The Captain America Casting Thread

[Chewy]

Hemsworth actually has starring roles in several films that he has done that will be coming out between now and Thor's release. Yes he had a small role in Star Trek, but that was actually the first film he had done in Hollywood. Since then he has filmed a small role in A Perfect Getaway, a starring role in the film Ca$h opposite Sean Bean, a starring role in the new horror film Cabin in the Woods from Joss Whedon, and the lead in the Red Dawn remake. Sure, his resume isn't the largest, but to suggest that he has done nothing but Star Trek isn't accurate.

[Blackman]

Hemsworth actually has starring roles in several films that he has done that will be coming out between now and Thor's release. Yes he had a small role in Star Trek, but that was actually the first film he had done in Hollywood. Since then he has filmed a small role in A Perfect Getaway, a starring role in the film Ca$h opposite Sean Bean, a starring role in the new horror film Cabin in the Woods from Joss Whedon, and the lead in the Red Dawn remake. Sure, his resume isn't the largest, but to suggest that he has done nothing but Star Trek isn't accurate.
I knew he was in The Perfect Getaway but he was only in there for like 10 mins thats why I said he hadn't appereared in more than 10 mins in a film since both his roles in Getaway and Star Trek were small

And yes i know he has things in the works, but as far as things hes finished and were released were limited

[Triad]

I still think that Marvel is going to shoot for the stars and try to get Leo.

While I cannot deny his acting chops and I feel that he would rock the role in that aspect, I still feel that he is too light in the frame for Cap. His age doesn't bother me because he doesn't come off as old as he is (it might even enhance the characterization as a "Man out of his time", older than his years!), but his physique is another matter. I know he is in good shape and could bulk up, but as someone else stated earlier, I think you can only do so much with his narrow shoulder width. He would have been great as Peter Parker back in the old days when he was suggested for the first Spiderman movie. I'm just not so sure about as Captain America. Just an opinion.

[Chewy]

Well he has finished/will finish filming them before Thor starts production, and that's the part that matters in terms of him being experienced in starring in blockbusters.

[Son of Coul]

And Chris Pine has more than that, so the point still stands that he could hold his own with those guys. Plus Leo's a ***.

[WeaponXProject]

I still think that Marvel is going to shoot for the stars and try to get Leo.


Me too. They've made their statements about star power so we'll just have to wait and see now.

[NotFadeAway]

Ben McKenzie.

[Rage]

If you mean McKenzie is too short. Hes the same height as RDJ and worst comes to worst he could wear lifts like RDJ, Daniel Craig, and even Brad Pitt have worn in movies. Cap isnt one of those roles that you need a naturally tall guy like Thor or Superman

And about having a guy who can hold his own with big name actors look at Chris Hemsworth. Never put in a big budget film for more than 10 mins until upcoming Thor. I know it hasnt come out yet but the fact that hes even being put in a movie directed by 4 time Oscar nominee, costarring with one of the best young actress in Hollywood: Natalie Portman along Hannibal freaking Lecter says alot. I mean his resume is even smaller than Pine's, McKenzie's or even Tatum's

McKenzie is 5'9 and so is RDJ... but Norton (weakling Bruce Banner) is 6'1 (4" taller than your would be Cap) McKenzie is quite a small man in stature.

And I agree about what you say about Hemsworth... He too has proved nothing to me. Sure he is tall and has the look... he has proven nothing to me. But I also think that Chris Pine (while he did a fine job in Star Trek) hasn't gotten a proven track record and when people put him up there in the class of Norton/Cheatle/RDJ/Jackson etc... that makes me laugh. I'm not slamming Chris Pine, I'm just saying that anointing him the next coming is a tad early....

Now whomever they get to play Cap will undoubtably have screen presence and you will believe he could command RDJ/Norton/Cheatle etc around... because those actors will SELL THE LIVING ***** OUT OF IT...cause they can act.

[Rage]

While I cannot deny his acting chops and I feel that he would rock the role in that aspect, I still feel that he is too light in the frame for Cap. His age doesn't bother me because he doesn't come off as old as he is (it might even enhance the characterization as a "Man out of his time", older than his years!), but his physique is another matter. I know he is in good shape and could bulk up, but as someone else stated earlier, I think you can only do so much with his narrow shoulder width. He would have been great as Peter Parker back in the old days when he was suggested for the first Spiderman movie. I'm just not so sure about as Captain America. Just an opinion.


While I agree with you on his slight frame... I think that it is actually a benefit for this movie. Leo would probably have to wear a muscle suit under his clothes and have a padded Uniform... but hey... it works for Ron Pearlman in Hellboy... and the upside... if Leo actually loses weight early on for the role... he could actually play the thin sickly Steve Rogers without much Hollywood magic (they would need some)

I think that if they get someone who is totally pumped up... it will be harder to do the pre SSS version of Steve believably... and if they get someone who is thinner...they can always enhance his physique with the suit etc...

I would prefer someone who is naturally buff... but I'm just thinking of the logistics of the whole thing here.

[Webhead2006]

i rather go with a guy who will have by the time filming starts the body for post sss steve rogers. i dont want to see a dam muscle suit for cap. That would be stupid. Then there is many ways they can do sickly pre sss steve.

[louiebling$]

I think Leo can bulk up for the role if given the opportunity.

[Triad]

I'm torn.
While I agree with Rage that his thinness might facilitate the filming of the pre-SSS scenes, I would like to try to avoid the use of a muscle suit if possible. I just feel that when one is worn, it doesn't move realistically enough as true muscle. It comes off as nothing more than padding. Sure Pearlman kinda pulled it off in the Hellboy movies, but there was constantly a lot of stuff going on during every scene that tends to draw the eye away. I don't claim that this is definite and it can not be done believably using a muscle suit, but if it can be avoided by casting a more pumped actor then I might prefer that. The obvious downside is that we would be disqualifying one of the premier actors of our generation just because his shoulder width. That would be a shame considering his talent.
I really don't know how I feel on this...

[MessiahDecoy123]

Leo will never be of super-soldier stature.

He would have to double his weight.

Besides his big apple head would look goofy in a Captain A costume.

[MessiahDecoy123]

Take Brad Pitt from Troy and Inglorious Basterds, mix it, and you have the ideal Cap.

[Rage]

I'm torn.
While I agree with Rage that his thinness might facilitate the filming of the pre-SSS scenes, I would like to try to avoid the use of a muscle suit if possible. I just feel that when one is worn, it doesn't move realistically enough as true muscle. It comes off as nothing more than padding. Sure Pearlman kinda pulled it off in the Hellboy movies, but there was constantly a lot of stuff going on during every scene that tends to draw the eye away. I don't claim that this is definite and it can not be done believably using a muscle suit, but if it can be avoided by casting a more pumped actor then I might prefer that. The obvious downside is that we would be disqualifying one of the premier actors of our generation just because his shoulder width. That would be a shame considering his talent.
I really don't know how I feel on this...

The thing with Cap... is he would almost always be wearing either a uniform or his costume... we may see him shirtless maybe twice during the movie...and then they can do the old Spidey face replacement thing. If they are using a muscle suit under clothing, people woudn't really notice. Kinda like Brandon Routh's muscle suit in Superman Returns. Not many people realized that he was wearing padding to enhance his performance.

If you want to get an actor of the calibre of Leo... then they will probably have to put him in a muscle suit of some sort (like Spidey, Human Torch, Superman, Hellboy etc...)

That's IF Marvel wants Leo... I get the feeling that Leo is their #1 choice... but we will probably get Ryan Phillipe (who I think is to short)

[Keyser Soze]

Hemsworth actually has starring roles in several films that he has done that will be coming out between now and Thor's release. Yes he had a small role in Star Trek, but that was actually the first film he had done in Hollywood. Since then he has filmed a small role in A Perfect Getaway, a starring role in the film Ca$h opposite Sean Bean, a starring role in the new horror film Cabin in the Woods from Joss Whedon, and the lead in the Red Dawn remake. Sure, his resume isn't the largest, but to suggest that he has done nothing but Star Trek isn't accurate.

For me, Hemsworth's big test will be Cabin in the Woods. If JOSS WHEDON can't make you look like a star, then you must be a block of wood.

[Webhead2006]

personally i as i said would go with an actor who will be buff/bulk by the time filming is to start and be the ideal cap look/size. Then either we have a stunt body in place for pre sss steve and either we dont see his face towards or, or we do but we only see face and when it cuts away from face to have the stunt body. Or we do the whole cgi deal like in spider-man 1 or other films of taking Steve's actor's head and digitally adding it to a frial body.

[Brian Braddock]

This has to be said from time to time but, in reference to the shot in Spiderman were we saw Toby's face on a skinny-bodied stand in, I haveta say that was merely about a 2 second shot.

I would assume any shots of Cap without his shirt on would be quite bit longer than that; therefore the CG would have to be more extensive, and more importantly, expensive.

[Young Superman]

Teddy Sears for Captain America!

[jab1118]

I love Leo as an actor but I think for one hes probably too busy to take on this kind of franchise. But if he were to get it I think he could get in the right kind of shape but he does need to do alot. He needs to make the kind of body jump will smith did from wild wild west and bagger vance to how big he is in Ali just one year later, and I hesitate to bring him up for what it may start

[Rage]

I think that whomever they cast as Cap...should have already been working out and eating right if they want a natural looking Captain America. The longer they wait to cast... the more likely we will end up with a muscle suit.

[Son of Coul]

They said they'd start production in June. Doesn't take THAT long to get buff.

[Infinity9999x]

While I cannot deny his acting chops and I feel that he would rock the role in that aspect, I still feel that he is too light in the frame for Cap. His age doesn't bother me because he doesn't come off as old as he is (it might even enhance the characterization as a "Man out of his time", older than his years!), but his physique is another matter. I know he is in good shape and could bulk up, but as someone else stated earlier, I think you can only do so much with his narrow shoulder width. He would have been great as Peter Parker back in the old days when he was suggested for the first Spiderman movie. I'm just not so sure about as Captain America. Just an opinion.

That's a good point. Heck, the guy played a 17 year-old in Catch Me if You Can and he was 28.

However, I agree about the look. He's just too much Spider-man and not enough Cap. Yeah, I have no doubt the guy could get ripped, but there's only so much you can do to make your frame bigger, aside from taking roids.

This has to be said from time to time but, in reference to the shot in Spiderman were we saw Toby's face on a skinny-bodied stand in, I haveta say that was merely about a 2 second shot.


Wait, are you talking about SM1? Because I'm pretty sure that was Toby's actual body. I remember reading about how much he had to work out to get in such good shape.

[jaymes_e06]

They said they'd start production in June. Doesn't take THAT long to get buff.
True. Hugh Jackman went from a fit guy to a ****ing mamath in about 4 months and that's including some of the shooting time of Wolverine. It just depends on the person and body type.

[Gamma Goliath]

chris pine all the way

[Keyser Soze]

chris pine all the way

While Chris Pine might be a bit busy with Star Trek sequels, I definitely think they should cast someone in the Chris Pine mould - a talented, up-and-coming young ACTOR rather than a bodybuilder/swimsuit model.

[Infinity9999x]

True. Hugh Jackman went from a fit guy to a ****ing mamath in about 4 months and that's including some of the shooting time of Wolverine. It just depends on the person and body type.

But also keep in mind that he's been systematically working his body out intensely since X1. It helps if you've been working out often.

[Blackman]

While Chris Pine might be a bit busy with Star Trek sequels, I definitely think they should cast someone in the Chris Pine mould - a talented, up-and-coming young ACTOR rather than a bodybuilder/swimsuit model.
I agree with this

[Son of Coul]

I agree with Keyser too, if not Pine, someone like him (or Hemsworth for that matter) who's going to be up-and-coming and nearing the top of his game early in his career rather than whatever celebrity is "hot" at the moment or big-name for the sake of international appeal like Brad Pitt or Tom Cruise or whoever the hell.

[Rage]

I think alot of people are underestimating how much work it it to put on solid pounds of lean muscle mass. Just because Bale (who was already ripped prior to BB) and Tobey (who put on some solid mass but had a suit with built in muscles and defining shading) were able to do it. Your average actor can't just hop in the gym for four months and come out looking like Captain America... or Hugh Jackman/Christian Bale for that matter.

It depends on their body type, their fitness level prior to working out etc... If they don't get someone in the gym now... our Cap is GOING to NEED visual effects help through costuming and CGI.

[donk70]

I've came to the conclusion that it's possible to make a spectacular, big budget film with a no name in the lead as long as there is a strong supporting cast. Look at Superman, for example. CR was a virtual unknown, but they had Hackman, Cooper, Beatty, Ford and Brando backing him up. As long as the supporting cast is strong, coupled with a strong story, I don't see why this can't be as big as Iron Man, if not bigger.

[donk70]

But they've got to get Cap right. What I mean by right is someone that comes off as a wholesome, honest true blond hair blue eyed American. They need to stick as close as they can get to the canon Cap. 10-15 years ago, I would say Brad Pitt would have been perfect. Someone along that vein would be ideal as long as they beef up a bit.

[daderade]

lets be honest, with makeup and shaved...Brad can still pull this roll off. Did anyone see Benjamin Button? makeup works well with him. Plus, if he Troy bulks, he would be great....i think he is my new top choice actually, he plays a great "man out of his time" character.

[Son of Coul]

I think alot of people are underestimating how much work it it to put on solid pounds of lean muscle mass. Just because Bale (who was already ripped prior to BB) and Tobey (who put on some solid mass but had a suit with built in muscles and defining shading) were able to do it. Your average actor can't just hop in the gym for four months and come out looking like Captain America... or Hugh Jackman/Christian Bale for that matter.

It depends on their body type, their fitness level prior to working out etc... If they don't get someone in the gym now... our Cap is GOING to NEED visual effects help through costuming and CGI.

They said they'd have him cast by the end of the year. If our Cap can't get cut in six months I don't want him as our Cap.

[Stripesy Strip]

I want somebody that can be young AND badass. The only guy that fit the bill is Clint Eastwood's son.

[chris moore]

Badass implies Ultimate Cap, who for the most part is an arsehole as well as badass. No way do I want badass.

[WeaponXProject]

I think Leo can bulk up for the role if given the opportunity.

Me too. He's bulked up a little recently if you've seen him in the trailer for Shutter Island.

I love Leo as an actor but I think for one hes probably too busy to take on this kind of franchise. But if he were to get it I think he could get in the right kind of shape but he does need to do alot. He needs to make the kind of body jump will smith did from wild wild west and bagger vance to how big he is in Ali just one year later, and I hesitate to bring him up for what it may start

The one thing I about Leo is that he is absolutely the most busy person in Hollywood. Very true.

I want somebody that can be young AND badass. The only guy that fit the bill is Clint Eastwood's son.

God ****it! There is nothing badazz about that kid.

[jab1118]

I think alot of people are underestimating how much work it it to put on solid pounds of lean muscle mass. Just because Bale (who was already ripped prior to BB) and Tobey (who put on some solid mass but had a suit with built in muscles and defining shading) were able to do it. Your average actor can't just hop in the gym for four months and come out looking like Captain America... or Hugh Jackman/Christian Bale for that matter.

It depends on their body type, their fitness level prior to working out etc... If they don't get someone in the gym now... our Cap is GOING to NEED visual effects help through costuming and CGI.

