Thread: Hank Pym?
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Old 07-22-2013, 12:28 PM   #81
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Default Re: Hank Pym?

Originally Posted by MessiahDecoy123 View Post
I don't see why they can't have Hank Pym in Avengers 2 create Ultron and then have Ant Man be a spin off film.
1) Does that mean Joss Whedon gets to cast Edgar Wright's movie?
2) Is there room for Hank Pym in Avengers 2, what with all the other madness going on?
3) Does Hank Pym being the creator of Ultron make it objectively a better film/story?
4) If not... why is having a Hank Pym cameo to create the big villain an issue?

Originally Posted by The Question View Post
You know, Pym not being involved with Ultron is a shame, because it really is his best story, but sometimes in the process of adapting a story into another medium things don't work out and you have to shift things around. It's the nature of the game.
Tough truth.

Originally Posted by Alex_Spider View Post
Spot on. I don't get it why deviate so much from the mythos and neglect such a pivotal Avenger like Pym? They could easily introduce him as a new character and do so many interesting things with him, show the flawed side of his self, his bad temper with his wife and so many other things.
Where would you easily insert a new character and do a bunch of interesting things with them into the Avengers movie? And if it's not easy in the first one... how would it be even easier in the second which has Thanos and Ultron and Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver and Hawkeye with a bigger part and everyone from the first film except (maybe) Loki.

Originally Posted by The Infernal View Post
I'm not too optimistic about AoU. Hank Pym isn't defined by Ultron, but Ultron is arguably defined by Hank Pyn (to an extent). The relationship between the two characters has been accepted as essential parts of either character's history for decades.
I disagree. Most Ultron stories I read, knowing his relationship with Pym is unnecessary.

Originally Posted by cherokeesam View Post
Hank Pym has been in every iteration of the Avengers from the very beginning, including Ultimates, including Mighty, including Initiative, including West Coast. He is an integral part of the team, and omnipresent in Avengers comics.

How is that an unreasonable comparison, in your opinion? Keeping in mind that my statement isn't about powersets, or popularity, or rank. Just about importance to the actual team and actual comic title.
It sounds like he hasn't been important in every team and comic title. He's just... been there. He certainly wasn't important in Ultimates. Batman is actually important in every incarnation of the JLA, so the comparison is unreasonable. If you think Pym is as important to the Avengers as Batman is to the JLA, then perhaps you could explain what makes a character important to you, since it's not their usefulness to the team or to the writers.

On Stark making Ultron

Stark!Ultron would naturally have the same personality as 616 Ultron. It'd be the same exact character, only everywhere 616 Ultron says "Pym" MCU Ultron would say "Stark." Not only that, it would make more sense for someone whom we've seen with documented daddy issues and a penchant for taking over things to have someone patterned after him have those same issues. As opposed to, someone who just wants to do good and help people making a robot that feels exterminating humanity is a good call.

Not only does it make more sense narratively, given the constraints: Ant-Man isn't out, and puts Pym out of reach logistics-wise for Avengers 2, and Avengers 2 is already jam packed full of people and action and story and arcs and such... using economy of storytelling is wise. Why include a new character to do what Tony Stark has already done. Tony Stark already has a robot that moves on its own and sometimes does things he doesn't want it to do. Why set up a new character and include a new arc in the film when you already have that story covered?

I understand the complaint that with Pym not being a founder AND Pym not creating Ultron he loses his best stories. I empathize with that. I do. That said... after he wasn't a founder... the writing was on the wall. Like the X-Men and Fantastic Four and Spider-Man relationships with Avengers, this is one bit of 616 that just isn't there.

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Last edited by DrCosmic; 07-22-2013 at 12:53 PM.
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