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Old 02-11-2013, 09:43 AM   #105
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Default Re: Tom Hiddleston: Loki Redux - Part 1

Originally Posted by Godzilla2000 View Post
I like Loki as a character but we have to be real about who the character is. Fangirls can get way too blinded by Tom's good looks to really see Loki's character for what he is. Loki consciously makes the decision to injure, maim, and kill innocent people in New Mexico for the specific purpose of killing Thor. Nobody forces Loki to tell the Destroyer to kill and maim all those people it does and this is in Thor before he meets Thanos. If Loki was a real person he'd be a Ted Bundy type of person.

Difference between Thor and Loki is that Thor has learned his lesson and Loki has not. We need to stop romanticizing evil characters of this nature and vilify the heroes who are trying to stop them from their selfish destructive behaviors.
essentially . At the end of the day, Loki is a villain.

Originally Posted by Godzilla2000 View Post
That's the problem I have discussing certain characters though. With Loki as a character if you break him down to his base core he's not what you could call a well of positivity. He's a mass murderer with zero remorse but for very superficial reasons. Really, I can't find it positive that he is willing to kill innocent people because he feels unloved. You just cannot sugar coat what Loki really is despite how cute looking Tom is.

Originally Posted by elizah72 View Post
First of all, I'm not some stupid teenage girl who just sympathizes with villains because the actor is hot. I really dont appreciate you insinuating that I am either. Clearly you dont think much of me, if that's what you think.

and the flip of the coin is we have Thor, early Thor 1, who was loved, and extremely priviledged, the precious chosen son, the one true heir, everything going his way, mom and dad love him best, all the babes love him, he's got his mighty hammer and the alpha male in the group. Everyone cheering as he is to be made King. Then his coronation is spoiled and he goes down to Jotunheim at the beginning of Thor 1, with the intention of beating and killing and subjugating the **** out of the Frost Giants, against the wishes of his father and companions, and needlessly endangering his companions. I"ll "slay them all" he said as a little boy. He murders them with a disturbing glee there on Jotunheim. Killing for the fun of it, he refuses to be dragged away as his brother calls to him, pleading with him to make an escape with the rest of them. Because he's just having too much fun there. He talks about "glorious battles" so it sounds like he's been killing in those battles across the 9 realms with glee for 1000 years. He has this attitude of violence is good and glorious for 1000 years, a mass murderer with zero remorse, for 1000 years. I dont say this to be vicious or attack Thor, not at all, I'm glad he changed, that's good, it's good that he had a character arc that made him much more complicated and grey and not just a Dudley Do-right character. That is a good thing. but if you break him down to his base core at that point, and for a LONG time before that, he is as bad as Loki, even if in slightly different ways, and with little or seemingly absolutely no reasons, superficial or not, for being that way.

So you see? No point in arguing about this crap. So please, let's move on.
I don't think she was insulting you, pretty sure "you" was in general, so don't take it personally.

But the thing you gotta understand Elizah, is that these are all people who have read comics, for a long time. A lot longer than you have. The MCU, and films didn't introduce them into comics, so in general, even though you are a fan, a lot of hard core comic book readers do know a lot more about the character than you do, or anyone else who started getting into it recently. They have read 50+ years of characterization in the source material going for them. And haven't read up about them cause they are fan. They've read all the source material. Again, yes, mcu and 616 are different, but he's not THAT different, and the film version is based on the comic book Loki...based on qualities that place him solidly in the top 10 marvel villains, as many lists say. It's just a different take on his 616 version. But qualities of his 616 are still there.

I am gunna say my opinion on mcu Loki super quick and short for once. Right now, Loki is a self conflicted, evil, egotistical narcisistic man, similar to how he is in the comics. HOWEVER, he had a much different origin, a deeper emotional origin that lead to his current state. That's how I see it. At the end of the day, he is the Loki we know, he just had a more conflicting and emotional rise that lead to this.

and No, Thor is a warrior born, and craves battle, but he was never as bad as Loki. Come on now, being spontaneous and arrogant is different than intentionally causing mischief. Thor and Loki aren't really comparable in that retrospect.

The thing you got to understand, as some people who have read of these characters their whole life, for someone to come in who is new to marvel and these characters, and tell them "how it is" regarding a character, it's destined for conflict.

this is a pointless debate, everyone has different views, so lets just drop it from here

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