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-   -   Female Superheores On Screen (http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=465657)

Shazam 09-20-2013 03:40 PM

Female Superheores On Screen
 
http://video.foxnews.com/v/268299228...silver-screen/

What do you think?

Since guys dominate the consumer market, do you think most really don't want to see a female-hero flick? All of them have been flops.....But the big one (Wonder Woman) has yet to be tried.

jonathancrane 09-20-2013 04:00 PM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
The problem with the female superhero offshoot is cinema is that it has not been marked with good writers and performers. I guarantee if Marvel Studios released a Black Widow film of the calibre of its other releases, it would perform quite well.

Loki882 09-20-2013 04:05 PM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
The big problem with previous female superhero movies is that they were terrible movies, or just bored you to tears like Elektra. Also, many of them weren't marketed very well. Now, if you put some actual time and effort into a female superhero film, got good performers to star, and marketed it well, then you might have a better chance at success. Black Widow is already an established and popular character in the MCU, so she's an obvious candidate. Wonder Woman is, well, Wonder Woman, so she's on the list. Captain Marvel would fit the cosmic stuff that Marvel seems to be doing now, and she could be Marvel's version of WW if done right. Marvel Studios is in a prime position to do this, as is WB if they're serious about DC films this time.

Shazam 09-20-2013 04:18 PM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Loki882 (Post 26878669)
The big problem with previous female superhero movies is that they were terrible movies, or just bored you to tears like Elektra. Also, many of them weren't marketed very well. Now, if you put some actual time and effort into a female superhero film, got good performers to star, and marketed it well, then you might have a better chance at success. Black Widow is already an established and popular character in the MCU, so she's an obvious candidate. Wonder Woman is, well, Wonder Woman, so she's on the list. Captain Marvel would fit the cosmic stuff that Marvel seems to be doing now, and she could be Marvel's version of WW if done right. Marvel Studios is in a prime position to do this, as is WB if they're serious about DC films this time.


How well is Wonder Woman selling on the shelf right now?

jonathancrane 09-20-2013 04:40 PM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
I think the question should be how well are comics selling right now?

Kahran Ramsus 09-20-2013 04:44 PM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
The Hunger Games proves that a female lead action film can do gangbusters. It just has to be good.

jonathancrane 09-20-2013 04:45 PM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Kahran Ramsus (Post 26878839)
The Hunger Games proves that a female lead action film can do gangbusters. It just has to be good.

Well said.

Mr. Dent 09-20-2013 05:28 PM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
Most of the most compelling Marvel females are at Fox. Marvel still has Scarlet Witch, Black Widow, and Captain Marvel, but it's dubious whether you'd even want to make a solo film out of Scarlet Witch...wouldn't make sense. At least Marvel is going so far to turn Peggy Carter into a character that can hold her own TV series.

Loki882 09-20-2013 05:52 PM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
The films offer the opportunity to do things a little differently. Maybe some comics characters wouldn't work as written. However, you could modify some things about the character that could work on film.

psylockolussus 09-20-2013 11:49 PM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
They just need to hire good writers and a good director. It won't perform like a Spider-Man movie or a Iron Man movie, but if the movie is good and the studio marketed it well, it should do okay at the box-office.

xeno000 09-21-2013 04:41 AM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Shazam (Post 26878739)
How well is Wonder Woman selling on the shelf right now?

Quote:

Originally Posted by jonathancrane (Post 26878815)
I think the question should be how well are comics selling right now?

Comic book sales have very little to do with how well a film version of a hero will do. Iron Man was never the highest-selling comic book (in fact, he was on the verge of cancellation for years) but his film counterpart took off like a rocket. Green Lantern is a popular character whose movie version flopped. The thing to remember is that the comic book market is minuscule compared to the potential film audience. The most successful comics sell maybe 100,000 copies per month. A blockbuster can sell tens of millions of tickets (TA sold 78 million in North America alone).


The execution of the film and its marketing determine box office success. The relative popularity of the source material is a far less important factor.

