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Old 04-22-2013, 02:56 PM   #31
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Default Re: Should the archenemy be first?

Originally Posted by PyroChamber View Post
When a superhero movie is being made do you think it's a good idea to go with the hero's main archenemy first, or start with a different villain and work your way up to the main one in a sequel?

With the Nolan trilogy, we started with Ra's al Ghul and Scarecrow first then went to the Joker in the second movie.

Iron Man: Iron Monger first, Whiplash and Justin Hammer second, with the third one now we're getting the Mandarin.
The reason for this is because most arch enemies require their own origin story. This was a weakness in the first Spider-Man. It had to break away from Spider-Man's origin story to tell this completely separate origin for Green Goblin. This hurt the film's continuity, and is part of why SM2 is seen as a much better film, because it's free to revolve the story around Doc Ock's origin and rise and fall, because it can make Spider-Man's story revolve around that.

For the first movie, the first time a character is introduced, you want to give them a villain that ties in well with their origin, so that it's all one story, instead of 30 minutes of origin, and then a completely separate story starting well into through the film.
  • Iron Monger is not only Iron Man's mentor, but is motivated entirely by Iron Man's appearance.
  • Ra's Al Ghul trained Batman
  • Zod is from and about Krypton, which is Superman's origin

Now there are some cases, particularly those with small rogues galleries, where the Archenemy is a good origin story enemy.
  • Joker '89 killed Batman's parents
  • Magneto started the school with Xavier
  • Red Skull and Captain America are both super soldiers
  • Loki is Thor's brother from Asgard where they grew up together
  • Deacon Frost turned Blade's pregnant mother, making him the Daywalker

And that works well for those heroes, but for others who try to make it fit, things turn out bad. Some would put Joker 89 in this list:
  • Dr. Doom becomes the funder and part of the initial power-giving voyage so he can be part of the origin.
  • Absorbing Man was turned into Hulk's father in Ang Lee's Hulk, so he could be a major part of the origin of Hulk's rage and Banner's science.
  • Kingpin was turned into Daredevil's Father's killer in his film
  • Typhoid Mary was inserted into the cadre of killers for Elektra in her film
  • Lex Luthor was turned into a catalyst for Superman's departure and return in Superman Returns

And, y'know, doing it the wrong way actually sucks:
  • Sinestro is Hal's arch enemy and plays a big part in his origin, but instead of being a villain, he was a hero in the film and only turned evil in the post credits, leaving us to deal with a film split between "Parallax" and an extended origin story of Hector Hammond, but a big WTF when Sinestro puts on a yellow ring.

So, If were doing it
  • For a Flash movie, Dr. Phosphorous' chemicals can be the ones that get hit by lightning
  • For a Wonder Woman movie, Ares should oppress and aggravate Paradise Island to action
  • For an Aquaman movie, his brother Ocean Master should be the foe
  • For an Martian Manhunter movie, the White Martians, or maybe Ma'le'fe'ak his relative... or even the same alien invasion responsible for the loss of Mars
  • For a Robin movie, Zucco would have to feature prominently (or else, make Blockbuster "Zucco")
  • For a Black Panther movie, Ulysses Klaw, who killed his father, would be the main baddie
  • For a Captain Marvel movie, Yon-Rogg, Mar-Vell's commanding officer would be the main baddie
  • For a Dr. Strange movie, obviously Baron Mordo, his co-student and master's killer
  • For an Inhumans movie, Maximus the Mad,a fellow inhuman would have to beguile

So yeah, just those things.

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"Sufficiently understood magic is indistinguishable from science."

Last edited by DrCosmic; 04-22-2013 at 03:02 PM.
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