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-   -   "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe." (http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=305004)

spideymouse 06-18-2008 01:20 AM

"Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
Nick Fury, at the end of Iron Man: "You think you're the only superhero in the world? Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe; you just don't know it yet."

How will Nick Fury, S.H.I.E.L.D., and the Avenger Initiative (and possibly General Ross?) specifically interact with the Iron Man 2 story? Will they become an integral part, where Stark really starts to get into this "bigger universe" and gets on-board with the Initiative, or will they be more sort of pushed aside while remaining a small factor, somewhat similar to Agent Colson's role in the first movie? There are benefits and disadvantages to each of these two approaches.

1st approach:
-Benefits: Nick Fury and S.H.I.E.L.D. playing an integral role would help lead Iron Man 2 directly into the Avengers movie and get people really, really excited for it. It could also very naturally introduce 1 or 2 other superheroes (Thor? Cap? Ant-Man?), proving that Iron Man really isn't "the only one in the world." It could also put bring that sweet Captain America shield into the limelight. This approach very naturally and smoothly kicks the Avenger Initiative into a higher gear and yet still waits for them all to assemble in the big one.
-Disadvantages: This approach would strip Iron Man (and unfortunately Robert Downey Jr.) of the center stage and would turn into more of a big Avengers trailer than an Iron Man movie. It would rob fans of getting into the Iron Man world as it would put less emphasis on important Iron Man stories and villains.

2nd approach:
-Benefits: Nick Fury and the Avenger Initiative playing an insignificant role would build on what is established in the first Iron Man--Stark's fun irreverence and somewhat self-focused story. I can picture RDJ doing more of the "avoiding government agents" thing while Sam Jackson continually tries to get a hold of him. Stark's idea of "the next mission" could start off as dissimilar to Fury's. This allows for an Iron Man story to be told, not an Avenger Initiative story. And by the end of Iron Man 2 (in other words, by the time he beats the Mandarin, Justin Hammer or whatever his company or he personally is up against), he can then be ready to get cracking with Fury on the Avenger Initiative.
-Disadvantages: This approach might somewhat ignore Fury's post-credits statements at the end of Iron Man and possibly leave fans wondering why Stark still seems to be "the only superhero in the world" and not yet "part of a bigger universe." Mere cameos and winks and nods don't seem to be what Fury meant, and they definitely weren't what Stark was describing at the end of The Incredible Hulk. This approach almost puts the Avenger Initiative on the backburner, when logically and by continuity it should be a part of the story.

I'd like to see a balance of the two approaches, with a lean towards the second. Iron Man 2 should be an Iron Man story, but there needs to be a way to set that story in that "bigger universe"--it needs to be bigger than simply cameos, but less than an integral part. The Avenger Initiative also needs to take a step forward. There are threads here about Thor and Hulk, but I think the key is Fury. How they use him will determine that balance.

How would you guys and gals approach putting Fury in Iron Man 2?

imnotbatman 06-19-2008 01:30 PM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
i think, while the idea of an avengers and JLA movie sound cool, i dont think they will work because then you have to focus on ALL the heroes and villians instead of just one. i think its something that works in the comics but probably would not work in a live action film. however, from the looks and sound of things, and by the ending of both ironman and hulk, it sounds to me like marvel studio's REALLY want to make an Avengers movie. it almost sounds inevitable.

FaT_tONle 06-19-2008 03:53 PM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
I think they sort of shot themselves in the foot in that all these cameos and foreshadowing will take away from the Iron Man movie. I am AGAINST ALL TEAM UPS in any way shape or form for Iron Man 2 with the exception of War Machine/Iron Man. No Hawkeye/Black Widow teaming up with Stark to take down the Mandarin. Have Fury in a supporting role but not as one of the main characters. Fury has to be in the film because there is no room for him in the other movies until Avengers. Black Widow/Hawkeye/Thor shouldn't be in it. Even cameos are pushing it. Maybe a cameo of one of those character but definitely not all three. This needs to be an Iron Man/Mandarin film and that's all.

Peyton Westlake 06-21-2008 09:57 AM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
The budget to have Iron Man, the Hulk & others on screen at same time, is what worries me. Can it really be done? And not have the 'heroes' have a total of like 10 minutes of screen time?

Syncos 06-21-2008 02:08 PM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Peyton Westlake (Post 15080394)
The budget to have Iron Man, the Hulk & others on screen at same time, is what worries me. Can it really be done? And not have the 'heroes' have a total of like 10 minutes of screen time?

