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Excel
11-26-2009, 11:24 PM
With the college football season coming to an end soon, players will be making up their minds shortly. A lot of juniors with some decision making to do, and arguably the biggest apparently made his decision today:

http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/playerbreakingnews.asp?sport=NFL&id=5574&line=160586&spln=1

According to that report, highly rated Notre Dame Quarterback Jimmy Clausen will be going pro. He should be an easy 1st round pick, but he will be interesting to watch. He could go anywhere from top 5 to 31-32 depending on who comes out. Another interesting one to watch will be Arkansas freak QB Ryan Mallet, whose all-world measurables and gawdy #'s will likely scouts drooling.

Also, the best wr in the draft, Dez Bryant, has already anounced he will be entering. Top seems certain for Dez.

Immortalfire
11-27-2009, 12:22 PM
Norman's gonna be pissed that you made this before him :hehe:

Dr. Evil
11-27-2009, 12:40 PM
Sam Bradford has also entered the draft as well.

StorminNorman
11-27-2009, 01:57 PM
Sam Bradford is an interesting prospect. I expect him to be a second rounder.

Jimmy Clausen will be the first QB taken.

Excel
11-27-2009, 03:04 PM
Clausen will likely find himself in St. Louis. Cleveland still has Quinn and would be idiots to take a QB. Locker and Mallet, should he come out, will all go before Bradford.

StorminNorman
11-27-2009, 04:08 PM
Clausen will likely find himself in St. Louis. Cleveland still has Quinn and would be idiots to take a QB. Locker and Mallet, should he come out, will all go before Bradford.

Clausen in St. Louis makes a lot of sense. I wouldn't be surprised if Oakland goes for Clausen either if the draft order works out in their favor. I think Russell's play this year is worthy of new QB consideration.

So does Brady Quinn. Unless Quinn is able to perform against a defensive seconadry not as terrible as Detroits, Cleveland has to look at a new QB for the future. If Mangini is still their coach, expect them to go after Jason Campbell - if he is not, expect them to draft a QB in the first two rounds. A new head coach will want a QB HE chooses.

I hope Mallet doesn't come out early, he can develop into a great QB with another year under Petrino. He could be this year's Josh Freeman (a big, physicl, naturally gifted QB prospect who is very, VERY raw) should he come out now. He could be next year's Matthew Stafford if he stays.

Erundur
11-27-2009, 05:12 PM
I just hope the skins have a competent head coach and an owner who will stay the F*** away from the football ops. for next season so that we don't have to encounter the same fiasco 2 years ago. That is, if we don't trade our 1st round pick away :(

Excel
11-27-2009, 10:18 PM
Mallet is a bit ahead of Freeman imo. But yeah, if he stays next year and doesnt pull a Jevan Snead, he'll be #1 overall pick no questions asked.

I think Oakland has wayyyy too much invested in Jamarcus Russel and way too many other holes to fill to think about taking a new QB in the 1st round, Cleveland is a different story as there will be a new shot caller. Dont count out Buffalo either. QB's are gonna go heavy in the 1st round.

Dr. Evil
11-27-2009, 11:21 PM
So where does Tebow go?

Darthphere
11-27-2009, 11:52 PM
Ufl.

Excel
11-28-2009, 12:04 AM
Tough to call. His skills are not 1st round worthy but hell prob. get taken by some team.

Darthphere
11-28-2009, 12:23 AM
The UFL was made for players like Tebow. Right now, he's probably looking at late 2nd round (best possible scenario). And it's going to be as a backup. He's not going to start on any team. Go to the UFL, become a starter. Work on your skills and if you're any good, you'll get the call up to the NFL.

StorminNorman
11-28-2009, 05:20 PM
Mallet is a bit ahead of Freeman imo. But yeah, if he stays next year and doesnt pull a Jevan Snead, he'll be #1 overall pick no questions asked.

I think Oakland has wayyyy too much invested in Jamarcus Russel and way too many other holes to fill to think about taking a new QB in the 1st round, Cleveland is a different story as there will be a new shot caller. Dont count out Buffalo either. QB's are gonna go heavy in the 1st round.

They only have money invested in Jamarcus Russel, but we are facing an uncapped year (so if you are going to make a move, you do it next year). Yes, they have other holes - but there is no more important position than QB. If you don't have a Franchise QB, that should be your most pressing priority.

So where does Tebow go?

Jacksonville makes the most sense.

Tough to call. His skills are not 1st round worthy but hell prob. get taken by some team.

The UFL was made for players like Tebow. Right now, he's probably looking at late 2nd round (best possible scenario). And it's going to be as a backup. He's not going to start on any team. Go to the UFL, become a starter. Work on your skills and if you're any good, you'll get the call up to the NFL.

I think Tebow will end up being drafted in the first round once he starts talking to scouts. Sanchez was drafted in the 5th spot based purely on charisma.

ComicChick
11-29-2009, 10:35 PM
does Carolina have a shot at anything good in the draft next year? i REALLY want them to draft a QB.

heck, i'll take Tebow

Dr. Evil
11-29-2009, 11:10 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/11/29/king-two-coaches-say-tebow-wont-get-past-them-in-round-one/

NBC's Peter King reported during Football Night in America that he has spoken to 17 coaches and personnel executives over the past month, and that he has asked for predictions as to the precise spot at which Florida quarterback Tim Tebow will be drafted.

The average draft position? 33rd overall.

But King added that two coaches of "winning teams" said Tebow won't get past their selections in round one.

Our guess as to the two teams in question? Jacksonville and Minnesota.

Excel
11-29-2009, 11:11 PM
Clausen is the QB to have, a true field general.

Dr. Evil
11-29-2009, 11:34 PM
Watch the Big 12 Championship game as Nebraska DE Ndamukong Suh has been projected as a top five pick in the draft, possibly even the top pick overall. From the little I've seen of him, he's pretty good.

ComicChick
11-29-2009, 11:37 PM
how in the world do you pronounce that?

Excel
11-29-2009, 11:41 PM
Hes a beastly, godlike DT.

Dr. Evil
11-29-2009, 11:43 PM
how in the world do you pronounce that?

ESPN College Football Commentator Ed Cunningham pronounces it as:

"N-damu-kong Suh"

StorminNorman
11-30-2009, 12:32 AM
does Carolina have a shot at anything good in the draft next year? i REALLY want them to draft a QB.

heck, i'll take Tebow

McCoy and Bradford may be available. Pike may be interesting.

ComicChick
11-30-2009, 12:59 AM
McCoy and Bradford may be available. Pike may be interesting.

i would love that. Carolina really needs something fresh at QB, especially since Jake's not getting it done for them.

The Incredible Hulk
11-30-2009, 09:55 AM
Clausen is the QB to have, a true field general.


:confused: Have you watched the same Notre Dame team that I have the past two seasons? He hasnt even looked as good as Brady Quinn did at Notre Dame.

Darthphere
11-30-2009, 10:43 AM
That's incredibly inaccurate.

bored
11-30-2009, 12:07 PM
Mallet is a bit ahead of Freeman imo. But yeah, if he stays next year and doesnt pull a Jevan Snead, he'll be #1 overall pick no questions asked.

I think Oakland has wayyyy too much invested in Jamarcus Russel and way too many other holes to fill to think about taking a new QB in the 1st round, Cleveland is a different story as there will be a new shot caller. Dont count out Buffalo either. QB's are gonna go heavy in the 1st round.


You assume that Oakland knows what it's doing.

Excel
11-30-2009, 12:15 PM
That's true. They need some much...they ought to draft Dez Bryant...Russel to Bryant could be lethal...oh wait, they already drafted DHB....Russels been benched.

I dont think a team has ever taken a bigger collective step backwards in one year than Oakland has this season.

:confused: Have you watched the same Notre Dame team that I have the past two seasons? He hasnt even looked as good as Brady Quinn did at Notre Dame.

I like Clausens transition to the pro's more than Quinn who I was never high on...Quinn never had any sort of poise. Clausen throws to perhaps the best receiving group in the nation, but he strikes me as someone for whome football is his LIFE. Its hard to imagine not succeeding where ever he goes.

VampElvis
11-30-2009, 12:57 PM
Who's the first RB taken, and how high? (Umm, let me clarify, not "how high" like Percy Harvin, but how high/low a number in the draft.)

StorminNorman
11-30-2009, 01:01 PM
C.J. Spiller

VampElvis
11-30-2009, 01:13 PM
Does he crack the top 10?

The Incredible Hulk
11-30-2009, 02:38 PM
That's incredibly inaccurate.

so is Jimmy Clausen.


I like Clausens transition to the pro's more than Quinn who I was never high on...Quinn never had any sort of poise. Clausen throws to perhaps the best receiving group in the nation, but he strikes me as someone for whome football is his LIFE. Its hard to imagine not succeeding where ever he goes.

Clausne comes off like Chris Simms. The college pundits swear up and down how good and sound of a QB he is. But he never really shows any leadership, or wins all that much. Then they start calling him a "next level guy" because of his "tools". Then he gets to the NFl and well, you know the rest.

Immortalfire
11-30-2009, 02:46 PM
You assume that Oakland knows what it's doing.

:hehe:

BigSams50
11-30-2009, 04:09 PM
i would love that. Carolina really needs something fresh at QB, especially since Jake's not getting it done for them.

Yea Jake is horrible. All the Panther fans i knew in Fayetteville hated him

StorminNorman
11-30-2009, 04:29 PM
Does he crack the top 10?

Probably not. I don't know if I would ever draft a RB in the top 10 again.

so is Jimmy Clausen.



Clausne comes off like Chris Simms. The college pundits swear up and down how good and sound of a QB he is. But he never really shows any leadership, or wins all that much. Then they start calling him a "next level guy" because of his "tools". Then he gets to the NFl and well, you know the rest.

Why are so always so wrong about QB's. :oldrazz:

The Incredible Hulk
11-30-2009, 04:51 PM
Why are so always so wrong about QB's. :oldrazz:

When are you going to admit that you're actually Mel Kiper Jr? :p

ComicChick
11-30-2009, 05:54 PM
When are you going to admit that you're actually Mel Kiper Jr? :p

paternity test pending lol

Excel
11-30-2009, 06:14 PM
Spiller is best player who plays running back; but from a "running" perspective and not counting special teams, I would take Jahvid Best over him. As an athlete Spiller is a lot like Chris Johnson, but I just do not like his tape at all. The guy has zero patience on the majority of his runs (CJ showed very impressive patience in college); in the NFL when there is no hole he will zoom to the outside ala Reggie and gets stuffed.

Jahvid Best, though having less burst (he still has excellent burst), has much better pateince and vision than Spiller. Anyone who remembers Cliton Portis back when he was with Denver, that pretty much IS Jahvid Best.

Excel
11-30-2009, 07:21 PM
Clausne comes off like Chris Simms. The college pundits swear up and down how good and sound of a QB he is. But he never really shows any leadership, or wins all that much. Then they start calling him a "next level guy" because of his "tools". Then he gets to the NFl and well, you know the rest.

1st of all, Simms was decent in his 1 season as a starter throwing to noone back in 2005 :o. He hasnt panned out, but his growth was totally stunted by injuries.

2nd, it is not Clausen's fault his defense was terrible. His carreer is filled with comebacks where he was down early and fought back and *almost* won, but didn't. Does Clausen benefit from throwing to guys like Michael Floyd which let him get away with passes like this/or put huge #s on simple throws:

l3igd-yBUIQ

YES. But he also has a lot more poise and maturity than pretty much anyone else.

Darthphere
11-30-2009, 07:31 PM
so is Jimmy Clausen.

Yes, 68% is terribly inaccurate.

Alex The Great
11-30-2009, 07:39 PM
I don't see the Vikings drafting a QB in the first, Favre has been an MVP QB this year and I expect him to stay.


I think that Tebow may not be fantastic in the NFl as the 1 million ESPN football commentators say, but hey, one team will bite. I want to say the Raiders but they punched down money on Mr. Tubs, so most likely not.

Tebow to the jags seems a better fit

StorminNorman
11-30-2009, 09:43 PM
I have always loved the idea of Tebow in Minnesota, though I think Tavaris may end up being their QB of the future after all.

Alex The Great
11-30-2009, 10:33 PM
I have always loved the idea of Tebow in Minnesota, though I think Tavaris may end up being their QB of the future after all.
The way Favre is playing, they won't draft a Qb this year, they might go for Tebow and see what happens. But what if Favre keeps being really good for like, 3 years?

StorminNorman
11-30-2009, 10:39 PM
The way Favre is playing, they won't draft a Qb this year, they might go for Tebow and see what happens. But what if Favre keeps being really good for like, 3 years?

One year is a possibility, two is not. Draft now, especially considering the development Tebow needs.

That-Guy
12-01-2009, 01:32 PM
Okay, I have to admit to being a bit of a moron here when it comes to the draft. I don't follow college football hardly at all. So I'm curious what it is specifically that teams look for when drafting a QB. I have heard Tebow's name brought up a lot over the past few years and just assumed he was a shoe-in first round pick, but looking around various sites, it seems that most analysts are thinking he's late first round at best, and more likely second or third.

Do they feel that he rushes too often? Do they only look for pure pocket passers in the draft? What specifically is evaluated when drafting a QB?

StorminNorman
12-01-2009, 03:10 PM
Arguably the most difficult position in all of sports is that of an NFL QB. In order to excel at being an NFL QB you have to be the hardest worker on the team, have the mind of a computer and the ability to place the ball into windows that are ridiculously small. You have to be able to go to the line, read the defense, make adjustments and then snap the ball in about 20-25 seconds - its incredibly difficult.

Not every team looks for the same things in a QB. Some teams believe that you cant teach talent and thus skew themselves to players with big arms, believing that can teach them the rest. Other teams look for leadership credentials, confident that if they win the locker room, they can win on the field. Others look for the smartest QB they can find, believing that they can simply out scheme defenses. Ideally, every team wants a bit of all of those - but what they put the highest priority on will play a big role on what QBs they target.