I completely disagree as long as the actor is not in bad shape and I dont think anyone suggested is its not that difficult if you are willing to totally commit. When your entire job for six months is work out you can get it done. A nutitionist with a trainer and lets be honest people steroids which hollywood is not opposed to using, and which by the way I dont care if they do they are not competing for anything you can easily get ripped enough in six months

[Young Superman]

Well, I saw other users post their cast for a Cap movie, so I thought I'd post mine :yay:

Jensen Ackles as Captain America

http://www.**************.com/images/users/uploads/12037/ackles%20cap%202.jpg

Jamie Bell as Bucky Barnes

http://www.**************.com/images/users/uploads/12037/barnes%20bell.jpg

Mads Mikkelsen as Red Skull

http://www.**************.com/images/users/uploads/12037/mikkelsen%20red%20skull.jpg

Ralph Fiennes as Baron Zemo

http://www.**************.com/images/users/uploads/12037/baron%20zemo%20fiennes.jpg
IMO just replace Jensen Ackles with Teddy Sears and this cast is PERFECT IMO.

[Son of Coul]

Badass implies Ultimate Cap, who for the most part is an arsehole as well as badass. No way do I want badass.

What the hell kind of logic is that?

[BoredGuy]

^^^ I don't want BADAZZZ either for Cap.

He dominates, but he is in no way a 'badass'
Cap's the ultimate boyscout, but not in an uptight, Superman kinda way.
He's the guy every child (and every soldier) on the planet wants to be..


and will you guys seriously shut the f*** up about Leo!
I may very well kill myself if he gets the role...
...lol kidding (kinda)

[Son of Coul]

Cap has always been a badass, in a good way. You don't have to be a rebellious prick to be badass. In fact I believe a kind, noble man who stands up for what he believes in, slaughtering his way through Nazis, with his head up high knowing that he isn't some super-nerd or genius intellectual, doing what he feels needs to be done no matter what it may do to him is a badass. That's Cap. He isn't all arrogant and "my way or the highway," just a man who will do what needs to be done to preserve his perspective of the American way and ideals, because he believes in them; all the while not caring what people think of him, not caring whether he's "badass" or not. THAT'S A BADASS. AND THAT'S THE CAP I WANNA SEE!

[Keyser Soze]

and will you guys seriously shut the f*** up about Leo!
I may very well kill myself if he gets the role...
...lol kidding (kinda)

The movie would be lucky to have Leonardio DiCaprio as Captain America. However I don't think that's likely to happen, so you don't need to prepare the noose just yet...

[jaymes_e06]

If DiCaprio gets the role I'm going to need for you to uphold your end of the bargan BordGuy. :oldrazz:

[DocHoliday]

I personally would have no issue with Leo getting the role but didn't he say he had no interest in starring ina comic book movie, only producing them?

[Son of Coul]

I don't want Leo as Cap either, but that's not what's irritating, just the redundancy of everyone gushing and saying it'll probably happen (which it probably won't) over and over. I was annoyed with everyone gushing about Jensen Ackles as Cap, even though I don't even know the guy. But now the "OMG JENSEN IS CAP" is dying down and it's more "Jensen could make a cool Cap imo," which I don't mind at all.

[louiebling$]

I personally would have no issue with Leo getting the role but didn't he say he had no interest in starring ina comic book movie, only producing them?
Well he is a big cap fan

[sdn]

I completely disagree as long as the actor is not in bad shape and I dont think anyone suggested is its not that difficult if you are willing to totally commit. When your entire job for six months is work out you can get it done. A nutitionist with a trainer and lets be honest people steroids which hollywood is not opposed to using, and which by the way I dont care if they do they are not competing for anything you can easily get ripped enough in six months

i agree with jab. if all you had to do was workout and about a million dollars was riding on you, anyone can make big changes. some of those "The Biggest Loser" contestants are making huge changes, and the hollywood guys would get the best in the biz.

[Brian Braddock]

From reading some posts on here I can only conclude that some people have never set foot inside a gym and have no idea what level of effort it would take to achieve a ‘Captain America’ type build. I mean, Steve Rogers' whole deal is that he is at the peak of physical fitness; that not only means muscle mass, but cuts as well. I’m talking extreme cuts where the full range of abdominal and obliques are on show, as well as striations in the back and chest area and an overall vascularity, particularly in the forearm and bicep area. I dunno, maybe I'm being too unrealistic here and setting my expectancy bar a tad too high, but I actually want whoever is cast as Cap to at least look a bit special. That is, after all, what separates Steve from the norm.

Anyone who thinks any actor can achieve this by simply ‘bulking up’ for a few months is deluded in my mind. As I’ve said before time and time again, not just any actor has the right ingredients (genetics) to achieve something like a Super Serum derived bod.

Leo, as much as he’s undoubtedly a huge name and fine actor, given that it’s obvious that he’s naturally got a tendancy to be a bit ‘podgy’ since he stopped being a teenager – simply hasn’t got the right ingredients, and no amount of gym work will fix that. Nor will the fact that his face is all wrong for the chiselled look of Steve Rogers.


I mean c'mon, Steve is supposed to look like he's the pinnacle of physical perfection for Pete's sake.

The only way for Leo to look like that would be with CG – but how much would that eat into the budget?

[Wolvieboy17]

They hardly need to go to that much effort... He just needs to have decent muscle tone... I imagine there would only be perhaps one shot with his shirt off, maybe a couple in a singlet, or tight fitting shirt.... He doesn't need to have every muscle bulging... its not like we're going to get full body nude shots, with him looking like arnie in Terminator upon arrival to the present lol.

I've said it before, we don't need an uber buff, ridiculously good looking actor just to sell Captain america to us... Thats up to the filmmakers, and the actors performance... If cap is portrayed as an amazing leader, with gravitas, and is shown to be a capable fighter and strategist, no one is going to be doubting his perfection because he isn't Mr Universe, bulging neck muscles akimbo.

[Brian Braddock]

Again, there seems to be some confusion on here [which happens from time to time]as to what 'the pinnacle of human perfection' or 'peak of physical fitness' really looks like.

I, for one, dont think the bodybuilder or 'Mr Universe, bulging neck muscles akimbo' is the way Cap should look. Cap should look more like a well developed, lithe, flexible, yet powerful, well toned athlete.

And that kind of look is harder to acheive than simply getting someone to 'bulk up'. I agree that it's up to the filmakers to sell the notion of Steve being a super-soldier, but it's a 2 way street.

The actor playing the part has got to look convincing too.

[Wolvieboy17]

Well Brian, you managed to take the last sentence from my post, and completely disregard the rest of it, which is all still perfectly valid.

My point, again, was that they don't have to look 100% like Steve Rogers in real life, there are numerous ways to trick things up, with angles, and shots and costumes. In reality, all the actor would really need to do is 'bulk up' for any scenes where he is shirtless or close to. Alot of people have referenced Christian Bale bulking up for Batman....but when you think about it, you only notice it in the scenes when he has his shirt off, and is doing push ups or whatever, so its not a massive deal... Obviously they need to be fit, but don't go setting that bar way too high.

[Brian Braddock]

Just as you took my post and made it out that I wanted to see a 'Mr Universe, bulging neck muscles akimbo', eh?

Horses for courses, I'd say.

And Bale has always been in good shape - certainly in better shape than Dicaprio, leading him to be able to get in a better physical condition when needed. My point is that an actor who either has an athletic background, or even at least has a history of physical training is going to have a better advantage, or base, in order to get into shape than someone who isnt.

But, I guess were going to have to agree to disagree on that one as I get the feeling we see this issue from 2 different perspectives.

[BoredGuy]

If DiCaprio gets the role I'm going to need for you to uphold your end of the bargan BordGuy. :oldrazz:


Are you suggesting I kill myself??
I'm depressive, you a******.

[Rage]

With Bale and Butler doing such amazing jobs of sculpting their bodies for BB and 300...people seem to think that anyone can do it. Bale was actually only really ripped for one scene in BB (where he does the pushups) and was over bulky for the scenes in Tibet... he had muscle mass but was bloated with water.

And don't get me started on 300. Yes, those actors got into great shape...but they were also airbrushed and oiled to look sculpted. NONE of those actors was in the kind of shape that they appeared to be in (definition wise)

As someone who used to body build (recreationally) and had a roommate who was a competitive bodybuilder... putting on LEAN MUSCLE MASS IS F'ing HARD TO DO...and takes more than just 4 months of training to do.

[Brian Braddock]

Emphatically agreed with, Rage.

I guess only those who've actually been to a gym or have experience with physical fitness training can really appreciating just how difficult it can be.

[marcvader]

This movie is going to be so so polarizing (casting, depiction, physique) that I can't wait.:hehe:

[Rage]

Finally... someone who understands the actual amount of work involved in transforming ones body... and that if you don' t have the genetics, the results just won't happen that quickly... or sometime at all.

Rage

[Brian Braddock]

If only there was a real Super Soldier Serum. lol.

I guess a course Deca, Dyanabol and HGH will have to do (not that I'd ever condone that type of thing, of course :D;) )

[Nightwing]

This movie is going to be so so polarizing (casting, depiction, physique) that I can't wait.:hehe:
For real. :up:

[Brian Braddock]

Yeah, it's not exactly going to be serene, is it? :D

God, can you imagine this thread when the actual casting announcement is made? It'll be bedlam...............

[Nightwing]

I'd expect the lag on this board to be annoying when that day arrives. :awesome:

[Webhead2006]

yea i may not hit the gym that much myself, i really need to lol. To get into better shape and all that. But i know it takes alot of time to build muscle size and mass up and all that. Plus your diet and all that factors in also. Then the type of natural body type you are plays into things. But i do think who ever lands the role of cap should be in good shape nice muscle size and definition and all that. We dont need an arnie looking cap but he should have some size on him.

[Nightwing]

People can go to the gym and try to bulk up all they want, but in the end it really comes down to what you eat after the workout and really the whole day. As well as how much rest you get. Cause muscle doesn't build once you're done pumping iron, it's when you sleep.

So who ever's Cap is gonna need alot of Proteins, Carbs, and sleep.

[Brian Braddock]

I agree, no bodybuilder Cap (remember that poster, Avengerscaptain, who argued day and night that Cap simply had to be more muscular than Thor or, as he described it, he had to be 'the biggest guy in the room'? :hehe:)

The ideal Cap build for me would be more Men's Health than Musclemag or Flex.

[Webhead2006]

totally.

[Nightwing]

I agree, no bodybuilder Cap (remember that poster, Avengerscaptain, who argued day and night that Cap simply had to be more muscular than Thor or, as he described it, he had to be 'the biggest guy in the room'? :hehe:)

The ideal Cap build for me would be more Men's Health than Musclemag or Flex.
Yes. :up:

[jab1118]

Emphatically agreed with, Rage.

I guess only those who've actually been to a gym or have experience with physical fitness training can really appreciating just how difficult it can be.

I agree its difficult but its made easier when you have all the top nutritionists and trainers at your disposal. On top of the fact that you have nothing but time to dedicate yourself to getting in that kind of shape. They have no job keeping them from the gym for your average guy who wants to be in incredible shape its really hard cause things get in the way compromises have to be made when your a millionaire and all you have to do on a given day is work out and remember to bang your supermodel girlfriend those obstacles dont exist

[Son of Coul]

Well no one's arguing that he has to look more athletic than bodybuilder, that's a given. But just because we say it's possible to look defined in six months doesn't mean we've "never set foot in a gym," (which is very untrue right here). All the guy needs beforehand is an athletic build that'll take to the program he'll have to utilize that yes, involves proteins and diet as well.

[jaymes_e06]

Are you suggesting I kill myself??
I'm depressive, you a******.
Ummm.... Ummm...




What's that!!!


*Runs away*

[Infinity9999x]

As someone who used to body build (recreationally) and had a roommate who was a competitive bodybuilder... putting on LEAN MUSCLE MASS IS F'ing HARD TO DO...and takes more than just 4 months of training to do.

Agreed. I've never gotten into bodybuilding, but I've always been a fairly big workout-aholic, and the hardest part about putting on lean muscle mass has to be the diet. I'll go for intense workout plans, but trying to cut my bad carbs and deserts...that's the thing that's really tough for me.

[Chewy]

I'd expect the lag on this board to be annoying when that day arrives. :awesome:
I expect the two most ridiculously laggy days on the Hype in the next few months to be the day the Iron Man 2 trailer comes out and the day Captain America is cast :hehe:

[louiebling$]

And the day when we get Leaked set pics of Chris as Thor

[marcvader]

How about the 1st Avengers trailer. That will truly be something.

[Young Superman]

or the day we get the 1st Spider-Man 4 trailer.

[louiebling$]

or the day we get the 1st Spider-Man 4 trailer.
Ehh not really

[Wolvieboy17]

Just as you took my post and made it out that I wanted to see a 'Mr Universe, bulging neck muscles akimbo', eh?

Horses for courses, I'd say.

And Bale has always been in good shape - certainly in better shape than Dicaprio, leading him to be able to get in a better physical condition when needed. My point is that an actor who either has an athletic background, or even at least has a history of physical training is going to have a better advantage, or base, in order to get into shape than someone who isnt.

But, I guess were going to have to agree to disagree on that one as I get the feeling we see this issue from 2 different perspectives.

I didn't make out you wanted that, contextually, it justified my point, which you have still missed, so I will say it as blunty and straight forwardly as possible.

The actor for Cap doesn't need to be as muscly as Cap. Sure they can if they want to, but with Cinema, costume in a WWII time period (which is usually bulky, and not of your body hugging variety) lighting and so forth, the actor doesn't need to be overly sculpted. This isn't '300' because he isn't going to be near naked for an entire film...

Sure the filmmakers will look for an athletic body type, but for GOOD casting, that stuff is secondary... Muscle mass can be gained, hair can be dyed, height can be tricked... You can't fake acting, and facial features.

THAT was my point... I agree with you about a more athletic body type, but I don't think that would be that much of a stretch for any actor, when you look at the kind of people they would be considering. Pretty much every young, blonde leading actor in Hollywood is fit. (btw, def not decaprio for cap either. Wrong face and voice).

[Brian Braddock]

Brilliant post, Wolvie - you should give lessons in how to be condescending. I really do appreciate that you felt the need to be as blunt and straight forward as possible; the omission of the big words helped so much in aiding my understanding. :whatever:

Give me a break. Sorry dude, but youve got my back up with that comment.

How about this? I answered the particular part of your post that I wanted to and made a conscious choice not to respond to the rest; such is my right and is what happens day in and day out on here and is pretty much standard practice.

If you still doubt this, then please by all means, show me in the Superherohype rules and regulations where it says that, when responding to a post, one has to answer every single point made? Or you could just stop being an ***?

Whichever is easier for you.

I would however point out the irony inherent in that apparent fact that your readiness to berate me has seemingly caused you to have glossed over the points that I have made.

If you go back and re-read them, you may find some of the answers that you're after. Then again, you may not. As I said before, I suspect that we're going to have to agree to disagree on this one (and then hopefully drop it, is I cant be arsed carrying this on for pages and pages quite frankly) - as we're obviously looking at this from differing perspectives.

In my mind, the actor does need to be sculpted to a sufficient level. Its pretty important. Just adding simple muscle mass and using camera tricks wont be sufficient to present the actor as a character who is the finest example of human physical fitness that can be achieved.

EDIT: The funny thing is, at least we are in agreement about Dicaprio. He's not Steve Rogers material.

[Wolvieboy17]

Brian, you are taking this way to seriously, and perhaps this is just the unfortunate fact that tone is not properly reflected in writing, but i'd say your attitude is a tad unnecessary. The irony is that in telling me i'm condescending, you have posted perhaps one of the post condescending posts i've ever seen lol.

