The Iran Thread

[Maxwell Smart]

Badges? We don't need no steenking badges.

[demento]

Invade them! Invade them now!!

[blind_fury]

People don't need the WWII generation to turn to about French cowardice, there's something there to remind us practically everyday.
Yeah that's why nascar dads call french people cowards. Because of the daily habits of Frenchmen. It has nothing to do with WWII. :rolleyes:

[Maxwell Smart]

Considering what a small percentage of the American population actually serves in the military currently, the idea of labeling another nation "cowardly" is hypocritical. Bunch of chickenhawks.

[droogiedroogie2]

I'm not sure if that was sarcasm. If it was, then just ignore this.

The people alive TODAY have NEVER owned slaves. I'm sick of people like applying the mistakes of the past to the people of the present when they weren't even alive when the mistakes were made.Yeah, man! All that "learnin' from history" stuff...**** that stuff man. Yeah...hold on, let me go smoke some ****in' meth...

[cass]

Yeah, man! All that "learnin' from history" stuff...**** that stuff man. Yeah...hold on, let me go smoke some ****in' meth...

What he said had nothing to do with not learning from history, but about not putting the blame on people who had nothing to do with what ended 150 years ago. Maybe YOU need to lay off the meth.

[droogiedroogie2]

What he said had nothing to do with not learning from history, but about not putting the blame on people who had nothing to do with what ended 150 years ago. Maybe YOU need to lay off the meth.No really, I went and smoked some ****in' meth...

People who want to act like their forefathers' oppression didn't make them better off today are not learning from history. They're burying their heads in the sand to avoid any personal responsibility for the plight of minorities, particularly black people, in this country. The fact of the matter is, slavery, failed Reconstruction, and segregation set blacks up to be on the bottom of society, but when we granted them civil rights, the only wrong that was righted was segregation. We never gave them the forty acres and a mule that was promised them in Reconstruction. We never gave them anything except a half-assed, non-committal, barely workable excuse for Affirmative Action. They're caught in a cycle of violence, poverty, and poor education, but all we can do is drone on and on about personal responsibility and victim-blaming. Hey, the poor are only poor by virtue of their own sin and sloth.

[cass]

No really, I went and smoked some ****in' meth...

People who want to act like their forefathers' oppression didn't make them better off today are not learning from history. They're burying their heads in the sand to avoid any personal responsibility for the plight of minorities, particularly black people, in this country. The fact of the matter is, slavery, failed Reconstruction, and segregation set blacks up to be on the bottom of society, but when we granted them civil rights, the only wrong that was righted was segregation. We never gave them the forty acres and a mule that was promised them in Reconstruction. We never gave them anything except a half-assed, non-committal, barely workable excuse for Affirmative Action. They're caught in a cycle of violence, poverty, and poor education, but all we can do is drone on and on about personal responsibility and victim-blaming. Hey, the poor are only poor by virtue of their own sin and sloth.

Seriously lay off of the meth.

[droogiedroogie2]

Especially when some can trace their ancestors to another country.

Such as mine, who emigrated from what is now the Schleswig-Holstein Bundesland (state of the federation) in Germany, in 1872, who eventually bought some land in Kansas and started a farm.What part of Kansas you from? Are you Mennonite?

[droogiedroogie2]

Seriously lay off of the meth.Seriously lay off of the cock.

Wanna take the childish discourse even further? We could be typing "NUR-NUR-NUR" at each other by 11.

[Maxwell Smart]

So cass, because you don't agree with what droogie is saying you call him a meth user? :confused:

[cass]

It's insane to claim that it's my fault that people join gangs, there are single mothers, and public education needs to be reformed. I can elect those pushing for education reforms, but I did not cause, nor can I fix those other problems. Sorry, but personal responsibility exists whether you want it to or not.

[cass]

So cass, because you don't agree with what droogie is saying you call him a meth user? :confused:

No, I agreed that he was a meth user. I guess it was a weak attempt at humor. See my actual response.



Funny how Matt can call N8 gay and that's fine with you. But if a conservative says something.....:eek:

[Mr Sparkle]

No, I agreed that he was a meth user. I guess it was a weak attempt at humor. See my actual response.



Funny how Matt can call N8 gay and that's fine with you. But if a conservative says something.....:eek:


GAHHHHH! I'm so ****ing tired of this endless *****ing, endless.
people ragged on N8 because he was a Douche that day, not a conservative.
why exactly is it so hard to discern the two?:mad:

[droogiedroogie2]

It's insane to claim that it's my fault that people join gangs, there are single mothers, and public education needs to be reformed. I can elect those pushing for education reforms, but I did not cause, nor can I fix those other problems. Sorry, but personal responsibility exists whether you want it to or not.You want to talk about personal responsibility? How about the parents who can't teach their own ****ing children so they force the government to regulate the airwaves? How about the parents who can't pass on their morality by themselves, so they expect the government to legislate morality by outlawing gay marriage and abortion. Where's the personal ****ing responsibility there?

As long as we're blaming victims, we don't we just start telling rape victims that it was their own ****in' fault for being in that part of town? You make me sick. As a member of the power elite, the American middle class, you have a responsibility to those that are oppressed by the government. You have a responsibility to help end that oppression. You have a responsiblity to vote for people who will do anything, even raise taxes if necessary (ooh! boogeyman!) to end the institutional racism of this nation. That is your "personal responsibility," and that is a community responsibility, and that is a responsibility of every American who has enough money to live comfortably in suburbia.

Just standing by and watching the country slide further and further into moral decay (true moral decay, not Janet Jackson's nipple and gay marriage) is not "conservative," and there's nothing noble about it. It's un-Christian, and it's wrong.

[cass]

You want to talk about personal responsibility? How about the parents who can't teach their own ****ing children so they force the government to regulate the airwaves? How about the parents who can't pass on their morality by themselves, so they expect the government to legislate morality by outlawing gay marriage and abortion. Where's the personal ****ing responsibility there?

As long as we're blaming victims, we don't we just start telling rape victims that it was their own ****in' fault for being in that part of town? You make me sick. As a member of the power elite, the American middle class, you have a responsibility to those that are oppressed by the government. You have a responsibility to help end that oppression. You have a responsiblity to vote for people who will do anything, even raise taxes if necessary (ooh! boogeyman!) to end the institutional racism of this nation. That is your "personal responsibility," and that is a community responsibility, and that is a responsibility of every American who has enough money to live comfortably in suburbia.

Just standing by and watching the country slide further and further into moral decay (true moral decay, not Janet Jackson's nipple and gay marriage) is not "conservative," and there's nothing noble about it. It's un-Christian, and it's wrong.

I know damn well about my personal responsibility. I practice it because I admit it exists. From your arguments, I guess you don't believe it exists. Because it seems you believe that it's my job to make sure that Junior stays in school. It's not. That's Junior's parents jobs. I'm sick and tired of people whining. It's old. Instead, step up and do your part. I'll do mine. But don't thrust the entire job on someone else because you're a supposed victim.

[Wilhelm-Scream]

whoah, I thought I was entering a thread about the evil Iranians.:confused:

[Erzengel]

We don't need no stinkin badges.

[droogiedroogie2]

I know damn well about my personal responsibility. I practice it because I admit it exists. From your arguments, I guess you don't believe it exists.Wait a minute..."you have a responsibility to those..." "You have a responsibility to help end that oppression..." "You have a responsiblity to vote for people..." "That is your personal responsibility..." Did I not just freaking say those things?

Because it seems you believe that it's my job to make sure that Junior stays in school. It's not.Nope. But it's your responsibility to help ensure that Junior's school is worth going to. Junior's going. It's just that because Junior lives in the ghetto, the government doesn't bother to fund his school. They'd prefer to shut it down by slapping unreasonably high No Child Left Behind expectations on it, knowing full well that it won't meet those expectations without some additional funding and support.

That's Junior's parents jobs.Maybe they'd do it, if they weren't so busy working three jobs apiece to try and feed their family.

I'm sick and tired of people whining. It's old.Yet you're a supporter of a party that whines about everybody supporting the terrorists and not blindly agreeing with everything the President does "because it's wartime." Right, you're tired of people whining.

Instead, step up and do your part. I'll do mine. But don't thrust the entire job on someone else because you're a supposed victim.I'm not a victim. I'm a white upper-middle-class American male. I've got it ****in' made. I'm even Jewish, so I'm related to diamond merchants, Hollywood agents, successful businessmen, and Cesar Chavez's head lawyer from back in the 1970s. Seriously, I'm not a victim. I just stand up for those who have no one to stand up for them. Like "good Christians" are supposed to do.

[droogiedroogie2]

We don't need no stinkin badges.No. We don't.

[cass]

I said that one thing I can do is elect someone who'll reform education.

One way to not work three jobs is not to be a single mother.

I didn't mean you specifically as a victim. I meant in general the people you claim as victims and how it's my job to right their situation while they sit back idlely.

[droogiedroogie2]

I said that one thing I can do is elect someone who'll reform education.George W. Bush doesn't count. While he technically did reform education, I don't think most people meant "reform" in the sense of "**** it up and completely destroy the public education system."

One way to not work three jobs is not to be a single mother.Whupp! There we go with that victim-blaming again. It's hard not to be a single mother when the system is stacked against your family and your husband was racially profiled into jail for ten years over his third-strike nonviolent marijuana offense.

I didn't mean you specifically as a victim. I meant in general the people you claim as victims and how it's my job to right their situation while they sit back idlely.Yeah, except that's not happening anywhere at all.

[cass]

George W. Bush doesn't count. While he technically did reform education, I don't think most people meant "reform" in the sense of "**** it up and completely destroy the public education system."

Whupp! There we go with that victim-blaming again. It's hard not to be a single mother when the system is stacked against your family and your husband was racially profiled into jail for ten years over his third-strike nonviolent marijuana offense.

Yeah, except that's not happening anywhere at all.

George Bush isn't the only politician ever.

Here's a thought: don't smoke/possess an illegal substance, and you'd think they'd learn after two previous convictions for it.

[droogiedroogie2]

George Bush isn't the only politician ever.

Here's a thought: don't smoke/possess an illegal substance, and you'd think they'd learn after two previous convictions for it.If the system was bending you over and ****ing you in the ass, you might be drawn to a completely harmless illegal substance that would numb the pain of continued existence for a few hours.

[cass]

If the system was bending you over and ****ing you in the ass, you might be drawn to a completely harmless illegal substance that would numb the pain of continued existence for a few hours.

So you break the law, you pay for it.


See crime and punishment.

[droogiedroogie2]

So you break the law, you pay for it.Like the Enron guys paid for their crimes? Or President Bush paid for his crimes and hundreds of shattered laws and Constitutional amendments? Or President Clinton, who perjured himself? Or President Bush the First, who was actively involved with war criminals? Or President Reagan, who openly and admittedly flouted a law because it inhibited his ability to fight the Cold War? Or President Nixon, who tried to assassinate a guy? Or Presidents Johnson and Kennedy, who faked the impetus for Vietnam? Who's paying for these crimes?

No one pays for the crimes of the rich. They get away with mass murder and the rape of the Constitution and the violation of our basic rights, but poor people go to jail for smoking an herb and not bothering anybody.

