Superman vs. Captain Marvel

[Kronocide]

Who is the most powerful? I'm obviously talking of the original Captain Marvel. SHAZAM!

Captain Marvel is officially "the world's mightiest mortal," but that's not really taking Superman into account.

Yet, Captain Marvel is not a freak of physics, but endorsed with divine powers, which is a difference in my mind.

Also, in Kingdom Come, Captain Marvel has twice the chin size and twice the chest size of Superman (and Alex Ross must be an authority, right?), and he seems stronger.

It's easy to tell I'm a Captain Marvel fan, and my vote is on him. What about you?

Some inspiration:
Superman vs Shazam (http://www.supermantv.net/wallpaperbattles/shazam.htm)

[Kronocide]

Noticed that there is already a thread for this under DC Comics.

[JSPIDEY]

Captain Marvel isn't Stronger. He is almost as strong as Superman but he is below his level. Size doesn't mean everything. Superman is the most powerful.

[Superman]

Superman :)

[TheCorpulent1]

Seriously, when did chest and chin size become a factor in anything? If they were, Jay Leno would be able to crush concrete with his bare hands. :eek: ;)

Anyway, as I said in the DC forum thread, Captain Marvel seems like he'd come out on top. Old-fashioned fisticuffs on the same level with Superman coupled with a well-placed magic lightning bolt or 2 would be tough for Supes to overcome.

[Kronocide]

If chin size doesn't mean anything in superhero comics, then when does it ever? Of course it means something. At least when it comes to these guys. :D Seriuosly though, see my post in the thread under DC.

[Eyeballing]

from what ive heard capt marvel handed supes his ass to him in Kingdom come since i havent read it yet ill take everyones word for it, but i also remember people saying that supes was a bad mo fo in that story as well

[Varient]

Originally posted by dark_knight_fan
from what ive heard capt marvel handed supes his ass to him in Kingdom come since i havent read it yet ill take everyones word for it, but i also remember people saying that supes was a bad mo fo in that story as well
Eeeh,..
Supes held back throughout Kingdom Come until billy red pants -w- gold trim started using the magic lighting.

It was obvious that if supes wasn't so squeamish about taking life or maiming folk that Shazam would've been toast.

[Eyeballing]

i was wondering if he was holding back because supes ALWAYS seems to hold back, but like i said i have yet to read the story so i dont know for sre. Also if supes is so damn fast, flying, running and just his movement period wouldnt he be able to just use his super speed and stand up hit Capt Marvel with one good shot before he could strike him with a lighting bolt? because even if the lighting bolt and supes travel at the same speed if supes gets going first he would reach capt marvel first wouldnt he?

[Morg]

Superman

[Kronocide]

Originally posted by Varient
Eeeh,..
Supes held back throughout Kingdom Come until billy red pants -w- gold trim started using the magic lighting.

It was obvious that if supes wasn't so squeamish about taking life or maiming folk that Shazam would've been toast.

(For the last time, his name is Cpt. Marvel! Shazam is a GOD.) How was this obvious? In the scene right before they meet, Supes is going full speed (the air around him is being scorched) and Marvel is a red streak to him. There are no signs that Superman is holding back in the ensuing fight. I'm not saying KC is consistent with other stories, but in that story, Marvel beats Supes into the ground with a grin on his face.

[Varient]

Originally posted by Kronocide
(For the last time, his name is Cpt. Marvel! Shazam is a GOD.) How was this obvious? In the scene right before they meet, Supes is going full speed (the air around him is being scorched) and Marvel is a red streak to him. There are no signs that Superman is holding back in the ensuing fight. I'm not saying KC is consistent with other stories, but in that story, Marvel beats Supes into the ground with a grin on his face.
My bad,...Cap'n Marvel then.


On Topic:

Throughout his history as a hero,...and underlined in kingdom come,..... Superman holds back his full powers in almost every confrontation.

He is always adjusting his abilities to suit.
CM was only a blur to Kal-El until HE got serious,...how else could he reach up between Lightning strikes and clamp CM's jaw shut?

Ya'll just wanna put a dude who's powers put him between Wonder Woman and the Martian Manhunter up next to Superman w/o considering which hero is known for not going full out.

Peace.

[Kronocide]

Throughout his history as a hero,...and underlined in kingdom come,..... Superman holds back his full powers in almost every confrontation.

Well, he'd know he doesn't have to hold back against Marvel. Also, they have met before, and even if Supes generally wins, he's not been holding back. He would lose if he did.

I don't know where you get that Marvel is between WW and Martian Manhunter, but originally (and in KC) he is "the world's mightiest mortal." Maybe Waid is more true to the original Captain Marvel than the later DC variant, but I'd say he is at least an even match for Supes. He is said to be able to "match Superman's every move." And face it, he does beat Superman in Kingdom Come. To claim that Supes is holding back, while he's losing the fight and armageddon arrives because of it, is just not a credible interpretation.

http://utterly.org/cm_vs_supes.jpg

[Varient]

Originally posted by Kronocide
Throughout his history as a hero,...and underlined in kingdom come,..... Superman holds back his full powers in almost every confrontation.

Well, he'd know he doesn't have to hold back against Marvel. Also, they have met before, and even if Supes generally wins, he's not been holding back. He would lose if he did.

I don't know where you get that Marvel is between WW and Martian Manhunter, but originally (and in KC) he is "the world's mightiest mortal." Maybe Waid is more true to the original Captain Marvel than the later DC variant, but I'd say he is at least an even match for Supes. He is said to be able to "match Superman's every move." And face it, he does beat Superman in Kingdom Come. To claim that Supes is holding back, while he's losing the fight and armageddon arrives because of it, is just not a credible interpretation.

http://utterly.org/cm_vs_supes.jpg

(smile)
Superman has even mentioned to the side in his own comics that sometimes he holds back too much, hence the ability for folk in his power range to tag him.

Even against Wonder Woman and the Martian,..Supes figurativly ties one arm behind his back.
In CM's case - It was magic lightning until supes clamped his mouth shut.
A more pragmatic man would have snapped his neck and been done with it with a nuke on the way,..but the point of Kingdom come was all about restraint.

CM was trying to beat Superman,.... Supes was trying to save the world, (like usual), Do you really think that if they threw down seriously that CM has even a fair chance to beat sumbody who by Kingdom Come was almost completly immune to his greatest weakness?

[Kronocide]

Well, Marvel was also under the hypnotic influence of Luthor. Not all there, as it were. If he had been, he hadn't been silly enough to transform back to Billy while fighting Superman. So you might say that he was holding back too.

Anyway, I can see no signs of restraint with Supes in that fight. If he actually held back and failed his mission, letting hundreds of people die because of it, it would seem like he's incapable of using his full force, so that would make the question of what he can really do academic. And of course, Marvel's lightning isn't "cheating" or anything, it's part of his powers.

[Guyverjay]

Oh please superman was getting his ass kicked plain and simple. I wouldn't mind so much if marvel was going all out. But he wasn''t even trying:o

[the defenders]

Spectre coulda w00ped em all right there and then

[3dman27]

holey moley cap wins this one he'll wax kal-el like a hardwood floor

[mg_productions]

Isn't one of supes weaknesses magic?Where does Captain Marvel get his powers from?
Sides that,let's break this down a little bit.Superman is an alien with all kinds of powers right.Good,gravy,whatever.
Captain Marvel gets his powers from gods.Not abnormally strong people, from gods.The strength of Hercules,etc. So,he's not as powerful as A god.He's as powerful as several gods.Would this not relegate to a serious ass whupping of an alien or does this mean that an alien is stronger than gods.
This arguement can be taken with Thor of the Marvel universe too.Shouldn't Thor be able to kick everyones ass?He's a damn god for heaven's sake(no pun intended) Maybe it's just me but when someone has the power of a god (or numerous gods) he should be able to hand a lot of people a lot of asses.(Nice mental note by the way;)

[Varient]

Originally posted by Kronocide
Well, Marvel was also under the hypnotic influence of Luthor. Not all there, as it were. If he had been, he hadn't been silly enough to transform back to Billy while fighting Superman. So you might say that he was holding back too.

Anyway, I can see no signs of restraint with Supes in that fight. If he actually held back and failed his mission, letting hundreds of people die because of it, it would seem like he's incapable of using his full force, so that would make the question of what he can really do academic. And of course, Marvel's lightning isn't "cheating" or anything, it's part of his powers.
Cheating?
Who said that?

Anyway, lets agree to disagree, I doubt I will ever read/see an all out fight between these two that could resolve the issue.
Any fight they have - one or the other would have to be mind fuzzed in some way to even think about it.

Peace.