Its difficult for college QBs to enter the NFL because college defenses are so different from NFL ones. College QBs can get away with throwing the ball to wide open wide receivers, in the NFL you rarely ever have a wide open receiver.

There are several reasons why Tebow will be knocked. At Florida, he has run a very simple spread passing offense, he will have to learn a lot of offensive philosophy in the NFL. Tebows form is also not typical for a QB, watch him throw a ball and compare it to Peyton Manning.

Tebow does, however, have the ability to win over a lockerroom. On a personal level, he will learn the trust and respect of his teammates. As such, teams that place the highest value on that will have no problem taking him in the first round if they need a QB.

Dr. Evil
12-01-2009, 03:14 PM
Okay, I have to admit to being a bit of a moron here when it comes to the draft. I don't follow college football hardly at all. So I'm curious what it is specifically that teams look for when drafting a QB. I have heard Tebow's name brought up a lot over the past few years and just assumed he was a shoe-in first round pick, but looking around various sites, it seems that most analysts are thinking he's late first round at best, and more likely second or third.

Do they feel that he rushes too often? Do they only look for pure pocket passers in the draft? What specifically is evaluated when drafting a QB?

The main concern over Tebow is whether or not he can be a QB in a pro style offense. He runs the spread offense and often runs the ball. If you notice, a lot of NFL teams run the Wildcat offense. And with the Wildcat, there is an option to either run or throw the ball. The feeling is that Tebow can effectively run the wildcat in the NFL, but that he will be an H-Back type in the NFL. The determining factor will be how he does at the Senior Bowl. At the Senior Bowl, the two worst teams in the NFL coach the two teams (if the two worse teams are changing coaches though, the next two worse teams coach the Senior Bowl) and from all accounts, it will probably be St. Louis and Detroit. The Senior Bowl will determine where Tebow ends up and how high as well as what position.

NFL teams look for a QB who can throw in the pocket, has size usually and has that crazy strong arm. The Raiders chose Chubbo number one several years ago because he could throw the ball pretty damn far. That's also the reason Vick was chosen number one back in 2001, because he himself could throw the ball pretty far. Not all of them look for that, but some do.

Jimmy Clausen is projected to be a first round pick because he played in a pro style offense. Sam Bradford is also a projected first round pick, although his injuries may scare off some people. If they come out, Jake Locker and Ryan Mallett could be first round picks as well. Colt McCoy could be a late first/early second round pick.

That-Guy
12-01-2009, 03:21 PM
Appreciated, thanks Norm.

Interesting stuff and it does make sense why so many successful college QBs aren't taken very high. It makes me wonder where a guy like Tebow could land then. Maybe St. Louis? That's a team that certainly needs a leader if it ever wants to be successful again. They do have a great RB... a decent QB who can rally the troops could be all they need to contend again, offensively anyway.

In regards to his form, do you think that he would struggle heavily in the NFL? Comparing him to Peyton Manning is a pretty tall order... even if he was a certified #1 overall, I doubt that he would look that good yet. But yeah, running a simple offense could possibly hurt his ability to succeed in the long run.

Excel
12-01-2009, 03:53 PM
ST. Louis pick will be too high for Tebow; they will likely snag Jimmy Clause.

StorminNorman
12-01-2009, 04:04 PM
The main concern over Tebow is whether or not he can be a QB in a pro style offense. He runs the spread offense and often runs the ball. If you notice, a lot of NFL teams run the Wildcat offense. And with the Wildcat, there is an option to either run or throw the ball. The feeling is that Tebow can effectively run the wildcat in the NFL, but that he will be an H-Back type in the NFL. The determining factor will be how he does at the Senior Bowl. At the Senior Bowl, the two worst teams in the NFL coach the two teams (if the two worse teams are changing coaches though, the next two worse teams coach the Senior Bowl) and from all accounts, it will probably be St. Louis and Detroit. The Senior Bowl will determine where Tebow ends up and how high as well as what position.

NFL teams look for a QB who can throw in the pocket, has size usually and has that crazy strong arm. The Raiders chose Chubbo number one several years ago because he could throw the ball pretty damn far. That's also the reason Vick was chosen number one back in 2001, because he himself could throw the ball pretty far. Not all of them look for that, but some do.

Jimmy Clausen is projected to be a first round pick because he played in a pro style offense. Sam Bradford is also a projected first round pick, although his injuries may scare off some people. If they come out, Jake Locker and Ryan Mallett could be first round picks as well. Colt McCoy could be a late first/early second round pick.

A lot of what you said is true, but I doubt Tebow plays any position other than QB in the NFL.

Also, the only QB that is a true projected first round pick is Clausen. The rest are up in the air. Bradford will likely be a second round pick, IMO.

StorminNorman
12-01-2009, 04:06 PM
Appreciated, thanks Norm.

Interesting stuff and it does make sense why so many successful college QBs aren't taken very high. It makes me wonder where a guy like Tebow could land then. Maybe St. Louis? That's a team that certainly needs a leader if it ever wants to be successful again. They do have a great RB... a decent QB who can rally the troops could be all they need to contend again, offensively anyway.

In regards to his form, do you think that he would struggle heavily in the NFL? Comparing him to Peyton Manning is a pretty tall order... even if he was a certified #1 overall, I doubt that he would look that good yet. But yeah, running a simple offense could possibly hurt his ability to succeed in the long run.

If you are going to compare Tebow to anyone, I think it's Vince Young without the quitting last year. Tebow may have flashes of brilliance combined with a lot of frustration early on (if he plays early on). Tebow is not going to enter the NFL as an NFL ready QB (like Manning did, like Stafford did, like even Sanchez did) - Tebow is going to take some serious time to develop.

Excel
12-01-2009, 04:33 PM
If Mallet comes out, he is top 15.

Immortalfire
12-01-2009, 05:42 PM
Tebow does, however, have the ability to win over a lockerroom. On a personal level, he will learn the trust and respect of his teammates. As such, teams that place the highest value on that will have no problem taking him in the first round if they need a QB.

I dunno if NFL veterans of any kind are going to put up with his little screaming fits.

Darthphere
12-01-2009, 05:48 PM
I dunno if NFL veterans of any kind are going to put up with his little screaming fits.

"I promise that you will never see anyone play harder or with more heart than..."

"Hey Tebow, shut the **** up."

Excel
12-01-2009, 05:55 PM
"I promise that you will never see anyone play harder or with more heart than..."

"Hey Tebow, shut the **** up."

:hehe:

ComicChick
12-01-2009, 06:46 PM
I dunno if NFL veterans of any kind are going to put up with his little screaming fits.

chicago puts up with Cutler's so you never know

Excel
12-01-2009, 06:49 PM
Wait till Urlachers back.

Alex The Great
12-01-2009, 10:44 PM
One year is a possibility, two is not. Draft now, especially considering the development Tebow needs.
Everyone has been saying that for the last 4 years.

RAMORE
12-02-2009, 11:55 AM
One year is a possibility, two is not. Draft now, especially considering the development Tebow needs.

Completely agree. Favre probably has one more good year in him 2 would be crazy but you never know. My grand scheme was for the bucs to draft Percy this year and then take Tebow the next but they screwed the pooch so let the Viking benefit from the formula and reunite two guys who worked great together.

StorminNorman
12-02-2009, 12:13 PM
I dunno if NFL veterans of any kind are going to put up with his little screaming fits.

You know who has similar screaming fits? Tom Brady.

Everyone has been saying that for the last 4 years.

Just Favre has done the impossible, doesn't mean he will continue to. The dude is 40.

Dr. Evil
12-02-2009, 12:27 PM
Has Jimmy Clausen made it official that he's coming out yet?

Alex The Great
12-02-2009, 02:13 PM
Just Favre has done the impossible, doesn't mean he will continue to. The dude is 40.
I know, I'm sure Favre has one more good year in him, and mayybe another. But Favre semms to always pull a Favre and make us do double takes so....:shrug:

That-Guy
12-02-2009, 02:18 PM
Has Jimmy Clausen made it official that he's coming out yet?

If he is, then I hope that Larry Johnson doesn't wind up on his team. :hehe:

Immortalfire
12-02-2009, 02:20 PM
I see what you did there :funny:

That-Guy
12-02-2009, 02:25 PM
:woot:

Excel
12-02-2009, 03:04 PM
If Rams snag Clausen this year and Green or Jones next year, after snagging Smith this past year...their offense could set for the next 10 years.

StorminNorman
12-02-2009, 03:12 PM
Carlos Dunlap's DUI will be a very interesting story to watch.

The dude is a 290 DE with high 4.6 speed. A physical freak whose raw ability had some placing him as a top 10 draft prospect earlier this season.

Hasn't been all that productive this year (garners a lot of attention when offenses scheme against Florida), so combine that with the DUI he is likely to slip. The guy has Mario Williams like potential though and could be a huge hidden gem.

Excel
12-02-2009, 05:07 PM
He'll be a 2nd rounder. Physical abilities are amazing, but lack of production and now appearently character concerns=slip.

RAMORE
12-03-2009, 01:15 PM
I think he'll go first round. What about brandon spikes Mel Kiper III (aka stormin norman)?

Mastodon123
12-03-2009, 03:04 PM
I want the Lions to draft either Eric Berry, or Suh. Though i'm afraid the Lions will probably draft offense again in 1st round. If they do they better draft a lineman and not another receiver.

StorminNorman
12-03-2009, 03:52 PM
He'll be a 2nd rounder. Physical abilities are amazing, but lack of production and now appearently character concerns=slip.

Very possible.

I think he'll go first round. What about brandon spikes Mel Kiper III (aka stormin norman)?

Brandon Spikes, IMO, is an ideal 3-4 ILB. I would guess a mid-late first round pick. Dolphins and Patriots make sense.

I want the Lions to draft either Eric Berry, or Suh. Though i'm afraid the Lions will probably draft offense again in 1st round. If they do they better draft a lineman and not another receiver.

I think Berry or Suh have to be top two for the Lions, Suh being the preference. For a while I thought it was unlikely Suh would fall to Detroit, but it may work out - especially if Wilfork goes to a team like Tampa.

There is not an offensive player I would want Detroit to invest a top 5 pick on, and that includes lineman.

Immortalfire
12-03-2009, 04:07 PM
Norman..you dang sure better sport the Mel avvy when draft time gets close.

StorminNorman
12-03-2009, 04:20 PM
Oh it will be there.

That-Guy
12-03-2009, 04:20 PM
Man, I bet this guy goes pretty high:

http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/blog/dr_saturday/post/Video-Florida-State-s-Zebrie-Sanders-redefines-?urn=ncaaf,206179

:D

Immortalfire
12-03-2009, 04:24 PM
I saw that on MNF C'mon Man

:facepalm:

That-Guy
12-03-2009, 04:43 PM
Missed it on Monday night. I have NO idea what was going through his mind. Maybe he was having a seizure or something.

Immortalfire
12-03-2009, 04:49 PM
Even after they were moving...even in his line of vision, he's still a statue. Wtf..

That-Guy
12-03-2009, 05:02 PM
Yeah. He looks like he's taking a dump. It's just mind-boggling.

StorminNorman
12-06-2009, 03:19 AM
Suh secured himself as a top 3 draft pick.

Dr. Evil
12-06-2009, 12:19 PM
Charley Casserly on NFL Today on CBS says that Colt McCoy is a late first/early second round pick and that Tebow is a third round pick.

StorminNorman
12-06-2009, 12:22 PM
Tebow easily cost himself two draft spots yesterday.

I still can't see McCoy in the first, unless a team late in the draft really is gunning for a QB.

Dr. Evil
12-06-2009, 12:30 PM
Casserly also said that Suh compares to Richard Seymour.

Cmill216
12-06-2009, 01:39 PM
Tim Tebow won't be an NFL QB. That was made painfully obvious in the SEC Championship game.

His mechanics are absolutely horrendous, and the fact that more people aren't aware of this is baffling. His footwork is stilted. His ball carriage needs to be completely re-taught. His throwing motion is awkward, moreso than those of Rivers and Young. Not to mention, his accuracy is wildly inconsistent.

Add to the fact that 90% of Florida's passing game consisted of play fakes from the gun that managed to leave wide receivers blatantly open, thus making him incredibly underdeveloped in terms of reading coverages. There's a difference between running the spread that McCoy or Bradford ran, which required them to drop back and consistently make accurate reads and throws, versus the spread option system that Tebow ran which was essentially nothing more than a glorified Wildcat.

How anyone can think this cat is an NFL QB is beyond me.

StorminNorman
12-06-2009, 01:43 PM
Casserly also said that Suh compares to Richard Seymour.

Seymour is the best comparison in the NFL.

Tim Tebow won't be an NFL QB. That was made painfully obvious in the SEC Championship game.

His mechanics are absolutely horrendous, and the fact that more people aren't aware of this is baffling. His footwork is stilted. His ball carriage needs to be completely re-taught. His throwing motion is awkward, moreso than those of Rivers and Young. Not to mention, his accuracy is wildly inconsistent.

Add to the fact that 90% of Florida's passing game consisted of play fakes from the gun that managed to leave wide receivers blatantly open, thus making him incredibly underdeveloped in terms of reading coverages. There's a difference between running the spread that McCoy or Bradford ran, which required them to drop back and consistently make accurate reads and throws, versus the spread option system that Tebow ran which was essentially nothing more than a glorified Wildcat.

How anyone can think this cat is an NFL QB is beyond me.

Tebow has the one thing that can't be taught or trained or developed - the IT factor. He can win over a locker room, he can inspire those around him, he loves the game of football.

It may take his three years on the bench, but I believe in Tebow.

Cmill216
12-06-2009, 01:47 PM
Tebow has the one thing that can't be taught or trained or developed - the IT factor. He can win over a locker room, he can inspire those around him, he loves the game of football.

The charisma thing is weak, though. The Sanchez argument doesn't apply, because Sanchez's game was an NFL game. He was built like a prototypical West Coast QB, but the charisma thing helped him leap higher in the draft than he probably should have.

