Wonder Woman Thread Reborn! - Part 6

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[Project862006]

is she any good tho just being on mad men does'nt mean you are good look at January Jones for example lol

she was known as the topless girl in the tub with Craig Robinson in hot tub time machine

she does have a great look

and her height is perfect at 5'9

dont know if she is any good of an actress

[flickchick85]

is she any good tho just being on mad men does'nt mean you are good look at January Jones for example lol

she was known as the topless girl in the tub with Craig Robinson in hot tub time machine

she does have a great look

and her height is perfect at 5'9

dont know if she is any good of an actress
She didn't get much to do last season, but just based on the premiere it seems she's gonna get a chance to show what she's capable of this season. Her character looks to be going to some interesting places, so we'll just have to wait and see how well she handles that.

[Lobo]

She's a pretty good actress from what I have seen of her in the past. And, she most certainly has the body for it

[batlovescatDC]

My dream cast has changed a little bit over the last couple years as I've been exposed to new films and actors. Thought I'd share it and see what everyone's thoughts on it would be.


Diana... Gina Carano (Haywire)

Ares... Viggo Mortensen

Circe... Angelina Jolie (she's never gotten to play a villainess yet, but I think she'd be ****in' awesome as an evil sorceress)

Steve Trevor... Bradley Cooper


Hippolyta... Demi Moore

Hades... Jason Isaacs

Veronica Cale... Kelly Carlson (Kimber on Nip/Tuck)

Artemis... Tricia Helfer (I really think that Artemis and Phillipus should be around the same age as the actress that plays Hippolyta. It would give more to the story that the head women on Themyscira still view Diana as a child if they have more age and experience than her.)

Phillipus... Merrin Dungey (Francie Calfo on Alias)

Etta Candy... Melissa McCarthy (I don't think her part should be huge in the first film. But she'd be great for the best friend/comic relief.)

Hera... Michelle Pfeiffer (I think it's important that the part of Hera be played by a famous actress of high caliber talent seeing how important the role of Hera is to the Amazons. I also think it'd be really cool if Hera was the narrator of the story.)

Phobos... Tom Felton (Malfoy in HP. He'd have to bulk up a bit but I think he'd be great to play the son of Ares.)

Eris... Amy Acker (Buffy, Alias)

Deimos... Tyler Mane (I know he played Sabretooth in X-Men but he isn't so recognizable as that character that people would relate him to it.)

[jaymes_e06]

Agelina Jolie's not played a villianess? Someone needs to look at her creditials again: Original Sin, Beowulf, Alexander, and in Sin City 2 she'll be a femme Fatale if I remember correctly so yeah. Other than that your cast list looks fine except for Gina who I just cant see as Diana.

I like your Hippolyta casting a lot.

[Isub_Zero]

She's a pretty good actress from what I have seen of her in the past. And, she most certainly has the body for it

I'm not sure the costume can handle Jessica's Breasts. ;)

[jmc]

Jessica's definitely not short in the breast department.

[ЯɘvlveR]

gina's my preferred choice, but if its j-law that gets the role, I'd like to see lynda carter as Hippolyta.

[batlovescatDC]

Agelina Jolie's not played a villianess? Someone needs to look at her creditials again: Original Sin, Beowulf, Alexander, and in Sin City 2 she'll be a femme Fatale if I remember correctly so yeah. Other than that your cast list looks fine except for Gina who I just cant see as Diana.

I like your Hippolyta casting a lot.


Original Sin she was a femme fatale, who was very torn about her emotions. Beowulf we didn't get to actually see her in the role, it was her in complete CGI. Alexander she just played a character that was dark and crazy, but at the same time loved her son. And Sin City 2 hasn't happpened yet, and like you said she's going to be a Femme Fatale.

What I mean is that she hasn't gotten to play an outright evil villainess. She's come close, but not quite gotten there yet. Just didn't want to put too much into my casting thoughts of her because I knew my post was already going to be somewhat long.d

[Project862006]

^she is playing the evil villain Maleficent in the upcoming sleeping beauty movie

[jaymes_e06]

Original Sin she was a femme fatale, who was very torn about her emotions. Beowulf we didn't get to actually see her in the role, it was her in complete CGI. Alexander she just played a character that was dark and crazy, but at the same time loved her son. And Sin City 2 hasn't happpened yet, and like you said she's going to be a Femme Fatale.

What I mean is that she hasn't gotten to play an outright evil villainess. She's come close, but not quite gotten there yet. Just didn't want to put too much into my casting thoughts of her because I knew my post was already going to be somewhat long.d
Some of your reasoning seems flawed. Most villians have motivation it doesn't make them less a villian. And like the poster above said she will be the villian in Sleeping Beauty. I think in that role she will be the "outright evil" too and why does it matter if it has already come out or not as long as it's happening?

[Project862006]

Jolie around tomb raider back in 01 would of been an amazing WW too bad her physique does'nt look like this anymore

she was 5'8
Big Name Actress
26 back then
beautiful body
already won an Oscar
and has that exotic look
http://www.thefancarpet.com/uploaded_assets/images/gallery/931/Lara_Croft_Tomb_Raider_The_Cradle_of_Life_11134_Me dium.jpg

[Dark Raven]

is she any good tho just being on mad men does'nt mean you are good look at January Jones for example lol

she was known as the topless girl in the tub with Craig Robinson in hot tub time machine

she does have a great look

and her height is perfect at 5'9

dont know if she is any good of an actress

Who are we talking about? :huh:

[Project862006]

^ Jessica Paré

[NigelHalsey]

Janet Montgomery. Okay, maybe not. But I do like her look.

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5104/5599644129_3290ab18f5_z.jpg
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5106/5605051345_be9fd4be5a.jpg
http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4107/5605059331_1a1e5e470e.jpg
https://p.twimg.com/ApV07WSCMAA8Gq3.jpg:large

[Sawyer]

I don't give a flying **** how old she is. Lucy Lawless. :o:up:

[Rockstar]

Janet Montgomery. Okay, maybe not. But I do like her look.

She would have been perfect for Lois Lane.

http://www2.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Janet+Montgomery+2011+WonderCon+Day+3+ANSsmDAH_J2l .jpg

[batlovescatDC]

^she is playing the evil villain Maleficent in the upcoming sleeping beauty movie


I know. I'm very excited about that. But I really wish that they would've had a WW film in development and had beaten them to the chase to get as evil, dark sorceress. Oh well.

[Hamill-Joker]

There is something about Jessica Pare's look that I am not a fan of. At times she can just look goofy.

My personal view of Wonder Woman's look is someone like Angie Harmon, Alana de la Garza, or Gina Carano.

[Project862006]

just sad WW has taken so long because 3 solid actresses were aged out because of it

Monica Belucci
Marion Collitard
Angelina Jolie

all 3 would of been amazing now it is hard to find a WW lol

[jmc]

There is something about Jessica Pare's look that I am not a fan of. At times she can just look goofy.

My personal view of Wonder Woman's look is someone like Angie Harmon, Alana de la Garza, or Gina Carano.

Liv Tyler + Anne Hathaway = Jessica Pare

[Project862006]

still don't get what is taking this film so long to get off the ground

Greek mythology movies have been in for awhile and recently female leaded films have been popular :

The Help
Girl With The Dragon Tattoo
Bridesmaids
The Hunger Games

[Rockstar]

It's because there's absolutely no need for Warner Bros to do this film.


It's a dead project now.

[Hamill-Joker]

Another reason why I like women who look like Harmon, Garza, and Carano is that they can have this determination in their face and eyes.

While Liv can pull it off, I don't see Pare or Hathaway as someone who can legitimately pull off the look that says to someone "I'm not going to take any of your crap", a look that can tell a man to definitely not mess with this woman.

I've been watching a lot of Law & Order lately and you can really see that defined in Angie Harmon.

While Harmon is too old to take the role, it makes me think Wonder Woman should have a harder look to her rather than a softer look. I don't see Pare as someone who can look very intimidating.

When I look at this: http://images.wikia.com/dcanimated/images/f/f5/Wonder_Woman.png

I see this: http://images.wikia.com/lawandorder/images/8/84/Carmichael_True_North.jpg

and this: http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/9534/abbielo1280x1024.jpg

[Project862006]

It's because there's absolutely no need for Warner Bros to do this film.


It's a dead project now.

no need to give the most popular and iconic female super hero a movie?

[Batman4ever]

That's right she's more of a support character. She'd be good in a JL movie.

[Brian Braddock]

http://images.wikia.com/lawandorder/images/8/84/Carmichael_True_North.jpg



Wow, if Reeve's Superman and Sarah Douglas' Ursa ever had a child, that's what she would have looked like. :wow:

[TheComicbookKid]

still don't get what is taking this film so long to get off the ground

Greek mythology movies have been in for awhile and recently female leaded films have been popular :

The Help
Girl With The Dragon Tattoo
Bridesmaids
The Hunger Games

Book
Book
Comedy
Book

[jaymes_e06]

Girl With The Dragon Tattoo was not a book. Am I missing somthing?:huh:

[KRIM]

Apparently the book.

[jaymes_e06]

Opps. Yep u right u right.

[Project862006]

Book
Book
Comedy
Book
and lol do comics not count as books now and WW is more popular and iconic than any of those i mentioned

[Rockstar]

no need to give the most popular and iconic female super hero a movie?

Yup.

No need.


Especially when they have Batman and Superman franchises, under Nolan, as better investments.

Wonder Woman is one of the lowest priorities. All this talk about a WW movie is really dated. The project hasn't gotten any legitimate movement in years.

[HighFivingMF]

Book
Book
Comedy
Book

Wonder Woman is also a book and a TV show and a highly recognized brand and an iconic symbol.

[batlovescatDC]

I still don't know why it's so hard to come up with a decent WW script. All u have to do is stick with the source material. It's all right there. Greek mythology films have been so succesful here lately. 300, Immortals, Clash of the Titans. And there have been so many succesful action franchises with female leads in the last decade. Resident Evil, Underworld, Tomb Raider.

It's just ridiculous. Why is WB/DC so afraid to take a risk? Just go on and do it already!


But sadly, like I said in the other thread... I think it's going to come down to them doing a Justice League film and then giving WW, Flash, and GL their own spinoffs. And that's only if JL is successful.

[TheComicbookKid]

and lol do comics not count as books now and WW is more popular and iconic than any of those i mentioned


Comics are books, but not the same as those.

There aren't reboots of The Help or Dragon Tattoo coming to bookstores in five years.


WW has more in common with freakin TinTin than any of those movies.

[Rockstar]

But sadly, like I said in the other thread... I think it's going to come down to them doing a Justice League film and then giving WW, Flash, and GL their own spinoffs. And that's only if JL is successful.

I don't even think we'll get Justice League honestly.

You can't do JL without Batman and Superman.


AND Batman and Superman are locked into their own seperate universes thanks to Chris Nolan.

[HighFivingMF]

AND Batman and Superman are locked into their own seperate universes thanks to Chris Nolan.

And WB not wanting to make a shared universe.

[Rockstar]

They did want to make a shared universe with Green Lantern, it just failed.


Nolan is against the shared universe. He's also against more than one version of Batman (or Superman) on film in the same period.

This was the REAL reason why Justice League:Mortal was scrapped and Armie Hammer didn't get to play Batman during the era of Christian Bale.

They knew they had a better investment with Nolan and TDK.

[jaymes_e06]

It's an easy fix really just recast the roles for the JLA movies but allow the SM BM movies to live on in there own contained universes.

[HighFivingMF]

They did want to make a shared universe with Green Lantern, it just failed.

This was the REAL reason why Justice League:Mortal was scrapped and Armie Hammer didn't get to play Batman during the era of Christian Bale.

Prove it.

[Majik1387]

The negative backlash against the cast and story for JL:M and the financial failure of Green Lantern is proof enough.

And Nolan is not against a shared universe per se; it's just he didn't care to adhere to its possible limitations for TDKR.

[Rockstar]

Prove it.

Prove that Nolan is against more than one version of Batman on screen during the same time?

It was reported by one of the trades back in 2007 when the JL:M forum was up on SHH. I think it was Hollywoodreporter.

Jaime and Showtime would probably remember. Nolan was upset that the studio was doing another version of Batman while his Batman was onscreen, so the studio cancelled JL:M.


The Australian "tax breaks" excuse was really nothing. They could have found a different filming location if need be. The project was scrapped because the studio realized it was a bad idea, and Nolan's Batman was the better bet.

[Project862006]

Comics are books, but not the same as those.

There aren't reboots of The Help or Dragon Tattoo coming to bookstores in five years.


WW has more in common with freakin TinTin than any of those movies.
not really i bet anyone on the street knows who wonder woman is but i bet you know one has even heard of the help ,hunger games,or girl with the dragon tattoo before their respective movies and even then then some still may not even heard of them

[Majik1387]

Nah, Hunger Games is pretty popular among the young adult novel crowd, and The Girl With A Dragon Tattoo had its following as well both before the movies.

[TheComicbookKid]

not really i bet anyone on the street knows who wonder woman is but i bet you know one has even heard of the help ,hunger games,or girl with the dragon tattoo before their respective movies and even then then some still may not even heard of them

What are you talking about? Did I mention anything about name recognition.

The fact that those books are popular with millions of people now is the point. Hollywood isn't rushing to adapt the Mountains of Madness or any other 50 year old book for a franchise is what I'm getting at.

People keep trying to pull any kind of connection(female led....Greek mythology movie...comics) when in reality it's just in a unique position.

You'd have an easier time getting a Red Sonja movie made.

[solidsnake86]

Yup.

No need.


Especially when they have Batman and Superman franchises, under Nolan, as better investments.

Wonder Woman is one of the lowest priorities. All this talk about a WW movie is really dated. The project hasn't gotten any legitimate movement in years.

Wonder Woman is a good investment if they can put together a good movie, in fact she would be more worth it than the flash.

[Red Mask]

Apparently the book.

A very good book too.:woot:

[batdude]

Well, Hunger Games and Dragon Tattoo certainly could help the situation. What we really need is a big name director like Nolan or even Whedon coming back interested in making it. I would say big star, but I don't know if there is an appropriate one with enogh clout.

[jaymes_e06]

Well, Hunger Games and Dragon Tattoo certainly could help the situation. What we really need is a big name director like Nolan or even Whedon coming back interested in making it. I would say big star, but I don't know if there is an appropriate one with enogh clout.
Don't mention Whedon around here. Poeple will get their knickers in a twist.

[LibidoLoca]

What was his vision for WW, again? I remember someone linked it on here and most weren't thrilled with his ideas.

[Young Superman]

If she was taller, Hayley Atwell would make a good Wonder Woman, Unfortunately Hayley is only 5' 6½".

[batdude]

What was his vision for WW, again? I remember someone linked it on here and most weren't thrilled with his ideas. He was going to use a new villian, not Cheetah or Ares. Which was kind of ironic,because when it was first announced, I kept pictureing Eliza Dushku as the brunette Cheetah that Perez did. Avengers is probably the better fit for him, but I still say we need a big name.

