Captain America's Costume

[sabetoonth]

i will except his classic in promo pics during th war effort but not as a soldier, theres blood and mud, bright colors also make you an easier target

[Shivsguy616]

I will say this.....with the economy as it is, the world matters as they are....doesn't it just make sense to do his suit and it's colors as they've always been? No dumbed down, toned down, darkened or muted colors. If ever there was a time to do it....USA! USA! USA!... ... ...

Wow, you really have no idea how the world works do you?

[chris moore]

Captain America stands for the American people, the American ideal, the best of us. He does not stand for the current government, or any government. He does not represent the policies, the economy or the global viewpoint of the American government. He represents what America was founded on, not what it has become. Exploring this in his movie, where he finds it difficult to be a beacon for how the world and how America has changed since he stood up to fight for what was right, is the emotional angle they should aim for.

When someone screams "USA! USA! USA!" nowadays, its sadly more often than not a proclamation of American power. Cap is not a symbol of that - and that is what this movie needs to promote. So put him in bright colours. Because the American flag is not the American government. The flag is the American people. Hell, I'm British. But until they find a good avenue for the Captain Britain movie without cocking it up, Captain America's a fine example of what a person to strive to be like, regardless of the flag draped on their uniform.

[marcvader]

During Cap's training and first mission this:
http://img348.imageshack.us/img348/4929/074kr.jpg

[Brian Braddock]

Absolutely. I love that WW2 design.

In terms of his modern costume, I say stick largely with the contemorary 616 design with a few alterations and swipes from the Ultimate one.

If I was to post a design I'm working on that's in black & white, I wonder what the possibility of one of my photoshop adept brothers taking a stab at colourisation would be?

[Chris Wallace]

Exactly!! That's the key Chris. It's a movie. They need to do some movie type things and trick us. William Shatner had the regular Beatles type boots with heels he wore as Captain Kirk most of the time. Yet when he's running or doing some sort of action scen they are clearly black shoes without the heels. It serves the purpose of making the story, the actor, the action. . .everything run smoother without being distracting. Gene Colan would make Iron Man's eyes look angry, sad, surprised, ...whatever...to fit the mood of the moment. This is all within the confines of an immovable mask. It's called artistic liscence. I remember a time when artists, movie makers....did this without trying to make it so realistic.

Oh.....and please...don't make it some fish net weave pattern material like Spider-Man did, like Superman copied and like they are now doing evidently, since I mentioned it above, with Star Trek. I've hated it with every iteration it's been used.
I didn't mind it on Spider-Man; clearly they were just trying to distance the look from the traditional spandex suit. i.e. the plainjane look that the guy at the Con wears.
But since I highly doubt Cap's movie costume is going to be spandex, I don't see it being an issue.

[cryptic name]

Captain America stands for the American people, the American ideal, the best of us. He does not stand for the current government, or any government. He does not represent the policies, the economy or the global viewpoint of the American government. He represents what America was founded on, not what it has become. Exploring this in his movie, where he finds it difficult to be a beacon for how the world and how America has changed since he stood up to fight for what was right, is the emotional angle they should aim for.

When someone screams "USA! USA! USA!" nowadays, its sadly more often than not a proclamation of American power. Cap is not a symbol of that - and that is what this movie needs to promote. So put him in bright colours. Because the American flag is not the American government. The flag is the American people. Hell, I'm British. But until they find a good avenue for the Captain Britain movie without cocking it up, Captain America's a fine example of what a person to strive to be like, regardless of the flag draped on their uniform.

excellent post

[Hypestyle]

some version of the Ultimates outfit(s) would be cool.. but no bike-helmets ala Reb Brown and no latex-ears ala Matt Salinger..! and the outfit must be seen throughout the film.. not covered up in a trench coat half the time..

[bunk]

:hehe:

http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/4334/captainamericamaskpremi.jpg

[November Rain]

i think he should keep his world war 2 costume throughout the film, only the shield should be updated.

i'd like to see them offering him a 616 counterpart but firstly refusing.

maybe when his normal clothes get battle damaged in the final battle, he accepts the new design but we hardly get to see him in it.

[chris moore]

:hehe:

http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/4334/captainamericamaskpremi.jpg


That's kinda scary. Cos provided they don't try a Batmanesque moulded helmet, or a spandex mask like spidey (only in cowl style obviously) they're probably going to go with a slightly fitted and shaped style like this. I'd be absolutely fine with a bit darker if this was the case - cos that doesn't look great

[Brian Braddock]

Absolutely. I love that WW2 design.

In terms of his modern costume, I say stick largely with the contemorary 616 design with a few alterations and swipes from the Ultimate one.

If I was to post a design I'm working on that's in black & white, I wonder what the possibility of one of my photoshop adept brothers taking a stab at colourisation would be?

Ok, contemporary movie costume design completed - Any takers for colourisation?

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b64/SUPERBENITEZ/scan0001-2.jpg

Like I said, a bit of a mix. I've ditched the 616 pirate boots and gloves for something a little more 'real world' practical. I havent used any scales or chainmail as I think something similiar to the material used for the Batman Begins suit could possibly be utilised (I got the idea seeing that Channing Tatum/Duke manip) hence the squared-off shoulders (possibly incorporating some padding to boost the actors build), and obviously, seams will probably be on show at the joins when 2 dfferent materials meet.

Apart from that, it's mainly 616.

In terms of the colour, Comedy value of the below photo aside, I really do like the shade of blue-

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b64/SUPERBENITEZ/1028200730556PM_captainamerica.jpg

Whereas I like the shade of red used here -

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b64/SUPERBENITEZ/classiccap.jpg

[Rage]

Hate that I can't see his ears...and I hate the wings. (not that there are wings...but that they are thick plastic looking lumps)

Rage

[Faded To Deaf]

Ok, contemporary movie costume design completed - Any takers for colourisation?

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b64/SUPERBENITEZ/scan0001-2.jpg



If the chest had some scales, maybe even just a little, I would say that's the version I want to see after WWII.

EDIT: I hope that isn't underwear he's wearing on the outside :p

[Judson Caspian]

lol and the original costume doesn't?
No.

[marcvader]

I like the Captain America: Red, White, and Blue outfit on the cover. It looks like BB's design plus scales and denim fabric. His cowl looks cool too in it.

[tamron]

I like the Captain America: Red, White, and Blue outfit on the cover. It looks like BB's design plus scales and denim fabric. His cowl looks cool too in it.

http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/8110/captainamerica01nr0.jpg

Just in case someone hasn't seen the image you're talking about. I don't think it's been posted in this thread.

I also love this version of the costume. It even pulls off the pirate cuffs feasibly.

[marcvader]

Yes thank you. This is what I'd give him to wear as his first official costume when introduced to the public and wear through out the war until frozen. He's wear the Ultimate WWII helmet outfit during secret testing, training, and first mission and then be given this ^^^ outfit after they've gotten all the kinks out and show him to the world.

[MarvelFanClub]

http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/8110/captainamerica01nr0.jpg

Just in case someone hasn't seen the image you're talking about. I don't think it's been posted in this thread.

I also love this version of the costume. It even pulls off the pirate cuffs feasibly.
that would look very cool if hes like that in the movie

[Faded To Deaf]

http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/8110/captainamerica01nr0.jpg

Just in case someone hasn't seen the image you're talking about. I don't think it's been posted in this thread.

I also love this version of the costume. It even pulls off the pirate cuffs feasibly.

That's perfect, except the star and neck covered in scales.

[Daredevil_2003]

That is sexy...I would be fine if they used that in WWII. I kinda still prefer the ultimate one, but that is really cool for the time period. If either one was used I'd be a very happy camper.

...still want ultimate for Avengers, though.

[sabetoonth]

i do want an adaption of the ult costume, but this looks nice as a)more lax clothes for not mission wearing or b) how they present him to the public for the first time

[Daredevil_2003]

That would be a nice way to do both. Wear the ultimate one in combat and the RWB one for propaganda purposes.

[Gamma Goliath]

http://images.wizarduniverse.com/WizardUniverse/Previews/PREV423/UE0708-01.jpghttp://nerdvana.freedomblogging.com/files/2008/05/ultimatesavengers.jpg

i like the helmet-maskish look for modern day cap.

[DJ Kornphlake]

The chinstrap is so garish looking.

[jpmuftak]

My Jan Fanart Contest entry:
http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/7824/cap2nk1.jpg

[chris moore]

The pic is really good. But I'd hope that whoever plays Cap would fill out the suit a little more.

And the chin strap helmet from Ult Vol 2 on the previous page? Ugh! Talk about moving backwards

[Daredevil_2003]

Now that's a manip! Awesome work!

I've always liked the chinstrap. It just looks cool, IMO.

Not trying to justify it through some reference to canon or whatnot, this is just a general question, but didn't Cap have pretty much the same helmet at some point back in WWII with wings and less 'garish' strap? I swear I've seen art with it...

[chris moore]

Here's his original one if this is what you mean:
http://www.iconusa4.com/online/Images/Bowen_Images/WWII_Capt_america_main.jpg

[Jordacar]

Here's his original one if this is what you mean:
http://www.iconusa4.com/online/Images/Bowen_Images/WWII_Capt_america_main.jpgI've mentioned this before, but here it is again: I wouldn't mind seeing this suit briefly in the film as a sort of PR suit that Steve is given to wear for the cameras and is designed to photograph well, but of course Steve hates it because it's not really functional. So when he goes into the field, he gets a real suit (and round) that is functional and state-of-the-art etc, but still has the recognizable symbols like the Ultimate WWII suit.

[Daredevil_2003]

That's the one I'm referring to but I swear I've seen it with the chin strap before. Not as pronounced as the Ultimate one, more like the ones they had on WWII helmets...

[Chris Wallace]

I don't think so, DD.

[captainrogers]

That's the one I'm referring to but I swear I've seen it with the chin strap before. Not as pronounced as the Ultimate one, more like the ones they had on WWII helmets...

Might you be refering to this pic? Just curious.
http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/9278/captainamericai06.jpg

[Daredevil_2003]

Yep, that's the one. I could've swore I saw it in a more period piece of art, but I'm probably just mistaken on that one...

[Jerkofwonder]

I agree with that the classic WWII outift should be used as a PR suit that Steve doesn't really like, with him wearing the Ultimate WWII suit in battle. Then in the modern times I would like the Ultimate costumes with the wings added. The chin strap helmet just makes more sense, and better in a movie IMO. The regular suit the way it is would just seem kind of corny in modern times.

[RAMORE]

It came from the Marvel Redesign Thread. Though RAMORES made it, I saved a copy for myself, because it was so awesome;

http://img22.imageshack.us/img22/3867/2dj8fmr.jpg

It is Awesome but I didn't draw it just found it on DeviantArt and posted it over here but I qouted the artist and her artist remarks I think. There are some things I don't likke about it [weird elbow pads, cirlcles on leg, belt buckle, lines in pecks] and some stuff I love about it [shield insignia on shoulder, A and wings work, scail mail, googgle for the eye piece] But for an avengers movie if it got close to that I would be ecstatic!!!:up:

However the first movie should be set in WWII IMO so a get up appropriate for the first film and when the avengers thaw him out develop that costume.

[RAMORE]

^Well, his original grey suit wouldn't have been too difficult but after that the molded metal look just wouldn't work. And before Granov came along, my favorite IM armor was:

http://i182.photobucket.com/albums/x9/vandar_photo/bestarmor.jpg

Even though it never would have worked.

I actually saw a real life version behind glass at a marvel theme park it looked perfect:up::word: Common people these hollywood people are talented they can make it look exactly like the books it's just convincing them that's best:grin:

[RAMORE]

Here are a few ideas I had for the Captain America costume, a way to keep it as traditional as possible while still making it acceptable for a live action 3D movie, and incorporating the Ultimate version too.