[cass]

Like the Enron guys paid for their crimes? Or President Bush paid for his crimes and hundreds of shattered laws and Constitutional amendments? Or President Clinton, who perjured himself? Or President Bush the First, who was actively involved with war criminals? Or President Reagan, who openly and admittedly flouted a law because it inhibited his ability to fight the Cold War? Or President Nixon, who tried to assassinate a guy? Or Presidents Johnson and Kennedy, who faked the impetus for Vietnam? Who's paying for these crimes?

No one pays for the crimes of the rich. They get away with mass murder and the rape of the Constitution and the violation of our basic rights, but poor people go to jail for smoking an herb and not bothering anybody.

Enron guys - currently on trial.
Bush - allegations of supposed crimes by far left.
Clinton - impeached.
Bush I - didn't commit war crimes.
Reagan - wha?
Nixon - resigned and pardoned by Ford.
Vietnam - policy of containment, nothing illegal.

A lot of these supposed crimes are nothing but allegations. They didn't find a bag of pot in the car unlike others.

Commit a crime, you pay for it.

[Wilhelm-Scream]

You two have to wear badges from now on.

[cass]

I apologize for the thread going completely off track.

[Wilhelm-Scream]

Just get this thread to Cuba and no one gets hurt. And don't get any ideas. And free Mumia.

[droogiedroogie2]

Enron guys - currently on trial.Woohoo, resort prison, here we come!

Bush - allegations of supposed crimes by far left. Do your research before you dismiss it.

Clinton - impeached.And not convicted. Impeachment doesn't mean ****. Anyway, it's funny that the guy who committed the smallest crime was the one who came closest to getting ****ed for it. What is it with our culture and punishing people who aren't dangerous?

Bush I - didn't commit war crimes.Do your research before you dismiss it.

Reagan - wha?Iran Contra what?

Nixon - resigned and pardoned by Ford.Yeah, those Presidential pardons and free rides are just the breaks, aren't they? And he was still never even charged for his attempt at arranging the murder of Daniel Ellsberg.

Vietnam - policy of containment, nothing illegal.Gulf of Tonkin was a lie. The Tonkin Gulf Resolution was drafted months in advance. They blew up that ship.

A lot of these supposed crimes are nothing but allegations. They didn't find a bag of pot in the car unlike others.They did find memos, and Reagan actually just came out and said, "Yep, we broke that law. It was a stupid law." Or something to that effect.

Commit a crime, you pay for it.You have no idea that there are shades of gray in between black and white, do you?

You two have to wear badges from now on.You have to stop listening to A Wilhelm Scream from now on.

I apologize for the thread going completely off track.I don't. I never apoloize for anything. I never change my opinion on anything. I just blindly charge in, and consequences be damned. Now elect me President.

[cass]

Woohoo, resort prison, here we come!

Do your research before you dismiss it.

And not convicted. Impeachment doesn't mean ****. Anyway, it's funny that the guy who committed the smallest crime was the one who came closest to getting ****ed for it. What is it with our culture and punishing people who aren't dangerous?

Do your research before you dismiss it.

Iran Contra what?

Yeah, those Presidential pardons and free rides are just the breaks, aren't they? And he was still never even charged for his attempt at arranging the murder of Daniel Ellsberg.

Gulf of Tonkin was a lie. The Tonkin Gulf Resolution was drafted months in advance. They blew up that ship.

They did find memos, and Reagan actually just came out and said, "Yep, we broke that law. It was a stupid law." Or something to that effect.

You have no idea that there are shades of gray in between black and white, do you?



I've done my research, thank you.

Investigations show that Reagan really didn't have a clue about Iran Contra.

Kennedy had nothing to do with the Gulf of Tonkin.

"Or something to that effect." - All to telling that you have a clue you don't know what you're talking about.

A crime is a crime. If found guilty of that crime, there is punishment. It's the law of the land. If you don't agree, try to change the law, or leave the land. Sorry, that's how life goes.

[droogiedroogie2]

Investigations show that Reagan really didn't have a clue about Iran Contra.If he didn't know about that, then he wasn't fit to be President. No matter--he ****ing knew.

Kennedy had nothing to do with the Gulf of Tonkin. The administration planned that from Day One.

"Or something to that effect." - All to telling that you have a clue you don't know what you're talking about.If I was writing a paper, I'd go find the exact quotes of the administration officials and the President. But this is a message board debate. Not really worth my time. Suffice it to say, I'm a History major, so while I may not be an expert, I do know how to do my research better than you do, and I do care about and learn from the mistakes of the past.

A crime is a crime. If found guilty of that crime, there is punishment. It's the law of the land.Jesus, and they say conservatives are supposed to be compassionate and Christian these days. So much for that. Not all crimes are the same. Jailing a guy for smoking weed is like jailing a guy for speeding. Really, the societal harm is exactly the same.

If you don't agree, try to change the law, or leave the land.I do try to change the law. All the time. But I also violate it all the time. Musta smoked me a quarter of an ounce of shwag just last night. But I will NEVER leave this country because the laws are unjust. I don't turn tail and run.

[cass]

If he didn't know about that, then he wasn't fit to be President. No matter--he ****ing knew.

The administration planned that from Day One.

If I was writing a paper, I'd go find the exact quotes of the administration officials and the President. But this is a message board debate. Not really worth my time. Suffice it to say, I'm a History major, so while I may not be an expert, I do know how to do my research better than you do, and I do care about and learn from the mistakes of the past.

Jesus, and they say conservatives are supposed to be compassionate and Christian these days. So much for that. Not all crimes are the same. Jailing a guy for smoking weed is like jailing a guy for speeding. Really, the societal harm is exactly the same.

I do try to change the law. All the time. But I also violate it all the time. Musta smoked me a quarter of an ounce of shwag just last night. But I will NEVER leave this country because the laws are unjust. I don't turn tail and run.

What you said about Reagan and Tonkin has no fact, it's your opinion. Sorry. It's not adequate.

As someone with a History degree I think my research is more than adequate.

A crime is a crime. Sorry, again, laws.

[Emrys]

A crime is a crime. If found guilty of that crime, there is punishment. It's the law of the land. If you don't agree, try to change the law, or leave the land. Sorry, that's how life goes.

So as long as it's law it's fine and dandy even if it's a completely idiotic, unreasonable, assbackwards and devoid of any logic law? You do know that humans have an obligation to ignore laws that go against reason? It's called civil disobedience.

[The Overlord]

OTTAWA (AFP) - The Canadian and Australian prime ministers expressed concern at unconfirmed reports that said Iran may force non-Muslims to wear colored badges in public so they can be identified.

ADVERTISEMENT

The National Post newspaper reported Friday, citing human rights groups, that Iran's parliament passed a law this week that sets a public dress code and requires non-Muslims to wear a special insignia.

Jews, Christians and Zoroastrians would be forced to wear a yellow, red or blue strip of cloth, respectively, on the front of their clothes, according to the newspaper.

"Anything of that kind would be totally repugnant to civilized countries, if it's the case, and something that would just further indicate to me the nature of this regime," Australia's Prime Minister John Howard told reporters during an official visit to Ottawa.

"It would be appalling," he added.

Canadian Prime Minister Stephen Harper said he had "only seen reports" about the law but commented he would not be surprised by them.

"Unfortunately, we have seen enough already from the Iranian regime to suggest that it is very capable of this kind of action," he said.

"It think it boggles the mind that any regime on the face of the earth would want to do anything that could remind people of Nazi Germany," he added.

"The fact that such a measure could even be contemplated, I think, is absolutely abhorent."

Earlier, Harper's parliamentary secretary, Jason Kenney, told the House of Commons that Canadian officials were trying to verify the claims and said Ottawa is "deeply concerned".

"Should these reports turn out to be true, this government will condemn in the strongest terms possible this kind of revisiting of the darkest period of the last century. It is something that the entire civilized world should condemn," Kenney said.

[Mee]

Already posted.;)

[Addendum]

What part of Kansas you from? Are you Mennonite?
I'm not from Kansas. My dad was born in Kansas, Topeka to be exact, but was raised in Chicago. My mom was born in Lincoln, Illinois but was raised in Texas, Missouri, and then Pontiac Michigan.

I was born in Millington, Tennessee at the Navy Hospital at what was then N.A.S. Memphis (Naval Air Station). My old man was in the Marines- worked on the radar for the A-6E Intruder.

I'm atheist

[SpHinX]

Hey, atleast we found whose body Hitler possessed when he was reincarnated. I guess he got tired of Europe. Don't we all just love it when history repeats itself? Except this time, he might have nuclear weapons and the great Mohammed on his side. *End sarcasm*

[Corinthian™]

http://http://www.canada.com/components/print.aspx?id=11fbf4a8-282a-4d18-954f-546709b1240f&k=32073

Yeah, we don't need to worry at all about Iran. :rolleyes:
yes, especially because the world war II started because Nazis were killing Jews and the Civil war was about freeing slaves

[SuperDude]

Actually, WWII was about fighting alien reptiles. Believe me, I'm a history major. ;)

[Super Kal]

sounds like World War 2 all over again...

[bored]

http://http://www.canada.com/components/print.aspx?id=11fbf4a8-282a-4d18-954f-546709b1240f&k=32073

Yeah, we don't need to worry at all about Iran. :rolleyes:


The link won't work:( .

[bored]

I'm not from Kansas. My dad was born in Kansas, Topeka to be exact, but was raised in Chicago. My mom was born in Lincoln, Illinois but was raised in Texas, Missouri, and then Pontiac Michigan.

I was born in Millington, Tennessee at the Navy Hospital at what was then N.A.S. Memphis (Naval Air Station). My old man was in the Marines- worked on the radar for the A-6E Intruder.

I'm atheist

I grew up in Topeka!

It kinda sucks:( .

[Corinthian™]

Actually, WWII was about fighting alien reptiles. Believe me, I'm a history major. ;)
I was being sarcastic. Of course it was about fighting evil reptillian aliens. Sadly they created holograms and now we are screwed:down:(

[SpideyInATree]

They should make Christians wear some kind of identification tags here in America. It would save a lot of awkward conversations.

I'm joking, of course.

But it'd really help out. :o

[celldog]

:rolleyes: I'm sure Americans will still be calling French people cowards long after the WWII generation is dead and gone.


http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y99/ianinozzie/UltimateCaptainAmerica.jpg

[SpideyInATree]

Yeah, but Cap fought in World War II, he has every right to keep calling them cowards. :)

[Corinthian™]

wait, how are the French cowards?

if America would stand it the geographically exact position France is then they would've lost to the germans too:confused:

[Tangled Web]

Iran = Neo Nazis

[Backdrifter]

wait, how are the French cowards?

if America would stand it the geographically exact position France is then they would've lost to the germans too:confused:
Yeah. Besdies, the was a very large underground french resistence movement during WWII that people seem to not know about. Many French men and women died fighting for their country. They were invaded and had no choice but to comply. Making fun of WWII France strikes me as being very ignorant of the time period.

[Corinthian™]

Yeah. Besdies, the was a very large underground french resistence movement during WWII that people seem to not know about. Many French men and women died fighting for their country. They were invaded and had no choice but to comply. Making fun of WWII France strikes me as being very ignorant of the time period.
agreed:confused::up:

so the reason that the french are concidered cowards is because they fell to the better tactics, army and equipment of the Germans?

:down:confused:

****ing Iraqis are cowards

[SpideyInATree]

wait, how are the French cowards?

if America would stand it the geographically exact position France is then they would've lost to the germans too:confused:

But America isn't in Frances' exact geographical position. And if we were, we'd be French. And the French would be Americans. And the dirty Americans would call us cowards, even 60 years after it happened.