[LibidoLoca]

If she was taller, Hayley Atwell would make a good Wonder Woman, Unfortunately Hayley is only 5' 6½".
Ah yes, but she has the chest of a Greek goddess. :o

[metaphysician]

Eh, when you say "just go to the source material", the problem with Wonder Woman especially becomes "which source material." Moulston? Linda Carter? Perez?

The downside of being such an old and iconic character is that Wonder Woman has 70 years of accumulated eras and interpretations. . . and unlike Superman or Batman, has never had the resulting hodge podge of mythos properly distilled. Hell, she doesn't even really have a singular definitive author ( yes, sadly, I include Perez ).

IMO, until a writer comes along who is capable of reworking Wonder Woman into a single coherent interpretation, with the various historical aspects either properly assembled into a workable whole, or cast to the side? A movie adaptation will be very, very difficult. Granted, the producer/director of such a movie could well be the one to *do* that, and if they succeeded at making a hit movie, their interpretation probably would stick. Its just an additional layer of burden.

[HighFivingMF]

Eh, when you say "just go to the source material", the problem with Wonder Woman especially becomes "which source material." Moulston? Linda Carter? Perez?

Yes.

[Blackman]

I think when making Wonder Woman that they should look toward the animated movie/Gods and Mortals. I said this a bunch of times. I think that that version of WW is the best Ive seen (I havent read many WW comics). The story was really cool too

and I think that a (heavily) modified version of War of the Gods could work for a sequel

[TheComicbookKid]

Honestly, a lot of that "which version" do you use is kind of a false argument.

Early comics didn't spend six issues on origin stories.If you don't use WWII then Marston's version is kind out.

The next 40 years aren't anything to write home about. A bunch of cool bits and pieces. Lynda's WW spin. Maybe you have a nod to the Mod era with her wearing a white jumpsuit or Hippolyta being blonde.

Perez' version is the most like a movie and has the depth to pull from. The problem is that Perez' version is written like Clash of the Titans from the 80s where you have the Gods making longform speeches in togas and manipulating events with the hero. Doing a better version of it without turning into the terrible 2010 Clash is the problem.

[metaphysician]

Which is why I'd largely do just that, and follow Perez as the definitive version. And then, I'd get yelled at by the fans who are wondering where the invisible jet is, and why she doesn't act like Linda Carter.

Downside to being iconic is that, when people recognize a character, they can potentially be offended by it being adapted "wrong."

[terry78]

They're just gonna have to take bits and pieces from various stories and versions and splice that **** together. Take some from Perez, some from Gail Simone, some from the old tv show, some from the new animated movie, etc.

[KRIM]

Downside to being iconic is that, when people recognize a character, they can potentially be offended by it being adapted "wrong."
Batman has been reinvented so many times to great success that it's proof that as long as it's done well, people will generally welcome it.

[Hamill-Joker]

As long as an interpretation is done well and maintains the basics of the character, I think people will be fine with it.

[DrCosmic]

They're just gonna have to take bits and pieces from various stories and versions and splice that **** together. Take some from Perez, some from Gail Simone, some from the old tv show, some from the new animated movie, etc.

Exactly. Take what makes people like each of those versions and fuse them together brilliantly.

I think it'd be interesting to take the Twilight/Hunger Games approach to Diana and have her be young and caught in a love triangle. I know most fans wouldn't enjoy that, but it certainly would be marketable.

[DoomsdayApex]

Love Triangle? Wonder Woman? What the...?

http://www.thehomeplanet.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Dean-nonono-GIF.gif

[Project862006]

they did it in xmen
superman returns

probably would of done it in thor if sif has more screen time

WW is not off limits lol

[DoomsdayApex]

Undeniably, but that's why I don't want a love triangle for Wonder Woman. It's been done so many times before.

Diana, as an immortal warrior-goddess, doesn't need to be apart a love triangle, only orgies. :p

[Project862006]

lol true hell they even did it in TDK

[DoomsdayApex]

lol true hell they even did it in TDK

Don't remind me. Love Triangles suck! :cmad:

[jmc]

Honestly, a lot of that "which version" do you use is kind of a false argument.

Early comics didn't spend six issues on origin stories.If you don't use WWII then Marston's version is kind out.

The next 40 years aren't anything to write home about. A bunch of cool bits and pieces. Lynda's WW spin. Maybe you have a nod to the Mod era with her wearing a white jumpsuit or Hippolyta being blonde.

Perez' version is the most like a movie and has the depth to pull from. The problem is that Perez' version is written like Clash of the Titans from the 80s where you have the Gods making longform speeches in togas and manipulating events with the hero. Doing a better version of it without turning into the terrible 2010 Clash is the problem.

I think the very basic foundations of that story are workable, Diana coming to our world and preventing WW3. Biggest issue is as you say the 80's, it's back drop is the cold war and there really isn't an equivalent nowadays. It's weird but things are a lot more stable now even if the whole 'war on terror' thing persists.

[LibidoLoca]

Don't remind me. Love Triangles suck! :cmad:
That's why I prefer Love Rhombuses. :oldrazz:

[Dark Raven]

Diana could be in a love triangle with Steve Trevor and one of the Amazons from Thermyscira. Since Thermyscira is entirely populated by women, Diana could have found love among the Amazons. Steve Trevor's arrival could disrupt that and Diana's gf could become jealous and find this outsider most unwelcome.

WW did used to keep saying "Suffering Sappho" before as her catchphrase.

[DrCosmic]

Wow. That's actually a crazy awesome idea, Dark Raven, and incredibly contemporary. You couldn't have them be proper gfs, if you're doing a love triangle right, but that's a really good starting point, because the other member of the triangle would need to be from Diana's world. I was thinking reworking Hermes or something, but that's just frikkin brilliant. Making it Artemis her trainer or something could be genius, and very interesting.

We all know her creator, Marston was super-kinky, but what does Suffering Sappho mean again?

I think the very basic foundations of that story are workable, Diana coming to our world and preventing WW3. Biggest issue is as you say the 80's, it's back drop is the cold war and there really isn't an equivalent nowadays. It's weird but things are a lot more stable now even if the whole 'war on terror' thing persists.

Stable for us. I think a truly good WW film will have to face that America is the bully on some level, being manipulated by Ares. The cartoon did it without being anti-America, I think a live action film could do the same. Because when America gets rolling, obviously, nothing else is stable.

Love Triangle? Wonder Woman? What the...?

http://www.thehomeplanet.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Dean-nonono-GIF.gif

lol. That's just if you want women and girls to come to the movie in equal/greater numbers to the men. If not, you're vying for the exact same audience as the male superheroes, and you're going to get Resident Evil/Underworld-like returns. I think a big budget Wonder Woman movie will *have* to do this, basically.

Even male-dominated movies have love stories and love triangles so that women will have something just as titillating as the action to watch. The examples are pretty much endless. You simply can't make big money without one.

Undeniably, but that's why I don't want a love triangle for Wonder Woman. It's been done so many times before.

Diana, as an immortal warrior-goddess, doesn't need to be apart a love triangle, only orgies. :p

That's a pretty good example of what guys want from Wonder Woman, unfortunately, orgies and fight scenes won't put many women in the seats, and you basically have a low budget guy movie. Incidentally, fight scenes have been done many times before, but we keep doing them for the same reason, even if they suck.

[Hamill-Joker]

I'm still in favor of World War II, when there actually was a war going on. I think it serves as better motivation for Diana leaving Themiscyra than any other reason.

The whole world is actually going to hell and the conflict in that war is much more black and white. Plus Ares being defeated by Wonder Woman at the end of WWII would give reason as to why Nuclear War never broke out during the Cold War.

[DoomsdayApex]

lol. That's just if you want women and girls to come to the movie in equal/greater numbers to the men. If not, you're vying for the exact same audience as the male superheroes, and you're going to get Resident Evil/Underworld-like returns. I think a big budget Wonder Woman movie will *have* to do this, basically.

I don't believe that for a second. CBMs aren't exactly derived from Twilight and Hunger Games books. A Love Triangle in a Wonder Woman adaptation won't attract millions of fangirls to the theaters.

That's a pretty good example of what guys want from Wonder Woman, unfortunately, orgies and fight scenes won't put many women in the seats, and you basically have a low budget guy movie. Incidentally, fight scenes have been done many times before, but we keep doing them for the same reason, even if they suck.

I was being sarcastic. I don't want Diana Prince to be in an actual orgy.

Fight scenes are bound to happen in a summer blockbuster and/or CBM. The genre features crime fighters, anti-heroes, superheroes, etc. So, if one is tired of fight scenes, one would be wise to avoid these type of films.

Love Triangles aren't specified as mandatory for a hero's victory over evil, per se.

[terry78]

It depends on how it's marketed. Dudes have no problem going to see action flicks with female leads. Doesn't mean they're always blockbusters, but we'll go see stuff like Salt, Haywire, Hunger Games, the Underworlds, etc. They just need to treat it as seriously as they are Supes and Bats. I don't care for having to depend on this dude so much, but if Nolan got involved with this treatment, it would speed **** up considerably.

[The Guard]

I still don't know why it's so hard to come up with a decent WW script.

It isn't. There are several solid, decent scripts out there. None of them are really good, though. They're all very average.

And the current and past WB brass has worried about spending $150-$200 million on a female driven superhero movie. UNDERWORLD's highest budget has been $70 million. TOMB RAIDER's budgets were under $100 million. Half what WW would require. The RESIDENT EVIL movies have had budgets of something like $50 millon, a fourth of what WW would require. WB can make money with less risky films and less investment, and so they have.

[Blackman]

It depends on how it's marketed. Dudes have no problem going to see action flicks with female leads. Doesn't mean they're always blockbusters, but we'll go see stuff like Salt, Haywire, Hunger Games, the Underworlds, etc. They just need to treat it as seriously as they are Supes and Bats. I don't care for having to depend on this dude so much, but if Nolan got involved with this treatment, it would speed **** up considerably.

1) Haywire didnt do that well with audiences
2) I used to agree with the bolded. But back in Feb, I was talking to my brother and, I forget why, but Haywire came up. We were talking about its low box office returns. My brother said "It's because there a girl in the lead." I said I doubt that, but he said that he knows a bunch a guys who didnt want to see it because a female is in the lead

It's ridiculous and also when you look at it, save for The Hunger Games, the movies with female leads only do well for their reported budgets

Underworld Awakening. Reported Budget= $70 mill. Worldwide gross= $159,041,314
Salt. Reported Budget=$110 mill. Worldwide gross= $293,503,354

As I said good/decent for their budgets, but if Wondy gets a reported budget of the standard superhero movie (150 mill) then having Worldwide BO returns of under $200 mill wouldnt be good and returns of around $294 mill wouldnt be that good either

[DoomsdayApex]

That's why I prefer Love Rhombuses. :oldrazz:

Haha, that'd be an interesting take. :hehe:

[Evil Twin]

It isn't. There are several solid, decent scripts out there. None of them are really good, though. They're all very average.

And the current and past WB brass has worried about spending $150-$200 million on a female driven superhero movie. UNDERWORLD's highest budget has been $70 million. TOMB RAIDER's budgets were under $100 million. Half what WW would require. The RESIDENT EVIL movies have had budgets of something like $50 millon, a fourth of what WW would require. WB can make money with less risky films and less investment, and so they have.

What about WW in particular requires a $200 million budget? Clash/Wrath of the Titans have about $150 million budgets. I don't see why WW is inherently more complicated than Captain America/Thor budget wise.

Yes, you have to be careful about the budget of a WW movie, which basically goes for all non-Batman, Iron Man, Spider-Man, Avengers, superhero movies at this point. A $130 million WW movie isn't that unrealistic considering you'd expect a bunch of hand to hand combat. Heck, the Hellboy movies aren't a bad starting point for a fantasy based superhero movie.

[HighFivingMF]

Wonder Woman comes to our world where there would most likely have to be destruction. Along with crashing planes and guns and whatnot. Clash has the advantage of not having skyscrapers or planes to destroy and they can film a lot in a field or wherever.

[DrCosmic]

I don't believe that for a second. CBMs aren't exactly derived from Twilight and Hunger Games books. A Love Triangle in a Wonder Woman adaptation won't attract millions of fangirls to the theaters.

Love triangles in other CBMs bring millions of women to those films. Why not for Wondy? When the woman is the central figure in a triangle, even more women show up, regardless of genre. Why not for Wondy? And who said anything about fangirls?

I was being sarcastic. I don't want Diana Prince to be in an actual orgy.

Fight scenes are bound to happen in a summer blockbuster and/or CBM. The genre features crime fighters, anti-heroes, superheroes, etc. So, if one is tired of fight scenes, one would be wise to avoid these type of films.

Love Triangles aren't specified as mandatory for a hero's victory over evil, per se.

I know you were being facetious, but it highlights your overall point and speaks to what most men want out of Diana. We want sexiness, but we don't want emotion, especially things like romance and inner conflict that women are into. That take on Wondy has repelled women from her comics, I'm sure it'd do the same in film. Couple that with the many men who just don't like female action heroes, and you have a box office failure.

Love triangles are bound to happen in any blockbuster, because they are movies about people, and love and relationships, are mandatory for people, especially for them to attain victory over their social lives. And cuz fight scenes don't appeal to everyone like they do most men. If you don't like love triangles, you probably should avoid movies with budgets over 140 million dollars.

Incidentally, Marston understood long ago the power of the love triangle to tell a young woman's story, but I don't think we want to update Bird Boy and Fish Boy. :)

It depends on how it's marketed. Dudes have no problem going to see action flicks with female leads. Doesn't mean they're always blockbusters, but we'll go see stuff like Salt, Haywire, Hunger Games, the Underworlds, etc. They just need to treat it as seriously as they are Supes and Bats. I don't care for having to depend on this dude so much, but if Nolan got involved with this treatment, it would speed **** up considerably.

I'll have to second Blackman on this one. All my male friends dislike female action heroes too. They have wildly varying reasons too. The numbers speak for themselves. Dudes don't go see female action flicks, unless its Angelina Jolie, basically.

It isn't. There are several solid, decent scripts out there. None of them are really good, though. They're all very average.

And the current and past WB brass has worried about spending $150-$200 million on a female driven superhero movie. UNDERWORLD's highest budget has been $70 million. TOMB RAIDER's budgets were under $100 million. Half what WW would require. The RESIDENT EVIL movies have had budgets of something like $50 millon, a fourth of what WW would require. WB can make money with less risky films and less investment, and so they have.

Yes, they are all very, very average. Incidentally, most of them could be filmed for less than 100M. Which, as you know, maybe necessary.

[The Guard]

What about WW in particular requires a $200 million budget? Clash/Wrath of the Titans have about $150 million budgets. I don't see why WW is inherently more complicated than Captain America/Thor budget wise.

Haven't seen WRATH, but I don't really think CLASH and WRATH OF THE TITANS, qualitywise, in terms of sets, locales, etc, are acceptable for a Wonder Woman film.

I'm spitballing a bit, but...