The Wings on his mask could be painted on like this:


The "A" on his mask should be about this size:


His "mask" should be a harder material, a helmet really. With the neck part being made of a thinner, softer, material, while the chest part is made of harder material as well. But the helmet, neck, and chest are all the same color blue:
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f358/seanstarrunner/cap%20costume/545698-secinv006c_cov_col_large_sup.jpg

His forehead/eyebrow ridge area should be molded like so:
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f358/seanstarrunner/cap%20costume/CAPTAIN_AMERICA_10.jpg

The neckline of his costume should go to his clavicle like this:
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f358/seanstarrunner/cap%20costume/82956-86681-captain-america_super.jpg

The chain male on his costume 3D bullet proof scales, not necessarily this big but not so small that they are unnoticeable:

His armpit area, however, should be lighter material like his neck and have no scales on it (for comfort and mobility). It should be the same blue as his costume though:
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f358/seanstarrunner/cap%20costume/captain_america2.jpg

The striped material on his waist should be a lighter material too, and should not be skin tight:
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f358/seanstarrunner/cap%20costume/CaptainAmerica.jpg

I liked when they were drawing his costume with the brown belt like this:
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f358/seanstarrunner/cap%20costume/171336-captain-america_400-1.jpg

His pants shouldn't be spandex or skin tight, but not very baggy either. It shouldn't have pockets or pouches on it, but seems and patterns like this are OK:
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f358/seanstarrunner/cap%20costume/030707cap_1.jpgWow really cool ideas Great research man!:up:

a work in progress, inspired by this:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v216/batsone/2dj8fmr.jpg

i am working on this:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v216/batsone/capt.jpgI'm loving this as well who's under the mask? Like the gauntlets better on this.

[Faded To Deaf]

It is Awesome but I didn't draw it just found it on DeviantArt and posted it over here but I qouted the artist and her artist remarks I think. There are some things I don't likke about it [weird elbow pads, cirlcles on leg, belt buckle, lines in pecks] and some stuff I love about it [shield insignia on shoulder, A and wings work, scail mail, googgle for the eye piece] But for an avengers movie if it got close to that I would be ecstatic!!!:up:

However the first movie should be set in WWII IMO so a get up appropriate for the first film and when the avengers thaw him out develop that costume.

:facepalm Ah my mistake. Still cool though.

[RAMORE]

Chris Egan as Cap Bad Manip I know I suck:D
http://i42.tinypic.com/15y2b4.jpg

I change the parts of the costume that bothered me. No weird elbow pad, More scales Although i'm thinking maybe should have put them on his pecks, and last but not least different belt buckle from another design I liked.

[Faded To Deaf]

Chris Egan as Cap Bad Manip I know I suck:D
http://i42.tinypic.com/15y2b4.jpg

I change the parts of the costume that bothered me. No weird elbow pad, More scales Although i'm thinking maybe should have put them on his pecks, and last but not least different belt buckle from another design I liked.

You changed everything I would have, nice. :up:

[chris moore]

I'm not keen on the massively padded/armoured effect that's getting thrown out there. Regular soldiers don't get to suit up in this kinda stuff, and the only explanation for Cap being allowed it would be that he's wearing bright, sniper drawing colours so he's more likely to be shot at let alone get hit.

I pretty much agree with all of Artistsean's ideas

[Mr. Todd]

Chris Egan as Cap Bad Manip I know I suck:D
http://i42.tinypic.com/15y2b4.jpg

I change the parts of the costume that bothered me. No weird elbow pad, More scales Although i'm thinking maybe should have put them on his pecks, and last but not least different belt buckle from another design I liked.

Mmm I wouldn't put ANYTHING extra on the legs, the block of scales look a bit out of place imo. Still think the costume design's purty.

[sabetoonth]

You changed everything I would have, nice. :up:

The chinstrap is so garish looking.
i think it looks rough and ready for combat, a coprimise of war helmet and cowl/mask

[chris moore]

The other thing about Cap is that his visual (during his introduction during the war) is supposed to be that of a superman. Not a flying superstrong superman; but a man who is the ultimate in everything a human being can be. And that Ultimate human being is standing up against Nazi tyranny to inspire allied forces and discontent citizens of axis countries alike. To have the guy wear any sort of blue or any kind of costume that separates him from regular soldiers only when in front of the press is just plain ridiculous. Out in the field he needs to been seen by both sides as a beacon of hope, and as the unstoppable force thats coming right at you. Slapping a white A on his standard issue army helmet and carrying his mud slathered red white and blue shield is not going to have the same effect.

A regular soldier is going to come up agsinst a barb wire fence and either have to stop, or spend the next 10 minutes cutting through it slowly to let the rest through. Cap is going to vault over it using his shield to compres the top of the fence, and he doesnt need his baggy standard issue combat pants (green or blue) catching on it and suddenly pulling him down. He doesnt need to be trying to bring down ten nazis in close quarter combat with waterlogged 1940's wool blend army trousers slowing down his moves.

Cap needs blue (even if toned down somewhat), he needs red boots, and he needs his uniform/costume to be figure hugging but probably not wetsuit level tightness. He needs almost to have his physique on display to a degree by having a superhero costume rather than a brighter uniform. To stand out and say "Our superman isnt just a really strong fat guy,or a former circus wrestler who's just big - our guy is the peak of perfection"

[afan]

Chris Moore, ......Amen Brother!

Re. the colors of the costume......I wonder if there is a standard color code that all manufacturers of a US flag must adhere to; if so then the coice of the colors on Cap's costume becomes a no brainer.

[batsone]

Wow really cool ideas Great research man!:up:

I'm loving this as well who's under the mask? Like the gauntlets better on this.i forget who it is under the mask, his last name is Dunn or something, when i get home i'll look it up as im on my laptop now.
and i finnished the pic

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v216/batsone/capA.jpg

[Occulus]

The other thing about Cap is that his visual (during his introduction during the war) is supposed to be that of a superman. Not a flying superstrong superman; but a man who is the ultimate in everything a human being can be. And that Ultimate human being is standing up against Nazi tyranny to inspire allied forces and discontent citizens of axis countries alike. To have the guy wear any sort of blue or any kind of costume that separates him from regular soldiers only when in front of the press is just plain ridiculous. Out in the field he needs to been seen by both sides as a beacon of hope, and as the unstoppable force thats coming right at you. Slapping a white A on his standard issue army helmet and carrying his mud slathered red white and blue shield is not going to have the same effect.

A regular soldier is going to come up agsinst a barb wire fence and either have to stop, or spend the next 10 minutes cutting through it slowly to let the rest through. Cap is going to vault over it using his shield to compres the top of the fence, and he doesnt need his baggy standard issue combat pants (green or blue) catching on it and suddenly pulling him down. He doesnt need to be trying to bring down ten nazis in close quarter combat with waterlogged 1940's wool blend army trousers slowing down his moves.

Cap needs blue (even if toned down somewhat), he needs red boots, and he needs his uniform/costume to be figure hugging but probably not wetsuit level tightness. He needs almost to have his physique on display to a degree by having a superhero costume rather than a brighter uniform. To stand out and say "Our superman isnt just a really strong fat guy,or a former circus wrestler who's just big - our guy is the peak of perfection"


Yep, my thoughts exactly

[Chris Wallace]

The other thing about Cap is that his visual (during his introduction during the war) is supposed to be that of a superman. Not a flying superstrong superman; but a man who is the ultimate in everything a human being can be. And that Ultimate human being is standing up against Nazi tyranny to inspire allied forces and discontent citizens of axis countries alike. To have the guy wear any sort of blue or any kind of costume that separates him from regular soldiers only when in front of the press is just plain ridiculous. Out in the field he needs to been seen by both sides as a beacon of hope, and as the unstoppable force thats coming right at you. Slapping a white A on his standard issue army helmet and carrying his mud slathered red white and blue shield is not going to have the same effect.

A regular soldier is going to come up agsinst a barb wire fence and either have to stop, or spend the next 10 minutes cutting through it slowly to let the rest through. Cap is going to vault over it using his shield to compres the top of the fence, and he doesnt need his baggy standard issue combat pants (green or blue) catching on it and suddenly pulling him down. He doesnt need to be trying to bring down ten nazis in close quarter combat with waterlogged 1940's wool blend army trousers slowing down his moves.

Cap needs blue (even if toned down somewhat), he needs red boots, and he needs his uniform/costume to be figure hugging but probably not wetsuit level tightness. He needs almost to have his physique on display to a degree by having a superhero costume rather than a brighter uniform. To stand out and say "Our superman isnt just a really strong fat guy,or a former circus wrestler who's just big - our guy is the peak of perfection"
I'm with you apart from the "toning down" aspect; there's really no need.

[batsone]

A regular soldier is going to come up agsinst a barb wire fence and either have to stop, or spend the next 10 minutes cutting through it slowly to let the rest through. "

you have never had any interaction with consintina wire, or any kind of real-life combat.

lol 10 min to cut through any fence lmFao... you sir are a tool and a fool.
once you have spent a nanosecond in real-life combat then your nerda ss can continue to run it's mouth


sorry, these duche bag "fan-boys" just get to me

[batsone]

I'm with you apart from the "toning down" aspect; there's really no need.
of course you are all your other post lead any person to believe your a tool.
and know absolutely nada about ......well anything

[chris moore]

The barbed wire example was actually meant as one set in WW2 where yes they did have a lot of difficulty with huge great whacking randomly placed walls of barbed wire stretching for hundreds of metres in the middle of a minefield.

And no, I don't have any combat experience - but that makes me about as unsuitable to comment on the usefulness of a superhero costume over a blue baggy uniform 70 years ago in wartime as any of us non-writers do commenting on the superhero writing skills of professional writers. Because provided we don't just poop all over someones words or get pointlessly argumentative and maintain some level of logic over our recommendations we are entitled to an opinion.

You however appear to just be spouting for the sake of spouting; to incite. Therefore you fall more towards the class of 'no valid opinion'.

That said, and my interest in pausing at your posts long gone because they have no place here, I bet somewhere there's a listing for what every official American flag must have as its base colours. Some kinda chart for mixing dyes.

[C. Lee]

you have never had any interaction with consintina wire, or any kind of real-life combat.

lol 10 min to cut through any fence lmFao... you sir are a tool and a fool.
once you have spent a nanosecond in real-life combat then your nerda ss can continue to run it's mouth


sorry, these duche bag "fan-boys" just get to me

of course you are all your other post lead any person to believe your a tool.
and know absolutely nada about ......well anything

You have recieved an infraction for these posts. You can discuss, debate, and rebutt other people's comments without resorting to name calling or rude behavior. Do not continue to post like this in the future.

[Chris Wallace]

of course you are all your other post lead any person to believe your a tool.
and know absolutely nada about ......well anything

:huh:

[Brian Braddock]

Such angst.........

[chris moore]

Seemed to be a new post on here every couple hours up until Batsone's 'input'. Kinda fallen flat since...

[lixdexia]

Seemed to be a new post on here every couple hours up until Batsone's 'input'. Kinda fallen flat since...
yep, because antagonizing him is sure to get people to post :down

so, does anyone else NOT want scales on any of the cap costumes? (assuming there will be more than one)

[jpmuftak]

I'm not a fan of the scales - at least the way some of the comics make them look. I understand the usefulness of "repelling bullets"...I guess.
But other than that, it just needs to be "Armor".

[Brian Braddock]

I cant stand the scales, personally.

I remember, when Cassaday drew them, thinking that they seemed so ridiculous. Sadly (for me) other artists liked them too and they rear up every so often to bug the hell out of me.

I'm firmly an old-school chainmail guy, although I accept that this may not be the way to go for live-action. I think something the way of Jpmuftak's manip is the way to go.

[lixdexia]

I'm not a fan of the scales - at least the way some of the comics make them look. I understand the usefulness of "repelling bullets"...I guess.
But other than that, it just needs to be "Armor".
i REALLY don't want to see cap in a flak jacket though. that just looks bad imo

[Brian Braddock]

I cant stand the scales, personally.

I remember, when Cassaday drew them, thinking that they seemed so ridiculous. Sadly (for me) other artists liked them too and they rear up every so often to bug the hell out of me.

