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Old 11-19-2012, 04:03 PM   #115
The Guard
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Default Re: In hindsight what changes would you do

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Actually it is explored, but maybe not to the depth of your liking. What more did you want from them exactly?
More than melodramatic line readings. I wanted some intellectual content, like we got in previous films.

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When you boil things down to bullet points, obviously it's going to seem thin.
So let's discuss the details, then.

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What makes Ra's in BB a 'full' character versus Bane being a 'thin' character in TDKR? In both cases you only get as much information as you need and as is pertinent to the themes that drove Bruce to seek justice.
Ra's Al Ghul's scenes actually deal with and explore concepts, like the nature of crime itself, the various layers and elements of it, his thoughts on punishing criminals VS seeking to redeem/understand them, and his thoughts/observations on corruption. They deal in specific ways that inform Bruce's crusade, like being invisible, learning to overcome one's fear and using symbols to become more than a man. They form a complete picture of a character and his motivations and desires, instead of a bunch of vague minor details.

The Joker's scenes actually deal with and explore concepts, like the nature of chaos, the various components of society, the reception/reaction to Batman, his place in society, the idea of a "better" class of criminal, etc. They form a complete picture of a character and his motivations and desires, instead of a bunch of vague minor details.

Bane's scenes? Abstract, melodramatic stuff like "I was born in the dark...molded by it...I didn't see the light until I was a grown man, and by then it was nothing to me but blinding", and that he learned the truth about despair by hoping...which explains how he knows to torture others with that knowledge, so we know he's a torturer, but not how he became a person who would do that…and a bunch of secondhand innuendo about a legend that Bane climbed out of a prison...which turns out not to be about Bane at all. Oh, and he punishes the rich...because he hates them for some reason.

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I personally was a big fan of getting vague pieces of the characters' pasts that you can match with how they handle situations in the film.
What do you mean by that?

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IMO this is a great example of getting an idea of a character and his motivations without beating it over the head.
Except that they did beat you over the head with the character and any/all motivations he had.

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And to the comment that Bane 'just IS evil', the answer is simple - he isn't.
Comments about Bane's moral code aside…he flat out says that he is evil. His actions are decidedly evil. And there's no real exploration of or any suggestion that his actions are not, or that there's any kind of a gray area to what he's doing.

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He isn't just a terrorist for no reason, he is because he has seen the horrors of those with power using it unjustly (much like Bruce).
Where? When? How? Other than Dagget, where is this exploration found in the film? Where does anything imply this?

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Either way, their goal is to clean Gotham's system of corruption, a noble goal in itself.
But it's not "in itself", is it? Because Bane intends to kill a bunch of innocent people.

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Last edited by The Guard; 11-19-2012 at 04:09 PM.
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