CAPTAIN AMERICA cost $140 million, and didn't have a whole lot of superpower effects. It was mostly physical combat, albeit enhanced physical combat. Add Themyscira, and more mythological elements to that basic approach and its easily going to be $150-$180 million, if not more. THOR was $150 million, and Thor doesn't do much of anything combatwise for about half the film. A faithful WONDER WOMAN film would need every bit as much mythology as THOR (arguably more), but more consistent action. I've got to believe it'd be compare to THE DARK KNIGHT, which was budgeted at $185, or GREEN LANTERN.

Personally, I think WONDER WOMAN is a calculated risk. I think it would clean up. At least it should. But the numbers for female action movies don't bear that out, and business is about numbers.

[ЯɘvlveR]

Diana could be in a love triangle with Steve Trevor and one of the Amazons from Thermyscira. Since Thermyscira is entirely populated by women, Diana could have found love among the Amazons. Steve Trevor's arrival could disrupt that and Diana's gf could become jealous and find this outsider most unwelcome.

WW did used to keep saying "Suffering Sappho" before as her catchphrase.

that's not a bad idea. i think that if there's ever a JL film though, bruce wayne as a love interest could make it interesting. for me at least. :hrt:http://forums.superherohype.com/data:image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAABAAAAAQCAIAAAC QkWg2AAACTElEQVQokXWS309ScRiHv3XVWv9AF/0V3brCOS9sWbJ1YWvNqQRWmq6TGk5TnM4ldVBZYlrqRkkNEpzk XFL4A0zDCJPQEcrPwwE5KsJEJOzTTczS+Vw/77t3ex9C/med3V6Ymhvu6X/dpTCMTvi8YXIckXBspvulTfY8qBzfHvnOaew2uaHvLl1X9MDrW T9sMy7G3afENw9iwB7AAm6ABRzwq8K1BQ2Wz0sHNheKRZQaMIn pdzNVdyi6XQYAQEer/P5NaqpjNqoHld/qXs2ct/ZKA/eGblBXVV0dDDHaYV16Pw1Aq9MxIUZc8VDzaGyxd7uS30IIIRFm KzEygSREgnKPz4sj+B0BYb7wtxFNhUNrzhDxfbFj2oroUTNDGn Aj/RGDlHXsjZksqfWwLO+HUoFg4LiR4BwTf4/RlkCnWEW+vh2F2YZNZGfnlpSUJpPJf9XUr5Sw7Dbv/MWUAdrmgKJRQ5bN1qhaD88eAFlnxwVeTt7lAkFDs6ChJe8KP4u XI5XQ8GBzBD0VFoN2gYSYrbknXTA5wPzd6jt3Sk+I/gTxnj0JALvAJMzyhKRQ7XNvEELIkKTtZ78KsyxcAIAqIU4TnCE QFYEDJrE8iN7K+cbinkw/4ThdKrK/UKc/+LEIOIF6GmIprNj9hB/9uwM1lnuXpGE2fvDsVae/hn9NU0+vDMyyOpabBmOEQxkbf+xoK1YJcupcK8HDOXGRnWaq9l bu1aYblLy882nZM4rfdD1LJKlo57jEsc1y3M6kwaSQdStohck4 z0V2Dgl/ANsP2DQrws2qAAAAAElFTkSuQmCC

[DrCosmic]

The Guard, what makes you (us?) think a WW movie would clean up? Right now, it doesn't seem like the reward justifies the risk.

I think a WW movie could come in under a 100M budget if they don't put her on Superman power levels, at least not at first. You can have some martial arts on Themyscira, any countryside will do, some low level urban action and some military base stuff on location at some abandoned place. Put emphasis on fight choreographers and light practical special effects. If done well, you can have a big-budget effect on a smaller budget.

[Blackman]

I dont know if itll clean up, I really hope it does

[Hamill-Joker]

I think the only potential love interest for Diana should be Steve Trevor and even then I think that their dynamic should be more of a will they or won't they type of relationship at the most.

[Blackman]

Does anyone have any hopes for a potential director?

The only two directors that I remember who showed interest were Joss Whedon (Buffy, Serenity), who now is doing The Avengers and Nicholas Winding Refn (Drive, Bronson), but Im not sure Refn would be good

[The Guard]

The Guard, what makes you (us?) think a WW movie would clean up? Right now, it doesn't seem like the reward justifies the risk.

I think a WW movie could come in under a 100M budget if they don't put her on Superman power levels, at least not at first. You can have some martial arts on Themyscira, any countryside will do, some low level urban action and some military base stuff on location at some abandoned place. Put emphasis on fight choreographers and light practical special effects. If done well, you can have a big-budget effect on a smaller budget.

The problem is...from a marketing standpoint, if she's not at Superman power levels, if its not EPIC, you're tacitly saying "Well, she's not as powerful as the greatest male heroes". It's a vote of no confidence. Its going to look that much more like another Resident Evil, Ultraviolet, Underworld, etc to the uninitiated. Or worse, Xena. And yes, Xena was popular. But emphasis on WAS.

Wonder Woman is still an iconic, recognizeable character thanks to TV show and pop culture. It's got Greek mythology, sword and sorcery elements, big battles/action, superhero movie, attractive asskicking female lead, attractive asskicking male lead. Nazis (hopefully), zombies and or mythological elements. She's incredibly accessible and versatile as a character.

I don't know, it just seems like it should be a sure thing.

And there are scripts out there that get some of it so, so right.

In my mind, this is the movie Sam Mendes was born to make. Maybe after SKYFALL.

[ЯɘvlveR]

Does anyone have any hopes for a potential director?

The only two directors that I remember who showed interest were Joss Whedon (Buffy, Serenity), who now is doing The Avengers and Nicholas Winding Refn (Drive, Bronson), but Im not sure Refn would be good

what about kenneth branagh?

[ЯɘvlveR]

yeah, i think this is the sorta film they can't afford to pinch pennies with. given jennifer lawrence's new found stardom, i think she's probably the ideal pick. young enough, talented, beautiful, she's got the height as well.

[LibidoLoca]

Oh just get James Cameron so we can have the superhero version of Titanic (of course it won't make as much). We might get a nice song out of it. :o

[ЯɘvlveR]

I think the only potential love interest for Diana should be Steve Trevor and even then I think that their dynamic should be more of a will they or won't they type of relationship at the most.

I'm not much for the romance thing in comics, but I've always thought that bat's and wondy getting together would be interesting. i don't think they've even gotten it on in the comics.



she's a goddess, he's a mystery. I've always found her and supes to be a bland match however ideal they may be for each other. its not interesting enough to make it worthwhile. just seems unnecessary. bats has a thousand and one women. maybe he's yet to find his match.


http://27.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_l7ny8w8oia1qcs3pdo1_500.jpg


i don't know much about wonder woman other then she's an amazon who kicks ass, but steve trevor is basically her male lois lane right?

[Blackman]

One day I just wanna see a modified version of War of the Gods on the screen. Not as a first game but probably a sequel.

Cmon Greek gods vs Roman gods and Amazons vs US Military. It could be epic

[Dark Raven]

Wow. That's actually a crazy awesome idea, Dark Raven, and incredibly contemporary. You couldn't have them be proper gfs, if you're doing a love triangle right, but that's a really good starting point, because the other member of the triangle would need to be from Diana's world. I was thinking reworking Hermes or something, but that's just frikkin brilliant. Making it Artemis her trainer or something could be genius, and very interesting.

We all know her creator, Marston was super-kinky, but what does Suffering Sappho mean again?



Thanks. I don't think Diana and the other Amazon would even call themselves gfs. They would've just loved each other, because they might not know anything different since neither have met a man before. They would both be in ignorant bliss of any other kind of gender (although Hippolyta would probably be aware) and since other Amazons are doing it, it would seem normal. Then the other Amazon (either Artemis or one of the other girls in that WW animated movie) could feel extremely threatened by the arrival of Steve Trevor when he captures Diana's attention and ultimately her heart.

If it is Artemis who is part of that triangle, that could even explain why there's such fierce competition between her and Diana later on, both vying for the role of Wonder Woman. It wouldn't simply be a test of who is better or more worthy, but there would be an underlying personal reason with Artemis as the spurrned lover.

And as for the Suffering Sappho catchphrase, I'm not sure what the suffering bit entailed, but Sappho was that female Greek poet on the isle of Lesbos who found love with other women, and from which the whole concept of lesbians and the word "sapphic" originates.

If they had an Amazon named Sappho, then that catchphrase would take on a new meaning. It could be that Diana always remembers the anguish and suffering she put her former lover through when she left Thermyscira and went off with Steve Trevor. Maybe Sappho the Amazon even killed herself as her heart was broken? So "suffering Sappho" is a kind of honorary battlecry.

As for whether the writers of WW would ever be that daring and use such an idea is another matter.

[DrCosmic]

The problem is...from a marketing standpoint, if she's not at Superman power levels, if its not EPIC, you're tacitly saying "Well, she's not as powerful as the greatest male heroes". It's a vote of no confidence. Its going to look that much more like another Resident Evil, Ultraviolet, Underworld, etc to the uninitiated. Or worse, Xena. And yes, Xena was popular. But emphasis on WAS.

Wonder Woman is still an iconic, recognizeable character thanks to TV show and pop culture. It's got Greek mythology, sword and sorcery elements, big battles/action, superhero movie, attractive asskicking female lead, attractive asskicking male lead. Nazis (hopefully), zombies and or mythological elements. She's incredibly accessible and versatile as a character.

I don't know, it just seems like it should be a sure thing.

And there are scripts out there that get some of it so, so right.

In my mind, this is the movie Sam Mendes was born to make. Maybe after SKYFALL.

Hmmm... I dunno, James Bond and Batman are very epic without being Superman power levels. I do see what you're saying about it making her like other female superpowered heroines, though. They'd need to emphasize her items to set her apart.

What makes you think of her as 'accessible?' If anything, her having a lot of dispirate elements makes her unaccessible.

Thanks. I don't think Diana and the other Amazon would even call themselves gfs. They would've just loved each other, because they might not know anything different since neither have met a man before. They would both be in ignorant bliss of any other kind of gender (although Hippolyta would probably be aware) and since other Amazons are doing it, it would seem normal. Then the other Amazon (either Artemis or one of the other girls in that WW animated movie) could feel extremely threatened by the arrival of Steve Trevor when he captures Diana's attention and ultimately her heart.

If it is Artemis who is part of that triangle, that could even explain why there's such fierce competition between her and Diana later on, both vying for the role of Wonder Woman. It wouldn't simply be a test of who is better or more worthy, but there would be an underlying personal reason with Artemis as the spurrned lover.

And as for the Suffering Sappho catchphrase, I'm not sure what the suffering bit entailed, but Sappho was that female Greek poet on the isle of Lesbos who found love with other women, and from which the whole concept of lesbians and the word "sapphic" originates.

If they had an Amazon named Sappho, then that catchphrase would take on a new meaning. It could be that Diana always remembers the anguish and suffering she put her former lover through when she left Thermyscira and went off with Steve Trevor. Maybe Sappho the Amazon even killed herself as her heart was broken? So "suffering Sappho" is a kind of honorary battlecry.

As for whether the writers of WW would ever be that daring and use such an idea is another matter.

Yes, all of that. Artemis also functions as the draw and exposition towards her mythological side in contrast with Steve drawing her towards her more mortal side. It's also nice that they both work as combat sidekicks, ranged ones at that. Steve Trevor and Artemis in conflict would just be awesome. Diana breaking that up could be very fun, especially with the whole arrow/bullet deflection thing. And they both work as recurring characters throughout the franchise.

I think Sappho, as a character name, and moreso as a battlecry, is a bit silly. Artemis already has a very strong established, and a bit butch, personality.

[Hamill-Joker]

I think a love triangle is over complicating the plot and would draw away from a central conflict. Also, Diana shouldn't be in the middle of a love triangle. I feel like that takes power away from her character.

If there is a conflict between her feelings toward the outside world and Themyscira, I think it should be more based on what she feels her duty is and where her loyalty lies. After she resolves the main conflict in the outside world, should she stay or should she return to Themyscira, to her people. And if there is a personal aspect of this inner conflict, it should involve Steve Trevor and Hippolyta.

[Blackman]

I think the love triangle is a stupid idea. Really stupid. Just pointless.

[DrCosmic]

How does a love triangle take away the power of her character? What do you think the power of her character is?

How do you think the audience will know or care what her duty is if it's not personal? How do you make them feel loyalty to Themyscira?

That's why it's not pointless, because it drives home a theme that pretty much has to be in the movie that everyone can understand and relate to and care about. That's why they have it in just about every summer blockbuster, cuz it's a simple good idea.

In my thoughts, the central conflict is between Ares' warmongering and Aphrodite and the Amazon's mission/message of peace. Diana in the middle of that trying to figure out what to do and how to do it. How to fight war itself without being a hypocrite. That's the conflict. Beating Ares is a pointless brainless action-fest unless these questions are resolved in a way the audience cares about without having read years of Wondy comics.

I mean, you guys have a better idea?

[Hamill-Joker]

I mean, you guys have a better idea?

I believe that one of Diana's strengths is her independence outside of romantic relationships. I think the development of any relationship with a love interest should be kept similar to something like Bruce and Rachel in Batman Begins or Tony and Pepper in Iron Man 1, and that it should only be one potential love interest.

While I feel like I did understate the importance of personal connections that Diana would have with other characters, you don't have to have a love triangle in order to get across themes and ideas. You can do that through simple relationships.

This is just a rough outline of my ideas. I'd have it set during WWII.

I would have Hippolyta as the driving force of Diana's loyalty to the Amazons with her being completely opposed to Diana leaving the island to the outside world with Steve, stating that it is her duty to remain with her people. Hippolyta would see the outside world as a dangerous and untrustworthy place, she would have a more isolationist view and instill the importance in Diana of being loyal and remaining with her people. This would also involve Hippolyta banning Diana from entering the tournament and even when Diana won, she would still forbid her to go.

On the other hand, Diana's building relationship with Steve would make her feel the importance of helping to resolve the conflict in the outside world and spreading the Amazon's message of peace.

Realizing that her duty involves bringing peace to the outside world, she disobeys Hippolyta and leaves with Steve, but promises to herself to return once the conflict has been resolved. However, the more time she spends in the outside world, the more she feels that she is needed there rather than with her family and her people.

I have this picture in my mind of Diana coming across a war ravaged village, where people's lives had been completely destroyed. Children are left parentless, whole families had been wiped by a barrage. Perhaps it could be a village that Diana and Steve had stayed in during a previous part of the film. This horrifies Diana and she begins to feel that she needs to remain in the outside world, she is needed much more there.

While Steve's personal feelings grow for her, he also realizes her importance in saving lives and ending such conflicts. He encourages her feelings that her real duty is to the whole world.

