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Old 07-21-2013, 11:51 PM   #18
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Default Re: All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part

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Originally Posted by Marvin View Post
I mean that critics don't want films to pander to it's audience, they claim to want films to challenge us to use our minds. Surely you see where I'm coming from.
I understand, but your argument is severely flawed. Showing Superman have an emotional reaction to the destruction his fight with Zod is causing during that fight and showing him at least make an attempt to take the fight out of the city isn't pandering in the slightest, it's maintaining some actual pathos and human emotion during the giant action slugfest that visually reminds people of the largest terrorist attack in US history.

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Originally Posted by Marvin View Post
Zod made the threat(I'm gonna kill everyone), superman reacted = superman cares. Achievement = unlocked.
Yes. That's how pathos in stories works.

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Originally Posted by Marvin View Post
Superman fighting zod, no committed facial expressions at the property damage with unconfirmed kills = superman stopped caring?
It makes it feel that way, yes.

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Originally Posted by Marvin View Post
The one time they cause serious damage superman was pretty much out cold.
I don't remember that being the case at all.

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Originally Posted by Marvin View Post
Zod about to burn innocent family, superman again with the concern and begging = ignore list.
No. The fact that there was a stretch in between where Superman wasn't reacting to what was likely thousands of deaths is what was really goddamn weird and awkward.


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Originally Posted by Marvin View Post
Remind me, which scene you are referring to, I'm at a loss here.
The end fight with Zod, where Superman and Zod are smashing through and toppling over a few different buildings and it hardly seems to phase Superman that he's in a populated city until they crash into the train station.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post
Correct me if I'm wrong but superman never once stops acting like a good guy during this film. If that's what you took from this film I think you are being obtuse. Fighting for the sake of the planet in the face of impossible odds is good. What you are doing is taking this level of good and reducing it to garbage in light of what you claim is the level of good needed for superman to satisfy you.
No. I'm not doing that. I'm saying that it makes me really uncomfortable that Superman doesn't make a token attempt to minimize the collateral damage of his fight with Zod or even react to the fact that they're knocking over skyscrapers that people are inside.

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Originally Posted by Marvin View Post
The only thing I said about avengers is that during their ugly fight they were making constant jokes on the radios, even with all the death and destruction around them. I love that, I love how they can do that and fanboys not claim that those heroes and that filmmaker still care.
I then said if superman did such a thing he'd be considered Lucifer. Imagine it right now, if superman was fighting zod punching him through the air(not through buildings) and on the second punch he said something about how much fun he's having....how he's bringing the party to mid town and how he's bringing sexy back.
the devil I tell ya.
They earned the right to make jokes because they also acknowledged the danger that civilians were in and actively tried to rescue them.

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Originally Posted by Marvin View Post
This is why I said you are hinting at things needing to be spelled out.
I am really absolutely not. Wanting Superman to react to the obvious carnage around him isn't wanting things to be spelled out. It's wanting the movie to acknowledge the consequences of what's going on in that scene that people are well aware of because we saw it happen in real life twelve years ago. And, it's wanting some things to stay consistent throughout the film.

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Originally Posted by Marvin View Post
Someone who doesn't care would walk away. Simple.
Someone who does care would do something about it, at the cost of their own life. I think this character cared.
People who care also have emotional reactions to skyscrapers collapsing.

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Originally Posted by Marvin View Post
He pleaded on two entirely separate occasions, his father did too. You want more.
Yes I do. In that scene where people are actually dying by the thousands I want him to display some actual emotions about it.

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Last edited by The Question; 07-22-2013 at 12:04 AM.
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