[Varient]

Originally posted by guyverjay
Oh please superman was getting his ass kicked plain and simple. I wouldn't mind so much if marvel was going all out. But he wasn''t even trying:o
(chuckle)

[Varient]

Originally posted by mg_productions
Isn't one of supes weaknesses magic?Where does Captain Marvel get his powers from?
Sides that,let's break this down a little bit.Superman is an alien with all kinds of powers right.Good,gravy,whatever.
Captain Marvel gets his powers from gods.Not abnormally strong people, from gods.The strength of Hercules,etc. So,he's not as powerful as A god.He's as powerful as several gods.Would this not relegate to a serious ass whupping of an alien or does this mean that an alien is stronger than gods.
This arguement can be taken with Thor of the Marvel universe too.Shouldn't Thor be able to kick everyones ass?He's a damn god for heaven's sake(no pun intended) Maybe it's just me but when someone has the power of a god (or numerous gods) he should be able to hand a lot of people a lot of asses.(Nice mental note by the way;)
The problem with this argument?:

"Worlds mightiest Mortal."

CM has established limitations and ATTRIBUTES of the "Gods" listed in his powerup.

I've read him breaking a sweat doing things Superman has no prob with.
I've read that his powers are halved or split into thirds whenever one of the other "marvels" power up.

Comic writers put the limit on your Deity-powered, red pajama, sissy cape wearing, yellow boot footin', mind of a teenager doesn't cut the mustard with the JLA, gotta settle for the JSA, "Big red cheese"

Not us.

Peace.

[mg_productions]

Alright,I didn't know.Don't read sorry-ass,stupid lettered,talent stealin,cape and under-wear wearing dc.

Hulk would kick both of their asses.

Salaam.

[Guyverjay]

Originally posted by Varient
(chuckle)

Great argument there

[magos2k6]

Captain Marvel. The Wisdom of Solomon, more knowledgeable than Supes. The Strength of Hercules, legendary, but maybe not as strong as Superman. But then there's the stamina of Atlas, the mortal that was so tough he could lift and hold up the world, I've never heard of Superman actually sustaining such a mass for so long (I could be wrong), the Power of Zeus, king of the gods, as we all know, Supes can't really deal with magic so well, the Courage of Achilles, so he has no fear or hesitation in battle, and the speed of Mercury, certainly as fast as the Flash or faster, as fast as Superman or faster. Supes has all those "visions" and "hearing" powers, but hey, it's not like Cap would really need to hide from him. I give the edge to Cap.

[Hachiman]

I like both characters but i'd give it to Superman. As cool as Capt. Marvel is, Superman is the original, and even with the weakness to magic, when push comes to shove Superman always pulls through.

In regards to posts above, my reading of KC has Supes the winner in that fight.
Supes was trying to subdue his friend in that fight and, as always, holding back. Realizing it wasnt working, he brought out his most powerful weapon, his heat vision, but again restrained himself. Marvel responded with the repeated lightning bolts, which being magical, drove Kal to his knees.
BUT, just as Marvel administered the coup de grace "Shazam" Kal outraced the bolt and crossed the distance between himself and Marvel, using Marvel's own powers to defeat him, and clamping Billy's jaw shut, and leaving him at Kal's mercy.

At that point any lesser man would've killed Billy, and despite the battering he had received Supes STILL survived the detonation which killed scores of others and had enough power to almost bring the UN building down
That fights the perfect example of why Supes is the greatest american comic character. Battered , almost broken, he still found a way to defeat an enemy who had him on the ropes.

Marvel has the wisdom of Solomon and Courage of Achilles to rely on, and even that could'nt save him from Sivana and Luthor's mind control. But Supes does'nt have an allwise voice whispering in his head, and still comes out tops.
Power wise i'd put Marvel, as the champion of the gods(Atlas is a Titan god btw) at the same level as Supes is now, but Supes, as shown in JLA one Million and his own books, has no upper limit, and his power level will increase incrementally as long as he lives.
Also Superman IS a god albeit a scientific one, the definition of god in a comic universe being a powerful entity with enormous might and abilities. Zeus et al may be gods by their own account but they're far from all powerful. They're not the beings they claim to be. None of them created the universe, and their sphere of influence is limited to mostly one world, full of other pantheons. I dont know if its still canon, but DC's Genesis crossover pretty much exposed the DC pantheons origin as being mortal humans empowered by the Godwave, so thats their "divine" heritage. Not so really different from the Kryptonian ability to absorb sunlight and use it to empower themselves.
All i'm saying in summary, is this; Captain Matrvel has defeated Superman in the past and could do so again in future, his magic spawned abilities giving him an enormous edge. but Superman has defeated Marvel as well, his solar based abilities allowing him to hurt Marvel and other Magic based beings, including Thor. ALL those mentioned have ceiling for their power levels, but not Superman.

Guys like Thor and Marvel and other powerful beings can and have beat the Man of Steel, but when the chips are down, the World's Greatest Hero ALWAYS pull through.

Let me also say that i am not a Captain Marvel hater, he's a damn cool character and i really like him. In a fight between him and Supes tthough, he might pull out a couple wins, but my bet is 7 times out of ten Superman wins. He's the first, and Greatest.:supes:

[:eek: jeez, thats a humungous post:D ]

[Red]

Why isn't this in the DC section?

[TheFalcon]

I think Superman is the most powerful. His strength and invulnerability is greater than Capt. Marvels.
However a fight between the two would be cery close because of Supermans weakness against magic. If Capt. Marvel fights smart enough I think he would win.

[Elijya]

thanks for the two year old thread bump :rolleyes:

::sigh:: moving.....

[TheFalcon]

thanks for the two year old thread bump :rolleyes:


It's better than someone making yet another thread on it. It seems to be one of those things that get's asked every once in awhile anyway.

[Purple Man]

Let's see if I can settle this.

Superman/Batman issue 5:

Quote from Captain Marvel "It doesn't take the wisdom of Solomon to know you should stay down. I've beaten you in the past and I'll do it again if I have to-- but I don't want to."

Thought caption from Superman: "Marvel's powers are based on magic. Toe-to-toe he has the advantage."

[fifthfiend]

Let's see if I can settle this.

Superman/Batman issue 5:

Quote from Captain Marvel "It doesn't take the wisdom of Solomon to know you should stay down. I've beaten you in the past and I'll do it again if I have to-- but I don't want to."

Thought caption from Superman: "Marvel's powers are based on magic. Toe-to-toe he has the advantage."

Yeah, and who ended up getting their ass kicked that time?

[Red]

How is Marvel winning?

[Wolvenom2099]

I pick Superman

[true316]

Captain Marvel is Earth's Mightiest Mortal. Superman has powers and abilities far beyond those of mortal men. So I pick Superman. If it just would have said "slightly better than" or "about the same as" I might of picked Marvel. But as it stands: Superman. :p

[Anubis]

Versus threads should be deleted from the database after two weeks of inactivity.

[thor god]

The problem with this argument?:

"Worlds mightiest Mortal."

CM has established limitations and ATTRIBUTES of the "Gods" listed in his powerup.

I've read him breaking a sweat doing things Superman has no prob with.
I've read that his powers are halved or split into thirds whenever one of the other "marvels" power up.

Comic writers put the limit on your Deity-powered, red pajama, sissy cape wearing, yellow boot footin', mind of a teenager doesn't cut the mustard with the JLA, gotta settle for the JSA, "Big red cheese"

Not us.

Peace.
superman is a sissy too.

[CaptainStacy]

When i was a kid i had one of those big Treasury sized comics that featured a fight between Superman and Captain Marvel.

Supes mopped the floor with him. Actually knocked CM unconcious.

The plot involved Luthor and Dr.Sivanna working together and coming up with a device to anger the two heroes to the point of coming to blows....

The cover showed the two of them up above earth, punching each other, with Supergirl and Mary Marvel flying towards them as if trying to break the fight up...looked like Neal Adams artwork, but don't quote me...

I sure wish i still had it.

[CAPT. MARVEL]

Yeah, and who ended up getting their ass kicked that time?
Batman:)

Bats: Billy? Can you hear me? Say something.
Captain Marvel: shazam

Anyways, Supes wins this, because he is Supes. Does anyone know the upper limit to Marv's invulnerability?

[Horseman Gambit]

I'm going with Captain Marvel, he has hoppy the marvel bunny for back up hahaha

[TheFalcon]

Does anyone know the upper limit to Marv's invulnerability?

I would think it's around Wonder Womans. Pretty high but not as high as Supermans. If not for the magic aspect Superman would have no problem with Capt. Marvel.

[The BatDude]

going with Captain Marvel since Superman is weak against magic Captain Marvel will win this one

[Quinza]

please superman could take marvel easily if he did not hold back he did not get his ass handed to him in kingdom come marvel's powers are only magic based and the only magic attack that he can do to hurt supes is call for the lightning bolt which in kindom come he used to hit superman 4 times even after that superman was able to stop marvel, changing him back to billy, even after that abuse he took at the hands of marvel he ready to take out that multi megaton nuclear bomb he even tells marvel that he can stop it but not sure that he should marvel stops it but gets blown to smitherines.

plus recently superman was being controlled by eclipso even the combined power of marvel and shazam could not stop him they had to ask the spectre for help true that they did not want to kill supes but if you read the comic you see eclipsosupes get struck numerous times by the lightning and still come back for more if superman went all out marvel would be finished.