Crying like a b**** on the sidelines is not going to inspire those around Tebow in the NFL. Do you see Manning balling his eyes out after a playoff loss? Do you see Brady making ridiculous declarations after a blowout?

StorminNorman
12-06-2009, 01:55 PM
The charisma thing is weak, though. The Sanchez argument doesn't apply, because Sanchez's game was an NFL game. He was built like a prototypical West Coast QB, but the charisma thing helped him leap higher in the draft than he probably should have.

Crying like a b**** on the sidelines is not going to inspire those around him. Do you see Manning balling his eyes out after a playoff loss? Do you see Brady making ridiculous declarations after a blowout?

It's not charisma, it's heart. That's the difference. Did we see Sanchez become the most dominant college football player IN THE SEC? Did you see him constantly bring his team back when he was asked, or see how his team played like they were invincible whenever he was on the field? Did you see players come to USC simply after TALKING to him (the way Brandon Spikes went to UF after talking to Tebow).

No.

And no, you don't see Manning balling his eyes out after a playoff loss - but passion and leadership and heart have all sorts of ways of showing themselves. Tebow cries, Manning and Brady yell.

Tebow has the raw skills, there is no denying that. He has the arm strength, he has demonstrated the accuracy (though he needs to be more consistent), he has the size at 6'3 240. If you ignored all the good and bad from Tim Tebow and just had him work out in t-shirts and shorts, he would still look like an NFL talent.

Put him in the hands of a great offensive coach and watch him develop into an NFL leader.

Just don't draft him round 1 and ask him to save the franchise year 1 (Jacksonville).

Cmill216
12-06-2009, 02:05 PM
If you wanna draft Tim Tebow in the 3rd or 4th Round as a project, sure. Go for it.

But he's not worth a 1st Round pick as a franchise signal caller. His arm strength is average, adequate at best. His accuracy is inconsistent, as you said, but I'll continue to point out that a large majority of his completions came off of gun action and "step ins", which ain't gonna fly when he's out of Meyer's gimmicky option offense. Tim Tebow was never asked (and probably for good reason) to just drop back and consistently read and throw, which are the basic tenets of being an NFL QB.

Being a ferocious leader at Florida does not translate to being a leader of a professional franchise with grown ass men. All that "ra ra" jazz doesn't make up for the fact that he's as underdeveloped as a QB can possibly be coming out of a high profile program.

StorminNorman
12-06-2009, 02:18 PM
It's hard for me to chalk up the production Tebow has had in college to a gimmicky offense. He doesn't play in the Big 12, he plays in the SEC which produces the most NFL talent on defense than any other conference (by far). The SEC has the best defensive coordinators in the country, many of them with NFL ties.

If stopping Tebow was as simple as breaking down a gimmick offense, Tebow would not be in the running for the best player in college football history.

Cmill216
12-06-2009, 02:40 PM
It's hard for me to chalk up the production Tebow has had in college to a gimmicky offense.

I'm not saying that entirely. Tebow's physical talent as a college QB (his size, athleticism, dual threat capabilities) are undeniable. But, yes, you also have to look at Meyer's spread option scheme and the talents they surrounded Tebow with.

Ask yourself this: what if Tebow had gone somewhere else? Could you see Tebow as a 3-step drop West Coast/USC guy? Could you see him as a throw it 50 times Texas Tech/Air Raid guy? No, because Tebow was a perfect fit for what Urban Meyer wants to do. And he hasn't shown enough consistency as a passer to make me think he could even remotely compete in those other systems, which are more comparable to NFL systems than what Meyer runs.

He doesn't play in the Big 12, he plays in the SEC which produces the most NFL talent on defense than any other conference (by far). The SEC has the best defensive coordinators in the country, many of them with NFL ties.

If stopping Tebow was as simple as breaking down a gimmick offense, Tebow would not be in the running for the best player in college football history.

Meyer's spread option is a great college system. But it is not a system conducive to developing an NFL QB, especially the way it's run in Florida. It's a system built almost solely on deception and misdirection, utilizing the speed of its backfield and the dual threat abilities of Tebow. The passing game is merely a change of pace.

That's why I say it's a gimmick in measuring Tebow's production as a QB. This is not to take away from what he's done in college. It's staggering. But none of it means a lick when projecting him as an NFL QB. Because based on what he ran at Florida and how he ran it, Tebow will be asked to completely re-learn the quarterback position.

StorminNorman
12-06-2009, 03:24 PM
I'm not saying that entirely. Tebow's physical talent as a college QB (his size, athleticism, dual threat capabilities) are undeniable. But, yes, you also have to look at Meyer's spread option scheme and the talents they surrounded Tebow with.

Ask yourself this: what if Tebow had gone somewhere else? Could you see Tebow as a 3-step drop West Coast/USC guy? Could you see him as a throw it 50 times Texas Tech/Air Raid guy? No, because Tebow was a perfect fit for what Urban Meyer wants to do. And he hasn't shown enough consistency as a passer to make me think he could even remotely compete in those other systems, which are more comparable to NFL systems than what Meyer runs.

I think it's impossible to tell. I am not willing to bet that Tebow would be unable to to learn to perform any system he was placed in. There is a reason why Tebow was seen as a top talent before he went to Florida, all of the top colleges in the nation wanted him to run their offense - not just Meyer.

Meyer's spread option is a great college system. But it is not a system conducive to developing an NFL QB, especially the way it's run in Florida. It's a system built almost solely on deception and misdirection, utilizing the speed of its backfield and the dual threat abilities of Tebow. The passing game is merely a change of pace.

That's why I say it's a gimmick in measuring Tebow's production as a QB. This is not to take away from what he's done in college. It's staggering. But none of it means a lick when projecting him as an NFL QB. Because based on what he ran at Florida and how he ran it, Tebow will be asked to completely re-learn the quarterback position.

So will any QB coming out of the Big 12.

Tebow has excelled against elite defenses almost every week he has put on pads, that gives him a tremendous advantage over McCoy, Bradford, Locker, etc.

Cmill216
12-06-2009, 03:36 PM
I think it's impossible to tell. I am not willing to bet that Tebow would be unable to to learn to perform any system he was placed in. There is a reason why Tebow was seen as a top talent before he went to Florida, all of the top colleges in the nation wanted him to run their offense - not just Meyer.

Well, naturally. He was a top flight physical talent coming out of high school. But that doesn't mean he'd actually be a fit at any of the other schools that salivated over his skill set. He was an archetypal fit for Meyer's scheme.

So will any QB coming out of the Big 12.

Not in the same sense as Tebow. The offenses ran at Oklahoma and Texas asked Bradford and McCoy to make key reads, go through progressions, and make consistently accurate throws. Both offenses were steeped in traditional pro principles, despite their spread tendencies. Bradford, obviously, will have to adjust to not having the benefit of the no-huddle setup, but he and McCoy will have a much easier time transitioning into the NFL. Whether or not they'll actually be good is another debate.

Tebow has excelled against elite defenses almost every week he has put on pads, that gives him a tremendous advantage over McCoy, Bradford, Locker, etc.

He excelled, but not as a QB. He excelled as the ultimate spread option weapon.

ComicChick
12-06-2009, 08:56 PM
i want McCoy to come to Carolina.

I like Tebow, he's got the "it" factor like others have said. and a lot of people give him flack for crying. i see it as passion for the game. and playing football is a job. i want someone who's passionate about what they do. i don't think he'll be a bust in the NFL. i think he'll need a while to make his niche but I believe in Tebow too. :)

Excel
12-06-2009, 09:03 PM
Of course Tim Tebow isn't a 1st round QB talent...but he's TIM TEBOW...he's the biggest name in college since Reggie. It doesnt matter if hes 1/10th the prospect JaMarcus Russell was, someone will take him in top 2 rounds.

Colt McCoy...another project. The only QB in this draft that anyone will be comfortable starting right away is Jimmy Clausen.

CJ Spiller has also turned himself into a top 15 if not top 10. He looked excellent yesterday.

ComicChick
12-06-2009, 09:25 PM
that QB from Cincinnati isn't too bad either. dunno if he's a senior or what, but he held his own.

from what I remember, Carolina has no first round pick, but if they can pick up a strong potential qb in the draft, maybe we can ship off delhomme.

Excel
12-06-2009, 09:27 PM
True, Pikes

Excel
12-06-2009, 09:27 PM
True, Pikes a decent

StorminNorman
12-06-2009, 10:12 PM
Pike is likely a 3rd-5th round QB at this point.

Excel
12-06-2009, 10:32 PM
Was Pike the guy benched for a freshman? Clausen, Bradford, and possibly Mallet are the only guys I think have top 15 potential.

ComicChick
12-07-2009, 11:42 PM
its official; clausen is entering the draft

StorminNorman
12-08-2009, 12:19 AM
Cleveland and St. Louis are pleased.

Excel
12-08-2009, 12:38 AM
He'll be a Ram almost no doubt about it. The most obvious pick in years. Cleveland's Quinn has showed excellent potential in recent weeks, TB has Freeman, and Lions got Stafford.

The Incredible Hulk
12-08-2009, 03:45 PM
He'll be a Ram almost no doubt about it. The most obvious pick in years. Cleveland's Quinn has showed excellent potential in recent weeks, TB has Freeman, and Lions got Stafford.


Claussen isnt even the top rated QB at this point. Granted that could change before April, although the fact that ND turned up their noses at a BOWL game wont help him, neither will the fact that he's not a Senior and thus not eligible for any of the All Star Games. At this point, though there's no way you can say the Rams will take him especially given their needs on the defensive line. Unless you mean at the top of Round 2?

And dont discount the Browns going after a QB. Quinn has one nice game against a bad Lions defense. Mangini never wanted him, and niether will whomever their next coach will be. Unless of course it's Charlie Weis ;) Then again, he'd likely take Claussen over Quinn.

Dr. Evil
12-08-2009, 03:55 PM
Claussen isnt even the top rated QB at this point. Granted that could change before April, although the fact that ND turned up their noses at a BOWL game wont help him, neither will the fact that he's not a Senior and thus not eligible for any of the All Star Games. At this point, though there's no way you can say the Rams will take him especially given their needs on the defensive line. Unless you mean at the top of Round 2?

And dont discount the Browns going after a QB. Quinn has one nice game against a bad Lions defense. Mangini never wanted him, and niether will whomever their next coach will be. Unless of course it's Charlie Weis ;) Then again, he'd likely take Claussen over Quinn.

Quinn didn't play all that bad against San Diego this past weekend. He went 25/45 for 271 yards and 3 TD's. He did fumble once, but he did not have a bad game.

Excel
12-08-2009, 03:56 PM
Who would be higher than Clausen? Locker? Hell no.

The Incredible Hulk
12-08-2009, 04:00 PM
Who would be higher than Clausen? Locker? Hell no.

McShay/Scouts Inc. have Locker and Bradford ahead of him.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/draft

The Incredible Hulk
12-08-2009, 04:01 PM
Quinn didn't play all that bad against San Diego this past weekend. He went 25/45 for 271 yards and 3 TD's. He did fumble once, but he did not have a bad game.

I didnt say that he did. Although a lot of those numbers were put up in garbage time against a mediocre defense missing 3 of their best players. Two of those TD passes to harrison were basically handoffs.

Dr. Evil
12-08-2009, 04:04 PM
It's not like Quinn's been playing like Tubby in Oakland has been this season as of late, although he was on his way to playing like Tubby.

The Incredible Hulk
12-08-2009, 04:05 PM
It's not like Quinn's been playing like Tubby in Oakland has been this season as of late, although he was on his way to playing like Tubby.


I guess thats true. Although that's one hell of a straw man argument. :)

Dr. Evil
12-08-2009, 04:07 PM
At least San Francisco is no longer in the hunt for a QB early in the draft now that Alex Smith is having a nice season so far.

StorminNorman
12-08-2009, 05:01 PM
Claussen isnt even the top rated QB at this point. Granted that could change before April, although the fact that ND turned up their noses at a BOWL game wont help him, neither will the fact that he's not a Senior and thus not eligible for any of the All Star Games. At this point, though there's no way you can say the Rams will take him especially given their needs on the defensive line. Unless you mean at the top of Round 2?

And dont discount the Browns going after a QB. Quinn has one nice game against a bad Lions defense. Mangini never wanted him, and niether will whomever their next coach will be. Unless of course it's Charlie Weis ;) Then again, he'd likely take Claussen over Quinn.

The fact ND turned up their noses at a Bowl won't hurt Clausen in the least. Clausen has enough tape and he doesn't have any real question marks (like say a Tebow does), so he doesn't need an All Star game. Clausen is the best QB in this draft and there isn't even a 1b.

The Rams can't afford to go for anything but a QB after passing on Ryan, Flacco, Sanchez and Freeman. Clausen might as well be checking out St. Louis reality.

McShay/Scouts Inc. have Locker and Bradford ahead of him.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/draft

It's not the first time McShay was wrong. McShay also initially had Sanchez ahead of Stafford at this point last year. Putting Bradford ahead of Clausen has to be the most ridiculous considering the guy suffered an injury riddled year (neither hit were all that vicious), AND comes from the spread, AND never had to read the defense before the play.

It's not like Quinn's been playing like Tubby in Oakland has been this season as of late, although he was on his way to playing like Tubby.

Quinn was actually playing worse than Tubby for most of the season simply due to his inability to oust struggling Derrick Anderson as the starting QB. If Mangini is still the coach, he will likely sign Jason Campbell in the Free Agency. If another coach is signed, it could be Quinn or another first/second round draft pick.

Cmill216
12-08-2009, 05:46 PM
It's not like Quinn's been playing like Tubby in Oakland has been this season as of late, although he was on his way to playing like Tubby.

Worst...defense...ever.

StorminNorman
12-08-2009, 05:48 PM
It will be interesting to see if Quinn remains in Cleveland if Weis may end up there as well.

