McGwire. Want to get together this week and not talk about the past?"

9. "Joe Torre here -- thanks for helping book sales."

8. "Could you find a steroid that keeps you from choking in the playoffs?"

7. "Are you worried this will taint all the championships you didn't win?"

6. "It's Bernie Madoff. Nice try but I'm still the most hated man in New York."

5. "Michael Phelps here. Got any snacks?"

4. "This is Sammy Sosa. Just pretend you don't speak English."

3. "Michael Phelps again. Did I call you or did you call me?"

2. "Hey, it's Rod Blagojevich -- I'll say you're innocent, if you say I am."

1. "It's Madonna. You got a phone number for Jeter?"


I think it's one of the best Top 10 lists they've ever done on the Letterman show. Absolutely hilarious.

[Excel]

8. "Could you find a steroid that keeps you from choking in the playoffs?"

7. "Are you worried this will taint all the championships you didn't win?"

:shock :lmao: :lmao:

Oh my god. That is absolutley hysterical. :applaud

[NewYorkSpider]

They're all funny. The Michael Phelps ones had me....:lmao:

[ih8nyy]

An excerpt from the upcoming SI Article on A-Rod.

IN A parking lot space halfway between the University of Miami's baseball complex and its athletic center sits a hulking sign of his presence: a black Maybach, the QM2 of luxury liner cars, with a silver license plate frame that has ALEX RODRIGUEZ engraved across the bottom. It's freezing by Miami standards, about 39°, making an indoor workout far preferable to fielding short hops in the icy dew of a practice field. An SI reporter walks into a sprawling but nearly empty weight room that smells of rubber mats, shows a business card and asks if Alex Rodriguez is around. "In the back," says a man in a Hurricanes jacket.

Rodriguez is dressed in a white T-shirt and sweatpants, working out with a trainer and a friend as music pounds in the background. He is not pleased to see the reporter—whom he recognizes—in a place he views as his sanctuary. "You're not supposed to be here," he says more than once. When told there are a couple of important questions that need to be asked, Rodriguez, the Yankees' All-Star third baseman, rests his arm on a parallel bar used for triceps dips and leans in to listen with a bored sigh, as if he's expecting yet another question about Joe Torre or Madonna or Derek Jeter.

Rodriguez is asked about a drug test he took in 2003 (his final year with the Rangers), which SI's sources said came up positive for two anabolic steroids—testosterone and methenolone, also known by the brand name Primobolan. Rodriguez's green eyes widen, and he looks away. He processes the question and says, "You'll have to talk to the union," as he begins to fiddle with a plate. He is asked if the positive result could be a mistake, if maybe he took a tainted supplement, if the information is wrong. He says nothing. Is there any explanation, anything further he wants to say? "I'm not saying anything," he replies and turns toward a barbell.

One more question comes his way: Three major league players told SI that Gene Orza, the chief operating officer of the Major League Baseball Players Association, tipped Rodriguez about an upcoming drug test in early September 2004. Rodriguez is asked if that is true, but he does not respond. He looks at the trainer and orders him to "get someone. [The reporter] is not supposed to be in here."

(entire article here) http://vault.sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1151759/1/index.htm


source sports illustrated dot com

[BlackLantern]

Getting this kind of info is neither hazardous to your health nor anything new. Journalists have been doing it forever. The union was supposed to have destroyed these test results anyway.

Woodward and Bernstein bent the rules a bit and they exposed one of this country largest political scandals.....

[ih8nyy]

Woodward and Bernstein bent the rules a bit and they exposed one of this country largest political scandals.....

I was reading the other day that they both turned up dead.

Oh wait.

Never mind that was thenewfrontiersmen.net.

[Spidey-Bat]

Woodward and Bernstein bent the rules a bit and they exposed one of this country largest political scandals.....

And yet people want to put a journalist on trial for leaking 1 name from test results that had no consequences on those who failed it. The only thing it's done is tarnish their image. If they cared about their image, they wouldn't have taken steroids to begin with.

[ChrisBaleBatman]

Eh, I dunno about that.

When everyone else is doing it....and you're conditioned into constantly upping your game, I don't see the "blatant disregard for your image" some point to.

Besides, nobody could have predicted how demonized the juice would become from then to now. It simply became the "Witch" accusation that doesn't really leave any wiggle room for people to understand, much less debate.

[ChrisBaleBatman]

That's a waste of time and resources. There are more important things than prosecuting a guy who leaked 1 name from a report that had no repercussions on those who failed the test.


And there are more important things to do than prosecute a guy for steroids.

But, since they're all in the same boat....I honestly thing they should kill two birds with one stone.

[BlackLantern]

Ive know since I was 9 and started playing little league that steroids are bad....

[ChrisBaleBatman]

Things aren't exactly as black and white simple as when we were kids.

And getting pressure from all angles matters. I know it doesn't matter to anyone here, but it matters to the players under the heat.

And again, when everyone else is doing it....and you can't snitch on everyone (because ever since I was 8 and started playing little league, I too knew that snitching was considered bad too) then that player is in quite a nice spot to **** up.

When everyone is performing at a crazy level, I'm sure others would like to keep up.