I don't think it'll be a big problem. I think there's more chance of having a LOT of large scenes with all of the characters, that's mostly cg. It's all about compositing shots. I'm more worried about the actor budget if they manage to score more people the likes of downey jr and norton.

ObakeTora 06-22-2008 10:37 PM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
Im worried about actor budget as well, but from the looks of things add a few successes under Marvel's belt and they can have enough money to remake Godfather with all the cosmic supervillians replacing the original cast.:bh:

spideymouse 06-26-2008 12:40 AM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
Regarding actor budget, I just wonder how Chris Nolan does it--Christian Bale, Michael Caine, Morgan Freeman, Tom Wilkinson, AND Liam Neeson all in one superhero movie? Any one of those names could sell a movie on its own. Marvel needs to tap on this guy's shoulder and ask the magician to reveal his tricks...

Gilpesh 06-26-2008 12:44 AM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by spideymouse (Post 15120501)
Regarding actor budget, I just wonder how Chris Nolan does it--Christian Bale, Michael Caine, Morgan Freeman, Tom Wilkinson, AND Liam Neeson all in one superhero movie? Any one of those names could sell a movie on its own. Marvel needs to tap on this guy's shoulder and ask the magician to reveal his tricks...

Marvel just has to wait until Nolan retires, then they can try and buy the secret of the trick off of him.

Raiden 06-26-2008 11:24 AM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gilpesh (Post 15120540)
Marvel just has to wait until Nolan retires, then they can try and buy the secret of the trick off of him.

I'd love for Marvel to lure Nolan to make a movie for them, like Singer was lured from X3 to make SR for WB.

Gilpesh 06-26-2008 11:25 AM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
:csad::csad::csad:

You didn't get it....

ProfeZZor X 06-26-2008 11:32 AM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
If you've seen his scene in The Incredible Hulk, he seems completely debriefed on what's going on at S.H.I.E.L.D. and his role in all of it. I think that IM2 will be a lot more advanced with complete integration of S.H.I.E.L.D.. I'm also confident that there will be more character references to other Avenger members, and possible cameos too.

Rich Santoro 06-30-2008 09:55 AM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
Agreed... he seems fully briefed and on the "inside" of the operation. A role for Shield and Fury could be to inform Stark that they discovered a figure behind the Ten Rings group which is the Mandarin, and they want Stark to investigate... The story could go from there, and of course Stark does more than just observe.

Through-out the film there can be references to different associates of the Mandarin that are working to overthrow governments, etc... including a particular underground Neo-Nazi organization headed by an enigmatice character who was terribly disfigured with red face.

Spider-Vader 07-02-2008 02:02 AM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
I'd like it if in the Avengers after Caps has been unfrozen either Fury or Stark runs down all the important events since he was frozen, then he runs down all the heroes. IM, Hulk, Thor, Ant Man, Spidey, X-Men, Blade, GR, FF, Venom (if his spin-off comes out around this time) & Deadpool. They can atleast mention these heroes right? I think it'd be wise to not mention DD since Marvel's probably getting the rights back soon & will reboot that series.

That's what I got of the bigger universe thing, a bigger universe of super heroes.

Rich Santoro 07-02-2008 09:19 AM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
I like the idea of Cap already thawed out and recuperating/training to ge back to 100% after decades on ice (outside of filming). Pym and Wasp would also already be members, being internal to SHIELD (also outside of filming). As a backstory... as Cap nears readiness to return to the field, info about some real nasty bad guys with crazy resources, tech and power starts to surface (Madarin, Zemo, Red Skull, even Killmonger, etc). The idea for a super team emerges and Fury starts looking around to add more beyond cap, Pym and Wasp. He has his eye on Banner, and finds out that Stark is flying around. He sends that guy from the IM movie to check it out. Since Stark reveals his ID, Fury just makes his move.

Then they approach Ross to track down banner again. So this is the "larger universe".

I don't know if they can mention characters whose rights are owned elsewhere... But somthing like, saying "there are masked vigilantes, teams of genetically enhanced beings, and a slew of others with super powers out there, all with their own agendas. Some good, some bad. Uncles Sam decided it was time to prepare a team capable of responding to any threat by super beings."

fabman 07-02-2008 07:17 PM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
This whole crossover / Avengers story sucks! Honestly, I want to know how the story goes on, what's happening to Tony Stark & Co. All these planning, crossover-ing and forcing these franchises into the Avengers flick ruins it quite a bit. Those flicks are not movies anymore, they're just one, big fat giant corporate s**t. Iron Man is a very well-done movie, and I don't see why you should ruin the sequels by forcing 'em into this corporate crap. Damn...

