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Old 12-02-2012, 01:41 AM   #54
The Joker
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Default Re: A theory about an alternate TDKR with the Joker

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Originally Posted by Anno_Domini View Post
It would have helped in the reasoning of why Crane showed up, but it's not necessarily bad writing.
I agree.

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You're asking this question even when I asked why Crane is even there to begin with, who's mostly likely insane?
Crane is there because he's one man who worked loyally for the LOS in Gotham before. He's not an uncontrollable psychopath. He's a cool, calculating psycho who knows how to follow orders as was shown in Begins.

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And he's unaware of Bane wanting to destroy Gotham City which includes Crane himself. Just using Crane the same exact way, so how is it any better?
Any better than what? You asked why Crane would be here again, I gave you an answer. He worked for the LOS before, the LOS was under new management, with a whole new scheme, and in control of Gotham.

What other reasons did you want to hear?

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Probably being at a much peaceful place in these forums where you don't have to reply to multi-quote posts day after day, I know I would, but I try to keep up until I'm just too dead tired to reply.
Nobody is forcing you to reply. If you feel this is disrupting the harmony in any way then the logical thing to do would be not to respond and keep it going.

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No support? Certain pieces of dialogue does support my theory, wild or not.
No dialogue supports it. But there's multiple quotes that say Batman's been gone for 8 years. Nolan himself said the 8 year gap is the retirement period for Batman.

It's so straight forward.

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Passing what sentence though? Just tossing out the cops and mostly the rich citizens out unto the ice river. You have to be a Gothamite to pass such a predictable sentencing?
Yes, these were the courts for the guilty and the corrupt of Gotham. They were not going to let any Joe blow have this task.

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So you're saying he's only mentioning the few days Falcone was put away in Arkham, someone needed to get a hold of power quickly in a matter of days?
Yes, that's what I'm saying. When Falcone was put into Arkham after going "crazy", the Falcone empire was left without a leader. Hence why Dent said with Falcone in Arkham someone had to step up to run the crime family.

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Exactly; a couple of days. I don't buy Maroni having to step up that quickly.
You can buy what you like. Gordon said the Narrows was lost at the end of Begins. That's where Arkham was. So what makes you think Falcone was even still in there anyway when the whole Narrows island was done for.

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I say they were pivotal because once they became part of Bane's plan after finding out about the truth about Dent, these criminals were handed guns and went along with the LoS in patrolling/policing the city, escorting people unto the ice river, hunting down cops, etc. That to me, shows them that they were pivotal to a point that they became allies to the League in that regard even if not knowing about the League's true intentions.
I don't know how many times a fact so simple as Bane's plan never ever relying on man power from Blackgate to take over and run Gotham. If it did, I'd be agreeing with you. But the Dent lie was just an accidental bonus and just added more troops to Bane's already healthy ranks.

Pivotal doesn't come into it when it comes to the Blackgate inmates. They were an accidental unexpected bonus.

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And making comparisons isn't even my point. I'm saying Joker would be compared EVEN more if he had some important plot with Batman, even with a cameo that'll tally up in his favor with still saying who is the better villain, even in the trilogy as a whole.
Then your point is moot, because whether he was in it or not, he still would have been compared to Bane. If the villain was Mr. Freeze in TDK, it would have been him getting compared to Bane.

The outcome would have been the same in regards to comparisons. The Joker just happens to be a better and more popular villain for the majority.

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It's silly to say Joker would be the talk of TDKR even as a cameo because of simply it being Joker?
Yes exactly. You are basically saying a came from him would eclipse all the new characters just because it's the Joker.

It sounds ridiculous.

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You say some buzz, I say major buzz. I think it would indeed dwarf the amount of attention Bane would receive.
Fine. I don't understand your logic for that though.

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I can't give any examples as we've never had seen one of the greatest villains in a CBM show up in a cameo, which yes, would've create massive hype.
Who do you consider greatest villains in a CBM?

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Would that much even be given to Norman who wasn't that great of a villain to begin with(imo)?
Go to the Spidey forums and ask do they think Dafoe was a great villain. Then you'll see.

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So you wouldn't have contributed to this then?
Of course I would. But to say this buzz would have been the predominant buzz over the whole movie and all the new characters is a falsity.

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Popular comic book characters yes, but did any of them make as much buzz as Joker has in any CBM?
That's not the point. Those characters are big popular fishes in their fan base pond. They didn't steal the limelight from everyone in the movies they had a cameo in.

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