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Old 11-17-2012, 11:12 PM   #82
The Guard
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Join Date: Jun 2002
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Default Re: In hindsight what changes would you do

True. But this is the only instance ever of Talia telling Bane to do something in the film. Ever, as far as we know. And Bane disregards it, despite his supposed "puppydog love" for Talia. So what does that tell us about Bane? What do we know about him, given the limited knowledge at our disposal?
Well, given the context? Only that he wants to kill Batman and is capable of disobeying Talia's orders.

There is absolutely no evidence in the film that Talia was the leader. None. The only reason people think that is because of one interaction between her and Bane.
Which is the only scene the film gives us in regard to their relationship. Where it becomes apparent that Bane’s stated plan…was actually Talia’s plan, and borne out of her own desire for revenge.

Eh, I read Knightfall and KnightsEnd. The latter was better because Bane is a very, very boring character and his plan is very generic.
I don’t see how he’s any more boring in the comics than he is in the film…

How is breaking a bunch of iconic, infamous madmen out of an asylum to create chaos and wear down your opponent so that you can study him before you ultimately break him and take over his city “generic”? Where have we seen that done before in film or in comics or in literature in general? Much less to the point where it has become "generic"?

It also doesn't help that Bane's personality isn't developed much beyond that of a generic pro-wrestler (hence his appearance).
Bane’s basically a self-made supervillain, Batman’s opposite. He sets himself as a sort of dictator/mob boss. He’s clearly very intelligent and cunning and quite strong and skilled.

How do you get “generic pro wrestler” out of that in regard to his personality?

Also, he made Bane a lot more interesting and developed as a character.
Arguable. He barely developed Bane at all, and the development Bane received in the movie largely revolves around the twist that it's not actually his development, and ultimately, any development he receives pales in comparison to the development he has received in the relevant comics.

This guy isn't just a lackey for anyone. I don't see how the Talia reveal suddenly erases all those depictions of true villainous strength.
It doesn’t.

What it does do is seriously cast into doubt whether Bane has any strong motivations of his own, which weakens him as a character.

That’s part of the reason people are calling him a “lackey”. It’s hyperbole on their part… clearly he’s more involved than just being a henchman, but Talia’s speech at the end of THE DARK KNIGHT RISES essentially boils down to “He did it all for me” and reveals that the intent behind everything going on stems from her own desire for revenge, which makes Bane look like he doesn’t have any motivations of his own. And since Talia’s motivations is fairly weak, and is basically a warmed over version of Ra’s Al Ghul’s mixed with a generic revenge plot…this isn’t a good thing for Bane in the least.

"Perception is the enemy of reason."

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