Excel
12-08-2009, 05:50 PM
McShay/Scouts Inc. have Bradford ahead of him.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/draft

:dry:

RAMORE
12-08-2009, 06:14 PM
Seymour is the best comparison in the NFL.



Tebow has the one thing that can't be taught or trained or developed - the IT factor. He can win over a locker room, he can inspire those around him, he loves the game of football.

It may take his three years on the bench, but I believe in Tebow.

I can't believe i'm saying this...I agree with Norman and I believe in Tebow too!

donk70
12-08-2009, 06:17 PM
So who's the top ranked RB coming out this year?

Excel
12-08-2009, 06:22 PM
So who's the top ranked RB coming out this year?

CJ Spiller is the best overall player, Jahvid Best is the best overall runner.

donk70
12-08-2009, 06:22 PM
Also, is it possible for Tebow to end up in Miami? He's look pretty good in the Wildcat

donk70
12-08-2009, 06:23 PM
CJ Spiller is the best overall player, Jahvid Best is the best overall runner.
Is spiller the one who was hurt early on this year?

I really don't follow college that much outside of Ohio State.

Excel
12-08-2009, 06:29 PM
Is spiller the one who was hurt early on this year?

I really don't follow college that much outside of Ohio State.

Nah, dunno which one was hurt. These are them:

Spiller
DJGfoudDm38

Best
1AoE5LF03FQ

Immortalfire
12-08-2009, 06:40 PM
Also, is it possible for Tebow to end up in Miami? He's look pretty good in the Wildcat
Doubtful, they've already got Pat White. I did see that the governor of FL is begging the Jaguars to draft him.

StorminNorman
12-08-2009, 06:44 PM
Also, is it possible for Tebow to end up in Miami? He's look pretty good in the Wildcat

No. They already have two wildcat QB's, plus Ronnie Brown. Miami could consider drafting a pocket QB late in the draft, though.

Jonathon Crompton would be interesting.

donk70
12-08-2009, 06:44 PM
Doubtful, they've already got Pat White. I did see that the governor of FL is begging the Jaguars to draft him.
I bet that makes David Gerrard feel like a hundred bucks

StorminNorman
12-08-2009, 06:46 PM
Garrard should feel fine. Tebow would be a two year project and that fits well with his contract. The guy IS post-30 after all.

StorminNorman
12-08-2009, 09:59 PM
Some that follow the league are apparently starting to believe there is a handshake/nod/wink deal in place by the entire league to ensure Tebow lands in Jacksonville.

The belief is that improving Jacksonville's income through ticket sales is to the benefit of everyone in the league.

Of course such a movie is VERY illegal from a league standpoint and would be in blatant violation to the Player/Owner Collective Bargaining agreement.

donk70
12-08-2009, 11:09 PM
Some that follow the league are apparently starting to believe there is a handshake/nod/wink deal in place by the entire league to ensure Tebow lands in Jacksonville.

The belief is that improving Jacksonville's income through ticket sales is to the benefit of everyone in the league.

Of course such a movie is VERY illegal from a league standpoint and would be in blatant violation to the Player/Owner Collective Bargaining agreement.
Not to mention that it's collusion and against the law in the US no matter what the league rules are.

The Incredible Hulk
12-09-2009, 02:06 PM
Collusion would be pretty hard to prove with an entity like the NFL. Whcih for all intents and purposes operates as one single, self-contained entity. It's not like you have distinct organization colluding to drive down th price of labor or something. You have one entity which basically assigns talent to it's various internal franchises based on a draft system.

However, I think the idea of the NFl trying to arrange to put Tebow in JAX is a bit silly. While it makes economic sense, you'd be hard pressed to get 31 other owners to buy into that. Not to mention, if they knew JAX wanted him they'd all try to exploit the hell out them in trying to get him. Imagine the stick-up job the GM picking in the spot before the jags would do if it was known that they had to have Tebow? Unless he's paid off, he's going to threaten to draft Tebow or trade the pick to someone who will and rob them blind in the process.

Excel
12-09-2009, 02:09 PM
Plus...Garrards been fine.

StorminNorman
12-09-2009, 02:12 PM
Collusion would be pretty hard to prove with an entity like the NFL. Whcih for all intents and purposes operates as one single, self-contained entity. It's not like you have distinct organization colluding to drive down th price of labor or something. You have one entity which basically assigns talent to it's various internal franchises based on a draft system.

However, I think the idea of the NFl trying to arrange to put Tebow in JAX is a bit silly. While it makes economic sense, you'd be hard pressed to get 31 other owners to buy into that. Not to mention, if they knew JAX wanted him they'd all try to exploit the hell out them in trying to get him. Imagine the stick-up job the GM picking in the spot before the jags would do if it was known that they had to have Tebow? Unless he's paid off, he's going to threaten to draft Tebow or trade the pick to someone who will and rob them blind in the process.

The only way it makes sense is if Jacksonville plans to pick Tebow in the first round when no one would even consider picking him that high to begin with.

It's very much a tin-foil hat sort of story, but if it's good enough to make ProFootballTalk, it's good enough for this thread.

Plus...Garrards been fine.

Irrelevant to the Tebow discussion.

Excel
12-09-2009, 02:20 PM
Garrard will be a better option than Tebow for the next 3-4 years, thus making drafting a qb of the future an retarded idea (espec. given he is a huge project and would have to be taken in the 1st roun).

StorminNorman
12-09-2009, 02:36 PM
Garrard will be a better option than Tebow for the next 3-4 years, thus making drafting a qb of the future an retarded idea (espec. given he is a huge project and would have to be taken in the 1st roun).

I think Tebow is likely to go in the 2-3 round area at this point, but it would make sense for the Jaguars to draft him to sit behind Garrard while getting Wildcat snaps.

Excel
12-09-2009, 02:48 PM
I doubt hes there in the 3rd round. I hate him as passing prospect, but someones gonna take him sooner, and I think Jax would be dumb to use a day 1 pick on him.

StorminNorman
12-09-2009, 03:08 PM
Tebow will sell tickets, plus give them a weapon for the offense in the wildcat. I like him in the second for Jacksonville.

VampElvis
12-09-2009, 03:54 PM
Is spiller the one who was hurt early on this year?.

No, that was Jahvid Best at Cal. He had two concussions in two weeks or so early in the season and hasn't played since the second one. At least I think that's what it was, I'm not much for PAC-10 ball so I really don't remember.

Cmill216
12-12-2009, 09:35 PM
Watching some cut-ups of the 2008 Sooners, I didn't realize their offense ran as much under center as they did. They weren't a straight up spread team.

It doesn't necessarily change my opinion of Sam Bradford, but I don't think he's going to have as big of a transition to the NFL as some assume.

FaT_tONle
12-12-2009, 10:52 PM
Panthers are in an ideal spot not having a 1st rounder because someone will undoubtedly fall to them. Or they can trade into the late 1st round to pick up a QB. Bills/Skins will be under a lot of pressure to pick up a QB early and may reach for somebody. Rams should try to trade down if they are looking for a QB. Seattle is in an ideal position to take a QB with Hasselback there a couple more years.

Excel
12-14-2009, 11:49 PM
Clausens gotta be pumped.

StorminNorman
12-15-2009, 05:08 PM
Panthers are in an ideal spot not having a 1st rounder because someone will undoubtedly fall to them. Or they can trade into the late 1st round to pick up a QB. Bills/Skins will be under a lot of pressure to pick up a QB early and may reach for somebody. Rams should try to trade down if they are looking for a QB. Seattle is in an ideal position to take a QB with Hasselback there a couple more years.

Rams won't be able to trade down with how high they are, they have to take Clausen wherever they draft.

The Bills, Skins and Browns will likely be looking for new QB's too. Campbell will go to one of those teams, most likely Cleveland if Mangini is there.

RAMORE
12-16-2009, 01:10 PM
Why does everyone say campbell to cleveland?

RAMORE
12-16-2009, 01:10 PM
I would send to Tebow to the vikings I want him to suceed.

Immortalfire
12-16-2009, 01:19 PM
Please don't make immediate, back-to-back posts. We have a lot of writing room in one response. :)

Excel
12-16-2009, 04:03 PM
Manginis gonna be out in Cleveland. Aside from trading away most of their talent, he was able to find Mohaad Massquaoi.

Immortalfire
12-16-2009, 04:09 PM
Mohammed Massaquoi.

Excel
12-16-2009, 04:10 PM
Whatever. He's played well (a hint at what AJ might provide in a few years...when hes on the Pats :up:)

Immortalfire
12-16-2009, 04:17 PM
Do not whatever me. You will spell former Dawgs' names correctly. :yay:

Excel
12-16-2009, 04:34 PM
This is the only bulldog I know of right now:

kCdL_R7RPUY&feature=related

Immortalfire
12-16-2009, 04:35 PM
Whenever Rennie Curran is picked, you'll be hearing about him too.

Excel
12-16-2009, 04:39 PM
Eh thats true hes a beast.

StorminNorman
12-20-2009, 09:50 PM
Whenever Rennie Curran is picked, you'll be hearing about him too.

Eh thats true hes a beast.

Curran will likely be a steal whenever he decides to go pro. His measurables will likely make him a 4-5 round pick. Love the fact that Ellerbee is looking very good for Baltimore.

One of my favorite draft prospects announced his departure today: Anthony Davis (LT) Rutgers. 6-5 330lbs with very quick feet.

The Incredible Hulk
12-21-2009, 11:02 AM
So with yesterday's results and Cleveland and Tampa's wins, the Lions now move up to the #2 spot in the draft. (have worse strength of schedule than the Bucs)

Ndamukong Suh here we come!

StorminNorman
12-21-2009, 01:40 PM
So with yesterday's results and Cleveland and Tampa's wins, the Lions now move up to the #2 spot in the draft. (have worse strength of schedule than the Bucs)

Ndamukong Suh here we come!

Yesterday was great for the Lion's draft stock, but it will likely be lost when we play Chicago (a game I think Detroit wins). the 49er game is also winnable.

At this point I am rooting for the L's though. The Lions still need to invest 2 picks between round 2 and 4 on a receiver and an offensive lineman.

Mastodon123
12-21-2009, 01:47 PM
The Rams could still take Suh #1 overall. What do you think about Gerald McCoy, Norman?

Excel
12-21-2009, 03:23 PM
Rams will be taking Clausen if their #1.

NewYorkSpider
12-21-2009, 07:38 PM
I don't think they will pass on Suh for a QB. As much as they need a franchise QB, passing on him might me a mistake.

RAMORE
12-22-2009, 03:13 PM
But it's the Rams they like the Bucs have made plenty of mistakes.

By the way if I think of something right after I post I will make a sequential post.

Cmill216
12-22-2009, 04:10 PM
Clausen or Bradford would have to kill during the workout period. I don't think either of them have enough on paper and on tape to justify the #1 pick in the draft.

Excel
12-22-2009, 04:25 PM
Clausen does. Or Ryan Mallet if he comes out. Mallet is going to the blow doors off workouts ala JaMarcus Russel.

The Incredible Hulk
12-22-2009, 05:03 PM
I'm sure that will be comfortng to know for whomever drafts him

Cmill216
12-22-2009, 05:57 PM
You know what's sad? Four of the top five picks last year were held by the Lions, Rams, Chiefs, and Browns.

One year later...and all four are right back in the top five.

Immortalfire
12-22-2009, 05:58 PM
You know what's sad? Four of the top five picks last year were held by the Lions, Rams, Chiefs, and Browns.

One year later...and all four are right back in the top five.

:wow:

rdh007
12-22-2009, 06:28 PM
You know what's sad? Four of the top five picks last year were held by the Lions, Rams, Chiefs, and Browns.

One year later...and all four are right back in the top five.

Living in Lion-land (but being a Viking fan), I can tell you that ownership can be a real obstacle to winning. Though the Fords' problem seems to be the opposite (but almost equal to) Dan Snyder's.

Excel
12-22-2009, 10:52 PM
You know what's sad? Four of the top five picks last year were held by the Lions, Rams, Chiefs, and Browns.

One year later...and all four are right back in the top five.

Dont forget, the Chiefs and Rams were in the top 5 in 2008 too...:dry:

StorminNorman
12-23-2009, 01:20 AM
The Rams could still take Suh #1 overall. What do you think about Gerald McCoy, Norman?

Gerald McCoy is a tremendous prospect, a much more physical tackle who will end up being much bigger than Suh (Suh's frame is almost maxed out at 300lbs while McCoy can easily pack on some more weight). Suh is much more of a pass rusher while McCoy plays low and is a punishing run stuffer.

That being said I don't like him for Detroit because I think Sammie Lee can play that position. What the Lions need is an Undertackle (as opposed to a Nosetackle - this is typically a defensive end in a 3-4). If Suh is not available, I would rather try to make a play for Glenn Dorsey to play that spot and drafting a player like Eric Berry rather than taking McCoy.

McCoy would be a tremendous fit for Tampa.

I don't think they will pass on Suh for a QB. As much as they need a franchise QB, passing on him might me a mistake.

A franchise QB is always more valuable than a franchise DT. If, and that's a huge if, the Rams identify a QB with the "Franchise" tag, (which likely means they value him as a top 5 pick, even if not the top guy on the board) I don't think they can pass him up.

Then again, they could decide to pick up Michael Vick and try their luck in the second round. Also, just throwing this out there, if McNabb chokes in the playoffs, the Eagles may decide to go into youth movement mode. Considering the play of Kevin Kolb, and the fact that their offensive playmakers are extremely young players - McNabb may be a trade-able commodity. This would be a good year to trade a player with a contract like McNabb sense no Salary Cap means no Cap Penalty. McNabb is familiar with the Ram's O-Cord.

Clausen or Bradford would have to kill during the workout period. I don't think either of them have enough on paper and on tape to justify the #1 pick in the draft.

Clausen has the ability to kill in shorts and shirts. Remember, Clausen was considered to be the most talented High School QB since Matt Stafford (:hehe:) coming out - the guy can chuck the ball. He is also familiar with a pro system and comes from a football family.

