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Old 07-07-2011, 07:17 AM   #34
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Default Re: What should come next? Transformers 4 or a reboot?

Originally Posted by Optimus_Prime_ View Post
You really think so, because that movie was initially panned by critics, and it made buttkiss at the Box Office. First of all, forget Bay, the 1986 movie callously killed off Optimus Prime which caused kids to cry in the theater. The reason: his toy was being discontinued. You want to talk about the "grand" plot? The first thirty minutes of the movie, including Optimus Prime's death have NOTHING to do with the rest of the movie. No seriously? Explain to me why that's b-e-t-t-e-r than what Bay did? Because that entire sequence was MANDATED, yes MANDATED by Hasbro to tie off toys no longer offered in stores. The writers of TFTM didn't want to do it. They wanted Optimus to die a martyr at the end. The folks at Hasbro though were adamate the story not focus on characters who were discontinued.

Unicron never explained, just shows up. Great set up there.

The Matrix was never explained, and was basically retconned in. We'd already seen what Optimus' inards looked like and the Matrix was conveinently abscent. The MATRIX WAS NEVER PART OF THE SHOW. You'd be surprised how many people who hate Bay's take never knew this. In fact NONE of the movie was in the show. The moon bases? Nope. Ultra Magnus, Kup, Daniel, Hot Rod, Wheelie, The Quintessons, any of it? Nope. Not even Autobot City. They are all just there.

The connections are never explained. The Quintessons were supposedly agents of Unicron, but in the final movie they show up, unannounced, and serve no purpose in the general plot EXCEPT they make one huge plot hole: How did Hot Rod and Kup know where Magnus and the others were?

Also Magnus was never supposed to be randomly killed in the original. His arms and legs were to have been pulled off. You can see this is the repair sequence, and if you watch the death scene and listen to the audio. However the "draw and quartering" was deemed inappropriate, so instead we got a random exploding Magnus.

Let's see what else

Oh yeah

Hot Rod: "Where is Galvatron, where is he?"
Wreck-Gar: "And the answer is...Unicron"

(By the way scintilating dialogue there)

How the flying f*** did Wreck-Gar know this, at all, by any wrapping of my mind. He'd met Galvatron like ten seconds ago, and never talked or interacted with him in any meaningful way whatsoever.

What else is wrong with that movie...hmmmm....

...Oh did you notice how many characters show up in two places at once: Hound, Sunstreaker, Dirge, Thundercracker and a few others. Thundercracker is reformatted by Unicron, and appears 2 minutes later at Starscream's coronation. By the way Starscream's treachery in that movie would mean literally NOTHING to someone who hadn't watched the show, neither would Soundwave's compassion towards Megatron. The movie does absolutely zilch to set up the characters.

Nothing is done to set up Hot Rod as the leader, he just fights Galvatron, gets Matrix, whoops leader. Why didn't it do that when he held it the first time? Never explained. Why didn't Optimus know it was him, he's carrying the damn thing? Never explained. The purpose of the Matrix is never really explained. Does the Matrix make you a bigger stronger robot? Why didn't Optimus revert back to Orion Pax when he passed it? Why didn't Magnus start calling himself Prime? Never explained

Also the dialogue is incredibly clunky.

But yes, it's a much better film than Transformers or Dark of the Moon.
Of course it was panned by critics. It was a feature length cartoon commercial. You can pick apart the movie all you want, but despite all those flaws, it is STILL better than Bayformers. As someone else said, judging the quality of these films by comparing them to the cartoon doesn't work because this movie is a multi-million dollar summer blockbuster. Honestly, think about what you are saying. They spent millions of dollars to bring these guys to the big screen, yet they made them "every bit as good" as a toy commercial from 25 years ago. That says alot about Bayformers. And for someone with the name Optimus Prime, you really seem to hate the Transformers.

Originally Posted by OoAnd1 View Post
Define "quality" because there's a reason millions of people have watched these Transformers films above almost everything else the last 5 years.
Of course millions of people watched this movie. It has pretty special effects. Quality is how well will these movies stand up to subsequent viewing. How many people are going to sit and watch these movies all the way through after the awe of the special effects as worn off. I wanted to go back and watch DotM again to see if I liked it because it's a good movie, or if it was just better than RotF. After thinking about it, I could not force myself to sit through that building scene again. The quality of the story was not enough to get me to sit through the pretty special effects.

Originally Posted by Drizzle View Post
Considering the amount of characters that are now dead, especially Decepticons, I don't really want to see a fourth one.
Just bring them back. Trust me, nobody is going to question how they came back.

Originally Posted by Optimus_Prime_ View Post
Reaaaaallllyyyyyyy. I post over at, the largest Tranformers messageboard, and also at TFTM2005. The majority of Transformers fans, ya'know the actual ones that have followed the franchise and don't have nostalgia fueled distorted memories of it, actually loved the Bayverse by and large. It's been pretty much the most profitable venture thus far. Your assertion that some dumb, cud chewing public is responsible for this and the other film's remarkable success is well...wrong, I'm sorry. The toys are revered in the forums. Check, they constantly get good reviews. Go to a BotCon. The biggest draw is the movie(s), has been for the past several years. No only people who seem to think the franchise was some brilliant fiction seem to think Bay pissed all over the franchise. You talk to actual faithfuls, who have followed ALL of the series, and the reaction has been quite the opposite.
It's not nostalgia fueled distorted memories. The cartoons were actually entertaining. How many of those fans just don't want to say anything bad about the franchise? I've seen many fan reviews that you could tell they were tring hard NOT to be critical of these films. I've seen so many reviews that preface their review by saying, "Don't expect oscar worthy material". It's a bad sign when you have to start by saying that because I never expect oscar material in any movie I go see. It only serves as code for "this movie is really crap, but I'm going to like it anyways because it's Transformers".

And I'm not some 80's purist. I also liked Beast Wars, TF: Animated, TF: Prime, and I did like the first movie. I even bough all the toys from the first one. I didn't like, however, TF: Armada and all the other anime crap, Beast Machines, or RotF. is one of the sites I check daily, along with SSH.

Originally Posted by Hound89 View Post
But that was The Direct Refence, theres no reason they cant make more movies in the franchise,

"We haven't lost the Transformers. They didn't grow up or become expensive like Toby Maguire."

For the Second Trilogy it wont be hard to introduce, Galavatron [thogh personaly id love for them to use Bludgeon or Thunderwing]
That's ironic because the reason we don't get enough Transformers is because they are expensive to begin with.

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