[gildea]

The US used to have slaves so it would be hypocritical for them to say anything. Germany and France were or helped the Nazis so they're out. I guess that just leaves Britain who can morally say something right guys? :rolleyes:


Nah us brits had the whole 'colonial' thing.

We're hypocrites also.

[Jack O'Lantern]

http://lighthousenews.us/03/NEWS/ISRAEL/ISRAEL_052906_2.html

I cant believe that Iran is so stupid as to sell missiles (albeit inaccurate ones) to a terrorist organization while under such scrutiny for its supposed nuclear weapons program. Just one more reason why we cant trust Iran. Their president says that he has nothing against Israeli citizens, just thier government when he says "Israel must be wiped off the map" and then goes and sells weapons that will go and kill those very civilians. :mad: I would say bomb them back to the stone age, if only we didnt have W in charge right now. "Fool me once" and so on.

[psychocheeseman]

If Selling weapons to a terrorist organisation is grounds to "bomb them back to the stone age" your going to have to bomb a **** load of countries. Ethically speaking it is just as bad to sell such weapons to any aggressors wether they be part of a nation state or not. However, a Nation state is often far better equiped to inflict damage than such "terrorist networks". Furthermore, Nation States have the fact that they are recognise internationally as having a legitimate monopoly of power to take life for political objectives.

[Sandman138]

Well, under our current policy this should be grounds to engage them. I kind of doubt we will though.

[kane9321]

good,... now it can be a fair fight!

[InsaneMembrane]

good,... now it can be a fair fight!

:rolleyes: Yeah let's give them more accurate missisles so they can bomb more civillian towns over lands that isn't Lebanon's or Israel's

[tzarinna]

I'm having enough trouble sleeping at night

[Darthphere]

Is the Lighthouse News a viable source?

[Kritish]

Is the Lighthouse News a viable source?

That's what I wanted to ask.

[War Lord]

http://lighthousenews.us/03/NEWS/ISRAEL/ISRAEL_052906_2.html

I cant believe that Iran is so stupid as to sell missiles (albeit inaccurate ones) to a terrorist organization while under such scrutiny for its supposed nuclear weapons program. Just one more reason why we cant trust Iran. Their president says that he has nothing against Israeli citizens, just thier government when he says "Israel must be wiped off the map" and then goes and sells weapons that will go and kill those very civilians. :mad: I would say bomb them back to the stone age, if only we didnt have W in charge right now. "Fool me once" and so on.

What makes you think Iran is having a stupid moment?

The Iranian government wants the end of the world so the 12th Imam can come.

[Sandman138]

And yet the Christian Right claims they are polar opposites.

[War Lord]

And yet the Christian Right claims they are polar opposites.

I know what you mean.

I just quake in my boots about the possibility of Jerry Falwell acquiring a nuke.

He's made several attempts, you know.

[TheSumOfGod]

I know what you mean.

I just quake in my boots about the possibility of Jerry Falwell acquiring a nuke.

He's made several attempts, you know.

He could use it against Homopolis! :eek:

[Kritish]

Fred Phelps with a nuke scares me.

[TheSumOfGod]

Fred Phelps with a nuke scares me.

He would probably blow himself and his followers up trying to catapult the damn thing towards Homopolis. :o

[C.F. Kane]

Bra-****ing-vo Iran!

[Darthphere]

I wonder why the Lighthouse News is the only source picking this story up?.....

[psychocheeseman]

How Ironic, Turns out Isreal Use to sell Missiles to Iran....Ha Ha Ha...Bet they're kinda regreting that know.

I'm nbot sure whether they were selling them before or after Ayatollah Khomeinei's revolution. But either way, its kinda ironic...sort of....

but very very sad.

[Dr. Weir]

mark my words, if you americans attack Iran, the United States will end in ten years from when you start war with them.

[War Lord]

mark my words, if you americans attack Iran, the United States will end in ten years from when you start war with them.

So, the Iranians, who are a few years from acquiring a nuke and has no other military technology of any consequence, can beat the Americans?

Right.

[cass]

mark my words, if you americans attack Iran, the United States will end in ten years from when you start war with them.

Wanna bet?

[logansoldcigar]

I know what you mean.

I just quake in my boots about the possibility of Jerry Falwell acquiring a nuke.

He's made several attempts, you know.

Carful with what you say. Thats the kind of statement that the CIA calls "evidence"

[TrailerMusic]

Iran's top leader, Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, warned Sunday that oil shipments from the Gulf region would be disrupted if the United States attacked his nation, but his threat was dismissed by Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice. Khamenei also insisted in a speech broadcast live on state-run radio that Tehran will not give up its right to produce nuclear fuel. He added that Iran is not seeking a nuclear bomb as the West suspects.

http://news.yahoo.com/fc/world/iran

Russian dudes & dudettes kidnapped
Oil Threats
All World Leaders coming together trying to make a deal to get Iran to stop making their nuke thingys

This should be interesting

[rodhulk]

With the situation in the middle east and with all these things that are supposed to happen out there as according to scripture, I expect bad things to develop more and more out there (and around the world).

[TrailerMusic]

A package of incentives presented Tuesday to Iran includes a provision for the United States to supply Tehran with some nuclear technology if it stops enriching uranium � a major concession by Washington, diplomats said. The offer was part of a series of rewards offered to Tehran by European Union foreign policy chief Javier Solana, according to the diplomats, who were familiar with the proposals and spoke to The Associated Press on condition of anonymity because they were disclosing confidential details of the offer.

http://news.yahoo.com/fc/world/iran

[TheSumOfGod]

I think the only way the US will "provide" Iran with nuclear technology is when they'll nuke them. ;)

[Hobgoblin]

So to keep Iran from getting the bomb, we are offering them nuclear technology? :confused: I guess we are testing to see if Iran will refuse the technology, which will make it look like Tehran is going on another path besides peaceful energy production.

[LexCorp]

I think the only way the US will "provide" Iran with nuclear technology is when they'll nuke them. ;)

Awesome...........................

[kane9321]

this doesnt sound to good

[Iceman]

So to keep Iran from getting the bomb, we are offering them nuclear technology? :confused: I guess we are testing to see if Iran will refuse the technology, which will make it look like Tehran is going on another path besides peaceful energy production.

That's probably the motivation. If they refuse they'll have a hard time explaining their decision.

[NHawk19]

Get a load of this . . . .

http://www.breitbart.com/news/2006/06/06/D8I2PI2O0.html

:(

[Addendum]

Get a load of this...

Article 4 of the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty

1. Nothing in this Treaty shall be interpreted as affecting the inalienable right of all the Parties to the Treaty to develop research, production and use of nuclear energy for peaceful purposes without discrimination and in conformity with Articles I and II of this Treaty.

2. All the Parties to the Treaty undertake to facilitate, and have the right to participate in, the fullest possible exchange of equipment, materials and scientific and technological information for the peaceful uses of nuclear energy. Parties to the Treaty in a position to do so shall also co-operate in contributing alone or together with other States or international organizations to the further development of the applications of nuclear energy for peaceful purposes, especially in the territories of non-nuclear-weapon States Party to the Treaty, with due consideration for the needs of the developing areas of the world.

The U.S. signed it in 1968. Iran has signed it as well.

As long as nuclear power is used for peaceful purposes, it's a right of every nation on the planet.

[NHawk19]

Well I'll be damned . . . .and they didnt do anything to retract that after the hostilities developed in that part of the world during the past 40 years?

[hippie_hunter]

Get a load of this...

Article 4 of the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty

1. Nothing in this Treaty shall be interpreted as affecting the inalienable right of all the Parties to the Treaty to develop research, production and use of nuclear energy for peaceful purposes without discrimination and in conformity with Articles I and II of this Treaty.

2. All the Parties to the Treaty undertake to facilitate, and have the right to participate in, the fullest possible exchange of equipment, materials and scientific and technological information for the peaceful uses of nuclear energy. Parties to the Treaty in a position to do so shall also co-operate in contributing alone or together with other States or international organizations to the further development of the applications of nuclear energy for peaceful purposes, especially in the territories of non-nuclear-weapon States Party to the Treaty, with due consideration for the needs of the developing areas of the world.

The U.S. signed it in 1968. Iran has signed it as well.

As long as nuclear power is used for peaceful purposes, it's a right of every nation on the planet.

But do you actually beleive that Iran is developing nuclear technology for peaceful purposes :o

[Addendum]

Text of the Treaty (http://www.un.org/events/npt2005/npttreaty.html)

Yes, damn those treaties we signed... :)

[hippie_hunter]

Get a load of this . . . .

http://www.breitbart.com/news/2006/06/06/D8I2PI2O0.html

:(

This is a major concession, but a necessary one. If we do supply them with civilian nuclear technology, at least we can be sure that Iran won't use it to produce nuclear weapons. And if they do, the payback will be very HARD.

The question is: Will Iran accept the deal?

[Addendum]

But do you actually beleive that Iran is developing nuclear technology for peaceful purposes :o
Do they have any now? No.

[Motown Marvel]

good for them...sounds like they're finally taking the idea of a peaceful resolution seriously....but if iran turns this down, then f**k'em.

[NHawk19]

I dont see why they wouldnt this would advance their program a hell of a lot but as Addendum pointed out it seems we were supposed to do that all along.

But placing this technology in that part of the world is of major concern though because even if Iran doesnt intend to built weapons it does make it easier for non-peaceful countries to come by. Not that Russia's fall didnt help that either.

[TheSumOfGod]

But HOW will the US "give" Iran nuclear technology? By nuking them. ;) :D

[War Lord]

This is a major concession, but a necessary one. If we do supply them with civilian nuclear technology, at least we can be sure that Iran won't use it to produce nuclear weapons. And if they do, the payback will be very HARD.

The question is: Will Iran accept the deal?

They probably will, because civilian nuclear technology can be converted to military purposes.

It's not that big of a step from civilian uses to military purposes.

[NHawk19]

Addendum, outside of nuclear technology what is our standing with Iran? I have a nasty tendancy to lump the entire Middle East together as one big hostile area.

[Addendum]

I just view them as sovereign nations

[The Venomator]

I personally think that the world will ned from a nuclear war, in the not to distance future. The russians will revive the soviet union, the soviets will firstly focuson years of extortion and then , when the moneys right, they will appoint The Kaiser, (I know its german, but yers before this the germans had one last shot at world domination, they won the 2006 world cup and thought it was a message) anyhow... The Kaiser will be named Graham in real life, to the people that know me, thats me, i will not go into detail on my plans but if you don't believe me ask Spidey Lad, its my dream to take over the once "disbanded Soviet Union"

[TheSumOfGod]

Addendum, outside of nuclear technology what is our standing with Iran? I have a nasty tendancy to lump the entire Middle East together as one big hostile area.

Iran has a lot of oil. And we want that oil. ;) Besides, we didn't "liberate" both Afghanistan and Iraq so that our military forces could sandwich Iran for nothing. :o

[Darthphere]

I have a couple of nukes if they need them.