:supes:

[Marvin]

Let's see if I can settle this.

Superman/Batman issue 5:

Quote from Captain Marvel "It doesn't take the wisdom of Solomon to know you should stay down. I've beaten you in the past and I'll do it again if I have to-- but I don't want to."

Thought caption from Superman: "Marvel's powers are based on magic. Toe-to-toe he has the advantage."

which could be interpreted as someone noting that someone else has powers one doesn't have...

superman's got X-ray vision, that gives him the advantage...deoesn't mean anyones weak against it!:o

[Marvin]

as far as the KO?

you need to ask yourself if Dick can KO Bruce with a sucker punch from behind...and then ask yourself if that makes him stronger

[Bullseye]

Doesn't Superman have a weakness toward magic, so I would think that Captain Marvel would prevail.

[Warhammer]

Superman.
But not by a longshot.

[el sensei]

Listen capt marvel only has the strength of hercules which sucks and could never be compared to supes strength. so supes can knock him out with one punch.

[marcofthebeast]

He may only have the streangh of Hercules but he has the wisdom if Solomon, the stamina of Atlas, the power of Zues, The courage of Achilles and the speed of Mercury. I was always under the impression that they are about equal in terms of damn near everything. And one match from a book dosen't completley determine how the match would go, considering they a few times.

[flash gordon]

If you ask Fawcett comics,captain marvel. ask DC and its superman.

in reality, Fawcett created Captain Marvel as their answer to Superman, this happens all the time(see batman, see spiderman) but CM started becoming more popular than superman and that spelled the demise of CM......I really think they are equal, but just can't occupy the same space......If you have a Captain Marvel who needs a Superman and vice-versa?

[CanaryFan]

CM held did well in Kingdom Come But Supes beat him down in the Eclipso crossover event from years back and also in the Justice League Unlimited series. Personaly I would be rooting for CM but Supes would win!

[Eros]

i can't give superman props for beating up a man with a kids mind. Or for that matter a kid with a mans body. lets put it like this, if it wasn't for CM being able to fly superman would still be leaping tall buildings instead of flying.

[LouFerignoDemon]

I dunno. CM is magical, which is one of Superman's cardinal weaknesses, and given that CM is now going through some serious power upgrade, possibly even becoming the new Shazam, who can direct and call upon the lightning as a much more serious weapon, I'm going to go with the newer Captain Marvel.

[LouFerignoDemon]

i can't give superman props for beating up a man with a kids mind. Or for that matter a kid with a mans body. lets put it like this, if it wasn't for CM being able to fly superman would still be leaping tall buildings instead of flying.

Kids mind, with the wisdom of Solomon. It's not just Billy Batson under the hood.

[Sloth7d]

OMG! If Superman wasn't holding back Lil boy Marvel would get knocked into a coma!

[Dr. Fate]

How ironic that Captain Marvel's poll color is blue while Superman's is red, even though the majority of Superman's costume is blue while the majority of Captain Marvel's costume is red...

Let's see, Captain Marvel has the strength of Hercules, Wonder Woman is said to be stronger than Hercules, but Superman is said to be stronger than Wonder Woman... oh my brain hurts...

[supermarvelman]

Hasnt it been said by Superman himself in Superman/Batman #4 that Cap Marvel is the stronger of the two? Or am I wrong? I dont think I am but I might be.

From the thoughts of Superman himself from issue 4

"Marvel's powers are based on magic. Toe-to-toe he has the advantage"

The mouth of Captain Marvel himself from issue 4

"I've beaten you in the past and I'll do it again if I have to...But I dont WANT to."

[Aren]

Captain Marvel of course :)

[Kenda Man]

To be honest, I like how Captain Marvel has the portrayal of child innocence and wonder as seen in "Power of Hope" by Paul dini and in other comics. Superman seems more harden and experienced. I am really glad that in Justice #6 and #7, they showed how Captain Marvel helped Superman and the dialouge of by Captain Marvel how they are similar equals before he threw SUperman in the sun. And the two of them gripping each other wrists after superman flew out of the sun... that was just incredible and I am sure it would seem impossible when Fawcett comics was around.

They are also making Black Adam an excellent villian and a real threat. I like he has his morals and did not accept that offer that was made in 52. Black Adam seems to be portrayed as an evil Superman. I am interested to see how Black Adam will be introduced in Justice and Johns has done a great job reviving both Black Adam and Captain Marvel. I thought the whole angle of Billy and Courtney being together was interesting and how Billy has to uphold his image as CM so that no one will treat him differently.

I was not so much a fan of how CM was done on Justice League Unlimited. I was grateful to see CM at all, but showing Superman go nuts and getting the upper hand... it did not seem even when it should have. I know the average viewer would not know the that CM is pretty equal to Supes, but it would damage dc image as to who is the all time superhero, which i can respect. I am happy that CM's head did not explode from Superman's punch, which could have happened to certain superheros or humans.

[TheCorpulent1]

CM got pwned way too easily in that JLU episode. It was a good episode outside of the fight, though.

[Varient]

Whoa,.. can u say "Blast from the Past?"

Who dug this up?

[32CAGE]

Superman

[supermarvelman]

The problem with this argument?:

"Worlds mightiest Mortal."

CM has established limitations and ATTRIBUTES of the "Gods" listed in his powerup.

I've read him breaking a sweat doing things Superman has no prob with.
I've read that his powers are halved or split into thirds whenever one of the other "marvels" power up.

Comic writers put the limit on your Deity-powered, red pajama, sissy cape wearing, yellow boot footin', mind of a teenager doesn't cut the mustard with the JLA, gotta settle for the JSA, "Big red cheese"

Not us.

Peace.

It's cause Superman is to worried about getting overshadowed by Captain Marvel

[flash gordon]

superman always wins the fights cause its a metaphor from the past court battles. and how ironic is it that every time they meet they end up fighting.......if DC had not won the court battle it might be captain marvel returns that we would be going to the movies for......DC writing a comic about cm vs. sm is like dick cheney counting the votes in an election between al gore and GW.

let fawcett comics write a comic about cm vs. sm and cm would win all the time.

[supermarvelman]

It really pisses me off that DC stole Captain Marvel away, right when he was becoming more popular than Superman, because "he was to much like Superman", which is total bull****, DC was scared. Then they purposly put him on the shelf so his popularity would die away, Captain Marvel really got the shaft. I love that he is part of DC though, If they where gonna steal him away they shouldn't have put him on the shelf. Eversince then he has been the back-up to Superman.

[flash gordon]

yep! it sucks, I sure hope they can bring him back......the whole story is unique and he pretty bas ass......I don't think they would have any trouble selling his story on tv or the movies.......

and isn't the current "smallville" more like bill batson than clark kent?

[flash gordon]

http://members.ozemail.com.au/~scunge/shazam/SupvsCap.jpg

[Mjolinar]

Not sure who'd win as I've seen them both get the best of each other in the past but I like Captian Marvel better so I gave him my vote.

[chuckymack]

Now that Captain Marvel has full control over his lightning, no lessening of his powers due to Freddie and Mary, and all the knowledge that the Rock of Eternity has to offer, I really don't see how Superman has a snowball's chance in Hell of winning this one.
Marvel may be slightly weaker, but he's also slightly faster and more durable, which seems to give him the advantage-- regardless of magic.
As for Kingdom Come, Marvel's just playing with Superman. He's not even trying, and has Superman bleeding out of places he didn't know he could bleed out of, and all the while, Marvel's grinning like a three-year-old with a new G.I. Joe. If not for the transformation that takes place with the lightning, Marvel would've killed him. Slowly and painfully.
It's not really a contest. In the passed ten years, every time Supes has seen Marvel coming, he probably crapped his pants.
Superman can beat the crap out of everybody.



Except Captain Marvel.

[Super Mark]

Supes is stronger. And more durable. Perhaps more experienced.
Wisdom of Soloman, fine. But the guy is still using his own mind most of the time. I think Supes could both outpower and outfight Marvel. But it wouldn't be an easy fight.

[rigel7soldiers]

Wait, this is Marv, right? Not, like, Genis, or Phyla, or Monica, or anybody? Either way, CM totally wins.

[LibrarianThorne]

I think the canon is that Superman is stronger, but thanks to Cap's magical advantage and the Wisdom of Solomon that Cap will beat Superman more often than not.

[supermarvelman]

Why does everybody think SM is stronger.

And the only reason SM might be more experienced is because DC put CM on the shelf. SM was created in '38 and CM was created in '39. CM is like the second or third oldest Comicbook hero ever.