Also, on paper Clausen's stats this year are pretty great. 3,700 yards, 28 TD's to only 4 INT's. Almost 70% completion rating.

Most of all (and possibly most importantly) there is obvious improvement year-to-year. He went from a 103 QB ration as a Freshman to a 132 to a 160.

Clausen does. Or Ryan Mallet if he comes out. Mallet is going to the blow doors off workouts ala JaMarcus Russel.

There is no way in hell Mallet makes it into the top 10 if he comes out. Mallet has Freeman potential, but the guy has project written all over him. He is a guy that shouldn't see the field next year.

Living in Lion-land (but being a Viking fan), I can tell you that ownership can be a real obstacle to winning. Though the Fords' problem seems to be the opposite (but almost equal to) Dan Snyder's.

The problem with the Lion's ownership is not the Fords, but who they hire. Matt Millen was initially seen as a good hire...it obviously wasn't. Millen himself had that same flaw.

The Lions can win with the Ford's at the helm, and I think they will. Martin Mayhew has been a tremendous GM and I believe in Jim Schwartz.

NewYorkSpider
12-23-2009, 01:54 AM
A franchise QB is always more valuable than a franchise DT. If, and that's a huge if, the Rams identify a QB with the "Franchise" tag, (which likely means they value him as a top 5 pick, even if not the top guy on the board) I don't think they can pass him up.

I think Clausen needs to have a great combine much like Stafford did for the Rams to be satisfied with selecting him #1 overall. Also, with Locker staying put and Bradford having injury problems, they may want to address the position early, but I still like Suh being selected #1 overall. If they slide down in the draft here in the next few weeks and the Bucs or Lions have the first pick, and Suh is off the board, then it's basically a no brainer to select Clausen.

Then again, they could decide to pick up Michael Vick and try their luck in the second round. Also, just throwing this out there, if McNabb chokes in the playoffs, the Eagles may decide to go into youth movement mode. Considering the play of Kevin Kolb, and the fact that their offensive playmakers are extremely young players - McNabb may be a trade-able commodity. This would be a good year to trade a player with a contract like McNabb sense no Salary Cap means no Cap Penalty. McNabb is familiar with the Ram's O-Cord.


Michael Vick wouldn't be a bad option for the Rams. I doubt McNabb would be traded, but you never know. If they want to settle for a QB in the second round, there's a few othere free agent QB's they could look at for the moment. Jason Campbell and Tarvaris Jackson. I don't think either QB here is horrible. Campbell has put up great numbers in the past. I just think the direction the Redskins went in has been his downfall.

Jackson on the other hand has had a year behind Favre. I think if they were going to select out of these two, they would select Campbell.

StorminNorman
12-23-2009, 02:04 AM
I think Clausen needs to have a great combine much like Stafford did for the Rams to be satisfied with selecting him #1 overall. Also, with Locker staying put and Bradford having injury problems, they may want to address the position early, but I still like Suh being selected #1 overall. If they slide down in the draft here in the next few weeks and the Bucs or Lions have the first pick, and Suh is off the board, then it's basically a no brainer to select Clausen.

Stafford didn't work out at the combine, he only spoke to people. Clausen, being the protege of Charlie Weis (and coming from a football family) will have no problem with interviews.

Michael Vick wouldn't be a bad option for the Rams. I doubt McNabb would be traded, but you never know. If they want to settle for a QB in the second round, there's a few othere free agent QB's they could look at for the moment. Jason Campbell and Tarvaris Jackson. I don't think either QB here is horrible. Campbell has put up great numbers in the past. I just think the direction the Redskins went in has been his downfall.

Jackson on the other hand has had a year behind Favre. I think if they were going to select out of these two, they would select Campbell.

I expect Jackson to return to Minnesota, the fact he has seen the field on the punt team, has the number 2 QB position and wasn't traded is very telling. Jason Campbell, IMO, isn't a good fit for St. Louis at all. The Rams need someone to get fans excited...Campbell isn't that man.

Campbell, as I have said before, very well could end up in Cleveland.

Excel
12-23-2009, 09:36 AM
Clausen will interview better than Stafford did. Not that Stafford did poorly by any means, but Clausen comes across obsessed ala Peyton Manning, that was the biggest thing for him out of High School that lead many to call him the greatest qb prospect ever.

Dr. Evil
12-23-2009, 12:47 PM
Anyone think the Raiders take a QB? Or do they think they have something in Gradkowski?

StorminNorman
12-23-2009, 02:24 PM
Clausen will interview better than Stafford did. Not that Stafford did poorly by any means, but Clausen comes across obsessed ala Peyton Manning, that was the biggest thing for him out of High School that lead many to call him the greatest qb prospect ever.

Stafford was able to recall every pass he has thrown since High School.

Anyone think the Raiders take a QB? Or do they think they have something in Gradkowski?

After JaMarcus Russell, I bet they don't look QB until a later round. They could look at a player like Derick Anderson.

Cmill216
12-24-2009, 12:12 AM
http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/category/_/name/09-nfc-draft-rewind

http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/category/_/name/09-afc-draft-rewind

StorminNorman
12-24-2009, 01:14 AM
Detroit passing on Michael Oher is the only flaw in an otherwise brilliant draft for Detroit.

The Incredible Hulk
12-24-2009, 11:02 AM
That being said I don't like him for Detroit because I think Sammie Lee can play that position. What the Lions need is an Undertackle (as opposed to a Nosetackle - this is typically a defensive end in a 3-4). If Suh is not available, I would rather try to make a play for Glenn Dorsey to play that spot and drafting a player like Eric Berry rather than taking McCoy.



I wouldnt be surprised to see the Lions convert Suh to a DE.


The problem with the Lion's ownership is not the Fords, but who they hire.

Then the problem IS with the Fords. If a company hires incompetent workers, the problem isnt with the incompetent workers, it's with the people in management that are hiring them.

I'll also clear up something about the "Fords." There is no "Fords", there is only William Clay Ford, Sr. Billy Ford Jr. has very little, if any, input into the Lions personnel decisions at this point and virtually had to beg his old man to fire Millen. I'll also add that neither of them has any attachment to Ford Motor Company at this point other than being descendants of Henry Ford. There's a common misconception out there that the Lions are run by Ford Motor Co. WC Ford Sr. hasnt worked at Ford Motor CO. since the 1960's and made his business fortune in real estate. Billy Ford Jr. was the CEo of FMC about 10-15 years ago and almost ran it into the ground, but again has never had much input to what the Lions do.


The Lions can win with the Ford's at the helm, and I think they will. Martin Mayhew has been a tremendous GM and I believe in Jim Schwartz.

I'm glad you have faith because I've been waiting almost 35 years to see it.

Detroit passing on Michael Oher is the only flaw in an otherwise brilliant draft for Detroit.

Meh, Oher is a nice player but gets a lot of hype because of that silly movie. I was more upset at them passing on certain quality players in the 3rd round and taking Derrick Williams, the WR out of Penn State.

StorminNorman
12-24-2009, 12:48 PM
I wouldnt be surprised to see the Lions convert Suh to a DE.

Suh is definitely athletic enough to play DE on first and second down and move to DT on pass rushing downs. Though I don't really want to see Detroit go defense with their first two picks (build the offense) if Carlos Dunlap falls, we could have a special draft class. Dunlap and Suh would give us two top 5 talents on that defensive line.


Then the problem IS with the Fords. If a company hires incompetent workers, the problem isnt with the incompetent workers, it's with the people in management that are hiring them.Yes, the Fords have been wrong in their hiring - but that is a mistake easily remedied by eventually hiring someone competent (Martin Mayhew has been fantastic as GM). The idea that the Lions can't win with Ford as owners is simply wrong. Within NFL circles, the Fords are highly respected due to the respect they pay their employees.

I'm glad you have faith because I've been waiting almost 35 years to see it. You will be rewarded, having an elite QB tends to do that ;)

Meh, Oher is a nice player but gets a lot of hype because of that silly movie. I was more upset at them passing on certain quality players in the 3rd round and taking Derrick Williams, the WR out of Penn State.Oher's hype comes all from his amazing play. He has been the most impressive offensive tackle rookie this year (held Jared Allen sackless).

Derrick Williams seems to be the lone bust of a tremendous class - but wide receivers are difficult to transition to the NFL game in year one (making Crabtree's year all the more amazing), so we shall see. Williams, as a talent, was a great value in the third round.

StorminNorman
12-24-2009, 01:05 PM
My favorite defensive player from last years draft?

http://photos-g.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs095.snc3/16260_1231590190611_1254810687_30819071_2795448_n. jpg

Excel
12-24-2009, 11:37 PM
Sebastian Volmer has been the most impressive rookie lineman this season.

More I think about it, more I think Clausen to the Rams just makes too much sense not to happen if hes there. I wont bother including economic reasons, such as the fact a new franchise face is the only way via the draft to generate any buzz in a team that many think might be on the move soon.

1. Time to go offense
Theyve got a head coach who can bring out the talent in the lesser talented, and Chris Long as well. As nice agood dlineman might be, they can likely someone capible of the job in later rounds.

2. QB is the next piece to the puzzle.
They already have a franchise running back, and last year drafted a franchise tackle who has looked good this season. Adding a young stud QB or WR is the next logical choice; considering 2011's class is the greatest wr class ever, it makes more sense to go QB and snag a wr next year. Clausen this years best qb far and away. Brilliant senior season as well as excellent improvement each year; a true field general.

Imagine if they were to snag Jimmy Clausen this season, and obtain AJ Green next year. All the while improving the talented oline with Steven Jackson in the backfield; and Donnie Avery in the mix too. That is a possibly deadly offense as I think Clausens the real deal and I tuink AJ Green could honestly be a top 3 wr as a rookie in that type of situation.

"Clausen to Green" could be an NFL staple for 15 years and a definite way to reinvigorate Rams interest in St. Louis.

StorminNorman
12-25-2009, 06:21 PM
Sebastian Volmer has been the most impressive rookie lineman this season.

Second most.

More I think about it, more I think Clausen to the Rams just makes too much sense not to happen if hes there. I wont bother including economic reasons, such as the fact a new franchise face is the only way via the draft to generate any buzz in a team that many think might be on the move soon.

1. Time to go offense
Theyve got a head coach who can bring out the talent in the lesser talented, and Chris Long as well. As nice agood dlineman might be, they can likely someone capible of the job in later rounds.

You can make the argument, though, that because of Chris Long - going Suh makes a whole lot of sense. If you build strength to weakness, as I believe you have to, you add in Suh to develop with Chris Long and develop a strong defensive line.

2. QB is the next piece to the puzzle.
They already have a franchise running back, and last year drafted a franchise tackle who has looked good this season. Adding a young stud QB or WR is the next logical choice; considering 2011's class is the greatest wr class ever, it makes more sense to go QB and snag a wr next year. Clausen this years best qb far and away. Brilliant senior season as well as excellent improvement each year; a true field general.

Excel, Jason Smith has played all of 8 games this season, started only 5 of those and none of them have been at LT. Plus he has been EXTREMELY slow to recover from a concussion.

There is no way, at all, you can claim he has "looked good" this season.

Imagine if they were to snag Jimmy Clausen this season, and obtain AJ Green next year. All the while improving the talented oline with Steven Jackson in the backfield; and Donnie Avery in the mix too. That is a possibly deadly offense as I think Clausens the real deal and I tuink AJ Green could honestly be a top 3 wr as a rookie in that type of situation.

"Clausen to Green" could be an NFL staple for 15 years and a definite way to reinvigorate Rams interest in St. Louis.

I don't dislike the idea, but I think Mike Vick may be who the Rams target. Especially if they like Keith Null.

Excel
12-25-2009, 07:16 PM
Im aware that Smith has only played RT, but by all accounts hes been excellent. Vick would be very interesting in ST. Louis.

NewYorkSpider
12-25-2009, 08:00 PM
Stafford didn't work out at the combine, he only spoke to people. Clausen, being the protege of Charlie Weis (and coming from a football family) will have no problem with interviews.

I forgot Stafford didn't work out at the combine. And I agree Clausen will have no problem with interviews. I think the Rams would be risking a lot by taking him at #1. The Rams really have no playmakers on the offensive side of the ball besides Steven Jackson. I think that makes their QB play a lot less dangerous. I would think taking someone in the second round makes more sense here. Stafford made sense for the Lions last season because of the big playmakers. Clausen wouldn't really have anyone to throw the ball to. I think a really good defensive player like Suh makes sense for the Rams.

I think Spagnuolo needs to build up this defense first before he makes a big decision at QB, especially if they have the #1 pick.

I expect Jackson to return to Minnesota, the fact he has seen the field on the punt team, has the number 2 QB position and wasn't traded is very telling. Jason Campbell, IMO, isn't a good fit for St. Louis at all. The Rams need someone to get fans excited...Campbell isn't that man.

Campbell, as I have said before, very well could end up in Cleveland.

Campbell could be another option for the Rams if they're not looking at drafting one in the first round. And Vick could be on another team before the Rams have a chance to make an offer. The Rams need to look at WR's too.

StorminNorman
12-25-2009, 08:15 PM
Vick to the Rams makes so much sense right now. The GM knows him from Atlanta, the offensive coordinator is from Philadelphia's system (so Vick is familiar) and I think Vick benefits greatly from playing in a dome.

Everything I hear says the Rams are very interested in the rookie QB they have, though he clearly isn't ready to start next year.

The question then comes who do the Rams take: Suh or McCoy. Suh's name is gigantic right now because he is the more viewer friendly defensive tackle prospect, but many scouts have McCoy ranked even higher than Suh.

NewYorkSpider
12-25-2009, 10:31 PM
I'm not saying Vick would be a horrible option for the Rams. I think the only way he ends up there is if he doesn't have any offers from good teams. There are a few teams that would still look at him. Bills, Redskins, Raiders, Browns and Jacksonville. I love Tebow to Jacksonville at the moment, though. Another reason he could choose the Rams is because they're a dome team. I think he's very comfortable playing in those.