I don't want to have silly, trivial arguments. I come on these boards to have interesting, informed discussions with fellow fans, and people who are actually in the know, and enjoy comics and such, which includes you. So lets take things back a notch, and get back on track to the initial convo... Not being condescending, just stating intention... I don't want it to be thought that i'm a douche or anything... I already got reported for 'Trolling' by DACMAN on the spiderman game board, which was ridiculously unfounded and incredibly insulting (forgive me if i'm a tad indignant about it lol).


Now, back to convo... In regards to his muscle mass and body, i agree with you in what he should be... particularly your line "who is the finest example of human physical fitness that can be achieved." I guess the main reason I just get hesitant when it comes to discussing physique in the past, is too often with casting for heroes, its the look and build of an actor that is the basis of their casting, rather than someone who embodies a character, and as a writer and lover of character work, It's one of my pet hatreds...
I just don't want that to happen with Cap.

My biggest hate at the moment is people choosing actors to play 'Conan' in the new movie, and basically they're ONLY criteria is muscle and build, whereas anyone who REALLY knows Conan knows that, like Cap, Conans commanding presence is so much more than muscle! Arnie has ruined that character forever! lol

[flickchick85]

Hmmm, I haven't been in here in a while but I have to say I'm a little surprised that Jensen Ackles is leading the poll. Nothing against him or anything - I like him and think he'd be just fine in the part - but he doesn't have the classic Cap look or the unusually amazing acting skills to make up for it. I just find that odd.

Still, while I've said in the past that I'd prefer an older Cap (my top choice is Gabriel Macht), and I do truly hope they aim a little higher than The CW's acting pool of pretty-former-soap-stars, I'm just curious: What makes Ackles more popular for the part than, say, the guy who plays Green Arrow on Smallville? I mean, from what I've seen, they're both on just about the same level, career wise (both started on soaps and now successfully pull off the roles of wise-cracking charismatic heroes on The CW), yet Justin Hartley has the closer look, voice, AND build for the part.

Is it because he plays a DC hero on TV? Because I thought that still made him fair game for Marvel?

Just for discussion's sake. I'm genuinely curious on this one.

[Brian Braddock]

Brian, you are taking this way to seriously, and perhaps this is just the unfortunate fact that tone is not properly reflected in writing, but i'd say your attitude is a tad unnecessary. The irony is that in telling me i'm condescending, you have posted perhaps one of the post condescending posts i've ever seen lol.

I wouldnt have been surprised by my tone at all, given that you basicically treated me like an idiot in your post. I mean, c'mon really, what did you expect, a friendship request?

That really got my back up to be honest; In retrospect, I do offer my apologies, but I'd suggest that if that hadnt happened, I wouldnt have felt the need to be so abrasive in my response.


I don't want to have silly, trivial arguments. I come on these boards to have interesting, informed discussions with fellow fans, and people who are actually in the know, and enjoy comics and such, which includes you. So lets take things back a notch, and get back on track to the initial convo... Not being condescending, just stating intention... I don't want it to be thought that i'm a douche or anything... I already got reported for 'Trolling' by DACMAN on the spiderman game board, which was ridiculously unfounded and incredibly insulting (forgive me if i'm a tad indignant about it lol).

I dont want to have silly, trivial arguements either - which is why I suggested that we agree to disagree and drop it as we're obviously looking at this from differing perspectives.

But.........


Now, back to convo... In regards to his muscle mass and body, i agree with you in what he should be... particularly your line "who is the finest example of human physical fitness that can be achieved." I guess the main reason I just get hesitant when it comes to discussing physique in the past, is too often with casting for heroes, its the look and build of an actor that is the basis of their casting, rather than someone who embodies a character, and as a writer and lover of character work, It's one of my pet hatreds...
I just don't want that to happen with Cap.

My biggest hate at the moment is people choosing actors to play 'Conan' in the new movie, and basically they're ONLY criteria is muscle and build, whereas anyone who REALLY knows Conan knows that, like Cap, Conans commanding presence is so much more than muscle! Arnie has ruined that character forever! lol

I want them to look at proper, well rounded and talented actors to be cast also (I mean - why wouldnt I?) but I want that tempered with a need for them to look for guys that have the right look too [or at least the ability to achieve the right look]. I'd prefer one not be sacrificed for the other, and casting Leo Dicaprio would be sacrificing the physical aspect of the character imo.

That's why the role is so damn hard to cast in my eyes as there arent that many guys out there with both the acting chops and the look that a character like Cap demands.

Incidentally, I totally agree with you on the Conan subject too, by the way.

[Wolvieboy17]

I agree about it being hard to cast... I'm still hoping somewhere out there there is a perfect captain america, waiting for an audition somewhere... Good to find another Conan fan... Have you read Robert E. Howards original stuff at all?

btw, my comment about writing not being able to convey tone was more in regards to my post, wasn't meaning to make you feel like an idiot, I actually think you're one of the more rational posters on SH, but lets forget all that.

I don't particularly like anyone on that list... Sure some of the people might be standouts as opposed to others on the list, but none of them really scream Cap to me.

[Wolvieboy17]

I agree about it being hard to cast... I'm still hoping somewhere out there there is a perfect captain america, waiting for an audition somewhere... Good to find another Conan fan... Have you read Robert E. Howards original stuff at all?

btw, my comment about writing not being able to convey tone was more in regards to my post, wasn't meaning to make you feel like an idiot, I actually think you're one of the more rational posters on SH, but lets forget all that.

I don't particularly like anyone on that list... Sure some of the people might be standouts as opposed to others on the list, but none of them really scream Cap to me.

[Denny67]

Guys I could see:

I really like the idea of Josh Duhamel. He does the Military thing great. Would need to hit the gym though.
Tahmoh Penikett (he played Helo in BSG and would need to bulk up some) Good actor who could really pull the role off well.
Scott Speedman - (Michael from Underworld). Has the looks and a good screen presence.
Paul Walker – He has the look, would need to bulk and would also need a great director. He is not the strongest actor.


Sorry for any repeat suggestions. I will admit it. I did not read all 54 pages. ;)

[Son of Coul]

Hmmm, I haven't been in here in a while but I have to say I'm a little surprised that Jensen Ackles is leading the poll. Nothing against him or anything - I like him and think he'd be just fine in the part - but he doesn't have the classic Cap look or the unusually amazing acting skills to make up for it. I just find that odd.

Still, while I've said in the past that I'd prefer an older Cap (my top choice is Gabriel Macht), and I do truly hope they aim a little higher than The CW's acting pool of pretty-former-soap-stars, I'm just curious: What makes Ackles more popular for the part than, say, the guy who plays Green Arrow on Smallville? I mean, from what I've seen, they're both on just about the same level, career wise (both started on soaps and now successfully pull off the roles of wise-cracking charismatic heroes on The CW), yet Justin Hartley has the closer look, voice, AND build for the part.

Is it because he plays a DC hero on TV? Because I thought that still made him fair game for Marvel?

Just for discussion's sake. I'm genuinely curious on this one.

Yeah I gotta say I just caught an episode of Supernatural and he's not particularly outstanding. As much as I hate to say it, his voice and delivery are a little Keanu Reeves-esque. But I could be underestimating his acting ability.

[Turtles]

People seem to think that there are so few men with the right build and the right talent to play Captain America. Well, that's totally wrong. There are just so few men that we've heard of.

I say: open casting! Get me an unknown! I love unknown/semi-know actors. And even an unknown could carry the movie if we fill some of the supporting roles with famous people like they did with Thor to drawn in the crowds.

I really hope they pull an Iron Man with this movie, and they skip over the famous guys in favor of casting somebody totally unexpected that will do an amazing job and completely own the character. Frankly, I don't want to see Brad Pitt or Leonardo Dicaprio or Matt Damon as Captain America anymore than I want to see Tom Cruise as Iron Man.

As for body type....well, I don't think the actor they pick needs to look like a steroid junkie that drinks raw eggs for breakfast and works out six hours a day. But I also don't think the actor they pick should be a skinny guy that needs half the special effects budget and a special costume just to make him a semi-believable Captain America. I don't want them to pick somebody that relys on rapid bulking up sessions, either, because actors take on other roles in between movies and I don't want whoever they cast to need to yo-yo train like Robert Downey Jr. He needed to lose weight for Sherlock Holmes, then pack on the pounds lighting fast to play a convincing Tony Stark, and then I think he had to start dieting again for Sherlock Holmes reshoots. Actors can't keep that up for long.

[Webhead2006]

Cant wait to see first real rumored names poping up. So then we can get a clear look at the possible direction marvel wants with cap pick.

[Brian2887]

So I was watching The Assassination of a High School President the other day, and it occurred to me that the star, Reece Daniel Thompson, would be an amazing Bucky. He's a great young actor who falls in Bucky's age range. He's good at being funny and awkward, but is a strong dramatic actor as well.

http://l.yimg.com/eb/ymv/us/img/hv/photo/movie_pix/sundance/sundance_film_festival_2008_photos/reece_thompson/sundance.jpg

[Webhead2006]

dont know his work myself.

[Gamma Goliath]

chris pine vs. viggo mortenson

captain america 2011

[Stripesy Strip]

Cap has always been a badass, in a good way. You don't have to be a rebellious prick to be badass. In fact I believe a kind, noble man who stands up for what he believes in, slaughtering his way through Nazis, with his head up high knowing that he isn't some super-nerd or genius intellectual, doing what he feels needs to be done no matter what it may do to him is a badass. That's Cap. He isn't all arrogant and "my way or the highway," just a man who will do what needs to be done to preserve his perspective of the American way and ideals, because he believes in them; all the while not caring what people think of him, not caring whether he's "badass" or not. THAT'S A BADASS. AND THAT'S THE CAP I WANNA SEE!

You get what I was saying, HappyPalooza. Badass meaning somebody than can take care of himself yet have the presence to carry some sort of morale gravitas and not being only tough. Christopher Reeves sort of had that as Superman and with Cap, the ideal would probably be a mix between Reeves' portrayal of Superman and Steve McQueen's fire and never-say-die attitude.

There's not a lot of 22-30 years old American actor that look like Cap and have what I was explaining. It better be a longer search than what they did with Thor.

[Ace of Knaves]

Ehh I don't think there are many decent young American actors out there right now.

It's mainly just a bunch of wise ass pretty boys. There ain't no Steve McQueens or Clint Eastwoods at the moment.

[Stripesy Strip]

You got that right!

That is why I say the search would have to be unbelievable to find the right guy. I don't see any young guys from the CW network, from any tv shows, even the known stars. I wouldn't want to touch Pitt/Damon/Decaprio. The solution would be perhaps to get a young Aaron Eckahrt but the reason Eckhart became so good it's because he's in his 40s and has spent years owning his craft. Young actors that look like Cap and that have any sort of depth are rare.

[Wolvieboy17]

Young actors that look like Cap and that have any sort of depth are rare.

Young stage actors would probably have more experience, just due to the fact that there would be more oppurtunities to develop as an actor, whereas as an up and comer, or unknown, its basically television ads and extra or bit parts in tv or movies, which is hardly enough to really develop....

Also, anyone from like, an HBO series or someone, would be good, because HBO tend to put alot of thought and consideration their casting, and their all great actors...
One thought for me would be Ryan Kwanten from True Blood, except he's an aussie.

[Antonello Blueberry]

EDIT: The funny thing is, at least we are in agreement about Dicaprio. He's not Steve Rogers material.
Instead the more I think about it, the less it seems an absurd idea to me.
If they have to go with a celebrity, I can live with Leo as Cap. A little bit of training, a muscle suit and you have someone who would not be overshadowed by Robert Downey jr.
The differences in their acting approach, more serious in Di Caprio and more playful in Downey, reflects the characters' spirit.

[Webhead2006]

i think there is plently of known/semi known/ or unknowns we dont even know about right now that could all do great with the captain america role.

[Ace of Knaves]

How can you say that, if you don't know about them or their abilities?

"There is someone out there who could be a great Cap! I just have never heard of him or seen him in anything!"

Makes no sense man.

[Turtles]

How can you say that, if you don't know about them or their abilities?

"There is someone out there who could be a great Cap! I just have never heard of him or seen him in anything!"

Makes no sense man.

So, you're saying that, because we've never seen them, they must not exist, right? Yeah, that's just stupid. Just because we've never seen them, doesn't mean nobody else has. I've never seen Scott Porter, Jensen Ackles, Garret Hedlund, or a ton of the other actors that have been mentioned on this thread so far, in anything at all, but I'm not denying that they are talented, and that they exist, now am I?

Actors aren't born famous, you know, they start out as an unknowns and work their way up. At one point even golden boys like Brad Pitt and Matt Damon were probably nobodies that had trouble getting a spot in a TV commercial less alone a leading role in a major motion picture.

[Ace of Knaves]

No I'm not saying actors are born famous.

I just find this faith in complete unknowns for a massive role like this a little illogical.

Yes let's try someone out who has never been in a major blockbuster before! Let's try someone out who has never worked opposite top quality actors before!

Whoever gets the Cap role needs to have a presence. A presence that can only come from experience.

Sure Brad Pitt and Matt Damon started off as unknowns...but were they thrown into the deep end with their first roles? Were they thrown into films like this one for their first roles? No, they weren't. They built themselves up gradually.

All this talk of throwing a completely unknown right into the deep end is illogical.

[Webhead2006]

oh totally we have to be careful giving a big role to an unknown but we have no clue how anyone would turn out for the role. Plus we have no clue how they are going to be casting the role yet.

[Hypestyle]

john cena! do some face morphing for skinny steve..

[Rage]

After hearing that Chuck's Zachary Levi was cast in Thor... I got a bit of a warm fuzzy feeling thinking that Marvel does have the show CHUCK on their radar... and if that is the case... maybe they've thought about making Captain America... "Awesome" :D

[Son of Coul]

How can you say that, if you don't know about them or their abilities?

"There is someone out there who could be a great Cap! I just have never heard of him or seen him in anything!"

Makes no sense man.

Are you suggesting that out of the MILLIONS upon MILLIONS of aspiring actors, not one fits the bill for that (very accurate) description of Cap?

There's no doubt that the American rugged image of male leads seemed to damn near die with westerns with stars like Clint Eastwood and John Wayne (I understand Eastwood's alive, but you get what I'm saying), but to say there's no one like that now sounds kinda silly to me.

[Wolvieboy17]

Yes let's try someone out who has never been in a major blockbuster before! Let's try someone out who has never worked opposite top quality actors before!

Cough Cough THOR Cough Cough

[Young Superman]

Teddy Sears for Captain America.

[Wolvieboy17]

You know what? I'm gonna go out on a limb and say "F**k" casting an American. If theres someone out there who can portray Cap well, and they're not american, who cares as long as they can play an american! Sure, i know he's Iconic and everything, but they're an ACTOR! It's more important to me that Cap is played well, and portrayed accurately through acting skill.

There, I know i've opened the floodgates for disagreement but so be it.

[Son of Coul]

Yeah I don't mind if he's not an American if he's the best possible option, but I'd prefer an American just for the sake of it.

[Wolvieboy17]

I just think it limits the casting massively... There would be so many young, handsome british actors who've had years of stage acting experience who would be eligible...

Personally, if they went non-american as well, i'd want to screen test Alexander Skarsgaard (ala generation kill) and Ryan Kwanten... just to see what they're like.

[Brian2887]

Alexander Skarsgaard would be pretty fantastic, actually. His was by far my favorite character in Generation Kill, and he does a flawless American accent.

[Wolvieboy17]

Yeah, he'd have the right commanding voice and presence too.

[Wolvieboy17]

http://true-blood.net/gallery/albums/cast-season1/ASkarsgard_generationkill.jpg

http://screencaps.biz/genklg1.jpg

Yeah, I can totally see that.