[Varient]

Is the fight between the two from JLU on dvd yet?

[TheCorpulent1]

No, I think they've only released the first season of Justice League on DVD so far. That one's all the way over in season 4, I believe.

As for the strength question, I've always heard that Captain Marvel and Superman are equal in strength, myself.

[Arkady Rossovich]

Im going to say Superman,especially if it was Pre-Crisis.I had once heard that Captian Marvel was another company`s version of Superman until DC bought the rights to Captian Marvel.

[Harlekin]

You heard wrong.

[flash gordon]

Is the fight between the two from JLU on dvd yet?


http://www.youtube.com/results?search=superman+vs+captain+marvel&search_type=search_videos


CM should have enough wisdom to know that kryptonite will kill superman......CM WINS EASILY. that JLU crap is just that, crap......I wonder why they are always fighting.....aren't they both great superheros for good.........its like DC has always had a complex about CM so they have to make it appear that their flagship(SM) is mighter than the rivals(1940's rival)flagship(CM) every chance they get and in fact, has never forgetten that CM was a legit threat to overtake SM.

[Batmanx]

Lets keep it REAL CM. can not match Superman n STRENGHT/SPEED or ABILITIES...Captain Marvel have the strenght of Hercules (which he is half Human/God) that makes him a Demi God...The Human side of him makes him that much weaker..The ONLY thing that give CM. a lil. change of getting good punches n is the MAGIC HITS & the Lighting Bolts...CM have the speed of Mercury BIG DEAL, Superman is FASTER then that...In the long run it will b a good cute fight , but Superman will take him down...

If u wish 2 c a good fight , then it should b Wonder Woman and Superman..
She is WAY stronger then Hercules and CM..People r always SLEEPING on WW. and her strenght and SKILLS... WW is just a lil. bit low then Superman n Strenght and thats why they say she is ONLY SECOND TO SUPERMAN..Her fighting skills is better then Superman and CM..

And by the way Captain Marvel share his power with Mary Marvel & CMJr.. So that alone is going to make CM weaker against Superman,WonderWoman and Martain Manhunter and Supergirl...Lets get real CM need to SIT DN and play n his COLORING BOOKS...

[Toby_Temple]

Superman is also mortal(remember guys. he can die and he did died). So if Captain Marvel is the mightiest mortal, the he is stronger than Superman. Its that simple.

[supermarvelman]

How-bout Pre-Crisis Superman vs Post-Inf Crisis Captain Marvel

I say Captain Marvel

Captain Marvel right now would definetly take Superman. Let's talk about the level of power these characters have currently (post-OYL), not pre-crisis ****. Thats like saying prep-time.

[supermarvelman]

Lets keep it REAL CM. can not match Superman n STRENGHT/SPEED or ABILITIES...Captain Marvel have the strenght of Hercules (which he is half Human/God) that makes him a Demi God...The Human side of him makes him that much weaker..The ONLY thing that give CM. a lil. change of getting good punches n is the MAGIC HITS & the Lighting Bolts...CM have the speed of Mercury BIG DEAL, Superman is FASTER then that...In the long run it will b a good cute fight , but Superman will take him down...

If u wish 2 c a good fight , then it should b Wonder Woman and Superman..
She is WAY stronger then Hercules and CM..People r always SLEEPING on WW. and her strenght and SKILLS... WW is just a lil. bit low then Superman n Strenght and thats why they say she is ONLY SECOND TO SUPERMAN..Her fighting skills is better then Superman and CM..

And by the way Captain Marvel share his power with Mary Marvel & CMJr.. So that alone is going to make CM weaker against Superman,WonderWoman and Martain Manhunter and Supergirl...Lets get real CM need to SIT DN and play n his COLORING BOOKS...

I dont think thats the case anymore.

Plus MM and CMjr would probably power down if SM and CM where fighting.

[Harlekin]

Lets keep it REAL CM. can not match Superman n STRENGHT/SPEED or ABILITIES...Captain Marvel have the strenght of Hercules (which he is half Human/God) that makes him a Demi God...The Human side of him makes him that much weaker..The ONLY thing that give CM. a lil. change of getting good punches n is the MAGIC HITS & the Lighting Bolts...CM have the speed of Mercury BIG DEAL, Superman is FASTER then that...In the long run it will b a good cute fight , but Superman will take him down...

If u wish 2 c a good fight , then it should b Wonder Woman and Superman..
She is WAY stronger then Hercules and CM..People r always SLEEPING on WW. and her strenght and SKILLS... WW is just a lil. bit low then Superman n Strenght and thats why they say she is ONLY SECOND TO SUPERMAN..Her fighting skills is better then Superman and CM..

And by the way Captain Marvel share his power with Mary Marvel & CMJr.. So that alone is going to make CM weaker against Superman,WonderWoman and Martain Manhunter and Supergirl...Lets get real CM need to SIT DN and play n his COLORING BOOKS...
Yeah, except CM has consequently been shown to either equal or dominate Supes.

[supermarvelman]

Atleast equal, atleast.

[Varient]

http://www.youtube.com/results?search=superman+vs+captain+marvel&search_type=search_videos


CM should have enough wisdom to know that kryptonite will kill superman......CM WINS EASILY. that JLU crap is just that, crap......I wonder why they are always fighting.....aren't they both great superheros for good.........its like DC has always had a complex about CM so they have to make it appear that their flagship(SM) is mighter than the rivals(1940's rival)flagship(CM) every chance they get and in fact, has never forgetten that CM was a legit threat to overtake SM.


Thank you very much for the link.

I think the fight was credible,.. on three occasions it could've gone either way.

[supermarvelman]

Agree with Flash Gordon, it is like DC has a complex against Captain Marvel, even to this day they have to make Superman the brighter light out of the two.

To me it's like DC is the head coach of a football team and Superman is the coach's son, Captain Marvel is like the guy who is just as good as the son probably even better, but never starts because he's not the coach's son. He only gets put in in the fourth quarter when the other team is getting there heads kicked in.

[lokisixnine]

superman

[Silicon Surfer]

If the issue posted above is the one think it is they established in it that Supes and CM are almost exact equals in strength, speed, and invulnerability. CM has the advantage in that he has no weaknesses and Supes has the advantage in that he has powers that CM doesn't like heat vision, super breath, etc. This however was the Silver Age and isn't really relevant unless you assume that unless otherwise stated all powers are still proportionally the same as they were but simply scaled down to fit current overall power levels

[supermarvelman]

The current versions of each character right now. Superman would get spanked like a lil *****.

[Speedball]

Captain Marvel is the Mightiest Mortal, but there's the a problem with one of those words- Mortal, which means he is defeatable.
Superman will win, CM might be mighty, but he is mortal.

[Toby_Temple]

Captain Marvel is the Mightiest Mortal, but there's the a problem with one of those words- Mortal, which means he is defeatable.
Superman will win, CM might be mighty, but he is mortal.
Oh dear!
Mortal means the opposite of Immortal. So a mortal is someone who could die. Can Superman die? YES. He already died, remember. So that makes Superman MORTAL.

Captain Marvel is the Mightiest Mortal. That technically means his stronger than any mortal there is, including Superman. Another reason why Superman will lose to Marvel is because of the nature of his powers, which are mystical in nature. Remember that one of Superman's weaknesses is mystical/magical powers. That alone is enough reason to believe that Captain Marvel can beat Superman anytime.

[Extra #6 in BB]

Captain Marvel was more powerful, and the Superman writers knew it. That's why they sued.

[Sloth7d]

Superman (not holding back) beats Marvel in a few hits.
Case closed.

[Union Jack]

i'm gonna say superman.
simply because (and i know its a knida weak argument) its superman....he always finds a way.
he is the ultimate hero....cap's just a pale imitation...
i wish supes could lose his magic vunerability...if not for that he would spam cap all over the place....

[chuckymack]

What part of 'equals' don't you understand?! The wizard's dead, and Cap can't change back to Billy, so there goes the whole 'trick him into saying it' routine.
And Cap being a pale imitation is probably the most ill-researched statement in this whole thread, which is quite an accomplishment!
DC gave Superman his x-ray vision, heat vision, cold breath and flight in an effort to make him superior to Captain Marvel. Cap could fly from the get-go. Supes couldn't. Cap could call down lightning from the get-go. Supes had no heat rays. If anything, modern Superman is an imitation of Captain Marvel with a few extra powers just to increase sales. If Fawcett and Whiz Comics had more money to fight the lawsuits, it'd be Captain Marvel's fifth movie in theatres, not Superman's.

[Aptman]

Oh dear!
Mortal means the opposite of Immortal. So a mortal is someone who could die. Can Superman die? YES. He already died, remember. So that makes Superman MORTAL.