St. Louis IMO just needs to look at defense round 1 and QB round 2. I'm sure there's still going to be a decent QB for them to take.

StorminNorman
12-25-2009, 11:02 PM
It will be interesting to see how the new draft format changes the second round.

For those that don't know, the first round will be televised on Thursday night. The second and third round takes place on either friday or saturday (I am unsure) and that leaves a large amount of time for trades.

Excel
12-26-2009, 12:36 AM
McCoy is could be the next Wilfork...or the next Dorsey. Suh should be an elite play maker wherever he goes.

Vick could be electrifying in the dome if he can still run.

StorminNorman
12-26-2009, 12:56 AM
McCoy is could be the next Wilfork...or the next Dorsey. Suh should be an elite play maker wherever he goes.

Vick could be electrifying in the dome if he can still run.

Comparing McCoy to Dorsey isn't good for either.

Dorsey is a small defensive tackle meant to penetrate, more like Suh (but Suh's not a good comparison). Dorsey's lack of production (which is more of what I think you were alluding to) has everything to do with being atrociously out of place in a 3-4 scheme.

Kansas City should have never gone to a 3-4 scheme after drafting Dorsey. Once they made that first (basic) mistake, they should have traded him ASAP to preserve his trade value.

McCoy doesn't fit a Wilfork comparison either, simply because of size, though that is much more similar to the player he could be.

I am predicting Wilfork will be a Dolphin next year, FWIW. The Dolphins need a NT, Wilfork's from Miami and players love going to in conference rivals after feeling disrespected.

danielisthor
12-27-2009, 01:20 PM
I am predicting Wilfork will be a Dolphin next year, FWIW. The Dolphins need a NT, Wilfork's from Miami and players love going to in conference rivals after feeling disrespected.

As much as we would love to have Wilfork home in Miami, the Trifecta has shown an unwilling desire to pay for top talent, preferring to overpay mediocre talent.

The Incredible Hulk
12-28-2009, 12:35 PM
It will be interesting to see how the new draft format changes the second round.

For those that don't know, the first round will be televised on Thursday night. The second and third round takes place on either friday or saturday (I am unsure) and that leaves a large amount of time for trades.

The 2010 draft (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NFL_Draft) will take place over three days, at Radio City Music Hall (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_City_Music_Hall) in New York City (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City), with the first round on Thursday, April 22, 2010, at 7:30pm US EDT (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_Eastern_Time_Zone). The second and third rounds will take place on Friday, April 23 starting at 6:30 PM EDT, while the final four rounds will be held on Saturday, April 24 commencing at 10 AM EDT.[ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_NFL_Draft#cite_note-0)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_NFL_Draft

StorminNorman
12-28-2009, 05:01 PM
As much as we would love to have Wilfork home in Miami, the Trifecta has shown an unwilling desire to pay for top talent, preferring to overpay mediocre talent.

We shall see.

NewYorkSpider
12-28-2009, 05:22 PM
I don't care for the new draft date. Probably because I work Thursday nights.

The Incredible Hulk
12-28-2009, 06:29 PM
I kind of liked the Saturday at Noon draft start. It was condusive to all day drinking without being worried about working the next day.

Updated Top 5 as of yesterday's results:

1. St. Louis (1-14)
2. Detroit (2-13)
3. Kansas City (3-12)
4. Tampa Bay (3-12)
5. Cleveland (4-11)

StorminNorman
12-28-2009, 06:54 PM
Agreed. Saturday at Noon is the proper placement for the draft. The NFL is being greedy. We are talking about what is essentially a glorified player management meeting that has become the highest rated sporting event in April (going against the first games of the MLB season and NBA playoffs).

Immortalfire
12-28-2009, 06:58 PM
Starting the draft on Thursday is freakin ridonkulous.

Excel
12-29-2009, 09:46 PM
They want ratings, and theyll get em.

StorminNorman
01-03-2010, 05:05 PM
Joe Haden makes it official, will go pro.

Dexter McClester did a lot yesterday to make his draft stock rise. He's Diet Chris Johnson.

StorminNorman
01-04-2010, 02:38 AM
I will be doing a 1st round mock draft after all undergrads declare.

I will be doing a 1st and 2nd round mock the day after the Super Bowl and draft positions are down.

I will then be doing a mock draft every Thursday night there after until the draft.

Over time I will add rounds 3 through 7.

The Incredible Hulk
01-04-2010, 02:15 PM
I'm giddy with anticipation.


(Just make sure you make the Rams take Jimmy Claussen ;) )

StorminNorman
01-04-2010, 03:58 PM
I'm giddy with anticipation.


(Just make sure you make the Rams take Jimmy Claussen ;) )

Right now I have them with Suh :(

Mrs. Sawyer
01-04-2010, 06:34 PM
Honestly, as a Rams fan, I would be so pissed if they waste another draft pick on a defensive end. People make fun of the lions all the time for drafting wide receivers in the first round. The rams have drafted a linemen in the 1st round 9 times in the last 13 seasons. All of them with the exception of Orlando Pace and Grant Winstrom have been laughing stocks.

I've heard it all before about Suh. Big, Strong, dominant. He's a game changer. I heard it about linemen before only to be busts. I'd rather have the rams draft a Claussen or another QB, draft Eric Berry, or trade the pick. If I was a member of the Rams front office, I'd draft Suh only if I was sure that I could trade back into the first round and draft a QB. Most of the good qb's would probably be gone by the second round.

Mastodon123
01-04-2010, 06:37 PM
Lions fans rarely get who they want in the draft. I think Sean Taylor was the popular choice in 2004, and the Redskins ended up drafting him. Its sad that he was murdered, and makes you wonder what could have been.

StorminNorman
01-05-2010, 01:50 AM
Lions fans rarely get who they want in the draft. I think Sean Taylor was the popular choice in 2004, and the Redskins ended up drafting him. Its sad that he was murdered, and makes you wonder what could have been.

We have a new sheriff in town. If the Lions can replicate their 09 draft success in '10, Detroits in good shape.

Bad news 'Fire:
Reshad Jones and Rennie Curran will enter the NFL draft.

Immortalfire
01-05-2010, 09:34 AM
Atlanta needs someone like Reshad..someone with height and long arms who can break up a pass, or intercept.

The Incredible Hulk
01-05-2010, 11:14 AM
when is the deadline for underclassmen to declare? After the Championship Game on Thursday I'm guessing?

StorminNorman
01-05-2010, 03:23 PM
when is the deadline for underclassmen to declare? After the Championship Game on Thursday I'm guessing?

January 15th.

Immortalfire
01-07-2010, 03:35 PM
Word on the street is Jevan Snead is going to declare. Though no one seems to think it's a good idea (except probably Norman)

Guess he knows something we don't.

StorminNorman
01-07-2010, 04:28 PM
It's good financially for Snead considering its a VERY weak QB class and there is the possibility of a rookie salary cap next year.

Now if Snead had gone back to school and had a tremendous year, he could have solidified himself as a top 10 draft pick. Then again, if Snead had gone back and had a mediocre-to-poor year, he possibly could have even done more damage to a his draft stock.

Snead is going to need everything he can get during the post season (combine, Pro Day, interviews, etc.) I think he becomes a favorite for Washington in the second round who is looking for a QB to develop with Shanahan while Campbell plays out 2010.

Mrs. Sawyer
01-07-2010, 04:30 PM
It's official. He's declared himself for the draft. What a stupid move on his part...

Immortalfire
01-07-2010, 04:47 PM
He's going to the draft just because he can. I don't think anyone has breathed a word about him any discussions.

StorminNorman
01-07-2010, 04:55 PM
You don't make one of the most important decisions in your life "just because you can". In football terms, this is likely the biggest decision he will ever make about his future.

He hasn't been talked about a lot because no one assumed he would come out this year. Before the college football season began, he was considered the number 1 QB draft prospect. His year was mediocre and his stock plummeted. His physical tools are still there, however, and it's not as if he was playing for a coach with a good track record of developing QB's. He didn't have the privilege of playing for Mark Richt or Bobby Petrino - he was playing for Houston Nutt. While Nutt is a great coach (a personal favorite of mine), he has never developed an NFL QB and the Offensive Coordinator/QB Coach for the Rebels, Kent Austin, has no NFL experience (his playing and coaching experience previously came exclusively from the CFL).

This isn't an awful move for Snead. It's also not a great one. How wise his decision is comes exclusively from what he does during this post season. If he is one of the first 42 players chosen in this draft, it was the right move.

RAMORE
01-08-2010, 12:40 PM
Anybody think Tebow helped his draft status with his great bowl performance? What about Colt?

StorminNorman
01-08-2010, 01:33 PM
No, because he didn't answer any of the questions about him.

Looking amazing in a college football game wasn't unexpected for Tebow - we have seen him have a similar game time and time again. The Alabama game hurt him more than the Cinci game helped him, mainly because Alabama was more Pro Style than...well...the Bearcats.

Nothing in that game changed concerns about Tebow's release, Tebow being a "system" QB, Tebow's horrible mechanics, Tebow's accuracy. Etc.

Tebow CAN do himself a lot of good by playing in the Senior Bowl. Tebow CAN do himself a lot of harm by playing god awful by playing in the Senior Bowl.

StorminNorman
01-08-2010, 03:40 PM
Demaryius Thomas - WR Georgia Tech

Joe McKnight - RB USC

Will enter the NFL Draft.

Ryan Mallett will not.

Full List of Early Departures:

QUARTERBACKS


Sam Bradford (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/10/25/bradford-to-undergo-surgery-enter-nfl-draft/), Oklahoma
Jimmy Clausen (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/07/clausen-bolting-south-bend-for-nfl/), Notre Dame
Jevan Snead (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/07/snead-declares-for-nfl-draft/), Ole Miss




RUNNING BACKS

Toney Baker (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/05/wolfpacks-baker-opts-for-nfl-over-a-sixth-year/), North Carolina State*
Jahvid Best (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/02/best-call-cal-back-makes-nfl-jump-official/), Cal
Ryan Mathews (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/21/report-nations-top-rusher-leaving-for-nfl/), Fresno State
Joe McKnight (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/08/trojans-mcknight-mcleavin-for-nfl/), Southern Cal



WIDE RECEIVERS


Arrelious Benn (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/16/benn-to-bounce-from-illini-to-nfl/), Illinois
Dezmon Briscoe (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/04/kus-briscoe-makes-nfl-leap-official/), Kansas
Antonio Brown (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/07/chips-wr-goes-all-in-for-nfl/), Central Michigan
Dez Bryant (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/11/05/high-school-coach-dez-to-make-nfl-leap/), Oklahoma State
Golden Tate (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/22/a-conversation-with-golden-tate/), Notre Dame
Demaryius Thomas (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/08/yellow-jackets-wr-joins-nfl-parade/), Georgia Tech
Mike Williams (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/11/22/ex-cuse-wr-to-enter-draft/), Syracuse




TIGHT ENDS


Jermaine Gresham (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/09/29/injured-sooner-to-enter-2010-nfl-draft/), Oklahoma
Aaron Hernandez (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/06/another-gator-bolts-gainesville-for-nfl/), Florida




OFFENSIVE LINE


Bryan Bulaga (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/06/bulaga-opts-to-leave-hawkeyes/), Iowa
Bruce Campbell (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/18/huge-terp-tackle-to-take-on-nfl/), Maryland
Anthony Davis (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/22/rutgers-davis-makes-it-official-bolts-for-nfl/), Rutgers




DEFENSIVE LINE


Thaddeus Gibson (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/05/report-de-gibson-leaving-buckeyes/), Ohio State
Everson Griffen (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/27/everson-griffen-jumping-to-nfl/), Southern Cal
Jerome Hayes (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/06/psus-hayes-eschews-sixth-year-for-nfl/), Penn State*
Abe Koroma, Western Illinois
Gerald McCoy (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/18/sooners-mccoy-makes-it-official-hes-going-pro/), Oklahoma
Jason Pierre-Paul (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/06/no-bull-pierre-paul-leaving-usf/), USF
Brian Price (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/30/bruins-lose-price-to-nfl/), UCLA
Jason Worilds (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/07/hokie-answers-the-nfl-call/), Virginia Tech




LINEBACKERS


Navarro Bowman (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/04/psus-bowman-opts-for-early-entry/), Penn State
Rennie Curran (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/05/one-uga-defender-leaving-another-likely-to-join-him/), Georgia




DEFENSIVE BACKS


Eric Berry (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/01/its-official-berry-heading-to-the-nfl/), Tennessee
Dominique Franks (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/05/sooner-latest-junior-to-skate-to-nfl/), Oklahoma
Joe Haden (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/03/haden-does-the-expected-will-leave-for-nfl/), Florida
Reshad Jones (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/01/05/one-uga-defender-leaving-another-likely-to-join-him/), Georgia
Donovan Warren (http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/20/michigan-corner-bolting-for-the-nfl/), Michigan

The Incredible Hulk
01-10-2010, 01:47 PM
Will the last person out of USC please turn off the lights.

I have a feeling that some crap is gonna come down on that program real soon and that's why you're seeing Carroll, McKnight, Williams, Griffen, etc. all getting the hell out of there

Alex The Great
01-10-2010, 02:06 PM
Will the last person out of USC please turn off the lights.

I have a feeling that some crap is gonna come down on that program real soon and that's why you're seeing Carroll, McKnight, Williams, Griffen, etc. all getting the hell out of there
The University of South California is having trouble?!?!?! :awesome:

RAMORE
01-11-2010, 11:41 AM
No, because he didn't answer any of the questions about him.

Looking amazing in a college football game wasn't unexpected for Tebow - we have seen him have a similar game time and time again. The Alabama game hurt him more than the Cinci game helped him, mainly because Alabama was more Pro Style than...well...the Bearcats.

Nothing in that game changed concerns about Tebow's release, Tebow being a "system" QB, Tebow's horrible mechanics, Tebow's accuracy. Etc.