I'm firmly an old-school chainmail guy, although I accept that this may not be the way to go for live-action. I think something the way of Jpmuftak's manip is the way to go.

Thinking on from that, I've changed my mind.

If chain-mail was good enough for Tom Selleck in Runaway, then it's good enough to be utilized in a Cap movie costume.

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b64/SUPERBENITEZ/runaway_080.jpg

No one can tell me that costuming advancements havent improved between now and 1984 to such a degree that it would enable a costume designer to be able to fashion a Cap costume out of modern materials but incorporate an upper back and shoulders made from a lighweight chain-mail ala Byrne or Zeck's Cap.

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b64/SUPERBENITEZ/captainamerica253p22_002.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b64/SUPERBENITEZ/panel_bwolv1_d.jpg

[lixdexia]

Thinking on from that, I've changed my mind.

If chain-mail was good enough for Tom Selleck in Runaway, then it's good enough to be utilized in a Cap movie costume.

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b64/SUPERBENITEZ/runaway_080.jpg

if they can get that light enough to be feasible then yeah, i like that

[Spidey_D.N.]

My Jan Fanart Contest entry:
http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/7824/cap2nk1.jpg

Awesome manip jpmuftak! :up: I don't mind that look for the movie.

[louiebling$]

I think the Scales could work......

[chris moore]

Maybe if its small scale chainmail that then have a fabric overlay so they give texture without appearing like thousands of little links, and more importantly, clinking around when he moves so he can't do anything stealthily

[Brian Braddock]

They can fabricate a plastic chainmail to look like metal using a bit of the ole' movie magic.

Hey presto - no clinking.

[Daredevil_2003]

Or not do chain/scale-mail at all. :hehe:

[Brian Braddock]

Wise-a$$.

It's better than fish-scales. ;)

[irapogi]

chain mail looks weird.. but thats just me.

[C. Lee]

I would prefer chain mail to scales.

[CaptainStacy]

I would prefer chain mail to scales.

Same here.

[louiebling$]

What about Chain Mail/Scale Hybrid ?

[Lobo]

I would prefer chain mail to scales.

Likewise.

Overall though, I prefer The Ultimates costume, as I feel that would best translate to a live action adaptation.

http://i42.tinypic.com/zloi9z.jpg

[chris moore]

Agreed. As much discussion as we put forward on the boots, and the scales, and the helmet etc, the bottom line is that the Ultimate Cap costume is very faithful to the original but with some minor modifications that make it more real world like. Ultimately, if anyone affiliated with SHIELD (as the Avengers are likely to be) or the military are the ones who find Cap in ice after his own movie (depending on which way they go with that), then his replacement uniform will have some modern touches and military sensibilities/practicalities such as the boots in the post above over pirate boots, and a scale/mesh/chainmail like torso covering for small arms fire protection over what could nicely be small scale chainmail proper on his WW2 costume.

I don't think we'd ***** about seeing the Ultimate uniform on the big screen now would we? Likewise we all seem to agree the Ultimate WW2 one is good. So if they put that up, or gave it some 616 uniform touches (like the gloves and boots, American civil war cavalry style), then we'd probably all be happy eh.

[CaptainStacy]

Likewise.

Overall though, I prefer The Ultimates costume, as I feel that would best translate to a live action adaptation.

http://i42.tinypic.com/zloi9z.jpg

What's the difference between that and 616, other than no cowl wings, or pirate boots?

[chris moore]

The glove style, the pouches on the belt, the star on the soulder, the grey underarm/torso sides. Its mostly about the boots, gloves and underarm bit.

[jpmuftak]

WINGS ________________or__________________________ NO WINGS
http://a.abcnews.com/images/Entertainment/ht_captainamerica_070307_ssv.jpghttp://captain-america.us/articles/captain_america.jpg


I've been thinking about this a lot, and I have to say, I can't IMAGINE them giving cap the wings.

I understand "they're iconic", "that's what makes his costume special" ect. ect.

But the feathers simply don't make any sense for the general viewing audience.

The ONLY way they would do them is if it were useful for an antenna or something ala Batman Begins, but even in Batman Begins they made him LOOK like a bat and that is all the justification needed.

Here, the ONLY real reason to give him wings is to make him look like his "cartoon" counterpart, and I don't have much faith that the execs behind this are going to give a crap about that.

I'm not sure I agree with it, but I can see the logic - let's be honest, Captain America is already on the verge of being cheesball given his costume, his name, and his boy scout attitude. I can imagine the studio is going to do EVERYTHING they can to give him credibility in the eyes of the general audience, and little feathers on his head would probably be the first to go.

[lixdexia]

WINGS ________________or__________________________ NO WINGS
http://a.abcnews.com/images/Entertainment/ht_captainamerica_070307_ssv.jpghttp://captain-america.us/articles/captain_america.jpg


I've been thinking about this a lot, and I have to say, I can't IMAGINE them giving cap the wings.

I understand "they're iconic", "that's what makes his costume special" ect. ect.

But the feathers simply don't make any sense for the general viewing audience.

The ONLY way they would do them is if it were useful for an antenna or something ala Batman Begins, but even in Batman Begins they made him LOOK like a bat and that is all the justification needed.

Here, the ONLY real reason to give him wings is to make him look like his "cartoon" counterpart, and I don't have much faith that the execs behind this are going to give a crap about that.

I'm not sure I agree with it, but I can see the logic - let's be honest, Captain America is already on the verge of being cheesball given his costume, his name, and his boy scout attitude. I can imagine the studio is going to do EVERYTHING they can to give him credibility in the eyes of the general audience, and little feathers on his head would probably be the first to go.
wow...wut?
your justification for no wings is "it's too much like the comic"? i think this is the first time i've ever heard of someone having that problem...

the wings will make as much sense as they did when they first showed up in the comics. people will look at them and say "oh, ok" and just accept that as part of his look. they don't need a function, somethings are just there for aesthetics.

[Brian Braddock]

Yeah, but let's not forget that with the 2 Marvel productions that we've had thus far, theyve given us 2 amazingly faithful visual translations of the main characters.

I honestly dont think that Marvel would feel the need to 'justify' an aspect of a costume the way other studios do - I think they seem to be quite happy in saying 'well, he looks like this in the comics, why cant he look like this in the movie?'

Look at the sonic cannons in the Incredible Hulk. I really have my doubts that another studio wouldnve had the ball$ to include them as they coulda been seen as too 'geeky'. Luckilly for us, Marvel have enough respect in the source material that they dont seem to necessitate the changes that we come to expect from the likes of studios adapting their characters.

[lixdexia]

Yeah, but let's not forget that with the 2 Marvel productions that we've had thus far, theyve given us 2 amazingly faithful visual translations of the main characters.

I honestly dont think that Marvel would feel the need to 'justify' an aspect of a costume the way other studios do - I think they seem to be quite happy in saying 'well, he looks like this in the comics, why cant he look like this in the movie?'

Look at the sonic cannons in the Incredible Hulk. I really have my doubts that another studio wouldnve had the ball$ to include them as they coulda been seen as too 'geeky'. Luckilly for us, Marvel have enough respect in the source material that they dont seem to necessitate the changes that we come to expect from the likes of studios adapting their characters.
yeah, marvel woudn't do something like change the hero's main accessory into a biological function. or change it so that he is no longer working on a morally questionable project, such as a bomb, and is instead working on a nice make everyone happy project, like medical research

[Brian Braddock]

I was talking visually.

If anyone wants an example of a studio really changing things and deviating from the source material then take a journey over to the Deadpool thread in the Wolverine Forums.

[Shivsguy616]

What's the difference between that and 616, other than no cowl wings, or pirate boots?

The gloves, pants, underarms and texture.

[CaptainStacy]

The gloves, pants, underarms and texture.

Yeah, but those are all pretty miniscule details, dont you think?

[chris moore]

They give a different all over look though.

And Lixdexia: The movies you're talking about as examples of radical change over faithful adaptation are those preceding Iron Man and Incredible Hulk when Marvel had little control.

How about the wings if they were this kinda size? This isn't a bad example of a real life mask:
http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m211/swftoys/statues/marvelcaparchive014.jpg

[Brian Braddock]

Hell, nothing is miniscule on these boards, Stacy. Everything's such a big deal.

You just know when we do finally see the cap costume, every stitch of that mother will be studied over and over and agued about by obsessive fanboys.

[lixdexia]

They give a different all over look though.

And Lixdexia: The movies you're talking about as examples of radical change over faithful adaptation are those preceding Iron Man and Incredible Hulk when Marvel had little control.
actually the second was from the incredible hulk.

anywho, i like the 616 costume, but i feel the ultimate costume would work a little better onscreen because it's just a bit more dynamic. the head wings are a must regardless

[Brian Braddock]

Yes, but the Incredible Hulk opening credits just took a vague cues from the origins that had already been established in both the previous movie and the tv show.

They seriously werent gonna waste time and money just to re-tell the origin as it was in the comics.

[lixdexia]

Yes, but the Incredible Hulk opening credits just took a vague cues from the origins that had already been established in both the previous movie and the tv show.

They seriously werent gonna waste time and money just to re-tell the origin as it was in the comics.at any rate my point was marvel will change things to suit the tone they're going for in the movie same as anyone else will. they do it in the comics, why wouldn't they do it in the movies?

[Brian Braddock]

I agree.

My point was, and I initially thought we were on the same page here, that Marvel dont necessarilly need to justify why the costume has certain attributes.

The idea on here that the wings can only be on the helmet if they serve some kind of purpose is unfounded.

[lixdexia]

I agree.

My point was, and I initially thought we were on the same page here, that Marvel dont necessarilly need to justify why the costume has certain attributes.

The idea on here that the wings can only be on the helmet if they serve some kind of purpose is unfounded.
we were/are on that point. however as a bat-fan i felt the need to point out that not only wb changes things:oldrazz:

and another point...i would like the mask to be a "helmet" in that it is armored, but i don't want it to be bulky like the batman masks, i want it closer to the daredevil mask in appearance. i'd also like an under armor like material as an undermask to connect the helmet to the shirt. i see this looking something like this
http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h56/themancalledbat/moviecapegancopy-1.png

[Shivsguy616]

Yeah, but those are all pretty miniscule details, dont you think?

No. Also, he has stars on his shoulders.

[Daredevil_2003]

and starting with vol 2 he has the helmet/chin strap combo so many seem to dislike. I think it's BA and hope they go with the Ultimates 2 costume exactly for Avengers.

[Chewy]

I hate the Ultimates 2 chinstrap. Please, no

[Shivsguy616]

They give a different all over look though.

And Lixdexia: The movies you're talking about as examples of radical change over faithful adaptation are those preceding Iron Man and Incredible Hulk when Marvel had little control.

How about the wings if they were this kinda size? This isn't a bad example of a real life mask:
http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m211/swftoys/statues/marvelcaparchive014.jpg

That looks pretty damn good. Any pics of it on someone?

[Jordacar]

On the wings:

TONY: "Tell you what, throw a little hotrod Red in there."
JARVIS: "Yes, that should help you keep a low profile."

Looking cool is a good enough reason

[CrimsonMist]

Without the feather, it seems like Cap is missing something. He looks kinda weird without them. I've never once questioned why he had feathers on his mask. I just accepted it as it was. They looked cool. I highly doubt the GA will question that.

I don't hate the Ultimates costume as much as i do the WW2 ultimates costume. But it really feels unnecessary. I mean, what's the point of giving him the gray sides, other than to make the costume look different from the 616 version? And the stars on the shoulders, to me, are kind of redundant. He's got the big one on his chest. Leave it at that. I wouldn't care too much if they use it, as long as they give him the feathers and get rid of the chin strap. But even so, the Ultimates costume just feels like change just to be change.

[Shivsguy616]

Without the feather, it seems like Cap is missing something. He looks kinda weird without them. I've never once questioned why he had feathers on his mask. I just accepted it as it was. They looked cool. I highly doubt the GA will question that.