Captain Marvel is the Mightiest Mortal. That technically means his stronger than any mortal there is, including Superman. Another reason why Superman will lose to Marvel is because of the nature of his powers, which are mystical in nature. Remember that one of Superman's weaknesses is mystical/magical powers. That alone is enough reason to believe that Captain Marvel can beat Superman anytime.

Saying Captain Marvel is stronger because he is the “World’s Mightiest Mortal” is like saying a refrigerator magnet would stick to Superman because he’s the “Man of Steel”.

It’s just a title given to the guy to show he’s really powerful. Even if the title was canon proof that he is this world’s (Earth’s) mightiest mortal, you could still argue that Superman isn’t of this world (he’s the “Last Son of Krypton”).

Marvel’s powers come from gods….that aren’t gods in the sense that they created the Universe, but in that they were mortals that gained power by an outside source and have earth people worship them because earth people think they created this world and everything in it. So, basically, they are aliens with superpowers…Sounds kind of like Superman, who is constantly getting stronger (to the point he could someday become basically immortal, and not be affected by kryptonite).

Superman has a weakness to magic. But it’s not like he falls to his knees in weakness because he’s touching an item lased in magical energy, it just means that a magic spell could actually have affect on him (like being turned into a lion…its happened). Marvel’s lightening would have a greater affect on Superman because it’s magically based, but that doesn’t mean Superman can’t fight against it or overcome it.

Superman is DC’s baby. DC decides who’s stronger. There will always be times where they’ll try to promote a character by making him seem more powerful than others, or where they try to make the character seem more human by weakening him. But when it comes down to it, Superman will come out on top.

[flash gordon]

What part of 'equals' don't you understand?! The wizard's dead, and Cap can't change back to Billy, so there goes the whole 'trick him into saying it' routine.
And Cap being a pale imitation is probably the most ill-researched statement in this whole thread, which is quite an accomplishment!
DC gave Superman his x-ray vision, heat vision, cold breath and flight in an effort to make him superior to Captain Marvel. Cap could fly from the get-go. Supes couldn't. Cap could call down lightning from the get-go. Supes had no heat rays. If anything, modern Superman is an imitation of Captain Marvel with a few extra powers just to increase sales. If Fawcett and Whiz Comics had more money to fight the lawsuits, it'd be Captain Marvel's fifth movie in theatres, not Superman's.


I agree 100%.

http://www.dccomics.com/media/covers/5782_400x600.jpg

[Toby_Temple]

Saying Captain Marvel is stronger because he is the “World’s Mightiest Mortal” is like saying a refrigerator magnet would stick to Superman because he’s the “Man of Steel”.

But it was already proven that Superman is not made of steel. Get what I'm saying? Captain Marvel was shown capable of beating Superman when he wanted to.

It’s just a title given to the guy to show he’s really powerful. Even if the title was canon proof that he is this world’s (Earth’s) mightiest mortal, you could still argue that Superman isn’t of this world (he’s the “Last Son of Krypton”).

And where is Superman right now? In Krypton? LOL! He is in Earth, and even though he is in Earth, Marvel is still the World's(Earth's) Mightiest Mortal.

Marvel’s powers come from gods….that aren’t gods in the sense that they created the Universe, but in that they were mortals that gained power by an outside source and have earth people worship them because earth people think they created this world and everything in it. So, basically, they are aliens with superpowers…Sounds kind of like Superman, who is constantly getting stronger (to the point he could someday become basically immortal, and not be affected by kryptonite).

Superman constanly getting stronger? Right. Make up more imaginary abilities for Supes just to make an arguement. Marvel was the first super strong hero who can fly and move at amazing speed than Supes while Superman was just a high-jumping superhero until DC decided to copy Marvel's powers and add them to Supes.

Superman has a weakness to magic. But it’s not like he falls to his knees in weakness because he’s touching an item lased in magical energy, it just means that a magic spell could actually have affect on him (like being turned into a lion…its happened). Marvel’s lightening would have a greater affect on Superman because it’s magically based, but that doesn’t mean Superman can’t fight against it or overcome it.

Nope. Superman can hurt himself if he punches a magical barrier and can be hurt by superstrong magical beings. His invulnerbility is useless against magic.

Superman is DC’s baby. DC decides who’s stronger. There will always be times where they’ll try to promote a character by making him seem more powerful than others, or where they try to make the character seem more human by weakening him. But when it comes down to it, Superman will come out on top.

Yes. And DC decided that Captain Marvel can beat him anytime if he wanted to. Case close, fanboy.:up:

[Toby_Temple]

Superman (not holding back) beats Marvel in a few hits.
Case closed.:down
Captain Marvel(not holding back) can literally kill Superman. Case closed.

[The Leaguer]

Superman has super-strength. He would win.

[Human Spidey]

I personally think Superman will win. I remember hearing about a comic some time ago, when Superman and Thor had a fight, Thor started to draw blood from the Man of Steel, but Superman's invulnerability, when hit with a magic based punch, acted completely as normal because the attack was a physical assault. So Captain Marvel would have to hold Superman just above him for his lightning to affect him, otherwise i beleive Superman will pretty much beat him to the gorund.

But they are both extremely powerful, and we might as well destroy the world before letting them battle.

[chuckymack]

I would agree. If neither of them held back, the world would be decimated in the rampage! Sweet pic, by the way, flashgordon!

[thor god]

But it was already proven that Superman is not made of steel. Get what I'm saying? Captain Marvel was shown capable of beating Superman when he wanted to.



And where is Superman right now? In Krypton? LOL! He is in Earth, and even though he is in Earth, Marvel is still the World's(Earth's) Mightiest Mortal.



Superman constanly getting stronger? Right. Make up more imaginary abilities for Supes just to make an arguement. Marvel was the first super strong hero who can fly and move at amazing speed than Supes while Superman was just a high-jumping superhero until DC decided to copy Marvel's powers and add them to Supes.



Nope. Superman can hurt himself if he punches a magical barrier and can be hurt by superstrong magical beings. His invulnerbility is useless against magic.



Yes. And DC decided that Captain Marvel can beat him anytime if he wanted to. Case close, fanboy.:up:....OWNED

[thor god]

Lets keep it REAL CM. can not match Superman n STRENGHT/SPEED or ABILITIES...Captain Marvel have the strenght of Hercules (which he is half Human/God) that makes him a Demi God...The Human side of him makes him that much weaker..The ONLY thing that give CM. a lil. change of getting good punches n is the MAGIC HITS & the Lighting Bolts...CM have the speed of Mercury BIG DEAL, Superman is FASTER then that...In the long run it will b a good cute fight , but Superman will take him down...

If u wish 2 c a good fight , then it should b Wonder Woman and Superman..
She is WAY stronger then Hercules and CM..People r always SLEEPING on WW. and her strenght and SKILLS... WW is just a lil. bit low then Superman n Strenght and thats why they say she is ONLY SECOND TO SUPERMAN..Her fighting skills is better then Superman and CM..

And by the way Captain Marvel share his power with Mary Marvel & CMJr.. So that alone is going to make CM weaker against Superman,WonderWoman and Martain Manhunter and Supergirl...Lets get real CM need to SIT DN and play n his COLORING BOOKS... wonder woman needs to stay on her knees.

[The Leaguer]

Superman would punch Captain Marvel. Superman would win.

[supermarvelman]

I'll ask this question again, who would win if both current versions (OYL) of these characters fought right now.

[The Cleric]

the HULK would win.

[The Leaguer]

No, the Hulk is very weak. He has a hard time lifting small boxes full of paperclips.

[LouFerignoDemon]

No, the Hulk is very weak. He has a hard time lifting small boxes full of paperclips.

I thought he was finally upgraded to pencil shavings? :confused:

[supermarvelman]

not funny

[The Leaguer]

I know, Hulk's weak, pathetic state is nothing to laugh at.

[chuckymack]

In the current OYL universe, Marvel is arguably the most powerful he's ever been. Supes, on the other hand, is still regaining his powers. Big Blue doesn't even have a shot at this one.

[The Leaguer]

Arguably how?

[chuckymack]

Well, some might argue that he could've possibly been more powerful in the Fawcett and Whiz era, i.e. the 'Golden Age'. I have some 'Golden Age' Captain Marvel comics, and in my opinion, they really don't show his prowress so much as they try to be cute and clever. More like a comedy with a superpowered main character.
As far as his DC history, I don't really think there could be a counterpoint.

[The Leaguer]

But you said OYL. He's barely been shown OYL. Where has he been shown to be so powerful?

[TheCorpulent1]

I think he's just going off the implication that he'd be more powerful because he's taken over the role Shazam used to play.

[LouFerignoDemon]

His power "upgrade" is really undefined. All the power left his sister and pal, and made it's way to him. It's suggested he's upgraded because he was basically on the losing side of a fight until the lightning struck him, and then beat the other person into submission what was seemingly easy.

[The Leaguer]

It was a downgrade. All he gained out of taking Shazam's place is the physical characteristics of an unbelievably old man.