Chris B 07-02-2008 08:23 PM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Spider-Vader (Post 15169477)
I'd like it if in the Avengers after Caps has been unfrozen either Fury or Stark runs down all the important events since he was frozen, then he runs down all the heroes. IM, Hulk, Thor, Ant Man, Spidey, X-Men, Blade, GR, FF, Venom (if his spin-off comes out around this time) & Deadpool.

I like this idea. I would assume they could still mention the other Marvel characters that Marvel currently don't have the rights to; as long as they didn't actually show them.

spideymouse 07-03-2008 09:44 AM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris B (Post 15176064)
I like this idea. I would assume they could still mention the other Marvel characters that Marvel currently don't have the rights to; as long as they didn't actually show them.

Right, like the way Jason Lee mentions them in Mall Rats! Except, they'd of course mention them as if they were real.

3dman27 09-24-2008 05:52 AM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
interesting therories
very interesting

batman44 09-25-2008 07:32 PM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gilpesh (Post 15120540)
Marvel just has to wait until Nolan retires, then they can try and buy the secret of the trick off of him.

lol, The Prestige ftw.

Superhero 101 09-26-2008 08:39 PM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
Wow if they are planning to do a IM2 in 2010 then Avengers in 2011 SWEET!!! We will see Iron Man less then a year!!

amazingfantasy15 09-30-2008 03:04 PM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by fabman (Post 15175600)
This whole crossover / Avengers story sucks! Honestly, I want to know how the story goes on, what's happening to Tony Stark & Co. All these planning, crossover-ing and forcing these franchises into the Avengers flick ruins it quite a bit. Those flicks are not movies anymore, they're just one, big fat giant corporate s**t. Iron Man is a very well-done movie, and I don't see why you should ruin the sequels by forcing 'em into this corporate crap. Damn...

Basically the entire Iron Man movie there were little hints leading up to the Sam Jackson/Nick Fury scene though. I really like the idea, everything becoming interconnected, all these heroes sharing a universe. I don't think it will affect the single character movies. Really in Iron Man 2 as far as the "larger universe" I think just having a scene with Tony, Nick Fury and maybe General Ross, discussing where things are at with the Avengers Initiative is enough, the search for Banner, reports of an Asgardian god, an expedition up North to find remains of Captain America, maybe at an under construction Triskeleton or Avengers Mansion.

ironman29758 10-01-2008 06:18 PM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
:woot::grin:does this count:

Quote:

Originally Posted by YJ1 (Post 15752098)
Anyone else read the bonus story attached to the Walmart Iron Man DVD? It's an excellent little comic that tells of Nick Fury and Agent Coulson's behind the scenes dealings during the events of the film. It's very well written and extremely interesting. The reason I'm posting here is the story eludes to Stark's father's involvement in Project Rebirth.

It states that, off camera, Tony pulled the old files on an alloy his father worked on during WWII. Tony found an example of the alloy in his father's archives and then used it to strengthen his suit of armor. It shows him working on a Captain America shield in a small panel. What Tony found was just a prototype, a reject of Cap's real shield. According to the story, that's what was on Tony's work bench in that one scene.

About the shield...

"The final product was lost... although you can bet your life we'll never stop looking for it."

This is brilliant and it ties the Avengers arc together. I wonder if this is the path Marvel is taking?!?!?


3dman27 10-02-2008 05:29 AM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
sounds good

odiin 10-04-2008 05:19 PM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by imnotbatman (Post 15065689)
i think, while the idea of an avengers and JLA movie sound cool, i dont think they will work because then you have to focus on ALL the heroes and villians instead of just one. i think its something that works in the comics but probably would not work in a live action film. however, from the looks and sound of things, and by the ending of both ironman and hulk, it sounds to me like marvel studio's REALLY want to make an Avengers movie. it almost sounds inevitable.

X-Men says "hi" guys.

It's not as if the Avengers is going to be the first ensemble film ever created, people are making way too much out of nothing. Yes, the Avengers movie will undoubtedly take focus away from the individual characters, but that's what their solo films are for, THIS is supposed to be about the TEAM as a whole, that's the whole point.

UA-Archangel 10-04-2008 05:27 PM

Re: "Mr. Stark, you've become part of a bigger universe."
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Peyton Westlake (Post 15080394)
The budget to have Iron Man, the Hulk & others on screen at same time, is what worries me. Can it really be done? And not have the 'heroes' have a total of like 10 minutes of screen time?

Some characters don't need a lot of screen time to be effective. For example, why show an extensive scene of Hulk going, "HULK SMASH!!", when all you really want him to do is throw a tank>


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