I don't hate the Ultimates costume as much as i do the WW2 ultimates costume. But it really feels unnecessary. I mean, what's the point of giving him the gray sides, other than to make the costume look different from the 616 version? And the stars on the shoulders, to me, are kind of redundant. He's got the big one on his chest. Leave it at that. I wouldn't care too much if they use it, as long as they give him the feathers and get rid of the chin strap. But even so, the Ultimates costume just feels like change just to be change.

It's because they look better and more realistic.

[chris moore]

That looks pretty damn good. Any pics of it on someone?

I found it randomly via google and haven't seen it on anyone. But given the angle it shouldnt be too difficult to find a head pic of one of the fan faves for playing Cap and manip it in there.

Still, I think its overall look is one for the "yay" box on having the wings

[jpmuftak]

I must say, I'm a bit surprised at the amount of support for the wings.

I guess I'm the only one, but I've always thought the wings looked dumb and useless.

My point was that Marvel changed things for a reason when they came out with the Ultimate version and I think it goes for many of the decisions that studios make Marvel or not.

I would equate the loss of the wings to the raised webbing on spider-man's suit, or the lack of outer-underwear on Batman, NOT to such a pivital change as organic webshooters.

To reiterate my earlier point: Marvel shouldn't necessarily be worried about "realism" what they DO need to be worried about is "Credibility".
The character that they build this history-making film series around has to be taken seriously by the movie goers and Captain America...even if you just take his name...is starting with a handicap in the cheesy category.
So they will be taking every precaution to make sure he is no joke...and I'm sorry to say that those dinky wings on the side of his mask (as they are in the comics) are a joke.

If wings on his head serve no purpose OTHER than to look like the comics, then there is no reason to keep them to serve any part of the backstory, character, or plot.

[lixdexia]

I must say, I'm a bit surprised at the amount of support for the wings.

I guess I'm the only one, but I've always thought the wings looked dumb and useless.

My point was that Marvel changed things for a reason when they came out with the Ultimate version and I think it goes for many of the decisions that studios make Marvel or not.

I would equate the loss of the wings to the raised webbing on spider-man's suit, or the lack of outer-underwear on Batman, NOT to such a pivital change as organic webshooters.

To reiterate my earlier point: Marvel shouldn't necessarily be worried about "realism" what they DO need to be worried about is "Credibility".
The character that they build this history-making film series around has to be taken seriously by the movie goers and Captain America...even if you just take his name...is starting with a handicap in the cheesy category.
So they will be taking every precaution to make sure he is no joke...and I'm sorry to say that those dinky wings on the side of his mask (as they are in the comics) are a joke.

If wings on his head serve no purpose OTHER than to look like the comics, then there is no reason to keep them to serve any part of the backstory, character, or plot. the same could be said for any aspect of his costume, be it the red and white stripes, the star on his chest, or the uniform as a whole

[marcvader]

The way I see it is besides Cap being a supersoldier he was a propaganda/morale tool as well and the fact that these will be the 40's it just seems fitting that his costume would look cheesy to us. But once everyone sees Cap in action kicking ass his costumes "cheesiness" will be a non-factor.

[chris moore]

Idea: They could have them in his 1940's uniform. Then when he is presented with his uniform in the modern era, it too has wings. But Cap asks that they be removed, explaining that during the war they got shredded or ripped from his mask so often. "Better to leave out the wings than have the American people see the wings of liberty broken and limp" he could say. Thereby suggesting the WW2 military was more concerned with presenting his image to the soldiers on the battlefield for both morale and intimidation than they were the functionality of running across a field of mud, mines and bullets.

[marcvader]

I really think the wings will be a non-issue by the end of the movie and nothing more than part of his uniform.

[RAMORE]

WINGS ________________or__________________________ NO WINGS
http://a.abcnews.com/images/Entertainment/ht_captainamerica_070307_ssv.jpghttp://captain-america.us/articles/captain_america.jpg


I've been thinking about this a lot, and I have to say, I can't IMAGINE them giving cap the wings.

I understand "they're iconic", "that's what makes his costume special" ect. ect.

But the feathers simply don't make any sense for the general viewing audience.

The ONLY way they would do them is if it were useful for an antenna or something ala Batman Begins, but even in Batman Begins they made him LOOK like a bat and that is all the justification needed.

Here, the ONLY real reason to give him wings is to make him look like his "cartoon" counterpart, and I don't have much faith that the execs behind this are going to give a crap about that.

I'm not sure I agree with it, but I can see the logic - let's be honest, Captain America is already on the verge of being cheesball given his costume, his name, and his boy scout attitude. I can imagine the studio is going to do EVERYTHING they can to give him credibility in the eyes of the general audience, and little feathers on his head would probably be the first to go.

Under this logic you might as well take off the A and the star as well. For that matter the suit is too bright lets go with green fatigues and or Black leather ala xmen:whatever:

[RAMORE]

They give a different all over look though.

And Lixdexia: The movies you're talking about as examples of radical change over faithful adaptation are those preceding Iron Man and Incredible Hulk when Marvel had little control.

How about the wings if they were this kinda size? This isn't a bad example of a real life mask:
http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m211/swftoys/statues/marvelcaparchive014.jpg

Hey I want that mask where did you find it?

[chris moore]

randomly on google images. "Captain america mask"

This guy has made a half decent attempt at a faithful costume. I think he may have used the mask above. The scales don't look too bad either, though the whole thing is ill fitting.
http://techrepublic.com.com/2346-22_11-191950-31.html

[jpmuftak]

Under this logic you might as well take off the A and the star as well. For that matter the suit is too bright lets go with green fatigues and or Black leather ala xmen:whatever:

I know you were being tongue and cheek, but I do agree about the A being taken off for the same reasons. However the suit colors do have significance in that they are the "beacon" of patriotism that Cap is supposed to represent.
I guess you could make that argument for the "A" but the wings? no.

[Jerkofwonder]

A part of me wants the wings, but another part says no. I think the perfect thing to do is his WWII outfit from The Ultimates in battle, and the Classic cap outfit for press and propaganda stuff. Then in The Avengers give him a blend of the more modern 616, and the Ultimates vol.2 cap. With the helmet and chinstrap.

[Faded To Deaf]

I want to see some form of wings, either stitched on or with little plastic things, just something to pay homage.

[MarvelFanClub]

i hope he has the wings on his head

[Deaths Head II]

I too hope he has the wings. The Ultimates outfit never looked right to me without them.

[Scarecrow_King]

I'm not really a big fan of the Ultimate outfit as a whole. Don't get me wrong, I like some parts of it. it does seem more practical than the 616 version, but I don't think that there should be ANY grey on Cap's costume. I'm fine without the pirate boots. But I don't like the stars on his shoulders either. they're unecessary and just clutter the costume.

[Faded To Deaf]

The stars aren't a big deal, getting rid of them is quite easy. However, you don't honestly think they are going to give him pirate boots in a live action movie, do you?

[lixdexia]

I know you were being tongue and cheek, but I do agree about the A being taken off for the same reasons. However the suit colors do have significance in that they are the "beacon" of patriotism that Cap is supposed to represent.
I guess you could make that argument for the "A" but the wings? no.
how can you make an argument for the a and not the wings!?! just say that it's a personal preference and stop trying to justify it

[Jerkofwonder]

I'm not really a big fan of the Ultimate outfit as a whole. Don't get me wrong, I like some parts of it. it does seem more practical than the 616 version, but I don't think that there should be ANY grey on Cap's costume. I'm fine without the pirate boots. But I don't like the stars on his shoulders either. they're unecessary and just clutter the costume.
I agree with most of that... except he does not wear pirate boots in The Ultimates.

[jpmuftak]

how can you make an argument for the a and not the wings!?! just say that it's a personal preference and stop trying to justify it

You must have misunderstood my point.

My point was that you can make an argument that the "A" is on some level an american propaganda device. The wings however have absolutely NOTHING to do with ANYTHING. The only thing remotely close to american about them is if they are an homage to the Bald Eagle...I don't think so.

Bottom line is I don't like either the "A" or the wings.

[lixdexia]

You must have misunderstood my point.

My point was that you can make an argument that the "A" is on some level an american propaganda device. The wings however have absolutely NOTHING to do with ANYTHING. The only thing remotely close to american about them is if they are an homage to the Bald Eagle...I don't think so.

Bottom line is I don't like either the "A" or the wings.
i understood your post fine, but you undermine your point in that you, who say they represent nothing, have clearly pointed out that they represent in your attack of them. it's your preference, you don't like the a or the wings? that's cool, you don't have to but just admit that the reason you don't want them is because you don't like them and stop saying they serve no perpose

[Gamma Goliath]

people bicker about his like they bickered about abominations ears.
IMO they're not that important.

[lixdexia]

people bicker about his like they bickered about abominations ears.
IMO they're not that important.
i'd like to see them, and i'd be upset if they weren't there, but no they're not crucial. all i'm pointing out is that they serve the exact same purpose as every other element of his costume, to propagandise america in a visually intresting way.

[Jerkofwonder]

i'd like to see them, and i'd be upset if they weren't there, but no they're not crucial. all i'm pointing out is that they serve the exact same purpose as every other element of his costume, to propagandise america in a visually intresting way.
Which is exactly why his classic WW2 outfit should be untouched, in propaganda and press events. But there is no way in hell he would wear that in Battle. This is supposed to be semi-believable on film and not only would any soldier absolutely refuse to wear that in battle, but it serves no tactical purpose, and why where the propoganda machine suit when the only ones seeing it are the Nazi's and Japanese? That's why I think he should have the Ultimate WW2 outfit in battle. And a mix of modern 616 and modern Ultimate in avengers. I'd like to see the wings incorporated in some way. Maybe jutting out, but still connected to the head peice all along each feather.

[TheVileOne]

Abomination ears are important! Leterrier also lied and said they would be in there.

Also, yes, keep the wings. Its like saying you need to ditch the bolts on Flash's mask. You keep them.

[lixdexia]

Which is exactly why his classic WW2 outfit should be untouched, in propaganda and press events. But there is no way in hell he would wear that in Battle. This is supposed to be semi-believable on film and not only would any soldier absolutely refuse to wear that in battle, but it serves no tactical purpose, and why where the propoganda machine suit when the only ones seeing it are the Nazi's and Japanese? That's why I think he should have the Ultimate WW2 outfit in battle. And a mix of modern 616 and modern Ultimate in avengers. I'd like to see the wings incorporated in some way. Maybe jutting out, but still connected to the head peice all along each feather.
if you're going to go that route why not just have him in fatigues? no, he wears the suit in battle because it's demoralizing for the enemy. i'd like to see the ultimate ww2 suit too, but it's no less ridiculous looking than any other cap costume.

[bunk]

I would be fine with the wings being represented as patches on the side of his mask or some sort of embroidery.

[Daredevil_2003]

I like the idea of them being painted on or at least updated/streamlined/whatever the hell you wanna call to look less flimsy and more BA...like have them coming directly out of the cowl/helmet rather than attached to the thin thingamajigs...ya, I know...that made a lot of sense. Think really small, wing shaped version of the ears on Wolverine's mask, is the best I can compare what I'm thinking, right now.

[Jerkofwonder]

if you're going to go that route why not just have him in fatigues? no, he wears the suit in battle because it's demoralizing for the enemy. i'd like to see the ultimate ww2 suit too, but it's no less ridiculous looking than any other cap costume.
It is absolutely less ridiculous because it is essentially fatigues. And it does the same thing in demoralizing the enemy while at the same time serving tactical functions. The classic suit goes to far over the top to be featured in WW2 battles. The Ultimate WW2 suit is just the right balance.

I like the idea of them being painted on or at least updated/streamlined/whatever the hell you wanna call to look less flimsy and more BA...like have them coming directly out of the cowl/helmet rather than attached to the thin thingamajigs...ya, I know...that made a lot of sense. Think really small, wing shaped version of the ears on Wolverine's mask, is the best I can compare what I'm thinking, right now.
I get what you mean, that is what I was saying too.

