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Old 10-25-2012, 07:04 PM   #107
The Joker
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Location: Arkham Asylum
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Default Re: TDKR Oscar Chances? - Part 1

Originally Posted by CConn View Post
When I said entire movie, I meant the entire time Ra's was present.
Ok. When someone says the entire movie, they usually mean the entire movie.

No, Bruce didnt go to him. Ra's slaughter him out. Vaguely offered services and answers that Bruce sought, bonded with him, utilized his knowledge of Bruce's anger and emotional makeup to steer him along the path that he wanted.
Ra's met him in the prison. Offered him something better than brawling with petty criminals, and left him to it. It wasn't a manipulation. It was an offer. Plain and simple.

He helped Bruce conquer his fears and deal with his anger. No manipulation because Bruce wanted that.

And yes, Bruce did rebel. But that was still Ra's goal the entire time with Bruce; manipulate him to achieve his own ends.
What own ends? Bruce wanted to join the LOS. He was with them on everything up until he learned that their way of doing things was murder. After that he was out.

Manipulation implies he was being conned into doing things he wouldn't normally do or didn't want. Everything he did with Ra's he wanted. He wanted to get over his fears. He wanted to deal with his anger. He wanted to learn how to fight criminals and use fear against them. Ra's showed him all of that. No manipulations needed.

You're the first person I've ever seen accuse Ra's of manipulating Bruce in the training.

"Sometimes I remember it one way. Sometimes another. If I'm going to have a past, I prefer it to be multiple choice!"

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