[The Venomator]

That was fun

[Addendum]

I personally think that the world will ned from a nuclear war, in the not to distance future. The russians will revive the soviet union, the soviets will firstly focuson years of extortion and then , when the moneys right, they will appoint The Kaiser, (I know its german, but yers before this the germans had one last shot at world domination, they won the 2006 world cup and thought it was a message) anyhow... The Kaiser will be named Graham in real life, to the people that know me, thats me, i will not go into detail on my plans but if you don't believe me ask Spidey Lad, its my dream to take over the once "disbanded Soviet Union"
A country hosting the World Cup isn't a sign of that nation "taking over the world". Or will you say that South Africa will take over the world since it's hosting the 2010 World Cup?

[DV8]

I don't know . . . seems like the best solution . . . if they ARE in fact using nuclear technology for "peaceful reasons" . . . which we should soon learn by the way this deal turns out . . .

[The Venomator]

A country hosting the World Cup isn't a sign of that nation "taking over the world". Or will you say that South Africa will take over the world since it's hosting the 2010 World Cup?

No, i never said that, and i quote "they won the 2006 world cup " By that what i was trying to get across was, Germany thought the world cup meant, as long as they were in possession of the world cup, they were the sole nation in charge of world affairs, basically i was implying germans were stupid, ( sorry if i offend any germans, but im an english ****, what ya gonna do) So there

[Slipknot]

I personally think that the world will ned from a nuclear war, in the not to distance future. The russians will revive the soviet union, the soviets will firstly focuson years of extortion and then , when the moneys right, they will appoint The Kaiser, (I know its german, but yers before this the germans had one last shot at world domination, they won the 2006 world cup and thought it was a message) anyhow... The Kaiser will be named Graham in real life, to the people that know me, thats me, i will not go into detail on my plans but if you don't believe me ask Spidey Lad, its my dream to take over the once "disbanded Soviet Union"
...

[Addendum]

No, i never said that, and i quote "they won the 2006 world cup " By that what i was trying to get across was, Germany thought the world cup meant, as long as they were in possession of the world cup, they were the sole nation in charge of world affairs, basically i was implying germans were stupid, ( sorry if i offend any germans, but im an english ****, what ya gonna do) So there
The World Cup hasn't started yet...

so no nation has won the 2006 World Cup:confused:

[The Venomator]

But im speaking in the future, all part of dillusionary state at the time, now im calm, i have ni idea why the hell i write that

[MoviesKickAss]

President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said on Thursday threats would not work in talks to settle the dispute over Iran's nuclear program but Tehran was ready to clear up misunderstandings with the rest of the world. He said Iran was not willing to abandon its nuclear rights -- usually shorthand in Iran for uranium enrichment -- but some analysts said his speech reflected a greater readiness in Tehran for talks on the country's atomic ambitions.

http://news.yahoo.com/fc/World/Iran

[blind_fury]

haha, America can't bully Iran.

and Bush caves into their demands for nuclear power. lol!

[newmexneon]

Good, they have every right to enrich uranium.

[Carter]

They also have every right to be bombed into oblivion

[newmexneon]

Shutup you racist.

[Carter]

Haha, how am I racist?

[newmexneon]

How do they deserve to be bombed?

[Carter]

Are you really that stupid?
It was a joke.

[blind_fury]

I don't know about that. You've stated you were willing to kill Iranians in the past.

[Carter]

It must have been in a certain context.
Let me put it this way - I am completely against the killing of innocent people.

But terrorists and terrorist sympathizers, I would gladlly dispose of.

[Arkady Rossovich]

haha, America can't bully Iran. lol!

America cant bully the world either.

[ScrnNmsSuck]

VIENNA, Austria - Western powers will reactivate efforts to punish Iran through possible U.N. Security Council sanctions unless it suspends uranium enrichment and agrees to talks on its nuclear program by July 12, diplomats said Monday.

The envoys — some of them senior U.N. diplomats and all familiar with details of the six-nation drive to persuade Iran to compromise on its nuclear activities — spoke just two days before a key Iran-
European Union meeting in Brussels meant to make clear to the Iranians that their time is running out.

On Wednesday, senior EU envoy Javier Solana will urge top Iranian nuclear negotiator Ali Larijani to commit his country immediately to suspending enrichment and starting negotiations, the diplomats said.

They also said Russia and China were closer than ever to supporting the West on U.N. Security Council action — including sanctions — if Tehran refuses the package of incentives meant to wean it off enrichment. Still, they suggested it could take some time to secure total commitment to sanctions from Moscow and Beijing.

"We are looking forward to hear from Iran ... the official response," said Cristina Gallach, Solana's spokeswoman.

A European official outlined more realistic expectations, saying Larijani would likely come back with questions — and perhaps a counterproposal.

If so, the diplomats said, Solana plans to tell him Iran must accept the terms of the package by July 12, when foreign ministers of the five permanent Security Council nations and Germany consult in Paris.

"If Iran has not answered positively by this date, the ministers will likely adopt a decision to resume negotiations on the Security Council resolution," said one of the diplomats, who, like the European official, demanded anonymity in exchange for divulging the game plan on Iran.

The European official said Russia and China were contemplating sending high-level officials to Wednesday's meeting in a symbolic show of unity with the West.

In Washington, Undersecretary of State Nicholas Burns told C-Span television in an interview to be aired Sunday that if Iran has not responded by July 12, "then I think the pressure will be enormous on the Iranians from all the international community."

Work on a U.N. Security Council resolution was suspended May 3 to allow the six powers to draw up a plan of perks if Iran agrees to a long-term moratorium on enrichment — or punishments that include the threat of selective U.N. sanctions if it doesn't. Solana last month presented the rewards to Larijani but made no mention of the punishments, so as not to rile Tehran.

While Iran argues it has a right to the technology under the Nuclear Nonproliferation Treaty to generate power, there is increasing international concern that it wants to enrich uranium to weapons-grade levels for use in the fissile core of nuclear warheads.

Iranian officials have said they would not respond to the six-power offer before mid-August, a gambit described by one of the diplomats as an attempt to stall beyond the July 15-17 summit of the Group of Eight industrialized nations in Russia.

Before the summit, the United States and its allies on the Security Council — all G-8 members — "can apply pressure on Russia" to stand with the West on Iran, but that lever will be weakened after the St. Petersburg meeting, one diplomat said.

Possible U.N.-mandated sanctions include a visa ban on government officials, freezing assets, blocking financial transactions by government figures and those involved in the country's nuclear program, an arms embargo and a blockade on the shipping of refined oil products to Iran. Rewards include providing Iran with nuclear expertise and hardware, including reactors.

Breaking with a more than 2-decade-old ban on high-level diplomatic contact with Tehran, the United States said in late May that it was ready to join in such talks.

But the Americans, along with Russia, China, Britain, France and Germany — the six nations that endorsed the package — insist that Iran suspend its nascent enrichment activities before talks begin.

Tehran repeatedly has rejected that demand since the six powers agreed on the package in Vienna on June 1.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060703/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iran_nuclear

[Matt]

They'll stop on July 11th, wait six months, and begin again.

[Darthphere]

They'll stop on July 11th, wait six months, and begin again.


Pretty much. Our government has ADD, theyll forget to check up on them.

[Antonello Blueberry]

They have every right to keep on enriching Uranium.

[Darthphere]

You have no idea what youve just done.

[Superman]

TEHRAN, Iran - Iran said Sunday that Western incentives to halt its nuclear program were an "acceptable basis" for talks, and it is ready for detailed negotiations


Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice responded that Iran should talk directly to negotiators if it wants to discuss the six-nation proposal.

Frustrated world powers agreed Wednesday to send Iran to the U.N. Security Council for possible punishment, saying Tehran had given no sign it would bargain in earnest over its nuclear ambitions.

Foreign Ministry spokesman Hamid Reza Asefi told reporters in Tehran that, "We consider this package an appropriate basis, an acceptable basis (for talks)."

"Now is an appropriate opportunity for Iran and Europe to enter detailed negotiations," he said. "Sending the dossier to the U.N. Security Council means blocking and rejecting talks."

Asefi called on the eight major world powers meeting in St. Petersburg, Russia, to choose dialogue with Iran.

"We can achieve acceptable results in this path," Asefi said.

Rice said at the Group of Eight meeting that Iran should contact European Union foreign policy chief Javier Solana, the envoy who delivered the proposal last month and has been meeting with Iran's top nuclear negotiator, Ali Larijani.

G-8 leaders were expected to discuss Iran's nuclear program at the summit but none directly addressed Asefi's comments.

"If the Iranians want to respond positively, I would hope that they would do so through the channel that is established between the six and the government of Iran, and that is Mr. Solana," Rice said. "There is, indeed, a very good proposal on the table that could be a basis for negotiations ... There is also a path ahead to the Security Council on which we are now launched."

Iran has said specialized committees in key state agencies are studying the June 6 offer by the United States, Britain, China, France, Russia and Germany, and that it will formally respond in late August.

Diplomats have said recent meetings with Iran have gone nowhere, and that it appeared Tehran hoped to buy time or exploit potential divisions among the six powers.

The package includes economic incentives and a provision for the United States to offer Iran some nuclear technology, lift some sanctions and join direct negotiations. The proposal also calls for Iran to impose a long-term moratorium on uranium enrichment — which can produce civilian reactor fuel or fissile bomb material.

The United States and some of its allies accuse Iran of seeking nuclear weapons. Tehran has denied the charges, saying its program is aimed at making electricity, not bombs.

Iran has said it will never give up its right under the Nuclear Nonproliferation Treaty to enrich uranium and produce nuclear fuel, but has indicated it may temporarily suspend large-scale activities to ease tensions.

Russian lawmaker Konstantin Kosachev, the Kremlin-linked chairman of the international affairs committee of the lower house of parliament, greeted Tehran's announcement with guarded optimism.

"On the one hand we must hail any readiness by Tehran at least to discuss the proposals of the six nations," he told The Associated Press. "Unfortunately, we have already witnessed such signals in the past, which then were not followed up."

He suspected Iran of "dragging its feet" to avoid unnecessary concessions.

"Iran is playing with fire," he warned. "The international community may one day run out of patience and unfortunately, the point of view of those who call for maybe a tougher stance on Iran may prevail. Iran must clearly understand that."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/iran_nuclear;_ylt=Am33.suxInIYpjSaXr_5XCZSw60A;_yl u=X3oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUl

[St. of Sinners]

This is decent news.

[bored]

Egads, something to be optimistic about?!:eek:

[Fred_Fury]

yeah right, coming from Iran :rolleyes: next week they'll say something totally different.

[bored]

Party-pooper:down .

[St. of Sinners]

yeah right, coming from Iran :rolleyes: next week they'll say something totally different. Maybe next week they'll all speak backwards and be able to see in the dark.

[Fred_Fury]

this is just Irans way of buying time. North Korea does the same thing. Saddam Hussein did the same thing.

And just like Saddam Hussein, their time is running out.

[JLBats]

yeah right, coming from Iran :rolleyes: next week they'll say something totally different.

Your Indian name shall be "Luka Gifthorse Ina Mouth".

[Spider-Bite]

this is just Irans way of buying time. North Korea does the same thing. Saddam Hussein did the same thing.

And just like Saddam Hussein, their time is running out.

we told saddaman to let inspectors in.

he did

we said you better not have WMDs

he didn't

we said you better not have ties to Alquida

he didn't

we said well even though your doing everything we tell you, were still gonna invade Iraq unless you agree to step down, and hand Iraq over to the UN to create a democracy.

he did step down

and we still went to war with Iraq anyways. I guess our foreign policy is your damned if you do, and your damned if you don't. doesn't matter what kind of behavior you engage in. It has no bearing on whether we will go to war with you.