[Wolvieboy17]

P.S. No wonder so many people wanted him for Thor, i just noticed he has 'Asgard' in his surname lol.

[Webhead2006]

well we know specifically for now marvel wants to get a full blooded american for the role. which would be nice, cause come on i doubt marvel wants the bad press of oh aussie star, british star, etc.... is captain america and all that. But whos to say they cant find their cap who is american. If not i dont see after a few casting rounds if they havent found a grouping to their likely to expand it a bit.

[Ace of Knaves]

Cough Cough THOR Cough Cough

Thor isn't Captain America.

And by the time Thor comes out, Hemsworth won't be a complete unknown. He has a few films coming out next year, and he has already appear in the likes of Star Trek.

This faith in complete unknowns is illogical.

You guys can say all actors start of somewhere. And you'd be right.

But they don't start off thrown into the deep end which a role like this is.

Look at Depp. His first roles were bit parts in Nightmare on Elm Street and Platoon. All these massive actors of today started off in small roles, and built themselves up.

They weren't thrown into massive blockbuster movies as the lead in their first ever roles.

[Wolvieboy17]

And by the time Thor comes out, Hemsworth won't be a complete unknown. He has a few films coming out next year, and he has already appear in the likes of Star Trek.

But your point about unknowns was lack of experience, and you can't say hemsworth gained acting experience from Star Trek. I'm not saying he's unqualified, i'm saying the opposite... I don't think you realise how much work an actor actually has to do to actually get to that point.... It's not just a matter of being thrown into a blockbuster... to even be considered for audition, to even find out about it, and get through the various rounds of auditions, you have to have some qualities that impress the casting agents, and 'recognition' is only a small factor of that, if the casting agents are any good anyway.

Look at Depp. His first roles were bit parts in Nightmare on Elm Street and Platoon. All these massive actors of today started off in small roles, and built themselves up.

Yes, but at the time of Nightmare, Depp WAS an unknown... He would have had virtually no name recognition...

I just think you have a naive view on the acting world... With the possible exception of child actors, most current big actors had been working for years before they had the big break, but they were still experienced enough to act BEFORE the break... It's not like hollywood recognition suddenly makes you gain more skill... If anything, it would make it harder to maintain talent, which I imagine is why so many great actors like George Clooney like to go and do independent projects inbetween blockbusters (Or Clive Owen in 'The boys Are Back' which I saw yesterday, and is fantastic!)

[Ace of Knaves]

You are still missing the point.

No actor EVER was thrown into a massive role like Captain America as their first ever role.

Throwing a TV actor into this is like throwing a child into the deep end with cement shoes.

I'm not saying it won't work out, who can tell? But this absolute faith in an complete unknown being Captain America is ridiculous.

[Hound55]

Need a peak human...?

How about Steve Guttenberg..?

[Ace of Knaves]

If only Chris Farley was still alive *sigh*

[Triad]

After hearing that Chuck's Zachary Levi was cast in Thor... I got a bit of a warm fuzzy feeling thinking that Marvel does have the show CHUCK on their radar... and if that is the case... maybe they've thought about making Captain America... "Awesome" :D
Amen to that! McPartlin's my #1 pick so far.

[Hound55]

If only Chris Farley was still alive *sigh*
You'd be doing superhuman s### too! If you were living in a van... down by the river...!

[Wolvieboy17]

No, you're missing the point.... When I, or someone else says "I hope they find an awesome unknown person", it's clearly under the proviso that they are entirely capable of the role. Considering it's entirely hypothetical, obviously that is assumed.

However, in a non-hypothetical role, whether its jonny Mcnoname or a big shot Celeb, obviously a casting director isn't going to cast someone unless they think they're capable... Also, what is it do you think that changes for an actor, from a big budget movie like Cap, and the pressure of acting on stage? Or needing the determination to earn enough money as a no name actor to pay the bills? When it boils down to it, and I am speaking from acting experience, and as a TV director, any actor who is worth their salt knows their job is to turn up, do their lines and do what their told. Big budget movies are the same, except there's just a hell of a lot more prep time going into each shot, and more standing around.

It's not going to be like Milhouse as fallout boy.

[Turtles]

I just find this faith in complete unknowns for a massive role like this a little illogical.

Contrary to what you may believe, being unknown doesn't equate to being untalented or inexperienced. People can get acting experience from more than just blockbuster movies, you know? There is theater, soaps, independent films, television shows......etc...

And, as I stated before, just because you've never seen an actor, doesn't mean they've never acted in anything and have no experience. It just means you haven't seen what they've acted in, that's all.

Yes let's try someone out who has never been in a major blockbuster before! Let's try someone out who has never worked opposite top quality actors before!

The way you make it sound, it's like the only way to become a good actor is to work alongside an ocsar winner in the year's biggest film. That's so untrue. People go to college for this sort of thing, you know?

Whoever gets the Cap role needs to have a presence. A presence that can only come from experience.

In my opinion, you can't learn how to have presence, you either have it or you don't. And by presence, I'm talking about the ability to really shine on set and make people believe that the character you're playing is actually standing right there in front of them. I'm not talking about the ability to strut around set like a peacock, demanding respect from cast and crew, just because you got the lead in the last big blockbuster and are now famous.

You have to remember that some people seem to have presence because they're good actors, while other people seem to have presence simply because people are obsessed with them, and get all excited when they enter a room. I mean, Paris Hilton commands a lot of respect and attention, but you wouldn't say she has presence, would you?

Sure Brad Pitt and Matt Damon started off as unknowns...but were they thrown into the deep end with their first roles? Were they thrown into films like this one for their first roles? No, they weren't. They built themselves up gradually.

Oh, yeah, I'm sure they gained all that talent from playing "pretty boy #3" and "kid on train."

All this talk of throwing a completely unknown right into the deep end is illogical.

Illogical as it is, it's common practice in Hollywood. Look at the kid who plays Harry Potter, Daniel Radcliff. He was put into the lead role of one of the biggest movie franchises of all time, but he was only a young kid at the time, and probably had no experience whatsoever when they cast him as Harry. The same with half the people in Twilight. Other people can think up better examples than me, I'm sure.

Unknowns get cast into the deep end all the time, because they have to be. You can't fill every role, all the time, with famous people, once in a while you have to give that unknown his/her big break. Captain America be could somebody's big break.

My final word of advice, Ace: Beware the catch-22. You think an unknown actor doesn't have experience enough to be the lead in a big blockbuster, but you seem to think that an unknown actor can't have experience until he is the lead in a big blockbuster.

[Wolvieboy17]

In my opinion, you can't learn how to have presence, you either have it or you don't. And by presence, I'm talking about the ability to really shine on set and make people believe that the character you're playing is actually standing right there in front of them. I'm not talking about the ability to strut around set like a peacock, demanding respect from cast and crew, just because you got the lead in the last big blockbuster and are now famous.

So true... You can't learn it, you either have it or you don't. Thats like when I saw a play in Sydney a couple of years ago, that had Cate Blanchett in it, and she just had the most amazing stage presence... i don't mean that she was 'hot' or 'pretty to look at' but her performance was just so mesmerising, everything about it. Also Geoffrey Rush is the same on stage.

[Wolvieboy17]

All this talk of throwing a completely unknown right into the deep end is illogical.

Also, every single child actor ever who has delivered an amazing performance, defies your theory.

[Ace of Knaves]

Yea but have they CARRIED a film like Captain America? Big things will be expected of this movie, not to mention it will be an EXTREMELY hard sell outside of America. Especially with some nobody American TV actor.

[Wolvieboy17]

Yea but have they CARRIED a film like Captain America? Big things will be expected of this movie, not to mention it will be an EXTREMELY hard sell outside of America. Especially with some nobody American TV actor.

They're not alone dude. One of the directors most important jobs is directing the cast, and that includes making sure you get the best possible performance out of them. As said before, obviously they're not going to cast an unknown UNLESS they are capable and suit the role... You're worrying about hypotheticals that are totally unnecessary until we know who is actually cast.

Also, i've always thought an unfamous actor would be best because this movie should be about Cap, not MATT DAMON as Cap. The character is bigger than the actor, and it should stay that way.

And thirdly, the movie is called "Captain America: THE FIRST AVENGER"... Prior to this movie, there will have been Iron Man 1, 2, Hulk and Thor, all of which are linked, and mention avengers, so by a snowball of promotion, do you honestly think people who have seen and enjoyed any of the previous films are going to miss it just because they don't know the actor?


In regards to this whole argument, its totally ridiculous because you are basically naysaying something that hasn't even come into existence yet.

We are saying "I hope they find an unknown who is perfect for Cap". You are saying "But what if he can't do it?" ...Do you see how flawed this whole disagreement is?

[Turtles]

Yea but have they CARRIED a film like Captain America? Big things will be expected of this movie, not to mention it will be an EXTREMELY hard sell outside of America. Especially with some nobody American TV actor.

If the film is good, it will carry itself. But if the movie sucks, and people either don't want to watch it, or refuse to watch it, because the name turns them off......well, not even Brad Pitt being cast as Cap could save it.

Don't believe me? Well, why don't I just list some of the flops we've had over the last few years with big name actors in the lead roles.

[Ace of Knaves]

Why would someone outside of America or who is not a comic book fan see a film called Captain AMERICA?

People who are not in the know will just think "Pfft a film glorying how awesome America is. I'm really interested in that. Not."

See what I'm saying?

[DACMAN]

I understand what you're saying, though I think you're wrong.

Spider-Man splashed the American flag all over the screen every chance it got. Iron Man was pretty "yeah America!"

I think people will see a good movie as long as it's a good movie. But I think you'll need some convining.


http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=savingprivateryan.htm

Saving Private Ryan
$265,300,000 Foreign in take

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=pearlharbor.htm

Peal Harbor
$250,678,391 Foreign in take


http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=diehard4.htm
Live Free or Die Hard
$249,002,061 Foreign in take

All of these movies made more overseas than domestically. Oh and if you want to argue that it's the word "America" that will keep people away consider American Gangster.

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=americangangster.htm

American Ganster
$136,300,392 Foreign in take

Once again it made more money overseas than here.

[Wolvieboy17]

For precisely the reason I already stipulated! Connection to previous SUCCESSFUL marvel films! Besides, that is a completely separate issue, relating to promotion and advertising... Also, who says there can't be a big name actor playing the villain, or a supporting role?

I'm not from America... We're not idiots, although alot of Americans like to think so. Most people will tend to judge a movie on its trailer, or content, rather than just title alone... As a Marvel movie, there will likely be a load of promotional content leading up to it, making it hard to avoid, and these days, if theres a movie someone doesnt know anything about they tend to look it up and see whats going on...

And seriously, if there are people out there, who don't know the comics, or anything about captain america, but aren't interested enough in the Superhero genre to look FURTHER than the title (which takes about 30 seconds on wikipedia) then they probably werent interested in Iron man either, or countless other supe movies.

Your argument is all over the place man. Nothing but really bold generalisations based on nothing but here-say and stubborness.

Tell me this, if there was an unknown actor, who was perfect for Cap, I mean looked like him, spoke how you pictured him, carried himself with real authority and presence, and could act quite well, would you be happy with that? Answer honestly...

[Wolvieboy17]

Also, again to reiterate its part of a huge franchise, and will take the audiences who all enjoyed Iron man, Hulk and Thor, which are 3 quite different characters, so thats a spread of different tastes for audiences.

[Ace of Knaves]

Yes I would be happy with that.

You are not understanding my argument. I'm not saying it CAN'T happen. I'm just saying you guys seem to have blind faith in these unknowns. That is what I find to be illogical.

[Wolvieboy17]

But thats because you totally misunderstand the concept of unknowns that we are referring to... The whole appeal of them casting an unknown is ENTIRELY on the assumption that they are cast because they are perfect for Cap! Why would we want them cast otherwise? I have faith that they are looking for someone who is the perfect Cap, and so far, I think that is more likely to be either someone totally unknown, or completely out of left field. I would certainly bet it to be one of them before they choose someone from our list up the top of this page.

You seem to have a wierd grudge about these 'unknowns', like they're a collective of people... Obviously for an unknown to be cast, they would have to have the talent and the look, otherwise they wouldnt be cast. Whoever they cast, will clearly be on the basis that they have the goods, but when i or anyone else says "I hope they cast an unknown" or "they have to cast an unknown" its because the alternatives thus far are pretty piss weak. So you can call that blind faith, but i put more faith that out of the millions of people on this planet, there is at least one person a hundred times better than any of the glorified extras on display at this forum. End of discussion for me, i'm out, otherwise this will never end and my nerdy fanboy core will self distruct :D

[tamron]

After hearing that Chuck's Zachary Levi was cast in Thor... I got a bit of a warm fuzzy feeling thinking that Marvel does have the show CHUCK on their radar... and if that is the case... maybe they've thought about making Captain America... "Awesome" :D

Yea, I definitely thought the same thing. I'd be completely on board with McPartlin as Cap.

[DACMAN]

Yes I would be happy with that.

You are not understanding my argument. I'm not saying it CAN'T happen. I'm just saying you guys seem to have blind faith in these unknowns. That is what I find to be illogical.

Dude, you're the one making blind sweeping statements.

Why would someone outside of America or who is not a comic book fan see a film called Captain AMERICA?

People who are not in the know will just think "Pfft a film glorying how awesome America is. I'm really interested in that. Not."



How do you know people would say that? You don't.

[Brian Braddock]

In answer to that last statement ^^^^ Without wishing to simply wade into this arguement, I'd like to say that Ace is in a good position to gauge what people outside the U.S. will think of the movie, being that he actually lives outside the U.S.

At the very least, he's in a damn better position than you are, Dacman. So I wouldnt be so dismissive of his assessment.

For the record, I happen share the same point of view as Ace, and we've talked about this on here before. It's a point of view borne out of actually garnering the opinions of various people who I work with here in the U.K. (people of British, Spanish, French and African nationality) who, when asked, have stated that they have no interest in seeing Cap whatsover because they wrongly assume [as probably many non U.S, non comicbook reading folk will assume if the train of thought follows suit] that a movie involving a character called Captain America, created by the American government/military, draped in the colours of the American flag and fighting for American ideals will come off like a properganda film.

I'd point out again that these people know nothing about comics, but would consitute as your average movie-goer.

[aka Kal el]

They're not alone dude. One of the directors most important jobs is directing the cast, and that includes making sure you get the best possible performance out of them. As said before, obviously they're not going to cast an unknown UNLESS they are capable and suit the role... You're worrying about hypotheticals that are totally unnecessary until we know who is actually cast.

Also, i've always thought an unfamous actor would be best because this movie should be about Cap, not MATT DAMON as Cap. The character is bigger than the actor, and it should stay that way.

And thirdly, the movie is called "Captain America: THE FIRST AVENGER"... Prior to this movie, there will have been Iron Man 1, 2, Hulk and Thor, all of which are linked, and mention avengers, so by a snowball of promotion, do you honestly think people who have seen and enjoyed any of the previous films are going to miss it just because they don't know the actor?


In regards to this whole argument, its totally ridiculous because you are basically naysaying something that hasn't even come into existence yet.

We are saying "I hope they find an unknown who is perfect for Cap". You are saying "But what if he can't do it?" ...Do you see how flawed this whole disagreement is?

I think the way around this is to remind the rest of the world what America has done for it. That why i think it is brilliant to keep it set in WWII. This will remind the rest of the world what America is really about. We stopped the ultimate evil in the Nazi's and lets face it if it wasn't for America everyone would be speaking Russian. Saving Private Ryan was a huge smash overseas because it reminded the world what America is truly about!

