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-   -   The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc. (http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=456069)

Dark Sentinel 04-13-2013 01:53 PM

The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
With the DSRW Project viral going live again, and with a slew of new Kryptonian glyphs, why don't those of us who study/appreciate language and/or dabble in "conlanging" (or constructed languages) talk about this stuff?

http://dsrwproject.com/files/images/...ranslation.png

Let us begin! :woot:

One of the major features of the written language is a curious "bracket" that appears to separate words from each other, shaped conspicuously like the top half of the crests.

DoomsdayApex 04-13-2013 02:14 PM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
It appears to be a mixture of Arabic and some other script.

http://i45.tinypic.com/8xuf51.jpg

Dark Sentinel 04-13-2013 02:16 PM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
I'm seeing Sanskrit and Tibetan as major influences.

Sanskrit also connects the letters in "brackets" to form words.

ThePhantasm 04-13-2013 02:19 PM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
Some of the letters look like their english equivalent.

For example, Zod's crest looks vaguely like a "Z" and Faora's looks like an "F".

"YOU" in the script above:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-QG0yrvZuEW...00/youzod2.jpg

The crests:

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-qTDpu9_3ig...aoraglyph1.jpg


http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-lPbYBmsbjh...aoraglyph2.jpg

Glassjaw 04-13-2013 02:32 PM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
Beautiful text they've come up with, love it. Might make a cool tattoo for those fans who like tattoos out there :p

ThePhantasm 04-13-2013 02:34 PM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
I can't find a pic of Tor-An's shield right now but it definitely looks like a "T".

Dark Sentinel 04-13-2013 02:36 PM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Glassjaw (Post 25586681)
Beautiful text they've come up with, love it. Might make a cool tattoo for those fans who like tattoos out there :p

Depending on what the DSRW message says it JUST MIGHT be my next one :wow:

http://i45.tinypic.com/8xuf51.jpg

Beautiful script.

DoomsdayApex 04-13-2013 02:45 PM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ThePhantasm (Post 25586699)
I can't find a pic of Tor-An's shield right now but it definitely looks like a "T".

Poor quality, but here's a sample:

http://www.bricksandbloks.com/wp-con...-Hardy-Zod.jpg

BH/HHH 04-13-2013 02:54 PM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
Faora's hair is nuts on that Lego set lol

DoomsdayApex 04-13-2013 02:57 PM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BH/HHH (Post 25586817)
Faora's hair is nuts on that Lego set lol

Indeed, she appears like a gothic lesbian.

ElDuderino 04-13-2013 03:50 PM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
Or rockabilly lesbian. One of the two.

BH/HHH 04-13-2013 04:04 PM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ElDuderino (Post 25587209)
Or rockabilly lesbian. One of the two.

http://www.thewrestlinglegendsforum....ockabilly0.jpg

Stitch 04-13-2013 04:06 PM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BH/HHH (Post 25586817)
Faora's hair is nuts on that Lego set lol

Quote:

Originally Posted by DoomsdayApex (Post 25586833)
Indeed, she appears like a gothic lesbian.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElDuderino (Post 25587209)
Or rockabilly lesbian. One of the two.

Literally crying laughing at the above. :funny: A man-hating gothic lesbian. (I'm a gay lady - this is ACE. :woot:)

I already have "HOPE" written in the old Kryptonian from the past 15 years on the inside of my wrist and the ol' S shield on the other side. (will upload pictures for anyone who's curious.) Would be lovely add to it with some of the new script.

I hope to see "Dark Sentinel's Kryptonese Pickup Lines - The Pocket Edition" at some point in future... :oldrazz:

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__...0px-Tor-An.png

Better look at Tor-An's shield. I wonder what Dev-Em's shield will look like?

Dark Sentinel 04-13-2013 04:21 PM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Stitch (Post 25587317)
I hope to see "Dark Sentinel's Kryptonese Pickup Lines - The Pocket Edition" at some point in future... :oldrazz:

:lmao: I have another two books to write and get published first but I'll keep that in mind :oldrazz:

DKDetective 04-13-2013 06:36 PM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
So now that it is appears that the last word of the script is "are", do you folks think that might mean that they have even constructed unique rules of grammar for Kryptonese? Perhaps the verb is always at the end. Eg. You not alone are (literal transcription to English) = You are not alone. (proper translation) Thoughts?

Dark Sentinel 04-14-2013 01:00 AM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DKDetective (Post 25588193)
So now that it is appears that the last word of the script is "are", do you folks think that might mean that they have even constructed unique rules of grammar for Kryptonese? Perhaps the verb is always at the end. Eg. You not alone are (literal transcription to English) = You are not alone. (proper translation) Thoughts?

It's very possible that Kryptonian has a SOV or OSV sentence structure. That's interesting. The conlang I made for my novel is VSO (Verb, Subject, Object), so as long as the word order makes sense for the language as a whole, I think it works.

Dark Sentinel 04-14-2013 02:47 AM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
Ok so this is what I can gather from the Kryptonian text:



Each full character is written in one swipe. From just what I'm seeing, the consonants are usually larger, fuller "glyphs", especially those which might be consonant clusters. So there's probably a fluid, natural system to the writing that allows for that, bearing a striking resemblance to Arabic and Sankskrit. The vowels appear to be these smaller "orbs"; it appears they all have the same general height, but again, diphthongs can be made by "clustering" these orbs, which is also interesting. And my favorite part, the way separate "words" are indicated, by the "bracket" resembling the top half of the :super: shield.