Eventually through several twists and turns, they find out Ares is behind the actual conflict and that leads to the showdown with him. After he is defeated, Diana feels that her true purpose was in defeating Ares and it was his interference in the human world that caused the resulting war. In the end she does not feel it is her place to interfere in the human world beyond dealing with someone like Ares. And despite the relationship she has developed with Steve and the outside world, she returns to Themyscira at the end.

[Majik1387]

I'm not anti-love interests/love triangles in my superhero movies, but I don't really see it working to Wonder Woman's advantage if included.

At most it should be like Tony Stark with Pepper Potts in the first Iron Man movie; a mutual understanding of being interested in each other but understanding there are more pressing matters at hand.

[roach]

One day I just wanna see a modified version of War of the Gods on the screen. Not as a first game but probably a sequel.

Cmon Greek gods vs Roman gods and Amazons vs US Military. It could be epic

I am actually working on an idea for a script I will write that will have the Greek Gods go to war with the Norse Gods.

[NigelHalsey]

Oh just get James Cameron so we can have the superhero version of Titanic (of course it won't make as much). We might get a nice song out of it. :o
And a billion dollars in the box office.:dry:

[jmc]

Eh, none of this love-triangle stuff please, even if part of it is girl on girl, I'm more in favour of any attraction being hinted at between Trevor and WW, but then again the film I have in my head takes place in only 36-48 hours.

[The Guard]

Hmmm... I dunno, James Bond and Batman are very epic without being Superman power levels.

I'm not sure what point you're making in relation to what I said. Can you elaborate?

What makes you think of her as 'accessible?' If anything, her having a lot of dispirate elements makes her unaccessible.

She's just an accessible, relatable character when she's written well. She's got some major strengths and weaknesses, she's compassionate but she has some issues with ego and temper, so she's accessible emotionally. Her royalty and her ambassador role makes her accessible politically. Socially, she's relevant in a fairly obvious way. I see her as being a kind of cultural, social touchstone.

If there's a love triangle, it needs to be between Diane, Steve and Etta, not Steve and two Amazons (who hate men). If there was ever a movie that needed a love triangle, it's WONDER WOMAN, and it's that particular triangle. Not the thin one that was presented in the comics for so long, but something that explores the situation fully. Wonder Woman is a goddess. Etta is a normal woman. Play with that.

Diana can be independent and still have feelings for someone. Make her duty and her background part of the issue. Shed like to love him, but she has her mission and her learned bias against men.

[DrCosmic]

I believe that one of Diana's strengths is her independence outside of romantic relationships. I think the development of any relationship with a love interest should be kept similar to something like Bruce and Rachel in Batman Begins or Tony and Pepper in Iron Man 1, and that it should only be one potential love interest.

While I feel like I did understate the importance of personal connections that Diana would have with other characters, you don't have to have a love triangle in order to get across themes and ideas. You can do that through simple relationships.

You can, but a love triangle brings it home stronger and easier. For instance, in the movies you mentioned, the hero's other women got in the way of their primary relationship. It's an easy, clear, simple way to illustrate internal conflict which is very relatable to women in general.

EDIT: It's very easy to say "I don't need men." That's not strength, especially when it has nothing to do with reality. It's much stronger to be independent and in a relationship. Male heroes are capable of this, they are not considered 'stronger' for being single. What's with that, you think?

This is just a rough outline of my ideas. I'd have it set during WWII.

I would have Hippolyta as the driving force of Diana's loyalty to the Amazons with her being completely opposed to Diana leaving the island to the outside world with Steve, stating that it is her duty to remain with her people. Hippolyta would see the outside world as a dangerous and untrustworthy place, she would have a more isolationist view and instill the importance in Diana of being loyal and remaining with her people. This would also involve Hippolyta banning Diana from entering the tournament and even when Diana won, she would still forbid her to go.

On the other hand, Diana's building relationship with Steve would make her feel the importance of helping to resolve the conflict in the outside world and spreading the Amazon's message of peace.

Realizing that her duty involves bringing peace to the outside world, she disobeys Hippolyta and leaves with Steve, but promises to herself to return once the conflict has been resolved. However, the more time she spends in the outside world, the more she feels that she is needed there rather than with her family and her people.

I have this picture in my mind of Diana coming across a war ravaged village, where people's lives had been completely destroyed. Children are left parentless, whole families had been wiped by a barrage. Perhaps it could be a village that Diana and Steve had stayed in during a previous part of the film. This horrifies Diana and she begins to feel that she needs to remain in the outside world, she is needed much more there.

While Steve's personal feelings grow for her, he also realizes her importance in saving lives and ending such conflicts. He encourages her feelings that her real duty is to the whole world.

Eventually through several twists and turns, they find out Ares is behind the actual conflict and that leads to the showdown with him. After he is defeated, Diana feels that her true purpose was in defeating Ares and it was his interference in the human world that caused the resulting war. In the end she does not feel it is her place to interfere in the human world beyond dealing with someone like Ares. And despite the relationship she has developed with Steve and the outside world, she returns to Themyscira at the end.

Sounds nice. I don't think anyone would not enjoy that. I think a lot of people wouldn't bother with it because it's a female heroine set in world war 2 with greek mythology and the only real foothold into our reality is mommy issues. And anytime a hero decides not to interfere with normal problems its contrived, best not to highlight that.

[MarvelKnight]

Anyone will be a better WW than adrianne Palicki who was going to be WW on the TV show.

If she wasn't Lois for so long, I may have recommended Erica Durance (Did anyone see the clip from Harry's Law when she was in the WW get up?!? Epitome of Hott) but now I have to rethink my choice.

[jaymes_e06]

Adrianne wasn't bad from what I seen. It was the script that was atrocious.

[DrCosmic]

I'm not sure what point you're making in relation to what I said. Can you elaborate?

You said if it's not Superman level, it's not "EPIC." Batman and James Bond are case in point that this is not true. A little world traveling -> Epic.

She's just an accessible, relatable character when she's written well. She's got some major strengths and weaknesses, she's compassionate but she has some issues with ego and temper, so she's accessible emotionally. Her royalty and her ambassador role makes her accessible politically. Socially, she's relevant in a fairly obvious way. I see her as being a kind of cultural, social touchstone.You keep saying that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

Every character is accessible if a great writer takes the time to deal with their inaccessibility and makes them accessible. That means they weren't before, and they do not become accessible to the next writer, who has to do the process all over again. And if they are not great writers, they will fail to make an inaccessible character accessible. Someone being compassionate but with a mean streak, sounds like a classic Mary Sue. A woman with a male-sized ego is not 'accessible' to either gender. The fact that you think royalty is accessible, much less accessible politically (what does that even mean) makes me doubt that whatever social relevance you alude to is actually obvious.

If there's a love triangle, it needs to be between Diane, Steve and Etta, not Steve and two Amazons (who hate men). If there was ever a movie that needed a love triangle, it's WONDER WOMAN, and it's that particular triangle. Not the thin one that was presented in the comics for so long, but something that explores the situation fully. Wonder Woman is a goddess. Etta is a normal woman. Play with that.

Diana can be independent and still have feelings for someone. Make her duty and her background part of the issue. Shed like to love him, but she has her mission and her learned bias against men.I'm not sure there's a lot to play with there. Etta is an inferior rival and a friend. The only conflict is... do I betray my friend to get the guy I want? And that does totally detract from the storyline unless Diana is wrestling with betraying man's world.

Using the mythological Amazons that hate men is a really, really bad idea. They are meant to be inaccessible and they effectively turn off everyone except for hardcore WW fans and people with serious mommy issues. This is where we get stories like Amazons Attack from. Even Perez and his inaccessible take didn't make that mistake of making the Amazons hate men. Marston, the original, and most successful with Wondy, made the Amazons ambassadors of peace, of a better way. They pitied and nurtured man because they were, in many ways, better, and wanted man to be better.

[MarvelKnight]

Adrianne wasn't bad from what I seen. It was the script that was atrocious.

I admit looks could be deceiving, and I would have given it a chance, don't get me wrong. I just think she didn't fit from the outset. Don't matter now, its scrapped.

I think its funny that CW tried to get Green Arrow on the air when WW couldn't even get off the ground. I knew it never had a chance lol

[Majik1387]

Adrianne wasn't bad from what I seen. It was the script that was atrocious.
It was both the script and her.

[DrCosmic]

Really?? Afaic, she had presence and delivered atrocious lines in a way that they almost sounded believable. She gets the stamp of approval over here. I mean, what could Emily Blunt, or Angelina Jolie or anyone have done better?

[The Guard]

\You said if it's not Superman level, it's not "EPIC." Batman and James Bond are case in point that this is not true. A little world traveling -> Epic.

I guess Bond and Batman are epic to a degree, but this is on another level entirely. Epic in scale, in mythology, etc. But that's not so much what I was talking about. I'm just saying, if it's not huge, if Wonder Woman is relegated to the scale of smaller action movies like the examples I provided, I think its a disservice to the character and her mythology.

You keep saying that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

I'm not talking about her being easily obtained. Not directly, at least.

The world has multiple definitions.

In writing terms, as I understand it, accessible means that a character is easy to understand and relate to. There are broader concepts inherent to Wonder Woman that are easily accessible to the average person.

What do you think it means?

Every character is accessible if a great writer takes the time to deal with their inaccessibility and makes them accessible. That means they weren't before, and they do not become accessible to the next writer, who has to do the process all over again. And if they are not great writers, they will fail to make an inaccessible character accessible. Someone being compassionate but with a mean streak, sounds like a classic Mary Sue. A woman with a male-sized ego is not 'accessible' to either gender. The fact that you think royalty is accessible, much less accessible politically (what does that even mean) makes me doubt that whatever social relevance you alude to is actually obvious.

But I never said she was inaccessible. I said she was accessible.

Luckily she's not only a compassionate person with a mean streak. She's a goddess, a warrior princess, and a political ambassador to man's world.

I'm not sure there's a lot to play with there. Etta is an inferior rival and a friend. The only conflict is... do I betray my friend to get the guy I want? And that does totally detract from the storyline unless Diana is wrestling with betraying man's world.

Well, no...there's not much to play with there. That was an incredibly broad statement about Etta's potential (not that what was already written wouldn't already compare favorably to most "friend portrayals" in a superhero movie). But there is within the actual character of Etta Candy. Not the least of which is a love of candy. There are plenty of concepts that can be explored. The specifics depend on the nature of the adaption. Is she a secretary? A lieutenant? A spy? Something else?

Using the mythological Amazons that hate men is a really, really bad idea. They are meant to be inaccessible and they effectively turn off everyone except for hardcore WW fans and people with serious mommy issues. This is where we get stories like Amazons Attack from. Even Perez and his inaccessible take didn't make that mistake of making the Amazons hate men. Marston, the original, and most successful with Wondy, made the Amazons ambassadors of peace, of a better way. They pitied and nurtured man because they were, in many ways, better, and wanted man to be better.

If they were actually meant to be inaccessible, they would just hate men period, because they have penises. I would tend to agree that there should be more to it than their historically has been, and I would never want something as thin as "We hate men because we just hate men". But I would imagine there would have to be some kind of bias against men for Diane's visit to man's world to have as much impact, and to maintain a faithful element to the Amazon concept. If it's that the Amazons pitied men and felt they'd fallen short of their potential, that could work. But there's still an inherent bias against men, man's world, etc.

Wonder Woman's social relevance should be obvious. She's Wonder Woman. A warrior princess with strong morals. Beyond the female power thing, she can be a strong role model for women and men alike. There are political dimensions to her as well.

[Blackman]

I'm not anti-love interests/love triangles in my superhero movies, but I don't really see it working to Wonder Woman's advantage if included.

At most it should be like Tony Stark with Pepper Potts in the first Iron Man movie; a mutual understanding of being interested in each other but understanding there are more pressing matters at hand.

Yeah I dont mind love interests/love triangles but I dont really see it working that well.

and the idea of an Iron Man like relationship sounds good to me

[Cain]

I don't want to see an Etta Candy/Steve Trevor/WW love triangle at all. Etta and Steve is one of those things I never liked about post-crisis compared to pre-crisis. Steve Trevor only really works as a love interest for WW conceptually.

If there must be a love triangle I prefer the traditional Diana Prince/WW/Steve Trevor conflict. As similar as it is to Clark Kent/Lois Lane/Superman it's effective and I like nurse Diana Prince as it highlights that WW is into saving lives 24/7 no matter what identity.

[DrCosmic]

Yeah I dont mind love interests/love triangles but I dont really see it working that well.

and the idea of an Iron Man like relationship sounds good to me

I mean, to be honest, Iron Man had two love interests and a conflict between the two, used as a metaphor for the character's personal arc. It works well.

I guess Bond and Batman are epic to a degree, but this is on another level entirely. Epic in scale, in mythology, etc. But that's not so much what I was talking about. I'm just saying, if it's not huge, if Wonder Woman is relegated to the scale of smaller action movies like the examples I provided, I think its a disservice to the character and her mythology.

Well, if Wonder Woman is like she's been in the comics, she can't make money to justify superman movies. We've seen what kinds of female vehicles make hundreds of millions, Wonder Woman isn't that.

I'm not talking about her being easily obtained. Not directly, at least.

The world has multiple definitions.

In writing terms, as I understand it, accessible means that a character is easy to understand and relate to. There are broader concepts inherent to Wonder Woman that are easily accessible to the average person.

What do you think it means?

A character that is easy to understand and relate to. That works. You mention that an (as yet not existing) incarnation is accessible, or that parts of her are accessible in isolation. This is not the same as the character being accessible.

Luckily she's not only a compassionate person with a mean streak. She's a goddess, a warrior princess, and a political ambassador to man's world.

She has a lot of jobs cuz she's uber. Doesn't mean she's not a Mary Sue.

Well, no...there's not much to play with there. That was an incredibly broad statement about Etta's potential (not that what was already written wouldn't already compare favorably to most "friend portrayals" in a superhero movie). But there is within the actual character of Etta Candy. Not the least of which is a love of candy. There are plenty of concepts that can be explored. The specifics depend on the nature of the adaption. Is she a secretary? A lieutenant? A spy? Something else?

Etta as a character has potential, most certainly, but there's only so much you can do with her as a supporting character in a big superhero movie.

If they were actually meant to be inaccessible, they would just hate men period, because they have penises. I would tend to agree that there should be more to it than their historically has been, and I would never want something as thin as "We hate men because we just hate men". But I would imagine there would have to be some kind of bias against men for Diane's visit to man's world to have as much impact, and to maintain a faithful element to the Amazon concept. If it's that the Amazons pitied men and felt they'd fallen short of their potential, that could work. But there's still an inherent bias against men, man's world, etc.

No, the inaccessibility works just fine if they take one experience and illogically apply it to all men throughout time. That's what Perez did, and most writers do.

Wonder Woman's social relevance should be obvious. She's Wonder Woman. A warrior princess with strong morals. Beyond the female power thing, she can be a strong role model for women and men alike. There are political dimensions to her as well.

What is it about Wonder Woman that we think people should model? I say to say: it's not obvious. Very few incarnations of Wonder Woman are characters with any social relevance. Being an ambassador doesn't make you relevant if you preach peace while punching people in the face.