Tebow CAN do himself a lot of good by playing in the Senior Bowl. Tebow CAN do himself a lot of harm by playing god awful by playing in the Senior Bowl.


He is playing in the senior bowl as qb for the southern team so we'll see. ESPN said 6 coaches and or GM's thought Tebow would go first round also Dungy thought he would go first round and be succesfull at the next level time will tell but I believe.

StorminNorman
01-12-2010, 04:45 PM
He is playing in the senior bowl as qb for the southern team so we'll see. ESPN said 6 coaches and or GM's thought Tebow would go first round also Dungy thought he would go first round and be succesfull at the next level time will tell but I believe.

Those GM's and Coaches don't know anything about the draft this far away from April. Teams are only now preparing their boards.

Cmill216
01-12-2010, 04:50 PM
Going first round and actually being GOOD are two different things. Tim Tebow can be a tremendous NFL talent, but not as an everydown QB.

Excel
01-12-2010, 10:31 PM
Tebow is going to be 110% dependent on the system in which hes placed in.

I will DIE OF ALUGHTER is if Al Davis takes him early hoping hes one of those guys who "just wins".

Dark Donnie
01-13-2010, 12:10 PM
Where's Taylor Mays projected to fall?

StorminNorman
01-13-2010, 12:36 PM
Probably around pick 10-20. He could slip further.

The Incredible Hulk
01-13-2010, 01:01 PM
But I thought Tebow was put on this Earth to do more than score touchdowns? Isn't Pa Tebow supposed to have that talk with him the driveway and then umm...die???

StorminNorman
01-13-2010, 02:44 PM
I know I said I would wait until January 15th to do my first mock, but the last few undergrads pending are not first round talents (not yet at least) so I figured I would do one earlier.

I decided to only do the first 24 picks until the next picks are solidified as the playoffs continue.

1-24 Mock Draft (1/13)

1. St. Louis (1-15) - Ndamukong Suh, DT Nebraska. This pick is a very difficult one to mock so far out because there are so many question marks here. Do the Rams acquire a QB another way? Can the Rams afford to put another defensive lineman on a 1st round salary? Does Spags fall in love with Clausen or Bradford the same way Schwartz, Ryan and Morris fell in love with Stafford, Sanchez and Freeman? I dunno, but the one ? that is not around is the worthyness of Suh for this top pick.

2. Detroit (2-14) - Joe Haden, CB Florida. Yes, Eric Berry is still on the board, but the draft is loaded with safety talent. Yes the Lions need a DT and McCoy is there too - but the Lions need speed and someone who can cover the pass and Haden helps with both. Right now I am projecting, but a 4.4 40 would move him into top 10 consideration and a sub 4.4 would make him a legit top 5. I like the Lions to look hard at trading down at this spot, possibly with Tampa wanting to lock up McCoy (who could easily be a Lions pick here) or a team looking for a QB before Washington picks.

3. Tampa Bay (3-13) - Gerald McCoy, DT Texas. Tremendous defensive line prospect whose only flaw is not having the media hype Suh enjoys. Had he come out last year he likely would have been the first DT off the board and he did nothing to lower his stock. A great fit for Tampa to pair next to former teammate Roy Miller.

4. Washington (4-12) - Jimmy Clausen, QB Notre Dame. Every new coach needs HIS QB and Snyder has made it clear he has no qualms getting rid of Jason Campbell. Clausen seems to be controversial amongst fans, but it's hard to deny his talent. He was a top QB coming out of high school because of his talent and displayed maturity by improving his performance expontentially each year.

5. Kansas City (4-12) - Rolando McClain, LB Alabama. Kansas City converted to a 3-4 before having the proper pieces for it - adding a linebacker like McClain can do wonders. If you want an NFL comparison, look at Patrick Willis with his speed and playmaking ability. Derrick Johnson may have saved his spot with his 2 TD game against Denver, but the Chiefs still have needs at two other LB positions.

6. Seattle (5-11) - Anthony Davis, OT Rutgers. When most people think OT in this draft class, they think Russell Okung - it's time for people to start thinking Anthony Davis. I called Jason Smith the top tackle prospect in last years draft class while everyone was talking about Andre, Davis is very similar. Extremely quick feet and tremendous size.

7. Cleveland (5-11) - Eric Berry, S Tennessee. Eric Mangini is a lucky man.

8. Oakland (5-11) - Carlos Dunlap, DE Florida. Carlos Dunlap is 290 lbs and reportedly runs a 4.6. Hakeem Nicks ran a slower time than that. Al Davis loves speed and freakish athletic ability and doesn't care about character concerns so Dunlap isn't penalized at all for his DUI.

9. Buffalo (6-10) - Russell Okung, OT Oklahoma State. Since trading Jason Peters the Bills have been trying to fill the LT spot. Okung has been on most people's top 5 list for a long while now and while he has slipped from that spot he still remains a very solid LT prospect.

10t. Denver (acquired from Chicago) (7-9) - Dez Bryant, WR Oklahoma State. I am assuming Brendan Marshall is gone at this point so in comes a WR very similar to his style. Bryant is a big, strong WR who will be prepared and mentored by the same group that got Crabtree ready while he was waiting to sign with San Fran.

10t. Jacksonville (7-9) - Tim Tebow, QB Florida. Kidding. Earl Thomas S Texas. Reggie Nelson has seemed to have made few fans in Jacksonville over the last few years, luckily this draft is saturated in safety talent. Tebow should be available in round 2. Thomas is an explosive play maker from the safety spot.

12. Miami (7-9) - C.J. Spiller, RB Clemson. Ronnie Brown is coming off knee surgery and Ricky Williams is going to be 33 - plus Spiller is an absolute beast. He offers tremendous potential in a wildcat and would be a great change of pace back to Williams or Brown. Dan Williams could be an option here if the Dolphins don't get Vince Wilfork. I don't think there is a receiver warranting a pick this high.

13. San Francisco (8-8) - Trent Williams, OT Oklahoma. Offensive line was always an area of need for San Fran, Williams provides help. He played most of his college career at right tackle and had some issues when he transitioned to the left side, but he is worthy of a selection at this point in the draft.

14. Seattle (acquired from Denver) (8-8) - Sam Bradford, QB Oklahoma. Taylor Mays would have been a sexy pick here, but it's hard to pass on a QB when all you have is Matt Hasselback.

15. New York Giants (8-8) - Dan Williams, NT Tennessee. A large, 3-4 style nose tackle to help bolster the New York front. This is a team that, in spite of its record, doesn't have many weaknesses.

16t. Tennessee (8-8) - Jason Pierre-Paul, DE, USF. An extremely talented, raw, defensive end that has a lot of Javon Kearse (circa 1999) in him. Kyle Vandon Bosch is likely gone, and Kearse already is.

16t. San Francisco (acquired from Carolina) (8-8) - Taylor Mays, S. A physical safety with tremendous athleticism but questionable play making instincts.

18. Pittsburgh (9-7) - Terrence Cody, NT Alabama. Casey Hampton is close to being gone and it's time to identify that next 3-4 nose.

19t. Atlanta (9-7) - Derreck Morgan, DE Georgia Tech. Atlanta needs a pass rusher so they grab the local talent.

19t. Houston (9-7) - Jonathon Dwyer, RB Georgia Tech. Houston has a need for a big, power back and Dwyer fits the drill. He has shredded a wide array of strong running teams while being confined to mostly dive plays in GT's triple option. He should be a very nice fit for Houston's zone offense.

21. Cincinnati (10-6) - JermaineE Gresham, TE, Oklahoma. The Bengals have a very nice offense developing (though Palmer needs a new thumb), but they have a very huge, gigantic need at TE. Luckily they can pick up the best one in the draft.

22. New England (10-6) - Golden Tate, WR Notre Dame. The Patriots receiving corp has seemed to become reduced to Randy Moss and Wes Welker (with Edleman playing Welker from time to time), they are in need for another play maker at the position, especially with Randy looking less and less like his 2007 version. In comes Golden Tate from the familiar face of Charlie Weis.

23. Green Bay (11-5) - Bryan Bulaga, OT Iowa. The poor performance of the Green Bay offensive line was well documented, in comes Bulaga from Iowa that can play Guard or Right Tackle and may be able to transition to the Blind Side.

24. Philadelphia (11-5) - Patrick Robinson, CB FSU. Not a particularly strong cornerback draft, but Robinson has the raw talent to be a very good cornerback in this league.

Cmill216
01-13-2010, 03:37 PM
3. Tampa Bay (3-13) - Gerald McCoy, DT Texas.

McCoy went to Oklahoma.

StorminNorman
01-13-2010, 03:59 PM
McCoy went to Oklahoma.

Same team. :o

Cmill216
01-13-2010, 04:13 PM
A good mock, though. I absolutely love Bradford to the Seahawks, which I've been feeling for a while now. He won't be rushed in to start, and he's a perfect fit for what Seattle will likely employ.

Dark Donnie
01-13-2010, 05:15 PM
CB isn't a huge need for The Eagles...S is however :( They need another DE and a DT with size as well. Long offseason.

Excel
01-13-2010, 05:30 PM
There is no way the Pats would go Golden Tate over Sergio Kindle or Jerry Hughes. Pass rush was non existent.

If they go wide receiver in the draft and not free agency, theyll use one of their round 2 picks on a guy Arrellious Benn or Brendan Lafell (whome I hate).

That said, I expect them to get someone via free agency. They wont draft a wr of the future until next season, where perhaps theyll take Golden Tates buddy Michael Floyd.

StorminNorman
01-13-2010, 06:15 PM
There is no way the Pats would go Golden Tate over Sergio Kindle or Jerry Hughes. Pass rush was non existent.

I actually thought I had Sergio Kindle already drafted when I made that mock. :o I had him going to the Browns at 7 when I was first playing with this.

Jerry Hughes is certainly a possibility there. I expect the Patriots to make a strong play for Peppers and they have that OLB from USF coming off of injury for them as well.

Darthphere
01-13-2010, 06:23 PM
12. Miami (7-9) - C.J. Spiller, RB Clemson. Ronnie Brown is coming off knee surgery and Ricky Williams is going to be 33 - plus Spiller is an absolute beast. He offers tremendous potential in a wildcat and would be a great change of pace back to Williams or Brown. Dan Williams could be an option here if the Dolphins don't get Vince Wilfork. I don't think there is a receiver warranting a pick this high.

Eh. I don't love the pick really. I think we can get a decent back later in the draft. Ricky is running pretty good and Ronnie has come back from injury before. I really think the fins need to get younger on defense.

StorminNorman
01-13-2010, 06:38 PM
Eh. I don't love the pick really. I think we can get a decent back later in the draft. Ricky is running pretty good and Ronnie has come back from injury before. I really think the fins need to get younger on defense.

I agree that the Dolphins need to get younger on defense, I just see C.J. Spiller as a real game changer giving the Dolphins a far more potent offensive attack. He would also be best player available. The Dolphins definitely need to add some young defenders, especially at both inside and outside linebacker. I think George Selvie would be a good 3rd round addition to be a 3-4 OLB. Michah Johnson is a good later round ILB talent.

If the Dolphins want to go defense in the first round, I would place Brandon Spikes as the top 3-4 ILB.

The real key is Free Agency. If Vince Wilfork resigns with New England (an event I find unlikely at this point), I would definitely pencil in either Dan Williams or Terrence Cody. In a 3-4, the nose is the most important single position.

Excel
01-13-2010, 09:01 PM
I actually thought I had Sergio Kindle already drafted when I made that mock. :o I had him going to the Browns at 7 when I was first playing with this.

I see...he would be a beast there as well

Jerry Hughes is certainly a possibility there. I expect the Patriots to make a strong play for Peppers and they have that OLB from USF coming off of injury for them as well.

If we get Peppers, which would be amazing, than I could see Golden Tate or possibly Jahvid Best (if CJ Spiller falls, hell be a Patriot period). But if not, theres no way the picks isnt either Kindle or especially Hughes.

Watch for Carlos Dunlap too, should he fall.

I agree that the Dolphins need to get younger on defense, I just see C.J. Spiller as a real game changer giving the Dolphins a far more potent offensive attack. He would also be best player available. The Dolphins definitely need to add some young defenders, especially at both inside and outside linebacker. I think George Selvie would be a good 3rd round addition to be a 3-4 OLB. Michah Johnson is a good later round ILB talent.

Selvie would be a S.T.E.A.L. in the 3rd round. Should Ronnie Brown leave, I could see CJ Spiller being the pick. But in the event he stays that seems very unlikely.

I would love to see them trade up for Dez Bryant myself, or maybe sign T.O. Their receivers are just dreadful.

The real key is Free Agency. If Vince Wilfork resigns with New England (an event I find unlikely at this point), I would definitely pencil in either Dan Williams or Terrence Cody. In a 3-4, the nose is the most important single position.

Wilfork is the Pats most important player on defense, I would be absolutely shocked if they let him go, regardless of how cheap they are. If they let him go, New England as a whole will blow a gasket.

StorminNorman
01-13-2010, 11:32 PM
Wilfork is the Pats most important player on defense, I would be absolutely shocked if they let him go, regardless of how cheap they are. If they let him go, New England as a whole will blow a gasket.

I think the Patriots were definitely ready to let him before their recent implosion. Drafting Ron Brace last year and not working on Wilfork's contract were big tip offs that they were certainly preparing themselves for the idea. After seeing the impact losing veterans had, though, I could see them reconsidering that.

Immortalfire
01-15-2010, 01:53 PM
Toby Gerhart has declared for the draft. Mel?

StorminNorman
01-15-2010, 02:04 PM
Some have him projected as a 1st rounder, but that's all because of media hype. Once the dust clears and a few months separate his fantastic 2009 campaign from his entry into the NFL, he will be a late 2nd-3rd round running back who could possibly be converted to a full back. He should be a good two down back who will likely be subbed out in third down situations for a more explosive receiving back.

vindrow
01-19-2010, 09:10 PM
NFL announces full list of draft early entries

Posted by Michael David Smith on January 19, 2010 11:52 AM ET
The National Football League announced today the full list of 53 players who have been granted special eligibility for the 2010 NFL Draft.