[LouFerignoDemon]

He's going to need a C-Bag here pretty soon.

[The Leaguer]

That is just sexy.

[chuckymack]

Basically, with no buddies to siphon power, his power increases threefold. Taking into account he fully understands his powers now, that only helps him.
And all this was shown in the 'Brave New World' one-shot.
What's a C-Bag, anyway?

[TheCorpulent1]

Colostomy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colostomy) bag.

All I remember from the Brave New World thing was Freddy and Mary's power disappearing and Freddy getting his ass kicked.

[chuckymack]

I know what a colostomy is, but thanks for the link, anyway!
If you scan it carefully, that same lightning bolt strikes Billy, returning Mary and Freddie's powers to him. This same lightning bolt puts a white streak in his hair, signifying his newfound badassness.
Or, at least, that's what I made of it.

[LouFerignoDemon]

Colostomy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colostomy) bag.

All I remember from the Brave New World thing was Freddy and Mary's power disappearing and Freddy getting his ass kicked.

And later on, in 52, Adam was incapable of changing back.

[TheCorpulent1]

I'm wondering if Adam even has powers anymore. After all, he looked basically the same in his human form as he does in his Mighty Adam form. That'd be a cool twist, if he's been organizing this whole coalition of nations on the bluff that he still has his Superman-level power when he's really a mere mortal.

[LouFerignoDemon]

I'm wondering if Adam even has powers anymore. After all, he looked basically the same in his human form as he does in his Mighty Adam form. That'd be a cool twist, if he's been organizing this whole coalition of nations on the bluff that he still has his Superman-level power when he's really a mere mortal.

It hasn't shown otherwise lately. And he was the only "Marvel" that didn't have to share with the other three of Shazam's power. And I'm pretty sure he'd notice the moment he lost his power. x.x

But it would be awesome if someone like Stargirl showed up to confront Adam, and he found out THERE he had no more power. But it'd be even sweeter if Booster Gold got his rep back that way, and claimed that Adam had no chance.

[Clark K.]

Well, I'm a superman fan as you can see but i have to bring forth the facts, in batman/superman public enemies (a comic) superman fights Captain Marvel and admits to himself openly that CM has the advantage of magic. So in my opinion in a fight, supes might as well be fighting a kryptonite monster. In a challenge of strenght or speed i think supes comes out on top, it depends on how far you takes supes powers, i have comics where he flies so fast he rips the time continuim or light speed so idk. its a question that can't be answered till a neutral comic writer writes the comic showdown, in some of these comics the writers obviously sick of superman bash the hell outta him, maybe CM is simply an invention to dull superman fans ego.:supes:

[jgye2002]

well i am going to go off what i have seen so far and that was marvel getting his ass handed to him in a paper bag in the jlu i download the episode and it was an bad a** fight completely destroyed lex city and even before the fight ended superman gets hit by what i think was the hardest hit from marvel and slams into a vault and supes just grins takes the vault and smaches marvel to the ground he meets supes undergroung brussed and patterd he can bearly walk so thats what i seen

[TheCorpulent1]

Their JLU power levels are much different from their comic power levels. When's the last time you saw electricity knock Supes out in the comics? It happens all the time in the animated series.

[chuckymack]

Most of these people have no idea who Captain Marvel is, let alone his longstanding history of handing Supes' ass to him.

[The Leaguer]

Superman would hand Captain Marvel's ass to him.

[incubat]

i haven't read all the posts yet, but i will when i get the chance. still i voted for superman, he has the adventage of not being a child (literally) inside, which makes captain marvel psicologically more impressionable, like in shazam where he is allways saying how cool superman's powers are and that he envies him, and that gives superman an edge

[chuckymack]

Except that child has the wisdom of Solomon.
That, and Supes is highly vulnerable to magic. Against someone who is his equal in every physical way AND has magical capabilities, Supes gets owned.

[incubat]

true, forgot about that...but i don't think supes gets owned, it's not like he can't get his way around magic...he has before

[Toby_Temple]

Superman already admitted that Marvel has the advantage due to the nature of his powers. And about what you stated: "where he is allways saying how cool superman's powers are and that he envies him". Marvel also stated that he can beat Superman anytime if he wanted to.

[CanaryFan]

Marvel also stated that he can beat Superman anytime if he wanted to.

and yet you'ld think he would have "wanted to" all the times Supes was kicking his ass!

[The Leaguer]

No, because then Superman would kick his ass even harder. Captain Marvel is actually quite the sissy.

[incubat]

is he captain sissy?

lol, i think it's actually a pretty even match, it depends on who's the one with the better motivation i guess

[Eros]

how many superman vs threads are their, what does it matter which fictonal character can beat who? It only matters who wrtitng the bloody story, this is not like matching up two real life boxers, superman and captain marvels only win if the writers makes one of them win. I really think "The mods" should ban tiresome threads like these, and it gets more tiresome every year. Don't you people get tired of argueing the same topic?!

[Toby_Temple]

and yet you'ld think he would have "wanted to" all the times Supes was kicking his ass!
Yes, if he wanted to kill him.;)
Listen to what your idol has to say about Marvel. He has the advantage over Supes due to the nature of his powers. Superman admitted that.

[incubat]

really? when? (i really am curious)

[Toby_Temple]

really? when? (i really am curious)

Here. Enjoy reading!;)
http://img378.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sb04171jv.jpg

And here is where Marvel tells Superman that he can beat him if he wanted to, just like in the past.
http://img378.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sb04166ml.jpg

[incubat]

wow:| what's that from?

[Toby_Temple]

I forgot the title.......:(

[incubat]

that sucks, but if you do remember would you be so kind to pm me? i'd appreciate that, thx

[Toby_Temple]

I think its the comic entitled Batman/Superman......

[Stealth_Prime]

Can someone give other alternatives how Cap'n Marvel can win over Superman OTHER THEN the shazam-lightning bolt angle....
If I was Superman...I would use my super-hearing to listen for when Cap says the word and then use my speed to get out of the way.

Cap and Superman is supposed to be almost on the same level...but the natures of their powers differ...so....
for all of you Cap lovers....and Supers out there...

Can you guys think of other means to put the other down in a brawl?

[CanaryFan]

Here. Enjoy reading!;)
http://img378.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sb04171jv.jpg

And here is where Marvel tells Superman that he can beat him if he wanted to, just like in the past.
http://img378.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sb04166ml.jpg (http://img378.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sb04166ml.jpg)


Kinda looks like he got his but kicked in the end.

[Harlekin]

Can someone give other alternatives how Cap'n Marvel can win over Superman OTHER THEN the shazam-lightning bolt angle....
If I was Superman...I would use my super-hearing to listen for when Cap says the word and then use my speed to get out of the way.

Cap and Superman is supposed to be almost on the same level...but the natures of their powers differ...so....
for all of you Cap lovers....and Supers out there...

Can you guys think of other means to put the other down in a brawl?
Yeah, Captain Marvel just needs to punch him. I think it was in the JLA: World War Three trade where Captain Marvel basically socker punches Supes twice and knocks him out cold just like that.

[Stealth_Prime]

sucker punch.....

a new approach....supes is down for the count...


I LIKE!!!!

[Super_Child]

Yeah, Captain Marvel just needs to punch him. I think it was in the JLA: World War Three trade where Captain Marvel basically socker punches Supes twice and knocks him out cold just like that.

Thats just bad Writing.

[CanaryFan]

Why don't threads like this ever end?

[incubat]

but sucker punching isn't nice, :( how could marvel beat superman without the lightning move which makes him seem like pikachu in smash brothers?

[Mogwai]

but sucker punching isn't nice, :( how could marvel beat superman without the lightning move which makes him seem like pikachu in smash brothers?
i agree...the lightning is pretty cheap.

[Harlekin]

Thats just bad Writing.
Why, exactly? Most people can get taken down by an equal opponent with a sucker punch. Heck, it's a testament to Supes that he actually needed two of 'em.

[incubat]

how can someone get suckerpunched twice, wouldn't he be aware something's going on after the first one?

[ssj wolverine]

It is funny to me how you Cap fans don't admit that he got his ass kicked by Supes before.

[Harlekin]

how can someone get suckerpunched twice, wouldn't he be aware something's going on after the first one?
It was a one-two follow-up.

[The Leaguer]

Thats just bad Writing.
Not as bad as your post.

[TheCorpulent1]

i agree...the lightning is pretty cheap.
Yeah, that was a cool scene in Kingdom Come but people have gone overboard with it. Not only is it lame, but it makes Captain Marvel look like a douche, too. There's a lot more he can do than just yell "Shazam" every 2 seconds. :o

[LouFerignoDemon]

Yeah, that was a cool scene in Kingdom Come but people have gone overboard with it. Not only is it lame, but it makes Captain Marvel look like a douche, too. There's a lot more he can do than just yell "Shazam" every 2 seconds. :o

Lightning is cool and all. Especially since it now allegedly contains a lot more power than it used to, but people seem to believe that's ALL Cap has. And that simply is not true.