[terry78]

Smulders' facial structure in those new Avengers wallpapers looks so much like WW it ain't funny.

[The Guard]

Well, if Wonder Woman is like she's been in the comics, she can't make money to justify superman movies. We've seen what kinds of female vehicles make hundreds of millions, Wonder Woman isn't that.

Sure she can.

She's got several powers, an invisible jet, which makes for good aerial combat. Giant battles what with the Amazons or Ares, mythological monster style threats, superpowered villains and villanesses. Nazis. A globetrotting, globespanning nature. The potential for action and intrigue is there. The movie could be huge, and many of the stories have been.

A character that is easy to understand and relate to. That works. You mention that an (as yet not existing) incarnation is accessible, or that parts of her are accessible in isolation. This is not the same as the character being accessible.

Ah.

But Wonder Woman does exist as a character, and is accessible.

She has a lot of jobs cuz she's uber. Doesn't mean she's not a Mary Sue.

She has a lot of "jobs" because she has a lot of aspects to her character. Because her character has some depth. A Mary Sue sends to be a shallower character without the shades of gray and tragic flaws. Diana doesn't fall into that category.

Etta as a character has potential, most certainly, but there's only so much you can do with her as a supporting character in a big superhero movie.

There's only so much you need to do with any supporting character in a superhero movie. My point is that she can be every bit as interesting as Selina Kyle, Pepper Potts, Rachel Dawes, Mary Jane Parker, etc. If not moreso.

No, the inaccessibility works just fine if they take one experience and illogically apply it to all men throughout time. That's what Perez did, and most writers do.

I'm not saying the inaccessibility doesn't work. It did. But I'm saying they're not inaccessible as a concept or characters. Not anymore, at least. Suggesting that they're inaccessible suggests that they are not an understandable concept. They are. Their point of view is rather logical in some respects.

What is it about Wonder Woman that we think people should model? I say to say: it's not obvious. Very few incarnations of Wonder Woman are characters with any social relevance. Being an ambassador doesn't make you relevant if you preach peace while punching people in the face.

What should people model?

Charity
Compassion towards others
Standing up for those who can't defend themselves
Working toward peace, I.E, finding a balance between diplomacy and war

Social relevance of the top of my head:

The nature of power
The nature of violence
Persecution of differences
Cultural and social bias
Nationalism
Terrorism

You mentioned it yourself. Wonder Woman uses violence to bring peace. That right there is a socially relevant concept and issue that can be explored.

[DrCosmic]

Sure she can.

She's got several powers, an invisible jet, which makes for good aerial combat. Giant battles what with the Amazons or Ares, mythological monster style threats, superpowered villains and villanesses. Nazis. A globetrotting, globespanning nature. The potential for action and intrigue is there. The movie could be huge, and many of the stories have been.

Being huge is just part of the equation. Green Lantern was huge. Green Lantern didn't get the masses to empathize with the character, so it failed.

Ah.

But Wonder Woman does exist as a character, and is accessible.

No, she is not. That is, afaik, what we're discussing.

She has a lot of "jobs" because she has a lot of aspects to her character. Because her character has some depth. A Mary Sue sends to be a shallower character without the shades of gray and tragic flaws. Diana doesn't fall into that category.

Mary Sues have tragic flaws, it's just that they're all the same flaw. They have a temper - but only when its justified by people who are despicable, so it's not really a flaw at all. Superman, Wonder Woman and Batman all fall into this often. Superman and Batman have additional actual flaws, like being psychotic, or having a messiah complex that play out in stories from time to time, and don't go away with the next writer, and don't actually make them despicable.

There's only so much you need to do with any supporting character in a superhero movie. My point is that she can be every bit as interesting as Selina Kyle, Pepper Potts, Rachel Dawes, Mary Jane Parker, etc. If not moreso.

I'm not saying the inaccessibility doesn't work. It did. But I'm saying they're not inaccessible as a concept or characters. Not anymore, at least. Suggesting that they're inaccessible suggests that they are not an understandable concept. They are. Their point of view is rather logical in some respects.

We just agreed that accessible means easily understood. Wodner Woman is not easily understood, as attested by everyone who has ever written her, and the widespread misunderstanding of her by virtually everyone.

What should people model?

Charity
Compassion towards others
Standing up for those who can't defend themselves
Working toward peace, I.E, finding a balance between diplomacy and war

Social relevance of the top of my head:

The nature of power
The nature of violence
Persecution of differences
Cultural and social bias
Nationalism
Terrorism

You mentioned it yourself. Wonder Woman uses violence to bring peace. That right there is a socially relevant concept and issue that can be explored.

Few of those themes are accessible, and all of them obscured by a militaristic society, making the character as a whole inaccessible. Think about it, what does a balanced between diplomacy and war have to do with my day to day personal life. Perhaps the themes are accessible to world leaders...

[Hamill-Joker]

If you go with a modern day setting for the film, I think that one of the main themes has to deal with fear and dealing with terrorism.

My thoughts were that of going with a first film involving WWII, dealing with a straightforward type of war and a sequel being modern day, dealing with terrorism as a new type of war, almost a constant state of war and the fear that instills in people.

[NigelHalsey]

Speaking of movies that almost got made, here's an image of Diana in the cancelled JL: Mortal Video Game.

http://www.shogungamer.com/sites/default/files/images/Justice%20League%20wonder%20woman.thumbnail.jpg (http://www.shogungamer.com/news/13746/images-cancelled-justice-league-game-surface)

[The Guard]

Being huge is just part of the equation. Green Lantern was huge. Green Lantern didn't get the masses to empathize with the character, so it failed.

Yes, but I never said being huge is all the movie has to be to succeed. We were discussing where Wonder Woman's mythology lent itself to a huge movie.

No, she is not. That is, afaik, what we're discussing.

Well, we were discussing the meaning of "accessible" of late. I believe she is an accessible character. Because her basic character traits are easy to understand. So are her more complex ones, frankly.

Mary Sues have tragic flaws, it's just that they're all the same flaw. They have a temper - but only when its justified by people who are despicable, so it's not really a flaw at all. Superman, Wonder Woman and Batman all fall into this often. Superman and Batman have additional actual flaws, like being psychotic, or having a messiah complex that play out in stories from time to time, and don't go away with the next writer, and don't actually make them despicable.

She lies.
She has a penchant for violence, and has killed.
She has a bit of a complex over her mother/background.

Justifying a flaw doesn't remove the flaw.

"A Mary Sue (sometimes just Sue), in literary criticism and particularly in fanfiction, is a fictional character with overly idealized and hackneyed mannerisms, lacking noteworthy flaws, and primarily functioning as a wish-fulfilment fantasy for the author or reader. It is generally accepted as a character whose positive aspects overwhelm their other traits until they become one-dimensional.

Mary Sue is a character who is classified as unrealistic, perfect, or without faults. she may have faults, but they are perfect faults, cliched ones. the typical fairytale princess are always mary sue characters.

The prototypical Mary Sue is an original female character in a fanfic who obviously serves as an idealized version of the author mainly for the purpose of Wish Fulfillment. She's exotically beautiful, often having an unusual hair or eye color, and has a similarly cool and exotic name. She's exceptionally talented in an implausibly wide variety of areas, and may possess skills that are rare or nonexistent in the canon setting. She also lacks any realistic, or at least story-relevant, character flaws — either that or her "flaws" are obviously meant to be endearing.

While it could be argued that Wonder Woman's positive attributes outweigh her other traits, she cannot accurately be described as overly idealistic or one dimensional. And I don't think her flaws can really be described as all that endearing. Diana may have been a Mary Sue character at one time. She is not anymore, at least in the last decade or so.

We just agreed that accessible means easily understood. Wonder Woman is not easily understood, as attested by everyone who has ever written her, and the widespread misunderstanding of her by virtually everyone.

I disagree. The concepts surrounding Wonder Woman are not difficult ones to grasp. People (writers) may have said she's a complex character, but she is not a difficult one to understand. I've never seen a writer say that about Diana.

The widespread misunderstanding of her in what sense? In that most people only know her TV show version and that she's an asskicking superheroine?

Few of those themes are accessible, and all of them obscured by a militaristic society, making the character as a whole inaccessible. Think about it, what does a balanced between diplomacy and war have to do with my day to day personal life. Perhaps the themes are accessible to world leaders...

You're suggesting that power, violence, persecution, cultural and social bias, terrorism and nationalism are not easy to understand or relatable themes?

I never said they were accessible, though its arguable. I said they are socially relevant. They are themes many people encounter almost every day.

Obscured by a militaristic society? Can you elaborate? If you mean that there socially accepted meaning of such things is unclear, that's all the more reason exploring them as themes makes sense.

[Venomfan]

que the tonia sotiropoulou casting bandwagon!

[flickchick85]

Smulders' facial structure in those new Avengers wallpapers looks so much like WW it ain't funny.
Yeah, I said something about that in the Avengers thread yesterday too. I really think Whedon was onto something when he wanted her to be WW. She has not just the look, but a certain natural toughness vibe about her too that's perfect for the character.

[TheComicbookKid]

que the tonia sotiropoulou casting bandwagon!

I'd want her just to see how many f--ked up misspellings of her name we'd get.:woot:lol

[Lobo]

que the tonia sotiropoulou casting bandwagon!

LOL, I wanted to be the first to make this post, so instead, I will start the faux campaign :woot:

Age 26. Height: 1.68m (I think that is 5'6)



http://www.thereelbits.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Tonia-Sotiropoulou002.jpg

http://nikosalpha.com/photos/big/394.jpg

edit last pic had see through shirt

[Majik1387]

Bleh

[TheComicbookKid]

How dare you!

http://i.imgbox.com/aatWv6xb.gif (http://imgbox.com/aatWv6xb)

She's brunette and the last name I've heard so that makes her perfect until (insert new actress) another brunette catches my eye!!

[roach]

wait where can you see the NBC WW pilot?

[Majik1387]

Through piracy

[Project862006]

i do like how cobie looks in avengers banner!! really does look like WW
http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/2463/avengerspromos0002layer.png

[Hamill-Joker]

I don't know. I feel like you need a really dynamic woman to pull off Wonder Woman and to me, Cobie feels generic.

[jmc]

What the hell is dynamic even suppose to mean? BTW I had a funny feeling Cobie's name would be brought up again due to Avengers. We've come full circle people!

[NigelHalsey]

i do like how cobie looks in avengers banner!! really does look like WW
http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/2463/avengerspromos0002layer.png

Yeah. Too bad Marvel got to her first.
That banner should read: SPECIAL AGENT DIANA PRINCE - DEPARTMENT OF METAHUMAN AFFAIRS. Oh well.


How dare you!

http://i.imgbox.com/aatWv6xb.gif (http://imgbox.com/aatWv6xb)

She's brunette and the last name I've heard so that makes her perfect until (insert new actress) another brunette catches my eye!!

Janet Montgomery?

http://64.19.142.10/25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m1zyv4N0Jj1qbjhjco1_500.jpg:woot::woot::woo t:

[HighFivingMF]

Yeah. Too bad Marvel got to her first.

Yeah, too bad a thing that doesn't matter happened.

[NigelHalsey]

Yeah, too bad a thing that doesn't matter happened.
Was sarcasm really necessary?

[LibidoLoca]

Yes. :o

Oh and Colbie looks great in the banner, sad I can't say that about her on HIMYM.

[DrCosmic]

Yes, but I never said being huge is all the movie has to be to succeed. We were discussing where Wonder Woman's mythology lent itself to a huge movie.

We were? I thought I acknowledged that. The mythos lends itself to a huge movie, but the mythos also lacks what is needed to make a succesful female-led film.

Well, we were discussing the meaning of "accessible" of late. I believe she is an accessible character. Because her basic character traits are easy to understand. So are her more complex ones, frankly.

Really? Cuz you said 'easy to understand' and I said 'that works.' That's the definition I've been going off of. You're still taking the character in isolation. Just because an ambassador is easy to understand and a warrior is easy to understand, doesn't mean a warrior ambassador is easy to understand. When you put it all together there's questions and conflicts that few writers can answer with any satisfaction. She, as a whole, is not easy to understand, thus, she is not accessible.

She lies.
She has a penchant for violence, and has killed.
She has a bit of a complex over her mother/background.

Justifying a flaw doesn't remove the flaw.

"A Mary Sue (sometimes just Sue), in literary criticism and particularly in fanfiction, is a fictional character with overly idealized and hackneyed mannerisms, lacking noteworthy flaws, and primarily functioning as a wish-fulfilment fantasy for the author or reader. It is generally accepted as a character whose positive aspects overwhelm their other traits until they become one-dimensional.

Mary Sue is a character who is classified as unrealistic, perfect, or without faults. she may have faults, but they are perfect faults, cliched ones. the typical fairytale princess are always mary sue characters.

The prototypical Mary Sue is an original female character in a fanfic who obviously serves as an idealized version of the author mainly for the purpose of Wish Fulfillment. She's exotically beautiful, often having an unusual hair or eye color, and has a similarly cool and exotic name. She's exceptionally talented in an implausibly wide variety of areas, and may possess skills that are rare or nonexistent in the canon setting. She also lacks any realistic, or at least story-relevant, character flaws — either that or her "flaws" are obviously meant to be endearing.

While it could be argued that Wonder Woman's positive attributes outweigh her other traits, she cannot accurately be described as overly idealistic or one dimensional. And I don't think her flaws can really be described as all that endearing. Diana may have been a Mary Sue character at one time. She is not anymore, at least in the last decade or so.

You really think for the entire last decade Diana's faults have been relevant? The only time her killing became a problem was with Max Lord, and that didn't even make any sense to be a problem except in comic book world. It's not just the justification of a flaw, it's when the flaw - killing people who are about to destroy the world, lying to protect your secret identity - are actually good things, 'perfect flaws.'

I disagree. The concepts surrounding Wonder Woman are not difficult ones to grasp. People (writers) may have said she's a complex character, but she is not a difficult one to understand. I've never seen a writer say that about Diana.

The widespread misunderstanding of her in what sense? In that most people only know her TV show version and that she's an asskicking superheroine?

Most people, at least amongst comics fans, have no idea that WW is about compassion and empathy. She has these dueling ideas of Amazons, Marston's female paradise, and ancient Greece's cautionary tale about uppity women.

Now, have you ever heard an author say Diana's an easy to understand character?

Morrison said she was challenging, every WW writer interview I've ever seen aludes to this reality.
http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=21870 (ctrl+f "Wonder Woman")

You're suggesting that power, violence, persecution, cultural and social bias, terrorism and nationalism are not easy to understand or relatable themes?

I never said they were accessible, though its arguable. I said they are socially relevant. They are themes many people encounter almost every day.

Obscured by a militaristic society? Can you elaborate? If you mean that there socially accepted meaning of such things is unclear, that's all the more reason exploring them as themes makes sense.

