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Old 04-10-2013, 02:53 PM   #39
DrCosmic
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Default Re: Super-soldier Action Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePowerCosmic View Post
I don't think it undermines his leadership. He just looks weaker than he actually is, and that lies specifically with his super soldier abilities, not his leadership. He only had to prove himself to those cops because they didn't know who he was, but once he took the aliens down he got their respect.

Stark was never seen as the leader in the movie. Him saying "Call it, Cap" just showed that he trusted Cap to call the shots, as did the rest of the team when no one gave any objections. I understand what you're saying about Cap's physical prowess, but he was clearly seen as the leader of the team and a leader of men.
Perhaps that's the way you took Tony's statement, but the fact remains that Tony specifically told Cap to give battlefield orders, unlike all the other trusting heroes. Would Cap have given orders otherwise? Dunno.

The cops are representative of the audience, many of whom also do not know who Cap is, and have concluded that this is him at his best, including his inability to triumph over mooks without his shield. His lack of known physical prowess undermines his leadership with the cops just like his lack of known physical prowess undermines his leadership with the audience. He's still seen as a leader, yes, but not as strong a leader, and that shows as Tony tells him to give orders, and later negates Cap's orders - without having to convince everyone to trust him as Cap did - with the nuke. These are related issues.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Juicy J View Post
Caps a pretty tough character to get right all around. Casting was difficult to begin with but Chris Evans is a great leading man; the costume in TFA was amazing and the one in the Avengers was... serviceable, I guess, but I can tell they're going to step their game up with this next movie.
I think that now that they've got the origins and the giant ensemble movie out of the way they'll be able to have more fun with this next one and really explore the character and what exactly he can do physically.
I don't think Cap is that hard. I think once you get rid of the notion that he's supposed to be corny, which TFA never quite shook, and accept: there is a badarse dude wearing the American Flag, Cap becomes very easy to write, you just burden someone hardcore with carrying America on their shoulder. But TFA was far more interested in seeing Cap ride out of explosions on motorcycles than show any impressive hand to hand skills, tactics or even the basic leadership skills in the Avengers. The only obstacle is people who see Cap as not-Awesome. There's was plenty of room in TFA to make Cap something more than a good man with an American flag, but they spent their extra time making sure that Howard Stark was awesome, that Cap had a big song and dance number and was subjected to not being taken seriously for an hour, before we saw even the traces of Captain America for less than that time.

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Last edited by DrCosmic; 04-10-2013 at 02:59 PM.
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