[Fred_Fury]

we told saddaman to let inspectors in.

he did

we said you better not have WMDs

he didn't

we said you better not have ties to Alquida

he didn't

we said well even though your doing everything we tell you, were still gonna invade Iraq unless you agree to step down, and hand Iraq over to the UN to create a democracy.

he did step down

and we still went to war with Iraq anyways. I guess our foreign policy is your damned if you do, and your damned if you don't. doesn't matter what kind of behavior you engage in. It has no bearing on whether we will go to war with you.

Yeah you're right, Saddam Hussein was fully cooperative :rolleyes: where do you get your info from? Al Jazeera? Michael Moore? I dont know what world you're living on.

[Mr Sparkle]

Yeah you're right, Saddam Hussein was fully cooperative :rolleyes: where do you get your info from? Al Jazeera? Michael Moore? I dont know what world you're living on.

pardon me. but, as of right now, have ANY wmd's been found?
Like, at all?
not from my knowledge, and get my infor from CBS, CNN, Fox News, MSNBC, BBC, NPR, The Guardian, and so forth.
maybe you have access to magical mystical truth machines that all evil leftists (and abouth 99.9%) of the world can consult.
short of stepping down (which he didn't do voluntarily) the war in Iraq? sorry.
no one's buying it anymore, even the dudes that used to say "well Saddam is a danger to America"now go like "we had to give them Democracy"so, in a way, even they know the reason for Iraq was bull****. :(:up:

[Fred_Fury]

actually a few WMD's have been found, just not huge stockpiles. I guess michael moore didnt mention that in his last movie so you wouldnt know about it.

[Mr Sparkle]

actually a few WMD's have been found, just not huge stockpiles. I guess michael moore didnt mention that in his last movie so you wouldnt know about it.

LOL, no, actually WMD's have NOT been found, that's why they haven't been mentioned in the news of the world.:(:down

[St. of Sinners]

actually a few WMD's have been found, just not huge stockpiles. I guess michael moore didnt mention that in his last movie so you wouldnt know about it. How a fool and his funny are soon parted. Your brilliant attempt at humor aside, you are 100% wrong. Zero WMD's have been found in Iraq. Also, just incase you decide to pull the freedom rabbit from your blind-patriot hat, the only thing that Iraqis were liberated from was their employment. The unemployment rate in U.S. occupied Iraq is currently at 60%, and this is entirely the fault of the United States.

[Fred_Fury]

http://news.bostonherald.com/editorial/view.bg?articleid=148385

“Since 2003 Coalition forces have recovered approximately 500 weapons munitions which contain degraded mustard or sarin nerve agent,” states a June 21 declassified summary of a report from the National Ground Intelligence Center. “Despite many efforts to locate and destroy Iraq’s pre-Gulf War chemical munitions, filled and unfilled pre-Gulf War chemical munitions are assessed to still exist.”




seriously guys, try getting your news from somewhere other than Michaelmoore.com and ihategeorgewbush.com

[St. of Sinners]

http://news.bostonherald.com/editorial/view.bg?articleid=148385

“Since 2003 Coalition forces have recovered approximately 500 weapons munitions which contain degraded mustard or sarin nerve agent,” states a June 21 declassified summary of a report from the National Ground Intelligence Center. “Despite many efforts to locate and destroy Iraq’s pre-Gulf War chemical munitions, filled and unfilled pre-Gulf War chemical munitions are assessed to still exist.”




seriously guys, try getting your news from somewhere other than Michaelmoore.com and ihategeorgewbush.com So where are the Weapons of Mass Destruction? I don't understand?

[Iceman]

At least this news is slightly positive (at the very least not negative) unlike everything else happening in the world.

[jaguarr]

At least this news is slightly positive (at the very least not negative) unlike everything else happening in the world.

Agreed. Diplomacy is the proper path, here. We already have one madman in N. Korea unwilling to discuss the issues. We don't need more of them.

jag

[Addendum]

http://news.bostonherald.com/editorial/view.bg?articleid=148385

“Since 2003 Coalition forces have recovered approximately 500 weapons munitions which contain degraded mustard or sarin nerve agent,” states a June 21 declassified summary of a report from the National Ground Intelligence Center. “Despite many efforts to locate and destroy Iraq’s pre-Gulf War chemical munitions, filled and unfilled pre-Gulf War chemical munitions are assessed to still exist.”




seriously guys, try getting your news from somewhere other than Michaelmoore.com and ihategeorgewbush.com
Those WMD's are Weapons of Minor Discomfort. The degraded mustard agent would still burn human skin if you apply it directly, such as busting it open and using it the same as suntan lotion. So it would only pose a threat to a platoon of mentally retarded soldiers. Last time I checked, Corky isn't in the military.

15-18 year old weapons, buried in the desert and forgotten, are not the serious weapons that this nation went to war over.

The only people making a big deal of this are 2 senators who are running for re-election this year, and the Bush administration has fluffed it off. The report was from 2003. It's old damned non-news

[Hobgoblin]

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/07/26/iran.volunteers.ap/index.html

True, its only 200 volunteers but its still military support to Hezbollah from Iran. I wouldnt be surprised to see more volunteers start heading to the battle zone, and then Israel will have to respond somehow.

[JLBats]

sumofgod

[Tangled Web]

It's happening!

[War Lord]

Yeah!

It's the last days!

[Hobgoblin]

Hm, not exactly the responses that I was expecting. :o

[Helghast]

SumofGod better be wrong because World War III will either end the world or turn it into emotional equilibrium, like that Batman guy movie.

[Gamma Ray]

Israel could take out 200 "volunteers" in a split second. Not really worried about this, or the war in general.

[Jack O'Lantern]

Israel could take out 200 "volunteers" in a split second. Not really worried about this, or the war in general.

Yeah, but the fact that Iran is sending any support to Hezbollah at all is not a good thing. Look at what Israel has done after two soldiers were kidnapped. Imagine how they will respond when a foriegn nation sends volunteers to help thier enemy. I'm not saying the Israelis are wrong in what they are doing, I'm just saying that they arent pussy footing around.

[War Lord]

Yeah, but the fact that Iran is sending any support to Hezbollah at all is not a good thing. Look at what Israel has done after two soldiers were kidnapped. Imagine how they will respond when a foriegn nation sends volunteers to help thier enemy. I'm not saying the Israelis are wrong in what they are doing, I'm just saying that they arent pussy footing around.

Who do you think funds Hezbollah?

Iran has been in it since the beginning.

[Jack O'Lantern]

Who do you think funds Hezbollah?

Iran has been in it since the beginning.

True, but sending soldiers (and I use the term loosely) is different from sending money and weapons, imo.

[kainedamo]

People make all sorts of assumptions about what things are like in the Middle East. I see people making crazy assumptions all the time.

People think that just because a country is in the Middle East and run by brown people that it must be bad.

But like, Iran has a good economy (I think I read that somwhere), and like, apparently a good health care system. And stuff.

Anyway, take Lebanon. I heard some crazy son of a ***** say that Hezbollah are like the Taliban and will turn Lebanon into something similar to Afghanistan.

[Harlekin]

Depends on your perspective.
- For your average Westerner: Hellhole.
- For your average African person living in a wooden hut: Paradise.

[kainedamo]

When you say "average", do you mean "upper class"??

What do you think it's like over there?? Do people think they have better wooden huts than the South Africans? I mean c'mon!

[Immortalfire]

But like, Iran has a good economy (I think I read that somwhere), and like, apparently a good health care system. And stuff.
Well, with that amazing in-depth analysis I'm booking my next vacation there. :up: :o

[Gonking]

Answering to your question I would say that if you are muslin is a great place to live but if you are from western civilization it is not. I need a Liberal political sistem to live my life.

[Harlekin]

When you say "average", do you mean "upper class"??

What do you think it's like over there?? Do people think they have better wooden huts than the South Africans? I mean c'mon!
When I say "average", I mean "average". That's not such a hard distinction to make is it?

I think it's a hellhole. After all, I'm your average Westerner.

[kainedamo]

What exactly about the place wouldn't you like?

[Harlekin]

What exactly about the place wouldn't you like?
- Religion. I'm not a muslim. Their beliefs would inevitably clash with mine, most probably in a violent conflict.
- Outside of major cities, the standard of living is significantly below the one that I currently have.
- Foreign policy. Iran is a hotbed of violent activity and is consistently under threat of military action.

[kainedamo]

- Religion. I'm not a muslim. Their beliefs would inevitably clash with mine, most probably in a violent conflict.

How can you be sure about that?

- Outside of major cities, the standard of living is significantly below the one that I currently have.

I'd like to see what evidence you have of this.

- Foreign policy. Iran is a hotbed of violent activity and is consistently under threat of military action.


That's true.

I did a search on google, and found some comments saying that the Iranian people were very friendly when they went to the country. So are you sure they would react violently towards you? I have read bad comments too, though. For example, I've read that the police are heavy handed and suspicious. I don't know alot about what it would be like to live in Iran, just what I see on tv and read. It seems like a perfectly normal place, to tell you the truth.

http://www.realprowrestling.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=243&Itemid=30

http://www.afsc.org/both-places/project/interview_bitta_mostofi.html

I found this comment...

"Name = Kaoru
Years Married = 13
Number of Children = 3
Country & City = Japan, Osaka
Category of Submission = Travel

Subject = I enjoyed traveling to Iran !

Salam, everyone.
I am a Japanese. I live with my Iranian husband and three kids in Japan. I met him here in Japan. We have been married for 13 years. There are not so many Iranians in Japan so we have only a few information about them. Fortunately I understand English. I enjoy Zanamu homepage very much.

I have traveled to Iran five times. My first visit was 9 years ago. Of course we took our kids. Before I had been to Iran, I was very anxious. I knew Iran was very strict religious country. But as soon as I arrive there, I changed my mind. People welcomed me very heartfully. I stayed there for two and half months. I hated the dress code for women. But I was acustomed to wear it at last. And my brother-in-law had a traditional marriage meeting, engagement party, wedding ceremony and so on. They were very intrested for me.

I am writing my travel note of Iran in my homepage. I put many photos of there. Please take a look. http://www.geocities.co.jp/SilkRoad-Oasis/5844/eindex.html"

The dress code doesn't sound too great. But you have to accept really, that's their culture, their religion. You have to respect that.

[Antonello Blueberry]

Oil drills are a state property and the government uses most of the money they make selling it to improve the school and medical system. Sure, they have a great number of religious fanatics, but most of them are far from being the "terrorist" type.
Being in a comics related board, may I suggest reading Marianne Satrapi's Persepolis, soon to be an animated picture. It's dated, its stories are set like 25 years ago when the artist was still living in Iran and they were at war with Iraq (at the time backed by the USA). Things have changed. There's a nice article on Iran on the latest issue of Newsweek, too.

[Wilhelm-Scream]

I've watched a few really good documentaries on life in Iran, on PBS.
With each one, I was surprised by how nice and normal it appeared to be, but then also surprised at how bad it was.

For instance, one of the documentaries was about an alternative newspaper which was trying to be the "voice of dissent". I was surprised at what they got away with printing, however the reporters and editor had plenty of stories of being threatened with violence by the gov't. if they were to print certain stories, so...

[kainedamo]

Sure, Welhelm, it has that aspect to it. Strict police and stuff.