I see, I did lose track of this thread. They are indeed socially relevant. That doesn't mean they're any good for a film, though. The ideas of cultural bias, terrorism and nationalism are certainly not relatable and easy to understand themes, because people are simply not aware of them in daily life. Persecution they relate more to bullies and violence and power is always justified on the part of the heroes, and that's what audiences expect. To deliver a different message on the nature of violence or power (other than: It's awesome! do it!) in an action superhero movie is simply not accessible, it's a turn off to most people.

Furthermore, you can't even address the nature of violence and power with a straghtface when your 'good guys' are a bunch of war-happy isolationists. It obscures the point with their hypocricy. You'd have to change the Amazons in order to bring out those themes that are accessible. You can always put the heavier themes, like nationalism et al in the background, but they can't be part of the character arc, because they won't draw the audience into the character at all.

i do like how cobie looks in avengers banner!! really does look like WW


This, like the Lynn Collins cry makes me so uninterested in casting choices. As long as the girl looks hot in the WW costume, fans will love it. I can only imagine if Adrianne Palicki's costume was decent, we'd still be singing her unsigned praises.

Hopefully we can get a good actress and story so the movie will actually be good.

[jaymes_e06]

Oh and Colbie looks great in the banner, sad I can't say that about her on HIMYM.
Agreed. Do they try to make her less attractive in that show?

[LibidoLoca]

I've developed a theory that wardrobe and hair hate her.

[batdude]

Yeah, for the last couple seasons.

[DoomsdayApex]

Eh, never been a Cobie supporter and never will. I just don't see Wonder Woman in her.

[LibidoLoca]

Eh, never been a Cobie supporter and never will. I just don't see Wonder Woman in her.
You must assimilate! ASSIMILATE! :argh:

[jmc]

What was wrong with her look in HIMYM? She was very girl next door looking in the first couple seasons. Granted I haven't watched the show much lately.

[DoomsdayApex]

You must assimilate! ASSIMILATE! :argh:

Never!!!! :argh:

[LibidoLoca]

What was wrong with her look in HIMYM? She was very girl next door looking in the first couple seasons. Granted I haven't watched the show much lately.
I don't know how to describe but those good looks faded as the show went on. It's noticeable in season six and seven (current).

[gugumugats]

Was Joss Whedon interested in casting Smulders while he was writing that WW script or am I imagining that?

[jaymes_e06]

I don't know how to describe but those good looks faded as the show went on. It's noticeable in season six and seven (current).
Yep. I don't watch the show much but I remember thinking how much better Alyson Hannigan looked than Cobie as the show went on which I recall thinking was odd because Aly was supposed to be the friend to the hot chick of the show but she's killing her game anymore.

[MarvelKnight]

You know you're hot when they have to dull your hotness to make someone else look prettier lol

[MarvelKnight]

Who would people have as WW mom?

[ЯɘvlveR]

depends who WW ends up being. if its j-law i think lynda carter would be pretty cool.

http://photos-2.posh24.com/p/1227102/lst/the_hunger_games/jennifer_lawrence_goes_brunette_for_the_hunger_gam es.jpg

http://images2.fanpop.com/images/photos/3300000/Lynda-Carter-wonder-woman-3310476-300-392.jpg


i like angie jolie for that part too.

http://www.flicksandbits.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/angelina-jolie-alexander.jpg

[roach]

I hope J-Law isn't cast...i am not a fan

[jmc]

Was Joss Whedon interested in casting Smulders while he was writing that WW script or am I imagining that?

He said it jokingly but her being in Avengers makes me think he may have been serious about her.

[jaymes_e06]

I hope J-Law isn't cast...i am not a fan
Why I oughta?:argh:

She's seriously better for WW then she is for Mystique imo.

[Hamill-Joker]

I am a fan of Jennifer Lawrence, just not as Wonder Woman. I just don't think she has the right look.

[DrCosmic]

J Law is an interesting choice. Another example of now that fans have seen it, all of a sudden she's acceptable. If I had suggested her after XMFC, sheesh. She's actually a great actress, and she's maybe a film and a half away from being able to headline stuff on her own. She'd be a great solid choice, I think. And she'd also cement the film as a film where the female lead is not just there to look hawt and kill stuff.

Who would people have as WW mom?

Angelina Jolie or Lucy Lawless. Great actresses, great fan-casting. Anything less would be a wasted opportunity imho. Lynda Carter can't pass for immortal anymore. She'd be a better fit for Julia Kapetalis, and I think she'd nail such a part much better, imho.

I am a fan of Jennifer Lawrence, just not as Wonder Woman. I just don't think she has the right look.

I don't want to pick on you, but this is a great example of nebulous disagreement that disappears once the actress dons a WW-like costume or plays a WW-like part.

[KRIM]

Would not change the fact that she's way too young for the part.

[jaymes_e06]

^Who told you they would go into production sometime soon?

Honestly we'll be lucky if it happens in the next 5-7 years she'll practically be to old by then.

[jmc]

It's funny just about every 20-something actress mention in this thread over the years is approaching 30 now. lol

[Lencho01]

I thought this was an interesting design with her having braided hair...

http://muddycolors.blogspot.com/2012/04/warrior-princess.html

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-3udLGMxKUso/T3pZqMTD1TI/AAAAAAAABjI/NIHjVQh9A3c/s1600/ww_final_low.jpg

[Hamill-Joker]

I don't want to pick on you, but this is a great example of nebulous disagreement that disappears once the actress dons a WW-like costume or plays a WW-like part.

I disagree. I don't think that Lawrence can look intimidating in the Wonder Woman costume, nor does her look fit the role in my opinion.

My opinion has always been that the actress who plays Wonder Woman should look more Greek. That is why I think the ideal actress to play Wonder Woman would look similar to Angie Harmon or Tonia Sotiropoulou.

[jmc]

I thought this was an interesting design with her having braided hair...

http://muddycolors.blogspot.com/2012/04/warrior-princess.html

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-3udLGMxKUso/T3pZqMTD1TI/AAAAAAAABjI/NIHjVQh9A3c/s1600/ww_final_low.jpg

I don't mind that look.

[Project862006]

she rocking the judge dredd shoulder pad!!

[TheComicbookKid]

Reminding me, I had a cool idea of how to visually represent the lasso piggybacking off something from Simone's run.

http://i.imgbox.com/aafhq98e.jpg (http://imgbox.com/aafhq98e)

[roach]

I just don't see WW in J-Law...guess thats me.
and Lynda Carter should be the mom on principle alone

[jmc]

Reminding me, I had a cool idea of how to visually represent the lasso piggybacking off something from Simone's run.

http://i.imgbox.com/aafhq98e.jpg (http://imgbox.com/aafhq98e)

I always thought a kind of Vulcan mind-meld thing would work visually.

[ЯɘvlveR]

whether its lawrence or anyone else, there probably isn't the ideal candidate out there. you're either going to get a novice who physical resembles what diana is supposed to look like or you're going to get someone who's got the chops to play her who doesn't necessarily look the way diana should.

[KRIM]

^Who told you they would go into production sometime soon?

Honestly we'll be lucky if it happens in the next 5-7 years she'll practically be to old by then.
The only way to sensibly discuss casting candidates would be under the presumption that production is in the foreseeable future. Otherwise, if you have no limits then discussing a 20 year old would have just as much efficiency as discussing a 5 year old. You cannot predict what an actress will be like several years down the line. You can however accurately assess what they have to offer now.

[jaymes_e06]

Yeah but that's the mentality that got us to where we're at with a lot of the actresses on the above poll and ten to fifteen years ago when Sandra Bullock and Lucy Lawless where candidates. You can think logically and intuitively without being over the top in your assumptions.

[Project862006]

so many great actors have been aged out due to how long this has taken

Monica Belluci
Angelina Jolie

for example would of been great in their prime

[KRIM]

Yeah but that's the mentality that got us to where we're at with a lot of the actresses on the above poll and ten to fifteen years ago when Sandra Bullock and Lucy Lawless where candidates. You can think logically and intuitively without being over the top in your assumptions.
...what? WB not greenlighting a movie is why the ship has sailed for many of these long-running candidates. It has nothing to do with casting for a particular period. Bullock and Lawless were absolutely appropriate choices given the time.

How exactly do you think signing actors for a part works? Roles are very rarely given out after a significant time of a contract being pinned.

[jmc]

To me the one that got away was Jennifer Connolly. She's 41 now, had a movie come out 6-7 years ago she would of been a great choice for a more seasoned WW, but you probably could of even done a tinkered origin story to incorporate a 30-something version of the character. I will say though she would probably be a great Hippolyta. If they ever cast that character the goal should be to find someone who could have been WW.

[jaymes_e06]

...what? WB not greenlighting a movie is why the ship has sailed for many of these long-running candidates. It has nothing to do with casting for a particular period. Bullock and Lawless were absolutely appropriate choices given the time.

How exactly do you think signing actors for a part works? Roles are very rarely given out after a significant time of a contract being pinned.

What are you talking about? I'm mearly stating that your logic says that we can't discuss anyone until they are exactly the right age with the right circumstances to play the part. I'm just pointing out that it isn't always that cut and dry.

I don't think you know how signing actors works because execs always want the next new and young thang so Jen Law would be idea casting especially for a franchise.

I agree with you last statement and have no idea what it is reffering too..:huh:

[batdude]

so many great actors have been aged out due to how long this has taken

Monica Belluci
Angelina Jolie

for example would of been great in their prime Catherine Zeta Jones too.

[Project862006]

i have noticed the lack of more exotic looking actresses these days but several years back there were quite a bit perfectly fit for WW

[KRIM]

What are you talking about? I'm mearly stating that your logic says that we can't discuss anyone until they are exactly the right age with the right circumstances to play the part. I'm just pointing out that it isn't always that cut and dry.
Precisely how is it helpful to discuss actresses that aren't the right age and in the wrong circumstances? None of us here have a magic eight-ball to let us peek into the future. I get that the prospects for a WW movie are slim right now, but if we are going to engage in discussing candidates, then it only makes sense to go with actors we know would be fitting now and the next couple of years. Beyond that is like a shot in the dark.

For example, I'd been a fan of Cavill for years. But not once did I throw my full support behind him for Supes (or Bond) until about '07-'08. I knew he had the chops and a look, but it was far too youthful at the time even when he was one of the main contenders. It's great that he did mature into the part, but even with this knowledge I still would not have cast him back during the MCG days. It wasn't his time.

I don't think you know how signing actors works because execs always want the next new and young thang so Jen Law would be idea casting especially for a franchise.
Every actress under 30 will be up for contention in this part. That is beside the point that a whole slew of them are girls as opposed to women. I'm not about to put my faith on an entire franchise on the hopes that a given actress might grow into the part.

[jmc]

I think every actresses ever mentioned in here has been well over 18. I don't even recall any under 20 for that matter.

[KRIM]

There have been plenty of early 20s being mentioned every now and then that I'd deem too young for this part. I should note however that I'm not necessarily talking about physical age. The two just correlate very well in most cases.

[HighFivingMF]

I think every actresses ever mentioned in here has been well over 18. I don't even recall any under 20 for that matter.

Just so I can be the first at something, Chloe Moretz. :o

[jaymes_e06]

Precisely how is it helpful to discuss actresses that aren't the right age and in the wrong circumstances? None of us here have a magic eight-ball to let us peek into the future. I get that the prospects for a WW movie are slim right now, but if we are going to engage in discussing candidates, then it only makes sense to go with actors we know would be fitting now and the next couple of years. Beyond that is like a shot in the dark.

For example, I'd been a fan of Cavill for years. But not once did I throw my full support behind him for Supes (or Bond) until about '07-'08. I knew he had the chops and a look, but it was far too youthful at the time even when he was one of the main contenders. It's great that he did mature into the part, but even with this knowledge I still would not have cast him back during the MCG days. It wasn't his time.


Every actress under 30 will be up for contention in this part. That is beside the point that a whole slew of them are girls as opposed to women. I'm not about to put my faith on an entire franchise on the hopes that a given actress might grow into the part.

What does it matter everyone thinks differently. I don't think a film will be made for at least another 5 years. So I suggest a girl who I feel would be good in that scope of time period. And even if they went into production tomorrow I'd still give my support to J-Law.

Who says WW has to look exactly 25? It would be more dynamic for her to be young looking because it would help convey her naivity without having to resort to doing over the top comedic things to make her look stupid.

[KRIM]

What does it matter everyone thinks differently. I don't think a film will be made for at least another 5 years. So I suggest a girl who I feel would be good in that scope of time period. And even if they went into production tomorrow I'd still give my support to J-Law.
It's no skin off my back who anyone supports. I'm just clarifying why I think it isn't so prudent to cast while an actor hasn't fully encapsulated the role at that time.

Who says WW has to look exactly 25? It would be more dynamic for her to be young looking because it would help convey her naivity without having to resort to doing over the top comedic things to make her look stupid.
You're pulling numbers out of thin air. I never specified any physical age. My only requirement is that she look young, but old enough that I can buy her as a mature woman. I'm not interested in watching yet another unqualified girl take on a leading role in these films.

Also, that last part you mentioned has nothing to do with youth.

[NigelHalsey]

so many great actors have been aged out due to how long this has taken

Monica Belluci
Angelina Jolie

for example would of been great in their prime

To me the one that got away was Jennifer Connolly. ...

Catherine Zeta Jones too.

Mine has always been Kate Beckinsale.

http://usemycomputer.com/indeximages/women/Kate.Beckinsale/magazine_unknown_Giant/.thumbnails/th-nerble_-_kate_beckinsale_giant_01.jpg (http://onlyhdwallpapers.com/wallpaper/kate_beckinsale_magazine_covers_giant_desktop_1180 x1526_wallpaper-224257.jpg)


Just so I can be the first at something, Chloe Moretz. :o

Elle Fanning!:woot:

http://blog.maskthemask.com/upload/ellefanning.jpg


Wait, how old is Diana anyway?

[jaymes_e06]

It's no skin off my back who anyone supports. I'm just clarifying why I think it isn't so prudent to cast while an actor hasn't fully encapsulated the role at that time.


But if I think they do encapsulate the role so why are we having this conversation?

You're pulling numbers out of thin air. I never specified any physical age. My only requirement is that she look young, but old enough that I can buy her as a mature woman. I'm not interested in watching yet another unqualified girl take on a leading role in these films.


What?:funny: Who says she's unqualified just because she's young? Jennifer Lawrence is probably one of the most accomplished actresses mentioned in years so I don't know what your getting at.


Also, that last part you mentioned has nothing to do with youth.

True but I seem to recall that that was one of the things critics said about Jeniffer's protrayal in THG was that she had an unjadded look about her that in my mind could work for WW.

[KRIM]

But if I think they do encapsulate the role so why are we having this conversation?
You tell me. I was making a general statement not directed toward anyone.

What?:funny: Who says she's unqualified just because she's young? Jennifer Lawrence is probably one of the most accomplished actresses mentioned in years so I don't know what your getting at.

She can act. Fantastic. Shes too young looking. Not fantastic. Therefore, I pass.

I can assure you I'm not the only one that feels this way. It doesn't matter if she excels at a single category. I want the full package, and to me she doesn't have that.