[The Leaguer]

Yes it is.

[TheCorpulent1]

Nuh-uh.

[The Leaguer]

Yeah. Just like Thor.

[TheCorpulent1]

Well, of course. I don't know why Marvel has Thor hit people and stuff. He's the god of thunder, which comes from lightning, not the god of thunder and punching b****es. :o

[The Leaguer]

Yeah. Thor's only power is lighting, just like Sentry's only power is being a s***ty character and Ion's power is being better than everyone else, especially Hal.

[LouFerignoDemon]

Yeah. Thor's only power is lighting, just like Sentry's only power is being a s***ty character and Ion's power is being better than everyone else, especially Hal.

And having superhuman emoness.

[The Leaguer]

No. "Only" means there is nothing but what I said. And what I said goes.

[LouFerignoDemon]

No. "Only" means there is nothing but what I said. And what I said goes.

Unfortunately, no. I am correct. So declares Francoise.

[TheCorpulent1]

I saw an official DC bio for Ion that listed "being better than Hal Jordan" under the powers section.

[The Leaguer]

Sentry fans' power is to have extremely bad judgment when it comes to gauging emo-ness.

[TheCorpulent1]

Ion fans' power is being automatically accepted as ASSHAT members.

[The Leaguer]

Whoa, now, let's not get hasty. We have our intregrity to think about. I think they have to prove themselves, first.

[Darthphere]

Yes.

[TheCorpulent1]

Whoa, now, let's not get hasty. We have our intregrity to think about. I think they have to prove themselves, first.
All right, Ion fandom and being an a**hole (with at least one Hype member who hates you to prove it).

[Darthphere]

All right, Ion fandom and being an a**hole (with at least one Hype member who hates you to prove it).


YES! Thanks supermarvelman!:up:

[TheCorpulent1]

I've got at least two that I can think of, and probably more that have borne their outrage in impotent silence. :up:

[The Leaguer]

I think it takes a bit more than hatred. Being called a troll has gotta factor in somehow.

[TheCorpulent1]

Most people call those they hate trolls. I frequently refer to people for whom I have even a passing dislike as trolls. Sometimes I even suggest that they go back under their bridge, only with more colorful language.

[The Leaguer]

But there are degrees of hatred, and style is very important.

Everyone hates Jplaya, but he has no style.

[TheCorpulent1]

But there are degrees of hatred, and style is very important.

Everyone hates Jplaya, but he has no style.
I was just talking about the requirements to get into the ASSHAT membership pool. All new members are only probationary, pending review by qualified ASSHAT reviewers--namely, us.

[Darthphere]

But there are degrees of hatred, and style is very important.

Everyone hates Jplaya, but he has no style.


:up:

[The Leaguer]

Still, we need to maintain our elitism. It's what sets us apart from the rest of those dirty, stupid motherf***ers.

[Darthphere]

I was just talking about the requirements to get into the ASSHAT membership pool. All new members are only probationary, pending review by qualified ASSHAT reviewers--namely, us.


:up:

[Darthphere]

Still, we need to maintain our elitism. It's what sets us apart from the rest of those dirty, stupid motherf***ers.


:up:

[TheCorpulent1]

Still, we need to maintain our elitism. It's what sets us apart from the rest of those dirty, stupid motherf***ers.
That and our relatively small amount of body hair compared to the primitives.

[The Leaguer]

And our literacy.

[Whirlysplat]

Captain Marvel has beaten Supes before in fact he punked him in the JLA after going to the Rock of Eternity. JLA # 29 · This was though a number of cheap shots and after it he says he Supes is vulnerable to magic and he got lucky. At the moment Supes would lose to CM as he has the power of the wizard Shazam see 52 issue 12 as the most recent reference to his stewardship of the wizards power.

http://supermantv.net/wallpaperbattles/shazam/shazamwoopssuperman.jpg

In Kingdom Come Billy transformed to use the lightning we know he doesn't have to and got Clarks hand around his jaw ending the battle.

However all this aside in a straight up fight Supes would probably in my opinion win against a standard CM. "Why"? you say, "Heat vision", I reply, the truth is in Kingdom come it was shown to hurt Billy badly and it was not the kind full intensity blast we know Clark can deliver. In speed and strength they are equal. We know the lightning hurts Supes we know Billy can hurt him. Remember the recent Black Adam episode in Action Comics # 831 he can take a sucker punch from CM equal in every way Black Adam. At the end of the fight BA kind of runs away.
Then of course we have TVo and all the other obsure powers supes "can" use.

http://www.supermanhomepage.com/images/solicitation-artwork/September-2005/SupermanShazamCv1.jpg

Then of course we just have Supes fists.

http://www.twomorrows.com/comicology/media/01supermanmarvel.gif

And guys about JPlaya hates not worth it.

- Whirly

[TheCorpulent1]

And our literacy.
Also, the opposable thumbs.

[The Leaguer]

And multiple genders.

[Darthphere]

Yup.

[Toby_Temple]

i agree...the lightning is pretty cheap.
Same can be said to Supes heat vision. You're just angry about it coz it is a realistic way of hurting Superman. Its part of Caps powers much like Supe's heat vision.:)

[LouFerignoDemon]

All right, Ion fandom and being an a**hole (with at least one Hype member who hates you to prove it).

Several Hype members hate me.

[Toby_Temple]

Thats just bad Writing.
Coz you're a bad loser. :p

[Fatality]

captain marvel

[The Leaguer]

Nah.

[SuGarRush]

I mean I'm gonna go with Superman. But that's just me...

[The Leaguer]

It's everyone else with a brain, too.

[Whirlysplat]

It's everyone else with a brain, too.

True

- Whirly

[Jplaya2023]

captain marvel would win. He already sonned him in JLA

[hippie_hunter]

captain marvel would win. He already sonned him in JLA

Stop saying sonned dammit :mad:

And Superman didn't expect that punch from Captain Marvel in JLA. If Captain Marvel and Superman got into a fight, it would be one hell of a fight. Honestly, I wouldn't even be able to guess who would be the winner.

[TheCorpulent1]

Same can be said to Supes heat vision. You're just angry about it coz it is a realistic way of hurting Superman. Its part of Caps powers much like Supe's heat vision.:)
Totally. When I think of realism, magic lightning that transforms little boys into giant, muscle-bound men is the first thing that pops into my head. :up:

[incubat]

It's everyone else with a brain, too.

i don't think an actual brain's necessary

[incubat]

why exactly does everyone hate jplaya?

[TheCorpulent1]

Because it's easy.

[incubat]

ok... i better stay out of that one

[TheCorpulent1]

Look up some of his previous posts and you'll see why people hate him.

[incubat]

someone erased them or something

[TheCorpulent1]

No, the search function here just sucks. Never mind. You've seen how many people hate Jplaya; just take their word for it and hate him too.

[incubat]

i just might do that *lights up a cigarrette*

[Jplaya2023]

Stop saying sonned dammit :mad:

And Superman didn't expect that punch from Captain Marvel in JLA. If Captain Marvel and Superman got into a fight, it would be one hell of a fight. Honestly, I wouldn't even be able to guess who would be the winner.

the only way superman beats captain marvel is by bad non canon writing

[TheCorpulent1]

That JLA scene was canon. :confused:

[Jplaya2023]

That JLA scene was canon. :confused:

that particular scene wasnt, 2 bias in favor of superman

[LouFerignoDemon]

i just might do that *lights up a cigarrette*

Cigarette's suck.

[Jplaya2023]

Cigarette's suck.

smoking sucks

[LouFerignoDemon]

smoking sucks

The first thing I'll agree with you on.

[incubat]

i don't smoke...i agree with you all on that, i was just making a parody of "what the cool kids do" you all hate jplaya, so i should do it 'cause cool kids do...bah, forget it, i'm not hping you understand my sense of humor...it happens to me sometimes

[LouFerignoDemon]

i don't smoke...i agree with you all on that, i was just making a parody of "what the cool kids do" you all hate jplaya, so i should do it 'cause cool kids do...bah, forget it, i'm not hping you understand my sense of humor...it happens to me sometimes

Humor translates poorly like that. If you said you flipped up your leather flap and slipped on your shades, I might've gotten it.

I apologize for the misunderstanding. :(

[incubat]

Humor translates poorly like that. If you said you flipped up your leather flap and slipped on your shades, I might've gotten it.

I apologize for the misunderstanding. :(

yeah, i should've thougt up a better example, at least we all agree on the fact that smoking sucks:up: :)

[The Leaguer]

Smoking makes you cool.

[LouFerignoDemon]

Smoking makes you cool.


Hardly.

[Jplaya2023]

Smoking makes you cool.

^^baka!