[lixdexia]

i'd like to see the wings as a single solid manufactured piece like the ones on the mask on this page

[chris moore]

Okay - for all the "Costume only for media and propaganda" and "Wings are for propaganda" people: You know that the term Propaganda is to provide or force information, reading and press for the purpose of insulting, injuring or damaging a person or institution right?

You really think thats the correct term to keep throwing out there to describe Cap's PROMOTION of American ideals and his increase MORALE of Allied Troops and Public alike?

[afan]

The whole concept of one costume for "the media" and one for action, is misguided at best. It just makes Cap too madison ave-like.

[Daredevil_2003]

From teh encyclom0pedophilia:

Propaganda is the dissemination of information aimed at influencing the opinions or behaviors of large numbers of people. As opposed to impartially providing information, propaganda in its most basic sense presents information in order to influence its audience. Propaganda often presents facts selectively (thus lying by omission) to encourage a particular synthesis, or gives loaded messages in order to produce an emotional rather than rational response to the information presented. The desired result is a change of the attitude toward the subject in the target audience to further a political agenda.

"Propaganda is the deliberate, systematic attempt to shape perceptions, manipulate cognitions, and direct behavior to achieve a response that furthers the desired intent of the propagandist."
—Garth S. Jowett and Victoria O'Donnell, Propaganda and Persuasion

[Jerkofwonder]

The whole concept of one costume for "the media" and one for action, is misguided at best. It just makes Cap too madison ave-like.
It is not misguided at all. Just because it is different from the comics and you don't like it does not make it so. Thinking that any soldeir would go into battle, or that anyone would even consider sending someone into battle in this...
http://z.about.com/d/comicbooks/1/0/3/V/captainww2.jpg

THAT is misguided. It works in comics but would never work today on film. Keep it for recruitment posters and press events.

Okay - for all the "Costume only for media and propaganda" and "Wings are for propaganda" people: You know that the term Propaganda is to provide or force information, reading and press for the purpose of insulting, injuring or damaging a person or institution right?

You really think thats the correct term to keep throwing out there to describe Cap's PROMOTION of American ideals and his increase MORALE of Allied Troops and Public alike?
LOL, you have no idea what you are talking about.

[marcvader]

I for one don't wan't two cotumes with different purposes. I understand having different costumes out of development, theres the fatigue and helmet one for training and possibly his first mission in secret. Then there's the one everyone sees. The one everyone wants, wings included.

[Jerkofwonder]

Military personnel always have multiple uniforms. It would be absurd to assume in cap's situation that he would not have a uniform for battle and a uniform for press events.

[marcvader]

His uniform for press events is Army Suit all soldiers wear. There's not going to be two simulteaneous costumes. This is still a comicbook movie and he'll have the one costume.

[DJ Kornphlake]

It is not misguided at all. Just because it is different from the comics and you don't like it does not make it so. Thinking that any soldeir would go into battle, or that anyone would even consider sending someone into battle in this...
http://z.about.com/d/comicbooks/1/0/3/V/captainww2.jpg

THAT is misguided. It works in comics but would never work today on film.

He's a superhero, not a regular soldier. Why wouldn't that work on film?

[Jerkofwonder]

No, he's a super soldier. He becomes a super hero later.

[marcvader]

Right, but the costume he wears as a superhero is the same one he wears as a supersoldier.

[Jerkofwonder]

Right, but the costume he wears as a superhero is the same one he wears as a supersoldier.
In the comics I know. But I don't think it would work on film. And it just doesn't make sense.

[marcvader]

It will work. People are getting way too negative. As has been said many times on this thread, If the movie is well written, well acted, and well directed to the fullest the audience will take the ride and eat it all up once they see Cap kicking ass on the battle field. I agree some parts of his costume will have to be tweaked, boots for instance, but on the whole I think we'll get stunning visuals of Cap doing crazy **** under enemy fire wearing his trademark red, white , and blue the whole way. The same costume he wears on the battle field will be the one he wears in front of the cameras.

[JackIvyGB]

Because despite the group of people he operates with in current times (the avengers, a group of superheroes), it was called the super SOLDIER formula/project, not the super HERO formula/project. They set out to make a better, stronger soldier. When Steve signed up for the project, he understood he was being made into a better soldier, not a superhero. Not saying that Steve would have turned it down if they called it that, but that's not the case. I think Steve may have raised an eye brow if they sent him into battle in the classic Cap costume (talking movies/real life now, as opposed to comics where anything goes). It's one thing to send someone into battle in a red white and blue uniform, it's another to send them in looking like a human cartoon of the flag. Yes, Cap should function as a mascot for troop morale and supporting the troops. But he's also a soldier. He can afford not to wear camoflauge. That's why he gets away with the flag colored uniform. However, to go with the full classic suit in battle is a little much.

It's like this. Look at a basketball game. You've got the mascot, running the sidelines, keeping up the hype and energy and morale of both the crowd and team (at least that's their purpose), wearing the school colors, energetic, etc. But the team itself, out there getting the job done, wears a uniform ready for what it is they are getting into. Still the same colors, same school, same energy, still inspiring to the team (or troops in Cap's case) and supporters, but more "battle ready", if you will. How silly would it look if the mascot was running the court with everyone else? Cap pulls double duty as a mascot and a "team captain" if you will. Now, obviously it's not as drastic with Cap not having a bobble head during mascot mode, but the point remains. The costume needs to fit the situation. Spidey is a youthful, humorous, energetic acrobat, and as such, the tights work for his character on film. Batman is a detective, a brutal fighter, rich and super-powerless, so it makes sense for his suit to have more inventive protective armor in movies. Cap is a soldier. He thinks of himself as a soldier and was designed and intended (in the comics) to be a soldier, super or not.

[DJ Kornphlake]

It's not supposed to be realistic. It doesn't have to make "sense" in that regard.

[Jerkofwonder]

It's not supposed to be realistic. It doesn't have to make "sense" in that regard.
Yes it does. Because the comic fans who will accept it are not enough to make this movie not flop. And before you say a Cap movie could not flop... look at how many other super hero icons have flopped at least once. Pretty much all of them.

[afan]

Captain America is a super-hero. It is the genre to which he belongs, and super heros wear flambouyant costumes. Whether he considers himself a soldier or not is irrelevant.

[Lobo]

How would you guys feel with this?

http://img348.imageshack.us/img348/4929/074kr.jpg

He'd get a modernized version in Avengers

[Lobo]

How would you guys feel with this?

http://img348.imageshack.us/img348/4929/074kr.jpg

He'd get a modernized version in Avengers

[Jerkofwonder]

How would you guys feel with this?

http://img348.imageshack.us/img348/4929/074kr.jpg

He'd get a modernized version in Avengers

I think that is the perfect way to go. As I said before. He's still got the A, the red white and blue scheme, the star, and the old shield, which I think he should keep the whole movie. And yet it still looks like a military unifrom. The shield, I think he should only use the round one in modern times. Have it be technological and built by Tony Stark, as we see it in Iron Man.

[DJ Kornphlake]

Yes it does. Because the comic fans who will accept it are not enough to make this movie not flop. And before you say a Cap movie could not flop... look at how many other super hero icons have flopped at least once. Pretty much all of them.
They didn't flop because of their costumes. This is a character who's going to be fighting alongside a Norse thunder god in his next movie. How realistic is that?

[JackIvyGB]

If realism didn't factor in at least to some degree, you would have been able to see Iron Man's muscles through his suit, the way it was drawn for so long until Adi Granov and others began depicting it more plausibly. If it didn't matter, we would have gotten Doc Ock in green and yellow tights. If it didn't matter, the division between 2 face's scarred and clean sides in TDK would have been drawn with a ruler. The list goes on. Yes, to comic fans it's anything goes sometimes, but to the general public, the difference between ridiculous and plausible within the realm of the material can be something so superficially trivial as what shade of green the hulk is.

And that's what you have to look at. Realism is not a great word to use. A better way to put it is the ability to create a level of plausibility that operates in conjunction with the general audience and also with the source material in a way that doesn't force viewers to make leaps to buy into situations or take them out of the submersive story, but still respects the material. Of course that's a rather lengthy way to say it, so most people just say "Let's inject some realism" :yay:

Am I saying wings will kill the movie? No. Am I saying that removing them wins oscars? No. But I can just hear it now:

The audience watches as american forces charge into the nazi outpost, fighting their hearts out. Suddenly, it looks as though one of the Americans is going to get killed as a Nazi attacks from behind! He rears up to strike and--BAM! Out of nowhere, it's our hero, Captain America, there to save his ally! He continues to pwn Germans left and right in a fantastic display of skilled movements and hand to hand combat, not to mention his wicked shield maneuvers. The audience watches in stunned silence until finally the action stops, and on screen we finally get a full shot of the good captain. He looks awesome. Close up on his head/face as he breathes heavy, exasperated, but victorious. Finally, 2 rows ahead of you, someone picks their jaw up off the floor and speaks:

"*smirk* Dude, look at his little wings..."
And everyone does..and they giggle with him.
Sure, theatre won't erupt in laughter over something so small, but everyone heard it. And now they'll think about it everytime they see it. Later on in the film, Cap is in a tight spot. Maybe it's the scene where he takes his fateful plunge into the cold sea to be frozen for a later time. We're on the edge of our seats, because for all those who don't know Cap's story, our hero is about to give his final breath in defense of his beloved country. And what do you hear:

"Quick Cap, use your little wings!!1!" *more immature smirks*
It kills the moment.

Sure, these people are jerks, and everyone is probably thinking, if not saying "Shut up you terd!" But still, it's in their heads. And later, they start thinking "Ya know, they do look a little silly. Why does he have them?"

It's not a huge deal, but isn't easier to avoid the situation?
Personally, I say having them as little hard sculpted pieces stuck on the sides of his cowl/mask/helmet/whatever is a great idea. They'd have to be flat against it though. Why stick something on that just looks like it's going to break off?

And why wouldn't it matter that cap sees himself as a soldier? He should really only start to be seen as a superhero when he joins the Avengers. Even still, that's only how the PUBLIC sees him. Whether that influences his wardrobe choice is up to interpretation, but it shouldn't change how he goes about his job.

Lobo, that suit and idea is something I'd love to see personally, at least in concept. As far as that suit being "updated", your meaning something other than the Ultimates suit with the chinstrap I presume? Sounds intriguing... As far as that suit in WW2, most definitely.
:)

[Daredevil_2003]

http://img348.imageshack.us/img348/4929/074kr.jpg

That would be my dream come true for WWII Cap, I've said it before and I'll say it again that is perfect!

For Avengers? I dunno...I was set on straight ultimate style but now I really don't know what I'd like to see, asides from no pirate boots/gloves and no scale/chainmail, my opinion on it changes like the wind, as of late...

[Faded To Deaf]

How would you guys feel with this?

http://img348.imageshack.us/img348/4929/074kr.jpg

He'd get a modernized version in Avengers

That would be perfect for appearing in WWII, very iconic.

[JackIvyGB]

As for Cap next to Thor, as I said, plausible within the realm of the material and the connection to the audience:
http://i459.photobucket.com/albums/qq320/JackIvyGB/thor20ages20of20thunder_preview.jpg

I'd be able to buy into that a bit more than this:
http://i459.photobucket.com/albums/qq320/JackIvyGB/204_20060317052537_char.jpg

[Jerkofwonder]

Yes, and it could be perfectly compliment with this uniform...

http://z.about.com/d/comicbooks/1/0/3/V/captainww2.jpg
For propaganda posters and press events. =D

[Brian Braddock]

I bet if you were to give the costume in the 2nd pic the colours of the costume in the first, it wouldnt look so outlandish.

[Jerkofwonder]

There wasn't much scale mail in WW2. Also the mask just doesn't work for the setting.

[jpmuftak]

If realism didn't factor in at least to some degree, you would have been able to see Iron Man's muscles through his suit, the way it was drawn for so long until Adi Granov and others began depicting it more plausibly. If it didn't matter, we would have gotten Doc Ock in green and yellow tights. If it didn't matter, the division between 2 face's scarred and clean sides in TDK would have been drawn with a ruler. The list goes on. Yes, to comic fans it's anything goes sometimes, but to the general public, the difference between ridiculous and plausible within the realm of the material can be something so superficially trivial as what shade of green the hulk is.