True but I seem to recall that that was one of the things critics said about Jeniffer's protrayal in THG was that she had an unjadded look about her that in my mind could work for WW.
That's thanks to acting talent, the script, and direction. Age isn't a factor in this regard, but portraying Diana as a woman is.

[ЯɘvlveR]

I can assure you I'm not the only one that feels this way. It doesn't matter if she excels at a single category. I want the full package, and to me she doesn't have that.


who do you think that is exactly?

[roach]

I am pretty sure there is a beautiful greek actress that we haven't heard of that would be perfect for the role

[ЯɘvlveR]

maybe, but for the purposes of this thread that isn't adding much.

[ЯɘvlveR]

what about caterina murino? too old? not good enough an actress? i think she looks the part.

http://tinyurl.com/blldefr

[jmc]

Aussie girl Zoe Ventoura is of Greek decent. 170cm, 31, solid actress.

http://ia.media-imdb.com/images/M/MV5BMTc2OTEzMDEzMV5BMl5BanBnXkFtZTcwMjgzMTMzNw@@._ V1._SX640_SY960_.jpg

[jaymes_e06]

who do you think that is exactly?
That's what I'm wondering.

[Venomfan]

casting threads remind me of highschool. it seems like you have to appease certain posters or the cool kids for a casting suggestion to stick

[ЯɘvlveR]

casting threads remind me of highschool. it seems like you have to appease certain posters or the cool kids for a casting suggestion to stick
yeah. i think its funny how every other page turns into a debate with someone disparaging someone Else's choice.

[Rockstar]

I'm still a fan of Pheobe Tonkin as Diana. She is perfect.

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm2100081/


http://ca.eonline.com/eol_images/Entire_Site/20111115/300.circle.ls.121511.jpg

http://cdn.buzznet.com/media/jjr/headlines/2011/11/phoebe-tonkin-airport.jpg

She comes off as quite mature for her age: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzX0UrFKd3g

Interesting that IMDB and a bunch of other sites list her as 5'10. I wonder if that's accurate.

[jmc]

She is quite tall, absolutely drop dead gorgeous girl, early 20's, and an Aussie (:woot:) but not great in the acting department.

[ЯɘvlveR]

she looks like she could be angie's (as hippolyta) daughter.

[Rockstar]

Back on the topic of Hayley Atwell. Some were saying she wouldn't be tall enough for WW.

This is her in heels next to 6'2 Craig Ferguson.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJShuatgUsQ


I think she works.

http://junglemagazine.com/img/people/30-ask-women/30-ask-women02.jpg

http://latimesherocomplex.files.wordpress.com/2011/08/hayley-atwell3.jpg?w=600&h=437

[Majik1387]

People to this day still refuse to acknowledge that height is an easy issue to work with in film. You can show them undeniable visual proof of behind the scenes photos, and they still will pay no mind to it, thinking to themselves that they'll need to spend too much money on CGI. It's a sad way of thinking.

[roach]

agreed Tom Cruise is 4'2" and looks 6' in movies

[Project862006]

People to this day still refuse to acknowledge that height is an easy issue to work with in film. You can show them undeniable visual proof of behind the scenes photos, and they still will pay no mind to it, thinking to themselves that they'll need to spend too much money on CGI. It's a sad way of thinking.
people keep on comparing it to carter's 5'10-5'11 frame but people also forget lynda was also very skinny

i think a shorter 5'6 actress but who put on some muscle and has a very toned body they will come across very imposing as WW similair to how lynn collins did in JC

[roach]

actually now that you mention it Lynn Collins might make a good WW

[Majik1387]

No, she wouldn't.

[Project862006]

^yes she would

[DoomsdayApex]

My leading candidates still are Yvonne Strahovski, Charlotte Sullivan, Emily Blunt, Taylor Cole, Jaime Alexander, Gemma Arterton, Sofya Skya and Haley Atwell.

[DarkSovereignty]

for me it'd be a toss up between lynn collins, jennifer lawrence or haley atwell.

[Rodrigo90]

Tonia Sotiropoulou

[terry78]

Que?

[Rodrigo90]

That new Bond chick in Skyfall.

[NigelHalsey]

People to this day still refuse to acknowledge that height is an easy issue to work with in film. You can show them undeniable visual proof of behind the scenes photos, and they still will pay no mind to it, thinking to themselves that they'll need to spend too much money on CGI. It's a sad way of thinking.

Sad but true.

http://www.myliftkits.com/wp-content/uploads//2011/08/rdj-im2.jpg

Downey on the IRON MAN set.

[Majik1387]

I'd throw Lauren Cohan's name in the mix. She's awesome on Walking Dead, she had a great run in Vampire Diaries, she exudes the beauty and strength necessary for the role.

[Isub_Zero]

Sad but true.
Downey on the IRON MAN set.

Remind me how many hand to hand combats Downey's had on Iron Man...

[NigelHalsey]

Remind me how many hand to hand combats Downey's had on Iron Man...

Point taken. But I don't think the height issue will be noticeable during fight scenes. An actress standing at 5'8" could easily look taller using practical movie magic.

[Any Carolina]

My leading candidates still are Yvonne Strahovski, Charlotte Sullivan, Emily Blunt, Taylor Cole, Jaime Alexander, Gemma Arterton, Sofya Skya and Haley Atwell.

My list is very similiar Emily, Andrea, Charlotte, Gemma, Sofya and Yvonne, but if my calculations are correct, and this film only come into podução in 8 years or more, Jennifer Lawrence is my favorite, since she will be free of their franchises and its age, will more than adequate, outside talent, beauty and versatility.

[ЯɘvlveR]

an actress standing 5'8 would be a ideal if the whole JL thing gets off the ground and cavill's still supes.

[Isub_Zero]

Point taken. But I don't think the height issue will be noticeable during fight scenes. An actress standing at 5'8" could easily look taller using practical movie magic.

5'8 is a good height. The problem is with less then 5'7.

[Majik1387]

The problem is there is no problem, so you guys are trying to make one.

[DoomsdayApex]

My list is very similiar Emily, Andrea, Charlotte, Gemma, Sofya and Yvonne, but if my calculations are correct, and this film only come into podução in 8 years or more, Jennifer Lawrence is my favorite, since she will be free of their franchises and its age, will more than adequate, outside talent, beauty and versatility.

I love me some JenLaw, but I just don't see her as Wonder Woman. Her face doesn't scream out Diana Prince.

[Majik1387]

Agreed, and I don't think any sort of make up will make her look it either.

[jaymes_e06]

Wow the conversation really went down hill since I was last here.

[Lencho01]

I don't mind that look.

I just remembered that she had braided hair in the DCUO trailer...

H7Nf-m6WGl4&ob

[DrCosmic]

It's really sad to me how rarely acting skill is thrown in with these picks. It's like people just want a Wonder Woman to look at, and don't care if it's actually a great movie or not. :cmad:

I'm still a fan of Pheobe Tonkin as Diana. She is perfect.

As eye candy, sure. As an actress who can bring home a dynamic loveable intense character? She isn't anything close to perfect.

The problem is there is no problem, so you guys are trying to make one.

^Agreed. I remember when people complained about Batman and Superman actors because they weren't 6'6" like in the comics. These really are non-issues.

Her face doesn't scream out Diana Prince.

Is this actually anything? Is there some Diana-ish facial similarity between any of your choices?

[Dark Raven]

I'd throw Lauren Cohan's name in the mix. She's awesome on Walking Dead, she had a great run in Vampire Diaries, she exudes the beauty and strength necessary for the role.

I saw her in Chuck. She was playing Volkov's daughter. She was pretty hot. Not sure she really looked like Wonder Woman in that series though. I'd have to see her with black hair.

[Hamill-Joker]

I think that whoever plays Wonder Woman will likely be an actress that is not being suggested, possibly an unknown.

I look at a movie like Thor and two actors that I never knew before, Hemsworth and Hiddleston, ended up doing great in the roles they were given. Especially Hiddleston in my opinion, I thought he was the highlight of the film.

I think when casting it would be best to look for a foreign actress, likely of Greek decent.

[ЯɘvlveR]

It's really sad to me how rarely acting skill is thrown in with these picks. It's like people just want a Wonder Woman to look at, and don't care if it's actually a great movie or not. :cmad:



i think alot of people here sound very hypocritical. one minute they slag off someone else's choice all the while suggesting actresses as if they're on some meryl streep's level type ****.



Is this actually anything? Is there some Diana-ish facial similarity between any of your choices? i don't get that either. last i recall lynda carter had soft features, and that's the wondy just about everyone knows. and about lawrence, she's practically blunt's blond doppelganger.

i'd bet that if this project gets off the ground, lawrence will be at the top of WB's list.

[DoomsdayApex]

Is this actually anything? Is there some Diana-ish facial similarity between any of your choices?

Yes, everything from her facial features to her voice is not what I envisioned for Wonder Woman.

Take one of my picks -- Charlotte Sullivan, for example. Not only is Charlotte beautiful and talented but her facial features undoubtedly hold more Wonder Woman-esque attributes than Jennifer Lawrence does.

http://www4.images.coolspotters.com/wallpapers/97565/charlotte-sullivan-mobile-wallpaper.jpg

http://www4.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Charlotte+Sullivan+Premiere+ReelzChannel+Kennedys+ Zl5CJPTfSZSl.jpg

[jaymes_e06]

Yes, everything from her facial features to her voice is not what I envisioned for Wonder Woman.

Take one of my picks -- Charlotte Sullivan, for example. Not only is Charlotte beautiful and talented but her facial features undoubtedly hold more Wonder Woman-esque attributes than Jennifer Lawrence does.

http://www4.images.coolspotters.com/wallpapers/97565/charlotte-sullivan-mobile-wallpaper.jpg

http://www4.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Charlotte+Sullivan+Premiere+ReelzChannel+Kennedys+ Zl5CJPTfSZSl.jpg
I'll give you that she does look like the more modern interpretation of how she is usually conveyed but JL looks like the original Diana very delicate features and less severe looking. I think both look like Diana it's just that your associations are different when you think of her.


PS,
I'm going to be putting my hat in and try my hand at a WW concept that I'll post tomorrow. I'll get more into it tomorrow but I basically wanted to honor the original design and give it more of a warrior motif and keep it as iconic, yet battle ready, and sexy as I could. These two looks where my main inspirations for the re-design.
http://i41.tinypic.com/jjtrtk.jpg
http://i43.tinypic.com/r9lbmu.jpg

Wish me luck.:yay:

[Project862006]

It's really sad to me how rarely acting skill is thrown in with these picks. It's like people just want a Wonder Woman to look at, and don't care if it's actually a great movie or not. :cmad:

based on what i have seen the following suggestions lately

Haley Atwell
Lynn Collins
Gemma Artreton
Emily Blunt
Jamie Alexander

just to name a few

pretty sure all of them aren't just pretty to look at

[DrCosmic]

based on what i have seen the following suggestions lately

Haley Atwell
Lynn Collins
Gemma Artreton
Emily Blunt
Jamie Alexander

just to name a few

pretty sure all of them aren't just pretty to look at

I guess we're reading different threads. I see a lot more than those suggestions, and I don't see many (any) more of significant acting talent.


Yes, everything from her facial features to her voice is not what I envisioned for Wonder Woman.

Take one of my picks -- Charlotte Sullivan, for example. Not only is Charlotte beautiful and talented but her facial features undoubtedly hold more Wonder Woman-esque attributes than Jennifer Lawrence does.

I'm not talking about J-Law or Sullivan, I'm talking about all of your choices. They're too different to possibly all exhibit Diana features.

[jmc]

Charlotte's purrrty. That is all. :)

[mhenshaw]

Yes, everything from her facial features to her voice is not what I envisioned for Wonder Woman.

Take one of my picks -- Charlotte Sullivan, for example. Not only is Charlotte beautiful and talented but her facial features undoubtedly hold more Wonder Woman-esque attributes than Jennifer Lawrence does.

I love that people have their favorites, and it's fun to dream; but when the time comes, there will be other factors involved in the casting that have nothing to do with how much the chosen actress looks like the fans' idealized version of WW.

Hollywood, as a general rule, isn't going to care nearly as much as we do whether the chosen actress looks like the traditional version of Wonder Woman.

For Hollywood, an actress's "bankability" trumps virtually all other considerations. Possible fan backlash against an actress who is too far off the "WW look" will create some constraints, but, believe me, as far as Hollywood is concerned, if the actress is white, reasonably curvy, and looks pretty with dark hair, that'll be good enough for them if she's "bankable." Jennifer Lawrence meets those criteria, and given how blazing hot her career is right now, if it came down to a choice between JL and Charlotte Sullivan, Sullivan would have zero chance. "Oscar-nominated actress whose career is on fire with two major franchises under her belt, or a C-list actress who's been on some TV shows, none of which was ever a major hit. Hmmm...which to choose?"

I think you know how that will end. The only way around this is if the WW movie ended up in the hands of a big name producer and/or director (a la Christopher Nolan) who had carte blanche to make the movie however he wanted. If WB trusted the producer, he'd have a free hand to pick his leading lady. If it's some lesser producer/director, his choice would have to meet the studio's approval; and the bigger the movie's budget (and potential profits/losses), the more influence WB will bring to bear.

[DoomsdayApex]

1.) C- actress? Whew, thank god you're not a decision-making executive. She was just recently nominated for Best Supporting Actress at the Canadian version of The Oscars.

2.) The studios and/or directors will weigh their options but you can't honestly sit there and say they make the 'right' selections every time. For instance, DeNiro was nearly Odin, Duchovny and Tatum were mere heartbeats away from becoming Hulk and Captain America.

While Lawrance is a great young actress, there is absolutely nothing about her that radiates of Diana Prince, other than her curves. It's the equivalent of suggesting Efron (a young actor everyone seems to love on this site) for Bruce Wayne.

[mhenshaw]

1.) C- actress? Whew, thank god you're not a decision-making executive. She was just recently nominated for Best Supporting Actress at the Canadian version of The Oscars.

Apologies to our Canadian friends, but that nomination won't carry much weight with American Hollywood studio executives. While it shows the girl can act--I'm not saying she's not talented--you can probably count the number of American moviegoers who even know what the Canadian Oscars are called on one hand. So, nomination aside, Sullivan is still effectively an unknown to US moviegoing audiences and the US audience typically accounts for ~50% of an action movie's box office receipts. Until she has a large role in a movie or show that is a US hit, that will weigh heavily on studio execs' perceptions of her bankability.

2.) The studios and/or directors will weigh their options but you can't honestly sit there and say they make the 'right' selections every time. For instance, DeNiro was nearly Odin, Duchovny and Tatum were mere heartbeats away from becoming Hulk and Captain America.

I'm not saying that they make the right decisions--quite the opposite. I am saying that the criteria by which they make casting choices aren't the same criteria by which we fans wish they would make casting choices; and those criteria explain why Hollywood makes so many crap casting choices.