But my main problem with people in general, the reason I made this thread, is the false assumptions people make. People think it's a terrible place to live, and then they're shocked when they find that people that have been there had a good time.

Like Harlekin's ignorant comment... people seem to think everyone in the Middle East except the Israelis live in mud huts.

[kainedamo]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3502911.stm

They have Playstation in Iran?!???!? :wow:

[Duende Verde]

People make all sorts of assumptions about what things are like in the Middle East. I see people making crazy assumptions all the time.

People think that just because a country is in the Middle East and run by brown people that it must be bad.

But like, Iran has a good economy (I think I read that somwhere), and like, apparently a good health care system. And stuff.

Anyway, take Lebanon. I heard some crazy son of a ***** say that Hezbollah are like the Taliban and will turn Lebanon into something similar to Afghanistan.

Translation of quote:
"I want to make a controversial thread. Is this controversial enough?"

[kainedamo]

If the concept that a country in the Middle East might not be so bad is controversial to you, maybe it's best to just lock the doors, stay at home, wrap yourself up in a bubble.

[Antonello Blueberry]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3502911.stm

They have Playstation in Iran?!???!? :wow:
Yes, and they have internet and Coca Cola, too.

[Harlekin]

How can you be sure about that?
Because I'd inevitably go against the religious beliefs in Iran. I'd adapt as much as I can, if I were to ever move to Iran for some reason, but certain things I would certainly have trouble with. You cited the dress code yourself.

The dress code doesn't sound too great. But you have to accept really, that's their culture, their religion. You have to respect that.
I respect that, therefore I'm not going to live there, because I know I wouldn't keep to that kind of rule, leading to the inevitably of conflict, and there are so few conflicts concerning religion that do not end in violence. You come from Belfast right? You should know this.

I'd like to see what evidence you have of this.
You don't exactly see homes being built out of rocks here. I do not doubt that I could live there, but take a look here:
http://www.rtfract.com/village.htm
http://www.horizonsunlimited.com/tstories/schuller/images/Iran-mountainvillagenearKaspeansea.jpg

You won't find villages like that here in the Netherlands.

I did a search on google, and found some comments saying that the Iranian people were very friendly when they went to the country. So are you sure they would react violently towards you? I have read bad comments too, though. For example, I've read that the police are heavy handed and suspicious. I don't know alot about what it would be like to live in Iran, just what I see on tv and read. It seems like a perfectly normal place, to tell you the truth.
'Inevitably' is a variable. Whether it takes a year or twenty, that conflict will eventually arise. The probability of it happening in Iran as opposed to here is significantly higher because the Middle East area is (as you agreed with) a hotbed of violent activity, most often over religious differences.

But my main problem with people in general, the reason I made this thread, is the false assumptions people make. People think it's a terrible place to live, and then they're shocked when they find that people that have been there had a good time.
Travelling there and living there are two very different things. I've been to places I found great to travel too, but wouldn't ever want to live. Have you been to the Cape verde Islands? Great place, sure as hell wouldn't want to live there.

Like Harlekin's ignorant comment... people seem to think everyone in the Middle East except the Israelis live in mud huts.
I made no such statement. I said that their standard of living is often significantly below what I'm used to. Also, word of advice, calling someone ignorant when you yourself:
- Get your info from TV/radio (as you yourself have posted).
- Have never been to Iran.
is ignorant.

So here's a good idea. You go to Iran, write down your experiences and then you come back and criticize the rest of us. How's that for a plan?

[Duende Verde]

If the concept that a country in the Middle East might not be so bad is controversial to you, maybe it's best to just lock the doors, stay at home, wrap yourself up in a bubble.
Nope, it's your posts like the one about playstation that are crying "please start some controversy, please".

[Immortalfire]

I bet what kainedemo really meant is Dan and Vicki went to Iran.

[JLBats]

I bet what kainedemo really meant is Dan and Vicki went to Iran.

If that were true, the thread would be called "Are four hour sex sessions legal in Iran?"

[Immortalfire]

If that were true, the thread would be called "Are four hour sex sessions legal in Iran?" Ahahahah

[Daisy]

It all depends.

For your average Western woman... it would be a bad place to live.

While women in Iran are educated and allowed to participate in the workplace (in most cases), they are second-class citizens. They are subject to whims of whatever males control their lives (if single: father and brothers, if married: husband).

This is worse in the rural areas than in the cities, but it's true of both to varying degree.


For example:
If a woman is raped, her father an brothers can choose to stone her to death for dishonoring their family and the government is unlikely to intervene.

It is a woman's father (or brothers if her father is deceased) who decides who she marries.

If a woman's husband chooses to beat her, she has virtually no recourse.
If her husband chooses to confine her to the house and not allow her to work, that is his right.

Women who are unescorted by men or deemed to be in any way 'immodest' are fair game to be raped or beaten by men, with virtually no recourse under the law (and if they are, can be disowned or even killed by their families for having been victimized).

And yes, these things DO happen. As I said, it's worse in rural areas than in the cities, but it happens in both.

Also, Iran is not tolerant of other religions. It is an ISLAMIC state. They kill members of the b'hai (*pretty sure that's spelled wrong) faith. Most Jews and Christians left Iran during the revolution or shortly thereafter to avoid persecution.

Also, if you are a Sunni Muslim, Iran is not a good place to live, as you will also be suject to persecution.

All that said, Iran is a great place to visit (provided you respect their laws - for example: dress modestly - women need minimally to wear head-coverings long sleeves and preferably long skirts, and men no muscle-shirts/tanks or shorts). Most people are very friendly and like to chat with Westerners (even Americans).

[jaguarr]

Have you visited Iran, Daisy? You made me curious as you seem fairly well versed in Iranian culture.

jag

[Wilhelm-Scream]

No Tank Tops And Shorts?!?

[jaguarr]

No Tank Tops And Shorts?!?

Add flip-flops to that ensemble and you'd get stoned to death in a heartbeat.

jag

[roach]

my views on middle eastern countries changed when I got over there.....However the problems most people have with foreign governments is not with it's people or infrastructure.....Hitler did wonderful things for Germany....it is with the person in charge that most people have issues with

[kingman]

I've never been to Iran and I will never be to Iran... there is a reason that most places in the middle east are associated with the terror aspects that we face in these times but there is so much to consider when looking at the place... a few months ago people might have been gladly accepted there if they were from another country but now that the US and Europe are trying to force them into doing something they have no intention of stopping many people wont be as welcome... you make references to terrorism in your signature too but I ask you... what do you really know about the subject?

[War Lord]

People make all sorts of assumptions about what things are like in the Middle East. I see people making crazy assumptions all the time.

People think that just because a country is in the Middle East and run by brown people that it must be bad.

But like, Iran has a good economy (I think I read that somwhere), and like, apparently a good health care system. And stuff.

Anyway, take Lebanon. I heard some crazy son of a ***** say that Hezbollah are like the Taliban and will turn Lebanon into something similar to Afghanistan.

I highly recommend that you move there.

[Wilhelm-Scream]

I'd love to see them try anything while I'm strutting down the street in my Wolf's Head Tank Top.

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/Wilhelm-Scream/huntermtank.jpg

[War Lord]

I'd love to see them try anything while I'm strutting down the street in my Wolf's Head Tank Top.

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/Wilhelm-Scream/huntermtank.jpg

What are you going to do?

You'd be screaming like a girl as they beat you down.

[Daisy]

Have you visited Iran, Daisy? You made me curious as you seem fairly well versed in Iranian culture.

jag

I was supposed to spend time studying there - had grants and everything, but they pulled/denied my visa... three times (originally I was scheduled to go October 2001 :whatever: ). After the third time, I had to give up and let go of the grant money.

Anyway, the reason I'm familiar with it is because it was part of my studies. I was going there to study Isfahan and the Safavid period, but in order to go and stay there for a while, I had to familiarize myself with contemporary culture. I've also had a number of professors and friends who've studied/lived there for various amounts of time (since the revolution), although only those with non-US passports have been able to go since 9/11.

[jaguarr]

I was supposed to spend time studying there - had grants and everything, but they pulled/denied my visa... three times (originally I was scheduled to go October 2001 :whatever: ). After the third time, I had to give up and let go of the grant money.

Anyway, the reason I'm familiar with it is because it was part of my studies. I was going there to study Isfahan and the Safavid period, but in order to go and stay there for a while, I had to familiarize myself with contemporary culture. I've also had a number of professors and friends who've studied/lived there for various amounts of time (since the revolution), although only those with non-US passports have been able to go since 9/11.

I thought there might be a story, there. Interesting. What sparked your interest in Middle Eastern culture, Iranian in particular?

jag

[Wilhelm-Scream]

What are you going to do?

You'd be screaming like a girl as they beat you down.I can take on any backwards, Jew-hating, misogynistic, miltant theocracy in my wolf-shirt.:cmad:

[War Lord]

I can take on any backwards, Jew-hating, misogynistic, miltant theocracy in my wolf-shirt.:cmad:

Cool!

Than why haven't you removed the Cryps from Los Angelos?

I hold you responsible for the gang problems of America.

[War Lord]

It all depends.

For your average Western woman... it would be a bad place to live.

While women in Iran are educated and allowed to participate in the workplace (in most cases), they are second-class citizens. They are subject to whims of whatever males control their lives (if single: father and brothers, if married: husband).

This is worse in the rural areas than in the cities, but it's true of both to varying degree.


For example:
If a woman is raped, her father an brothers can choose to stone her to death for dishonoring their family and the government is unlikely to intervene.

It is a woman's father (or brothers if her father is deceased) who decides who she marries.

If a woman's husband chooses to beat her, she has virtually no recourse.
If her husband chooses to confine her to the house and not allow her to work, that is his right.

Women who are unescorted by men or deemed to be in any way 'immodest' are fair game to be raped or beaten by men, with virtually no recourse under the law (and if they are, can be disowned or even killed by their families for having been victimized).

And yes, these things DO happen. As I said, it's worse in rural areas than in the cities, but it happens in both.

Isn't this the way life is supposed to be?

[Daisy]

Oh, and while Iran doesn't have a really bad economy... they have high unemployment (which is in large part structural in nature)... particularly among young men... which has a tendency to create volitility (and makes it easier for terrorist groups to recruit - they appeal to the dissatisfaction among these young people).

A number of Arab countries (like Saudi Arabia/Palestine), as well as Pakistan, have the same problem.

[Daisy]

I thought there might be a story, there. Interesting. What sparked your interest in Middle Eastern culture, Iranian in particular?

jag

That was my doctoral field of study... Islamic Archaeology and Art History.

I jumped from Islamic influence in the Medieval west during my Masters to straight Islamic.

[JLBats]

Isn't this the way life is supposed to be?

Wait, wait...

War Lord's dream world is IRAN?

*Head... EXPLODES*

[War Lord]

Wait, wait...

War Lord's dream world is IRAN?

*Head... EXPLODES*

Just the woman-oppression thing, where they have to serve you and you can beat them into submission or treat them like a blow-up doll.

[JLBats]

Just the woman-oppression thing, where they have to serve you and you can beat them into submission or treat them like a blow-up doll.

....

[Wilhelm-Scream]

Wait, wait...

War Lord's dream world is IRAN?

*Head... EXPLODES*I think it pretty much would be if you just switched Allah out with Elohim.

[JLBats]

I think it pretty much would be if you just switched Allah out with Elohim.

Eh, what's the difference?:down:(

[roach]

People make all sorts of assumptions about what things are like in the Middle East. I see people making crazy assumptions all the time.