Which is the problem I think alot of people are forgetting. It's not like it was only a few players doing it for recreation or something. It was tons of players. Tons.

If you watch the interview with A-Rod, I thought it was clear that he knew a number of other players involved. There were times where he took seconds to think before he spurted anything out.

[BlackLantern]

Exactly...this kind of thing trickles down....everyone wants to be competitive for the next level and the last thing we need is 13 and 14 year old shooting up to get size for HS football....

[Addendum]

They'll get size, but that doesn't translate to improvement in skill

[Spidey-Bat]

Steroids have shown an increase in hand-eye coordination.

[ChrisBaleBatman]

But, those 13 year olds already are shooting up to get size. Have been for years. The problem has been hitting Highschool and College sports for quite a while now.

Demonzing these guys won't help, either. You get one emotional guy who suddenly feels like the entire world and all the planets of the universe are falling on him....and that person could go crazy and do something he can't take back. Pffft, we all know how tied into roids that suicides are as well. I dunno how tied into it is with HGH and all these other different versions.

I'm not making excuses for A-Rod, but I think it's important to keep a clear head about these things.

He was a man about it, at the very least. He didn't deny it. My favorite player ever (sigh..yeah) Roger Clemens denied and denied, and is probably going to end up in jail for it. He'd had been better off admitting in.

Hell, even Andy Pettitte was better off for it....and he lied about the numbers of seasons he used the stuff....but still came out relatively good compared to Rocket and Bonds.

Even Giambi who denied and denied...and then admitted came out okay. Clemens could probably come clean and in some way be forgiven. It's the guys who deny and deny and deny that get hung up to get beaten with the proverbial sticks.

I'l say this too:

I really expect the rest of the 103 baseball players to be ousted as well. Right now, Latin America is taking it personal that A-Rod is being singled out of a list of 104 players.

[Addendum]

And even then it doesn't guarantee a home run with every swing, let alone a hit. It also doesn't diminish the amount of errors made by a player

[ChrisBaleBatman]

Steroids have shown an increase in hand-eye coordination.


They have?

For me, the biggest advantage of steroids is the recovery time. Suddenly, a guy who's played through 162 games and is in the playoffs can be just as freash as when he started the season, so there probably won't be any drop off in his abilities or his power. Same for pitchers.

That's huge, I think. Just being able to feel that good when your arm is supposed to be feeling like jell-o.

[ChrisBaleBatman]

Yeah, the jury is still out on what it does EXACTLY.

As well as what it does to people years later. I know heart attacks seem to spike up a ton for roid users in the later years of they're life.

[Addendum]

And even with that player feeling fresh, he still has to rely on the performance of his team mates

[ChrisBaleBatman]

Well, I think if there's anything we know for sure...is that steroids doesn't make a ****** player a good one. Much less a great one.

It seems that if the player is good, he can become great. If the player is great, he can become legendary.

Give the stuff to some bench warmer and he probably won't knock in over 20 hrs.

Of course, confidence could be a big aspect as well. If the player has is the back of his mind that the other one is better than him because of those insane numbers...he's lost the edge.

[BlackLantern]

But, those 13 year olds already are shooting up to get size. Have been for years. The problem has been hitting Highschool and College sports for quite a while now.

Demonzing these guys won't help, either. You get one emotional guy who suddenly feels like the entire world and all the planets of the universe are falling on him....and that person could go crazy and do something he can't take back. Pffft, we all know how tied into roids that suicides are as well. I dunno how tied into it is with HGH and all these other different versions.

I'm not making excuses for A-Rod, but I think it's important to keep a clear head about these things.

He was a man about it, at the very least. He didn't deny it. My favorite player ever (sigh..yeah) Roger Clemens denied and denied, and is probably going to end up in jail for it. He'd had been better off admitting in.

Hell, even Andy Pettitte was better off for it....and he lied about the numbers of seasons he used the stuff....but still came out relatively good compared to Rocket and Bonds.

Even Giambi who denied and denied...and then admitted came out okay. Clemens could probably come clean and in some way be forgiven. It's the guys who deny and deny and deny that get hung up to get beaten with the proverbial sticks.

I'l say this too:

I really expect the rest of the 103 baseball players to be ousted as well. Right now, Latin America is taking it personal that A-Rod is being singled out of a list of 104 players.

People need an object lesson....we don't listen unless someone gets caught doing something ****ed up or something awful happens....

Someone needs to be made an example of in a serious way....only then will people listen

[Addendum]

And if this came out in 2001-2003, then some type of action would be appropriate depending on the rules. Instead it's 6-8 years later and rules have changed.

[Captain Planet!]

I like how Bud Selig acts like he is completely innocent of all this steroid business. :whatever:

[signalman]

Once again the leaders of the Players Union, Donald Fehr and Gene Oriza(SP?) have their heads in sand.
Why haven't those two been fired Yet?

[ChrisBaleBatman]

People need an object lesson....we don't listen unless someone gets caught doing something ****ed up or something awful happens....

Someone needs to be made an example of in a serious way....only then will people listen

An example of?

Isn't that what's happening whenever someone gets outed as a user?

Btw...where the **** are the rest of the 103 names at?

I mean, c'mon...those names better come out. They just ****ing have to, or it'll stink of smear if not.