[Jplaya2023]

Hardly.

we have business to tend to in this thread

http://www.superherohype.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9783052&postcount=322

[The Leaguer]

Jplaya loves Superman so much.

[incubat]

haha, here we go again

[Vic Von Doom]

How does Captain Marvel have so many votes? In Kingdom Come, Superman wins. In "Clash" from JLU, Superman wins.
Superman wins. That's it.

[Jplaya2023]

How does Captain Marvel have so many votes? In Kingdom Come, Superman wins. In "Clash" from JLU, Superman wins.
Superman wins. That's it.

bad writing

[Whirlysplat]

bad writing

Nah.

- Whirly

[chuckymack]

In Kingdom Come, Supes doesn't win. He's bleeding out of every orifice possible. He's getting his ass handed to him, and he knows it. Sensing his imminent demise, he talks Marvel out of killing him and concentrating on the real matter at hand: the nuke.
JLU sucks, by the way. John Stewart's NOT the Green Lantern. Hal is.
The only way Captain Marvel loses to Superman is if some Hypester moron is writing the story with blatant disregard to powers and weaknesses.

[marcofthebeast]

How does Captain Marvel have so many votes? In Kingdom Come, Superman wins. In "Clash" from JLU, Superman wins.
Superman wins. That's it.

And those stories are both out of normal universe continuity.

[chuckymack]

Correct!

[MajinShenron]

Thor beat Captain Marvel but couldn't beat Superman. Superman for the win.

[Jplaya2023]

In Kingdom Come, Supes doesn't win. He's bleeding out of every orifice possible. He's getting his ass handed to him, and he knows it. Sensing his imminent demise, he talks Marvel out of killing him and concentrating on the real matter at hand: the nuke.
JLU sucks, by the way. John Stewart's NOT the Green Lantern. Hal is.
The only way Captain Marvel loses to Superman is if some Hypester moron is writing the story with blatant disregard to powers and weaknesses.

stop it, you're making jag and darthsphere cry

[KAD]

How does Captain Marvel have so many votes? In Kingdom Come, Superman wins. In "Clash" from JLU, Superman wins.
Superman wins. That's it.

For quite a long time they we're depicted as equals.

The Capt has and always will be the Mightiest Mortal

So supes loses.

[Vic Von Doom]

For quite a long time they we're depicted as equals.

The Capt has and always will be the Mightiest Mortal

So supes loses.

Who says Captain Marvel is the World's Mightiest Mortal? The guy who wrote the nickname? Superman is the Man Of Steel, he's not actually made of steel. Plus, Superman might be immortal. And therefore exempt from the list of Mighty Mortals.

And Superman does beat Captain Marvel in Kingdom Come. He's bleeding but he's also gripping Batson's face with his hand. If he squeezes, his face implodes. Superman wins.

Marvel has the strength of Hercules. Thor is probably equal to or greater than in terms of strength level compared to Hercules. In JLA/Avengers, Superman knocked Thor on his ass. Ergo, Superman beats Captain Marvel.

And JLU sucks? Wow. You must not know anything about what makes the DCU great, since if you did, you would understand that JLU is the greatest example of comics to tv there ever was.

[KAD]

Who says Captain Marvel is the World's Mightiest Mortal? The guy who wrote the nickname? Superman is the Man Of Steel, he's not actually made of steel. Plus, Superman might be immortal. And therefore exempt from the list of Mighty Mortals.

And Superman does beat Captain Marvel in Kingdom Come. He's bleeding but he's also gripping Batson's face with his hand. If he squeezes, his face implodes. Superman wins.

Marvel has the strength of Hercules. Thor is probably equal to or greater than in terms of strength level compared to Hercules. In JLA/Avengers, Superman knocked Thor on his ass. Ergo, Superman beats Captain Marvel.

And JLU sucks? Wow. You must not know anything about what makes the DCU great, since if you did, you would understand that JLU is the greatest example of comics to tv there ever was.

1. SM only got his hand on Batson because his mind was addled by Savanaha's worms. Employing the Wisdom of Solmon would have tipped the scales in favor of CM

2. Thor from Marvel is no way a measuring stick for the Gods in the DC pantheon. Ergo your argument has no merit

3. I didn't mention JLU you did

4. you wouldn't be related to another confused poster jplaya now would you?

[Vic Von Doom]

1. SM only got his hand on Batson because his mind was addled by Savanaha's worms. Employing the Wisdom of Solmon would have tipped the scales in favor of CM

2. Thor from Marvel is no way a measuring stick for the Gods in the DC pantheon. Ergo your argument has no merit

3. I didn't mention JLU you did

4. you wouldn't be related to another confused poster jplaya now would you?

1. Superman got his hand on Batson in JLU.

2. Hercules is Hercules. 616 or DC.

3. Someone else mentioned JLU. I was just defending it.

4. We're not related. I think.

5. When Eclipso possessed Superman, he kicked the hell out of Marvel. So the worms argument is moot, when either one of them is altered somewhat, Superman wins. I'm talking about the recent Winick-pencilled crossover.

[KAD]

1. Superman got his hand on Batson in JLU.

2. Hercules is Hercules. 616 or DC.

3. Someone else mentioned JLU. I was just defending it.

4. We're not related. I think.

5. When Eclipso possessed Superman, he kicked the hell out of Marvel. So the worms argument is moot, when either one of them is altered somewhat, Superman wins. I'm talking about the recent Winick-pencilled crossover.


You did notice he was holding back in the Eclipso issue?

Jlu is a cartoon and does not crossover into the comics

Go read some TT back issues or WW then come back and tell me that the DC pantheon is the same as 616. They aren't even close.

[TheCorpulent1]

While JLU's a great cartoon, the characters' power levels are much different in it. The Flash could barely outrun traffic, for example, and the one time he actually used any decent amount of speed, he got sucked into the Speed Force and nearly died. So bringing it up in an argument over the comics doesn't work because it's not pertinent to the comics.

[Whirlysplat]

While JLU's a great cartoon, the characters' power levels are much different in it. The Flash could barely outrun traffic, for example, and the one time he actually used any decent amount of speed, he got sucked into the Speed Force and nearly died. So bringing it up in an argument over the comics doesn't work because it's not pertinent to the comics.

Agreed

- Whirly

[supermarvelman]

One day they need to have Captain Marvel and Superman duke it out in continuity, all outt no holes bared, just so fans can finally know who would really win, and how good of a fight it would actually be.

[LouFerignoDemon]

Who says Captain Marvel is the World's Mightiest Mortal? The guy who wrote the nickname? Superman is the Man Of Steel, he's not actually made of steel. Plus, Superman might be immortal. And therefore exempt from the list of Mighty Mortals.

And Superman does beat Captain Marvel in Kingdom Come. He's bleeding but he's also gripping Batson's face with his hand. If he squeezes, his face implodes. Superman wins.

Marvel has the strength of Hercules. Thor is probably equal to or greater than in terms of strength level compared to Hercules. In JLA/Avengers, Superman knocked Thor on his ass. Ergo, Superman beats Captain Marvel.

And JLU sucks? Wow. You must not know anything about what makes the DCU great, since if you did, you would understand that JLU is the greatest example of comics to tv there ever was.

Shazam.

[incubat]

In Kingdom Come, Supes doesn't win. He's bleeding out of every orifice possible. He's getting his ass handed to him, and he knows it. Sensing his imminent demise, he talks Marvel out of killing him and concentrating on the real matter at hand: the nuke.
JLU sucks, by the way. John Stewart's NOT the Green Lantern. Hal is.
The only way Captain Marvel loses to Superman is if some Hypester moron is writing the story with blatant disregard to powers and weaknesses.

you clearly don't know how to appreciate the jlu, ti belongs in DCAU, it was never supposed to be just like regular continuity DCU, that's why it has the A in it, for ANIMATED. but the main thing is, I agree with corp, you can't use DCAU as a reference for DCU, but it's still a great show. I'm still not sure who would win between them, I personally vote for Superman, but it's a very close match. and btw, hal may be the real gl, but he is an ass, so i'm ok with gl being john

[Toby_Temple]

You did notice he was holding back in the Eclipso issue?

Jlu is a cartoon and does not crossover into the comics

Go read some TT back issues or WW then come back and tell me that the DC pantheon is the same as 616. They aren't even close.
:up: OWNED!:)

[MajinShenron]

John Stewart's NOT the Green Lantern. Hal is.

Anyone who wears the ring is a Green Lantern.

[TheCorpulent1]

Yes. But Alan Scott is more of a Green Lantern than all of them because he came first. :p

[The Leaguer]

Hal is less of a Green Lantern than all of them because he blows ass.

[CanaryFan]

I won't comment on the sexual overtones of Alan's weakness for wood.

[marcofthebeast]

He's weak around wood cause he aint a homo.

[Darthphere]

He's weak around wood cause he aint a homo.


*applause*