And that's what you have to look at. Realism is not a great word to use. A better way to put it is the ability to create a level of plausibility that operates in conjunction with the general audience and also with the source material in a way that doesn't force viewers to make leaps to buy into situations or take them out of the submersive story, but still respects the material. Of course that's a rather lengthy way to say it, so most people just say "Let's inject some realism" :yay:

Am I saying wings will kill the movie? No. Am I saying that removing them wins oscars? No. But I can just hear it now:

The audience watches as american forces charge into the nazi outpost, fighting their hearts out. Suddenly, it looks as though one of the Americans is going to get killed as a Nazi attacks from behind! He rears up to strike and--BAM! Out of nowhere, it's our hero, Captain America, there to save his ally! He continues to pwn Germans left and right in a fantastic display of skilled movements and hand to hand combat, not to mention his wicked shield maneuvers. The audience watches in stunned silence until finally the action stops, and on screen we finally get a full shot of the good captain. He looks awesome. Close up on his head/face as he breathes heavy, exasperated, but victorious. Finally, 2 rows ahead of you, someone picks their jaw up off the floor and speaks:

"*smirk* Dude, look at his little wings..."
And everyone does..and they giggle with him.
Sure, theatre won't erupt in laughter over something so small, but everyone heard it. And now they'll think about it everytime they see it. Later on in the film, Cap is in a tight spot. Maybe it's the scene where he takes his fateful plunge into the cold sea to be frozen for a later time. We're on the edge of our seats, because for all those who don't know Cap's story, our hero is about to give his final breath in defense of his beloved country. And what do you hear:

"Quick Cap, use your little wings!!1!" *more immature smirks*
It kills the moment.

Sure, these people are jerks, and everyone is probably thinking, if not saying "Shut up you terd!" But still, it's in their heads. And later, they start thinking "Ya know, they do look a little silly. Why does he have them?"

It's not a huge deal, but isn't easier to avoid the situation?
Personally, I say having them as little hard sculpted pieces stuck on the sides of his cowl/mask/helmet/whatever is a great idea. They'd have to be flat against it though. Why stick something on that just looks like it's going to break off?

And why wouldn't it matter that cap sees himself as a soldier? He should really only start to be seen as a superhero when he joins the Avengers. Even still, that's only how the PUBLIC sees him. Whether that influences his wardrobe choice is up to interpretation, but it shouldn't change how he goes about his job.

Lobo, that suit and idea is something I'd love to see personally, at least in concept. As far as that suit being "updated", your meaning something other than the Ultimates suit with the chinstrap I presume? Sounds intriguing... As far as that suit in WW2, most definitely.
:)

Bravo.:up:

[lixdexia]

There wasn't much scale mail in WW2. Also the mask just doesn't work for the setting.
there were also no government programs that took a skinny, sickly young man and through chemical process advanced him to the peak of human physical performance...but if i'll buy that happening in a movie then i'll buy the guy in a mask

[Jerkofwonder]

Do you know what suspension of disbelief is?

[chris moore]

As "faithful" as we would like the material to be. You have to consider the wider audience who know Captain America as a Superhero, not a supersoldier. Put up a guy on a movie poster in military fatigues or give him two uniforms for the movie and the general public are going to wonder what makes him so special for the war effort if he's just a stronger, faster GIJOE

[lixdexia]

Do you know what suspension of disbelief is?
yes, and since i fully expect to see the aforementioned process and a guy who's head is a mutilated red skull, a mask isn't so fantastic that i'm going to be sitting in the theater going "well THAT is the straw that broke that camel's back!"

[Jerkofwonder]

Your response would leave me to believe you don't know the principle behind suspension of disbelief. You can't just assume one thing will be accepted because something more unrealistic is. The more things the audience might call into to question the worse off you are. Now while the SSS is essential to the character, the bright shiney blue uniform being on the battlefield is not. In movies people will take impossible much easier than implausible. People go into the movie ready to believe the impossible, not the implausible or silly.

[Jerkofwonder]

As "faithful" as we would like the material to be. You have to consider the wider audience who know Captain America as a Superhero, not a supersoldier. Put up a guy on a movie poster in military fatigues or give him two uniforms for the movie and the general public are going to wonder what makes him so special for the war effort if he's just a stronger, faster GIJOE

Have you even looked at the Ultimate WW2 outfit we are talking about? It is clearly Captain America, and does not just look like a stronger faster GIJOE.

[chris moore]

Think of it this way: You're an American citizen back in 1942. You go to the cinema on a friday to watch the cartoon, the piss poor black and white movie, and the news reel they always put on. Its wartime, and so the biggest story, and all the footage is of the boys out there fighting. Amidst the gunfire and the obvious death comes a shining blue beacon of American patriotism who, despite wearing the american flag as if it were his own skin and only carrying a shield (no gun visible), he's not getting hit by the bullets, he's not getting caught in the mud, he's not setting off the mines; he's darting across the battlefield and taking out the enemy as if he's frickin' Superman. He stands out, he can do things no ordinary soldier can do. And with his example, and his leadership on the field, the other soldiers are doing better than before and believe now more than ever that its not hopeless and that they can win!

You leave the cinema feeling the same way. Now, stick a green fatigues guy in that same news reel and you just don't see it the same way. Its the same for the modern audience who know full well its a made up bloke. But they feel hopeful and excited anyway.

[marcvader]

I guarantee the Cap movie will be made along the vein of Superman and Spiderman mixed with the Rocketeer. It'll be a family friendly superhero movie. Cap is not a b list Superhero by the way and it's not going to be the first time they've seen him. It won't be a surprise to anyone, what he looks like and all of a sudden put people off because of what he was wearing in all his history and trailers and posters available before the movie comes out. His death was documented on all the major news outlets for crying out loud. People know who he is or atleast have an idea. The way he looks won't surprise anyone.

[chris moore]

Have you even looked at the Ultimate WW2 outfit we are talking about? It is clearly Captain America, and does not just look like a stronger faster GIJOE.

I'm saying the Ultimate WW2 Cap uniform for WW2 and the 616 or Ultimate would be fine and great - its not having a Cap uniform or even a costume for his actual war missions in WW2 and only having the suit for "media" that I completely disagree with

[lixdexia]

I'm saying the Ultimate WW2 Cap uniform for WW2 and the 616 or Ultimate would be fine and great - its not having a Cap uniform or even a costume for his actual war missions in WW2 and only having the suit for "media" that I completely disagree with
same here.

as long as it's a cap suit i'll be ok, but it needs to be just one suit.

[jpmuftak]

Think of it this way: You're an American citizen back in 1942. You go to the cinema on a friday to watch the cartoon, the piss poor black and white movie, and the news reel they always put on. Its wartime, and so the biggest story, and all the footage is of the boys out there fighting. Amidst the gunfire and the obvious death comes a shining blue beacon of American patriotism who, despite wearing the american flag as if it were his own skin and only carrying a shield (no gun visible), he's not getting hit by the bullets, he's not getting caught in the mud, he's not setting off the mines; he's darting across the battlefield and taking out the enemy as if he's frickin' Superman. He stands out, he can do things no ordinary soldier can do. And with his example, and his leadership on the field, the other soldiers are doing better than before and believe now more than ever that its not hopeless and that they can win!

You leave the cinema feeling the same way. Now, stick a green fatigues guy in that same news reel and you just don't see it the same way. Its the same for the modern audience who know full well its a made up bloke. But they feel hopeful and excited anyway.

If I were going to the movies in 1942 I wouldn't see a bright blue anything...it would all be black and white, plus it wouldn't matter what the hell the guy is wearing, if he is doing all of that amazing stuff I would crap my pants with red white and blue patriotism.

[chris moore]

Okay, okay. It'd be B&W anyway. And yes, because its too fantastic to comprehend, and if it were your first time yes you'd crap your pants. But the point is still the same. The feeling you'd get from seeing the flag on a guy doing that is way more positive than seeing a guy in plain, wooly, baggy combats do the same things.

[Lobo]

How would you guys feel with this costume

http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/9537/capfinoj7.jpg

And have him get a modernized version when he is thawed out in Avengers?

[jpmuftak]

How would you guys feel with this costume

http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/9537/capfinoj7.jpg

And have him get a modernized version when he is thawed out in Avengers?

It just makes SO much sense, I can't see why people want tights in ww2.:woot:

[Faded To Deaf]

How would you guys feel with this costume

http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/9537/capfinoj7.jpg

And have him get a modernized version when he is thawed out in Avengers?

That's what I would want.

....and I'm saving that image.:oldrazz:

[ChickenScratch]

I like that.

[Lobo]

Yay. Here's one more I found

http://i44.tinypic.com/2yni1w2.jpg

[marcvader]

http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/8110/captainamerica01nr0.jpg


This is what I want to see in First Avenger. He can start in fatigues and helmet but I want it to evolve to this. This is Cap in the 40's.

[DJ Kornphlake]

It just makes SO much sense, I can't see why people want tights in ww2.:woot:
No one is saying they want tights, just something else than muted blue fatigues.

[Jerkofwonder]

I'm saying the Ultimate WW2 Cap uniform for WW2 and the 616 or Ultimate would be fine and great - its not having a Cap uniform or even a costume for his actual war missions in WW2 and only having the suit for "media" that I completely disagree with
No one is saying he should have regular fatigues though, we are saying he should have the Ultimate WW2 outfit in this movie. My personal opinion for avengers would be a cross between modern 616 and modern Ultimate.

Here are some good pics.
http://captain-america.us/wallpaper/images/cap_quote.JPG
http://fc03.deviantart.com/fs22/i/2007/316/2/1/Veterans_Day_Cap_colored_by_ragnarok2k3.jpg

[Jerkofwonder]

http://www.francescofrancavilla.com/commissions/images/cap_america_vi_low.jpghttp://www.stardestroyer.net/Armour/UltimateCap.jpghttp://animated-views.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/12/ult22.jpg

[lixdexia]

i like that suit, the mask just just needs to be changed imo

[marcvader]

I'm cool with the fatigue's just don't want to see him in them the entire time and I'm not wanting two costumes. I want him to evolve into something closer to what he has worn for over 70 yrs.

[Drakon]

http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h56/themancalledbat/capcopy-1.png


I like this overall.

Also, AMAZING Avatar. I damn near peed myself.


http://fc03.deviantart.com/fs22/i/2007/316/2/1/Veterans_Day_Cap_colored_by_ragnarok2k3.jpg

Jesus, he must be from Chincinnati.

[Jerkofwonder]

I think the mask works to well with the rest of the suit to change it. IMO that is the perfect way to portray Cap during WWII.

[chris moore]

I think we need some photo manips to sway the naysayers about him wearing the costume in action during WW2. I tried looking for a suitable photo of an American WW2 army uniform to start from, but couldnt find the right kinda one.

[afan]

How would you guys feel with this costume

http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/9537/capfinoj7.jpg

And have him get a modernized version when he is thawed out in Avengers?

Captain America.........starring Don Knotts?

[Lobo]

Thanks for commenting on the costume.

[afan]

Thanks for commenting on the costume.

If I offended....I apologize.

Disregarding the drawing( the helmet and clothing look a size or so too big, hence the Knotts reference)and solely focus on the costume design........

If Captain America slogged thru foxholes, struggled up hillsides gaining ground inches every hour, and hunkered down behind cover waiting for artillery to soften the enemy before advancing, then by all means but him in this outfit, hell give him a rifle, grenades, canteen, K rations, folding trench shovel, and a bayonet!

However, that's not what he does! He leaps over foxholes, and effortlessly sprints up hillsides. His super serum enhanced , speed, strength, agility, senses, and intelligence allows him to penetrate the enemies defense, leading the way for assaulting troops that may follow. The amazing acrobatic maneuvers that he finds natural would dictate the abandonment of the restrctive nature of helmets, ammo belts, back packs, sacks, woolen knit turtlenecks, and army boots. His costume must have an emphasis on fantastic freedom of movement equal to his ability to move fantastically free.

