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Old 08-29-2012, 07:17 PM   #16
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Default Re: Joseph Gordon-Levitt as John Blake V - Part 6

Originally Posted by The Guard View Post
1. He didn't actually DO the actions that caused Ra's to die, though. Gordon did. This isn't a military hearing where its Batman's fault for giving Gordon an idea. This is real life, where people have to make moral choices despite the options other people provide them.
So anytime someone makes up a trap, and that person doesn't actually physically kill someone, they aren't to blame for the killing? So now Gordon killed Ra's? Right...

2. It wasn’t a trap for Ra’s. It wasn’t about killing Ra’s Al Ghul at all. It was about preventing the train from reaching Wayne Station to save Gotham City. Period.
Of course it was to stop the train from reaching the tower, but seing as he knew the train wouldn't reach the end of the tracks, he knew the demise of Ra's in the train the second he was on. Thinking otherwise is crazy to even think about.

If you really think Batman just flat out killed Ra's by telling Gordon to do something in case he failed to stop the train, then I don’t think you understand cause and effect. At least in context.
He never said "just in case I can't stop the train, blow the tracks". That was NEVER implied at all. Where can you show me that it was the setup to the plan?

This isn't the same as tackling Two Face off a ledge. THAT is cause and effect. He didn't know he was going to kill Two Face, but at the same time, he had to save the kid. On the other hand with Ra's, he knew he was dead the second he told Gordon to blow the tracks. He wasn't trying to stop the train, other than derailing it from its tracks. Even the script spells that out clearly.

That’s not what Batman said at all. Look at the scene in context. He said “Who said anything about stopping it”? And why did Batman say that? What was the context of the words in the scene?

He said it in response to Ra’s saying “That’s why you can’t stop this train”. While Batman was getting choked to death.

When Batman says “Who said anything about stopping it”, he’s basically grasping at straws to survive, acknowledging that he knows the train can't be stopped and using that to surprise Ra's with his calm over that fact, simultaneously implying that he has an ace up his sleeve to throw Ra's further. He’s saying that because he’s trying to distract Ra’s, so Ra's will look up and see the towers collapsing and remove his attention from Bruce for that split second. Because otherwise, he’s going to die at Ra’s Al Ghul’s hands.
Ohhhh, so the "underlying context" of it all says something different that what he's actually saying? Kinda like you making up plot points that were never implied in the movie? Gotcha....

He clearly said "who said anything about stopping it", which clearly implies, regardless of the situation, that he was never going to stop it. He could have said anything like "I blew the tracks" if he wanted to 'distract' him. Did it work as a distraction? Sure, but he still told us the truth in that sentence.

It’s a ploy to distract Ra's and gain the upper hand, not an admission or a statement of “My plan all along was to derail this train”. Before the event, he clearly says to Gordon "I may need your help". Derailing the train was a backup plan.
So the "context" of the line "I may need your help" actually means "backup plan"?

You know what would have worked the best? Bruce calling up the company and going "hey, I'm Bruce Wayne, I own part of the monorail, why don't you shut off power to the tracks please".

Last edited by Travesty; 08-29-2012 at 07:28 PM.
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