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Old 03-21-2013, 10:04 PM   #510
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Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 507
Default Re: am I the only one who DIDN'T think Nicholson nailed joker??

Originally Posted by Gotham's Knight View Post
^^^Heath's Joker had the same goals of the Joker in The Killing Joke on a larger scale. It wasn't about driving Gordon mad in this version, in TDK it's about bringing Harvey down to his level and also showing everyone else that they're like him and that "when the chips are down, these civilized people; they'll eat each other".
I know what it was about. It was just executed poorly. Why would they not blow eachother up? Because of the inner goodness of people, is that the point? No crook tried to get the detonator because they were afraid of the big black guy? You had the conservative guy on the other boat, suddenly get a change of heart? It was corny.

Is it some thinly veiled reference to the War on Terror? That people are willing to participate in mass murder to save themselves because of fear of what the 'terrorists' might do?

But it wasn't about turning these people 'mad' and 'like him' IE: a psychotic killer. It was about driving people from fear to go along with mass murder (hence the not too subtle reference to the Iraq war, etc).

I suppose I can agree on Two-Face, since he did get half his face burnt off (although bizarrely he doesn't seem to care at all about this in the movie) and his fiance gets killed. But we see little signs of the madness that is supposed to already have been brewing in him, only when he was threatening Joker's henchman, but that wasn't enough for me to see him go totally vigilante and even willing to kill little kids. But it was all just because he was trying to avenge Rachel, not really because he had become like the Joker. I just found all this a little too convenient for the plot.

Compare this to Two-Face's origin in the classic BTAS episode. Harvey was clearly already insane. Not because his girlfriend was being threatened, but because he just was. All it took was his scarring to push him over the edge. It wasn't caused by Joker killing his girlfriend. LAME, Nolan, LAME.

We get little of Two-Face's backstory in The Dark Knight. Only that he's fighting corruption, has a nickname "Harvey Two-Face" (and we never find out why) and is engaged with Rachel Dawes. His Two-Face was more of a vigilante, seeking to make things right, than an outright criminal or madman like the Joker.

So, again, I don't see the point. It's not illustrated as well as in The Killing Joke. Where he tries to drive Gordon mad but fails. In The Dark Knight, he succeeds with Harvey (driving him to madness or criminality), so does that mean that the Joker is right or wrong? This is never addressed in the movie.

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