Several posts back, JackIvyGB used a basketball team( mascot and players) in an analogy to defend soldier attire for Cap in action, but I think that inadvertently he proved the opposite. Cap's movements in action are similar to those of the most athletic player, magnified ten fold, and just as a b-ball players outfit allows for freedom of movement, Cap's attire must facillitate extreme and impossible acrobatics.

[Drakon]

Captain America.........starring Don Knotts?

"There's way too many nazis. Why are there so many nazis? The brochure said there would only be a few nazis. This is a terrible war!"

[DJ Kornphlake]

:pal:

[November Rain]

anyone who doesn't think he's gonna be in his ultimate get up initially is kinda fooling themselves.

[DJ Kornphlake]

Or just have a difference of opinion.

[Brian Braddock]

Yeah, based on the fact that we literally have no information so far;

I'd say that most anyones viewpoint on this is as good as anyone elses.

[afan]

Forgive me, couldn't resist......
Nazis beware, he's comin to "Nip It!"

[DJ Kornphlake]

:applaud:lmao:

[Jerkofwonder]

If I offended....I apologize.

Disregarding the drawing( the helmet and clothing look a size or so too big, hence the Knotts reference)and solely focus on the costume design........

If Captain America slogged thru foxholes, struggled up hillsides gaining ground inches every hour, and hunkered down behind cover waiting for artillery to soften the enemy before advancing, then by all means but him in this outfit, hell give him a rifle, grenades, canteen, K rations, folding trench shovel, and a bayonet!

However, that's not what he does! He leaps over foxholes, and effortlessly sprints up hillsides. His super serum enhanced , speed, strength, agility, senses, and intelligence allows him to penetrate the enemies defense, leading the way for assaulting troops that may follow. The amazing acrobatic maneuvers that he finds natural would dictate the abandonment of the restrctive nature of helmets, ammo belts, back packs, sacks, woolen knit turtlenecks, and army boots. His costume must have an emphasis on fantastic freedom of movement equal to his ability to move fantastically free.

Several posts back, JackIvyGB used a basketball team( mascot and players) in an analogy to defend soldier attire for Cap in action, but I think that inadvertently he proved the opposite. Cap's movements in action are similar to those of the most athletic player, magnified ten fold, and just as a b-ball players outfit allows for freedom of movement, Cap's attire must facillitate extreme and impossible acrobatics.

Instead of going to that cartoonish level would it not be better to strike a balance between the two? A super hero as you describe it completely clashes with the tone of WWII. As good as the old cap comics were they in no way captured the feel of the war. The first few pages of the Ultimates managed to take Cap as he was, and tone it down a little, throwing in the soldier aspect that should have been there from the start and you get the perfect balance of super and soldier.

[Daredevil_2003]

^ What he said....

[lixdexia]

I like this overall.

Also, AMAZING Avatar. I damn near peed myself.
danke x2

and yes, i want the feel of the first issue of the ultimates to permeate throughout this movie

[November Rain]

Or just have a difference of opinion.
it's fine to want anything you want. It is very likely for the ultimate ww2 suit to be used

it really is a no brainer.

when odds are that high, there's no point drawing it out. it'd be like myself wanting another actor to play spidey, it's not gonna happen so why draw it out.

[DJ Kornphlake]

It's not drawing anything out when we have virtually no information on this movie other than it's coming out. We have no idea what the tone will be. It's all speculation at this point, and people are simply putting in their two cents.

[Drakon]

So long as Cap is the badass he could be, I don't particularly mind if they take a few liberties with his suit [pun intended].

danke x2

and yes, i want the feel of the first issue of the ultimates to permeate throughout this movie

Seriously, how are your avatars so win? This GL one is almost as good as the last one. :yay:

[Compi716]

If Captain America slogged thru foxholes, struggled up hillsides gaining ground inches every hour, and hunkered down behind cover waiting for artillery to soften the enemy before advancing, then by all means but him in this outfit, hell give him a rifle, grenades, canteen, K rations, folding trench shovel, and a bayonet!

However, that's not what he does! He leaps over foxholes, and effortlessly sprints up hillsides. His super serum enhanced , speed, strength, agility, senses, and intelligence allows him to penetrate the enemies defense, leading the way for assaulting troops that may follow. The amazing acrobatic maneuvers that he finds natural would dictate the abandonment of the restrctive nature of helmets, ammo belts, back packs, sacks, woolen knit turtlenecks, and army boots. His costume must have an emphasis on fantastic freedom of movement equal to his ability to move fantastically free.

Several posts back, JackIvyGB used a basketball team( mascot and players) in an analogy to defend soldier attire for Cap in action, but I think that inadvertently he proved the opposite. Cap's movements in action are similar to those of the most athletic player, magnified ten fold, and just as a b-ball players outfit allows for freedom of movement, Cap's attire must facillitate extreme and impossible acrobatics.
Thank you.

[Scarecrow_King]

Instead of going to that cartoonish level would it not be better to strike a balance between the two? A super hero as you describe it completely clashes with the tone of WWII. As good as the old cap comics were they in no way captured the feel of the war. The first few pages of the Ultimates managed to take Cap as he was, and tone it down a little, throwing in the soldier aspect that should have been there from the start and you get the perfect balance of super and soldier.

but isn't that kinda the point of cap? you've got this awful war with everybody in olive drabs. that doesn't really do much to improve the morale of the troops. but seeing this guy in bright vibrant colors, doing things no other guy can do would give 'em a little hope. it would brighten up the war for them, and probably give them some hope that they were gonna make it outta there alive.

[Jerkofwonder]

He still has the colors. They express exactly what you say in the opening to The Ultimates without making it so cartoonish. Make him the happy go lucky character on posters and news reels, but not on the battlefield. That would never work on film. WW2 is far to serious in tone. People didn't realize it as much back when the cap comics came out.

You don't win battles flipping around and kicking people. The idea of him doing that and never getting shot is more than movie going audiences will accept. Show off his tactical genius, complimented by his physical power more than his ability to do flips and cartwheels.

It still works.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WXIwV3p1bA
That is still clearly Captain America, doing exactly what you said in a much more realistic way.

[gingysheringham]

http://img348.imageshack.us/img348/4929/074kr.jpg


imo this is the costume for ww2. but have the gloves and leg warmer ( lol) things red, his cowl blue and less......... bird like. also i think wings should be painted on his helmet just like the "a" .and maybe instead of the turtle neck he could wear a blue scarf thing ( yanno like what rorshach has)

i think when steve rogers is endowed with his super powers they should give him his "swash buckler" outfit for press and stuff. but then when its over he's like "get me outta this stuff!" and chooses a cotume that is more similar to his "comrades".

http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/wp-content/2007/10/CaptainAmericaAlexRossSketch3.jpg

then when he is unfrozen he is given something like this, more police like as i suppose in the future he will be more policeman than soldier


here is something i just chucked together
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3427/3390563839_6cd203f108.jpg?v=0

[Faded To Deaf]

http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/wp-content/2007/10/CaptainAmericaAlexRossSketch3.jpg



It's good for Bucky, but I would prefer the classic Rogers look much more -- minus the pirate boots.

[lixdexia]

the "leg warmers" are called spats, and were standard issue for american troops when we entered the war

[jpmuftak]

He still has the colors. They express exactly what you say in the opening to The Ultimates without making it so cartoonish. Make him the happy go lucky character on posters and news reels, but not on the battlefield. That would never work on film. WW2 is far to serious in tone. People didn't realize it as much back when the cap comics came out.

You don't win battles flipping around and kicking people. The idea of him doing that and never getting shot is more than movie going audiences will accept. Show off his tactical genius, complimented by his physical power more than his ability to do flips and cartwheels.

It still works.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WXIwV3p1bA
That is still clearly Captain America, doing exactly what you said in a much more realistic way.

Thanks for posting that video, it's been a while since I've seen that, and it reminded me how much I want this movie to have emotional weight...without the feathers. :woot:

[GNR]

I'm all for a mix of the BuckCap and Ultimate versions.Nothing else would work on screen IMO.

Pirate boots?No.

Wings?No.

Chainmail during WW2?No.

[JackIvyGB]

On the subject of chainmail, I think something like what formed the under layer of the new Bat suit in TDK might be cool. You can see it's chainmail, but the "chain material" isn't very big.
Otherwise, I think he should just have a texture to his suit, at least the top half of the "shirt" anyway.

Only on his new/Avengers suit though. I vote for Ultimate WW2 for "First Avenger".

[afrayedknot]

On the subject of the wings on Cap's cowl, would people make the same argument for the wings on the Flash's cowl (I know, different universe)?

[Faded To Deaf]

At the risk of changing the subject but, all Flash incarnations, including his opposites have those wings/bolts. I would highly doubt they would leave it out.

[Shockdingo]

He still has the colors. They express exactly what you say in the opening to The Ultimates without making it so cartoonish. Make him the happy go lucky character on posters and news reels, but not on the battlefield. That would never work on film. WW2 is far to serious in tone. People didn't realize it as much back when the cap comics came out.

You don't win battles flipping around and kicking people. The idea of him doing that and never getting shot is more than movie going audiences will accept. Show off his tactical genius, complimented by his physical power more than his ability to do flips and cartwheels.

It still works.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WXIwV3p1bA
That is still clearly Captain America, doing exactly what you said in a much more realistic way.
I never saw the Ultimate Avengers movie, but that is a great example of what Cap should be doing. Tactics mixed with power and agility would work nicely, he should fight the nazis differently than he would fight a villain of the week.

[gingysheringham]

the "leg warmers" are called spats, and were standard issue for american troops when we entered the war

yeah i think they're a good way of adding red to the legs in place of the boots

[afrayedknot]

At the risk of changing the subject but, all Flash incarnations, including his opposites have those wings/bolts. I would highly doubt they would leave it out.

So, why are people discussing leaving the wings off Cap's cowl?

[Drakon]

He still has the colors. They express exactly what you say in the opening to The Ultimates without making it so cartoonish. Make him the happy go lucky character on posters and news reels, but not on the battlefield. That would never work on film. WW2 is far to serious in tone. People didn't realize it as much back when the cap comics came out.

You don't win battles flipping around and kicking people. The idea of him doing that and never getting shot is more than movie going audiences will accept. Show off his tactical genius, complimented by his physical power more than his ability to do flips and cartwheels.

It still works.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WXIwV3p1bA
That is still clearly Captain America, doing exactly what you said in a much more realistic way.

Not only that, it would make more sense for this guy to be leading a squad of superhumans.

[Faded To Deaf]

So, why are people discussing leaving the wings off Cap's cowl?

I'm not really sure, maybe because there has been a somewhat successful Captain America without them, and therefore has supporters.

[jpmuftak]

So, why are people discussing leaving the wings off Cap's cowl?

I don't mean this with ANY disrespect, but I've always thought they looked stupid. I believe there are execs, fans and general movie goers that would agree with me, therefore, maybe he won't have them.

That's it.

[louiebling$]

IMO... they wings are part of who Cap is.... which is one of the main reasons i hate ULT cap among other things.

[jpmuftak]

IMO... they wings are part of who Cap is.... which is one of the main reasons i hate ULT cap among other things.

I just don't think the wings are anymore an integral part of Cap than the black lines are to Spiderman. Or the green & yellow tights are to Doc Ock. Or the cowl is to wolverine. Or the black underwear is to Batman.

[louiebling$]

thats different... the wings are apart of the symbolism of cap... those others dont make the character... what makews doc ock... his mechanical arms... wolverine is his attitude and claws... spiderman his wittiness and Webs.... Cap his patriotism and being the symbol of hope.The red, white and blue, the star the A ,the wings. Thats all part of who Captain America is.

[Brian Braddock]

So, what do you guys think about colours?

Me? I'm all for a slightly darker (than the norm) blue and a ribrant red:-

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b64/SUPERBENITEZ/cptnacolorsforbrianbrad.jpg

[louiebling$]

i like the Blue used in Jpmuftac's Manip in his avvy

[Jerkofwonder]

I really hope we don't see the red gloves and boots. There is just no way to make that not goofy.