People think that just because a country is in the Middle East and run by brown people that it must be bad.

But like, Iran has a good economy (I think I read that somwhere), and like, apparently a good health care system. And stuff.

Anyway, take Lebanon. I heard some crazy son of a ***** say that Hezbollah are like the Taliban and will turn Lebanon into something similar to Afghanistan.


While I agree with this statement dont base everything you know about a country on what you read or the internet

[War Lord]

While I agree with this statement dont base everything you know about a country on what you read or the internet

Then why should I believe you?

[celldog]

People make all sorts of assumptions about what things are like in the Middle East. I see people making crazy assumptions all the time.

People think that just because a country is in the Middle East and run by brown people that it must be bad.

But like, Iran has a good economy (I think I read that somwhere), and like, apparently a good health care system. And stuff.

Anyway, take Lebanon. I heard some crazy son of a ***** say that Hezbollah are like the Taliban and will turn Lebanon into something similar to Afghanistan.


Most Muslim countrties suck for women. So I guess if you're a man (not a homosexual) you'd be okay. :up:

[roach]

Most Muslim countrties suck for women. So I guess if you're a man (not a homosexual) you'd be okay. :up:

in most Mid East countries men are for pleasure women are for babies

[roach]

Then why should I believe you?


cause im the godammmed Roach ya bastich

[The Overlord]

People make all sorts of assumptions about what things are like in the Middle East. I see people making crazy assumptions all the time.

People think that just because a country is in the Middle East and run by brown people that it must be bad.

But like, Iran has a good economy (I think I read that somwhere), and like, apparently a good health care system. And stuff.

Anyway, take Lebanon. I heard some crazy son of a ***** say that Hezbollah are like the Taliban and will turn Lebanon into something similar to Afghanistan.

The thing is you would have to be an ultra social conservative to truly enjoy living there. Personally I hate social conservatism, so I have no desire to live there. Lety me ask you questions, does iran have anti buggery laws, does Iran treat women as equals and does Iran respect people of other religions?

Also if Iran is an open and free society, how do explain this:
http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/kazemi/

[celldog]

via NYTimes:
Op-Ed Contributor
Muslim Myopia
By IRSHAD MANJI
Published: August 16, 2006
New Haven
LAST week, the luminaries of the British Muslim mainstream — lobbyists, lords and members of Parliament — published an open letter to Prime Minister Tony Blair, telling him that the "debacle" of both Iraq and Lebanon provides "ammunition to extremists who threaten us all." In increasingly antiwar America, a similar argument is gaining traction: The United States brutalizes Muslims, which in turn foments Islamist terror.

But violent jihadists have rarely needed foreign policy grievances to justify their hot heads. There was no equivalent to the Iraq debacle in 1993, when Islamists first tried to blow up the World Trade Center, or in 2000, when they attacked the American destroyer Cole. Indeed, that assault took place after United States-led military intervention saved thousands of Muslims in Bosnia and Kosovo.

If Islamists cared about changing Iraq policy, they would not have bothered to abduct two journalists from France — probably the most antiwar, anti-Bush nation in the West. Even overt solidarity with Iraqi suffering did not prevent Margaret Hassan, who ran a world-renowned relief agency in Baghdad, from being executed by insurgents.

Meanwhile, at least as many Muslims are dying at the hands of other Muslims as under the boots of any foreign imperial power. In Sudan, black Muslims are starved, raped, enslaved and slaughtered by Arab militias, with the consent of an Islamic government. Where is the "official" Muslim fury against that genocide? Do Muslim lives count only when snuffed out by non-Muslims? If not, then here is an idea for Muslim representatives in the West: Go ahead and lecture the politicians that their foreign policies give succor to radicals. At the same time, however, challenge the educated and angry young Muslims to hold their own accountable, too.

This means reminding them that in Pakistan, Sunnis hunt down *****es every day; that in northern Israel, Katuysha rockets launched by Hezbollah have ripped through the homes of Arab Muslims as well as Jews; that in Egypt, the riot police of President Hosni Mubarak routinely club, rape, torture and murder Muslim activists promoting democracy; and, above all, that civil wars have become hallmarks of the Islamic world.

Muslim figureheads will not dare be so honest. They would sooner replicate the very sins for which they castigate the Bush and Blair governments — namely, switching rationales and pretending integrity.

In the wake of the London bombings on July 7, 2005, Iqbal Sacranie, then the head of the influential Muslim Council of Britain, insisted that economic discrimination lay at the root of Islamist radicalism in his country. When it came to light that some of the suspects enjoyed middle-class upbringings, university educations, jobs and cars, Mr. Sacranie found a new culprit: foreign policy. In so doing, he boarded the groupthink express steered by Muslim elites.

The good news is that ordinary people of faith are capable of self-criticism. Two months ago, 65 percent of British Muslims polled believed that their communities should increase efforts to integrate. The same poll also produced troubling results: 13 percent lionized the July 7 terrorists, and 16 percent sympathized. Still, these figures total 29 percent — less than half the number who sought to belong more fully to British society.

Whether in Britain or America, those who claim to speak for Muslims have a responsibility to the majority, which wants to reconcile Islam with pluralism. Whatever their imperial urges, it is not for Tony Blair or George W. Bush to restore Islam's better angels. That duty — and glory — goes to Muslims.
...

Irshad Manji, a fellow at Yale University, is the author of The Trouble with Islam Today: A Muslim's Call for Reform in Her Faith.

from Wikipedia:

Manji has been a critic of orthodox Islam, especially the treatment of women by some Muslims. She does not wear a headscarf or chador whereas many traditional Muslim women do observe the hijab. She has criticized the Palestinian leadership and the opinions of some Muslims about Israel.

In March 2006 a letter she co-signed entitled MANIFESTO: Together facing the new totalitarianism with eleven other individuals (most notably Salman Rushdie) was published in response to violent protests in the Islamic world surrounding the Jyllands-Posten Muhammad cartoons controversy.

She questions historical interpretations of the Qur'an and advocates the concept of ijtihad, "the Muslim tradition of independent thinking".


Where are the rest like this woman???

[Darthphere]

Oh dear.

[Alpha and Omega]

Where are the rest like this woman???

:confused: Um, my guess is that they're staying silent out of fear of small things like random throat slittings, condoned-legal spousal rape, and other types of vicious verbal/physical abuse.:confused:

The fairer sex definitely have frightening lives in some militant muslamic countries. It's sickening.

[Mr Sparkle]

you fools! why did you reply???? you've murdered us all!!!!!!

[jaguarr]

you fools! why did you reply???? you've murdered us all!!!!!!

*stones Mr. Sparkle to death*

jag

[Addendum]

http://www.shipoffools.com/Cargo/Features99/Features/BrianPic1.jpg

[jaguarr]

http://www.shipoffools.com/Cargo/Features99/Features/BrianPic1.jpg

Oh. Sorry. My bad. :csad:

jag

[Mr Sparkle]

hey guys, to quote Celldog


http://www.eamgmt.com/eam_images/hair/Creighton/cb20_bryce%20dallas%20howard_la%20times%201.jpg





Where are the rest like this woman???

[Alpha and Omega]

http://images.ibsys.com/2005/0515/4490722_200X150.jpg

[Maxwell Smart]

jesus... celldog's such a ****ing tool.

[celldog]

:confused: Um, my guess is that they're staying silent out of fear of small things like random throat slittings, condoned-legal spousal rape, and other types of vicious verbal/physical abuse.:confused:

The fairer sex definitely have frightening lives in some militant muslamic countries. It's sickening.

Exactly! She's been threatened! She'll probably have a short life, unfortunately. :(

[celldog]

jesus... celldog's such a ****ing tool.


How?? This woman "IS" a Muslim. Isn't her view even more valid than mine?

[Super_Ludacris]

The way I read that article is that she's saying to Blair that if we continue to bomb the middle east or let Isarel bomb them, then naturally people will to turn fundamentalism which in turn could mean terror grou[s. No suprise there, muslims and non-muslims have been saying. Plus generally when a country is in turmoil or attack people turn to a sort of national pride/religon to gain solace (turn to core values) so it's no suprise that Neo-christianism (sp? lol) is on the rise post 9/11 and Zionism in Isarel. None of it helps but to me article is showing a clear line between Fundamentalist and Modeate Islam. But no one can deny that if western countries stay bombing civillans that will happen. And tons of people say this not just islamic woman there all around (where the hell do you live? lol). So if that article was trying to convince people to be anti-Islamic...didnt work on me *shrug*

[celldog]

The way I read that article is that she's saying to Blair that if we continue to bomb the middle east or let Isarel bomb them, then naturally people will to turn fundamentalism which in turn could mean terror grou[s. No suprise there, muslims and non-muslims have been saying. Plus generally when a country is in turmoil or attack people turn to a sort of national pride/religon to gain solace (turn to core values) so it's no suprise that Neo-christianism (sp? lol) is on the rise post 9/11 and Zionism in Isarel. None of it helps but to me article is showing a clear line between Fundamentalist and Modeate Islam. But no one can deny that if western countries stay bombing civillans that will happen. And tons of people say this not just islamic woman there all around (where the hell do you live? lol). So if that article was trying to convince people to be anti-Islamic...didnt work on me *shrug*


Huh? That's not what she said....

This is her quote: "But violent jihadists have rarely needed foreign policy grievances to justify their hot heads. There was no equivalent to the Iraq debacle in 1993, when Islamists first tried to blow up the World Trade Center, or in 2000, when they attacked the American destroyer Cole. Indeed, that assault took place after United States-led military intervention saved thousands of Muslims in Bosnia and Kosovo."

So how did you come that conclusion?? Did you even read it?

Her first paragraph was her saying what British Muslim leaders were telling Tony Blair. But she goes on to shoot down those weak excuses.

[Mr Sparkle]

The good news is that ordinary people of faith are capable of self-criticism. Two months ago, 65 percent of British Muslims polled believed that their communities should increase efforts to integrate. The same poll also produced troubling results: 13 percent lionized the July 7 terrorists, and 16 percent sympathized. Still, these figures total 29 percent — less than half the number who sought to belong more fully to British society.



celldog really, what was the point of posting this? what are you trying to say? :confused: you speak as if ONLY this woman was the ideal muslim, but your own article states otherwise, did you just like....scan it for phrases you might like?

[Darthphere]

celldog really, what was the point of posting this? what are you trying to say? :confused: you speak as if ONLY this woman was the ideal muslim, but your own article states otherwise, did you just like....scan it for phrases you might like?


Yes.

[Super_Ludacris]

Huh? That's not what she said....

This is her quote: "But violent jihadists have rarely needed foreign policy grievances to justify their hot heads. There was no equivalent to the Iraq debacle in 1993, when Islamists first tried to blow up the World Trade Center, or in 2000, when they attacked the American destroyer Cole. Indeed, that assault took place after United States-led military intervention saved thousands of Muslims in Bosnia and Kosovo."

So how did you come that conclusion?? Did you even read it?

Her first paragraph was her saying what British Muslim leaders were telling Tony Blair. But she goes on to shoot down those weak excuses.


Honestly I didnt read past the first paragraph.......


































































mainly cause you posted it

[Darthphere]

Oh snap! Sonned.