[aka Kal el]

I think the way around this is to remind the rest of the world what America has done for it. That why i think it is brilliant to keep it set in WWII. This will remind the rest of the world what America is really about. We stopped the ultimate evil in the Nazi's and lets face it if it wasn't for America everyone would be speaking Russian. Saving Private Ryan was a huge smash overseas because it reminded the world what America is truly about!

Sorry I meant this as a response to Brian,not you.

[aka Kal el]

In answer to that last statement ^^^^ Without wishing to simply wade into this arguement, I'd like to say that Ace is in a good position to gauge what people outside the U.S. will think of the movie, being that he actually lives outside the U.S.

At the very least, he's in a damn better position than you are, Dacman. So I wouldnt be so dismissive of his assessment.

For the record, I happen share the same point of view as Ace, and we've talked about this on here before. It's a point of view borne out of actually garnering the opinions of various people who I work with here in the U.K. (people of British, Spanish, French and African nationality) who, when asked, have stated that they have no interest in seeing Cap whatsover because they wrongly assume [as probably many non U.S, non comicbook reading folk will assume if the train of thought follows suit] that a movie involving a character called Captain America, created by the American government/military, draped in the colours of the American flag and fighting for American ideals will come off like a properganda film.

I'd point out again that these people know nothing about comics, but would consitute as your average movie-goer.

I responded to your post under Wolvie but corrected myself so please read that entry first. I have said this before and I think it's still a viable solution to this issue. Really it's not America but the former administration policies that fuels this opinion. So the movie should do everything to distance itself from the issue. How? A few years ago there was a story line with the Red skull infiltrating the US government by becoming the Secretary of State and controlling things behind the scenes. Dell Rusk was an evil Dick Cheney though I know that is redundant. Do you see were I'm going with this? Cheers from across the pond.... LOL

[Brian Braddock]

I think the way around this is to remind the rest of the world what America has done for it. That why i think it is brilliant to keep it set in WWII. This will remind the rest of the world what America is really about. We stopped the ultimate evil in the Nazi's and lets face it if it wasn't for America everyone would be speaking Russian. Saving Private Ryan was a huge smash overseas because it reminded the world what America is truly about!

I responded to your post under Wolvie but corrected myself so please read that entry first. I have said this before and I think it's still a viable solution to this issue. Really it's not America but the former administration policies that fuels this opinion. So the movie should do everything to distance itself from the issue. How? A few years ago there was a story line with the Red skull infiltrating the US government by becoming the Secretary of State and controlling things behind the scenes. Dell Rusk was an evil Dick Cheney though I know that is redundant. Do you see were I'm going with this? Cheers from across the pond.... LOL




>phew<

where to start?...............

Maybe you guys 'across the pond' think that and, I admit, it sure is a nice 'romantic' notion, but the U.K. box office of Private Ryan had zero to do with us being 'reminded of what America is truly about'. For me and a lot of others in the U.K., the appeal wasn’t that deep and was mainly because of:-

1) It was a Steven Spielberg movie.

2) It had Tom Hanks in it, who was arguably at the peak of his career at the time (and if not the peak, was certainly white hot).

3) It was hyped as being one of the most realistic and visceral war movies ever made.

4) We love going to the cinema to see Hollywood made war movies to see how much historical fact has been altered either for the purpose of the story or just purely in the name of patriotism. I mean, read the real history behind U571 and see how Hollywood absolutely shafted the British on that one (so much so that screenwriter David Ayer had to apologise for the distortion of historical facts and for some of the complete fiction present in the movie that was attempted to be passed off as historical fact) or perhaps read how the British and Canadians around Caen took most of the brunt of the German armoured assault after Omaha, but hardly anything of that is mentioned in Private Ryan.

Hell, if you want me to elaborate further, take ‘Patton’ - in reality it was only because the British had succeeded in diverting and engaging the majority of German troops and artillery to the Caen front (in a plan devised by our own General Montgomery), that American forces were able to break out in the south (with a numerical advantage over the Germans of 2 to 1, I might add), but Hollywood conveniently glosses over that; just as it glosses over the British contribution towards the victory in WW2 in general, and more often than not tries to make the British look incompetent and foolish.

Sidestepping the issue of bad feeling caused by your former administration (as it’s pretty much a given and the subjects been done to death), I’d suggest that it’s this revisionist attitude which may be a leading factor in why U.K. moviegoers may not want to go and see a Hollywood film featuring a character called Captain America who they think will be depicted almost single-handedly winning the war, while at the same time promoting American idealism ad nauseam.

Because they’ve seen that all before.

I do know what you mean though, my dad was born in 1940 in US 8th airforce territory in East Anglia and says that you guys were great during the war and were real good guys. Maybe this is what you mean when you speak of how the US [and Cap] should be seen; almost untainted and pure perhaps?

P.S. I’d also like to add, in response to your comment about everyone [presumably in Europe] speaking Russian [or German, as I've heard other people say before now] if it wasn’t the U.S; that if it wasn’t for the British in 1759, you’d all be speaking French! :oldrazz: :woot:

And following on from that, you got involved in WW2 not to 'save us' or because it was the right thing to do, but for your own ends:-

1) Pearl Harbour happened. While some Americans wanted to get involved in the war, the majority did not as America was currently in a period of isolationalism. The powers that be realised that any motion to go to war would be met with the strictest of opposition but the Japanese bombing of Pearl Harbour changed all that and you simply had to enter the war from that point.

2) Hitler declared war on you too; not an easy thing to ignore – if he defeats us, guess who’s next?

3) In 1941, with Britain almost exhausted financially, President Roosevelt advanced Britain £1,075 million in ‘Lend-Lease’ aid. The United States did not ask for repayment directly, but there was a high price to be paid all the same. Britain was stripped of her gold reserves and overseas investments and American businessmen moved into markets that had hitherto been British. It also served no purpose to let the British be defeated as the US wouldnt, more than likely, get their money back.

So, the reasons for American involvement in WW2 aren’t so cut and dried, or righteous, as some would have you believe. Be that as it may, I just want to stress that there’s absolutely no ill will or malice fuelling what I’ve posted – I’m just saying it as it is (or was). I dearly hope that no one takes offense with what I’ve said, but i've largely just been stating facts.

Anyways, I digress; in my opinion [speaking as a non US citizen] Marvel have got to tread very carefully with what tone they adopt for Cap, if they dont want to scare off the overseas, non US market from wanting to go and see this movie.

[Triad]

Debated very well BB.

[Young Superman]

>phew<

where to start?...............

Maybe you guys 'across the pond' think that and, I admit, it sure is a nice 'romantic' notion, but the U.K. box office of Private Ryan had zero to do with us being 'reminded of what America is truly about'. For me and a lot of others in the U.K., the appeal wasn’t that deep and was mainly because of:-

1) It was a Steven Spielberg movie.

2) It had Tom Hanks in it, who was arguably at the peak of his career at the time (and if not the peak, was certainly white hot).

3) It was hyped as being one of the most realistic and visceral war movies ever made.

4) We love going to the cinema to see Hollywood made war movies to see how much historical fact has been altered either for the purpose of the story or just purely in the name of patriotism. I mean, read the real history behind U571 and see how Hollywood absolutely shafted the British on that one (so much so that screenwriter David Ayer had to apologise for the distortion of historical facts and for some of the complete fiction present in the movie that was attempted to be passed off as historical fact) or perhaps read how the British and Canadians around Caen took most of the brunt of the German armoured assault after Omaha, but hardly anything of that is mentioned in Private Ryan.

Hell, if you want me to elaborate further, take ‘Patton’ - in reality it was only because the British had succeeded in diverting and engaging the majority of German troops and artillery to the Caen front (in a plan devised by our own General Montgomery), that American forces were able to break out in the south (with a numerical advantage over the Germans of 2 to 1, I might add), but Hollywood conveniently glosses over that; just as it glosses over the British contribution towards the victory in WW2 in general, and more often than not tries to make the British look incompetent and foolish.

Sidestepping the issue of bad feeling caused by your former administration (as it’s pretty much a given and the subjects been done to death), I’d suggest that it’s this revisionist attitude which may be a leading factor in why U.K. moviegoers may not want to go and see a Hollywood film featuring a character called Captain America who they think will be depicted almost single-handedly winning the war, while at the same time promoting American idealism ad nauseam.

Because they’ve seen that all before.

I do know what you mean though, my dad was born in 1940 in US 8th airforce territory in East Anglia and says that you guys were great during the war and were real good guys. Maybe this is what you mean when you speak of how the US [and Cap] should be seen; almost untainted and pure perhaps?

P.S. I’d also like to add, in response to your comment about everyone [presumably in Europe] speaking Russian [or German, as I've heard other people say before now] if it wasn’t the U.S; that if it wasn’t for the British in 1759, you’d all be speaking French! :oldrazz: :woot:

And following on from that, you got involved in WW2 not to 'save us' or because it was the right thing to do, but for your own ends:-

1) Pearl Harbour happened. While some Americans wanted to get involved in the war, the majority did not as America was currently in a period of isolationalism. The powers that be realised that any motion to go to war would be met with the strictest of opposition but the Japanese bombing of Pearl Harbour changed all that and you simply had to enter the war from that point.

2) Hitler declared war on you too; not an easy thing to ignore – if he defeats us, guess who’s next?

3) In 1941, with Britain almost exhausted financially, President Roosevelt advanced Britain £1,075 million in ‘Lend-Lease’ aid. The United States did not ask for repayment directly, but there was a high price to be paid all the same. Britain was stripped of her gold reserves and overseas investments and American businessmen moved into markets that had hitherto been British. It also served no purpose to let the British be defeated as the US wouldnt, more than likely, get their money back.

So, the reasons for American involvement in WW2 aren’t so cut and dried, or righteous, as some would have you believe. Be that as it may, I just want to stress that there’s absolutely no ill will or malice fuelling what I’ve posted – I’m just saying it as it is (or was). I dearly hope that no one takes offense with what I’ve said, but i've largely just been stating facts.

Anyways, I digress; in my opinion [speaking as a non US citizen] Marvel have got to tread very carefully with what tone they adopt for Cap, if they dont want to scare off the overseas, non US market from wanting to go and see this movie.

Great post:up:

[Wolvieboy17]

I agree...

Although lets not let the brits get off too lightly... Remember Gallipoli Brian? Hmmmmmmmmmmm? :P

Also, I agree about diverting attention away from 'Cap winning the war' and make him more like a 'get behind enemy lines and take out a seperate threat, kinda thing....No idea what, but something more universal than 'American punching a german in the face'.

[Webhead2006]

very well thought out and written post brian.

[Wolvieboy17]

Can't argue with history..........or can you?

[Hound55]

Although lets not let the brits get off too lightly... Remember Gallipoli Brian? Hmmmmmmmmmmm? :P
That wasn't about British ineptitude... That was because the Poms have always been jealous of Australians and wanted to do away with us over in Turkey so they'd stand a chance in cricket tests... :oldrazz:

[Steve Holt]

That wasn't about British ineptitude... That was because the Poms have always been jealous of Australians and wanted to do away with us over in Turkey so they'd stand a chance in cricket tests... :oldrazz:


It all makes sense now, PREACH ON BROTHER!!!

[Stripesy Strip]

Thor isn't Captain America.

And by the time Thor comes out, Hemsworth won't be a complete unknown. He has a few films coming out next year, and he has already appear in the likes of Star Trek.

This faith in complete unknowns is illogical.

You guys can say all actors start of somewhere. And you'd be right.

But they don't start off thrown into the deep end which a role like this is.

Look at Depp. His first roles were bit parts in Nightmare on Elm Street and Platoon. All these massive actors of today started off in small roles, and built themselves up.

They weren't thrown into massive blockbuster movies as the lead in their first ever roles.

I will say this, having Hemsworth being cast as Thor is textbook example of what I find to be detrimental to acting and movies in this day and age. He'll be another Tom Weilling/Brandan Routh, guys that I haven't acted for crap, guys that have been cast by looks before all.

There was zero rush to get a young actor for Thor as Thor is an immortal and his whole run in the comic books he looked like a seasoned warrior, not a pretty prince. There's no reason he couldn't have been a guy of Robert Downey Jr's age for instance.

[Stripesy Strip]

As a previous poster mentioned, for a young actor to have gravitas, to carry depth, they have to have acted a lot and this can only come from theatre. This is how they got such a young actor like Christopher Reeves playing Superman at 24 and being so good at it, he had being acting for quite a while in theatre plays. I would suggest the director Joe Johnston to travel the theatres of the United States to find that gem.

I also like the fact that theatre actors whatever ages they are, are unassuming, humble people that do not care about fame and movie artifices. They're kind of a throwback and they're down to Earth people and that is how Steve Rogers should be, somebody that come from another age with different values.

[Turtles]

Why would someone outside of America or who is not a comic book fan see a film called Captain AMERICA?

People who are not in the know will just think "Pfft a film glorying how awesome America is. I'm really interested in that. Not."

See what I'm saying?

As I said before: if the movie is good, it will carry itself. If, by word of mouth, people in other countries learn that this isn't a flag waving, America is the best nation in the world, propaganda film, then they'll go see it. A good publicity campaign tying it into the comics and/or the Avengers would help, too.

When the movie is done, then the director and all the people at Marvel need to take a close look at it, and if it looks like the people who actually used the term "freedom fries" filmed it.......then it's doomed overseas, and there is nothing we can do about it.

But, I'm counting on Marvel not to make asses out of themselves, and ruin the movie by turning it into an "America won the war single-handed--duh!" movie.

And, if you seriously think filling the movie with famous AMERICAN celebrities is going to help convince people that it's not a flag-waving, super-patriot American war film, then you're nuts. I mean, casting Brad Pitt, a guy who thinks foreign countries are so bad that he goes around compulsively adopting little foreign babies with his wife so they can have a better life IN AMERICA, would totally convince them that this isn't that type of movie, right?

Yes I would be happy with that.

You are not understanding my argument. I'm not saying it CAN'T happen. I'm just saying you guys seem to have blind faith in these unknowns. That is what I find to be illogical.

Are you saying I should have blind faith in famous actors? Yeah, I would.....if they weren't so busy putting out total crap and demanding ten to twenty million dollar salaries for it.

I will say this, having Hemsworth being cast as Thor is textbook example of what I find to be detrimental to acting and movies in this day and age. He'll be another Tom Weilling/Brandan Routh, guys that I haven't acted for crap, guys that have been cast by looks before all.

How is casting an actor who hasn't acted in a blockbuster (but has acted), and who got cast based mostly on looks, any more detrimental than casting only famous celebrities.......who've also got cast based mostly on looks many times in the past?

Can you say Jessica Alba as Sue Storm? Are you seriously telling me that casting an unknown, blond white chick would have been more detrimental to the film, and the acting industry in general, because the white chick was cast mostly on looks rather than the fact she was the current hip celebrity?

I'd rather have an actor cast based on looks, than on fame, because neither actor is guaranteed to have talent.......but one is guaranteed to look the part, at least.

As a previous poster mentioned, for a young actor to have gravitas, to carry depth, they have to have acted a lot and this can only come from theatre. This is how they got such a young actor like Christopher Reeves playing Superman at 24 and being so good at it, he had being acting for quite a while in theatre plays. I would suggest the director Joe Johnston to travel the theatres of the United States to find that gem.

I also like the fact that theatre actors whatever ages they are, are unassuming, humble people that do not care about fame and movie artifices. They're kind of a throwback and they're down to Earth people and that is how Steve Rogers should be, somebody that come from another age with different values.