Fenrir 04-14-2013 03:46 AM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark Sentinel (Post 25590733)
Ok so this is what I can gather from the Kryptonian text:



Each full character is written in one swipe. From just what I'm seeing, the consonants are usually larger, fuller "glyphs", especially those which might be consonant clusters. So there's probably a fluid, natural system to the writing that allows for that, bearing a striking resemblance to Arabic and Sankskrit. The vowels appear to be these smaller "orbs"; it appears they all have the same general height, but again, diphthongs can be made by "clustering" these orbs, which is also interesting. And my favorite part, the way separate "words" are indicated, by the "bracket" resembling the top half of the :super: shield.

It might look Arabic to those who don't know Arabic, but that is where the similarities end. The Arabic script is written from right to left and there is absolutely no visual resemblance whatsoever to the Arabic alphabet.

The influence of Sanskrit (and Hindi), however, is striking so you are right on that one.

Dark Sentinel 04-14-2013 04:55 AM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Fenrir (Post 25590851)
It might look Arabic to those who don't know Arabic, but that is where the similarities end. The Arabic script is written from right to left and there is absolutely no visual resemblance whatsoever to the Arabic alphabet.

The influence of Sanskrit (and Hindi), however, is striking so you are right on that one.

:woot: ok, check this out:
I have a feeling, though I'm probably wrong, that the actual direction of the writing may be right to left like you said. But it's possible judging from the vowel markers that the words could be written right-to-left.

Just something to think about.

Dark Sentinel 04-21-2013 09:06 PM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
So somebody asked me to "transliterate" this Kryptonian script into Latin transcription. Bear in mind I have NO idea what MOS's Kryptonian language sounds like but it was fun trying to think of what it might sound like. It's what we "conlangers" like to do for fun :hehe:


http://i45.tinypic.com/8xuf51.jpg

Kryptonian:
Hxh vurk'tā syktā edeag.
(You alone are not.)

English:
You are not alone.

This is based solely on pure assumption by eyeballing the letters, and assuming that Kryptonians write left-to-right as we do. The vowels appear to be the smaller, closed off characters, while the consonants are fuller "glyphs," written in one stroke.

The curves atop the "brackets" seem to appear over the vowel characters, and to a degree I've identified three "types" of vowels:
  1. 1) a "plain" vowel is where there is no break in the bracket above a vowel character.
  2. 2) a "weak" vowel, where a short forward curve breaks the bracket (see the first "word"); this vowel is written with a simple accent or stress mark (ex.: )
  3. 3) a "strong" or "fortified" vowel, where the bracket is broken by a large backward curve. This vowel is written with a "macron" (ex.: ā)

The last word is really peculiar, and I can only guess that this is how vowel "diphthongs" are written, one vowel on top of the other. But there you go :woot:

Enjoy!

Stitch 04-25-2013 10:51 AM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
There's a few single Kryptonese letters on one of the Man Of Steel arty posters at GBPosters. I really hope one of the books delves a little more into this version of Kryptonese. :-)

Also, in the trailer we see *two* moons. What's the reckoning on these being named/referenced? Wegthor was one in the silver age I think...?

Dark Sentinel 05-05-2013 01:25 AM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
Bumping :woot:

ArmsHeldOut 05-05-2013 02:36 AM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DoomsdayApex (Post 25586765)

I like how Zod and Faora come with armor and masks. I actually didn't notice that at first.

Dark Sentinel 05-05-2013 03:16 AM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Kal-El.9859 (Post 25766987)
The winged beast Jor-El is riding is called: H'Raka and the robots are Kelex and Kelor
http://imageshack.us/a/img541/3936/photo32jc.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img198/6994/photo11sd.jpg

http://imageshack.us/a/img89/9352/photo12qqkf.jpg

Discuss!! :woot:

I wonder if H'Raka is the personal name of the creature or its species...I'd assume that (given English convention) it might be the former, although German convention might dictate the latter. Intriguing...

Dark Sentinel 05-18-2013 12:51 PM

Re: The Kryptonian Thread - Language, Writing, Culture, etc.
 
Regarding the use of "Sol" in reference to our solar system, let's have a little fun and go through the process of reverse-Kryptonian linguistics, shall we? :cwink:

I'll use my translation of the Kryptonian text from DSRW

Spoiler!!! Click to Read!:


as a template. Bear in mind this is ALL HYPOTHETICAL, based on conjectures made from Kryptonian names (family, personal, and common nouns i.e. "H'Raka") as well as my own imaginative philological attempts at a reverse transliteration.

So, using the phrase Hxh vurk'tā syktā edeag (my interpretation of the "You are not alone" text) coupled with H'Raka, Kelex, Kelor, Dev-Em, Zor, Jor, Elsi, Dar-Enx, Syra Ten-Ar, Rao, etc., I can infer some patterns amid the apparent "chaos", and assuming that the Kryptonians did indeed know of human life on Earth and (presumably) intercepted one or both of the Voyager "golden phonographs", I can safely assume that their variant of "Sol" being phonologically similar wouldn't be out of the realm of possibility.

However, since I never assume that it isn't "that simple," and since Kryptonian is a language far more ancient and homogenous than any human language, and for the sake of adding a little "flavor", let's assume that their approximation of "Sol" would be Xha, with a pronunciation of "K'shay-OH".

EDIT: I arrived at the final form Xha, based on Rao (which I assume will be pronounced "ROW" in the film)..I assume the -ao phoneme as being the word "star"

:woot:


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