[Mentok]

I think this picture sums up my feelings...


http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k8/mentokmentok/1155895289505.jpg

[Super_Ludacris]

celldog really, what was the point of posting this? what are you trying to say? :confused: you speak as if ONLY this woman was the ideal muslim, but your own article states otherwise, did you just like....scan it for phrases you might like?

Basically

I mean I'mma dude who has family in the US Miltary. I also lived in the Middle East for a majority of Expatriate life, I have muslim, Jewish and christian friends from Lebanon, Palestine, Saudi Arabia, Isarel, London, Australia, South Africa etc etc. and I check out all the news networks and read foreign news publications on the in internet. So if I humbly say so, I think I have well rounded view on the current events of the world today.... I dont know what dude wants me to say when I know that's just one perspective and he probably dont have any Muslim friends...

[Maxwell Smart]

celldog really, what was the point of posting this? what are you trying to say? you speak as if ONLY this woman was the ideal muslim, but your own article states otherwise, did you just like....scan it for phrases you might like?

We have a winnar!

And for extra credit, WHY would he do this?

I'll go ahead and take this one for the win, Alex...

What is a bloated sense of self-importance in relation to his religious views?

[Kurosawa]

via NYTimes:
Op-Ed Contributor
Muslim Myopia
By IRSHAD MANJI
Published: August 16, 2006
New Haven
LAST week, the luminaries of the British Muslim mainstream — lobbyists, lords and members of Parliament — published an open letter to Prime Minister Tony Blair, telling him that the "debacle" of both Iraq and Lebanon provides "ammunition to extremists who threaten us all." In increasingly antiwar America, a similar argument is gaining traction: The United States brutalizes Muslims, which in turn foments Islamist terror.

But violent jihadists have rarely needed foreign policy grievances to justify their hot heads. There was no equivalent to the Iraq debacle in 1993, when Islamists first tried to blow up the World Trade Center, or in 2000, when they attacked the American destroyer Cole. Indeed, that assault took place after United States-led military intervention saved thousands of Muslims in Bosnia and Kosovo.

If Islamists cared about changing Iraq policy, they would not have bothered to abduct two journalists from France — probably the most antiwar, anti-Bush nation in the West. Even overt solidarity with Iraqi suffering did not prevent Margaret Hassan, who ran a world-renowned relief agency in Baghdad, from being executed by insurgents.

Meanwhile, at least as many Muslims are dying at the hands of other Muslims as under the boots of any foreign imperial power. In Sudan, black Muslims are starved, raped, enslaved and slaughtered by Arab militias, with the consent of an Islamic government. Where is the "official" Muslim fury against that genocide? Do Muslim lives count only when snuffed out by non-Muslims? If not, then here is an idea for Muslim representatives in the West: Go ahead and lecture the politicians that their foreign policies give succor to radicals. At the same time, however, challenge the educated and angry young Muslims to hold their own accountable, too.

This means reminding them that in Pakistan, Sunnis hunt down *****es every day; that in northern Israel, Katuysha rockets launched by Hezbollah have ripped through the homes of Arab Muslims as well as Jews; that in Egypt, the riot police of President Hosni Mubarak routinely club, rape, torture and murder Muslim activists promoting democracy; and, above all, that civil wars have become hallmarks of the Islamic world.

Muslim figureheads will not dare be so honest. They would sooner replicate the very sins for which they castigate the Bush and Blair governments — namely, switching rationales and pretending integrity.

In the wake of the London bombings on July 7, 2005, Iqbal Sacranie, then the head of the influential Muslim Council of Britain, insisted that economic discrimination lay at the root of Islamist radicalism in his country. When it came to light that some of the suspects enjoyed middle-class upbringings, university educations, jobs and cars, Mr. Sacranie found a new culprit: foreign policy. In so doing, he boarded the groupthink express steered by Muslim elites.

The good news is that ordinary people of faith are capable of self-criticism. Two months ago, 65 percent of British Muslims polled believed that their communities should increase efforts to integrate. The same poll also produced troubling results: 13 percent lionized the July 7 terrorists, and 16 percent sympathized. Still, these figures total 29 percent — less than half the number who sought to belong more fully to British society.

Whether in Britain or America, those who claim to speak for Muslims have a responsibility to the majority, which wants to reconcile Islam with pluralism. Whatever their imperial urges, it is not for Tony Blair or George W. Bush to restore Islam's better angels. That duty — and glory — goes to Muslims.
...

Irshad Manji, a fellow at Yale University, is the author of The Trouble with Islam Today: A Muslim's Call for Reform in Her Faith.

from Wikipedia:

Manji has been a critic of orthodox Islam, especially the treatment of women by some Muslims. She does not wear a headscarf or chador whereas many traditional Muslim women do observe the hijab. She has criticized the Palestinian leadership and the opinions of some Muslims about Israel.

In March 2006 a letter she co-signed entitled MANIFESTO: Together facing the new totalitarianism with eleven other individuals (most notably Salman Rushdie) was published in response to violent protests in the Islamic world surrounding the Jyllands-Posten Muhammad cartoons controversy.

She questions historical interpretations of the Qur'an and advocates the concept of ijtihad, "the Muslim tradition of independent thinking".


Where are the rest like this woman???


Dead or in hiding.

[celldog]

Dead or in hiding.

Or soon will be........ and that's the shame of it all. A point many on these board choose to ignore.

[JLBats]

Or soon will be........ and that's the shame of it all. A point many on these board choose to ignore.

Oh, come on, celldog. I'm hardly a fan of you or your views, and you know that. But I don't think ANYONE on these boards thinks that Middle East society is perfect, and most of us have even said that they need to reign in their fanatics more effectively and stop violent aggression. Accusing us of ignoring the absolutely terrible, wrong, EVIL treatment of women and views of free speech is just low:down

[Maxwell Smart]

Oh, come on, celldog. I'm hardly a fan of you or your views, and you know that. But I don't think ANYONE on these boards thinks that Middle East society is perfect, and most of us have even said that they need to reign in their fanatics more effectively and stop violent aggression. Accusing us of ignoring the absolutely terrible, wrong, EVIL treatment of women and views of free speech is just low

What do you expect? Being self-righteous is pretty much inherent with the type of absolutist views he has. We can't ever reach his level of moral superiority because to him it's all or nothing.

[Mr Sparkle]

hey guys, to quote Celldog


http://www.eamgmt.com/eam_images/hair/Creighton/cb20_bryce%20dallas%20howard_la%20times%201.jpg


Where are the rest like this woman???



:( please.....anyone?

[Maxwell Smart]

http://www.eamgmt.com/eam_images/hair/Creighton/cb20_bryce%20dallas%20howard_la%20times%201.jpg

Dyn-o-MITE!

[jaguarr]

:( please.....anyone?

Well, if I TELL you where they are you'll show up and ruin it! :down

jag

[Maxwell Smart]

Well, if I TELL you where they are you'll show up and ruin it!

Wouldn't want us to deflate your date, eh?

[Mr Sparkle]

Well, if I TELL you where they are you'll show up and ruin it! :down

jag


:mad::mad::mad::mad::):mad:

[jaguarr]

Wouldn't want us to deflate your date, eh?

Some of us have actually been with real live women, Max! I know it's shocking to your young psyche, but it's true. Now go attend to your girlfriend. I think she sprang a leak.

jag

[Maxwell Smart]

Some of us have actually been with real live women, Max! I know it's shocking to your young psyche, but it's true. Now go attend to your girlfriend. I think she sprang a leak.

Doesn't apply any more here, friend. :D

Still, nice rebound burn.

[jaguarr]

Doesn't apply any more here, friend. :D

Still, nice rebound burn.

I'm sorry you damaged your blow-up doll beyond repair, Maxwell. She just wasn't meant for your rough lovin'. R.I.P. Suzy O'Mouth. Maxwell loved you so. *moment of silence*

jag

[Alpha and Omega]

Some of us have actually been with real live women, Max! I know it's shocking to your young psyche, but it's true. Now go attend to your girlfriend. I think she sprang a leak.

jag

:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

*wow* :wow: *wow*

you got sonned maxy

[Maxwell Smart]

I'm sorry you damaged your blow-up doll beyond repair, Maxwell. She just wasn't meant for your rough lovin'. R.I.P. Suzy O'Mouth. Maxwell loved you so. *moment of silence*

LOL! Nah what I meant is I'm a man now.

[Mr Sparkle]

LOL! Nah what I meant is I'm a man now.

the operation was a success?:confused:








:p

[Alpha and Omega]

LOL! Nah what I meant is I'm a man now.

uh, congratz I guess.<I've been throwing that word around a lot lately.>

I respect you even more for not creating a thread about it like you just won a Heisman or something.

[Maxwell Smart]

I respect you even more for not creating a thread about it like you just won a Heisman or something.

Haha, I know whatcha mean. Nah.. its just getting laid, no big deal. Right time right place more than anything...

[Alpha and Omega]

Haha, I know whatcha mean. Nah.. its just getting laid, no big deal. Right time right place more than anything...

This seems to be the case until I think about Male Rogue's thread and just shake my head.

There are really no words. . .

[jaguarr]

the operation was a success?:confused:








:p

LMAO! :D

Congrats on getting your wick dipped, Max. :up:

jag

[Darthphere]

All the islamic women are getting their asses kicked by Ultimate Captain America.

[JLBats]

OMG, Maxwell isn't a virgin.

[Super_Ludacris]

All the islamic women are getting their asses kicked by Ultimate Captain America.


I always he was a redneck woman beater. Dude might as well be having a wifebeater vest with a homer simpson belly than that spandex/shield number:o

[celldog]

Oh, come on, celldog. I'm hardly a fan of you or your views, and you know that. But I don't think ANYONE on these boards thinks that Middle East society is perfect, and most of us have even said that they need to reign in their fanatics more effectively and stop violent aggression.

When have you said that?? I don't remember that at all!! All any of you do is critcize your own country and pretty much insinuate that we deserve to be hit.


Accusing us of ignoring the absolutely terrible, wrong, EVIL treatment of women and views of free speech is just low:down

Not any lower than the way you guys have attacked me. :down I'm just calling it like I see it. Geeez...even this Islamic woman sees the Islamic threat that you "REFUSE" to acknowledge.

[Mr Sparkle]

LOL, I think you mean the "extremist" threat (since she's Islamic)


again, did you like read the article you posted?

[JLBats]

Not any lower than the way you guys have attacked me. :down I'm just calling it like I see it. Geeez...even this Islamic woman sees the Islamic threat that you "REFUSE" to acknowledge.

First of all, as I am not American, I'm not exactly insulting my own country, now, am I:rolleyes:

And I have never REFUSED to acknowledge anything. I will easily acknowledge that Extremists of ANY sort are dangerous. I will NEVER acknowledge that it is INHERENT in Islam, as this women, and many other peaceful people living amongst us, can attest to:rolleyes:

[Topdawg]

This woman is pretty stupid.

[Alpha and Omega]

:huh: :dry:

[Mentok]

Dont mind TOPDAWG... He posts stupid comments... Its is thing.

[celldog]

First of all, as I am not American, I'm not exactly insulting my own country, now, am I:rolleyes:

And I have never REFUSED to acknowledge anything. I will easily acknowledge that Extremists of ANY sort are dangerous. I will NEVER acknowledge that it is INHERENT in Islam, as this women, and many other peaceful people living amongst us, can attest to:rolleyes:


Well I'm sure you live in "western society.

[celldog]

This woman is pretty stupid.


Based on what?? How old are you?? 12????