Yeah, here's the problem with that: theater actors, to most people, yeah, they'd appear to be......UNKNOWNS!? :wow: God, mother of god, not an unknown! Anything but that! It needs to be a household name or else this movie will never sell--especially not overseas! :whatever:

Which leads me to remind you people what I said before: When I said I wanted an unknown, it didn't mean I wanted some idiot blond jock, who only played the eye candy in a dance scene in a television commercial. By unknown I meant someone who had acting experience--real acting experience--in either theater, or television, but who just hadn't had a place in a big blockbuster to make him a household name yet.

Again, being an unknown, doesn't equate to being inexperienced or untalented.

[Ace of Knaves]

Real acting experience? What? On Friday Night Lights or some other ****** American TV show?

Theater actors though, that is a good idea. That's REAL acting.

[Hound55]

Real acting experience? What? On Friday Night Lights or some other ****** American TV show?

Theater actors though, that is a good idea. That's REAL acting.
Not all theatre actors are equal though... some make the transition better than others.

I mean take a Charlton Heston... he's far more accepted today because he's accepted for what he was. You have a guy over-acting and being overdramatic to those extents these days and he wouldn't have a career long and he'd be a joke in the industry.

That wasn't the case then though because he's CHARLTON HESTON. Times change.

Me? I'd just be happy with a good actor who's not so dissimilar from the incantation that I know that it would break the illusion... after that the scripts more important to me. Some scripts leave more room for character interpretation than others. A great actor with a s### script isn't going to look like a great actor. Its the choices these actors make that gets them the reputation they have to live with and not all actor's have the pull to influence directors to let them take a different angle for character.

[Brian Braddock]

Debated very well BB.

Great post:up:

very well thought out and written post brian.

Cheers guys, I was due one at some point. It'll be another 4 years till the next one probably. :hehe:

I agree...

Although lets not let the brits get off too lightly... Remember Gallipoli Brian? Hmmmmmmmmmmm? :P

Ouch - touche, sir. I'll be the 1st to admit that we're not perfect either. We've had our fair share of embarrassments over the years. :O


Also, I agree about diverting attention away from 'Cap winning the war' and make him more like a 'get behind enemy lines and take out a seperate threat, kinda thing....No idea what, but something more universal than 'American punching a german in the face'.

Man, that approach would work so well. Fingers crossed.

That wasn't about British ineptitude... That was because the Poms have always been jealous of Australians and wanted to do away with us over in Turkey so they'd stand a chance in cricket tests... :oldrazz:

Cricket Shmicket, football is where it's at dude. And we're definately better at that than you are. We've no need to fix that one. :oldrazz: :woot:

I will say this, having Hemsworth being cast as Thor is textbook example of what I find to be detrimental to acting and movies in this day and age. He'll be another Tom Weilling/Brandan Routh, guys that I haven't acted for crap, guys that have been cast by looks before all.

There was zero rush to get a young actor for Thor as Thor is an immortal and his whole run in the comic books he looked like a seasoned warrior, not a pretty prince. There's no reason he couldn't have been a guy of Robert Downey Jr's age for instance.

Well, looks aside, apparently Branagh was looking at Skarsgard who is older, but Hemsorth auditioned and simply 'blew Branagh away'.

[Hound55]

Sure, sure... shift the focus to a sport you CAN play... :-P






Says the guy from the country which lost the Ashes...

[Wolvieboy17]

Umm, well just so you know, Hemsworth worked on Home and Away for years, which is an australian Soap Opera, and while soaps aren't great forms of acting, its different to American style soap operas... Hemsworth would have had to go through years of acting college tuition (in which he would have had plenty of stage experience, particularly shakespeare)..

Australia doesn't seem to have that American tradition of letting people become famous for sweet FA (at least not as bad)

[Blackman]

Real acting experience? What? On Friday Night Lights or some other ****** American TV show?

Theater actors though, that is a good idea. That's REAL acting.
HAve you actually seen FNL? It's the most realistic show since The Wire. And the acting in there is always top knotch and very natural. Even put in the American Film Registry for being culturaly significant
It is one of the best shows o television and has even been put in

And there are plenty of good American shows

[Turtles]

Real acting experience? What? On Friday Night Lights or some other ****** American TV show?

Just because a movie and/or show is bad doesn't mean the experience an actor gets working on it is null and void.

And whether or not a show is bad is usually a matter of opinion. I think a lot of shows are bad......but they're still popular, and they keep getting renewed for another lame season again and again......:csad: And movies can be just as bad as television shows, but I don't see you saying all those famous actors can't have the role because they only got their real acting experience from some ****** America blockbuster.

Besides, a show's and/or movie's quality is in no way the measure of an actor's quality. If that were the case, then nobody would have touched George Clooney after he made Batman and Robin, and soap stars would never get jobs in Hollywood--ever.

Theater actors though, that is a good idea. That's REAL acting.

Finally, we agree on something. We need more theater actors in Hollywood....you know, actors who know how to make the character convincing without the aid of editing, special effects, and an army of make-up people.

[Hound55]

Umm, well just so you know, Hemsworth worked on Home and Away for years, which is an australian Soap Opera, and while soaps aren't great forms of acting, its different to American style soap operas... Hemsworth would have had to go through years of acting college tuition (in which he would have had plenty of stage experience, particularly shakespeare)..

Australia doesn't seem to have that American tradition of letting people become famous for sweet FA (at least not as bad)
I agree but for different reasons than you might expect.

Any aspiring actors in Australia undergo a Spartan-esque regime.

Much like the Ancient Spartan warriors who were bred and trained for a life of war, forced to subsist on a diet of olives, gristle and bread and water, we force any aspiring actors in Australia to undergo time in an Australian soap where they will be forced to try and make convincing shows with ridiculously inferior writing and action sequences (to the point where any action sequence is generally laughable).

They are forcefed this diet of **** writing, mediocre direction and piss-poor action scenes until they decide that "I've got to get the f*** out of here and into some real acting work!" or "F*** it... so I'm on a piss poor show like Neighbours or Home and Away... at least it gets me action when I go out to the club and name drop Toadie or Harold."

They then dive on any mediocre script that they think could give them a shot at rising up the ladder and immediately impress because they're so used to having to try and make s### look good.

Then they wind up getting cast opposite Christian Bale in Terminator: Salvation or as a doctor beneath Hugh Laurie in House...

[Nightwing]

>phew<

where to start?...............

Maybe you guys 'across the pond' think that and, I admit, it sure is a nice 'romantic' notion, but the U.K. box office of Private Ryan had zero to do with us being 'reminded of what America is truly about'. For me and a lot of others in the U.K., the appeal wasn’t that deep and was mainly because of:-

1) It was a Steven Spielberg movie.

2) It had Tom Hanks in it, who was arguably at the peak of his career at the time (and if not the peak, was certainly white hot).

3) It was hyped as being one of the most realistic and visceral war movies ever made.

4) We love going to the cinema to see Hollywood made war movies to see how much historical fact has been altered either for the purpose of the story or just purely in the name of patriotism. I mean, read the real history behind U571 and see how Hollywood absolutely shafted the British on that one (so much so that screenwriter David Ayer had to apologise for the distortion of historical facts and for some of the complete fiction present in the movie that was attempted to be passed off as historical fact) or perhaps read how the British and Canadians around Caen took most of the brunt of the German armoured assault after Omaha, but hardly anything of that is mentioned in Private Ryan.

Hell, if you want me to elaborate further, take ‘Patton’ - in reality it was only because the British had succeeded in diverting and engaging the majority of German troops and artillery to the Caen front (in a plan devised by our own General Montgomery), that American forces were able to break out in the south (with a numerical advantage over the Germans of 2 to 1, I might add), but Hollywood conveniently glosses over that; just as it glosses over the British contribution towards the victory in WW2 in general, and more often than not tries to make the British look incompetent and foolish.

Sidestepping the issue of bad feeling caused by your former administration (as it’s pretty much a given and the subjects been done to death), I’d suggest that it’s this revisionist attitude which may be a leading factor in why U.K. moviegoers may not want to go and see a Hollywood film featuring a character called Captain America who they think will be depicted almost single-handedly winning the war, while at the same time promoting American idealism ad nauseam.

Because they’ve seen that all before.

I do know what you mean though, my dad was born in 1940 in US 8th airforce territory in East Anglia and says that you guys were great during the war and were real good guys. Maybe this is what you mean when you speak of how the US [and Cap] should be seen; almost untainted and pure perhaps?

P.S. I’d also like to add, in response to your comment about everyone [presumably in Europe] speaking Russian [or German, as I've heard other people say before now] if it wasn’t the U.S; that if it wasn’t for the British in 1759, you’d all be speaking French! :oldrazz: :woot:

And following on from that, you got involved in WW2 not to 'save us' or because it was the right thing to do, but for your own ends:-

1) Pearl Harbour happened. While some Americans wanted to get involved in the war, the majority did not as America was currently in a period of isolationalism. The powers that be realised that any motion to go to war would be met with the strictest of opposition but the Japanese bombing of Pearl Harbour changed all that and you simply had to enter the war from that point.

2) Hitler declared war on you too; not an easy thing to ignore – if he defeats us, guess who’s next?

3) In 1941, with Britain almost exhausted financially, President Roosevelt advanced Britain £1,075 million in ‘Lend-Lease’ aid. The United States did not ask for repayment directly, but there was a high price to be paid all the same. Britain was stripped of her gold reserves and overseas investments and American businessmen moved into markets that had hitherto been British. It also served no purpose to let the British be defeated as the US wouldnt, more than likely, get their money back.

So, the reasons for American involvement in WW2 aren’t so cut and dried, or righteous, as some would have you believe. Be that as it may, I just want to stress that there’s absolutely no ill will or malice fuelling what I’ve posted – I’m just saying it as it is (or was). I dearly hope that no one takes offense with what I’ve said, but i've largely just been stating facts.

Anyways, I digress; in my opinion [speaking as a non US citizen] Marvel have got to tread very carefully with what tone they adopt for Cap, if they dont want to scare off the overseas, non US market from wanting to go and see this movie.
Even though this was yesterday, post of the week Brian. :up:

[Wolvieboy17]

Then they wind up getting cast opposite Christian Bale in Terminator: Salvation or as a doctor beneath Hugh Laurie in House...

You can't include Sam Worthington in that... he's been slogging it as an actor in Aus for ages, and did some fantastic movies. He's been acting for like 15 years, and only now is getting any Hollywood notice.

[Wolvieboy17]

Anyways, I digress; in my opinion [speaking as a non US citizen] Marvel have got to tread very carefully with what tone they adopt for Cap, if they dont want to scare off the overseas, non US market from wanting to go and see this movie.
I agree, but i'm sure they've already considered that... there were elements of them trying to do that with Cap in the Ultimates comics (before Loeb ruined it), with him having strong reservations about being used as propaganda and so forth.

[Young Superman]

Hey Brian Braddock who is your pick for Cap?

[Brian Braddock]

Even though this was yesterday, post of the week Brian. :up:

Aw shucks - many thanks dude.

I agree, but i'm sure they've already considered that... there were elements of them trying to do that with Cap in the Ultimates comics (before Loeb ruined it), with him having strong reservations about being used as propaganda and so forth.

That's one excellent point. Marvel arent fools [in my mind, they have ecelled with their decision making thus far] so yeah, you gotta assume that they have talked about all that stuff.

Hey Brian Braddock who is your pick for Cap?

I'm ashamed to say that I havent yet nailed my colours to the wall as I havent got one, clear choice to be honest. I find myself changing between actor to actor every so often but I guess thats only because I dont see one obvious forerunner.

[Timstuff]

If Brits go to see American war movies in droves just because they love looking at all the historical inaccuracies, then shouldn't a movie about an American superhero during WW2 be quite successful over there?

[Brian Braddock]

Actually, TS, although it's one reason why we go and see 'em, I also did say further on in my post that we're getting pretty sick of it too; So I wouldnt bank on the fictional aspect of Cap being the sole crowd pulling reason for audiences turning up. ;)

(smartass :D)

[Ace of Knaves]

>phew<

where to start?...............

Maybe you guys 'across the pond' think that and, I admit, it sure is a nice 'romantic' notion, but the U.K. box office of Private Ryan had zero to do with us being 'reminded of what America is truly about'. For me and a lot of others in the U.K., the appeal wasn’t that deep and was mainly because of:-

1) It was a Steven Spielberg movie.

2) It had Tom Hanks in it, who was arguably at the peak of his career at the time (and if not the peak, was certainly white hot).

3) It was hyped as being one of the most realistic and visceral war movies ever made.

4) We love going to the cinema to see Hollywood made war movies to see how much historical fact has been altered either for the purpose of the story or just purely in the name of patriotism. I mean, read the real history behind U571 and see how Hollywood absolutely shafted the British on that one (so much so that screenwriter David Ayer had to apologise for the distortion of historical facts and for some of the complete fiction present in the movie that was attempted to be passed off as historical fact) or perhaps read how the British and Canadians around Caen took most of the brunt of the German armoured assault after Omaha, but hardly anything of that is mentioned in Private Ryan.

Hell, if you want me to elaborate further, take ‘Patton’ - in reality it was only because the British had succeeded in diverting and engaging the majority of German troops and artillery to the Caen front (in a plan devised by our own General Montgomery), that American forces were able to break out in the south (with a numerical advantage over the Germans of 2 to 1, I might add), but Hollywood conveniently glosses over that; just as it glosses over the British contribution towards the victory in WW2 in general, and more often than not tries to make the British look incompetent and foolish.

Sidestepping the issue of bad feeling caused by your former administration (as it’s pretty much a given and the subjects been done to death), I’d suggest that it’s this revisionist attitude which may be a leading factor in why U.K. moviegoers may not want to go and see a Hollywood film featuring a character called Captain America who they think will be depicted almost single-handedly winning the war, while at the same time promoting American idealism ad nauseam.

Because they’ve seen that all before.

I do know what you mean though, my dad was born in 1940 in US 8th airforce territory in East Anglia and says that you guys were great during the war and were real good guys. Maybe this is what you mean when you speak of how the US [and Cap] should be seen; almost untainted and pure perhaps?

P.S. I’d also like to add, in response to your comment about everyone [presumably in Europe] speaking Russian [or German, as I've heard other people say before now] if it wasn’t the U.S; that if it wasn’t for the British in 1759, you’d all be speaking French! :oldrazz: :woot:

And following on from that, you got involved in WW2 not to 'save us' or because it was the right thing to do, but for your own ends:-

1) Pearl Harbour happened. While some Americans wanted to get involved in the war, the majority did not as America was currently in a period of isolationalism. The powers that be realised that any motion to go to war would be met with the strictest of opposition but the Japanese bombing of Pearl Harbour changed all that and you simply had to enter the war from that point.

2) Hitler declared war on you too; not an easy thing to ignore – if he defeats us, guess who’s next?

3) In 1941, with Britain almost exhausted financially, President Roosevelt advanced Britain £1,075 million in ‘Lend-Lease’ aid. The United States did not ask for repayment directly, but there was a high price to be paid all the same. Britain was stripped of her gold reserves and overseas investments and American businessmen moved into markets that had hitherto been British. It also served no purpose to let the British be defeated as the US wouldnt, more than likely, get their money back.

So, the reasons for American involvement in WW2 aren’t so cut and dried, or righteous, as some would have you believe. Be that as it may, I just want to stress that there’s absolutely no ill will or malice fuelling what I’ve posted – I’m just saying it as it is (or was). I dearly hope that no one takes offense with what I’ve said, but i've largely just been stating facts.

Anyways, I digress; in my opinion [speaking as a non US citizen] Marvel have got to tread very carefully with what tone they adopt for Cap, if they dont want to scare off the overseas, non US market from wanting to go and see this movie.