Zant 09-21-2013 06:55 AM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
[QUOTE=Mr. Dent;26879031]Most of the most compelling Marvel females are at Fox. Marvel still has Scarlet Witch, Black Widow, and Captain Marvel, but it's dubious whether you'd even want to make a solo film out of Scarlet Witch...wouldn't make sense. At least Marvel is going so far to turn Peggy Carter into a character that can hold her own TV series.[/QUOTE
I agree with this all the great female marvel characters are from the x universe. I am sure Marvel wishes they could borrow more female xmen characters

Shazam 09-21-2013 06:56 AM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Kahran Ramsus (Post 26878839)
The Hunger Games proves that a female lead action film can do gangbusters. It just has to be good.

That's a different genre of film..........that's from a novel not a comic book. My daughter reads novels. She doesn't read comics....

Shazam 09-21-2013 06:59 AM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jonathancrane (Post 26878815)
I think the question should be how well are comics selling right now?

Not really.....since the subject is "can a "female" superhero pull off a decent movie and will people go see it?"

Shazam 09-21-2013 07:00 AM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Dent (Post 26879031)
Most of the most compelling Marvel females are at Fox. Marvel still has Scarlet Witch, Black Widow, and Captain Marvel, but it's dubious whether you'd even want to make a solo film out of Scarlet Witch...wouldn't make sense. At least Marvel is going so far to turn Peggy Carter into a character that can hold her own TV series.

Peggy Carter is getting a TV series?????

DrCosmic 09-21-2013 09:48 AM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
Borrowing female team characters would not help MS make a solo heroine movie, same problem with Scarlet Witch, who is every bit as compelling as Storm or Invisible Woman, but as the ladynerd said, not solo characters.

The popularity of the property is only relevant if it's currently really popular, like Hunger Games. That's why using that as an example of how a superheroine movie would perform gets this face --> :dry:



Quote:

Originally Posted by psylockolussus (Post 26880587)
They just need to hire good writers and a good director. It won't perform like a Spider-Man movie or a Iron Man movie, but if the movie is good and the studio marketed it well, it should do okay at the box-office.

This. Precisely. The challenge is getting a budget for IM/Spidey caliber creators when you know you're not getting IM/Spidey returns. Stan's point, that Marvel is getting almost as many female eyes as Hunger Games, almost completely removes the motivation to do so.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jonathancrane (Post 26878639)
The problem with the female superhero offshoot is cinema is that it has not been marked with good writers and performers. I guarantee if Marvel Studios released a Black Widow film of the calibre of its other releases, it would perform quite well.

One thing people forget is that these movies had some of the best actresses at the height of their marketability, and still flopped tremendously. The bar is set higher for females by the audience. "okay" = flop for female movies. Its actually the female films with poor writing and performances that succeed.

Kahran Ramsus 09-21-2013 10:22 AM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Shazam (Post 26881327)
That's a different genre of film..........that's from a novel not a comic book. My daughter reads novels. She doesn't read comics....

Comic books are not a genre, they are a medium. Same with novels.

Katniss Everdeen is the same kind of heroic action figure that you would expect to see in a female led film based off of a comic book.

DrCosmic 09-21-2013 10:36 AM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Kahran Ramsus (Post 26881733)
Comic books are not a genre, they are a medium. Same with novels.

Katniss Everdeen is the same kind of heroic action figure that you would expect to see in a female led film based off of a comic book.

Not true.
1. Katniss doesn't get into many fights, they are all very short, and she doesn't win any on her own, she is saved more often than not, and her ultimate victory is not achieved through combat at all.
2. Katniss has a very angry unheroic attitude, and only deals with people because she's forced to.
3. Katniss is driven entirely by caring for her closest friends, her sister, the little girl that died, eventually Peetah. She could give a flip about the greater good, that's what makes her interesting.

The most compelling things about Katniss are in complete contrast with the superhero genre. The only thing she has in common with any female superhero is two x chromosomes. And in mystique's case, the same actress.

Mr. Dent 09-21-2013 12:39 PM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
Oh yeah, Spider-Woman is another potential character that could hold a movie.

Raiden 09-21-2013 01:15 PM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
Natalie Portman Teases Marvel`s Female Superhero Movie Is Coming


I hope Portman does indeed know something we don't.

jaymes_e06 09-21-2013 01:48 PM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
I know that it's confirmed for the most part about Agent Carter getting her own show. I hope she is referring to the fabled Ms. Marvel movie though.