We fans are looking at things like resemblance to the character, acting ability, physicality, etc. They're going to be looking at stuff like, "how many hit movies and TV shows has she been in? How many magazine covers has she been on? What's been the financial performance of the movies she's starred in? What do the critics think about her acting?" This is a business to them. It's all about money, so they're going to give preference to actors who've proven they can sell tickets and everything else is secondary. We'll be lucky if physical resemblance to the character, talent, and physicality even make the top ten on their lists.

How do you think Halle Berry got cast as Catwoman?

While Lawrance is a great young actress, there is absolutely nothing about her that radiates of Diana Prince, other than her curves. It's the equivalent of suggesting Efron (a young actor everyone seems to love on this site) for Bruce Wayne.

I wouldn't compare her to Efron--Lawrence has ten times the acting talent of Efron--but I do understand your point. I even sympathize with it. But Hollywood execs won't sympathize with it and that's the point. Lawrence's latest role as an action star is putting people's butts in theater seats and that would trump most other considerations in the studio execs' minds.

Face it--if you were going to be personally on the hook for the success or failure of a comic book movie with a $100 million+ budget, you too would be thinking about whether a hot actress with a track record of hit movies wouldn't improve your chances of the movie becoming a profitable. And if you didn't really understand the comic book character's appeal in the first place...

[jaymes_e06]

1.) C- actress? Whew, thank god you're not a decision-making executive. She was just recently nominated for Best Supporting Actress at the Canadian version of The Oscars.

2.) The studios and/or directors will weigh their options but you can't honestly sit there and say they make the 'right' selections every time. For instance, DeNiro was nearly Odin, Duchovny and Tatum were mere heartbeats away from becoming Hulk and Captain America.

While Lawrance is a great young actress, there is absolutely nothing about her that radiates of Diana Prince, other than her curves. It's the equivalent of suggesting Efron (a young actor everyone seems to love on this site) for Bruce Wayne.

1) Who gives a crap? No one but the people who esoterically follow her career would know that. Nor do people look at the "Canadian Oscars" to scout for talent in Hollywood. :whatever:

2) Did you not read the post? His points were valid no one in there right mind would give a franchise to a virtual unknown.

Dude your exaggerating immensly. At the end of the day the producers will go with someone who will sell the movie rather than one who fits Diana's visage to a t.

[ЯɘvlveR]

I love that people have their favorites, and it's fun to dream; but when the time comes, there will be other factors involved in the casting that have nothing to do with how much the chosen actress looks like the fans' idealized version of WW.

Hollywood, as a general rule, isn't going to care nearly as much as we do whether the chosen actress looks like the traditional version of Wonder Woman.

For Hollywood, an actress's "bankability" trumps virtually all other considerations. Possible fan backlash against an actress who is too far off the "WW look" will create some constraints, but, believe me, as far as Hollywood is concerned, if the actress is white, reasonably curvy, and looks pretty with dark hair, that'll be good enough for them if she's "bankable." Jennifer Lawrence meets those criteria, and given how blazing hot her career is right now, if it came down to a choice between JL and Charlotte Sullivan, Sullivan would have zero chance. "Oscar-nominated actress whose career is on fire with two major franchises under her belt, or a C-list actress who's been on some TV shows, none of which was ever a major hit. Hmmm...which to choose?"

I think you know how that will end. The only way around this is if the WW movie ended up in the hands of a big name producer and/or director (a la Christopher Nolan) who had carte blanche to make the movie however he wanted. If WB trusted the producer, he'd have a free hand to pick his leading lady. If it's some lesser producer/director, his choice would have to meet the studio's approval; and the bigger the movie's budget (and potential profits/losses), the more influence WB will bring to bear.

*starts slow clap*

[ЯɘvlveR]

I'll give you that she does look like the more modern interpretation of how she is usually conveyed but JL looks like the original Diana very delicate features and less severe looking. I think both look like Diana it's just that your associations are different when you think of her.


PS,
I'm going to be putting my hat in and try my hand at a WW concept that I'll post tomorrow. I'll get more into it tomorrow but I basically wanted to honor the original design and give it more of a warrior motif and keep it as iconic, yet battle ready, and sexy as I could. These two looks where my main inspirations for the re-design.
http://i41.tinypic.com/jjtrtk.jpg
http://i43.tinypic.com/r9lbmu.jpg

Wish me luck.:yay:

what kind of a face will you give her? I'd like to see J-law's face in those if you don't mind that suggestion.

[DoomsdayApex]

1.) Yes, then who gives a flying s**t about the Oscars then? :o

The point is she can act and has proven it on more than occasion.

2.) Ahem... Chris Hemsworth, Brandon Routh, Eric Bana, Hugh Jackman, Hayden Christenson, Daniel Craig, Christian Bale, Sam Worthington were all virtually unknown to the general audience as well when they nabbed their leading roles. Point?

Your logic here cites that studios would only be looking towards one direction when selecting a lead. That's just not true though.

[DoomsdayApex]

@mhenshaw:

I don't disagree with your points. In fact, I concede to several of them, especially when arriving to the studio selection process. Hollywood sometimes tends to go for an actor/actress that resembles a figure or character, and sometimes it goes in the opposite direction. So, it's arduous to try and predict which way WB would go with selecting a Wonder Woman candidate. JenLaw could very well be an actress that WB would consider just because of accomplishments and current popularity levels.

[jaymes_e06]

1.) Yes, then who gives a flying s**t about the Oscars then? :o

The point is she can act and has proven it on more than occasion.

2.) Ahem... Chris Hemsworth, Brandon Routh, Eric Bana, Hugh Jackman, Hayden Christenson, Daniel Craig, Christian Bale, Sam Worthington were all virtually unknown to the general audience as well when they nabbed their leading roles. Point?

Your logic here cites that studios would only be looking towards one direction when selecting a lead. That's just not true though.
1) No me but Hollywood execs do. I could give a flying **** about who gets a rigged Oscar anyway. I don't dissagree she can act just your logic was lacking IMO.

2) You realize you only shown men here. Female led films seem destined to fail that's why a fail safe is someone who has proven that they could open a movie by themselves. J Law is virtually the only one who has done this in recen history who is not over 30.

I agree. As mhenshaw has stated. It could be situational too. Like if a really prolific producer a la Chris Nolan put his 100% faith in an unknown no one would bat an eyelash but we don't hav that situation at the moment.

[jaymes_e06]

what kind of a face will you give her? I'd like to see J-law's face in those if you don't mind that suggestion.
It's already done but I realized after I drew it that it looked like Jen Law without me purposfully trying to use her as refrence.:wow:

I'll post it in about 30 minutes if the scanner at my school works right today.

[Majik1387]

I saw her in Chuck. She was playing Volkov's daughter. She was pretty hot. Not sure she really looked like Wonder Woman in that series though. I'd have to see her with black hair.
The closest she's come to having black hair has been in Vampire Diaries, it has shades of brunette in this pic, but it looked more black throughout her run on the show.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v338/Majik1387/as-rose.jpg

[jaymes_e06]

Sorry it took so long. Here it is plus a rundown of why I made my choices for the look.
http://i44.tinypic.com/2h4w0p4.png
First lets start off by saying I hate the stars in the armor it serves no purpose other than to relate it to america and I always saw Diana as a embassador of all people not just to the US. So I ditched that entirely. I went instead with the symbol of the bird on her chest and took it further.

I always felt the bird/ was a very important part of her armor before the more modern interpretations that are more like two w's sitting on top of each other. Also I thought it feminized the bodice a bit more by how round it was as opposed to the harder edges the more modern takes have made. I felt that, in the story in my head, a bird, simular to a phoenix was a native animal and they don't worship it or anything but it is a mark of their people in general.

So that is where my inspiration of the gladiatoresque look of the golden bird look comes in. Also her classic look with the more rounded edges took was somthing I wanted to look at. Making the breast plate kind of have the basic shape but kind of injoining with her arm armor became the focus of the look and kind of made everything else flow better.

Also I wanted to try to keep it as iconic as possible by keeping things that look like WW but might be taken a bit more seriously on a warrior of her calibre. I wanted something that covered her and was acutally armor but was kind of sexy too. I'm not sure if I accomplished that part you'll have to be the judges of that but yeah.


The new things I intergrated was probably the crown and how it seems a bit more jagged. I liked how it felt like it was broken and war torn yet still royal. The choker I wanted the bird not the star to be there and for it to agian have a jagged feel to give that warrior vibe. I went with the gauntlets that were from JMS's run, again keeping with the bird theme.

How it would look in action:
http://i44.tinypic.com/1zq334o.png

I was also going to ask, because I cant make up my mind, which boots do you think fit this look the most?
http://i42.tinypic.com/51rmc.png

[mhenshaw]

2.) Ahem... Chris Hemsworth, Brandon Routh, Eric Bana, Hugh Jackman, Hayden Christenson, Daniel Craig, Christian Bale, Sam Worthington were all virtually unknown to the general audience as well when they nabbed their leading roles. Point?

Your logic here cites that studios would only be looking towards one direction when selecting a lead. That's just not true though.

I think that most of your examples reinforce the idea that whoever the producer and director are will go a long way to determining whether the lead actress in a WW movie ends up being an actress chosen primarily for "bankability" or one chosen because she actually a good fit for the role.

In 2006, Christian Bale was not an unknown. He had a long resume and was highly regarded in Hollywood as a great actor who was ripe for a big break. Christopher Nolan was equally well regarded as a fine director who was ready to take on a major franchise which gave him some leeway in casting Bale.

Hemsworth got Thor because Kenneth Branaugh was the director and Branaugh has carte blanche in Hollywood to do what he wants. A guy who can make a hit out of an original Shakespeare play without changing the dialogue is a guy you don't second guess on anything.

Brandon Routh is cited in Hollywood as one of the reasons why you *don't* cast an unknown in a leading role in a major franchise. He did a great job, but in the aftermath a lot of Hollywood execs were thinking, "might Superman Returns have performed better if Singer had cast someone better known in the lead?"

Hayden Christensen—picked because George Lucas was self-financing the Star Wars prequels and could cast whoever he wanted with no studio pressure whatsoever.

Etc etc etc. I'm much more worried about who the producer and director will be. Get the right producer and director and we'll end up with a great actress. Get the wrong ones, and we'll end up with Lady Gaga as WW.

[Artistsean]

After seeing her on Law and Order, I think she could play Wonder Woman:
http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z193/hydo-kun/alana-de-la-garza.jpg
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i306/jillianhallfan/Graphics%20and%20Stuff/Alana.jpg
http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/ff474/GwenBrady/Up%20for%20Grabs/94564_D0234Cliff20Lipson.jpg
I think she has the looks, and since she was good enough for Law and Order I think she would be good enough for Wonder Woman.
I know she is 36, and maybe considered too old, but I think DC's characters like Batman, Wonder Woman, and Superman can be cast a bit older since they seem older in the comics. And, and, Robert Downey Jr. was cast as Iron Man and he is older than that and it worked.

[Majik1387]

Too waify for my liking.

[Rockstar]

We're back in 2005.

[Artistsean]

I just think she has the look, and the poise or whatever that Wonder Woman has (at least in most things I have seen her in) and like Hemsworth (spelling?) who played Thor she could build muscle and work out and stuff to be more physically fit to be Wonder Woman.

[BruceWanner]

After seeing her on Law and Order, I think she could play Wonder Woman:
http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z193/hydo-kun/alana-de-la-garza.jpg
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i306/jillianhallfan/Graphics%20and%20Stuff/Alana.jpg
http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/ff474/GwenBrady/Up%20for%20Grabs/94564_D0234Cliff20Lipson.jpg
I think she has the looks, and since she was good enough for Law and Order I think she would be good enough for Wonder Woman.
I know she is 36, and maybe considered too old, but I think DC's characters like Batman, Wonder Woman, and Superman can be cast a bit older since they seem older in the comics. And, and, Robert Downey Jr. was cast as Iron Man and he is older than that and it worked.
Speaking of Law & Order alumni, IMO Milena Govich is a very good template for how an actress cast as Wonder Woman should look.
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1950996/

[The Guard]

In 2006, Christian Bale was not an unknown. He had a long resume and was highly regarded in Hollywood as a great actor who was ripe for a big break. Christopher Nolan was equally well regarded as a fine director who was ready to take on a major franchise which gave him some leeway in casting Bale.

He was a known entity in Hollywood. But Hollywood doesn't pay for the tickets to make Hollywood money. Christian Bale is something of an anomaly in my mind. Many people had seen films he was in, such as EMPIRE OF THE SUN and NEWSIES, which he gained a lot of recognition for, and AMERICAN PSYCHO, and he had a decent resume, but at the time he was cast, he was still something of an unknown to most people. He wasn't anything approaching a known star. I don't think THE MACHINEST had come out yet, had it?

[Artistsean]

He was a known entity in Hollywood. But Hollywood doesn't pay for the tickets to make Hollywood money. Christian Bale is something of an anomaly in my mind. Many people had seen films he was in, such as EMPIRE OF THE SUN and NEWSIES, which he gained a lot of recognition for, and AMERICAN PSYCHO, and he had a decent resume, but at the time he was cast, he was still something of an unknown to most people. He wasn't anything approaching a known star. I don't think THE MACHINEST had come out yet, had it?
But he had been in lots of movies ever since he was a little kid, and not just a bunch of kid movies or easy parts, these were like dramatic hardcore roles I think. So I think when Nolan cast him he wasn't worried about the box office draw but more about his acting ability and whether or not Bale could pull off the type of movie Nolan wanted probably.

[mhenshaw]

He was a known entity in Hollywood. But Hollywood doesn't pay for the tickets to make Hollywood money. Christian Bale is something of an anomaly in my mind. Many people had seen films he was in, such as EMPIRE OF THE SUN and NEWSIES, which he gained a lot of recognition for, and AMERICAN PSYCHO, and he had a decent resume, but at the time he was cast, he was still something of an unknown to most people. He wasn't anything approaching a known star.

Yeah, he definitely wasn't considered a star; but in Hollywood he was perceived as very much having paid his dues and having the talent to carry a movie (or franchise); he just needed that big break, which Batman Begins provided. And Nolan had the influence and cred to cast him in the role when other, bigger-name actors wanted it.

The problem here is that most of the actresses being talked about on this forum don't have half the resume Bale did in 2005 and certainly aren't perceived in Hollywood as having paid the dues to deserve a leading franchise role or having demonstrated sufficient talent to carry a big movie. Maybe they can, maybe they can't, but Hollywood execs usually aren't excited about giving the lead franchise role to someone who's resume is populated largely with guest-starring roles on mediocre sitcoms and short-lived TV dramas. And I'm always amazed how many fans here don't want to accept that reality. An unknown actress can certainly give a mind-blowing audition and get the part, but that's the rare exception, not the rule for big franchise movies with $100 million+ budgets.


I don't think THE MACHINEST had come out yet, had it?

It had come out the year before. It was the last movie Bale shot before moving on to Batman Begins. He went from 130 pounds to 230 pounds in less than a year. There's a guy who is willing to suffer for his art.