WOW how did I miss this? Well said Brian, well said.

I'm lucky you responded to the jack ass you brought out the "Well if we didn't save you you'd be speaking Russian/German" crap, because if I saw it first and responded I'd be banned right now.

But you are more level headed that me, and spit 100% FACT. So well done sir!

And actually I remember a line in Saving Private Ryan mocking Monty. Which really pissed me off because he was one of if not the best tactician in that god awful war.

[Brian Braddock]

Cheers, Ace. :up:

I'm normally not one to make really deep [or long] posts, I normally prefer one liners :D but every so often.......................

[Ace of Knaves]

Heh, well it had to be said. And said well it was.

[Brian Braddock]

Cheers fella.

And you're right about Monty btw. Hell, even Eisenhower said the allies couldnt have won the war without his tactical nouse.

[GNR]

wow,Thor's pretty close to production yet we haven't heard a peep about any casting for this flick

[Rage]

The thing about WWII is that EVERY country involved has a great deal of history... yet you probably only really hear about your country and the US. I know all about Canada's involvement in WWII because I learned it in school and researched it on my own... but like everyone else... I've seen the hollywood movies about the US in WWII. And while I enjoy those movies...they do seem to be a little revisionist at times :D

[Webhead2006]

well i so cant wait to we get some names of guys testing or guys that they want to look at. So the we can figure out oh if X guy is testing they are looking for this type of guy for the role.

[Wolvieboy17]

Well I've noticed all the Thor info is starting to build up... I think it's good that they're putting so much work into pre-production, because once both movies start filming, I think it's pretty much gonna be a juggernaut... They're going to want to show off the product as much as possible to maximise hype.

[Timstuff]

I'm lucky you responded to the jack ass you brought out the "Well if we didn't save you you'd be speaking Russian/German" crap, because if I saw it first and responded I'd be banned right now.]

American: "If it wasn't for America during World War 2, you French would all be speaking German right now!"

Frenchman: "Vell if it vasn't for France during ze American Revolution, you Americans vould all be speaking English right now!"

:D

[Wolvieboy17]

If it wasn't for Australia then..........um......you...er....you wouldn't have Hugh Jackman, or Russell Crowe..... So...um....think about THAT!

[Webhead2006]

lol

[Stripesy Strip]

As I said before: if the movie is good, it will carry itself. If, by word of mouth, people in other countries learn that this isn't a flag waving, America is the best nation in the world, propaganda film, then they'll go see it. A good publicity campaign tying it into the comics and/or the Avengers would help, too.

When the movie is done, then the director and all the people at Marvel need to take a close look at it, and if it looks like the people who actually used the term "freedom fries" filmed it.......then it's doomed overseas, and there is nothing we can do about it.

But, I'm counting on Marvel not to make asses out of themselves, and ruin the movie by turning it into an "America won the war single-handed--duh!" movie.

And, if you seriously think filling the movie with famous AMERICAN celebrities is going to help convince people that it's not a flag-waving, super-patriot American war film, then you're nuts. I mean, casting Brad Pitt, a guy who thinks foreign countries are so bad that he goes around compulsively adopting little foreign babies with his wife so they can have a better life IN AMERICA, would totally convince them that this isn't that type of movie, right?



Are you saying I should have blind faith in famous actors? Yeah, I would.....if they weren't so busy putting out total crap and demanding ten to twenty million dollar salaries for it.



How is casting an actor who hasn't acted in a blockbuster (but has acted), and who got cast based mostly on looks, any more detrimental than casting only famous celebrities.......who've also got cast based mostly on looks many times in the past?

Can you say Jessica Alba as Sue Storm? Are you seriously telling me that casting an unknown, blond white chick would have been more detrimental to the film, and the acting industry in general, because the white chick was cast mostly on looks rather than the fact she was the current hip celebrity?

I'd rather have an actor cast based on looks, than on fame, because neither actor is guaranteed to have talent.......but one is guaranteed to look the part, at least.



Yeah, here's the problem with that: theater actors, to most people, yeah, they'd appear to be......UNKNOWNS!? :wow: God, mother of god, not an unknown! Anything but that! It needs to be a household name or else this movie will never sell--especially not overseas! :whatever:

Which leads me to remind you people what I said before: When I said I wanted an unknown, it didn't mean I wanted some idiot blond jock, who only played the eye candy in a dance scene in a television commercial. By unknown I meant someone who had acting experience--real acting experience--in either theater, or television, but who just hadn't had a place in a big blockbuster to make him a household name yet.

Again, being an unknown, doesn't equate to being inexperienced or untalented.

It's like you've not read my posts at all. We're not that far removed as far as what we think about this. I don't care about celebrities. I just want like you, an actor that has acting chops, who hasn't just been in "Days of our Lives" and who just look the part.

Chris Reeves is an example of unknown that was great. And a big reason for this I thought was because he had worked in theatre for quite some time.

Most theatre actors are unknown by the way. I don't know where you've been living but theatre actors hardly make money and are working under the radar.

[Triad]

If it wasn't for Australia then..........um......you...er....you wouldn't have Hugh Jackman, or Russell Crowe..... So...um....think about THAT!
OR Paul (Crocodile Dundee) Hogun & Men At Work! :oldrazz:

[aka Kal el]

>phew<

where to start?...............

Maybe you guys 'across the pond' think that and, I admit, it sure is a nice 'romantic' notion, but the U.K. box office of Private Ryan had zero to do with us being 'reminded of what America is truly about'. For me and a lot of others in the U.K., the appeal wasn’t that deep and was mainly because of:-

1) It was a Steven Spielberg movie.

2) It had Tom Hanks in it, who was arguably at the peak of his career at the time (and if not the peak, was certainly white hot).

3) It was hyped as being one of the most realistic and visceral war movies ever made.

4) We love going to the cinema to see Hollywood made war movies to see how much historical fact has been altered either for the purpose of the story or just purely in the name of patriotism. I mean, read the real history behind U571 and see how Hollywood absolutely shafted the British on that one (so much so that screenwriter David Ayer had to apologise for the distortion of historical facts and for some of the complete fiction present in the movie that was attempted to be passed off as historical fact) or perhaps read how the British and Canadians around Caen took most of the brunt of the German armoured assault after Omaha, but hardly anything of that is mentioned in Private Ryan.

Hell, if you want me to elaborate further, take ‘Patton’ - in reality it was only because the British had succeeded in diverting and engaging the majority of German troops and artillery to the Caen front (in a plan devised by our own General Montgomery), that American forces were able to break out in the south (with a numerical advantage over the Germans of 2 to 1, I might add), but Hollywood conveniently glosses over that; just as it glosses over the British contribution towards the victory in WW2 in general, and more often than not tries to make the British look incompetent and foolish.

Sidestepping the issue of bad feeling caused by your former administration (as it’s pretty much a given and the subjects been done to death), I’d suggest that it’s this revisionist attitude which may be a leading factor in why U.K. moviegoers may not want to go and see a Hollywood film featuring a character called Captain America who they think will be depicted almost single-handedly winning the war, while at the same time promoting American idealism ad nauseam.

Because they’ve seen that all before.

I do know what you mean though, my dad was born in 1940 in US 8th airforce territory in East Anglia and says that you guys were great during the war and were real good guys. Maybe this is what you mean when you speak of how the US [and Cap] should be seen; almost untainted and pure perhaps?

P.S. I’d also like to add, in response to your comment about everyone [presumably in Europe] speaking Russian [or German, as I've heard other people say before now] if it wasn’t the U.S; that if it wasn’t for the British in 1759, you’d all be speaking French! :oldrazz: :woot:

And following on from that, you got involved in WW2 not to 'save us' or because it was the right thing to do, but for your own ends:-

1) Pearl Harbour happened. While some Americans wanted to get involved in the war, the majority did not as America was currently in a period of isolationalism. The powers that be realised that any motion to go to war would be met with the strictest of opposition but the Japanese bombing of Pearl Harbour changed all that and you simply had to enter the war from that point.

2) Hitler declared war on you too; not an easy thing to ignore – if he defeats us, guess who’s next?

3) In 1941, with Britain almost exhausted financially, President Roosevelt advanced Britain £1,075 million in ‘Lend-Lease’ aid. The United States did not ask for repayment directly, but there was a high price to be paid all the same. Britain was stripped of her gold reserves and overseas investments and American businessmen moved into markets that had hitherto been British. It also served no purpose to let the British be defeated as the US wouldnt, more than likely, get their money back.

So, the reasons for American involvement in WW2 aren’t so cut and dried, or righteous, as some would have you believe. Be that as it may, I just want to stress that there’s absolutely no ill will or malice fuelling what I’ve posted – I’m just saying it as it is (or was). I dearly hope that no one takes offense with what I’ve said, but i've largely just been stating facts.

Anyways, I digress; in my opinion [speaking as a non US citizen] Marvel have got to tread very carefully with what tone they adopt for Cap, if they dont want to scare off the overseas, non US market from wanting to go and see this movie.

Brian, I also hope you do not take offense to my response as well. The last comment is not directed to you personally but to some of the other comments that have followed.

1. After the Battle for Britain, the German air force continued its aerial blitz on London and Britain’s inferstructure. (Like factories and other important buildings.) After these bombings Britain’s military was running out of supplies and Churchill was begging for FDR's help.

2. Some say the UK could've won, but I disagree. If it weren’t for US supplies, Britain would've died out, due to the German U-boat blockade. The UK knew it did not have the fighting capability to invade Nazi Europe. Germany lost most of their Air Force, but their land force was still intact.
If it wasn't for the allied push into France and Italy, German troops could've easily turned the tide of war against the Soviets, since the German troops were better trained, the German rifles were better, and the German Air Force was far better. If wasn't for the allied push, the German Me 262 would not have been rushed, thus allowing it to be in combat earlier without problems, that airplane could've won the war.

3. If it wasn't for America, the Germans might have beaten the soviets, which would've lead to the defeat of Britain. And if the Soviets won, almost all of Europe would've been under Soviet control, which would be bad for Britain and the US.

4. If Germany had the freedom of knowing that the US would not invade, it would've sifted its troops in Western Europe to the eastern front. That would've lead to the defeat of the Soviets. After the fall of the Soviets, Britain would be up for easy takings. Since Hitler really didn't care for troops (just look at his "no retreat" policy shown in Stalin grad) an invasion of Britain would've been under taken after the Soviet's defeat.

PS: Britain never thanked us for the Marshall Plan or the secret US volunteers we sent during the Battle for Britain, who went under Canadian identities. They never thank us for our pivotal help in WW1, which without us, the war would've lasted longer and more innocent people would've died.

Now we could go over endless what if scenarios as to what could have happened. I was merely point out the fact that America was instrumental in this victory. It was not meant in any way an insult to Brits. I have nothing but respect for the British people and do not appreciate the personal attacks. This was taken completely out of context. Now lets stick to the subject shall we?

:word:

[Wolvieboy17]

Kal el, I think you totally missed the point of Brians post. He wasn't trying to say that Britain played a more significant role in the war than America, he was merely underwriting the attitude that America wasn't the SOLE reason behind victory in WWII. Clearly both nations played a substantial role.

Personally, however, in my opinion, I find any overt patriotism (for any nation) regarding either of the World Wars (or any war for that matter) flawed in the fact that there is no valiant victory, or glory in war, it is merely a terrible, tragic bloodshed, that has been given this grand spin by governements in an attempt to justify that act of war itself, and to compensate families with the notion that their loved ones who died were super war heroes. Not taking anything away from the people who died, but it does kind of get to me sometimes how much war gets glorified...

Anyway, thats all from me. Tune in next week to see how I solve the tension between Palestine and Israel!

[Gamma Goliath]

anyway, i got star trek on blu ray today, and i have to say im liking chris pine more and more for this role.
and i want viggo mortenson as redskull

[Gamma Goliath]

double post

[Hound55]

If it wasn't for Australia then..........um......you...er....you wouldn't have Hugh Jackman, or Russell Crowe..... So...um....think about THAT!
If it wasn't for Australia New Zealand Australia then you wouldn't have Russell Crowe, Split Enz, Crowded House, Sam Neill...

[Wolvieboy17]

Well fine, Mel Gibson then...........wait, what?!? He's a kiwi too! God... well at least I definitely know Nicole Kidman isn't an aussie.... oh FFS

[Turtles]

It's like you've not read my posts at all. We're not that far removed as far as what we think about this. I don't care about celebrities. I just want like you, an actor that has acting chops, who hasn't just been in "Days of our Lives" and who just look the part.

Sorry, it's just that some of people I've been arguing with of late seem to want to cast only famous (almost famous) people so the movie will have Star Power. But talent is way more important than fame in my opinion.

Most theatre actors are unknown by the way. I don't know where you've been living but theatre actors hardly make money and are working under the radar.

I said most theater actors were unknowns. I said, and I quote: "To most people, yeah, they'd appear to be unknowns."

If your confusion arose from my use of the word "appear" then just know that I used such a word to illustrate the fact that even Broadway actors, who do have some measure of fame and maybe even fortune, would be unknown to every person without their nose buried in a Playbill.

[Triad]

anyway, i got star trek on blu ray today, and i have to say im liking chris pine more and more for this role.
and i want viggo mortenson as redskull
So did I, but to be honest it had the opposite effect for me. While I loved the movie and thought he was definitely excellent in it, I was left not feeling that he's quite Captain America material. This is just a personal taste, but his presence and voice doesn't really fit the mold in my mind for the role. Besides, most of us agree that he probably wouldn't be even able to take on an additional franchise character like Cap. The success of Trek almost guarantees that there will be sequels to follow. He was great in it and I believed his characterization. If by some chance he is cast as Cap I wouldn't be upset at all, but I still think that there has got to be a better candidate out there.

[bobbydigi81]

How come Sam Worthington's name isn't on the poll?? I think he is the best choice honestly. Tall, muscular frame, blue eyes, good acting chops, and becoming a relevant action star (Terminator, Clash of the Titans, Avatar..)

[Infinity9999x]

Well fine, Mel Gibson then...........wait, what?!? He's a kiwi too! God... well at least I definitely know Nicole Kidman isn't an aussie.... oh FFS

Well technically, Mel was born in the US, but his family move to Australia when he was still a wee little youngster.

So he's kind of like halfsies.

How come Sam Worthington's name isn't on the poll?? I think he is the best choice honestly. Tall, muscular frame, blue eyes, good acting chops, and becoming a relevant action star (Terminator, Clash of the Titans, Avatar..)

Marvel has said they're only going for American actors, and American Sam is not.

[Ace of Knaves]

Brian, I also hope you do not take offense to my response as well. The last comment is not directed to you personally but to some of the other comments that have followed.

1. After the Battle for Britain, the German air force continued its aerial blitz on London and Britain’s inferstructure. (Like factories and other important buildings.) After these bombings Britain’s military was running out of supplies and Churchill was begging for FDR's help.

2. Some say the UK could've won, but I disagree. If it weren’t for US supplies, Britain would've died out, due to the German U-boat blockade. The UK knew it did not have the fighting capability to invade Nazi Europe. Germany lost most of their Air Force, but their land force was still intact.
If it wasn't for the allied push into France and Italy, German troops could've easily turned the tide of war against the Soviets, since the German troops were better trained, the German rifles were better, and the German Air Force was far better. If wasn't for the allied push, the German Me 262 would not have been rushed, thus allowing it to be in combat earlier without problems, that airplane could've won the war.

3. If it wasn't for America, the Germans might have beaten the soviets, which would've lead to the defeat of Britain. And if the Soviets won, almost all of Europe would've been under Soviet control, which would be bad for Britain and the US.