[Brian Braddock]

Waitaminute - no red gloves or boots because they'll look goofy?

Hell, why stop there - why have him in a costume in the 1st place? Jeez.

Y'know, I've read a few of your posts on different threads and sometimes I can only think that you say these things just to get a rise out of people........

[Jerkofwonder]

Are you serious? Just because I don't like the gloves? Notice the costume I have been ringing for the whole time does not have the red gloves? I have been extremely civil on hre, you're the one being an ass now.

[Brian Braddock]

Think that if you want, but there have been a few threads were your viewpoints are so much the polar opposite to the majority of other posters out there one cant help but wonder what the deal is.

As shocking as it may seem, there are people out there who sign up just to post deliberately inflammable comments just to stir some s*** up with the natives.

See, as I've said, I know that this isnt the only thread were youve expressed some viewpoints that differ substantiantly from the masses and you have a low post count considering you joined in '06.

I actually think what I posted was pretty fair - I dont see that as being an ass, to be honest.

At worst, I could probably be accused of being a touch cynical.

[Jerkofwonder]

I just started posting regularly. But about the gloves, it is not the polar opposite, as anyone who backs the ultimate ww2 suit is also anti-red gloves. How is that against most of the people here? And your post before this one was absurd. Obviously some things from the costume will work on film and some things wont. Me saying I think the gloves should be changed hardly warrants you to accuse me of being a troll, neither does my not fapping for skarsgard, or that I like Dragonball Evolution. I didn't know not going with the crowd all the time made someone a troll.

[Brian Braddock]

You call my post absurd yet I'm the one who's an ass?

I guess that civility of yours has just gone out of the window.

:hehe:

[Jerkofwonder]

It did the second you called me a troll for disagreeing with you.

[November Rain]

in all fairness, as long as he remains a beacon for hope and freedom, does it 'really' matter what he wears

nelson mandella doesn't have to wear a costume to be a beacon of hope, he's just easily recognisable.

as long as he stands out slightly from the rest of the troops and can strike fear into the enemy and rally courage from his own, does it matter what he's in?

[Jerkofwonder]

He needs the costume in some form. I wouldn't like them to tone it down anymore than the Ultimate WW2 costume.

[chris moore]

Good God! He's a superhero whichever way you cut it. Doesn't matter how well he blends into the mud in WW2 or how much of a target he makes for Nazi machine gun fire, or how well recognisable real life icons are whether they wear a suit or pyjamas. Bottom line is Captain America needs to (AND WILL) be in some derivation of his superhero outfit. We can give opinions on wings or no, pirate boots or no, ultimate WW2 or no, and it is interesting. But its getting pretty dull reading page after page of insistence that it will work better as a movie and be more acceptable if he doesnt wear his SUPERHERO COSTUME in combat. The likelihood of him being in normal clothes in action is right up there with Spider-Man having no kind of webs whatsoever.

[Jerkofwonder]

I agree with you, I would be furious if he was in normal soldier clothes. I think they need to strike a balance between soldier and super hero. That is what Ultimate WW2 cap is.

[jpmuftak]

I haven't gone back through the thread, but I don't remember ANYONE posting that he should wear normal clothes...ever.

I think the 2 opposing sides are this:

1. He is Captain America - so let him wear his tight 616 costume with wings, pirate boots and all in WW2.
http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/4752/cap1p.jpg

2. He needs plausibility - so still let him be in red, white & blue with the star, stripes & shield, but make the style more of the WW2 garb ala The Ultimate 1945 version.
http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/6677/picture3g.pnghttp://img7.imageshack.us/img7/8279/picture1mkp.png
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/64/cap6f.jpghttp://img18.imageshack.us/img18/7222/cap7g.jpg

This one I found somewhat meets in the middle:
http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/8114/cap2r.jpg


Then there are the questions as to what he should wear once he is in present day:

1. 616 all the way.
http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/3144/cap3i.jpg

2. Somewhere close to the Ultimates (no wings, ect.)
http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/9945/cap4.jpg

Of course with all of these, everyone has details that they prefer (chainmail or scales, no pirate boots, no grey on the ultimate costume ect...), but NO ONE is saying they want Cap to be in old green fatigues.

I say screw the uniform...a flag will do. Earth X style. :oldrazz:
http://img25.imageshack.us/img25/8141/cap5.jpg

[Deaths Head II]

I haven't gone back through the thread, but I don't remember ANYONE posting that he should wear normal clothes...ever

No one said he should but people have said it would be fine if he did.

in all fairness, as long as he remains a beacon for hope and freedom, does it 'really' matter what he wears

nelson mandella doesn't have to wear a costume to be a beacon of hope, he's just easily recognisable.

as long as he stands out slightly from the rest of the troops and can strike fear into the enemy and rally courage from his own, does it matter what he's in?

[Jerkofwonder]

http://www.maddogresin.com/images/ca3.jpg

This is what I would want to see in The Avengers.

[jpmuftak]

No one said he should but people have said it would be fine if he did.

True, I was mainly responding to this:

But its getting pretty dull reading page after page of insistence that it will work better as a movie and be more acceptable if he doesnt wear his SUPERHERO COSTUME in combat. The likelihood of him being in normal clothes in action is right up there with Spider-Man having no kind of webs whatsoever.

[Spider-ManHero12]

http://www.maddogresin.com/images/ca3.jpg
This is what I would want to see in The Avengers. IMO, that would work very well.

[Faded To Deaf]

Cool, but I wouldn't mind having the boots coloured red either.

[DJ Kornphlake]

Cool, but I wouldn't mind having the boots coloured red either.
The gloves, too.

[Aesop Rocks]

Well, since he's going to be in the new era, why not the new suit?

I mean in WW2, give him his war suit.

http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm132/cwise75thr/captainamerica.png

http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/wp-content/2007/10/CaptainAmericaAlexRossSketch3.jpg

I mean, I can't really complain. Just replace Bucky with Steve!

[chris moore]

http://www.maddogresin.com/images/ca3.jpg
This is what I would want to see in The Avengers.

That is an excellent compromise for the modern costume! I agree that it'd be nice maybe to redden up the boots and gloves - but not to bright red. otice the wings're in there and actually look good cos they're not too prominent.

I think that the WW2 uniform from the Ultimate Avengers cartoon is honestly the best way to go for the WW2 part of the movie. It makes sense that back then he literally was a supersoldier and was permanently on the battlefield so needs the practicality of a 1940's army uniform but in the visual of the American flag. But in the modern era he is now a superhero rather than a supersoldier. And one that is around in a time where not only have costumes in comicbooks become more athletic and vibrant and detailed, but (in the movieverse) there are also actual superheroes already present such as IronMan and Thor, and so those comicbook outfits have been brought to life. So cutting back on the war-time/battlefield elements of his uniform makes more sense for his modern appearance. In the digital age he is going to be seen more easily by more people and so its important to show a true superhero, not a superpowered soldier. It would just give the wrong impression nowadays and showcase American military superiority too much, which in turn hints to the world the possibility of the events of the beginning of Ultimates Vol 2.

[afan]

So, what do you guys think about colours?

Me? I'm all for a slightly darker (than the norm) blue and a ribrant red:-



I think this is the easiest costume decision.
I assume there is a standard for the colors used when manufacturing the United State flag. That standard should also be used for Cap.

[November Rain]

No one said he should but people have said it would be fine if he did.
this is coming from the same group of fans who allow decades of fury to be replaced by samuel l jackson in an eye patch and a long coat.

as long as he stands out from being different from the rest, it doesn't honestly matter what he's in.

it's not like all the people in this thread arent going to watch it. There's legitimate logic behind all costume choices, if the director wanted him in superhero gear all the way through or in army stuff all the way through, we'd all accept it because both make sense.

again, as long as he strikes fear into the heart of the enemy and inspires hope in his colleagues, his costume is irrelevant. They may just give him an A on his helmet and we'd all have to suck it up.

the film is more about how people react to him rather than his costume. in all fairness, the more of a charicature you make the captain america mantel, the less effect you have of steve rogers the person because it's the media that is controlling his propaganda rather than the legends of his battles on the field among both troops.

[chris moore]

No way in hell would I accept Captain America on screen if he had nothing red white and blue about him. The general viewing public wouldnt either. They would wonder what the hell makes it a superhero film. Thats like keeping Bruce Wayne in the Nomex suit with a simple, non-eared helmet and no cape for the entire film because functionally it performs as he needs it. Then he goes, Oh well I'm Batman cos I come out of the dark like a bat and scare the crap out of you. He incorporated the Bat motif to enhance the image he was trying to convey.

Nick fury has never really had a defining costume, though his blue and white SHIELD uniform has always been a popular choice. Plus, he's not a superhero. He's not supposed to be seen, or have his exploits in the media.

Think about the youtube clip on the last page where Kowalski asks Bucky where his Supersoldier who they all followed in the gates of hell is. Imagine Bucky answering him with "No idea. Could be any of these guys out here. Just run at the mountain or something, I'm sure he's probably headed that way"

[November Rain]

that's the 'stands out' part. and it's pretty easy to spot cap, he's the guy carrying the shield.

bats uses the tool of a bat costume for intimidation. steve doesn't use the costume for anything, it's his government that use it for propaganda.

as long as he noticeably stands out from the rest of his troops, it makes no difference what he wears.
It's the man who defines captain america, not the costume.

i mean look at 1602, cap, pretty much just paints an A on his forehead and he's pretty much reflects what he wants.

[chris moore]

Problem being with the theory that Cap doesnt use it for anything is that back in the war he was in service with the American military. Therefore if your reasoning is that his government are the ones who use it, then of course he would be wearing the flag - same as any other soldier doesnt get to wear whatever they want. And in the Ultimate U (both cartoon and comicbook) he was reinstated in the military in service to SHIELD and so again, he would be wearing the flag because he's ordered to.

And in the 616 he voluntarily wears the flag uniform because he wants everyone to know which ideals he stands for and fights for and he knows he is an example to every superhero and so wears it to honour them as the symbol for their struggles.

So in the movie whoever his superiors, if any, he will be wearing the flag either under orders, respect for his past uniform and what it gave people, or in honour of who he is remembered as by the other heroes of the modern era.

[Brian Braddock]

I think this is the easiest costume decision.
I assume there is a standard for the colors used when manufacturing the United State flag. That standard should also be used for Cap.

Yeah, that thought had crossed my mind too, right up until I Google Imaged the flag and saw varying shades of reds and blues (mostly blues).

Although wiki has this:-

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b64/SUPERBENITEZ/x.jpg


So hey, maybe I was right about the darker blue after all..................

[chris moore]

The red isnt bad either

[Jerkofwonder]

I could handle the red if it was that dark. Though I would still prefer if they went brown like the statue posted earlier on this page.

[Rage]

http://www.maddogresin.com/images/ca3.jpg
This is what I would want to see in The Avengers.

While I prefer the Ultimate version of the costume (with a better mask/goggles) This image is a close second.

The materials look believable enough for the time and durable. The thick look of the stitching and the muted colours of the materials (remember that there were NO COLOUR NEWSREELS OR PHOTOGRAPHS AT THE TIME) Reds and blues would appear almost the same shade in Black & White... unless they used a really dark Blue with a light red or vice versa.

Not a fan of this mask...mostly because of the nose... but I could handle this version of the costume.

While I LOVE the character of Captain America, I have always hated the pirate boots and these boots and the boots from the Ultimates make WAAAYYY more sense for the character and the time.

Rage

[Brian Braddock]

I've just noticed that the statues boots are a mix of 616 boot and Ultimate;

Very clever and covert way of incorporating the pirate boot.

[Jerkofwonder]

It really looks like a good blending of Ultimate and 616 modern cap. I still wouldn't want it in this movie, but for The Avengers I think it would be perfect.

[Daredevil_2003]

I actually think that would work better in WWII...it looks too old-timey in the stitching, etc for a modern day costume.