Kahran Ramsus 09-21-2013 02:13 PM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DrCosmic (Post 26881769)
Not true.
1. Katniss doesn't get into many fights, they are all very short, and she doesn't win any on her own, she is saved more often than not, and her ultimate victory is not achieved through combat at all.

It is true that she tries to avoid fighting, but modern superhero films aren't all punchfests either (witness all the complaints about there not being enough Iron Man or Batman in their respective trilogy closers) She can fight when forced to, and she does defeat the final male contestant in the games. I haven't read the books to comment on the sequels yet. She's still a strong, action-oriented lead which is essentially what is needed in a female superhero film. And it shows that people will go to a female led action film.

Quote:

2. Katniss has a very angry unheroic attitude, and only deals with people because she's forced to.
Like Wolverine.

Quote:

3. Katniss is driven entirely by caring for her closest friends, her sister, the little girl that died, eventually Peetah. She could give a flip about the greater good, that's what makes her interesting.
Like Wolverine.

We can only really start having this conversation after a good female superhero film flops at the box office. As of now that hasn't happened since we've never actually gotten a good female superhero film yet.

Silvermoth 09-21-2013 04:37 PM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Raiden (Post 26882359)
Natalie Portman Teases Marvel`s Female Superhero Movie Is Coming


I hope Portman does indeed know something we don't.

I hope so too. Captain marvel is the obvious choice but I wonder if marvel will be really forward thinking and already starting to plan a wanda maximoff movie. It would suprise me at all if she was the real star of avengers AOU

DrCosmic 09-21-2013 05:51 PM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Kahran Ramsus (Post 26882577)
It is true that she tries to avoid fighting, but modern superhero films aren't all punchfests either (witness all the complaints about there not being enough Iron Man or Batman in their respective trilogy closers) She can fight when forced to, and she does defeat the final male contestant in the games. I haven't read the books to comment on the sequels yet. She's still a strong, action-oriented lead which is essentially what is needed in a female superhero film. And it shows that people will go to a female led action film.

She doesn't avoid fighting Peetah after the interview. She just tries to avoid getting killed, which for her means not facing any opponent since they are all far superior. She does shoot the final male contestant after Peetah fights him, that's true, but only after the male contestant has an epiphany and a death wish. She doesn't win fights. And if THG is an ''action movie'' so is Harry Potter, and Twilight for that matter.

Quote:

Like Wolverine.

We can only really start having this conversation after a good female superhero film flops at the box office. As of now that hasn't happened since we've never actually gotten a good female superhero film yet.
You would expect to see something like a Wolverine on a female superhero movie? What superheroine movie is that? And didn't Wolverine start his film presence by helping a random little girl for no reason? So, not like movie Wolverine so much. THG is nothing like what people expect from a superheroine movie, and not like any female superhero that MS would make.

So, How would a good superheroine film flopping show anything we don't already see? We already know great female genre films don't sell as well as male ones, and quality teams can't be built on the budgets of the successful female action movies, and that females are about as likely to see avengers or iron man as hunger games. Whether great films would bomb is immaterial, if we have concrete reasons why a great film isn't likely to be made. The discussion is past magical gender money ceilings.

Kahran Ramsus 09-21-2013 07:46 PM

Re: Female Superheores On Screen
 
Wolverine was also motivated primarily by those he directly cares about, generally doesn't like dealing with people, and shies away from the greater good unless he has a direct reason to get involved. But both Logan and Katniss do have hearts and much like Logan refuses to abandon Rogue and takes her under his wing, Katniss does the same with Rue.

So your suggestion is just to abandon the idea without trying? There is zero evidence that audiences won't show for a quality female led superhero film. There have been plenty of female led films over the years that grossed a ton, despite your claims. The highest grossing movie of all-time adjusted for inflation (Gone with the Wind) had a female lead. Granted female led action films are few and far between and good ones even rarer, which is why The Hunger Games is such a useful template. And, yes, The Hunger Games is very much apart of the same action/scifi genre that most superhero films (especially Marvel ones) are. To claim that a female lead action film is a waste of time with no evidence to back it up is delusional at best and sexist at worst.

I'm not trying to turn lead into gold here. A great female led superhero film is entirely feasible.


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