The 53 players granted early eligibility this year match the highest total ever, tying the 53 who were granted early eligibility in 2008. Last year 46 players entered the draft early.

To gain early entry, a player needs to be at least three years out of high school and needs to renounce his remaining college football eligibility.

The full list is right here.


Kevin Basped, DE, Nevada
Arrelious Benn, WR Illinois
Eric Berry, DB Tennessee
Jahvid Best, RB California
Navorro Bowman, LB Penn State
Sam Bradford, QB Oklahoma
Dezmon Briscoe, WR Kansas
Antonio Brown, WR Central Michigan
Dez Bryant, WR Oklahoma State
Bryan Bulaga, T Iowa
Morgan Burnett, DB Georgia Tech
Bruce Campbell, T Maryland
Jimmy Clausen, QB Notre Dame
Rennie Curran, LB Georgia
Anthony Davis, T Rutgers
Carlos Dunlap, DE Florida
Jonathan Dwyer, RB Georgia Tech
Dominique Franks, DB Oklahoma
Clifton Geathers, DE South Carolina
Thaddeus Gibson, DE Ohio State
Jermaine Gresham, TE Oklahoma
Everson Griffen, DE Southern California
Rob Gronkowski, TE Arizona
Joe Haden, DB Florida
Aaron Hernandez, TE Florida
Kareem Jackson, DB Alabama
Chad Jones, DB Louisiana State
Reshad Jones, DB Georgia
Reshad Joseph, DT East Carolina
Darius Marshall, RB Marshall
Ryan Mathews, RB Fresno State
Rolando McClain, LB Alabama
Gerald McCoy, DT Oklahoma
Joe McKnight, RB Southern California
Shawnbrey McNeal, RB Southern Methodist
Carlton Mitchell, WR South Florida
Joshua Moore, DB Kansas State
Derrick Morgan, DE Georgia Tech
Jerell Norton, DB Arkansas
Jason Pierre-Paul, DE South Florida
Maurkice Pouncey, C Florida
Brian Price, DT UCLA
Dennis Rogan, DB Tennessee
Jevan Snead, QB Mississippi
Amari Spievey, DB Iowa
Golden Tate, WR Notre Dame
Demaryius Thomas, WR Georgia Tech
Earl Thomas, DB Texas
Donovan Warren, DB Michigan
Damian Williams, WR Southern California
Mike Williams, WR Syracuse
Jason Worilds, DE Virginia Tech
Major Wright, DB Florida

The Incredible Hulk
01-20-2010, 11:50 AM
A lot of people trying to get into the league before the rookie cap is in place I see.

StorminNorman
01-21-2010, 04:15 AM
Which would make it hilarious if the league caps rookie salary caps before THIS draft. (Which is possible).

RAMORE
01-22-2010, 03:19 PM
Tip Sheet: Tebow impresses Herock


In nine years of preparing draft-eligible players for the interview process at the NFL combine, Ken Herock has worked with more than 500 players, including 40 quarterbacks, readying them for the crucial Q-and-A session that each prospect must undergo at the February audition in Indianapolis.

But never has Herock -- a longtime talent evaluator who spent most of his 40 seasons in the league as a personnel director or general manager -- encountered a product like Florida QB Tim Tebow.

In an unsolicited phone call to ESPN.com earlier this week, Herock, who worked with Tebow for several hours, uncharacteristically gushed about the Gators' star.

"He's by far the best [prospect] with whom I've ever worked," said Herock, who operates "Pro Prep," a popular service that simulates a combine interview and familiarizes players on the subjects with which they will be confronted by league scouts. "He walks into a room and he just energizes it. Whatever 'it' is, he's definitely got 'it.' & Even for a guy like me, who's done this for so long, you almost get goosebumps."

The 2007 Heisman Trophy winner, and one of the most celebrated players in recent college history, Tebow has received decidedly mixed predictions about his NFL future from critics evaluating the 2010 talent pool. Most rate him behind at least two quarterback prospects, Jimmy Clausen of Notre Dame and Oklahoma's Sam Bradford, and some have him rated even with Colt McCoy of Texas. Citing his low delivery and an elongated release, critics contend that Tebow lacks the physical skills that will make him a first-round selection.

Others suggest Tebow must play another position -- fullback, H-back or perhaps linebacker or safety -- in the NFL. It conjures up memories of 2001 Heisman winner Eric Crouch of Nebraska, a college quarterback drafted by the St. Louis Rams in the third round in 2002 as a wide receiver. He failed to make it at that position or at safety.

The four-hour tutorial designed by Herock doesn't necessarily deal with a player's athletic skills. But Herock has long believed that a top-flight quarterback is necessary to win in the NFL, and during his league career, he drafted prominent passers such as Doug Williams, Steve Young, Chris Miller and Brett Favre. He has an estimable track record at the game's most difficult position. This week he took some time out to watch and evaluate Tebow on the practice field.

Tebow is working on his physical skills with former NFL quarterback Zeke Bratkowski. Onetime NFL quarterbacks coach Marc Trestman, currently head coach of the CFL's Montreal Alouettes, has worked some with Tebow at the blackboard on the mental part and X's and O's of the game. After playing in coach Urban Meyer's spread offense, in which the quarterback is almost never directly under center, Tebow has been working on taking the snap more conventionally.

Herock believes Tebow is making solid progress in addressing what are generally perceived as his physical shortcomings, and noted that his intangibles are hard to ignore.

Said Herock: "His release might be a little low at this point, but a lot of people talked about Philip Rivers' delivery too before he was drafted, and look at what he's done. I've heard all the supposed [negatives]. But I watched [Tebow] on the field and his velocity is good enough, and so is his accuracy. As far as his learning, you don't have to tell him anything twice. And he's a student of the game. I recommended that he watch some tapes of Steve Young, and he said, 'Oh, I've already done that.' He wants to be good. He wants to succeed. And he will succeed."

In some ways, Herock said, Tebow reminds him of Favre, whom he took in the second round of the 1991 draft in Atlanta. The Florida star probably doesn't have Favre's brashness, noted Herock, but his presence is beyond charismatic.

"I've seen him on TV and heard all the stuff about him, and you think to yourself, 'It's too good to be all be true,'" Herock said. "But there is nothing phony about him at all. He's about as genuine as you can get. If there was one word I would use to describe him, it would be 'winner.'

"People will have to convince me he's not a quarterback and that he won't succeed."


Alternative pursuits

His critics aside, Tim Tebow will probably play quarterback in the NFL. There are, however, some franchises that might try the University of Florida star at a different position. Here are some former college quarterbacks who switched positions in the NFL in recent seasons and experienced mixed results:

Josh Cribbs (undrafted, Cleveland, 2005): The former Kent State quarterback is arguably the most electrifying kick returner in the league. The five-year veteran has returned eight kickoffs and one punt for touchdowns, and led the NFL this year for players with more than 40 kickoff returns, posting a 27.5-yard average.


Julian Edelman (seventh round, New England, 2009): Some felt the Patriots chose Edelman, a three-year starter at Kent State, to operate a Wildcat offense. But he developed into a solid slot receiver and punt returner. Edelman had 37 catches for 359 yards in the regular season, then replaced an injured Wes Welker in the playoffs. He had six catches for 44 yards and two touchdowns in the Patriots' wild-card loss.


Matt Jones (first round, Jacksonville, 2005): He was nicknamed "The Freak" after he was timed at 4.37 seconds in the 40-yard dash before the 2005 draft. In his four seasons with the Jaguars, the former Arkansas quarterback played in 54 games, with 15 starts. He had 166 receptions for 2,153 yards and 15 touchdowns, and led the team with 65 catches in 2008. He was released by the Jags this past March after he was arrested twice in eight months for drug- or alcohol-related charges. Currently out of the league.


Brad Smith (fourth round, New York Jets, 2006): He has become the team's jack-of-many-trades. Smith has played in 60 games and has 60 catches for 513 yards and two touchdowns, and also has 24 kickoff returns for a 22.3-yard average and one score. He has operated the Wildcat, rushing 60 times for 468 yards. He was a four-year starter at Missouri.


Isaiah Stanback (fourth round, Dallas, 2007): He started 19 games at the University of Washington in 2005-06. He was waived by Dallas this past September, signed to the New England practice squad and then elevated in November to the active roster. He has only five receptions for 46 yards in his career, and has returned 13 kickoffs for a 22.8-yard average.

Len Pasquarelli, a recipient of the Pro Football Hall of Fame's McCann Award for distinguished reporting, is a senior writer for ESPN.com.

chesslover
01-24-2010, 10:52 PM
I hope Tebow does well

danielisthor
01-24-2010, 11:14 PM
I hope Tebow does well

I hope he fails like every other Gator QB.

That-Guy
01-25-2010, 01:51 PM
LOL, talk about opposite opinions.

I'm interested to see how he does at the Senior Bowl.

The Incredible Hulk
01-25-2010, 02:42 PM
Jim Schwartz and the Lions staff are coaching one of the Senior Bowl teams, I believe it may be the North. I think Sparano is coaching the South. I hope he puts Tebow in the Wildcat.

That-Guy
01-25-2010, 03:05 PM
Would be interesting to see. Miami seems like an ideal spot for Tebow, after all. And they're in need of a franchise QB. I don't think Chad Henne is true starter material and I think Pat White might still be in a coma after that Pittsburgh game.

Excel
01-25-2010, 03:51 PM
QB is the last thing Miami needs.

More I think about it, more I think Suh falls to Detroit. St. Louis will go QB.

StorminNorman
01-25-2010, 03:57 PM
Jim Schwartz and the Lions staff are coaching one of the Senior Bowl teams, I believe it may be the North. I think Sparano is coaching the South. I hope he puts Tebow in the Wildcat.

There is no reason at all for Sparano to put Tebow in the Wildcat. It would be a grave disservice to Tim Tebow. There is four years of tape with Tebow in the Wildcat, there is no tape of Tebow playing Pro QB.

Would be interesting to see. Miami seems like an ideal spot for Tebow, after all. And they're in need of a franchise QB. I don't think Chad Henne is true starter material and I think Pat White might still be in a coma after that Pittsburgh game.

Chad Henne, regardless of what you may think, is their franchise QB. As long as they believe that, QB won't be an option. Especially after spending three consecutive 2nd round picks on a QB.

QB is the last thing Miami needs.

More I think about it, more I think Suh falls to Detroit. St. Louis will go QB.

It all depends on the QB performances. I don't think St. Louis can afford to draft a QB they don't love.

Matt
01-25-2010, 04:14 PM
The Cardinals, regardless of Warner's decision need to franchise tag, then trade Boldin and a 2nd or 3rd round pick to the Chiefs and use their pick to get McCoy.

StorminNorman
01-25-2010, 04:25 PM
I believe Boldin is under contract next year, so there is no need to franchise Boldin. Which McCoy should they target? Gerald McCoy would be a good addition to any team, Colt McCoy is a prospect that could be had easily with Arizona's current 1st round pick and possibly even their second rounder.

The Incredible Hulk
01-25-2010, 04:32 PM
There is no reason at all for Sparano to put Tebow in the Wildcat. It would be a grave disservice to Tim Tebow. There is four years of tape with Tebow in the Wildcat, there is no tape of Tebow playing Pro QB.


Although I do see your point about Tebow wanting to showcase his "pro" skills, I will say there's a big difference between the spread option and the Wildcat and wouldnt be surprised to see a play or two with him flanked out wide. .

That-Guy
01-25-2010, 04:37 PM
Chad Henne, regardless of what you may think, is their franchise QB. As long as they believe that, QB won't be an option. Especially after spending three consecutive 2nd round picks on a QB.


Do they really think that? I thought he was just their backup and would have remained so if Pennington hadn't gone down. I thought they were planning to go with Pat White once Pennington decided to hang it up; but of course things worked out differently.

I might be totally off-base on that though; I don't follow Miami.

Cmill216
01-25-2010, 06:19 PM
...

According to NFL Network's Lindsay Soto, Florida QB Tim Tebow botched several snaps on his first day of Senior Bowl practice.

Unfortunately, along with being one of the generation's most decorated college football players comes the microscope at the next level. Tebow played primarily out of the shotgun formation at Florida, and clearly isn't used to taking snaps from under center. Soto added that Tebow's tendency to lower the football below his hips before delivering it also isn't going away. Other reports have Tebow struggling badly with accuracy.

Excel
01-25-2010, 06:23 PM
Can be fixed.

Mayock is saying Suh and McCoy are worlds better than everyone else.

StorminNorman
01-25-2010, 07:58 PM
Although I do see your point about Tebow wanting to showcase his "pro" skills, I will say there's a big difference between the spread option and the Wildcat and wouldnt be surprised to see a play or two with him flanked out wide. .

There's not. His spread option was a wildcat formation. The first defensive read was Tebow running (why the jump pass was so effective). It was a wildcat formation used as a base offense (thus more passing).

Do they really think that? I thought he was just their backup and would have remained so if Pennington hadn't gone down. I thought they were planning to go with Pat White once Pennington decided to hang it up; but of course things worked out differently.

I might be totally off-base on that though; I don't follow Miami.

No, Henne was already groomed to be the starting QB and was expected to take over the reigns this year anyway.

Pat White wasn't drafted to be a starting QB.

Cmill216
01-25-2010, 08:07 PM
The Dolphins need a legit #1 WR more than just about any team in the league.

Excel
01-25-2010, 08:56 PM
Dez FTW

Mrs. Sawyer
01-26-2010, 08:15 AM
The Dolphins need a legit #1 WR more than just about any team in the league.

Not more than the rams. The rams need a whole new passing game!

kane9321
01-26-2010, 10:38 AM
16t. San Francisco- cj spiller...that would be sooo nice

Darthphere
01-26-2010, 10:58 AM
The Dolphins need a legit #1 WR more than just about any team in the league.

God yes.