4. If Germany had the freedom of knowing that the US would not invade, it would've sifted its troops in Western Europe to the eastern front. That would've lead to the defeat of the Soviets. After the fall of the Soviets, Britain would be up for easy takings. Since Hitler really didn't care for troops (just look at his "no retreat" policy shown in Stalin grad) an invasion of Britain would've been under taken after the Soviet's defeat.

PS: Britain never thanked us for the Marshall Plan or the secret US volunteers we sent during the Battle for Britain, who went under Canadian identities. They never thank us for our pivotal help in WW1, which without us, the war would've lasted longer and more innocent people would've died.

Now we could go over endless what if scenarios as to what could have happened. I was merely point out the fact that America was instrumental in this victory. It was not meant in any way an insult to Brits. I have nothing but respect for the British people and do not appreciate the personal attacks. This was taken completely out of context. Now lets stick to the subject shall we?

:word:

It was the BRITISH Navy that ****ed the U-Boats up in the Atlantic, allowing US aid to reach Europe. It was the Royal Commando's that blew up a **** load of U-Boat docks.

[jab1118]

America, Britain they were both istrumental in winning the war we need to stop this fighting come together and agree that in the end it was the French's fault

[Son of Coul]

Indeed.

[Webhead2006]

yea from what we know right now marvel only wants americans for the role, plus it would be nice to have an american playing the role and all that. Hopefully we will know soon enough the type of person they are looking for so like if we get something like what happened with gl for example saying X actor was being looked at. We can figure its likely going to go this way over that way.

[Nightwing]

Man, Leo's got like so many movies in the works and in possible development.

[Antonello Blueberry]

How come Sam Worthington's name isn't on the poll?? I think he is the best choice honestly. Tall, muscular frame, blue eyes, good acting chops, and becoming a relevant action star (Terminator, Clash of the Titans, Avatar..)
he's not tall, I think he's like 5ft9. And he's not American.

[Hound55]

How come Sam Worthington's name isn't on the poll?? I think he is the best choice honestly. Tall, muscular frame, blue eyes, good acting chops, and becoming a relevant action star (Terminator, Clash of the Titans, Avatar..)
Wolvieboy might be the only one here who gets the reference but I just had an image of Eric Bana playin Cap as Poida.

Cap arises from thawed block of ice producing a six pack from under his mighty shield: What? I'm alive again? Swoit!

[Denny67]

I have kind of read through the posts since this semi-political-historical debate started and I think there have been solid points made all around. Some are rooted in singular perspective but none have been malicious. Nice to see. :yay:

That being said I think the concerns are for not. The modern Captain America comic has been able to be good and not be preachy, self righteous or take a stance of superiority. Most people around the world like it, not because he is an “American” hero but because he is a hero.

I think this movie has a massive amount of potential for social commentary that just may make young and old people alike think and re-think the world we want to live in. Cap is a man out of his time. In essence a stranger in a strange land. I think by ride along with him on his journey of self discovery the audience may gleam something from his tale as well.

I just hope the Narnia writers approach this script from stance of hope and pride and not be too self deprecating to appease what they feel and international audience may want. It is not a shameful thing to be an American. Americans are not guiltier of corruption at high levels and self serving politicians with rich and powerful handlers than any other country. It happens everywhere. Maybe this film will point that out and show we have far more in common that we think.

[Silvermoth]

Wolvieboy might be the only one here who gets the reference but I just had an image of Eric Bana playin Cap as Poida.

Cap arises from thawed block of ice producing a six pack from under his mighty shield: What? I'm alive again? Swoit!

lol.

"G'day Tony. How you doing?"

I was stuck on a plane to Bali with a Poita once. He took full advantage of the alcoholic bevarages on board.

[Hound55]

lol.

"G'day Tony. How you doing?"

I was stuck on a plane to Bali with a Poita once. He took full advantage of the alcoholic bevarages on board.
Was it Boonie?

*Bewildered American onlookers*

[Steve Holt]

Was it Boonie?

*Bewildered American onlookers*

It's Poita Poita, not Poita Poita

[Webhead2006]

hopefully so they get the character right.

[Young Superman]

Teddy Sears for Captain America.
http://ia.media-imdb.com/images/M/MV5BMTg0NjAxMTkyOF5BMl5BanBnXkFtZTcwNzQ5ODYyMg@@._ V1._SX265_SY400_.jpghttp://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/13/Cap_america_v4.jpg

[Steve Holt]

teddy sears for captain america.
http://ia.media-imdb.com/images/m/mv5bmtg0njaxmtkyof5bml5banbnxkftztcwnzq5odyymg@@._ v1._sx265_sy400_.jpghttp://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/13/cap_america_v4.jpg

win!!!!!!

[chiefchirpa]

November but all still quiet in Cap's front?

[Timstuff]

he's not tall, I think he's like 5ft9. And he's not American.

According to IMDB he's 5' 8 1/2". Way too short to be Cap! That'd be as bad as Matthew Bomer as Superman, except with the additional dumbness of having an Australian play a character whose name has "America" in it.

[Webhead2006]

We have plently of time still for cap casting. Remember film isnt due to start filming to june. Plus its probably going to be alot shorter filming time then say im/thor/tih were for marvel. I am sure we will likely know all or most of the casting by march.

[Brian Braddock]

Yeah, still plenty of time - anyways, Johnson still has his hands busy with editing the Wolfman.

[Webhead2006]

totally i think many just dont see cap is a different type of film then the other comic films like thor/green lantern which are starting up earlier and all that. We would only have to worry if they dont have their cap picked before at least 3 months before filming.

[jab1118]

Yeah, still plenty of time - anyways, Johnson still has his hands busy with editing the Wolfman.

The problem with that is he still has his hands full because the early buzz on that movie is that its terrible. They are bringing in a new editor to re edit the movie trying to fix the problems. This movie is taking way too long which is not a good sign. I saw the trailer in a theater and people were laughing at it. All of this makes me nervous for Cap

[Brian Braddock]

Early buzz is that its terrible? Where have you go that from? From it being pushed back or from the re-edit? (none of which are proof that the movie is terrible by the way)

People are reading way too much into this re-editting the Wolfman business.........but there's a thread to discuss that issue.

[Minus Shock]

heh, yeah, I laughed at the RR shout too; very witty Spoons. :D

Of course, even if the suggestion was serious - he is Canadian.

Wouldn't he be American now if he married Scarlet? I guess doesn't fit the born part but meh.

[Brian Braddock]

I dunno - dont know much about how the old Green Card thing works on your side of the pond.

[jab1118]

Early buzz is that its terrible? Where have you go that from? From it being pushed back or from the re-edit? (none of which are proof that the movie is terrible by the way)

People are reading way too much into this re-editting the Wolfman business.........but there's a thread to discuss that issue.

Well the fact that they screened the movie and that caused them to push it back and re-edit it. While your right it aint proof that its not good but its definently not a good sign. For some reason I dont think that the sreenings went so well they decided push it back and change the movie..... Anyway your correct there is a thread for this back to casting

[Webhead2006]

well lots of movies do advance screenings and things in films get re edited or even reshot and changed. its a normal thing.

[marvel_freshman]

http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs51/f/2009/326/9/e/Marvel_Movie_Universe_Casting_by_Marvel_Freshman.j pg

[Nightwing]

Did you make that?

[jab1118]

well lots of movies do advance screenings and things in films get re edited or even reshot and changed. its a normal thing.

Yeah and the outcome usually is a bad movie

[Bren]

Just watching a movie with Aaron Ekhart - Yes, I know he's too old now, but if he was 35 he would have been brilliant...

Let's not stuff around, just cast Teddy Sears and get started!

[Timstuff]

I doubt JGL would take the Bucky part. He's already played the macho main character's wimpy soldier buddy in two movies now, so I doubt he's interested in a third.

[jaymes_e06]

I didn't think about it until I saw that cast list but Wentworth Miller would make a good Cap IMO.

[tallsy_1]

Trevor Donovan is an awful actor. No way he should be Captain America. I could live with McPartlin or Sears.

[Hound55]

Just watching a movie with Aaron Ekhart - Yes, I know he's too old now, but if he was 35 he would have been brilliant...

Let's not stuff around, just cast Teddy Sears and get started!
To me Eckhart IS Cap.

Just how I see the role... Yes, possibly (maybe even probably - but I think he still could) too old to play it, but that's how I see it.

[louiebling$]

Trevor Donovan is an awful actor. No way he should be Captain America. I could live with McPartlin or Sears.
He isn't awful but he isn't great either

[Webhead2006]

hopefully we will have a few testing names soon enough so we can get a judge on what marvel/joe are likely going for cap.

[Silvermoth]

hopefully we will have a few testing names soon enough so we can get a judge on what marvel/joe are likely going for cap.

Wasn't there a rumour a while ago that both Matthew McConaghey and John Barrowman were being considered by Marvel for Captain America.

[Wolvieboy17]

^^ Yeah, but that was ages ago, and it was one of those dodgy rumours perpetuated by a magazine, rather than from Marvel, like all those stupid Catwoman/Batman 3 rumours.

[afrayedknot]

I saw the trailer for "Invictus" the other day, and it made me think that Matt Damon CAN pull it off!

[Wolvieboy17]

Yeah, if they did want to choose a big celebrity, I could live with Matt Damon. Every time I watch Bourne Supremacy, in that scene in the beginning when he is running along the beach, I always think he looks totally Cap.

[Brian Braddock]

Of all the big names out there, Damon would be my pick too.

If they decided to go that way.

Out of all the 'A' listers I can think of at the moment, he's probably the best fit given all the requirements of the role.

[tamron]

Wasn't there a rumour a while ago that both Matthew McConaghey and John Barrowman were being considered by Marvel for Captain America.

No. Barrowman has stated at several times that he wants to be Cap, but that he knows he won't get it. McConaughey was rumored to be definitively out of the running for Cap, not in. The dye job Damon has for Invictus definitely has him looking much more Cap like. I've said it before, Damon is the only A-list star I can see as Cap.

[Wolvieboy17]

I'm still pinning my hope on an unknown, as none of the people i've seen suggest, though several of them may be quite talented, seem to scream Captain America to me. Theres got to be someone impressive out there with the right qualities... All I need is gravitas! Why can't I have my gravitas!

[Nightwing]

Damon would be great as Cap.

[Steve Holt]

Teddy Sears, he's hot the look, the jaw, the height, and CAN ACT!

[Triad]

I've heard a lot about Sears and he doesn't look bad for the part, but I have still yet to see him act. I've watched interviews on YouTube and he doen't have too bad of a voice.

I also really like Damon if they want an A-lister. His height kinda bugs me though. But who knows, with a little movie magic he could look 6' 4" on screen. (Doubt it though)

My current pick is Ryan McPartlin. He would be "awesome!"

[Young Superman]

Teddy Sears, he's hot the look, the jaw, the height, and CAN ACT!
:up::up::up::cap:

[zeptron]

I think Damon could pull of Cap, but the thing is he's gonna be in his 40s by the time this comes out. They might wanna go with someone younger.

It would be interesting seeing as how his best friend played Daredevil. Another Marvel character.

[sdn]

I saw the trailer for "Invictus" the other day, and it made me think that Matt Damon CAN pull it off!

Agreed. Man, he really filled out nicely for the rugby player role. I think he's absolutely perfect for Cap.

[Rage]

Except that he's lke 5'8 or 5'9 (max) Cap needs to stand taller than most everyone in the room... Matt Damon does not.

[cerealkiller182]

I saw the trailer for "Invictus" the other day, and it made me think that Matt Damon CAN pull it off!

Hes looking pretty spry in Green Zone too. I dont think he'll get it, but its hard for me to be dissapointed if he was

[Project862006]

Teddy Sears looks like the best choice by looks/age/acting chops/physique/


http://img684.imageshack.us/img684/9039/mv5bnde1mtgynzm1nf5bml5.jpg
(http://ia.media-imdb.com/images/M/MV5BNDE1MTgyNzM1NF5BMl5BanBnXkFtZTcwMDU5ODYyMg@@._ V1._SX435_SY400_.jpg)

[Webhead2006]

yea i doubt we will end up with a damon or a pitt for cap, they are in their 40s and marvel will likely want to go young like they did with thor casting so they can have a nice young guy for a 3 picture deal and all that.

[Wolvieboy17]

Well, if you scroll up a bit, we only really brought up Damon again as the best selection out of the A Listers, IF Marvel were looking for Star Power, but since we know that's not the direction they're looking in, it was merely speculation... I just think he's better than Di Caprio or (Vomits) Phillippe (still vomitting).

[Webhead2006]

oh totally i get if they did want to go with an a lister for the role i would be down with damon for cap, he is a solid actor, has a nice look and all that. Personally i rather go with someone like a teddy spears or a solid up an coming actor.

[Wolvieboy17]

Hmmmm... I'm still not entirely sold on Teddy Sears... I've seen a few photos that seem okay (apart from all those lame glamour shots and head shots) but i'd need to see him acting in at least a couple of things first... I have very particular standings, and I take hypothetical casting very seriously lol.

What is his most notable tv show or movie? Anything war themed or actiony would be a plus...

[Wolvieboy17]

Scratch that, watched several videos of him on YouTube... he doesn't do it for me. I can not see Robert Downey Jr and a Thunder god taking orders from him at all... Maybe he could get their coffee or something, but Cap? Newnewnewww

[louiebling$]

You will never be pleased :rolleyes:

[Wolvieboy17]

You will never be pleased :rolleyes:

Forgive me for not having low standards of excellence:oldrazz:

[Hound55]

Scratch that, watched several videos of him on YouTube... he doesn't do it for me. I can not see Robert Downey Jr and a Thunder god taking orders from him at all... Maybe he could get their coffee or something, but Cap? Newnewnewww
Exactly, I actually quite like the thought of Eckhart despite age and knowing that they'll never go with an older option for limiting the number of future films.

Eckhart I could actually see people listening to if he starts yelling tactical orders...

[Wolvieboy17]

Yeah, I agree.... I think the problem with casting for Cap, is when you read a Cap or Avengers comic, he never comes across as a young person. He always feels like a much older, more experienced warrior. Even in the marvel games, his voice actor has an older voice. I remember finding it quite jarring watching the ultimate avengers animated movie, and he had a really young voice. It just doesn't seem right.

I think thats one of the main reasons I can't see any of these young actors for Cap. Sure they're blonde, buff and pretty, but none of them look like they've experienced anything.

I actually wouldnt mind an older actor. You can make actors look younger than they are. Eckhart might be too old, methinks, but if they raise the age they're looking for, they'd be more likely to find more experienced actors, rather than an assortmen of actors who play the token 'young hunk' on various tv shows.

Btw, Teddy Sears, he basically just looks like a more bland version of Alex Skarsgard, who can't act as well. If the only difference between them is that Sears is a born American, to that I say 'pffft' and cast Skarsgard.

[Hound55]

I agree.

We're looking for a Steve McQueen type ideally... no one's close in the age bracket that you're looking for. Even Eckhart is a reach and would play it differently than a McQueen (not that that would necessarily be a bad thing) there just aren't that many young guys who could really pull it off.

Most young guys aren't going to be able to push the authority... hell, I have doubts as to whether Damon could.

[Wolvieboy17]

If I got to choose, I would cast Alex Skarsgard... However, thats irrelevant because I don't think he, or anyone else mentioned on this thread is going to be cast... It's going to be someone completely different. Look at Thor... Sure its a diff director, but its virtually being planned and developed by all the same people. I think they're giong to be clever enough to look beyond all the young blond actors on television now lol.